1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:13,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, Welcome to the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. I'm term Keene 2 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: jay Leye. We bring you insight from the best in economics, finance, investment, 3 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:23,520 Speaker 1: and international relations. Find Bloomberg Surveillance on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, 4 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:32,680 Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot Com, and of course, on the Bloomberg So 5 00:00:32,800 --> 00:00:35,960 Speaker 1: what are you doing at ten am Eastern time? That 6 00:00:36,120 --> 00:00:39,680 Speaker 1: is the big decision this morning? When the United States 7 00:00:39,800 --> 00:00:44,479 Speaker 1: Ambassador Lightheiser testifies to a House panel, the fetes J 8 00:00:44,680 --> 00:00:47,600 Speaker 1: Pal testifies to a House panel, and at the very 9 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 1: same time, the president's former lawyer Michael Cohen testifies before 10 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: a House panel. To help answer that question here in 11 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 1: New York, Todd, Mariano, you raised a group US director 12 00:00:58,040 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 1: and shiphap jellin news credit suite, head of FX, and 13 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: a macro trading strategy. So what do you do at 14 00:01:04,360 --> 00:01:07,319 Speaker 1: ten am? Todd? You've got those three screens? Which one 15 00:01:07,319 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 1: are you watching? First of all, I try to watch 16 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:13,800 Speaker 1: all three at once, But failing that endeavor, I have 17 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:16,840 Speaker 1: to go with Lightheiser first and catching up with the 18 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,520 Speaker 1: other two in full later. What do you think should 19 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:24,320 Speaker 1: have I think from a pure entertainment perspective, I'd watch Coming, 20 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 1: but I'd have to agree with Todd from a professional perspective, 21 00:01:27,160 --> 00:01:30,000 Speaker 1: lighthiser comes. Yeah, it's funny that for the substance the focus, 22 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 1: I think for many people, Tom Keane is going to 23 00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:36,640 Speaker 1: be on Ambassador Lightheiser, But the distraction and the fireworks 24 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:40,320 Speaker 1: and the theater is coming from comedy. For those on radio, 25 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:42,800 Speaker 1: you just see the body language in Hannoy And as 26 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: a beginning statement, it's totally different than Singapore. There at 27 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 1: the Metropole Hotel Shob You've you've been there, John, Have 28 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,520 Speaker 1: you been to the metropolit Annoy? I've never been, But 29 00:01:55,600 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 1: it's beautifully restored. It's elegant. You can buy fancy watches, 30 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:02,960 Speaker 1: you can have day what what was it, wago beef? 31 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:05,680 Speaker 1: They don't serve that on McDonald's. But the whole thing 32 00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:09,079 Speaker 1: and the answer is that's a different president than what 33 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 1: we saw in Singapore. Do you think today's events a 34 00:02:12,480 --> 00:02:14,720 Speaker 1: whang on him? Somewhere? Absolutely saw it with the tweets 35 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:16,639 Speaker 1: this morning, I mean the tweets this morning, the eclectic 36 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:19,919 Speaker 1: sense of them. Todd was it was extraordinary where he 37 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,360 Speaker 1: is distracted by domestic issues, not that he's the first 38 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:27,239 Speaker 1: president to ever have that. He can't not be distracted 39 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:31,200 Speaker 1: by what's going on. It's it's too important to his presidency. Um, 40 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 1: you know, certainly with with what's going on in the 41 00:02:33,560 --> 00:02:36,400 Speaker 1: in the House, just in the oversight and reform let alone, 42 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 1: you know, the various other investigations, the drip drip drip 43 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:42,919 Speaker 1: of of what comes out every day. Even his harshest 44 00:02:42,919 --> 00:02:46,640 Speaker 1: critics give the President Shahab massive cred for trying to 45 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:51,360 Speaker 1: jump start a medieval kingdom towards some form of model 46 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 1: of Asian capitalism. The President mentioned that in his comments, 47 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:58,160 Speaker 1: he's he's tremendous, I believe is the word he was. 48 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 1: I'm paraphrasing their folks. Can he be optimistic about any 49 00:03:02,760 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: sense of North Vietnam becoming like Laos Well, I think 50 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: I think, having actually visited d M the DMZ some 51 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 1: years ago and seeing that even then there were factories 52 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 1: across the border that we're producing products for South Korea 53 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 1: and others, the potential is clearly there, and even some 54 00:03:21,400 --> 00:03:25,600 Speaker 1: of the infrastructure is already there. Uh. And with relations 55 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 1: between South Korea and North Korea improving as well constantly, UM, 56 00:03:29,240 --> 00:03:31,720 Speaker 1: we do have symplomas of hope here. But I think 57 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: ultimately though It's not so much about what Trump thinks 58 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:38,320 Speaker 1: about all of this. It's the North Korea's domestic internal 59 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 1: political structure that's very hard to read from from where 60 00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:44,880 Speaker 1: I sit. For anyone waking up on Wall Street this morning, 61 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 1: this isn't even on the radar? Is it todd? The 62 00:03:48,080 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 1: situation in Hannoy? Is it? Is there something you're even 63 00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:56,320 Speaker 1: paying attention to, Probably pay more attention tomorrow to uh, 64 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,680 Speaker 1: you know, actual outcomes the press conference last time and 65 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 1: sing poor we had President Trump mentioned a couple of 66 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: things during the press conference that weren't in the joint 67 00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 1: statement UM, but markets in general from a macro perspective, 68 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 1: or as Schab was saying earlier, going to look at 69 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: this from an as an up or down vote. You know, 70 00:04:14,720 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 1: do we have a higher geopolitical risk premium um, you know, 71 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:20,600 Speaker 1: or a or a lower one or staying the same 72 00:04:20,680 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 1: The nuance is harder at a price. And also, as 73 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:25,279 Speaker 1: you said at the top of this program, you're focus 74 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 1: today will actually be on whatever Ambassador lighthiser has to 75 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: say in front of the House panel. I just wanted 76 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:32,680 Speaker 1: to what degree the story playing out in Hannay actually 77 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:35,479 Speaker 1: folds into the trade story and China being the important 78 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 1: piece in both. What are your thoughts on that side. Yeah, well, 79 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:41,960 Speaker 1: you know, the the chart that that Tom put up 80 00:04:41,960 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 1: on TV earlier today is is interesting. It gets that 81 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 1: it gets that okay more than more than okay. As 82 00:04:49,839 --> 00:04:53,159 Speaker 1: as usual, Ferro didn't want me to use that chart. Explain, 83 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:58,400 Speaker 1: you don't because your focus on radios into the shot. 84 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: Come on charts on radio here it is nominal GDP 85 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: per capita the growth rate of the Asian nations back 86 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:12,239 Speaker 1: and Todd is is we just to quickly summarize China 87 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 1: and Vietnam on fire, Cambodia a little less allows worse 88 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 1: than that trailing. Yeah, this is uh, this is what 89 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,800 Speaker 1: I think the North Korean's what would ideally like to achieve. 