Speaker 1: Of the Law and Order franchises. SVU is considered especially watchable.
Speaker 2: We are the amateur detectives who kind of investigate the
Speaker 2: vicious felonies. These episodes are based on. These are our stories.
Speaker 3: Done done.
Speaker 2: Yay, that's messed up an sv podcast. We're coming to
Speaker 2: you with another episode. I'm Lisa and I'm Kara, and yeah,
Speaker 2: every week another one. We never stop. We never stop,
Speaker 2: and I think some people sometimes stop, but we do not.
Speaker 1: We really never have taken a break. And I hope
Speaker 1: all of you notice that these Chris re releases ever one,
Speaker 1: never have we done a re release.
Speaker 4: We get it fucking done.
Speaker 2: It's so funny because we pre quartered last interview like
Speaker 2: our last intro though, and everyone today is like, hope
Speaker 2: you're recovering from Saint Patrick's to day, and it was
Speaker 2: like I was in bed by eleven. We know Saint
Speaker 2: Patrick's in my heart and mine. I agreed to like
Speaker 2: do a sketch for for I don't know, it's just yeah.
Speaker 2: I had a lot of spots this weekend, so I
Speaker 2: was walking around a lot and people were out and
Speaker 2: I felt jealous.
Speaker 4: I was there. My husband was in Chicago this past weekend.
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, Chicago on Saint Patrick's
Speaker 1: Day weekend.
Speaker 2: I mean, I misbehaved so bad one of the parades
Speaker 2: got canceled for years. I mean it's yeah, I almost
Speaker 2: got arrested by Secret Service because I did charge at
Speaker 2: Rod Blogoyevitch.
Speaker 4: And this is pre arrests.
Speaker 2: And I'm sure I've brought this up before, but I knew,
Speaker 2: I know a scumbag.
Speaker 1: You charged at it. I don't think i've ever heard
Speaker 1: this book. I was fucking blacked out as all hell.
Speaker 2: I should find the photos because I'm like so blonde,
Speaker 2: so drunk, and my friend and I just saw his
Speaker 2: ass in the parade and I just started going at
Speaker 2: him and then like you know, people in suits started
Speaker 2: coming at me, and then we ran away and then
Speaker 2: we went ice skating, so which I can't believe. I think, God,
Speaker 2: we didn't fall break our faces. I mean, what like,
Speaker 2: blacked out as fuck ice skating and charging at you know,
Speaker 2: the governor. But you know he's been pardoned, but he
Speaker 2: is a piece of shit, like every politician, every I
Speaker 2: honestly death to them all.
Speaker 4: JK.
Speaker 2: This is our postwatch what Happens live intro. That is true,
Speaker 2: But and I was supposed to go to Luigi's trial
Speaker 2: tomorrow postponed another thirty days. Oh my god, without an
Speaker 2: indictment being held. But yeah, so I was gonna go
Speaker 2: to court tomorrow.
Speaker 4: I'm not.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be April nineteenth. And that also ends like
Speaker 2: that's gonna be the limit to like his right for
Speaker 2: a speedy trial.
Speaker 4: All that.
Speaker 2: I actually wrote an email to care and the lawyer
Speaker 2: through the White site, so if I get more info,
Speaker 2: I'll update everybody. But I'm just because I watched all
Speaker 2: this stuff and I read some of the things this
Speaker 2: morning before soul cycle. I'm a busy girl. Oh my god,
Speaker 2: my best friend accused me.
Speaker 1: She goes, She goes, I I'm into this Luigi stuff
Speaker 1: better than when you were obsessed the gypsy Rose Blanchard.
Speaker 4: I go, that has never happened. I go.
Speaker 2: I was interested because that is a big thing, but
Speaker 2: I go, there was never an inkling that that was
Speaker 2: going to be an obsession and follow And we got
Speaker 2: into kind of like an argument yesterday because I was like,
Speaker 2: you're I can just.
Speaker 1: Back up the that I don't remember that being a
Speaker 1: thing of yours. No, obviously we were interested, we were
Speaker 1: chatting I'm glad she's free.
Speaker 4: Am I following her every step?
Speaker 1: No? It makes me oh, the Luigi of it all
Speaker 1: is not even You've barely given Gypsy a wink compared
Speaker 1: to the list.
Speaker 4: Thank you. She didn't believe me, and I go no.
Speaker 2: Internally, I'm telling you I never felt the same way.
Speaker 2: But also with what's happening at Colombia and all these
Speaker 2: people getting deported, it's like too much to think about.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I'm doing this and.
Speaker 2: Anyways, Yeah, so Pennsylvania, basically there's all these motions to
Speaker 2: throw all these the rest away and all this evidence.
Speaker 2: So that's a separate thing. That's a separate lawyer. And
Speaker 2: then this federal case. So my thing is like is
Speaker 2: it because because if the federal government had enough evidence
Speaker 2: in a case, why wouldn't they just indict him?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 2: So it's like do they not have a case? And
Speaker 2: this is better? Is this also good for her because
Speaker 2: she can build a case? Are they trying to work
Speaker 2: on a plea right now? Is this unfair? Is like
Speaker 2: what is actually going on? But after the indictment, it
Speaker 2: has to be a max of seventy days to get
Speaker 2: to trial, Like I am just like trying to do
Speaker 2: comedy and be a fun girl. But anyway, so I'll
Speaker 2: keep you posted if Karen responds to me, I also,
Speaker 2: I did you know I dropped the pod. I was like, listen,
Speaker 2: I have been, you know, spouting about you on a
Speaker 2: lot of stuff.
Speaker 4: Yeah, but I can always stop, I go. If you'd
Speaker 4: like me to stop, I'll stop.
Speaker 2: But if you have any thing, because in my head,
Speaker 2: I'm like, I guess it gives her more time to
Speaker 2: like work on this case and get the death penalty
Speaker 2: off the table, and like and is it good?
Speaker 4: Do they not have a case?
Speaker 2: Like what does them holding him without an indictment and
Speaker 2: keep asking for excessions me?
Speaker 1: And you know, I'm curious where would he get the
Speaker 1: death penalty in New York? I thought the name in
Speaker 1: New York, it's federal. It's the federal. They're like, the
Speaker 1: federal government is because this is the thing. The defense
Speaker 1: is complying with all of this and agreeing to it.
Speaker 1: So like I read one of the documents and it's
Speaker 1: like the defense says yes, but the last the last
Speaker 1: court date where I read the transcription, she was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: we're agreeing to it because the death penalty is being
Speaker 1: loomed over our head, like, yeah, we're not gonna fight,
Speaker 1: like we have to comply. There's a man's life is
Speaker 1: on the line, right So but yeah, it's like federal.
Speaker 1: But I don't think they have an actual case because
Speaker 1: they keep asking for these extensions.
Speaker 2: So I don't know. I don't know. I do think that,
Speaker 2: like I think it's like a frame job. I think
Speaker 2: they couldn't find someone they had to or it was
Speaker 2: like a professional type pit And I think they like
Speaker 2: got the wrong pansy. I think they are if they
Speaker 2: got the wrong patsy.
Speaker 1: If you're gonna frame somebody, you can't pick a guy
Speaker 1: that hot, you you cannot Next time, guys.
Speaker 4: You gonna not only hot.
Speaker 2: We have ivy League valedictorian of like private high school,
Speaker 2: so we have sexy, we have brains, we have wealth,
Speaker 2: and we and he seems zen.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I I don't know. Yeah. I had
Speaker 1: to tell Ralph Lauren on that first day. Wait, can
Speaker 1: we also talk about no if unless is Luigi? Watch
Speaker 1: are we concluded? I don't want to cut you off, Like, okay,
Speaker 1: So we've been getting tons and tons of this video
Speaker 1: of what looks like the.
Speaker 2: FBI girl it is we someone better fucking d m us.
Speaker 2: There is no way. There is no way.
Speaker 1: So we got this video of what looks like the
Speaker 1: FBI going into a New York City art gallery and
Speaker 1: taking a stolen Rembrandt painting that it like is believed
Speaker 1: to be part of the Isabella Stuart Gardner heist, which
Speaker 1: we just did last week on the podcast Wait Happened?
Speaker 4: Message fucking Lare.
Speaker 1: Here's the deal it was. It's a marketing ploint, of
Speaker 1: course it.
Speaker 2: Is, because in my head, what what I was seeing
Speaker 2: and that's what I wanted to confirm with our friend
Speaker 2: was like that that wouldn't be in a Chelsea art gallery,
Speaker 2: is what I kept saying online where it's like this
Speaker 2: is a Rebrandt would not be hanging out in Chelsea?
Speaker 2: Is Yes, I was what I saw, you know, briefly
Speaker 2: on the internet.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and then so who was in a publicity
Speaker 1: stunt for? Because the FBI doesn't real but fuck you?
Speaker 1: How dare you do this so close to us?
Speaker 4: I know?
Speaker 1: And like the whole thing is that when people when
Speaker 1: somebody was like yeah, but somebody message us like yeah,
Speaker 1: but why does the guy look the FBI agent look
Speaker 1: like Colin Joe's and it's true, like they had they
Speaker 1: should have cast somebody older, more hag like this young
Speaker 1: fresh faced FBI agent being like, excuse me, he just
Speaker 1: seems like an actor. Let's see, it's supposed to be
Speaker 1: called any Day Now the movie, but I don't see
Speaker 1: it's for a movie. Yeah, yea, oh my god, well
Speaker 1: ye boycott. I don't see anything about the movie on
Speaker 1: IMDb or anything. There's another movie called any Day Now,
Speaker 1: and it's y it's from twenty twelve, so like I
Speaker 1: don't really get it. But there's a full article on
Speaker 1: Boston Nbcboston dot com that is talking about how this
Speaker 1: the director's name is Eric Aaronson.
Speaker 4: In the movie about the Museum, Like what the fuck?
Speaker 1: The film premiere's Monday Night, which I think is like yesterday, right,
Speaker 1: let me just look at the date of this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so the film premiered on Saint Patrick's Day Monday at
Speaker 1: the Summerville Theater and is loosely based on the nineteen
Speaker 1: ninety heist.
Speaker 4: But it's just wild.
Speaker 1: It's like, you have this, it's a it must be
Speaker 1: a very indie movie. It doesn't even have an IMDb
Speaker 1: and this stunt is like very seems very high. You
Speaker 1: know what I've inexpensive, you know what I've learned.
Speaker 2: You know how most movies get made in Hollywood rich parents. Okay, yeah, sorry,
Speaker 2: I'm sure someone helped pay for the Indy and he
Speaker 2: had money to do this.
Speaker 1: But yeah, because literally, like this is playing at No Shade,
Speaker 1: but Summerville just like a small neighborhood of Boston, and
Speaker 1: but only that, like bake Heist is in New York,
Speaker 1: like you're you're doing across state lines. All the articles
Speaker 1: are back up like I'm looking, and it's just like
Speaker 1: article or six hours ago, forty four minutes, so twenty
Speaker 1: hours ago.
Speaker 2: All of this. We we talked about this weeks ahead.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry and I want yeah, and I don't care. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that's we totally and no one's asking for our expert opinion.
Speaker 2: This is nonsense, the disrespect Again, why am I not
Speaker 2: being asked questions?
Speaker 4: I just like, this is a huge stunt for a.
Speaker 1: Movie that doesn't have an IMDb page, and like literally
Speaker 1: web videos have IMDb pages, commercials have IMDb pages now,
Speaker 1: so it's.
Speaker 4: A huge stunt.
Speaker 1: Anyway, I did think for three seconds that they possibly
Speaker 1: were finding a real part of the Isabella Stewart Gardner
Speaker 1: heist and that we had.
Speaker 4: Something to do with it, and I was excited.
Speaker 2: Okay, so I apologize. I do have another Luigi thing,
Speaker 2: so the one thing that's funny. So I have to
Speaker 2: follow these Luigi accounts and I will say they are unhinged,
Speaker 2: and I think these people are unwell, but that's my
Speaker 2: only way to know that there's new documents or motions
Speaker 2: or like stuff happening like so sometimes they so all
Speaker 2: of them are like pissed because Law and Order original
Speaker 2: Recipe is doing a Luigi based case and they're like,
Speaker 2: how is this legal? We need to get this down
Speaker 2: what the fuck? And I had to be like, listen, guys,
Speaker 2: this is not an orchestrated attack. They've been doing this
Speaker 2: for thirty plus years. You're making us look crazy, like
Speaker 2: you cannot go after Law and Order like that is.
Speaker 4: They're like, literally, that's the thing.
Speaker 2: I was like, they get away with it because there's
Speaker 2: a disclaimer up top, like girl, but it was funny.
Speaker 4: Are you caught up on White Lotus? Yes? I love
Speaker 4: Walt Walton, Walton.
Speaker 1: Walt Goggins walk body that him listening to Sam Rockwell
Speaker 1: talk Fellow Soul cycler.
Speaker 2: I was like obsessed. I'm like, honestly, what a cool
Speaker 2: face to make. I loved it.
Speaker 4: And Sam Rock Wellry Bibb your soul cycle.
Speaker 2: He's the Megan Fahe of this season. So much with
Speaker 2: a face, so much with a face, it's like heavenly.
Speaker 1: This season is so like scary, Like I feel like
Speaker 1: the other two seasons, it's.
Speaker 4: Like you know someone's gonna die.
Speaker 1: I guess like that's the like you you obviously know
Speaker 1: a body is going to wash up. But in Hawaii
Speaker 1: and Venice, I never felt like, oh, these people are
Speaker 1: all in danger. In Thailand, I'm like anybody could be
Speaker 1: murdered at any moment for some reason, and like just
Speaker 1: like so many sketchy people staying at this hotel, like
Speaker 1: the girls.
Speaker 4: Manager go fuck yourself.
Speaker 2: And I heard he played the big Nazian zone of interest,
Speaker 2: so you know he's.
Speaker 4: Got a face. Oh my god, that is him. Shit,
Speaker 4: I just put that together. Fuck he's good though.
Speaker 2: Also I learned that my last Luigi letter was too
Speaker 2: long and it will be sent back, so I had
Speaker 2: to write this is my fifth attempt too long.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, I didn't know there was a word count.
Speaker 1: I diden either it's three page max Eight eight and
Speaker 1: a half by eleven standard sized paper, I'm assuming.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well yeah, you can't have non standard size. They
Speaker 2: sent that back too. Yeah wow, these prisons, these prisons.
Speaker 4: You wrote more than three pages to him?
Speaker 2: Unfortunately I did, because other things kept getting sent back.
Speaker 2: Oh it wasn't like I had like this is actually
Speaker 2: five letters in one I have a lot to say. Okay,
Speaker 2: it was just like all of these because I had
Speaker 2: three letters get sent back, so and I know my
Speaker 2: fourth one's about to get sent back, so I'm just
Speaker 2: like waiting for it, like so annoyed. I'm like, I
Speaker 2: don't even care anymore. I mean I do. I'd like
Speaker 2: to get I just want to offer my services. Okay,
Speaker 2: this is actually like for some reason, I might have
Speaker 2: been drunk or just like excited, but someone gave me
Speaker 2: this idea and I acted like we've never thought about
Speaker 2: this ever in our lives, but clearly we've played this
Speaker 2: probably and with these people. But it might just be fun.
Speaker 2: Fuck Mary kil Amorrow, Stabler cares God.
Speaker 1: I don't really want to be married to any of them,
Speaker 1: to be honest, Oh I do.
Speaker 4: I just don't.
Speaker 2: Okay, I'm fucking tomorrow, I'm marrying Caresy and I'm murdering Stabler.
Speaker 1: Yeah, unfortunately, I think I'm murdering Careesy and fucking tomorrow
Speaker 1: and marrying Stabler. I don't think I'm gonna like it,
Speaker 1: but I don't want to be married to Carese either.
Speaker 1: I can't like with theh you want to can like?
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 4: I can't.
Speaker 1: I don't think that's for me. He's gonna be like
Speaker 1: want bacon for breakfast? Ever, I don't know. I just
Speaker 1: it's not I don't think. I just not tracted to Creasy,
Speaker 1: but I guess marriage isn't about that. I would rather
Speaker 1: argue with Stabler than just be like bored with Creasy.
Speaker 1: I think I would be bored with Creasy personally. That's it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's fine, but it's just that's who I'm picking.
Speaker 2: I don't want to be married to Stabler. He has
Speaker 2: never gone to therapy and he has anger problems like
Speaker 2: I'm not yode for that.
Speaker 1: I would hate it. I don't want to be I
Speaker 1: don't want to be married to either one of them,
Speaker 1: but I'd rather be married to someone that's too nice.
Speaker 1: At least we can agree that we're both fucking Amorrow. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: just for the one time, right, that's what buck Mary kill.
Speaker 1: It's just a one timer. Yeah, yeah, one time only.
Speaker 1: I mean, I guess they can text you back if
Speaker 1: maybe I would just be rather be married to Stabler
Speaker 1: almost because I feel like sometimes he can be normal,
Speaker 1: whereas Tomorrow just is always fucking flying off the handle
Speaker 1: like a wacko. So yeah, I don't think I could
Speaker 1: be married to him. Yeah, yeah, we're definitely fucking him.
Speaker 2: Wait oh and shout out to everyone that came to
Speaker 2: Caleb Show Minnesota and I'm actually in Minnesota doing my
Speaker 2: own shows this weekend. At Sisyphis Brewing. They have to
Speaker 2: get a new name. It's like so uncomfortable to say it, Sisyphis.
Speaker 2: Yeah that sounds like a puss disease.
Speaker 1: Well, sisphilis does come from the words Sisyphis.
Speaker 4: Yeah, So what is the etymology? Like, why are they
Speaker 4: doing that?
Speaker 1: I don't know. Someone's got a fucking boner for Greek
Speaker 1: mythology or something. I don't know.
Speaker 2: I feel like there's probably a nice ven diagram between
Speaker 2: Greek mythology and.
Speaker 1: Brewing, you know. Yeah, yeah, but I will be there.
Speaker 1: But Caleb play is trivia.
Speaker 2: Like there's always questions and you have to get a
Speaker 2: certain amount right. And I truly knew so much about
Speaker 2: Minnesota and people were really impressed with me.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I've won every time I've played, So
Speaker 2: this is my I've played four trivia's on that pod
Speaker 2: and I've won every single time.
Speaker 4: And the minute what like, what kind of Minnesota questions?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 1: I remember them all.
Speaker 2: It asked if like the Gophers were the mascot of
Speaker 2: the university basketball team, and I said yes, and it
Speaker 2: was true.
Speaker 4: It's all truth false.
Speaker 2: Then I'm he asked if it was known as something
Speaker 2: about rivers and I'm like, you, dumb bitch, it's ten
Speaker 2: thousand lates, oh dari. And then he asked if it
Speaker 2: was what the capital was and I knew it Saint
Speaker 2: Paul and that's all I'm thinking about right now.
Speaker 4: But he tried to fuck me.
Speaker 2: Oh, so, you know, I famously know all the NBA teams,
Speaker 2: so he's like, as they're thirty teams and I got
Speaker 2: to say false, motherfucker, and he couldn't believe it. And
Speaker 2: then he said, are there ten thousand dots on a basketball?
Speaker 2: And I said more and he goes, are you sure?
Speaker 2: About that, and I go, I am and I was right,
Speaker 2: and he tried to fuck me. But I just like
Speaker 2: I do know things wildly, and I think I'm a
Speaker 2: hero for podtheads everywhere.
Speaker 1: Okay, was I believe how much you remember? For smoking Pot?
