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Speaker 1: Pushkin.

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Speaker 2: Hey everybody, it's me W camout Bell. I'm dropping into

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Speaker 2: your feed today to bring your preview of my new podcast,

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Speaker 2: Who's with Me Now. If you know me in my work,

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Speaker 2: I like to have conversations, but not just regular conversations.

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Speaker 2: I like to have conversations that focus on the big talk,

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Speaker 2: the big things. So I'm talking to some people, reached

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Speaker 2: out to friends of mine, people I admire, to ask

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Speaker 2: them things that I really want to know, and also

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Speaker 2: to give them their flowers. I hope you enjoy it,

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Speaker 2: and if you do, find Who's with Me with W

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Speaker 2: cam al Bell wherever you listen to your podcasts. Push

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Speaker 2: can Plus subscribers can hear each episode ad free. Sign

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Speaker 2: up on the Who's with Me with W kmal Bell

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Speaker 2: show page on Apple or at pushkin dot Fm, slash plus.

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Speaker 2: Hey everybody, it's me W Cabell. Welcome to episode five

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Speaker 2: of Who's With Me? And also, if you're on YouTube

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Speaker 2: like subscribe, hit that hype button. I hear that hype

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Speaker 2: button is important. I hypet things now too, so hit

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Speaker 2: that hype button. If you're on the regular podcast apps,

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Speaker 2: just subscribe, and you know, hit the share button. Share

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Speaker 2: with a friend everybody, please share this podcast with your friends.

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Speaker 2: That's how we build this It's really going well right now.

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Speaker 2: I'm really excited about it, but we got to share

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Speaker 2: it with the friends. Please share it with your friends.

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Speaker 1: Thank you.

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Speaker 2: Today the guest is David Diggs. Super excited to have

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Speaker 2: him on. The conversation was great. You may know David

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Speaker 2: from the most recent season of The Boys. You may

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Speaker 2: know him as one of the stars of the musical

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Speaker 2: Hamilton on Broadway. You might know him from his rap

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Speaker 2: group clipping he's a rapper, or you may know him

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Speaker 2: from just Lots of Stuff snow Piercer. The dude works hard.

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Speaker 2: We talk about working hard and the importance of being

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Speaker 2: with your family. We also talk about the importance of

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Speaker 2: men nurturing their friendships with their men friends. Famously, he's

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Speaker 2: friends with Rafael Cassol. They met each other in high school.

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Speaker 2: Raefael is also a good person who is too good

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Speaker 2: looking to be such a good person. I don't know

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Speaker 2: how they do it. And also they're both famously from

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Speaker 2: the East Bay of Northern California, Oakland and Berkeley and

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Speaker 2: a little bit Albany. Weirdly, but anyway, we talked about

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Speaker 2: all that enjoy the interview when we get there. First,

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Speaker 2: I have a confession to make. I w Cambell used

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Speaker 2: to be a fan of the UFC, the Ultimate Fighting Championship.

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Speaker 2: I know, I know, I know, it's not I was

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Speaker 2: bit by the martial arts bug early as a young person.

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Speaker 2: I grew up in the era of Bruce Lee movies

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Speaker 2: being on television and renting them from the video store,

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Speaker 2: and so I did martial arts as a kid, also

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Speaker 2: as a teenager. So I love martial arts and I

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Speaker 2: found my pathway into the UFC through martial arts. Originally,

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Speaker 2: when the UFC came out in the nineties, I didn't

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Speaker 2: like it because their whole marketing thing was like somebody

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Speaker 2: might die, and I was like, I don't really want

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Speaker 2: to see that. But then when Dana White took it over,

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Speaker 2: he made an effort to make it more mainstream, bringing

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Speaker 2: more rules in and weight classes, and that was all great,

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Speaker 2: and so I was there for the prime era of

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Speaker 2: the UFC.

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Speaker 1: Rowsy Connor McGregor.

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Speaker 2: My favorite UFC fighter of all time Amna Nunez, who

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Speaker 2: was the first champion who was also openly gay in

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Speaker 2: any combat sport. So yeah, shout out to Aman in

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Speaker 2: nunas the Lionus. And then at some point I started

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Speaker 2: to just struggle with my UFC fandom. I think it

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Speaker 2: happened around COVID because Dana White, who was clearly, you know,

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Speaker 2: not a guy that I'd want to like hang out

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Speaker 2: with or invite to my house, just through the struggles

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Speaker 2: of COVID he did with a lot of people on

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Speaker 2: the right did. They went super maga and super trumpy

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Speaker 2: and super anti the left, even though COVID happened when

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Speaker 2: his friend Donald Trump was president. So I don't know

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Speaker 2: what had to do with the left, but all the

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Speaker 2: COVID restrictions really put a b in Dana's bonnet, and

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Speaker 2: so he's gone. He went super like maga. Not just Republican,

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Speaker 2: but maga. He's also spoken in all three of Trump's

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Speaker 2: Republican national conventions and calls Trump a friend, and you

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Speaker 2: know that's not a good sign. And so I just

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Speaker 2: started to like feel like, I don't know if I

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Speaker 2: can support this sport with my dollars anymore, and I

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Speaker 2: started to buy less and less fights. And then a

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Speaker 2: couple of years ago, on New Year's Eve, he famously

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Speaker 2: was in a fight with his wife that was captured

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Speaker 2: on video. They were in a nightclub somewhere and she

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Speaker 2: slapped him and he slapped it right back, and I

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Speaker 2: was like, oh, I'm out, And I knew I was

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Speaker 2: right to be out because a lot of UFC fans

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Speaker 2: were saying she hit him first. Yeah, that's that's how

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Speaker 2: uh chivalry, being a gentleman works.

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Speaker 1: My wife hit me. She had it coming.

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Speaker 2: Oh, you guys are awful, and you're probably gonna be

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Speaker 2: awful in the comments if you find this clip. And

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Speaker 2: I had been one of the evangelists of the sport,

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Speaker 2: one of the few left wing evangelists. Max's also a

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Speaker 2: fan of a guy named Luke Thomas who's also a

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Speaker 2: more left wing evangelist of the UFC. He's an MMA

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Speaker 2: journalist and also a regular journalist. He's in my book

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Speaker 2: Who Is Government? Luke's a great guy. Follow his work

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Speaker 2: on YouTube. Luke Thomas gets a political also Morning Combat,

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Speaker 2: which is a UFC show or his MMA show.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So I was like one of the few left wing

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Speaker 2: UFC people. I knew, fans I knew, and I just like,

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Speaker 2: I can't do it anymore.

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Speaker 1: I can't.

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Speaker 2: I can't do it. And I understand that athletes don't

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Speaker 2: always have your politics. That's fine, but they can't be

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Speaker 2: anti my humanity or what I think is good in

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Speaker 2: the world. They can't do that. Like recently some of

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Speaker 2: the San Francisco giants on Pride Day war hats with

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Speaker 2: Bible versus that were somehow saying we're not with Pride Day.

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Speaker 2: So it's like, all right, well, I can't sit for

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Speaker 2: a game of that. I get that we don't have

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Speaker 2: to think the same way, but I can't have you

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Speaker 2: poke in a stick in my face while I'm trying

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Speaker 2: to enjoy your sport. So I just left it behind.

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Speaker 2: But Dana White did not care. He didn't care. He

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Speaker 2: figured out a way to keep the sport going. But

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Speaker 2: I think day White knew he was losing some left

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Speaker 2: wing fans. So in his new media deal, he didn't

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Speaker 2: do a pay per view thing, because pay per view

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Speaker 2: you do exactly who wants your sport. He signed with

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Speaker 2: Paramount Plus, which is also the Ellisons, and so you

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Speaker 2: don't have to pay for individual fights now they just

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Speaker 2: come if you pay for Paramount Plus. So I think

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Speaker 2: it's a way of hacking around on the idea of like, oh,

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Speaker 2: I don't have to get you to pay for anymore.

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Speaker 2: You'll just watch it because it's on your app. I

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Speaker 2: did not watch it. And we all have been talking

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Speaker 2: about the UFC recently because of the event that just

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Speaker 2: happened over the past weekend, the UFC Freedom two fifty

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Speaker 2: Raw Rah Kid RockA USA event that happened on the

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Speaker 2: lawn of the White House that was supposed to be

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Speaker 2: to celebrate the two hundred and fiftieth Birthday of America

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Speaker 2: but somehow ended up being moved to Donald Trump's birthday.

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Speaker 2: And that event happened over the weekend, and if you

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Speaker 2: read the reviews of it as a UFC event, people

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Speaker 2: say it was a good UFC event, But if you

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Speaker 2: read the reviews of it as a cultural event, it

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Speaker 2: is pointing to everything wrong in America right now. In particular,

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Speaker 2: one moment, a fighter named Josh Hokitt won his fight

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Speaker 2: against Things fought. Derek lewis a black guy, which is

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Speaker 2: not important, but there's not that many black guys in

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Speaker 2: the UFC, so I mentioned it, so Josh Hokit, who

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Speaker 2: is not a black guy, at the end of his

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Speaker 2: fight when he was in the ring doing his winter speech,

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Speaker 2: and Josh Hogen is sort of a he's doing like

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Speaker 2: a bad version of Randy Mochellman Savage from the WWE.

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Speaker 2: It's like a TMU Randy Mochellman Savage. Uh. He's given

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Speaker 2: his speech and somebody he sort of runs out of

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Speaker 2: steam and clearly just wants to get out of there.

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Speaker 2: And so he turns to Joe Rogan who's interviewing him,

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Speaker 2: and Joe was dressed like I think the way I

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Speaker 2: could describe Joe, he was dressed like a like the

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Speaker 2: junior used car salesman who needs to talk to the

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Speaker 2: manager to decide if you're gonna get your undercoding. He

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Speaker 2: was dressed like a like a majer d at a restaurant.

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Speaker 2: That's not good anymore. So Josh Hog turns to Joe

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Speaker 2: Rogan and says, uh, Michelle Obaum was a man right America,

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Speaker 2: And the crowd cheers. And I heard this because I

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Speaker 2: was paying attention to the fights through Luke Thomas's watch

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Speaker 2: along and just through following it online. And I saw that.

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Speaker 2: I was like what And I pulled it up and

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Speaker 2: found the clip and that's what.

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Speaker 1: The guy did.

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Speaker 2: And to me, any any fin layer of belief that

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Speaker 2: this was about, that this event was about that was

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Speaker 2: nonpartisan and non political. Dana White kept saying it was

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Speaker 2: non political, it was just the way to celebrate America.

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Speaker 2: Even though Dana White is political and everything he does,

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Speaker 2: he somehow seems to think he's not political. But at

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Speaker 2: the same time he's spoken at all three Republican national conventions.

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Speaker 2: He literally will say, I'm not into politics, but you

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Speaker 2: spoke at three Republican national conventions. So any hint that

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Speaker 2: this was not a toxic environment strewn with maga politics

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Speaker 2: went away. When Josh Hogad said the thing about Michelle

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Speaker 2: Obama that I don't want to repeat again. It sort

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Speaker 2: of ties into last week why I really am anti

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Speaker 2: and have to be loudly anti transphobia, because transphobia doesn't

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Speaker 2: just hurt trans people, it hurts women overall, because anybody

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Speaker 2: who's transphobic is going to use that as an attack

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Speaker 2: on a woman they don't like. And Michelle Obama, who's

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Speaker 2: just somewhere living her best life, having conversations on her

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Speaker 2: podcast with her brother, just doing her own thing and

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Speaker 2: has not ever tried to run for politics and has

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Speaker 2: not been involved in politics since Obama left office, is

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Speaker 2: being called a man on the lawn of the house

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Speaker 2: she used to live in, and Joe Rogan just sat

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Speaker 2: there and laughed, which really made me just feel like,

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Speaker 2: fuck you, Joe Rogan. The Kevin Heart Roast the news

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Speaker 2: story that will never end. Recently, Joe Rogan said, any

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Speaker 2: comedian who criticized any comedian who made jokes with the

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Speaker 2: Kevin Heart Roast, that comedian is a trader to comedy.

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Speaker 2: And trader is such a funny word because traders normally

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Speaker 2: use as the word you use when you're a trader

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Speaker 2: to your country. And I would say, Joe Rogan, I'm

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Speaker 2: fining to be a trader to comedy. Are you fining

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Speaker 2: to be a trader to your country? Because that's what

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Speaker 2: you're doing right now by glad handling Trump everywhere you

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Speaker 2: go and letting this man slowly become the fascist of

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Speaker 2: his dreams. You, Joe Rogan, are being a trader to

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Speaker 2: your country. I'll take trader to comedy. Can you handle

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Speaker 2: trader to your country? All right, let's breathe, let's relax.

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Speaker 1: We got to clear the air.

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Speaker 2: I gotta relax because my guest doesn't need all this

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Speaker 2: bad ugliness in the air, because he is the amazing,

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Speaker 2: the awesome, the incredible to be Biggs.

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Speaker 1: Right now we're officially started.

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Speaker 3: There we go.

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Speaker 2: So thank you for doing my podcast, Thank you for

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Speaker 2: having It's You're among the first conversations I've had for

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Speaker 2: this podcast. So I when I was like, who can

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Speaker 2: I reach out to? I want to come down to

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Speaker 2: LA and do some episodes, and you were high on

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Speaker 2: my list. And I was also like, who knows where

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Speaker 2: that dude is in the world. You can be like

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Speaker 2: I figured you'd say yes, but also was like he

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Speaker 2: could be anywhere.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, that's true.

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Speaker 4: But I'm always trying to be home, so like it's

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Speaker 4: good if you're doing so of the NLA. It's a

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Speaker 4: really like good choice to try and hit me, like

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Speaker 4: get me to do something here because I'm trying to

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Speaker 4: be here.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I start every episode of by giving people their flowers.

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Speaker 2: I feel like in the hectic world that we're in

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Speaker 2: and the thing's going on and I'm and I'm booking

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Speaker 2: people who I really admire and want to talked to

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Speaker 2: for an hour, so it's not like it's not yet

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Speaker 2: just like, well I got to book you because we

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Speaker 2: got a slot, so it really important to me to

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Speaker 2: like book people, and so certainly. I've appreciate how like

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Speaker 2: how you have come into my life. Like when I

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Speaker 2: it was when I moved back to the Bay Area

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Speaker 2: with my wife and Melissa, who you know, was pregnant

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Speaker 2: with our second kid, our second daughter. I was between jobs,

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Speaker 2: so I didn't really know what was happening when things

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Speaker 2: were going on, and that I was working on the

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Speaker 2: United Shades, and I was really like had decided, we

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Speaker 2: decided to make our life in the East Bay. At

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Speaker 2: that point, we were living in Berkeley, but we always

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Speaker 2: wanted to get to Oakland. But we decided we're not

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Speaker 2: going to live in LA or New York. We're going

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Speaker 2: to be here. And when you and Rafa reached out

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Speaker 2: about blind spotting, I remember getting the call like they

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Speaker 2: got these guys want you to do this thing.

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Speaker 1: I was like, okay, cool, and then they're like, they

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Speaker 1: want to talk to you on the phone. Do you

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Speaker 1: remember this. You guys were like, we want to talk to.

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Speaker 3: You on the I remember talking to you on the phone.

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Speaker 1: It was like a meet. They were like, they want

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Speaker 1: to talk to you on the phone, was what it

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Speaker 1: was said to me. I was like, okay.

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Speaker 2: Before I moderated and you both just sort of let

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Speaker 2: me know that, no, we know who you are, which

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Speaker 2: I appreciated.

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Speaker 4: It was such a that everything associated with that film

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Speaker 4: was like a wild experience for us because we had

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Speaker 4: yet to work in Hollywood at all, really, so we

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Speaker 4: didn't know how these things actually work. But it was

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Speaker 4: you know, we kept being like, we want everybody to

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Speaker 4: know how intentional this is for us, you know, like

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Speaker 4: this is not a part of this that's like, yeah,

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Speaker 4: that would be cool. It was like, no, this is

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Speaker 4: who we want to do this and you were like,

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Speaker 4: what it would be awesome if Kamal did this, Like

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Speaker 4: this would be amazing.

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Speaker 2: And for me, I was still in this spot. I

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Speaker 2: mean I still in this spot, but I was in

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Speaker 2: the spot of like, I know, I'm working hard, I'm

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Speaker 2: doing doing things, but I don't know if you know

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Speaker 2: who's seeing it, or who's aware of it, or who

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Speaker 2: is who or who even or maybe people see it

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Speaker 2: but don't like it, you know what I mean. I

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Speaker 2: sort of put my head down and like I'm going

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Speaker 2: to do the work. Especially then, so the fact that

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Speaker 2: I think you all told me that you'd seen me

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Speaker 2: at the punch line back in the day, Yeah, which

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Speaker 2: I was when it's the club that I came up

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Speaker 2: at in San Francisco. So I just appreciate you too,

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Speaker 2: and you how intentional you all are about your life

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Speaker 2: and your work and connecting those things, and how when

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Speaker 2: I when I look at you, like I said when

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Speaker 2: I reached out for you the podcast, like this dude,

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Speaker 2: I just saw him on stage in Berkeley with clipping like,

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Speaker 2: you know, wrapping his ass off madness. Yeah, I had

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Speaker 2: opened my eagle on yesterday.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, yeah, So I just

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Speaker 1: I just saw you.

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Speaker 2: Then I'm watching you on my phone in a in

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Speaker 2: the new clip from the Boys, like there's a very

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Speaker 2: proof like there he is, yeah yeah yeah. And then

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Speaker 2: and then as I sit down today, I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 2: another movie's coming out, Yeah yeah, a Magic Hour.

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Speaker 4: Magic Hour Yeah yeah, which I'm I'm that's one of

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Speaker 4: those ones, like amazing that it's gonna have a theatrical release,

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Speaker 4: very independent, yeah, very yeah.

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Speaker 3: So I'm so excited about it.

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Speaker 2: Looking at the clip, looks like the movie is like,

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Speaker 2: is this the movie that me and my wife can

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Speaker 2: go to or should we see separately of those intense

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Speaker 2: marriage movies where you're like.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, I think it's a can though. It's

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Speaker 4: very pro marriage. Okay, it's very pro forgiveness. It's very Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I remember I went and saw Eternal Sunshine of the

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Speaker 2: spotless uh spotless mind with my girlfriend at the time,

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Speaker 2: and I watched someone go I think we got to

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Speaker 2: break up.

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Speaker 1: I don't get this from you. I'm not I don't

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Speaker 1: feel this.

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Speaker 3: Where's the support, I'm not so.

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Speaker 2: I just want to be careful about those things. But

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Speaker 2: I just see you like busting your ass all the time.

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Speaker 2: Oh man, I appreciate that. I mean, yes, sort of.

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Speaker 2: I mean we all waste time behind the scenes, and

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Speaker 2: we all we all like have days we can't get

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Speaker 2: out of bed. I'm not saying that you no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 2: but I just but I just want to be clear,

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Speaker 2: like and again to take these flowers.

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Speaker 3: Yes, I'm not accepting. I'm trying to be and you

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Speaker 3: can you can elaborate.

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Speaker 2: But I do see like sometimes there's people like I

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Speaker 2: look at your I get he's he's.

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Speaker 1: Good at a lot of things. Just take it.

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Speaker 2: He's good a lot of things. But he doesn't have

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Speaker 2: to do all these things. He doesn't need to be

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Speaker 2: here in Berkeley, wrapping his ass off with clipping and

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Speaker 2: he could be at home, you know what I mean,

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Speaker 2: you know, he could be he you know, I see

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Speaker 2: you like I just see you in being in a

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Speaker 2: lot of spaces and and you do all of those spaces.

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Speaker 2: And I really appreciate like it models like intentional work ethic,

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Speaker 2: but also the kind of like approach to this business

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Speaker 2: that is like on some level we're all just like

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Speaker 2: some of us are just plumbers making the donuts, you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean, not that plumbers should make donuts,

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Speaker 2: but you know what I mean, the idea of like

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Speaker 2: we're just doing the work that's in front of us.

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Speaker 3: It's crazy, but yeah, you know, yeah, no, I agree.

