1 00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:04,240 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of I 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:13,760 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. Ah yeah, yeah yeah, And welcome to the podcast. 3 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,360 Speaker 1: I'm Josh and there's Chuck. Jerry's hanging out here wearing 4 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: a giant sombrero, and that makes this stuff you should know. 5 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 1: I was actually gonna sing that that's funny that you 6 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:26,439 Speaker 1: thought of the same dang thing. That's that's the one. 7 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: That's the one that I've you know, I grew up on. Yeah. 8 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 1: I think I told the story once before about when 9 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:36,960 Speaker 1: it's funny how these things you remember from your childhood. 10 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,479 Speaker 1: When I was in kindergarten, they taught us the Mexican 11 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:46,879 Speaker 1: hat dance, and we danced around uh not hats, but 12 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:53,320 Speaker 1: spray can lids, like like like spray pant lids. Why 13 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 1: because you know, we didn't have little sombreros, Okay, And 14 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:00,440 Speaker 1: it's one of those things we're looking back like bless him. 15 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 1: They were teaching us about another culture, which is great 16 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:06,560 Speaker 1: for a five year old, but like looking back all 17 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:09,919 Speaker 1: these you know, white suburban at Landing kids dancing around 18 00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: spray pant spray paint candle its is a little little cringe. 19 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 1: It's an it's a weird, like at a detail, but 20 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: I'll bet it was still adorable to see. You know, 21 00:01:19,440 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: it's an odd substitute, like we didn't decorate them. I 22 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 1: would get that they were just the lids, right, no 23 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,440 Speaker 1: brims or anything like that. So it's more of like 24 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:34,320 Speaker 1: a fees dance. Yeah. Sure, it was like a fest 25 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:38,279 Speaker 1: Hits minus the tassel. So Chuck, I just want to say, um, 26 00:01:38,319 --> 00:01:41,880 Speaker 1: if this pick is from your recent trip to the Yucatan, 27 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: that is a vacation that just keeps giving. Now it's 28 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 1: not at all. We heard no mariachi down there. Uh. 29 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 1: I don't know why I thought of this. I'm not 30 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 1: sure other than the fact that it's a music that 31 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:59,280 Speaker 1: I like and it's a fun like when people are 32 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:02,200 Speaker 1: over and it's a Friday night where happy hour and 33 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:06,520 Speaker 1: up some cocktails. Putting on a mariachi mix is always 34 00:02:06,520 --> 00:02:09,839 Speaker 1: a good move. Uh. And you know, when I lived 35 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 1: in l A, I lived in a Mexican neighborhood in 36 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:19,360 Speaker 1: a largely Mexican neighborhood and a Mexican or Mexican American 37 00:02:20,120 --> 00:02:24,160 Speaker 1: apartment complex. I was the only gringo there and so 38 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 1: the music was just blaring out at all times, and 39 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:33,040 Speaker 1: I really got tired of it for a while, but 40 00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: it was in getting tired of it that I got 41 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:37,360 Speaker 1: an appreciation for it and ending up loving it. If 42 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,320 Speaker 1: that makes sense, that's really cool. Yeah, it does make sense. Actually, 43 00:02:40,639 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: you have subsumed it by attrition, I guess, yeah, yeah, sure, 44 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 1: so yeah this was your pick um. I don't know 45 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:49,080 Speaker 1: that I ever would have gotten around to this one 46 00:02:49,080 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 1: because I'm not like a huge mariachi fan. Got nothing 47 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:55,400 Speaker 1: against it, but like, my exposure to mariachi is sadly 48 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: like speedy guns all is Um cartoons and like Mexican 49 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:02,920 Speaker 1: restaurant visits. But now that I've researched it some I 50 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:05,280 Speaker 1: have kind of developed more of an appreciation of it 51 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 1: than I had before. But one of the things that 52 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 1: struck me about it, Chuck, is that if you listen 53 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:14,000 Speaker 1: to like old mariachi and like relatively new mariachi, like 54 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:16,800 Speaker 1: there's a some there's something about there's like a through 55 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:20,840 Speaker 1: line where it's very clearly the same kind of music 56 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:24,840 Speaker 1: after decades and decades centuries. Really you could say, um, 57 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:27,320 Speaker 1: and I think that's really cool that it's not like 58 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:31,480 Speaker 1: like I went to look for disco mariachi and yeah, 59 00:03:32,040 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: it doesn't exist like I found some I found like 60 00:03:34,960 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: a mariachi band doing covers of some disco favorites, like 61 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,800 Speaker 1: you know, but it was still mostly disco with a 62 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: little bit more horn than than normal. Um. But it's 63 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: like a really like I don't want to say unchanged 64 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: because it's definitely evolved in other kinds of merged with 65 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 1: other kinds, you know, but but it's you can recognize 66 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 1: it from nineteen hundred to nine as mariachi music. Yeah, 67 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: And you know, I think one of the through lines 68 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:03,720 Speaker 1: that I saw, and it's something we talked a little 69 00:04:03,760 --> 00:04:07,280 Speaker 1: bit about before we recorded was and I think the 70 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 1: name of this episode of already titled the Rodney Danger 71 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:14,000 Speaker 1: Field of Musical Genres, But it's a it's a genre 72 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: that I think is always worked at gaining respect globally 73 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:24,400 Speaker 1: and among you know, the intelligentia and the classical community. 74 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: And I think part of that is rooted in some 75 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: just inherent racism that America feels towards Mexico, which I 76 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,479 Speaker 1: think is just something that's that's just there. It's a 77 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:40,239 Speaker 1: country that is our closest neighbor, obviously Canada as well, 78 00:04:40,279 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 1: but uh, it's an interesting place and that you know, 79 00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:46,640 Speaker 1: fifty percent of the country, I think, since the pandemic 80 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 1: lives below the poverty line, but it's also like a 81 00:04:49,960 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: top ten country economically globally, which was hard to believe. 82 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 1: So it's Mexico, I think has a lot of people 83 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: living in poverty and a lot of very wealthy people, 84 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:04,120 Speaker 1: so a big wealth gap there. Uh. And this music 85 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:06,039 Speaker 1: is a part of their proud tradition. And I think 86 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:09,040 Speaker 1: little things have happened over the years, and we'll talk 87 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:10,960 Speaker 1: about a lot of them that have helped kind of 88 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:15,000 Speaker 1: uh up their respect anti where it's not just a 89 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:19,680 Speaker 1: Mexican restaurant music to two people here and around the world. 90 00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:22,080 Speaker 1: And I think like movies like Coco coming along, like 91 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: just little things like that have happened over the years 92 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 1: that really helped kind of bring it to the four 93 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:28,440 Speaker 1: where people realize what a kind of cool music it is. 94 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 1: Yeah for sure. Uh. And yeah that's just because you know, 95 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:34,880 Speaker 1: people's exposure to it is strictly a Mexican restaurant doesn't 96 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:36,880 Speaker 1: mean like that's where it exists like that. It's moved 97 00:05:36,880 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: into concert halls, um Uh, it's moved into like schools 98 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:45,479 Speaker 1: and colleges like it's it's it's it's definitely gained a 99 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:49,039 Speaker 1: lot of respect. But I think what you're saying is 100 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:52,240 Speaker 1: is is correct. You know largely that there is a 101 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: certain sense of, if not racism, at least xenophobia or 102 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:58,599 Speaker 1: a sense of foreignness. Yeah, that probably prevents like the 103 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:03,839 Speaker 1: average waspy American from getting really deep into mariachi. Um. 104 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,000 Speaker 1: But I think also in this this stands from Mexico too, 105 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:11,240 Speaker 1: that it's a it's a classist thing too, because mariachi 106 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: music is rooted in the rural areas. It's a proud 107 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:21,599 Speaker 1: rural worker tradition. It's like super um egalitarian in that sense. 108 00:06:22,080 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 1: And you know, people of you know, certain classes, they 109 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 1: don't like that kind of stuff. They find it low brow, 110 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: or they they it doesn't appeal to them or whatever. 