90 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 1: Of course, for for China, it's an economic opportunity as well. 91 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: And what what we see across that whole region now 92 00:05:31,720 --> 00:05:35,240 Speaker 1: is is competition. You know, not only over you know, 93 00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 1: just economic models and influence things like that, but you know, 94 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:43,120 Speaker 1: but certainly over technology too. So you know, China's approach 95 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 1: here has been to um, you know, play this a 96 00:05:46,440 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 1: little more quietly, stay behind the scenes, while uh, while 97 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 1: the US is really out in front kind of you know, 98 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 1: driving this semmetery with with Kim Jong Un. For them, 99 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 1: it's a it's a longer term game. I think of 100 00:05:58,320 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 1: economic competition. I spend a couple of it's talking about 101 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 1: what you want to focus on a little bit later 102 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 1: this morning, which is the hearing with Lightheiser on trait specifically, 103 00:06:06,560 --> 00:06:08,480 Speaker 1: what are the missing pieces that you want some color on. 104 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 1: I would say, UM first and foremost U S M 105 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: c A. It's it's something where lawmakers have been trying 106 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:20,080 Speaker 1: to get a little bit more color from Lightheiser. Where 107 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,279 Speaker 1: do we um, you know, where do we stand on 108 00:06:22,320 --> 00:06:27,240 Speaker 1: some of the procedural steps. UM, very importantly, where is 109 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:32,000 Speaker 1: Mexico with their labor law? And UM. You know, certainly 110 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,599 Speaker 1: the stealing aluminum terroffs that are still in place on 111 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:38,120 Speaker 1: Canada and Mexico ought to be lifted, you know, especially 112 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:41,240 Speaker 1: for some Republican lawmakers, you know, to give their blessing 113 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:46,280 Speaker 1: to this agreement. So some additional you know, detail from 114 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:49,160 Speaker 1: Lightheiser would would really be interesting for me, Jahab what 115 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:53,600 Speaker 1: are you looking for? But I think one of the 116 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:57,040 Speaker 1: debates in the market has been about the extent to 117 00:06:57,080 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: which this apparent divide between UH some of the hardliners 118 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:03,800 Speaker 1: on China on the trade issue and light highs and 119 00:07:03,880 --> 00:07:06,040 Speaker 1: might be seen as one of them, and Trump himself 120 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,159 Speaker 1: who's looking for a deal. Some senses as to how 121 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:12,840 Speaker 1: protracted that conflict could be if there is one, um 122 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:15,960 Speaker 1: and is it bad enough to potentially derail the talks 123 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:18,800 Speaker 1: and stop the market getting to it where it wants 124 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:22,960 Speaker 1: to with respect to this issue. Um. I don't imagine 125 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 1: that we'll see that today, but of course if if 126 00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 1: it comes out looking negative on that front, then there 127 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:30,239 Speaker 1: could be a bit of an upset for the market 128 00:07:30,240 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: on that. And I think it's good John that you 129 00:07:31,560 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 1: bring up the China trade talks because the fact is 130 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:38,600 Speaker 1: the vast majority of Americans are completely distracted by this 131 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 1: other stuff, and yet these are going to be substantial 132 00:07:41,440 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: discussions from the Primarily the distraction will be Michael coming today, 133 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:48,120 Speaker 1: I would say, given the last twelve hours for those 134 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: waking up across America right now, just the last twelve 135 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: hours of the the I guess the leak of is 136 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:57,360 Speaker 1: it it too uh? Leaked to The New York Times. 137 00:07:57,400 --> 00:07:59,800 Speaker 1: Of course, on the language of Mr Cohen alone brings 138 00:07:59,800 --> 00:08:02,720 Speaker 1: that a new level of acuity planning to tell the 139 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:07,040 Speaker 1: committee about alleged mistates by film of box. They're going 140 00:08:07,080 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 1: to have how many hours of this liked it today? Well, 141 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 1: three days or two days, whatever it is. But well, 142 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 1: of course what we're seeing now across all of news 143 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 1: is of course these images from Hanoi as well. I 144 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 1: think we have to leave it there, gentlemen in the 145 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 1: news logest extraordinary. I'm going to stick with us. It's 146 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 1: a little bit later on this actually talk about markets 147 00:08:25,880 --> 00:08:27,720 Speaker 1: and in the financial markets at the back of the 148 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: events in Pakistan and India right in the last couple 149 00:08:30,200 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 1: of days, especial thanks to Todd Marianna, thank you you 150 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:50,560 Speaker 1: write A group's US director John extraordinary to see just 151 00:08:50,600 --> 00:08:53,880 Speaker 1: the immediacy in the last sixty minutes of the headlines 152 00:08:53,920 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: on Indian Pakistan, the econ Market Times of India says, 153 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,839 Speaker 1: let better sense prevail. We're willing to talk, says Mr 154 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:05,600 Speaker 1: Khan of Pakistan's that's sort of the legist nugget promise 155 00:09:05,640 --> 00:09:08,079 Speaker 1: to Imran Khan is trying to make this settled down 156 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:10,559 Speaker 1: a little bit after the events of the last the 157 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:13,240 Speaker 1: last couple of days or so, the biggest escalation, I 158 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 1: have to say in decades, India saying that an Air 159 00:09:16,040 --> 00:09:19,240 Speaker 1: Force pilot was missing. After Pakistan said it has shot 160 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:23,199 Speaker 1: down to Indian fighter jets, relations between what many people 161 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:27,480 Speaker 1: consider to be arch rivals have just worsened amid the 162 00:09:27,480 --> 00:09:30,160 Speaker 1: possibility potentially, of course, there is always the risk of 163 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:32,400 Speaker 1: full blown war. I want to bring in from New 164 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 1: Delhi Ian Marlow Bloomberg, South Asia Government reporter, Ian, some 165 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 1: fantastic reporting from the team and yourself over the last 166 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 1: couple of days. Can you get us up to speed 167 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 1: and where we are now, where we have been and 168 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:45,959 Speaker 1: where this is going. Yeah, at the moment, we're all 169 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:49,200 Speaker 1: still in a little bit of shock from the speed 170 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:53,360 Speaker 1: at which events have moved here. Earlier today two jets 171 00:09:53,440 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 1: um Pakistan announced that they had shot down two jets, 172 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,560 Speaker 1: and then India came out and confirmed that a pilot, 173 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:02,840 Speaker 1: one of their Indian Air Force pilots was was in 174 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:06,640 Speaker 1: Pakistani custody um or at least that he was missing, 175 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:09,280 Speaker 1: missing an action. Um So, at the moment, we're all 176 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:14,840 Speaker 1: waiting to see how India responds to the developments of today. 