Speaker 1: Like when I spoke pot, I'm like in a full
Speaker 1: fugue state. I don't know what's going on, you.
Speaker 2: Know, Okay, Well, all right, so I'm gonna do my
Speaker 2: watch what Happens Live kind of monologue unless you do
Speaker 2: want to say stuff beforehand.
Speaker 4: I don't know anything if I feel there's a place.
Speaker 2: So I also like didn't think it was gonna actually happen,
Speaker 2: like until the day before when Andy said and tomorrow
Speaker 2: there will be Lisa. I was like, they're gonna take
Speaker 2: it away from me, Like there's no way I get
Speaker 2: to do this. Like so I was on edge just
Speaker 2: like waiting till it was the day. Then of course
Speaker 2: I go to soul Cycle with my friend Caitlin, and
Speaker 2: there I see Leslie Bib White lotuses Leslie Bib So
Speaker 2: she probably thought I was just a deranged fan bothering
Speaker 2: her to her workout, but instead I went, hey, girl,
Speaker 2: I know you love Bravo I'm on watch what happens tonight.
Speaker 2: So then we start talking about West the guests who
Speaker 2: I was on with, who I was too nice to,
Speaker 2: and you know, it is what it is.
Speaker 4: He ended up being great. I partied with him till
Speaker 4: two in the morning.
Speaker 1: I forgot he was a young man and I can't
Speaker 1: drink brown liquor. But anyways, I don't know what why
Speaker 1: I cannot remember that.
Speaker 2: So then Leslie Bib ended up giving me the best
Speaker 2: advice ever, because you do get some of the questions
Speaker 2: ahead of time, but there's way more. And so I
Speaker 2: mentioned the questions and she goes, I don't even look
Speaker 2: at them. It all changes on the fly, like be
Speaker 2: in the moment, have fun, like do not care or
Speaker 2: prep for anything, And I go, bitch, you just changed
Speaker 2: my day. So she also said not to drink.
Speaker 1: Obviously did not listen, Okay, So then like are you kidding? Actually,
Speaker 1: when we did the shots, ski Andy goes, WHOA, Okay,
Speaker 1: that was real and I was like, yeah, bitch, we're
Speaker 1: not doing water here. Actually, on my way to get
Speaker 1: my nails done, there's a store that opens at noon
Speaker 1: happened to be open at eleven thirty.
Speaker 4: Wildly like I couldn't believe it.
Speaker 2: I was like, girl, you're open early, and so I
Speaker 2: got to go in there by like a Wicked themed notepad.
Speaker 4: So then important important day of show stuff. So then
Speaker 4: as I'm.
Speaker 2: Walking, I was like, well, I gotta get andy something.
Speaker 2: I want to get some you know, I'm gonna go
Speaker 2: to my toy stores. But then I run into Sabrina Bryer,
Speaker 2: famous from the Internet, and her friend Lucas.
Speaker 4: So then I get to like chit chat.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: I love running into people on the streets. So I'm
Speaker 1: just like feeling fuck in pumped. You're feeling Jovanni, you Banni,
Speaker 1: you know.
Speaker 2: And then the prep for the day is watching Bravo,
Speaker 2: so it's like heaven. And then I wanted to catch
Speaker 2: up on some summerhouse to get my opinions sorted. West
Speaker 2: fucking dms me follows me, sends me a photo he's
Speaker 2: watching my special.
Speaker 4: I send him a photo I'm.
Speaker 2: Watching him but it's the reunion, but it's the reunion
Speaker 2: from last season, and he goes, God, could you just
Speaker 2: watch anything but that, Like, are you fucking kidding me?
Speaker 2: And I go, no, you scumbag, you know, But already
Speaker 2: that's like nice as fuck. So then Candice Hair and
Speaker 2: Makeup comes over, A couple of our friends come over.
Speaker 2: And then I brought Lane there because Andy Cohen has
Speaker 2: looked him up and down in the streets of New
Speaker 2: York multiple times, and so I brought him as bait.
Speaker 2: So I brought him as just a little bait. But
Speaker 2: Andy's too busy. He filmed three shows that day. Oh
Speaker 2: my god, three shows. Yeah, so and then I so
Speaker 2: we walk in. So then the girls are here. I mean,
Speaker 2: we're getting dressed makeup here. They send an escalate. I
Speaker 2: love a Cadillac. So then when we get there, Jen
Speaker 2: Fessler is sitting on the couch and I'm looking and
Speaker 2: I go jen Fessler. West brought Jenfesler. He's not even there.
Speaker 2: So she's there. She's so nice. We're chatting with her,
Speaker 2: and then it's kind of like drinks, having fun, making
Speaker 2: Instagrams photos. Andy says, Hi, we hug in the hallway.
Speaker 2: We get to do the promo, and then I find
Speaker 2: out I'm in first chair, and that's when, like, I
Speaker 2: couldn't even believe it.
Speaker 1: And then I'm the bartender. I couldn't believe whenever I've
Speaker 1: seen a stand up on or like somebody who's not
Speaker 1: on Bravo, they're usually in the second chair. So I
Speaker 1: was surprised one hundred percent because I was like, he's
Speaker 1: the Bravo liberty. But I was like, but he's a man,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe they'll put But that's just when I was rationalizing.
Speaker 1: After never in my life did I think it was
Speaker 1: gonna be first chair. I definitely thought second chair. But
Speaker 1: West was nice. We do our little promo. I love
Speaker 1: that we got to meet Eric, you know, chef Eric.
Speaker 1: It was just like, did Andy remember you're from us Bartending.
Speaker 2: I did not bring it up. There is just no time.
Speaker 2: He is like really wild, he has on his phone.
Speaker 2: But when he introduced me as Liza, he called me
Speaker 2: Liza twice.
Speaker 4: I saw.
Speaker 1: I knew he would fix it. He did, and you know,
Speaker 1: I went it happened. You know, I should have been like,
Speaker 1: you're gay. The gays really have the hardest time with
Speaker 1: it because they just know about love Liza. They love
Speaker 1: Liza and I, you know, culturally, I don't want to
Speaker 1: It's kind of like that's I feel the same way
Speaker 1: about Kara. When it's a British person, I'm like, I
Speaker 1: love British culture. Go off with Kara. If you're like
Speaker 1: another person, you know, but you need to say it
Speaker 1: the right way. But if you're British, you know, if
Speaker 1: you're gay, you can go Liza. I guess you know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, And if you're hot.
Speaker 2: Brett Goldstein the whole podcast called me Lisa and I allowed,
Speaker 2: fully allowed it.
Speaker 4: I was like, it must be the accent.
Speaker 2: So and West is taller, and you would think he
Speaker 2: just looks short because he's around Carl and Jesse, but
Speaker 2: like he is hot.
Speaker 4: He's fucking hot and nice and smart.
Speaker 2: We talked about geopolitical stuff like it was kind of
Speaker 2: what we talked about Ukraine.
Speaker 4: It was not on air, not on air, but he
Speaker 4: thought that it would.
Speaker 1: He's like, I thought, because of your stuff, like and
Speaker 1: they would bring up you.
Speaker 4: I was like, on watch what happened? On Watch? Happened? Dog?
Speaker 1: Come on?
Speaker 2: And then so But once he got my name right,
Speaker 2: I mean I also I won the Tic Tacto game.
Speaker 2: I won the game the fastest I think in history
Speaker 2: anyone has won it. Like I was on fire. I
Speaker 2: made Andy lapp oh about the bartending. So in the
Speaker 2: beginning when after he introduced me and he said something,
Speaker 2: I said, I've been in the audience twice. Bartended once
Speaker 2: now I'm here, and then we double high five. But
Speaker 2: that was it. And even at the end he did
Speaker 2: say drum roll. He goes, you're gonna have to come back. Oh,
Speaker 2: so that's pretty huge. And then I pushed my luck
Speaker 2: by going, can we just take a photo?
Speaker 4: And he goes, I just can't.
Speaker 2: And I go, oh my god, I'm being too desperate
Speaker 2: and he goes, you're not being desperate, but I gotta go.
Speaker 4: But don't they didn't that guy coming.
Speaker 2: That's what Andy said, not just about Andy. Andy goes,
Speaker 2: we got enough. He's like, we got enough, So I
Speaker 2: got it. It was fine. But then Julia told me
Speaker 2: Jen Fessler asked him for a selfie, and she said
Speaker 2: that she could tell Andy.
Speaker 1: Was like, okay, like he's just hired. I think he's
Speaker 1: like a tired one night. That's fucking crazy. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: to do.
Speaker 2: The shot ski, I couldn't believe.
Speaker 4: My parents were really happy.
Speaker 2: I wore a heel and my dad's like, you better
Speaker 2: get you swearing heels, and I flipped out, of course
Speaker 2: on my family. I go, I go, I got down
Speaker 2: there myself. He's like, ooh yeah, my mom such bitches. Wow,
Speaker 2: you haven't worn heels in forever, and it's like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't like them. I did it because I'm already
Speaker 2: sitting like that's the only reason I did it, Like
Speaker 2: if I had to walk at all, I.
Speaker 1: Would not wear a heel. But also go, fuck they're crazy.
Speaker 4: No, they liked it.
Speaker 2: My mom just said, you could tell you were really happy.
Speaker 2: Think you were so happy the whole time.
Speaker 1: And I think that's what led to me being a
Speaker 1: little too positive about Roasting West. But I do have
Speaker 1: to say that I said what I wanted about Paige
Speaker 1: and Craig.
Speaker 2: I feel like I let Craig have it, but in quick,
Speaker 2: concise way.
Speaker 1: That's the thing.
Speaker 4: The producer everyone really helps.
Speaker 2: Everyone was like, it's fast, just give him answers, quick answers,
Speaker 2: keep moving. And as a watcher, I hate when people
Speaker 2: think too much. I also hate when people have pre
Speaker 2: planned bits right, you know, as a fan, I just like,
Speaker 2: that's great. So Leslie bib kicked you off on the
Speaker 2: right direction just living home. I guess what I'm rambling
Speaker 2: to say is Paige DMed me. Wow, So Paige DMed me.
Speaker 2: It was a thank you for defending her honor and
Speaker 2: it's what I meant, so so nice. Yeah, because people
Speaker 2: are giving her shit and at the end of the day,
Speaker 2: he wants a trad wife to have his babies in
Speaker 2: the South and is annoyed that she has a career
Speaker 2: waiting for her to give birth, you know, instead of
Speaker 2: making it work for her.
Speaker 4: Like he's just old school.
Speaker 2: He's old school traditional while like gritting his teeth trying
Speaker 2: to be supportive. And it's been disgusting to watch, honestly,
Speaker 2: the last few weeks of Southern charn and Summerhouse. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but anyway, so it was a dream come true taking
Speaker 2: the shots, and then we all went to ear In,
Speaker 2: which is one of my favorite spots famously. I saw
Speaker 2: Dean Winters there and then my friends all left and
Speaker 2: I stayed out. I stayed out with the youth till too,
Speaker 2: and then I talk about and I've really still had
Speaker 2: a pep in my step ever since and just holding
Speaker 2: myself back from not posting more and more photos.
Speaker 1: But I don't think Brown Liquor really has anything against
Speaker 1: Watch what Happens. Like the buzz of Watch What Happens
Speaker 1: kind of like took you over Brown Liquor, you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like because I didn't puke. I just
Speaker 1: had to lay on the floor for like an Ye. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think the endorphins of watch what happened combatd the
Speaker 1: brown liquor is what I'm saying.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and I've also been so cyclicly every like
Speaker 2: I've been almost spinning off the bike like I just not.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's really sustained me.
Speaker 2: So yeah, thanks for everyone support, DNS messages, for watching,
Speaker 2: and don't be mad at Andy for calling me Eliza.
Speaker 2: It also happened when I met Miley Cyrus. It's truly
Speaker 2: my curse, you know.
Speaker 1: I mean, you have a yeah, you have a different
Speaker 1: pronunciation of a of a common name. I guess it's
Speaker 1: tough stuff.
Speaker 2: But no, I looked at the teleprompter in parentheses it
Speaker 2: said Lisa.
Speaker 1: It saw the teleprompter like Liza. Not to throw them
Speaker 1: under the bus, you know. I hope this doesn't get
Speaker 1: clipped for the internet. No, I don't think anyone's kissing.
Speaker 1: But then people obviously were protecting Craig. And then I
Speaker 1: had friends and be like, I think Craig has bots
Speaker 1: because there's all these people writing crazy shit. Was zero followers,
Speaker 1: zero post zero I read yeah, and people were like transfer.
Speaker 1: People are like, I bet she has balls, and I'm
Speaker 1: like Lady Gaga and like, would that be the worst
Speaker 1: thing to transphobic here? I don't think so, Oh my god,
Speaker 1: and West, I can't off camera. I could tell you
Speaker 1: some scoop that I got from but I you know,
Speaker 1: I have to I have to protect the confidence. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I have your new your new best friend. Yeah, of course,
Speaker 1: of course we texted the next day. I truly like,
Speaker 1: am livid. I'm livid that he was great because in
Speaker 1: my head, I know I'm gonna let this work. Even
Speaker 1: Leslie Bibb was like, let him have it.
Speaker 4: And then I couldn't. I couldn't. But yeah, dom me.
Speaker 2: If you guys have questions, I feel like I covered
Speaker 2: everything and then if not, I'll scream something.
Speaker 1: Yeah wait the but then the next day we did interviews,
Speaker 1: I had a meeting, and then I had a show,
Speaker 1: Like the I just can't really, I don't.
Speaker 4: I should have taken the next day off. I should have.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm surprised that you didn't. I'm surprised you scheduled
Speaker 1: stuff for the next day. I really am. You know what,
Speaker 1: we gotta yeah, work night streaming on Netflix everybody get
Speaker 1: out there and watch it. If you haven't had a chance,
Speaker 1: it doesn't fucking matter.
Speaker 4: Oh wait.
Speaker 1: Also like talking about somebody who's kind of an asshole
Speaker 1: on the reality show, but then you like them. Carolyn
Speaker 1: from Traders has been going on interviews saying she likes
Speaker 1: Tom Sandoval, and she's like, I think we all need
Speaker 1: to forgive. We all need to like move on with
Speaker 1: Tom Sandoval. And I was like, Oh, I wonder how
Speaker 1: this is gonna go. She's such a fan, babe.
Speaker 2: She is shooting him, but she's like someone that's really
Speaker 2: into sobriety, forgiveness, second chances. Like that's her vibe. Kooky lady.
Speaker 2: That's fine, and everyone can forgive whoever the fuck they want.
Speaker 4: I will not. I do not try.
Speaker 2: If you are willing to do this to your life partner,
Speaker 2: you're gonna fuck their best friend while you're at your
Speaker 2: grandmother's funeral. And the fair started the day your beloved
Speaker 2: dog fucking dies, your scum.
Speaker 4: I don't need to forgive you.
Speaker 2: I don't care if that's the You shouldn't have to
Speaker 2: be defined by the worst moment of your life. But like,
Speaker 2: I don't know you, and I don't need to get
Speaker 2: to know you.
Speaker 4: What is this thing? I don't need to forgive shit.
Speaker 2: I actually saw the back of Ariana's boyfriend's head this week.
Speaker 2: I went to a soft opening of a restaurant. He's
Speaker 2: an investor in. My friend said, I think he's here.
Speaker 2: I said, I went to a late night soul cycle.
Speaker 1: It's like out of my mind, and I go, I'll
Speaker 1: be there in a half hour.
Speaker 4: And I saw the back of his head.
Speaker 1: Amazing. Wow, he's cute. They seem happy. I think, you know,
Speaker 1: I think everything happens for a reason. Now she's with
Speaker 1: a better guy. He just was such a fucking adult
Speaker 1: on the Traders. It was so entertaining to watch, Like
Speaker 1: I would watch him on more shows where he thinks
Speaker 1: he's so important and he's.
Speaker 4: Such a dumb ass. But anyway, let's get go.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: And I don't know if this was the after show
Speaker 2: or on regular on the watch Rappons side, but it's like,
Speaker 2: which wife should have a comeback? And I said, Eileen,
Speaker 2: and Andy goes on the regular Andy goes. That's the
Speaker 2: second person to say it this week. Guess who it was?
Speaker 2: Michelle fucking Collins. Oh yep, I and she goes, that's
Speaker 2: because we have good taste. Oh look what I'm wearing.
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, she's wearing her Olivia Benson Era's sweatshirt that
Speaker 1: a listener nailed us.
Speaker 4: Okay, Casey is losing his mind. We need to start it.
Speaker 1: Look, thank you to the listener who mailed us these Olivia's,
Speaker 1: these Olivia Eras sweatshirts. They're gorgeous, and thank you so much.
Speaker 1: I don't know if there was a card or not,
Speaker 1: and I apologize if there wasn't. I thought I didn't
Speaker 1: think there was, but thank you so much for showing
Speaker 1: so wearing my bracelet that says thrashing, that's what Oh.
Speaker 1: I looked down yesterday and Oscar was like, look at
Speaker 1: this beautiful bracelet I found because they play with my
Speaker 1: friendship bracelets, and it was the one that says let
Speaker 1: Olivia fuck.
Speaker 4: So we're okay.
Speaker 1: He can't read, but you know, pretty soon I'm gonna
Speaker 1: have to start censoring these bracelets.
Speaker 4: Let's get started.
Speaker 1: We have a great show today. Okay, we are doing Spellbound.
Speaker 1: This is season eighteen, episode eighteen, eighteen eighteen. I had
Speaker 1: obviously seen it, but it was like watching it anew
Speaker 1: for me because I hadn't seen it in a long time,
Speaker 1: so I.
Speaker 2: Very much like what's gonna happen? Maybe twice, but it
Speaker 2: was fresh for me. And it also like is similar
Speaker 2: to some other it is.
Speaker 1: There are other episodes like this A spiritual guy that's yeah,
Speaker 1: takes advantage and it's not just a NICEIVU trope. I
Speaker 1: think it's you know, it's a life. It's a wild trope. Yeah,
Speaker 1: like that happens all the fucking time. Every fucking guru
Speaker 1: you hear about has done something creepy. So we open
Speaker 1: on a cold night in Manhattan. This couple's walking. He's
Speaker 1: trying to pitch like a night on the couch snuggling,
Speaker 1: and she's like, babe, we do that all the time.
Speaker 1: And she's like, I know you don't get it, but
Speaker 1: I need to do this for me. And everyone says
Speaker 1: it's amazing. So you're like, what is she doing? But
Speaker 1: she kisses him goodbye and gets in the car. He
Speaker 1: has like a moment of worry on his face and
Speaker 1: that's that and then a very early done done. I
Speaker 1: feel like we don't always get like a dunt done
Speaker 1: right in the cold open, there's a dunt done not.
Speaker 4: Since like the early seasons.
Speaker 2: Now yeah, I mean some of these newer ones, it's
Speaker 2: like a full six minute art.
Speaker 1: It's like the girl, Yeah tell New York from Ohai. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he gets such a there's a there's like an indie
Speaker 1: pop song playing like it's a full Yeah, it's like
Speaker 1: a full short film playing at the very beginning in
Speaker 1: the cold open. But this is like quick to a
Speaker 1: dunt done. And we're at the apartment of Declan Trask
Speaker 1: and it's like we already have a Declan on this show,
Speaker 1: like we're in we're in the seasons that are right
Speaker 1: after Declan Murphy, and I think we just need to
Speaker 1: give the guy a different fucking Irish name. And uh,
Speaker 1: Trask reminds me of this character and Working Girl. Have
Speaker 1: you seen Working Girl Melanie Griffith and Joan Cusack.