111 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:33,719 Speaker 1: And so I think that even as mariachi has evolved 112 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,640 Speaker 1: over the decades, that same old kind of grudge or 113 00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:39,599 Speaker 1: view that's become outdated over time to a large extent, 114 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:43,560 Speaker 1: still remains among some people agreed, this is one of 115 00:06:43,560 --> 00:06:46,279 Speaker 1: our best interests yet. All right, So let's go back 116 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 1: to the beginning. How where did mariachi come from? Uh? Well, 117 00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:51,680 Speaker 1: and by the way, we're I'm really worked on a 118 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 1: lot of these pronunciations. I'm gonna do my best, but 119 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 1: as always, we try, We're we're gonna try. But yeah, 120 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,360 Speaker 1: there's a lot of pronunciation challenges up in this one, 121 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:06,440 Speaker 1: all up in here. Uh So, we gotta go back 122 00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:09,960 Speaker 1: to colonial Mexico and the original form of the music 123 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 1: came and this is pretty obvious. Is obviously some Spanish influence, 124 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:18,760 Speaker 1: but something that may surprise folks is that also enslaved 125 00:07:18,800 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 1: Africans that the Spanish brought to the colonies, a lot 126 00:07:22,840 --> 00:07:26,080 Speaker 1: of the rhythmic traditions of that music is present in 127 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:29,400 Speaker 1: the origins of mariachi as well. Yeah, and there are 128 00:07:29,400 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: a lot of people say, plus there was indigenous music 129 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,240 Speaker 1: at the time, so those things always just kind of 130 00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 1: blended and gelled together, which is pretty um appropriate for 131 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,280 Speaker 1: mariachi as we'll see over the decades, like it's they've 132 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:44,520 Speaker 1: not hesitated to be like, oh I really like that sound. 133 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 1: I didn't think of using that instrument and incorporating it 134 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:52,160 Speaker 1: to make a new a new sound. Yeah, yeah, totally. Um, 135 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: you gotta go to western Mexico to uh Jalisco, where 136 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 1: we talk about a musical form called sun Holly Sience. 137 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 1: I know, I got that one right, because prexit over 138 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:07,000 Speaker 1: and over, uh and the crack. I don't want to 139 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 1: have practice for nothing, holly, yeah, very nice, okay, Um, 140 00:08:14,560 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: I think we should each pronounce everything, okay, and then 141 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 1: Jerry can just blend them together. Had a little guitar 142 00:08:23,840 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 1: own on top of it, and we're all set. Uh. 143 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 1: So that music was happening in Jalisco and western Mexico, 144 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 1: but it was you know, similar kinds of music were 145 00:08:32,679 --> 00:08:35,400 Speaker 1: happening in other places in Mexico. And like you said, 146 00:08:35,400 --> 00:08:39,600 Speaker 1: these were farm workers. They would play for special occasions, 147 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:43,600 Speaker 1: they would Uh. It's interesting in the early mariachi did 148 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:47,080 Speaker 1: not have horns, which is almost hard to believe because 149 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 1: horns are so vital to it now. But violence, guitar 150 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 1: and harp were sort of the first mariaci instruments. Yeah, 151 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: mostly string string ensembles, right, and they were they were 152 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 1: songs performed by the peasant class working on haciendas. And 153 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:08,800 Speaker 1: at the time before the Mexican Revolution UM that ran 154 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 1: roughly from nineteen and nineteen twenty UM, there was a 155 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: feudal system essentially that that that was the hacienda um 156 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:21,079 Speaker 1: and the people who worked on those haciendas were very 157 00:09:21,120 --> 00:09:23,720 Speaker 1: much exploited. But one of the jobs you could have 158 00:09:24,040 --> 00:09:27,200 Speaker 1: is a mariachi performer. I got the impression like, if 159 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:29,720 Speaker 1: you're a mariachi performer, that was your job. You didn't 160 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:32,040 Speaker 1: necessarily work in the fields or do anything else. That 161 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:34,800 Speaker 1: was the role you played on the hacienda. And the 162 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:39,959 Speaker 1: thing is that kind of um inequality is just unsustainable. 163 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:41,800 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what century you live in, it doesn't 164 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 1: matter what country you live in. Eventually, as one group 165 00:09:44,679 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 1: is just so thoroughly exploited by another group, that the 166 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:50,680 Speaker 1: exploited groups going to revolt. And that was the basis 167 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 1: of the Mexican Revolution, that it was a class revolution 168 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,440 Speaker 1: where the workers rebelled and said no more, You're not 169 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:02,080 Speaker 1: going to exploit us anymore. Right, And as you'll see, 170 00:10:02,080 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: they wrote a lot of music about this stuff in 171 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: the form of the mariachi songs. But um Kokula, which 172 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:13,280 Speaker 1: is in Jalisco outside of Guadalajara, is um where some 173 00:10:13,320 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 1: people say it started, even though you can't draw like 174 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:18,240 Speaker 1: written history there. If you want to look at the 175 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:20,199 Speaker 1: word in print, which is something we always seem to 176 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 1: talk about the first time we see things written down, Uh, 177 00:10:23,559 --> 00:10:27,440 Speaker 1: it is a letter from a Catholic priest in eighteen 178 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: fifty two that was denouncing it, basically saying, you know, 179 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 1: these big drunken festivals in this music that you're doing, 180 00:10:34,520 --> 00:10:38,880 Speaker 1: uh is a problem. Please cut it out right, signed 181 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: local crank priests exactly. So, Um, that was the like 182 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:45,800 Speaker 1: you said the first time in print, right, and yeah 183 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: before that it was a local place name. Um. But 184 00:10:50,040 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 1: really Mariachi as we understand it, the word the etymology, 185 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,040 Speaker 1: I guess, has long been kind of disputed. And here's 186 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 1: the little fun fact. I had no idea about. Uh. 187 00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 1: The French, as in France occupied Mexico from eighteen sixty 188 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 1: two to eighteen sixty six. Did you know that? Sure 189 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 1: you knew that. I did. I think I've seen that 190 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 1: in movies. I had no idea. The only reason I 191 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:19,320 Speaker 1: wouldn't know anything. So so during that for your occupation 192 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:23,120 Speaker 1: of Mexico by the French, apparently local musicians would be 193 00:11:23,200 --> 00:11:25,839 Speaker 1: hired to perform at weddings. So there was a longstanding 194 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 1: myth that the word mariachi was a kind of a 195 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: local butchering of the French word mariage. Yeah, not true, No, 196 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:38,440 Speaker 1: that's not. Actually the answers a lot cooler. I think, well, 197 00:11:38,640 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 1: they still don't know for sure. I mean, my money 198 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:44,520 Speaker 1: is on the tree. Is that what you were talking about? Yeah? 199 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: What else could it possibly be? I don't know, because 200 00:11:47,640 --> 00:11:51,160 Speaker 1: there's a tree, it's separated out differently, but it is 201 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:56,760 Speaker 1: the word mariachi. It's just mariachi. That sounded totally Italian. 202 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:00,560 Speaker 1: That's probably probably put the stress in the wrong thing. 203 00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 1: But that was a tree that legend has it, or 204 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 1: people say at least was the wood that they made 205 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:08,760 Speaker 1: the instruments out of, and that I don't know, that 206 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,080 Speaker 1: seems pretty convincing to me. For sure. It was an 207 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:15,319 Speaker 1: indigenous Cora word too, so hats off to them as well. Um, 208 00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 1: there's another there's one more that I'm like, I don't 209 00:12:17,800 --> 00:12:19,800 Speaker 1: know about this one, but they're they're like, no, the 210 00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 1: g is from the Cora language, but the maria refers 211 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 1: to the Virgin Mary, and that these were religious songs. 212 00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 1: At first, I didn't see anything about these being particularly 213 00:12:29,760 --> 00:12:33,280 Speaker 1: religious at any point in time, did you not? Really? 