WEBVTT - The RFK Jr. Problem 0:00:15.356 --> 0:00:23.236 Pushkin. I recently called up my friend Safie Bacall. I 0:00:23.276 --> 0:00:26.036 wanted to see if he could correctly guess the answer. 0:00:26.076 --> 0:00:26.876 To a puzzle. 0:00:27.916 --> 0:00:29.796 First of all, before we start, I just wanted to 0:00:29.876 --> 0:00:35.236 briefly establish your bona fides for this conversation. You have 0:00:35.396 --> 0:00:41.436 a PhD from m I T is that correct? Stanford, Stanford, Stanford, 0:00:41.996 --> 0:00:45.236 and you went on to be to work on the 0:00:45.236 --> 0:00:47.516 development of a number. 0:00:47.236 --> 0:00:48.076 Of different. 0:00:49.516 --> 0:00:50.796 Drugs, So that's correct. 0:00:51.116 --> 0:00:51.876 I did. 0:00:52.276 --> 0:00:54.676 Safi ran a drug company for a long time that 0:00:54.796 --> 0:00:57.476 worked on some of the hardest problems in cancer treatment. 0:00:58.356 --> 0:01:02.076 In preparation for our call, I sent Safie the package 0:01:02.116 --> 0:01:05.996 insert for something called rototech. As I'm sure you've noticed, 0:01:06.116 --> 0:01:09.116 when you get a prescription drug, there's a leaflet inside 0:01:09.276 --> 0:01:13.716 the box, all folded up, tiny print. That's the package insert. 0:01:14.076 --> 0:01:17.556 It tells you in great detail, every benefit, every side effect, 0:01:17.756 --> 0:01:21.716 every clinical study associated with your medication. The Food and 0:01:21.756 --> 0:01:26.116 Drug Administration and drug companies spend years working out the 0:01:26.156 --> 0:01:29.756 exact wording of that leaflet. And I'm assuming you've never 0:01:29.796 --> 0:01:30.956 read this before. 0:01:31.316 --> 0:01:33.276 Never read it before. I just saw it twenty minutes 0:01:33.276 --> 0:01:34.396 ago whenever you sent it. 0:01:35.356 --> 0:01:39.076 Rod Tech is a vaccine to protect babies against a 0:01:39.156 --> 0:01:44.396 very nasty intestinal bug called rotavirus. What Softie first noticed 0:01:44.716 --> 0:01:46.076 was how well it worked. 0:01:46.276 --> 0:01:49.316 Where I go to right away that's interesting is the 0:01:49.876 --> 0:01:58.716 efficacy data, which is post marketing adverse events description, drug 0:01:58.716 --> 0:02:03.436 interactions Clinical Studies, section fourteen. Yeah, that's amazing. You look 0:02:03.436 --> 0:02:07.836 at table eight on page ten or whatever. Yeap, there 0:02:07.916 --> 0:02:15.516 was one incidence of any grade of diarrhea or gastritis, 0:02:15.556 --> 0:02:18.716 which is what this virus is supposed to protect, and 0:02:18.956 --> 0:02:21.636 fifty one on the placebo arm. 0:02:21.996 --> 0:02:23.556 Oh wow, so it's. 0:02:23.516 --> 0:02:28.916 Fifty times higher. Fifty times higher. More kids will get 0:02:30.516 --> 0:02:37.436 some serious or moderate diarrhea or gasprininturitis compared to those 0:02:37.476 --> 0:02:39.876 who got the vaccine. And that tells me, of course 0:02:39.916 --> 0:02:41.436 I want the vaccine for my kid. 0:02:41.796 --> 0:02:46.516 Yeah. If I told you you had a drug undevelopment 0:02:46.596 --> 0:02:49.156 that had efficacy data where there was a fifty x 0:02:49.356 --> 0:02:52.796 difference between treatment and control, what would you what word 0:02:52.796 --> 0:02:53.756 would come out of your mouth? 0:02:54.516 --> 0:03:01.276 That's absolutely astonishing, that's just jaw dropping. You almost never 0:03:01.356 --> 0:03:05.356 see that kind of efficacy in a therapeutic for treating 0:03:05.516 --> 0:03:09.756 active disease. You see it once in a generation. You know, 0:03:09.796 --> 0:03:13.076 a fifty x improvement is incredible. 0:03:13.596 --> 0:03:15.636 And now that Sophia knew what we were talking about, 0:03:16.076 --> 0:03:18.116 it was time to see if he could answer my 0:03:18.236 --> 0:03:22.516 little puzzle, a puzzle connected to the co inventor of rhototech, 0:03:22.996 --> 0:03:26.556 a man named Paul Offitt. I want to read you 0:03:27.116 --> 0:03:29.276 now that we've done this, I want to read you 0:03:29.396 --> 0:03:31.956 from a book. I'm going not to tell you who 0:03:31.956 --> 0:03:34.436 wrote it, but someone in a position of real authority 0:03:35.036 --> 0:03:39.076 in the world. The best evidence indicates that doctor off 0:03:39.156 --> 0:03:43.556 Its rotavirus vaccine causes negative net public health impacts. In 0:03:43.596 --> 0:03:47.516 other words, doctor Offitz vaccine almost certainly kills and injured's 0:03:47.556 --> 0:03:50.516 more children in the United States than the rotavirus disease 0:03:50.596 --> 0:03:52.756 killed and injured prior to the vaccine's introduction. 0:03:54.636 --> 0:03:59.876 That's just complete bullshit. I don't know what else to say. 0:03:59.996 --> 0:04:04.716 That's just you look at this data. This is extremely robust, 0:04:04.876 --> 0:04:09.036 careful data. If you look at the statistics are probably 0:04:09.236 --> 0:04:14.956 and all of the numbers and tables here is just 0:04:15.436 --> 0:04:16.676 absolute nonsense. 0:04:17.196 --> 0:04:18.356 Do you want to guess who wrote that? 0:04:19.996 --> 0:04:23.716 Does it rhyme with jeneity? 0:04:23.876 --> 0:04:24.516 Yeah? 0:04:24.556 --> 0:04:30.796 Oh, Sophie, you win the prize. My name is Malcolm Gladwell. 0:04:30.996 --> 0:04:34.636 You're listening to revisionist History, my podcast about things Overlooked 0:04:34.676 --> 0:04:39.556 and misunderstood. This episode is the very strange story of 0:04:39.836 --> 0:04:43.436 Rhodo tech I vaccine that every American infant is supposed 0:04:43.476 --> 0:04:46.436 to get three times in their first eight months of life, 0:04:47.356 --> 0:04:51.556 or rather, the very strange campaign waged against Rhodo tech 0:04:51.996 --> 0:04:55.556 by Robert F. Kennedy Junior, the Secretary of Health and 0:04:55.636 --> 0:04:59.596 Human Services, the man in charge of every aspect of health, 0:05:00.036 --> 0:05:12.156 medicine and research in the United States. If you are 0:05:12.196 --> 0:05:15.596 the parents of small children in the developed world in 0:05:15.636 --> 0:05:18.636 the twenty first century, diarrhea is not high on your 0:05:18.676 --> 0:05:21.556 list of things you worry about. But that was not 0:05:21.596 --> 0:05:24.556 true of your parents when you were a child, or 0:05:24.596 --> 0:05:27.636 your parents' parents, or anyone else for that matter, going 0:05:27.676 --> 0:05:31.236 back as far as human beings go, particularly those living 0:05:31.516 --> 0:05:34.716 in the poorest parts of the world, this is what 0:05:34.796 --> 0:05:35.676 it used to be like. 0:05:36.716 --> 0:05:41.156 There's one vivid memory that I can actually think of 0:05:42.396 --> 0:05:48.116 is going into these pediatric wards and you had patients, 0:05:48.236 --> 0:05:52.356 these children literally to the point that you would actually 0:05:52.436 --> 0:05:57.956 have a daria ward, a separate daria ward, because that 0:05:58.236 --> 0:06:01.916 was the quantum of cases that you would see in 0:06:02.076 --> 0:06:05.196 hospitals without exception. 0:06:06.036 --> 0:06:10.436 This is vishwejit Kumar, a pediatrician and public health researcher 0:06:10.676 --> 0:06:13.996 in Uttar Pradesh, one of the poorest states in India, 0:06:14.556 --> 0:06:18.156 Remembering his days as an intern in the nineteen eighties. 0:06:19.516 --> 0:06:26.036 You have babies who come in dehydrated, severely dehydrated, and 0:06:26.076 --> 0:06:30.476 the force thing, you know, sunken eyes. You know, you 0:06:30.556 --> 0:06:33.276 could just pull their skin and you'll find that, you know, 0:06:33.476 --> 0:06:36.436 they just don't retract because there's no doug of pressure. 0:06:37.556 --> 0:06:40.796 A small child would get sick with the rotavirus, they 0:06:40.796 --> 0:06:44.036 would run a fever, they would start vomiting, they would 0:06:44.036 --> 0:06:47.476 develop severe diarrhea as the virus rea havoc in their 0:06:47.516 --> 0:06:53.476 stomach and intestines. That's three sources of dehydration suddenly and simultaneously. 0:06:53.956 --> 0:06:56.356 And if the child was far from a hospital and 0:06:56.476 --> 0:07:00.596 already malnourished, they were in trouble. The best estimates at 0:07:00.636 --> 0:07:03.876 the time were the children in developing countries had between 0:07:03.956 --> 0:07:07.556 four and eight episodes of severe diarrhea in their first 0:07:07.596 --> 0:07:11.996 five years of life, each lasting from two to ten days. 0:07:12.476 --> 0:07:15.636 For doctor Kamar, this meant a giant room for those 0:07:15.636 --> 0:07:20.036 shrunken infants, two and sometimes three to a bed. 0:07:20.996 --> 0:07:25.716 So you have these sweepers whose job is to just 0:07:25.836 --> 0:07:29.396 keep cleaning the mess, or the parents would do it, 0:07:29.636 --> 0:07:31.516 or the parents would clean it. You know. 0:07:31.996 --> 0:07:34.476 And of the children in that ward in that era, 0:07:35.436 --> 0:07:36.636 how many would you lose? 0:07:37.596 --> 0:07:39.956 Okay, so let's say that is a hundred of them 0:07:40.076 --> 0:07:44.996 will come in with severe and life threatening darreet, you'd 0:07:44.996 --> 0:07:46.156 lose ten percent for sure. 0:07:46.596 --> 0:07:51.996 Oh my goodness, I mean to lose one. To be 0:07:52.076 --> 0:07:56.396 a doctor and lose one baby must is emotionally overwhelming. 0:07:56.756 --> 0:08:00.396 You're talking about over the course. So though, over the 0:08:00.396 --> 0:08:02.876 course of working in a ward, you would lose dozens 0:08:02.916 --> 0:08:05.356 of children over the course of months. 0:08:05.396 --> 0:08:10.276 Yes, yes, So to give you an example, so we 0:08:10.316 --> 0:08:13.716 do these verbal autopsies because hospitals don't have good records, 0:08:14.756 --> 0:08:20.036 and so essentially reconstruct that event so that then experts 0:08:20.036 --> 0:08:23.076 can sit around and say this possibly could have led 0:08:23.116 --> 0:08:27.836 to BED. I have never been able to go through 0:08:27.956 --> 0:08:33.396 one verbal autopsy in one city. 0:08:33.476 --> 0:08:34.036 What do you mean? 0:08:34.156 --> 0:08:38.116 It's so heartbreaking because you're like, oh, you know, this 0:08:39.276 --> 0:08:42.196 could have been so, this could have been prevented. 0:08:42.876 --> 0:08:43.036 You know. 0:08:43.116 --> 0:08:46.516 It's like you look at these cases and see every 0:08:46.596 --> 0:08:48.996 newborn dies. That is one mother who also in some 0:08:49.036 --> 0:08:51.636 ways there is some part of it dies with her. 0:08:52.636 --> 0:08:56.996 The battle against rotavirus took years. First, the virus itself 0:08:57.076 --> 0:08:59.956 had to be identified, separated out from all the other 0:08:59.996 --> 0:09:03.476 pathogens that can cause diarrhea in young children. Then a 0:09:03.556 --> 0:09:07.156 vaccine had to be constructed from that newly identified virus, 0:09:07.436 --> 0:09:11.516 another time consuming ten One of the leading groups working 0:09:11.556 --> 0:09:14.516 on the problem was at the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia, 0:09:14.996 --> 0:09:18.596 at a lab run by Paul Offitt. You helped develop 0:09:18.636 --> 0:09:22.916 the rotavirus vaccine in what year did that? Did that 0:09:22.956 --> 0:09:23.356 come out? 0:09:24.036 --> 0:09:25.836 Two thousand and six, two thousand and six. 0:09:25.916 --> 0:09:26.956 How long did you work on that? 0:09:27.716 --> 0:09:28.636 Twenty six years? 0:09:28.796 --> 0:09:29.196 Wow? 0:09:29.716 --> 0:09:32.876 Why was that a hard problem to solve? 0:09:34.556 --> 0:09:36.316 I don't think it was terribly hard to solve. It 0:09:36.516 --> 0:09:39.756 just takes a long time to solve these things. Although 0:09:39.796 --> 0:09:42.636 the veterinarians knew this to be a cause of disease 0:09:42.676 --> 0:09:46.196 and animals since the forties, it wasn't really described as 0:09:46.236 --> 0:09:47.996 a human pathoge until the seventies, so there wasn't a 0:09:48.036 --> 0:09:50.516 lot of information about this. So we developed a small 0:09:50.556 --> 0:09:52.836 animal model for the disease in the early eighties, and 0:09:52.876 --> 0:09:56.756 then we figured out and simply put which part of 0:09:56.796 --> 0:09:59.436 the virus made you sick and which part of the 0:09:59.476 --> 0:10:02.556 virus induced immune sponsor that was protective, and with that information, 0:10:02.636 --> 0:10:06.876 we then combined strains that were a virulent benign with 0:10:07.076 --> 0:10:11.276 virulent strains to knock out the virulent part but include 0:10:11.276 --> 0:10:14.756 the protective part, Thus summarizing twenty six years of work 0:10:14.796 --> 0:10:16.556 in forty seconds. 0:10:17.476 --> 0:10:21.036 Offits group took their candidate vaccine to the drug company Merk, 0:10:21.436 --> 0:10:23.836 which spent well over a billion dollars to bring the 0:10:23.876 --> 0:10:28.996 candidate vaccine to market. The result was Rottech And. 0:10:28.956 --> 0:10:32.516 With that, you know, the vaccine eliminated, really eliminated hospitalizations 0:10:32.556 --> 0:10:33.156 from this country. 0:10:33.196 --> 0:10:33.836 We don't really. 0:10:33.956 --> 0:10:36.356 Most pediatric residents in our hospital have never seen an 0:10:36.356 --> 0:10:40.036 inpatient with rotavirus, which is amazing because it dominated my residency. 0:10:40.476 --> 0:10:42.076 It dominated your residency. 0:10:42.156 --> 0:10:44.156 Oh yeah, no, you over the winter, you were just 0:10:44.196 --> 0:10:46.356 flooded with kids both in the emergency department and coming 0:10:46.396 --> 0:10:50.156 into the hospital severe dehydration. Yeah, and now the one 0:10:51.076 --> 0:10:52.796 and now the hospitalizations are gone. 0:10:53.356 --> 0:10:56.916 Other rotavirus vaccines followed. A group of scientists in India 0:10:57.116 --> 0:11:00.556 developed their own in twenty sixteen. Also around this time, 0:11:00.676 --> 0:11:04.596 many developing countries made huge strides in sanitation, which cut 0:11:04.636 --> 0:11:07.836 down on the spread of the virus. Oral rehydration therapy 0:11:07.876 --> 0:11:11.716 became widespread, and now the dedicated diarrhe awards that were 0:11:11.716 --> 0:11:14.716 such a big part of Kumar's training are all but gone. 0:11:16.156 --> 0:11:18.796 It's hard to find anyone who works with children and 0:11:18.836 --> 0:11:22.196 remembers the way things were who isn't in love with 0:11:22.276 --> 0:11:25.676 the rotavirus vaccine. And you s have lists the most 0:11:25.716 --> 0:11:30.396 important innovations that you've seen that have affected the lives 0:11:30.396 --> 0:11:31.996 of children. Where does this rank. 0:11:33.716 --> 0:11:35.396 At the top amongst the top? 0:11:35.956 --> 0:11:40.116 This is doctor Zulfikar Bhutah, co director for the Center 0:11:40.156 --> 0:11:43.636 of Global Child Health at Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto. 0:11:43.876 --> 0:11:47.076 He spent years as a pediatrician in his native Pakistan. 0:11:47.756 --> 0:11:51.556 We went down from ten million child debts under five 0:11:51.996 --> 0:11:55.316 in the year two thousand by twenty fifteen to just 0:11:55.516 --> 0:11:58.956 under six million deaths. Today they are down to around 0:11:58.996 --> 0:12:01.996 three million debts in children on the five. It's the 0:12:02.036 --> 0:12:05.996 fastest rate of reduction in child deaths and the history 0:12:06.036 --> 0:12:10.036 of mankind. And it hasn't just happened by happens fast. 0:12:11.636 --> 0:12:15.196 And this is the vaccine that Robert F. Kennedy Jr. 0:12:15.676 --> 0:12:16.076 Hates. 0:12:28.516 --> 0:12:30.596 I have to confess that I knew very little about 0:12:30.636 --> 0:12:33.356 Robert F. Kennedy Junior before he ran for president in 0:12:33.436 --> 0:12:36.756 twenty twenty four. But as he loomed larger and larger 0:12:36.796 --> 0:12:39.836 in the news, I realized I had his most recent book, 0:12:40.116 --> 0:12:43.556 The Real Anthony Fauci, Bill Gates, Big Pharma and the 0:12:43.596 --> 0:12:47.876 Global War on Democracy and Public Health. His publicist must 0:12:47.876 --> 0:12:50.076 have sent me a review copy when it came out 0:12:50.076 --> 0:12:52.396 in twenty twenty one. I found it in a big 0:12:52.436 --> 0:12:55.036 pile of books on the porch, so I decided to 0:12:55.076 --> 0:12:58.756 read it all four hundred and ninety two pages. And 0:12:58.796 --> 0:13:01.436 it was there in chapter three that I discovered the 0:13:01.476 --> 0:13:06.036 particular loathing that RFK Junior has for the rotavirus vaccines. 0:13:06.516 --> 0:13:08.636 I couldn't make head nor tails of it, which is 0:13:08.676 --> 0:13:11.156 why I had to call my friend Safi boocall up. 0:13:11.916 --> 0:13:15.636 We were going over the package insert, which you thought 0:13:15.756 --> 0:13:19.876 was clean as a whistle, Yeah, right, And so I 0:13:19.916 --> 0:13:22.076 was trying to figure out why, if it was as 0:13:22.156 --> 0:13:25.716 clean as a whistle, does Kennedy have such a problem 0:13:26.236 --> 0:13:30.556 with rototech and rotavirus vaccines in general? And I want 0:13:30.556 --> 0:13:34.596 to read to you the key paragraph in his book, 0:13:35.596 --> 0:13:38.436 which and we're going to try and solve this puzzle together, 0:13:38.476 --> 0:13:40.436 because I have a vague idea, but I think i'm 0:13:40.636 --> 0:13:43.636 I can't my idea is so reflects so poorly on 0:13:43.756 --> 0:13:46.476 him that I part of me thinks it can't be 0:13:47.876 --> 0:13:53.396 the right idea. This is the key paragraph. Reported adverse 0:13:53.436 --> 0:13:56.956 reactions from doctor off its roto Tech vaccine ranged from 0:13:57.036 --> 0:13:59.636 nine hundred and fifty three to sixteen hundred and eighty 0:13:59.716 --> 0:14:04.836 nine per year. These included fever, diarrhea, vomiting, irritability, into 0:14:04.876 --> 0:14:11.636 susception since severe combined immunity deficiency. See Kennedy lists twenty 0:14:11.996 --> 0:14:14.916 different really bad things he thinks are associated with rhodo Tech, 0:14:15.356 --> 0:14:20.236 ending with gastro enteritis, pneumonia, and death. Then he writes 0:14:20.276 --> 0:14:22.596 the paragraph that I read to Sofi at the beginning 0:14:22.596 --> 0:14:25.956 of this episode. The list of adverse reactions is so 0:14:26.116 --> 0:14:30.156 long that rot tech quote almost certainly kills and injures 0:14:30.196 --> 0:14:33.676 more children in the United States than the rotavirus disease 0:14:33.756 --> 0:14:38.636 killed and injured prior to the vaccine's introduction. Now, I 0:14:38.676 --> 0:14:42.276 have to say that at this point things get deeply confusing, 0:14:42.756 --> 0:14:45.996 because I couldn't figure out where that number nine hundred 0:14:46.036 --> 0:14:49.356 and fifty three to sixteen hundred and eighty nine adverse 0:14:49.476 --> 0:14:53.356 reactions a year comes from. In the real Anthony Fauci 0:14:53.556 --> 0:14:57.196 Kennedy lists as his source the package INCERT, but those 0:14:57.316 --> 0:15:00.796 numbers aren't in the package INCERT. We hired a fact 0:15:00.916 --> 0:15:03.636 checker with a PhD in biology, and she couldn't figure 0:15:03.636 --> 0:15:07.636 out where Kennedy's numbers come from either. Then we thought, oh, 0:15:08.036 --> 0:15:12.476 he got the numbers from the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System, 0:15:12.636 --> 0:15:15.716 which is the government run database where anyone can report 0:15:15.716 --> 0:15:18.276 a side effect that they think is associated with a 0:15:18.356 --> 0:15:22.796 vaccine keyword think. But VEHIRS is in Kennedy's source either. 0:15:23.276 --> 0:15:25.996 We found the numbers. VERS only has three hundred and 0:15:26.036 --> 0:15:29.716 forty four reports of side effects over fifteen years for 0:15:29.956 --> 0:15:33.756 all rotavirus vaccines, of which only thirty two are serious, 0:15:34.036 --> 0:15:36.876 which is like miles and miles away from the massive 0:15:36.956 --> 0:15:40.516 number of problems that Kennedy's talking about. And even if 0:15:40.516 --> 0:15:42.956 he just made a typo and read the numbers wrong, 0:15:43.196 --> 0:15:47.236 it still doesn't prove his case because, as the CDC says, quote, 0:15:47.516 --> 0:15:51.156 a report to VERS does not mean a vaccine caused 0:15:51.396 --> 0:15:54.996 an adverse event end quote. So just because a baby 0:15:55.076 --> 0:15:58.996 vomited after getting his rototech doesn't mean rototech caused the 0:15:59.076 --> 0:16:02.956 vomiting baby's vomit. All the time to prove the vaccine 0:16:02.996 --> 0:16:04.956 was the cause of the side effect. You really have 0:16:04.996 --> 0:16:07.996 to dig into the data look for patterns, or, better yet, 0:16:08.196 --> 0:16:10.676 go back to the original clinical trial and see if 0:16:10.716 --> 0:16:13.316 there were any clues when the vaccine was first tested 0:16:13.316 --> 0:16:16.956 for side effects. In the case of rhodotech, the clinical 0:16:16.996 --> 0:16:21.236 trial was enormous. Twelve countries, thirty four thousand infants were 0:16:21.276 --> 0:16:24.796 given the vaccine, thirty four thousand were given a pacbo. 0:16:25.076 --> 0:16:27.956 The babies were followed for a full year, and absolutely 0:16:28.076 --> 0:16:32.636 every medical event that happened to them was recorded and analyzed. 0:16:33.156 --> 0:16:36.436 Sixty eight thousand babies. If in the course of a 0:16:36.516 --> 0:16:39.796 year the babies who got the vaccine had more complications 0:16:39.796 --> 0:16:42.316 than the babies who got the placebo, then that would 0:16:42.356 --> 0:16:45.636 raise a red flag. It would suggest, wait, maybe the 0:16:45.716 --> 0:16:48.996 vomiting was the result of the vaccine, But if there 0:16:49.036 --> 0:16:51.796 was no difference in the experience of those two groups, 0:16:52.076 --> 0:16:55.876 it would suggest any associated problems were just the kind 0:16:55.876 --> 0:16:58.236 of health problems that you'd expect to see as a 0:16:58.276 --> 0:17:00.796 matter of course, in a very large group of babies. 0:17:02.116 --> 0:17:04.796 All of this data is laid out in the package. 0:17:04.836 --> 0:17:09.556 Insert page five the SAE series adverse events, and you 0:17:09.596 --> 0:17:13.076 would just look at that table and you would say, 0:17:13.196 --> 0:17:13.836 no difference. 0:17:14.756 --> 0:17:17.316 The table is a comparison of side effects in the 0:17:17.396 --> 0:17:20.116 kids who got the vaccine and the kids who didn't. 0:17:20.596 --> 0:17:24.676 Numerically, if anything, there were more essays on the placebo 0:17:26.396 --> 0:17:30.836 than the control arm. But it's insignificantly. It's like the 0:17:30.876 --> 0:17:34.956 difference between eating a banana or an apple. Yeah, no difference. 0:17:35.396 --> 0:17:38.116 Together, we went through every one of the medical problems 0:17:38.396 --> 0:17:42.836 listed on the chart. Gos true and is point six 0:17:42.916 --> 0:17:48.716 percent treatment? Treatment? What's that placibo? He would just use 0:17:48.756 --> 0:17:51.036 it is that where we are now? We kept finding 0:17:51.076 --> 0:17:54.556 the same thing. No difference, no difference in any difference. 0:17:55.476 --> 0:18:01.636 Let's see point six point six No, no difference and seizures. 0:18:01.996 --> 0:18:06.236 See where are your next page? Yes, seizures. Yes, Numerically 0:18:06.796 --> 0:18:11.236 maybe a little higher, but the SAEs were exactly the same. 0:18:11.876 --> 0:18:17.796 But somehow Kennedy reached the opposite conclusion in his book 0:18:18.156 --> 0:18:23.276 The Real Anthony Fauci, Kennedy writes, quote, since its approval, 0:18:23.716 --> 0:18:28.996 doctor Offit's rotavirus vaccine has caused a wave of catastrophic 0:18:29.116 --> 0:18:32.116 illnesses and agonizing death. 0:18:33.876 --> 0:18:34.756 I mean, that's just. 0:18:36.596 --> 0:18:39.956 A stonishingly. It just makes it just astonishing. 0:18:40.276 --> 0:18:42.276 Yeah, so wait, what's he doing? 0:18:42.396 --> 0:18:45.436 He looked at the same thing you looked at and 0:18:45.516 --> 0:18:49.996 decided that the rotavirus vaccine was causing this enormous burden 0:18:49.996 --> 0:18:53.876 of adverse reactions. I have to say I got completely 0:18:53.996 --> 0:18:58.476 obsessed with this. Where is RFK Junior getting his information? 0:18:58.956 --> 0:19:01.436 And what about the data from the clinical trial? Did 0:19:01.476 --> 0:19:04.276 he not read it? Did he read it and not 0:19:04.396 --> 0:19:07.556 understand it? Or did he read it and understand it 0:19:08.076 --> 0:19:13.716 and just say yah. You have a simple chart that 0:19:13.756 --> 0:19:17.876 has two columns, one columns called pacebo and one columns 0:19:17.916 --> 0:19:22.636 called treatment. And he decided to completely ignore the column 0:19:22.716 --> 0:19:25.196 called pacbo right exactly. 0:19:25.276 --> 0:19:28.196 He decided to reach a conclusion about the vaccine by 0:19:28.196 --> 0:19:32.836 looking at it by by by fundamentally not just misinterpreting. 0:19:33.516 --> 0:19:36.956 He got a he's one eighty one hundred and eighty 0:19:36.996 --> 0:19:41.556 degrees wrong in his interpretation of the data, and he 0:19:41.636 --> 0:19:43.796 had to he had to place It's as if he 0:19:43.836 --> 0:19:46.076 took his hand and placed it over the side of 0:19:46.076 --> 0:19:48.996 the chart that says placebo, like there has to be 0:19:49.076 --> 0:19:52.596 some agency here that allows you to look at something 0:19:52.636 --> 0:19:54.516 that has two rows and only see one row. 0:19:55.916 --> 0:19:59.436 Well, firstly, I doubt that he actually looked at this source. 0:19:59.476 --> 0:20:02.116 I'm furious, A pretty busy guy, and you know. 0:20:02.196 --> 0:20:06.436 But Spasafi, he writes half of an entire chapter denouncing 0:20:06.436 --> 0:20:08.716 the ronavirus vaccine. It's not like this is this is 0:20:08.756 --> 0:20:11.716 not a He's not making this observation in passing. He's 0:20:11.756 --> 0:20:15.676 going after at length one of the most significant public 0:20:15.676 --> 0:20:18.476 health advances of the last twenty five years, right, telling 0:20:18.556 --> 0:20:22.116 us get his saved millions of lives. This is not 0:20:22.276 --> 0:20:25.836 trivial stakes here, right, he's big game hunting here. 0:20:26.476 --> 0:20:26.916 Yeah. 0:20:27.196 --> 0:20:30.156 Wasn't he trained as a lawyer? I don't know he's 0:20:30.156 --> 0:20:34.476 a lawyer. Yeah, yeah, yeah, because on the last I 0:20:34.516 --> 0:20:39.116 guess I try to air on sort of generous explanations 0:20:39.476 --> 0:20:41.356 and maybe you are you go on the other side. 0:20:41.396 --> 0:20:44.916 I don't know. But aren't lawyers trained to do that 0:20:45.036 --> 0:20:47.756 sort of thing, dig deep into facts and make a 0:20:47.796 --> 0:20:50.236 case or prove or disprove a case. You would think 0:20:50.276 --> 0:20:52.196 that would be part of your legal training. 0:20:52.476 --> 0:20:54.996 But if you if you was you're a lawyer, and 0:20:55.116 --> 0:20:58.836 made this argument in court, you would be humiliated by 0:20:58.876 --> 0:20:59.796 opposing counsel. 0:21:00.356 --> 0:21:01.916 Yeah, he would take five seconds. 0:21:01.996 --> 0:21:04.916 Who just hold up the chart and say, oops, yeah, 0:21:05.196 --> 0:21:06.116 that's the other side. 0:21:06.476 --> 0:21:07.036 Yeah. 0:21:07.276 --> 0:21:10.956 One last one of but a very specific one, which 0:21:11.076 --> 0:21:14.836 is if you're going to do this. Why does he 0:21:14.996 --> 0:21:20.036 link to the source that refutes his argument? He so 0:21:20.436 --> 0:21:25.316 I can understand. I want to completely misinterpret the clinical 0:21:25.356 --> 0:21:28.636 data on rhodo tech. I want to make the sorry 0:21:28.836 --> 0:21:31.116 about vaccines, and I'm going to clasp my fingers and 0:21:31.196 --> 0:21:34.036 hope that ninety five percent of my readers don't notice. 0:21:34.196 --> 0:21:37.916 But then he gives you the link to the very 0:21:37.956 --> 0:21:41.276 thing that shows you that he's absolutely wrong. 0:21:41.436 --> 0:21:42.156 Who does this? 0:21:42.676 --> 0:21:43.796 He's not even a good liar. 0:21:44.716 --> 0:21:48.996 What was that word that they used a few years ago, truthiness? Yeah, right, 0:21:49.756 --> 0:21:53.556 there must be an equivalent word of scienceiness. My book 0:21:53.596 --> 0:21:57.796 has sciency neus because it has footnotes that are sciency done. 0:22:00.756 --> 0:22:02.956 By the way, this isn't even the half of it. 0:22:03.516 --> 0:22:05.276 If you spend any time at all immersed in the 0:22:05.356 --> 0:22:08.236 words and thoughts of rfk Jr. It's pretty clear that 0:22:08.276 --> 0:22:11.796 the person who he hates above all others is Anthony Fauci. 0:22:12.356 --> 0:22:15.956 Kennedy really really doesn't like Anthony Fauci. He wrote a 0:22:15.956 --> 0:22:18.236 four hundred and ninety two page book about how much 0:22:18.236 --> 0:22:21.036 he hates Anthony Fauci. But do you know who's a 0:22:21.116 --> 0:22:25.836 close number two? Paul Offit, the inventor of rototech in 0:22:25.876 --> 0:22:30.236 the real Anthony Fauci, Kennedy spends pages on off It. 0:22:30.876 --> 0:22:34.916 He writes off It quote represents himself as an authoritative 0:22:34.956 --> 0:22:39.116 source of reliable information, but he's actually a fond of 0:22:39.236 --> 0:22:44.796 wild industry bally who prevarication and outright fraud end quote. 0:22:45.436 --> 0:22:48.756 Tune into any of the countless podcast interviews Kennedy has 0:22:48.796 --> 0:22:51.596 given and you'll find the same thing. After he's gone 0:22:51.596 --> 0:22:54.956 after Fauci, he goes after Offit, to the point where 0:22:54.996 --> 0:22:57.636 after Kennedy goes on Joe Rogan and went on one 0:22:57.636 --> 0:23:00.156 of his usual Paul off At rants, off It got 0:23:00.236 --> 0:23:01.956 death threats and hate mail. 0:23:02.876 --> 0:23:04.076 I mean, I don't know if this is the whole 0:23:04.156 --> 0:23:06.276 Rogan thing, but he attacks me all the time because 0:23:06.356 --> 0:23:09.476 I committed the unpardonable sin of being the going ventnor 0:23:09.916 --> 0:23:12.476 of the rodavirus vaccine, which by the way, saves about 0:23:12.476 --> 0:23:14.316 one hundred and sixty five thousand lives a year in 0:23:14.356 --> 0:23:16.516 the in the world. I thought that was a good thing, 0:23:16.556 --> 0:23:18.756 but apparently, according to him, I'm just the pharma show. 0:23:19.076 --> 0:23:23.796 Yeah. I keep seeing him go after you, and I'm 0:23:23.796 --> 0:23:27.636 trying to sort of understand, but he's never to your knowledge, 0:23:27.676 --> 0:23:30.276 has he ever kind of acknowledged what you what you 0:23:30.356 --> 0:23:34.036 guys created was of value to mankind. Has he's never 0:23:34.196 --> 0:23:38.116 has he ever acknowledged that no. One hundred and sixty 0:23:38.116 --> 0:23:41.156 five thousand people a year doesn't believe it? 0:23:42.636 --> 0:23:43.036 But did he? 0:23:43.196 --> 0:23:45.996 I mean, did he actually work through the logic of this? 0:23:46.156 --> 0:23:49.156 So he just not publicly? I mean, I don't know, 0:23:49.236 --> 0:23:52.596 I don't know what how his brain works. 0:23:52.876 --> 0:23:54.076 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:23:54.276 --> 0:23:56.196 Maybe it was that warm, Maybe the worm was telling 0:23:56.236 --> 0:23:56.716 him to do it. 0:23:58.356 --> 0:24:01.716 I'm sorry to keep harping on this, but this is 0:24:01.876 --> 0:24:05.716 just bizarre. If I was someone who really didn't like 0:24:05.836 --> 0:24:09.116 vaccines and I was writing my massive opus on the subject, 0:24:09.676 --> 0:24:12.596 I'd pick a really marginal vaccine to go after, something 0:24:12.636 --> 0:24:15.876