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That's thirty dollars off your first box and 0:01:35.480 --> 0:01:38.680 free croissants for life when you visit wildgrain dot com, 0:01:38.720 --> 0:01:43.080 slash podcast, or simply use the promo code podcast at checkout. 0:01:43.480 --> 0:01:50.080 This is a sponsor I absolutely embrace, so use that code. 0:01:51.280 --> 0:01:51.400 Well. 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:54.440 Joining me now is the mayor of Minneapolis. It's Jacob 0:01:54.480 --> 0:01:56.480 cried mister Maher. I appreciate you taking a few minutes 0:01:56.520 --> 0:01:56.720 with me. 0:01:57.080 --> 0:01:58.360 Thanks so much for having me. 0:01:58.760 --> 0:02:02.360 So, I mean, just we get a few you know. 0:02:02.400 --> 0:02:04.880 One of the things that why I appreciate the longer 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:07.640 form is that we can put some context, so just 0:02:07.680 --> 0:02:11.800 in a quick summary, because a lot of people don't 0:02:11.840 --> 0:02:16.359 know what is the what powers individual mayors have. Right 0:02:16.440 --> 0:02:18.760 in some cities it's a strong mayor. Some cities, it's 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:21.359 a weak mayor. Some cities it's up to the mayor 0:02:21.400 --> 0:02:23.720 who the police chief is. Others it is not. So 0:02:23.760 --> 0:02:27.400 give me the quick structure on law enforcement in your 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:30.320 authority over law enforcement. How much it's you, how much 0:02:30.320 --> 0:02:31.440 it's the city council. 0:02:33.160 --> 0:02:38.320 In twenty twenty two, we began officially shifting our structure 0:02:38.440 --> 0:02:41.280 of government to what is known as a strong mayor system. 0:02:41.960 --> 0:02:44.920 I just call it a regular mayor system. It's sure 0:02:45.639 --> 0:02:48.280 Innneapolis and St. Paul and Duluth in New York City. 0:02:48.360 --> 0:02:52.520 Chicago is a strong mayor's system where the executive runs 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:54.840 the day to day operations and the council is like 0:02:54.880 --> 0:02:57.880 the congress. They as laws or. 0:02:57.919 --> 0:03:02.480 More of a legislature, also participating in the executive functions. 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:05.240 That's exactly right. So the police, for instance, report up 0:03:05.280 --> 0:03:07.480 through the commissioner. 0:03:07.840 --> 0:03:10.800 Ultimately, so you appoint the police commissioner or does the 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:12.799 city council have a saying that. 0:03:12.960 --> 0:03:16.920 I appoint the Commissioner of Safety and the police of 0:03:17.080 --> 0:03:22.360 chief the chief of police. Our council then confirms the appointment. 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:26.320 Gotcha? So I say this because when it comes to okay, 0:03:26.320 --> 0:03:30.239 so let's take the so called phrasing of sanctuary city, right, 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:32.799 And I know you. At first it was an executive order. 0:03:33.240 --> 0:03:38.960 Now it's been codified in the city law, and I 0:03:38.960 --> 0:03:44.120 guess what is the line between city and state and 0:03:44.160 --> 0:03:47.040 then what is the line between city and federal in 0:03:47.080 --> 0:03:47.960 this sanctuary law. 0:03:48.720 --> 0:03:50.520 Well, you're asking all the right questions. So we have 0:03:50.680 --> 0:03:55.560 had what is called a separation ordinance in place well 0:03:55.600 --> 0:03:58.960 before my time, right, with that order on some twenty 0:03:59.000 --> 0:04:03.120 plus years, right, it's been quite simple, and it's virtually 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:06.440 been the same throughout that entire time period. The Council 0:04:06.520 --> 0:04:09.480 lamented it a little bit recently, but it's virtually the 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:11.760 same thing. And the basis of it is this is 0:04:11.760 --> 0:04:16.160 that our police officers, our officials at the City of Minneapolis, 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:22.760 do not coordinate with any federal agency around immigration enforcement work. So, 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:25.680 in other words, we will not work with ICE or 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:29.720 any other federal agency that has been deputized around immigration 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:34.160 enforcement work. We do work with them around general safety, 0:04:34.720 --> 0:04:39.800 crime prevention, driving down homicides, that kind of stuff. And 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:44.440 we also won't ask people as to their documentation status. 