214 00:12:33,400 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: And I mean, I'm sure they're religious mariachi songs, but 215 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:40,000 Speaker 1: most of the stuff I've seen is about like working 216 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,760 Speaker 1: on the farm, or these love ballads and stuff like that. Yeah, 217 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 1: or just getting you know, crunk, getting down. Yeah. So, 218 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: like I said, the hacienda system, I don't believe it 219 00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:52,840 Speaker 1: actually ended, but I think it was very much disrupted 220 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:57,640 Speaker 1: during and right after the revolution, and as a result, 221 00:12:57,679 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 1: there was you know a lot of people who were 222 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:03,840 Speaker 1: displaced as workers, including mariachi musicians, who no longer had 223 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:06,760 Speaker 1: like a regular gig on the local hacienda. And so 224 00:13:06,840 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 1: whenever there's a disruption in the countryside, those people tend 225 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:12,320 Speaker 1: to make it towards city centers to see if there's 226 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 1: work or other ways to support themselves. There's a big 227 00:13:14,840 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 1: influx of people to Mexico City around the nineteen teens 228 00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:22,679 Speaker 1: in twenties, and a lot of them were mariachi musicians, 229 00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:26,120 Speaker 1: and they brought their different traditions with them, because depending 230 00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:28,640 Speaker 1: on what state you're talking about, each state has its 231 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:32,240 Speaker 1: own kind of musical mariachi tradition. And in that in 232 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: that era in in Mexico City is when they first 233 00:13:34,920 --> 00:13:38,080 Speaker 1: started to really kind of blend together. Yeah, I think, 234 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,400 Speaker 1: I mean, I love this kind of thing where different 235 00:13:40,559 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 1: whether it's food or musical styles, when different people of 236 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:47,240 Speaker 1: different cultures all of a sudden are living among each 237 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 1: other and start sharing opinions and ideas. That's just I 238 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 1: don't know. I think that the best stuff in history 239 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,200 Speaker 1: is created that way. And that's what happened there. And 240 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 1: they brought their musics together. This is when band sizes grew. 241 00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 1: It was not necessarily like a quartet like it had been. 242 00:14:03,679 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 1: All of a sudden, you could see Mariachi in the 243 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 1: you know, like twelve people playing in a band. This 244 00:14:09,040 --> 00:14:11,920 Speaker 1: in big time game changer. This is when horns came 245 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:16,320 Speaker 1: into the mix. Uh. And you know, basically this was 246 00:14:16,400 --> 00:14:22,160 Speaker 1: what nineteen teens you said in twenties, maybe yeah, Mariachi 247 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: would never be the same after the introduction of those trumpets, no, 248 00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 1: for sure. Um And apparently in pretty short order they 249 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:30,320 Speaker 1: figured out how to do you know, more than one trumpet. 250 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:32,760 Speaker 1: As we'll see, there's actually one band that was responsible 251 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 1: for that. But one of the other things they started 252 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:39,440 Speaker 1: doing two was wearing charos, those um cowboy outfits, the 253 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 1: very like slick cowboy outfits with like the short waistcoat 254 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 1: and the tight pants and the ankle length boots and 255 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:48,320 Speaker 1: a wide bow tie and a big sombrero that that 256 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,080 Speaker 1: emerged from this era as well too, where all of 257 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,200 Speaker 1: a sudden, these guys were in the big city wearing 258 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:56,720 Speaker 1: peasant guard with straw hats. This is probably a little 259 00:14:56,760 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: ghost all of a sudden, and they were making pretty 260 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:04,120 Speaker 1: good money. So you could outfit like a dozen Mariotti 261 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: musicians and matching outfits and you know, probably attract even 262 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:10,320 Speaker 1: more money because people would want to hire you because 263 00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:12,240 Speaker 1: you had that kind of thing going on. And it 264 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:15,640 Speaker 1: became a tradition pretty quick. Can I admit something. Yeah, 265 00:15:16,680 --> 00:15:22,160 Speaker 1: if it were not for uh being accused of cultural appropriation, 266 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 1: I would wear Chatto clothing at every fancy event I 267 00:15:26,600 --> 00:15:31,200 Speaker 1: ever went to. So I think it's so cool looking. 268 00:15:31,440 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 1: I love it. Uh, And I think I might just 269 00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 1: have to settle for a nudy suit. Uh you know 270 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 1: what those are? Birthday? No, you probably do. It was 271 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:45,720 Speaker 1: there was a tailor and he was a lot of things. 272 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:47,560 Speaker 1: In fact, he might make an interesting episode one day 273 00:15:47,720 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 1: named Nudy Cone. And he made these suits that uh 274 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 1: like Graham Parsons war and Ryan Stone cowboy type stuff 275 00:15:55,720 --> 00:15:59,760 Speaker 1: with like roses embroidered on the suits and all that stuff. Uh. 276 00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:03,080 Speaker 1: So nuty suits became really popular with like the earliest 277 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 1: alt country scene and like rodeos and stuff. So I 278 00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,160 Speaker 1: think I could get away with a newty suit, okay, 279 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: but why you're not part of the cowboy culture, you're 280 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 1: appropriating that. Why is it any different? Like why couldn't 281 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 1: you just wear a charo suit? I think if you 282 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:20,080 Speaker 1: think something is cool and you're wearing out of respect 283 00:16:20,240 --> 00:16:23,600 Speaker 1: and because you think it's super cool, not because for 284 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 1: whatever reason. If you're just positively wearing something, I don't 285 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: see how somebody could legitimately accuse you of cultural appropriation. 286 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: And if they did, I think they'd be wrong. No, 287 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:35,800 Speaker 1: I'm with you. It would be from fear of being 288 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: accused of that more than anything being accused. I think 289 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 1: because people would probably think, like Tom Hanks showing up 290 00:16:41,600 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 1: in Big in that thing, they would think I was 291 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: being funny or making a joke, where I'm like, no, 292 00:16:46,760 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 1: I actually think I look really cool because this is 293 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:51,920 Speaker 1: a really cool suit and the tailors that make this 294 00:16:51,920 --> 00:16:53,840 Speaker 1: stuff are amazing and I would love to show it off. 295 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:55,640 Speaker 1: So the difference would be you would show up and 296 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:59,720 Speaker 1: just not say anything about your charo suit. I don't 297 00:16:59,720 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 1: know I would be the way to do it, okay, 298 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 1: because you're not trying to be like, hey, get a 299 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,080 Speaker 1: load of this, get up you're just like, this is 300 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:08,760 Speaker 1: what I'm wearing. If you're wearing a regular suit, I 301 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,760 Speaker 1: wouldn't say anything about that. So I definitely shouldn't have 302 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:14,879 Speaker 1: a squirting flower in my lopell no, or like a 303 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:19,520 Speaker 1: little a spray paint. Can cap you do a little hat? Answer? Yeah, 304 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:21,840 Speaker 1: I would have a little elastic chord that hangs like 305 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: like a little tiny bell hat pat totally. Uh No, anyway, 306 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 1: I just think those are super cool, and I think 307 00:17:28,160 --> 00:17:32,680 Speaker 1: nudy suits would be maybe a short stuff. Okay, I'm 308 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 1: glad you explained nudy because I think no, there's not 309 00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:40,400 Speaker 1: a T. It's in U d I E. Okay, So yeah, 310 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:44,120 Speaker 1: that's exactly. That was a guy's name. Hey, you want 311 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:45,879 Speaker 1: to take a break and come back because we're like 312 00:17:45,920 --> 00:17:49,040 Speaker 1: eighteen minutes into this great one. Hey, let's do it. Okay, 313 00:17:49,080 --> 00:18:09,639 Speaker 1: we'll be right back everybody. So one more thing, Chuck 314 00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 1: about this kind of diaspora towards Mexico City. Um, there 315 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: was there was. There was a change in how they 316 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: performed too. They started performing in like public places, in 317 00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 1: like bars and plazas. Um. And they also started to 318 00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,959 Speaker 1: be more mobile. They would move around in part because 319 00:18:30,359 --> 00:18:34,439 Speaker 1: they were busking basically, so if there was a somebody 320 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:36,159 Speaker 1: that looked like they might be a paying customer, they 321 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: might follow them around for a little bit and see 322 00:18:37,760 --> 00:18:39,120 Speaker 1: if they could get them to pay for a song 323 00:18:39,240 --> 00:18:42,159 Speaker 1: or request a song or something like that. So that mobility, 324 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:47,240 Speaker 1: the charos, suits, and the expansion and like rearrangement of instruments, 325 00:18:47,520 --> 00:18:50,040 Speaker 1: including the horns, those were all big things that happened 326 00:18:50,040 --> 00:18:52,960 Speaker 1: in the twenties. Yeah, And I think that tradition when 327 00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:57,120 Speaker 1: you see a small mariachi quartet moving around a Mexican restaurant, 328 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:00,320 Speaker 1: it's sort of rooted in that tradition. And I think 329 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: that's another reason I didn't have an appreciation now that 330 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:06,520 Speaker 1: I remember back is whenever that happened when I was 331 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:08,200 Speaker 1: at dinner with my family and I was a kid, 332 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:11,920 Speaker 1: I could just see the air leave my dad's body 333 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 1: and just like he hated it so much. He hated 334 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:20,240 Speaker 1: any attention at all, being like pointed publicly his way, 335 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:22,960 Speaker 1: like at Disney World. Theory like let me pick somebody 336 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:24,800 Speaker 1: from the audience, if they ever looked at my dad, 337 00:19:24,840 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: he would just shake his head. I can not smile 338 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,120 Speaker 1: or anything, whereas I could not be more different. I'm 339 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: like raising my hand wanting to jump up and volunteer 340 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 1: for whatever. And I love it when the mariaci comes 341 00:19:37,000 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 1: by the table, even though Atlanta doesn't have nearly enough 342 00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:42,680 Speaker 1: of that. UM. And I think just word of advice 343 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 1: if you never if you feel awkward and you don't know, 344 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 1: like do I eat or not? Uh yeah, you just 345 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 1: keep eating and like smile at them and just enjoy 346 00:19:50,280 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: the whole thing. I don't think it means, hey, stop 347 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:55,240 Speaker 1: what you're doing and only look at us. It's it's 348 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 1: a part of the lively atmosphere of enjoying the food. 349 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:00,640 Speaker 1: But you can also, if you're in your dad mindset, 350 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 1: order a double margarita stat Uh. Yeah, he didn't drink though. 