Speaker 1: Welcome back to Popcorn Book Club. It's still being November
Speaker 1: just a little bit. We are still talking V four
Speaker 1: Vendetta the graphic novel. We have made it to book three,
Speaker 1: the final part of the graphic novel by Alan Moore
Speaker 1: and illustrated by David Lloyd. Uh. The most dramatic, and
Speaker 1: I will say, at some moments insane. Uh. And also
Speaker 1: I also think we're it departs the most from the movie,
Speaker 1: which will describe next week. Uh. So Book three, which
Speaker 1: is called The Land of Do As You Please, Uh,
Speaker 1: begins with the symphony of the blowing up Jordan's Tower,
Speaker 1: which uh, I think that we'll get into the timeline
Speaker 1: of the movie, which I think is a little cleaner.
Speaker 1: But yeah, I really liked it. I really like the
Speaker 1: timeline of the movie. But in this we also have
Speaker 1: this on November. He blows up jordan Tower on November five,
Speaker 1: and then November six, sort of the Land of Do
Speaker 1: as You Please anarchy stuff sort of begins. So well,
Speaker 1: it wasn't anarchy, it was chaos, chaos which he hopes
Speaker 1: will become anarchy. But I thought it was really important
Speaker 1: that they made that distinction because I think a lot
Speaker 1: of people don't fully understand what anarchy is as a philosophy,
Speaker 1: as opposed to just like colloquial usage of the word
Speaker 1: anarchy anarchy were like, no one's in charge, it's anarchy,
Speaker 1: and that's not the same thing. Yes, I don't know.
Speaker 1: Just do you have a good understanding of what anarchy is,
Speaker 1: because I'm not actually sure I know what it looks
Speaker 1: like in practice. I don't think I know what it
Speaker 1: looks like in practice, and I think I did not
Speaker 1: have a very good understanding of it prior to reading
Speaker 1: this book, because my idea of anarchy came from like
Speaker 1: a meme that I saw on my Space, like two
Speaker 1: thousand five. It was like, anarchy is bad because it's
Speaker 1: people running around, and you know what happens when everybody
Speaker 1: is running around scraped knee. I was like, Oh, that
Speaker 1: sounds terrible. I just think about the purge like it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: it's one day of anarchy, no rules, and this is
Speaker 1: a bunch of murder, murder. Daddy's everywhere, murder, daddy's murder,
Speaker 1: mommy's murder, murder uncle. I will say, by the by
Speaker 1: the end of this book, things do not appear to
Speaker 1: be getting better unless we all felt the Catharsis, and
Speaker 1: I guess ellen Bore wanted us to feel by watching
Speaker 1: a wealthy woman get raped by a group of homelessman
Speaker 1: A very weird ending to a book, but okay, I
Speaker 1: guess that is what ellen Moore wanted to end on.
Speaker 1: I think Alan Moore is very bad on women, and
Speaker 1: I want to talk about that a little later and
Speaker 1: the full thing. But I also want to say one
Speaker 1: thing that I think is um starkly different from both
Speaker 1: the film and sort of how the character of the
Speaker 1: has been portrayed. He's not like a great guy, He's
Speaker 1: not like the hero. He's like he has no charm
Speaker 1: about him whatsoever. Like for me in the book, he's
Speaker 1: like stop what the monologues dude? And you note but
Speaker 1: deeply weird in a good way. There's a lot of
Speaker 1: guy in your m f A under coming from ving.
Speaker 1: There's this point at which Evie was like, can you
Speaker 1: just say what you mean? And I would like, thank you,
Speaker 1: thank you for actually saying that, But like, I think
Speaker 1: this is a really good point where I've been seeing
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff like on TikTok because I'm super
Speaker 1: cool and young, and on TikTok about how um media
Speaker 1: literacy means that you don't necessarily just because somebody is
Speaker 1: the main character, have to identify with them, And just
Speaker 1: because somebody's the main character does not mean that they
Speaker 1: are correct. And I think that V as a flawed person.
Speaker 1: I think we can all agree that VA is a
Speaker 1: deeply flawed person and he's not always correct, And this
Speaker 1: monologueing at ev and not answering any questions directly is
Speaker 1: just frankly infuriating. He also guess letter in the most
Speaker 1: horrifying way I can imagine anybody being gas. I mean,
Speaker 1: he plays games with her in ways that I think
Speaker 1: the movie tries to make justifiable, and like in the
Speaker 1: grand scheme of things, I would argue that like symbolically
Speaker 1: they succeed. In the book, he comes off as much
Speaker 1: less charming, much more insane, with a far less like
Speaker 1: consistent ideology. And I think that Evie becomes spoiler like
Speaker 1: becoming V at the end makes more sense if V
Speaker 1: is like a deeply imperfect symbol and unlikable character, right.
Speaker 1: And it also has to do with the idea that
Speaker 1: anarchy has two sides, destruction and creation, and he was
Speaker 1: destruction and she was creation, and next week always talked
Speaker 1: about the movie. I have more things I don't want
Speaker 1: to say about that. So the thing that I wanted
Speaker 1: to focus on first about three is a character that's
Speaker 1: not in the movie, Rosemary, who goes through a journey
Speaker 1: a brief recap. Rosemary is in an abusive marriage with
Speaker 1: that of the ear who listens into all the phone tapping.
Speaker 1: He dies, and then she starts sleeping with Roger Dascombe,
Speaker 1: who's the head of the visual Jordan Tower at the
Speaker 1: mouth thank you. Uh. He also dies. People think she's
Speaker 1: deeply cursed because the last two dudes she slept with died.
Speaker 1: She is miserable at the Sad Cabaret. Uh. She is
Speaker 1: forced to work as a a burlesque dancer, a dancer
Speaker 1: non consensually in the sense that she does not want
Speaker 1: to do and she's doing it only for money that
Speaker 1: she desperately needs. Uh. And then she's driven to murdering
Speaker 1: to going full taxi driver and murdering Adam Susan in
Speaker 1: the street in what this chore and in a way
Speaker 1: that then talking about taxi driving in a way that
Speaker 1: v then seems to argue that he orchestrated the whole thing.