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Speaker 4: I mean to a certain degree, I do have to

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Speaker 4: do all of those things because I don't know how

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Speaker 4: to function otherwise, you know, like I don't ye the

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Speaker 4: Bay Arean is of it all is that is that

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Speaker 4: thing where we just do things. We have to make things,

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Speaker 4: and a lot of the way the business side of

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Speaker 4: this works is you end up waiting to make things.

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Speaker 3: You end up like waiting for permission to make things.

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Speaker 4: And I don't know how to feel like a person

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Speaker 4: when I'm doing that. At the same time, like and

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Speaker 4: this is you know, I admire you a lot in

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Speaker 4: this too, because like I'm trying. I'm new to this

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Speaker 4: dad business and I'm like always trying to be with him,

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Speaker 4: so anything that takes me away from him, I am

355
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Speaker 4: like I'm like very nervous about and I'm always trying

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00:16:31,556 --> 00:16:33,356
Speaker 4: to minimize and like how quickly can I get in

357
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Speaker 4: and get out? But I still like need to do it.

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Speaker 4: You know, the amount of like serious discussions me and

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Speaker 4: my wife Abby I have had to have about like

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Speaker 4: I know this doesn't bring in any money and I

361
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Speaker 4: know like where she's never getting out. It's like me

362
00:16:47,236 --> 00:16:50,556
Speaker 4: apologizing beforehand, like I'm so sorry, but I just I

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Speaker 4: have to go do this rap show.

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Speaker 1: I mean, and you know, and it's a real rap show.

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Speaker 2: It's not like it doesn't there's nothing about clipping that

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Speaker 2: feels like it's like a hobby. It feels like this

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00:17:00,836 --> 00:17:02,956
Speaker 2: is and you know, I saw the tiny desk and

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Speaker 2: I've and listened to the music and it's like there's

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Speaker 2: in an alternate timeline, this is just who you are.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, Like you're just that guy.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I still kind of think of myself as

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Speaker 4: that guy. I don't know, like, yeah, I'm just like

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Speaker 4: I in the you know, around twenty two thousand and

374
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Speaker 4: nine or something eight something like that, Like I made

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Speaker 4: a very conscious decision to start identifying as a rapper,

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Speaker 4: you know, because I was like, I otherwise, how can

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Speaker 4: I say that I am? You know, like it was

378
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Speaker 4: the thing I had been doing for longer than anything else.

379
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Speaker 4: I wasn't making any money from anywhere at the time,

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Speaker 4: so it was just like, well, what's the thing that

381
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Speaker 4: And I had.

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Speaker 3: To be like, well, what do I love if I

383
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Speaker 3: you know, what is what is the thing? I want?

384
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Speaker 4: To be honest, I want to make these rap songs.

385
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Speaker 4: I want to go all over the world playing raps.

386
00:17:51,036 --> 00:17:53,316
Speaker 4: I'm a rapper. I was saying that in public, which

387
00:17:53,316 --> 00:17:55,396
Speaker 4: is a crazy thing for like a young black men

388
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Speaker 4: to just especially like without a deal and with no

389
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Speaker 4: like evidence that that's working. But just like you know,

390
00:18:02,476 --> 00:18:06,596
Speaker 4: show it up in my ninety seven Honda Civic being like, yeah,

391
00:18:06,596 --> 00:18:07,076
Speaker 4: I'm a rapper.

392
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Speaker 3: I'm a crazy thing to do.

393
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Speaker 4: But I so anyway, that was such a choice that

394
00:18:12,236 --> 00:18:14,636
Speaker 4: it's a thing that I still I still very much

395
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Speaker 4: identify as.

396
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Speaker 2: Yeah, and and I would imagine, like you said in

397
00:18:19,436 --> 00:18:22,236
Speaker 2: the bay, there's just a let's make some stuff yeah,

398
00:18:22,276 --> 00:18:25,476
Speaker 2: and sort of let's make some stuff without almost without

399
00:18:25,516 --> 00:18:29,556
Speaker 2: regards often to profit or or market.

400
00:18:29,876 --> 00:18:32,116
Speaker 1: Uh whether the market needs this thing.

401
00:18:32,076 --> 00:18:34,076
Speaker 4: They know, because we don't know how, right, like who

402
00:18:34,116 --> 00:18:37,476
Speaker 4: there's no industry there, which is it's a wild place

403
00:18:37,716 --> 00:18:42,756
Speaker 4: in hindsight to be such a robust like arts forward

404
00:18:42,956 --> 00:18:46,076
Speaker 4: place where there isn't an industry behind it. So all

405
00:18:46,116 --> 00:18:49,116
Speaker 4: of us are just making it and like figure and

406
00:18:49,316 --> 00:18:51,396
Speaker 4: making the time to make it and figuring out how

407
00:18:51,396 --> 00:18:53,236
Speaker 4: to work other jobs and make it. And that's just

408
00:18:53,316 --> 00:18:56,636
Speaker 4: what you do because like art is necessary and we

409
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Speaker 4: make art and so yeah that yeah, so that that's

410
00:19:00,916 --> 00:19:03,676
Speaker 4: just part of the thing. And I have so I

411
00:19:03,836 --> 00:19:05,116
Speaker 4: was just thinking about this today, like I have a

412
00:19:05,116 --> 00:19:09,756
Speaker 4: lot of I have hired people and also keep other

413
00:19:09,796 --> 00:19:13,156
Speaker 4: people around me who are concerned with product right because

414
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Speaker 4: I don't even know how.

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00:19:14,356 --> 00:19:17,076
Speaker 1: Oh you need people who are like that's a good unit.

416
00:19:17,116 --> 00:19:17,676
Speaker 1: We can sell that.

417
00:19:17,916 --> 00:19:19,916
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean not in a cynical way, but

418
00:19:19,996 --> 00:19:22,356
Speaker 2: in like a this is a capitalistic society we live in.

419
00:19:22,716 --> 00:19:24,436
Speaker 2: You have made a good unit that we can this

420
00:19:24,476 --> 00:19:25,276
Speaker 2: is a good thing we can do.

421
00:19:25,436 --> 00:19:29,316
Speaker 4: Yeah, or even you know, even in films like this,

422
00:19:31,396 --> 00:19:34,876
Speaker 4: I am such a process guy that I don't you know,

423
00:19:34,996 --> 00:19:39,116
Speaker 4: if I see a thing that's like, this is a

424
00:19:39,116 --> 00:19:40,956
Speaker 4: really interesting script I would like to do.

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Speaker 3: That's all I need to want to do it.

426
00:19:42,756 --> 00:19:44,996
Speaker 4: And other people can advise me like that's gonna tank,

427
00:19:45,036 --> 00:19:47,596
Speaker 4: that's not or this is whatever. Ultimately I can decide

428
00:19:47,596 --> 00:19:49,756
Speaker 4: to do it, even like while shooting, somebody to tell

429
00:19:49,756 --> 00:19:51,836
Speaker 4: me that's what directors are for. I'm so interested in

430
00:19:51,916 --> 00:19:54,076
Speaker 4: the process. I'll do a thousand takes of a scene.

431
00:19:54,076 --> 00:19:54,596
Speaker 3: I don't care.

432
00:19:54,996 --> 00:19:56,636
Speaker 4: You got to tell me when it's done. I'm going

433
00:19:56,676 --> 00:19:59,196
Speaker 4: to keep trying something new. I'm having a great time here,

434
00:19:59,676 --> 00:20:02,356
Speaker 4: you know, So like you tell me when you got it,

435
00:20:02,956 --> 00:20:04,556
Speaker 4: because I don't know. I'm just out here.

436
00:20:04,716 --> 00:20:05,476
Speaker 1: I'm just out here doing it.

437
00:20:05,476 --> 00:20:05,996
Speaker 3: I'm just out here.

438
00:20:06,076 --> 00:20:08,396
Speaker 2: You're out here, like do the thing and let the

439
00:20:08,436 --> 00:20:10,796
Speaker 2: director go, oh there it was great. I'm glad to

440
00:20:10,836 --> 00:20:11,676
Speaker 2: know that where it was.

441
00:20:11,756 --> 00:20:14,196
Speaker 4: Yeah, And I put a lot of trust in my

442
00:20:14,236 --> 00:20:16,556
Speaker 4: collaborators in that way. Like my you know, if when

443
00:20:16,596 --> 00:20:18,796
Speaker 4: I know what my role on a on a particular

444
00:20:18,836 --> 00:20:20,556
Speaker 4: project is, my role here is as actor.

445
00:20:20,636 --> 00:20:22,556
Speaker 3: Great, That's what I'm doing. I have to learn the

446
00:20:22,596 --> 00:20:23,636
Speaker 3: lines and say the lines.

447
00:20:24,396 --> 00:20:26,636
Speaker 4: Those are my parameters and like I'm gonna do as

448
00:20:26,716 --> 00:20:28,676
Speaker 4: much as I can within that is everybody else. You

449
00:20:28,716 --> 00:20:30,436
Speaker 4: tell me when I'm lit, you tell me if my

450
00:20:30,476 --> 00:20:32,116
Speaker 4: hair is out of place, you tell I'm not gonna

451
00:20:32,116 --> 00:20:32,796
Speaker 4: look at the screen.

452
00:20:32,876 --> 00:20:33,436
Speaker 3: I don't care.

453
00:20:33,796 --> 00:20:37,596
Speaker 4: He's like, my job is to be honest, try to

454
00:20:37,596 --> 00:20:40,476
Speaker 4: find these moments of honesty. Like that's it, and I'll

455
00:20:40,876 --> 00:20:42,436
Speaker 4: as many chances as you want to give me to

456
00:20:42,476 --> 00:20:44,396
Speaker 4: do that. Cool if you're losing light and we got

457
00:20:44,396 --> 00:20:47,396
Speaker 4: to move on, cool, you know, Like that's what it is.

458
00:20:48,716 --> 00:20:50,476
Speaker 2: So I don't know if it's intentional, but I mean

459
00:20:50,516 --> 00:20:52,076
Speaker 2: it's sort of connected to like you just want to

460
00:20:52,156 --> 00:20:54,676
Speaker 2: work and do things, but you're just a person who

461
00:20:54,676 --> 00:20:57,436
Speaker 2: also it has no problem appearing and like you said,

462
00:20:57,476 --> 00:21:01,556
Speaker 2: a small independent film on stage doing you know, how

463
00:21:01,596 --> 00:21:04,516
Speaker 2: would you declibe clipping is where's their role?

464
00:21:04,556 --> 00:21:06,236
Speaker 1: And rap and hip hop? What is the you know?

465
00:21:06,276 --> 00:21:07,356
Speaker 1: I talked to Mike Eglist day.

466
00:21:07,396 --> 00:21:09,636
Speaker 2: He was like, I called myself art raps isn't working

467
00:21:09,676 --> 00:21:13,116
Speaker 2: more so, I was like, I say indie rap because

468
00:21:13,116 --> 00:21:14,676
Speaker 2: it sort of describes the entire thing.

469
00:21:14,756 --> 00:21:15,676
Speaker 3: Oh that's interesting.

470
00:21:15,836 --> 00:21:18,676
Speaker 4: Yeah, maybe we'll just put ourselves there. I don't We've

471
00:21:18,716 --> 00:21:20,836
Speaker 4: always just called ourselves rap music. It was like very

472
00:21:20,876 --> 00:21:24,436
Speaker 4: intentionally track because when we first came along, it was

473
00:21:24,516 --> 00:21:26,996
Speaker 4: a lot of a lot of the commentary around us

474
00:21:27,196 --> 00:21:31,956
Speaker 4: was like like I don't like rap, but I like this,

475
00:21:32,156 --> 00:21:33,876
Speaker 4: or like this isn't like what rap is like, and

476
00:21:33,916 --> 00:21:36,516
Speaker 4: we kept so we started being very intentional about this

477
00:21:36,556 --> 00:21:37,236
Speaker 4: is just rap.

478
00:21:37,436 --> 00:21:38,916
Speaker 3: We're not actually doing anything new.

479
00:21:38,956 --> 00:21:40,676
Speaker 4: We are taking all of the traditions that we have

480
00:21:40,796 --> 00:21:44,316
Speaker 4: learned from being lifelong like practitioners and fans of this

481
00:21:44,516 --> 00:21:46,676
Speaker 4: culture of music and making the thing.

482
00:21:46,516 --> 00:21:46,916
Speaker 3: That we do.

483
00:21:46,996 --> 00:21:50,756
Speaker 4: So so I've always just called I just.

484
00:21:50,476 --> 00:21:54,556
Speaker 1: You're not an anti rap. You post post rap.

485
00:21:54,476 --> 00:21:57,996
Speaker 4: Not post rap, node nothing. Yeah, it's all it's all

486
00:21:58,076 --> 00:21:58,596
Speaker 4: rap music.

487
00:21:59,196 --> 00:22:00,836
Speaker 2: So but yeah, just to get back to the questions,

488
00:22:00,876 --> 00:22:03,076
Speaker 2: like I see you like this is like what I

489
00:22:03,076 --> 00:22:06,796
Speaker 2: would define is like like this hardcore rap outfit rap group.

490
00:22:07,076 --> 00:22:10,476
Speaker 2: You're doing independent movies and then but you're also I'm

491
00:22:10,476 --> 00:22:12,036
Speaker 2: not shocked at all to see you pop up in

492
00:22:12,076 --> 00:22:14,476
Speaker 2: something big and loud and commercial like The Boys. That

493
00:22:14,516 --> 00:22:18,716
Speaker 2: doesn't feel like Deviata is supposed to be independent. There's

494
00:22:18,756 --> 00:22:20,956
Speaker 2: a time when people sort of put those labels on people,

495
00:22:20,956 --> 00:22:23,516
Speaker 2: like you're not supposed to be doing that, you'd Parker posey,

496
00:22:23,516 --> 00:22:26,956
Speaker 2: what are you doing in the movie. And I don't

497
00:22:26,996 --> 00:22:29,236
Speaker 2: feel like with you that I see you as being like,

498
00:22:29,316 --> 00:22:31,396
Speaker 2: oh that's I feel like, no, that's perfect for him,

499
00:22:31,396 --> 00:22:33,276
Speaker 2: and I'm happy for him and I can't wait to

500
00:22:33,276 --> 00:22:34,796
Speaker 2: see what he does in that space.

501
00:22:34,956 --> 00:22:36,116
Speaker 3: Oh that's cool, thank you.

502
00:22:36,236 --> 00:22:36,476
Speaker 1: Yeah.

503
00:22:36,516 --> 00:22:38,916
Speaker 3: I mean I think that those.

504
00:22:40,436 --> 00:22:43,356
Speaker 4: That kind of sectioning off is sort of disappearing in

505
00:22:43,396 --> 00:22:48,076
Speaker 4: some ways, you know. I'm I think we've we as

506
00:22:48,156 --> 00:22:50,556
Speaker 4: fans as audience, have become so much more aware of

507
00:22:50,636 --> 00:22:52,556
Speaker 4: the business side of it than we were before and

508
00:22:52,596 --> 00:22:54,796
Speaker 4: how hard it is to make money doing art. So

509
00:22:54,916 --> 00:22:58,076
Speaker 4: like I don't know, generally for me, any actor I

510
00:22:58,116 --> 00:22:59,636
Speaker 4: see in a big thing that it looks like they

511
00:22:59,676 --> 00:23:01,396
Speaker 4: got paid a lot for Like I'm very.

512
00:23:01,276 --> 00:23:06,796
Speaker 1: Happy for man, that guy got insurance. You know, he's

513
00:23:06,796 --> 00:23:08,316
Speaker 1: got an insurance cover for the whole year.

514
00:23:08,636 --> 00:23:11,596
Speaker 4: And you know, Mike Eagle Song gets a placement in

515
00:23:11,636 --> 00:23:14,876
Speaker 4: a on a Netflix movie. Hell yeah, like that's yes,

516
00:23:16,876 --> 00:23:18,556
Speaker 4: I know you didn't get paid enough for that, but

517
00:23:18,596 --> 00:23:22,916
Speaker 4: like I hope you did, like you know, so yeah,

518
00:23:23,076 --> 00:23:29,596
Speaker 4: but I do, you know. I mean, the jump off

519
00:23:29,636 --> 00:23:32,116
Speaker 4: for me was Hamilton and It and it was the

520
00:23:32,156 --> 00:23:36,356
Speaker 4: most popular thing in a very long time, but it

521
00:23:36,396 --> 00:23:38,156
Speaker 4: was still for me, it was me and my friends

522
00:23:38,476 --> 00:23:42,756
Speaker 4: making something dumb, right, So like that it was so

523
00:23:43,876 --> 00:23:45,076
Speaker 4: the only process I know.

524
00:23:45,396 --> 00:23:47,276
Speaker 3: It's all part of the same as the same process.

525
00:23:47,596 --> 00:23:50,316
Speaker 4: Oh, these people are people I trust, Like, these are

526
00:23:50,396 --> 00:23:53,756
Speaker 4: artists I enjoy working with. This is an idea that

527
00:23:53,836 --> 00:23:56,236
Speaker 4: I don't know if it works or not. It's a big,

528
00:23:56,796 --> 00:23:59,276
Speaker 4: a big thing for me on everything. It's like if

529
00:23:59,276 --> 00:24:01,956
Speaker 4: I'm the most attractive thing for me is to not

530
00:24:02,116 --> 00:24:05,236
Speaker 4: know if it's gonna work because I need the experiment

531
00:24:05,276 --> 00:24:07,236
Speaker 4: of it. I need the excitement of being like, wow,

532
00:24:07,356 --> 00:24:10,156
Speaker 4: this is a big swing or what could we possibly

533
00:24:10,196 --> 00:24:12,676
Speaker 4: be doing here, you know, being halfway through and me

534
00:24:12,796 --> 00:24:15,196
Speaker 4: like this is a failure. You know, I kind of

535
00:24:15,436 --> 00:24:20,916
Speaker 4: need that juice. So yeah, and so it just but

536
00:24:21,076 --> 00:24:24,516
Speaker 4: because I think I have benefited in many ways because

537
00:24:24,596 --> 00:24:27,476
Speaker 4: of that being my sort of entry to the more

538
00:24:27,516 --> 00:24:30,676
Speaker 4: mainstream world in that for me, it was still that

539
00:24:30,756 --> 00:24:35,196
Speaker 4: exact same modality of working, but but it became this phenomenon.

540
00:24:35,476 --> 00:24:38,036
Speaker 3: Yeah that was just pop art, you know.

541
00:24:38,356 --> 00:24:40,716
Speaker 2: So yeah, I mean I don't want to spend too

542
00:24:40,756 --> 00:24:42,196
Speaker 2: much time with that because I know you've talked about

543
00:24:42,356 --> 00:24:44,836
Speaker 2: Hamilton a lot, but I do I don't actually know

544
00:24:45,036 --> 00:24:47,156
Speaker 2: the origin story of you and lin Manuel coming across

545
00:24:47,156 --> 00:24:47,436
Speaker 2: each other.

546
00:24:47,476 --> 00:24:48,516
Speaker 1: I'm sure you've talked about before.

547
00:24:48,516 --> 00:24:51,156
Speaker 3: But how do you just freestyle of Supreme?

548
00:24:51,596 --> 00:24:53,716
Speaker 1: Okay, just a hip hop collective?

549
00:24:53,916 --> 00:24:57,916
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, so we were rapping like yeah yeah and

550
00:24:57,956 --> 00:25:01,196
Speaker 4: a yeah and a funny clerical error but.

551
00:25:01,556 --> 00:25:03,436
Speaker 3: And so on. Some bas I told the story before too,

552
00:25:03,476 --> 00:25:05,316
Speaker 3: so you cut it out of the thing. But like, it's.

