WEBVTT - CZM Rewind: The Rot-Com Bubble

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<v Speaker 1>Cau Zone Media. Hey, folks, it's me Ed, So I'm

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<v Speaker 1>off this week, get my wisdom teeth out finally time.

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<v Speaker 1>But I'm going to rerun this episode the rock com Bubble,

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<v Speaker 1>and I want to be clear that this is two

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<v Speaker 1>years old. It's gonna I am sure at some point.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm like, this is going to end in three quarters,

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<v Speaker 1>which I was. I was wrong about that one. Nevertheless,

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<v Speaker 1>this is an important piece because I think everything about

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<v Speaker 1>the AI bubble comes back to the rock com bubble,

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<v Speaker 1>which is the idea that the big companies they run

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<v Speaker 1>out of hypergrowth ideas they don't have a new smartphone,

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<v Speaker 1>they don't have a new cloud computing. And I think

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<v Speaker 1>this episode is super educational, and yeah, I'm taking a

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<v Speaker 1>week off, so enjoy this. Remember it's from like September

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<v Speaker 1>twenty twenty four. But nevertheless, it's very, very important that

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<v Speaker 1>you listen to this as I think that this is

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<v Speaker 1>going to be kind of formative to the future. Anyway. Enjoy, Hello,

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<v Speaker 1>and welcome to Better Offline. I'm your Hoe stad Ze Tron.

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<v Speaker 1>In the next two episodes, I want to present you

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<v Speaker 1>with a theory about why the tech industry has felt

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<v Speaker 1>so weird for the last few years, and why there

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<v Speaker 1>are so many products that have popped up that don't

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<v Speaker 1>seem to really do anything or be things that people

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<v Speaker 1>have actually asked for. And it comes down to a

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<v Speaker 1>few simple questions, chief of them, what if the next

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<v Speaker 1>big thing in tech is actually years or decades away?

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<v Speaker 1>What if the era of hypergrowth in tech is over now?

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<v Speaker 1>As I've mentioned before, I believe the rot economy is

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<v Speaker 1>to blame for a lot of this. It's a growth

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<v Speaker 1>at all cost mindset that sits at the core of

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<v Speaker 1>pretty much everything I've written or spoken about. It's this

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<v Speaker 1>force that drives businesses to grow bigger rather than better,

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<v Speaker 1>and make products to conquer markets and show growth to

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<v Speaker 1>the public markets, rather than fixing a problem that you

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<v Speaker 1>or I might have or a business might have, or

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<v Speaker 1>provide a necessary service that was nevertheless popular and profitable.

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<v Speaker 1>And the rot economy doesn't feel like any other economic

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<v Speaker 1>period I've seen. It's not like, say, I don't know

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<v Speaker 1>the post two thousand and eight financial crisis or that

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<v Speaker 1>stagnation that lingered afterwards. And what's different was there isn't

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<v Speaker 1>really a single obvious event that started the decline of

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<v Speaker 1>the services we're using all the companies that make them,

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<v Speaker 1>and there's not really like a Layman Brothers crater we

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<v Speaker 1>can point out and say, there you go, that's the thing.

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<v Speaker 1>The closest I can come is kind of FTX, which

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<v Speaker 1>was the big crypto crash, the big massive Ponzi scheme

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<v Speaker 1>that no one really saw coming other than many people

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<v Speaker 1>who were looking behind the scenes. But other than that,

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<v Speaker 1>that was kind of what crashed crypto. And maybe it

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<v Speaker 1>was the end of the zero interest free era where

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<v Speaker 1>interest rates went up and it was harder to get money.

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<v Speaker 1>But it was no one thing you could point out.

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<v Speaker 1>But I do want to try, and I have one

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<v Speaker 1>epoch I think for when the rot economy kind of

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<v Speaker 1>took over, and I'd want to point to the latter

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<v Speaker 1>point of the twenty tens. Think about it, like really

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<v Speaker 1>think about it for a second. Sometime after twenty nineteen,

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<v Speaker 1>the tech industry it cand of lost its sizzle. There

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<v Speaker 1>were new gadgets, there were new apps, new services, but

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<v Speaker 1>tech started to feel iterative rather than innovative. Yet they

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<v Speaker 1>were making more money than ever, and by twenty twenty one,

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<v Speaker 1>even the pretense of any gradual improvement was really dropped.

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<v Speaker 1>It felt like, I don't know, they were trying to

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<v Speaker 1>sell us things that didn't really exist. We were told

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<v Speaker 1>that NFTs would replace physical, tangible collectibles, and that cryptocurrency

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<v Speaker 1>would replace regular money, while also emancipating customers for an

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<v Speaker 1>unstoppable market force like inflation or big tech. Because of

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<v Speaker 1>course cryptocurrency came with it the idea and a mean

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<v Speaker 1>idea of decentralized software, and this was all meant to

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<v Speaker 1>get rid of rent seeking middle men that were taking

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<v Speaker 1>parts of every purchase, despite the very same middle men

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<v Speaker 1>investing in cryptocurrency. Yet the actual services that came out

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<v Speaker 1>of these movements didn't really seem to do anything or

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<v Speaker 1>improve our lives in any meaningful way. And we were

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<v Speaker 1>told at one point that our futures were in the

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<v Speaker 1>meta US and we lived in this massive interconnected called

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<v Speaker 1>New Internet. When we actually got there, it was just

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<v Speaker 1>this really wonky VR virtual reality space that Mark Zuckerberg

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<v Speaker 1>has somehow burned thirty six billion dollars on. It's all

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<v Speaker 1>so weird. And today we're told that we have this

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<v Speaker 1>glorious AI powered future that's just imminent. Yet what we've

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<v Speaker 1>actually got is this unprofitable, unsustainable generative AI that has

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<v Speaker 1>this horrible unastainable problem of hallucination, where it spits out

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<v Speaker 1>incorrect information authoritatively, which, worryingly, Google CEO Sander Pesha has

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<v Speaker 1>said in an interview with The Verge is an inherent

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<v Speaker 1>feature of a technology that he's now plugged into Google Search,

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<v Speaker 1>which means it's generating these horrible answers to queries based

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<v Speaker 1>on the links of a search engine that Sandar Peshai