177 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:18,880 Speaker 1: Um what pakistanalogies are two down Indian Air Force fighters 178 00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 1: And as a lot of other commentators have said, this 179 00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:24,760 Speaker 1: is some of the most severe as military escalation we've 180 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:28,480 Speaker 1: seen in decades UM and UH some say dating back 181 00:10:28,520 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 1: fifty years to the nineteen seventy one Indo Pakistani War. 182 00:10:31,880 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 1: So Prime Minister Imran Khan Ian saying that he only 183 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:38,520 Speaker 1: took action after a ascertaining damage was done by Indian's 184 00:10:38,520 --> 00:10:41,840 Speaker 1: attack on Tuesday, he called for dialogue. Essentially, he said 185 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 1: better sense should prevail, we should sit down and talk. 186 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 1: What is the Indian response. There hasn't been a solid 187 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:55,600 Speaker 1: Indian response to Prime Minister Khan's comments so far. UM. 188 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 1: It would be useful to to note that over the 189 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 1: past um year, Khan has made various gestures to India 190 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,200 Speaker 1: indicating that he would be happy to have some kind 191 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 1: of peace talks with with India. But India always sort 192 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:15,480 Speaker 1: of goes back to their default position, which is that 193 00:11:15,559 --> 00:11:20,920 Speaker 1: they say Pakistan sponsors terrorists UH and trains them and 194 00:11:20,960 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 1: they strike inside India, and that they do that as 195 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 1: a way to avoid a sort of direct military confrontation. 196 00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:29,000 Speaker 1: So India says, we will not talk, and there's no 197 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:32,920 Speaker 1: point in talking unless you stop that and acknowledge that, 198 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,320 Speaker 1: and so at at the same time, con you know, 199 00:11:35,360 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: can't come out and acknowledge that because of domestic politics 200 00:11:38,480 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: and other things in India, that's what the U. S 201 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,319 Speaker 1: And other countries think is happening UH, and India is 202 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: probably unlikely to to engage in any widespread or or 203 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: sort of meaningful talks with with Pakistan at the moment. 204 00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,320 Speaker 1: The one thing we're sort of looking at is whether 205 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 1: there could be any sort of restricted talks in terms 206 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:58,319 Speaker 1: of getting this UH pilot back UM. And that's something 207 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 1: that at the moment isn't quite clear because India hasn't 208 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 1: made their made their stance known. I And as you say, 209 00:12:03,679 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 1: it's been surprising because it's happened so quickly, the events 210 00:12:06,880 --> 00:12:10,400 Speaker 1: of the last day or so. They feel somewhat clumsy 211 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: the way all of this is played out in the 212 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:15,720 Speaker 1: last several hours. Your thoughts on that, Yeah, absolutely, it's 213 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:19,600 Speaker 1: been It's been pretty remarkable to UM. Each day there's 214 00:12:19,640 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 1: something dramatically different, UM and each each side UM is 215 00:12:24,080 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 1: claiming remarkably different set of facts here. On Monday, India 216 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: said they bombed a terrorist camp and killed three people. 217 00:12:34,240 --> 00:12:36,920 Speaker 1: Pack stance that nothing was hit at all, There was 218 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: just some damage on a sort of hillside somewhere in 219 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:42,960 Speaker 1: the in the mountains. UM, and today we have you know, 220 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:47,000 Speaker 1: two jets, one jet, two pilots captured, one pilot captured. 221 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:49,440 Speaker 1: No one is quite sure who to believe at the 222 00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,680 Speaker 1: moment um, it's quite clear that these are you know, 223 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 1: very kind of diametrically opposed positions, and it's very very 224 00:12:56,679 --> 00:12:59,560 Speaker 1: sort of weighted in terms of what people are allowed 225 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:02,320 Speaker 1: to say in the record. UM. You know, for example, 226 00:13:02,360 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: straight whether yeah, there's twenty two major languages in India 227 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:09,240 Speaker 1: by one count all that you decide is the expert 228 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:13,520 Speaker 1: here and within those languages is an election for Mr Modi. 229 00:13:13,760 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 1: And within the linkage of language to culture is religion. 230 00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 1: Give our viewers worldwide, our listeners rather worldwide a sense 231 00:13:23,440 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: of the religion debate in India. Now after these hostilities, yeah, 232 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 1: I mean so Kashmir is obviously a Muslim majority state, 233 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: and so after the terrorist attack of earlier this month 234 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,880 Speaker 1: on February fourteenth, that killed forty Indian paramilitary troops, there 235 00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 1: was a strong reaction um inside UH India towards UM 236 00:13:49,520 --> 00:13:54,800 Speaker 1: Kashmiris and Kashmiri businesses. You had some hotels in parts 237 00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:59,280 Speaker 1: of the sort of the sort of Hindu majority states, 238 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 1: UM saying we don't want Kashmiri's coming to our hotels. 239 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: You had a a state governor who was appointed by 240 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 1: the ruling party urging a boycott of Kashmir so saying 241 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:16,040 Speaker 1: Indians shouldn't go there for tourism, you shouldn't frequent Kashmiri businesses. 242 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 1: And I mean obviously most most Kashmiris are Muslim And 243 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:23,400 Speaker 1: this is very waited kind of fraud language coming ahead 244 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:25,600 Speaker 1: of an election. And and the U S government you know, 245 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:29,560 Speaker 1: has warned in the past that as elections approach in India, UM, 246 00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 1: there could be religious clashes and that's something that a 247 00:14:32,040 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 1: lot of analysts are are waiting to see. Um. No 248 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: one you know has expected, um a sort of India 249 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 1: Pakistan confrontation has the election and obviously, um, you know, 250 00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 1: Pakistan does play up every once in a while. The 251 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 1: treatment of of Muslims in India and always great to 252 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: get your thoughts and inside from from the team fantastic 253 00:14:52,600 --> 00:15:09,160 Speaker 1: Bloomberg South Asia Government reported Carol Rick Odonna, where us 254 00:15:09,160 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: a Bloomberg Economics. He and tim O Haiti have published 255 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,520 Speaker 1: on all things Pole. But first let's go to Janna Smilek, 256 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: who is in the trenches of looking question to question Jenna, 257 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:26,160 Speaker 1: is the chairman gonna have to face today political questions 258 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 1: from a Democratic House? Is there going to be a 259 00:15:30,000 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: much more political chit chat than what we witnessed yesterday? 