Speaker 4: No, but I should.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Lisa, it's one of the best movies.
Speaker 1: I love it so much. It's one of the best movie.
Speaker 4: Seems like it's up my alley.
Speaker 1: It is absolutely I mean, let the River Run is
Speaker 1: like the big song from it, you know, like for
Speaker 1: the Carly Simon song, like they're on the ferry from
Speaker 1: Staten Island and it's like let the river like it's
Speaker 1: so good. Anyway, Melanie Griffith. In the movie, there's a
Speaker 1: character named Trask and she always goes mister Trask, and
Speaker 1: the way she keeps saying, it's like that name's always
Speaker 1: in my head because she says it's so sexy. And
Speaker 1: then I looked it up and the guy who plays
Speaker 1: t is Svu Judge and Vincenzo from It Takes Two.
Speaker 1: So it is a full circle Trask moment for me
Speaker 1: right now that this guy and I forgot his name.
Speaker 1: It's phil Bosco, I think is his name, and so
Speaker 1: that just wow, that on the top of my head
Speaker 1: is part of the illness that I have, like that
Speaker 1: I just know this man's name off the top of
Speaker 1: my head. Anyway, he is mister Trask and working girl.
Speaker 1: And if you're a working girl, girly, let us know
Speaker 1: in the comments, because I fucking love that movie. So anyway,
Speaker 1: this blonde woman enters the building, the apartment building, and
Speaker 1: she goes Deanima to the doorman and then he just
Speaker 1: like lets her through and she heads to the elevator
Speaker 1: and she gets on with this other guy and he says,
Speaker 1: de anima to her, So I mean, Anima in Italian
Speaker 1: is soul, so I don't know if that's like Latin
Speaker 1: and that's some kind of like from the Soul password,
Speaker 1: but it's very on the nose, and it's this feels
Speaker 1: like some kind of eyes wide shut shit immediately, right.
Speaker 1: So they take the elevator up together, her and this guy.
Speaker 1: Inside it's obviously a massive apartment. People are barefoot, there's
Speaker 1: projections on the wall reading Release Bliss and everything now,
Speaker 1: and there's like what I imagined the CD they sold
Speaker 1: at the Rainforest Cafe, like that kind of music is playing.
Speaker 1: And then Declan Trask walks up. He's cute. The actor's
Speaker 1: named Stuart Townsend. I literally recognize this man because he
Speaker 1: dated Charlie's theron hat Mary Well. He said they were married,
Speaker 1: but they weren't married. He said that they referred to
Speaker 1: each other as husband and wife, but they weren't, but
Speaker 1: that they never actually did like a ceremony or like
Speaker 1: a legal thing.
Speaker 4: So yeah, I just remember him being really tan. Yeah
Speaker 4: he is.
Speaker 1: I mean he's especially for an irishman. He's quite tanned
Speaker 1: for an irishman. And it's like, yeah, we just had
Speaker 1: iconic Donald Logue as Declan and he was declan undercover.
Speaker 1: We don't need another duclan. Let's get another name up
Speaker 1: here with this Decklan Trask. But nonetheless he's here. I
Speaker 1: don't really know what else I know this guy from,
Speaker 1: but he's acted in a bunch of stuff. I don't
Speaker 1: know if he acts anymore. And then the girl, the
Speaker 1: blonde girl is Kristin Hager. She has been on Chicago Med.
Speaker 1: She's on suits La, which just premiered I believe, or
Speaker 1: is premiering right now, because it is kind of wild
Speaker 1: that suits just did so well on Netflix that they
Speaker 1: just rebooted it kind of and now there's a Suit's La.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 4: It's like, it's like, I mean, that's what's like cool.
Speaker 2: Timing isn't anything you know, like the Kate Bush song
Speaker 2: that became popular because of like Stranger Things, and all
Speaker 2: the songs that became repopular because of Yellow Jackets, like
Speaker 2: or that Cruel Summer from Taylor Swift was like number
Speaker 2: one on the charts year after five albums were released.
Speaker 2: So it's Jornsnoff did a speech about this. I'm not, like,
Speaker 2: you know, a musical chart genius, but it's like cool
Speaker 2: that things have less of a timeline now.
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, even like when you think about like Jeane
Speaker 1: Smart having the best time time of her career. I mean,
Speaker 1: I know she's been around for a while, but she's
Speaker 1: honestly popping like later in her career.
Speaker 4: Jennifer Coolidge, same thing. It's great.
Speaker 2: I mean I love that and everyone to make it
Speaker 2: about me. But you could still watch my special night
Speaker 2: owll Netflix, or tell.
Speaker 4: A friend or a coworker, yes, get in there.
Speaker 1: Night Owl's probably doing great right now, but like who
Speaker 1: fucking knows, in like two years, it could be something
Speaker 1: where it like pull ups off and gets mass. Of course,
Speaker 1: hopefully sooner, but you know what I mean, It is
Speaker 1: just cool to have your shit out there because anything
Speaker 1: could happen with it at anytime.
Speaker 4: Anyway. Okay, so yeah, so she's on Suit's La.
Speaker 1: She's the moment you're gonna see her more of her,
Speaker 1: And this is obviously now we're figuring out some kind
Speaker 1: of ayahuasca ceremony. Everybody's gathered around some big like cauldron.
Speaker 1: He's doling out this tea and he's like, if you
Speaker 1: open your souls tonight could change.
Speaker 4: Your whole life.
Speaker 1: And the elevator guy says to the blonde girl, buckle
Speaker 1: your seatbelt and whatever. They have like a little cheers moment.
Speaker 1: We don't see her drink the tea. We just cut
Speaker 1: to her boyfriend dragging her test VU Okay, she wants
Speaker 1: to leave. She's like, this is a bad idea, fine,
Speaker 1: I'm fine, and he's insisting. He goes in and grabs
Speaker 1: Benson and goes, I think my girlfriend Abby was raped
Speaker 1: at a spiritual retreat last night.
Speaker 4: And as they go.
Speaker 1: Back into the hallway, Abby's trying to kind of run
Speaker 1: her way away and Benson's like, not so fast, girly,
Speaker 1: I'm your best friend. She's like, Hi, Like let Abby
Speaker 1: don't go anywhere, Like, let's talk about this. What happened?
Speaker 1: Where did this happen? Can you name your rapist? And
Speaker 1: she goes, yeah, Declan Trask. She goes, he's a healer
Speaker 1: who was supposed to change my life and now, if
Speaker 1: you know, he has changed her life in a bad way.
Speaker 1: So now that's the credits. Top of Act one were
Speaker 1: in wood room blinds. Abby's explaining I was at the
Speaker 1: siahuasca retreat and Benson's never heard of yahuasca before. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's twenty seventeen. I was surprised. I was surprised she
Speaker 1: knows everything about fashion. I guess she's not as hot
Speaker 1: into the drug world. I was just so not into that.
Speaker 1: She's a cop. At the end of the day, she's
Speaker 1: not into drugs, sure, but like and she can't get
Speaker 1: spiritual or she would quit her job.
Speaker 4: It's too much beat to handle.
Speaker 1: I know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Benson can't meditate.
Speaker 1: She has to do like kickboxing only and like running
Speaker 1: in the park with a trainer. Okay, So Benson is
Speaker 1: like Ayahuasca come again and rollins is like it's a
Speaker 1: drug from Peru. It causes hallucinations. It's supposed to give
Speaker 1: you insights into your life. And I would say around
Speaker 1: this time in twenty seventeen, ayahuasca is big, Like people are.
Speaker 1: I'm starting to hear of comics, a lot of comics
Speaker 1: and comedians and people I know going on ayahuasca retreats.
Speaker 1: It's like, allegedly, you go for like a whole weekend,
Speaker 1: you drink it, you throw up a lot thing, talk
Speaker 1: the relatives.
Speaker 4: And they're gonna get into it.
Speaker 2: In the episode, I like love the people they cast
Speaker 2: in the direction it gets shotted in. It's just like
Speaker 2: it's always the worst most unstable lunatic people that are
Speaker 2: telling you it's changed their lives, and you're sitting there
Speaker 2: being like you are worse than ever. Yeah, you're worse
Speaker 2: than ever. Ketamine did not work for you. I don't know,
Speaker 2: you need to sue somebody, like it's never I mean
Speaker 2: there was one Like so it's really I've been on
Speaker 2: that for years. Yeah, cool, that's to turrent for me now.
Speaker 1: I well, I heard about it on like Bitch Sash,
Speaker 1: like Casey Wilson's Bravo podcast, Like she went out and
Speaker 1: did it and was like talking about talking about it
Speaker 1: and everything. But she was like making jokes about how
Speaker 1: she was like fucking up during like the throwing up
Speaker 1: and everything. I mean, she loves to talk about like
Speaker 1: shitting her pants and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 4: But anyway, I just.
Speaker 1: Remember being like, oh, it feels like a lot of
Speaker 1: people are doing ayahuasca right now, like it's having a time.
Speaker 1: And Abby's like They're like, okay, so you were on
Speaker 1: ayahuasca And Abby's like, no, I never took it.
Speaker 4: I got scared.
Speaker 1: So you know, one of the reasons why we didn't
Speaker 1: see your drink it is because you never fucking drank it.
Speaker 1: And she's like, this all went down around twelve thirty.
Speaker 1: But also it's like, if you're gonna do ayahuasca, you're
Speaker 1: not in Manhattan. I feel like you're getting out. You're
Speaker 1: going into the woods somewhere. It's a full weekend. You're
Speaker 1: gonna throw up. It's not like getting into a cab
Speaker 1: and going to some bolding in a big apartment. But
Speaker 1: maybe I'm maybe I'm Slee did a drug journey at
Speaker 1: a house near the airport in La So you never know.
Speaker 4: You never know where a drug journey was.
Speaker 1: Oh, that is funny. Near the airport near lax Well, Mick,
Speaker 1: I have a friend that lives there. He could do
Speaker 1: a perfectly nice drug journey at her house.
Speaker 2: But also like she was full plastic surgery out and
Speaker 2: deferring to her husband. It was just like, I don't
Speaker 2: think you're the spiritual that we're looking for.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because it's like probably the people that are actually
Speaker 1: good at spiritually leading you don't have access to like
Speaker 1: the marketing and the money to.
Speaker 4: Get to you.
Speaker 1: You know, like it's these grifter people that have enough
Speaker 1: money for plastic surgeryy or in this episode, a rich
Speaker 1: kid gone, you know, trying to change his life or.
Speaker 4: Whatever, which we'll get to.
Speaker 1: So twelve thirty, Abby goes into the meditation room because
Speaker 1: she wants to be alone because everyone's tripping, and I mean,
Speaker 1: at that point, i'd be like, babe, I'm going home,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know.
Speaker 4: I guess you paid for this.
Speaker 1: But if I'm not doing the ayahuasca and everyone's fucking
Speaker 1: tripping and puking, I'm out of there.
Speaker 4: But Declan finds her there.
Speaker 1: She says he gives her water and then she says
Speaker 1: she felt strange and dizzy after drinking the water. And
Speaker 1: they're like, oh, so maybe he slipped ayahuasca. She's like, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: like that shit is brown sludge. I would have seen it.
Speaker 1: I to taste it, and you know, she didn't know
Speaker 1: nothing about the water. Seemed weird. And they're like, okay,
Speaker 1: well he must have drugged her with something else. She's like,
Speaker 1: I felt totally disoriented. He just kept talking and talking,
Speaker 1: and the next thing she knew, he pulled down her
Speaker 1: pants and he was, you know, assaulting her. She wanted
Speaker 1: to scream, but she was paralyzed. She felt powerless. So
Speaker 1: this sounds a lot like the scopolamine stuff that we've
Speaker 1: talked about a million times, which is like, you're not roofeed,
Speaker 1: because when you're roofied, you're out right, like you're just
Speaker 1: you're awake, you're still functioning, you could even maybe talk,
Speaker 1: but you're like.
Speaker 4: Zombie like state.
Speaker 1: And you know, we just did an episode about this
Speaker 1: with the ice cream truck driver. So they want to
Speaker 1: take her to the hospital for first thing, for a
Speaker 1: rape kit and a talk screen, So good first step.
Speaker 1: In the next scene, the Gang Benson Rollins, Finn and
Speaker 1: Careesi are watching Trask give like a ted talk about
Speaker 1: really looking in the mirror and realizing your potential, and
Speaker 1: Cariese's like, why does this guy look like his shoes
Speaker 1: costs more than my rent? And Finn's like, oh, because
Speaker 1: they do. Like he's from money. His dad is a
Speaker 1: huge hedge fund guy named Tate Drask, And you know
Speaker 1: we talk about this a lot, but it's like, why
Speaker 1: do you have to work?
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then a lot of these rich people they
Speaker 2: do want purpose, and it's like, why don't you just
Speaker 2: I mean, they just don't have it in them, but
Speaker 2: it's like just help people. Then yeah, I guess he
Speaker 2: thinks he's helping people, but it is like, I just
Speaker 2: if I came from extreme hedge fund wealth, I would
Speaker 2: be lounging.
Speaker 1: Oh. It's like, have you seen that meme that's going
Speaker 1: around about Elon Musk where it's like, you're like the
Speaker 1: richest man in the world. Where's the Elon Musk Library,
Speaker 1: Where's the Elon Musk hospital wing, where is the foundation
Speaker 1: that Elon Musk does for like blind children or you
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like, he doesn't do anything good
Speaker 1: with his fucking money. Maybe he might, he might donate
Speaker 1: that we don't know, but it's like it's not Knocks,
Speaker 1: it's not He's not Bill Gates, you know what I
Speaker 1: mean or Melinda Gates. Okay, So anyway, fuck these guys.
Speaker 1: He's a fucking hedge fund baby. And they find a
Speaker 1: headline about him from notorious party boy to Shaman of
Speaker 1: the rich and Famous, and this article talks about how
Speaker 1: people pay five k for a weekend for his like
Speaker 1: little retreats or whatever. So Rollins is like there's a
Speaker 1: sucker born every minute, and Finn's like, I don't know,
Speaker 1: Like I like how Finn Like if this was Finn
Speaker 1: early seasons, he would have been like fuck these people,
Speaker 1: but that he grows so much from like to season
Speaker 1: eighteen where he goes, I don't know, everybody needs something.
Speaker 1: He's like, my ex made me go on a reiki
Speaker 1: retreat to clear my energy. And they're like, well had
Speaker 1: that go and he goes, yeah, made me realize it
Speaker 1: was time to break up. So we're having fun with Finn.
Speaker 1: But Finn's like, live you ever do anything like that?
Speaker 1: And She's like, fuck that noise. Anyone who claims they
Speaker 1: can change your life in a weekend can't. So live
Speaker 1: is as you said, Lisa not here for the fucking
Speaker 1: meditation retreats. It's just not her all.
Speaker 2: I mean maybe if she went to Jamaica she would
Speaker 2: hit a little weed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I just don't.
Speaker 2: I think she's a wine girl, very into the law,
Speaker 2: even if yeah might let me tell you mental like
Speaker 2: if we did Mollie. I don't think she would judge
Speaker 2: us if we told her. But I just can't see
Speaker 2: her as a drug girl.
Speaker 4: Yeah. I could see her.
Speaker 1: Being like after they first of all CBD gummies, I
Speaker 1: bet you somemmer therapist.
Speaker 4: Told her about.
Speaker 1: But then I bet legal maybe once New York went
Speaker 1: like a half a gummy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, just a little bit with the wind. But
Speaker 2: I think they might drug test them. I mean she's
Speaker 2: a sergeant, but yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they still drug test for weed and places where
Speaker 1: it's legal, like police, police and stuff.
Speaker 4: Well, I know, if like.
Speaker 2: You work for the federal or like you work, there's
Speaker 2: some jobs where I think, like if you're a surgeon,
Speaker 2: you can't like to ask your brother, but like it,
Speaker 2: just like there are some jobs i'd prefer you not
Speaker 2: be a stoner. Yeah, that's what I would like. Speaking
Speaker 2: of my brother, he just writes.
Speaker 1: Me, I'm gonna I'm gonna spark the joint as I
Speaker 1: give it up to the surgeons speaking of my brother,
Speaker 1: like as I literally the other yesterday he texted me.
Speaker 1: He goes, I'm a little bit behind on the podcast,
Speaker 1: but it is just funny to me that you keep
Speaker 1: saying claraza pan and it's clarazza pam. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: he goes, I'm sure a lot of people have written that.
Speaker 1: I go, No, actually, Colin, you're the first one. You're
Speaker 1: the first person to let me know that I've been
Speaker 1: saying this fucking medication wrong for so long. Anyway, live
Speaker 1: maybe as we discussed live, like that's what she's up
Speaker 1: to drug wise, she's not, you know, she's not going
Speaker 1: to any retreats. And she sends Rollins and Careesi to
Speaker 1: talk to Declan, like let's go find out what this
Speaker 1: guy has to.
Speaker 4: Say at his place.
Speaker 1: He's like, hey, yeah, like, if you're here about the ayahuasca,
Speaker 1: it's legal. I'm registered to distribute it as a religious
Speaker 1: ceremony as part of like the Church of Brazil or
Speaker 1: something like that.
Speaker 4: And they're like, yeah, we're not here about that.
Speaker 1: They do the usual song and dance like you know
Speaker 1: this girl, Oh yeah, that's abbyous.
Speaker 4: She okay, no, she was assaulted.
Speaker 1: Oh no, And then he says he doesn't know anything
Speaker 1: about her assault. But then he's like, I mean we
Speaker 1: had consensual sex, but like, I don't know how she
Speaker 1: could have thought that was rape. He goes, yeah, she
Speaker 1: didn't want to take the ayahuasca, so she went another room.
Speaker 1: Then we meditated, we talked, and then Rollins is like,
Speaker 1: and then had sex. Like again, it's like, it's not
Speaker 1: that hard to just be have integrity. If this is
Speaker 1: what you're doing and you're opening people's minds, don't sex
Speaker 1: into it. Like if that's what you're like, I don't
Speaker 1: know have sex with the people later. I'm sure they
Speaker 1: all want to fuck you, Like, don't do it in
Speaker 1: the middle of the ceremony. But obviously we find out
Speaker 1: more about this man, and he's like, well, I like
Speaker 1: to think it's more meaningful than like just sex. You know.
Speaker 4: I liked her, she liked me. We connected.
Speaker 1: And then they're like, he goes, maybe she had a
Speaker 1: change of hard or feels guilty, but I swear it
Speaker 1: was consensual, and she said yes. They asked him about me,
Speaker 1: like did you put anything in her water? He's like
Speaker 1: the drugging allegation is ridiculous, and Cresey's like, well, you
Speaker 1: do drug people for a living, and he's like, I
Speaker 1: swear to put anything in her water. He shows them
Speaker 1: the meditation room and talks about their passionate moment of
Speaker 1: spiritual connectivity. The apartment is truly huge, I mean the
Speaker 1: most massive windows in just like a meditation room. Declann
Speaker 1: tell I would love to be a location scout for
Speaker 1: s for you. How fun? Okay, So Declan tells them,
Speaker 1: of course, I'll give my DNA. But he's like, oh man,
Speaker 1: the names of the people at the retreat. My people
Speaker 1: are private like that, people expect privacy. It's like you're
Speaker 1: not a therapist. And then Cresey's like, we will get
Speaker 1: a warrant. So now they obviously do get a warrant
Speaker 1: because now they're at this woman, Christina's apartment, and she
Speaker 1: is raving about the retreat. She's talking to Finn and
Speaker 1: she's like, I'm a different woman. I see the world
Speaker 1: differently now. Declan filled a void and she also has
Speaker 1: an insanely huge apartment and Finn is like, dog, this
Speaker 1: apartment is amazing, and she's like, oh, thank you. And
Speaker 1: then they just move on and she says Declan was
Speaker 1: obsessed with Abby before they took the ayahuasca. He was
Speaker 1: asking her all these questions and then like what about
Speaker 1: after the ayahuasca? And the woman's like, I really can't
Speaker 1: speak to that. I was fucked up.