Speaker 1: Because she is the last rose he cultivated. What did
Speaker 1: you guys make of this subplot? I mean, she's what
Speaker 1: a sad, sad character to like to have that be
Speaker 1: her kind of whole arc of like, you know, being
Speaker 1: subjugated to like the intense violent patriarchy of this particular society,
Speaker 1: having her husband killed, but being sad about that loss,
Speaker 1: to to like sit with that loss of this person
Speaker 1: who was like deeply abusive to her as well, and
Speaker 1: then to like go and just straight I mean just
Speaker 1: straight up, point blank shoot that man. And the worst
Speaker 1: the worst part for me is she doesn't even have
Speaker 1: any like um agency in this because then they frame
Speaker 1: it as the fact that she was all just part
Speaker 1: of v scheme that he puppet mastered, this miserable woman,
Speaker 1: and they also felt like not just no agency, but
Speaker 1: like her character just really doesn't have any It doesn't
Speaker 1: have any like full three dimensional like depth or I
Speaker 1: don't know who she is outside of the horrible men
Speaker 1: that she has been with, or like the horrible man
Speaker 1: she kills at the end, like it like EVI, at
Speaker 1: least you understand who she is and and she like you.
Speaker 1: You kind of have this three sixty view of her,
Speaker 1: but Rosemary just feels like this sad abuse lady who
Speaker 1: then is up I guess upon and VI's whole chess game.
Speaker 1: But I don't quite understand how he did that. I
Speaker 1: don't get that either. Yeah, neither. It didn't make any sense,
Speaker 1: like there were there were plot holes you could drive
Speaker 1: a mac dress true, especially bensidering, like I get that then,
Speaker 1: or that the chaos is a part of these plan,
Speaker 1: Like that makes sense, But then you can't say, yes,
Speaker 1: I plan for chaos, but then within this chaos, I
Speaker 1: plan for this woman to specifically go up to the
Speaker 1: leader of the country and shoot him point blank, you know,
Speaker 1: and it's gonna work perfectly. They're gonna they're gonna let
Speaker 1: her through. We're planning that creedy. We know that Creedy
Speaker 1: sort of wants to sabotage Adam, and so he'll sabotage
Speaker 1: him by putting him out in public when maybe a
Speaker 1: lady could assassinate him. Like all of these pieces are
Speaker 1: do not fit together. Either the plan is chaos or
Speaker 1: the plan is a plan, Like you can't have it
Speaker 1: both ways. Yes, it's very joker, we're jokers. Things were
Speaker 1: all very thought through in Dark Knight dark Knight. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: you get to plant a lot of bombs in advance
Speaker 1: of his cattle work. Yeah. Yeah, it was almost it's
Speaker 1: too neat, like the level of chaos that he's trying
Speaker 1: to invoke, and then for that to be Like as
Speaker 1: she was walking through the crowd, I was like, even
Speaker 1: that's a little too far fetched just to let one
Speaker 1: lady walk through the crowd in this public moment. I'm like,
Speaker 1: this is a little like her, Like, get her out
Speaker 1: of the way, keep away from the man. They'll die
Speaker 1: if they get too you know, I'm thinking of myself
Speaker 1: if I was in that society, and I would fully
Speaker 1: be like stay away from her, Like I would be
Speaker 1: one of the people pushing that Laura about her as well.
Speaker 1: She's she's car don't go and don't sleep with her.
Speaker 1: And then there's the other wife of a top party
Speaker 1: member who is deeply fascinating and Jennifer, I know, I'm
Speaker 1: getting obsessed with Helen Hair. She's not a good person,
Speaker 1: but I am extremely interested. Like she's bad but also
Speaker 1: she's kind of bad. Yeah, she's bad in a fun way,
Speaker 1: and we meet her really in in book three, Jennifer,
Speaker 1: will you describe her for maybe people who have a
Speaker 1: read it. So Helen Hair is just enthusiastically sexually dominating
Speaker 1: every man who comes into her proximity. Um, I think
Speaker 1: the first time we see her, the first time we
Speaker 1: see her, she's selling at her husband like always. The
Speaker 1: next time we see her, her husband just like kneeling
Speaker 1: before her um and towlding her off as she everges
Speaker 1: from the bath, and then he tries to go down
Speaker 1: on him and she like kicks him away. So um,
Speaker 1: it's it's very interesting that in this society every man
Speaker 1: and she goes on to half an affair with what's
Speaker 1: his name, Ali Ali Creedy creating the same as Ali. No.
Speaker 1: Creedy is the head of the Finger who's the evil
Speaker 1: policeman and Ali Ali and Creedy um have an alliance.
Speaker 1: Creedy sort of wants that you said Ali Creedy, and
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm so confused. Now, both Creedy and
Speaker 1: Hair and want a need to use Allie's gang powers
Speaker 1: and then to get the chaos power. So Helen Hair
Speaker 1: wants to be a vita um and you know what,
Speaker 1: it almost works out for her. She's having an affair
Speaker 1: with Ali so she can use his brute force to
Speaker 1: help elevate her husband to the position of High Chancellor,
Speaker 1: and uh they end up killing each other in a
Speaker 1: lover's quarrel. Oh for Helen, Uh so it doesn't happen,
Speaker 1: and she is pretty mad at her husband for fucking
Speaker 1: things out that way. I love the negotiation of price
Speaker 1: that she has with Ali for his services, where she's like, well,
Speaker 1: how much are you getting paid by Creedy right now?