260 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:37,920 Speaker 1: You know, it's an interesting question. We did see some 261 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: political chit chat yesterday. You know, there were questions about 262 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 1: the fact that, you know, Donald Trump. Actually Jenny Ellen's 263 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 1: comments from earlier this week that Donald Trump really is 264 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:51,760 Speaker 1: doing got raised. I think you could definitely see more 265 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: of that. You're also likely to see Powell kind of 266 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:58,880 Speaker 1: dem and choose not here. I know that, okay, but 267 00:15:58,960 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 1: let's cut to the theater. Let's cut to the theater 268 00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:03,600 Speaker 1: with the news law John Farrell says, what's a trade 269 00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:07,520 Speaker 1: representative testimony? Not this song and dance? Okay? Sell me 270 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 1: on why I need to watch Powell? Is he going 271 00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 1: to answer any questions from from democratic socialists? I mean, 272 00:16:15,080 --> 00:16:17,040 Speaker 1: let's cut to the chase. Is he going to have 273 00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:21,560 Speaker 1: to bounce off socialism today? It's an interesting question. He 274 00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: certainly pushed back heavily on this idea that death that 275 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 1: don't matter in a country that is the reserve currency. 276 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 1: Yes r and I thought that his pushback on that 277 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:35,560 Speaker 1: was really full throated, certainly more definitive than I would 278 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 1: have expected from Chair Power. I think. Also it's going 279 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: to be really interesting to watch to see if he 280 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:43,640 Speaker 1: gets asked more about the SIDS current rethink. You know, 281 00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 1: they are considering prentically going to some sort of average 282 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 1: inflation targeting or price level targeting regime rather than the 283 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:53,080 Speaker 1: symmetric regime that they're right now. And he got asked 284 00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 1: about that yesterday. This is a big deal for the FED, 285 00:16:55,960 --> 00:17:03,400 Speaker 1: this this whole year long process symmetric symmetric teacher. Yeahs interesting. 286 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:05,720 Speaker 1: Is he going to be asked about the collapse of Duke? 287 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:09,480 Speaker 1: I mean, what do you think? I mean, one can 288 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,560 Speaker 1: only hope. Okay, Gina smile like a chapel hill. Thank 289 00:17:12,600 --> 00:17:14,320 Speaker 1: you so much for joining us. And there's a drinking 290 00:17:14,440 --> 00:17:16,960 Speaker 1: game over the over the last twenty four hours and 291 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:20,000 Speaker 1: into today as well. Do you want to know what 292 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:22,199 Speaker 1: the buzzword is? Do it for the second day of 293 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,680 Speaker 1: the testimony is not due. It's not my lane. Oh, 294 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:28,000 Speaker 1: it's not my line. When Chamon Pal says it's not 295 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:30,640 Speaker 1: my lane, that's when you have a shot. And I 296 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:33,359 Speaker 1: imagine you'll be getting a lot more drunk today than 297 00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:35,600 Speaker 1: you've got yes, I would think so as well. Carl 298 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:38,240 Speaker 1: rickodon Here, why don't you bring in Mr Rickodna, who 299 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 1: knows the multiple lanes of the American economy. Boom Bag 300 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,359 Speaker 1: Economics chief US economist Carlie says that a lot doesn't he. 301 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 1: I don't think it's fair when you are at the 302 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:51,919 Speaker 1: controls of the largest economy in the world and the 303 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 1: FED chair is like it or not to say that's 304 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,920 Speaker 1: not in my lane. Everything pretty much falls under your 305 00:17:58,080 --> 00:17:59,920 Speaker 1: But he still says it, right, Yeah, he can say 306 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: that they can. The FED can deny they're responsible for 307 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 1: participation trends and productivity growth and all those good things. Uh, 308 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:10,240 Speaker 1: they have to be held accountable lot. To some extent, 309 00:18:10,359 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 1: the Chairman's had some difficulty with communication over the last 310 00:18:13,520 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 1: year or so. Some sounded pretty good, pretty good day 311 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:20,439 Speaker 1: going into the second day. Is that why we watch 312 00:18:20,520 --> 00:18:23,879 Speaker 1: this still? Just in case? Is it that? Just in case? 313 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,080 Speaker 1: It is interesting? Absolutely, and so ordinarily the prepared testimony 314 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,640 Speaker 1: that the speech he reads that the that the onset 315 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:33,680 Speaker 1: is identical on day two. It doesn't have to be identical. 316 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 1: So if there is a misstatement or a big market 317 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:39,719 Speaker 1: move on day one, they can tweak the language. There 318 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:41,879 Speaker 1: wasn't a big market move yesterday, So I don't expect that. 319 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:45,359 Speaker 1: I want to framework to be your Bloomberg intelligence in 320 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:49,360 Speaker 1: Bloomberg economics work, which is you have certainly your job 321 00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:51,639 Speaker 1: is not to predict what the Fed will do, but 322 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 1: you have stated very coherently, here's why we're going to 323 00:18:55,920 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: see a rate rise or even two of them. That's 324 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: the backdrop of all this chit chat, isn't it is? 325 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 1: He's never been as far away from the markets as 326 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 1: he is right now. Absolutely, I think the Fed has 327 00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:10,679 Speaker 1: been rattled. Uh, they've lost a little bit of their 328 00:19:10,720 --> 00:19:13,640 Speaker 1: confidence after what happened in Q four and the less, 329 00:19:15,200 --> 00:19:18,080 Speaker 1: you don't raise rates when equities are already down about 330 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:20,520 Speaker 1: twelve percent going into the meeting unless you really want 331 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:22,840 Speaker 1: to create a foul mood. And so they did that. 332 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 1: They made that communications blunder, and they had to backtrack. 333 00:19:25,560 --> 00:19:28,479 Speaker 1: As a result, they're now less confident that they have 334 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 1: the tea leaves right in the economy. And so I 335 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:35,119 Speaker 1: think we're now looking at a more reactionary FED in 336 00:19:35,160 --> 00:19:40,439 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen compared to eighteen. And that reactionary behavior means 337 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:43,520 Speaker 1: that as we get more inflation heading into mid year, 338 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:50,199 Speaker 1: they're gonna reverse course on a bad day. Where's the inflation? 