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<v Speaker 1>has helped decay. It's all just very frustrating, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>also quite useless. Kind of it logical too. And at

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<v Speaker 1>the forefront of this AI boom is Sam Moltman and

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<v Speaker 1>his eighty billion dollar Jugger or open AI, a company

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<v Speaker 1>that claims it's going to build artificial general intelligence, one

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<v Speaker 1>that experiences human like cognition, which is just not possible

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<v Speaker 1>with generative AI. The tech he is selling today is

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<v Speaker 1>not going to give us AGI. I just want to

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<v Speaker 1>be abundantly clear about that. Anytime you read Sam Mortman

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<v Speaker 1>talking about AGI, he is talking about tech the Open

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<v Speaker 1>AI does not have and is not building. They may

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<v Speaker 1>claim they're building it behind the scenes, but they're only

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<v Speaker 1>working on generative AI. And the frustration you hear in

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<v Speaker 1>my voice, you might have felt yourself. You might not have,

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<v Speaker 1>but it's this prevailing sense of you keep telling me

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<v Speaker 1>the future is here, but when I look at what

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<v Speaker 1>the future is, it isn't even close. And the products

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<v Speaker 1>you're selling me aren't actually useful. Let me give you

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<v Speaker 1>another example. Windows laptops will soon integrate an AI high

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<v Speaker 1>powered search feature called Recall that allows you to search

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<v Speaker 1>everything you've ever done on your computer in the last

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<v Speaker 1>three months. And it does so by recording everything, everything

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<v Speaker 1>from the meetings you've been into to the things you've written.

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<v Speaker 1>I should be clear, I don't think anybody actually asked

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<v Speaker 1>for a feature like this, and it's also inherently invasive.

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<v Speaker 1>It directly encroaches on your privacy and your security, and

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<v Speaker 1>it takes screenshots of your machine every few seconds and

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<v Speaker 1>stores them, along with AI generated inferences, in a locally

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<v Speaker 1>held database. This isn't good, and the fact that they're

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<v Speaker 1>not sending anywhere doesn't really make it better. It is,

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<v Speaker 1>in essence, a pre installed screen recorder, the kind of

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<v Speaker 1>thing that hacker might install on a victim's computer, and

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<v Speaker 1>if an attack against access to it, it's obvious how

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<v Speaker 1>catastrophic the ramifications are. Or let's be honest, domestic abuses,

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<v Speaker 1>people at work. There are people who can get on

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<v Speaker 1>your computer, force access by forcing you or just getting

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<v Speaker 1>your password, and they can now see everything you've done.

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<v Speaker 1>Despite this being an inherently AI powered feature. It just

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<v Speaker 1>it can't distinguish between your regular computer usage and say,

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<v Speaker 1>sensitive information passwords, health information, trade secrets, the very obvious

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<v Speaker 1>stuff you would not want your computer recording. It treats,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't know, like an email from your doctor with

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<v Speaker 1>the same level of concern and copying as it would

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<v Speaker 1>like YouTube or a chat conversation. It's just really bad

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<v Speaker 1>and already white hat security researchers they've created a proof

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<v Speaker 1>of concept malware applications that can pull sensitive data obtained

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<v Speaker 1>or generated by Microsoft Recall from your computer and with

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<v Speaker 1>pretty minimal effort, And now the UK's Information Commissioner's Office,

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<v Speaker 1>the nation's privacy watchdog. By the way, they can actually

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<v Speaker 1>do quite steep fines. It's not great. They're now probing

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<v Speaker 1>whether the tech actually presents an unacceptable risk to consumers,

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<v Speaker 1>which as anyone who thinks about it for more than

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<v Speaker 1>twelve seconds or even five can confirm it does. It's

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<v Speaker 1>just very frustrating, and who asked for this, who actually

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<v Speaker 1>asked for this? Now, every major tech company they're integrating

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<v Speaker 1>AI into their products and services. Yeah, underneath the hood,

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<v Speaker 1>the AI they're integrating doesn't actually seem to do anything new,

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<v Speaker 1>or generate a profit or solve anyone's actual needs. Even

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<v Speaker 1>the companies themselves seem incapable of explaining why AI is

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<v Speaker 1>such a big deal. To the point of the Microsoft Super

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<v Speaker 1>Bowl commercial for its AI powered co pilot assistant featured

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<v Speaker 1>multiple things that it cannot do, like generate the code

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<v Speaker 1>for an open world game. When you, by the way,

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<v Speaker 1>you type in the prompt, which on the commercial is

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<v Speaker 1>three D generate the code for an open world three

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<v Speaker 1>D game, and you type that in and it will

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<v Speaker 1>give you a list of things you should do to

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<v Speaker 1>build an open world game. It's so strange, and it's

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<v Speaker 1>so strange how so many of these companies just can't

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<v Speaker 1>really explain why this is the next best thing. They

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<v Speaker 1>just need you to be even And maybe that might

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<v Speaker 1>actually be the problem. For decades, the tech industry and

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<v Speaker 1>its various venture capital funders, they've been remarkably good at

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<v Speaker 1>coming up with both innovative new products and ways to

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<v Speaker 1>turn them into huge new markets For hypergrowth, one hundred

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<v Speaker 1>billion trillion dollar markets that they could then sell in

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<v Speaker 1>to investing companies. Within actual industries, you had search engines,

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<v Speaker 1>digital maps, smartphones and apps, social media, cloud computing, software

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<v Speaker 1>as a service, electro cars, streaming audio and video. And

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<v Speaker 1>also another thing. In the period between like two thousand

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<v Speaker 1>and five and twenty twenty four, we've tripled the amount

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<v Speaker 1>of people on the Internet. It's now over five billion

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<v Speaker 1>people who use it. And that's also another problem I'll

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<v Speaker 1>get to in a little bit. There were obvious meaningful

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<v Speaker 1>markets to move into. Ways to connect people, ways to

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<v Speaker 1>get people content, they wanted algorithms to present it to them,

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<v Speaker 1>ways to sell people, Things that solve problems that they

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<v Speaker 1>had or either for the first time or solving them faster,

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<v Speaker 1>like the transition from physical to digital media, and problems

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<v Speaker 1>that were both important to solve and actually solvable. Teke

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<v Speaker 1>has perpetually succeeded at building things, new things that neatly

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<v Speaker 1>create these new markets, and they've been incentivized by both

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<v Speaker 1>the public and private markets in growing these companies as

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<v Speaker 1>fast and as big as possible to dominate these new markets,

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<v Speaker 1>with the assumption that there would always be more of them.