351 00:20:05,119 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 1: Oh well, yeah, I'll bet he was super He really 352 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:13,879 Speaker 1: didn't have to discomfort. Uh. So we're talking nineteen fifties 353 00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:16,719 Speaker 1: about this time and as uh, this is when we 354 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 1: had a couple of trumpets come on the scene. Uh. 355 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: And again we'll talk about the two gentlemen who worked 356 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:24,440 Speaker 1: out how to how to do that. Uh. You had 357 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:27,359 Speaker 1: a few violins usually, and then you had two really 358 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 1: key instruments, um that are basically ubiquitous in any madiachi. 359 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 1: One is the vihuela, which you might call a guitar, 360 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 1: but it's a little different. It's smaller, it's got five strings. Uh, 361 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:43,119 Speaker 1: it's it's higher pitched, so the G, D and A 362 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:46,200 Speaker 1: strings are all tuned in octave higher, so it sounds 363 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:51,280 Speaker 1: a little different. But it's got those nylon strings. Uh yeah, yeah, Well, 364 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 1: I mean you strum it with your fingers as well, 365 00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:56,920 Speaker 1: but uh, fingerpicking and strumming. Uh. And then you've got 366 00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 1: the really the heart of the band, and the most 367 00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:02,480 Speaker 1: important strument is that guitar on that I talked about, 368 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 1: and that's that it sort of looks like a stand 369 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 1: up bass with a super super short neck that you 370 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:13,440 Speaker 1: are playing. It's really really big bodied and uh. This thing, though, 371 00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:16,520 Speaker 1: is not plucked like a standard bass. It also has 372 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: five strings, although there are some five string basses, but 373 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:22,159 Speaker 1: traditionally you think of a four string bass. Uh, but 374 00:21:22,200 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 1: it's not plucked. You're playing octaves on the strings with 375 00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:28,040 Speaker 1: a guitar on, yeah, and you're playing it like a guitar, 376 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:31,960 Speaker 1: So it looks like a hilarious, oversized, novelty guitar until 377 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,120 Speaker 1: you hear it and then you're like, okay, it's pretty awesome. Yeah, 378 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 1: but that's the whole rhythm section. Because one thing you 379 00:21:37,560 --> 00:21:40,080 Speaker 1: will never hear someone say is did you get a 380 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:42,680 Speaker 1: load of that drummer in the mariachi band? Right, Yeah, 381 00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:47,840 Speaker 1: it's true. That huge, deep, hollow body like produces all 382 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:51,040 Speaker 1: of the sound you need from that. Yeah, it's it's 383 00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:53,640 Speaker 1: pretty great. It's really a key some other things though 384 00:21:53,680 --> 00:21:57,320 Speaker 1: you might you might overhear people saying it a mariachi 385 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:01,000 Speaker 1: show is wow, wasn't that accordion player amazing? Where the 386 00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:05,879 Speaker 1: French horns or the flout ist even because they like 387 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:09,439 Speaker 1: wind instruments and they like accordions, and one of the 388 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:13,399 Speaker 1: things that they'll play, as we'll see are things like waltz's, 389 00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 1: polka's And that was because of the influence of German 390 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:21,120 Speaker 1: immigrants to northern Mexico and southern Texas in the nineteenth century, 391 00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:25,680 Speaker 1: that that that music influenced mariachi as well. That's right. 392 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:32,560 Speaker 1: One of the big respect boxes was ticked in when 393 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:37,480 Speaker 1: UNESCO came forward and said, mariachi the string music. The 394 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:40,320 Speaker 1: song in the trumpet is now officially added to what 395 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:44,640 Speaker 1: is called the Representative List of the Intangible Cultural Heritage 396 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 1: of Humanity, which is a great sounding list. I love 397 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:53,199 Speaker 1: the whole intangible aspect. I went to a place in Kyoto, 398 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:57,440 Speaker 1: UM that was like a bamboo forest, and Unesco added 399 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:00,240 Speaker 1: the sound of wind moving through that bamboo floors to 400 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 1: that same lists. We should, at the very least, we 401 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:06,880 Speaker 1: should do this list. We could just read it off 402 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:11,479 Speaker 1: and be like that one's awesome too, here's another. Yeah, 403 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:14,280 Speaker 1: I love it. Okay, So yeah, that's a huge deal. 404 00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:16,679 Speaker 1: I mean, and that was two thousand eleven. So Mariatta, 405 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 1: it's like this is this is never going anywhere um 406 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:21,879 Speaker 1: and it wasn't going to anyway. There was a guy 407 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 1: who bring in Jalisco's second Ministry of Culture. His name 408 00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 1: was Alejandro Cravotto, and he said at the time that 409 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 1: there's no Mexican musical musical expression more widespread throughout the world. 410 00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:36,960 Speaker 1: And he also said that it's so much a part 411 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,480 Speaker 1: of Mexican people's lives that they they hear it. It's 412 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 1: played from their baptism to their burial. And it's absolutely true. 413 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:48,000 Speaker 1: They play baptisms, they play funerals, and they play everything 414 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 1: in between. Two yeah, but it's interesting when that happened. 415 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,880 Speaker 1: There was a TV musician and a TV house named 416 00:23:55,320 --> 00:24:00,800 Speaker 1: Cornelio Garcia you like that that said this happened, that said, 417 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,920 Speaker 1: you know, Maryachi still isn't getting the respect among academics 418 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: here in our own country. Uh. And you'll see that's 419 00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 1: one of the sort of recurring themes over and over 420 00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: is within Mexico itself, it's gained more acceptance in the 421 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 1: US than it has in some parts of Mexico among 422 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:19,760 Speaker 1: higher classes. Yeah, and I think that's that kind of 423 00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:22,959 Speaker 1: classic's grudge that I was referring to is still around, 424 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:26,159 Speaker 1: you know, because again, it's the music of the revolution, 425 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 1: and the revolution was the revolution of the peasants, and 426 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:33,720 Speaker 1: it's really prideful, patriotic music, you know in a lot 427 00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:36,600 Speaker 1: of ways too, and it's the music of Mexico. There's 428 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,160 Speaker 1: a Mariachi song called El Sonde la Negra and it's 429 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:44,640 Speaker 1: um considered Mexico's second national anthem. Yeah, so it's it's 430 00:24:44,680 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: like it's just so woven into the fabric that, Yeah, 431 00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,680 Speaker 1: it's pretty tough. Like if if you live in Mexico, 432 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: if you're born and raised Mexican intellectual and you don't 433 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:55,520 Speaker 1: like Mariachi, I'm sure you just have a miserable life 434 00:24:55,560 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: down there. You're the Mexican version of my dad. Uh 435 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: so you mentioned the different musical sounds incorporating things like 436 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:09,280 Speaker 1: waltz and polka. Uh. Fan dango is also another like 437 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:12,480 Speaker 1: it these African rhythms that we were talking about, and 438 00:25:13,040 --> 00:25:15,680 Speaker 1: they have you know, obviously the ballads and the waltzes 439 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 1: and things like that, but some other uh sort of 440 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 1: song styles. Uh. One of them is called rancheria. And 441 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:27,280 Speaker 1: these were very much songs of the Mexican Revolution. These 442 00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 1: are the ones that are really the patriotic songs of 443 00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:34,000 Speaker 1: the peasant class talking about how great and that's what's 444 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: so cool about it too, was like these songs weren't 445 00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: talking about Maybe some did, but it seems like they 446 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 1: were never talking about oppression. They were celebrating the farm 447 00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,920 Speaker 1: and celebrating ranch life and stuff like that, right exactly, Yeah, 448 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:50,439 Speaker 1: I'm romanticizing it. You could even say, Um, there's a 449 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 1: very famous song called the valve Are evolve Are? I 450 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 1: think it's maybe how you'd say