339 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: Just because the inflation inflation for the last eight years 340 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:56,880 Speaker 1: doesn't mean they'll be wrong in twenty nineteen. Here's where 341 00:19:56,920 --> 00:20:00,200 Speaker 1: the inflation is. It's in goods, it's in services, it's 342 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:04,119 Speaker 1: in wages. Inflation is up forty BIPs over the course 343 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:06,720 Speaker 1: of the last year. That acceleration is going to extend 344 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,280 Speaker 1: into nineteen as the economy continues to operate above trend 345 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 1: dangerous words and economics, this time is different. What is 346 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: different in twenty nineteen. We've gone through full employment and 347 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:22,800 Speaker 1: we're starting to see changes the voice. The voice changes. 348 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,000 Speaker 1: He knows what's coming. Is that you should see him. 349 00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 1: He can bring a bar to a complete halt. On 350 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 1: Newtonian I've decided that I prefer timohitie, Why don't you 351 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:34,520 Speaker 1: step in here and look alone? Rick Odonna fired up 352 00:20:35,640 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 1: inflation second half of the year. Okay, so the feed 353 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:41,679 Speaker 1: sits there, inflation starts creeping a little bit higher. Then 354 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 1: all the duom crew come out and say, twenties coming, 355 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:46,400 Speaker 1: it's not going to be pretty. Why do they hike 356 00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 1: into that? Sure, they hike into that because they simply 357 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,920 Speaker 1: won't have the tolerance to sit on their hands as 358 00:20:52,920 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 1: they reassess economic conditions at mid year and realize, Okay, 359 00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:58,280 Speaker 1: we had a bit of a soft patch towards the 360 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:00,440 Speaker 1: end of eighteen and the first part of nine team, 361 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,920 Speaker 1: we had an earnings recession, possibly not an outright recession, 362 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 1: and earnings recession that has subsequently passed, and we have 363 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:12,000 Speaker 1: an economy operating above trend. We have inflation above their target, 364 00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:14,600 Speaker 1: and we have wage pressures at the highest at the 365 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 1: fastest pace of the cycle, and we're seeing evidence that 366 00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:21,360 Speaker 1: those wage pressures are indeed passing through into consumer prices. 367 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:25,560 Speaker 1: And they realize a setting of zero on real interest 368 00:21:25,640 --> 00:21:28,679 Speaker 1: rates is not What about the argument the inflation is 369 00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:30,320 Speaker 1: on the shelf for so long that we need to 370 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,640 Speaker 1: let an overshoot take place for a little while. Well, 371 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,480 Speaker 1: this site is happening very pumpluent, something Gina highlighted and 372 00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 1: something they're considering. Do you simply reset the clock every 373 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,440 Speaker 1: year on January one and say, let's aim for two 374 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:45,240 Speaker 1: percent this year, or do you say we need to 375 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:47,639 Speaker 1: make up for lost time? Really important, and this is 376 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:50,159 Speaker 1: the at the FED, and they're not clear on what 377 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 1: the answer what is the history, What is the history 378 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 1: of the quote overshoot unquote? Can they can they establish 379 00:21:56,680 --> 00:22:00,920 Speaker 1: a policy to overshoot two percent? It's not in their DNA, 380 00:22:00,960 --> 00:22:04,080 Speaker 1: it's not in their history. It's not in history. It's 381 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:08,600 Speaker 1: not in their DNA. If we're looking at me, absolutely 382 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 1: asymmetric by definition, and you can see that in inflation expectations. 383 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:16,120 Speaker 1: Right as soon as we're overshooting their two percent target, 384 00:22:16,320 --> 00:22:19,640 Speaker 1: they're gonna panic and start pushing more heavily on the intrket. 385 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: How many basis points does a tenure pop um? Given 386 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 1: the asymmetric nature, nature, the lack of history, we get 387 00:22:26,800 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: the rick of Donna world. What's it gonna do to 388 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:31,560 Speaker 1: my portfolio on my yield market? Sure well, it's gonna 389 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,840 Speaker 1: push yield back up to the levels I think that's 390 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,080 Speaker 1: a fair assessment. Or even more, as we return to 391 00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:40,680 Speaker 1: what yields looked like in the latter half of last year, 392 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 1: those are still pretty low yields. The real yield will 393 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,880 Speaker 1: be the unreal yield because real yields will disappear. Can 394 00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 1: bring an important point. The FED is gonna let the 395 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:52,720 Speaker 1: market lead the way on this. If FED doesn't want 396 00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 1: to job own the market into rate hikes. If Fed's 397 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: gonna sit back and say patient, patient, patient until the 398 00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:01,480 Speaker 1: market is crying for rate hikes, and then jed to 399 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:03,840 Speaker 1: oblige you touched on something important. Car. Just to wrap 400 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:08,199 Speaker 1: this conversation up, real rates at the Federal Reserve, we 401 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:12,680 Speaker 1: are barely real. We are essentially at zero. Sensitive are 402 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:16,480 Speaker 1: they to that the economy has never slowed or gone 403 00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 1: into recession with rates as low as they are right now? 404 00:23:19,400 --> 00:23:24,240 Speaker 1: Yet yet people think we might have gone through neutral 405 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:27,240 Speaker 1: with the rate where it is right now. And then July, 406 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,399 Speaker 1: when we're next talking about the semianual testimony of the 407 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:33,600 Speaker 1: FED chair on Capitol Hill, will reassess and say we 408 00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:37,080 Speaker 1: weren't at neutral and the economy is still growing above trend. 409 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:39,520 Speaker 1: You've gotta be proud. Did you see how Pharaoh jumped 410 00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:43,760 Speaker 1: right there to elasticities and FED dynamics. You're going to 411 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 1: test those elasticities. Donna very Um, Crystal very Newton about 412 00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 1: the second half of this year in ran the minute 413 00:23:52,320 --> 00:24:07,840 Speaker 1: at the at the Tower, I wanted to have a 414 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,960 Speaker 1: good discussion now with where we are in two thousand 415 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:15,480 Speaker 1: nineteen and maybe project to the future of our fractious 416 00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,440 Speaker 1: international relations in the Pacifics, and you can, of course 417 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:22,000 Speaker 1: do that with James Travitas, formerly with Tough University, now 418 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:25,000 Speaker 1: the Carlisle Group and noted author. But I think I 419 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:28,880 Speaker 1: need to step back, as I have the last few days, Admiral, 420 00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,960 Speaker 1: in trying to bring a little history into what is 421 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:37,280 Speaker 1: west of the Red River, what is near the wonderful 422 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:42,399 Speaker 1: like of the restored sword in Hanoi, and discussions of 423 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,880 Speaker 1: a prison and discussions of a hotel where the President 424 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:50,199 Speaker 1: eight and just left moments ago. But let me begin 425 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:57,640 Speaker 1: with your Hanoi of seventy two, when you wandered out 426 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:02,399 Speaker 1: to San Diego on the US Jewett. What was Vietnam 427 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,119 Speaker 1: like when you first put out the sea. What a 428 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:10,440 Speaker 1: wonderful question, Tom. The war was on the down slope. 