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<v Speaker 1>More massive, multi billion and multi trillion dollar markets to conquer,

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<v Speaker 1>and it must be clear you should never assume anything.

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<v Speaker 1>Between twenty twenty two and twenty twenty three, only one

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<v Speaker 1>hundred million additional people got online, which is the slowest

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<v Speaker 1>rate of growth in the last eighteen years. And that's

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<v Speaker 1>not because the need to bring connectivity to the masses

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<v Speaker 1>is actually solved. Especially in the global South. It hasn't been.

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<v Speaker 1>And as of the most recent figures from the UN's

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<v Speaker 1>International Telecoms Union shows thirty three percent of the world's population,

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<v Speaker 1>or about two point six billion people, have never actually

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<v Speaker 1>used the Internet. But I have more worrying stuff. I've

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<v Speaker 1>received some data from similar Web that shows that the

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<v Speaker 1>majority of the Internet's top one hundred web properties have

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<v Speaker 1>seen significant declines in traffic since twenty twenty one. In

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<v Speaker 1>the years since the world slowly emerged from lockdown, Google

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<v Speaker 1>dot com has seen the decline of five point three

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<v Speaker 1>percent in web visits, as has YouTube, which lost three

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<v Speaker 1>point eight percent of its traffic, Facebook, which lost a

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<v Speaker 1>remarkable twenty seven point seven percent, Twitter which lost three

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<v Speaker 1>point five percent, Amazon which lost eleven point six percent,

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<v Speaker 1>Twitch dot tv seventeen point five percent lost there. They

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<v Speaker 1>are owned by Amazon. Sadly, Wikipedia, which lost twenty four

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<v Speaker 1>point eight percent of its traffic. And here's the thing

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<v Speaker 1>that really worried me. Porn sites like ex videos twenty

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<v Speaker 1>seven point four percent loss and porn harp seventeen point

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<v Speaker 1>one percent loss. When the pawns down, that's that's when

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<v Speaker 1>you start worrying. Though you might be tempted to dismiss

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<v Speaker 1>this all as a result of life returning to normal

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<v Speaker 1>and the traditional office based environments aren't particularly conducive to

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<v Speaker 1>a crafty mid day wank, you shouldn't. The trend actually

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<v Speaker 1>began earlier, with similar Web data showing the declines starting

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<v Speaker 1>in twenty nineteen. My analysis focus is in twenty twenty

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<v Speaker 1>one to twenty twenty four because that's the one I

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<v Speaker 1>have the most detailed month by month and year by

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<v Speaker 1>year breakdowns for. And by the way, I'm going to

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<v Speaker 1>put in the episode notes links to things so that

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<v Speaker 1>you can all see this. I want you to know

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<v Speaker 1>this date is very worrying. But don't trust me. Trust

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<v Speaker 1>the data from similar Web. When you look at the

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<v Speaker 1>trajectory of the web's most valuable properties on a year

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<v Speaker 1>over year basis, things look quite bleak, with Google which

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<v Speaker 1>lost about point nine percent, YouTube lost about four point

0:12:52.080 --> 0:12:55.480
<v Speaker 1>four percent, Facebook seven point seven percent loss, Twitter six

0:12:55.520 --> 0:12:58.760
<v Speaker 1>point two percent loss, Twitch eleven point nine percent loss,

0:12:58.840 --> 0:13:01.720
<v Speaker 1>and Amazon two point seven one percent loss, all still

0:13:01.760 --> 0:13:05.400
<v Speaker 1>seeing significant de clients. Only a few sites like Reddit,

0:13:05.440 --> 0:13:08.319
<v Speaker 1>which saw a thirty one point three percent growth, TikTok

0:13:08.400 --> 0:13:11.120
<v Speaker 1>eleven point six percent growth, and Instagram nine point nine

0:13:11.160 --> 0:13:14.040
<v Speaker 1>percent growth but trending down every year since twenty nineteen,

0:13:14.240 --> 0:13:17.840
<v Speaker 1>and also LinkedIn up seventeen point nine percent. They're the

0:13:17.880 --> 0:13:20.560
<v Speaker 1>only ones that are really seeing good year over year growth.

0:13:21.200 --> 0:13:23.320
<v Speaker 1>And while it's important to note that these are visits

0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:25.959
<v Speaker 1>rather than active users, and in fairness, this data only

0:13:26.040 --> 0:13:28.160
<v Speaker 1>covers visits made through a browser rather than an app,

0:13:28.880 --> 0:13:33.080
<v Speaker 1>this is still a truly astounding trend that suggests, for

0:13:33.120 --> 0:13:35.880
<v Speaker 1>the most part that the web's largest platforms are seeing

0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:39.600
<v Speaker 1>kind of a digital recession. While there might be revenue

0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:42.280
<v Speaker 1>coming to these companies and they might still be acquiring

0:13:42.320 --> 0:13:45.440
<v Speaker 1>no users, there's really no good way to spin the

0:13:45.480 --> 0:13:49.559
<v Speaker 1>fact that traffic to platforms like Amazon and Google has plateaued,

0:13:49.720 --> 0:13:53.360
<v Speaker 1>then declined, something shifting downwards, and it's been doing so

0:13:53.520 --> 0:13:57.120
<v Speaker 1>since twenty nineteen. Perhaps this explains why platforms like Google

0:13:57.160 --> 0:14:00.319
<v Speaker 1>and Facebook have kept making changes to make each USERG journey,

0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.360
<v Speaker 1>create more engagement and make it more profitable to sustain

0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:08.760
<v Speaker 1>growth because fewer people than ever are actually visiting the platforms.

