1 00:00:02,120 --> 00:00:04,960 Speaker 1: Welcome to Katie's Crib, a production of Shonda Land Audio 2 00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:07,840 Speaker 1: in partnership with I Heart Radio. How do I not 3 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:11,760 Speaker 1: raise a spoiled kid in Hollywood? Ha Um, you would 4 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: not believe the number of private schools that have had 5 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:17,720 Speaker 1: me in to have this conversation with the parent body. Actually, 6 00:00:17,760 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 1: you probably would believe it. I would believe it. I 7 00:00:20,800 --> 00:00:24,520 Speaker 1: get more questions about private jets there than I do 8 00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 1: nearly any God, what is the best way to set 9 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:35,880 Speaker 1: a kid up for success from birth with the savings account? Well, 10 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:39,599 Speaker 1: that's a great question. So I um did not know 11 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:42,279 Speaker 1: the laws governing this. So as soon as I pet 12 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: on the pregnancy stick and got two stripes, I said, 13 00:00:45,720 --> 00:00:47,760 Speaker 1: I got to open a scholar Share five twenty nine. 14 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,559 Speaker 1: And I took the stick down and they said, oh no, no, 15 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 1: you actually have to have a person with the social 16 00:00:52,760 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: Security number to open up a five college account. You 17 00:00:56,840 --> 00:00:59,640 Speaker 1: can't show up with a pete on stick at the bank. 18 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 1: So that's a good tip. But as soon as you 19 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 1: have said baby, hey, everybody, welcome back to Katie's Crib. 20 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: You guys, I know how I feel about this podcast, 21 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 1: and I just feel so lucky because I selfishly get 22 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: to have people teach me things that I don't know 23 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: a lot about, And one of those topics I don't 24 00:01:27,440 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 1: really know about is how to teach kids about money. 25 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:33,600 Speaker 1: We do a lot of work on this podcast when 26 00:01:33,600 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: it comes to race and sex other hot topics, but 27 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 1: I don't think anyone ever puts money on this list 28 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 1: of conversations to have with our kids, and it is 29 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,960 Speaker 1: a big deal. So what we have here for you 30 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: today is actually a two parter. Half of today's episode 31 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:53,800 Speaker 1: is with New York Times your money columnist Ron Lieber. 32 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 1: He's incredible and my husband is playing him in a movie. 33 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: No joke. More on that later after Ron, I then 34 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:05,440 Speaker 1: talked to this incredible duo that goes by the name 35 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:12,799 Speaker 1: of the Fiscal Firecrackers. Actress Susan Yagely and personal financial 36 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: expert Gallia Geishawn host their own podcast that educates, entertains, 37 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:22,399 Speaker 1: and empowers people about their money. So let's get started 38 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:25,880 Speaker 1: for everyone listening. Adam is in this movie coming out 39 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: called She said. It's based on an article that Ron 40 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:31,639 Speaker 1: Lieber's wife, Jodi Canter wrote. She said, as a movie 41 00:02:31,720 --> 00:02:34,840 Speaker 1: about the reporting that led to the Harvey Weinstein hole 42 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:39,119 Speaker 1: going to prison. Nightmare. Uh. Jody is played by Zoe 43 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: Kazan and Ron is played by Adam And when Adam 44 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:44,720 Speaker 1: said he was playing Ron Lieber, I went down a 45 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:47,400 Speaker 1: huge Google deep dive of who Ron is and my 46 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: first thought was, um, Hello, I have to get him 47 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:51,960 Speaker 1: on Katie's crib and I have to have him teach 48 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:54,240 Speaker 1: us how we are not going to mess up our 49 00:02:54,280 --> 00:02:58,040 Speaker 1: kids when it comes to money. Okay, So back to Ron. 50 00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 1: He's known for being the or Money columnists since two 51 00:03:01,560 --> 00:03:04,359 Speaker 1: thousand eight. He's also co author of five books, including 52 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: The Price You Pay for College and the Opposite of Spoiled. 53 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 1: Before coming to The New York Times, Ron wrote for 54 00:03:10,639 --> 00:03:13,079 Speaker 1: The Wall Street Journal, Fast Company, and Fortune. He lives 55 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 1: in Brooklyn with his wife, Jodie Canter, an investigative reporter 56 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: for The Times, and their two daughters. Welcome Ron to 57 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 1: Katie's crib. Hello, you're starting to get to this. But 58 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 1: why money? How did you get into this? Sure? So 59 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: I write about money all day. I have since roughly 60 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 1: two thousand two. Yeah, when I was at the Wall 61 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 1: Street Journal. Um, I think if there's anything that I'm 62 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 1: good at, or best at, or better at than a 63 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 1: lot of people, it's about making the connection between money 64 00:03:49,920 --> 00:03:53,600 Speaker 1: and feelings right. There are so many feelings that are 65 00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:58,280 Speaker 1: evoked that are invoked right when we talk about this stuff, um, 66 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:01,280 Speaker 1: and we often don't acknowledge it, or we're afraid to 67 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:03,800 Speaker 1: even speak of it in the first place. I think, 68 00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:07,600 Speaker 1: you know, we've gotten more used to talking about race, 69 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 1: at least semi comfortably. I think you know many of 70 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:15,880 Speaker 1: us have gotten better about sex. But this thing is harder, right, Um, 71 00:04:15,920 --> 00:04:18,600 Speaker 1: particularly if you're lucky enough to have more than average. 72 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 1: People don't know where to start, and they don't know 73 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: quite what the point of the exercise is. Um. So 74 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: you know that's where I began. How do I not 75 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,480 Speaker 1: raise We're going to go through questions quickly, guys, because 76 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 1: I could. You should see the amount of notes I 77 00:04:34,680 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 1: have on this guy, and we might have to do 78 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:38,039 Speaker 1: a part two of this episode. How do I not 79 00:04:38,160 --> 00:04:41,960 Speaker 1: raise a spoiled kid in Hollywood? Ha? Um. You would 80 00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: not believe the number of private schools that have had 81 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,960 Speaker 1: me in to have this conversation with the parent body. Actually, 82 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:51,720 Speaker 1: you probably would believe it. I would believe it. Yeah, 83 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:55,839 Speaker 1: it's so that the Hollywood, l A. Area conversations are 84 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:59,680 Speaker 1: interesting to me. In part, because I get more questions 85 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:03,559 Speaker 1: of out private jets there then I do nearly any 86 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: place so rich. Yet, what are we gonna do when 87 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:13,039 Speaker 1: the kid refuses to fly on the jet? What do 88 00:05:13,120 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 1: we do when the kid is late arriving for the jet? 89 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:21,279 Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? Oh? My god? And that is that? 90 00:05:21,279 --> 00:05:24,760 Speaker 1: That is insane? Like that is not that is that 91 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: is absolutely wild. Look, I think people for the most part, 92 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 1: are trying to do better than their parents. Right, Like 93 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:35,760 Speaker 1: our collective goal is if our parents had X amount, 94 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:37,800 Speaker 1: it would be awesome if I had more, and then 95 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 1: it would be awesome if my kids could worry less 96 00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:43,159 Speaker 1: about this kind of thing. But at the same time, 97 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 1: you're trying to teach the values that you may have 98 00:05:47,279 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: had growing up because you did have less. Is the 99 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: deprivation tactic something that's worth it? Like you can't have 100 00:05:55,240 --> 00:05:58,520 Speaker 1: that lacrosse stick, you can't have that class, you can't 101 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 1: have that private tutor. So here's the thing, Right, we 102 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:05,840 Speaker 1: all may be luckier than average, we may be way 103 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:09,039 Speaker 1: luckier than average. We may have achieved that dream of 104 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 1: having more and doing more than our parents, but that 105 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 1: doesn't mean our kids need to live that way all 106 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 1: of the time. Right, no matter how much we have, 107 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: we're always subconsciously, quite often making tradeoffs in our grown 108 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:26,080 Speaker 1: up lives, right, you know, trade offs with our time 109 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:28,520 Speaker 1: and trade offs with our money. And so a big 110 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:30,839 Speaker 1: part of what we're trying to do with kids starting 111 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,080 Speaker 1: at like the earliest ages, starting at four or five, 112 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 1: is giving them ever increasing amounts of money for them 113 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:42,840 Speaker 1: to practice on, but a limited amount, so that they 114 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:46,279 Speaker 1: learn to make choices, right, to make trade offs, because 115 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 1: that's what we grown ups do, and we're in the 116 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:50,520 Speaker 1: adult making business here, right, So it sort of begins 117 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:55,240 Speaker 1: there with that overarching philosophy strategy, and then the tactics 118 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 1: come later, but you have to start with figuring out 119 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: like what is the point of this exerci is anyway, 120 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 1: Like what are we actually trying to teach them? And 121 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:05,800 Speaker 1: how much can we get them to do the thing 122 00:07:06,320 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 1: themselves so that they're ready at eighteen or twenty two 123 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: to go out and do it without us. With your kids, 124 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 1: did you practice and allowance? Did you practice? Um? You know, 125 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: I had Kristen bell On and she has a big 126 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:23,160 Speaker 1: thing of like if you want a toy, or you're 127 00:07:23,200 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 1: getting a toy, you have to donate seven that's her number. 128 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: That's how her household works. Did you have rules like 129 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,160 Speaker 1: this in your house. We didn't have that rule, though, 130 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: my cousins and San Diego did one in one out, 131 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 1: which I really like because we live in a New 132 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,440 Speaker 1: York City apartment. That just sort of happens naturally, like 133 00:07:40,560 --> 00:07:42,800 Speaker 1: we don't have that much space, and stuff just like 134 00:07:43,040 --> 00:07:45,640 Speaker 1: has to go, you know, we have no choice. And 135 00:07:45,720 --> 00:07:48,040 Speaker 1: so you know, my my kids have learned that almost 136 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:52,880 Speaker 1: by their nature. So allowance. Yeah, money is for practice. Um, 137 00:07:52,960 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: you know you started roughly the age of five or six, 138 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: when they start asking for stuff, you can impose a 139 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 1: rule in your household where um, you know, parents buy 140 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: or a parent buys everything that the kid needs, right, 141 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:12,520 Speaker 1: but only some of the things that they want. And 142 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,960 Speaker 1: the things that they want happen uh you know at birthdays, 143 00:08:16,200 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: um and at you know, December holidays. If you mark 144 00:08:19,080 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 1: any of those, right, and then maybe everything else that 145 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 1: they want comes out of that allowance, and so they 146 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:30,040 Speaker 1: begin to learn to make choices. Wow, So you started 147 00:08:30,080 --> 00:08:35,480 Speaker 1: this pretty early. Yeah, Um, so starting at five or six, Um, 148 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 1: you know, a buck a week for every year they've 149 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 1: been on the planet, right, so the six year old 150 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 1: gets six bucks a week, and she's got to divide 151 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: it between a save jar and a spend jar and 152 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 1: a give jar. Um Ideally, you know, saving is for 153 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: you know, webs kind of whimsical purchases. Save you know, 154 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:56,280 Speaker 1: we encourage and people can require their kids to you know, 155 00:08:56,360 --> 00:08:58,880 Speaker 1: hold that money for a certain amount of time. And 156 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:01,600 Speaker 1: then the giving jar is for causes that are important 157 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: or you know, people who need the money more than 158 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: we do. And you know, then you're sort of often 159 00:09:06,120 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: running from there. It's so good. My husband was raised 160 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:13,680 Speaker 1: I'm so glad he's playing you. My family comes from 161 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 1: nothing and my dad did really well. But he also 162 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:20,840 Speaker 1: um believed every day as a holiday. I've seen a 163 00:09:20,840 --> 00:09:22,760 Speaker 1: lot of highs and I've seen a lot of lows, 164 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 1: but my parents have lived a very full experiential life, 165 00:09:26,760 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 1: which is where I always lean towards. Adam is very 166 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: much in the there are if you have three dollars, 167 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 1: you spend one, you save one, you give one to charity, 168 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 1: like that's a non negotiable. We also are in the 169 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 1: camp