0:04:44.480 --> 0:04:47.400 And so when we haven't asked somebody their documentation status, 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:50.320 we haven't gathered any information, And because we haven't gathered 0:04:50.400 --> 0:04:53.440 any information, when Donald Trump or anybody else asks us 0:04:53.440 --> 0:04:55.559 for all of our information, our answer is quite simple, 0:04:55.560 --> 0:04:57.400 which is we don't have it right. 0:04:58.360 --> 0:05:00.960 What is the line of when you think somebody's immigration 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:08.279 status matters when you have a interaction with a resident 0:05:08.320 --> 0:05:09.120 of your city. 0:05:09.520 --> 0:05:12.640 For purposes of safety, It doesn't for purposes of calling 0:05:12.760 --> 0:05:15.800 nine to one one, It doesn't. You know, I want 0:05:15.880 --> 0:05:20.640 our police officers spending their limited and valuable time keeping 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:25.880 people safe, driving down murders, arresting carjackers, doing all the 0:05:25.920 --> 0:05:28.240 basic stuff that any police officer would need to do 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:30.640 on a daily basis. I don't want them spending a 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:35.599 single second hunting down some father who just dropped his 0:05:35.760 --> 0:05:38.039 kids off at daycares about to go work a twelve 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:40.279 hour shift, who happens to be from Ecuador. Like that 0:05:40.320 --> 0:05:42.800 guy makes our city a better place. And so, as 0:05:42.839 --> 0:05:46.640 far as you know, what is the line. Look, I 0:05:46.680 --> 0:05:49.160 don't know if you committed a murder or you shot 0:05:49.200 --> 0:05:52.400 a gun. I don't care where you're from. I don't 0:05:52.400 --> 0:05:55.240 care who your parents were. You know there are consequences 0:05:55.279 --> 0:05:58.960 for that, But I don't get the sense of spending 0:05:59.000 --> 0:06:01.080 limited resource is on Immigration. 0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:05.279 If ICE comes to the city of Minneapolis and says, 0:06:06.200 --> 0:06:11.839 we believe you have a criminal in custody, will you 0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:15.400 release that criminal to us if they have proof that 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:19.880 this individual is a criminal? What is the policy of 0:06:19.920 --> 0:06:21.480 the police force at that point. 0:06:21.920 --> 0:06:23.800 So there's parts where we are involved and there's parts 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:28.080 where we are not arresting that criminal. We are involved, 0:06:28.160 --> 0:06:34.080 and we will work with federal agencies to arrest that criminal. Now, 0:06:34.279 --> 0:06:38.599 remember the whole concept of deportation is on the civil side. 0:06:39.600 --> 0:06:43.200 But we will work with federal agencies to get a 0:06:43.240 --> 0:06:47.479 guy that has done bad dates, murders, carjackings, whatever it 0:06:47.560 --> 0:06:51.400 might be. We at the city, however, don't control the jail. 0:06:52.120 --> 0:06:53.440 So the whole concept of. 0:06:53.360 --> 0:06:56.200 The interest that is that is the Canneban County. 0:06:56.600 --> 0:06:58.880 Now he runs the jail. That is the jail. And 0:06:58.920 --> 0:07:02.320 then the state, who has provided quite a bit of 0:07:02.400 --> 0:07:07.279 information recently about how they actually do work with immigration 0:07:07.520 --> 0:07:11.520 and ICE to provide, you know, to you know, not 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:15.120 let murderers back on the street. That's through the state. 