Speaker 1: Booked a call with a TikTok coach and it went
Speaker 1: viral almost immediately, and.
Speaker 2: I was like, this is it. This is what I'm
Speaker 2: supposed to be doing.
Speaker 1: Anybody that does something to land themselves in jail for
Speaker 1: a month is not somebody you should be dating.
Speaker 3: What does this person from the moment you meet them?
Speaker 3: What are they doing to your nervous system?
Speaker 1: Most of the time women can't let go of what
Speaker 1: doesn't serve them anymore, and they don't realize if I
Speaker 1: just let oh of this, I'm going to create so
Speaker 1: much space for what I really want to come into
Speaker 1: my life.
Speaker 3: Oh I really want these butterflies and the excitement they
Speaker 3: use to dating traumatic men.
Speaker 2: If it's not working out Shift Gears.
Speaker 3: I'm Radi Wukiah and on my podcast a Really Good Cry,
Speaker 3: we embrace the messy and the beautiful, providing a space
Speaker 3: for raw, unfiltered conversations that celebrate vulnerability and allow you
Speaker 3: to tune in to learn, connect and find comfort together.
Speaker 3: So I want to know, Wow, you got started and
Speaker 3: what brought you to the genie or now.
Speaker 1: I always knew I wanted to do something creative since
Speaker 1: I was a very little kid, and I knew I
Speaker 1: loved performing and telling stories, and I was a theater kid,
Speaker 1: and you know, I think my parents always said, like,
Speaker 1: you should allow your children to do what they want
Speaker 1: to do, because if they want to do something, it's.
Speaker 2: Very likely that they're good at it.
Speaker 1: And that rang pretty true for me because I was
Speaker 1: really terrible at math and science and all the things
Speaker 1: that Asian immigrant kids are supposed to be good at.
Speaker 1: All of their friends who had come over from China
Speaker 1: around the same generation and had children around my age,
Speaker 1: they were all getting full scores on their SATs in
Speaker 1: eighth grade when they were taking early SAT exams and everything,
Speaker 1: and I just I was academically decent, but I was
Speaker 1: never a genius when it came to be like reading
Speaker 1: and everything like that. So I just kind of real
Speaker 1: just like, I'm not into sports, I'm not into math
Speaker 1: and sciences. I was actually very good at writing and
Speaker 1: I like performing, and so that kind of hits you
Speaker 1: at a young age and you kind of realize you
Speaker 1: like that. So I went to college always knowing like
Speaker 1: I kind of wanted to be a performer, but I
Speaker 1: didn't really know what. So I tried out the singer's
Speaker 1: songwriter route, for about twenty five seconds, and I realized
Speaker 1: I was like, this is not it. I don't have
Speaker 1: a great voice, nor can I write amazing songs. So
Speaker 1: then I was like, I'm going to be an actress.
Speaker 1: And I left NYU with a liberal arts degree with
Speaker 1: the intention of giving myself the next eight years to
Speaker 1: try making it as an actress. And it was an
Speaker 1: incredibly unstable eight years, but you know, I learned a
Speaker 1: lot and through that I was also trying to find
Speaker 1: a husband, and so there was a lot of instability.
Speaker 1: I did a lot of gigwork, a lot of jobs
Speaker 1: I didn't want to do. Eventually, I did find my
Speaker 1: way into real estate, which was a great kind of
Speaker 1: day job because it gave me the flexibil to go
Speaker 1: on auditions, but also gave me somewhat of a stable income.
Speaker 1: By the time I met my husband, I was on
Speaker 1: pretty solid ground in terms of, like my finances, which
Speaker 1: was really important, and I honestly think that that gave
Speaker 1: me so much confidence in my late twenties to be like,
Speaker 1: I would love a man in my life right now,
Speaker 1: but I can take care of myself and I can
Speaker 1: save money, and I don't need somebody to take care
Speaker 1: of me like that. And I think when you feel
Speaker 1: confident in yourself and what you have to offer, you
Speaker 1: walk into a first date so much more relaxed and
Speaker 1: so much more yourself like I would like to have this,
Speaker 1: but I don't need this, And I think the timing
Speaker 1: was right. And so by the time we got together,
Speaker 1: I was in my late twenties, he was in He
Speaker 1: was thirty four, and then the pandemic hit and everything
Speaker 1: went to utter shit. I was working in real estate
Speaker 1: and I was an actress, which are two very non
Speaker 1: COVID friendly jobs. And then we moved to Connecticut because
Speaker 1: that's where his job was, and you know, we didn't
Speaker 1: want him commuting on the train and everything, and so
Speaker 1: I kind of had a lonother quarter life crisis at
Speaker 1: thirty and I was like, what am I going to do?
Speaker 1: Like auditions ground to a halt. I didn't have my
Speaker 1: real estate job anymore because we were in a different
Speaker 1: place and real estate is very local. So I did
Speaker 1: what any practical thirty year old would do. Instead of
Speaker 1: getting my real estate license and starting over in a
Speaker 1: new state, I was like, I'm.
Speaker 2: Going to start a blog.
Speaker 1: I started a word press of all things in twenty twenty,
Speaker 1: when everyone's already getting on TikTok, right, everyone's blowing up
Speaker 1: on TikTok. I was just like, I think word press
Speaker 1: and Instagram is the way to go. And I started
Speaker 1: off trying to do home decorp because I didn't want
Speaker 1: to be on camera because I think, to me, I
Speaker 1: love design and everything. But it almost felt safer to
Speaker 1: me because I was like, I'm not showing my face,
Speaker 1: and so it's almost like if it doesn't do well,
Speaker 1: it's like my face, and I didn't have to be
Speaker 1: as vulnerable. It was just like my designs right. And
Speaker 1: then I was like, I can't redecorate my living room
Speaker 1: eight thousand times. I have so much respect for home
Speaker 1: day core bloggers who just continuously come up with these
Speaker 1: magical creations like Lone Fox Home the way he just
Speaker 1: like does his house over and over again. He's like,
Speaker 1: I found this vintage piece on the back of like
Speaker 1: a horse and buggy and Amish country, and I just say,
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh my god, that's incredible. And that's just
Speaker 1: like a passion and a love for it that I
Speaker 1: just didn't have. I was like, okay, so what next.
Speaker 1: So then I was like, well, everybody's doing fashion. So
Speaker 1: I tried to do fashion for a bit that also
Speaker 1: didn't work out, and so I probably should have quit.
Speaker 1: Honestly many times. I was two years in basically and
Speaker 1: to very little fruition. I think I had like twenty
Speaker 1: five hundred followers, about a thousand of those for people
Speaker 1: I knew, and I didn't know what was going on,
Speaker 1: and so I just.
Speaker 2: Booked a call with a TikTok coach.
Speaker 1: I was like, let's see what I'm doing wrong, right,
Speaker 1: and she goes, I think you should start talking to
Speaker 1: camera because you have the personality to talk to camera,
Speaker 1: Like you should not be doing these fashion reels where
Speaker 1: nobody hears you, and why don't you try that?
Speaker 2: Tell a story?
Speaker 1: And I was like, okay, what do I you know,
Speaker 1: it's like when you get to a certain age, like
Speaker 1: what am I good at? So I was like, I
Speaker 1: had a lot of crazy dating experiences and I know
Speaker 1: how to do my makeup.
Speaker 2: So I just did that.
Speaker 1: I told a story and it went viral almost immediately,
Speaker 1: and I am very quick to change course when I
Speaker 1: realized I need to, and I was like, this is it,
Speaker 1: this is what I'm supposed to be doing, and it's
Speaker 1: just been crazy since it's been two years.
Speaker 2: Two years.
Speaker 3: Props to your parents for being so open to you
Speaker 3: doing what you love versus what they might have expected
Speaker 3: you to do. So that's actually quite I feel like,
Speaker 3: especially in Asian communities, South Asian and I'm sure your community.
Speaker 2: There is where we are from the same.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's like, really, arts, is that really what you
Speaker 3: want to do? Like anything creative is kind of like hmm,
Speaker 3: But that's so wonderful that they really encouraged you in that,
Speaker 3: and that makes such a difference.