it. Sure it was 451 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,639 Speaker 1: in practice that one. It was very famously performed by 452 00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: a named Vincente Fernandez known as El Rey de la 453 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,200 Speaker 1: Musica Renchera. And this guy is my speed, Like he 454 00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:09,480 Speaker 1: he looks like a total tough guy from the seventies, 455 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,680 Speaker 1: but he also looks like he probably smells really good, 456 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:17,639 Speaker 1: and he's like, um singing this this like one plaintive 457 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,920 Speaker 1: love song where his heart's clearly broken. Um in a 458 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,879 Speaker 1: Mexican restaurant with a horse in there with him, and 459 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,240 Speaker 1: he plays his song on the jukebox and starts singing it, 460 00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:29,560 Speaker 1: and it's really awesome. So I really kind of like 461 00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: VINCENTI Fernandez as of yesterday. Yeah, that's a good song. 462 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:37,200 Speaker 1: I remember hearing a lot of ballads when I lived 463 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,480 Speaker 1: in Yuma. I my sort of best friend for that years, 464 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,320 Speaker 1: this guy named Mark, And this was like a big 465 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:46,240 Speaker 1: cultural shift for me to all of a sudden, my 466 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 1: best friend was this Mexican guy, and I hung out 467 00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:51,680 Speaker 1: at his house a lot and just got kind of 468 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:55,040 Speaker 1: thrown into like the real deal culture as opposed to 469 00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:59,680 Speaker 1: the kid dancing around the spray paint lid. And it 470 00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:01,840 Speaker 1: was just they were also sweet and so nice and 471 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 1: and Mark's dad, like I remember seeing this picture on 472 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:07,480 Speaker 1: the fridge of Mark's dad in the seventies and he 473 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,560 Speaker 1: was like he had these sideburn shops and was riding 474 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 1: a Chopper motorcycle and was wearing like a beaded vest, 475 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 1: and I was like, do you have any idea how 476 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:19,960 Speaker 1: much cooler your dad is than mine? And it was 477 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:21,720 Speaker 1: like your dad was it is just like the coolest 478 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,639 Speaker 1: looking dude I've ever seen. And I remember like his 479 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,720 Speaker 1: mom would play these great Mexican uh mariachi ballads and 480 00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: I like the ballads, Okay, I really like the up beat, 481 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:33,400 Speaker 1: upbeat stuff a lot more, but it's kind of fun. 482 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,800 Speaker 1: It's like these these ballads are so like sort of 483 00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: slow and languid and syrupy, and you could they just 484 00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:44,480 Speaker 1: feel very sincere, Yeah, for sure, like in in some 485 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:50,200 Speaker 1: some places gut wrenching UM. In uh last June, a 486 00:27:50,359 --> 00:27:52,840 Speaker 1: bunch of mariachi I think something like fifty of them 487 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:56,879 Speaker 1: showed up at Uvaldi to basically sing um and just 488 00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:01,159 Speaker 1: just two mourn with everybody there. And there's plenty of 489 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: videos on it. And if you want to just have 490 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 1: your guts wrenched, like go watch that. It's It's just 491 00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:10,159 Speaker 1: really amazing how um just applicable this music is to 492 00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:17,959 Speaker 1: all these different like UM events or or occasions. You know, yeah, absolutely, 493 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:20,960 Speaker 1: Uh that song you were singing, by the way, that 494 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:23,680 Speaker 1: are you kind of Lee read sang it with the 495 00:28:23,760 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 1: I I ai uh that is very famous ranch era 496 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:33,120 Speaker 1: and that song is uh uh ci Alito Lindo. That's 497 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,359 Speaker 1: the that's the one that everyone has heard. Everyone has 498 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: heard either that or Laka, which is not a ranch era, 499 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:43,440 Speaker 1: that is called a corrido. Yeah, so I am not 500 00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,080 Speaker 1: a harderd percent certain that there's a clear dividing line 501 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: between ranchers and currito's because the Voliver Volver song is 502 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: it tells a story. So that's one of the defining 503 00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 1: characteristics of a carito. It's a ballad, and it's not 504 00:28:56,480 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 1: necessarily just about like love lost or even love game. 505 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 1: They can be a crime, it can be about heroism. 506 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: And I saw on a site called Remes cla Um 507 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,640 Speaker 1: that that's usually paired with like a moral lesson of 508 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,200 Speaker 1: some sort. So it's like a ballad basically, is the 509 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 1: is the best way to put it, as we already did. Yeah, 510 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:17,800 Speaker 1: and you know what, this is a great time to 511 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:19,680 Speaker 1: mention that I was wrong. We had our sort of 512 00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 1: ballad disagreement a while back when I said that ballads 513 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:26,160 Speaker 1: were love songs, uh, and we had a lot of 514 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 1: people right in they were like no, no, no, like 515 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:30,760 Speaker 1: your own Billy Joel Chuck saying the ballad Ability to 516 00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:35,040 Speaker 1: Kid and uh, the Ballad of Curtis Lowe by Leonard Skinner. 517 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 1: They're like these they're just story songs. But I think 518 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:41,560 Speaker 1: I just was thinking more love ballads and that's a subgenre. Sure. Yeah, 519 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 1: so correction made. So wait a minute, were they saying 520 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:46,959 Speaker 1: Josh was right? Oh yeah, you were way right? How 521 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,080 Speaker 1: did I miss this bunch of emails? Then I forgot 522 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: to frame them and sin the view like yeah, but 523 00:29:52,880 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 1: I have like a filter set on my outlook anytime 524 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:58,960 Speaker 1: it says the phrase Josh is right or any variation, 525 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 1: and it goes right to the top of you have. 526 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:06,040 Speaker 1: You have searches out for the words correct. Sometimes I 527 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,680 Speaker 1: hit up people who have already sent in listener mail 528 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,360 Speaker 1: just to kind of goad them into sending those kind 529 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,560 Speaker 1: of emails. Uh. And then the final little style that 530 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 1: will cover is when we mentioned at the beginning, Uh, 531 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:23,040 Speaker 1: the son hallis Salencia and that is the original folk style. Yeah, 532 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,239 Speaker 1: that's that. Yeah. That elsn de Lenegra, the second um 533 00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 1: national anthem of Mexico, and that's usually accompanied by a 534 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 1: dance called zappa tied. Hey I nailed this first time. 535 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:38,920 Speaker 1: I would say tato oh man, I actually surprised myself. 536 00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,800 Speaker 1: I had that like, um like little or fanany like 537 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:46,440 Speaker 1: like surprised look, and I still didn't get it. Right, 538 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,560 Speaker 1: Come here, Sandy, come mere girl. Right, but that's like 539 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,720 Speaker 1: a heel stomping foot dance. That's pretty cool if you 540 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:57,800 Speaker 1: just look that up. That's what we were doing in kindergarten. Okay, okay, gotcha, 541 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:03,360 Speaker 1: I got you. You're doing this still so embarrassing, tiato. 542 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,760 Speaker 1: I guess so we called it the Mexican hat dance, 543 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: which is probably wrong too. I'm quite sure it was. 544 00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 1: It sounds. Yeah, of those two, I'm pretty sure Mexican 545 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:19,440 Speaker 1: hat dances the wronger in nineteen seventies America. Of those, uh, 546 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:22,000 Speaker 1: that's right. I guess. The last thing we should mention 547 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:25,840 Speaker 1: about the music um itself. Like the sound is one 548 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,120 Speaker 1: of my favorite parts of this or any music, which 549 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 1: is multiple voices singing together. I love choral music. I 550 00:31:33,600 --> 00:31:37,120 Speaker 1: love three, four or five part harmonies. I love There 551 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,520 Speaker 1: probably is no just thing as five part harmony. Why not? 552 00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 1: I don't know. Is there a limit? I don't think so, 553 00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: only in your mind? Oh hold on, uh yeah, but 554 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: there's there aren't. I mean there are there are singers 555 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 1: that have backing mariachi bands, but there in a mariachi band, 556 00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:01,239 Speaker 1: there's typically not what's called elites singer that someone may 557 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:03,240 Speaker 1: take a lead on the song, but it's usually a 558 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 1: lot of people singing at once. Yeah, it's like Chicago, 559 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:10,240 Speaker 1: basically everybody can sing right and they take turn. You'll 560 00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:14,400 Speaker 1: actually you'll actually see uh, like you know, a guy 561 00:32:14,560 --> 00:32:18,240 Speaker 1: stopped playing um his trumpet and moved to the front 562 00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:20,680 Speaker 1: and start singing on a on a new song. Like 563 00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: that's just kind of how laid back it is. One 564 00:32:23,520 --> 00:32:25,760 Speaker 1: of the other cool things about mariotchi two is if 565 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:30,040 Speaker 1: you watch, like if you watch the violinists, they'll be 566 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:32,719 Speaker 1: like three or four of them just standing there potentially, 567 00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:36,680 Speaker 1: and they'll all start to bring their bow to their 568 00:32:36,840 --> 00:32:41,400 Speaker 1: instrument at different times. It's not it's not this precision timing. 