0:07:15.960 --> 0:07:21.600 Like any situation, I assume you tried diplomacy first, meaning 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:23.960 you know, you knew a new administration was coming in 0:07:24.000 --> 0:07:30.280 and all this stuff. What were those conversations like before 0:07:30.520 --> 0:07:33.920 this escalated to what it has become today, walk me 0:07:34.040 --> 0:07:37.920 through your interactions you had with DHS or with ICE, 0:07:38.040 --> 0:07:41.080 or with any part of the federal government before it 0:07:41.280 --> 0:07:43.720 got to where what you're having to deal with in 0:07:43.760 --> 0:07:44.480 the moment. 0:07:44.960 --> 0:07:47.360 With this administration, it was a pretty quick zero to 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.600 one hundred, not as far as this operation goes, but 0:07:50.720 --> 0:07:54.080 as the general mentality of what they were doing. And look, 0:07:54.640 --> 0:08:00.840 you always expect different ideologies and value use with a 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:03.840 new administration, especially a new administration that is of a 0:08:03.880 --> 0:08:07.640 different party, but this is something entirely different. Even from 0:08:07.640 --> 0:08:11.920 the first Trump administration. We did not see this kind 0:08:11.960 --> 0:08:15.600 of conduct to this degree with the first Trump administration. 0:08:15.720 --> 0:08:18.560 And I think it was probably twenty or thirty days 0:08:18.640 --> 0:08:22.240 or something like that, maybe even less after Trump was 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:24.680 sworn into this term. I got a letter on my 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:27.520 desk from I believe the Office of Management and Budget. 0:08:27.960 --> 0:08:31.560 They quite literally said that all grants that were provided 0:08:31.600 --> 0:08:33.760 to the City of Minneapolis totally somewhere in the range 0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:37.960 of seventy million dollars would be cut off. And the 0:08:38.200 --> 0:08:41.400 basic lever that they were trying to pull was, you 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:45.200 will lose this money if you don't get rid of 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:50.320 all diversity work and stop the separation. 0:08:50.160 --> 0:08:52.840 Which I want to put up, which federal governments have 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:55.640 tried to do with cities and states for decades. Right 0:08:55.760 --> 0:08:57.920 is always the first threat is usually financial. 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:06.840 Right it is. And there's a ton of legal dictum 0:09:06.960 --> 0:09:09.920 on this particular issue of how much can you know 0:09:10.320 --> 0:09:16.480 the federal government influence or coerce cities based on some 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:19.440 alternate policy that has nothing to do with that right 0:09:20.040 --> 0:09:23.440 and so, But they've taken a pretty extreme line on 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:24.079 how they're doing it. 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:27.679 So you now, this wasn't a case of I mean, 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:31.960 have you had a meeting with Christino and said, hey, 0:09:32.400 --> 0:09:37.160 what are you trying to truly accomplish here that's in 0:09:37.440 --> 0:09:42.200 the interest of public safety. We'd like to help. Have you. 0:09:42.360 --> 0:09:44.560 Have you been able to have that conversation with the 0:09:44.600 --> 0:09:45.439 Secretary of d J. 0:09:46.200 --> 0:09:49.600 I have not had that conversation because the way they're 0:09:49.679 --> 0:09:53.440 framing this up, sadly, is not about safety. I don't 0:09:53.480 --> 0:09:57.600 even think it's about immigration. I think this is political retribution. 0:09:57.880 --> 0:09:59.800 I think you feel like it's all about George Floyd. 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:05.400 I don't know George Floyd. I think it's about Tim Walls. 0:10:05.000 --> 0:10:09.199 It's it's you know, the Vice presidential candidate ran against 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:14.520 Donald Trump, and I think there's a I think perhaps 0:10:14.559 --> 0:10:18.080 Donald Trump is unhappy that for three elections in a row, 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:25.040 Minnesota did not support his candidacy. I believe that he's 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:26.600 trying to make a point here. 