Speaker 2: They always supported me. I think they were very worried
Speaker 2: by the way they want like, oh yeah, it'll be fine.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: They were like this is not great, especially in your
Speaker 1: early twenties, mid twenties.
Speaker 2: You she'll figure it out.
Speaker 1: My dad was like I always just assumed you would
Speaker 1: hit thirty and if it didn't work out, you would
Speaker 1: just go get a sales job.
Speaker 2: Everybody was always like, go get a job in sales.
Speaker 1: I'm like, because you like to talk, right, I was
Speaker 1: like selling what, Like, there's nothing that I'm that passionate
Speaker 1: about in terms of like somebody told me to be
Speaker 1: like go into pharma sales. I was like that's so boring,
Speaker 1: you know, so you know it's but they were very nervous.
Speaker 1: I think they just realized I was also so stubborn
Speaker 1: that I was.
Speaker 2: Never going to do it anyway.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it obviously worked out, but it was a
Speaker 1: long It was a long journey together. I was thirty
Speaker 1: two before I made a dime off of social media
Speaker 1: and being a creative. And so it's like, I think
Speaker 1: when people get discouraged because it's not happening, it's like,
Speaker 1: don't quit before you get there. Like if magine, if
Speaker 1: i'd quit a year before I went viral, that would
Speaker 1: have been the final stop.
Speaker 3: But's so good that you're so aware of when you
Speaker 3: need to change course and that you still have the
Speaker 3: motivation to keep doing that, like looking back and reflecting
Speaker 3: what was it that allowed you to keep changing course
Speaker 3: and still having belief in what you were doing, Because,
Speaker 3: like you said, most people would quit. What stopped you
Speaker 3: from quitting?
Speaker 1: Not having another choice is actually really good because I
Speaker 1: honestly think that sometimes when you have a backup plan,
Speaker 1: you just fall back on that backup.
Speaker 3: Plan feel safer.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So I'm not saying be fiscally irresponsible. I'm just saying
Speaker 1: that you know, don't have a comfortable job that you
Speaker 1: can live with but you don't love as a backup plan,
Speaker 1: because if it's not working out and what you love,
Speaker 1: oftentimes you will just fall back and stay there. I
Speaker 1: think the other thing too, is that I saw my
Speaker 1: parents come to this country and make it from impossible circumstances,
Speaker 1: and I always had that in the back of my
Speaker 1: mind that if they could make it here with far
Speaker 1: less resources than I had and far less support.
Speaker 2: Then it was going to be okay.
Speaker 1: That whatever I was going to do was not ever
Speaker 1: going to be as catastrophic as what they would have
Speaker 1: endured if they had lost in their life. And for
Speaker 1: me it was also like, I think the biggest thing too,
Speaker 1: for anybody who's a creative or anybody who's an entrepreneur
Speaker 1: or has a crazy idea that doesn't fit convention, the
Speaker 1: biggest thing you have to lose is actually your ego
Speaker 1: and your pride. Yeah, that is the toughest thing to
Speaker 1: have to swallow. It's not so much the fact it's
Speaker 1: like time spent on creating content or whatever. It's time
Speaker 1: spent on creating content and putting it out into the
Speaker 1: world and not having it do well and knowing that
Speaker 1: maybe the people in your life are.
Speaker 3: Like, ooh, you know exactly exactly, and everybody experiences that
Speaker 3: in the beginning.
Speaker 1: Everybody experiences that shame and just you know, I had
Speaker 1: plenty of situations for that first two years.
Speaker 2: People would ask me what I'm doing, and.
Speaker 1: I remember thinking, oh, it would be so much easier
Speaker 1: if I was just a housewife, Like that would make
Speaker 1: sense to people because I have something to say, yeah, like, oh.
Speaker 2: I've I've stopped working.
Speaker 1: I've had children, and my husband works, and you know,
Speaker 1: we were lucky enough in the sense that he worked
Speaker 1: and could support our family. But I was like, that's
Speaker 1: just not the life I want. And so I would
Speaker 1: go out and hang out at these parties with people
Speaker 1: we knew, and they'd be like, what are you doing
Speaker 1: now that you've moved to Connecticut.
Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm blogging and you just see that, you know.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, that is amazing blog.
Speaker 1: About I'm like it is just like then the word vomit,
Speaker 1: you know, the scramble comes out.
Speaker 2: And so I'm not saying I didn't feel the shame.
Speaker 2: It's just that at some.
Speaker 1: Point I knew that I was afraid of shame and
Speaker 1: afraid of not being successful and what I wanted to do.
Speaker 1: But I would be more afraid of the regret I
Speaker 1: would feel if I didn't do it exactly. So it's
Speaker 1: all about more what do you fear more? I think
Speaker 1: a lot of people are like, oh, how are you
Speaker 1: so confident? And like how did you have like how
Speaker 1: did you get rid of all that self doubt?
Speaker 2: I have self doubt.
Speaker 1: Every day and day every moment, you know, even here now.
Speaker 1: It's like you think you make it to a certain point, right.
Speaker 1: I never thought I would have a million followers on
Speaker 1: any platform combined anything.
Speaker 2: I was just hoping for ten thousand.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what was my base.
Speaker 1: And you think, oh, if I ever made it there,
Speaker 1: I would just be happy forever.
Speaker 2: I would feel calm forever.
Speaker 1: I mean, you never thought you would be here, right,
Speaker 1: And it's not ten years ago you had told twenty
Speaker 1: four year Oldrana you'd be here. You'd be like, I
Speaker 1: would never have a bad day in my life, right,
Speaker 1: But like you told me yesterday, you cry almost every week.
Speaker 3: Yeah that is fair, right.
Speaker 1: And it's not just sound ungrateful because obviously we have
Speaker 1: attained a certain level of discomfort that we didn't experience
Speaker 1: a long time ago. But it's like it is just
Speaker 1: to say that everybody struggles and just because you've you know,
Speaker 1: the goalpost keeps.
Speaker 3: Moving definitely, And I think it's just testament too. And
Speaker 3: I think the confidence also comes by the way, as
Speaker 3: knows happen in your life, the fact that you keep
Speaker 3: getting up, that actually builds confidence. It's not necessarily other
Speaker 3: people what they're saying to you. It's not the same
Speaker 3: people that asked what you were doing three years ago
Speaker 3: and you're feeling uncomfortable with them saying, Wow, what you're
Speaker 3: doing now is amazing. That actually doesn't real confidence. What
Speaker 3: builds confidence is when things don't go right, how you
Speaker 3: then react to them, and then you keep going and
Speaker 3: going and going. And I find the process and actually
Speaker 3: being active is what builds confidence rather than just sitting
Speaker 3: back and giving up. And so I think that's basically
Speaker 3: what you've done, which is incredible.
Speaker 1: Thank you, and I've tried, and you know, there's to
Speaker 1: that point, there's a really inspirational quote from Muhammad Ali
Speaker 1: that I'm going to completely mess up, but he had
Speaker 1: just lost a big fight or something. And I always
Speaker 1: remember this because I don't know. Boxing is just like
Speaker 1: you know, you win or you lose. It's such a
Speaker 1: high stakes game. You're getting punch for a living. And
Speaker 1: he had just lost a big fight and he was
Speaker 1: just basically saying, you know, it's important for my fans
Speaker 1: to see me lose because they will also lose in
Speaker 1: their life, and it's important for them to see how
Speaker 1: I handle loss and how I come back from it.
Speaker 1: And then he would go on to win the next
Speaker 1: couple of fights. But it's like I always remember that.
Speaker 3: It's like, oh gracious, yeah.
Speaker 2: Exactly, and sometimes not graciously.
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm not gracious a lot of the time,
Speaker 1: but figuring out how to get back up. I think
Speaker 1: your character is really what you do when things are
Speaker 1: not going well for you.
Speaker 2: It's so easy to be a great person.
Speaker 1: And emanate kindness and love when you know everything's going
Speaker 1: your way, But when things aren't going your way, who
Speaker 1: are you?
Speaker 2: And that's who you are?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I want to switch gears a little bit because
Speaker 3: I need to know some horrific dating stories that have
Speaker 3: happened to you that have inspired you know who? I
Speaker 3: love hearing about Chad all the Chads, well, whoever's called
Speaker 3: Chad in the world is now got you to thanks
Speaker 3: for their popularity, because I'm not saying they've got a
Speaker 3: good name, but they're definitely popular now because of you.