0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:12.360
<v Speaker 1>I believe her at the end of something I called

0:14:12.400 --> 0:14:16.160
<v Speaker 1>the rockcom boom, the tech industry's hypergrowth cycle, where there

0:14:16.200 --> 0:14:18.760
<v Speaker 1>were so many new lands to conquer, so many new

0:14:18.800 --> 0:14:22.640
<v Speaker 1>ways to pile money into, so many new innovative, useful ideas,

0:14:22.840 --> 0:14:25.760
<v Speaker 1>that it felt like every tech company could experience perpetual

0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:29.160
<v Speaker 1>growth just by throwing money at a problem. It also

0:14:29.240 --> 0:14:32.720
<v Speaker 1>explains why so many tech products YouTube, Google, Search, Facebook,

0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:35.560
<v Speaker 1>and so on feel like they're either trapped in amber

0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.000
<v Speaker 1>or like they've got tangibly worse, because when you think

0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:41.480
<v Speaker 1>about it, when there's no incentive to improve the things

0:14:41.560 --> 0:14:45.000
<v Speaker 1>you've already built, why would you You should just be

0:14:45.080 --> 0:14:47.120
<v Speaker 1>working on the next big thing or new ways to

0:14:47.120 --> 0:14:49.920
<v Speaker 1>reduce the thing you have right now to keep people

0:14:49.920 --> 0:14:53.280
<v Speaker 1>coming back, Yeah, maybe, but to keep people on the platform,

0:14:53.440 --> 0:14:56.240
<v Speaker 1>sometimes by monopolizing an industry so they have nowhere else

0:14:56.280 --> 0:15:03.520
<v Speaker 1>to go. And that's the thing. All of these come companies, Facebook, Google, Amazon,

0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:06.120
<v Speaker 1>I mean all of them. They've all built themselves on

0:15:06.200 --> 0:15:09.800
<v Speaker 1>this very simple idea that they'd always be a next

0:15:09.800 --> 0:15:12.760
<v Speaker 1>big thing. And I'm not even saying that they won't be,

0:15:13.160 --> 0:15:16.200
<v Speaker 1>but they've assumed, and the problem that they're facing right

0:15:16.200 --> 0:15:19.520
<v Speaker 1>now is that there would always be one around the corner.

0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:23.760
<v Speaker 1>This belief that exponential growth is not just a reasonable

0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:27.160
<v Speaker 1>expectation but a requirement is central to the core of

0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:29.560
<v Speaker 1>the rot in the tech industry. And as these rapacious

0:15:29.600 --> 0:15:32.480
<v Speaker 1>demands run into reality, I'm sorry to say that the

0:15:32.560 --> 0:15:35.320
<v Speaker 1>rockcom bubble is going to deflate. And as we speak,

0:15:35.360 --> 0:15:38.920
<v Speaker 1>the tech industry they're grappling with somewhat of a midlife crisis,

0:15:39.400 --> 0:15:42.720
<v Speaker 1>and they're desperately searching for that next hyper growth market,

0:15:42.800 --> 0:15:45.920
<v Speaker 1>and they're eagerly pushing customers and businesses to adopt this

0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:49.760
<v Speaker 1>technology that nobody actually asked for. They must keep the

0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:54.080
<v Speaker 1>rot economy alive because if they don't, they're gonna they're

0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:56.560
<v Speaker 1>gonna have to face the fact that they've built pretty

0:15:56.600 --> 0:16:01.280
<v Speaker 1>unsustainable businesses. Even though they're profitable, they keep growing. The

0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:17.160
<v Speaker 1>only thing that grows forever is cancer. The raw economy

0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:19.960
<v Speaker 1>and takes growth lust. It isn't new, though venture capital

0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:23.080
<v Speaker 1>has been incentivizing and monetizing rot for over a decade,

0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:25.920
<v Speaker 1>and Mark andrew's An advocated in twenty eleven that we

0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:29.560
<v Speaker 1>should look to expand the number of innovative new software

0:16:29.600 --> 0:16:34.320
<v Speaker 1>companies created rather than constantly questioning their valuations. Yet just

0:16:34.360 --> 0:16:37.960
<v Speaker 1>a year earlier, in March twenty ten, his partner Ben Horowitz,

0:16:37.960 --> 0:16:40.560
<v Speaker 1>he advocated for fat startups, and I'll link to that

0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:43.120
<v Speaker 1>in the notes, saying that you can't save your way

0:16:43.160 --> 0:16:46.640
<v Speaker 1>to winning the market, and that startup purgatory is when

0:16:46.640 --> 0:16:48.920
<v Speaker 1>you don't go bankrupt, but you fail to build the

0:16:48.960 --> 0:16:51.680
<v Speaker 1>number one product in this space and have zero chance

0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:55.000
<v Speaker 1>of becoming a high growth company, which, by the way,

0:16:55.120 --> 0:16:58.400
<v Speaker 1>Horowitz described this as worse than startup hell because you

0:16:58.480 --> 0:17:01.520
<v Speaker 1>are and I quote stuck with the small company, even

0:17:01.560 --> 0:17:04.360
<v Speaker 1>if it's cash flow positive. At the time, this might

0:17:04.400 --> 0:17:06.680
<v Speaker 1>have made sense to them because this mindset made them

0:17:06.760 --> 0:17:11.560
<v Speaker 1>quite rich, even though there's something inherently abnormal about describing

0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:16.400
<v Speaker 1>being a staple profitable company as being an estate that's

0:17:16.520 --> 0:17:20.800
<v Speaker 1>worse than hell. Anyway, I want you to take a

0:17:20.800 --> 0:17:23.240
<v Speaker 1>step back in time with me, though, and think about

0:17:23.280 --> 0:17:27.600
<v Speaker 1>how much has changed in the last ten years, fifteen years.

0:17:27.920 --> 0:17:33.359
<v Speaker 1>Think about it for a second. In twenty ten, it

0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:36.120
<v Speaker 1>felt like we were just making our first steps into

0:17:36.119 --> 0:17:39.800
<v Speaker 1>the digital world. It was still pretty new twenty ten.

0:17:39.840 --> 0:17:42.080
<v Speaker 1>There was no Instacart. There was no Zoom, no Snapchat,

0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:44.680
<v Speaker 1>no Lyft, no Tinder, no Slack, no Snowflake, no door Dash,

0:17:44.720 --> 0:17:47.800
<v Speaker 1>no TikTok, no Discord, no Coinbase, no Robinhood. And there

0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:54.320
<v Speaker 1>wasn't any Venmo or Zel either. Tesla, Facebook, LinkedIn, Airbnb, Uber, Square, Alassian, Octa,

0:17:54.480 --> 0:17:58.639
<v Speaker 1>Mongo dB, work Day, Palo Alto networks, Asana, UiPath, Spotify.