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:29.760 And well, when you look at the data, it's not 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:34.080 like it's not as if Minneapolis stands out compared to Chicago, Denver, 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:37.320 New York. We could go through the cities here. So 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:40.160 it does feel as if you're you, I think you 0:10:40.200 --> 0:10:43.360 have said this that you feel as if you're a 0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:45.839 petri dish political petritish right now. 0:10:46.200 --> 0:10:48.640 You know, it feels a little bit as if there 0:10:48.760 --> 0:10:52.600 were multiple things that were occurring in rapid succession that 0:10:52.640 --> 0:10:55.400 don't necessarily have anything to do with one another, you 0:10:55.400 --> 0:10:58.199 know what I mean. It almost feels like you remember 0:10:58.360 --> 0:11:01.480 like post nine to eleven. I remember, you know, you 0:11:01.600 --> 0:11:03.800 reporting on that, you know, at nine to eleven, and 0:11:03.840 --> 0:11:09.640 then you had going after the Taliban. Then it was 0:11:09.679 --> 0:11:13.360 looking at Afghanistan. Suddenly we're in Iraq again, and so 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:16.400 it was these things that, like if you weren't paying 0:11:16.440 --> 0:11:19.040 a lot of attention, were seemingly linked, but they weren't 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:23.280 at all, And so we had an issue in our 0:11:23.280 --> 0:11:27.120 state around fraud, and look, it's real, it is a 0:11:27.360 --> 0:11:33.400 real issue. And then there were these racist attacks on 0:11:33.679 --> 0:11:38.360 entire communities, most notably are Somali community, based on that fraud. 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:43.520 And then from there it was let's I believe and 0:11:43.760 --> 0:11:47.720 this is not based on personal information. I speculate that 0:11:47.880 --> 0:11:50.400 somebody from relatively high up in the Trump administration said, 0:11:50.440 --> 0:11:53.199 go to Minneapolis, go to Port a bunch of Somalis, 0:11:53.679 --> 0:11:57.160 and whoever gave that directive didn't get the necessary pushback, 0:11:57.480 --> 0:11:59.480 and then suddenly you got a bunch of ICE agents. 0:11:59.520 --> 0:12:01.520 There are in many apple Is trying to deport Somalis, 0:12:01.600 --> 0:12:05.439 only to find out they're from here. They're American citizens, 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:08.840 they got here on a plane, they're here legally. 0:12:09.000 --> 0:12:11.760 When we're the first Somalian settled settlements, it was in 0:12:11.800 --> 0:12:12.880 the mid to late nineties. 0:12:12.920 --> 0:12:15.400 Correct, Yeah, I would say, men, we were. 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:19.199 Accepting refugees from a war torn country. This was a country. 0:12:19.280 --> 0:12:22.160 So this is what America has done for decades. That's right, 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:25.280 that's refugees from a war torn country. Yeah, they've been 0:12:25.280 --> 0:12:27.640 here longer than I've been here. They're very Minneapolis and 0:12:27.679 --> 0:12:30.600 at this point, you know, multiple generations they have been. 0:12:31.960 --> 0:12:35.960 And so it's it's it's not like there's a location 0:12:36.080 --> 0:12:39.080 where you can go to get a bunch of undocumented Somalis. 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:42.960 Those locations don't exist because again, for the most part, 0:12:42.960 --> 0:12:43.920 they're citizens. 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:48.319 So basically you have this fraud issue that really has 0:12:48.440 --> 0:12:50.640 nothing to do with undocumented. 0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:53.640 Immigrants, right, right, it's it's a completely separate issue. 0:12:53.640 --> 0:12:55.439 And you know, I mean the irony is whatever fraud 0:12:55.480 --> 0:12:58.319 was committed was likely committed by American citizens. 