553
00:25:06,676 --> 00:25:10,076
Speaker 4: Me and Anthony VININCIALI was another founding member Freestyle. I

554
00:25:10,156 --> 00:25:12,516
Speaker 4: was living in San Francisco. We were both due to

555
00:25:12,556 --> 00:25:14,956
Speaker 4: a clerical error called the substitute teach the same class

556
00:25:14,956 --> 00:25:18,356
Speaker 4: in Marine City, and so we show up. It's like

557
00:25:18,396 --> 00:25:21,196
Speaker 4: a first grade class or something. You have to come

558
00:25:21,276 --> 00:25:22,756
Speaker 4: up with something new to do with these kids every

559
00:25:22,796 --> 00:25:25,156
Speaker 4: fifteen minutes. I guess we're both getting paid today, so

560
00:25:25,156 --> 00:25:27,436
Speaker 4: we're both gonna do this. Yeah, And at some point

561
00:25:27,476 --> 00:25:29,316
Speaker 4: we just start freestyling with the kid. He's like, do

562
00:25:29,356 --> 00:25:30,276
Speaker 4: you do you freestyle?

563
00:25:30,596 --> 00:25:30,836
Speaker 1: I do?

564
00:25:30,916 --> 00:25:32,116
Speaker 4: He was like, great, this is what we're gonna do.

565
00:25:32,156 --> 00:25:33,556
Speaker 4: We're gonna be boxing. We do this, and we did

566
00:25:33,596 --> 00:25:35,156
Speaker 4: that for half an hour. Really worked out.

567
00:25:35,236 --> 00:25:35,716
Speaker 1: Yeah.

568
00:25:35,796 --> 00:25:37,836
Speaker 4: I think his wife's car broken down or something, so

569
00:25:37,916 --> 00:25:41,316
Speaker 4: I gave him a ride home to San Francisco, and

570
00:25:41,436 --> 00:25:44,356
Speaker 4: he we started talking and he was like, I'm part

571
00:25:44,396 --> 00:25:46,476
Speaker 4: of this group freestyle of a pre of my friend Lynn.

572
00:25:46,476 --> 00:25:48,356
Speaker 4: I don't know if you know him, he's like whatever,

573
00:25:48,396 --> 00:25:50,316
Speaker 4: he's about to do a show on Broadway called in

574
00:25:50,356 --> 00:25:52,036
Speaker 4: the Heights. That I have no idea of anything that

575
00:25:52,036 --> 00:25:55,996
Speaker 4: you're talking about, but whatever. So but it was that's

576
00:25:55,996 --> 00:25:59,276
Speaker 4: how I know those guys say that we became friends.

577
00:25:59,276 --> 00:26:01,836
Speaker 2: And then I've become more fascinating recently with just the

578
00:26:01,916 --> 00:26:04,476
Speaker 2: idea of sliding doors and butterfly effect and the idea

579
00:26:04,516 --> 00:26:07,876
Speaker 2: that like that, doesn't you know that's a that's a yeah,

580
00:26:07,916 --> 00:26:10,636
Speaker 2: your whole life goes a different direction if you maybe

581
00:26:10,676 --> 00:26:13,716
Speaker 2: like you still an actor, you're still rapping, but you're

582
00:26:13,756 --> 00:26:15,276
Speaker 2: not necessarily in Hamilton.

583
00:26:15,756 --> 00:26:19,796
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm almost certainly not. I don't know how, you

584
00:26:19,836 --> 00:26:21,956
Speaker 4: know how I would have met those cats otherwise. And

585
00:26:21,956 --> 00:26:25,316
Speaker 4: it's yeah, that that is particularly crazy, especially because like

586
00:26:25,436 --> 00:26:29,436
Speaker 4: if anyone who's been a substitute teachers, not a lot

587
00:26:29,596 --> 00:26:31,196
Speaker 4: of great opportunities to come.

588
00:26:31,076 --> 00:26:33,396
Speaker 2: Out of it, a lot of life changing and after

589
00:26:33,436 --> 00:26:37,596
Speaker 2: I substitute talk Yeah, yeah, those things and forget I

590
00:26:37,596 --> 00:26:39,476
Speaker 2: tripped over a billion dollars, and I was like, there's

591
00:26:39,516 --> 00:26:40,436
Speaker 2: a billion dollars here.

592
00:26:40,516 --> 00:26:43,156
Speaker 1: I just thank god I substitute taught today. Yeah.

593
00:26:43,276 --> 00:26:45,996
Speaker 2: No, that's so I want to give you just this is,

594
00:26:46,236 --> 00:26:50,396
Speaker 2: uh how like my Hamilton, how I've seen Hamilton from

595
00:26:50,396 --> 00:26:52,556
Speaker 2: the outside, because that ends in a very personal way.

596
00:26:53,156 --> 00:26:55,876
Speaker 2: Otherwise we wouldn't necessarily talk about it. But like, I'm

597
00:26:55,876 --> 00:26:58,516
Speaker 2: a person who like I was living in Oakland when

598
00:26:58,556 --> 00:27:00,636
Speaker 2: Hamilton hit, and all I knew about Hamilton was that

599
00:27:00,716 --> 00:27:03,076
Speaker 2: people in New York Twitter were like raving over Like

600
00:27:03,676 --> 00:27:05,956
Speaker 2: that was like when Twitter was Twitter, you know, yeah,

601
00:27:05,996 --> 00:27:07,876
Speaker 2: and Twitter was talking about Hamilton.

602
00:27:07,996 --> 00:27:08,156
Speaker 1: Yeah.

603
00:27:08,476 --> 00:27:10,876
Speaker 2: And at the time, I didn't know if I was

604
00:27:10,876 --> 00:27:12,476
Speaker 2: ever gonna see it. My wife's a big Broadway person,

605
00:27:12,556 --> 00:27:13,636
Speaker 2: but we were not in a position to go to

606
00:27:13,716 --> 00:27:15,596
Speaker 2: Broadway and see these things. So I just and then

607
00:27:15,596 --> 00:27:18,116
Speaker 2: I remember, and then it like then it tours, and

608
00:27:18,116 --> 00:27:20,876
Speaker 2: then more people start to see it, and then my

609
00:27:20,916 --> 00:27:22,716
Speaker 2: wife starts to see it, and then it becomes Hamilton

610
00:27:22,796 --> 00:27:26,716
Speaker 2: and it's everywhere and everybody's talking about it, uh pandemic

611
00:27:26,756 --> 00:27:30,116
Speaker 2: it airs on Disney Plus and then the Hamilton discourse begins.

612
00:27:33,476 --> 00:27:35,276
Speaker 2: And I sort of had this feeling that because my

613
00:27:35,276 --> 00:27:38,276
Speaker 2: wife loves Broadway that like, I don't know that Broadways

614
00:27:38,276 --> 00:27:40,876
Speaker 2: for everybody, Like I think that, like there's a reason

615
00:27:40,916 --> 00:27:42,636
Speaker 2: why it's in New York and the people who want

616
00:27:42,636 --> 00:27:44,636
Speaker 2: to see it go see it. I agree, and that

617
00:27:44,796 --> 00:27:47,716
Speaker 2: like I feel like you can basically discourse every Broadway

618
00:27:47,716 --> 00:27:50,676
Speaker 2: play because it's just it's just. And I know if

619
00:27:50,676 --> 00:27:53,396
Speaker 2: it's a Broadway it's just it's it's about there's a

620
00:27:53,396 --> 00:27:55,596
Speaker 2: lot of suspension of disbelief that happens when you go

621
00:27:55,596 --> 00:27:58,036
Speaker 2: into a theater, like a Broadway theater, and why is

622
00:27:58,036 --> 00:27:58,996
Speaker 2: everybody singing at me?

623
00:27:59,196 --> 00:28:01,876
Speaker 1: You know, why is it? Why are there? Why isn't there?

624
00:28:01,876 --> 00:28:02,676
Speaker 1: There's why isn't there that?

625
00:28:02,716 --> 00:28:05,596
Speaker 2: But so the Hamilton discourse starts, which you know, which

626
00:28:05,636 --> 00:28:07,316
Speaker 2: we don't have to get into, but it's just about

627
00:28:07,356 --> 00:28:10,196
Speaker 2: like is this thing is? Is this thing the thing

628
00:28:10,236 --> 00:28:11,596
Speaker 2: that it is? Or is it not the thing that

629
00:28:11,636 --> 00:28:13,436
Speaker 2: it is? And how why would you do the thing

630
00:28:13,436 --> 00:28:15,356
Speaker 2: this way? And D D D dad and all these things.

631
00:28:15,556 --> 00:28:17,676
Speaker 2: And I remember seeing that Hamilton discourse and being like

632
00:28:17,836 --> 00:28:20,756
Speaker 2: at the time, knowing you and be like, man, it's

633
00:28:20,796 --> 00:28:22,196
Speaker 2: not his play, but he's in the middle of this

634
00:28:22,676 --> 00:28:24,116
Speaker 2: and sort of feeling like how does it feel to

635
00:28:24,116 --> 00:28:25,636
Speaker 2: be in the middle of this and sort of like

636
00:28:25,676 --> 00:28:28,516
Speaker 2: and then everybody and then it feels like that happened,

637
00:28:29,516 --> 00:28:31,356
Speaker 2: you know, we also in the pandemic and we all

638
00:28:31,396 --> 00:28:33,356
Speaker 2: and then we sort of come back, and then then

639
00:28:33,396 --> 00:28:35,796
Speaker 2: you all are at the Tonys and it's suddenly like

640
00:28:35,916 --> 00:28:37,356
Speaker 2: it's okay.

641
00:28:37,676 --> 00:28:40,436
Speaker 3: Ten years will do a lot like we're back, we're.

642
00:28:40,556 --> 00:28:42,676
Speaker 1: Maybe, and we're celebrating the anniversary.

643
00:28:42,876 --> 00:28:45,036
Speaker 2: My favorite moment of the Tonys is when you you

644
00:28:45,036 --> 00:28:46,956
Speaker 2: did that jump. I was watching with my daughter and

645
00:28:47,036 --> 00:28:47,636
Speaker 2: she heard me go.

646
00:28:47,596 --> 00:28:52,476
Speaker 3: Oh yeah. I got text from everybody I know like

647
00:28:52,556 --> 00:28:55,236
Speaker 3: are you okay? You're okay? I think I might have

648
00:28:55,276 --> 00:28:56,036
Speaker 3: said my niece.

649
00:28:57,396 --> 00:29:00,996
Speaker 4: Literally, I don't think I've ever gotten more reach outs

650
00:29:01,036 --> 00:29:01,836
Speaker 4: like for anything.

651
00:29:01,916 --> 00:29:02,116
Speaker 1: You know.

652
00:29:02,236 --> 00:29:04,716
Speaker 2: It was just like I watched it several times because

653
00:29:04,756 --> 00:29:06,876
Speaker 2: I was like, I couldn't pull that off even at

654
00:29:06,916 --> 00:29:09,836
Speaker 2: my best, my most athletic day of my life, but

655
00:29:09,916 --> 00:29:11,636
Speaker 2: like that was truly impressed.

656
00:29:11,676 --> 00:29:14,556
Speaker 4: I got separate phone calls before, you know, when we

657
00:29:14,636 --> 00:29:18,356
Speaker 4: had decided to do that, from both Lynn and Andy

658
00:29:18,436 --> 00:29:21,556
Speaker 4: the choreographer, both reached out like separately being like, can

659
00:29:21,596 --> 00:29:23,876
Speaker 4: you jump off a table? I was like, I can't

660
00:29:23,876 --> 00:29:26,036
Speaker 4: do it. Eight times a week but I could. I

661
00:29:26,036 --> 00:29:29,956
Speaker 4: could probably get it up one time. There's and that

662
00:29:30,076 --> 00:29:32,436
Speaker 4: is something about you that that I was respect you.

663
00:29:32,556 --> 00:29:36,956
Speaker 2: There's an athletic, kinetic nature about you as an actor

664
00:29:37,556 --> 00:29:39,156
Speaker 2: that is just that is also a part of your

665
00:29:39,236 --> 00:29:40,436
Speaker 2: that seems to be a part of your process.

666
00:29:40,516 --> 00:29:42,876
Speaker 4: Yeah, man, I you know, I came up running track,

667
00:29:42,956 --> 00:29:45,196
Speaker 4: and so you know, from when I was nine till

668
00:29:45,516 --> 00:29:47,196
Speaker 4: post colle ran all the way through college and was

669
00:29:47,236 --> 00:29:48,756
Speaker 4: trying thought I might be able to make the trials

670
00:29:48,836 --> 00:29:49,636
Speaker 4: or something after college.

671
00:29:49,716 --> 00:29:51,196
Speaker 3: I was really it was really.

672
00:29:50,956 --> 00:29:53,116
Speaker 4: Important to me and it is still the thing that

673
00:29:53,196 --> 00:29:56,276
Speaker 4: I miss the most is that that, you know, I

674
00:29:56,316 --> 00:29:59,876
Speaker 4: think most former athletes have this this thing where you

675
00:30:00,116 --> 00:30:04,316
Speaker 4: just there was a kind of especially for me, where

676
00:30:04,316 --> 00:30:05,996
Speaker 4: I'm not I'm you know, I'm a pretty I'm a

677
00:30:06,476 --> 00:30:08,876
Speaker 4: I'm a relatively shy person. I'm like not, you know,

678
00:30:08,876 --> 00:30:12,276
Speaker 4: I'm I play a lot of boisterous characters or I'm

679
00:30:12,396 --> 00:30:16,356
Speaker 4: really that way in my life. It was a way

680
00:30:16,396 --> 00:30:21,236
Speaker 4: to just quietly walk around and feel superior to and

681
00:30:21,276 --> 00:30:23,956
Speaker 4: it's like you have this superpower. I can run really

682
00:30:23,996 --> 00:30:27,196
Speaker 4: fast and I like jump over these I was a hurdler,

683
00:30:27,236 --> 00:30:28,796
Speaker 4: so like I could also do this kind of like

684
00:30:28,876 --> 00:30:33,076
Speaker 4: weird timing, technical flexibility thing that like you know, is

685
00:30:33,236 --> 00:30:37,316
Speaker 4: useless probably in life, especially giving it.

686
00:30:37,236 --> 00:30:38,156
Speaker 1: Gets over there quickly.

687
00:30:38,196 --> 00:30:41,836
Speaker 4: But there's a bunch of you know, especially with my

688
00:30:41,876 --> 00:30:44,396
Speaker 4: life choices, I'm running from the police or anything like that. Like,

689
00:30:44,796 --> 00:30:48,276
Speaker 4: but but it was just nice you had that thing,

690
00:30:48,676 --> 00:30:52,076
Speaker 4: and that just like all physical things goes away with age,

691
00:30:52,476 --> 00:30:55,436
Speaker 4: you know. And so when I get those opportunities to

692
00:30:55,516 --> 00:30:59,556
Speaker 4: do that on on shows or in TV work or whatever.

693
00:30:59,636 --> 00:31:02,756
Speaker 4: You know, I'm always annoying my stump performer by being

694
00:31:02,796 --> 00:31:03,756
Speaker 4: like how much you go let me do?

695
00:31:04,396 --> 00:31:05,996
Speaker 3: Like can you can you teach me that thing? Like

696
00:31:05,996 --> 00:31:07,356
Speaker 3: when we better if I died that thing.

697
00:31:08,356 --> 00:31:10,556
Speaker 1: Because then you can you get the camera right.

698
00:31:11,756 --> 00:31:14,716
Speaker 2: So to wrap up the Hamilton discourse, that just about

699
00:31:14,756 --> 00:31:16,836
Speaker 2: seeing you, Tony's the reason why my daughter.

700
00:31:16,676 --> 00:31:18,836
Speaker 1: Was watching it, My my Juno.

701
00:31:18,916 --> 00:31:21,836
Speaker 2: She's now twelve at the time, she's probably ten because

702
00:31:21,876 --> 00:31:24,916
Speaker 2: she became a kid who fell into Broadway and fell

703
00:31:24,956 --> 00:31:27,196
Speaker 2: into Hamilton. And then I'd be walking around my house

704
00:31:27,396 --> 00:31:29,236
Speaker 2: and here a ten year old be like, how goes

705
00:31:29,276 --> 00:31:32,596
Speaker 2: the best? And it was just like, I don't care

706
00:31:32,636 --> 00:31:36,116
Speaker 2: what anybody said. This thing is is like I just

707
00:31:36,236 --> 00:31:37,516
Speaker 2: was like it was just so cool to see it

708
00:31:37,556 --> 00:31:40,076
Speaker 2: in my life come full circle and come around like

709
00:31:40,116 --> 00:31:42,076
Speaker 2: now I got this ten year old who is wrapping

710
00:31:42,076 --> 00:31:44,676
Speaker 2: to herself in her bedroom lyrics from Hamilton.

711
00:31:45,236 --> 00:31:45,796
Speaker 3: It's wild.

712
00:31:45,956 --> 00:31:49,116
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a I never know whether to apologize her

713
00:31:49,156 --> 00:31:49,916
Speaker 4: parents or to.

714
00:31:51,076 --> 00:31:54,276
Speaker 2: There are creators who need to apologize. Are you involved

715
00:31:54,276 --> 00:31:56,836
Speaker 2: in Coco Melon because Yeah.

716
00:31:56,476 --> 00:31:58,436
Speaker 4: What's funny is we were at clipping was asked to

717
00:31:58,436 --> 00:32:00,276
Speaker 4: contribute to sorry to Cocomelon, and we were all like,

718
00:32:00,396 --> 00:32:01,116
Speaker 4: absolutely not.

719
00:32:01,436 --> 00:32:03,076
Speaker 1: I can don't even understand how that would work.

720
00:32:04,436 --> 00:32:06,996
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, we made Puppy ver Hanka, so

721
00:32:07,036 --> 00:32:08,036
Speaker 3: we have some Yeah, but I.

722
00:32:08,036 --> 00:32:11,036
Speaker 2: Did, But Cocomelons anyway, that's a whole nother podcast. But

723
00:32:11,156 --> 00:32:13,796
Speaker 2: like luckily my seven year old who was the Cocomela

724
00:32:13,836 --> 00:32:15,716
Speaker 2: and fiend is out of it for several years. But

725
00:32:15,756 --> 00:32:17,396
Speaker 2: it was a I don't have I don't, I don't,

726
00:32:17,396 --> 00:32:19,436
Speaker 2: you don't. You don't need apologize for Hamilton. There's other

727
00:32:19,476 --> 00:32:21,076
Speaker 2: things I would like to talk to people about, to

728
00:32:21,276 --> 00:32:41,996
Speaker 2: other other child creators. So for me just to see

729
00:32:42,436 --> 00:32:46,036
Speaker 2: it as an inroads for this ten year old to

730
00:32:46,196 --> 00:32:49,276
Speaker 2: like music and to hip hop, yeah, was like I

731
00:32:49,356 --> 00:32:51,756
Speaker 2: think it's just like becomes like That's that's what you

732
00:32:51,796 --> 00:32:52,556
Speaker 2: want right there, right.

733
00:32:52,676 --> 00:32:54,756
Speaker 4: You know, it's a pretty wild you know, that's not

734
00:32:54,796 --> 00:32:56,756
Speaker 4: what we thought we were doing, I don't think, but sure,

735
00:32:56,796 --> 00:32:59,716
Speaker 4: it's amazing that that's happened. Well, the thing that it

736
00:32:59,796 --> 00:33:02,756
Speaker 4: did is just the thing that Lynn is, which is

737
00:33:02,796 --> 00:33:05,396
Speaker 4: like a person who exists at the intersection of exactly

738
00:33:05,476 --> 00:33:08,756
Speaker 4: those things that there are, a history buff who is

739
00:33:09,396 --> 00:33:13,716
Speaker 4: as knowledgeable about Broadway as he is about rap music

740
00:33:13,876 --> 00:33:17,476
Speaker 4: and and so that it's like this show is just

741
00:33:17,516 --> 00:33:19,796
Speaker 4: like the intersection of the things he loves. And that's

742
00:33:20,076 --> 00:33:22,876
Speaker 4: he's a pretty like unique, fascinating person. But he's so

743
00:33:23,836 --> 00:33:26,316
Speaker 4: kind of his you see this when you see him,

744
00:33:26,316 --> 00:33:29,316
Speaker 4: when you see him speak publicly or whatever. His gift

745
00:33:29,436 --> 00:33:33,996
Speaker 4: is that he lets everybody into its very and that

746
00:33:33,996 --> 00:33:36,676
Speaker 4: that was it there. These are actually sort of three

747
00:33:36,716 --> 00:33:41,996
Speaker 4: spheres that always feel incredibly gate kept right, and he

748
00:33:42,116 --> 00:33:42,596
Speaker 4: was just like.