Speaker 4: Then she starts telling Finn about her trip.
Speaker 1: She's like, I was walking on water and.
Speaker 4: There was the back.
Speaker 2: This is what I was thinking about where it's like
Speaker 2: you are unchanged. I love the zoom out. This is
Speaker 2: like I wonder what the director. The director is a
Speaker 2: sense of.
Speaker 1: Humor, yeah, yeah, Like they're definitely laughing about wellness in
Speaker 1: this episode, and like because she's like, then I realized
Speaker 1: I was the owl, and Finn goes, okay, I'm happy
Speaker 1: for you.
Speaker 4: It's so funny.
Speaker 1: It's like the funniest like phin like because it's almost
Speaker 1: like Finn getting bit in the ass for what he
Speaker 1: was trying to say earlier, because he was kind of like,
Speaker 1: you know, I don't know some of this stuff.
Speaker 4: Is like good for people.
Speaker 1: And then he has to listen to somebody's fucking dream
Speaker 1: and he and somebody's trip story and he's like, fuck, man,
Speaker 1: I guess everybody should get a grip this got.
Speaker 2: This director does not have a comedy bone in his body.
Speaker 2: I mean it, oh first first directorial debut, sixth episode
Speaker 2: of Homicide, Life on the Street.
Speaker 4: It's like truly ohs.
Speaker 2: Fifty five episodes of SVU, CSIA Unit, Kidnapped, Life on Mars,
Speaker 2: and Treatment Trauma Shook.
Speaker 1: Oh my God in Treatment Made Me Depress, Damages, three
Speaker 1: episodes Boss Elementary, but like.
Speaker 4: Truly the most serious stuff.
Speaker 1: Wow, Nashville seems like the lightest on this guy's uh well,
Speaker 1: maybe it's like that kind of guy's trying to get
Speaker 1: a little humor into what he works on. If he's
Speaker 1: funny in real life, who knows, you know.
Speaker 4: Oh, he did funny.
Speaker 2: Seize, but there was no jokes there. Wrath tangled popular,
Speaker 2: Oh he did hooked.
Speaker 4: He did hooked. The director of this it Hooks, which we.
Speaker 1: Just said last week, which is so crazy because they're
Speaker 1: thirteen episodes apart from each other, or seasons apart from
Speaker 1: each other.
Speaker 2: He's been directing a fifty five episodes from nineteen ninety
Speaker 2: nine to twenty twenty four. Wow, he is a director's name,
Speaker 2: Jean Dison Zach.
Speaker 1: Oh, yes, I recognize his name, Jean Desk or whatever. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Like he's like he's like.
Speaker 4: Always in the sega sack.
Speaker 1: Yeaheah. I recognize his name because it's like it's not
Speaker 1: like it's not like Bill Stanley. It's like his name
Speaker 1: is like, you know, he has like a name I
Speaker 1: recognized from the credits. Oh, let's one day we can
Speaker 1: get Jean on the podcast.
Speaker 4: So anyway comes on.
Speaker 1: He goes, it's actually Gene, It's actually Jean Desasniak.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So now we're talking to the guy from the elevator,
Speaker 1: the guy who Abby saw when she rode the elevator
Speaker 1: up that she kind of had a little moment with
Speaker 1: and the.
Speaker 4: Elevator guy's like cleaning up. He's at a coffee shop
Speaker 4: where he works.
Speaker 1: He's cleaning up a table and he tells Careesy, Yeah,
Speaker 1: like Abby didn't drink the tea, and he's like, I
Speaker 1: fucking wish I didn't either. I spent half the night puking,
Speaker 1: and he's like yeah, like and like that shaman spends
Speaker 1: most of his soul men time on the good looking ladies,
Speaker 1: especially Abby, So this guy is a hater. He wishes
Speaker 1: he did not spend five k on this fucking retreat.
Speaker 1: And again, a lot of money to save up if
Speaker 1: you're working at a coffee shop to go puke for
Speaker 1: a while and not have a good experience. So this
Speaker 1: guy goes, yeah, Declan told me he was bummed Abby
Speaker 1: didn't drink the tea and he wanted her to get
Speaker 1: her money's worth. Then he saw Declan get her water,
Speaker 1: but he didn't see him put anything in it. But
Speaker 1: he's like, I was also puking, so I might not
Speaker 1: have seen that. And then he's like, I'm not like,
Speaker 1: I'm not psyched on that guy. He's a con artist.
Speaker 1: So all right, we're getting two different Christina, the woman
Speaker 1: from before Obsessed Coffee shop boy not obsessed. Corisie and
Speaker 1: Rollins are at a place now called body Food by Valerie,
Speaker 1: and Rollins just wants to tell. She's like, I just
Speaker 1: want to tell all these vegetarian eating fucks how good
Speaker 1: my burger was last night. And Chrisey's like, I actually
Speaker 1: ate here last week and the raw portobello fries weren't
Speaker 1: so bad. I mean, you know, I hate mushrooms, but
Speaker 1: that sounds disgusting even if you like mushrooms, Like a
Speaker 1: raw portobello fry, what makes it a fry that it's
Speaker 1: shaped in a long tube, Like, that's not fry. It's
Speaker 1: not fried anyway. Rollins is like, oh, since wonder you
Speaker 1: a raw food guy? And he goes, I'm trying new things.
Speaker 1: And Rollins goes, you ever gonna bring her around? Ooh,
Speaker 1: a little careesy love life intrigue. He doesn't comment. Then
Speaker 1: Valerie herself walks up Valerie of body Food by Valerie,
Speaker 1: and they ask her about the retreat and she's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I saw Abby sitting alone in the meditation room crying,
Speaker 1: And they're like, did you ask her if she was okay?
Speaker 1: And She's like, oh, no, I just assumed it was
Speaker 1: like cathartic tears, you know, ayahuasca provides this sort of beautiful,
Speaker 1: joyous pain.
Speaker 4: And then she goes.
Speaker 1: But then I did see Abby twenty minutes later leaving,
Speaker 1: and she seemed upset and angry, and Rollins goes, I
Speaker 1: guess her pain wasn't so joyous. Huh. So they're getting
Speaker 1: some digs in back at the precinct. They're giving vents
Speaker 1: in the info. They're like, yeah, Trusk definitely had his
Speaker 1: eye on Abby. Finn walks in semen is a match
Speaker 1: to Trask, But that's like not shocking because he admitted
Speaker 1: that they had sex. But the shock is no drugs
Speaker 1: found in her system. Talkscreen clean, no ayahuasca, no alcohol,
Speaker 1: and Benson's like, so Abby's story doesn't add up, and
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, but there's plenty of drugs that they
Speaker 1: don't test for. We've talked about that on various SPUs,
Speaker 1: Like we just did the one about the Bartender, the
Speaker 1: Solving for the Unknowns that's like two or three seasons
Speaker 1: after this one, but still, like even on the other
Speaker 1: episode that they did with Kelly Hugh, like there's copollam me,
Speaker 1: and there's like stuff they don't test for. So it's
Speaker 1: weird that they're like Abby's story, like, we're doubting Abby
Speaker 1: now because even like.
Speaker 2: The date rape drug if like that, I don't Yeah,
Speaker 2: says in your system either.
Speaker 4: Yes, well they talk about that later. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah. But so they've got Wooby Wooby. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: they've got Abby in wood room lines. I just said Wooby.
Speaker 1: That was being wood. I was saying wood room lines
Speaker 1: and Abby at the same time. So they've got Wooby
Speaker 1: in the wood room lines. And she's confused how the
Speaker 1: talk screen came back negative. She was like, no, there's
Speaker 1: no way I was disoriented. I was frozen. Benson explains, Oh,
Speaker 1: it's possible that you had tonic immobility, which I think
Speaker 1: is a great, great thing that they talk about in
Speaker 1: the show because I think a lot of women when
Speaker 1: they are attacked or in any way, like even if
Speaker 1: someone steals your purse or like you're assaulted in any way,
Speaker 1: you like, this is basically your brain telling your body
Speaker 1: to freeze, to shut down. It's like fight or flight.
Speaker 1: This is the this is the like flight or just
Speaker 1: frozen part of it, or it's it's fight, flight or freeze.
Speaker 1: Isn't that really the three things? So I think tonic
Speaker 1: immobility is the freeze. And Abby's like, yeah, I hear
Speaker 1: what you're saying about tonic immobility, but I felt this
Speaker 1: way before the assault actually happened, like I started to
Speaker 1: feel this weird paralysis. So she goes over her story again.
Speaker 1: He came in, gave her the water, told her to relax,
Speaker 1: and that he was going to take her to the
Speaker 1: sixth plane of enlightenment. And he said, when you look
Speaker 1: at me, you might find yourself enveloped by a warm feeling.
Speaker 1: And then she felt this weird out of body experience.
Speaker 1: He kept whispering, you look like a beautiful rag doll. Ugh,
Speaker 1: and she goes, that's how I felt, though, she said,
Speaker 1: I had no control over my own body.
Speaker 4: I've never had that feeling before.
Speaker 1: So now we're talking to Barba and they bring up
Speaker 1: rufe's and like they're like, well, Rufe's can leave your
Speaker 1: system in hours, like one tinkle and it's out of there.
Speaker 1: But they're like, yeah, but rhypnal doesn't really match because
Speaker 1: she remembers everything like she remembers it happening, you know,
Speaker 1: like that's more of the scopalamine. It feels like, well
Speaker 1: because like Rufie's is like you wake up and you're like,
Speaker 1: what I've lost time, you know, But that's not what
Speaker 1: happened here. Barba wonders, Oh, do we think Abby has
Speaker 1: another agenda? Like Trass comes from a ton of money,
Speaker 1: And they're like, I don't know, dog. She's a successful publicist,
Speaker 1: her boyfriend's a partner in a law firm. She has
Speaker 1: a nice outerwear, like I don't think she's like, you know,
Speaker 1: out here for a payday, and Careese's like, well, I
Speaker 1: found another possible victim from a civil case in New Jersey,
Speaker 1: a woman named Rachel Sykes who accused Trask in twenty fourteen,
Speaker 1: and then Cariesi and Rollins go to the lawyer to
Speaker 1: see what's up, and the lawyer's like, okay, yeah, like
Speaker 1: Trask is a piece of shit. She's like, Rachel had
Speaker 1: a solid case. She took a rape kit and she
Speaker 1: swore she was drugged. But there was a negative talk screen,
Speaker 1: like all the same calling cards as Abby's case.
Speaker 4: She got hired.
Speaker 1: Basically, they dropped the case because Rachel got tired of
Speaker 1: fighting him. She spiraled, She got depressed, she moved back
Speaker 1: to Ohio, and then she died three months later of
Speaker 1: pancreatic cancer. Tragic and horrible. That's like really the worst
Speaker 1: thing ever. But the good news is they have Rachel's
Speaker 1: whole statement on video and it's basically they start watching it,
Speaker 1: it's the same exact story as Abby's. She also kind
Speaker 1: of looks like Abby, like a pretty blonde, and like
Speaker 1: the whole thing about giving her the water, the sixth
Speaker 1: plane of enlightenment, the beautiful rag doll, her feeling limp,
Speaker 1: and then the rape, like all of this is the
Speaker 1: exact same. And Finn's like, maybe he slipped something undetectable
Speaker 1: into her water, and Barbara goes, I think he slipped
Speaker 1: something undetectable into his words neuro linguistic programming.
Speaker 4: She was hypnotized. I didn't see this coming.
Speaker 1: Me neither, and everyone looked shocked. I mean, in my mind,
Speaker 1: I was like, well, it can't be another drug. We
Speaker 1: haven't found thing, because that's literally they've done so many
Speaker 1: episodes about that, but they honestly do an episode about
Speaker 1: it in three seasons, so they could have.
Speaker 4: But everyone looks shocked.
Speaker 1: They're like, what, like, Barbara, you're not usually one to
Speaker 1: think outside the box like this. Victims stories are the same.
Speaker 1: Careese says, yeah, I don't know, guys, this seems like
Speaker 1: really out there for me. Am I the only one
Speaker 1: that's like, you know, from Staten Island and doesn't believe
Speaker 1: in this kind of shit. And Finn's like, I don't know.
Speaker 1: My cousin quit smoking with hypnosis. So they're like, well,
Speaker 1: we really can't use Rachel's case because the suit was dismissed.
Speaker 1: We have to prove that he knowingly used hypnosis, so
Speaker 1: let's start digging on where he may have learned this hypnosis.
Speaker 1: So now Rollins and CAORESI are at Regent's College in
Speaker 1: New Jersey and they're asking this professor about Declan and
Speaker 1: the professor's like, oh, I remember Declan because his dad
Speaker 1: gave a lot of money. And they go, well, we're
Speaker 1: going to need his transcripts. Why are you talking to
Speaker 1: professor about his transcripts? They don't have that anyway, Declan.
Speaker 1: The guy goes, well, they're going to be pretty short
Speaker 1: because he was kicked out his junior year, and the
Speaker 1: professor's like, I can't really talk about why, and they're like, sir,
Speaker 1: we're going to get a warrant, save us the time,
Speaker 1: help us nab a rapist. Come on, like, do us
Speaker 1: a solid, and they're like the guy's like, yeah, he
Speaker 1: had a serious drug problem. Like we tried to help
Speaker 1: him as much as we could, but we couldn't. He
Speaker 1: went to an addiction facility in the Hampton's called the Springs.
Speaker 1: So now we're at the Springs. We're walking and talking
Speaker 1: with a counselor and he said, oh, yeah, I just
Speaker 1: talked to Declan two weeks ago.
Speaker 4: Like we're very close, We're very tight.
Speaker 1: Guess how they helped Declan kick his heroin habit everybody hypnosis.
Speaker 1: They're like, we saw him for sixty days and at
Speaker 1: the end, if he even thought about heroin, he would
Speaker 1: physically gag. We think, I don't understand if hypnosis is
Speaker 1: so good, why we're not using it for so much shit?
Speaker 2: I think it's expensive or yeah, last the whole time.
Speaker 2: He can't just be hypnotized forever?
Speaker 4: Yeah, does it? That's what I was gonna say. I
Speaker 4: wonder if it like when I left.
Speaker 2: The Office Space, I wish I could have an office
Speaker 2: Space experience. I think I live like the guy from
Speaker 2: Office Space post hypnosis.
Speaker 1: Wait, who got hypnotized in office space? Remind me what
Speaker 1: happens in that man guy, the main guy, Ron Livingston.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's this whole thing.
Speaker 1: That's why he becomes like a different kind of guy
Speaker 1: and doesn't care about work. He gets hypno trys to
Speaker 1: stop giving a fuck and like to be a little
Speaker 1: bit more.
Speaker 4: Okay, I forgot that.
Speaker 1: Well.
Speaker 2: No, the hypnotist has like a heart attack and dies
Speaker 2: mid hypnosis, so he never wakes up from the hip.
Speaker 4: That's why he's like living this life.
Speaker 2: And then because then the ex girlfriend is pissitive.
Speaker 1: She's like, you just sat there as he was dying. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because he's in a trance, right. Okay, Wow, I like
Speaker 1: love that movie and I've seen it dozens of times
Speaker 1: and that's really wild. I just don't remember that part really,
Speaker 1: but now I'm remembering it now that you bring it up.
Speaker 4: On my Delta movies. Yeah, Delta movies.
Speaker 1: Wait, I once watched a magician like hypnotize a bunch
Speaker 1: of people on stage, and like, I actually asked a
Speaker 1: lot of my magic coworkers when I was working at
Speaker 1: Magic for Humans, you have to also be susceptible to hypnotism,
Speaker 1: like some people not everyone is and not everyone is.
Speaker 1: Like they would figure out ways, like they were ways
Speaker 1: that they would do hypnotism. They told me for like
Speaker 1: TV shows where they would bring people into rooms and
Speaker 1: they were just kind of be prompts and like different
Speaker 1: ways that you could figure out who was susceptible and
Speaker 1: who wasn't, and they would they would excuse the people
Speaker 1: that weren't susceptible, and that's how they like they would
Speaker 1: find people.
Speaker 4: I don't want to give away.
Speaker 1: All the trints. I want to know. I want to know.
Speaker 4: I don't want to give away all the tricks.
Speaker 1: But that's like you know, and then you can do
Speaker 1: hypnosis because like a lot of mentalist stuff apparently is hypnosis,
Speaker 1: and like I do believe some of this, Like I watched,
Speaker 1: We watched so much hypnosis and magic stuff when I
Speaker 1: was in the room for this show. Like one time
Speaker 1: a guy was paying a vendor at on the street
Speaker 1: for food with white pieces of paper and the guy
Speaker 1: was counting it out like it was money because he'd
Speaker 1: like hypnotized him.
Speaker 4: No, I that had happened.
Speaker 2: I saw my friend give money that wasn't what he
Speaker 2: was at Like in front of my eye was like
Speaker 2: what the fuck just happened? And then it had happened
Speaker 2: to my other friend that were at her work in
Speaker 2: the same area, like someone was hitting all the spots.
Speaker 2: And then I followed the guy and he did lose me.
Speaker 2: He's he was like a master little trickster.
Speaker 1: Wow, Like I watched I watched like at a magic show,
Speaker 1: like from a magician, like who's pretty good but not
Speaker 1: like a major mentalist. And he had this woman and
Speaker 1: he was like, Okay, look out there, everybody in the
Speaker 1: audience is naked. And I watch this woman, who like
Speaker 1: does not have a sense of humor get mortified because
Speaker 1: she thought every single person in the room was naked,
Speaker 1: and he had her beeping like the road runner like
Speaker 1: he like.
Speaker 4: I don't know.
Speaker 1: It just feels like if it helps so many people,
Speaker 1: I wish we could. I wish that like it would
Speaker 1: work like more. I guess.
Speaker 4: I guess it was more full personally doesn't share.
Speaker 2: The dangers a lot, because you know the other ones
Speaker 2: where it's like they hypnotize someone to have experience and
Speaker 2: then it's not a real experience.
Speaker 1: I don't know if I I like it for getting
Speaker 1: rid of addiction, I don't like it for recovered memory,
Speaker 1: you know, because I feel like that's dicey anyway.
Speaker 4: So yeah, so.
Speaker 1: Basically this guy every time he thought about heroin, if
Speaker 1: he even thought about it, he would gag. So the
Speaker 1: hypnotism works perfect on Decklan Trask, and they're like, well
Speaker 1: to the guy, They're like, we think he might be
Speaker 1: using these techniques to sexually assault women. And like this
Speaker 1: guy who just said yeah, me and Decklin are really close,
Speaker 1: like we're buddies, turns on him like a dime.
Speaker 4: He goes, yeah, I mean we're close, but I know
Speaker 4: who he is.