of if something's more expensive, it's better, which is 170 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,240 Speaker 1: what I believe and what Adam is like that is 171 00:09:47,280 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 1: not true, like which brings me to my question. I 172 00:09:51,160 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 1: love when you say this, we're gonna get to this 173 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 1: state or great? You know what I mean Again, a 174 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,440 Speaker 1: top flight school can cost nearly three d and fifty 175 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:02,560 Speaker 1: thousand in dollars At this point my child is for 176 00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: so it's going to be way more than that. That's 177 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:10,320 Speaker 1: insane when parents are planning college savings or retirement. What 178 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: do you advise? Yeah, so here's the thing. I'm glad 179 00:10:13,800 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 1: you brought this up because you and Adam come from 180 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:19,839 Speaker 1: different backgrounds, you have different philosophies, and before you can 181 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:23,160 Speaker 1: do anything with your kids, before you can get started, 182 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:26,480 Speaker 1: you need to make sure you agree, right, and not 183 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:29,880 Speaker 1: just when it comes to your kids and how you're 184 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:32,120 Speaker 1: going to talk to them and how much allowance they're 185 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 1: going to get, what the rules are going to be. 186 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,640 Speaker 1: I mean, that's important because it's short term, but hopefully everyone, 187 00:10:37,720 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: if there's two parents in the family, are thinking hard 188 00:10:41,760 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 1: about whether they have the same goals for their future, right, 189 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 1: And so you know, maybe you went to a terrific 190 00:10:50,559 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 1: state school and that's going to be good enough for 191 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 1: your family because you're going to spend you know what's 192 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:59,320 Speaker 1: now an extra two dollars per kid. Assuming you don't 193 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:01,559 Speaker 1: get any finding ChIL aid, you know you're going to 194 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 1: spend that doing something else. Right, Maybe you value having 195 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:10,280 Speaker 1: a home in an expensive city that is large enough 196 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: to host the grandparents. Maybe you value having an escape 197 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:18,560 Speaker 1: cabin in Maine or Minnesota or wherever it is that 198 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: you happen to live, and that's where the extra money 199 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 1: is going to come from, because you feel like the 200 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: value of those experiences and the memories that you're going 201 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 1: to make is actually like better than the difference between 202 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:37,920 Speaker 1: Stanford and Berkeley, or Cornell in Binghamton, or name your favorite, 203 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:41,000 Speaker 1: you know, state with the fancy school and the state school. 204 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 1: So the two of you have to be on the 205 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: same page. And if it's just one of you, it's 206 00:11:45,640 --> 00:11:48,840 Speaker 1: really helpful to find somebody, either a professional or somebody 207 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 1: you trust who knows a lot about money, to probe 208 00:11:52,040 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: you and push you to make sure you're being emotionally 209 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: honest with yourself about what it is that you want 210 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: and what is that need. What are we talking about 211 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 1: in terms of trade offs with between retirement and college, 212 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:11,800 Speaker 1: which is a big thing for a lot of people. Yeah, So, 213 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 1: I mean we could go really deep on this personal 214 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,520 Speaker 1: finance question. I mean, let's start about with what the 215 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:23,840 Speaker 1: wrong answer is. Um, there's this uh slogan almost in 216 00:12:23,880 --> 00:12:27,120 Speaker 1: the world of financial planning that a lot of professionals 217 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:32,280 Speaker 1: and and some journalists to default too. And they say, well, look, 218 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:38,040 Speaker 1: you can't borrow for retirement, but you can borrow for college. 219 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,920 Speaker 1: So save for retirement first, particularly when you're younger, because 220 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:45,559 Speaker 1: the money has that much more time to grow. And 221 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: most of that is true, but some of it isn't. 222 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,679 Speaker 1: You can borrow for retirement. Um, there are a variety 223 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: of ways to extract money from your home if you're 224 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 1: lucky enough to own one, and you may well have 225 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:02,079 Speaker 1: it mostly or completely paid off by the time you're retired. 226 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 1: And you know, so we you know, we don't want 227 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:09,239 Speaker 1: to get like really deep and into the technicalities there. Um, 228 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 1: But if somebody says that to you, they don't actually 229 00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:17,480 Speaker 1: know what they're talking about. So what is the right answer? Well, yeah, 230 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:22,680 Speaker 1: you know, much much depends on on your values, right. Um, 231 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 1: If you are sort of hell bent on making sure 232 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:30,000 Speaker 1: your kid has the same kind of education that you did, 233 00:13:30,120 --> 00:13:33,280 Speaker 1: and you happen to have gone to a private college, 234 00:13:33,679 --> 00:13:36,600 Speaker 1: you just need to be real with yourself about the 235 00:13:36,640 --> 00:13:39,720 Speaker 1: fact that if you know, if your kids or your age, Katie, 236 00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:42,880 Speaker 1: you know, you're looking at probably half a million bucks 237 00:13:42,920 --> 00:13:47,640 Speaker 1: each after taxes, if you know, the tuition keeps growing, pays, 238 00:13:47,679 --> 00:13:52,439 Speaker 1: So be kind to yourself. Right, Adam turned out okay, 239 00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 1: having gone to a state school, right change the course 240 00:13:56,800 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 1: of his life. I think about this all the time, 241 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:03,160 Speaker 1: and I think about Julie, you know, I feel so 242 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:07,600 Speaker 1: First of all, I'm such a hippie and and Adam 243 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:09,719 Speaker 1: and I disagree about this where you know, my dad 244 00:14:09,760 --> 00:14:12,360 Speaker 1: didn't go to college and he was very successful at 245 00:14:12,400 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: different times in his life. Um, you know, I joke 246 00:14:16,440 --> 00:14:18,200 Speaker 1: around where I'm like, I just want my kid to 247 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 1: be a feather wizard in the woods playing a piccolo 248 00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:26,000 Speaker 1: whatever that's you know, because I don't neither do I. 249 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:28,440 Speaker 1: But it just gives me such an image of like, 250 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:33,240 Speaker 1: fuck the system. It's screwed anyway, Like why are we 251 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 1: paying this? Is sucks? Like I get so angry, I'm like, 252 00:14:36,200 --> 00:14:37,600 Speaker 1: why are we going to pay for this? And then 253 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 1: it's not even like guaranteed that the person gets a job, 254 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 1: like this is horrible and blah blah blah. But college 255 00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:46,280 Speaker 1: was the best four years of my life. I mean 256 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: for so many reasons. I mean I had the most. 257 00:14:50,560 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: I loved my college experience. My best friends and community 258 00:14:55,840 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 1: of artists and moms are my college friends, like it 259 00:15:00,520 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 1: is my Thank God my dad paid for that. Thank God. 260 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 1: Now Adams, it's so incredible because Adam was supposed to 261 00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,360 Speaker 1: be a tar heel. His entire family went to u 262 00:15:11,480 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 1: n C. His mom, his dad. That's where they met 263 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:15,880 Speaker 1: his brother. His brother met his wife there. His grandma 264 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:18,440 Speaker 1: was the first graduating class. His other grandmother was a 265 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: was the house mother at um z BT at UNC 266 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,480 Speaker 1: for forty five years. The dean of u n C 267 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: calls Adam's dad, who is the dean of the of 268 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,239 Speaker 1: the School of Tourism Hospitality, a temple university in Philadelphia, 269 00:15:30,240 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 1: and says, your son is not going to get in. 270 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 1: I am so embarrassed and I am so sorry. Changed 271 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:38,400 Speaker 1: the course of Adam's life. He had been in tar 272 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:44,880 Speaker 1: heels onesies since he was born. And thank god, because 273 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:49,680 Speaker 1: your life is supposed to be whatever, Like just meaning 274 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:52,400 Speaker 1: to say, it was a miracle that he didn't get 275 00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 1: a U n C. All of his friends from sleepaway camp, 276 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 1: we're going to University of Maryland. He said, forget it, 277 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 1: I'll go to University of Maryland with my boys. He 278 00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 1: went and joined the sketch team. The sketch team said 279 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: you should be a drama major. He was like, I should. 280 00:16:05,920 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 1: He switched to being a drama major when he was 281 00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:09,800 Speaker 1: a senior University of Merland, which caused him to move 282 00:16:09,800 --> 00:16:11,360 Speaker 1: out to l A, which caused him to meet me. 283 00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:15,600 Speaker 1: I'm I'm convinced had he not been, had he gone 284 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 1: to U n C, I don't know if we'd ever met, 285 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,600 Speaker 1: you know, if our parents managed to do whatever the 286 00:16:20,640 --> 00:16:24,480 Speaker 1: equivalent is of today's three or fifty education for us 287 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:28,600 Speaker 1: back in the day. Um, things are really different right now. 288 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: Right The costs have gone up at a steeper trajectory 289 00:16:32,560 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 1: than healthcare has, right. I mean there's basically nothing out 290 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 1: there that's you know, increased in in cost, at least 291 00:16:39,680 --> 00:16:42,840 Speaker 1: at the list price, the rack rate, the way higher 292 00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:47,320 Speaker 1: education has. So stop beating yourself up if you're tempted 293 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:51,400 Speaker 1: to make a different choice, right. Um, you know, Jody 294 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 1: and I have done it through like three jobs each, 295 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:56,520 Speaker 1: you know. Um, And and that was that was a 296 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:58,640 Speaker 1: choice that we made, right. But you don't have to 297 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:02,560 Speaker 1: make that choice. Um, you can make a different choice. No, 298 00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 1: it does. It's really important to hear though that there 299 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:09,760 Speaker 1: are options, Like, there are options, you don't have to 300 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:13,840 Speaker 1: I remember my brother, Adam's brother who lives in Virginia, 301 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 1: who's really successful. But he was like, no, no, no, 302 00:17:16,840 --> 00:17:18,960 Speaker 1: We're already talking to Ela a lot about going to 303 00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,000 Speaker 1: the state school for two years, getting a lot of 304 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:24,800 Speaker 1: her prerequisites done, and like, this is the type of 305 00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:27,960 Speaker 1: kid Eila is, like she wanted that. But it was 306 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:30,119 Speaker 1: the first time I ever heard that that was like 307 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:34,800 Speaker 1: a plan financially what was best for the family. Was like, Oh, 308 00:17:34,920 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 1: you're gonna do one school and get this stuff done 309 00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: and then transfer into this one. Like I was like, wow, 310 00:17:40,080 --> 00:17:43,879 Speaker 1: Like he's really been thinking about it, really planning. Um. 311 00:17:44,359 --> 00:17:47,240 Speaker 1: But it just opened my eyes that there are options. Yeah. 312 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:49,280 Speaker 1: I mean, this was the thing I learned more than anything, 313 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:51,879 Speaker 1: um in writing The Price You Pay for College. I 314 00:17:52,280 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: was trying to test myself. Most of the places I 315 00:17:54,720 --> 00:17:57,760 Speaker 1: went to report where places I've never been before, right, 316 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,880 Speaker 1: because those were the places that, um that we're least 317 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:03,680 Speaker 1: familiar and I could I could benefit and readers benefit 318 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: um more. You know, the more reporting you do in 319 00:18:07,320 --> 00:18:09,760 Speaker 1: the best perspective, you have, right, or the more perspective 320 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:12,360 Speaker 1: you have. And the thing that it's cemented for me 321 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:16,919 Speaker 1: was that, like, there are dozens and dozens and dozens 322 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:22,520 Speaker 1: of places where our daughters could go and um, have 323 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 1: their brains properly rearranged in the classroom, find the friends 324 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 1: who will pick them up and carry them through life, 325 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,600 Speaker 1: and get a credential that's going to be meaningful in 326 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,560 Speaker 1: whatever marketplace they choose to swim around in. Right, the 327 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,439 Speaker 1: Ivy League doesn't have a monopoly on this. In fact, 328 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:42,880 Speaker 1: I don't know about you out there, Katie, but um, 329 00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:45,520 Speaker 1: here in New York, I hear a lot of stories 330 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:48,200 Speaker 1: from people who don't really want to hire kids from 331 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:51,160 Speaker 1: the Ivy League for a variety of reasons, whether it's 332 00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:55,400 Speaker 1: like educational or socio economic diversity, or it's just because 333 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:59,200 Speaker 1: they think those kids come out a little bit entitled. Right, 334 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:02,919 Speaker 1: So are you possibly doing yourself a disservice by by 335 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:05,360 Speaker 1: having one of those degrees? I would I would never 336 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 1: go that far, because you know, there are all sorts 337 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:10,560 Speaker 1: of reasons to go to schools, and all sorts of 338 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: things that different schools can do, right, you know, for 339 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:18,119 Speaker 1: different kids. But I'm just trying to get people, you know, 340 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 1: kind of off of this head trip where there's something 341 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 1: wrong if your kid doesn't go to one of like 342 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:29,040 Speaker 1: the twenty most rejective schools in the country. Again, I've 343 00:19:29,119 --> 00:19:31,959 Speaker 1: learned so much from this podcast about like, yeah, like 344 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:33,679 Speaker 1: talk to your kids about it, which I don't know 345 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 1: why my parents, Like, I mean, my parents didn't talk 346 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:38,760 Speaker 1: to us about ship like it was so great and 347 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:41,119 Speaker 1: I had such a lovely childhood. But when I really 348 00:19:41,119 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: look back, I'm like, God, yeah, we never talked about race, 349 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 1: We never talked about sex. We definitely talked about money. 