0:17:58.880 --> 0:18:02.840
<v Speaker 1>They hadn't even gone public. Instagram was still independent, it

0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:06.960
<v Speaker 1>wasn't part of Facebook yet, and consumer drones they hadn't reached. Ubiquity,

0:18:07.359 --> 0:18:11.320
<v Speaker 1>voice assistance hadn't even been launched. Full gled networks they

0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:14.040
<v Speaker 1>were brand new, and Amazon Web Services, one of the

0:18:14.080 --> 0:18:16.600
<v Speaker 1>most profitable things in the world, as I'll get to,

0:18:17.000 --> 0:18:19.840
<v Speaker 1>was on course to make six hundred million dollars in

0:18:19.920 --> 0:18:22.720
<v Speaker 1>revenue in twenty ten, which is, by the way, two

0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:25.760
<v Speaker 1>point five percent of the twenty four billion that AWS

0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:28.240
<v Speaker 1>on its own made in the first quarter of twenty

0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:31.359
<v Speaker 1>twenty four. Google and Apples stock prices were worth less

0:18:31.359 --> 0:18:33.680
<v Speaker 1>than a tenth of what they are today, and Nvidia,

0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:36.680
<v Speaker 1>a stock now worth over one thousand dollars traded at

0:18:36.760 --> 0:18:40.160
<v Speaker 1>under three dollars a share. Between two thousand and five

0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:43.400
<v Speaker 1>and twenty eighteen, we saw this incredible surge of innovation

0:18:43.520 --> 0:18:48.160
<v Speaker 1>and tech valuations, and this kind of seemingly unstoppable period

0:18:48.200 --> 0:18:51.320
<v Speaker 1>of growth and big sexy ideas that created big, sexier

0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:54.960
<v Speaker 1>new markets. While applications existed in two thousand and eight,

0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:58.639
<v Speaker 1>Apple's App Store and the perpetual nature of connection that

0:18:58.640 --> 0:19:03.200
<v Speaker 1>we get from smartphones. It consumerized the concept of distinct

0:19:03.359 --> 0:19:06.119
<v Speaker 1>service based apps, as well as the overall concept of

0:19:06.160 --> 0:19:11.320
<v Speaker 1>software ecosystems, which has become a multi trillion dollar philosophical

0:19:11.359 --> 0:19:15.240
<v Speaker 1>and economic force, and it's changed just about everything about

0:19:15.280 --> 0:19:18.280
<v Speaker 1>how we communicate and even do business. It's remarkable and

0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:21.199
<v Speaker 1>also was a new market just sitting there waiting for

0:19:21.280 --> 0:19:23.840
<v Speaker 1>the hardware and software to catch up with it, and

0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:25.440
<v Speaker 1>for someone to come up with the idea, of course,

0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:29.920
<v Speaker 1>connecting people digitally through social media, voice, video, and so on.

0:19:30.520 --> 0:19:34.239
<v Speaker 1>It's been central to the hypergrowth cycle, with innovations like

0:19:34.480 --> 0:19:37.959
<v Speaker 1>connectivity and cloud infrastructure allowing multiple companies to carve out

0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:42.120
<v Speaker 1>these one hundred billion and trillion dollar ecosystems on some level,

0:19:42.200 --> 0:19:45.680
<v Speaker 1>big tech companies could put money through research and development, investment,

0:19:45.760 --> 0:19:48.280
<v Speaker 1>or acquisitions wherever they needed to as a means of

0:19:48.280 --> 0:19:50.760
<v Speaker 1>making the future a reality, and thanks to the fact

0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:53.520
<v Speaker 1>that interest rates were rock bottom and there was a

0:19:53.520 --> 0:19:57.040
<v Speaker 1>lot of private money going into startups, they were never

0:19:57.040 --> 0:20:01.080
<v Speaker 1>really short of cash to do so. One point, hype

0:20:01.280 --> 0:20:04.320
<v Speaker 1>began to outpace innovation, and while there were new ideas,

0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:08.879
<v Speaker 1>the actual fundamental technology required to actually innovate may not

0:20:08.880 --> 0:20:12.399
<v Speaker 1>actually exist, making a lot of these ideas theoretical and

0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:16.640
<v Speaker 1>so far behind the cart that you may as well

0:20:16.640 --> 0:20:21.560
<v Speaker 1>shoot the horse dead. When Mark Zuckerberg renamed Facebook to Meta,

0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:23.720
<v Speaker 1>he told Casey Newton, who by the way, should feel

0:20:23.920 --> 0:20:27.240
<v Speaker 1>nothing but shame for accepting this in good faith, that

0:20:27.320 --> 0:20:30.159
<v Speaker 1>he believed the metaverse was an embodied Internet that was

0:20:30.200 --> 0:20:34.560
<v Speaker 1>a persistent, synchronous environment that would resembles social media but

0:20:34.640 --> 0:20:38.320
<v Speaker 1>also be an environment where you're embodied in it. That's

0:20:38.359 --> 0:20:40.560
<v Speaker 1>a real quote. By the way, This is of course

0:20:40.640 --> 0:20:44.359
<v Speaker 1>total nonsense, a total word salad that will make you

0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:49.320
<v Speaker 1>throw up, conjured up by somebody without any real ideas

0:20:49.359 --> 0:20:52.400
<v Speaker 1>that knows that they won't receive any pushback on them anyway,

0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:56.080
<v Speaker 1>not even from those whose job it is to scrutinize

0:20:56.119 --> 0:20:58.679
<v Speaker 1>the tech industry and ask the difficult questions so that

0:20:58.720 --> 0:21:03.520
<v Speaker 1>people don't buy stupid Anyway, what Zuckerberg had actually built,

0:21:03.920 --> 0:21:06.480
<v Speaker 1>by which for the most part I mean acquired, was

0:21:06.480 --> 0:21:09.800
<v Speaker 1>a half fast virtual world accessed through niche virtual reality

0:21:09.800 --> 0:21:12.800
<v Speaker 1>technology that nobody asked for, that already kind of existed,

0:21:12.800 --> 0:21:15.439
<v Speaker 1>that made people sick, and that Meta couldn't actually build.