Speaker 1: Like, I like the guy I hang out with him,
Speaker 1: but I know that he has rape in his heart,
Speaker 1: Like I know he could actually assault people, no problem,
Speaker 1: Like it's just it's it's not surprising. I feel like
Speaker 1: a lot of men probably feel that way about their friends.
Speaker 1: But he was like, I wasn't really crazy about this
Speaker 1: whole ayahuasca thing that he was doing. I just feel
Speaker 1: like he's he's just like another dealer pedaling drugs. So,
Speaker 1: you know, he admits that he helped teach Trask to hypnotize,
Speaker 1: but he's like, he told me.
Speaker 4: He wanted to use it to help other people. He
Speaker 4: wanted to pay it forward.
Speaker 1: So I taught him everything I know and he says
Speaker 1: that he will help the cops bring Declan down. So
Speaker 1: now cut to Declan and the therapist guy meeting at like
Speaker 1: I can't tell what it is, a bar, coffee shop,
Speaker 1: somewhere public, and he's like, oh man, I need your help.
Speaker 1: The therapist he's like, recently, I was working with this
Speaker 1: like client, this woman. She was like an addict, and
Speaker 1: the conversation she was under like my hypnosis, and the
Speaker 1: combo got sexual. I couldn't stop myself. I kissed her.
Speaker 1: He's like, then I stopped myself, but I didn't want to.
Speaker 1: So he's setting up this whole like uh, you know,
Speaker 1: staying or whatever. Declan's like, well, hypnosis doesn't make anyone
Speaker 1: do something that they didn't already want to do. So
Speaker 1: if she kissed you, it's because she wanted to, like
Speaker 1: in her subconscious and it's like that's so that's just.
Speaker 4: The rape language is wild.
Speaker 1: Finn and Rollins are like watching all this go down
Speaker 1: in the van, you know, and the guy's like, hypnosis
Speaker 1: sometimes lead to sex. It happens, that's what Trask is saying,
Speaker 1: And the therapist is like, you've done that, and Declan's like,
Speaker 1: it's no big deal. I'm helping a woman get what
Speaker 1: she really wants. And then you could like, Trask isn't stupid.
Speaker 1: The therapist goes, when was the last time you did this?
Speaker 1: Like why would you be asking for those specific details?
Speaker 4: And then Declan's yeah, he fucked up. He kind of
Speaker 4: makes questions. Yeah, he goes, ah, good to see you, buddy,
Speaker 4: I got her run.
Speaker 1: So he gets up but uh oh, like yeah, maybe
Speaker 1: he figured out the sting. Before you can walk out
Speaker 1: of the place, Rollins and Finn are on his ass.
Speaker 1: They arrest him and Rollins goes, look deep into my eyes.
Speaker 1: So she's still making fun of the whole premise of
Speaker 1: the hypnosis. In cement room, Declan is like, you guys
Speaker 1: got me all wrong. I'm a healer that there's intimacy
Speaker 1: involved that sometimes leads to consensual sex. So they bring
Speaker 1: up Rachel Sykes and Declan's like, I should probably get
Speaker 1: a lawyer, and Finn's like, well, if this will go
Speaker 1: to trial, if you lawyer up, and then he goes,
Speaker 1: do you think a jury is gonna believe that I
Speaker 1: Declan Trask hypnotized Abby so I could have sex with her,
Speaker 1: and Live is like, A, that wasn't sex, it was rape,
Speaker 1: and b yes, I do think a jury will believe that.
Speaker 1: And then Live tells Finn, could you escort our spiritual
Speaker 1: friend to wrikers please? So now we're in court and
Speaker 1: Barbara is, oh, my god, I did it. I just said, Barbara,
Speaker 1: so out in the open, so brazen. Barbara is addressing
Speaker 1: the jury and he's doing his opening statement right, and
Speaker 1: he's like, you know, he sounds good. He's killing him.
Speaker 1: He's getting all the points in. And then uh oh,
Speaker 1: Declan has Rita Calhoun fuck. But Barbara's opening statement is
Speaker 1: slick and it's about this is a healer who's really
Speaker 1: a predator. And now it's Rita's turn. She calls Barbara's
Speaker 1: claims ridiculous. Deck Clan hask is hot and single and
Speaker 1: that the two of them had sex that night. She's
Speaker 1: kind of like Blake, basically playing on the idea of
Speaker 1: like why would this hot, single, rich guy need to
Speaker 1: do this like a little bit in her opening statement.
Speaker 1: And then we cut to the boyfriend, Abby's boyfriend who
Speaker 1: we met at the very beginning, and he's he's in
Speaker 1: court and he does not look comfortable, he looks uncomfy,
Speaker 1: and then Rita calls the hypnosis claim completely absurd. So
Speaker 1: now Abby is on the stand. She's testifying she was
Speaker 1: happy when she went to the meditation room. She's like,
Speaker 1: I was good. I didn't want to take the drugs.
Speaker 1: I went there just to think and to meditate. She explains,
Speaker 1: like everything we've heard so far, how he brought her
Speaker 1: the water. He kept saying, you might find yourself at peace,
Speaker 1: You may find yourself soothed by my voice. Can you
Speaker 1: imagine how good you'll feel while you listened to me?
Speaker 1: She said she became disoriented and felt like she was
Speaker 1: in a dream and she couldn't control her body. Then
Speaker 1: she describes the rape and how terrified she was, and
Speaker 1: that's the end of her time with Barba and uh oh,
Speaker 1: it is now Rita's turn. She asks Abby, well, didn't
Speaker 1: you go to this rot treat with the intention to
Speaker 1: sleep with someone else? And Abby's like, that's not true,
Speaker 1: and then Rita enters into evidence Abby's application to the
Speaker 1: retreat to me and wants her to read from the
Speaker 1: top of the page.
Speaker 4: I'm like, not remembering this part of the episode.
Speaker 1: I'm like, what the fuck could she possibly have written
Speaker 1: that would be so bad because she doesn't want to
Speaker 1: read it.
Speaker 4: She's freaking out. Barba's like, can we get a moment?
Speaker 1: And Rita's like, she can't have a moment during my
Speaker 1: cross and Barba's like please and begs the judge. And
Speaker 1: the judge is Amy Brebson, who is Andre Brower's widow
Speaker 1: and a wonderful judge that we've seen many, many times.
Speaker 1: And she's like, fine, you can take fifteen minutes, but Barbara,
Speaker 1: you know you're not allowed to talk to her during
Speaker 1: that time, and like, I didn't realize that, so you know,
Speaker 1: obviously we've got to send live to do the dirty work.
Speaker 1: So now Abby is in the hallway outside the courtroom.
Speaker 1: Her boyfriend tries to talk to her, and Rollins says like,
Speaker 1: why don't you come with me. Let's go, let me
Speaker 1: go flirt with you by a ending machine. And then
Speaker 1: Benson talks to Abby, who is upset, like Rita is
Speaker 1: trying to humiliate me, Like what the fuck? Benson's like,
Speaker 1: the thing is, Benson's not even trying to find out
Speaker 1: what she knows what's on the paper. She's like, you're
Speaker 1: prepped for this. We went all over this, like did
Speaker 1: you give Steven a heads up? And this is making
Speaker 1: me as a viewer like heads up about what? What
Speaker 1: the fuck? She goes, I tried three times to talk
Speaker 1: to him, but I just couldn't. I can't read that
Speaker 1: letter in open court. It will destroy him and it
Speaker 1: will destroy our relationship.
Speaker 4: I love him.
Speaker 1: I just want this to be over and I'm like
Speaker 1: I wrote in my notes, OMG, what is it? Like?
Speaker 1: I need to know what this is? And Benson goes,
Speaker 1: I get that this is painful, but if you decide
Speaker 1: not to testify, Declan's gonna walk like you know, let
Speaker 1: me just like lay it down for your baby girl,
Speaker 1: Like if you want to walk away, totally okay, but
Speaker 1: a rapist walks and like this dog will do it again.
Speaker 1: Benson also tells her they are trying to shame her
Speaker 1: into giving up, but you didn't do anything wrong, so
Speaker 1: hopefully this resonates with Abby. It does, She's back on
Speaker 1: the stand. In the next scene, she reads this whole
Speaker 1: letter out loud, and it's all about growing up in
Speaker 1: Iowa wanting the perfect life. She has almost everything she's
Speaker 1: ever wanted, but the only thing holding back is done
Speaker 1: done her relationship with Steven. She wants to progress, he
Speaker 1: wants to stay put. They've turned into roommates, not lovers.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is humiliating. He looks pretty upset. I
Speaker 1: don't understand why in the fifteen minute breaks she couldn't
Speaker 1: have talked to Steven and given him heads up. Then,
Speaker 1: Like this is so much worse that she's doing it
Speaker 1: in public and not didn't just give him heads up.
Speaker 4: She goes on, I'm not sure we connect.
Speaker 2: But I also don't think it mattered, Like, I don't
Speaker 2: think it means that she would want to cheat on him.
Speaker 2: If you're like writing in your diary you want to,
Speaker 2: doesn't mean you're gonna do it, and you went there
Speaker 2: to fuck someone just like.
Speaker 4: Of course I hate the way she's playing it.
Speaker 1: Of course, and that's why it's like, I don't know
Speaker 1: why you wouldn't just go to your boyfriend and go
Speaker 1: we'd been fighting. I felt weird, like I you know,
Speaker 1: I wanted to. I wrote down a bunch of stuff.
Speaker 1: I don't feel this way anymore, but just fy, we're
Speaker 1: gonna read it in court. Maybe you want to stay
Speaker 1: home that day, babe or something, or just so you
Speaker 1: know you're gonna get like cocked in front of all
Speaker 1: these fucking people, but not really, you know, like emotionally,
Speaker 1: I fucking can't.
Speaker 4: Believe I even use that as a verb. I'm sorry.
Speaker 1: Anyway, she goes on, and she goes I'm not sure
Speaker 1: sure we connect anymore intellectually, spiritually or sexually. I mean,
Speaker 1: these are major doubts she's having, Like this, this is major.
Speaker 1: This isn't just like, hey, we haven't fucked in a while,
Speaker 1: or like, I don't know. Intellectually do you think he's
Speaker 1: like dumber than you, or like I don't know, or
Speaker 1: you're like it's wild. So like again, I just wrote,
Speaker 1: why the fuck would you not have had your Why
Speaker 1: would you have your boyfriend come to court and not
Speaker 1: tell him? She tells Rita that she wrote all of
Speaker 1: this when she was confused they'd been fighting. She loves
Speaker 1: her boyfriend and she would never cheat on him, because
Speaker 1: you're right, none of this is admission of cheating. First
Speaker 1: of all, nobody goes to an ayahuasca ceremony to have sex.
Speaker 1: You're going there for like spiritual enlightenment and to change
Speaker 1: the way you.
Speaker 4: But why didn't she want to do the drug?
Speaker 2: That's what I don't understand the people that are like, eh,
Speaker 2: never mind, Like I don't get that.
Speaker 4: I don't either. I don't either.
Speaker 2: There were definitely like my drug journey, where there were
Speaker 2: people that were on certain medications so they couldn't do
Speaker 2: the drug we were doing, but then they still did
Speaker 2: a different drug.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. It's like you
Speaker 4: came there for that. You've obviously on your research.
Speaker 1: You're not like a person that just got like brought
Speaker 1: in for like, you know, a random Aahuascar party, like
Speaker 1: you're I don't know.
Speaker 4: I don't know why she chickened out. I don't know.
Speaker 1: So Rita goes, well, it looks like you were in
Speaker 1: a rut and looking to explore and you had sex
Speaker 1: with another man. Objection sustained, Rita. That was cheeky of you.
Speaker 1: So you can't you can't keep calling it that. You know,
Speaker 1: you can't keep doing that. And Stephen, he can't take
Speaker 1: it anymore. He walks out of the courtroom and Abby's like, no, Stephen, please,
Speaker 1: and like from the stand, you know, it's a lot
Speaker 1: of drama for the jury to take in. It would
Speaker 1: have been hard enough to hear all those words just
Speaker 1: coming out of her mouth, but let alone in front
Speaker 1: of this court room of people, Like I'm sure he's mortified.
Speaker 1: The judge adjourns them for the night, but Rita wants
Speaker 1: to meet in chambers. Some new evidence has come to light.
Speaker 1: This is one of the most fucking crazy things I've
Speaker 1: seen them try to shoehorn into an sview in my life.
Speaker 1: In chambers, Rita is introducing an audio recording of quote
Speaker 1: unquote the encounter. Apparently Trask often tapes his encounters with
Speaker 1: people at the retreats to protect himself against these kind
Speaker 1: of fraudulent accusations.
Speaker 4: What in the fuck?
Speaker 1: Like you could have introduced this months ago, it might
Speaker 1: not have even gone to trial. Like if Barbara had thought, oh,
Speaker 1: this is too damning, he wouldn't have taken it to trial,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like this is a crazy
Speaker 1: thing to.
Speaker 2: Throw out in the mid trial. It makes anything it's
Speaker 2: not real. Or maybe he's like so arrogant he didn't
Speaker 2: think you'd need it like I do.
Speaker 1: Wonder you're right, yeah, like that he just wouldn't show
Speaker 1: that to them. Oh, by the way, I have recording
Speaker 1: devices around my entire area.
Speaker 2: Like the prosecution is to give up all evidence, does
Speaker 2: the defense doesn't have to.
Speaker 1: The defense has to, but she's claiming she just got it.
Speaker 1: She's claiming it's from the guy. Yeah, yeah, Like there
Speaker 1: is discovery.
Speaker 4: I believe that.
Speaker 1: I believe the defense has to give everything to the
Speaker 1: prosecution that they have as well, like in discovery, but
Speaker 1: like yeah, and Barbara's just as pissed as we are.
Speaker 1: He's like, you're just now introducing this, like what now
Speaker 1: a warning? And the judge wants the judge wants to
Speaker 1: hear okay, and the tape is is him going, I'm
Speaker 1: going to take you to the sixth plane, Okay, you
Speaker 1: want to come with me there? And she's like I will,
Speaker 1: and then he goes and you want me to have
Speaker 1: sex with you? And she goes yes, But like, this
Speaker 1: doesn't sound like a woman who's like enthusiastically consenting to sex.
Speaker 4: Like she sounds like a robot, you know.
Speaker 1: She's just like like monotone, monosyllabic answers pretty much like
Speaker 1: and Barba's like, well, she's hypnotized. This means nothing, but
Speaker 1: Rita's like the jury might feel differently. And then in
Speaker 1: the next scene, Rita and Barba are walking and talking.
Speaker 4: She's like, hey, baby. Just because the judge is.
Speaker 1: Letting me, like, letting me play the recording doesn't mean
Speaker 1: I'm adverse to a deal.
Speaker 4: So she knows that this guy did.
Speaker 1: Something fucked up, because this is pretty smoking gun. This
Speaker 1: like a jury hearing a consent on tape. You don't
Speaker 1: really get that in a lot of rape cases, you know,
Speaker 1: like and so it's wild that Rita still thinks that
Speaker 1: this hypnosis argument has legs because now she's offering a deal.
Speaker 1: They haggle back and forth. Barba's like, I want him
Speaker 1: on the She's tried to get a misdemeanor. He's like
Speaker 1: it's a felony, and I want him on the registry.
Speaker 1: She's like assault to no registry. They're going back and forth.
Speaker 1: Now he's talking to Live Lives. Pissed, She's like, no registry.
Speaker 1: Fuck that, I want this fucker on the registry. And
Speaker 1: Abby wants to let the jury decide, and Barba's like, well,
Speaker 1: it's not really Abby's choice, Like I'm worried we're gonna lose,
Speaker 1: and like, I don't love that they're going to hear
Speaker 1: a tape of the victims saying yes. And Benson's like, well,
Speaker 1: let's like lean into it. Let's prove that Tras hypnotized her.
Speaker 1: So now Abby is back on the stand. This girl's
Speaker 1: had the longest testimony of all time. Rita's badgering her
Speaker 1: into saying that, yes, it is her voice on the tape,
Speaker 1: but she doesn't remember saying it.
Speaker 4: But she does admit it is her voice.
Speaker 1: Which is weird because it's like, it does feel like
Speaker 1: she remembers everything he said she but she doesn't remember
Speaker 1: saying yes. But she remembers everything he said, everything he did,
Speaker 1: and how she felt, but she doesn't remember saying yes.
Speaker 4: So that is an interesting thing for a part of it.
Speaker 1: I believe her, obviously, I think this happened, but it's
Speaker 1: a weird way that this hypnosis works. Now we're at
Speaker 1: a bar Live maybe we're at Forlini's, and Live and
Speaker 1: Barbara are having a drink and Barba is feeling dejected.
Speaker 1: He is like, this is not good. Careese walks in
Speaker 1: and he goes, I got something good. It's from eighteen
Speaker 1: years ago in Philly, and it's got nothing to do
Speaker 1: with rape, but it goes to Trask's accountability.
Speaker 4: This is another wild turn of this episode that I'm.
Speaker 1: Like, what Barba asks is the arresting officer in and
Speaker 1: Crisey's like he's down. And then they're like, well, if
Speaker 1: Deckling takes the stand, I will get this admitted. That's
Speaker 1: what Barba says. Benson goes, oh, this guy he's going
Speaker 1: to take the stand. He thinks he can hypnotize the jury. Okay,
Speaker 1: so now we're back at trial. Finally, Declan the spiritual
Speaker 1: rapist is on the stand and he denies hypnotizing her.
Speaker 1: He's like, nope, didn't do any of that. He's got
Speaker 1: Rita asking him some softballs and he's like nope, nope, nope,
Speaker 1: don't do any of that.
Speaker 4: Now it's Barba's turn.
Speaker 1: He asks about the money, like the money that you make,
Speaker 1: like like where where does all of it? Doesn't go
Speaker 1: all back into your ayahuasca, Like some of it goes
Speaker 1: into your foundation, right, which i's clean drinking water to
Speaker 1: impoverish countries.
Speaker 4: And he's like yeah.
Speaker 1: And then Barbara goes, so you save lives and he's
Speaker 1: like yeah, and I'm so proud of myself. Like he's
Speaker 1: just like so gross, Like he's very proud of himself
Speaker 1: for saving lives. They're like, have you ever been arrested
Speaker 1: for a crime, and he says no, and now he goes, uh, okay,
Speaker 1: I'm done with this witness. But Barbara immediately goes, I
Speaker 1: want to call a rebuttal witness Lieutenant Hill, and Rita's pissed.
Speaker 4: She's like, what the fuck's going on.
Speaker 1: They approached the bench and Barbara goes, Lieutenant Hill arrested
Speaker 1: Decland twenty two years ago. Okay, Careesi said, eighteen, But
Speaker 1: let's go with it. I should be a fucking script supervisor.
Speaker 1: I find all these holes anyway, he tells Rita and
Speaker 1: the judge. This proves that he is a guy with
Speaker 1: no regard for anyone but himself.
Speaker 4: Somehow this is let in. I don't know how.
Speaker 1: So now Lieutenant Hill is on the stand and he
Speaker 1: reveals that he responded to a car accident back in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety five when Declan Trask hit a street light.
Speaker 1: He had drugs in the car, and the officer quickly
Speaker 1: learned that Declan had been shooting heroin with a friend
Speaker 1: because that friend was upstairs in the house having odd
Speaker 1: and he died in Lieutenant Hill's arms.
Speaker 4: He was nineteen.