Speaker 2: I feel very badly for all the good chats out there.
Speaker 1: I apologize, not in advance, because the damage is done,
Speaker 1: but I apologize. I think my dating stories are not
Speaker 1: dissimilar to most women's dating stories in their twenties in
Speaker 1: any major city. I just think because I dated so
Speaker 1: many people, I maybe had more experiences to draw from,
Speaker 1: and that was purely because I just couldn't find a
Speaker 1: guy to align with that maybe I really wanted to
Speaker 1: be with a guy and he didn't really want to
Speaker 1: be with me or couldn't be with me for several reasons,
Speaker 1: and maybe he wanted to be with me the next guy,
Speaker 1: but I didn't know if I wanted to be with him,
Speaker 1: and there was a lot of exploration, and I don't
Speaker 1: think I was ready for the marriage and the relationship
Speaker 1: that I thought I was in my early twenties. But
Speaker 1: I think I was very attracted to traumatize people in
Speaker 1: my early twenties. I'll tell you a story. So when
Speaker 1: I was I think twenty three, right, out of college.
Speaker 1: Tinder had just come on the market and dating aps
Speaker 1: were really popular, and I went on a date with
Speaker 1: a guy who was almost a decade older than me.
Speaker 1: I think he was like I was twenty three, he
Speaker 1: was thirty two. Yea, and that was my age range.
Speaker 1: I said anything within ten years, I'll do anything beyond that.
Speaker 1: I was like, eh, I think, is.
Speaker 3: That when you really started thinking about dating someone for
Speaker 3: long term?
Speaker 2: Oh, I was always pretty.
Speaker 1: When he was the girl in high school that I
Speaker 1: was like, it'd be great if I just found my husband. Now,
Speaker 1: I've never been casual, so I knew I was always
Speaker 1: looking for my husband. I go on a date with
Speaker 1: this guy. He's great on paper, really good looking, quite charming,
Speaker 1: and then pretty early into the date, maybe half an
Speaker 1: hour in, he tells me that he's been to jail before.
Speaker 1: And he's not saying it in a way that like
Speaker 1: he's ashamed of it. He's almost kind of like bragging
Speaker 1: because on paper he's so clean cut, he's a finance
Speaker 1: bro and he's and I was like very intrigued because
Speaker 1: obviously that's not what I was expecting. And you knew
Speaker 1: that that it's like kind of almost a source of
Speaker 1: pride for him and that should have been a red
Speaker 1: flag to me, like, maybe don't.
Speaker 2: And because then I.
Speaker 1: Asked him, I was like, what were you in jail for?
Speaker 1: And it was actually not anything crazy. It was marijuana
Speaker 1: was very, very heavily policed fifteen years ago. So he
Speaker 1: was on his college campus and he got caught.
Speaker 3: That was his bad boycott.
Speaker 2: That was his bad boycott.
Speaker 3: I'm in finance, but I know.
Speaker 1: He was like, I'm trying to be different, right, And
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, like, maybe don't date a man
Speaker 1: who needs to lead with his you know, prison rectory.
Speaker 2: I was like, does your So it.
Speaker 1: Was really interesting because it was like does your company
Speaker 1: know that? So then it got worse too, because okay,
Speaker 1: so I had an auntie be like, why are you
Speaker 1: dating this man? So he was like yeah, So I
Speaker 1: got arrested for having weed on me and whatever, went
Speaker 1: to court. They put me on probation. They were like, okay,
Speaker 1: just whatever, do community service, all of that. Just don't
Speaker 1: get into trouble for the next three months. And then
Speaker 1: he was like, but then I got into a bar
Speaker 1: fight outside of my front house within that probation period.
Speaker 1: The cops came and then they saw that I was
Speaker 1: already in probation and then I got thrown into jail
Speaker 1: for a month. That's not an insignificant amount of time.
Speaker 1: It was like he was in a holding cell for twenty.
Speaker 2: Four hours, right exactly.
Speaker 1: So my you know, friend's mom, who was like a
Speaker 1: second mom to me, was like, anybody that does something
Speaker 1: to land themselves in jail for a month.
Speaker 2: Is not somebody you should be dating.
Speaker 1: She's like, I don't care that it was technically weed
Speaker 1: and technically because he like punched somebody, It's like, don't
Speaker 1: date men that get into bar fights, Like that's just it, right,
Speaker 1: But there was something intriguing about that because I don't know.
Speaker 1: I guess I just didn't like healthy men.
Speaker 3: What did you learn about like from when you started
Speaker 3: dating in that time, so maybe in the last decade
Speaker 3: of dating before you found your husband, What did you
Speaker 3: learn about yourself in that dating experience of what you
Speaker 3: were looking for? And two, how did you change? Because
Speaker 3: let me tell you, so many of my friends and
Speaker 3: like i'd say, most of the women that I know,
Speaker 3: have this experience of going for men that are either
Speaker 3: emotionally unstable, erratic in their emotions, possessive, you know, all
Speaker 3: the kind of red flags that would come up, but
Speaker 3: being okay with them because oh, you know what, they've
Speaker 3: got good heart, or oh they're a little bit exciting. Yeah,
Speaker 3: so how did you go? But they're struggling now to
Speaker 3: find the man that they really want to settle down
Speaker 3: with because they've got in the habit of wanting that.
Speaker 3: So how did you get out of that? And what
Speaker 3: was the shift for you on really realizing that that's
Speaker 3: not what you wanted.
Speaker 1: I think for me, what I really realized that I
Speaker 1: was looking to save a man so that I wouldn't
Speaker 1: have to save myself. I was hoping that if I
Speaker 1: saved my boyfriend, he would then in turn save me,
Speaker 1: and then I wouldn't have to face whatever it was
Speaker 1: I was avoiding. And I think a lot of women
Speaker 1: do that because it's so much easier to focus on
Speaker 1: somebody else up than it is to focus.
Speaker 2: On your problems.
Speaker 1: And it was only when I'm I met my husband
Speaker 1: was I really able to just hear the voices inside
Speaker 1: my head. Fully, I always knew that I'd struggled with
Speaker 1: mental health, but not to the degree that I realized
Speaker 1: it once I met my husband. Because Dave was like,
Speaker 1: I don't need you to fix me. I got my
Speaker 1: own stuff, you know, but you're you know, we're good.
Speaker 1: I am working on me. You do you And for
Speaker 1: the first time in a decade, it was silent, and
Speaker 1: I didn't love what I hear.
Speaker 3: So I think that's the number one question, honestly that
Speaker 3: most people have, is like how do you go from
Speaker 3: a bad boy like wanting to be with a bad guy,
Speaker 3: but I wouldn't say bad guy. Yeah, it's like a
Speaker 3: bad boy too, wanting a real man, well, like a
Speaker 3: good a good human that's actually going to treat you well,
Speaker 3: versus wanting to fix somebody. And I think as women,
Speaker 3: a lot of people fixed. A lot of women are fixes.
Speaker 1: They're fixers because we've been taught that that's almost how
Speaker 1: we're going to get them, like that's our value, you know,
Speaker 1: we're nurturing, Like, oh, if you take care of them,
Speaker 1: eventually they'll take care of you. And that's not always
Speaker 1: the case at all. So that's something I had to unlearned.
Speaker 1: But I kind of realized that through the process of
Speaker 1: dating all these guys, I was like, I'm never going
Speaker 1: to find what I want, which is stability, and I
Speaker 1: don't think you have to sacrifice excitement for a good man.
Speaker 1: I think that's the thing. It's like social media makes yeah,
Speaker 1: social media make things very black and white, and they're
Speaker 1: always like, oh, you can go for the nerdy, good
Speaker 1: stable man, or you can go for the tortured ht
Speaker 1: or whatever guy who doesn't really want It's like, guys,
Speaker 1: there's yes, those men exist, but there's a whole range
Speaker 1: of men who are attractive who want to do really
Speaker 1: exciting things with you. And like, also, it's like, define
Speaker 1: excitement right. For me, excitement in my twenties was just
Speaker 1: not quite knowing where everything stood. And you know, he's
Speaker 1: spontaneous and would you know, be like, let's just go
Speaker 1: to Miami or something for the weekend. And like, for me,
Speaker 1: excitement now And what I learned in my late twenties
Speaker 1: is like excitement is a man who has a goal
Speaker 1: that he wants to achieve in a vision and you know,
Speaker 1: our lives are so crazy.