350 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:47,320 Speaker 1: I mean, when I was twelve, I told my dad 351 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:48,760 Speaker 1: I was going to School of the Arts and the 352 00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:54,119 Speaker 1: poor guy paid for it. But I just assumed he would, 353 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:58,399 Speaker 1: Like how was that never a conversation? Now I know 354 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 1: that that really took a way for my parents savings, Like, 355 00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:05,320 Speaker 1: you know, thank god, I'm an actor who can pay 356 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:08,680 Speaker 1: my health insurance. But that wasn't a guarantee. I think 357 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,919 Speaker 1: one of the coolest things my dad did was he 358 00:20:11,960 --> 00:20:15,600 Speaker 1: paid for my school, and the day I graduated, he said, congratulations, 359 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:20,399 Speaker 1: you're at zero. That doesn't happen for anyone. But I'm done, 360 00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 1: and good luck all. I'm gonna give you is I'm 361 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 1: going to cover your health insurance till you're twenty six, 362 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:27,440 Speaker 1: and I'm going to pay for your cell phone bill 363 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:29,439 Speaker 1: because I'm demanding you call me every day to let 364 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,360 Speaker 1: me know you're alive. But the rest is on you. 365 00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:33,880 Speaker 1: And I'm so fucking grateful if he did that, because 366 00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 1: I can't tell you how many friends I had whose 367 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:39,760 Speaker 1: parents were still massively supporting them in their early thirties, 368 00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:41,720 Speaker 1: and I was like, oh my god, I'm either gonna 369 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:44,320 Speaker 1: have to move home, which seems like death at this point. 370 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:48,040 Speaker 1: I mean, it's not, but that's sort of my story. 371 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,679 Speaker 1: But at fourteen, you're having a conversation with your kid 372 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 1: about what is realistic for your child in what kind 373 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,280 Speaker 1: of school or planning they want to do. Is that 374 00:20:57,320 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 1: also what you advise? Totally, and it starts way earlier 375 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:03,480 Speaker 1: than fourteen. But I'm glad you brought that up, um, 376 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 1: and talked about your old undergraduate experience and what happened 377 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 1: in your household sometimes many times, UM, you know parents 378 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:16,920 Speaker 1: who had a kind of roller coaster pain for college 379 00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:20,919 Speaker 1: experience growing up, which I did to write. So, my 380 00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 1: parents marriage broke up when I was in middle school. 381 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 1: My dad lost his job, he didn't earn much income 382 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 1: to speak of for a couple of years, so you know, 383 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:31,360 Speaker 1: we were deep in financial aid mode and more than 384 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 1: almost anything else. Um, I didn't want my kids to 385 00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:39,440 Speaker 1: have to think about that for a second. And so 386 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: I've made it clear to our older one, um starting 387 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: you know, eight years old. Right when the when the 388 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 1: college savings accounts statement comes in the mail, I remind 389 00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:55,160 Speaker 1: her that, like we're on it right and right now, 390 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:57,919 Speaker 1: we're you know whatever, it is sixty eight percent of 391 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:01,360 Speaker 1: the way towards paining it and full and she knows, Wow, 392 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,119 Speaker 1: I have goose bumps, Ron, I have goose bumps. That 393 00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:07,560 Speaker 1: what an achievement and also so cool for her to 394 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:12,640 Speaker 1: know that you've really worked for this. So like, I 395 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: think she'll think about it when she goes to school 396 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,479 Speaker 1: and instead of like getting wasted, I mean whatever, Like 397 00:22:18,520 --> 00:22:21,479 Speaker 1: that's important learning skills too, But like I wanted her 398 00:22:21,520 --> 00:22:24,399 Speaker 1: to get wasted, of course, you know, but like you 399 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 1: want her to experience the social learnings of college a percent. 400 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:30,600 Speaker 1: I mean it's a big growing up moment. But also 401 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 1: she'll think about, like, my dad worked, has worked really 402 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 1: hard and really long to have paid for this for me, 403 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:37,400 Speaker 1: you know, part of what I want to make sure 404 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 1: that she understands. It's just like contextually, right, there's a 405 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 1: reason for this. It's because I had to think about 406 00:22:44,600 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 1: it a lot. I don't want her to have to 407 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: think about it a lot, but I want her thinking 408 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:52,760 Speaker 1: about other things instead, right, filling her brain space, maybe 409 00:22:52,800 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 1: with one or two nights a week of alcohol, but 410 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:58,359 Speaker 1: like four or five nights a week of like thinking 411 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:02,359 Speaker 1: hard about the world, right and and her place in it. 412 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:05,479 Speaker 1: But it but it doesn't start at fourteen, you know. 413 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,360 Speaker 1: It starts for many parents at the age of four 414 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:12,920 Speaker 1: or five or six, when kids start asking questions about money, right, 415 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,520 Speaker 1: And we can't just shut up or shut down at 416 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:17,679 Speaker 1: that point, you know, we need to be thinking about 417 00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:21,199 Speaker 1: age appropriate answers that also lead to all of the 418 00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:23,960 Speaker 1: values that we hold dear. So, if it's about a 419 00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 1: spending question, right, we're thinking in the back of our 420 00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:31,359 Speaker 1: heads about modesty and prudence and thrift and learning about 421 00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 1: the things that make you happiest and spending as much 422 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 1: as you like safely and affordably can on those, and 423 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:42,000 Speaker 1: then scrimping on all the stuff that doesn't matter to you. Right, Um, 424 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:44,640 Speaker 1: you know, if it's a saving question. Right, we're thinking 425 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:49,400 Speaker 1: about delayed gratification. I mean, the world conspires against patients 426 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:53,000 Speaker 1: and children. Now, anything you could want or need, you know, 427 00:23:53,119 --> 00:23:57,200 Speaker 1: comes with a push of a button on these goddamn phones. Right. 428 00:23:57,520 --> 00:24:00,439 Speaker 1: You don't have to sit through commercials any more. Are like, 429 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:03,359 Speaker 1: you don't have to go to Blockbuster? Right? No? And 430 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 1: my my son's having a full meltdown when the Amazon 431 00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 1: box isn't for him. He's like, I don't understand why 432 00:24:09,520 --> 00:24:12,920 Speaker 1: you got something and I didn't get something. I mean, 433 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 1: it's it's a fucking wild you know, Hanukkah is coming 434 00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 1: or whatever, and you're trying to hide these I mean, 435 00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 1: the kids run to the Amazon boxes, they know when 436 00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 1: they're getting delivered. It's in the sane next level. I 437 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:30,600 Speaker 1: don't know how to parent and teach, like what you're saying. 438 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: So are you supposed to say if your kid really 439 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:37,120 Speaker 1: wants to go to a school that you can't afford, 440 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:41,080 Speaker 1: or really wants a toy they can't you can't afford. 441 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,360 Speaker 1: Or do you say simply I'm so sorry we can't 442 00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:48,040 Speaker 1: afford that. Is that the language? No? I think there's 443 00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 1: there's two things right. First of all, you've got to 444 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:54,119 Speaker 1: get straight in your own head um and straight you know, 445 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,439 Speaker 1: with your spouse if you have one, and your X 446 00:24:56,480 --> 00:25:00,440 Speaker 1: if you have one of those, definitely right, Like there's 447 00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: there's the ability to pay, and then there's the willingness 448 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:06,399 Speaker 1: to do so. And if there's a gap or a 449 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 1: gulf between those things, you're going to have some explaining 450 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:13,880 Speaker 1: to do, especially to older kids, because you know they're 451 00:25:13,960 --> 00:25:16,920 Speaker 1: listening all the time, they're picking up stuff by osmosis, 452 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: and they can sense when something is affordable and you're 453 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 1: just not letting them have it. So we don't want 454 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,439 Speaker 1: to lie to them um about whether we can afford 455 00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 1: something or not. We want to speak in the language 456 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 1: of choices, of trade offs, like we're not going to 457 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 1: do this now because there's something else we want to 458 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:35,680 Speaker 1: do later, or we're not going to do this now 459 00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,120 Speaker 1: because it's not actually good for you to have everything 460 00:25:39,160 --> 00:25:42,000 Speaker 1: you want. Right, we're actually trying to train you to 461 00:25:42,119 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 1: be a twenty two year old grown up who's going 462 00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,760 Speaker 1: to be cut off, sent to zero except for insurance 463 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 1: till the age of and the cell phone plan so 464 00:25:51,040 --> 00:25:52,920 Speaker 1: you can call your parents every day. Did you think 465 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: that was a good plan? He did, yeah, it's not bad. 466 00:25:56,480 --> 00:25:59,399 Speaker 1: I like that it was really effective. Like I walked 467 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:03,359 Speaker 1: into eight thousand restaurants and applied that day, you know 468 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: what I mean? Like I was like, oh ship. Now. 469 00:26:05,680 --> 00:26:09,919 Speaker 1: Julie Liffcott Haymes came on the podcast and she said, 470 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 1: of all the kids, for for those listening to remind you, 471 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:14,959 Speaker 1: she um wrote the book How to Raise an Adult, 472 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:17,040 Speaker 1: and she was the dean at Stanford University for a 473 00:26:17,119 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 1: very long time, and she's wonderful. But she was saying, 474 00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:23,199 Speaker 1: of all the kids she's come across, the ones that 475 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 1: are actually successful in adults, And again, I want to 476 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,160 Speaker 1: talk to you about this because what is your definition 477 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:31,119 Speaker 1: of success And what she means is not necessarily financially. 