0:21:15.960 --> 0:21:18.639
<v Speaker 1>And what Mark Zuckerberg wanted to do was built the

0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:21.520
<v Speaker 1>successor to the mobile Internet in the hopes that quote

0:21:21.600 --> 0:21:25.320
<v Speaker 1>the metaverse would be another hypergrowth industry where people would

0:21:25.359 --> 0:21:28.439
<v Speaker 1>buy land which they didn't, or hang out on mass

0:21:28.440 --> 0:21:30.919
<v Speaker 1>which they didn't, or have meetings which they did not,

0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:34.520
<v Speaker 1>all while sharing data and watching ads served by Meta

0:21:34.560 --> 0:21:38.439
<v Speaker 1>and other companies that Meta could sell ads too. In

0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:41.680
<v Speaker 1>this cynical, horrible version of the future, the Internet, neutral

0:21:41.760 --> 0:21:44.359
<v Speaker 1>standards based and controlled by no single company would be

0:21:44.400 --> 0:21:47.920
<v Speaker 1>transformed into a platform, a feudal system where Meta would

0:21:47.920 --> 0:21:51.560
<v Speaker 1>set the rules an exactor cut from each engagement, interaction

0:21:51.880 --> 0:21:55.159
<v Speaker 1>and transaction. It was quite plainly a power grad the

0:21:55.280 --> 0:21:57.560
<v Speaker 1>likes of which the Internet hasn't seen since the bleak

0:21:57.640 --> 0:22:00.200
<v Speaker 1>days of Internet Explorer six and Active X if you

0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:03.400
<v Speaker 1>don't know what those are. Microsoft has some evil things

0:22:03.400 --> 0:22:07.200
<v Speaker 1>in the past. The tech, however, it was never there.

0:22:07.800 --> 0:22:10.399
<v Speaker 1>Mark Zuckerberg sold everybody on the concept of a Ready

0:22:10.400 --> 0:22:13.399
<v Speaker 1>Player one Metaverus and putting aside for a second that

0:22:13.440 --> 0:22:16.680
<v Speaker 1>Ready Player one is a poorly written dystopia. This vision

0:22:16.800 --> 0:22:20.600
<v Speaker 1>hinges heavily on the idea of technology that completely immerses

0:22:20.640 --> 0:22:23.399
<v Speaker 1>the user and their senses and makes them feel like

0:22:23.440 --> 0:22:28.640
<v Speaker 1>they're actually in a world, which is just insane. It's

0:22:28.680 --> 0:22:31.280
<v Speaker 1>not possible, It's not even close to possible. We're talking

0:22:31.320 --> 0:22:34.919
<v Speaker 1>about full sensory takeover and the ability to traverse the

0:22:34.920 --> 0:22:38.600
<v Speaker 1>digital world somehow without moving. This would be a revolution,

0:22:39.000 --> 0:22:42.360
<v Speaker 1>both in cloud computing because just the raw data would

0:22:42.400 --> 0:22:48.400
<v Speaker 1>be insane, but also immersive technology. Just what was everyone

0:22:48.560 --> 0:22:53.480
<v Speaker 1>doing accepting this idea, And let's be honest, the reality

0:22:53.600 --> 0:22:56.080
<v Speaker 1>was just so much worse. You had these nausea inducing

0:22:56.119 --> 0:22:59.919
<v Speaker 1>headsets that led you into this horrible, clunky, cartoon world.

0:23:00.040 --> 0:23:03.520
<v Speaker 1>It wasn't fun or practical or useful, and tens of

0:23:03.560 --> 0:23:06.520
<v Speaker 1>billions of dollars of R and D costs developing headsets

0:23:06.560 --> 0:23:10.840
<v Speaker 1>that lose money on every sale. It's just insane. By

0:23:10.880 --> 0:23:13.680
<v Speaker 1>the way, Mark Zuckerberg has spent tens of billions of dollars,

0:23:13.680 --> 0:23:15.359
<v Speaker 1>and I realized sometimes people don't like it when I

0:23:15.400 --> 0:23:17.639
<v Speaker 1>get yelly, and I apologize. But where has the thirty

0:23:17.680 --> 0:23:20.560
<v Speaker 1>billion dollars gone? What has Mark Zuckerberg done with it?

0:23:20.800 --> 0:23:23.600
<v Speaker 1>Where is it going? I don't know. I'm not accusing

0:23:23.640 --> 0:23:26.760
<v Speaker 1>anyone of anything, but the whole thing just feels like

0:23:26.800 --> 0:23:30.560
<v Speaker 1>a con. And Zuckerberg's glossy Metaverse video the first one

0:23:30.600 --> 0:23:34.040
<v Speaker 1>he published when they rebranded Facebook to Meta. It was

0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:38.080
<v Speaker 1>significant in quite a few ways. First of all, the

0:23:38.119 --> 0:23:42.160
<v Speaker 1>most disgusting bullshit I've ever seen a tech company put out,

0:23:42.280 --> 0:23:45.080
<v Speaker 1>just complete lies. But it was also a demonstration of

0:23:45.119 --> 0:23:48.719
<v Speaker 1>the company's future ambitions and directions, and it showed exactly

0:23:48.760 --> 0:23:53.240
<v Speaker 1>what they hoped they could build. And had Zuckerberg actually

0:23:53.280 --> 0:23:54.919
<v Speaker 1>done so, I would have said it would have been

0:23:54.920 --> 0:23:57.680
<v Speaker 1>a success, But said success would have been predicated on

0:23:57.720 --> 0:24:00.199
<v Speaker 1>a pace of innovation that we haven't had in for

0:24:00.240 --> 0:24:04.640
<v Speaker 1>a decade or longer. I don't actually know how we

0:24:04.720 --> 0:24:07.760
<v Speaker 1>get to anything close to what Mark Zuckerberg was selling,

0:24:08.040 --> 0:24:11.640
<v Speaker 1>But forty billion dollars later, the Metaverse is just nowhere

0:24:11.680 --> 0:24:14.679
<v Speaker 1>near close to existing. And yet he keeps burning cash

0:24:14.760 --> 0:24:16.400
<v Speaker 1>in the hopes that he can get just one more

0:24:16.440 --> 0:24:19.199
<v Speaker 1>hit of hypergrowth. Man, that's all Mark Zuckerberg needs. Just

0:24:19.200 --> 0:24:21.560
<v Speaker 1>one more hit, brother, Just give me a little more growth.