0:12:57.880 --> 0:13:02.000 Correct A likely? Yeah? Yeah, I mean I don't breakdown, 0:13:02.080 --> 0:13:07.520 but yes, you know, and when somebody commits fraud, you investigate, 0:13:07.679 --> 0:13:12.160 you prosecute, you charge, you get a conviction, and yeah, 0:13:12.160 --> 0:13:15.240 you put the person in jail as an individual. You 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:17.560 don't hold an entire community accountable. You hold the person 0:13:17.600 --> 0:13:21.079 accountable as an individual. It's just a very basic American value, 0:13:21.080 --> 0:13:24.640 in law enforcement value, and it's shocking and concerning that 0:13:24.640 --> 0:13:26.199 we're getting so far straight from that. 0:13:26.480 --> 0:13:28.280 Well I'm old enough to remember when part of the 0:13:28.280 --> 0:13:33.440 anti woke mindset was to not was to not try 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:36.839 to attack an entire group of people for one person, right, 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.319 I thought that was one of the complaints. Yeah, I 0:13:39.400 --> 0:13:42.520 mean that was coming from the right. But day here 0:13:43.040 --> 0:13:46.440 we are. Let me ask you about dealing with the 0:13:46.600 --> 0:13:50.920 safety of your community. Nine to one one response times 0:13:50.920 --> 0:13:55.120 have gotten worse in the last few months. Do you 0:13:55.120 --> 0:13:59.160 believe that's directly the result of the chaos that you 0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:01.040 believe is creating in your city. 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:06.319 I'm certain that's part of it. With anything law enforcement related, 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:09.400 there's always more than one causal factor. But look, we 0:14:09.440 --> 0:14:11.319 got six hundred cops in the city. We have fewer 0:14:11.320 --> 0:14:14.560 officers per capita than virtually any major city in the country. 0:14:14.920 --> 0:14:17.000 Are you short of cops? I mean and an ideal world, 0:14:17.040 --> 0:14:20.000 do you wish you had more? Yes? Yeah, I mean 0:14:20.200 --> 0:14:22.800 I've yet to meet a mayor that is not frustrated 0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:26.720 by this. I'm pretty friendly with maryel Bowser, mayor of DC, 0:14:26.880 --> 0:14:30.320 and she's literally, I swear almost wearing a sign, you know, 0:14:30.440 --> 0:14:32.000 call please apply. 0:14:32.360 --> 0:14:36.160 You know, I wear the same sign, and I would argue, 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:38.920 I would argue we need them even more. Just on 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:42.520 a per capita basis, we are very low. We hemorrhaged 0:14:42.640 --> 0:14:46.440 officers following twenty and we are at the point where 0:14:46.440 --> 0:14:48.840 we're netting positive. More and more officers are coming on, 0:14:48.920 --> 0:14:52.240 but we don't have enough. Now, juxtapose that six hundred 0:14:52.280 --> 0:14:55.280 number versus the three or four thousand or whatever it is. 0:14:55.360 --> 0:15:02.520 ICE agents and border control is a massive imbalance here, 0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:05.840 and our police officers have got to do the day 0:15:05.840 --> 0:15:09.480 to day work of being a cop. And you know, 0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:13.280 on top of that, we've got all of these calls 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:17.880 coming in, all of these you know, ICE instigated events 0:15:18.120 --> 0:15:21.400 that are taking place that requires some form of our 0:15:21.680 --> 0:15:23.920 police officers to do even more work on top. 0:15:24.200 --> 0:15:26.760 So what happened? So if somebody calls in and says, hey, 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:31.680 I'm being harassed, I'm a I'm a Minneapolis resident, I'm 0:15:31.680 --> 0:15:35.040 an American citizen, and I feel as if I'm being 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:39.200 harassed by these ICE agents. What are your what's your 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:41.880 police force supposed to do? Well? 0:15:41.880 --> 0:15:43.760 It all depends on the nature of the call. Of course, 0:15:45.800 --> 0:15:49.800 we respond to calls regarding kidnappings, and so if somebody 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:55.560 says my son is getting kidnapped, we go. If if 0:15:55.640 --> 0:16:00.280 there is a protest taking place in an ambulance needs 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:03.760 to get in to help somebody, we escort the ambulance in. 