478 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 1: I mean, they have a job that they like to do, 479 00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:38,359 Speaker 1: they have meaningful relationships in their lives, and they feel 480 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:43,639 Speaker 1: fulfilled in the life that they are leading. She was saying, 481 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:48,240 Speaker 1: of all the kids that are successful adults, the things 482 00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 1: they have in common are across the board. They either 483 00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: did chores growing up, or had a part time job 484 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:58,160 Speaker 1: or both. I couldn't agree more, not that I would 485 00:26:58,240 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 1: dare to contradicting j who is like a goddess as 486 00:27:01,840 --> 00:27:05,440 Speaker 1: far as I'm concerned and and a friend. But as 487 00:27:05,840 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 1: I knew it, I knew it. I was like, these 488 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:10,399 Speaker 1: two people are the smartest people I've ever had the 489 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:13,600 Speaker 1: pleasure to speak with. Okay, so well, thanks so Julie's 490 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 1: and A. So let me start here, right, um, with 491 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 1: what coach Steve Polos at the Francis W. Parker School taught, 492 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 1: In fact, forced our eighth grade basketball team to memorize. Um. 493 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,760 Speaker 1: It's a quote about success, um from John Wooden, the 494 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 1: legendary u c l A men's basketball coach. Success is 495 00:27:34,119 --> 00:27:37,159 Speaker 1: a peace of mind which is the direct result of 496 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:42,480 Speaker 1: self satisfaction in knowing that you did your best to 497 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:46,480 Speaker 1: become the best that you are capable of becoming. Right, So, 498 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 1: notice there's nothing in there about money. There's nothing in 499 00:27:50,040 --> 00:27:53,199 Speaker 1: there about Goldman Sachs or teach for America or y 500 00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: Combinator or being an assistant at William Morris and you know, 501 00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 1: having your brains beaten out or flying that private jet, 502 00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:05,119 Speaker 1: none of that, right, right, It's it's the feeling of 503 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,119 Speaker 1: self satisfaction and knowing that you did your best. You 504 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,080 Speaker 1: know what the thing that you and the person right 505 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 1: that you want to become. So you know for me, 506 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:18,240 Speaker 1: it starts there. But yeah, I mean, Julie is absolutely right, 507 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:21,639 Speaker 1: And I think it makes sense for kids to work 508 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,960 Speaker 1: outside the home, not just chores, um, so they can 509 00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:27,960 Speaker 1: report to somebody who's going to fire their ass. Right 510 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: if you're not performing right your your parents or parents 511 00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,360 Speaker 1: are not going to fire you. Right, they might punish 512 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:37,840 Speaker 1: you or whatever or ground to you, but like you know, 513 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 1: it's it's it's good to you know, to kind of 514 00:28:40,040 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 1: have that on the line there. Should kids get paid 515 00:28:44,440 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 1: an allowance for just doing the household crap to be 516 00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:51,760 Speaker 1: a part of this family and this household? Nope, Katie, 517 00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:54,640 Speaker 1: do you get paid for doing chores? And I'm glad 518 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 1: you've heard it here. I'm so tired of saying And 519 00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 1: I'm like, why are we giving our children treats for 520 00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 1: like taking a dump, making their bed, clearing the table, 521 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 1: like we're all doing it. I didn't get a treat 522 00:29:07,760 --> 00:29:09,960 Speaker 1: for doing that, Like, you have to be a part 523 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 1: of this family and we don't want to live like pigs. 524 00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 1: This is just what it takes for you to get 525 00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:18,320 Speaker 1: to be a part of this household, right, And you 526 00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,000 Speaker 1: did not compensate Adam for all that time he spent 527 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:24,960 Speaker 1: in the kitchen, occupying your older one while the little 528 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:30,840 Speaker 1: one was attached to you. Right, Adam didn't getting composite exactly? Okay, great, 529 00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:33,240 Speaker 1: So that is not what they get allowans for. What 530 00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 1: do they get allowance for? What are the things they 531 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 1: get allowance for? Practice? Right, Money is a tool for learning, 532 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,640 Speaker 1: the same way that the ingredients in the kitchen are 533 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,120 Speaker 1: for a kid who's grown up on the Food Network 534 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 1: and wants to cook for a hobby or soccer cleats 535 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,960 Speaker 1: or a musical instrument. Right, we expect them to respect 536 00:29:56,840 --> 00:30:00,239 Speaker 1: those things, and we expect them to practice because is 537 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:03,560 Speaker 1: you know, we want them to you know, get a 538 00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 1: sense of what it feels like to achieve mastery, right, 539 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:10,680 Speaker 1: or at least competence. Right. The chores are just something 540 00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,720 Speaker 1: they do because we want the household to be orderly, 541 00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 1: because we love one another, and everybody has to pitch in. 542 00:30:17,160 --> 00:30:19,600 Speaker 1: And here's the other problem. I mean, you can pay 543 00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: for chores, but the challenge there is is if you've 544 00:30:23,000 --> 00:30:26,520 Speaker 1: got a good saver on your hands, eventually, you know 545 00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:30,640 Speaker 1: they're gonna say to you, I've got enough money right now, 546 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:33,040 Speaker 1: you know, so I'm not going to do the chores 547 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 1: and then you're really screwed. Smartass twelve year old gets 548 00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 1: the smirk, and then and then what are you gonna do? 549 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: Then you're boxed into a corner, and you've got to 550 00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 1: change the rules again. That's what I always tell people 551 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,280 Speaker 1: about potty training. Lead they get into this big trouble. 552 00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:50,640 Speaker 1: It's if we give an eminem every time you pee 553 00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:53,440 Speaker 1: on the potty. I know people who are literally trying 554 00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,960 Speaker 1: to give trips to Disneyland in exchange for a poop 555 00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 1: on the potty. It's like, guys, you are this was 556 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 1: a bad spiral for you. This was not good. So okay, Ron, 557 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,479 Speaker 1: I need to know, how do you teach, you know, 558 00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:10,880 Speaker 1: gratitude when a kid doesn't like the present or a 559 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,360 Speaker 1: gift and they're just being spoiled breaths like, you know, 560 00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 1: come on, kids say the darnedest things. How do you 561 00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:20,640 Speaker 1: personally instill gratitude in your daughters? Yeah, I mean, look, 562 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,120 Speaker 1: I don't I don't claim success on this front. Um. 563 00:31:23,680 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: I think most kids are like this. Um. You know, 564 00:31:26,800 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: they express disappointment when they are disappointed. You know, we 565 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 1: spend the first couple of years like begging them to 566 00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:38,520 Speaker 1: articulate their feelings rather than just like bursting into tears, 567 00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:42,200 Speaker 1: just throwing the tantrum. And so you can't be surprised 568 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:45,240 Speaker 1: or upset when they blurt out that, like they don't 569 00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: like something or they're sad. Yeah, and you're like asking 570 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 1: them to lie, which I'm like, I'm never asking him 571 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 1: to do that. This is so confusing. Yeah, I don't 572 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:57,120 Speaker 1: know that we ever want to ask them to lie, 573 00:31:57,400 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 1: and I try not to ever lie to them. Right. 574 00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:07,000 Speaker 1: But it's so it's perfectly fine to express gratitude and 575 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:10,720 Speaker 1: appreciation for the thought and the care that went into 576 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:13,000 Speaker 1: thinking of you in the first place and then getting 577 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 1: something for you, you know, in the second one. Um, 578 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 1: but you know, it's it's I don't think it's reasonable 579 00:32:19,640 --> 00:32:23,840 Speaker 1: to expect success from yourself on that front, or from 580 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:26,959 Speaker 1: a kid until they're you know, five, six seven, Right. 581 00:32:27,000 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 1: All you can do is just sort of take them 582 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,000 Speaker 1: aside beforehand and say, hey, I've got really good news. 583 00:32:32,000 --> 00:32:35,360 Speaker 1: There may be presence here. Um, you may not like 584 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:40,720 Speaker 1: the presence. That's okay, Just be nice and safe, thank you, 585 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:43,480 Speaker 1: Like that's something that they can understand. I think, you know, 586 00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:46,920 Speaker 1: once you say it five or ten times. I caught 587 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,560 Speaker 1: myself yesterday going back to the life and I caught 588 00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:51,640 Speaker 1: his lives. Dar. We were at a kid's birthday party 589 00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:53,640 Speaker 1: and there was a goodie bag. He was like so excited, 590 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 1: and the mom was right there and clearly worked very 591 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: hard in the goodie bag and my son, you know, 592 00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: thrashed it open ended all the stuff and then just 593 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:02,840 Speaker 1: looked at it again. I don't like anything in here. 594 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,760 Speaker 1: And I was like, then, yesterday I brought it up 595 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:09,680 Speaker 1: and I said, well, you know, you have to say 596 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,400 Speaker 1: thank you, and I love it. And then I was like, 597 00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:14,800 Speaker 1: oh my god, this is the worst parenting moment ever. 598 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 1: Don't do that. Don't do what I just said. That's 599 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 1: not true. That's what I meant, like, I'm asking him 600 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:21,400 Speaker 1: to lie. That makes no sense and is completely confusing. 601 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,080 Speaker 1: What I do have to say is you just say 602 00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:28,080 Speaker 1: thank you so much. That's it. That's it. That's it. Um. 603 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:32,120 Speaker 1: Any piece of advice on not raising a spoiled brat. 604 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 1: So I think that the first thing to think about, 605 00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 1: right is that these kids are going to have a 606 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:46,360 Speaker 1: ton of questions. They're gonna come fast and furious, um, 607 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:50,280 Speaker 1: and you have to be ready to answer them all. Right, money, 608 00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,840 Speaker 1: whether you have more than average or less than average 609 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:56,320 Speaker 1: is not something to be ashamed about. And you know, 610 00:33:56,360 --> 00:33:59,200 Speaker 1: where you've ended up on the socio economic ladder is 611 00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:01,600 Speaker 1: also not some thing to be ashamed about. Even if 612 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: you feel like you could have and should have made 613 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 1: different choices in your life, this is not the time 614 00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 1: to sort of work that out when your kids ask questions. 615 00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:14,919 Speaker 1: It starts there, right, but then you know, it's sort 616 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:19,400 Speaker 1: of goes on throughout the ages of like four to 617 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:24,000 Speaker 1: twenty four, where you are not only giving them opportunities 618 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: ever increasing ones, you know, to spend and to save 619 00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:29,880 Speaker 1: and to give, but you're also talking to them about 620 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:33,240 Speaker 1: the choices that they've made, right, the choices that they've made, 621 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:36,600 Speaker 1: and whether they feel regret about that thing that the 622 00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:39,920 Speaker 1: seven year old bought three weeks ago that's now broken 623 00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:45,400 Speaker 1: or abandoned. Um. But also you know, looking for openings 624 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 1: in your you know, if not daily then like weekly 625 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:53,600 Speaker 1: life to narrate for them the choices you're making, um 626 00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:56,040 Speaker 1: or the choices you've made recently, and whether they were 627 00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: good ones right, because they're watching our every move, every 628 00:35:00,600 --> 00:35:04,600 Speaker 1: move right, can you give an example of that, gosh 629 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 1: um in our own lives? Yeah, you know, post pandemic 630 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:16,280 Speaker 1: I've said to my older daughter who shares my um 631 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:21,760 Speaker 1: ecallectic and you know, passionate taste for seeing live music 632 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: about which I'm so thrilled. You know, I said to 633 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 1: her point blank, right, you know that we save a 634 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 1: lot of money, right, You know that we work really hard, Um, 635 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:35,680 Speaker 1: But having been cooped up, you know, for two years 636 00:35:35,760 --> 00:35:38,759 Speaker 1: more or less, with a few exceptions, Um, this is 637 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:41,759 Speaker 1: the time to get out and experienced stuff, and for 638 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,600 Speaker 1: us to get out and experienced stuff before you fly 639 00:35:44,719 --> 00:35:48,359 Speaker 1: the coope. So I made a list of bucket list 640 00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:54,200 Speaker 1: concert venue states and we're going to all of them, right. 641 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:56,480 Speaker 1: So I took her to Radio City a couple of 642 00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 1: days ago to see Bob Weir, and they're going to 643 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,000 Speaker 1: Red Rocks in June, and we're going to the Greek 644 00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: and Berkeley in October, and then the Hollywood Bowl, you know, 645 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,280 Speaker 1: whenever we can get there. And all of the freaking 646 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 1: flyer miles we we built up, we're not even spending 647 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:12,800 Speaker 1: that much money, like all the stuff that we couldn't 648 00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 1: use for a couple of years. We're just going out 649 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,040 Speaker 1: and blowing it. You're the coolest dad in the world. 650 00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:21,040 Speaker 1: I'll take that compliment to any day. Okay, last question. 