Speaker 2: Like he travels for work. I travel for work.
Speaker 1: It's usually on short notice and that's exciting. But actually
Speaker 1: what I crave now at thirty four is not excitement.
Speaker 1: I crave peace. And when we come home at the
Speaker 1: end of the day. It's not like, all right, now,
Speaker 1: let's go plan the next adventure. It's like we had
Speaker 1: our individual adventures at work, and we are a safe space.
Speaker 3: I find. So I have friends that are guys who
Speaker 3: are in their thirties looking for a partner, and then
Speaker 3: women who are in their thirties looking for a man.
Speaker 3: And some of the men are still trying to like
Speaker 3: they may have been bad boys when they were younger,
Speaker 3: and they think that the same thing is going to
Speaker 3: work for adult women now, And I'm like, you can't
Speaker 3: be what women were looking for when they were twenty
Speaker 3: Like looking after yourself now, getting therapy do one thing
Speaker 3: that is what's sexy right now to women at the
Speaker 3: age that you're right right now in your thirties. If
Speaker 3: you're a man who is trying to look after himself physically, mental,
Speaker 3: and emotionally, that is attractive, right And at the same time,
Speaker 3: some of my girlfriends who were who are like, oh,
Speaker 3: I really want this, these butterflies and the excitement. They're
Speaker 3: used to dating traumatic men, and so for them, when
Speaker 3: you find a guy who's emotionally stable, they're like, this
Speaker 3: is so boring, and I'm like, no, it's not boring
Speaker 3: peace you it's peace, and you are confusing the two.
Speaker 3: And so she'll be like, but I don't get these
Speaker 3: butterflies when I'm with them. I'm like, those butterflies was anxiety. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it was pure anxiety.
Speaker 2: Trauma. That is true trauma talking to you, right.
Speaker 3: And they're really self sabotaging in that because they are
Speaker 3: completely expecting this, like, oh, is he going to message me?
Speaker 3: Is he not going to message me? Is he going
Speaker 3: to disappear for two days? Is he not? And I'm like,
Speaker 3: you're looking, you're looking for somebody who's gonna be able
Speaker 3: to take care of you, but you're you're you're looking
Speaker 3: for it in a guy who's not ready.
Speaker 2: To give it to you exactly.
Speaker 3: And it is like it's so difficult to go through
Speaker 3: that and realize that. And also you're right, when you're
Speaker 3: in your twenties, by the way, your hormones are different,
Speaker 3: your hormones are raging. Everything is just different. You feel
Speaker 3: excitement in different ways. So she's now like my one
Speaker 3: particular friend, she's gonna listen to this and be like
Speaker 3: I felt targeted, Well, I am targeting you with love
Speaker 3: with love with But she really keeps saying, She's like,
Speaker 3: but I don't. I don't feel how I did when
Speaker 3: I first met this person at this age, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: of course you're not going to. Of course you're not
Speaker 3: going to. When we were teenagers, everything was so different,
Speaker 3: or in our twenties, it was so different. And so
Speaker 3: I think it's so important what you said earlier to
Speaker 3: heal before you're looking for somebody, because otherwise you put
Speaker 3: all your trauma into that person, you put all your
Speaker 3: expectations into that person, and you still feel a little
Speaker 3: bit empty because you haven't filled yourself up before you're
Speaker 3: coming to that relationship. And also sometimes I think that
Speaker 3: I also went through a similar experience, and so for me,
Speaker 3: I think, instead of thinking what can I gain from
Speaker 3: that person, let me think about what am I serving
Speaker 3: to that person? Like what am I providing in this relationship?
Speaker 3: Not looking for the things that I that I want
Speaker 3: in my life, but what am I bringing to the
Speaker 3: table before thinking about what that person is going to
Speaker 3: be pouring into me. I'm so sorry. Can you hear
Speaker 3: my summerchea? You hear it in the audio? Everybody, I'm really.
Speaker 2: Sorry, It's actually so cute.
Speaker 3: I'm really trying to I slip on water. I actually
Speaker 3: didn't have my shape this morning off my workout. So
Speaker 3: just letting you all know that if you hear rumbling sounds,
Speaker 3: it's not Anna, it's me. Okay.
Speaker 2: It was very cute. It was a very cute rumbling sound.
Speaker 3: When you first met your husband, How did you know
Speaker 3: that this was different.
Speaker 1: I did not believe in love at first site anymore
Speaker 1: at that point, because I'd fallen in love so many
Speaker 1: times at first sight that had proven to be not
Speaker 1: you know, not to say it wasn't real love, but
Speaker 1: everlasting love. So by the time I met him, I
Speaker 1: was like, let's just see how this goes. Yeah, And
Speaker 1: I don't think it's a bad thing to be jaded.
Speaker 1: So I went in a little bit jaded but open minded,
Speaker 1: and I immediately felt comfortable with him. So I believe
Speaker 1: in comfort at first sight. And I just felt so
Speaker 1: at home, like I couldn't say anything wrong and I
Speaker 1: didn't have to think about the next thing. You know,
Speaker 1: some dates you're like, oh, this man's great and he's attractive,
Speaker 1: but you're kind of searching for the next thing to say.
Speaker 1: It was just a very org again a conversation, and
Speaker 1: I just remember seeing him and thinking he was just
Speaker 1: so kind, like you know, you know, he had a
Speaker 1: kind face.
Speaker 2: I don't know if in Indian culture there's like this expression.
Speaker 1: I know in Chinese culture there is, and there's not
Speaker 1: anything directly translated into English. But some people you can
Speaker 1: just tell like they're kind because they just look kind.
Speaker 1: And some people are quite manipulative, and they look manipulative,
Speaker 1: I don't know, and it's like he just looks kind
Speaker 1: and he is kind, and I just there was no
Speaker 1: ulterior motive with him, you know, because you could be
Speaker 1: I had met a lot of guys in New York
Speaker 1: who were very attractive, but you can always tell they
Speaker 1: were just a little schemey maybe, you know, always kind
Speaker 1: of figuring out the next move and you know, making
Speaker 1: it too much of a game almost. And my husband
Speaker 1: was just always very upfront with me from the beginning.
Speaker 1: He never let me question and it was easy. So
Speaker 1: I knew pretty quickly that this was different.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's so true. What does this person do to
Speaker 3: your nervous system? Yes, like that's really what does this
Speaker 3: person from the moment you meet them, from that first
Speaker 3: date to the second date, to the third date, to
Speaker 3: the month after like what are they doing to your
Speaker 3: nervous system? And I think that's a really good You
Speaker 3: know a lot of the time with it for butterflies
Speaker 3: or you're looking for excitement usually comes in the mind
Speaker 3: where you just want to be stimulated, But like, what
Speaker 3: are they doing to your nerves? How do they make
Speaker 3: you feel? Do they make you feel comforted and safe?
Speaker 3: And I think safety is a big thing. You can
Speaker 3: be financially safe, that's one thing, But how do they
Speaker 3: make you feel safe emotionally and in the times that
Speaker 3: you would expect them to like either run or get rude,
Speaker 3: even in the times where you're horrible to them? How
Speaker 3: do they react right when you are not your kindest exactly?
Speaker 3: Do they try and make you feel bad for it?
Speaker 3: Do they try and react in a worse way than
Speaker 3: you are, or do they try and settle your nerves?
Speaker 3: And I think that's something that we're not used to
Speaker 3: seeing as like a bar of a relationship, of like
Speaker 3: a barometer of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think it's always like and I blame
Speaker 1: Hollywood for that, arnt. Yes, I blame the fact that
Speaker 1: we were raised on these very compelling love stories that
Speaker 1: actually were really unhealthy depictions of Love.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like The Notebook. I was just about
Speaker 2: to say that, Okay, can we just talk about I love?
Speaker 3: Can we talk about it? No? I love The Notebook.