749
00:33:42,796 --> 00:33:46,236
Speaker 3: Or or the everybody could just walk in.

750
00:33:46,396 --> 00:33:48,676
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I just wanted to give you my

751
00:33:48,836 --> 00:33:51,676
Speaker 2: this is my my Hamilton, the arc of my Hamilton

752
00:33:52,076 --> 00:33:55,476
Speaker 2: relationship based on my twelve year old who's very excited

753
00:33:55,476 --> 00:33:58,796
Speaker 2: I'm talking to you. The other thing that I when

754
00:33:58,796 --> 00:34:02,676
Speaker 2: I think about you is just public displays of men

755
00:34:03,116 --> 00:34:06,116
Speaker 2: in community. Men who are friends is such a cool thing,

756
00:34:06,596 --> 00:34:08,556
Speaker 2: like dudes who have each other's backs all the time

757
00:34:08,716 --> 00:34:11,356
Speaker 2: and don't so you and Rafa is like this as

758
00:34:11,396 --> 00:34:15,556
Speaker 2: this sort of like one of the most exactly one

759
00:34:15,556 --> 00:34:17,996
Speaker 2: of the most adorable things being Kelly Rafferty, who was

760
00:34:17,996 --> 00:34:20,276
Speaker 2: who worked with me for years when we discovered the

761
00:34:20,316 --> 00:34:23,716
Speaker 2: Calvin and Hobbes videos, you guys did. I mean, it's

762
00:34:23,756 --> 00:34:27,596
Speaker 2: just like it's like they're so sweet and so sacrid

763
00:34:27,636 --> 00:34:30,036
Speaker 2: and so underrated. Like I feel like I just want

764
00:34:30,076 --> 00:34:31,916
Speaker 2: if anything can happen on this podcast, I need people

765
00:34:31,916 --> 00:34:32,916
Speaker 2: to go watch those videos.

766
00:34:32,996 --> 00:34:33,196
Speaker 1: Yeah.

767
00:34:33,236 --> 00:34:36,756
Speaker 4: Yeah, but they're not too many because I'll just get

768
00:34:36,756 --> 00:34:38,396
Speaker 4: taken out.

769
00:34:37,156 --> 00:34:39,876
Speaker 2: I don't think the calviny, I don't think he's that

770
00:34:39,916 --> 00:34:43,236
Speaker 2: worried about it. Yeah, I'm sure, yeah, but anyway, I

771
00:34:43,236 --> 00:34:44,876
Speaker 2: don't want to I don't want to get him. But anyway,

772
00:34:45,516 --> 00:34:49,156
Speaker 2: just talk about being uh that this is you know,

773
00:34:49,436 --> 00:34:51,476
Speaker 2: we all have this, many of us be friends with

774
00:34:51,476 --> 00:34:53,156
Speaker 2: somebody in high school, like we're going to be friends

775
00:34:53,156 --> 00:34:55,836
Speaker 2: forever or we're gonna do things forever, and then you know,

776
00:34:55,916 --> 00:34:59,036
Speaker 2: things don't happen that way. Talk about being friends for

777
00:34:59,116 --> 00:35:02,676
Speaker 2: a long time, publicly professionally and continually.

778
00:35:02,916 --> 00:35:07,076
Speaker 4: Yeah, man, I mean Rafa so we you know, we

779
00:35:07,156 --> 00:35:09,956
Speaker 4: actually we knew each other and high school, but we

780
00:35:12,516 --> 00:35:15,036
Speaker 4: uh we actually didn't start really hanging out very much.

781
00:35:15,076 --> 00:35:16,316
Speaker 4: So I was a little bit older than he was

782
00:35:16,396 --> 00:35:18,276
Speaker 4: until I got back from college. So it's like two

783
00:35:18,316 --> 00:35:24,436
Speaker 4: thousand and four, and uh, one of my best friends

784
00:35:25,036 --> 00:35:28,116
Speaker 4: his little brothers the same classes as Rafael and were

785
00:35:28,156 --> 00:35:29,356
Speaker 4: they were very good friends.

786
00:35:29,356 --> 00:35:29,676
Speaker 1: And so.

787
00:35:31,316 --> 00:35:34,436
Speaker 4: Raphael at whatever he was at the time, eighteen years old,

788
00:35:34,556 --> 00:35:37,316
Speaker 4: nineteen years old, was already running a recording studio in

789
00:35:38,476 --> 00:35:43,716
Speaker 4: North Oakland, and and my friend.

790
00:35:43,556 --> 00:35:45,116
Speaker 3: Justin was like, you gotta go, you should go. You

791
00:35:45,196 --> 00:35:47,396
Speaker 3: guys got you know, you guys go ahead.

792
00:35:47,436 --> 00:35:48,996
Speaker 4: So we got like set up on a rapper play

793
00:35:49,076 --> 00:35:51,436
Speaker 4: date basically and that and that was it. Like we

794
00:35:51,476 --> 00:35:53,596
Speaker 4: stayed up till four in the morning that first night.

795
00:35:53,636 --> 00:35:55,556
Speaker 4: I was there making a song and we got in

796
00:35:55,596 --> 00:35:57,236
Speaker 4: the car and we listened to the song because that's

797
00:35:57,316 --> 00:36:00,516
Speaker 4: as is the custom. And then uh, then I was

798
00:36:00,516 --> 00:36:03,516
Speaker 4: there pretty much every night. I have probably spoken to

799
00:36:03,596 --> 00:36:08,556
Speaker 4: him almost every day since then, Eida, But it was

800
00:36:09,236 --> 00:36:13,636
Speaker 4: it's just yeah, it's crazy when you I think, especially

801
00:36:13,636 --> 00:36:19,836
Speaker 4: at that age early twenties, you know, when you're really

802
00:36:20,156 --> 00:36:23,196
Speaker 4: trying to figure it out. And if you're an artist

803
00:36:23,196 --> 00:36:26,436
Speaker 4: and you find someone you click with artistically, that's incredibly valuable.

804
00:36:26,836 --> 00:36:29,196
Speaker 3: That person also becomes somebody who.

805
00:36:29,236 --> 00:36:34,236
Speaker 4: You trust, who you're you're making mistakes together and growing

806
00:36:34,316 --> 00:36:36,036
Speaker 4: up together, and you know, has your back and has

807
00:36:36,076 --> 00:36:38,596
Speaker 4: seeing you at your worst and is still there and

808
00:36:38,716 --> 00:36:42,036
Speaker 4: get forces you to celebrate your wins. Like Rafa is

809
00:36:42,076 --> 00:36:43,956
Speaker 4: so good with that for me, because I'm not a

810
00:36:44,076 --> 00:36:47,516
Speaker 4: celebration type and he, for my whole life, has always

811
00:36:47,516 --> 00:36:48,876
Speaker 4: been like try to eat.

812
00:36:48,716 --> 00:36:50,956
Speaker 1: Me flowers and you're like, I know, yeah, yeah.

813
00:36:50,756 --> 00:36:53,676
Speaker 4: But he's he's yeah, he has always been the one

814
00:36:53,716 --> 00:36:56,756
Speaker 4: who's like, we gotta let's acknowledge it. Who knows how

815
00:36:56,756 --> 00:37:00,316
Speaker 4: many of these we get, you know, so he's he's

816
00:37:00,356 --> 00:37:00,836
Speaker 4: one of those.

817
00:37:00,876 --> 00:37:02,196
Speaker 3: And so it's.

818
00:37:04,036 --> 00:37:08,316
Speaker 4: It's interesting, we're, uh, we're writing another film together right now,

819
00:37:08,316 --> 00:37:12,596
Speaker 4: and it is kind of about the how that kind

820
00:37:12,636 --> 00:37:15,556
Speaker 4: of a friendship ages and what happens, you know, when.

821
00:37:15,676 --> 00:37:17,076
Speaker 3: Kids get them all on the study, you know, like

822
00:37:18,476 --> 00:37:20,596
Speaker 3: just yeah, what you know we made?

823
00:37:20,596 --> 00:37:25,236
Speaker 4: Blind Spotting is essentially about like a you know, young man,

824
00:37:25,476 --> 00:37:29,756
Speaker 4: late twenties, right, that kind of male friendship, and now

825
00:37:29,836 --> 00:37:33,756
Speaker 4: what's what's a forties male friendship? Like, like you know,

826
00:37:35,236 --> 00:37:37,596
Speaker 4: and what are those changes and how do you know,

827
00:37:39,596 --> 00:37:40,676
Speaker 4: how do those things grow together?

828
00:37:40,716 --> 00:37:41,236
Speaker 3: But it is.

829
00:37:42,876 --> 00:37:45,516
Speaker 4: I think to me, what's interesting about it is it's

830
00:37:45,556 --> 00:37:50,036
Speaker 4: both absolutely effortless and also incredibly intentional.

831
00:37:50,156 --> 00:37:53,716
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, when you're in your forties. I don't

832
00:37:53,716 --> 00:37:55,196
Speaker 2: know if this is true for women. As a man,

833
00:37:55,276 --> 00:37:57,396
Speaker 2: you have to be intentional to stay friends with your men,

834
00:37:57,476 --> 00:37:59,756
Speaker 2: friends anybody, Yeah, because it just sort of, yeah, are

835
00:37:59,916 --> 00:38:02,116
Speaker 2: with your friends because it can just easy because you

836
00:38:02,156 --> 00:38:03,756
Speaker 2: get so caught up in whatever your life is.

837
00:38:03,836 --> 00:38:05,796
Speaker 1: Yeah, they like I don't even talk to that dude anymore.

838
00:38:05,876 --> 00:38:08,156
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I don't know. Yeah, when your life just

839
00:38:08,196 --> 00:38:11,676
Speaker 4: stopped involving friends like as a necessary part of life,

840
00:38:11,676 --> 00:38:12,356
Speaker 4: it kind of does.

841
00:38:12,836 --> 00:38:15,036
Speaker 3: Uh, it's some ways. So yeah, it has to be intentional.

842
00:38:15,196 --> 00:38:18,476
Speaker 4: But I mean even all of our you know, starting

843
00:38:18,516 --> 00:38:21,916
Speaker 4: to when we were working together when when blind spoting happened,

844
00:38:21,956 --> 00:38:26,556
Speaker 4: and it happened after Hamilton and so there was like

845
00:38:27,196 --> 00:38:29,276
Speaker 4: for two people actually honestly in the bay when we

846
00:38:29,276 --> 00:38:31,436
Speaker 4: were making rap songs, like Rafa was kind of the

847
00:38:31,476 --> 00:38:34,076
Speaker 4: famous one, so he had the deaf poetry thing going. Honestly,

848
00:38:34,076 --> 00:38:36,156
Speaker 4: he had like a huge YouTube following. He was the

849
00:38:36,156 --> 00:38:37,756
Speaker 4: one who was able to book shows out of town

850
00:38:37,796 --> 00:38:39,796
Speaker 4: and he would always bring us a lot. Was always like,

851
00:38:40,156 --> 00:38:42,876
Speaker 4: you know, so he was the one opening door so

852
00:38:42,956 --> 00:38:45,676
Speaker 4: everybody could run through. And then this this thing happened.

853
00:38:45,796 --> 00:38:47,996
Speaker 4: Now like the sort of balance had shifted the other way.

854
00:38:48,036 --> 00:38:50,596
Speaker 4: People knew my name, wanted to talk to me, and

855
00:38:51,356 --> 00:38:54,476
Speaker 4: like navigating those kinds of things. And then now you're

856
00:38:54,516 --> 00:38:57,276
Speaker 4: adding agents and managers and stuff on top of that,

857
00:38:57,356 --> 00:38:59,676
Speaker 4: who like don't understand the history of it and who

858
00:38:59,956 --> 00:39:02,236
Speaker 4: you know? There are so many hard conversations that had

859
00:39:02,276 --> 00:39:02,636
Speaker 4: to be had.

860
00:39:02,676 --> 00:39:04,396
Speaker 1: Well like I know you suggest Draffa, but who else

861
00:39:04,396 --> 00:39:04,916
Speaker 1: should we look at?

862
00:39:05,396 --> 00:39:10,316
Speaker 4: Yeah, like literally nobody, but also know, hard conversations them

863
00:39:10,356 --> 00:39:13,396
Speaker 4: hard conversations with each other about you know, we've we've

864
00:39:13,436 --> 00:39:16,996
Speaker 4: had to we've developed a pretty good muscle now for

865
00:39:17,116 --> 00:39:19,676
Speaker 4: on projects that we're working on together, like sitting down

866
00:39:19,756 --> 00:39:21,516
Speaker 4: really before we even get into it and being like,

867
00:39:22,116 --> 00:39:24,316
Speaker 4: what is important to you about this and what's important

868
00:39:24,356 --> 00:39:26,316
Speaker 4: to me about this, and let's get really clear on that.

869
00:39:26,356 --> 00:39:28,636
Speaker 4: What are non negotiables so that when all the bullshit

870
00:39:28,676 --> 00:39:32,476
Speaker 4: starts happening, it's going to happen like we can. We

871
00:39:32,476 --> 00:39:35,636
Speaker 4: can know that, like we are satisfying these things and

872
00:39:35,676 --> 00:39:37,356
Speaker 4: we get we get that really clear.

873
00:39:37,156 --> 00:39:40,156
Speaker 1: Before like what do we both want out of this? Yeah?

874
00:39:40,236 --> 00:39:42,076
Speaker 2: Is that when the when all the crazy, when all

875
00:39:42,076 --> 00:39:44,396
Speaker 2: the show is nonsense happens, we can remember, well, I

876
00:39:44,476 --> 00:39:45,596
Speaker 2: just need this and you need.

877
00:39:45,396 --> 00:39:50,396
Speaker 4: That, right because you know, when you start, especially with us,

878
00:39:50,396 --> 00:39:53,276
Speaker 4: when you start talking about like who wrote what or

879
00:39:53,316 --> 00:39:54,316
Speaker 4: whose idea.

880
00:39:54,116 --> 00:39:55,876
Speaker 3: Is, it's like, not what are you talking about? Like

881
00:39:55,916 --> 00:39:56,876
Speaker 3: that's not how it works.

882
00:39:57,556 --> 00:40:00,156
Speaker 1: It's like Lennon McCartney, we were both there talking about it.

883
00:40:00,356 --> 00:40:03,036
Speaker 4: We sit down and we eat food, and then like

884
00:40:03,436 --> 00:40:05,196
Speaker 4: you know, a year later there's a thing. But it's

885
00:40:06,676 --> 00:40:10,276
Speaker 4: so yeah, we've had to realize that, and this word

886
00:40:10,356 --> 00:40:13,116
Speaker 4: the Hollywood business is very much about dividing those things

887
00:40:13,196 --> 00:40:15,476
Speaker 4: up and being like credit, the credit is what you need,

888
00:40:15,516 --> 00:40:18,236
Speaker 4: and so we tend to decide early on, like what's

889
00:40:18,276 --> 00:40:19,436
Speaker 4: the credit you need from this?

890
00:40:19,596 --> 00:40:19,716
Speaker 3: Bro?

891
00:40:19,916 --> 00:40:23,236
Speaker 4: Like what's the what do we say? Obviously it doesn't matter,

892
00:40:23,316 --> 00:40:24,996
Speaker 4: like the work doesn't matter. We're going to do what

893
00:40:25,036 --> 00:40:27,356
Speaker 4: we do. What what what do you need.

894
00:40:27,236 --> 00:40:27,556
Speaker 1: Out of this?

895
00:40:27,676 --> 00:40:29,636
Speaker 4: Or what do I need out of this? Okay, let's

896
00:40:29,716 --> 00:40:32,076
Speaker 4: do that let's make that happen. Let's send the teams

897
00:40:32,116 --> 00:40:33,476
Speaker 4: off to accomplish that.

898
00:40:33,916 --> 00:40:34,476
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would.

899
00:40:34,796 --> 00:40:37,076
Speaker 2: That's the part about it that is so remarkable to

900
00:40:37,116 --> 00:40:39,756
Speaker 2: me because once the as you know, I mean, you know,

901
00:40:39,836 --> 00:40:43,196
Speaker 2: being a person who's also a rapper, the money has

902
00:40:43,236 --> 00:40:45,556
Speaker 2: broken up a lot of friends in a wrapper, It's

903
00:40:45,596 --> 00:40:48,156
Speaker 2: broken up a lot of crews, like a lot of

904
00:40:48,196 --> 00:40:50,476
Speaker 2: boys falling apart over money.

905
00:40:50,516 --> 00:40:53,396
Speaker 3: That's true. Ours, maybe ours didn't come from rap.

906
00:40:53,236 --> 00:40:56,156
Speaker 2: But just I would imagine that there's probably it's got

907
00:40:56,236 --> 00:40:58,356
Speaker 2: to be certain times where you have to sort of

908
00:40:58,356 --> 00:41:01,556
Speaker 2: go stop, let's talk about this, because the would you

909
00:41:01,596 --> 00:41:03,356
Speaker 2: want to prioritize the friendship.

910
00:41:03,076 --> 00:41:04,316
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh absolutely.

911
00:41:04,836 --> 00:41:09,436
Speaker 4: It turns out that these yeah, having relationships for that long,

912
00:41:10,396 --> 00:41:13,476
Speaker 4: you have to talk things out. Yeah, stuff does get weird,

913
00:41:13,636 --> 00:41:18,476
Speaker 4: you know, and stuff and time passes and you don't know.

914
00:41:18,876 --> 00:41:22,316
Speaker 4: You go from when you're young and you're just hanging

915
00:41:22,316 --> 00:41:24,996
Speaker 4: out in studios or whatever. You spend all you know,

916
00:41:25,076 --> 00:41:27,196
Speaker 4: most of your free time is together, so you don't

917
00:41:27,196 --> 00:41:28,516
Speaker 4: actually have to have those check ins.

918
00:41:28,596 --> 00:41:34,356
Speaker 3: I just saw you and I'll see you again.

919
00:41:34,396 --> 00:41:36,636
Speaker 2: And you're and you're also now if you two are working,

920
00:41:36,916 --> 00:41:38,396
Speaker 2: there's not a sense of like We'll just do this

921
00:41:38,516 --> 00:41:40,876
Speaker 2: until four in the morning, because I got a kid.

922
00:41:41,436 --> 00:41:43,876
Speaker 4: Nothing until four in the morning. She's up at six.

923
00:41:43,996 --> 00:41:47,996
Speaker 4: I'm like yeah, but yeah, and we work. You know,

924
00:41:48,036 --> 00:41:51,076
Speaker 4: he's off shooting a TV show right now. So also,

925
00:41:51,156 --> 00:41:54,756
Speaker 4: like geographically, we're just spread out and time is different.

926
00:41:54,796 --> 00:41:57,716
Speaker 4: So it's just yeah with the clipping stuff too, Like

927
00:41:58,036 --> 00:42:00,196
Speaker 4: finding time to record now is crazy. When I first

928
00:42:00,276 --> 00:42:03,156
Speaker 4: moved to we started that band in twenty like eleven,

929
00:42:03,196 --> 00:42:07,196
Speaker 4: when I first came down to LA and it's very

930
00:42:07,196 --> 00:42:09,556
Speaker 4: easy to spend all day at Gionathan's house making songs.

931
00:42:09,556 --> 00:42:15,396
Speaker 3: I didn't have anything else to do. Literally, my calendar.

932
00:42:15,076 --> 00:42:19,636
Speaker 1: Was free, like my Google calendar. Yep. I'm free for

933
00:42:19,716 --> 00:42:20,956
Speaker 1: the till the end of time.

934
00:42:21,036 --> 00:42:23,196
Speaker 3: Currently, I've got nothing going on.