Speaker 1: And he was like, oh, like five hundred a week
Speaker 1: when it's four hundred a week, And then she's like, wow,
Speaker 1: I really would have thought he wouldn't pay you more
Speaker 1: than four hundred hundred. Yeah, where where are you coming
Speaker 1: at this? Cos I want to Lady Lady Macbeth and
Speaker 1: her regional theater production. Definitely I got very lady m
Speaker 1: vibes from her, because like, how did she get her
Speaker 1: power in this society of just being she's the only one,
Speaker 1: the only one. She's really interesting as a woman in
Speaker 1: the society. She's obviously a terrible person, but it just
Speaker 1: feels so unlikely that any woman would have this capacity
Speaker 1: to dominate people, have you, especially the ear Yeah, And
Speaker 1: and then of course he becomes the v uses like
Speaker 1: the voyeuristic thing of the cameras to uh to cause
Speaker 1: the chaos smart doubt smarter in his perfect like puppet
Speaker 1: master way, which seems like a sort of like a
Speaker 1: line from like a Bob Dylan or like a folk
Speaker 1: song like Oh and the Voyeurs on the CCTV. It's
Speaker 1: like that the classic idea that like I will be
Speaker 1: like he uses their their tools of mass surveillance against
Speaker 1: them and we're all pervert seeing it. Bob Dylan. Now, Um,
Speaker 1: what I was gonna say was her level of power
Speaker 1: as a woman in this society where women are just
Speaker 1: like massively disempowered kind of reminds me of Serena Joy
Speaker 1: in uh, The Handmaid Sale, but like the adaptation of
Speaker 1: The Handmaid Sale, not the book The Handmaids Tale, because
Speaker 1: I feel like Serena Joy has a lot more power
Speaker 1: in the screen adaptation versus the book, but she's still
Speaker 1: thing about Serena Joy. She at least has to have
Speaker 1: the effect of being like a dutiful wife that she
Speaker 1: feels honored to have this home. In this husband to follow,
Speaker 1: Helven Hair so clearly doesn't think have that pretense at all,
Speaker 1: Like the first time he's see her, she's being really
Speaker 1: shitty to her husband, and Roseberry is like, she's kind
Speaker 1: of a mean lady, and Roseberry's husband says, fucky, he
Speaker 1: is awesome, and we all like her. Her level of
Speaker 1: like sexual manipulation isn't even understated. It is so outrageously
Speaker 1: in it's just crank. Yeah, it's crank to eleven. There's
Speaker 1: no there's no pussy footing around about it. It's just
Speaker 1: like I didn't even need to say that. I'm embarrassed. Sometimes. Also,
Speaker 1: these comic book women are drawn in a way where
Speaker 1: I'm like, David Lloyd, you had a day drawing those boobs,
Speaker 1: didn't you? Oh my god, just massive watermelons, just enormous boobs.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, when she's like, look what you're missing. Had
Speaker 1: a day drawing the like cabaret ladies with their asses,
Speaker 1: like out to the stages. Eighties comic book artists loved
Speaker 1: drawing at boobs and butts. It's their favorite thing. Dana
Speaker 1: and I wrote for she Hulk, and so we spent
Speaker 1: a lot of time with those she Whole comics, and
Speaker 1: my god, they are so horny for she Hulk, Like
Speaker 1: it's just like the way their boobs with like like
Speaker 1: grip two sure in a way that was like, oh,
Speaker 1: there gripped like under the boob and to the side
Speaker 1: of the boob, and it's just like a blouse in
Speaker 1: a way. I look like, that's not how That's not
Speaker 1: how gravity works. The clothes are like painted painted on,
Speaker 1: but only for part of it. And then there's like
Speaker 1: a little bit of a blouse for you know, demure
Speaker 1: for because if we don't do that, I was saying,
Speaker 1: if we if we didn't see the line of the boob,
Speaker 1: how would we know she has boobed adjacent to that too?
Speaker 1: Just to touch on like how this particular you know
Speaker 1: illustrator is uh portraying women every time e V screams,
Speaker 1: I'm like, this is a grotesque portrayal of this woman's
Speaker 1: face that like towards the end, I was like, this
Speaker 1: is this is a different person I had that not
Speaker 1: like she is I think like fifteen different women in
Speaker 1: this book. At the beginning, she's like a little scared
Speaker 1: Lolita esque drawing, and then she becomes a like a
Speaker 1: like a when she's with that nice guy you know,
Speaker 1: lives with him. She's like a like a seventies sitcom lady.
Speaker 1: And then she turns and she goes and is tortured,
Speaker 1: and she looks like a hundred and five years old
Speaker 1: in this chapter, like I had it open to this page.
Speaker 1: She looks like like a like sort of like Jennifer Gray.
Speaker 1: She looks kind of like an X man. She looks
Speaker 1: like she looks like a gargoyle off the side of
Speaker 1: a building. That also is like the gutter that's brays water.
Speaker 1: But then yes, this what's that? That's like? This is
Speaker 1: all very great for any Chloris leech Man. I'm gonna
Speaker 1: be back real quick. I'm just gonna write a manifesto,
Speaker 1: be back into gym. I did want to make one
Speaker 1: more point about Helen Hair before we move on to women. No,
Speaker 1: this is essential. Have any of you read or seen
Speaker 1: the film The Wife. Yeah, it's it's a different dynamic.
Speaker 1: It's not like a sexually dominant dynamic. But the titch
Speaker 1: I'm gonna spoil the Wife, but it's not a spoiler.
Speaker 1: You know it the whole thing and it's just whatever
Speaker 1: the titular wife. And the Wife is a wonderful writer,
Speaker 1: but it's like in America, and she knows that her
Speaker 1: books will never get the attention or acclaim that they'll
Speaker 1: get under her name as they would under her husband's name.
Speaker 1: So she like makes the decision out, like you're gonna
Speaker 1: publish my books and we're going to have this partnership
Speaker 1: and we're both in on it and this is our relationship. Um,
Speaker 1: And that a little bit feels like a muted version
Speaker 1: of the Helen Hair thing of like I can't be
Speaker 1: the face of the who's in charge, so I am
Speaker 1: going to use you, my husband, as the man puppet
Speaker 1: for me to get my agenda across. I feel like
Speaker 1: though I don't think her husband was as in on it,
Speaker 1: and I don't think it was I feel like it
Speaker 1: was like a Rebecca type deal where she got married
Speaker 1: to him and she was like, great, we're not going
Speaker 1: to have sex. I'm gonna like withhold sex from you,
Speaker 1: and you're gonna be in charge of the ear and
Speaker 1: I'm going to make sure or was he the ear
Speaker 1: or the mouth? He he was the No, he was
Speaker 1: the eye because he had the cameras right, Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: he liked watch the propagateda the visual thing before you're
Speaker 1: without the seeing. But so she's like, you're gonna be
Speaker 1: in charge of the eye because I say so, and
Speaker 1: that's how I'm going to get to the top like
Speaker 1: it was hardcore lady m energy. You don't think that
Speaker 1: it's a consensual b D s M relationship. I think
Speaker 1: it's pretty into it. Um like makes it clear at
Speaker 1: the very end that she's going to have sex with
Speaker 1: them because she's going to be in a good mood.
Speaker 1: I do. I don't think it's kind of likes it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't think it. I think he gets off on it.
Speaker 1: I think he likes for sure. I know. I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't get that sense, just because of that scene
Speaker 1: where she's with Ali, she's like the cameras are off
Speaker 1: because they had that sort of blackout of surveillance, and
Speaker 1: then she's got her like eighties tich and she's and
Speaker 1: she's like pointing him at the camera, which she thinks
Speaker 1: isn't recording anything, and she's like, hey, look what you're missing.
Speaker 1: And then later he flies into like furious rage and
Speaker 1: that's why he ends up killing Oh, you're right. I
Speaker 1: think he's curious because his wife's sleeping with another. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's what I that's what I gathered from that change.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's both. I gathered that he's
Speaker 1: sorry when she was in the top like he was
Speaker 1: townling her off. He clearly sees her tits on a
Speaker 1: regular basis, right, but I don't think he gets to
Speaker 1: touch them on a regular I mean I was reading it,
Speaker 1: I was like, what a cook? Indeed he quite literally,
Speaker 1: yeah he really is. So that's where what did you
Speaker 1: think of the ending? We got to go back to
Speaker 1: part of the north. I guess, well, that's not good sleep.