Speaker 1: So they're like, so this defendant ran away while his
Speaker 1: friend was dying. And the officer's like, yes, I don't know,
Speaker 1: barba bringing up this old ass crime when the defendant
Speaker 1: wasn't never got at the time, it would never be allowed. Literally,
Speaker 1: Rita calls out that it was expunged from the record,
Speaker 1: so like, I don't even understand. I guess because it's expunged,
Speaker 1: they couldn't bring it up outright. But because he lied
Speaker 1: on the stand and said he'd never been arrested, that
Speaker 1: opens the door to prove that, yes, he was arrested
Speaker 1: and prove that he is a liar.
Speaker 4: But in the course of how this, in the history of.
Speaker 1: This show, they've not been allowed to bring up people's
Speaker 1: past crimes, even when it's like even when it's like
Speaker 1: crimes that are related to the current crime, they can't
Speaker 1: bring them up sometimes, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 1: there's just no way that you're like, oh, he failed
Speaker 1: the Good Samaritan Act, which was like, I mean, is
Speaker 1: there a legal act that says you have to sit
Speaker 1: with your friend when he od's like you're on heroin?
Speaker 1: He ran.
Speaker 4: I'm sure people do that every fucking day.
Speaker 1: But saying it's a good thing, but your paint, You're like, like,
Speaker 1: I don't know if a jury, If I was on
Speaker 1: a jury, I'd be like, okay, it was twenty two
Speaker 1: years ago and he was on heroin.
Speaker 4: Like I don't know. I just that doesn't illustrate to me.
Speaker 2: To me, what illustrates the bad is not only that
Speaker 2: he lied on the stand and now we can get
Speaker 2: him for perjury.
Speaker 4: Right, but he could say that was expunged.
Speaker 1: So I didn't know if I thought I could say that,
Speaker 1: I hadn't be a question. Oh yeah, sure, you know,
Speaker 1: Like I don't know.
Speaker 4: It just this feels such a sad I'm with you.
Speaker 4: I'm with this.
Speaker 1: Feels like they had to do rewrites and they were like,
Speaker 1: we've got the whole cast here, we got to shoot.
Speaker 4: Let's just go, you know, like it was like who
Speaker 4: told us? Who told us?
Speaker 1: Like that they was it dian Neel that told us that.
Speaker 1: Sam Watterson was like, don't open Pandora's box. You'll just
Speaker 1: have so many questions, Like you know, like if you
Speaker 1: start asking questions, but you know that's our job here
Speaker 1: on this pod. So I opened the box and I
Speaker 1: want to know what the fuck? So it's a fucking stretch.
Speaker 1: So now we've got Barba in his final statement, He's
Speaker 1: like declan Trask used neuro linguistic techniques.
Speaker 4: He admitted doing that to his friend.
Speaker 1: And Barbara's basically like, what you heard on that tape
Speaker 1: is essentially like hearing a victim on a date rape
Speaker 1: drug giving consent on a tape, Like it's the same thing.
Speaker 1: He likens the hypnotism to giving someone a date rape drug.
Speaker 1: Abby was not capable of giving consent. So now the
Speaker 1: verdict is back and they find him done doone guilty.
Speaker 4: He doesn't even look mad.
Speaker 1: They go to Trask's face and he's like, well they
Speaker 1: got me, you know, like he it's very weird, like
Speaker 1: he doesn't have a misset.
Speaker 4: As like, oh, we'll see you in the appeals right.
Speaker 1: I wrote that as well, like I mean Abby, Abby
Speaker 1: is emotional but happy to watch him get carted off.
Speaker 1: And like you know, later in the hallway, Abby's there
Speaker 1: and Barba and Live go up to her and they're like,
Speaker 1: Trusk is going away for a long time, And I wrote,
Speaker 1: I doubt it.
Speaker 4: He's rich.
Speaker 1: He'll appeal a million times until he's free. Like if
Speaker 1: you're rich, you just keep appealing until they figure out
Speaker 1: something that your.
Speaker 4: Lawyer did wrong or the judge did wrong.
Speaker 1: Or something, and they get you off, like if you
Speaker 1: can keep appealing, you will. She thanks them, and I
Speaker 1: mean it also not to mention they don't even talk
Speaker 1: about it, but like the precedent of it, it's like
Speaker 1: anyone that does hypnosis now is going to be under scrutiny.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 4: It's interesting.
Speaker 1: But she thanks them, and she's like, oh, Stephen won't
Speaker 1: return my calls. I haven't heard from him in three days,
Speaker 1: and lives like, girl, you were honest about everything. If
Speaker 1: you want this loser who can't fuck back, then good,
Speaker 1: why don't you go fight for him? But if he
Speaker 1: doesn't get it, it's not worth the fight. And Abby's like,
Speaker 1: thank you, thanks again, walks off, and Barble goes, who knows,
Speaker 1: maybe it'll all work out, and Live goes, yeah, I hope. So.
Speaker 1: I think honestly, it's kind of a good thing for
Speaker 1: her to clean slate it. I think it's good that
Speaker 1: he was with her to help her through the trial.
Speaker 1: But she doesn't feel it doesn't feel like she wants
Speaker 1: to be with this guy, and he doesn't understand. He's
Speaker 1: he's having a temper tantrum and not hearing anything. She
Speaker 1: said again that could be more about the public amiliation
Speaker 1: of it all. But Stephen and Abby, you guys want
Speaker 1: different things. He wants to maybe do ayahuasca. You want
Speaker 1: to sit on the couch watching Netflix like you're just
Speaker 1: you guys. You're not on the same page. But that's
Speaker 1: stick wolf baby, that's the end. It ends on living.
Speaker 1: Barbara wishing the best for this this kind of dysfunctional couple.
Speaker 1: And that's that, and that.
Speaker 2: Is that, all right, Okay, a couple cases, a couple
Speaker 2: of little freaks. Okay, Michael Fine Cleveland and this guy,
Speaker 2: you know, married man of two with two daughters, wildly
Speaker 2: not the deterrent to crime like men would.
Speaker 1: Like to believe. So funny true. And he was a
Speaker 1: divorce attorney.
Speaker 2: He practiced laws since nineteen eighty one, and that's according
Speaker 2: to court records reported by Ruders. He didn't lose his
Speaker 2: license till November twenty fourteen. So he either like started
Speaker 2: being a freaky criminal later or he got away with
Speaker 2: it for forever we will not know. So a long
Speaker 2: time working, but finally Lorraine County Bar Association filed a
Speaker 2: motion with the Ohio Supreme Court in twenty fourteen saying
Speaker 2: that he utilized hypnotic therapy to facilitate the impairment of
Speaker 2: and sexual exploitation of his clients. And that's clearly a
Speaker 2: direct quote from Routers. The cops began its investigation in
Speaker 2: twenty fourteen, like so as a female client basically discovered
Speaker 2: her art. She was disheveled, her clothes were disheveled after
Speaker 2: meetings with him, her undergarments were moved around and she
Speaker 2: couldn't really recall anything that had occurred in the meetings.
Speaker 2: So that kind of and this is according to the
Speaker 2: Bar Association filing. And then the Sheffield Village Police Department
Speaker 2: investigated him after two dozen women came forward with similar complaints.
Speaker 4: Oh.
Speaker 2: One woman wants to be known by only her first name, Melissa.
Speaker 2: She said that he would say how he wanted to
Speaker 2: help her relax. Never called it hypnosis, but called it mindfulness.
Speaker 2: Then they had the client so like the one that
Speaker 2: was complaining about being disheveled and having memory loss, decided
Speaker 2: to start taping the sessions on her phone and then
Speaker 2: she handed over that to the authorities and then they
Speaker 2: sent her back in with a wire and part as
Speaker 2: part of a sting operation. Various I would say this
Speaker 2: is more SVU than the episode of SVIE you just
Speaker 2: even covered.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So the recordings revealed that shortly after the meeting started,
Speaker 2: he would use these code words that induced her into
Speaker 2: a trance like stage. So doctor Dan Chue, a neuro psychiatrist,
Speaker 2: tells ABC News, So the basic law of hypnosis is
Speaker 2: that you cannot make people do what they do not
Speaker 2: want to do. However, we can affect the things that
Speaker 2: you want or what you desire, and so interesting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but he's just a random guy on the news.
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know him.
Speaker 2: So there was no consent by the women obviously to
Speaker 2: go into this trance. And he would say, it's just
Speaker 2: a breathing exercise, and then according to ABC News, the
Speaker 2: trance went a little like this, your entire body is
Speaker 2: a vessel of pleasure and arousal and excitement. And the
Speaker 2: better it feels, the tighter you'll grip my hand. And
Speaker 2: then asks when was the last time you made love?
Speaker 2: And then he would ask he yes several times on
Speaker 2: the day, to bring a vibrator to the next meeting,
Speaker 2: and yeah, oh my god. Also on the tape recording,
Speaker 2: according to The Washington Post, I did not pay for it.
Speaker 2: I went on safari where I have not reached the
Speaker 2: maximum because I'm a chrome girl. So on tape, according
Speaker 2: to the post, at the count of three, you won't
Speaker 2: be able to control yourself. You will remain ravenous, incredibly horny,
Speaker 2: amazingly amazingly aroused, and an excited person, and you will
Speaker 2: insist that I touch you in any way that brings
Speaker 2: you pleasure. And then when she snaps out of the trance,
Speaker 2: he asks, like nothing's ever happened. He's just like okay,
Speaker 2: so here are the papers. And then at that point
Speaker 2: the police burst into the room and arrest him.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: They hand the case over to the Lorraine County Prosecutor's
Speaker 2: office in October twenty fourteen, and then he was arrested
Speaker 2: after the hidden camera footage in the office that was
Speaker 2: like part of the you know, staying operation obviously, so
Speaker 2: for some reason, the authorities released the footage in twenty seventeen,
Speaker 2: like to the media, like you can watch it. It's
Speaker 2: actually really fucked up, like ABC News and twenty something
Speaker 2: Yeah called it shocking, but like I just can't imagine
Speaker 2: an undercover abuse video that like helps him get captured,
Speaker 2: Like why would the authorities do that.
Speaker 1: Maybe they got her permission so that people could see
Speaker 1: what it looks like.
Speaker 2: Has she had to come forward and do an interview later,
Speaker 2: like because she was just like, yeah, I guess they
Speaker 2: did that. Oh no, did they blur her face? Well yeah,
Speaker 2: it's mostly it's just him. It's just him. But it's
Speaker 2: just like, I don't know why the public needed to
Speaker 2: see it. I'm confused why authorities would do that. Like,
Speaker 2: I just don't get it.
Speaker 1: I can only imagine so that other people that feel
Speaker 1: like any of those words, like like like oh my god,
Speaker 1: that's how I know someone that talks to me with
Speaker 1: that kind of like I guess to get the word out.
Speaker 4: I don't know, yeah, but that's yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 2: And then in like what the you know some of
Speaker 2: her phone stuff in the hypnosis, he made the woman
Speaker 2: like walk to the couch where he initiated a sexual encounter,
Speaker 2: and he actually ended up pleading guilty. He pled guilty
Speaker 2: six days before the trial was scheduled to open, with
Speaker 2: five counts of kidnapping with sexual motivation and one count
Speaker 2: of attempt at kidnapping. Can someone please let me know
Speaker 2: why hypnosis is kidnapping? I swear to you, I was googling.
Speaker 2: I was in the reddits. I was trying. Maybe I
Speaker 2: could have tried harder, Like, I don't understand.
Speaker 1: I remember one time being shocked about like if you
Speaker 1: I mean, I remember. It's like if you move someone
Speaker 1: against their will, even within like a home, to one
Speaker 1: room to the other, that's kidnapping. Apparently, like you don't
Speaker 1: have to take them out anywhere. But that still doesn't
Speaker 1: really cover what you're talking about. So I don't know. Oh, okay,
Speaker 1: I just googled.
Speaker 2: I guess I don't know why I didn't reverse search
Speaker 2: in terms of what constitutes as kidnapping. I just kept
Speaker 2: being like, how is hipnosis kidnapping? But this makes sense. Now,
Speaker 2: person acts with intent to prevent another's liberation, either by
Speaker 2: secreting her whole ding in a place or here she
Speaker 2: is not likely to be found using threatening use of
Speaker 2: deadly physical force when that person's conscious, objective or purposes
Speaker 2: to do so. Okay, so I think it's the liberation
Speaker 2: of it all. Prevent another's liberation an unlawful restraint of
Speaker 2: a person's liberty by force or show of force. Yeah, interesting,
Speaker 2: there's no other charges, Like, I wonder if that was
Speaker 2: like hard to like proven core that happened. I'm just
Speaker 2: really confused. So if anyone has answers, let us know. Yeah,
Speaker 2: at his sentencing, one victim did testify and two sentence statements,
Speaker 2: and you know, he was like, I have remorse and regret.
Speaker 4: I don't really care.
Speaker 2: But they did get more than fifty letters sent in
Speaker 2: of support, so don't worry. His wife, mother, sisters, friends,
Speaker 2: church people and pastor said that he was a great
Speaker 2: best friend.
Speaker 4: All said, this is a great guy. This is a
Speaker 4: great guy.
Speaker 1: He was just testing out his hypnosis kit that he
Speaker 1: got for Hanukkah.
Speaker 4: It's like truly on a tape that's so wild. Whatever.
Speaker 2: He also did admit it because he pled guilty. Yeah
Speaker 2: if he didn't, but if he wouldn't have gone to court.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's church people though, because they're being like he's admitting
Speaker 1: his sin and he's repenting, you know. Yeah, well yeah,
Speaker 1: he basically he did admit he his familiarity with and
Speaker 1: dexterity in hypnosis to control six women, forcing them to
Speaker 1: tend to his sexual desires against their conscious will. So
Speaker 1: that sucks.
Speaker 2: So this former Ohio lawyer was sentenced to twelve years
Speaker 2: in prison for hypnotizing and sexually abusing his female clients.
Speaker 2: Michael was fifty nine when sentenced by Judge Patricia Cosgrove
Speaker 2: in twenty sixteen, and then he was also ordered like,
Speaker 2: even when he gets out, he has to register as
Speaker 2: a sex defender for twenty five years. And I didn't
Speaker 2: know this, but during this time, every one hundred and
Speaker 2: eighty days he has to reregister for those twenty five
Speaker 2: So it's like, shit, yeah, and obviously disbarred.
Speaker 1: Uh wow, so twice a year you have to reregister down?
Speaker 2: Okay, wow, quick math? And so why didn't they just
Speaker 2: say twice a year.
Speaker 1: I'm so harried.
Speaker 2: Six months he's fucking he's fucking up, but he freaks okay.
Speaker 2: He also had six civil lawsuits and so like, because
Speaker 2: one of his former clients goes, I spent seventeen grand
Speaker 2: on his services while he his mother fucking hymno, oh
Speaker 2: my god. In October twenty eighteen, ap News reports that
Speaker 2: he was ordered to pay, but only to one client
Speaker 2: two point three million dollars. There were three other civil
Speaker 2: cases that were unsuccessful that I found out about in Corato.
Speaker 2: The judge goes, this is actually unsurprising Michael Fine is
Speaker 2: a lawyer, and even though he is now disbarred, are
Speaker 2: no longer licensed to practice law. He fought this tooth
Speaker 2: and nail and just did a lot of motions to
Speaker 2: inhibit the progress of the case. And that's on Cleveland
Speaker 2: dot com. I don't know what that is. Melissa said
Speaker 2: that it changed her life in many ways, like it sucks,
Speaker 2: like when we talk about the residual, like trauma. She
Speaker 2: won't be in a room with anybody by you know,
Speaker 2: by herself. She doesn't shut doors.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: It's like a lot of trauma.
Speaker 2: And the judge again, Patricia, I really am down with her.
Speaker 2: She said, at the lowest point in their lives, when
Speaker 2: they came to for help and throes of painful divorces
Speaker 2: and custody battles, you took advantage of them. You took
Speaker 2: advantage of their trust and faith in you sexually abusing them.
Speaker 4: And that's in the Washington Post.
Speaker 1: Love the Judge, Yeah, love the judge. You don't need
Speaker 1: to learn hypnotism, you don't need to like to You
Speaker 1: can just be nice and women will have sex with
Speaker 1: you. You could just be a good person, like I do
Speaker 1: think that everybody finds everybody can find someone to have
Speaker 1: sex with them, don't need to learn hypnotism and take
Speaker 1: advantage of people.
Speaker 4: Well, yeah, you had a wife.
Speaker 2: If it's not even about sex, it's like, yeah, you
Speaker 2: know rapists. Yeah, I wonder if they couldn't do the rape.
Speaker 2: I wonder if it didn't go a certain way. I mean,
Speaker 2: twelve years, I'm okay with twelve years. One of the
Speaker 2: victims did say, you got twelve years. I got a lifetime,
Speaker 2: so you know, yeah, finish the trauma.
Speaker 1: Twelve years would mean he's kind of out in like
Speaker 1: the next few years, right.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I for some reason, I was like, I
Speaker 2: bet they fucking let him out early. But I guess not, yeah,
Speaker 2: or yeah, maybe he changed his name.
Speaker 4: I mean, I don't fucking know. Right, there's more.
Speaker 2: There's more the Jeffrey shawcase, and it's Jeffrey GEO f
Speaker 2: fr e y if you want to, you know, if
Speaker 2: that's what you're thinking about. This guy's a hypnotherapist, obviously
Speaker 2: up to no good and he was like seventy when
Speaker 2: the case came up. So again, like, I don't know
Speaker 2: how long he's been doing all this fucked up shit,
Speaker 2: and we're in Bingley West Yorkshire, so we're in the UK.
Speaker 1: Manchester area is where I kind of put this.
Speaker 2: Shaw used his powers to rape a vulnerable patient repeatedly.
Speaker 2: Instead of treating her for what she was there for,
Speaker 2: he controlled and dominated her and that having set and
Speaker 2: like convinced her that having sex was essential to her recovery.
Speaker 2: And this was in his home office while like, the
Speaker 2: therapist's wife sat in a nearby room in the house.
Speaker 2: The Guardian reports she was unaware of what's going on.
Speaker 2: But I don't think that could really be proven, so
Speaker 2: I don't know either way.
Speaker 4: It sucks.
Speaker 2: So the victim trusted, you know this, She paid his
Speaker 2: fee after sessions, even when she was attacked. She was
Speaker 2: really into the therapy. But he did not ever ask
Speaker 2: permission to you know, for the crossing of boundaries, No consent,
Speaker 2: none of that. The woman was from Stockport, Greater Manchester,
Speaker 2: and said according to the Guardian, the attacks happened after
Speaker 2: she contacted the therapist through the Yellow Pages so Old
Speaker 2: School nineteen eighty nine. She said that during her sessions
Speaker 2: he would talk in a soft, monotone voice, counting down
Speaker 2: from ten, and his voice would get quieter, and she
Speaker 2: says she lost all sense of time because there was
Speaker 2: a very pleasant feeling of relaxation. The next thing she
Speaker 2: remembers is doing what he said and she felt powerless.
Speaker 2: And then the woman said, after several sessions, Shaw started
Speaker 2: to kiss her and then later told her to remove
Speaker 2: her clothing and did rape her. She stopped seeing him
Speaker 2: and then went to the police only after attending a
Speaker 2: rape crisis center ten years later. So this happened, So
Speaker 2: she went in between nineteen eighty nineteen eighty nine. It
Speaker 2: happens in eighty nine, she stops seeing him, doesn't fully
Speaker 2: you know, I don't know her journey in that went
Speaker 2: to a crisis center in nineteen ninety eight. The Crown
Speaker 2: Prosecution Service decided not to prosecute, but then the charges
Speaker 2: were finally brought on after the woman found an old
Speaker 2: dress which she wore the time of her like in
Speaker 2: the session, and there was semen that was traced back
Speaker 2: to Shaw DNA with DNA tests very Lewinsky. Yeah, when
Speaker 2: police talks to Shaw, he was like listen, you know,
Speaker 2: I hypnotized her. But he denied the sextor rape, which
Speaker 2: is classic, but it's like the the jizz is there.