429 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 1: You'll recall we had withdrawn almost all of the U. 430 00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:17,040 Speaker 1: S troops at that point. We were continuing to fund 431 00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: the South Vietnamese security forces. They were holding their own 432 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:25,520 Speaker 1: against the viet Cong. And then, unfortunately, before I even 433 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:29,600 Speaker 1: left the Naval Academy UH by seventy five, we cut 434 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 1: off that funding. Saigon fell now a toki Min city 435 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,600 Speaker 1: helicopters lifting off the rooftop from the Embassy's not a 436 00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:42,080 Speaker 1: good outcome. Flash forward, now these forty plus years, we're 437 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,679 Speaker 1: in a positive relationship with Vietnam. I never could have 438 00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 1: imagined that back in the nineteenth seven. What should those 439 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,720 Speaker 1: older think, who remember the name Alvarez and remember the 440 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 1: name Thompson, our two longest POWs, how should they interpret 441 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:04,240 Speaker 1: where we are in two thousand nineteen. I have spoken 442 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:07,000 Speaker 1: to many of the POWs over the years, including to 443 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 1: the most famous of them, Senator John McCain, who spent 444 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,840 Speaker 1: seven years in the Hanoi Hilton. I had visited his 445 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,639 Speaker 1: cell in the Hanoi Hilton, the Prison Hilton, and uh, 446 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,360 Speaker 1: they will tell you universally the POWs that they are 447 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:27,199 Speaker 1: happy to see a reduction intentions between the United States 448 00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: and Vietnam. Um. They have risen above the pain in 449 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,200 Speaker 1: the anguish they went through, and we had to salute 450 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:36,920 Speaker 1: every single one. How do you, as a former admiral 451 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 1: and retired with a great distinction, and as an author, 452 00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 1: how do you interpret the President's tweet this morning going 453 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:47,919 Speaker 1: after the Senator from Connecticut, who I believe was a 454 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:52,720 Speaker 1: Marine reservist, and with the various deferments and and and 455 00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:55,719 Speaker 1: all that, how do you interpret that tweet? This morning, 456 00:26:55,800 --> 00:27:00,320 Speaker 1: Admiral Um, I'm disheartened by it. I think this is 457 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:04,480 Speaker 1: a Senator Bluementhal who's not only a Marine Corps veteran, 458 00:27:05,040 --> 00:27:07,119 Speaker 1: h he has a son who's a seal and another 459 00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,800 Speaker 1: son who's a Marine Corps officer. Um, he's someone Blumenthal 460 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,960 Speaker 1: who cares deeply about the country. What I hate to 461 00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:19,160 Speaker 1: see going both ways, Tom, is this ad hominum attitude 462 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,879 Speaker 1: of personal attack. We've got big policy issues we have 463 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 1: to solve as a nation. Let's rise above the horrible 464 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:30,280 Speaker 1: tweets and the name calling in the insults. Let's get 465 00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,240 Speaker 1: after what we have to get done, to include solving 466 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: this challenge with North Korea. Give us an update on 467 00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,679 Speaker 1: where we should be with a DMZ in North Korea 468 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:44,919 Speaker 1: in two years or in five years. I'd say, in 469 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:49,000 Speaker 1: the most optimistic case, in two years we will have 470 00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:53,360 Speaker 1: obtained an inventory of North Korean nuclear weapons. I think 471 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:56,320 Speaker 1: in five years we may be able to put in 472 00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:02,160 Speaker 1: place an international observation regime around those nuclear weapons. But Tom, 473 00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:04,239 Speaker 1: I'll tell you the bad news is, I think the 474 00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:08,640 Speaker 1: chances of Kim john On actually giving up those weapons 475 00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,000 Speaker 1: completely are roughly the same as the chances of the 476 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:16,280 Speaker 1: Mexicans paying for the wall. I'd say they approach negative infinity. 477 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,120 Speaker 1: So we've got to be mindful of how we can 478 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: contain his nuclear capability. Uh, the President's dealing with a 479 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:28,880 Speaker 1: very tricky, very lethal foe in these negotiations. I wish 480 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:32,080 Speaker 1: him well, but I'm very concerned. I've been surprised and 481 00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,239 Speaker 1: well if you're just joining us. James trevidis with us 482 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,160 Speaker 1: with a Carlisle group, and we're thrilled that he could 483 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,600 Speaker 1: be with us on this historic to day. The President 484 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:41,680 Speaker 1: meeting again with Mr Kim of North Korea. They have 485 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 1: just had dinner at the Metropole in North Korea and 486 00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:49,600 Speaker 1: the President has left all twenty minutes ago or so 487 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 1: from that dinner in the late night of Hannoi, Vietnam. 488 00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 1: Almos Trevidez. There is Busan naval base, which I believe 489 00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,920 Speaker 1: is the follow on South Korean naval based to JENNI 490 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:06,280 Speaker 1: explain our support of South Korea and what South Korea 491 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 1: needs to see from this summit. I'm glad you bring 492 00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:12,680 Speaker 1: that up, Tom, because we spend way too much time 493 00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,680 Speaker 1: yelling at the North Koreans and not enough time talking 494 00:29:16,760 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: to the South Koreans who understand the North Koreans in 495 00:29:20,600 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 1: three dimensional ways that we will never completely get. So 496 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 1: you mentioned Bussan, the naval base in the South. It's 497 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:33,160 Speaker 1: emblematic of this deep military and intelligence and cyber relationship 498 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:36,040 Speaker 1: we have with South Korea. What the South Koreans want 499 00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 1: to see is war avoidance, but they also want to 500 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:45,040 Speaker 1: see continued deterrence of Kim's not only his nuclear force 501 00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:47,640 Speaker 1: tom but his conventional forces. He is one of the 502 00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 1: largest standing armies in the world. He has extensive stocks 503 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 1: of chemical and biological weapons. If we do solve the 504 00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: nuclear problem, the South Koreans want us there to continue 505 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:05,960 Speaker 1: to deter those conventional forces. Whether Democrat or Republican, How 506 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 1: do we affect a policy or initiate a policy with 507 00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:15,640 Speaker 1: North Korea given what is clear documented human rights abused, 508 00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:19,120 Speaker 1: as you mentioned chemical weapons just as one idea, but 509 