651 00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:27,000 Speaker 1: Parenthood is Parenthood is trying to imprint all of the 652 00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:31,520 Speaker 1: values that we hold dearest on their silly, little empty 653 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:35,440 Speaker 1: minds and then sending them off knowing they're gonna be 654 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:40,440 Speaker 1: good people. You know, whether they're extremely affluent or you know, 655 00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:44,160 Speaker 1: earn or have less than um we do. UM, we 656 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:48,120 Speaker 1: know that they're going to be okay because um, you know, 657 00:36:48,160 --> 00:36:51,200 Speaker 1: they're good people who understand how to be patient and 658 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:55,400 Speaker 1: generous and prudent, have a sense of perspective about their 659 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,840 Speaker 1: place in the world. Um, and also curiosity about how 660 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,319 Speaker 1: they got there and how they can get to the 661 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:04,879 Speaker 1: place that they want to be. Ron Lieber, you are 662 00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:08,719 Speaker 1: a treasure, a gem, and a gift to us all. Everyone, 663 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:13,239 Speaker 1: please run and buy these books. I can't even tell 664 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:16,800 Speaker 1: you how you've like literally changed how we're going to 665 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:21,200 Speaker 1: be doing this. Um. And I thank you in advance 666 00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:24,400 Speaker 1: for helping not grow up my child further when it 667 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:40,200 Speaker 1: comes to money. Hello everybody, and welcome back to Katie's Crib. 668 00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:46,080 Speaker 1: I am so excited about today's guests. We have a 669 00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:51,920 Speaker 1: very very very dear mutual friend. They are big podcasters themselves, 670 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,399 Speaker 1: So if you don't know now you know I am 671 00:37:54,440 --> 00:37:58,359 Speaker 1: talking about this incredible duo that goes by the name 672 00:37:58,400 --> 00:38:02,080 Speaker 1: of the Fiscal fire Crackers. I mean, come on, I 673 00:38:02,160 --> 00:38:05,520 Speaker 1: have to have him on the podcast. We've got Susan Yaguely. 674 00:38:05,719 --> 00:38:09,160 Speaker 1: She is an actress. Her television credits include recurring roles 675 00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:11,760 Speaker 1: on CBS Rules of Engagement, Foxes Till Death. In addition, 676 00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,440 Speaker 1: she's guest started Our Friends Reno nine one one. I mean, 677 00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:17,320 Speaker 1: come on, you name it. In addition to her acting career, 678 00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:22,200 Speaker 1: she has a voracious appetite to learn about earning, saving 679 00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:25,080 Speaker 1: and growing money. She's married to stand up comedian and 680 00:38:25,239 --> 00:38:28,040 Speaker 1: snl A lum Kevin neil In. They created a magical 681 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,799 Speaker 1: son who we're going to talk about, named gable Ness 682 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,160 Speaker 1: neil In. Dang, what a great name. Okay. The other 683 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:38,720 Speaker 1: half of the Incredible Fiscal Firecrackers is Galia ge Sean. 684 00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:43,000 Speaker 1: She's an independent personal financial expert with more than twenty 685 00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:47,880 Speaker 1: years in financial services, including nearly ten years on Wall Street. 686 00:38:48,320 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 1: She's the founder of Down to Earth Finance, a company 687 00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 1: that focuses on independent personal finance education. She's been teaching 688 00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:56,600 Speaker 1: at Barnard Colleges Athena Center for Leadership Freelancers Union for 689 00:38:56,680 --> 00:39:00,720 Speaker 1: ten plus years and Yale School of Management or Friend Yale. 690 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:05,000 Speaker 1: She's been wildly quoted in New York Times, NBC, CNN, 691 00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,320 Speaker 1: and more. Galli is also the author of My Money Matters, 692 00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:10,440 Speaker 1: which was featured on The Today Show, and the author 693 00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:13,960 Speaker 1: of the published fiction The Accidental Suffragist. She lives with 694 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:17,400 Speaker 1: her two teen daughters. I want to hear all about them. 695 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:24,759 Speaker 1: Welcome your Fiscal Firecrackers to Katie's Crib. I get to 696 00:39:24,800 --> 00:39:27,960 Speaker 1: have this Katie's Crib podcast as an excuse to try 697 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,439 Speaker 1: to learn and be a great mom, which is good 698 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:32,120 Speaker 1: and bad because I learned stuff, but also then I 699 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:35,359 Speaker 1: know how bad I'm messing up. You guys are way 700 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:38,200 Speaker 1: ahead of me. Your kids are like adults. Your kids 701 00:39:38,200 --> 00:39:41,360 Speaker 1: are like grown ups. You like the turkey is based 702 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:44,640 Speaker 1: in The turkey is cooked. Yes, it just needs a 703 00:39:44,640 --> 00:39:48,520 Speaker 1: little bit of basting. But it's cooked. I need so 704 00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:55,080 Speaker 1: much basting still, it's exhausted. God. Um, okay for you 705 00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:59,919 Speaker 1: all listening um Fiscal Firecrackers is so amazing because sue 706 00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:06,160 Speaker 1: In you're a self taught money interested enthusiast, and Galia 707 00:40:06,239 --> 00:40:09,279 Speaker 1: you are an expert, and so our way in is 708 00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:12,200 Speaker 1: through Susan and then Gali has got all the answers. 709 00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:16,480 Speaker 1: But um, I think, especially with young girls and women, 710 00:40:16,640 --> 00:40:24,600 Speaker 1: we really sadly don't know a lot and it's um 711 00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:29,000 Speaker 1: it has to change. And I think that Fiscal Firecrackers 712 00:40:29,080 --> 00:40:33,120 Speaker 1: is a real place where people can learn through Lehman's 713 00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:37,640 Speaker 1: Lehman's terms in that word, Lehman was the bank. You 714 00:40:37,880 --> 00:40:46,240 Speaker 1: see the expert. The expert comes, just come and okay. So, Katie, 715 00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:48,680 Speaker 1: you bring up such a good point is that women, 716 00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,160 Speaker 1: especially girls, just aren't getting started. They're not sure what 717 00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:53,040 Speaker 1: to do. They don't even know where to begin. So 718 00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:55,920 Speaker 1: we just right away say let's remove those obstacles. And 719 00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:58,839 Speaker 1: so we are throwing tips at them, and then they're 720 00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 1: also on the website we're saying stop and write it down. 721 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:06,560 Speaker 1: It's not just ideas, it's it's actually through doing. And 722 00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:09,520 Speaker 1: we're not taught this crap in school. Yeah no, or 723 00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:11,759 Speaker 1: my girls having in school. It was like a one 724 00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:14,080 Speaker 1: hour workshop at the end of the year. Here's a 725 00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:16,719 Speaker 1: tip that Gallia taught me that is so helpful is 726 00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:20,920 Speaker 1: in twenty minutes, pull out your credit card statement and 727 00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:23,840 Speaker 1: look at all the recurring charges. You will see stuff. 728 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,640 Speaker 1: I have apps on my phone that we're from when 729 00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:29,240 Speaker 1: my kid was a baby and I was stacking letters, 730 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:31,680 Speaker 1: I was doing all this animated stuff, and he's fifteen 731 00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:36,399 Speaker 1: years old and I was being charged. Go through that 732 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:40,320 Speaker 1: really swiftly and you'll immediately have a savings. Just delete 733 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:42,560 Speaker 1: those apps that you're not paying for anymore. That's a 734 00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:46,280 Speaker 1: real quick tip that you can take in your pocket 735 00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:48,680 Speaker 1: and walk out with today. That's what the shows about. 736 00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,160 Speaker 1: But I've been teaching personal finance for a long time. 737 00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:53,799 Speaker 1: It is sometimes hard to get people to talk about 738 00:41:53,800 --> 00:41:57,360 Speaker 1: their money. So that's where this collaboration between Susan and 739 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:01,480 Speaker 1: myself is so key and so different, because she just 740 00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:03,879 Speaker 1: makes people want to listen to it. And first of all, 741 00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:06,320 Speaker 1: I've I laugh at it. I'm having a good time. 742 00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:10,160 Speaker 1: I'm more relaxed. I'm literally I've We've had sessions where 743 00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:12,680 Speaker 1: I'm cracking up my cheeks hurt, I can't. I'm like, okay, 744 00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:19,839 Speaker 1: stops up, catch my breath, like she s right. So 745 00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,640 Speaker 1: those it is our way to laugh about it and 746 00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,719 Speaker 1: make it enjoyable and fun instead of just like and 747 00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:28,920 Speaker 1: I feel like you are the Charlie Brown teacher or whatever, 748 00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:31,520 Speaker 1: where I can hear it right right, and they're not. 749 00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:34,120 Speaker 1: She's not just making them laugh. She's sharing her stories. 750 00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,880 Speaker 1: By the way, they're her really firsthand stories, which are 751 00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:39,359 Speaker 1: amazing because I've done I mean, Katie, as a kid, 752 00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:43,040 Speaker 1: I blew through money when I was sixteen, seventeen, eighteen 753 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:45,080 Speaker 1: and the eighties. I would go out and buy pop 754 00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:49,200 Speaker 1: rocks and parachute pants and just the dumbest stuff. Would 755 00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:51,719 Speaker 1: anytime I made money, I would just go and a 756 00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:55,520 Speaker 1: pac Man concert tickets to see at a Man concert 757 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:57,919 Speaker 1: t shirts. When if I had known Galia, I would 758 00:42:57,920 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: have put that in a roth. I would have put 759 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:02,680 Speaker 1: that in a four one k Oh, my god, no one, 760 00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,000 Speaker 1: no kid is doing this. By the way, Katie, do 761 00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:08,000 Speaker 1: you hear Susan seeing the lingo Like she's not just 762 00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:09,840 Speaker 1: saying the words, like she knows what that means. She 763 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:12,640 Speaker 1: knows the row, she knows the four win k. Yeah, 764 00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:15,160 Speaker 1: I've learned all this because I listened to Galia, this 765 00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:20,160 Speaker 1: girl I know nothing thing and the fiscal firecrackers. I 766 00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:22,600 Speaker 1: mean again, how am I expected? Like It's like I 767 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:24,960 Speaker 1: want my kid to know this stuff, But how is 768 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,080 Speaker 1: my kid going to know this stuff if I don't 769 00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,840 Speaker 1: know this stuff? So thank you for your podcast and 770 00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:34,719 Speaker 1: for doing this service. For the rest of us, Um, 771 00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:38,680 Speaker 1: what is the best way in your both of your opinions, 772 00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:40,839 Speaker 1: and Susan, you can go first, what is the best 773 00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:44,480 Speaker 1: way to set a kid up for success from birth 774 00:43:44,600 --> 00:43:48,919 Speaker 1: with the savings account? Well, that's a great question. So I, 775 00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:52,120 Speaker 1: um did not know the laws governing this. So as 776 00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,399 Speaker 1: soon as I paid on that pregnancy stick and got 777 00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,240 Speaker 1: two stripes, I said, I got to open a scholar 778 00:43:57,239 --> 00:43:59,399 Speaker 1: Share five twenty nine. And I took the stick down 779 00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:01,880 Speaker 1: and they said, oh no, no, you actually have to 780 00:44:01,880 --> 00:44:04,960 Speaker 1: have a person with the social Security number to open 781 00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,000 Speaker 1: up a five nine college account. You can't show up 782 00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:11,000 Speaker 1: with a peat on stick at the bank. So that's 783 00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:15,239 Speaker 1: a good tip. But as soon as you have said baby, 784 00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:17,680 Speaker 1: and you're holding your baby and it has a social 785 00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:20,759 Speaker 1: Security number, that's go time, babies, you can do it. 786 00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:24,640 Speaker 1: That's when you can start saving nine. And again, the 787 00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,360 Speaker 1: earlier the better. The numbers are bananas. If you start 788 00:44:28,800 --> 00:44:31,520 Speaker 1: young and early, that compound interest. It just multiplies and 789 00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:34,560 Speaker 1: multiplies and multiplies. Someone's telling me a statistic if you 790 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:37,560 Speaker 1: put six thousand dollars in an account for an eight 791 00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:39,960 Speaker 1: year old, So just imagine putting that in account for 792 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:42,480 Speaker 1: an eight year old six thousand dollars. You never mentioned 793 00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 1: it to the eight year old. You never contribute one 794 00:44:45,040 --> 00:44:48,000 Speaker 1: more penny the rest of their life. When they open 795 00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:50,480 Speaker 1: that account at the age of sixty eight, which is 796 00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:53,360 Speaker 1: my husband's age. If you open that account, there'll be 797 00:44:53,360 --> 00:45:00,520 Speaker 1: a million dollars in there. What that's pound interest shock. 