Speaker 3: It is my plain film. But every time I watch it,
Speaker 3: I'm like.
Speaker 1: She left Lawn, who was just like amazing, like and
Speaker 1: she's like, I'm gonna go back to this guy that
Speaker 1: I fought with every single week while we were together.
Speaker 3: Are you always rooting for them? You're watching you? You
Speaker 3: can't every time. I want to not be rooting for them,
Speaker 3: But I'm rooting for them every single time I'm watching it.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, You're always rooting.
Speaker 1: And that's the problem is that I think I love
Speaker 1: that movie as a kid growing up, and we see
Speaker 1: that played out over and over again with all these
Speaker 1: different rom coms that we had in the late nineties
Speaker 1: early two thousands. It's the concept of the manic pixie
Speaker 1: dream girl where somebody talks about this in a very
Speaker 1: eloquent way that I'm gonna butcher. But there is this
Speaker 1: stuff he done on like how women back in the
Speaker 1: late nineties early two thousands were just very ancillary characters
Speaker 1: to the men, right stories, So did you ever see Elizabeth.
Speaker 2: Town with Orlando Bloom.
Speaker 1: Actually, okay, so I don't know, Like, you know, the
Speaker 1: Notebook is like a classic that I think kind of
Speaker 1: hit worldwide. Elizabeth's Town did very well in the US.
Speaker 1: I don't know if it made it over to the UK,
Speaker 1: but you should and in it Orlando Bloom obviously very attractive.
Speaker 1: So that was intentional, right, yeah, yeah, I've seen.
Speaker 2: Better, right, So he I guess it's like this really tortured.
Speaker 1: Guy and his dad dies and he has to travel
Speaker 1: home to the dad's funeral and he meets Kirsten Dunce
Speaker 1: along the way, and like he's all like brooding and like,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of a grouch, and she's just like
Speaker 1: this happy, kind of fairy girl in his life and.
Speaker 2: She's like, don't worry, it'll be fine, you know, I'll
Speaker 2: I'll take care of it. I'll be happy whatever.
Speaker 1: And eventually like she brings him out of his shell
Speaker 1: and she like she makes him realize that life is
Speaker 1: worth living again, which is great, but that's the kind
Speaker 1: of media I was digesting as a child, so I
Speaker 1: was like, oh, I need to be that savior, that savior.
Speaker 3: I grew up thinking the same thing. Yeah, and I
Speaker 3: ended up like even on dates and whatever, I would
Speaker 3: end up wanting to find someone that I could fix
Speaker 3: or save because I felt like that was my role
Speaker 3: in the relationship. And then I met Jay and it
Speaker 3: was like, wait, what is my role? Because he does
Speaker 3: not need fixing, he's very fixed.
Speaker 2: And then you're like, oh shit, it's me.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And then it's like there's nothing for me to save,
Speaker 3: like he's really good at saving himself, and I'm like,
Speaker 3: so what do I do in this? And so so
Speaker 3: much of my trauma would come out in our relationship
Speaker 3: where I was wanting to be very independent and showing
Speaker 3: him that I could do everything by myself because I
Speaker 3: don't want to be saved because I'm not a damsel
Speaker 3: in distress. But at the same time, I would be like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I'll just i'll cook for you and i'll do this
Speaker 3: fore you and I'll do this few and it's like
Speaker 3: he's not wanting or expecting that. He's like very self
Speaker 3: sufficient and so really all he wanted was love, and
Speaker 3: I was like, wait, I'm really not used to this
Speaker 3: that what does that mean? Like how do I navigate this?
Speaker 3: And so it's definitely a shift in mindset and dynamic
Speaker 3: when you find someone who has done the work and
Speaker 3: is ready for a partner to give two versus waiting
Speaker 3: for a partner to look after them exactly.
Speaker 1: But I think a lot of men were also raised
Speaker 1: to think that, oh, I'll find a wife, go from.
Speaker 2: My mum to my wife exactly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that we call the mummy boys.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there we go.
Speaker 3: Okay, have you found like in all the I'm sure
Speaker 3: you get so many dms, so many dms from so
Speaker 3: many women. What do you find women are struggling with
Speaker 3: the most right now? Like in your community of women
Speaker 3: who are dating one What do you think is going
Speaker 3: on with men right now? And why people struggling so
Speaker 3: much to figure out who to be with and find someone.
Speaker 1: I do think to an extent that people are not
Speaker 1: struggling maybe as much as we think they are. They've
Speaker 1: always just been struggling, right, It's just always been difficult. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, think about Sex and the City. When did
Speaker 1: that first episode air? The reason why that show is
Speaker 1: so iconic is because if you watch it again, it's
Speaker 1: exactly the same stuff that everybody is going through now.
Speaker 1: It's just we're so much more aware of the struggle
Speaker 1: now because of social media, so but it's always been there.
Speaker 2: Big is the chad in all of our lives. So
Speaker 2: I think, you know, I think it almost And I.
Speaker 1: Don't mean to say this in a diminishing way because
Speaker 1: I know some people are going to be like, oh
Speaker 1: my god, it is so much worse, Like you know,
Speaker 1: you're married now, how dare you know? But here's the
Speaker 1: thing is is that, like, if you tell yourself it's
Speaker 1: so much harder now, it's so much harder than it
Speaker 1: was for my parents or whatever, you're going to start
Speaker 1: acting in ways I kind of prove that and validate that.
Speaker 1: Like I don't really believe we're preordained for anything. I think,
Speaker 1: you know, our lives kind of have a path, and
Speaker 1: we can kind of choose our path. And if you're
Speaker 1: telling yourself that it's so hard that it's impossible, you'll
Speaker 1: kind of.
Speaker 3: Do things that impossible path for yourself exactly.
Speaker 1: This is why I don't like, you know, a lot
Speaker 1: of my girlfriends go to psychics and mediums and.
Speaker 3: Say my friends to some of the friends I was
Speaker 3: just talking about, Yeah.
Speaker 1: Some of them, I will say, are shockingly accurate, to
Speaker 1: the point where I'm like, there is I believe in God.
Speaker 1: I believe in something out there, and when I hear
Speaker 1: people like that, I'm like, there's something you have that
Speaker 1: the rest of us don't.
Speaker 2: But I don't.
Speaker 1: Necessarily, I've never really wanted to go to a psychic
Speaker 1: to figure out when am I going to get married?
Speaker 1: Like when's my job going to happen? Because I don't
Speaker 1: want to start living my life as if something is inevitable.
Speaker 1: So I think, again, don't like find a solution before
Speaker 1: you know even what the problem is?
Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, I think the problem with psychics now is
Speaker 3: that you end up putting or just generally, you end
Speaker 3: up putting so much weight on that and then when
Speaker 3: it doesn't happen, you just feel like it's doomed and
Speaker 3: then it's not possible. And so I have found friends
Speaker 3: that have heard it. It's happened and it's been great.
Speaker 3: But I do think sometimes when you get into desperation,
Speaker 3: you just end up holding onto every single word and
Speaker 3: every single thing that that person has said, and then
Speaker 3: it can really lead to more disappointment than you were
Speaker 3: destined for in your life. You end up feeling way
Speaker 3: more disappointed than you would have had things just not
Speaker 3: happen naturally exactly.
Speaker 1: And what if a psychic tells you you're going to
Speaker 1: be alone forever? Yeah, and then you just live the
Speaker 1: rest of your life thinking that, and you go through
Speaker 1: life assuming that, and then they're wrong. Well, you just
Speaker 1: spent whatever the four years between when you listen to
Speaker 1: that psychic and when you met your husband, just feeling
Speaker 1: like it wasn't going to happen for you.
Speaker 3: Have any of the chads reached out to you since
Speaker 3: you started making it?
Speaker 1: No, and I had an interesting habit, not intentionally. I
Speaker 1: think everybody is a type, right. That's why they say
Speaker 1: when you get divorced, you're so much more likely to
Speaker 1: get divorced again, because so many people think that the
Speaker 1: second person they're marrying is different from the first person,
Speaker 1: but they just find a different version of.
Speaker 2: The first person.
Speaker 1: Oh god, yeah, because everybody has something that they're attracted to, right.
Speaker 2: My type has historically always.