0:24:21.600 --> 0:24:23.320
<v Speaker 1>I'll be okay. I swear I won't need any in

0:24:23.359 --> 0:24:27.520
<v Speaker 1>the future. Putting that aside, I really think this is

0:24:27.560 --> 0:24:30.600
<v Speaker 1>why Zuckerberg is so full force on generative AI. He

0:24:30.720 --> 0:24:33.680
<v Speaker 1>shoved it into every meta platform now, regardless of whether

0:24:33.720 --> 0:24:37.520
<v Speaker 1>it does anything useful, whether it's doing anything weird, like

0:24:37.560 --> 0:24:40.280
<v Speaker 1>commenting on a parenting group that it has a gifted

0:24:40.359 --> 0:24:43.600
<v Speaker 1>child and telling parents where to take their kids. It's

0:24:43.680 --> 0:24:46.480
<v Speaker 1>just so weird. And it's the same reason that Sun

0:24:46.520 --> 0:24:50.080
<v Speaker 1>Dhar Pashai and Liz Reader forcing generative AI into Google Search,

0:24:50.440 --> 0:24:55.800
<v Speaker 1>even as it misinforms customers and it's recommending people put

0:24:55.840 --> 0:24:58.320
<v Speaker 1>glue on their pizza and eat rocks, and it's claiming

0:24:58.359 --> 0:25:01.919
<v Speaker 1>that Barack Obama is a muzzle, and it's regurgitating stories

0:25:02.000 --> 0:25:06.440
<v Speaker 1>from the Onion as indisputable fact, and it's just it's

0:25:06.560 --> 0:25:09.359
<v Speaker 1>very frustrating. You can hear it in my voice. But

0:25:09.400 --> 0:25:12.240
<v Speaker 1>it all comes down to a simple problem, which is

0:25:12.800 --> 0:25:16.440
<v Speaker 1>the tech industry is getting withdrawal symptoms. They're realizing there

0:25:16.520 --> 0:25:20.080
<v Speaker 1>might not be any massive new markets. They might not

0:25:20.320 --> 0:25:23.359
<v Speaker 1>be another way to create another billion dollar arm of

0:25:23.359 --> 0:25:26.560
<v Speaker 1>a trillion dollar enterprise. And on some level, I believe

0:25:26.560 --> 0:25:31.359
<v Speaker 1>that the industry wide alignment around this unprofitable, unsustainable AI

0:25:31.480 --> 0:25:35.000
<v Speaker 1>tool is just proof that they're getting desperate and that

0:25:35.080 --> 0:25:38.680
<v Speaker 1>some of them might be irredeemably washed. Why else would

0:25:38.760 --> 0:25:42.200
<v Speaker 1>Sam Altman spend most of the time talking about what

0:25:42.240 --> 0:25:46.199
<v Speaker 1>AI might do. Why else would Sam Altman talk so

0:25:46.400 --> 0:25:50.160
<v Speaker 1>often about building artificial general intelligence, a thing that, as

0:25:50.200 --> 0:25:53.639
<v Speaker 1>I have mentioned, is totally and utterly impossible to build

0:25:53.840 --> 0:25:57.160
<v Speaker 1>with any of the generative AI tech his company makes,

0:25:58.000 --> 0:26:02.240
<v Speaker 1>and likely requires kinds of computing that do not exist. Yet.

0:26:04.400 --> 0:26:08.760
<v Speaker 1>It's really frustrating, and the rock com bubble bursting is

0:26:09.440 --> 0:26:11.600
<v Speaker 1>it's going to be nasty for bid Tech. It's going

0:26:11.680 --> 0:26:14.199
<v Speaker 1>to wash out at least one of these companies, and

0:26:14.240 --> 0:26:17.800
<v Speaker 1>it might take years to happen. But the growth trend

0:26:17.840 --> 0:26:21.600
<v Speaker 1>is reversing. Every single one of these companies with a

0:26:21.640 --> 0:26:25.960
<v Speaker 1>few exceptions, I realize, is seeing traffic declines and they're

0:26:26.000 --> 0:26:30.840
<v Speaker 1>not improving. Perhaps they will find new ways, but where

0:26:30.880 --> 0:26:33.480
<v Speaker 1>are they going to find them? What are the things

0:26:33.480 --> 0:26:37.280
<v Speaker 1>they're going to do? What happens when none of this

0:26:37.440 --> 0:26:41.840
<v Speaker 1>stuff actually is the future. What happens when Google Search

0:26:41.960 --> 0:26:45.880
<v Speaker 1>tells someone to actually do something that kills them how

0:26:45.920 --> 0:26:49.040
<v Speaker 1>to clean up a chemical firing correctly, for example. There

0:26:49.040 --> 0:26:52.159
<v Speaker 1>are very real ways that these things are going to

0:26:52.240 --> 0:26:55.280
<v Speaker 1>hurt people. But putting that aside, even if they don't,

0:26:55.359 --> 0:26:57.520
<v Speaker 1>they're not going to make them the kind of money

0:26:57.760 --> 0:27:00.159
<v Speaker 1>and get them the kind of customers that they needed

0:27:00.400 --> 0:27:05.119
<v Speaker 1>to perpetually show perpetual growth. As I said last episode,

0:27:05.560 --> 0:27:09.240
<v Speaker 1>two episodes ago, Facebook is dying and Facebook's dying because

0:27:09.640 --> 0:27:12.640
<v Speaker 1>I actually believe Mark Zuckerberg is quite innovative about one thing,

0:27:12.640 --> 0:27:16.720
<v Speaker 1>which is he can smell blood in the water, except

0:27:16.720 --> 0:27:20.040
<v Speaker 1>now he can smell his I think Mark Zuckerberg realized

0:27:20.160 --> 0:27:23.280
<v Speaker 1>that this was happening many years before everybody else, and

0:27:23.320 --> 0:27:25.440
<v Speaker 1>that's why he pushed the metaverus in twenty twenty one.