569 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 1: And because there's multiple instruments, one can come in like 570 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:47,920 Speaker 1: you know, a half measure late or something like that, 571 00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 1: and it makes no difference. Was there you can't hear 572 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,280 Speaker 1: it in the first place. But it's just like it's 573 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: not meant to be this uh intensely perfect, imprecise music. 574 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:00,560 Speaker 1: And and that's actually seen in a way that it's 575 00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:04,040 Speaker 1: passed along like you, um, you don't you can now 576 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:07,600 Speaker 1: as I I think the sixties. You can go to schools, 577 00:33:08,040 --> 00:33:11,560 Speaker 1: um sometimes public schools like elementary and middle and high schools. 578 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:16,160 Speaker 1: But there are some college curriculum that UM teach you mariachi. 579 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,600 Speaker 1: But traditionally it was passed down just by practicing, like 580 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 1: it wasn't written down. It was like here's how you 581 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,440 Speaker 1: play see Elito Lindo, you know, um, and you would 582 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:28,560 Speaker 1: pick that up. Or else you go watch your favorite 583 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:32,360 Speaker 1: mariachi band in the town plaza and you know, basically 584 00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 1: be a groupie long enough that they'd let you start 585 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:36,880 Speaker 1: playing with them. That kind of thing. That was Coco. 586 00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:40,360 Speaker 1: Did you ever see Cocoa? I did not know. One 587 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:45,800 Speaker 1: of the best uh movies, animated films. It's just fantastic 588 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,160 Speaker 1: that but one definitely the best looking animated film I've 589 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 1: ever seen. But that was the kid in Coca was 590 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:54,800 Speaker 1: like a little mariachi groupie would and would just like 591 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:57,560 Speaker 1: and you know, his parents didn't want him hanging around 592 00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:01,120 Speaker 1: Like all of this stuff is kind of spot on, uh, 593 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:05,040 Speaker 1: really good movie thown, great music, UM, but mariachi finally 594 00:34:05,080 --> 00:34:07,200 Speaker 1: would make its way to the United States long before 595 00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: Cocoa in the nineteen forties. In Los Angeles obviously has 596 00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 1: always had a strong proud Mexican American community there and 597 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,919 Speaker 1: then up through the nineteen sixties, which during the zoot 598 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,720 Speaker 1: suit Um episode, we talked a lot about the Chicano 599 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:29,560 Speaker 1: movement in the sixties where Mexican immigrant communities all of 600 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: a sudden kind of stood up for themselves and organized 601 00:34:33,719 --> 00:34:36,240 Speaker 1: and it was very much akin to the Black Power movement, 602 00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:40,160 Speaker 1: and they adopted a lot of mariachi songs has kind 603 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,480 Speaker 1: of part of their movement. Yeah, and some of they repurposed. 604 00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:45,719 Speaker 1: There's a famous song called de caloris Um that talks 605 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:50,319 Speaker 1: about how beautiful the landscape is in spring, and they 606 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,720 Speaker 1: basically repurposed it to to be more of a metaphor 607 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:56,640 Speaker 1: for how, you know, the beauty of different people of color, 608 00:34:57,040 --> 00:34:59,680 Speaker 1: you know. Um. Other ones were actually written. There's a 609 00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:03,560 Speaker 1: song called l Pickett Sign It's hilarious. Did you listen 610 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,040 Speaker 1: to it? I did, and it doesn't It doesn't sound 611 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,600 Speaker 1: very mariachi. It more sounds like a nineteen sixties acoustic 612 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: guitar protest song, which is exactly what it was. But 613 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: it was, you know, part of the um the United 614 00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: farm Workers Union strike and the larger Chicano movement too. 615 00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:25,560 Speaker 1: A big respect box again was checked in the eighties 616 00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:31,160 Speaker 1: when Linda Ronstat came out with her album, UH concionis 617 00:35:31,560 --> 00:35:34,920 Speaker 1: Dami Padre And this was a very big deal. I 618 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,400 Speaker 1: don't know if you remember this at the time, but 619 00:35:37,640 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 1: it was. Linda ron Stat was a huge star. And 620 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,600 Speaker 1: I can't recommend the documentary about her enough. It's called 621 00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:47,080 Speaker 1: The Sound of My Voice. One of the great UH 622 00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:52,720 Speaker 1: singers of all time UH in any genre is Linda Ronstat. 623 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:55,840 Speaker 1: And she has Mexican heritage, and not many people know 624 00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:58,680 Speaker 1: this because she's very fair skin. Her name is ron 625 00:35:58,800 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 1: Stat is German, but she that's why she made that album, 626 00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:05,920 Speaker 1: and she did interviews at the time, and and the 627 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: documentary talks a lot about her Mexican heritage, and it 628 00:36:09,280 --> 00:36:12,239 Speaker 1: was I think she's part German too, and that was 629 00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:14,800 Speaker 1: like you were talking about the German influence in Mexico. 630 00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:17,719 Speaker 1: It was she. It was a big melting pot and 631 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:19,440 Speaker 1: she was a part of that melting pot. I think 632 00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 1: her uh, either father or grandfather was Mexican. And so 633 00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:26,760 Speaker 1: she came out with this album and it was huge. 634 00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:30,279 Speaker 1: It went double platinum. And this was in the like 635 00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:34,000 Speaker 1: mid late nineteen eighties, and it gave a huge boost 636 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,600 Speaker 1: to the mariachi music. Yeah, and she was playing with 637 00:36:36,719 --> 00:36:39,800 Speaker 1: like some legit mariachi bands. I think she hosted basically 638 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: three of them on her album. She played with one 639 00:36:42,440 --> 00:36:45,800 Speaker 1: of the mariachi Vargus on Saturday Night Live. Yeah, I 640 00:36:45,840 --> 00:36:48,360 Speaker 1: mean it was a giant, enormous thing. I don't remember 641 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:50,719 Speaker 1: when it happened, but I can just imagine America being like, 642 00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:54,400 Speaker 1: wait what and then listen being like, oh, this is 643 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:57,320 Speaker 1: really good. But that also explains a longstanding mystery that 644 00:36:57,400 --> 00:37:00,359 Speaker 1: I never understood before, which is why on the Mr 645 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:04,399 Speaker 1: Plow episode of The Simpsons, when Barney is hanging out 646 00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:09,040 Speaker 1: with Linda Ronstead, she tries to adapt the Mr. Plow 647 00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:13,480 Speaker 1: song into Spanish. Really yeah, or she's like that funny 648 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:19,239 Speaker 1: Senior Plow nois macho solda mente umbaraco, which Mr Plow 649 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:22,200 Speaker 1: is not mainly only a drunk, and it's like it 650 00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:26,719 Speaker 1: lasts like to three seconds, but no idea. Man, that 651 00:37:26,840 --> 00:37:29,160 Speaker 1: was so random. God, don't you love that when a 652 00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:32,320 Speaker 1: Simpsons joke hits, you know, twenty years later exactly thirty 653 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:36,920 Speaker 1: years actually, that episode came. That is crazy. All right, Well, 654 00:37:37,000 --> 00:37:40,200 Speaker 1: let's take another break. I'm gonna go get my spray 655 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,040 Speaker 1: paint candle it. That's really tough to say, isn't it. 656 00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:47,600 Speaker 1: It really is that stumble you say it, spray paint 657 00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 1: candle it. Yeah. See, I've been practicing in my head 658 00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,680 Speaker 1: because I knew this moment would come. I've been stumbling 659 00:37:53,719 --> 00:37:55,160 Speaker 1: over the whole time. So I'm gonna keep rex in 660 00:37:55,239 --> 00:38:16,600 Speaker 1: saying that and We'll be right back. Spray paint candle it. 661 00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:22,600 Speaker 1: Very nice, everybody, very nice? All right. So now we 662 00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:27,200 Speaker 1: are in the mid twentieth century and Mexican cinema is 663 00:38:27,360 --> 00:38:30,319 Speaker 1: all of a sudden finding its way into theaters all 664 00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:33,480 Speaker 1: over the world, and that means Mexican music is going 665 00:38:33,520 --> 00:38:35,640 Speaker 1: to be introduced in more places all over the world, 666 00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:40,080 Speaker 1: which includes mariachi and uh, depending on where you are 667 00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:42,399 Speaker 1: in the world, it might have taken hold more than others. 668 00:38:42,480 --> 00:38:44,640 Speaker 1: And this is I think it is a really cool 669 00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:48,440 Speaker 1: thing when something from one disparate culture makes this way 670 00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,320 Speaker 1: to another place, and for some like Hasslehof in Germany, 671 00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:54,480 Speaker 1: like all of a sudden, that place really loves this thing. 