Speaker 2: He was charged with six counts of rape and one
Speaker 2: count of indecent assault. Finally went to trial in March
Speaker 2: two thousand. When she was on the stand, they put
Speaker 2: a screen up between her and him because she was like,
Speaker 2: that's scared that he would hypnotize her.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So he was cleared, though unfortunately by a jury in
Speaker 1: less than two hours after a five day trial acquit
Speaker 1: it on all charges. I want to think about the
Speaker 1: last guy who got a lot of jail time. I know,
Speaker 1: I don't want to and this guy is a fraud.
Speaker 1: He took like a college course, but he never sat
Speaker 1: through final exams before, like setting himself up up and
Speaker 1: this one man practice.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Like, don't go to hypnosis in a one man practice.
Speaker 1: Like I'm sitting here acting like I think it can
Speaker 1: definitely help people quit smoking and all kinds of other shit.
Speaker 1: But go somewhere where it's like open door or someone
Speaker 1: else's in the room.
Speaker 4: I don't know, it's a I don't know. Honestly. The
Speaker 4: book I read, The Easy Way to Quit.
Speaker 1: Smoking by Alan Carr, I truly feel like that got
Speaker 1: me to quit smoking by hypnosis. It was literally just
Speaker 1: repeating the same phrases and words like.
Speaker 4: Over and over and over again.
Speaker 1: But like, but it was a book, so I felt like,
Speaker 1: you know, it was it was safe. But I don't know,
Speaker 1: this is all really fucked up. I hate that these guys. Yeah,
Speaker 1: people came to you for help, and like so many
Speaker 1: people they can for you help. You took advantage of
Speaker 1: them and it makes me sick. Ugh, stop teaching bad
Speaker 1: guys the practice of hypnosis. Meanwhile, I'm like, can I
Speaker 1: get hypnotized to do something that will help me? I
Speaker 1: need that? Okay, well we're gonna have we have a guest,
Speaker 1: so let's move on. Our guest today is an actor
Speaker 1: you've seen on shows like Chicago, Med, Condor, and Being Human.
Speaker 1: She's in three episodes of the currently running suits La
Speaker 1: as well, but you know her best as the victim
Speaker 1: of an evil hypnotist, Abby Clark. Please enjoy our chat
Speaker 1: with Kristin Hager. What an episode?
Speaker 4: What a performance? Oh? Thank you?
Speaker 1: Tell us how you found a while?
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, I mean it's if we've shot it when
Speaker 5: twenty seventeen?
Speaker 4: It was, I remembers March. Also, I have a weird
Speaker 4: date thing.
Speaker 1: Cool yeah date because the episode came out in May,
Speaker 1: so wow, I.
Speaker 5: Can't definitely it was definitely March twenty seventeen, so it
Speaker 5: was eight years ago.
Speaker 4: And I and I and I remember enough.
Speaker 5: But also I'm like, I don't remember enough. Yeah, it's
Speaker 5: like it was, it was. I mean, it was an
Speaker 5: intense episode to shoot for sure. Yeah, it was an
Speaker 5: exciting job to come along because it was an offer
Speaker 5: which was which was great.
Speaker 4: But it was one of.
Speaker 5: Those really great things where you know, we do this
Speaker 5: job that's really hard and you just get rejected over
Speaker 5: and over again. You get really close to so many
Speaker 5: jobs and you're like, well that was for nothing. But
Speaker 5: specifically this was you know, the casting director knew me
Speaker 5: from like a Chicago fire audition that I had done
Speaker 5: i think like two years before. Because all of Dick
Speaker 5: Wolfe's shows are cast by the same wonderful casting director,
Speaker 5: Jonathan Strauss.
Speaker 2: Well, we want to get him on the pod, but
Speaker 2: he's too busy. It's like, well, yes, exactly shows twelve shows.
Speaker 5: So so yeah, it was because of you know, it
Speaker 5: was one of those great things where I almost got
Speaker 5: a role on a different show and then he just
Speaker 5: thought of me for this, and and it's also led
Speaker 5: to some other things down the road as well, which
Speaker 5: has been really really nice. So yeah so he so
Speaker 5: it just came out of nowhere and I was like,
Speaker 5: wonderful that s for you. This is great and I
Speaker 5: and I read the script and I was like, wow,
Speaker 5: this is what a really you know, hard challenging role
Speaker 5: to come and do, but also like a nice, meaty
Speaker 5: role to go and do.
Speaker 1: Well. Yeah it was.
Speaker 4: It was really fun.
Speaker 2: And you repeat, like there's some storylines that kind of
Speaker 2: overlap or repeat, But this is the only hypnosis episode
Speaker 2: that I can think of?
Speaker 1: Am I wrong? Era?
Speaker 4: It's the only hypnosis one.
Speaker 1: But there have been other sort of like spiritual gurus
Speaker 1: that have missed, had that been, have done bad things,
Speaker 1: but never yes, never like hypnohypnotizing someone with your link
Speaker 1: with your language. That's like what I think, like the
Speaker 1: neuro linguistic of it all is wild. Did you do
Speaker 1: research about it or anything? Like yeah, I believe like
Speaker 1: let's just go.
Speaker 4: I mean, you know what.
Speaker 5: I obviously the ayahuasca world I still find so fascinating
Speaker 5: and it's something I would love to do at some point.
Speaker 4: But what the research I did was.
Speaker 5: Mostly about these like because I always thought like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 5: you know, I had a bunch of friends at that
Speaker 5: point that had done it, and most people had gone
Speaker 5: down to Peru and places. But it was these learning
Speaker 5: about these like urban ayahuasca sessions all over New York
Speaker 5: that were happening that I was like, what, Wow.
Speaker 4: I didn't even know that that was happening.
Speaker 1: I thought was like, I live in La so I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: people go out to the desert and do that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff all the time.
Speaker 4: I didn't think it was.
Speaker 1: Like in the episode. I was like, is this real?
Speaker 1: People just go to a massive loft and do iowas
Speaker 1: go together? Like I agreed? And then that's how I felt.
Speaker 1: Never and apparently yes, it was like, you know.
Speaker 4: On the down low.
Speaker 5: But yeah, And and what was interesting is that Stuart Townsend,
Speaker 5: who was who was cast opposite me, is.
Speaker 4: The bad guy.
Speaker 5: We you know, we had rehearsals and then and then
Speaker 5: afterwards we're staying in the same hotel, so so had
Speaker 5: dinner together to discuss you know, the roles and stuff.
Speaker 5: And he he had taken ayahuasca like twenty times, so
Speaker 5: so you know, it was very informative about that whole
Speaker 5: world and stuff, which was crazy. But yeah, he's like
Speaker 5: a he's just one of those guys that that's just
Speaker 5: what you know, they do these like over a week,
Speaker 5: you do it like every day or something. It's great,
Speaker 5: it's crazy. Yeah, but yeah, So he had a lot
Speaker 5: of information about that, but no, the hypnosis stuff, now,
Speaker 5: I just I since then, I've I've done a lot
Speaker 5: of research because I actually had a baby two years
Speaker 5: ago and I used hypnosis for childbirth.
Speaker 4: Really I did more I did.
Speaker 5: I got pregnant and was like, great, I don't have
Speaker 5: a plan. I'm just gonna, you know, see how I'm feeling.
Speaker 5: And I ended up reading a book that my mom
Speaker 5: had got me halfway through and it was just about
Speaker 5: like a midwife somewhere in in you know, I don't know,
Speaker 5: the South, and and she just wrote about one hundred
Speaker 5: women's birth stories and just you know how you just
Speaker 5: kind of go internal and let your body do what
Speaker 5: it's going to do and and see what happens. And
Speaker 5: I was like, you know what, I actually grew up
Speaker 5: in a really small town in Canada, where like women
Speaker 5: just didn't have drugs when they.
Speaker 4: Go back in the day. So I was like, well,
Speaker 4: I'm just gonna try this if I can.
Speaker 5: So I hired a hypno doula basically trail.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: I did self hypnosis for like the last two and
Speaker 5: a half months of my pregnancy, where I would listen
Speaker 5: to a track and I would lay down every day
Speaker 5: for forty five minutes and just listen to this this
Speaker 5: specifically this music that was just really calming and and
Speaker 5: I don't know, just it was the same music over
Speaker 5: these tracks of of you know, just self affirmations, et cetera.
Speaker 5: And I was just like, if anything, it was just
Speaker 5: really relaxing for me and I and I did this
Speaker 5: for two and a half months and then and then,
Speaker 5: like I kid you not, the day of my due date,
Speaker 5: one am passed and my water broke and I was like,
Speaker 5: what the fuck, Like what do I do now? And
Speaker 5: I called my dou lau and she was like, well,
Speaker 5: it doesn't mean anything, like you could go into labor
Speaker 5: in twelve or thirty six hours, but lay down and
Speaker 5: try and get some rest.
Speaker 4: And I put my track in and I.
Speaker 5: Laid down, and sure enough, like my back started aching,
Speaker 5: and every six minutes it would ache more and more
Speaker 5: and more, and I was like, I.
Speaker 4: Think I'm in active labor.
Speaker 5: So I woke up my husband again because he had
Speaker 5: fallen asleep, of course, and I was like, I think
Speaker 5: we need to get moving. And I started walking around
Speaker 5: the house and I still had these stupid headphones in
Speaker 5: and and like as soon as I started walking around,
Speaker 5: it was like every four minutes, and then and then
Speaker 5: within thirty minutes, it was every three minutes. And we
Speaker 5: like got into the car and I was like, I
Speaker 5: was like, I think I might have the baby in
Speaker 5: the car. Like it was she was wild, like I
Speaker 5: I I don't even know. I guess I transitioned from
Speaker 5: like nine to ten centimeters in the car because my
Speaker 5: legs were shaking, and that's what happens when you're transitioning.
Speaker 4: And by the time I got to the.
Speaker 5: Hospital and they checked me, she I was ten centimeters
Speaker 5: dilated and she was three centimeters down.
Speaker 4: So it was like it was wild.
Speaker 5: And I went into the room and you know, pushed
Speaker 5: for like forty five minutes and she came out.
Speaker 4: But it was just like I truly think that, I mean, it.
Speaker 5: Fucking hurt, like hell, don't like the hypnosis didn't take
Speaker 5: the pain away, but I was able to just stay
Speaker 5: super calm throughout the entire situation, like.
Speaker 4: I never it was They didn't.
Speaker 5: They couldn't tell how far along I was because I
Speaker 5: was just so calm, Like it was so.
Speaker 4: Weird, Like I really felt like I was hypnotized.
Speaker 1: I think it was so wild. I'm a two time
Speaker 1: epidural user over here. Yeah, it was just great.
Speaker 5: And had I not done this then that would have
Speaker 5: sure been. But I would just like what I want
Speaker 5: to see what happens, and there's something too that's cool
Speaker 5: obvious yea, truly.
Speaker 1: Okay, So back to this, I am obsessed with the
Speaker 1: fact that you had to do so many scenes on
Speaker 1: the stand, like most times they just do what. I
Speaker 1: feel like you were on the stand three different times
Speaker 1: and then you had to basically tell your fictional boyfriend
Speaker 1: everything you hated about him.
Speaker 4: And that was wild. It was so wild, Yeah, it was.
Speaker 4: It was. I think we started with the stand stuff too.
Speaker 1: Okay.
Speaker 5: We started in the court, which is always you know,
Speaker 5: you fly, you fly in, and then and then it's
Speaker 5: the time change, and then you get up at four
Speaker 5: am and you just go into a court scene. Like
Speaker 5: I remember being really obviously nervous, but but it was
Speaker 5: a very welcoming set really, you know, at that point,
Speaker 5: a very well oiled machine and so everyone was.
Speaker 4: Just like it just it.
Speaker 5: It was so cool to get to come in and
Speaker 5: especially it's like be in the courthouse and.
Speaker 4: Yeah with Star there. Yeah, so yeah, it was really
Speaker 4: really really great job.
Speaker 5: And it was just one of those jobs that like
Speaker 5: it's such an iconic show that getting to come in
Speaker 5: and do it always feels surreal. And like my dad,
Speaker 5: he's the guy that no matter what network TV show
Speaker 5: I get an audition for, I'll call him to be like,
Speaker 5: what's this about?
Speaker 4: What's going on? What happened last week?
Speaker 5: Because he's like watched everything cool, even the like bad stuff,
Speaker 5: but something like Law and Order, any of them, he's obsessed.
Speaker 5: So it's so cool to get to like go do
Speaker 5: a show that like you know your parents are going
Speaker 5: to love too, because you know, half the time, especially
Speaker 5: my mom, she's like, I don't they watch everything?
Speaker 4: Of course, yeah xactly, but but but.
Speaker 5: She's very honest about like if it's something that she
Speaker 5: actually likes. But with my dad, it's, uh, yeah, it
Speaker 5: was one of his favorites.
Speaker 1: So it's really funny here because we hear like so
Speaker 1: many people have watched it with their moms and their
Speaker 1: grandma's and everything, like their whole lives and it's great
Speaker 1: to see a dad out there getting into the SVU
Speaker 1: and Universal View love it. Yeah, so were they always
Speaker 1: really supportive and artsy?
Speaker 4: Well, you know, it's funny.
Speaker 5: I had mentioned I grew up in Canada, but I'm
Speaker 5: from a very very tiny, remote gold mining town and
Speaker 5: the closest city is five hours away. WHOA, The closest
Speaker 5: city is Winnipeg, Manitoba as well.
Speaker 4: I don't know if you've been to Winnipeg. I haven't,
Speaker 4: bag I haven't heard good things.
Speaker 2: I did comedy in Winnipeg and Wow, and I went
Speaker 2: to the movies on my downtime.
Speaker 1: I actually had long lost family there that I went
Speaker 1: to their house. Okay, yeah, actually I guess I had
Speaker 1: a good time in Winnipeg.
Speaker 4: Amazing. So Winnipeg was the closest city. But I would
Speaker 4: have to do that would be a nightmare. That's not
Speaker 4: a big city that I drive hour. I didn't mean
Speaker 4: to talk shit on Winnipeg.
Speaker 1: I just had a therapist that was from there and
Speaker 1: she told me it has like the highest crime rate
Speaker 1: in Canada.
Speaker 4: And it's like she was like, it's bad, it's very bad.
Speaker 4: It's very dangerous.
Speaker 5: But that was the closest movie theater, so if I
Speaker 5: wanted to even go to the movies, we would drive
Speaker 5: five hours to get to the city if we wanted
Speaker 5: to go to a mall or any fast food chains,
Speaker 5: like I'm from the woods, that's so crazy. My mom
Speaker 5: was the drama teacher in the only high school in town.
Speaker 1: Stop.
Speaker 4: Oh my god.
Speaker 1: Okay, so when.
Speaker 5: You ask if my parents were artsy, my mom, yes,
Speaker 5: my dad was an electrician and and no, I mean
Speaker 5: he did one play in high school and still likes
Speaker 5: to talk about the fact that he stole the show.
Speaker 5: But my mom always kind of gives me a gives
Speaker 5: me a no, he didn't under her breath because she
Speaker 5: was in the rival cast. They went to high school together. Oh,
Speaker 5: I didn't start dating until afterwards. But but yeah, so
Speaker 5: I grew up in a small town. My mom was
Speaker 5: the drama teacher in the high school as well as
Speaker 5: like one of the founding members of the community theater
Speaker 5: up there, so I, you know, grew up going to
Speaker 5: all of her plays and started doing you know, theater
Speaker 5: when I was like six, and and then and then yeah,
Speaker 5: moved moved to Toronto when I was eighteen and went
Speaker 5: to a theater school.
Speaker 4: So did she direct you in the place?
Speaker 5: When I was in high school, she directed me in
Speaker 5: a couple of times, And how was that dynamic? I
Speaker 5: mean it was, uh, it was interesting. I never got
Speaker 5: the lead roles. I was like, okay, thanks. Maybe that
Speaker 5: was intentional, I don't know, but but it was. It
Speaker 5: was it was, you know, fun but also embarrassing, like
Speaker 5: we would do in her drama class, like improvisations together
Speaker 5: and like I remember at one point her and I
Speaker 5: like came up together and did this thing and it
Speaker 5: ended up like we had to yell at each other
Speaker 5: about something and it was just very it was like, yeah,
Speaker 5: it was, it was, and it's it was that awkward
Speaker 5: time of being I was probably like sixteen at that point,
Speaker 5: so very self conscious. But but it was weird. Yeah,
Speaker 5: it was weird to have your mom as a drama teacher.
Speaker 1: All right, But I did interrupt to So then you're
Speaker 1: eighteen and eighteen, moved to.
Speaker 5: Toronto, got my degree in theater, and then started working
Speaker 5: in film and TV after that. But but yeah, I
Speaker 5: have a very supportive family for sure.
Speaker 1: And you're married to another actor, and we always like
Speaker 1: to ask our acting couples, how is that do you
Speaker 1: guys run auditions with each other or do you just
Speaker 1: keep it separate, Like what's the.
Speaker 5: We Well, it's challenging. It's also great because we understand
Speaker 5: each other and understand what each other.
Speaker 4: Is going through. But self taping is a disaster.
Speaker 5: Because I just want to like say the words and
Speaker 5: do it, and he's and he's all.
Speaker 4: About like the setup of it.
Speaker 5: Well wait, let me get the like this is his
Speaker 5: like how he put a mic here for me today
Speaker 5: and this is little you know, and I just want
Speaker 5: to get things going. And I'm the most impatient person
Speaker 5: on the planet anyway, So we just care about different things.
Speaker 5: And then and then yeah, it always ends in a
Speaker 5: fight no matter what.
Speaker 4: So we try and then we're and then we like.
Speaker 5: Before we do another table, we'll be like, okay, well
Speaker 5: let's just let's just you know, try and get along.
Speaker 4: And then it still ins in a fight.
Speaker 5: So it's it's not ideal, but it's better if we
Speaker 5: have a friend come over and then we read with them.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, sometimes I feel like.
Speaker 1: Also when you read with another act or too, they're like,
Speaker 1: you're you just want someone to kind of do it
Speaker 1: regular and they're doing their own Flair and you're like, oh,
Speaker 1: he'll do the.
Speaker 5: Voice, like if it says this person is like this actor,
Speaker 5: he'll do the voice. And I'm like, you're doing the
Speaker 5: voice and he's like, no, I'm not. He's like not
Speaker 5: even aware of that he's doing it. Like stop, you're
Speaker 5: you're you're upstaging me off camera.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, now he is like he was in
Speaker 1: one of the most iconic television shows of the past
Speaker 1: twenty years. Do people just yell badger it you guys
Speaker 1: when you're walking down.
Speaker 5: The street all day every day, like because he's six'
Speaker 5: four and very neat, looking like he's so noticeable that
Speaker 5: no matter, what he can't escape. It and even like
Speaker 5: during the pandemic when he had a mask on all the,
Speaker 5: time he's got this really raspy voice and everyone recognizes
Speaker 5: his voice, Too so even then he would just say
Speaker 5: something to someone and people knew who he, Was like
Speaker 5: it's it's really that's so.