Speaker 1: Been men who may have been my age but were
Speaker 1: allergic to social media and who are really old souls
Speaker 1: is maybe just kind of like an overused word, but
Speaker 1: like they were eighty five year old men at heart,
Speaker 1: so it didn't matter. Like my high school boyfriend, who
Speaker 1: is my exact age never had an Instagram, which is
Speaker 1: very strange for somebody.
Speaker 2: Who's thirty four.
Speaker 1: I mean, like we grew up with Instagram, So I
Speaker 1: never dated any men who were active on social media.
Speaker 1: So my feeling is that the majority of them do
Speaker 1: not know that I have this career because we live
Speaker 1: in a microcosm, even though it feels like our entire world.
Speaker 1: And think about how many creators out there that have
Speaker 1: massive followings and everything, but like, if you're not on
Speaker 1: their algorithm, you're not going to see it. Yeah, if
Speaker 1: you're a forty five year old man with a family
Speaker 1: who checks Facebook once a year, you probably don't know.
Speaker 3: And you married someone outside of your culture, how has
Speaker 3: that dynamic been for you? Did you ever date men
Speaker 3: that were part of your culture or have you always
Speaker 3: kind of not really been attracted to that.
Speaker 1: I've dated men within my culture and look to a
Speaker 1: certain extent.
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna lie. It's easier.
Speaker 1: It is easier because my parents are Chinese immigrants, and
Speaker 1: I did date a man who not only was Chinese
Speaker 1: but spoke their dialect. They're sharing Chinese, and that was
Speaker 1: really special for me when it happened because my parents
Speaker 1: are very fluent in English, but they still have accents
Speaker 1: and they're not nearly as comfortable in English as they
Speaker 1: are in Chinese. But then when they're around their Chinese friends,
Speaker 1: they just kind of come alive. And so for the
Speaker 1: first time, it was like really cool to see my mom,
Speaker 1: especially just be able to interact with a boyfriend that
Speaker 1: she had not been able to interact with previous boyfriends
Speaker 1: because she's just felt so comfortable in her language. That
Speaker 1: being said, you know, you can't just marry somebody because
Speaker 1: your culture is aligne And that was a struggle for
Speaker 1: me because I think I would date a lot of
Speaker 1: American men who did not have an immigrant background. And
Speaker 1: what I didn't realize that a lot of the time
Speaker 1: it didn't work out is because I'm actually very Chinese nice.
Speaker 1: I have a lot of traditional Chinese values, and it
Speaker 1: really took Dave to kind of even reinforce that in me.
Speaker 1: I don't think I even knew. And yes, he's white,
Speaker 1: he's from Boston. He is just American, but we always
Speaker 1: call him like an egg white on the outside, yell
Speaker 1: on the inside, some amalgamation of his personalities because of his.
Speaker 2: Mom and dad's jeans.
Speaker 1: He like just came out sort of like my parents.
Speaker 1: Like he's more Chinese than some Chinese people we know,
Speaker 1: like and I mean in ways like how he looks
Speaker 1: at money, like what he values in life, Like he's
Speaker 1: very frugal. He's a saver, which is not very American,
Speaker 1: like America's built on debt culture. He lives well below
Speaker 1: his means. He lived in the same apartment for nine
Speaker 1: years in New York City. It was a rent stabilized apartment.
Speaker 1: It was awful. And when I started dating him, you know,
Speaker 1: you don't know how much somebody makes. I knew he
Speaker 1: had a good job and a good career and he
Speaker 1: was driven, but you know, you only have their apartment
Speaker 1: to look exactly. And I was like, oh, he's probably
Speaker 1: doing okay, but he's probably not doing great, which is fine.
Speaker 1: And I was like, you know, And then when we
Speaker 1: finally got serious enough where we started talking about finances
Speaker 1: and everything, I was like.
Speaker 2: You make that? What are you doing?
Speaker 1: I was like, why haven't you upgraded? He was like,
Speaker 1: I'm fine here, I don't need more.
Speaker 2: This works.
Speaker 1: I was like, your ceiling crumbles every time you shut
Speaker 1: the door. There's a piece of plaster on his ceiling
Speaker 1: over his couch that was loose, and every time you
Speaker 1: shut the front door would crumble a little, so before
Speaker 1: you sat down you would have to get the dustbuster
Speaker 1: out and vacuum it up. His toilet handle you have
Speaker 1: to hold down for five seconds before it fully flushes,
Speaker 1: and he was like whatever, it worked for me. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he was happy. So he needs very little and he
Speaker 1: really works. You know, obviously we work for money, but
Speaker 1: we also work for a sense of fulfillment. And he
Speaker 1: just really understands my parents in an intrinsic way that
Speaker 1: I never thought would be possible. So that is really
Speaker 1: awesome and I never thought i'd have that, but I'm
Speaker 1: glad I do.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I am. We have in my family two white
Speaker 3: Englishmen that married into the family into a very Indian family,
Speaker 3: and let me tell you, they are more Indian than
Speaker 3: some of our other like the other son in laws
Speaker 3: that came into the family, and they love Indian food
Speaker 3: and all the parents love them and they integrated into
Speaker 3: the culture so beautifully that you wouldn't even realize they
Speaker 3: know all the foods that they love. They love in
Speaker 3: new food more than some more than my cousin sisters.
Speaker 2: Like they're like, we want to cheeseburgers.
Speaker 3: They're like, no, exactly, And so I, you know, I
Speaker 3: grew up thinking the same thing, that you marry in
Speaker 3: your culture, like it's just normal to think that. You've
Speaker 3: seen people, you've seen your parents do it. And then
Speaker 3: when I started seeing my cousins stay outside of that,
Speaker 3: and I was like, wow, it is so much more
Speaker 3: about values. And you know, in my culture, there's still
Speaker 3: such a tradition of you only marry in your culture,
Speaker 3: no matter what fason it's bad.
Speaker 1: That's more true in Indian culture than Chinese culture. Chinese people,
Speaker 1: at least at this stage, don't really care, but Indian
Speaker 1: culture is very very.
Speaker 3: Some parts are still very strict. And even if the
Speaker 3: guy is not that great, and even it's fine, even
Speaker 3: if there's a guy that's who's best, he's a man,
Speaker 3: he's a man, he's part of the culture. You're going
Speaker 3: to marry him. And unfortunately that, you know, causes a
Speaker 3: lot of issues. And I think it's getting better slowly,
Speaker 3: but it's taken a lot to improve that. But when
Speaker 3: I've seen them come into the family, I'm like, wow,
Speaker 3: you really saw how possible it is to have such
Speaker 3: a beautiful multicultural relationship. And family and respect and honor
Speaker 3: each other's values and traditions and become part of one
Speaker 3: another's And like, how amazing that you get to celebrate
Speaker 3: both cultures, Like instead of celebrating one, you get to
Speaker 3: celebrate both exactly. And I think that's actually such a
Speaker 3: You end up becoming so much more aware of each
Speaker 3: other and respectful of each other just by honoring each
Speaker 3: other's traditions.
Speaker 1: And you get the best of both worlds. Truly, I
Speaker 1: think about it in a simplistic way. The food my
Speaker 1: mom makes amazing homemade noodles and lo maine, well, my
Speaker 1: mother in law makes amazing pesto.
Speaker 2: I still haven't gotten right, and I never had pesto
Speaker 2: growing up.
Speaker 3: You know, no, I completely agree. I think that's so
Speaker 3: important for people to also hear. And also, your parents
Speaker 3: are not dating the man and so and not spending
Speaker 3: the rest of their life with the man, so as
Speaker 3: much as they may think they know what's best for you,
Speaker 3: I think there has to be you know, I'm always
Speaker 3: going to be a baby to my mum, and I
Speaker 3: understand that, But at the same time, you are going
Speaker 3: to have to spend the rest of your life with
Speaker 3: that person. And I think it is a fact. Of course,
Speaker 3: it is a family thing. Like, look, in your culture,
Speaker 3: your husband is part of your family. But to a
Speaker 3: certain extent, you can only let your family, haven't put
Speaker 3: to a certain extent to the man you're gonna end
Speaker 3: up marrying.