798 00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:03,200 Speaker 1: And by the way, Katie that this is probably one 799 00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:06,040 Speaker 1: of the most important concepts is no matter where you are, 800 00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:10,640 Speaker 1: start immediately because the power of just money growing over 801 00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:15,600 Speaker 1: time is insane. Wait and Ghalia tell us what is 802 00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:21,400 Speaker 1: so A five twenty nine is a college savings account 803 00:45:21,440 --> 00:45:25,480 Speaker 1: that has amazing, amazing tax benefits. So if you invest 804 00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:27,680 Speaker 1: in the five twenty nine in your state and so 805 00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,640 Speaker 1: the best place to find it is college savings dot org, 806 00:45:31,920 --> 00:45:35,319 Speaker 1: college savings dot Com. So the idea is that you 807 00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:37,640 Speaker 1: put the money away, you save a little bit on 808 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,200 Speaker 1: taxes now, but then the money comes out tax free 809 00:45:42,000 --> 00:45:45,440 Speaker 1: and you can use it for any college that's accredited 810 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:48,480 Speaker 1: in the United States. So even though I'm in Connecticut 811 00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:50,799 Speaker 1: and I'm in Connecticut's plan, my daughter is going to 812 00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:54,000 Speaker 1: school in Massachusetts, it doesn't matter. It's coming out tax free. 813 00:45:55,239 --> 00:45:57,799 Speaker 1: So it's growing tax free and it's coming out tax free, 814 00:45:57,800 --> 00:46:01,000 Speaker 1: which is our huge benefits. So here's a tip. Stop 815 00:46:01,040 --> 00:46:03,760 Speaker 1: and write this down that if you have a child 816 00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:08,320 Speaker 1: and you want to say for the tell your family 817 00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,399 Speaker 1: your parents say, don't buy them another toy. They don't 818 00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:16,000 Speaker 1: need contribute to their five te Take that and let's 819 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:19,200 Speaker 1: put that towards I do that for my sister. I 820 00:46:19,280 --> 00:46:22,919 Speaker 1: have goose bumps, like what a gift. And honestly, I've 821 00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:27,400 Speaker 1: taken so for granted. Like between us, you know and 822 00:46:27,480 --> 00:46:32,600 Speaker 1: everybody listening, see this is where I get in trouble. Um. No, 823 00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:38,520 Speaker 1: between us, my in laws are incredible savers and as 824 00:46:38,800 --> 00:46:42,120 Speaker 1: their gift to both of my children when they were 825 00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:46,000 Speaker 1: born is that they opened up their college account, their 826 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:50,239 Speaker 1: five nine and they add money to it yearly. My 827 00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:55,080 Speaker 1: parents had the motto every day is a holiday, so 828 00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:59,360 Speaker 1: they were like sixteen year old Susan um where it 829 00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,520 Speaker 1: was like, can't take it with you, So like, if 830 00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:07,400 Speaker 1: we've got it, spend it um. And it's sort of 831 00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:12,200 Speaker 1: cool that I married someone who was raised differently than me, 832 00:47:12,760 --> 00:47:15,239 Speaker 1: and I love having you on because I need we 833 00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:20,560 Speaker 1: need to figure out what our values are with money 834 00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:25,480 Speaker 1: and how we're raising our children. Susan how okay. So 835 00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:29,720 Speaker 1: five big tip, how do you when did you start 836 00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:34,640 Speaker 1: talking to Gable about money at what age? That's a 837 00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:37,560 Speaker 1: great question. I think I started talking to him about 838 00:47:37,600 --> 00:47:42,600 Speaker 1: money when he could talk, uh, when he was a baby. 839 00:47:42,760 --> 00:47:45,200 Speaker 1: So one thing we always did, my husband and I 840 00:47:45,239 --> 00:47:49,560 Speaker 1: were on board with this is too always do slow 841 00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:53,680 Speaker 1: shipping on Amazon, not Prime, and that way would build desire. 842 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:55,560 Speaker 1: So if he wanted a fire truck or a Lego 843 00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:58,200 Speaker 1: or Batman figure, he would have to wait and not 844 00:47:58,239 --> 00:48:00,600 Speaker 1: get it at three o'clock today. So that was one 845 00:48:00,600 --> 00:48:03,720 Speaker 1: thing that we did, is to teach him uh, anticipation 846 00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:08,120 Speaker 1: to build desire. That stuff matters, and you just don't 847 00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:10,960 Speaker 1: get things every day at three o'clock that you have 848 00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:15,560 Speaker 1: to wait for it. My jaw is on the ground. 849 00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:21,759 Speaker 1: Everybody listening. I have never heard of the idea of 850 00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:26,560 Speaker 1: not selecting Prime and having the packages take a while. 851 00:48:27,320 --> 00:48:31,840 Speaker 1: That is the one of the greatest tips I have 852 00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:38,839 Speaker 1: ever received podcast episode in my life. I has never 853 00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:41,080 Speaker 1: occurred to me that that was an option. It has 854 00:48:41,120 --> 00:48:43,280 Speaker 1: never occurred to me what that would teach my children, 855 00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:46,200 Speaker 1: because I have We did one other money episode with 856 00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:48,839 Speaker 1: this lovely man by the name of Ron Lieber, who 857 00:48:48,920 --> 00:48:53,560 Speaker 1: my husband. Yeah, you know Ron. Of course, I've read 858 00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:55,680 Speaker 1: his book. Yeah, I've been in the New York Times 859 00:48:55,719 --> 00:49:01,719 Speaker 1: for years, so Ron, he's amazing. He's been on Katie's crib. Oddly, 860 00:49:01,840 --> 00:49:05,120 Speaker 1: my husband plays him in a movie coming out called 861 00:49:05,239 --> 00:49:09,320 Speaker 1: She Said, which was why I know him. Um. Yes, 862 00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,160 Speaker 1: But we talked a lot about in the age of Amazon, 863 00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,840 Speaker 1: how are you supposed to not have a spoiled brat 864 00:49:17,239 --> 00:49:19,600 Speaker 1: and ding ding ding ding ding ding ding. No one 865 00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:24,240 Speaker 1: ever said, don't hit prime, pick the one that takes 866 00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:28,520 Speaker 1: three weeks. So, Galia, when did you first start talking 867 00:49:28,560 --> 00:49:31,440 Speaker 1: to your daughters about money? Can you remember the womb? 868 00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:37,120 Speaker 1: Now I'm kidding. Um, So, two things I was thinking 869 00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:39,239 Speaker 1: about is I remember and I lived in the city 870 00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:41,080 Speaker 1: with them until they were seven or eight, and you 871 00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:42,480 Speaker 1: were just, you know, do anything to get out of 872 00:49:42,520 --> 00:49:44,720 Speaker 1: the apartment. And I remember we were walking to Dwayne 873 00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:46,600 Speaker 1: Reid and they were three or four years old, and 874 00:49:47,080 --> 00:49:48,919 Speaker 1: I think I said, oh, you can get one thing, 875 00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:52,960 Speaker 1: and they wanted three things, and you know, of course, 876 00:49:53,000 --> 00:49:54,640 Speaker 1: I'm like, well there's a lesson here. I'm like, no, 877 00:49:54,760 --> 00:49:56,479 Speaker 1: you can get one. And I think I even said 878 00:49:56,480 --> 00:50:01,279 Speaker 1: and I'm limiting it to five dollars and there were tears, 879 00:50:01,520 --> 00:50:04,719 Speaker 1: there was you know, a little temper tantrum. But it 880 00:50:04,800 --> 00:50:06,680 Speaker 1: was a lesson. It was an absolute lesson. And I 881 00:50:06,719 --> 00:50:08,640 Speaker 1: wasn't saying no. I was like saying, no, you have 882 00:50:08,760 --> 00:50:12,200 Speaker 1: to choose, you have to prioritize. They chose to back, 883 00:50:12,239 --> 00:50:17,799 Speaker 1: so yes, back to back, and yes. I could have said. 884 00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:19,400 Speaker 1: You know, I could have been mortified because you know, 885 00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:21,040 Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, everyone's looking at me, 886 00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:24,200 Speaker 1: my you know, daughter's having a temper tantrum. I'm gonna fine, 887 00:50:24,200 --> 00:50:27,000 Speaker 1: I'll just spend the fifteen dollars. But no, I was like, no, 888 00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,520 Speaker 1: one like I stayed calm and and it's like, what 889 00:50:30,640 --> 00:50:33,520 Speaker 1: a lesson. It was such an amazing lesson. Both of 890 00:50:33,560 --> 00:50:36,920 Speaker 1: you have really just rocked me, and I'm sure the 891 00:50:37,000 --> 00:50:39,400 Speaker 1: Katie's Crib listeners are going to be rocked as well. 892 00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:43,160 Speaker 1: I think that there's mom guilt and working things like 893 00:50:43,200 --> 00:50:46,200 Speaker 1: that where it's like, you know, oh, did you get 894 00:50:46,200 --> 00:50:47,799 Speaker 1: me something? Did you get me a treat? Every time 895 00:50:47,840 --> 00:50:49,759 Speaker 1: I come home from working a job that's away, what 896 00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:52,640 Speaker 1: did you get me? It has never occurred to me 897 00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:55,680 Speaker 1: to say, well, it always occurs to me pick one thing. 898 00:50:55,800 --> 00:50:59,120 Speaker 1: Of course, I do do that, and I do say 899 00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,400 Speaker 1: when he starts to lip is Lid, I say, I 900 00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:03,920 Speaker 1: said one thing, and I'm only going to say at 901 00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:07,600 Speaker 1: one time. I don't want to have to repeat myself. Um, 902 00:51:07,640 --> 00:51:11,719 Speaker 1: but I've never said a price limit. I've never said 903 00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:13,880 Speaker 1: a price limit. And he knows what the number five 904 00:51:13,920 --> 00:51:17,040 Speaker 1: looks like, you know what I mean? Like, like, why 905 00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:19,640 Speaker 1: do I just assume that because he's four and a 906 00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:23,760 Speaker 1: half that he's not capable. He's completely capable of running 907 00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:27,359 Speaker 1: around the drug store downstairs in Budapest and saying, look, 908 00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:29,560 Speaker 1: do you see what numbers above that? On the thing? 909 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:31,680 Speaker 1: It says that it's ten dollars. We can't have that one. 910 00:51:31,840 --> 00:51:34,560 Speaker 1: The limit today is five dollars. I like to throw 911 00:51:34,600 --> 00:51:38,480 Speaker 1: in the word you get to so gable. You get 912 00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:41,560 Speaker 1: to have one toy to day at Walgreens, you get 913 00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,400 Speaker 1: to pick out one. So that's like, wow, fancy, I 914 00:51:45,480 --> 00:51:49,120 Speaker 1: get to it's an honor, and that kind of phraseology 915 00:51:49,200 --> 00:51:51,080 Speaker 1: I think teas him up to feel like it's a 916 00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:55,040 Speaker 1: treat changes it rather than you can only write you 917 00:51:55,200 --> 00:51:57,799 Speaker 1: get to I haven't even gone to my second tip, 918 00:51:57,840 --> 00:51:59,560 Speaker 1: but then I did have another tip that I remembered 919 00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,759 Speaker 1: early at at an early age, three or four years old, 920 00:52:02,840 --> 00:52:06,160 Speaker 1: I showed them the bill, I showed them the receipts. 921 00:52:06,680 --> 00:52:08,840 Speaker 1: We'd go to the diner. I'd say, here's what it costs. 922 00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:12,160 Speaker 1: I'm putting tip on it. Do they get it? I 923 00:52:12,239 --> 00:52:15,000 Speaker 1: don't know. Eventually they get it, But why not tell them? 924 00:52:15,040 --> 00:52:17,279 Speaker 1: What are we trying to hide? If we're trying to 925 00:52:17,360 --> 00:52:20,560 Speaker 1: hide what things cost, that's another story. So even Katie, 926 00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:21,839 Speaker 1: with you saying that you want to spend a lot 927 00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:24,680 Speaker 1: of vacations, I'm not judging that. I'm like, great, so 928 00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:26,600 Speaker 1: say I'm spending a lot of vacations, but next week 929 00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:29,600 Speaker 1: we Trader Joe's like, show them that you're making your 930 00:52:29,760 --> 00:52:31,319 Speaker 1: this is what's important to you, and this is where 931 00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:33,799 Speaker 1: you're spending your money on. But from an early age, 932 00:52:33,840 --> 00:52:35,680 Speaker 1: it was like here's the you know, here's the credit card. 933 00:52:35,719 --> 00:52:37,760 Speaker 1: Now it's like Apple wallet. You just show them the phone. 934 00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:40,280 Speaker 1: But still, why not? What are we trying to hide 935 00:52:40,280 --> 00:52:44,080 Speaker 1: it from them? One thing I love doing is uh, 936 00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:46,759 Speaker 1: I guess since Cable was eight or nine, is that 937 00:52:47,320 --> 00:52:49,399 Speaker 1: we would have dinner and I'd give him the our 938 00:52:49,440 --> 00:52:51,799 Speaker 1: credit card and make him pay for it and make 939 00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:54,000 Speaker 1: him sign it and do the math for the tip 940 00:52:54,280 --> 00:52:58,400 Speaker 1: and I'd supervise, but he was in full control to 941 00:52:58,840 --> 00:53:01,080 Speaker 1: do the math to figure it out. I would guide 942 00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:04,560 Speaker 1: him and side coach, but he I really wanted to 943 00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:07,319 Speaker 1: raise an individual who knows how to pay the bill 944 00:53:07,360 --> 00:53:10,759 Speaker 1: and knows how to include gratuity. Um. So now I 945 00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:12,960 Speaker 1: can sit in the car and he runs in at 946 00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:15,440 Speaker 1: fifteen and pays the bill and knows how much to 947 00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,160 Speaker 1: tip and then comes back with the receipt. Like I said, 948 00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:21,400 Speaker 1: I have, I've given birth to my nanny, to my assistant. 949 00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,520 Speaker 1: This is incredible. And speaking from someone who was a 950 00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:29,440 Speaker 1: waitress for like a decade, I thank you. I thank 951 00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:33,520 Speaker 1: you for instilling the importance of gratuity and tipping. And 952 00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:37,680 Speaker 1: I'm sure you're a good tipper in your son, Um, Gallia, 953 00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:40,040 Speaker 1: what was your second tip? I know you this is 954 00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,359 Speaker 1: really your third, which like I'll take his mony, that's 955 00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:45,719 Speaker 1: my third. So the second and this isn't maybe the 956 00:53:45,719 --> 00:53:48,640 Speaker 1: best financial move, but I really and I think my 957 00:53:48,719 --> 00:53:50,680 Speaker 1: daughter was six or seven. I took her to the bank, 958 00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:52,920 Speaker 1: our little local it was Chase I think at the time, 959 00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,439 Speaker 1: and we opened a savings account. I say, the reason 960 00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:57,480 Speaker 1: it wasn't a good financial move is because they're savings 961 00:53:57,560 --> 00:54:01,160 Speaker 1: rate is abysmally low, Like you can get a much 962 00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,520 Speaker 1: better savings rate and an online savings bank, and that's 963 00:54:04,560 --> 00:54:06,719 Speaker 1: f D, I C insured and such. But but my 964 00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:08,880 Speaker 1: point is I wanted to write away. And really she 965 00:54:08,960 --> 00:54:10,960 Speaker 1: was six or seven years old, teacher the power of saving, 966 00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:12,960 Speaker 1: and I said, we're gonna open a savings account. I'll 967 00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:15,799 Speaker 1: fund it for you. I'll open it fifty dollars. When 968 00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:19,040 Speaker 1: you get tooth fairy money or lemonade money, you know, 969 00:54:19,120 --> 00:54:22,000 Speaker 1: you'd give me a little portion. And and she was 970 00:54:22,120 --> 00:54:25,360 Speaker 1: so excited, so excited to go to the bank. And 971 00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:27,000 Speaker 1: I remembered when I was a kid, you'd get the 972 00:54:27,000 --> 00:54:29,200 Speaker 1: pass book, and so that was a little bit what 973 00:54:29,239 --> 00:54:31,719 Speaker 1: I wanted to instill. But it was such a powerful 974 00:54:32,560 --> 00:54:37,719 Speaker 1: event exercise memory. And then back up part two. You know, 975 00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:39,640 Speaker 1: after a year, we get the statement. She's like, Mommy, 976 00:54:39,640 --> 00:54:41,560 Speaker 1: why is it the money growing? And I'm like, because 977 00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:43,640 Speaker 1: the savings rate is so low. So then we opened 978 00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:47,200 Speaker 1: a mutual fund and that was online. But it was like, 979 00:54:47,360 --> 00:54:49,640 Speaker 1: just look at that lesson, go to the bank, open 980 00:54:49,680 --> 00:54:52,520 Speaker 1: a savings account, look at the statement. Why isn't it growing? 981 00:54:52,520 --> 00:54:54,520 Speaker 1: And I'm like, you're right, because the savings rate is 982 00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:57,600 Speaker 1: like point zero zero zero zero to five. She was six. 983 00:54:57,800 --> 00:55:00,879 Speaker 1: But there was something about going there, something about that's 984 00:55:00,960 --> 00:55:04,799 Speaker 1: very adult and it's very experiential. Well, and and by 985 00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:07,440 Speaker 1: the way, I also offered to match her. I offered 986 00:55:07,480 --> 00:55:09,400 Speaker 1: to match her. I said, if you do twenty five dollars, 987 00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:12,400 Speaker 1: I'll match you twenty five. So it's an incentive. And 988 00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:14,120 Speaker 1: and by the way, I don't I don't want to, 989 00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:16,640 Speaker 1: you know, ding Chase. It was really most of the 990 00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:19,759 Speaker 1: sort of brick and mortar banks have low savings rate, 991 00:55:19,840 --> 00:55:22,479 Speaker 1: but I just wanted that power, right. You know, Chase 992 00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:24,319 Speaker 1: is great. I don't want to say anything about Chase. 