672 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:59,480 Speaker 1: And that happened in Yugoslavia. One of the reasons is 673 00:38:59,760 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 1: at time political leaders there um didn't want a lot 674 00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,040 Speaker 1: of Soviet music, they didn't want a lot of American music, 675 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:11,840 Speaker 1: and they saw this Mexican music as neutral politically, So 676 00:39:12,120 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: it was a little more not encouraged, I guess, but 677 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,920 Speaker 1: not shunned. And all of a sudden there were some 678 00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:22,040 Speaker 1: parallels being drawn between the revolutionary traditions in both of 679 00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 1: those countries, and even today in places like Serbia and 680 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:29,320 Speaker 1: Croatia there are mariachi bands that play. Yeah, and this 681 00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,360 Speaker 1: wasn't like a fringe thing like mariachi. From what I 682 00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,520 Speaker 1: can tell, there's a really interesting Roads and Kingdom's article 683 00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:40,360 Speaker 1: that Olivia dug up Um that basically says like mariachi 684 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:44,920 Speaker 1: was as as big as any music in Yugoslavia in 685 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:48,440 Speaker 1: like this, I'm guessing fifties, sixties and seventies is the 686 00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:51,879 Speaker 1: impression that I had, maybe I ever heard Yugoslavia music. 687 00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:54,120 Speaker 1: I listened to a little bit, well, I listened to 688 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:56,200 Speaker 1: a little bit of Mariochi. That's the other thing too. 689 00:39:57,040 --> 00:40:01,200 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if it's a Serb playing um mariachi, 690 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 1: a Japanese band playing mariachi or um. You know, somebody 691 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:09,719 Speaker 1: from Texas playing Mariochi. It is the same music. Mm hmm, 692 00:40:09,880 --> 00:40:13,200 Speaker 1: it's pretty cool. Yeah, I think honoring that tradition, like, 693 00:40:13,360 --> 00:40:15,880 Speaker 1: no one wants to put a spin on something that 694 00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:21,759 Speaker 1: is so much just what it is. I looked, Uh, 695 00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,640 Speaker 1: there are Japanese mariachi, one called Mariachi Samurai that's been 696 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:30,759 Speaker 1: around for twenty plus years. Uh. There is confirmed mariachi 697 00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,800 Speaker 1: band in China, as we will see there in the 698 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:37,440 Speaker 1: big festival happening this year. There is one from Sweden 699 00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,440 Speaker 1: that's showing up. So it definitely like took hold in 700 00:40:40,520 --> 00:40:44,399 Speaker 1: different parts of the world in the twentieth century. So, Chuck, 701 00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,600 Speaker 1: I feel like we should talk about some notable mariachi. Yeah, 702 00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:50,880 Speaker 1: and we should also point out that when we say mariachi, 703 00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:54,320 Speaker 1: that can be a band, that can be an adjective 704 00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:57,800 Speaker 1: describing the music, or it can be, as in the 705 00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:01,440 Speaker 1: case of the great Robert Rodriguez film El Medriachi, it 706 00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,080 Speaker 1: can be a single individual is a mariachi. I still 707 00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: never saw it. I've only seen Desperado. I've seen it 708 00:41:06,600 --> 00:41:09,640 Speaker 1: like fifty times, but I never moved on to El Mariachi. 709 00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:14,840 Speaker 1: Well moved back. El Mirachi was the first one, and 710 00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:18,120 Speaker 1: then Desperado was kind of a remake, but kind of 711 00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:22,080 Speaker 1: not like Evil Dead an Evil Dead too. Yeah, very 712 00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:24,840 Speaker 1: much in uh yeah, in a lot of ways. You 713 00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:27,040 Speaker 1: should check out al Mariachi. It's the one he made 714 00:41:27,080 --> 00:41:30,279 Speaker 1: for like eight thousand dollars or whatever. I'll check it out. 715 00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:36,120 Speaker 1: I'll check it out. I'm pressure me. It's good. Back off, 716 00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:40,000 Speaker 1: bub all right, go ahead, tough guy. Tell me some 717 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:44,680 Speaker 1: some notable matriachi. One of the first actually was Um 718 00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:52,640 Speaker 1: the Quartetoko Linse Okay, I think that's that's good. There's 719 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:56,200 Speaker 1: a guy named Husto Villa and he Um was the 720 00:41:56,239 --> 00:41:59,640 Speaker 1: first mariachi to performer his His quartet was at the 721 00:41:59,719 --> 00:42:02,880 Speaker 1: mex Can Capital back in nineteen o five. They were 722 00:42:02,920 --> 00:42:05,520 Speaker 1: also the first ones to put the som whacks as 723 00:42:05,560 --> 00:42:08,160 Speaker 1: early as nineteen o eight. So these guys were holding 724 00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: it down because remember mariachi, it had only been fifty 725 00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:15,440 Speaker 1: sixty years old tops when it was first being started 726 00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:17,480 Speaker 1: to be played, you know, in the rural areas. So 727 00:42:17,560 --> 00:42:20,040 Speaker 1: these guys were the first in Mexico City playing this 728 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:24,480 Speaker 1: stuff and at the turn of the twentieth century, that's right. 729 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:27,919 Speaker 1: We could also mention mariachi Vargas, this is a tough 730 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:36,439 Speaker 1: one day to call it Lan will say it again 731 00:42:36,560 --> 00:42:42,319 Speaker 1: to caliplan O. Now I added a t to make 732 00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:44,600 Speaker 1: it I think you I think you said it right 733 00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:47,120 Speaker 1: the first time that that's a tough one. But um, 734 00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:50,480 Speaker 1: this was one of the more famous, uh maybe the 735 00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,160 Speaker 1: most famous and longest running mariachi group ever. They were 736 00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:58,320 Speaker 1: founded in eight and is still around today. Um. Obviously 737 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:00,440 Speaker 1: over the years they just you know, swap people in 738 00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:03,160 Speaker 1: and out, but it's still still the same band under 739 00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:05,120 Speaker 1: the same name, which is pretty cool. And they really 740 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:10,239 Speaker 1: kind of established the mariachi style from that region and 741 00:43:11,040 --> 00:43:14,440 Speaker 1: uh used that harp early on. Yeah, so they've been 742 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:18,319 Speaker 1: playing since the nineteenth century. In the thirties, they made 743 00:43:18,360 --> 00:43:21,279 Speaker 1: their way to Mexico City because again this is like 744 00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,800 Speaker 1: now the epicenter of mariachi music. And I don't know 745 00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:27,799 Speaker 1: how or exactly what they did, but they were named 746 00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,080 Speaker 1: during that decade the official mariachi of the Mexico City 747 00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:34,719 Speaker 1: Police Department. I thought that was really funny, really, like 748 00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,440 Speaker 1: did they follow them around on like raids and stuff 749 00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:42,160 Speaker 1: and like playing music or that would be pretty great. Um. 750 00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: They also started to show up in movies, um, and 751 00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:48,120 Speaker 1: they would play. They would back up a guy named 752 00:43:48,160 --> 00:43:51,879 Speaker 1: Pedro and Fonte, who was like a pretty huge star 753 00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:55,520 Speaker 1: during the Mexican Golden Nage of the thirties to the fifties. Um, 754 00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:58,480 Speaker 1: and these movies were typically vehicles of his and I'm 755 00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:00,560 Speaker 1: guessing those were a lot of the ones that made 756 00:44:00,600 --> 00:44:05,200 Speaker 1: their way to Yugoslavia. Yeah. Probably. Uh, let's just pick 757 00:44:05,239 --> 00:44:08,120 Speaker 1: out a couple of more of these, because we could 758 00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:10,239 Speaker 1: just list people all day long. I'm gonna well, since 759 00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:12,920 Speaker 1: we mentioned these guys earlier, we need to shout up 760 00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:17,080 Speaker 1: Miguel Martinez and Jezus Cordoba, who were from the band 761 00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:22,440 Speaker 1: uh Mariachi Mexico de Pepa Villa, and they were from 762 00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:24,920 Speaker 1: the nineteen fifties. And those are the two guys who 763 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:28,080 Speaker 1: worked out how to use two trumpets together. Uh. And 764 00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:30,000 Speaker 1: it sounds like you just play the same thing at 765 00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:32,719 Speaker 1: the same time and the same melody, but that that 766 00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:36,080 Speaker 1: wasn't exactly what they did. Uh. They mixed it up 767 00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:38,680 Speaker 1: and I think they played in harmony and all of 768 00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:42,399 Speaker 1: a sudden, two trumpets were a thing. Yeah. There's another group, 769 00:44:42,560 --> 00:44:47,040 Speaker 1: Mariachi Los Camperos, that was founded by Nadi Kano Um 770 00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:51,239 Speaker 1: and he really kind of like with this this existing 771 00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:55,799 Speaker 1: band into shape UM and got them into Carnegie Hall 772 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:58,480 Speaker 1: in nineteen sixty four. They were the first mariachi group 773 00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:02,000 Speaker 1: to perform there. Um they opened their own restaurant, Lafonda 774 00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:05,759 Speaker 1: de los Camperos in l A. And that explains why 775 00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:09,480 Speaker 1: vincent A. Rodriguez was in is basically in a Mexican 776 00:45:09,560 --> 00:45:12,440 Speaker 1: restaurant where I guess just a restaurant, and in the 777 00:45:12,560 --> 00:45:15,880 Speaker 1: two videos I've seen of his UM, so that became 778 00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:18,040 Speaker 1: kind of like a thing like you would have your 779 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:20,640 Speaker 1: own like home base where you could perform every every 780 00:45:20,760 --> 00:45:22,279 Speaker 1: night of the week if you wanted to, and also 781 00:45:22,360 --> 00:45:25,919 Speaker 1: probably attract more business. Plus you're making that restaurant money 782 00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:30,080 Speaker 1: on the side too. Yeah. And you know, highly recommend 783 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:31,680 Speaker 1: if you go to Los Angeles you want to do 784 00:45:31,760 --> 00:45:35,320 Speaker 1: something fun one night. There are quite a few restaurants 785 00:45:35,360 --> 00:45:38,719 Speaker 1: there that have not the roaming the tables mariachi, but 786 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:43,480 Speaker 1: the full like twelve to fourteen symphonic on a stage 787 00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:46,440 Speaker 1: performance scene. Uh. And there's a lot of fun to 788 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:48,239 Speaker 1: go to these places and get some great food and 789 00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:52,640 Speaker 1: margarita's and and listen to these performances. So look it up. 790 00:45:52,760 --> 00:45:54,520 Speaker 1: It's online. I don't have any I can the one 791 00:45:54,520 --> 00:45:56,600 Speaker 1: I went to I could texted my friend but he 792 00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:58,320 Speaker 1: never answered, so I can't remember the name of it. 793 00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:00,879 Speaker 1: I'll tell you another place to get all that same 794 00:46:01,160 --> 00:46:05,919 Speaker 1: experience as Epcot Center. Are you talking about Mariachi Cobra. Yeah, 795 00:46:05,960 --> 00:46:10,200 Speaker 1: they've been the house um Epcot Mexico Pavilion Mariachi band 796 00:46:10,239 --> 00:46:14,240 Speaker 1: since two. Not a bad gig. That's a pretty good streak. 