Speaker 1: But well it's sad that he said with his wife
Speaker 1: and she's sleeping with another, but they're all bad. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: he'sac to say. I got a lot of ship for
Speaker 1: saying that the cabaret seemed like a place I would
Speaker 1: want to hang out. I think we should give Jen
Speaker 1: just a little bit more ship for feeling bad. Both
Speaker 1: equal and fascist sympathize. That's instant of his life. Seems okay,
Speaker 1: But Colin Hair deeply sucks. Yes, yeah, um okay, so
Speaker 1: with Helen Hair, I don't believe that rapists an appropriate
Speaker 1: punishment for everyone and for anyone and for everyone for anyone. Um.
Speaker 1: I really don't care for that end. And it also
Speaker 1: was just such a weird tag, Like what a choice
Speaker 1: to end on that, Like it's hard enough the choice
Speaker 1: in it of itself is like, oh, she's going to
Speaker 1: be raped, that's her punishment is rough. But it's like
Speaker 1: and also, that's going to be the ending of V
Speaker 1: for Vandetta. It's like we can all feel happy about
Speaker 1: Helen Hair getting raped as opposed to like I was like, wait,
Speaker 1: I turned the page, being like, that's not that can't
Speaker 1: be the end of it though, that's the tone he
Speaker 1: wants to end on, that the sexually manipulative woman is
Speaker 1: going to be in a forced Island sexual submission. That
Speaker 1: I think in my mind I had transposed the two
Speaker 1: parts of the ending, and after I read it, I
Speaker 1: immediately was like, oh, she had the bad thing happened.
Speaker 1: But then we had Evie bringing that guy into the
Speaker 1: shadow gallery and like she's going to be the next
Speaker 1: vat that is the end of In my brain I
Speaker 1: made that the end. I was like this, well that
Speaker 1: would be better. That's that's a way better ending because
Speaker 1: it's almost like a little optimistic and hope for the future.
Speaker 1: And then it's like, wait, one more page, we forgot
Speaker 1: to rape. Believe. Look, I also just don't believe that
Speaker 1: Helen Hair is going to be kept down for long,
Speaker 1: Like that woman seems remarkably indomitable. I am saying metaphorically right,
Speaker 1: not no, she's She's obviously going to be raped terrifically,
Speaker 1: and Alamor seems psyched about that, and it's a note
Speaker 1: he wanted to end on. But look, I'm not saying
Speaker 1: I want a sequel. That's just Helen Hair once again
Speaker 1: taking over society in a ruthless way. But if it existed,
Speaker 1: I would read it. You know what, Jennifer, there are
Speaker 1: more than enough stories about like awful men rising through
Speaker 1: the ranks of power and how and why they do it.
Speaker 1: It would be interesting to see one about it Helen
Speaker 1: Hair's rest to power like Wicked. Sure, yeah, let's actually,
Speaker 1: you know what, I wanted to be a musical just
Speaker 1: like Vida. I wanted Madnna to play Helen Higher. I
Speaker 1: literally meant the book Wicked, though, I just want to
Speaker 1: make that very clear. I also think that this sort
Speaker 1: of goes into like why Alan Moore is bad at
Speaker 1: women one because he sees them all as sexual objects
Speaker 1: and like all of their problems are like sex based.
Speaker 1: Like there's Helen Hair, who again is just like a
Speaker 1: cardboard cutout of a dominatrix, then gets what she deserves
Speaker 1: in his opinion, not in my opinion, um Evie with
Speaker 1: her like weird daddy issues that he goes way too
Speaker 1: much into. And then Rosemary, who again it's like her
Speaker 1: relationships with men put her in this very like sexually
Speaker 1: vulnerable position, and then she is not even a person
Speaker 1: who makes decisions. She's just a pawn in the plan,
Speaker 1: like every woman has some deeply weird sexual thing with her.
Speaker 1: Oh she's cool, yeah, yeah, yes, yes, VAL's on that
Speaker 1: chapter is like genuinely so sweet and nuanced, and yet
Speaker 1: we don't get that with anyone else. It is. The
Speaker 1: unfortunate thing is that it's the same issue of like
Speaker 1: queer people always dying in literature. Yes, and Delia also
Speaker 1: now has to be in a relationship with Finch, which
Speaker 1: she didn't have to. Yeah that's oh yeah, that was
Speaker 1: weird that they threw that in there. They're just like
Speaker 1: and we're sleeping together, by the way, Well, I think
Speaker 1: it's interesting that to your point, Dana, I think the
Speaker 1: one thing that is I think an interesting challenge about
Speaker 1: these kind of like authoritarian dystop dystopias is that they're
Speaker 1: usually like patriarchies, and so these women are so reliant
Speaker 1: on men for survival that like, even when Evie is
Speaker 1: kicked out, she does have to like go find shelter
Speaker 1: with this man. And I think that's why Handmaid's Tale
Speaker 1: is so interesting. I mean I've not read it, I've
Speaker 1: only seen the adaptation, but you know in a Woman's
Speaker 1: Hands that this that that you can find like stories
Speaker 1: that are separate from men. But I think that is
Speaker 1: a challenge to do in like a patriarchal, authoritarian regime
Speaker 1: that you're setting your story. And I guess I have
Speaker 1: less of an issue with like e with Evie being
Speaker 1: like reliant on men, and more of an issue that
Speaker 1: like I don't know, the daddy issue stuff and the
Speaker 1: issues I just was trying to see, Like, I think
Speaker 1: it is a challenge, and then if you don't have
Speaker 1: that perspective, you're going to just kind of fall back
Speaker 1: on tropes and I And I also think in Alan
Speaker 1: Moore's defense, I think so much of the for Vendetta
Speaker 1: is meant to be like making a larger political point,
Speaker 1: so like characters fall by the wayside because he's trying
Speaker 1: to make his argument in a in a in a
Speaker 1: way that comes across. Yeah, it's a manifesto as much
Speaker 1: as it is a piece of art. I think the
Speaker 1: tiny glimmer of like him potentially being more thoughtful about
Speaker 1: it is that like the one little girl in the
Speaker 1: book with the glasses is the one that like one
Speaker 1: of the first outside characters that like takes up you know,
Speaker 1: graffiti v um onto the street, which to me is
Speaker 1: like you know, in Lesser Hands would have gone to
Speaker 1: like a little boy, you know, like and I think
Speaker 1: that is like an interesting an interesting choice in a
Speaker 1: small detail that I loved and loved seeing we'll talk
Speaker 1: about it later, but loved seeing in the movie as well,
Speaker 1: like that tiny little moment. Yeah, some of the stuff
Speaker 1: in the movie we were talking about it a little
Speaker 1: off off Mike that we'll talk to in our movie episode,
Speaker 1: but like little easter eggs that are directly from the
Speaker 1: graphic novel that I think make it more satisfying. Mm hmmm.