0:27:25.800 --> 0:27:27.720
<v Speaker 1>That's why he was talking about Web three and twenty

0:27:27.760 --> 0:27:30.679
<v Speaker 1>twenty one. That was a very very easy year to

0:27:30.720 --> 0:27:32.800
<v Speaker 1>get money, and it was a year when people were

0:27:32.840 --> 0:27:35.359
<v Speaker 1>aggressively buying things, so it was a great time to

0:27:35.400 --> 0:27:38.320
<v Speaker 1>sell new ideas. Also, I think he read Ready Player

0:27:38.320 --> 0:27:41.159
<v Speaker 1>one and they actually liked it, which is so strange.

0:27:41.560 --> 0:27:45.000
<v Speaker 1>But either way, I do think Zuckerberg's an innovator because

0:27:45.000 --> 0:27:48.440
<v Speaker 1>he's realized that the highpergrowth era is over and he's

0:27:48.480 --> 0:27:51.760
<v Speaker 1>really trying to create the next best thing. Now, Notice

0:27:51.800 --> 0:27:55.800
<v Speaker 1>I didn't say something good or something useful. That's just

0:27:55.960 --> 0:27:59.240
<v Speaker 1>not in Zuckerberg's DNA, and it's not in Sundhar Pashai

0:27:59.400 --> 0:28:04.159
<v Speaker 1>or sam Or or satch In Adela's either Microsoft, Amazon, Meta.

0:28:04.680 --> 0:28:07.399
<v Speaker 1>These companies are not innovative anymore because they're no longer

0:28:07.440 --> 0:28:10.159
<v Speaker 1>engineered to be. When the living was free and easy,

0:28:10.320 --> 0:28:12.320
<v Speaker 1>when there were tons of these markets to attack and

0:28:12.440 --> 0:28:15.080
<v Speaker 1>grow and eat and shit out the other way and

0:28:15.119 --> 0:28:19.320
<v Speaker 1>make money from, they just needed a management consultant mindset.

0:28:19.480 --> 0:28:21.280
<v Speaker 1>It was growth at all costs. It was growth all

0:28:21.320 --> 0:28:23.200
<v Speaker 1>the time, because all they had to do was throw

0:28:23.240 --> 0:28:25.520
<v Speaker 1>more money at the problem and they'd always keep growing.

0:28:25.720 --> 0:28:30.120
<v Speaker 1>And to their credit, they have been. But mark my words,

0:28:31.200 --> 0:28:34.000
<v Speaker 1>they're not going to grow forever. And they don't have

0:28:34.280 --> 0:28:38.200
<v Speaker 1>a next trick. They don't have the next one billion

0:28:38.280 --> 0:28:41.520
<v Speaker 1>user product, they don't have the next innovation, and I

0:28:41.520 --> 0:28:43.640
<v Speaker 1>don't think they're going to have it for a long time.

0:28:44.520 --> 0:28:47.480
<v Speaker 1>And this is why all of this stuff feels kind

0:28:47.520 --> 0:28:50.880
<v Speaker 1>of weird. It's why all of this stuff doesn't seem

0:28:50.920 --> 0:28:52.640
<v Speaker 1>to be solving a need that you or I have,

0:28:52.800 --> 0:28:55.760
<v Speaker 1>or that even a business has, And it's why so

0:28:55.920 --> 0:28:58.720
<v Speaker 1>often it feels like they're pleading with us to believe

0:28:58.760 --> 0:29:02.800
<v Speaker 1>that this is the future. Companies that build useful things

0:29:02.840 --> 0:29:05.960
<v Speaker 1>that people need don't need to talk about what they're

0:29:05.960 --> 0:29:08.480
<v Speaker 1>build in the future. You can see it in the

0:29:08.480 --> 0:29:11.440
<v Speaker 1>things they're selling you today. You could see in the

0:29:11.480 --> 0:29:14.880
<v Speaker 1>early days of cloud computing, how you bickered with storage

0:29:14.920 --> 0:29:18.040
<v Speaker 1>like Dropbox or Box might have existed. I was using FTT.

0:29:18.640 --> 0:29:23.280
<v Speaker 1>Thank god for Dropbox, honestly, but seriously, you could see

0:29:23.520 --> 0:29:27.040
<v Speaker 1>why these things were the future. And in the next episode,

0:29:27.080 --> 0:29:30.160
<v Speaker 1>I'm going to walk you through how the tech industries

0:29:30.240 --> 0:29:33.600
<v Speaker 1>promises no longer actually seem to match their ability to

0:29:33.600 --> 0:29:37.160
<v Speaker 1>build things and how this desperation I've been discussing shows

0:29:37.200 --> 0:29:40.479
<v Speaker 1>that were close to the rockcom bubble bursting. Thanks for listening,

0:29:48.720 --> 0:29:51.160
<v Speaker 1>Thank you for listening to Better Offline. The editor and

0:29:51.160 --> 0:29:54.360
<v Speaker 1>composer of the Better Offline theme song is Matasowski. You

0:29:54.360 --> 0:29:56.600
<v Speaker 1>can check out more of his music and audio projects

0:29:56.760 --> 0:30:03.680
<v Speaker 1>at Matasowski dot com m Att w Ski dot com.

0:30:03.720 --> 0:30:06.040
<v Speaker 1>You can email me at easy at Better Offline dot

0:30:06.080 --> 0:30:08.280
<v Speaker 1>com or visit better Offline dot com to find more

0:30:08.320 --> 0:30:11.720
<v Speaker 1>podcast links and of course my newsletter. I also really

0:30:11.720 --> 0:30:13.920
<v Speaker 1>recommend you go to chat dot Where's Youreed dot at

0:30:14.040 --> 0:30:16.480
<v Speaker 1>to visit the discord, and go to our slash Better

0:30:16.520 --> 0:30:19.680
<v Speaker 1>Offline to check out our reddit. Thank you so much

0:30:19.720 --> 0:30:23.560
<v Speaker 1>for listening. Better Offline is a production of cool Zone Media.

0:30:23.680 --> 0:30:26.520
<v Speaker 1>For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool

0:30:26.600 --> 0:30:29.960
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