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:07.680 If property damages take place, we deal with the property damage. 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:13.320 And yes, we intervene if there is some form of 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:18.600 misconduct or unlawful behavior that is part of our officer's jobs. 0:16:18.640 --> 0:16:25.560 And obviously this gets very difficult when you're also trying 0:16:25.600 --> 0:16:29.280 to determine whether the conduct that is taking place is 0:16:29.320 --> 0:16:36.000 within the roles and responsibilities provided delegated to ICE other agencies, 0:16:36.360 --> 0:16:39.920 or if it's outside that scope of a criminal nature. 0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:45.560 This is a very tenuous and difficult place for officers 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:45.720 to be. 0:16:45.920 --> 0:16:48.000 And let me guess most of your police officers don't 0:16:48.040 --> 0:16:49.040 travel with legal counsel. 0:16:49.120 --> 0:16:50.880 Now, do they believe it or not? They don't. 0:16:51.440 --> 0:16:56.880 I mean, I mean, I just so what is I mean? 0:16:57.240 --> 0:17:01.960 I get that each circumstance is unique, but you know what, 0:17:02.160 --> 0:17:06.439 what advice are your police officers getting and dealing with 0:17:06.480 --> 0:17:07.400 these situations. 0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:11.520 Their their goal is to keep the peace, their goal 0:17:11.840 --> 0:17:12.800 to keep pizza. 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.119 De escalate whatever it is. They're just trying to de escalate. 0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:18.800 Absolutely, they try to de escalate the situation. They try 0:17:18.840 --> 0:17:21.439 to keep the peace. They do not and will not 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:27.840 cooperate with ICE or any federal agency on immigration enforcement work. 0:17:27.880 --> 0:17:33.440 That's not our job, that's not what we do. And yeah, 0:17:33.480 --> 0:17:37.840 they're trying to keep people from getting hurt or injured. 0:17:38.040 --> 0:17:41.200 And the way that ICE is conducting this, I'm telling 0:17:41.240 --> 0:17:43.919 you it's I've never seen anything like this. 0:17:44.800 --> 0:17:46.880 Do you think this is designed to provoke a response? 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:50.840 Yeah, perhaps, I don't. I mean, look, I don't. I'm 0:17:50.840 --> 0:17:52.959 not in the mind of either of these federal agents 0:17:52.960 --> 0:17:55.399 nor this administration. I think a lot of what is 0:17:55.400 --> 0:17:59.320 happening is designed to create some form of response. I mean, 0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:02.880 we don't have that many undocumented immigrants here. What they're 0:18:02.920 --> 0:18:05.479 doing is not based on safety. We have partnered with 0:18:05.520 --> 0:18:09.879 them based on safety. This seems to me like, you know, 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:13.200 they are trying to whip people up into a frenzy. 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:17.520 And I mean, thankfully and for the vast majority of 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:20.960 people in our city and the tens of thousands of protesters, 0:18:21.000 --> 0:18:25.479 they're not taking the bait. They're not countering Donald Trump's 0:18:25.560 --> 0:18:27.760 chaos with our own brand of chaos here. 0:18:29.680 --> 0:18:29.879 You know. 0:18:29.960 --> 0:18:32.680 That's that seems like what they're looking to do. And 0:18:32.720 --> 0:18:38.800 they've got fifteen hundred militarized troops that are presently on standby. 0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:45.080 This episode of The Chuck Podcast is brought to you 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:48.200 by Quints, and I love me some Quints. New Year, 0:18:48.320 --> 0:18:51.440 Colder Days. This is the moment your winter wardrobe really 0:18:51.520 --> 0:18:54.240 has to deliver. 