Speaker 1: I want to talk about faith. Oh yeah, Karama bring
Speaker 1: us up to speed with faith. So faith, as we've
Speaker 1: talked about, and I think chapter not Chapter two, but
Speaker 1: Book two was the like supercomputer that tells Susan what
Speaker 1: to do and he's like kind of creepy in love
Speaker 1: with it, says I Love You near the end of
Speaker 1: the book two, and then in book Flree it's heavily
Speaker 1: implied that he sleeps with the computer. Right. It wasn't
Speaker 1: just me right, they have a sexual it's an x
Speaker 1: mack in a situation. Yeah, I mean I was like,
Speaker 1: he found a drive and I just went to down
Speaker 1: like that's the way I read it, m bloppy drive.
Speaker 1: It was the eighties they use floppy does excuse you?
Speaker 1: So yeah, Then you find out that v has access
Speaker 1: to Fate in his in the basement of his shadow
Speaker 1: gallery home that has like eight levels and an elevator. Apparently, um,
Speaker 1: how is no again a block hole that you could
Speaker 1: drive a mack truck through? But again, manifesto more than
Speaker 1: not more than art, but as much as it is art.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I thought it was interesting too. For me
Speaker 1: was frustrating because if he had access to this supercomputer
Speaker 1: and could then give messages to the government directly, Uh,
Speaker 1: it was just sort of like, why don't you make
Speaker 1: things better for some of the people while you're doing
Speaker 1: your scheme. I really liked it because it's like, this
Speaker 1: is the best episode of MTVS Catfish I've ever seen life,
Speaker 1: just like the like just thinking about the spending all
Speaker 1: that time flirting with uh, what's his name, Adam Susan
Speaker 1: through the computer. It's so it's so fun to think
Speaker 1: about just like him back at the in his eight
Speaker 1: story elevator home, just like sending sex through the fate
Speaker 1: computer to Susan. It's it's great. It's just very funny
Speaker 1: because what this was written in like the eighties, right
Speaker 1: that it is very like early Hackers, that kind of
Speaker 1: style stuff where it's like you can't really like these days.
Speaker 1: Of course v is has hacked into the supercomputer, like
Speaker 1: that is the first thing a terror or not a terror,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? And what v would do
Speaker 1: and uh, and it just it's very funny. It's like
Speaker 1: it's so simple that like, oh, I'm just gonna like
Speaker 1: log into the supercomputer and just and just talked and
Speaker 1: that that's all I can do is just talk to him,
Speaker 1: just like send messages on like a black and green screen. Um. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like ten years before the movie Hackers. So he
Speaker 1: was really looking far ahead, I think, and I mean
Speaker 1: very he again a historical catfish, and also very funny
Speaker 1: that with this power he couldn't like disarmed bombs or
Speaker 1: like do anything tangible for his plan, forget like helping
Speaker 1: people having Adam Susan fall in love with him the
Speaker 1: via computer like doesn't really affect his plan other than
Speaker 1: like he doesn't really need to do it again. It's
Speaker 1: so he does these things for himself, and that one
Speaker 1: feels that one feels like a personal pet project that
Speaker 1: he like dislikes this high Chancellor so much that like
Speaker 1: the best revenge is like, yeah, make him funk this computer. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it does seem like it undermines uh sus insanity the
Speaker 1: guys of other people, Helen hair points so that they
Speaker 1: shouldn't have him to a parade to restore confidence because
Speaker 1: he's insane. Yeah, um, I think that, though he does
Speaker 1: use it for concrete things at times, like he uses
Speaker 1: it to send all those the mail that male things
Speaker 1: Oh yeah yeah, like poems in the mail. I'm just like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if he knows what he's doing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I wouldn't if I got a poem in the mail,
Speaker 1: I would think it was just a direct marketing stunt.
Speaker 1: I wouldn't think it was a call to anarchy, yeah,
Speaker 1: especially because it was not like anarchist poetry. It was
Speaker 1: just like flowers. It's also weird you've seen a bird? Yes,
Speaker 1: he has the foresight and like mental acumen to like
Speaker 1: manipulate every act of Rosemary's life and and drive her
Speaker 1: to homicide. And yet he doesn't really know how to
Speaker 1: how to put that organization skill into any other aspect
Speaker 1: of his plan. Yeah, the best thing you can do
Speaker 1: is like a postcards campaign like the last election. That's
Speaker 1: my point. He has an opportunity to do so much good,
Speaker 1: and he sends people weird cryptic poetry in the mail
Speaker 1: and then makes the dude sleep with a computer. Do
Speaker 1: you remember, like six months ago when a bunch of
Speaker 1: people just got seeds in the mail? Yes, what is
Speaker 1: this like us in this year? Hundreds of people maybe thousands,
Speaker 1: I'm not sure, but a lot of people got mysterious
Speaker 1: seeds in the mail, and then the government was like,
Speaker 1: please don't plant Oh no, I'm curious. Did they ever
Speaker 1: find out who sent them and what were they didn't
Speaker 1: want to test the seeds? Some people planted them before
Speaker 1: they That feels this, It feels like how a little
Speaker 1: shop of horrors gets started. Oh that sounds fun though,
Speaker 1: like just a little fun, like a little carnivorous plan
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, in terms of anarchy destruction, I
Speaker 1: would argue that Tyler Dirtan does something much better by
Speaker 1: destroying the records of credit card debt. Yeah. Fight Club,
Speaker 1: that's a love fight Club so much I'm gonna make
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make a point and I want both for
Speaker 1: Vendetta and fight Club are rare cases of the movies
Speaker 1: better than the book. Yes, I would say that I
Speaker 1: read and seen Fighting book is Chuck Palinak. Chuck Palinak
Speaker 1: was like the movie has a much better ending the
Speaker 1: book movie poster in way too many dorm rooms that
Speaker 1: here's the thing about fight Club, and then we can
Speaker 1: move away from it. But um, fight Club is another
Speaker 1: instance of you are not supposed to identify with the
Speaker 1: main character. And it's also one of those instances of
Speaker 1: people misreading the point, like it's an indictment of toxic masculinity,
Speaker 1: and people are like, you don't want to fight and
Speaker 1: I want to make soap and I want to have insomnia,
Speaker 1: and like that's not the point. Their lives suck and
Speaker 1: you shouldn't want to do what they do. It's the
Speaker 1: sad cabaret, but with men and soap, can I also
Speaker 1: say something deeply embarrassing about be for Vendetta. I didn't.