935
00:42:24,116 --> 00:42:26,076
Speaker 2: Has there been have you guys been like you said,

936
00:42:26,116 --> 00:42:29,076
Speaker 2: I there's a point when early in relationship where Rafa

937
00:42:29,196 --> 00:42:31,836
Speaker 2: is like the big dog or the more prominent one,

938
00:42:32,156 --> 00:42:33,836
Speaker 2: and then you you're after Hamilton.

939
00:42:34,236 --> 00:42:35,396
Speaker 1: Is there is there any tension?

940
00:42:35,396 --> 00:42:38,356
Speaker 2: There is there any sort of like guilt survivors You

941
00:42:38,356 --> 00:42:40,476
Speaker 2: know that the I deal with a lot.

942
00:42:40,396 --> 00:42:45,436
Speaker 4: Of survivors guilt, but not with that relationship. Really, I

943
00:42:45,476 --> 00:42:50,196
Speaker 4: think the tension is always from it's not from within

944
00:42:50,276 --> 00:42:53,076
Speaker 4: the relationship, right, it's always from outside, But it's always

945
00:42:53,516 --> 00:42:57,236
Speaker 4: it's and it is often like I, how do I

946
00:42:58,996 --> 00:43:01,436
Speaker 4: where it has been with me? And Rabbit's not really

947
00:43:01,436 --> 00:43:04,996
Speaker 4: like this now. But at some points early on it

948
00:43:05,076 --> 00:43:08,076
Speaker 4: was like, well, how what can I do to even

949
00:43:08,076 --> 00:43:13,236
Speaker 4: this out? Because there's no way I can get the

950
00:43:13,636 --> 00:43:15,156
Speaker 4: thing isn't out yet, right, there's no way that I

951
00:43:15,156 --> 00:43:17,956
Speaker 4: can get them to see it. So what's the what's

952
00:43:17,996 --> 00:43:19,636
Speaker 4: the thing that I can do the level this playing

953
00:43:19,636 --> 00:43:20,356
Speaker 4: field or something?

954
00:43:21,556 --> 00:43:23,076
Speaker 1: What do you mean the thing isn't out yet.

955
00:43:23,116 --> 00:43:24,956
Speaker 4: Like when we were making blind spoting or whatever, you know,

956
00:43:25,076 --> 00:43:26,356
Speaker 4: for example, like trying to get.

957
00:43:26,196 --> 00:43:30,316
Speaker 3: That once this comes out, I think it's very obvious that.

958
00:43:30,676 --> 00:43:31,236
Speaker 1: We're a duo.

959
00:43:31,476 --> 00:43:33,556
Speaker 2: Yeah, but right now it's not here. But so you're

960
00:43:33,636 --> 00:43:36,156
Speaker 2: feeling I'm doing half the work, but the world sees

961
00:43:36,196 --> 00:43:38,516
Speaker 2: you as being the guy. Yeah, I want you to

962
00:43:38,516 --> 00:43:40,676
Speaker 2: feel like I value your input into this.

963
00:43:40,956 --> 00:43:43,236
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I used to worry about that a lot more,

964
00:43:43,276 --> 00:43:46,316
Speaker 4: but we've we've gotten pretty good at it. But yeah,

965
00:43:46,836 --> 00:43:49,276
Speaker 4: talk about being a dead is the best thing I've

966
00:43:49,276 --> 00:43:49,636
Speaker 4: ever done.

967
00:43:49,676 --> 00:43:52,996
Speaker 3: It's not even close, but it it did.

968
00:43:54,276 --> 00:43:58,436
Speaker 4: It was that I really liked being on the road before,

969
00:43:58,516 --> 00:44:03,636
Speaker 4: and I really enjoyed. Yeah, there's a certain kind of

970
00:44:03,756 --> 00:44:06,356
Speaker 4: like high that you get from that, like not sleep

971
00:44:06,556 --> 00:44:10,236
Speaker 4: like different city, every day kind of life. And now

972
00:44:10,236 --> 00:44:12,876
Speaker 4: I just literally everything is to go back home. Like

973
00:44:13,236 --> 00:44:15,516
Speaker 4: how much can I minimize the time away from home?

974
00:44:15,916 --> 00:44:17,716
Speaker 1: Is there a flight after the show? Yeah?

975
00:44:17,756 --> 00:44:18,876
Speaker 3: I'm on Red Eyes.

976
00:44:18,756 --> 00:44:21,476
Speaker 4: All the time, man like like I yeah, or that

977
00:44:21,676 --> 00:44:24,476
Speaker 4: the you know the show I'm working on right now,

978
00:44:24,556 --> 00:44:27,316
Speaker 4: New York. I'm my lap whatever. My last day of

979
00:44:27,356 --> 00:44:29,236
Speaker 4: work is. There's a seven am flight the next day,

980
00:44:29,276 --> 00:44:31,316
Speaker 4: and I'm on it. You know, they can get me

981
00:44:31,356 --> 00:44:31,516
Speaker 4: on it.

982
00:44:31,556 --> 00:44:32,036
Speaker 1: I'm on it.

983
00:44:33,236 --> 00:44:34,756
Speaker 4: And here it's the if you put me on that

984
00:44:34,876 --> 00:44:36,916
Speaker 4: midnight red Eye, I'll take that one.

985
00:44:37,036 --> 00:44:37,236
Speaker 1: You know.

986
00:44:37,356 --> 00:44:39,236
Speaker 3: Mostly they don't like me to show up the day

987
00:44:39,236 --> 00:44:39,996
Speaker 3: of that.

988
00:44:41,556 --> 00:44:44,276
Speaker 2: The more you start to like get you know, put

989
00:44:44,276 --> 00:44:46,276
Speaker 2: more miles on yourself, I don't say get older. You

990
00:44:46,316 --> 00:44:48,316
Speaker 2: start to realize I can't do that red Eye flight

991
00:44:48,476 --> 00:44:49,956
Speaker 2: and show up it like, hey, I'm here.

992
00:44:49,876 --> 00:44:52,196
Speaker 1: Everybody, I'm here to work and I'm ready to work.

993
00:44:52,436 --> 00:44:55,316
Speaker 4: Yeah, I won't be good exactly, but again, like that's

994
00:44:55,316 --> 00:44:57,276
Speaker 4: actually less of a concern for me. And then spending

995
00:44:57,276 --> 00:44:59,436
Speaker 4: time with my kids like if I get to do bedtime,

996
00:44:59,476 --> 00:45:00,956
Speaker 4: I'll take being shitty tomorrow.

997
00:45:03,036 --> 00:45:04,596
Speaker 1: I'm gonna need extra makeup today.

998
00:45:06,996 --> 00:45:12,236
Speaker 4: Uh so yeah, so that thing is has been interesting,

999
00:45:12,596 --> 00:45:16,796
Speaker 4: and but being a dad is it's the it's the.

1000
00:45:16,716 --> 00:45:18,956
Speaker 2: Most surprising thing. I mean, I know it's the best thing,

1001
00:45:18,996 --> 00:45:23,396
Speaker 2: but talking about some like really like specific things for me,

1002
00:45:23,916 --> 00:45:28,316
Speaker 2: I'll say, just to give you an example, like how

1003
00:45:28,436 --> 00:45:32,236
Speaker 2: much that like the kid. The moment the kid is born,

1004
00:45:32,716 --> 00:45:35,156
Speaker 2: you're actually meeting who they are, and it just reveals

1005
00:45:35,196 --> 00:45:37,756
Speaker 2: itself more over time, Like from the day each of

1006
00:45:37,756 --> 00:45:40,476
Speaker 2: my three daughters was born. They're that same person, but

1007
00:45:40,516 --> 00:45:42,636
Speaker 2: they were the day they were born. It's just because

1008
00:45:42,676 --> 00:45:45,036
Speaker 2: I just see it more. Their personality has emerged more

1009
00:45:45,076 --> 00:45:45,476
Speaker 2: over time.

1010
00:45:45,556 --> 00:45:46,556
Speaker 3: Man, it's so real.

1011
00:45:46,916 --> 00:45:51,276
Speaker 1: And so yeah, they're not empty vessels. They don't show up.

1012
00:45:51,316 --> 00:45:54,036
Speaker 2: They don't show up like O, well, just put whatever

1013
00:45:54,076 --> 00:45:55,036
Speaker 2: personality you wanted me.

1014
00:45:55,316 --> 00:45:55,636
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1015
00:45:55,716 --> 00:45:56,356
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I.

1016
00:45:58,276 --> 00:45:58,636
Speaker 1: Don't know.

1017
00:45:58,716 --> 00:46:00,436
Speaker 4: I don't think I thought that's what it was going

1018
00:46:00,516 --> 00:46:02,476
Speaker 4: to be exactly, but I did think i'd have slightly

1019
00:46:02,516 --> 00:46:03,516
Speaker 4: more influence than I do.

1020
00:46:03,956 --> 00:46:04,916
Speaker 3: For sure, turns out like.

1021
00:46:04,876 --> 00:46:08,276
Speaker 4: I don't really have any Sometimes I get lucky, but

1022
00:46:08,436 --> 00:46:11,196
Speaker 4: he to he's really into music.

1023
00:46:11,276 --> 00:46:12,116
Speaker 3: Which is great.

1024
00:46:13,076 --> 00:46:15,196
Speaker 4: And we listen to so much music every day, and

1025
00:46:15,196 --> 00:46:17,556
Speaker 4: he's got you know, for for a two year old,

1026
00:46:17,596 --> 00:46:19,676
Speaker 4: like you know, generally they want to listen to the

1027
00:46:19,716 --> 00:46:22,076
Speaker 4: same things over and over again. But his his playlist

1028
00:46:22,076 --> 00:46:23,796
Speaker 4: of songs that he loves that you can sort of

1029
00:46:23,796 --> 00:46:26,796
Speaker 4: play anytime is like probably thirty songs long. Now, like

1030
00:46:26,836 --> 00:46:30,276
Speaker 4: he's you know, like he's made some musical stamina.

1031
00:46:30,356 --> 00:46:33,436
Speaker 2: Yeah, and now are these are these kids songs?

1032
00:46:33,556 --> 00:46:33,716
Speaker 1: No?

1033
00:46:33,916 --> 00:46:36,156
Speaker 3: Almost none of them. I mean, he likes the Bluey

1034
00:46:36,196 --> 00:46:37,556
Speaker 3: theme song Come On.

1035
00:46:37,596 --> 00:46:40,116
Speaker 1: That's which I don't think is really kids programming.

1036
00:46:40,316 --> 00:46:42,276
Speaker 3: No, he doesn't really watch the show.

1037
00:46:42,316 --> 00:46:44,996
Speaker 4: I watched the show, but every time the loops back

1038
00:46:45,036 --> 00:46:46,076
Speaker 4: to the song.

1039
00:46:47,556 --> 00:46:48,596
Speaker 1: It's a show for parents.

1040
00:46:48,676 --> 00:46:51,556
Speaker 2: Yeah, and the cartoon parts for the for the kids,

1041
00:46:51,636 --> 00:46:53,636
Speaker 2: but the actual contents.

1042
00:46:53,196 --> 00:46:56,236
Speaker 3: For the parents exactly. That show is so amazing.

1043
00:46:56,796 --> 00:47:01,396
Speaker 4: But big fan of of of uh.

1044
00:47:00,836 --> 00:47:01,396
Speaker 3: G n X.

1045
00:47:01,476 --> 00:47:03,236
Speaker 4: Like he was like that was you know, which is

1046
00:47:03,316 --> 00:47:06,276
Speaker 4: amazing that it you know, it came out. It was

1047
00:47:06,316 --> 00:47:09,876
Speaker 4: for it was literally his generation, and he like that

1048
00:47:09,996 --> 00:47:12,356
Speaker 4: Kendrick Lamar halftime show. We were just watching it again.

1049
00:47:12,436 --> 00:47:15,516
Speaker 4: He watches it daily. We've had to limit it.

1050
00:47:16,036 --> 00:47:17,876
Speaker 1: Eat your vegetables and then we can watch the.

1051
00:47:17,916 --> 00:47:22,116
Speaker 3: Kid literally what we do, Like, that's not the statement.

1052
00:47:21,796 --> 00:47:23,276
Speaker 1: Have a lot of common because I just watched that

1053
00:47:23,316 --> 00:47:24,716
Speaker 1: recently too, again.

1054
00:47:24,596 --> 00:47:27,156
Speaker 4: Like yeah we yeah, that's on all the time and

1055
00:47:27,156 --> 00:47:29,516
Speaker 4: he has his favorite Peekaboos, his favorite song on the

1056
00:47:30,196 --> 00:47:32,156
Speaker 4: which is inappropriate.

1057
00:47:32,156 --> 00:47:35,356
Speaker 2: I'm a where my seven year old's a TV off kid.

1058
00:47:35,596 --> 00:47:38,436
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I mean yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

1059
00:47:38,756 --> 00:47:39,276
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.

1060
00:47:39,316 --> 00:47:40,356
Speaker 3: He calls that song mustard.

1061
00:47:40,516 --> 00:47:43,756
Speaker 2: Yeah, she was excited to see Mustard at the super Bowl.

1062
00:47:43,796 --> 00:47:44,356
Speaker 1: That was that.

1063
00:47:44,516 --> 00:47:48,356
Speaker 4: Mustard too, And every time it comes out, he goes here,

1064
00:47:48,436 --> 00:47:53,756
Speaker 4: cup Mustard. Yeah, so g had Ex's is out. He's

1065
00:47:53,756 --> 00:47:56,156
Speaker 4: a big Brandy Carlisle fan. Didn't get that from me,

1066
00:47:57,396 --> 00:47:59,596
Speaker 4: saying I like a lot of choices that are his own.

1067
00:47:59,676 --> 00:48:01,276
Speaker 3: Also, that's I would like.

1068
00:48:01,316 --> 00:48:03,876
Speaker 2: The musical festival that was like the big stage is

1069
00:48:03,996 --> 00:48:05,356
Speaker 2: Kendrick Lamar and Brandy Carlisle.

1070
00:48:05,636 --> 00:48:09,276
Speaker 4: Yeah and clipping, Yeah, he only likes a cup all

1071
00:48:09,316 --> 00:48:11,316
Speaker 4: of my songs, but he does ask for them, which

1072
00:48:11,316 --> 00:48:11,996
Speaker 4: is very sweet.

1073
00:48:11,996 --> 00:48:13,916
Speaker 3: He goes one played Dada rapping.

1074
00:48:15,156 --> 00:48:18,436
Speaker 4: Breaks my heart and then I'll play a song and

1075
00:48:18,436 --> 00:48:26,596
Speaker 4: he's like, not that one, but yeah he's he's.

1076
00:48:27,316 --> 00:48:29,876
Speaker 3: Yeah, like he discovered I left the room.

1077
00:48:29,836 --> 00:48:31,436
Speaker 4: At one point and came back in and knew we

1078
00:48:31,436 --> 00:48:34,196
Speaker 4: were We had been like cruising through Apple Music on

1079
00:48:34,236 --> 00:48:36,516
Speaker 4: the Apple TV, which is how crazy it is that

1080
00:48:36,596 --> 00:48:40,036
Speaker 4: he can use remotes and stuff. But I left to

1081
00:48:40,076 --> 00:48:42,916
Speaker 4: use the bathroom song. I came back and he's got uh,

1082
00:48:43,356 --> 00:48:46,956
Speaker 4: some Egyptian pop song on called Bumbum that he's just

1083
00:48:47,116 --> 00:48:51,236
Speaker 4: dancing and he's that. He insisted that I added to

1084
00:48:51,276 --> 00:48:53,556
Speaker 4: his playlist right then, and it is like that's another

1085
00:48:53,596 --> 00:48:55,756
Speaker 4: thing in heavy rotation that he discovered entire time.

1086
00:48:56,636 --> 00:48:57,116
Speaker 1: I didn't know.

1087
00:48:57,396 --> 00:48:59,076
Speaker 3: I had to go look up what it was about.

1088
00:48:59,076 --> 00:49:00,876
Speaker 4: It turns out it's like about a guy who like

1089
00:49:00,956 --> 00:49:04,956
Speaker 4: accidentally gets drunk uh when he's out with his friends

1090
00:49:04,996 --> 00:49:06,476
Speaker 4: and like the hilarity that ensues.

1091
00:49:06,516 --> 00:49:07,796
Speaker 3: It's kind of like a novelty song.

1092
00:49:07,916 --> 00:49:08,036
Speaker 2: Ah.

1093
00:49:08,116 --> 00:49:11,756
Speaker 4: This dude Muhammed was apparently like a that's which sounded

1094
00:49:11,756 --> 00:49:13,396
Speaker 4: fake to me, But that's because I don't know nothing.

1095
00:49:14,036 --> 00:49:17,556
Speaker 4: Uh uh apparently like a very big star and.

1096
00:49:21,956 --> 00:49:23,316
Speaker 3: I don't know, so that stuff's crazy.

1097
00:49:23,356 --> 00:49:26,956
Speaker 4: But yeah, him that that thing about them already being

1098
00:49:26,956 --> 00:49:27,636
Speaker 4: their own people.

1099
00:49:28,636 --> 00:49:32,316
Speaker 3: I think I was surprised initially.

1100
00:49:32,316 --> 00:49:34,836
Speaker 4: This has calmed down somewhat now, but by how much

1101
00:49:34,836 --> 00:49:38,396
Speaker 4: anxiety I had, uh right when he was very small.

1102
00:49:39,636 --> 00:49:44,076
Speaker 4: The pregnancy too, Yeah, I was having I thought I

1103
00:49:44,156 --> 00:49:45,956
Speaker 4: was sick, Like I was in the at the doctor

1104
00:49:45,996 --> 00:49:47,036
Speaker 4: all the time, and it was like I think you

1105
00:49:47,036 --> 00:49:47,556
Speaker 4: should try.

1106
00:49:48,756 --> 00:49:51,636
Speaker 1: Oh wow, just like anxiety if I'm about to be

1107
00:49:51,636 --> 00:49:51,956
Speaker 1: a dad.

1108
00:49:52,076 --> 00:49:54,356
Speaker 4: I wore one of them seven day heart monitors, you know, say,

1109
00:49:54,356 --> 00:49:56,596
Speaker 4: like I was really, I was like, there's something wrong

1110
00:49:56,676 --> 00:49:59,756
Speaker 4: with me and I wanted to be a dad. It

1111
00:49:59,836 --> 00:50:03,796
Speaker 4: was just it was like this incredible amount of fear.

1112
00:50:06,636 --> 00:50:10,836
Speaker 4: And then when he was small too, just that this

1113
00:50:10,916 --> 00:50:13,436
Speaker 4: is the not knowing if you're doing anything right and

1114
00:50:13,596 --> 00:50:17,316
Speaker 4: what does that even mean? And like the whole you know, yeah, really,

1115
00:50:17,516 --> 00:50:21,676
Speaker 4: I there's a person who hasn't. I'm a pretty nervous person,

1116
00:50:21,676 --> 00:50:23,396
Speaker 4: but I don't think of myself as an anxious person.

1117
00:50:23,476 --> 00:50:27,396
Speaker 4: I haven't had a ton of anxiety in my life,

1118
00:50:27,556 --> 00:50:31,356
Speaker 4: but that the last couple of years, I've been like, yeah,

1119
00:50:31,556 --> 00:50:33,116
Speaker 4: more stressed that I ever.

1120
00:50:33,476 --> 00:50:35,276
Speaker 2: Have you figured out what it's connected to exactly? I

1121
00:50:35,316 --> 00:50:37,636
Speaker 2: mean as a dad, I don't. I don't need to

1122
00:50:37,676 --> 00:50:39,556
Speaker 2: be like why would you be anxious? But I get

1123
00:50:39,636 --> 00:50:41,956
Speaker 2: but have you sort of figured out what it is.

1124
00:50:41,956 --> 00:50:44,036
Speaker 1: Or where it's coming from I think it was just.

1125
00:50:45,676 --> 00:50:53,116
Speaker 4: I, you know, really loving somebody very deeply is anxiety

1126
00:50:53,116 --> 00:50:58,396
Speaker 4: inducing in some ways, and that like I can't control everything.

