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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here,

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Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of

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Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election.

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Speaker 2: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade

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Speaker 2: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent

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Speaker 2: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about,

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Speaker 2: it just means the absolute world to have your support.

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Speaker 2: But enough with that, let's get to the show.

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Speaker 3: Look, uncommitted got thirteen percent. That's not nothing. But in

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Speaker 3: twenty twelve, where there was no big uncommitted campaign against

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Speaker 3: that incumbent President Barack Obama, uncommitted got eleven percent. Now

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Speaker 3: I'm not a big mathematician, but eleven percent and thirteen percent.

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Speaker 4: I don't have the budget for a giant touchcreen TV

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Speaker 4: to do pundit math on, but I do have a

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Speaker 4: pen and paper, so let's do some pundent math. In

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty four and the Democratic primary in Michigan, uncommitted

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Speaker 4: received thirteen percent. This uncommitted vote being part of an

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Speaker 4: effort to scare the Biden administration into discontinuing the us

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Speaker 4: A support for the assault on Gaza, in which Israel

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Speaker 4: has killed about thirty thousand people. Others have expect you lated,

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Speaker 4: the number could be as high as two hundred thousand.

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Speaker 4: In twenty twelve, the last election in which a Democrat,

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Speaker 4: Obama was up for reelection, eleven percent voted uncommitted. Those

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Speaker 4: numbers are pretty close, and actually, in two thousand and eight,

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Speaker 4: about forty percent voted uncommitted in the Democratic primary, and

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Speaker 4: as a matter of fact, nineteen ninety six, eighty six

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Speaker 4: percent voted uncommitted in Michigan. Now I can understand why

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Speaker 4: someone might look at the twenty twelve number and think, well,

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Speaker 4: what happened in twenty twenty four isn't terribly unusual. I

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Speaker 4: do not understand, however, how a data person at a

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Speaker 4: national news agency could look at those numbers and think

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Speaker 4: they're comparable, because they're not. Those numbers are for completely

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Speaker 4: different reasons. They have nothing to do with each other.

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Speaker 4: The twenty twelve number is as irrelevant as the two

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Speaker 4: thousand and eight number and the ninety six number. I

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Speaker 4: will explain now, Michigan might have been the first state

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Speaker 4: in the uncommitted campaign, but since then, hundreds of thousands

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Speaker 4: have voted uncommitted around the country. Routinely outperforming all the

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Speaker 4: other Democratic candidates combined, and we're not done with primaries yet.

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Speaker 4: Some people are unmoved by this. Some voters logged protest

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Speaker 4: votes against President Biden on Super Tuesday, but in many places,

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Speaker 4: proportionally it was a smaller share than in twenty twelve. Obama,

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Speaker 4: you will recall one reelection, but the uncommitted vote in

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty four does say something serious and unique and

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Speaker 4: could absolutely help inform how the general election is going

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Speaker 4: to go. Now, you might have heard people say something like, who,

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Speaker 4: Michigan is a purple state. We are a state that

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Speaker 4: frequently votes uncommitted. Yeah, it does kind of. In nineteen

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Speaker 4: ninety six and the Democratic primary, one hundred and twenty

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Speaker 4: three thousand people voted uncommitted in Michigan. In nineteen ninety six,

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Speaker 4: Michigan switched to an open primary in addition to holding

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Speaker 4: a caucus. However, the National Democratic Party didn't recognize open

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Speaker 4: primaries for presidential elections, so all the candidates removed their

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Speaker 4: names from the ballot. The options in the primary that

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Speaker 4: year vote uncommitted or write in a name, and so

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Speaker 4: uncommitted got eighty six percent and the U fourteen percent

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Speaker 4: were right ends two thousand and eight in the Michigan

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Speaker 4: Democratic primary. That's an interesting year because that year saw

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Speaker 4: two hundred and thirty eight thousand people vote uncommitted, almost

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Speaker 4: forty percent of the vote. That's because that year Michigan

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Speaker 4: tried to challenge the DNC rules. See, Michigan wanted to

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Speaker 4: have more influence, so they moved their primary earlier that

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Speaker 4: year to January fifteenth, which was before Super Tuesday. But

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Speaker 4: there were only four states allowed to vote before Super Tuesday,

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Speaker 4: and Michigan was not one of them. So in response

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Speaker 4: to this, pretty much everyone took their name off the ballot.