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:21,480 Speaker 1: I mean some of the reports I've seen, which I 510 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 1: would suggest folks are documented ore outright labor camps which 511 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,720 Speaker 1: are literally out of the fiction of Game of Thrones, 512 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:34,800 Speaker 1: except it's not Hollywood or or London based fiction. It's real. 513 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:38,239 Speaker 1: How do we affect a policy with a nation like that, 514 00:30:38,440 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 1: or a regime I should say like that you know. 515 00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:45,280 Speaker 1: Henry Kissinger said to me once, Tom that every time 516 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,560 Speaker 1: we solve a problem, we are presented with a key 517 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:53,240 Speaker 1: to a door through which lies the next problem. And 518 00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 1: if we can solve the nuclear problem, I would argue 519 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:59,160 Speaker 1: that door that we're going to open is going to 520 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:03,080 Speaker 1: have to leave us ultimately to further sanctions on North 521 00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 1: Korea for running these labor camps. And I would direct 522 00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:07,960 Speaker 1: your readers. You and I always talk about books. I 523 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,959 Speaker 1: would direct your readers to a National Book Award winner, 524 00:31:11,280 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 1: The Orphan Master's Son by Steve Johnson, which is a 525 00:31:15,240 --> 00:31:20,320 Speaker 1: searing portrait of this utopian society. Which door does China 526 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: want opened? And by Beijing? And I don't mean the 527 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:26,960 Speaker 1: fixation I have on Shanghai or Hong Kong or that, 528 00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:31,560 Speaker 1: but the northeast China and that river across the North Korea. 529 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:37,360 Speaker 1: Which uh door does China want opened? On? Off this summit. 530 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,600 Speaker 1: I'll tell you the one that don't want opened is 531 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,680 Speaker 1: they don't want a war on the Korean peninsula because 532 00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:47,520 Speaker 1: that would open the door to millions of refugees flowing 533 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,320 Speaker 1: into China. Okay, so there's twenty that there's twenty five 534 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 1: million admiral in North Korea. How many of those millions 535 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 1: would would drift over into China off of twenty three 536 00:31:56,640 --> 00:32:01,200 Speaker 1: or million, five, five to seven million, And so China 537 00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:04,200 Speaker 1: has skinned in the game here. And I would argue 538 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:07,480 Speaker 1: the Korean Peninsula is a problem we can solve with 539 00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: China because to get to Kim, all roads to pun 540 00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 1: Yang in the end top be to Beijing. We've got 541 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: to get China in the game. Four party talks are 542 00:32:17,880 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 1: the way to go. Let's get out of this one 543 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:23,480 Speaker 1: on one between the President and Chairman Kim James Travitas, 544 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: thank you so much. I am so choked up emotionally 545 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:41,920 Speaker 1: that I'm gonna have to have you bring in our 546 00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:46,000 Speaker 1: next esteem guest. Folks, it's impossible to believe this. It's 547 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,400 Speaker 1: sort of like the end of Raiders Have Lost Arc 548 00:32:48,440 --> 00:32:51,360 Speaker 1: where they take the Ark into the Pentagon and it's 549 00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,680 Speaker 1: you know wherever they are in the warehouse. If I 550 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:56,120 Speaker 1: take the Ark into the warehouse and it's lost there 551 00:32:56,720 --> 00:33:00,880 Speaker 1: somewhere out there on the Bloomberg terminal is the audio 552 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:05,840 Speaker 1: of my first time I was ever on Bloomberg Radio. 553 00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:10,280 Speaker 1: I have that audio. We need to get it. I 554 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:15,320 Speaker 1: was the sweat, I was so nervous and shaking as 555 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 1: I was grilled and they say grilled by our next guest, 556 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:22,680 Speaker 1: and she was a saint to let me get through 557 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 1: exactly by lengthy interview of two minutes seconds. Well, that 558 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 1: would be the one June Grosso. June is co host 559 00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:36,960 Speaker 1: of Bloomberg Politics, Policy, Power and Law, and that's every 560 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,480 Speaker 1: day at twelve Eastern in uh in the East shop. 561 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 1: I haven't eight years, I know, it just comes by 562 00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:47,720 Speaker 1: my desk. And so June, we're looking here at this 563 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,920 Speaker 1: on the our monitor here in Michael Cohen. The folks 564 00:33:51,920 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 1: in conquissrgating seat and getting ready for this. So this 565 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,760 Speaker 1: Michael Cohen hearing that is coming up the testimony, What 566 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 1: do you expect to really here today? May I first 567 00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:07,440 Speaker 1: paraphrase Betty Davis who said, fasten your seatbelts. It's going 568 00:34:07,480 --> 00:34:10,160 Speaker 1: to be a bumpy ride today. There's a lot of 569 00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:13,680 Speaker 1: uncertainty here, Isn't there there is? But if you know, 570 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:16,440 Speaker 1: I'd read his statement, his opening statement, and that's just 571 00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:21,480 Speaker 1: the opening salvo, and he starts out saying that President 572 00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 1: Trump is a racist, a comment of cheat, and then 573 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:28,840 Speaker 1: he goes into specific instances and specific incidents that we 574 00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,120 Speaker 1: have been talking about for perhaps two years back it up. 575 00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 1: Is it loyally? It's not. It's it's not loyally, except 576 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:41,560 Speaker 1: that there is a part where he backs up what 577 00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:44,560 Speaker 1: he says some of what he says with evidence. And 578 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:47,239 Speaker 1: you know, we've talked about this before, but it's very 579 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,400 Speaker 1: important because they're going to attack him as and he 580 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:53,400 Speaker 1: admits he's a liar. He's a convicted liar. Okay, But June, 581 00:34:53,760 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 1: you know you're too young to remember the John Dene moment. 582 00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:00,880 Speaker 1: I you know, remember the John Dee moment. I'm looking 583 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:04,040 Speaker 1: at the cameras right now. This is a huge, huge 584 00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 1: turnout for this hearing. Are we going to have a 585 00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:11,759 Speaker 1: John Dene moment like in Watergate of lore? It might 586 00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:15,040 Speaker 1: be close to a John Dene moment? Remember something, John Dene, 587 00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 1: his testimony became so riveting and so important because it 588 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: was then backed up by the tapes, the tapes, the 589 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,920 Speaker 1: Nixon tapes. In this instance, you're not likely going to 590 00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:32,239 Speaker 1: have that. You may have some canceled not only that, 591 00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 1: you have canceled checks, you have financial records that he 592 00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 1: sent to Deutsche Banks. So you do have. And that's 593 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,799 Speaker 1: why I say it is loyally in part because he 594 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:45,000 Speaker 1: does have the backup, and I think that you're going 595 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: to hear things that people have said and we're suspected, 596 00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:50,319 Speaker 1: and he's going to say they're true. For example, you're 597 00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:52,920 Speaker 1: going to hear about the hush money payments to Stormy Daniels. 