Speaker 4: Funny it is very.
Speaker 1: Funny and it's also it's so funny when your kids are,
Speaker 1: like how does that person know?
Speaker 4: You And you're, LIKE i don't, know don't worry about.
Speaker 2: It such a memorable name BECAUSE i don't remember any
Speaker 2: heavy other like, friends you know Of Aaron, paul's you,
Speaker 2: know so it's like it's a batcher.
Speaker 1: FOREVER i, know he was memorable for. Sure, yeah definitely. Definitely,
Speaker 1: well and then you're back at The Dick wolf. Universe
Speaker 1: you did do a bunch Of chicago met you ended
Speaker 1: up back.
Speaker 5: THERE i, Did and so again back to This chicago fire.
Speaker 5: Tape that's how The chicago med job came along as.
Speaker 5: WELL i feel like this should just be my demo
Speaker 5: scene For Chicago. Fire, no but that's that's also how
Speaker 5: The chicago med job came. Along, uh and so so,
Speaker 5: YEAH i. WENT i went To chicago for you, KNOW
Speaker 5: i did fourteen. EPISODES i left the show ONCE i got.
Speaker 5: Pregnant BUT i but, yeah it was it was also
Speaker 5: such a well oiled machine to come. IN i think
Speaker 5: it was like season, eight but Like fire was in
Speaker 5: ten at that, point and OR i don't even, know
Speaker 5: but like, again it's just he has such an enterprise
Speaker 5: that it's really.
Speaker 4: Cool but but, yeah it was also a really a
Speaker 4: really fun.
Speaker 1: Job that's. Awesome and now you're in like, this you're
Speaker 1: In Suit's, la, Right SO i came in, too Suits
Speaker 1: la to do a three episode. Arc, okay so, YEAH
Speaker 1: i think one of them has aired so. Far very
Speaker 1: cool because Like suit was over and then just had
Speaker 1: this like resurgence On, netflix which is like a really
Speaker 1: cool like you, know you just never know these shows
Speaker 1: that are going to hit later when they hit streaming and.
Speaker 1: Stuff and now you're in the spin off of THE La,
Speaker 1: yeah it's very.
Speaker 4: COOL i had an auditioned for the.
Speaker 5: ORIGINAL i ended up screen testing for the original for
Speaker 5: The Megan marko.
Speaker 4: ROLE i, know, uh and then She's Megan.
Speaker 1: Sussex, now oh, right, right you're getting that would have
Speaker 1: changed the course.
Speaker 4: Of, history would have changed the course of it.
Speaker 1: HISTORY i also wanted to ask you you, played speaking
Speaker 1: of like true crime and, stuff you Played leslie Van
Speaker 1: houghton in a movie and that's really, crazy one of
Speaker 1: The Manson Murderers.
Speaker 4: Murderouses it was A.
Speaker 5: Canadian, film uh Called Leslie My name Is evil about
Speaker 5: About leslie Van.
Speaker 4: Houghton but it was like a kind.
Speaker 5: Of a social satire of the sixties and and the,
Speaker 5: time so it's not what people are expecting when they watch.
Speaker 4: It it's like a, wild, weird surreal.
Speaker 5: Movie, cool but it was really cool to, Shoot AND
Speaker 5: i don't THINK i left my house for a solid
Speaker 5: month prepping for the movie BECAUSE i was so deeply
Speaker 5: obsessed and and involved in Anything Charles. Manson LIKE i
Speaker 5: watched EVERYTHING i could watch and read EVERYTHING i could,
Speaker 5: read and it was dark and, crazy but also like
Speaker 5: how fascinating what happened to these? People and he was
Speaker 5: speaking of hypnosis that he was able to brainwash. Them In,
Speaker 5: canada it's Called Leslie My name Is, evil but In,
Speaker 5: AMERICA i think they changed the title To Manson My
Speaker 5: name Is.
Speaker 4: Evil, yeah and she's.
Speaker 5: Out she's out and now after a, long long time
Speaker 5: Years AND i.
Speaker 4: Said think she was eighteen when she went, in and.
Speaker 1: Yeah it's really because Like newsom tried to deny her
Speaker 1: parole and then she they overruled, it like she appealed
Speaker 1: it and Got AND i think she's like the First
Speaker 1: manson member that was.
Speaker 4: RELEASED i THINK i think so, so which which makes.
Speaker 5: Sense but, yeah like it, was you, KNOW i had
Speaker 5: tried to appeal so many times and was yeah.
Speaker 1: Denied you can't even imagine what her life would be
Speaker 1: like after so much of it behind. Bars it's just you, know, Wow,
Speaker 1: yeah that must have been a wild Role, yeah it.
Speaker 4: Was it. Was it was very.
Speaker 5: Also, challenging but also really you, know it's always fun
Speaker 5: when you get to when there's so much material to, research, yeah,
Speaker 5: project because sometimes you just go in and then you
Speaker 5: make it up as you go and it's your own.
Speaker 5: Thing but when when it's when you're playing a real.
Speaker 5: Person i've had this a couple of. Times it's it's it's,
Speaker 5: daunting but also just really cool to to have all of,
Speaker 5: this you, know all this uh, stuff the photos that
Speaker 5: you get To, yeah it's, uh it was, yeah really really.
Speaker 4: Cool it is. Cool it was a. Weird it's a weird,
Speaker 4: one but it's but it's. Cool what are you doing?
Speaker 4: Now what's?
Speaker 5: Next SO i just finished shooting suits about a month,
Speaker 5: ago and NOW i don't know what's coming.
Speaker 1: Next I'm i'm home with the nose More. Toddler and
Speaker 1: you looked really good on the red. Carpet was a
Speaker 1: nice thank, you thank, you thank, you some.
Speaker 3: Girl.
Speaker 5: Thanks, yeah it's always fun to get to, go you,
Speaker 5: know do The red. Carpets it's been a while BECAUSE
Speaker 5: i BECAUSE i, uh you, KNOW i, mean first of,
Speaker 5: all the world shut, down AND i feel like this
Speaker 5: was the first event i've actually been to in five
Speaker 5: years because also people just stopped and, yeah and the
Speaker 5: strike and and then also BECAUSE i had a, KID
Speaker 5: i stopped working for a bit AND i, yeah and
Speaker 5: Now i'm you, know clawing my way. Back if you, were,
Speaker 5: well a two year old is holding onto my.
Speaker 1: Leg if you were to come back TO, svu what
Speaker 1: kind of character would you want to?
Speaker 4: Play you've been the? VICTIM i, KNOW i want to
Speaker 4: play a.
Speaker 5: LAWYER i NEVER i feel LIKE I i'd love to
Speaker 5: play a, lawyer putting it out, THERE i see.
Speaker 4: It, yeah what are you on? Suits on?
Speaker 5: Suits i'm An i'm an actress.
Speaker 4: Whose husband.
Speaker 5: Uh is a famous producer and he ends up on
Speaker 5: trial for murdering his best friend WHO i was having an.
Speaker 5: Affair way, Whoa, okay there's layers, layers so it will
Speaker 5: she stand by him or? Not and and the next
Speaker 5: episode that will air his trial, begins So i'm back
Speaker 5: in the.
Speaker 1: Courthouse, okay, okay, YEAH i would love you as a
Speaker 1: lawyer On law And ORDER.
Speaker 4: Svu i'd love.
Speaker 1: It prosecutor, Defense, oh prosecutor probably all?
Speaker 4: Right they do they do love a blonde a Da,
Speaker 4: yeah you, know we'll.
Speaker 1: See oh this was great, though thanks for taking the
Speaker 1: time to talk to. Us thank, you and great job
Speaker 1: in the.
Speaker 4: Episode thank. You wow that was.
Speaker 2: WILD i just, honestly what keeps haunting me is the
Speaker 2: five hours and the biggest city Is. WINNIPEG i mean
Speaker 2: five hours to go to a, movie to go to a.
Speaker 4: Movie it's, like that's a that's a that's an.
Speaker 1: ISOLATION i can't even, Fathom, like you, KNOW i don't
Speaker 1: even Think i've ever been to a place that's that
Speaker 1: far from other. STUFF i don't, Know, LIKE i Guess
Speaker 1: i've driven cross, country BUT i keep. MOVING i Don't
Speaker 1: i've never like. Stopped but, wow that is. Isolated but
Speaker 1: she seems fun and that was.
Speaker 2: Fun i'm glad we're getting guests, back getting in the,
Speaker 2: room talking to the artists.
Speaker 1: Acts she seems like she's gonna get. Back she's got
Speaker 1: to be back on our radars now she's in Suits
Speaker 1: la and, yeah she was.
Speaker 2: Cool, wait you know, what people keep trying to get
Speaker 2: on our podcast And i'm, like you need to get ON.
Speaker 4: Svu who do you think you? Are it's also just fun.
Speaker 2: CASTS a girl this week was, like oh my, god
Speaker 2: you KNOW i watch you should have me On And i'm, like,
Speaker 2: well you clearly don't.
Speaker 4: Listen don't. Listen, yeah which is, fine it's just.
Speaker 1: Fine but sometimes a publicist will write us and be, like,
Speaker 1: Oh i'd love to get my client on your.
Speaker 4: Show i'm, like do you know what it's?
Speaker 1: About you should just do a Basic google and if
Speaker 1: you know that your client has not been ON, svu
Speaker 1: we would not have your clients on the.
Speaker 4: Podcast it's really very.
Speaker 2: PICKY i, mean unless unless you're trying to save abortion
Speaker 2: rates In.
Speaker 1: America we have an. Exception that's the only guest we've ever, had,
Speaker 1: right who's been. On and that was our.
Speaker 2: Attempt, yeah and then one time we didn't do a
Speaker 2: true crime and it was to get the late Great
Speaker 2: Bob saga, On so it was we know we were doing,
Speaker 2: here we.
Speaker 1: Know what you're. Doing yeah, yeah, yeah but that episode
Speaker 1: is fucking, crazy AND i, like not trust these.
Speaker 4: PEOPLE i. Know it's, like it's just and bring a.
Speaker 4: FRIEND i don't KNOW i, was.
Speaker 1: But bring a, friend bring a. GALPAL i don't. Know
Speaker 1: you don't need to bring your boring. Boyfriend but also
Speaker 1: it Was Charlie's theren's. Ex what's, yeah what's your? Deal?
Speaker 2: Yeah why have to see? Him, yeah that's. ALL i
Speaker 2: know him from his being at two tan on a
Speaker 2: red carpet one. Time, ABSOLUTELY i was, like how DO
Speaker 2: i know this? Guy WHEN i googled, IT i, Go,
Speaker 2: yep the guy that was like With shirley's their Own.
Speaker 4: Forever, yeah.
Speaker 2: Totally Anne hathaway was the Movie snake today AND i
Speaker 2: did get top eight percent of, players but then it's
Speaker 2: moved throughout the day and Now i'm only a top twenty.
Speaker 2: Percent but oh my, GOD i was really excited for
Speaker 2: like ten.
Speaker 4: Minutes wow for.
Speaker 1: Translations thank.
Speaker 2: YOU i wish you got into. It BUT i can't
Speaker 2: beat these. FREAKS i think people are. CHEATING i really
Speaker 2: think people are. CHEATING i don't trust. IT i don't trust.
Speaker 2: It the other side of. Heaven who knows that? Movie that's?
Speaker 2: BULLSHIT i don't.
Speaker 4: KNOW i don't. Know you. KNOW i have a.
Speaker 1: Friend i'm actually having dinner with him. Tonight he's my
Speaker 1: friend from summer. Camp he if you tell him your,
Speaker 1: birthday he can tell you all the movies that have
Speaker 1: premiered on your. Birthday he's like his mind, works he.
Speaker 1: GOES i kind of see time as like a circle
Speaker 1: and he's like he LITERALLY i told him my birthday
Speaker 1: once and they're not big movie like he was, like,
Speaker 1: Oh september, twentieth he was Like bogus Starring Whoopee.
Speaker 4: GOLDBERG i was, like, What, like he tells me the.
Speaker 1: Most random movies that have opened on my on your,
Speaker 1: birthday he basically in the calendar just backs it up
Speaker 1: to the last time you. Move your birthday was like
Speaker 1: on A, friday and then he knows like what opens
Speaker 1: Every friday of like every. Year it's a wild Rain
Speaker 1: man esque quirk of. His Maybe i'll see. Tonight what
Speaker 1: are the latest When i've had Some fridays Since, well it's.
Speaker 2: So funny BECAUSE i put on Movie snake as you were,
Speaker 2: talking AND i was looking at a poster Of interstellar
Speaker 2: as you were talking about. Time i'm going in a
Speaker 2: circle for this. Man Oh i've never Seen. Interstellar oh
Speaker 2: it's about.
Speaker 1: Time, Oh casey just gave the maham.
Speaker 2: Signal, No BUT i was, really, Yeah i'm not going
Speaker 2: to talk about. MOVIES i really have to find a new.
Speaker 2: INTEREST i truly talk about the same few. Things my
Speaker 2: soul psychical teacher has. Noticed she's one of the receptionists,
Speaker 2: too is, like you should probably come here for, free,
Speaker 2: Right i'm LIKE i talk about it all the.
Speaker 4: Time he, goes, NO i, KNOW i see, It.
Speaker 1: Like throw me a.
Speaker 4: Bone, yeah CAN i get like a promotional? Credit Jesus.
Speaker 1: Well one THING i wanted to sort of point out
Speaker 1: from the episode to day THAT i don't really feel
Speaker 1: like we touched on WAS i did a little bit
Speaker 1: more digging into neural linguistic, programming and it is it
Speaker 1: is like different than just straight up. Hypnosis like neural
Speaker 1: linguistic programming focus is more on like the words that
Speaker 1: you're hearing and less on putting you into like a full.
Speaker 1: Trance AND i think they made that they kind of
Speaker 1: interchanged hypnosis AND nlp as it's called in this, episode but.
Speaker 4: They are different.
Speaker 1: Things and actually we could just hoperate into what Would
Speaker 1: Sister peg do because for this, week or what Would
Speaker 1: Sister peg do which is our weekly segment where we
Speaker 1: direct you to, resources, charities you, know documentary something to
Speaker 1: give you more. INFORMATION i wanted to give a little
Speaker 1: bit more information about neural linguistic programming because when you google,
Speaker 1: it it is kind of giving Scam like a lot
Speaker 1: of the top results when you google it are from
Speaker 1: people that are practicing it that are like come to
Speaker 1: my therapy.
Speaker 4: Place this is why it's.
Speaker 1: Great AND i found out that like these two guys
Speaker 1: invented it in the seventies Named, Richard Wayne, bandler And John,
Speaker 1: grinder they Founded neural to, me, yeah it was in the,
Speaker 1: seventies and it was an attempt at it was another
Speaker 1: approach to, therapy they called. It and but it's widely
Speaker 1: considered to be a pseudo, science even THOUGH i think
Speaker 1: there are probably like elements of it that makes, sense like,
Speaker 1: Visualization like there's all kinds of elements that make sense in,
Speaker 1: IT i don't think as a. Whole it's from WHAT
Speaker 1: i was, Reading i'm, like why is there not one
Speaker 1: like legitimate website.
Speaker 4: That talks about how it's good and. Works it sounds like.
Speaker 2: The like, defense like the WHEN i was looking at.
Speaker 4: Parental, oh parental.
Speaker 2: Alienation, yeah and HOW i just kept finding like bogus
Speaker 2: law offices trying to like help.
Speaker 1: Rid you guys exactly the same vibe That i'm, got
Speaker 1: because it's like everything's, like, no this is, great and
Speaker 1: here's HOW i KNOW i practice. It you, Know Like
Speaker 1: i'm like not finding enough facts and a lot of
Speaker 1: the facts are like actually in medical journals or the
Speaker 1: studies and psychological studies and. Journals So i'm not gonna
Speaker 1: be totally the source for, this BUT i wanted to
Speaker 1: point you to an article on healthline dot com because
Speaker 1: that seems like the most legit THING i could. Find
Speaker 1: it breaks down all the different tens of neural linguistic,
Speaker 1: programming but it also points to the many studies that
Speaker 1: finds that its benefits are largely anecdotal and not supported by.
Speaker 1: Science so if you want to learn a little bit
Speaker 1: more ABOUT nlp, therapy what it, is and just in
Speaker 1: case it's, not, like, yeah what it is and what it's,
Speaker 1: not and just in case somebody tells you about it
Speaker 1: and you're, like that sounds, Amazing that sounds like just
Speaker 1: What i'm looking. For just you, know look into like
Speaker 1: what the full picture of it. Is and, again just
Speaker 1: the fact that there is no full picture readily available
Speaker 1: on the internet makes me feel Like i'm getting my
Speaker 1: little Scam spidey senses. Tingling also a not so fun,
Speaker 1: Fact Richard, bandler one of the, founders did go to
Speaker 1: trial for the nineteen eighty six murder of a sex
Speaker 1: worker in his, home but he was. Acquitted he said
Speaker 1: it was another guy in his home that shot this
Speaker 1: woman to.
Speaker 4: Death so you, know just. Stop, yeah just a cool.
Speaker 1: Character so ANYWAY i thought, pedophile but, YEAH i guess just.
Speaker 4: Murderer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, anyway The healthline article will be LinkedIn On instagram
Speaker 1: stories and our show, notes you know the.
Speaker 2: Deal, yeah my Friend marcia said that she could see
Speaker 2: me being susceptible to joining a.
Speaker 1: Cult absolutely.
Speaker 2: No what she because of my love Of Soul cycle
Speaker 2: and she's, LIKE i can see you getting into.
Speaker 4: IT i, go, well, NO i Think i'd get out
Speaker 4: before it got.
Speaker 1: Scared if one person at Soul cycle said something that
Speaker 1: went against something that you believe, in you would be,
Speaker 1: LIKE i Love Soul cycle until fucking this person said
Speaker 1: diet coca, shit and THEN i was. Out you, know
Speaker 1: like you not that, frivolous but like you think for,
Speaker 1: yourself and you would absolutely be out of a cult
Speaker 1: the minute that they asked you to brand your. Vagina
Speaker 1: you'd be, Like i'm, gone you.
Speaker 3: Know?
Speaker 4: Wow, Yeah, Marcia I'LL dm her that and join.
Speaker 2: Us next week we will be doing Truth embargo from
Speaker 2: season twenty, five episode, two and Hopefully i'll get a
Speaker 2: response From luigi's Lawyer, Karen.
Speaker 1: And until, then thank you guys so much for listening
Speaker 1: and good Night That's Messed up as An Exactly right.
Speaker 1: Production if you have compliments you'd like to give us
Speaker 1: or episodes you'd like us to, cover shoot us an
Speaker 1: email It That's messed uppod at gmail dot. Com follow
Speaker 1: the podcast On instagram At That's Messed Up pod and
Speaker 1: On twitter At Messed Up, pod and follow us personally
Speaker 1: At Kara klank and at Glitter. Cheese as, always please
Speaker 1: see our show notes for sources and more.
Speaker 2: Information thank you so much to our senior Producer casey
Speaker 2: O'Brien and our associate Producer Christina, chamberlain and to.
Speaker 1: Our Mixer John bradley and our guest Booker Patrick, cottner and.
Speaker 2: To Henry kaperski for our theme, song And Carly Geen
Speaker 2: andrews for our.
Speaker 4: Artwork thank you
Speaker 1: To our executive Producers georgia Hard, Start Karen, Kilgareff Daniel,
Speaker 1: kramer and everybody At Exactly Right media dot dun