1127
00:50:58,396 --> 00:51:00,956
Speaker 4: I can't make everything good for them, you know, And

1128
00:51:01,036 --> 00:51:05,716
Speaker 4: I am so mostly I think at peace with like

1129
00:51:05,756 --> 00:51:07,836
Speaker 4: the that not everything's going to be good for me,

1130
00:51:08,516 --> 00:51:08,836
Speaker 4: you know.

1131
00:51:08,916 --> 00:51:12,236
Speaker 2: But yeah, you know, yeah, but you can't. You can't

1132
00:51:12,276 --> 00:51:13,716
Speaker 2: wrap your head around mine. Everything's gonna be.

1133
00:51:13,676 --> 00:51:14,676
Speaker 1: Good for him. Yeah.

1134
00:51:14,676 --> 00:51:16,676
Speaker 4: And then with a kid like I had never I've

1135
00:51:16,716 --> 00:51:19,076
Speaker 4: never loved anybody that much, Like that was wild.

1136
00:51:19,276 --> 00:51:20,636
Speaker 3: So this this thing of.

1137
00:51:20,596 --> 00:51:24,396
Speaker 4: Being like, oh, I only want good things for you

1138
00:51:24,436 --> 00:51:27,676
Speaker 4: and that's impossible, and I I just like that really

1139
00:51:27,716 --> 00:51:30,716
Speaker 4: stresses me out. And I think I also had a

1140
00:51:31,716 --> 00:51:34,356
Speaker 4: I had a great childhood in a very hard situation,

1141
00:51:34,516 --> 00:51:37,316
Speaker 4: you know, saying in hindsight, like we were poor, we

1142
00:51:37,316 --> 00:51:39,156
Speaker 4: were East Oakland, we were you know, like it was

1143
00:51:39,196 --> 00:51:43,356
Speaker 4: a lot against us. And I was so happy and

1144
00:51:43,476 --> 00:51:49,836
Speaker 4: like I had so much fun and we have everything relatively,

1145
00:51:49,996 --> 00:51:53,556
Speaker 4: and I am so worried about his happiness all the time,

1146
00:51:53,636 --> 00:51:55,756
Speaker 4: you know, I'm just like, oh, is this what you

1147
00:51:55,836 --> 00:51:56,236
Speaker 4: want to do?

1148
00:51:56,316 --> 00:51:58,516
Speaker 3: And I like and am I around enough?

1149
00:51:58,556 --> 00:52:01,036
Speaker 4: Which I'm really worth of being around That's the one

1150
00:52:01,076 --> 00:52:02,716
Speaker 4: thing I know is that both my parents were they

1151
00:52:02,756 --> 00:52:05,276
Speaker 4: were there. They weren't together, they were both very present,

1152
00:52:05,396 --> 00:52:07,876
Speaker 4: you know. So that's the one thing I try to

1153
00:52:07,916 --> 00:52:11,756
Speaker 4: control as much as I can. That just that he's

1154
00:52:11,796 --> 00:52:13,716
Speaker 4: about to start preschool, Are we choosing the right I

1155
00:52:13,716 --> 00:52:18,796
Speaker 4: don't know, like what and it's preschool. We could change

1156
00:52:18,836 --> 00:52:21,276
Speaker 4: it if he doesn't like it, go somewhere else, like where.

1157
00:52:21,316 --> 00:52:24,076
Speaker 4: It feels like such a stressful decision right now.

1158
00:52:24,676 --> 00:52:28,836
Speaker 3: I don't know.

1159
00:52:43,396 --> 00:52:46,316
Speaker 2: We live in a time where the algorithm once it knows,

1160
00:52:46,316 --> 00:52:47,916
Speaker 2: oh you and your dad, let me send you some

1161
00:52:47,956 --> 00:52:49,156
Speaker 2: things to be anxious about you and.

1162
00:52:49,516 --> 00:52:51,396
Speaker 3: Get the hell off. Yeah, barely.

1163
00:52:52,276 --> 00:52:54,076
Speaker 4: When I have to promote something, I tapped back in

1164
00:52:54,196 --> 00:52:55,476
Speaker 4: but mostly off that.

1165
00:52:55,876 --> 00:52:57,396
Speaker 2: But I think there's just the idea that there's also

1166
00:52:57,436 --> 00:53:00,396
Speaker 2: just so much more information to make you feel anxious

1167
00:53:00,956 --> 00:53:04,116
Speaker 2: and and that before when our parents were around, they

1168
00:53:04,156 --> 00:53:05,556
Speaker 2: just had to sort of you know, there's that one

1169
00:53:05,596 --> 00:53:07,756
Speaker 2: doctor's bock book, but other than that, it was just

1170
00:53:07,796 --> 00:53:11,396
Speaker 2: like just like figure it out, whereas now there's like,

1171
00:53:11,516 --> 00:53:13,956
Speaker 2: oh it's a book. Here's a book for kids who

1172
00:53:13,956 --> 00:53:15,476
Speaker 2: are one month and three days old, you know what

1173
00:53:15,516 --> 00:53:18,436
Speaker 2: I mean. So like there's just a lot more information

1174
00:53:18,476 --> 00:53:20,756
Speaker 2: that wants to make you anxious. But and I understand that,

1175
00:53:20,836 --> 00:53:23,396
Speaker 2: Like and I as a dad who travels a lot,

1176
00:53:23,516 --> 00:53:26,076
Speaker 2: and as a dad who if I talk about work,

1177
00:53:26,156 --> 00:53:27,476
Speaker 2: my kids sort of have that moment.

1178
00:53:27,436 --> 00:53:28,796
Speaker 1: Like are you about to leave? You know what I mean.

1179
00:53:28,836 --> 00:53:31,236
Speaker 2: But it's just like often I'm and I don't travel

1180
00:53:31,236 --> 00:53:33,156
Speaker 2: as much as I used to, but like even coming

1181
00:53:33,196 --> 00:53:35,516
Speaker 2: down here, I have to go. I'm two sleeps. I'll

1182
00:53:35,516 --> 00:53:37,636
Speaker 2: be gone for two sleeps. You have to describing things

1183
00:53:37,636 --> 00:53:39,916
Speaker 2: and sleep. So I feel like it helps, like.

1184
00:53:39,796 --> 00:53:42,596
Speaker 3: It changed everything so immediately.

1185
00:53:43,676 --> 00:53:48,756
Speaker 4: And all for like, I love my life right now.

1186
00:53:48,756 --> 00:53:51,516
Speaker 4: It's so great, but it was, it is. It's a bit.

1187
00:53:51,596 --> 00:53:52,476
Speaker 4: It's a big.

1188
00:53:52,276 --> 00:53:55,396
Speaker 3: Change, you know. So yeah, and it's great.

1189
00:53:55,516 --> 00:53:57,356
Speaker 2: It makes me when you're on the road, you're always

1190
00:53:57,476 --> 00:53:59,156
Speaker 2: like you said, it's like, oh, I'm glad to be

1191
00:53:59,196 --> 00:54:02,916
Speaker 2: here after the show's gore the air for yeah, get

1192
00:54:02,996 --> 00:54:03,596
Speaker 2: how to get home?

1193
00:54:03,636 --> 00:54:04,996
Speaker 3: How do I get home from here?

1194
00:54:05,196 --> 00:54:05,396
Speaker 1: Yeah?

1195
00:54:05,396 --> 00:54:07,596
Speaker 2: This is like I'm I'm like, oh, this will wrap

1196
00:54:07,676 --> 00:54:09,556
Speaker 2: up soon. I mean I have at nine o'clock, but

1197
00:54:09,596 --> 00:54:11,036
Speaker 2: I can just go straight to the airport, you know,

1198
00:54:11,436 --> 00:54:13,756
Speaker 2: you know. I like the idea of like all all.

1199
00:54:13,676 --> 00:54:15,756
Speaker 4: Three of us in clipping now have young children and

1200
00:54:15,836 --> 00:54:18,676
Speaker 4: like that. Jonathan described it really well one time. It's

1201
00:54:18,756 --> 00:54:20,396
Speaker 4: just like, yeah, I love playing shows.

1202
00:54:20,476 --> 00:54:22,756
Speaker 3: I love it. Nothing's better than hanging out with my daughter.

1203
00:54:22,756 --> 00:54:25,636
Speaker 4: Though there's another I would of course rather be doing

1204
00:54:25,676 --> 00:54:28,396
Speaker 4: that than anything else. So it doesn't really matter how

1205
00:54:28,476 --> 00:54:28,996
Speaker 4: much I love this.

1206
00:54:29,236 --> 00:54:30,556
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that more.

1207
00:54:30,636 --> 00:54:33,236
Speaker 1: Yeah. Just unfortunately I can't figure out how hanging off

1208
00:54:33,276 --> 00:54:34,916
Speaker 1: my daughter will pay. Yeah.

1209
00:54:34,756 --> 00:54:37,756
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean you can't say come to the show, yeah,

1210
00:54:38,116 --> 00:54:39,636
Speaker 2: or you do like a family channel where you just

1211
00:54:39,876 --> 00:54:41,036
Speaker 2: put your family on the internet.

1212
00:54:41,596 --> 00:54:42,796
Speaker 3: Yeah, I can't do that.

1213
00:54:42,876 --> 00:54:43,716
Speaker 1: No, I can't do it either.

1214
00:54:43,716 --> 00:54:46,396
Speaker 3: I can't do wish that for him. He is very cute.

1215
00:54:46,396 --> 00:54:50,036
Speaker 1: Though you look at your kid like, man, you could be.

1216
00:54:50,356 --> 00:54:52,156
Speaker 3: You could really make some money, kid, I.

1217
00:54:52,556 --> 00:54:55,356
Speaker 1: Talk, I be your manager, We can really be out there.

1218
00:54:56,076 --> 00:54:59,796
Speaker 3: That has occurred to me. Yeah, but I think he's

1219
00:54:59,916 --> 00:55:02,036
Speaker 3: he's pretty introverted like me. I don't think you would

1220
00:55:02,036 --> 00:55:02,676
Speaker 3: love it, so.

1221
00:55:02,996 --> 00:55:05,516
Speaker 2: For sure, for sure. Before we get out of here,

1222
00:55:05,516 --> 00:55:08,876
Speaker 2: a couple more things. Uh So, I moved to the

1223
00:55:08,916 --> 00:55:11,436
Speaker 2: band in ninety seven, and I was really moving to

1224
00:55:11,476 --> 00:55:13,156
Speaker 2: be a part of the San Franco comedy scene. But

1225
00:55:13,196 --> 00:55:15,836
Speaker 2: I found an apartment in Oakland. So that's how I

1226
00:55:15,916 --> 00:55:18,276
Speaker 2: ended up in Oakland. I lived in the city, but

1227
00:55:18,316 --> 00:55:19,916
Speaker 2: I was even for a while, but I was always

1228
00:55:19,996 --> 00:55:21,636
Speaker 2: in Oakland because I met Melissa. She was in the

1229
00:55:21,636 --> 00:55:23,636
Speaker 2: East Bay, and I worked and had a day job

1230
00:55:23,716 --> 00:55:25,836
Speaker 2: in Berkeley, and so it was like I was.

1231
00:55:25,796 --> 00:55:27,476
Speaker 1: Like, again, it's sliding door things.

1232
00:55:27,476 --> 00:55:29,796
Speaker 2: If I found an apartment in San Francisco, maybe I'm

1233
00:55:29,836 --> 00:55:33,716
Speaker 2: a different my life's different, but I'm so like and

1234
00:55:33,756 --> 00:55:36,036
Speaker 2: I've only learned more as i've sort of been in Oakland.

1235
00:55:36,116 --> 00:55:37,916
Speaker 2: And we moved back to the Bay in twenty fourteen,

1236
00:55:37,956 --> 00:55:41,556
Speaker 2: right apart met you, and my one oldest doughter was

1237
00:55:41,596 --> 00:55:42,316
Speaker 2: born in San Francisco.

1238
00:55:42,356 --> 00:55:43,956
Speaker 1: By the two kids were born in the East Bay.

1239
00:55:44,876 --> 00:55:47,716
Speaker 2: But so there's just this real sense of like my

1240
00:55:47,836 --> 00:55:49,276
Speaker 2: kids are growing up with this idea of like we

1241
00:55:49,316 --> 00:55:52,396
Speaker 2: are from Oakland or we are from the East Bay.

1242
00:55:52,596 --> 00:55:55,676
Speaker 2: Can you talk about for people from the outside, Because

1243
00:55:55,676 --> 00:55:57,996
Speaker 2: there's a thing and I heard you, we've talked about

1244
00:55:58,036 --> 00:56:00,196
Speaker 2: you've talked about before, like that you told me when

1245
00:56:00,196 --> 00:56:03,236
Speaker 2: you were doing a blind spotting that like you had

1246
00:56:03,236 --> 00:56:05,396
Speaker 2: to explain to the to the costume people, no people

1247
00:56:05,396 --> 00:56:06,916
Speaker 2: from Oakland were things that say Oakland on.

1248
00:56:07,076 --> 00:56:11,476
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not it's not weird. It's not the only

1249
00:56:11,476 --> 00:56:12,996
Speaker 1: tourists do conversation.

1250
00:56:13,156 --> 00:56:16,756
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, actually we do wear It's not like everybody

1251
00:56:16,796 --> 00:56:20,476
Speaker 4: can just be wearing shirts to wrep the city. Yeah,

1252
00:56:20,756 --> 00:56:23,156
Speaker 4: they kind of go walk around for a second.

1253
00:56:22,836 --> 00:56:26,276
Speaker 1: You know, I can. Yeah, So can you just explain

1254
00:56:26,436 --> 00:56:27,516
Speaker 1: what that is? Why?

1255
00:56:27,676 --> 00:56:29,876
Speaker 2: What is the secret sauce there? Because you know, a

1256
00:56:29,916 --> 00:56:31,956
Speaker 2: lot of people love their hometown, but you've traveled all

1257
00:56:31,956 --> 00:56:33,676
Speaker 2: over the world, so you've seen other places.

1258
00:56:33,916 --> 00:56:34,676
Speaker 1: What is it about?

1259
00:56:34,916 --> 00:56:36,476
Speaker 2: And I feel like there's also part of the conversation

1260
00:56:36,556 --> 00:56:39,476
Speaker 2: that I also want to have East Bay versus Oakland.

1261
00:56:40,196 --> 00:56:41,516
Speaker 3: That's interesting, like like you.

1262
00:56:41,476 --> 00:56:43,436
Speaker 2: Also went to school in Berkeley, right, Yeah, so there's

1263
00:56:43,476 --> 00:56:46,156
Speaker 2: also the Berkeley thing versus Oakland.

1264
00:56:46,556 --> 00:56:48,556
Speaker 1: And I find myself in times like trying to figure

1265
00:56:48,556 --> 00:56:50,476
Speaker 1: out I live in Oakland.

1266
00:56:50,516 --> 00:56:52,356
Speaker 2: I love Oakland, but also I love the greater East

1267
00:56:52,396 --> 00:56:54,316
Speaker 2: Bay and also I did live in Berkeley, you know.

1268
00:56:54,396 --> 00:56:56,116
Speaker 2: And I'm not mad, you know, and I'm not trying to,

1269
00:56:56,276 --> 00:56:58,596
Speaker 2: but just but there is a there's all these different

1270
00:56:58,596 --> 00:57:01,676
Speaker 2: ways to describe this place and to name this place.

1271
00:57:01,916 --> 00:57:09,356
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's a lot to unpack there.

1272
00:57:08,276 --> 00:57:10,476
Speaker 1: A lot. Yeah, and it is inside baseball. But I

1273
00:57:10,516 --> 00:57:11,596
Speaker 1: sort of feel like there's.

1274
00:57:11,436 --> 00:57:14,076
Speaker 3: No more baseball. But that's not true. I mean the.

1275
00:57:14,956 --> 00:57:17,276
Speaker 1: Balls, dollars, yeah, the ballers, the boers.

1276
00:57:17,796 --> 00:57:20,556
Speaker 2: But yeah, so like I just feel like you are

1277
00:57:20,596 --> 00:57:23,276
Speaker 2: from that place, so you and I feel sometimes I've

1278
00:57:23,276 --> 00:57:26,996
Speaker 2: gotten to the place where I'm really careful with my language,

1279
00:57:27,396 --> 00:57:30,276
Speaker 2: like because I know that sometimes people from Oakland are like, hey, come,

1280
00:57:30,316 --> 00:57:32,636
Speaker 2: I'll slow the down, you know what I mean, Like,

1281
00:57:32,716 --> 00:57:35,076
Speaker 2: you're not you didn't go to high school here, so

1282
00:57:35,196 --> 00:57:35,796
Speaker 2: settle down.

1283
00:57:35,996 --> 00:57:37,876
Speaker 1: So I'm like, okay, so you know, okay, I'll set

1284
00:57:37,916 --> 00:57:38,556
Speaker 1: it out a little bit.

1285
00:57:38,516 --> 00:57:39,916
Speaker 3: You know, but you I don't know, you've been there

1286
00:57:39,916 --> 00:57:41,996
Speaker 3: off a long time. But but yeah.

1287
00:57:41,916 --> 00:57:44,076
Speaker 1: As a as you're like, you're I've been here long,

1288
00:57:44,156 --> 00:57:44,676
Speaker 1: You've been alive.

1289
00:57:44,716 --> 00:57:52,916
Speaker 4: But okay, I think this is this feels like it's

1290
00:57:53,116 --> 00:57:56,516
Speaker 4: I'm speaking from a particular perspective of my age. Also

1291
00:57:56,596 --> 00:57:58,436
Speaker 4: that should be madeware. So like, I don't know how

1292
00:57:58,436 --> 00:58:02,716
Speaker 4: this applies to people younger than me, but it used

1293
00:58:02,756 --> 00:58:04,716
Speaker 4: to be and this is still to a degree true.

1294
00:58:06,116 --> 00:58:09,436
Speaker 4: When you tell people you're from California, it's either La

1295
00:58:09,556 --> 00:58:12,036
Speaker 4: or San Francisco, right, Like those are the two things that.

1296
00:58:11,996 --> 00:58:14,196
Speaker 1: People know yeah, sure.

1297
00:58:16,236 --> 00:58:19,556
Speaker 4: So part of being from the East Bay was about

1298
00:58:19,876 --> 00:58:22,676
Speaker 4: differentiating from that. It was hard line about we are

1299
00:58:22,796 --> 00:58:26,756
Speaker 4: not San Francisco, and you know because you're there, like

1300
00:58:26,796 --> 00:58:31,476
Speaker 4: culturally they are very different experiences. But also like yeah,

1301
00:58:31,596 --> 00:58:35,636
Speaker 4: we just hated that thing, like that's not who we are,

1302
00:58:35,676 --> 00:58:37,596
Speaker 4: Like we're we're over here and we're own thing.

1303
00:58:37,676 --> 00:58:38,556
Speaker 3: We're either it's.

1304
00:58:38,436 --> 00:58:40,796
Speaker 2: Sort of analogous to the Brooklyn Queens thing, but like.

1305
00:58:42,356 --> 00:58:45,596
Speaker 1: The cities, different cultures and differsonality.

1306
00:58:45,436 --> 00:58:46,796
Speaker 3: Functions the same way sort of.

1307
00:58:48,276 --> 00:58:52,636
Speaker 4: And so there's that Oakland being kind of like the

1308
00:58:52,676 --> 00:58:56,036
Speaker 4: biggest East Bay city, like the kind of hub that

1309
00:58:56,196 --> 00:58:58,676
Speaker 4: also became kind of a catch all for East Bay, right,

1310
00:58:58,836 --> 00:59:02,796
Speaker 4: And so there'd be again like if you're away, you

1311
00:59:02,836 --> 00:59:04,996
Speaker 4: could tell people from San Franciso.

1312
00:59:04,636 --> 00:59:07,716
Speaker 3: No from Oakland, then you'll just match just across the bridge. Whatever.