598 00:35:52,960 --> 00:35:56,759 Speaker 1: That's the canceled check. Yes, Um, I'll explain that you 599 00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 1: after after the show. Okay, Um, the hush mon payments 600 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:03,440 Speaker 1: to Stormy damimals that he knew about the release of 601 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:07,080 Speaker 1: the hacked wiki leaks and things that Michael Cohen heard, 602 00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,799 Speaker 1: things that he saw, And I think his testimony also 603 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 1: has a sort of um literary side to it. I mean, 604 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:17,120 Speaker 1: he's he has certain things that he says that that 605 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:21,719 Speaker 1: you will appreciate. He said, uh that Donald Trump is 606 00:36:21,719 --> 00:36:24,560 Speaker 1: a man who ran for office to make his brand great, 607 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,959 Speaker 1: not to make our country great. So there are little 608 00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:29,279 Speaker 1: things sprinkled in there that you'll ensure. You think there's 609 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:33,560 Speaker 1: a smoking gun that will come out today. I think 610 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:36,480 Speaker 1: that when it won't be so much of smoking gun. 611 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:39,120 Speaker 1: We know the smoking gun now because we've seen his testimony. 612 00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:41,120 Speaker 1: That's a smoking gun. But things that we have been 613 00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:46,400 Speaker 1: questioning for years. Taxes, you know, all the financial statements, 614 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,000 Speaker 1: the dealings with Russia. This is the man who did 615 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:52,520 Speaker 1: all that, who was his personal attorney, his fixer. So yeah, 616 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:55,080 Speaker 1: I think they're gonna be some moments where there might 617 00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,120 Speaker 1: be bombshell moments and it and it depends on what 618 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:01,839 Speaker 1: they ask. What is his approach here so he does 619 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:08,040 Speaker 1: not jeopardize his future with other prosecutions, other legal events. 620 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:11,920 Speaker 1: I don't think he is. I don't think he's considering that. 621 00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:15,000 Speaker 1: I think he's going all out for it. He's facing prison. 622 00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:17,960 Speaker 1: He's not a jail yet. He's going to be in 623 00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:22,279 Speaker 1: jail for three years, and um no, there's this is 624 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:24,839 Speaker 1: the thing. In order for him to reduce that prison Tom, 625 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:28,120 Speaker 1: you have to have a prosecutor come forward and say 626 00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,640 Speaker 1: to a judge, Judge, I want you to reconsider this 627 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:35,560 Speaker 1: because the Southern District prosecutors are not happy with him 628 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:37,920 Speaker 1: because he lied to them to start out with. Mueller 629 00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:40,400 Speaker 1: has already really dealt with him. So the question is 630 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:42,759 Speaker 1: who would do that? So he is going to go 631 00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,560 Speaker 1: all out here. I can't imagine him holding anything back 632 00:37:45,600 --> 00:37:48,120 Speaker 1: except for what Muller has said. He can't because I 633 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,839 Speaker 1: have legal representation today. Or is he just showing up 634 00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:54,080 Speaker 1: as a guy on his way to prison. He does 635 00:37:54,160 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 1: have legal representation. However, I think that it's going to 636 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,640 Speaker 1: be mostly you're going to hear people object and that, 637 00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:04,080 Speaker 1: you know, in other ways, you can't say that because 638 00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:07,319 Speaker 1: we have this smaller investigation going on, that will be 639 00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,799 Speaker 1: the only thing that stops him. And let's just say 640 00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,319 Speaker 1: one thing, because the Republicans are going to attack him 641 00:38:12,320 --> 00:38:14,520 Speaker 1: as a liar. But I just want to remind everyone 642 00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:17,840 Speaker 1: that in courtrooms across the country today, they're going to 643 00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,440 Speaker 1: be people who are the prime witnesses for the prosecution, 644 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:24,520 Speaker 1: who have lied, who have cheated, who have stolen, and 645 00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:28,480 Speaker 1: they'll be believed by juries because they'll have corroboration. Important 646 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:30,919 Speaker 1: so aside, and you bring up the good point, which 647 00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:32,759 Speaker 1: is this, obviously this is not a jury trial, and 648 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,800 Speaker 1: it's more about public relations and getting information out there. Arguably, 649 00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:39,080 Speaker 1: But if if I'm a Republican senator on this community today, 650 00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,880 Speaker 1: what's my most effective way to challenge the testimony of 651 00:38:41,920 --> 00:38:45,640 Speaker 1: Michael Cohen. You're a convicted liar. You lied before, Why 652 00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:48,480 Speaker 1: should we believe you now? Why aren't you lying now? Different? 653 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:51,040 Speaker 1: Because he'll give a piece of evidence, right, he will. 654 00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:53,520 Speaker 1: For some of this he can't get evidence for all 655 00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:55,920 Speaker 1: of this, and even some of the evidence. You know, 656 00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:58,400 Speaker 1: I can imagine, and you know what is very I've 657 00:38:58,680 --> 00:39:01,480 Speaker 1: struck me this morning. Some of the ramblings of Rudy 658 00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 1: Giuliani makes sense. Now. Remember when he remember when he 659 00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:11,040 Speaker 1: described he kept backing, backing up about the Stormy Daniels 660 00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 1: hush payments, and finally he said, well, we really will 661 00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:18,880 Speaker 1: have a talk after promise. Yeah, that's okay, No, but 662 00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:21,000 Speaker 1: he will say he said, all of a sudden he 663 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:23,439 Speaker 1: came out with this, Well, there were payments that came 664 00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:26,359 Speaker 1: into the into his lawyer's office, and his lawyer then 665 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:30,120 Speaker 1: and now we see why there's a canceled check. Yeah. 666 00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:35,560 Speaker 1: So it's thank you so much, pleasure, appreciate, and I 667 00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 1: am willing to borrow over that tape I have of you. 668 00:39:40,239 --> 00:39:42,919 Speaker 1: It's out there, folks, it's it's out there, and soon 669 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:46,680 Speaker 1: they'll be testimony in front Congress. Wonderful always to have 670 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,479 Speaker 1: June Grass with us with her patients a few years ago. 671 00:39:50,600 --> 00:40:01,680 Speaker 1: So thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Subscribe 672 00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:06,640 Speaker 1: and listen to interviews on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whichever 673 00:40:06,800 --> 00:40:10,840 Speaker 1: podcast platform you prefer. I'm on Twitter at Tom Keene 674 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:15,000 Speaker 1: before the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide. I'm 675 00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:15,920 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio.