WEBVTT - The State of the Music Industry, Fall 2021 0:00:08.080 --> 0:00:12.200 Welcome to Strictly Business Varieties, weekly podcast featuring conversations with 0:00:12.280 --> 0:00:16.000 industry leaders about the business of media and entertainment. This 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:18.640 is this Variety Deputy music editor gem As. A lot 0:00:18.920 --> 0:00:21.640 in this week's installment actually is from a discussion panel 0:00:21.680 --> 0:00:25.520 I put together about three weeks ago October twelve one 0:00:25.840 --> 0:00:28.880 for the Mondo NYC count called the State of the 0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:31.600 Music Industry. It looks at how the business is doing 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:35.000 twenty months into the pandemic. While that topic is obviously 0:00:35.120 --> 0:00:38.360 ridiculously broad, I narrowed it down to four key roles 0:00:38.400 --> 0:00:41.680 and chose people who are running successful careers or businesses 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:46.240 or departments. An artist, an agent that's the person whose 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:48.800 job it is to get work for the artist, everything 0:00:48.880 --> 0:00:52.440 from live shows to book deals. An artist manager in 0:00:52.440 --> 0:00:54.760 this case one who also happens to be an attorney 0:00:54.760 --> 0:00:57.520 in the GM of an independent record label, and a 0:00:57.640 --> 0:01:01.680 music publishing executive. Asked each one questions about what their 0:01:01.680 --> 0:01:03.920 experiences have been like over the past year and a 0:01:03.960 --> 0:01:07.759 half and how they pivoted to use everyone's favorite pandemic 0:01:07.800 --> 0:01:10.520 buzzword to keep alive their careers, and those are the 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:13.640 people that they worked with now. I was honestly stunned 0:01:13.640 --> 0:01:18.360 by these conversations. The speakers were Brittany Spencer, a country 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:22.080 singer songwriter who CBS This Morning is called Nashville's new Star. 0:01:22.640 --> 0:01:26.000 She saw her career take off almost entirely during the 0:01:26.040 --> 0:01:30.319 pandemic by keeping a dialogue with her fans, playing live streams, 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:33.039 and dropping a series of songs online that led up 0:01:33.080 --> 0:01:35.880 to the release of her debut EP, Compassion, which has 0:01:35.920 --> 0:01:39.160 gotten rave reviews in the press and really has made 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:43.240 her arrive. Here. She speaks in vivid and very poetic 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:45.959 terms about how she did it and how strange it 0:01:46.000 --> 0:01:48.120 all felt to be achieving a lot of her dreams 0:01:48.160 --> 0:01:51.240 during a pandemic, and the deep connection she's made with 0:01:51.240 --> 0:01:53.760 her audience as they rode through the past months together. 0:01:54.800 --> 0:01:57.840 Next up was Lucy Dickens, the London based co head 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:01.240 of music for William Morris Endeavor talent agency who works 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:03.880 with A Dalla and Mumford and Sons and loads of others. 0:02:04.360 --> 0:02:06.600 She spoke about how she and her company found new 0:02:06.640 --> 0:02:09.280 ways not only to keep their artists and clients working, 0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:12.240 but also how the staff and company adjusted and found 0:02:12.280 --> 0:02:16.360 new opportunities for themselves and the business. Next up was 0:02:16.480 --> 0:02:19.640 Bent and the Ambi Brown, artist manager and founder of 0:02:19.639 --> 0:02:22.600 her own oh Maliley Projects, but also an attorney in 0:02:22.600 --> 0:02:25.839 general manager of Keep Cool Records, an independent hip hop 0:02:25.840 --> 0:02:28.000 and R and B labeled distributed by Our c A. 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:31.440 She spoke about how our artists not only kept motivated 0:02:31.680 --> 0:02:34.640 but have managed to thrive through the pandemic, and also 0:02:34.680 --> 0:02:37.680 about the moment how she and they embraced the Black 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:42.240 Lives Matter protests of the spring and summer of and Finally, 0:02:42.639 --> 0:02:45.760 Christina Hedrick of Sony Music Publishing talked about how that 0:02:45.800 --> 0:02:49.320 business has actually managed to soar during the pandemic, as 0:02:49.320 --> 0:02:51.480 the shutdown of touring led not only to a boom 0:02:51.520 --> 0:02:54.320 of songwriting but a boom in the value of songs 0:02:54.320 --> 0:02:57.760 and song cattle. With everyone home streaming and no one 0:02:57.840 --> 0:03:00.880 playing concerts for months and months, songs turned out to 0:03:00.919 --> 0:03:04.480 be a valuable and durable thing to create. Non Now, 0:03:04.600 --> 0:03:07.959 it's not all roses. These are not all positive stories, 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:11.079 and each of these people talk about how difficult it 0:03:11.240 --> 0:03:14.400 was to achieve anything, let alone the success that they 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:18.720 did during this time. It's a really remarkable conversation, although 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:21.440 I hesitate to call it that because I basically just 0:03:21.560 --> 0:03:24.240 asked each one A couple of long winded questions, and 0:03:24.280 --> 0:03:29.680 they took off with these thoughtful and inspiring answers. Normally 0:03:29.840 --> 0:03:32.880 these kinds of discussions are round tables filled with bantering 0:03:32.960 --> 0:03:36.800 and contradictions and even arguments, and everyone here let each 0:03:36.800 --> 0:03:40.320 other have their say, and we're so complimentary and supportive 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:44.600 of each other. No coincidence they're all female. So without 0:03:44.680 --> 0:03:47.320 further ado, after the break, you'll be hearing from them 0:03:47.400 --> 0:03:56.840 and me on strictly business. We'll be right back. We 0:03:56.960 --> 0:04:00.320 will start up, actually, um, start this up, be taking 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:02.760 you look at where things are in the music industry 0:04:02.800 --> 0:04:04.920 at the moment, where we've been in the last year 0:04:04.960 --> 0:04:07.240 and a half as we all cope with the pandemic 0:04:07.800 --> 0:04:11.200 and uh, what's come of what we feel is coming next? 0:04:11.200 --> 0:04:14.119 And bring me. I'm actually gonna start with you, um, 0:04:14.240 --> 0:04:19.680 not not to be mean, but because without music and musicians, 0:04:19.960 --> 0:04:22.760 none of us have anything to do here. So go 0:04:22.839 --> 0:04:27.000 back eighteen months. Um, your career is on the rise. Um, 0:04:27.279 --> 0:04:29.440 your ep I guess was about to come out at 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:33.120 that time or coming out soon. Um, presumably lots of 0:04:33.160 --> 0:04:37.640 tour dates lined up, COVID hits. How did you react, 0:04:37.880 --> 0:04:40.680 how did you pivot? And um, how did you keep 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:43.440 your career moving because you've you've been on and up 0:04:43.640 --> 0:04:48.200 on and up swing through all this. Yeah, it's been 0:04:48.240 --> 0:04:51.480 the most bizarre thing, um, if I'm honest in a 0:04:51.839 --> 0:04:56.400 beautiful way, but also um, you know, I, like you said, 0:04:56.400 --> 0:04:58.760 I was getting ready to release my EP at the 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:01.440 time that the pandemic hit, and I actually put it 0:05:01.480 --> 0:05:03.760 off for a few months. Um, and I kind of 0:05:03.839 --> 0:05:06.320 changed course and decided to release each song one at 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:10.000 a time because I figured everyone's home, you know, what 0:05:10.040 --> 0:05:13.040 are we doing? Just you know, there's no rush um, 0:05:13.120 --> 0:05:15.760 And I I wanted to take a more of a 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:21.560 content approach um to my releasing I guess style. Um. 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:24.440 But yeah, the world came, it stopped. It just no 0:05:24.440 --> 0:05:26.200 one knew what to do. I mean, as as far 0:05:26.240 --> 0:05:29.040 as artists goes and the artists in my orbit, none 0:05:29.040 --> 0:05:30.960 of us knew what to do. I mean, we didn't 0:05:30.960 --> 0:05:34.000 know if we should release music. We thought, oh, it's 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:35.760 only gonna be other month. That was kind of like 0:05:35.800 --> 0:05:37.960 the talk at the beginning of the pandemic, it's going 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:40.480 to be a month um of quarantine and then we'll 0:05:40.520 --> 0:05:43.360 be okay. And and so I held off, you know, 0:05:43.440 --> 0:05:45.600 like a lot of artists, and then at some point, 0:05:45.600 --> 0:05:46.920 I was just like, I don't want to do this anywhere. 0:05:46.880 --> 0:05:48.560 I don't want to hold off. I just you know, 0:05:48.600 --> 0:05:52.200 I want to go. UM. I think the advantage of 0:05:52.240 --> 0:05:55.560 me being such a new artist is that, UM, I 0:05:55.600 --> 0:05:58.200 didn't really feel like I didn't feel pressured to change 0:05:58.200 --> 0:06:01.720 my tactics. I guess, so my little strategies I just 0:06:01.839 --> 0:06:04.440 I just show who I am. I honestly, every song 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:06.440 that's on my EP has probably been on my social 0:06:06.480 --> 0:06:09.360 media for at least six months prior to it even 0:06:09.480 --> 0:06:12.159 being released. I just tried out new songs on social 0:06:12.160 --> 0:06:14.880 media the way people trying out at shows, and so 0:06:14.960 --> 0:06:19.000 I just found ways to engage music and find different 0:06:19.000 --> 0:06:22.800 ways to to do content. UM. A whole lot of 0:06:22.800 --> 0:06:26.520 COVID testing. Honestly, there was like a period of several 0:06:26.520 --> 0:06:29.599 months where I was getting tested at least once or 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:32.520 twice a week. UM, because I would I would just 0:06:32.560 --> 0:06:34.320 plan everything out and say, Okay, hey, I need to 0:06:34.360 --> 0:06:36.320 do a photo shoot this day, or I need to 0:06:36.360 --> 0:06:38.080 go write a song with this person this day. I 0:06:38.080 --> 0:06:40.680 would just kind of I would plan out my in 0:06:40.800 --> 0:06:43.240 person things and I would just get tested in quarantine. 0:06:43.600 --> 0:06:45.479 And it was a whole lot. It was really interesting, 0:06:45.520 --> 0:06:48.400 like planning out when the hang with someone because you 0:06:48.440 --> 0:06:51.960 need to get tested and and quarantine. But m m hm, 0:06:52.600 --> 0:06:56.160 so I'm having sinus issues right now if you hear it. UM. 0:06:56.200 --> 0:06:59.080 But I think the Jurassic change, and I'll try to 0:06:59.120 --> 0:07:02.320 be brief. For me at least is watching everything come 0:07:02.400 --> 0:07:06.440 to a halt and feeling the agony of that, but 0:07:06.520 --> 0:07:09.600 also finding the opportunity and that. And I think for artists, 0:07:09.600 --> 0:07:12.920 we found we found ways to dig deeper into our music. 0:07:13.040 --> 0:07:16.800 We found ways to um, I don't know, to engage 0:07:16.800 --> 0:07:18.720 Like a few friends of mine, we started just going 0:07:18.760 --> 0:07:21.000 around and doing shows in people's backyards for a little 0:07:21.040 --> 0:07:24.000 bit UM like when it got a little safer, UM 0:07:24.040 --> 0:07:27.120 Like towards the end of last summer, UM, we started 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:29.960 getting more creative with strategies. I I just signed with 0:07:30.000 --> 0:07:33.480 my booking agency at the top of this year, UM, 0:07:33.520 --> 0:07:37.560 and so we just we started engaging UM branding opportunities, 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:42.160 We started engaging the live stream opportunities, anything that was UM, 0:07:42.200 --> 0:07:45.040 I guess innovative for this particular time. We just started 0:07:45.080 --> 0:07:47.880 engaging it UM. And I think artists had to be 0:07:47.960 --> 0:07:50.080 really open to that because a lot of times, I 0:07:50.120 --> 0:07:51.720 mean a lot of artists in Nashville. They don't want 0:07:51.720 --> 0:07:53.800 to do TikTok all the time. We don't, we don't. 0:07:53.880 --> 0:07:55.440 We don't like to do things. We just like to 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:58.320 go do shows. It was it was not the easy route, 0:07:58.360 --> 0:08:00.560 and and you know it's not easy to do shows, 0:08:00.600 --> 0:08:03.280 but it was the biggest, it is the biggest the 0:08:03.320 --> 0:08:06.040 revenue stream, and so artists had to I feel like 0:08:06.040 --> 0:08:09.120 we had to open our minds and and really just 0:08:09.200 --> 0:08:12.240 be open to finding more innovative ways to see the 0:08:12.240 --> 0:08:15.720 opportunity in quarantine and not just the the pain in 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:18.120 the agony and the setback of it. And I think 0:08:18.160 --> 0:08:21.520 some of those things will be implemented uh and years 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:23.640 to come, I think in addition to live shows. But 0:08:23.720 --> 0:08:25.360 people are going to have to be more innovative, I 0:08:25.400 --> 0:08:29.200 think moving forward in order to sustain a viable career 0:08:29.240 --> 0:08:32.960 path for artists. How did you replace the income that 0:08:33.080 --> 0:08:38.360 you lost from from not being able to play live shows? Um, 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:42.040 I think, well, during the pandemic. I actually I had 0:08:42.040 --> 0:08:44.160 a job even before the pandemic. I had a part 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.319 time job that allowed me to work remotely. So I'm 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:49.840 a new artist, Like the tag is probably still on me, 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:53.079 Like I'm I'm new new UM, and I was spending 0:08:53.080 --> 0:08:54.840 I mean, prior to the pandemic, I was spending a 0:08:54.840 --> 0:08:58.360 lot of time recording, a lot of time writing, and 0:08:58.480 --> 0:09:00.960 I started doing these personal trips where I would just 0:09:01.000 --> 0:09:04.959 go and travel to different cities, different states to write 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:07.560 with my friends. And I did that for a long time. 0:09:08.280 --> 0:09:10.720 Um but I was I was still working. But but 0:09:10.880 --> 0:09:12.600 in addition to that, I mean, I wasn't able to 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:15.000 continue to work during the pandemic as things started taking 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:18.040 off for me. Um but I I just found branding 0:09:18.040 --> 0:09:23.559 opportunities really, UM, I felt opportunities to um with live streams. 0:09:23.559 --> 0:09:26.000 Live streams were really cool help um in terms of 0:09:26.000 --> 0:09:30.559 income as well. UM yeah, those were my Those were 0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:32.560 probably my two biggest ones. And I think for more 0:09:32.679 --> 0:09:36.000 established artists there were more opportunities. But as an independent 0:09:36.080 --> 0:09:39.240 artist who was new, I really just had those different 0:09:39.360 --> 0:09:42.480 Um those really those two outlets. I mean it's probably 0:09:42.520 --> 0:09:44.120 maybe one or two more that I'm not remembering, but 0:09:44.120 --> 0:09:48.040 those were the biggest ones. Branding and live streams and 0:09:48.160 --> 0:09:50.520 uh but yeah, I mean it's it's a labor of love. 0:09:50.559 --> 0:09:52.200 I mean, especially as a new artist, and I was 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:56.000 doing some of the most fantastic things. I never even 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:57.679 thought I could do, and I was doing it from 0:09:57.679 --> 0:10:00.720 my studio apartment, like getting to have a feature in 0:10:00.800 --> 0:10:03.679 New York Times or being a rolling Stone, And like 0:10:04.000 --> 0:10:06.720 they're not sending photographers, you know, you had my makeup 0:10:06.800 --> 0:10:09.800 artist was literally taking photos of me and we were 0:10:09.800 --> 0:10:12.720 getting sent off to edit. And so like these big 0:10:12.760 --> 0:10:15.880 monumental moments were happening in a way that I never 0:10:15.920 --> 0:10:17.520 thought they would. I thought it would be bigger, I 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:20.560 thought it'd be something else. And and because of the 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.400 solitude that we've had in quarantine, we've had to really 0:10:23.559 --> 0:10:28.720 readjust and really reimagine, um, how things, how big things 0:10:28.760 --> 0:10:31.120 could be, and and and I guess in ways that 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:34.040 we didn't foresee them in pass. So I hope I'm 0:10:34.040 --> 0:10:37.400 answering your question. Yeah, no, that's actually a really interesting 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:39.760 way of putting it, is, is how big things can be? 0:10:39.920 --> 0:10:44.600 Did you get so you enjoyed live streams? Because I remember, um, 0:10:44.640 --> 0:10:47.079 you know, you think about the early ones like that 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:50.360 that Elton John benefit where you've got Paul McCartney like 0:10:50.520 --> 0:10:54.040 playing into his phone. Um, you know, and several months 0:10:54.120 --> 0:10:58.400 later things had really really progressed. Um, did you ever 0:10:58.559 --> 0:11:01.320 get used to st make it easier? But did you 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:08.600 ever really get used to playing, you know, playing live streams. Um. Yes, 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:12.600 as a person who who just posted videos online. I 0:11:12.600 --> 0:11:13.960 didn't do it all the time, but I did it 0:11:14.040 --> 0:11:18.320 quite a bit, um playing for Instagram or you know, 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:20.320 like people playing for people who going to see you 0:11:20.360 --> 0:11:23.560 on YouTube or Instagram or Twitter. I was kind of 0:11:23.640 --> 0:11:26.520 used to it. I did enjoy it, honestly, UM, But 0:11:26.600 --> 0:11:30.000 I do understand missing that that interaction that really can 0:11:30.000 --> 0:11:33.600 only be gained from a live performance. You missed that exchange, 0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:38.080 You missed that that conversation, and in live streams can 0:11:38.120 --> 0:11:41.080 kind of just be this this, this um, just one 0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:44.679 way conversation that might not always be the most engaging 0:11:45.160 --> 0:11:48.360 um or fulfilling, but it's I like it. I thought 0:11:48.360 --> 0:11:51.600 it was a really cool opportunity to to hone in 0:11:51.760 --> 0:11:55.280 on the craft of just I mean, I don't know, 0:11:55.360 --> 0:11:57.079 and where I come from, we call it just flat 0:11:57.120 --> 0:12:00.320 footed singing, like just standing there and singing the song 0:12:00.480 --> 0:12:03.920 and singing and communicating the story and singing your gass 0:12:04.000 --> 0:12:07.880 off and and not relying on on what can sometimes 0:12:07.880 --> 0:12:10.120 feel like a crush. If you have that audience interaction, 0:12:10.200 --> 0:12:12.520 everyone's loving it, you know, you that can kind of 0:12:12.640 --> 0:12:16.160 sometimes be an artistic crutch. There. There's so many times 0:12:16.960 --> 0:12:18.840 where I've looked back at a video and I thought 0:12:19.000 --> 0:12:20.600 I felt so good on the stage, and I listened 0:12:20.600 --> 0:12:22.280 back and I'm like, oh my god, what was I 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:24.880 doing at this part? That sounds crazy? But everyone was 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:28.000 just loving it, you know, And so it's it's those 0:12:28.040 --> 0:12:30.480 moments where it just it was a time to really 0:12:30.520 --> 0:12:32.559 hone in. That's that's the best way that I can 0:12:32.600 --> 0:12:35.000 describe it. For artists. It was a time to hone in. 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:37.360 What are we writing about? You know, we were in 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:39.720 the pandemic, but it was also a whole lot going on. 0:12:39.760 --> 0:12:44.880 It wasn't we weren't lacking um events at all during 0:12:44.880 --> 0:12:47.000 this pain theem We were in the houses, but I 0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:49.319 mean they were protests going on. There was there was 0:12:49.360 --> 0:12:51.880 a whole lot of injustice happening. There was an election 0:12:51.960 --> 0:12:54.840 we were embarking upon. There was there were events. You know, 0:12:54.920 --> 0:12:59.079 this was a very eventful time of solitude, and so 0:12:59.200 --> 0:13:02.440 it I think it cause creatives to really to really 0:13:02.600 --> 0:13:04.520 dig in and figure out what it is that they 0:13:04.559 --> 0:13:07.280 want to say, and also what do I want to 0:13:07.280 --> 0:13:09.000 do the next time I get in front of people. 0:13:09.160 --> 0:13:10.760 You know, we're not going to take those moments for 0:13:10.800 --> 0:13:13.360 granted anymore, at least I hope not, you know, just 0:13:13.400 --> 0:13:16.080 thinking like oh, it's another show, or or just get 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:18.280 on the bus and just treating this casually like oh, 0:13:18.320 --> 0:13:20.880 this is just my life. No, because we remember when 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:24.160 we couldn't do this anymore. Remember when it was it 0:13:24.320 --> 0:13:27.800 wasn't it wasn't an option. You know, you didn't see people, 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:29.640 you didn't get to see your fans. I mean even now, 0:13:29.800 --> 0:13:31.800 like on I'm on the road right now with Brett 0:13:31.800 --> 0:13:34.199 Eldredge and with Jason Is Bowl, and I don't I 0:13:34.200 --> 0:13:36.600 don't think we bring people backstage, Like there are no 0:13:36.720 --> 0:13:40.800 meet and greets. Um, we're not bringing friends and family backstage. 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:44.640 Everyone is vaccinated. Um, we're all wearing masks behind stage, 0:13:45.160 --> 0:13:49.480 and so it's it's um, it's different. You know, I'm 0:13:49.520 --> 0:13:51.440 about to be playing I'm about to do my first 0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:55.320 show at the Rhyman Auditorium on Saturday with Jason Is 0:13:55.400 --> 0:13:58.000 Bowl and it's so cool and I can't, like I 0:13:58.040 --> 0:14:00.000 can invite people, but I'm not bringing I wouldn't even 0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:03.280 feel comfortable to bring people backstage. So it's these big 0:14:03.320 --> 0:14:07.920 moments and they're happening much different than we thought. Um, 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:10.120 and even just touring as a new artist, touring with 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:15.520 COVID has been has been really really hard. Um, it's 0:14:15.520 --> 0:14:17.560 just it's just some more challenging time. But as a 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:19.440 new artist, and I keep stressing it because I don't 0:14:19.480 --> 0:14:22.520 really I don't have a huge point of context for 0:14:22.600 --> 0:14:25.640 how life was before COVID because I just released my 0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:29.280 first EP and December. Um, but this is my point 0:14:29.280 --> 0:14:31.440 of context. And so if we can I don't know, 0:14:31.440 --> 0:14:33.200 if I can make it through COVID, then then that 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:36.120 can hopefully, you know, meet any of the challenge in 0:14:36.160 --> 0:14:38.640 the future. Head on. That's how I feel with COVID. 0:14:38.680 --> 0:14:41.200 It's just if you can make it through this, that 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:44.480 we can make it through anything. Yeah. I think we've 0:14:44.520 --> 0:14:47.960 all feel like we've been tested enough. So UM, just 0:14:48.080 --> 0:14:51.080 one more question on that on that point, and that's 0:14:51.080 --> 0:14:55.040 how did your relationship with your fans change? Like, you know, 0:14:55.280 --> 0:14:57.280 I've talked a lot of artists who say that like 0:14:57.320 --> 0:15:00.320 they know they did a good performance during live streaming 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:03.200 by the number of claps they see they see, or 0:15:03.520 --> 0:15:05.720 like the number of people who are singing along in 0:15:05.840 --> 0:15:09.760 all caps, you know, singing along. Um, did you engage 0:15:09.880 --> 0:15:14.240 more with your fans? And how did you how did you, like, 0:15:14.400 --> 0:15:17.840 you know, sort of manage that relationship with them, And 0:15:17.880 --> 0:15:19.680 I'm just gonna get up for one second because there's 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:24.720 construction across the way and they got to close the door. Absolutely. UM. 0:15:24.880 --> 0:15:30.800 I I think that my relationship with with fans UM 0:15:30.840 --> 0:15:33.520 has changed in that I think people utilize social media 0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:37.720 a little more. I started noticing a huge uptick someone's 0:15:37.800 --> 0:15:40.440 knocking at my door. I noticed a huge uptick in 0:15:40.640 --> 0:15:42.840 comments and in the amount of people that would just 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:45.840 message me UM just to let me know, like hey, 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:49.120 I saw your thing, or just more YouTube comments. I 0:15:49.160 --> 0:15:52.360 saw this thing you did online, I saw this live stream. 0:15:52.400 --> 0:15:55.320 It's just I think the audience has been like that 0:15:55.400 --> 0:15:59.720 immediate UM interaction you don't have, but you can so 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:04.440 to still here. UM. You don't get that immediate reaction, 0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:08.120 but you do get UM. I guess the after the 0:16:08.240 --> 0:16:11.320 after effect, people just find ways to still engage with you. 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:13.120 I mean, if we didn't have social media, there would 0:16:13.160 --> 0:16:16.320 be no medium to still communicate with fans and and 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:17.960 UM and for people to be able to share with 0:16:17.960 --> 0:16:20.320 you their story, you know, because they heard yours on 0:16:20.400 --> 0:16:23.080 some other you know medium, and so it was UM. 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:25.840 I don't know. It's just been a really beautiful time 0:16:26.240 --> 0:16:28.440 I feel and and maybe this I hope this answers 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:30.560 your question more as well. I feel like even the 0:16:30.600 --> 0:16:35.520 responses that I've gotten from fans has been more um like, 0:16:35.600 --> 0:16:37.720 more in depth. Like people aren't just like, oh, I 0:16:37.760 --> 0:16:39.880 liked your show. They're saying, I loved your show. I've 0:16:39.880 --> 0:16:42.720 had a really hard time. I got laid off from work, 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:46.240 or you know, my family is struggling financially right now, 0:16:46.800 --> 0:16:49.560 or someone in my family has COVID and this really 0:16:49.600 --> 0:16:52.360 brightened my day. Like people, I'm seeing more of that 0:16:52.880 --> 0:16:54.960 um where people are just excited even now to just 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:56.920 be back at shows and they let you know, they 0:16:56.960 --> 0:16:59.360 let you know in person if they can, or they'll 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.560 just message or opposed to comment. It's just it feels 0:17:02.600 --> 0:17:07.359 deeper right now because people know the cost of attending 0:17:07.359 --> 0:17:10.600 a show. It's not just a taboo thing. It's not 0:17:10.640 --> 0:17:13.919 just a Friday night this is this is how life 0:17:15.000 --> 0:17:18.400 is enjoyed now. So it feels it feels like it's 0:17:18.440 --> 0:17:21.200 on a deeper level right now, the connection between artists 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:28.120 and fans. We'll be right back with Variety strictly business, 0:17:28.400 --> 0:17:30.879 taking a look at the state of the music industry 0:17:30.960 --> 0:17:42.600 in the fall of You're back with Variety strictly Business 0:17:42.880 --> 0:17:44.600 this week, taking a look at the state of the 0:17:44.720 --> 0:17:48.720 music industry in the fall of one Lucy, I want 0:17:48.760 --> 0:17:52.439 to move over to the next um again. It's the 0:17:52.480 --> 0:17:57.520 same situation, uh march um. You have a lot of 0:17:57.640 --> 0:18:01.480 artists presumably touring, about to start tours, and all of 0:18:01.520 --> 0:18:05.640 a sudden their main source of income is shut down completely. 0:18:06.160 --> 0:18:09.560 How did you and how did w m E pivot 0:18:09.720 --> 0:18:14.160 and find new opportunities for your artists. Well, I mean, 0:18:14.600 --> 0:18:17.440 obviously there's been a huge amount of change with within 0:18:17.480 --> 0:18:19.680 the agency world, and I think that the key part 0:18:19.720 --> 0:18:23.040 of all of that was in a way, I think 0:18:23.240 --> 0:18:26.919 it gives you that false moment to actually stop and 0:18:27.000 --> 0:18:29.879 to actually think, because obviously the life thing was always 0:18:29.920 --> 0:18:32.040 so you know, you're on a roll and you just 0:18:32.119 --> 0:18:34.240 keep booking live show, live show, and then when something 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.240 forces you to stop like that, you then have to 0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:39.800 start really really delving into what else you can do. 0:18:39.920 --> 0:18:42.240 And obviously, you know, as Brittany is already alluded to, 0:18:42.840 --> 0:18:47.000 we obviously had to set up a virtual department. We 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.439 also have been things, you know, we've had areas of 0:18:49.480 --> 0:18:52.080 like visual media where with our artists doing that or 0:18:52.160 --> 0:18:56.399 crossover department became hugely, hugely valuable to us for artists 0:18:56.400 --> 0:18:58.480 such as Lizzo and everyone else that we've had that 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.000 can just crossover into like to the other departments. We've 0:19:02.040 --> 0:19:04.680 had Book department that's been working on people like Dave 0:19:04.720 --> 0:19:07.199 grow with his new book that's come out. So it 0:19:07.320 --> 0:19:11.280 really was how do we how do we keep momentum? 0:19:11.400 --> 0:19:14.399 Momentum was the hardest thing, and it wasn't just for 0:19:14.440 --> 0:19:16.919 our clients. It's like, how do you keep momentum and 0:19:16.960 --> 0:19:20.400 people's morale high in a company like that where suddenly 0:19:20.840 --> 0:19:23.160 they don't know what to do themselves. So it wasn't 0:19:23.200 --> 0:19:25.560 it was like a whole big problem that we were 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:28.080 dealing with. But you know, we navigated through and we 0:19:28.160 --> 0:19:31.520 found lots of other areas and and we've grown other departments. 0:19:31.600 --> 0:19:35.040 You know, we've got the Legends department now, So you know, 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:38.760 it's been quite I think that that false time being 0:19:38.800 --> 0:19:40.879 able to stop and actually go, hang on a minute, 0:19:40.880 --> 0:19:43.040 what else can we do here? Because we've got all 0:19:43.160 --> 0:19:45.320 these tools available to us in this company, but none 0:19:45.320 --> 0:19:48.360 of us are really utilizing it. So let's start working 0:19:48.359 --> 0:19:52.080 out ways that we can cross the departmentalize and benefit 0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:55.159 and help our artists out. You know. But I think 0:19:56.280 --> 0:19:59.720 depending as Brittany spoke so brilliantly about with a new 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:03.080 are tist it could. It was so beneficial, like signed 0:20:03.160 --> 0:20:06.479 so many new artists during the pandemic, and I think 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:10.360 the ability for them to not rush, which I think 0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:12.600 was the key term that you use their Brittany, which 0:20:12.640 --> 0:20:15.439 is so what so many artists always want to do. 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:17.280 It's like, you know, they want to rush everything out. 0:20:17.640 --> 0:20:20.679 It's not rushing, it's engagement. It's letting your fans be 0:20:20.720 --> 0:20:22.440 able to relate to you. And it gave us all 0:20:22.560 --> 0:20:25.080 time for that. It gave us time to think about 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:26.800 what tour is going to be like when we go 0:20:26.880 --> 0:20:30.360 further forward. What you know what tour wise, my tour 0:20:30.920 --> 0:20:34.520 going to sell bad tickets than the fifteen other tours 0:20:34.560 --> 0:20:36.239 that are out at the same time because obviously we're 0:20:36.240 --> 0:20:39.160 now a bottleneck with everyone wanted to come back touring. 0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:43.000 So it's like it's just having that moment to stop 0:20:43.240 --> 0:20:45.880 and actually to think and be Okay, you know, how 0:20:46.080 --> 0:20:47.880 what else are we going to do here moving forward? 0:20:48.200 --> 0:20:50.560 And you know, times have changed massively and if we 0:20:50.600 --> 0:20:56.560 don't keep moving forward, we become irrelevant and stay all right. Indeed, um, 0:20:56.880 --> 0:20:59.640 were you having a lot of conversations with with your 0:20:59.720 --> 0:21:02.880 artists at the beginning of the pandemic that were almost 0:21:03.000 --> 0:21:05.240 um you know what were you saying to them? To 0:21:05.320 --> 0:21:08.480