993 00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:28,080 Speaker 1: You know, no, no, no, we love you. Chase great. 994 00:55:28,840 --> 00:55:31,560 Speaker 1: You're looking for a savings account that could protect to 995 00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:34,919 Speaker 1: do better, you might do some research on Yes, yes, 996 00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,279 Speaker 1: it's Marcus. Marcus's great. And also, let's lets into your 997 00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:42,520 Speaker 1: fiscal Firecrackers episodes to teach us where we should be 998 00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:54,680 Speaker 1: opening savings account. Why do you think we don't talk 999 00:55:54,719 --> 00:55:58,280 Speaker 1: to our children about money. I think it's so heated. 1000 00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:02,520 Speaker 1: We all have money stories from our childhood. It's raw. 1001 00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:07,120 Speaker 1: It makes people feel vulnerable. People get really weird and 1002 00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:12,720 Speaker 1: private around money. And sadly, I think our kids suffer 1003 00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:15,799 Speaker 1: when we don't bring this up. I think our relationships 1004 00:56:15,840 --> 00:56:18,760 Speaker 1: suffer when we don't. I just think it's so important 1005 00:56:18,760 --> 00:56:20,640 Speaker 1: to turn the lights on in the room and let 1006 00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:23,520 Speaker 1: everybody know what's going on, you know, to build upon. 1007 00:56:23,960 --> 00:56:26,520 Speaker 1: Like I joke, when I first started my business, instead 1008 00:56:26,520 --> 00:56:28,279 Speaker 1: of an NBA and finance, I should have gotten in 1009 00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:35,399 Speaker 1: MSW in social work. Um, but we we don't talk 1010 00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:37,560 Speaker 1: about it. Let's start because our parents didn't. I mean, 1011 00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:40,719 Speaker 1: we really are doing we're learning from our parents, so 1012 00:56:40,760 --> 00:56:43,799 Speaker 1: we have the choice to change that. And I think 1013 00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:45,719 Speaker 1: there's also fear and shame is that we don't want 1014 00:56:45,760 --> 00:56:47,839 Speaker 1: to talk about it because we don't know. So we're like, 1015 00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:49,319 Speaker 1: well if I don't know, how am I gonna talk 1016 00:56:49,320 --> 00:56:51,719 Speaker 1: to my kid about it? Like I'm embarrassed that I 1017 00:56:51,719 --> 00:56:53,839 Speaker 1: don't know what a five nine is, Like thank god 1018 00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,960 Speaker 1: someone else opened it, Like I don't know, I'm the actor, 1019 00:56:56,960 --> 00:56:59,880 Speaker 1: you know. But I do think that there is something 1020 00:57:00,080 --> 00:57:04,799 Speaker 1: ing about topics that people don't feel didn't come from 1021 00:57:04,840 --> 00:57:07,120 Speaker 1: households where people spoke about them, Like and when I 1022 00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:09,560 Speaker 1: my house was growing up, you know, we didn't speak 1023 00:57:09,560 --> 00:57:12,520 Speaker 1: about race. We didn't talk about sex, we didn't talk 1024 00:57:12,560 --> 00:57:16,920 Speaker 1: about money, um, but everything was fine and fun loving 1025 00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:20,240 Speaker 1: and super liberal, and so they were doing better than 1026 00:57:20,400 --> 00:57:23,200 Speaker 1: their parents, which was their parents were just talking shit 1027 00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:26,840 Speaker 1: about a lot of that stuff. Um, so they did 1028 00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:28,760 Speaker 1: better and that they weren't talking about it at all. 1029 00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:32,600 Speaker 1: And now I feel like we're sort of moving into 1030 00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:36,960 Speaker 1: this hope. Well, I'm hopeful through fiscal firecrackers and Katie's 1031 00:57:36,960 --> 00:57:39,000 Speaker 1: crib that we are moving into a place where we 1032 00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:42,160 Speaker 1: do speak about these things with our children, even though 1033 00:57:42,520 --> 00:57:45,000 Speaker 1: not having the vo I don't have the vocabulary, but 1034 00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:49,600 Speaker 1: I'm trying to learn so that my children comfortably has 1035 00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:52,200 Speaker 1: the vocabulary. I mean, Katie, you might not have, like 1036 00:57:52,360 --> 00:57:55,520 Speaker 1: per se the investment vocabulary, but you've got plenty of vocabulary. 1037 00:57:55,640 --> 00:57:57,520 Speaker 1: And I think that's like a great lesson here, Like 1038 00:57:57,920 --> 00:57:59,680 Speaker 1: you can talk about how much things cost and the 1039 00:57:59,720 --> 00:58:04,439 Speaker 1: choice as you're making and ps, you've got talent. Yes, 1040 00:58:04,520 --> 00:58:06,840 Speaker 1: but this is really interesting, Like why have I never 1041 00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:12,400 Speaker 1: showed ah, thanks Susan, I just like it is weird 1042 00:58:12,440 --> 00:58:14,920 Speaker 1: that I've never showed my kid a bill, or like 1043 00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:18,120 Speaker 1: I've never said, like, wait, aren't they three years old? 1044 00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:23,800 Speaker 1: You know he's half Never I was like there's still 1045 00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:26,600 Speaker 1: a little but he is being raised in a you know, 1046 00:58:26,640 --> 00:58:29,120 Speaker 1: I talked to Ron about this, like in a Hollywood place, 1047 00:58:29,160 --> 00:58:32,680 Speaker 1: like he has to coach families on like why aren't 1048 00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:38,919 Speaker 1: we taking the jet? Like I'm not kidding, like spoiled people. Now, 1049 00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:41,960 Speaker 1: I'm not at that level, but it is concerning that 1050 00:58:42,040 --> 00:58:47,680 Speaker 1: like anything my son asks for, he gets in as long. 1051 00:58:47,800 --> 00:58:50,080 Speaker 1: You know, right now, the trade off with a four 1052 00:58:50,120 --> 00:58:52,640 Speaker 1: and a half year old is a lot based in behavior, right, 1053 00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:55,600 Speaker 1: It's a lot based in like, well, you know, you've 1054 00:58:55,640 --> 00:58:58,640 Speaker 1: been super kind and loving and generous to your sister 1055 00:58:58,760 --> 00:59:01,000 Speaker 1: and sharing really well this week. So you know what, 1056 00:59:01,080 --> 00:59:05,000 Speaker 1: I do think that thing that you've really been asking about, 1057 00:59:05,320 --> 00:59:07,440 Speaker 1: we can consider it. I think if we, if we 1058 00:59:07,520 --> 00:59:10,160 Speaker 1: continue on this path, like this is looking really good 1059 00:59:10,160 --> 00:59:12,880 Speaker 1: for you, honey, Like you are such a good big brow. 1060 00:59:13,080 --> 00:59:18,000 Speaker 1: I'm really appreciative how helpful you are. Tell me about 1061 00:59:18,840 --> 00:59:22,960 Speaker 1: chores and allowance and when you introduced those to your children, 1062 00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:26,680 Speaker 1: if you did or didn't, ay, I do believe in allowances, 1063 00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:28,960 Speaker 1: and I do believe in paying for chores. And that's 1064 00:59:29,080 --> 00:59:31,880 Speaker 1: very controversial. There's you know, you can hear the stories, 1065 00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:34,480 Speaker 1: the pros and cons, but I want them to learn 1066 00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:37,240 Speaker 1: the power of working, and especially that you know, when 1067 00:59:37,280 --> 00:59:42,479 Speaker 1: you have parents that are making decent incomes, it's easy 1068 00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:44,040 Speaker 1: to be like, well, go mow the lawn. Oh wait, 1069 00:59:44,080 --> 00:59:46,880 Speaker 1: somebody does that, you know kind of so you can't. 1070 00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:49,600 Speaker 1: So their dad and my kids dad used to always 1071 00:59:49,600 --> 00:59:51,680 Speaker 1: say that. He's like, you know, go with the lawn. Um, 1072 00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:54,960 Speaker 1: oh yeah, you can't. Um. So you do want them 1073 00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:57,960 Speaker 1: to learn the power of working and getting an income. 1074 00:59:58,000 --> 00:59:59,960 Speaker 1: And right now it's through chores and so our chores 1075 01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:04,320 Speaker 1: or empty the dishwasher, walk the dog, feed the dog, um, 1076 01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:07,880 Speaker 1: you know, helpful the laundry. I mean, these are not backbreaking, 1077 01:00:07,960 --> 01:00:10,760 Speaker 1: but yes, absolutely if you don't do it, you know, 1078 01:00:10,800 --> 01:00:13,280 Speaker 1: it's not that you don't get your allowance. But you know, 1079 01:00:13,320 --> 01:00:15,280 Speaker 1: we do have that discussion. And I've had to do 1080 01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:18,040 Speaker 1: that once or twice. Um. But here was an interesting 1081 01:00:18,080 --> 01:00:20,840 Speaker 1: story that I was remembering as I remember going on vacation. 1082 01:00:20,880 --> 01:00:22,400 Speaker 1: We stick go to the Jersey Shore and at the 1083 01:00:22,480 --> 01:00:25,400 Speaker 1: beginning of the week, I'd give my girls whatever for 1084 01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:27,320 Speaker 1: the week, and I'm like, you can spend in any 1085 01:00:27,320 --> 01:00:28,880 Speaker 1: way you like it. Because I didn't want them to 1086 01:00:28,920 --> 01:00:30,520 Speaker 1: have to say, Mom, I'm cana have an ice cream. 1087 01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:32,680 Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this, like, and I also wanted to 1088 01:00:32,720 --> 01:00:36,920 Speaker 1: teach him the power of so day one, my daughter, 1089 01:00:37,160 --> 01:00:41,120 Speaker 1: one daughter blew it all at the arcade and it 1090 01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,160 Speaker 1: was kind of girl. No. I was like, you know, 1091 01:00:44,200 --> 01:00:49,720 Speaker 1: whack them all and ski ball. Yeah, she's in Vegas, baby, 1092 01:00:49,840 --> 01:00:54,400 Speaker 1: She's just not the Jersey Shore. And it it broke 1093 01:00:54,520 --> 01:00:58,120 Speaker 1: my heart because you know, like she wanted. Of course 1094 01:00:58,160 --> 01:01:00,200 Speaker 1: I bought her ice cream. I'm not that terrible, but 1095 01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:02,000 Speaker 1: you know I did buy her ice cream. I bought 1096 01:01:02,000 --> 01:01:05,000 Speaker 1: her ice cream. Okay, but you know she wanted a souvenir. No, 1097 01:01:05,120 --> 01:01:07,280 Speaker 1: but you got to keep bringing it up like had 1098 01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:09,920 Speaker 1: you saved, you could have gotten that other thing you 1099 01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:12,600 Speaker 1: might want on day four, right, you know. And my 1100 01:01:12,640 --> 01:01:14,960 Speaker 1: other daughter was leaning it out at ten percent interest 1101 01:01:15,120 --> 01:01:19,240 Speaker 1: or she wasn't fun. I'm kidding, but I'm telling you 1102 01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:22,640 Speaker 1: it's a really really great money mistake, like learn that, 1103 01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,240 Speaker 1: um and then just I think a more official tip 1104 01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:28,320 Speaker 1: is that when they were a little bit older, around 1105 01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:30,520 Speaker 1: twelve thirteen years old, I gave them a debit card 1106 01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:32,680 Speaker 1: and I would have them put money on the debit 1107 01:01:32,720 --> 01:01:35,760 Speaker 1: card and so it wasn't a credit card, so they 1108 01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:38,760 Speaker 1: couldn't necessarily like just spend and spend, and the debit 1109 01:01:38,800 --> 01:01:41,800 Speaker 1: card was attached to an account that only had their 1110 01:01:41,840 --> 01:01:43,800 Speaker 1: money in it a hundred dollars or you know, very 1111 01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:47,200 Speaker 1: nominal amount. So I say they wanted to go shopping, 1112 01:01:47,360 --> 01:01:48,920 Speaker 1: they could look at the debit card and see how 1113 01:01:48,960 --> 01:01:51,280 Speaker 1: much they had, or if they wanted to go to 1114 01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:56,919 Speaker 1: Starbucks every day. So just they started to make money decisions. Susan, Yeah, 1115 01:01:57,160 --> 01:01:59,840 Speaker 1: we're still at he's fifteen. We're still at five bucks 1116 01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:04,880 Speaker 1: a week, pretty cheap over here doing our Amazon delivery 1117 01:02:04,960 --> 01:02:09,560 Speaker 1: three weeks away. His chores are light, though, I'll tell 1118 01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:13,960 Speaker 1: you they're light. They're like crystal light, pepsi light. Um. 1119 01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:18,200 Speaker 1: He has to feed fish. That's not a hard pet 1120 01:02:18,240 --> 01:02:21,000 Speaker 1: to have. Um. He has to make sure there's not 1121 01:02:21,080 --> 01:02:24,200 Speaker 1: a pizza box in his sheets. I have found pizza 1122 01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:30,160 Speaker 1: boxes in his sheets. Um, bring his glasses downstairs, load 1123 01:02:30,160 --> 01:02:32,160 Speaker 1: the dishwasher a couple of times a week, and then 1124 01:02:32,200 --> 01:02:36,360 Speaker 1: empty the dishwasher, and just be freaking kind, you know, 1125 01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:42,320 Speaker 1: be kind. Okay, so your kids are older. What what 1126 01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:44,680 Speaker 1: is the age in the states that you live in 1127 01:02:44,680 --> 01:02:47,720 Speaker 1: that kids are allowed to have jobs? I think fifteen 1128 01:02:47,880 --> 01:02:52,760 Speaker 1: here you can chewhorn yourself in at fifteen. Possibly sixteen, 1129 01:02:52,760 --> 01:02:56,240 Speaker 1: but fifteen seems like when they're they're interested in you, right, 1130 01:02:56,320 --> 01:02:59,040 Speaker 1: So sixteen for my daughters. But I will say babysitting 1131 01:02:59,040 --> 01:03:02,920 Speaker 1: we started young. I was like called the neighbors. I 1132 01:03:03,040 --> 01:03:05,400 Speaker 1: was twelve when I was a mother's helper, be a 1133 01:03:05,400 --> 01:03:08,520 Speaker 1: mother's helper. It was like, get on there and go 1134 01:03:08,520 --> 01:03:10,680 Speaker 1: go next door to you know, put a flyer in 1135 01:03:10,680 --> 01:03:14,280 Speaker 1: the mailbox. Twelve thirteen years old. My neighbor Karen just 1136 01:03:14,360 --> 01:03:17,200 Speaker 1: got three kids, ask if she needs help after school? 1137 01:03:18,600 --> 01:03:21,600 Speaker 1: That is so I have that, right, fourteen year old 1138 01:03:21,640 --> 01:03:23,520 Speaker 1: boy that I have a fourteen year old boy that 1139 01:03:23,560 --> 01:03:25,919 Speaker 1: comes over to my house on Tuesday afternoons for one 1140 01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:29,640 Speaker 1: hour in the backyard runs my son like the Labrador 1141 01:03:29,760 --> 01:03:34,280 Speaker 1: retriever and I give him ten dollars and he's so 1142 01:03:34,360 --> 01:03:37,040 Speaker 1: happy and my son is so happy, and it's just 1143 01:03:37,320 --> 01:03:43,800 Speaker 1: everybody wins. That is a smart kid to win. What 1144 01:03:43,880 --> 01:03:47,800 Speaker 1: do you think about the line we can't afford that 1145 01:03:48,040 --> 01:03:52,840 Speaker 1: or holding back? There's this whole thing about you know, 1146 01:03:53,000 --> 01:03:56,680 Speaker 1: your kid really wants the fancy lacrosse stick. I don't know. 1147 01:03:56,720 --> 01:03:59,560 Speaker 1: I'm making this up my lacrosse obviously, I'm from Long 1148 01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:01,920 Speaker 1: Island and alleys from spent years a mile and so 1149 01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:04,960 Speaker 1: lacrosse was a big sport there. Um, they want the 1150 01:04:05,000 --> 01:04:07,840 Speaker 1: really fancy stick is there and you can't afford it? 1151 01:04:07,920 --> 01:04:11,200 Speaker 1: Are there lessons to be had? Should you say things 1152 01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:14,360 Speaker 1: like we can't afford it and get them a lesser stick? 1153 01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:20,480 Speaker 1: What are your opinions on that? No, I'm choosing not 1154 01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:26,520 Speaker 1: to buy that. Our family can't cable, we can't afford that, 1155 01:04:26,560 --> 01:04:29,240 Speaker 1: But we're choosing to get the baseline lacrosse stick and 1156 01:04:29,240 --> 01:04:30,760 Speaker 1: then we're going to take the difference in the money. 