Speaker 1: I didn't realize that the circle and the V was
Speaker 1: an upside down anarchy symbol until like a few days ago.
Speaker 1: I didn't realize until you just told me that me neither.
Speaker 1: I was driving in l A and I saw an
Speaker 1: anarchy symbol, and for a second, I was like, it's
Speaker 1: a V for Vandetta thing. And then I was like, oh, Jennifer,
Speaker 1: and I knew Jennifer, and I also knew that all
Speaker 1: the chapters started with V. I'm just saying, you guys
Speaker 1: have to pick up on these clues. Okay, Alan is
Speaker 1: dropping them, and pick them up. We're all going to
Speaker 1: print out all of these poems and we're going to
Speaker 1: figure out the messages. So he's getting to us. So
Speaker 1: if someone mailed you an anonymous poem in the mail,
Speaker 1: you wouldn't the government something They did that a while
Speaker 1: ago for some comics. UM, I don't know, some maker
Speaker 1: of comic books, comic publishers. Um, they sent this weird
Speaker 1: random letter in the mail to like various comic people's
Speaker 1: houses and Dana as you know, as somebody who has
Speaker 1: written comic books. Comic fans are insane, said death threats
Speaker 1: on like a regular basis. Um. So we found out
Speaker 1: that this was viral marketing, fortunately very quickly, because otherwise
Speaker 1: we were going to call the police. Um. It was
Speaker 1: not reassuring to know that a crazy person had air address. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Jack Horsemen where they do the viral marketing for the
Speaker 1: show that he's on, that has like it looks like
Speaker 1: a ransom note like somebody else what idea was exactly
Speaker 1: like that? It was like cutout letters, centuary indication. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm going to be back in just a minute. I
Speaker 1: got a bunch of poems in the mail. So a
Speaker 1: brief full circle. Now back to be for Vendetta of
Speaker 1: plans that don't really make any any sense. Finch. He
Speaker 1: was the detective on the case of trying to find out.
Speaker 1: I know, I'm really bringing this back. Finch, there's the
Speaker 1: detective for the Scotland Yard. His plan, to understand be
Speaker 1: to get inside the terrorist's mind is to go to
Speaker 1: Larkhill and drop acid. Oh my god, that that scene
Speaker 1: because first of all, yes, dropping acid at a concentration camp,
Speaker 1: weird choice. I'm gonna go on the record and say
Speaker 1: don't do don't don't go to concentration camps and drop acid.
Speaker 1: I think we can stand for that as a podcast.
Speaker 1: But the second thing is when he was tripping because
Speaker 1: like they killed all the black people in the society,
Speaker 1: he has this like hallucination that they're black people, and
Speaker 1: he's like, Oh, I forgot how cool your skin? Like
Speaker 1: a big yikes. It was a huge yikes. I will say,
Speaker 1: of all the things that we've read thus far as
Speaker 1: a book club, it took the longest to get to
Speaker 1: the weird racism in this one. They really bury the
Speaker 1: lead in this one because all this Costley was like boom,
Speaker 1: page three saying some weird stuff about negro egg. But
Speaker 1: this one was a slow burn and I knew that
Speaker 1: it was racist as a society because they killed all
Speaker 1: the black people. But like that was where I was like, oh,
Speaker 1: I rooted for you before, and this was weird. You
Speaker 1: didn't need to do that. He was he was. It's
Speaker 1: almost it's like well meaning racism where he thought he
Speaker 1: was really doing something. M yeah. Well, he also makes
Speaker 1: it clear that he was on the side of killing
Speaker 1: all those people, like he misses them now. But oh yeah,
Speaker 1: fish sucks. And also Finch, I meant well meaning racism
Speaker 1: on the part of Alan Moore, who was, yeah, that
Speaker 1: that is what I read what you said as he
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, I'm trying to make a statement that
Speaker 1: he is like weird and racist and like that's not
Speaker 1: you didn't know he tried. But then Finch, who else
Speaker 1: who sucks? He's the one in the book who spoiler alert,
Speaker 1: kills me and he's excited about it. What did you
Speaker 1: guys make of that? Yeah, he was like too excited.
Speaker 1: I was kind of honestly sad that Finch was the
Speaker 1: one that took me down, like for for everything that
Speaker 1: V stands for, and like, you know, as far as
Speaker 1: adversaries goes, like adversaries go, um, Finch is sad and
Speaker 1: weird and pathetic and like shouldn't have been the one
Speaker 1: to take down this idea of V. In my opinion,
Speaker 1: it's just like you're telling me, he drops acid and
Speaker 1: kills the main character, Like come on, And he also
Speaker 1: felt like I like the idea that he figures out
Speaker 1: where he's where he is, like the station and stuff,
Speaker 1: I think, but the fact that he also he not
Speaker 1: only he like bests him also physically and mentally feels
Speaker 1: strange and also I think like and then we can
Speaker 1: talking about the all time of the movie next week.
Speaker 1: But it's like he's always catching up, but he's always late, right,
Speaker 1: And that's what it feels like, is the proper level
Speaker 1: of like he's smarter than the rest of these idiots, spine,
Speaker 1: but he's not as smart as B. And I like
Speaker 1: the idea that the is like, uh a part, like
Speaker 1: a part of his plan is his death and I
Speaker 1: get jumping to the movie, but it feels like not
Speaker 1: having v B a little bit more responsible for his
Speaker 1: own death field. It also felt very weird to me
Speaker 1: that the the arc that they're asking us to go
Speaker 1: on with Finch is that he goes to lark Hill
Speaker 1: and understand he drops his ascid to understand the and
Speaker 1: then his next immediate move is to be like, ha
Speaker 1: I killed him, my god, Like he didn't go through
Speaker 1: that ascid at the concentration camp, did nothing, and then
Speaker 1: like pasted a woman, push a woman back in getting raped,
Speaker 1: and then it's like he's the final frame of the story,
Speaker 1: which is very strange to me with his pipe with
Speaker 1: this pipe, like like to go back to those last
Speaker 1: two pages that are so terrible, Like I couldn't understand
Speaker 1: Alan Moore's reasoning of putting like chaos in the last
Speaker 1: two pages of like oh look this like best laid
Speaker 1: plans or whatever, like it's still going to be bad,
Speaker 1: but to a specify it as rape for this one character,
Speaker 1: and also ended with like Finch walking down the road
Speaker 1: being like, man, what a journey. I'm like he wasn't
Speaker 1: He's not poor rot, Like it's not like what are
Speaker 1: we doing here? He's the grizzled hero. He dropped as
Speaker 1: ad a concentration camp and murdered me and now on
Speaker 1: he walks, you know, Kelen hair backing being I think
Speaker 1: you're right to of like asking v to be more
Speaker 1: responsible or more careful, like he literally has, you know,
Speaker 1: taken um responsibility for the very precise killing of Adam
Speaker 1: Susan in the parade with Helen higher like why would
Speaker 1: he let Finch just like pop him one in the subway?