Speaker 1: And my parents have always been very good at that,
Speaker 1: to the extent that they've always said, do not think
Speaker 1: about us, focus on your relationship. Never let in lav
Speaker 1: realelationships get in the way of your marriage, because when
Speaker 1: you get married, which I said to them, like, I
Speaker 1: don't consider this to be true, but they're like, when
Speaker 1: you get married, like, that's your nuclear family now, like
Speaker 1: we're secondary. It's like, no, you're not. I'm like, you
Speaker 1: are still my nuclear family. Calmed the down, I said
Speaker 1: the same thing.
Speaker 3: I was like, what do you mean that's not true?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: I like, hell, now, you know, I understand what they mean.
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of parents aren't like that.
Speaker 1: They're like, oh, you're married now, well, like you still like,
Speaker 1: I'm I gave life to you, so you need to
Speaker 1: consider me first.
Speaker 2: And it causes a lot of issues for.
Speaker 3: People, yes, and ano of it just comes from ego.
Speaker 3: I think if you just end up trying to, you're
Speaker 3: constantly thinking about how you can make the other person's
Speaker 3: life better rather than how they can. Even even in
Speaker 3: family relationships, right, It's like, if my mum always wants
Speaker 3: to make my life easier, so she's going to be
Speaker 3: as nice as she can to my in laws and
Speaker 3: as nice as you can to my husband, and I
Speaker 3: mean they will get along really well. But if you
Speaker 3: have that mentality of how can we actually keep this
Speaker 3: family together and make it the best that it can
Speaker 3: be versus how can I put my foot down and
Speaker 3: have it my way, It's it's always going to be better.
Speaker 1: But I think that it's also so Asian culture in
Speaker 1: general is much more multi generational, you know, Okay, I've
Speaker 1: told my husband from the beginning, I was like, if
Speaker 1: my parents ever get to a point one day where
Speaker 1: they're unable to live on their own, I'm never putting
Speaker 1: them in a nursing home. They're moving in with us.
Speaker 1: We will figure it out, right, And he's okay with that,
Speaker 1: which is very different than American culture, where obviously, like
Speaker 1: assisted living is very much a thing here and it's
Speaker 1: not a shame to put your parents into assisted living.
Speaker 1: And I'm not saying that you should feel badly for
Speaker 1: doing that. I'm just saying like, those are two very
Speaker 1: different cultures and neither is right or wrong. But I
Speaker 1: think because Asian culture is so multi generational, there's this
Speaker 1: kind of collective well being that we're all funneling our
Speaker 1: efforts towards where I think American culture, like strict American
Speaker 1: culture is just much more individualistic, and there's pros and
Speaker 1: cons to each. But it feels like, at least like
Speaker 1: with you know, a lot of the men that I
Speaker 1: was dating, they were they had nice relationships with their family,
Speaker 1: but it was distant that it was like, oh, you know,
Speaker 1: well I call home once a month at most, and
Speaker 1: we might see them at the holidays, or you know,
Speaker 1: if I feel like going to Bali over Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2: I'll just do that instead.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 1: I was like, what, yeah, yeah, so that's what I
Speaker 1: couldn't really get over. I needed somebody who was more
Speaker 1: family oriented, who understood why I needed to see my
Speaker 1: parents all the time as a fully formed adult.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. I need you to know I'm going to
Speaker 3: be calling my mom three times a day minimum, exactly,
Speaker 3: and there will be not much conversation happening, but we
Speaker 3: will be talking.
Speaker 1: Sometimes just FaceTime is like literally propped up on my
Speaker 1: computer and like nobody's talking, but it's like it's the togetherness.
Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly, it is. Okay, So now you're married, having
Speaker 3: been married.
Speaker 1: For we've been married for a little over two years.
Speaker 1: We got married in September tenth of twenty twenty two.
Speaker 3: Okay, And what are some of the things that were
Speaker 3: surprises once you got married? Were there any? And also
Speaker 3: what's been difficult? Like what have you what have you
Speaker 3: had to navigate that you weren't can give it a
Speaker 3: bad day?
Speaker 1: There were no surprises because I will say the fact
Speaker 1: that we were together for four years prior to getting married.
Speaker 1: Marriage doesn't really change much if it's a piece of paper, right,
Speaker 1: I have health insurance.
Speaker 2: Now, exact really what it changed for me?
Speaker 1: And we actually got legally married before our official ceremony
Speaker 1: because I needed health insurance and it was like four
Speaker 1: months before a wedding and I was running out of
Speaker 1: my health insurance and he was like, let's just get
Speaker 1: legally married so you can get onto mine. So marriage
Speaker 1: didn't change anything for us. I don't think there were
Speaker 1: any surprises. I just think in terms of like what's challenging. Like, actually,
Speaker 1: our marriage is not challenging. Life is pretty challenging. And
Speaker 1: I always think, you know, when I hear people say
Speaker 1: marriage is so much work, so much work. Look, look,
Speaker 1: I don't have kids right with him, so let's see.
Speaker 1: But as a childless couple, marriage has not been difficult.
Speaker 1: Life has been really difficult at times. Over the last
Speaker 1: six and a half years that we've been together, I've
Speaker 1: struggled a lot with mental health stuff. You know, We've
Speaker 1: had family health issues and everything, and just those things
Speaker 1: are difficult. But we're always kind of coming at it
Speaker 1: from the same page. So I don't at all actually
Speaker 1: feel like our marriage is difficult. I just feel like
Speaker 1: life is kind of tough sometimes, but we'll figure it out.
Speaker 3: You know. One thing we were talking about earlier that
Speaker 3: we touched on was trying to make friends as couples. Yes,
Speaker 3: and I feel like that that is I agree. I
Speaker 3: agree with you. I think like, if you're both putting
Speaker 3: in work to the relationship, there's not much that can
Speaker 3: be chilling if you're both choosing to be there, If
Speaker 3: you're both choosing to work at it, there's always hope
Speaker 3: in the relationship, right. But one thing we spoke about earlier,
Speaker 3: which was trying to make friends as adults. As an
Speaker 3: adult couple.
Speaker 1: Well, it's really hard making friends as a couple in
Speaker 1: your thirties because essentially two people have to like the
Speaker 1: other counterpart, right, So we moved to Connecticut knowing very
Speaker 1: few people, and we've made very few couple friends in
Speaker 1: the four years we've been there because oftentimes it's like, oh,
Speaker 1: I'll really get along with the wife, but like my
Speaker 1: husband won't quite click with the husband, or he'll click
Speaker 1: with the husband and I won't quite click with the wife.
Speaker 1: And that's that's tough because, like, you know, when you're younger,
Speaker 1: you're just naturally more social and you're used to larger
Speaker 1: groups of friends around.
Speaker 3: You and more free time. You're like not as invested
Speaker 3: of how much how much free time you have and
Speaker 3: who you spend it with. You're a little bit looser
Speaker 3: with that as well, because you're like, I've got all
Speaker 3: the time in the world.
Speaker 1: Exactly, and you're just kind of like, you know, the
Speaker 1: you have less responsibilities, less bills to pay for, less
Speaker 1: just stuff going on. And so I feel like as
Speaker 1: an adult, it's just been really interesting, Like I have
Speaker 1: a handful on one hand, close girlfriends in Connecticut at
Speaker 1: this point, and like we really only have like one
Speaker 1: or two couple friends that we consistently see on a
Speaker 1: regular basis. First of all, there's no time. I mean,
Speaker 1: we don't do anything on the weekdays. We don't socialize
Speaker 1: on the weekdays. It's just too much. So that really
Speaker 1: leaves Friday and Saturday. And I'm somebody that like, if
Speaker 1: I see somebody on Friday, I can't go out Saturday.
Speaker 2: I need it.
Speaker 3: One day on like three days off exactly.
Speaker 1: I need I can only do like one big social
Speaker 1: thing a week at most, and so that really limits
Speaker 1: the amount of time you can spend with somebody. I
Speaker 1: think it'll change maybe when we have kids, because I
Speaker 1: hear you meet a lot of.
Speaker 3: Kidople, Yeah you have.
Speaker 2: I agree.