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So refresher winter wardrope 0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:09.199 with Quints. Go to quints dot com slash chuck for 0:20:09.280 --> 0:20:11.800 free shipping on your order and three hundred and sixty 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:14.600 five day returns. And it's also available in Canada. That's 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.880 q u i ncee dot com slash chuck, free shipping 0:20:19.000 --> 0:20:22.560 and three hundred and sixty five day returns quints dot 0:20:22.640 --> 0:20:29.760 com slash chuck. What legal avenues do you think you 0:20:29.840 --> 0:20:36.760 have to sort of at least limit ICE's uh ability 0:20:36.880 --> 0:20:40.800 to roam the city. I mean this sort of five 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:44.160 to one ratio right being outnumbered by Ice and Border 0:20:44.200 --> 0:20:47.760 patrol versus your local police. That seems excessive. Is there 0:20:48.200 --> 0:20:50.760 a court Is there a legal avenue a court order 0:20:50.800 --> 0:20:53.000 you could get that says you know, this is this 0:20:53.040 --> 0:20:56.720 is outside the bounds of what's necessary, This is an 0:20:56.920 --> 0:21:00.720 excessive et cetera. Is there is there any lea avenue here? 0:21:01.119 --> 0:21:04.000 There is a legal avenue. I am hopeful that we 0:21:04.040 --> 0:21:09.920 will succeed in the litigation that is presently underway. We 0:21:10.320 --> 0:21:13.200 have a judge. I think we're working towards a hearing. 0:21:13.280 --> 0:21:14.480 Dat I was hoping that it was going to be 0:21:14.480 --> 0:21:17.679 this Friday, and I'm optimistic. 0:21:17.720 --> 0:21:19.800 And what do you want that judge to do? What's 0:21:19.840 --> 0:21:20.840 the specific ask? 0:21:21.800 --> 0:21:24.760 This specific? I mean, there are several asks within the 0:21:24.960 --> 0:21:28.720 complaint itself, but the basic one is to stop the operation, 0:21:30.720 --> 0:21:33.399 appear and simple, yes, to stop the operation that is 0:21:33.400 --> 0:21:37.679 presently taking place, which is the huge influx of federal agents. 0:21:37.680 --> 0:21:41.040 I mean, look, you know ICE has existed now for decades. 0:21:42.960 --> 0:21:47.600 Immigration enforcement exists. We're not talking about like just ICE 0:21:47.640 --> 0:21:52.560 doing ICE stuff. We're talking about constitutional violations which have 0:21:53.560 --> 0:21:55.840 gone way beyond anything I could imagine it. This is 0:21:55.880 --> 0:21:57.760 targeting of Somalia and Latino people. 0:21:58.200 --> 0:21:58.760 This is. 0:22:00.880 --> 0:22:03.639 I mean, this is actually happening. Do you look Somali? 0:22:03.680 --> 0:22:06.520 Do you look Latino dragging people off the street, give 0:22:06.560 --> 0:22:08.760 me your passport or else we're detaining you. That is 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:12.080 actually happening, you know, mister May, this is the hardest 0:22:12.080 --> 0:22:14.840 thing to convey. I think these days, especially in the 0:22:14.880 --> 0:22:19.240 world of deep fakes, nothing you believe, nothing online feels 0:22:19.280 --> 0:22:22.240 like it's on the up and up. Obviously we live, 0:22:22.520 --> 0:22:25.040 we've been sort of poisoned by these algorithms and all 0:22:25.040 --> 0:22:25.240 of that. 0:22:27.960 --> 0:22:29.720 I find this to be the hardest thing to convey 0:22:29.720 --> 0:22:32.959 to people who are not seeing it firsthand, and I 0:22:32.960 --> 0:22:37.879 imagine you feel this frustration as well. There was a 0:22:37.960 --> 0:22:42.640 Brooklyn Park police chief when viral yesterday with some comments 0:22:42.640 --> 0:22:45.400 he made about what has happened to off duty officers 0:22:45.400 --> 0:22:47.240 who just don't happen to look like you and me? 0:22:50.800 --> 0:22:53.679 What kind of experiences have you heard on that front? 0:22:54.200 --> 0:22:57.000 And if you talk to any of these off duty cops, 0:22:57.040 --> 0:23:00.200 have they shared their experiences with ice of you? 0:23:02.440 --> 0:23:07.479 Yeah, we've heard countless instances very similar, almost identical to 0:23:07.520 --> 0:23:11.600 what you heard from that. I believe it was Brooklyn Park, Yeah, 0:23:12.080 --> 0:23:12.760 police chief. 0:23:14.800 --> 0:23:16.359 For those of you that are in Brooklyn Park, I 0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:19.120 believe that's where Jesse Ventura was mayor if I'm not mistaken. 0:23:19.119 --> 0:23:21.600 Back in the day, I often get to who if 0:23:21.640 --> 0:23:23.760 it's from Brooklyn Park or Brooklyn Center, which are right 0:23:23.760 --> 0:23:24.119 next to E. 0:23:24.400 --> 0:23:26.280 But I do think you were one of them. Was 0:23:26.520 --> 0:23:28.920