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Speaker 4: So if you wanted to vote for Edwards or Obama

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Speaker 4: or Biden, you would to vote uncommitted. So in those elections,

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Speaker 4: the option to vote uncommitted was a way to vote

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Speaker 4: for someone who for whatever reason wasn't on the ballot,

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Speaker 4: but as a protest vote. There was a lot more

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Speaker 4: to this, and this is actually an important topic that

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Speaker 4: is generally under explored. The option to vote for none

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Speaker 4: of the above is something I think everyone should have

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Speaker 4: the right to do. This year, the entire country saw that.

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Speaker 4: In the Republican primary in Nevada, Nikki Haley was defeated

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Speaker 4: by none of these candidates. I don't think there is

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Speaker 4: anything that could possibly represent the spirit of Nikki Haley's

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Speaker 4: participation in the Republican primary this year better than this image.

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Speaker 4: But none of these candidates is on all of Nevada's ballots,

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Speaker 4: and none of these candidates has won in the past.

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Speaker 4: In twenty fourteen, in the Democratic primary for governor Nevada,

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Speaker 4: Democrats chose none of these candidates. There's actually been an

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Speaker 4: effort to remove this option from the ballot because supposedly

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Speaker 4: it disenfranchises voters through its spoiler effect, And generally speaking,

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Speaker 4: I think the spoiler effect and labeling certain candidates as

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Speaker 4: spoilers is a really toxic element in our political discourse. However,

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Speaker 4: if we're being generous, it can be at least an

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Speaker 4: accurate diagnosis if you are truly talking about someone whose

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Speaker 4: voters might plausibly draw from someone else. So in the

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Speaker 4: case of RFK, for example, I think a number of

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Speaker 4: his supporters would vote for Trump, whereas someone voting for

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Speaker 4: Cornell West is less likely to vote for Biden no

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Speaker 4: matter what. But let's think about someone who votes for

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Speaker 4: none of these candidates. If you are so dissatisfied with

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Speaker 4: everyone on the ballot, that you put on clothes, you

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Speaker 4: get in your car, you drive to your polling place,

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Speaker 4: just to mark on your ballot that you hate your

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Speaker 4: options and ostensibly don't care who wins. You're only showing

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Speaker 4: up to register your dissatisfaction. If that person goes to

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Speaker 4: vote and realizes they can't choose none of these candidates,

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Speaker 4: their vote would probably go to a candidate who didn't

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Speaker 4: have much of a chance to win anyway, And for sure,

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Speaker 4: you're removing the ballot option that actually represented that person's desires,

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Speaker 4: which is some way of expressing non consent. But on

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Speaker 4: the occasion when none of these candidates does well or

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Speaker 4: even wins, it certainly has a delegitimizing effect, which I

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Speaker 4: assume is a reason people have tried to get this

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Speaker 4: option removed from the ballot in Nevada, since this option

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Speaker 4: has no actual concept, because what happens if none of

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Speaker 4: these candidates wins, the election then defaults to the person

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Speaker 4: who came in second. So in twenty fourteen, the thirty

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Speaker 4: percent who voted none of these candidates were tossed aside

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Speaker 4: and the election went to this guy. Where this would

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Speaker 4: really become a threat is in the case where a

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Speaker 4: vote of non consent had actual consequences. Now, there are

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Speaker 4: places where a none of the above vote would trigger

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Speaker 4: a new election. In Colombia, for example, if a blank

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Speaker 4: vote receives a simple majority, not only does it trigger

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Speaker 4: a new election, all the candidates on the ballot are

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Speaker 4: precluded from participating in that new election. How do you

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Speaker 4: think that would change to the political landscape in the

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Speaker 4: US if we knew that we could go to the

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Speaker 4: polls in November, vote blank, and then get a new

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Speaker 4: election where neither Trump nor Biden were allowed to run.

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Speaker 5: Leave a comment.

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Speaker 4: Do you think in such a scenario, Blank would win?

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Speaker 4: Because I can't even fathom such a hypothetical. If people

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Speaker 4: thought that the candidates amounted to an etch a sketch,

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Speaker 4: they could shake in November. But for right now, how

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Speaker 4: you'd express your dissatisfaction is by voting third party alternative candidates,

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Speaker 4: or by staying home, or in the states where you

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Speaker 4: can voting uncommitted or none of the above. Would you

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Speaker 4: consider voting uncommitted? Love it, respected, encourage it, help people

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Speaker 4: do it. No, I can understand why people want to, but.

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Speaker 1: I won't be Why not yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 6: Honestly too.

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Speaker 7: The I mean, the whole situation there is horrible.

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Speaker 5: I'm just not informed enough to be able to commit

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Speaker 5: or not commit.

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Speaker 7: But what can you do with your vote that would

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Speaker 7: actually make a difference the property? I get it, I

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Speaker 7: would consider it.

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Speaker 3: In the prim area.

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Speaker 4: Eleven percent, twenty twelve, thirteen percent, and twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 4: what's the difference. Way fewer people have voted uncommitted against

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Speaker 4: Joe Biden is time then did against Barack Obama in

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Speaker 4: twenty twelve, which means that this time around is also immaterial.

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Speaker 4: It also means that the other uncommitted votes in other

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Speaker 4: states are probably not worth paying attention to. This is incorrect. Dearborn,

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Speaker 4: Michigan has a huge air population. In twenty twelve, their

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Speaker 4: congressional district voted thirteen percent uncommitted. There is no effort

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Speaker 4: to unite in an uncommitted vote, and so Dearborn's district

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Speaker 4: voted uncommitted at the same rate every other place did,

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Speaker 4: whereas in twenty twenty four they voted fifty seven percent uncommitted. Now,

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Speaker 4: after all the death in Gaza and the knowledge that

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Speaker 4: the US is doing things like authorizing the transfer of

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Speaker 4: two point five billion dollars of warplanes and weapons day Israel,

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Speaker 4: which includes eighteen hundred Mk eighty four two thousand pound bombs. Now,

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Speaker 4: the use of a two thousand pound bomb can amount

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Speaker 4: to a war crime because the blast radius is so big.

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Speaker 6: For an example of the deadly reach this bomb has,

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Speaker 6: here is Yankee Stadium, and here is where you would

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Speaker 6: not want to be. Whereas aid to Gaza as of

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Speaker 6: March seventh, was only one hundred and eighty million dollars.

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Speaker 6: And so in twenty twenty four, uncommitted got one hundred

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Speaker 6: and one thousand votes in Michigan or thirteen point two percent.

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Speaker 6: Alternative ways you could compare twenty twenty four to twenty

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Speaker 6: twelve one.

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Speaker 4: Hundred and one thousand votes for uncommitted. Obama only got

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Speaker 4: one hundred and seventy four thousand votes in twenty twelve.

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Speaker 4: But I think the most useful comparison is this twenty

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Speaker 4: years ago. In two thousand and four, Carry one Michigan

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Speaker 4: by one hundred and sixty thousand. Twenty sixteen was famously close.

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Speaker 4: Trump won by eleven thousand votes, and in twenty twenty

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Speaker 4: Biden won by one hundred and fifty four thousand votes,

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Speaker 4: so this number is pretty close to the margin of

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Speaker 4: victory in an important state. It just so happens because

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Speaker 4: of this uncommitted vote, people have the chance to use

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Speaker 4: the Democratic primary for something other than participating in a

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Speaker 4: predetermined outcome, which is to say that because the numbers

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Speaker 4: are big enough, because there is a big enough campaign,

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Speaker 4: you can register a vote of non consent and be

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Speaker 4: heard in a way that you normally can't. And in

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty four, it would seem this is the most

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Speaker 4: effective way to use the Democratic primary to actually say something,

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Speaker 4: and that will do it for me. My name is

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Speaker 4: Spencer Snyder. If you found this video interesting, make sure

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Speaker 4: you are subscribed to Breaking Points. You can also check

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Speaker 4: out my YouTube channel where I talk about media and

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Speaker 4: politics and things link in the description linking and sharing

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Speaker 4: always helps. Thank you to Breaking Points. Thank you so

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Speaker 4: much for watching, and I will see you in the

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Speaker 4: next one.

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Speaker 7: Is we Work two point zero upon us. My name

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Speaker 7: is James Lee and you're watching beyond the Headlines on

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Speaker 7: Breaking Points after his turbulent departure from We Work and

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Speaker 7: amid new speculation of a possible reconciliation as his former

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Speaker 7: company struggles in bankruptcy. Adam Newman has embarked on another venture, Flow,

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Speaker 7: a still very secretive real estate startup, which is now

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Speaker 7: valued at one billion dollars, bolstered by a significant three

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Speaker 7: hundred and fifty million dollar investment from Mark Andreesen and

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Speaker 7: his venture capital firm A sixteen Z.

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Speaker 5: We own three thousand apartments that we're running. We have

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Speaker 5: over one hundred and fifty employees. The business model that

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Speaker 5: we have is a vertically integrated system. We own the buildings,

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Speaker 5: we operate the buildings, We build a technology, we build

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Speaker 5: a community, and we build the teams up running them.

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Speaker 7: Vertical integration, technology, community, buzzword after buzzword. So to try

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Speaker 7: and figure out what Flow actually is, I recently went

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Speaker 7: undercover inside one of their apartment buildings, the guy.

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Speaker 1: That found few business.

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Speaker 7: Yes, do you see that?

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Speaker 1: Do you really any toms here?

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Speaker 7: That video is on my YouTube channel fifty one to

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Speaker 7: forty nine with James Lee. Definitely check it out. But

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Speaker 7: today to give us even more insider knowledge into Flow,

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Speaker 7: we have with us, say front of the show, Ben Bergman.

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Speaker 7: He is a senior correspondent and business insider, where he

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Speaker 7: was the first reporter to set foot inside flows first

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Speaker 7: apartment building, which is located in Fort Lauderdale called Society

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Speaker 7: Las Olas.

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Speaker 1: Welcome, Ben, Thanks good to be here.

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Speaker 7: All right, I want to start first with the original

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Speaker 7: A sixteen Z's three hundred and fifty million dollars funding

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Speaker 7: announcement of flow, which I would say was imbued heavily

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Speaker 7: with this rhetoric about solving America's housing crisis, the need

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Speaker 7: for more human connection. But then the solution, it seems

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Speaker 7: like now that they've presented, is just luxury condos. So

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Speaker 7: I don't know, maybe it's just me that's missing the sauce,

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Speaker 7: But can you help us square those two ideas? How

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Speaker 7: do they connect?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I mean, this wouldn't be the first time that Silicon

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Speaker 1: Valley over sold something or made it seem more grand

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Speaker 1: than it really was. But yeah, when it was announced

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Speaker 1: A sixteen Z Andres and Horowitz, one of the most prestigious,

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Speaker 1: biggest venture firms out there, said you know, this is

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Speaker 1: what we're going to do to solve America's housing crisis.

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Speaker 1: And so a lot of people have been curious, what

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Speaker 1: exactly are they going to do or is it like

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Speaker 1: a rent to own model? Are they going to use crypto?

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Speaker 1: How are they going to use tech, and when I

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Speaker 1: actually visited the building, when I was the first reporter

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Speaker 1: to visit in November, it actually was pretty low tech

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Speaker 1: and not unlike a lot of other buildings that I've

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Speaker 1: visited that aren't flow properties.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, so they outlined four or Newman specifically has outlined

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Speaker 7: what he calls the four pillars of flow. He's talking

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Speaker 7: about a branded technology company, a real estate company. There's

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Speaker 7: also potentially going to be a financial services component, and

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Speaker 7: a mechanism that will quote unquote share some of the

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Speaker 7: value or the venture's value with the value creator in

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Speaker 7: this case it's the renter. I know they only have

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Speaker 7: that one building so far that's been branded, But based

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Speaker 7: on your behind the scenes axis, how many of these

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Speaker 7: pillars have they been able to incorporate in the business

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Speaker 7: model so far? And are they looking If not, are

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Speaker 7: they looking to do more?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I mean it's still very much in the preliminary stages,

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Speaker 1: and even the building I visited it is the farthest along,

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Speaker 1: but it's not yet branded as a flow property. No

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Speaker 1: one walking by or even living there would really know

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Speaker 1: that it's associated with Adam Newman. So I'd say that

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Speaker 1: these things are pretty conceptual unlike we work, Flow is

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Speaker 1: moving very slowly, and that's by design we work. I

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Speaker 1: think a lot of people associated with Flow feel like

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Speaker 1: moved too quickly. They were pushed by SoftBank, if you

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Speaker 1: accept that explanation to just expand so quickly. So Flow

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Speaker 1: is trying to do it much slower.

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Speaker 7: They So can you talk to me a little did you?

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Speaker 7: Were you able to see any of the technology side

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Speaker 7: of things. I know that there's this app that they're

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Speaker 7: working on, which in your article you described it as

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Speaker 7: a Flow executive described it as a lubricant of the building.

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Speaker 7: I've stayed in apartments before, not even nice apartments, but

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Speaker 7: they also have an app. So how is this that

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Speaker 7: much different?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I mean I was able to view the app, or

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Speaker 1: at least a prototype of it. And you know a

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Speaker 1: lot of modern buildings, yes, you can pay rent and

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Speaker 1: you can you know, request maintenance and other things, but

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Speaker 1: this is different. For one thing, it's all seamless, it's

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Speaker 1: much easier to use. It also allows you to connect

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Speaker 1: with other residents. It could be something that you could

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Speaker 1: use at all Flow properties. It allows you to do

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Speaker 1: commerce to you know, promote your business, and to have

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Speaker 1: playlists in the building. So yes, a lot of buildings

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Speaker 1: use apps. But the idea is that this would be

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Speaker 1: a lot better than that.

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Speaker 5: Got it.

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Speaker 7: And to go to the second pillar, the real estate

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Speaker 7: component of it is this, is there something different to

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Speaker 7: this business model than to say, traditional real estate investing?

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Speaker 1: Well not really, and that's you know, part of the

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Speaker 1: puzzlement around this, right because real estate is very asset heavy.

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Speaker 1: You have to own the buildings. That's a business that's

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Speaker 1: been around for a long time. It's certainly not a

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Speaker 1: tech business. It's much lower margins. There's not like any secret,

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Speaker 1: it's not scalable, so just like we work. I think

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of questions about how this would be

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Speaker 1: a tech company given that you have to have the

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Speaker 1: real estate.

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Speaker 7: How quickly are they able or are they wanting to

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Speaker 7: incorporate new properties because I know, based on my research,

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Speaker 7: Adam Newman owns a number of different properties all over

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Speaker 7: the country. So what's the pipeline looking like in terms

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Speaker 7: of branding it as a flow property.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so he owns about five of these and you know,

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Speaker 1: but certain ones of them are under contract, so they

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Speaker 1: can't be run by flow yet, but I eventually they

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Speaker 1: would be. But there's also other buildings where he can

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Speaker 1: operate more quickly. So they've been vague about the timeline.

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Speaker 1: This one I visited will be the first one this

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Speaker 1: year to be actually unveiled as a flow property, but

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Speaker 1: they haven't even said when they're doing that. They've said

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Speaker 1: early twenty twenty four, and then after that maybe a

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Speaker 1: couple more.