Speaker 3: I think me and Jay have always found that where
Speaker 3: someone he's a little bit older than me. So when
Speaker 3: we're back home, he has his friends who he's been
Speaker 3: friends with for a long time, and I don't have
Speaker 3: that same relationship with the wives. They're wonderful, but we're
Speaker 3: just at different stages in life. A lot of them
Speaker 3: had kids that are a little bit older, and they're
Speaker 3: in a different stage of life. And then me, I've
Speaker 3: got a lot of friends. All my girlfriends are still single.
Speaker 3: A lot of them are still single, and so like
Speaker 3: one we don't have couples there to actually spend time with,
Speaker 3: and two we just have a different relationship. I've known
Speaker 3: them since I was a teenager, like we have when
Speaker 3: we're together, we end up being like who we were
Speaker 3: when we were teenagers. It's a different.
Speaker 1: Relationship and it's like the cackling out, I want nothing
Speaker 1: to do with this. I need to go meditate now,
Speaker 1: Like I just, oh my.
Speaker 3: God, I do not want to hang out with you guys.
Speaker 3: And so what we've learned to do now is he
Speaker 3: has a lot of separate time with his guy friends
Speaker 3: and I have a lot of separate time with my girlfriends.
Speaker 3: And then we do have times where we bring a
Speaker 3: lot of people together at once. But I think sometimes
Speaker 3: trying to drag your partner along to a time where
Speaker 3: he doesn't want to be part of it, or doesn't
Speaker 3: necessarily not dislike the partner but doesn't have as much
Speaker 3: in common or want to spend his spare time with
Speaker 3: that person. I think that's what it is. Same with family,
Speaker 3: there's a lot of time Robbie, Like, why would you
Speaker 3: not want to spend three to four hours doing nothing
Speaker 3: with my family?
Speaker 2: What do you mean?
Speaker 3: Like that's the best thing, sitting around, not talking, being
Speaker 3: around each other and hanging out. And I had to
Speaker 3: realize that, Look, he's also not someone who has done
Speaker 3: that a lot with his own family, and so he
Speaker 3: loves spending time with my family. But would he want
Speaker 3: to just spend days on end doing absolutely nothing with them?
Speaker 3: Probably not right, not because he doesn't love and adore them,
Speaker 3: but because he wants to spend his time differently exactly.
Speaker 3: And so, yeah, now we have a lot of like
Speaker 3: he goes on his guide dates, I go on my
Speaker 3: girl dates, and then we'll have a few people that
Speaker 3: will kind of bring together for games, nights and stuff
Speaker 3: where we can do it in large groups with everybody.
Speaker 3: But yeah, I think it's sometimes unrealistic to think you're
Speaker 3: going to have all these couple friends that will get
Speaker 3: along with each other, like you see, it's probably less
Speaker 3: true for most people.
Speaker 1: Exactly, and you don't always have to be doing things together.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what do you see in terms of where you
Speaker 3: are right now and the kind of impact that you
Speaker 3: want to have and what you want women to know,
Speaker 3: is there one piece of advice that you would want
Speaker 3: to give people right now after everything you've done, like
Speaker 3: the biggest piece of advice that you feel has impacted you.
Speaker 1: If I had to pick one, I would say that
Speaker 1: what you're able to let go of is actually going
Speaker 1: to be your greatest asset, because I think most of
Speaker 1: the time women can't let go of what doesn't serve
Speaker 1: them anymore, and they don't realize if I just let
Speaker 1: oh of this, I'm going to create so much space
Speaker 1: for what I really want to come into my life.
Speaker 1: But we have a finite amount of time and energy
Speaker 1: and just what we can dedicate to one person one career,
Speaker 1: and if it's not working out Shift Gears think about
Speaker 1: the chaos of my Instagram career, like very few people
Speaker 1: I know were like, oh yeah, I started off in
Speaker 1: a completely different niche like most people like were like, Okay,
Speaker 1: this is what I want to do, and like you know,
Speaker 1: they build slowly or they go viral overnight and then
Speaker 1: they just keep doing it. Like I had eight thousand
Speaker 1: different personalities online and I was just willing to I
Speaker 1: was like, Okay, it's working, Like.
Speaker 2: Let's let it go.
Speaker 1: If I had stuck to my guns, and then like no,
Speaker 1: I started off at Home Day Corps, I'm going to
Speaker 1: continue in Home Day Corps. It wouldn't be here because
Speaker 1: that's just I wasn't good at it and I didn't
Speaker 1: like it.
Speaker 3: So let go, let goga and go of the chads.
Speaker 2: Let go of the chad.
Speaker 3: Is there an emotion that you find difficult to deal with?
Speaker 3: If there's one, let me see.
Speaker 1: I'm such an open book that I really allow myself
Speaker 1: to feel all my emotions. But what I will say
Speaker 1: is like, for me personally, i'm quite I have a
Speaker 1: I'm quick to anger, and I think that's not great,
Speaker 1: both for me and the people around me. But it's
Speaker 1: weird because like, I don't like feeling angry, but I
Speaker 1: also feel like my anger has gotten me here. Like
Speaker 1: a lot of my content is inspired by the fact
Speaker 1: that I am angry about what I seem, what I
Speaker 1: deem to be injustices in the world.
Speaker 2: So I don't know.
Speaker 1: It's like, I think you should make space for all
Speaker 1: the emotions. It's like that movie Inside Out. It's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I love that not everything you know. Joy is not
Speaker 1: the old It's the point of life is not to
Speaker 1: just be happy all the time and just kind of,
Speaker 1: you know, float through life in this drug induced haze.
Speaker 1: That's not that's not a meaningful life. That's just called
Speaker 1: living in ignorance. So, uh yeah, I find sadness. I
Speaker 1: find anger difficult to deal with, but I understand the
Speaker 1: necessity in my life.
Speaker 3: They say, I don't know whether you've had this before,
Speaker 3: but they say that anger is a secondary emotion to
Speaker 3: something else that you're feeling, and so it's hurt, pain, neglect, disappointment.
Speaker 3: You know, there's a primary emotion that's led to the
Speaker 3: protective secondary emotion that is anger. And I always find
Speaker 3: that helpful because every time I feel angry, if I
Speaker 3: really do like track it back to where it's actually
Speaker 3: come from, it does come from a place where it's
Speaker 3: a protection. It's actually a protective emotion, right like anger
Speaker 3: is a protective emotion. I feel these feelings that have
Speaker 3: made me open up and that feel very sacred to me,
Speaker 3: and now to actually express that anger is the way
Speaker 3: I can express it because there's other emotions feel too intimate.
Speaker 3: So I found that really interesting and it helped me
Speaker 3: really process anger differently. Once I figured that out, what
Speaker 3: kind of cry are you. Are you like an actress?
Speaker 3: One one?
Speaker 1: No, I am such an ugly cry okay, And it's
Speaker 1: not cute, And like I don't cry on camera mostly because.
Speaker 2: Like nobody needs to be that.
Speaker 1: I don't know, and I just there's something to me
Speaker 1: and like I don't really I think I cried on
Speaker 1: camera once for my grandfather passed away.
Speaker 2: But other than that, I'm just I'm an ugly crier. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I love an ugly crier me too. I feel like
Speaker 3: that is really the best type of crier.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not. And it's like you look at my face, like,
Speaker 2: is she smiling? Is she like it? Is she great?
Speaker 2: Is she angry? Like what's happened? It's not. It's not good.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for being here. Thank you so
Speaker 3: much for conversation. So appreciate everything you do. You bring
Speaker 3: so much. Every time I see your videos, it makes
Speaker 3: me so happy because you make people laugh, and I
Speaker 3: think you make them laugh you make them think at
Speaker 3: the same time, and I think the duality of that
Speaker 3: is such a perfect combination to have impact. And so
Speaker 3: you're helping so many women out there to really move
Speaker 3: through their relationships and think about what they want in life.
Speaker 3: And also find worth in their life about themselves, and
Speaker 3: I think that's something that a lot of women are
Speaker 3: lacking these days. So thank you for making everyone feel
Speaker 3: so much more confident. And I'm so excited for whatever
Speaker 3: journey you've got coming along, and I'm here for it.
Speaker 3: I'm going to be.
Speaker 2: Watching, thank you so much, and right back at you,
Speaker 2: thank you, and
Speaker 1: Through