1157 01:04:30,800 --> 01:04:33,760 Speaker 1: We're gonna donate, donate that to the Ukraine. Do you 1158 01:04:33,880 --> 01:04:35,760 Speaker 1: do that a lot in your household Susan? Do you 1159 01:04:35,800 --> 01:04:38,800 Speaker 1: do a lot of like talk about charitable stuff. We're 1160 01:04:38,880 --> 01:04:41,120 Speaker 1: very grateful, we're we've mom and dad have worked hard, 1161 01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:44,080 Speaker 1: and we're really grateful that we can't afford those pair 1162 01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:45,560 Speaker 1: of shoes. But you know what, you don't need the 1163 01:04:45,600 --> 01:04:47,560 Speaker 1: fancy pair of shoes. You can let's just go with 1164 01:04:47,600 --> 01:04:50,880 Speaker 1: the standard black pair and then look, there's about twenty 1165 01:04:50,920 --> 01:04:53,240 Speaker 1: five difference in those and let's let's throw it into 1166 01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:56,880 Speaker 1: something that calls us and give it to somebody would 1167 01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,080 Speaker 1: need it. We're an organization that would need it. But 1168 01:04:59,120 --> 01:05:02,440 Speaker 1: I like the empower choice to say this family, we 1169 01:05:02,560 --> 01:05:05,160 Speaker 1: choose to do this, rather than saying we can't afford. 1170 01:05:05,280 --> 01:05:08,600 Speaker 1: Feels very victimy to me. And it's first of all, 1171 01:05:08,600 --> 01:05:11,640 Speaker 1: you're lying so like and I'm not saying you would 1172 01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:17,320 Speaker 1: like to let's start young, teach him to lie, swindle 1173 01:05:17,400 --> 01:05:21,840 Speaker 1: their way. I was just going through this because my 1174 01:05:21,920 --> 01:05:26,360 Speaker 1: son is such an ungrateful pood He's not I'm putting 1175 01:05:26,360 --> 01:05:28,400 Speaker 1: that on him. He's not my kids at the age 1176 01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:30,720 Speaker 1: where if he doesn't like the gift that's been given, 1177 01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:37,120 Speaker 1: it is a clusterfuck of awful shape. He's so it's like, 1178 01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:40,000 Speaker 1: on one hand, I've taught this child to be so independent, 1179 01:05:40,120 --> 01:05:42,680 Speaker 1: not taught him. He is so independent and fiery and 1180 01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:45,760 Speaker 1: wonderful and dynamic, But I also want him to be 1181 01:05:45,800 --> 01:05:50,160 Speaker 1: like obviously super polite and loving and kind, and right now, 1182 01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:51,439 Speaker 1: at a four and a half year old, you kind 1183 01:05:51,440 --> 01:05:55,040 Speaker 1: of can't have both. So when he gets something he's like, 1184 01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:58,480 Speaker 1: I don't like this. I mean, it's like so rude 1185 01:05:58,760 --> 01:06:01,560 Speaker 1: it kills me. But I can't teach him to be 1186 01:06:01,640 --> 01:06:04,560 Speaker 1: like I have to. I've been trying to say to 1187 01:06:04,600 --> 01:06:06,520 Speaker 1: him when you don't like something, you know, you still 1188 01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:11,960 Speaker 1: say thank you so much. Um. And at first I 1189 01:06:11,960 --> 01:06:13,880 Speaker 1: caught myself because I was like, you just have to say, like, 1190 01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:15,400 Speaker 1: thank you so much for the gift. I love it. 1191 01:06:15,440 --> 01:06:17,200 Speaker 1: And then I was like, oh, Ship, I'm already teaching 1192 01:06:17,240 --> 01:06:20,360 Speaker 1: him to lie. I'm listing up already. This is so hard. 1193 01:06:20,960 --> 01:06:24,360 Speaker 1: What are you supposed to do? I trust me. We 1194 01:06:24,440 --> 01:06:28,040 Speaker 1: made plenty of mistakes, so plenty of money mistakes here 1195 01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:31,200 Speaker 1: like we are. I mean, I can't speak for Susan. Yes, 1196 01:06:31,680 --> 01:06:34,240 Speaker 1: I got lots of vices. You know. I showed him 1197 01:06:34,280 --> 01:06:36,120 Speaker 1: that movie Airplane when he was seven. I didn't know 1198 01:06:36,160 --> 01:06:39,960 Speaker 1: there was booties and Jello in it. I've done a lot, 1199 01:06:41,000 --> 01:06:44,440 Speaker 1: I've done. I've made mistakes every day, yes, yes, and 1200 01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:49,120 Speaker 1: we've made so great and the money mistakes we want 1201 01:06:49,160 --> 01:06:52,360 Speaker 1: them to make. Um. You've taught me some of the 1202 01:06:52,480 --> 01:06:59,440 Speaker 1: greatest tips I have had on this entire fifty billion 1203 01:06:59,640 --> 01:07:01,840 Speaker 1: episod odes we've done. I mean there are some real 1204 01:07:02,600 --> 01:07:05,240 Speaker 1: I mean, if anyone is listening, it's have a baby, 1205 01:07:05,280 --> 01:07:11,360 Speaker 1: open a five Uh, it's order Amazon Prime, not Prime 1206 01:07:11,480 --> 01:07:14,800 Speaker 1: three weeks delayed. Take your kid to the bank, open 1207 01:07:14,840 --> 01:07:18,800 Speaker 1: to savings account. Um. For the experience of it and 1208 01:07:18,840 --> 01:07:21,240 Speaker 1: to teach them. Say, can I ask you a question, Katie, Yes, 1209 01:07:21,280 --> 01:07:24,560 Speaker 1: my love? Okay love? Yeah, all right. Here it is, 1210 01:07:24,840 --> 01:07:28,120 Speaker 1: if you could go back in your money history, what 1211 01:07:28,160 --> 01:07:31,160 Speaker 1: did you do right? And what do you wish you 1212 01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:37,760 Speaker 1: could do differently so that others can learn WHOA Okay, 1213 01:07:38,160 --> 01:07:41,760 Speaker 1: I think the thing I did two things right. The 1214 01:07:41,880 --> 01:07:44,720 Speaker 1: first well I didn't do it, my dad did it. 1215 01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:49,120 Speaker 1: Does that count? It counts? Here's what Here's the best 1216 01:07:49,120 --> 01:07:50,960 Speaker 1: thing that ever happened to me in my fi, in 1217 01:07:51,040 --> 01:07:53,320 Speaker 1: my financial life that I think my parents did right. 1218 01:07:53,320 --> 01:07:55,320 Speaker 1: Because I've been shipping all over them in this podcast 1219 01:07:55,760 --> 01:08:00,240 Speaker 1: because they have money issues. But my dad's he this 1220 01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:04,080 Speaker 1: gift that he gave me was that he paid for 1221 01:08:04,120 --> 01:08:07,160 Speaker 1: my college education, which is insane and nobody gets that. 1222 01:08:07,920 --> 01:08:11,400 Speaker 1: And on the day I graduated, he shook my hand 1223 01:08:11,600 --> 01:08:15,760 Speaker 1: and he said, congratulations, you're at zero and I'm done now, 1224 01:08:16,760 --> 01:08:22,680 Speaker 1: good luck. And my parents could have definitely kept covering me. 1225 01:08:23,160 --> 01:08:25,760 Speaker 1: They were really well off at that time. They went 1226 01:08:25,840 --> 01:08:28,320 Speaker 1: up and down a lot in my life, but at 1227 01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:30,120 Speaker 1: that time they could have kept it going. And my 1228 01:08:30,200 --> 01:08:32,759 Speaker 1: dad was like, oh no, no, no no, no, like we good. 1229 01:08:33,040 --> 01:08:35,360 Speaker 1: So your rent is nine a month. You've been living 1230 01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:37,240 Speaker 1: in this apartment in New York City for the last 1231 01:08:37,240 --> 01:08:39,560 Speaker 1: three years of school. The only thing I'm going to 1232 01:08:39,680 --> 01:08:41,640 Speaker 1: help out with is your cell phone because you have 1233 01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:43,640 Speaker 1: to call mom every day. And I will cover your 1234 01:08:43,640 --> 01:08:46,519 Speaker 1: health in journey to So good for you. But your 1235 01:08:46,520 --> 01:08:51,640 Speaker 1: metro card, your apartment, you're drinking, your food, your groceries. 1236 01:08:52,320 --> 01:08:57,080 Speaker 1: That's on you. And as scary as that was, and 1237 01:08:57,120 --> 01:09:00,000 Speaker 1: it was, it was walking into every restaurant New York's 1238 01:09:00,080 --> 01:09:04,360 Speaker 1: the and applying, it was such a gift. Um. So 1239 01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:06,760 Speaker 1: I think in my financial life that was great because 1240 01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:09,559 Speaker 1: I got on my two ft on my own the 1241 01:09:09,880 --> 01:09:12,360 Speaker 1: like the minute I was twenty one. Do you think 1242 01:09:12,360 --> 01:09:15,599 Speaker 1: you worked harder because of that? A yeah. I mean 1243 01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:20,160 Speaker 1: I worked so hard. I had so many jobs. My 1244 01:09:20,200 --> 01:09:22,040 Speaker 1: therapist when I moved to l A had never met 1245 01:09:22,080 --> 01:09:26,559 Speaker 1: anyone like me. I had more side hustles than you even. 1246 01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:31,880 Speaker 1: I mean, I've had every job known to man, a 1247 01:09:31,920 --> 01:09:36,880 Speaker 1: personal assisting, catering. Wait, you're saying nanny ing, running a 1248 01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:39,640 Speaker 1: catering company. I was a wedding planners personal assistant for 1249 01:09:39,680 --> 01:09:44,479 Speaker 1: three years. I mean I have had a million jobs, um, 1250 01:09:44,560 --> 01:09:46,760 Speaker 1: And the only thing was I would leave them all 1251 01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:48,000 Speaker 1: at a drop of a hat if I had an 1252 01:09:48,040 --> 01:09:50,200 Speaker 1: audition or a call back. So I also got fired 1253 01:09:50,200 --> 01:09:52,280 Speaker 1: from million jobs and quit a million jobs because they 1254 01:09:52,400 --> 01:09:57,280 Speaker 1: always came second fiddle. But my boss is always kind 1255 01:09:57,280 --> 01:09:59,800 Speaker 1: of put up with it because I was so good 1256 01:09:59,800 --> 01:10:02,080 Speaker 1: at the jobs. While I was there. I would say 1257 01:10:02,080 --> 01:10:03,559 Speaker 1: to them, I will give you a hundred and fifty 1258 01:10:03,920 --> 01:10:05,240 Speaker 1: when I'm here, But whenever I got to go to 1259 01:10:05,240 --> 01:10:06,680 Speaker 1: an audition, you've got to let me go and you've 1260 01:10:06,680 --> 01:10:08,400 Speaker 1: got to support me. But I am going to work 1261 01:10:09,080 --> 01:10:10,920 Speaker 1: way more hours than you're paying me. I'm going to 1262 01:10:11,000 --> 01:10:12,639 Speaker 1: work through the night. I'm going to make this happen. 1263 01:10:12,680 --> 01:10:15,880 Speaker 1: And I did. Um Okay, now what did I mess up? 1264 01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:18,880 Speaker 1: Was that your other brilliant question I just need to 1265 01:10:18,920 --> 01:10:21,200 Speaker 1: insert here That makes me to love you so much. 1266 01:10:21,360 --> 01:10:24,280 Speaker 1: Hearts are flying out of my eyes for you. That 1267 01:10:24,360 --> 01:10:27,680 Speaker 1: you had all those jobs. What a wonderful thing to 1268 01:10:27,720 --> 01:10:30,919 Speaker 1: have in your toolbox as an actor. I think everyone 1269 01:10:30,960 --> 01:10:33,479 Speaker 1: should have to work in the service industry totally. I 1270 01:10:33,479 --> 01:10:36,000 Speaker 1: think it should be mandatory. I think there should be 1271 01:10:36,040 --> 01:10:39,880 Speaker 1: money education in school. The fiscal firecrackers should have a 1272 01:10:39,920 --> 01:10:44,080 Speaker 1: school handbook that's given to all young children of what 1273 01:10:44,120 --> 01:10:45,639 Speaker 1: the funk we're supposed to be doing with our money. 1274 01:10:46,200 --> 01:10:49,439 Speaker 1: And then I think everyone should be a waiter at 1275 01:10:49,479 --> 01:10:51,760 Speaker 1: some point. I just do. I think you would be 1276 01:10:51,760 --> 01:10:54,040 Speaker 1: a different person. I just or in the service industry 1277 01:10:54,120 --> 01:10:56,439 Speaker 1: at all, whether that's in clothing or whatever, but like 1278 01:10:56,479 --> 01:11:00,679 Speaker 1: where you are serving people. Um, I just think that 1279 01:11:00,800 --> 01:11:04,040 Speaker 1: was I learned more in those ten years than probably 1280 01:11:04,080 --> 01:11:08,639 Speaker 1: anywhere else. Although no, right now, mothering is crazy. Yes, 1281 01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:11,479 Speaker 1: I know mothering. Mothering is really hard. It is. But 1282 01:11:11,840 --> 01:11:14,479 Speaker 1: so if anyone's listening that is working the side hustle 1283 01:11:14,600 --> 01:11:16,960 Speaker 1: jobs at Katie is, just take a little bit and 1284 01:11:17,040 --> 01:11:19,160 Speaker 1: open a roth ira, just a little bit, just a 1285 01:11:19,200 --> 01:11:25,200 Speaker 1: little crumb. Never did that, I know, and most of us, 1286 01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:26,760 Speaker 1: dott and I work with. I work with a lot 1287 01:11:26,760 --> 01:11:29,120 Speaker 1: of freelancers and artists, and I'm like, and Susan knows, 1288 01:11:29,160 --> 01:11:30,680 Speaker 1: we've kind of made up our own little thing. Just 1289 01:11:30,680 --> 01:11:32,639 Speaker 1: take a little crumb. If you've just taken a hundred 1290 01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:35,720 Speaker 1: dollars here and there, fifty dollars here and there and 1291 01:11:35,720 --> 01:11:37,559 Speaker 1: put it in a roth ira, the power of that 1292 01:11:37,600 --> 01:11:40,720 Speaker 1: compound interest. So we love that you worked hard. We're not, 1293 01:11:40,760 --> 01:11:42,519 Speaker 1: but we're kind of like, great, we love that you 1294 01:11:42,560 --> 01:11:45,280 Speaker 1: did that. Now let's do a little more, because that's 1295 01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:47,519 Speaker 1: our job is to have you do a little bit more. 1296 01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:52,240 Speaker 1: You guys are smart. Yeah, I should have opened a rath. 1297 01:11:52,760 --> 01:11:56,040 Speaker 1: I didn't. I also didn't know anything about taxes or 1298 01:11:56,080 --> 01:11:58,080 Speaker 1: anything of the time, and so I remember the first 1299 01:11:58,080 --> 01:12:02,160 Speaker 1: time I finally booked a big acting, my finances look 1300 01:12:02,320 --> 01:12:04,599 Speaker 1: drastically different than the year before, Like I went from 1301 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:07,519 Speaker 1: making two dollars a year to like way more than that, 1302 01:12:07,600 --> 01:12:10,080 Speaker 1: and so that's when I started getting audited right and left. 1303 01:12:10,120 --> 01:12:15,120 Speaker 1: It was insane. So I also think probably you have 1304 01:12:15,200 --> 01:12:17,880 Speaker 1: to surround yours if you're not a money person, listen 1305 01:12:17,960 --> 01:12:21,200 Speaker 1: to fiscal firecrackers, and surround yourself with people you trust, 1306 01:12:21,200 --> 01:12:23,720 Speaker 1: who you can ask what the hell you're supposed to 1307 01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:26,960 Speaker 1: be doing, and get over your own shame and embarrassment 1308 01:12:27,760 --> 01:12:30,439 Speaker 1: so that you don't get audited in oh, thirty seven 1309 01:12:30,479 --> 01:12:33,439 Speaker 1: thousand dollars, which is what happened to me. I didn't 1310 01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:37,000 Speaker 1: have it, I know. I always tell my feel answers, 1311 01:12:37,120 --> 01:12:39,280 Speaker 1: it's not your money. Take that money and put it 1312 01:12:39,320 --> 01:12:42,120 Speaker 1: away in taxes right away, create a separate savings account, 1313 01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:46,200 Speaker 1: it's not your money, and us to get packets from 1314 01:12:46,240 --> 01:12:48,640 Speaker 1: the from the government like this, and I didn't know 1315 01:12:48,680 --> 01:12:50,840 Speaker 1: what I was looking at. Okay, but this isn't about me, guys, 1316 01:12:50,880 --> 01:12:56,160 Speaker 1: this is about motherhood. Um. I have learned so much today. 1317 01:12:56,280 --> 01:13:02,480 Speaker 1: I'm honestly like, I've just learned so many very applicable, 1318 01:13:03,439 --> 01:13:10,320 Speaker 1: actionable mothering things that are so helpful. And I'm just 1319 01:13:10,400 --> 01:13:13,600 Speaker 1: so grateful to you Susan and Galia for spending the 1320 01:13:13,720 --> 01:13:17,120 Speaker 1: time on Katie's cribbin talking to all of our mom listeners. 1321 01:13:17,320 --> 01:13:20,000 Speaker 1: Because money is one of these things we have got 1322 01:13:20,040 --> 01:13:22,519 Speaker 1: to talk about. We've got to take pride when we 1323 01:13:22,560 --> 01:13:27,639 Speaker 1: talk about it and remove any of the stigmas or 1324 01:13:27,720 --> 01:13:30,479 Speaker 1: your own money issues or whatever you grew up with 1325 01:13:30,720 --> 01:13:33,880 Speaker 1: surrounding money issues to not pass that on to your kid. 1326 01:13:34,880 --> 01:13:38,080 Speaker 1: Show them the bill, have them practiced the gratuity, open 1327 01:13:38,160 --> 01:13:40,519 Speaker 1: up a savings account, do it with them. So and 1328 01:13:40,520 --> 01:13:42,400 Speaker 1: I'm not and this is not like a plug for me, 1329 01:13:42,479 --> 01:13:43,880 Speaker 1: but a group that I work with the New York 1330 01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:46,400 Speaker 1: City is called the Freelancers Union, and I do workshops 1331 01:13:46,439 --> 01:13:48,760 Speaker 1: for them, and so we literally teach personal finance one 1332 01:13:48,760 --> 01:13:51,639 Speaker 1: oh one, investing one oh one. There's a lot of 1333 01:13:51,680 --> 01:13:54,479 Speaker 1: like investing one oh one personal finance classes that are 1334 01:13:54,520 --> 01:13:57,080 Speaker 1: being taught at places, so just you know, and I 1335 01:13:57,080 --> 01:13:59,520 Speaker 1: would say, really focus on taking it from an independent 1336 01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:02,840 Speaker 1: profession like not a you know, money manager, but have 1337 01:14:03,000 --> 01:14:05,200 Speaker 1: them take a personal finance one on one class and 1338 01:14:05,240 --> 01:14:07,480 Speaker 1: investing one on one. There is a two key classes. 1339 01:14:08,040 --> 01:14:10,760 Speaker 1: I'm so I'm such a huge fan of you both 1340 01:14:11,320 --> 01:14:14,559 Speaker 1: and everyone. Please listen to the Fiscal Firecrackers on anywhere 1341 01:14:14,560 --> 01:14:17,520 Speaker 1: you can listen to your podcasts. Please visit the website. 1342 01:14:17,600 --> 01:14:20,040 Speaker 1: Please talk to your children about money. Thank you, Thank 1343 01:14:20,080 --> 01:14:28,920 Speaker 1: you for having us. Thank you guys so much for 1344 01:14:28,960 --> 01:14:31,320 Speaker 1: listening to today's episode. I want to hear from you. 1345 01:14:32,560 --> 01:14:36,000 Speaker 1: Let's chat questions, comments, concerns. Let me know. You can 1346 01:14:36,000 --> 01:14:42,160 Speaker 1: always find me at Katie's Crib at Shanda land dot com. 1347 01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:44,559 Speaker 1: Katie's Crib is a production of Shonda Land Audio in 1348 01:14:44,640 --> 01:14:48,120 Speaker 1: partnership with I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from shandaland Audio, 1349 01:14:48,240 --> 01:14:50,880 Speaker 1: visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 1350 01:14:50,920 --> 01:14:52,240 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.