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Speaker 7: And the finance services component of it, what is that

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Speaker 7: looking like? Is that an incorporation of crypto or are

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Speaker 7: there other things? You know, is there going to be

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Speaker 7: some kind of model where the renter is somehow going

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Speaker 7: to be more tied to the property than just the

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Speaker 7: traditional you know, paying rent.

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Speaker 1: There was talk of crypto when it was first announced,

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Speaker 1: and Adam Newman did have some crypto ventures, but that

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Speaker 1: doesn't seem to be the case as much now. I

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Speaker 1: think the idea is that, you know, for most people,

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Speaker 1: the biggest expense every month easily is what they spend

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Speaker 1: on rent, So they are already controlling that and they

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Speaker 1: can use that in many other ways to help, you know,

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Speaker 1: you spend money in other ways, and also make it

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Speaker 1: all sort of an app on your wallet. And also

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Speaker 1: just like you get credit card or board points, you

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Speaker 1: would get rewards for being loyal there, or to businesses

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Speaker 1: they select, or there's also the example of you know,

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Speaker 1: they know that you are really into dogs, so they

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Speaker 1: could help you find dog walking services, or if you're

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Speaker 1: a die walker, they could help you advertise that. So

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Speaker 1: they really feel like that's underutilized in apartments right now.

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Speaker 7: What is this community building?

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Speaker 1: Ask?

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Speaker 7: But were you able to talk to any of the

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Speaker 7: residents at Society les Olus, what's been their experience, what

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Speaker 7: are they looking forward to and is this really something

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Speaker 7: that renters are looking for.

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Speaker 1: I was able to talk to a couple of residents,

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Speaker 1: and granted, the residents I've talked to were selected to

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Speaker 1: me by flow, so said they were naturally predisposed to

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Speaker 1: like it, but they did really love being there, and

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Speaker 1: they found that this social commerce aspect, so to speak,

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Speaker 1: was so lucrative for them that they would live there

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Speaker 1: or at least have a place there, even if they

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Speaker 1: weren't living there, because they said, you know, they've been

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Speaker 1: able to meet a lot of customers and really help

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Speaker 1: grow their business. And you know, I think that's certainly

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Speaker 1: true for certain businesses, like I talked to one guy

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Speaker 1: who was selling insurance and there you're trying to constantly

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Speaker 1: meet people. If you're just you know, a professional, not

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Speaker 1: trying to meet customers, it's not as clear how flow

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Speaker 1: would help you. But this is something they're very into,

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Speaker 1: and you know, I think actually makes more sense than

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Speaker 1: we work. I've worked at we work for a long time,

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Speaker 1: but I've never actually really met anyone else that we

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Speaker 1: work aside from my immediate colleagues. But I think when

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Speaker 1: you're spending all day and all night with people in

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Speaker 1: a building, you're much more likely to interact with them.

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Speaker 7: So it sounds like this building is all encompassing. Obviously

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Speaker 7: you live there, but there's also an office component, you

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Speaker 7: have working spaces, it's they definitely have recreational spaces, pools,

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Speaker 7: lounges and things like that. So is the idea here

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Speaker 7: that you just never have to leave?

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Speaker 5: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I mean that That is what I was told several

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Speaker 1: times by residents, is I never have to leave because yes,

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Speaker 1: it is all there. You wouldn't need we work, right

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Speaker 1: because there is like a nicer or as nice coworking

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Speaker 1: space there. You would have all your friends there, you

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Speaker 1: would have the amenities, and you would have so many

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Speaker 1: things going on. I mean, they do help plan trips

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Speaker 1: and other events. But the idea is that everything would

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Speaker 1: be under the Flow umbrella.

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Speaker 7: And then the ownership aspect. This idea that Adam Newman

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Speaker 7: through out there letting the tenants build equity, is that

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Speaker 7: something that's actually on the table at Flow or is

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Speaker 7: this more of just rhetoric from the initial announcement to say, hey,

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Speaker 7: we're going to solve the housing crisis.