Speaker 1: Like it doesn't make any sense to me. I think
Speaker 1: he wants to die. I think he's ready. I think
Speaker 1: he knows that it's time that the mantle gets passed
Speaker 1: on to a new person, and that person is going
Speaker 1: to be efy do it in a cooler way totally agreed.
Speaker 1: You organize all this, You're he's so theatrical. He loves theatrics.
Speaker 1: You're gonna die just by like a crazy guy with
Speaker 1: by the clock shadows, shooting biking burial, like he's going
Speaker 1: to be sent off. Even monologue, he could go with
Speaker 1: a cooler death. I mean, he got a little bit.
Speaker 1: He said the thing about the ideas or bulletproof. This
Speaker 1: is my thesis and the whole riddle of like take
Speaker 1: off my mask but don't see my face, blah blah blah.
Speaker 1: But how am I to remember at that point, she's
Speaker 1: sixteen years old. She's like, how do I see your
Speaker 1: face if I take off that I'm not supposed to,
Speaker 1: but I am okay uh. I read that later. I
Speaker 1: read that late at night, and the panels were like
Speaker 1: she we think that she's taking off the mask. Each
Speaker 1: time I was like, that was, oh wait a minute.
Speaker 1: Also like today, I did not like that the panels.
Speaker 1: I know it's not real, but that the panels showed
Speaker 1: a face at all, Like I thought that was a
Speaker 1: weird choice to me because I thought the whole point
Speaker 1: is you never see his face, and it's like, so
Speaker 1: now we're seeing the imagined face that Ev. It just
Speaker 1: felt like it takes away a little bit of me.
Speaker 1: It's like seeing a dame named Rebecca. You think, then
Speaker 1: you don't bringing it back the circle. Yeah, So I
Speaker 1: will say I was unsatisfied by the ending. It just
Speaker 1: didn't hit emotionally for me. When I think that the
Speaker 1: world is so theatrical and I wanted a big emotional hit.
Speaker 1: It felt very Yeah, it felt very lackluster. At the
Speaker 1: end book three, I found myself very angry and very
Speaker 1: confused for a lot of time, especially because like there's
Speaker 1: I don't think we should see everything, like I don't
Speaker 1: think it needs to be like every single thing they
Speaker 1: do needs to be in panels. But also like there's
Speaker 1: this point where V quotes some dude Alistair somebody I
Speaker 1: can't remember the yeah, yea, thank you um, But like
Speaker 1: remember before Eve doesn't know much about things, and then
Speaker 1: she's like, don't you quote Alistair Crowley. I mean, I'm like, wait,
Speaker 1: when did she become like she has a lot of
Speaker 1: books educational but we don't see that. But it felt
Speaker 1: and then they mentioned it on the next page. I
Speaker 1: was like, Okay, I'm caught up, but it felt very weird.
Speaker 1: At first, because that wasn't who this character was. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but they did show her, okay, so there was a
Speaker 1: specific like they did show her working out and like
Speaker 1: getting ripped because at the end I was like, how
Speaker 1: did she pick up the and put him onto this
Speaker 1: like Viking burial? And I was like, because she worked out,
Speaker 1: so Karma, I see, I see your point. I see
Speaker 1: your point. We should have seen some reading from her, yeah,
Speaker 1: just a little montage of her like reading, I like
Speaker 1: doing co ups, you know, yeah, I think, yeah, that's good.
Speaker 1: The panel that was helen hair getting riped could have
Speaker 1: been EVI reading a book. Just push everything back one panel. Sure.
Speaker 1: I tried to think about what it ended would be
Speaker 1: like that I would have liked more, and I had
Speaker 1: a very difficult time coming up without nothing though. I
Speaker 1: think the idea that e VI becomes fee is really nice.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I wanted Helen to meet up
Speaker 1: with Finch and him to be like, that's a great plan, Helen,
Speaker 1: You're right, let's take over the world. Were the villains
Speaker 1: now to protect the world from devastation? Yeah, I do
Speaker 1: it is I think satisfying that she puts on the mask.
Speaker 1: That felt inevitable, but it didn't have like comics can
Speaker 1: have a big emotional impact, you know, like a full
Speaker 1: splash page or like, I don't know something about it
Speaker 1: didn't feel like it's almost like I think some artists
Speaker 1: and writers think that, like, sometimes things are cliche so
Speaker 1: they don't do them, But sometimes things are cliche because
Speaker 1: they work, and it's like, well, don't take those tools
Speaker 1: out of your toolbox because they work. So I kind
Speaker 1: of think that maybe Allan Moore was consciously like, I'm
Speaker 1: not going to give you like the big, clean, thartic
Speaker 1: third act reveal that you want when it's like, well, yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe that's like a classic structure, but it's classic because
Speaker 1: it it's sort of proven and audience is like that right,
Speaker 1: and you're gonna screw something into a wall, you're probably
Speaker 1: going to need to use like a Phillips had screwdriver. Sorry,
Speaker 1: that's just what you want to get that job done,
Speaker 1: and if you want to satisfying ending, there are some
Speaker 1: tools that you will need to rely on. Okay, very
Speaker 1: butch metaphor love it, love it. But maybe maybe as
Speaker 1: as you've said before that this is like manifesto art,
Speaker 1: like maybe he wanted it to be unsatisfying, because you know,
Speaker 1: revolution anarchy and trying to overthrow some sort of fascist
Speaker 1: government isn't like a one and done catharsis ending, And
Speaker 1: it's like a kind of how we feel which is
Speaker 1: this like in overthrowing the government isn't like a c
Speaker 1: W what are you talking about? But I mean, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe that's what he was trying to go for. It's
Speaker 1: like all of this chaos has happened, and like some
Speaker 1: people will move forward and walk off into the distance
Speaker 1: like Finch and not turn back. But like, no one's
Speaker 1: going to get a satisfying ending from this. But I
Speaker 1: guess my I totally agree with you that I think
Speaker 1: that that's what Alan Moore is going with. But I
Speaker 1: think that some things are so neat, like like V
Speaker 1: being like uh my last rose that I cultivated with Rosemary,
Speaker 1: and then some things are so messy where I'm like
Speaker 1: one or the other. I think that the idea that
Speaker 1: V has been formulating this plan for twenty years and
Speaker 1: it is like a perfectly orchestrated plan like that is
Speaker 1: very satisfying to me, and so I wish that like
Speaker 1: carried through to the structure of the end of the book,
Speaker 1: and I think to me, that didn't like I agree.