1313
00:59:08,436 --> 00:59:11,596
Speaker 4: If you start saying saying if you start saying things

1314
00:59:11,636 --> 00:59:15,996
Speaker 4: like Hayward or San Leandro or whatever else, Rito, Albany

1315
00:59:16,076 --> 00:59:18,956
Speaker 4: where I lived, like all of it, you know, Richmond,

1316
00:59:19,076 --> 00:59:22,636
Speaker 4: all these other things, people, it got so granular that

1317
00:59:22,676 --> 00:59:26,676
Speaker 4: people couldn't take it. So there was also this generalization happening,

1318
00:59:26,756 --> 00:59:29,196
Speaker 4: and for people who are really from Oakland used to

1319
00:59:29,236 --> 00:59:31,956
Speaker 4: be like you got used to being like people say,

1320
00:59:31,956 --> 00:59:35,596
Speaker 4: I'm from Oakland, Oh where we'll part you from, you know,

1321
00:59:35,916 --> 00:59:36,756
Speaker 4: or I'm from there too.

1322
00:59:36,876 --> 00:59:40,196
Speaker 3: Oh well I'm from Piedmont, you know.

1323
00:59:40,156 --> 00:59:42,276
Speaker 4: Which is actually like part of Oakland but you don't

1324
00:59:42,276 --> 00:59:46,436
Speaker 4: want to you know, or you know, was like a suburb,

1325
00:59:46,596 --> 00:59:50,236
Speaker 4: or you know, I'm from Hayward people. Yeah, so there

1326
00:59:50,676 --> 00:59:53,556
Speaker 4: there's this this other kind of like Oakland chauvinism, because

1327
00:59:53,556 --> 00:59:56,596
Speaker 4: Oakland feels special because it like was the hub.

1328
00:59:57,036 --> 00:59:59,596
Speaker 3: It was like it had the the.

1329
01:00:01,236 --> 01:00:05,956
Speaker 4: It was a historically was like a rougher area, you know,

1330
01:00:06,116 --> 01:00:09,676
Speaker 4: although I don't know, we were all scared of Richmond.

1331
01:00:10,476 --> 01:00:15,036
Speaker 3: But so yeah, so there was there was that too.

1332
01:00:16,276 --> 01:00:17,836
Speaker 4: So yeah, there was like a badge of honor with

1333
01:00:17,916 --> 01:00:20,916
Speaker 4: being from Oakland, from this like home of the Black

1334
01:00:20,956 --> 01:00:24,876
Speaker 4: Panther Party, this like real like sort of important like cultural,

1335
01:00:25,356 --> 01:00:29,716
Speaker 4: culturally relevant thing. And so I always I was born

1336
01:00:29,756 --> 01:00:32,156
Speaker 4: in Oakland, and my dad always lived in Oakland, and

1337
01:00:32,196 --> 01:00:34,596
Speaker 4: my mom then kept moving further and further north. So

1338
01:00:34,676 --> 01:00:36,396
Speaker 4: I was, as a person who was kind of out

1339
01:00:36,396 --> 01:00:40,036
Speaker 4: of place anyway, would always just claim Oakland because I

1340
01:00:40,156 --> 01:00:43,636
Speaker 4: was always living there. And then when I moved back home,

1341
01:00:43,676 --> 01:00:46,036
Speaker 4: I moved to Oakland, so you know, I've always felt

1342
01:00:46,116 --> 01:00:49,356
Speaker 4: like that was my home. But I also, like my

1343
01:00:49,436 --> 01:00:51,556
Speaker 4: mom lived in Albany, and I would never claim that,

1344
01:00:51,676 --> 01:00:53,356
Speaker 4: like that's crazy. You don't want to say that in

1345
01:00:53,436 --> 01:00:59,196
Speaker 4: public Like already is a very like well off small

1346
01:00:59,316 --> 01:01:02,756
Speaker 4: suburb with great public schools and where the most of

1347
01:01:02,796 --> 01:01:07,876
Speaker 4: the population, at least at the time were families of

1348
01:01:08,476 --> 01:01:11,916
Speaker 4: professors or my mom's case, they had one student housing

1349
01:01:11,956 --> 01:01:14,636
Speaker 4: complex down by the train tracks called the University Village

1350
01:01:14,676 --> 01:01:17,996
Speaker 4: where like graduate students with families could could live. And

1351
01:01:18,036 --> 01:01:19,676
Speaker 4: so my mom had gone back to school after my

1352
01:01:19,756 --> 01:01:23,316
Speaker 4: brother was born, and so she moved to the to

1353
01:01:23,396 --> 01:01:26,196
Speaker 4: the village, which is really desirable because again, like great

1354
01:01:26,196 --> 01:01:28,036
Speaker 4: public schools in Albany. So if you're gonna send it

1355
01:01:28,116 --> 01:01:30,596
Speaker 4: the thing, I understand so much more now than I

1356
01:01:30,676 --> 01:01:32,476
Speaker 4: did at the time. But like we had just saiducated

1357
01:01:32,476 --> 01:01:35,156
Speaker 4: in public school, you could live in Albany, then there

1358
01:01:35,196 --> 01:01:35,476
Speaker 4: you go.

1359
01:01:36,996 --> 01:01:37,356
Speaker 3: And so.

1360
01:01:39,316 --> 01:01:43,716
Speaker 4: Yeah, so there there's always this kind of like division

1361
01:01:43,796 --> 01:01:46,076
Speaker 4: and explanation and like where are you really from and

1362
01:01:46,116 --> 01:01:48,636
Speaker 4: all this stuff, But yeah, a lot of it, at

1363
01:01:48,716 --> 01:01:54,076
Speaker 4: least when we were young, was about being able to

1364
01:01:54,116 --> 01:01:58,276
Speaker 4: claim something that felt tough, you know, both because like

1365
01:01:58,316 --> 01:01:59,836
Speaker 4: it's cool because you're a young man and you want

1366
01:01:59,876 --> 01:02:02,276
Speaker 4: to feel tough, and also because like there's a certain

1367
01:02:02,356 --> 01:02:05,156
Speaker 4: kind of safety with having people be a little bit

1368
01:02:05,236 --> 01:02:09,436
Speaker 4: afraid of you for no good reason, right, like for

1369
01:02:09,436 --> 01:02:11,476
Speaker 4: someone like me, you know, who's not a scary person

1370
01:02:12,636 --> 01:02:14,436
Speaker 4: to lead with something that's a little bit like.

1371
01:02:14,516 --> 01:02:17,116
Speaker 3: Oh and like that.

1372
01:02:17,276 --> 01:02:19,876
Speaker 4: There's another great thing about Oakland is that like there's

1373
01:02:19,916 --> 01:02:22,436
Speaker 4: a kind of danger associated with it, even though like

1374
01:02:22,476 --> 01:02:24,516
Speaker 4: a lot of us are very artsy, like, even though

1375
01:02:24,516 --> 01:02:28,116
Speaker 4: it's a sort of and it's you know, you get

1376
01:02:28,156 --> 01:02:32,316
Speaker 4: your you get your like kumbaya, you're sort of hippiasthetic

1377
01:02:32,396 --> 01:02:34,476
Speaker 4: mixed right in with all your gangsterism and stuff. So

1378
01:02:34,876 --> 01:02:38,676
Speaker 4: it's and it was, so it's very useful to be

1379
01:02:38,676 --> 01:02:41,076
Speaker 4: able to come from a place that is that mixture,

1380
01:02:41,116 --> 01:02:44,396
Speaker 4: you know, where I got the hard part for Free

1381
01:02:45,196 --> 01:02:50,156
Speaker 4: God having to actually portray any of it. And so yeah,

1382
01:02:50,236 --> 01:02:52,716
Speaker 4: that's what I think about it for me. But it

1383
01:02:52,796 --> 01:02:57,316
Speaker 4: is like sort of the rich cultural history, the history

1384
01:02:57,316 --> 01:03:00,876
Speaker 4: of protests, the intellectual.

1385
01:03:00,276 --> 01:03:03,636
Speaker 3: History of Oakland, you know, and it.

1386
01:03:03,716 --> 01:03:06,116
Speaker 4: Is all there, and it is all there actually in

1387
01:03:06,116 --> 01:03:09,876
Speaker 4: the Holy Spade. But the neighborhoods field different. But like

1388
01:03:10,756 --> 01:03:12,516
Speaker 4: you know, I can go home and talk to people

1389
01:03:12,556 --> 01:03:14,716
Speaker 4: about books. I can't really talk to people in La

1390
01:03:14,756 --> 01:03:15,436
Speaker 4: about books.

1391
01:03:15,476 --> 01:03:16,916
Speaker 3: Really.

1392
01:03:19,476 --> 01:03:26,636
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it's so it's that there is something different there, and.

1393
01:03:28,596 --> 01:03:31,956
Speaker 3: Especially for artists, but kind of for everybody. There's a.

1394
01:03:33,596 --> 01:03:36,316
Speaker 4: I think if you're from there, there's a there's an

1395
01:03:36,396 --> 01:03:39,076
Speaker 4: understanding that like it is special, and a lot of

1396
01:03:39,156 --> 01:03:40,556
Speaker 4: us end up fighting to.

1397
01:03:40,396 --> 01:03:43,276
Speaker 3: Keep it that way or to figure out how to keep.

1398
01:03:43,156 --> 01:03:46,556
Speaker 4: It that way and to figure out how to be

1399
01:03:46,676 --> 01:03:49,316
Speaker 4: able to survive and live there and make better livings there,

1400
01:03:49,356 --> 01:03:51,316
Speaker 4: and you know, you're still living there, so like this

1401
01:03:51,396 --> 01:03:53,316
Speaker 4: is a this is weird, like really part of that

1402
01:03:53,396 --> 01:03:56,396
Speaker 4: it's like how to you know, how can we grow

1403
01:03:56,436 --> 01:03:58,236
Speaker 4: this here instead of having to leave so much to

1404
01:03:58,716 --> 01:04:03,596
Speaker 4: figure this out and so and often at odds with

1405
01:04:03,836 --> 01:04:08,836
Speaker 4: our elected officials or you know, like there's often not

1406
01:04:08,876 --> 01:04:12,876
Speaker 4: a lot of help. But because I think historically that

1407
01:04:12,996 --> 01:04:16,316
Speaker 4: is also true, like the way community works there is

1408
01:04:16,356 --> 01:04:18,196
Speaker 4: different than it is in a lot of places.

1409
01:04:18,476 --> 01:04:19,156
Speaker 3: Certainly that it.

1410
01:04:19,156 --> 01:04:23,036
Speaker 4: Is here, you know, which geographically is very different. There

1411
01:04:23,036 --> 01:04:24,076
Speaker 4: are all sorts of reasons for that.

1412
01:04:24,156 --> 01:04:29,956
Speaker 2: But but yeah, La was northern was that area. It

1413
01:04:29,996 --> 01:04:32,156
Speaker 2: would be like nine different cities, like it would not

1414
01:04:32,236 --> 01:04:33,236
Speaker 2: be just Los Angeles.

1415
01:04:33,356 --> 01:04:37,076
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, so we you know, there's a.

1416
01:04:38,516 --> 01:04:41,076
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's a kind of community there that like does

1417
01:04:41,236 --> 01:04:44,836
Speaker 4: feel different. And I think when you're from there, you've

1418
01:04:44,876 --> 01:04:46,956
Speaker 4: lived there a long time, there is this sort of

1419
01:04:47,436 --> 01:04:50,556
Speaker 4: uh drive and desire to continue to give back to

1420
01:04:50,596 --> 01:04:52,996
Speaker 4: it and continue to figure out how to.

1421
01:04:52,876 --> 01:04:55,156
Speaker 3: Make it a better place, because we all love it.

1422
01:04:55,156 --> 01:04:55,836
Speaker 1: So much.

1423
01:04:57,476 --> 01:05:00,716
Speaker 4: And even when we're not there, like we want it

1424
01:05:00,836 --> 01:05:04,836
Speaker 4: to thrive. Like the so much of my identity is

1425
01:05:04,876 --> 01:05:07,716
Speaker 4: about being from Oakland and being from.

1426
01:05:07,596 --> 01:05:09,036
Speaker 3: The East Bay in general, and so like.

1427
01:05:11,116 --> 01:05:16,436
Speaker 4: As that changes, I feel it is like shake, it shakes.

1428
01:05:16,156 --> 01:05:20,356
Speaker 3: Some things for me. You know, there were.

1429
01:05:22,236 --> 01:05:24,916
Speaker 4: Yes, but people could you know, families that I knew

1430
01:05:24,956 --> 01:05:26,716
Speaker 4: can't live there anymore, all that stuff, like all these

1431
01:05:26,996 --> 01:05:28,876
Speaker 4: just home the things that you called home, And that

1432
01:05:29,076 --> 01:05:32,276
Speaker 4: happens for everybody everywhere. But I think us or for me,

1433
01:05:32,876 --> 01:05:34,996
Speaker 4: loving that place so much, like it takes on like

1434
01:05:35,076 --> 01:05:38,756
Speaker 4: more of a Sometimes you feel like your foundation gets

1435
01:05:38,756 --> 01:05:42,276
Speaker 4: shaky when I don't know if the a's leave heard

1436
01:05:42,356 --> 01:05:47,076
Speaker 4: something you know, like or whatever, or the or the

1437
01:05:47,116 --> 01:05:51,436
Speaker 4: warriors leading a sign I'm not still It's like that's

1438
01:05:51,556 --> 01:05:53,996
Speaker 4: what a yeah, a slap.

1439
01:05:53,596 --> 01:05:56,556
Speaker 3: In the face. You were on the better side.

1440
01:05:56,916 --> 01:05:58,916
Speaker 2: You want some championships and the services like, oh we'd

1441
01:05:58,956 --> 01:06:00,836
Speaker 2: like that team now, yeah, bring back over here.

1442
01:06:00,916 --> 01:06:02,116
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah.

1443
01:06:02,156 --> 01:06:05,316
Speaker 2: Well, I think it's just the sort of connected to

1444
01:06:05,356 --> 01:06:09,956
Speaker 2: all this is there's not every city has an activist culture,

1445
01:06:10,476 --> 01:06:13,556
Speaker 2: but I don't know that every city demands that all

1446
01:06:13,596 --> 01:06:15,716
Speaker 2: of its people sort of be engaged in the activist

1447
01:06:15,756 --> 01:06:18,436
Speaker 2: culture of the way that Oakland does. And Berkeley is

1448
01:06:18,476 --> 01:06:20,356
Speaker 2: part of this too with the free speech movement and everything.

1449
01:06:20,476 --> 01:06:23,156
Speaker 2: But the idea that like talk about, because you could

1450
01:06:23,156 --> 01:06:26,556
Speaker 2: be doing everything you're doing and not be regularly engaging

1451
01:06:26,596 --> 01:06:29,036
Speaker 2: in activism, right, you could just be like, I'm working,

1452
01:06:29,236 --> 01:06:32,556
Speaker 2: I'm a good representative of my city, but you are

1453
01:06:32,596 --> 01:06:37,076
Speaker 2: also regularly sort of like speaking out and saying things

1454
01:06:37,116 --> 01:06:40,196
Speaker 2: and supporting things someone regularly. Yeah, yeah, I mean I

1455
01:06:40,236 --> 01:06:42,756
Speaker 2: see you know, yeah, I'll say regularly.

1456
01:06:42,956 --> 01:06:46,876
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, more than most. All right again, more flowers,

1457
01:06:46,916 --> 01:06:47,276
Speaker 1: thank you?

1458
01:06:47,316 --> 01:06:47,556
Speaker 2: Sorry?

1459
01:06:47,596 --> 01:06:50,596
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Here's the thing. When people call on you,

1460
01:06:50,596 --> 01:06:51,556
Speaker 1: you do answer the call.

1461
01:06:52,036 --> 01:06:54,316
Speaker 2: It's not like you're not like, sorry, I've got a

1462
01:06:54,316 --> 01:06:56,836
Speaker 2: big movie coming out. I can't really be out here

1463
01:06:57,356 --> 01:06:59,876
Speaker 2: looking like I care about these care about humans.

1464
01:06:59,956 --> 01:07:02,796
Speaker 1: Yeah, so why do you answer the call?

1465
01:07:03,716 --> 01:07:05,756
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I think it was how we grew up,

1466
01:07:05,796 --> 01:07:08,796
Speaker 4: you know, I mean the Berkeley all the Berkeley High thing,

1467
01:07:08,796 --> 01:07:10,356
Speaker 4: like we were walking out of school every day.

1468
01:07:10,396 --> 01:07:12,676
Speaker 3: I don't know, prot it was a protest. It was

1469
01:07:12,716 --> 01:07:14,236
Speaker 3: at least a protest a week.

1470
01:07:15,316 --> 01:07:17,916
Speaker 4: Just like, and the teachers were like, oh, we got

1471
01:07:17,916 --> 01:07:18,756
Speaker 4: to wrap up class earlier.

1472
01:07:18,756 --> 01:07:20,076
Speaker 3: I know, you got a big protest to get to.

1473
01:07:20,196 --> 01:07:23,876
Speaker 1: You know. It was like, uh, we'll stop math today

1474
01:07:23,876 --> 01:07:24,636
Speaker 1: because you gotta get up.

1475
01:07:24,676 --> 01:07:25,756
Speaker 3: You guys got to get out there.

1476
01:07:26,236 --> 01:07:27,316
Speaker 1: Nuclear here.

1477
01:07:27,436 --> 01:07:29,356
Speaker 4: I have some extra signs behind the desk if you'd

1478
01:07:29,476 --> 01:07:30,796
Speaker 4: like to, you know, whatever.

1479
01:07:32,156 --> 01:07:35,276
Speaker 3: So, yeah, it was just part of it, and I

1480
01:07:35,316 --> 01:07:37,636
Speaker 3: don't know it was.

1481
01:07:40,116 --> 01:07:44,476
Speaker 4: It was sort of a surprised to find art separate

1482
01:07:44,516 --> 01:07:48,276
Speaker 4: from activism actually, like upon leaving, you know, I didn't

1483
01:07:48,316 --> 01:07:51,036
Speaker 4: really know. I guess I had heard tell of it,

1484
01:07:51,116 --> 01:07:53,316
Speaker 4: but like I didn't really know how you participated, and

1485
01:07:53,396 --> 01:07:54,756
Speaker 4: I didn't know that it existed.

1486
01:07:54,996 --> 01:07:55,196
Speaker 1: You know.

1487
01:07:55,996 --> 01:07:59,356
Speaker 4: I was a poetry slam kid, and I was like whatever,

1488
01:07:59,476 --> 01:08:03,476
Speaker 4: like I you know, Mark Mamuti, Joseph one of my mentors,

1489
01:08:03,516 --> 01:08:08,356
Speaker 4: like they're there literally was no separation between like any

1490
01:08:08,396 --> 01:08:10,996
Speaker 4: word he said, and like any way that his body

1491
01:08:11,036 --> 01:08:17,036
Speaker 4: moves and like his connection to activism, So like I yeah,

1492
01:08:17,116 --> 01:08:20,996
Speaker 4: so it's just yeah, it's just kind of in there

1493
01:08:22,436 --> 01:08:26,796
Speaker 4: and it's not you know, it's not all great. There's

1494
01:08:26,956 --> 01:08:29,316
Speaker 4: you know, there are some ways that like Berkeley is

1495
01:08:29,356 --> 01:08:33,676
Speaker 4: really fucking annoying man like Oakley can be really annoying.

1496
01:08:34,516 --> 01:08:38,076
Speaker 4: But also I would take it over, you know, I

1497
01:08:38,356 --> 01:08:44,956
Speaker 4: would take an awareness, even at the expense of just

1498
01:08:44,996 --> 01:08:47,396
Speaker 4: being able to have a nice dinner, you know, to

1499
01:08:48,356 --> 01:08:50,476
Speaker 4: the other side of it, to only ever having nice

1500
01:08:50,516 --> 01:08:54,436
Speaker 4: tenders with like not having at least some some awareness

1501
01:08:54,436 --> 01:08:58,596
Speaker 4: and desire to like help people that like things should

1502
01:08:58,596 --> 01:09:00,836
Speaker 4: not be as they are and how do I at

1503
01:09:01,196 --> 01:09:03,596
Speaker 4: at least some exploration of how do I fit into that,

1504
01:09:03,636 --> 01:09:06,396
Speaker 4: and how can I affect that and how can we

1505
01:09:06,556 --> 01:09:07,596
Speaker 4: affect that for each other.