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Speaker 1: This was probably something that got the most attention, the

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Speaker 1: most head scratching, because Adam Newman and also Mark and

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Speaker 1: Dreasen did allude to this that you know, Mark and

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Speaker 1: Dreasen said, well, I kind of marveling at how people

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Speaker 1: will pay rent for ten years and never own anything,

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Speaker 1: but that really seems to not be the case. Adam

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Speaker 1: Newman's camp, you know, has been very rare of any

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Speaker 1: connotations with rent to own, and what it would look

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Speaker 1: like is much more like a loyalty program, like a

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Speaker 1: frequent flyer program, so you would have loyalty to the building,

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Speaker 1: but not any sort of actually getting equity in your apartment.

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Speaker 7: Okay, so I don't know about you, but I'm not

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Speaker 7: personally sure how Flow is going to do anything to

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Speaker 7: solve the housing crisis. But I do want to touch

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Speaker 7: on the business side of things. So they raised three

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Speaker 7: hundred fifty million dollars initially from Andrews and Horowitz. What

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Speaker 7: do you know, what is the current valuation right now?

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Speaker 7: What's the long term goal? Specifically, is there an exit strategy?

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Speaker 7: Is this going to go in the direction of we

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Speaker 7: work or is this the next potentially Wall Street juggernaut

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Speaker 7: in the real estate sector.

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Speaker 1: Well, so, yeah, they raised three hundred and fifty million

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Speaker 1: from Andreyes. Adam Newman also put in three hundred and

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Speaker 1: fifty million. That was at a billion dollar valuation, and

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Speaker 1: that's still the valuation. There has not been new funding,

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Speaker 1: and I think they're trying to you know, I'm sure

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Speaker 1: that Andreas and Adam Newman did not get into this

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Speaker 1: to make a one billion dollar company. They would like

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Speaker 1: a much more valuable company. But they they say, at

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Speaker 1: least they are trying to build the business slowly, really

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Speaker 1: pay attention to the details rather than what happened when

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Speaker 1: we work, which is trying to make it, you know,

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Speaker 1: a trillion dollar company or just something that grew so

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Speaker 1: quickly that they kind of lost track of.

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Speaker 7: Yeah, is this do you think this is something that

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Speaker 7: they're eventually going to offload or is it going to IPO.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I think that's a that's a ways off

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Speaker 1: I don't think that's that's really the thought now. I

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Speaker 1: mean the thought is to build it into a huge

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Speaker 1: brand and a huge business and then worry about that later,

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Speaker 1: all right, got it?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, So then eventually every city will have a Flow property.

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Speaker 7: Everybody's gonna love it. It's going to be kind of

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Speaker 7: a utopian little a slice of utopia, if you might,

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Speaker 7: in every single city.

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Speaker 1: Yes, exactly.

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Speaker 7: All right, Well, so we'll have to see how that

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Speaker 7: all shakes out. But Ben, I know you're on Business Insider,

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Speaker 7: but anywhere else in particular you want to point viewers

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00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:13,800
Speaker 7: if they want to find more of your.

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Speaker 1: Work, Yeah, you can just find me on Twitter at

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Speaker 1: the Ben Bergman.

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Speaker 7: I'm on Twitter X. I guess it is now awesome?

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Speaker 7: All right, Well, Ben, thank you so much for coming

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Speaker 7: on the show today. I really appreciate your time and

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00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:29,359
Speaker 7: your insights. Thanks so much, anytime if you like to

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00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 7: learn a little bit more about Flow. I also did

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00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,040
Speaker 7: a deep dive documentary style investigation in which I even

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00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:38,840
Speaker 7: went undercover at Society Los Olas. The video is posted

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00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:41,560
Speaker 7: on my YouTube channel fifty one forty nine with James Lee.

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00:23:41,920 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 7: Head on over check that out, give me a follow.

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00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:46,960
Speaker 7: The link will be in the description below. As always,

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00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,080
Speaker 7: like to thank you for your time today and keep

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00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:50,679
Speaker 7: on tuning into breaking points.