Speaker 1: I think that's what Allan Moore was trying to do
Speaker 1: with the ending, And I feel like it didn't land
Speaker 1: for me because they personalized it with this character of
Speaker 1: Helen Higher, which feels like still these plans are working
Speaker 1: that because she's a part of the system and Finch,
Speaker 1: you know, bested v and he's walking off. Like if
Speaker 1: it were I think it would be more anonymous, like
Speaker 1: seeing the chaos and seeing the you know, people being
Speaker 1: killed or raped or assaulted like as and it's like,
Speaker 1: oh and the system and it like continues to be
Speaker 1: good and bad or happening at the same time. But
Speaker 1: when you personalize it with this woman that like she's
Speaker 1: getting hers you know, it just feels like, oh and
Speaker 1: you know, you don't see that much good happening. Would
Speaker 1: Would it be nicer if some people were growing a
Speaker 1: community guarding Yes, I love that because like that's the
Speaker 1: thing you can do with your neighbors. It doesn't require
Speaker 1: organized leadership. Um, like you could help your neighbors and
Speaker 1: that would be nice and that would show us that like,
Speaker 1: while we may not be returning to the fascist system
Speaker 1: of government they had before, there can still be communal
Speaker 1: projects that people working together. And I think you should
Speaker 1: write a Purge that's just about community. I said that,
Speaker 1: I said, if you were the Purge, thought like, that's
Speaker 1: the dystopia. I would want to live in no rules?
Speaker 1: What are you going to plan one day? One day
Speaker 1: you're doing crazy good like it's a great day, canceled
Speaker 1: student loans? Yeah, what would instead of the Purge? What
Speaker 1: would you call it? Then? Well, I mean it's still
Speaker 1: the Purge, like you could rules just right? But are
Speaker 1: you copyrighting it and making it does right? W No? No,
Speaker 1: I no, I'm giving it to the people. I'm giving
Speaker 1: it to the people who've got to grow a command
Speaker 1: And now I imagine with w r U L Yes,
Speaker 1: no rules, no rule right, just right. It's also weird.
Speaker 1: But if this is Alan Moore's manifesto, he doesn't leave.
Speaker 1: He doesn't make the end feel like outful or exciting,
Speaker 1: like you want to join. Uh these I'm like this
Speaker 1: looks bad. It seems scary and bad, and it seems
Speaker 1: sort of like the people who have the avatars on
Speaker 1: bad internet forums. I'm like, oh, I start to get
Speaker 1: it now. Maybe it's so scary and bad to you
Speaker 1: all because you're stuck in the happiness prison. Happiness is
Speaker 1: a per prison get out. But he did nothing but
Speaker 1: treat himself like a nineteenth century super wealthy aristocrat. He's
Speaker 1: surrounded by books and priceless oil paintings. Um, he's always
Speaker 1: eating like fine foods. He's lording his superior already for
Speaker 1: women who live in his house, um, and then being
Speaker 1: contemptuous of him. I'm sorry. V to me does not
Speaker 1: read as like a forward thinking individual, and he reads
Speaker 1: as the most entitled rich man knife And he's not
Speaker 1: a proletariat. He's not like out working in the fields,
Speaker 1: like the means of production. He is, yeah, listening to
Speaker 1: his jukebox and again reading Shakespeare. He's not going to
Speaker 1: share any of those paintings with people. Those are kings.
Speaker 1: And now there she got jan Herod his house. This
Speaker 1: supports my belief that V is gay and that he's
Speaker 1: not like a political dissent person that they threw in
Speaker 1: the camps. He's not. I don't think he's a person
Speaker 1: of color, like just in terms of the people that
Speaker 1: they were trying to exterminate in that camp and that
Speaker 1: they were experimenting on the Only thing is like assists
Speaker 1: like white gay dude. That makes sense to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think so. I think that's also a good transition
Speaker 1: for next week because I think the V that we
Speaker 1: see in the movie is I think he reads very
Speaker 1: gay to me, and I think he's very theatrical, and
Speaker 1: I like the way that character comes across from comes across.
Speaker 1: I mean, I get spoiler alert that they try to
Speaker 1: make him fall in love with e V. I don't
Speaker 1: buy it. I don't buy it. Are there any final
Speaker 1: notes on on the book that you guys want to
Speaker 1: make before we close out? I think I'll say I
Speaker 1: think we've been like ripping apart the third book, but rightfully,
Speaker 1: but I really loved reading this book, and I think,
Speaker 1: you know, it is so compelling and is someone This
Speaker 1: is my first graphic novel I've ever read, and I
Speaker 1: think it is It brings you into a world so
Speaker 1: quickly and that feels so razor sharp and obviously much
Speaker 1: to Allen Moore's uh chagrin, extremely universal and extremely timeless
Speaker 1: and could be about any any current uh cool closing
Speaker 1: and fascist society that I M really enjoyed it really well, said, yeah,
Speaker 1: very well said. I don't know if I can top that.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna say something stupid, but I think that
Speaker 1: more books should have weird dudes that want to sleep
Speaker 1: with a computer that's in love with more ink. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, women sleeping with tech. I'm just gonna say
Speaker 1: that out yeah, yeah, okay, making an opportunity. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: feel like it would work better that way. Okay, cool,
Speaker 1: I guess we'll write that. Well. On that note, I
Speaker 1: think they have to end this year. Thanks for listening.
Speaker 1: We'll catch you next week when we talk about Before
Speaker 1: Vendetta the film. That's our show for the week. Thank
Speaker 1: you so much for listening. I'm Danis Schwartz and you
Speaker 1: can find me on Twitter at Danish Schwartz with three
Speaker 1: z s. You can follow Jennifer Wright at jen Ashle
Speaker 1: right Karama, Donqua is at Karama Drama, Melissa Hunter is
Speaker 1: at Melissa f tw and Tan Tran is smart enough
Speaker 1: to have gotten off Twitter, but she is on Insta
Speaker 1: at Hank Tina. Our executive producer is Christopher Hessiotes and
Speaker 1: were produced and edited by Mike Johns. Special thanks to
Speaker 1: David Wasserman. Popcorn Book Club is a production of I
Speaker 1: Heart Radio