1506
01:09:08,116 --> 01:09:10,076
Speaker 2: There's also to me with the thing that when I

1507
01:09:10,116 --> 01:09:12,876
Speaker 2: think about what I gained by moving to the Bay

1508
01:09:12,916 --> 01:09:17,676
Speaker 2: Area and living in Oakland specifically, there's an effortless intersectionality

1509
01:09:17,676 --> 01:09:20,876
Speaker 2: that happens there where you just stumble across different communities

1510
01:09:20,956 --> 01:09:23,436
Speaker 2: and so then you leave and go, Wait, you guys

1511
01:09:23,436 --> 01:09:25,836
Speaker 2: are freaked out about those things. I didn't know, to

1512
01:09:25,876 --> 01:09:27,836
Speaker 2: be freaked out about those things, you know what I mean,

1513
01:09:27,916 --> 01:09:30,556
Speaker 2: Like I was just sort of around people saying those things,

1514
01:09:30,596 --> 01:09:33,596
Speaker 2: and you know, so you know that we just sort

1515
01:09:33,636 --> 01:09:35,596
Speaker 2: of that even though it's funny, Oakland has this very

1516
01:09:35,636 --> 01:09:37,836
Speaker 2: hard you know, like you said, like you know, like

1517
01:09:37,996 --> 01:09:41,116
Speaker 2: don't oh you're from Oakland up. But also like Oakland

1518
01:09:41,156 --> 01:09:44,956
Speaker 2: has this like as long as you're cool, you know. Yeah,

1519
01:09:45,036 --> 01:09:47,236
Speaker 2: and also down for the people, down for the cause,

1520
01:09:47,276 --> 01:09:49,116
Speaker 2: down for the people struggling, down for the oppressed.

1521
01:09:49,436 --> 01:09:51,796
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, and not a lot of.

1522
01:09:56,156 --> 01:09:58,396
Speaker 4: There's not a lot of pretense about what that looks

1523
01:09:58,476 --> 01:10:00,876
Speaker 4: like on some what kind of person that is, right,

1524
01:10:01,436 --> 01:10:08,196
Speaker 4: It's a diverse community in all senses, economically, ethnically, and

1525
01:10:08,396 --> 01:10:11,756
Speaker 4: just so like there's yeah, I feel like a lot

1526
01:10:11,756 --> 01:10:15,316
Speaker 4: of places you'll go and there's there's just an assumption

1527
01:10:15,396 --> 01:10:17,636
Speaker 4: that a person who cares about this is this kind

1528
01:10:17,676 --> 01:10:19,356
Speaker 4: of a person, or has this kind of a job,

1529
01:10:19,476 --> 01:10:20,996
Speaker 4: or does this really you know, and that's just not

1530
01:10:21,036 --> 01:10:24,956
Speaker 4: true there. Like you said, like the intersectionality is very common.

1531
01:10:24,996 --> 01:10:27,996
Speaker 4: It's almost like it just is how it is, you know.

1532
01:10:29,316 --> 01:10:30,996
Speaker 4: And I think that's one of the things when you

1533
01:10:31,076 --> 01:10:36,076
Speaker 4: talk about the reason we are so proud of it

1534
01:10:36,156 --> 01:10:42,316
Speaker 4: when we're from there is because we you know, you

1535
01:10:42,396 --> 01:10:44,716
Speaker 4: go away and you is the first time when you

1536
01:10:44,756 --> 01:10:48,636
Speaker 4: realize that not everywhere. It's like oh and you're starting

1537
01:10:48,636 --> 01:10:51,276
Speaker 4: to explain yourself all the time, and the explanation always

1538
01:10:51,316 --> 01:10:53,956
Speaker 4: ends up starting to look, I'm from I'm from Oakland.

1539
01:10:53,996 --> 01:10:58,316
Speaker 3: So and then you know and you hope that that.

1540
01:10:58,236 --> 01:10:59,676
Speaker 1: Will be enough. Is that you know?

1541
01:10:59,796 --> 01:11:06,236
Speaker 4: So you yeah, yeah, it's a different way of seeing things.

1542
01:11:06,276 --> 01:11:08,716
Speaker 3: It just is it just it just is. I don't

1543
01:11:08,716 --> 01:11:10,356
Speaker 3: know and make it, but I grew up in it,

1544
01:11:10,636 --> 01:11:11,916
Speaker 3: so like, yeah.

1545
01:11:11,916 --> 01:11:14,036
Speaker 1: You're and you're making it. You're making it.

1546
01:11:14,156 --> 01:11:17,756
Speaker 2: My penultimate question, are there any Is there any life

1547
01:11:17,876 --> 01:11:20,156
Speaker 2: lesson or thing that is true in your life? Are

1548
01:11:20,196 --> 01:11:21,836
Speaker 2: things that regularly help you sort of get through the

1549
01:11:21,916 --> 01:11:24,156
Speaker 2: day or sort of process the world, or things that

1550
01:11:24,196 --> 01:11:27,236
Speaker 2: you're like, this thing is true, this thing I've learned,

1551
01:11:27,276 --> 01:11:29,156
Speaker 2: this thing my mom said, this thing I read one

1552
01:11:29,196 --> 01:11:31,876
Speaker 2: time really helps you sort of like a mantra or

1553
01:11:31,956 --> 01:11:34,756
Speaker 2: anything that's sort of like like that, you're like, this

1554
01:11:34,796 --> 01:11:35,236
Speaker 2: is one thing.

1555
01:11:35,276 --> 01:11:36,316
Speaker 1: I know a few.

1556
01:11:36,436 --> 01:11:40,356
Speaker 4: I have a couple of good mantras and me and

1557
01:11:40,476 --> 01:11:43,636
Speaker 4: Ralph's mantra for since we started making rap songs. Energy

1558
01:11:43,716 --> 01:11:46,876
Speaker 4: up expectations down, is it?

1559
01:11:48,476 --> 01:11:50,916
Speaker 1: And so energy up expectations down.

1560
01:11:51,156 --> 01:11:53,036
Speaker 4: When we were doing rap shows at you know, the

1561
01:11:53,076 --> 01:11:55,796
Speaker 4: Senior Citizens Center in Berkeley or whatever like that, this.

1562
01:11:55,796 --> 01:11:58,156
Speaker 3: Was the thing like you're gonna put if you this

1563
01:11:58,236 --> 01:11:58,956
Speaker 3: is what we're doing.

1564
01:11:58,956 --> 01:12:01,116
Speaker 4: This is what we're doing now, and I'll put all

1565
01:12:01,156 --> 01:12:03,916
Speaker 4: of myself into it, and I'm going to expect absolutely

1566
01:12:03,916 --> 01:12:06,116
Speaker 4: nothing in return. I'm doing this because this is what

1567
01:12:06,156 --> 01:12:10,676
Speaker 4: I do, and so has served me very well. I'm

1568
01:12:10,716 --> 01:12:15,276
Speaker 4: always pleasantly surprised when anything comes back. It's not the point.

1569
01:12:15,436 --> 01:12:21,756
Speaker 4: It's again like about being a process person. And my

1570
01:12:22,156 --> 01:12:27,276
Speaker 4: dad always told me that you love people for exactly

1571
01:12:27,276 --> 01:12:31,476
Speaker 4: who they are and uh not who you want them

1572
01:12:31,476 --> 01:12:33,796
Speaker 4: to be. Who love them for who they are, and

1573
01:12:33,836 --> 01:12:35,316
Speaker 4: when they tell you who they are, you get to

1574
01:12:35,356 --> 01:12:37,036
Speaker 4: listen to them and you get to hold them to that,

1575
01:12:37,156 --> 01:12:43,236
Speaker 4: you know, And that is a thing that has really

1576
01:12:43,596 --> 01:12:44,476
Speaker 4: served me, like.

1577
01:12:44,436 --> 01:12:45,676
Speaker 1: That, you look for it, that's who you are.

1578
01:12:46,436 --> 01:12:48,316
Speaker 2: If I love you, then I understand that you are

1579
01:12:48,516 --> 01:12:52,636
Speaker 2: and I don't again, energy up expectations exactly what to

1580
01:12:52,716 --> 01:12:54,636
Speaker 2: expect from you, because you've told me who you are.

1581
01:12:54,756 --> 01:12:56,916
Speaker 4: Yeah, And it's and it was never about what I

1582
01:12:56,956 --> 01:12:59,076
Speaker 4: get back from you necessarily. You know, it's about I

1583
01:12:59,116 --> 01:13:01,156
Speaker 4: love this, this is who this is you, that's what

1584
01:13:01,196 --> 01:13:04,876
Speaker 4: I love and uh yeah, so those those are probably

1585
01:13:04,836 --> 01:13:06,276
Speaker 4: the two best ones.

1586
01:13:06,356 --> 01:13:08,276
Speaker 2: That's great, that's great. We don't know, we get too

1587
01:13:09,156 --> 01:13:13,556
Speaker 2: Thank you for that last question. What cause would you

1588
01:13:13,636 --> 01:13:15,236
Speaker 2: like people to support? What nonprofit?

1589
01:13:15,316 --> 01:13:17,076
Speaker 1: What? What thing that's going on? Do you want people

1590
01:13:17,116 --> 01:13:17,636
Speaker 1: to know about?

1591
01:13:17,916 --> 01:13:21,396
Speaker 4: The organization I've been doing the most work with lately

1592
01:13:21,436 --> 01:13:25,836
Speaker 4: is one called cool Hand Series, which is run by

1593
01:13:25,836 --> 01:13:30,836
Speaker 4: a woman named Madison O'Leary, and it's the hype as

1594
01:13:30,836 --> 01:13:37,236
Speaker 4: we bring films and filmmakers into prisons and then have

1595
01:13:37,316 --> 01:13:43,196
Speaker 4: conversations with inmates after post screening. So it's allowing art

1596
01:13:43,236 --> 01:13:48,476
Speaker 4: to make its way into the prison system and for

1597
01:13:48,876 --> 01:13:51,076
Speaker 4: the artists, for the creator, also getting us to think

1598
01:13:51,116 --> 01:13:53,036
Speaker 4: more about where our stories come from and who there's

1599
01:13:53,116 --> 01:13:55,596
Speaker 4: who are stories are for and.

1600
01:13:55,556 --> 01:13:56,076
Speaker 3: Where the story.

1601
01:13:57,916 --> 01:14:02,796
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's a great organization is basically Maddie doing all

1602
01:14:02,836 --> 01:14:05,836
Speaker 4: of it. Ralph and I have brought Blind Spotting into

1603
01:14:05,836 --> 01:14:07,876
Speaker 4: a number of prisons at this point. They're also doing

1604
01:14:08,276 --> 01:14:13,996
Speaker 4: playwriting and and theater workshops in there, so producing plays

1605
01:14:14,036 --> 01:14:19,476
Speaker 4: and uh yeah, and she's brought so many great films

1606
01:14:19,476 --> 01:14:23,036
Speaker 4: and filmmakers in already a lot of work in California,

1607
01:14:23,076 --> 01:14:26,116
Speaker 4: a lot of New York. Also, we've done work in Utah.

1608
01:14:26,236 --> 01:14:28,876
Speaker 4: She's doing work in Texas. I haven't been there yet,

1609
01:14:28,876 --> 01:14:31,036
Speaker 4: but we're trying to figure that out. So yeah, it's

1610
01:14:31,796 --> 01:14:34,796
Speaker 4: it's a great org for like the artist friends of mine,

1611
01:14:34,916 --> 01:14:37,436
Speaker 4: like the naming names who are listening to this when

1612
01:14:37,556 --> 01:14:39,116
Speaker 4: when you get the call just say yes.

1613
01:14:39,076 --> 01:14:39,916
Speaker 3: It's so fun.

1614
01:14:40,396 --> 01:14:43,316
Speaker 4: It is actually like you know, it's it's a great,

1615
01:14:43,356 --> 01:14:46,116
Speaker 4: great time and a great and eye opening experience and

1616
01:14:46,756 --> 01:14:50,556
Speaker 4: you get to have some really beautiful conversations and meet

1617
01:14:50,636 --> 01:14:54,756
Speaker 4: really beautiful people, and you know, it's a way to

1618
01:14:55,876 --> 01:15:00,556
Speaker 4: acknowledge the madness of our for profit prison system in

1619
01:15:00,596 --> 01:15:04,676
Speaker 4: a very like hands on way and then figure out

1620
01:15:05,876 --> 01:15:08,076
Speaker 4: at least start to spend a little bit on well,

1621
01:15:08,116 --> 01:15:12,236
Speaker 4: what what can we do? This is how it is

1622
01:15:12,316 --> 01:15:14,356
Speaker 4: a how can we change it? And be like what

1623
01:15:14,356 --> 01:15:17,196
Speaker 4: can we do with it in this in its current state?

1624
01:15:17,196 --> 01:15:19,836
Speaker 4: And I think that's actually for a thing that is

1625
01:15:19,996 --> 01:15:22,716
Speaker 4: pretty simple at its course, just like come in to

1626
01:15:22,756 --> 01:15:25,436
Speaker 4: prison and do and talk to people who show art

1627
01:15:25,476 --> 01:15:27,596
Speaker 4: and talk to people who are interested in art.

1628
01:15:28,116 --> 01:15:30,276
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's called the cool Hand Series, cool Hand Series,

1629
01:15:30,276 --> 01:15:31,756
Speaker 2: and I haven't done that, but I have done so

1630
01:15:31,836 --> 01:15:33,916
Speaker 2: at Saint Quentin, and I think people don't understand that

1631
01:15:33,956 --> 01:15:36,476
Speaker 2: you get afraid of, like going into a prison, but

1632
01:15:36,516 --> 01:15:38,396
Speaker 2: when you go to those places, you immediately feel like,

1633
01:15:38,916 --> 01:15:41,836
Speaker 2: who's afraid of? They're just so happy that I'm here.

1634
01:15:41,916 --> 01:15:43,796
Speaker 2: Oh my god, the just and there and there happen,

1635
01:15:43,836 --> 01:15:46,116
Speaker 2: and the things that I say that I know they'd never.

1636
01:15:45,996 --> 01:15:48,716
Speaker 1: Have heard before, and they really appreciate it, you know, yeah.

1637
01:15:48,636 --> 01:15:51,316
Speaker 4: Yeah, no, it's it's always a beautiful experience. Everyone is

1638
01:15:51,316 --> 01:15:55,476
Speaker 4: thrilled that you're there. And also and I end up

1639
01:15:55,516 --> 01:15:57,556
Speaker 4: getting so much out of it, and every time I

1640
01:15:57,596 --> 01:15:58,636
Speaker 4: go so sure.

1641
01:15:58,596 --> 01:15:58,956
Speaker 3: All right.

1642
01:15:59,356 --> 01:16:01,476
Speaker 1: Uh, last of the podcast is called Who's with Me?

1643
01:16:01,556 --> 01:16:02,076
Speaker 1: Are you with me?

1644
01:16:02,156 --> 01:16:03,116
Speaker 3: I'm with you? All right?

1645
01:16:03,236 --> 01:16:05,276
Speaker 1: Always be weird to find out.

1646
01:16:06,436 --> 01:16:08,636
Speaker 3: Actually, thank you.

1647
01:16:08,676 --> 01:16:11,036
Speaker 1: Finally, I didn't want to be here at all.

1648
01:16:11,836 --> 01:16:14,116
Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you, Thanks Verving.

1649
01:16:16,316 --> 01:16:18,996
Speaker 2: That was my conversation with David Diggs. Love talking to

1650
01:16:19,036 --> 01:16:20,876
Speaker 2: that dude, could talk to him for hours and hours.

1651
01:16:20,876 --> 01:16:21,836
Speaker 2: Just sort of good person.

1652
01:16:22,276 --> 01:16:22,676
Speaker 1: As you heard.

1653
01:16:22,676 --> 01:16:24,556
Speaker 2: At the end, he shouted out the cool Hand Series,

1654
01:16:24,876 --> 01:16:27,636
Speaker 2: which is a curated series that brings filmmakers and their

1655
01:16:27,676 --> 01:16:31,756
Speaker 2: films into prisons so that the population there can see

1656
01:16:31,756 --> 01:16:33,716
Speaker 2: these films they might not otherwise see, and also they

1657
01:16:33,756 --> 01:16:35,956
Speaker 2: can engage enough conversations with these filmmakers.

1658
01:16:36,076 --> 01:16:36,956
Speaker 1: It's a great idea.

1659
01:16:37,156 --> 01:16:38,956
Speaker 2: I do a lot of work with San Quentin in

1660
01:16:38,996 --> 01:16:42,236
Speaker 2: my area, so I know the power of going into

1661
01:16:42,236 --> 01:16:44,516
Speaker 2: a prison. It is powerful for the people in the prison.

1662
01:16:44,556 --> 01:16:47,276
Speaker 2: It's also powerful for you. Thank you DEVV for being

1663
01:16:47,276 --> 01:16:50,956
Speaker 2: on the show today. Come back anytime. Also, thank you

1664
01:16:50,956 --> 01:16:52,916
Speaker 2: to Rabigren here in La where I am right now,

1665
01:16:52,916 --> 01:16:56,756
Speaker 2: who's producing this show, Rabagren Productions. Thank out to Pushkin

1666
01:16:56,796 --> 01:17:00,996
Speaker 2: Productions who is helping send this podcast around the world.

1667
01:17:01,316 --> 01:17:04,756
Speaker 2: And thank you to who else. Thank you to me.

1668
01:17:05,036 --> 01:17:07,156
Speaker 1: I showed up and I did it. I did my best.

1669
01:17:10,316 --> 01:17:12,876
Speaker 2: Special shout out to Skyline Studios as always, who lets

1670
01:17:12,876 --> 01:17:15,116
Speaker 2: me do things in Oakland. Next week, our guest is

1671
01:17:15,196 --> 01:17:18,876
Speaker 2: Nava Mao. Nava Mao is famously known for being one

1672
01:17:18,916 --> 01:17:22,076
Speaker 2: of the stars of the Netflix series Baby Reindeer. Nava

1673
01:17:22,196 --> 01:17:25,236
Speaker 2: Mao is also a transgender actress, which I only mentioned

1674
01:17:25,236 --> 01:17:26,916
Speaker 2: because we talk about that a lot, and I want

1675
01:17:26,956 --> 01:17:28,436
Speaker 2: you to tune in for that episode because the last

1676
01:17:28,436 --> 01:17:30,716
Speaker 2: two weeks we've talked about the transgender community. But I

1677
01:17:30,716 --> 01:17:33,796
Speaker 2: should probably have somebody from that community to speak for themselves.

1678
01:17:33,876 --> 01:17:37,716
Speaker 2: So next week, nav Mao and also once again, please

1679
01:17:38,356 --> 01:17:42,636
Speaker 2: like and subscribe Hype the Channel, give us five star reviews,

1680
01:17:42,836 --> 01:17:45,716
Speaker 2: and once you do all that, then share the podcast

1681
01:17:45,756 --> 01:17:47,356
Speaker 2: with somebody in your life who you think would dig it.

1682
01:17:47,396 --> 01:17:49,436
Speaker 2: That's the important part. That's how we build it. If

1683
01:17:49,476 --> 01:17:52,116
Speaker 2: you share this podcast with one or two people, then

1684
01:17:52,156 --> 01:17:54,476
Speaker 2: we can really start to do some things and really

1685
01:17:54,516 --> 01:17:55,356
Speaker 2: get the word out there.

1686
01:17:55,476 --> 01:17:57,956
Speaker 1: Who's with me? Are you with me? I'm with you?

1687
01:17:58,156 --> 01:18:00,516
Speaker 1: If you're watching right now, I'm pretty sure I'm with you.

1688
01:18:00,876 --> 01:18:02,836
Speaker 2: I can't imagine that Dana White and Joe Rogan made

1689
01:18:02,836 --> 01:18:12,236
Speaker 2: it this far.