797 00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,000 Speaker 1: That's a forty year streak. Well, I love it. They're 798 00:46:17,040 --> 00:46:19,120 Speaker 1: just like, why hird, Like these guys are great, so 799 00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,120 Speaker 1: let's just keep them on forever exactly, And that band 800 00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:26,600 Speaker 1: was like, Florida's pretty great, We're just gonna move here. Uh. 801 00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:29,759 Speaker 1: If you notice we keep talking about men. Uh, Like 802 00:46:30,000 --> 00:46:32,600 Speaker 1: many many musical genres have we've seen that we've covered 803 00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,920 Speaker 1: throughout the years, and except for disco, actually notably is 804 00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:40,319 Speaker 1: that women have had a harder time getting a toe 805 00:46:40,360 --> 00:46:44,200 Speaker 1: in the pool, and Mariachi is no different. At the beginning, 806 00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:48,319 Speaker 1: it was exclusively men, and they were playing in these 807 00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:50,640 Speaker 1: sort of rough and tumble places where people were getting 808 00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:54,279 Speaker 1: boozed up on survesa and it was not seen as 809 00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:57,040 Speaker 1: an acceptable thing for women to do. In the mid 810 00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:01,040 Speaker 1: nineteenth century, in Mexico, but Olivia is keen to point 811 00:47:01,080 --> 00:47:04,319 Speaker 1: out there always have been exceptions. Beginning in the early 812 00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:07,000 Speaker 1: nineteen hundreds. That was a thirteen year old named uh 813 00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:12,520 Speaker 1: Rosa Quirino who had played with male mariachi bands, but 814 00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,680 Speaker 1: uh eventually went on to lead her own group and 815 00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,200 Speaker 1: apparently used to carry a piece to protect herself on 816 00:47:18,239 --> 00:47:21,200 Speaker 1: the road because it was dangerous business. I also saw 817 00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:24,600 Speaker 1: that she would um threaten heckler's and people who harassed 818 00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:27,000 Speaker 1: her while she and her band were playing with it. 819 00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:29,960 Speaker 1: She would say, a gentlemen, we are working and she 820 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:32,040 Speaker 1: would produce her gun and just let them see like 821 00:47:32,400 --> 00:47:35,120 Speaker 1: she was not to be trifled with. She also wore 822 00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:38,800 Speaker 1: like bandal aros like Pancho Villa. Oh cool, Yeah, she 823 00:47:38,920 --> 00:47:43,839 Speaker 1: sounds pretty goods Uh. In the early um, I'm sorry, 824 00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,279 Speaker 1: late nineteen forties, Uh, they're start. You started to see 825 00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:50,600 Speaker 1: some bands that were all women so mariachi groups in 826 00:47:50,680 --> 00:47:54,200 Speaker 1: Mexico City. Eventually they would make their way to Los 827 00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:59,320 Speaker 1: Angeles in the US. The first all female uh Mariaci 828 00:47:59,320 --> 00:48:03,520 Speaker 1: group was last Lancritas and this was an Alamo, Texas 829 00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:08,080 Speaker 1: in nineteen seven. And I believe there is even now 830 00:48:08,680 --> 00:48:12,520 Speaker 1: an all l G B t Q plus mariachi group 831 00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:16,279 Speaker 1: with the very first transgender woman in the history of 832 00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:23,759 Speaker 1: the genre, with Natalia Melndez. Yeah, mariachi are courious, are courious. Yeah, 833 00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:26,439 Speaker 1: I mean things have come a long way. Yeah. There's 834 00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:30,680 Speaker 1: also another one worth mentioning Florida tot tolo Achi. They're 835 00:48:30,680 --> 00:48:33,120 Speaker 1: from New York. I think there are four piece and 836 00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:37,000 Speaker 1: they are really amazing too. But even even still today, 837 00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:40,920 Speaker 1: even with all of these like really great all female 838 00:48:41,040 --> 00:48:44,680 Speaker 1: mariachi bands, um, they still are just kind of viewed 839 00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,920 Speaker 1: differently than the male performers are. There was a anthropologist 840 00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:51,960 Speaker 1: in two thousand thirteen named Mary Lee m Holland, and 841 00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:55,759 Speaker 1: she basically just started studying the difference between male and 842 00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:59,160 Speaker 1: female mariachi performers and found that the male performers are 843 00:48:59,160 --> 00:49:03,640 Speaker 1: typically expect to represent like that kind of rural rough 844 00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:09,480 Speaker 1: and tumble body um humorous sometimes uh like just macho 845 00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:13,600 Speaker 1: kind of vibe, while the female performers were expected to 846 00:49:13,719 --> 00:49:18,280 Speaker 1: like be sober and like dignified and pretty. Don't forget 847 00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:21,200 Speaker 1: pretty had me pretty too, And then they were judged 848 00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:24,600 Speaker 1: on that, And I mean that's I guess it's to 849 00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:28,920 Speaker 1: be expected, but I get the impressions that the female 850 00:49:28,920 --> 00:49:32,880 Speaker 1: performers were still just be just treated differently depending on 851 00:49:32,920 --> 00:49:35,880 Speaker 1: where they performed, and they said, by and large they 852 00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:40,560 Speaker 1: tended to prefer performing at weddings and baptisms and that 853 00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:43,080 Speaker 1: kind of stuff rather than like at bars and like 854 00:49:43,200 --> 00:49:47,920 Speaker 1: the public applauses where the male performers typically go. Who 855 00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:53,120 Speaker 1: wants to be heckled, objectified and have to flash your gun? Yeah? 856 00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:57,120 Speaker 1: Exactly what else you got? Uh? I think that's about it. 857 00:49:57,200 --> 00:49:59,400 Speaker 1: I mean the last section here is just where to 858 00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:03,239 Speaker 1: here's some mariachi music, and I think you can you 859 00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:05,400 Speaker 1: can hire him out in your town to play a 860 00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:07,879 Speaker 1: party if you want a bet you every big city, 861 00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:10,080 Speaker 1: in many small towns, if you look up on the 862 00:50:10,160 --> 00:50:13,239 Speaker 1: inner webs, we'll have mariachi that you can hire. You 863 00:50:13,239 --> 00:50:15,040 Speaker 1: can go to look up and see if there are 864 00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:19,160 Speaker 1: Mexican restaurants that have that music you can go check out. Uh. 865 00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:22,680 Speaker 1: There are festivals now and and certainly Mexico and all 866 00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:25,400 Speaker 1: over the world where you can go here lots of mariachi, 867 00:50:26,560 --> 00:50:29,799 Speaker 1: or just dial some up on your favorite music service. Yeah, 868 00:50:30,200 --> 00:50:32,480 Speaker 1: you could do a lot worse than um. Starting with 869 00:50:32,760 --> 00:50:37,640 Speaker 1: Vincente Fernandez, Is that your guy? He is definitely he's 870 00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:41,520 Speaker 1: a good gateway mariachi performer. I think you know. Yeah, 871 00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:44,480 Speaker 1: by the way, shout out. Since I mentioned women in disco, 872 00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:47,399 Speaker 1: Rolling Stone magazine just came up with with They're they're 873 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:49,799 Speaker 1: doing a bunch of top two hundred lists. They came 874 00:50:49,840 --> 00:50:54,000 Speaker 1: out with their top two hundred dance songs of all time. Uh, 875 00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:56,880 Speaker 1: and not just disco, just like club anything. And Donna 876 00:50:56,920 --> 00:51:00,600 Speaker 1: Summer was number one with I Feel Love one of 877 00:51:00,640 --> 00:51:04,879 Speaker 1: the greatest songs ever. That's a great one. You're right. Well, 878 00:51:04,960 --> 00:51:06,960 Speaker 1: since Chuck doesn't have anything else and I don't either, 879 00:51:07,160 --> 00:51:12,239 Speaker 1: I think that means everybody that it's time for listener mail. Yeah, 880 00:51:12,280 --> 00:51:14,360 Speaker 1: we're gonna call this breaking news. It's fun when a 881 00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:20,080 Speaker 1: stuff you should know mystery and uh, Australia woke up 882 00:51:20,160 --> 00:51:24,040 Speaker 1: and started emailing us one after the other around midday 883 00:51:24,200 --> 00:51:28,640 Speaker 1: Georgia time today because the Somerton Man has been solved. 884 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:32,360 Speaker 1: Somerton Man mystery. I'm like, I'm bivalent about this. I 885 00:51:32,520 --> 00:51:36,279 Speaker 1: I don't know how I feel interesting. Did you want 886 00:51:36,320 --> 00:51:38,920 Speaker 1: it to remain a mystery? Yeah? I think I did. Actually, 887 00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:42,080 Speaker 1: I don't think there was any harm in it remaining 888 00:51:42,120 --> 00:51:44,399 Speaker 1: a mystery forever and I almost feel like this guy 889 00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:48,080 Speaker 1: just kind of cheated. All right, Well here we go. Uh, 890 00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:52,680 Speaker 1: long time listener, first time writer from Adelaide, Australia. I've 891 00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:54,520 Speaker 1: got excuse to right in. I thought you and your 892 00:51:54,560 --> 00:51:57,680 Speaker 1: listeners might be interested in breaking news. After exhuming the 893 00:51:57,719 --> 00:52:01,680 Speaker 1: body last year, Professor Derek Abbott Boo, a researcher at 894 00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:05,840 Speaker 1: the University of Adelaide, has completed DNA matching. No, I 895 00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:07,799 Speaker 1: get what you mean. He didn't do like just good 896 00:52:07,880 --> 00:52:12,200 Speaker 1: detective work, unless you want to discount DNA is good 897 00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:14,520 Speaker 1: detective work. I mean, there's that show called The New 898 00:52:14,600 --> 00:52:16,600 Speaker 1: Detectives and it's all about this kind of thing. But 899 00:52:16,960 --> 00:52:20,000 Speaker 1: I don't know, all right, so we like the Old Detectives. Yeah, 900 00:52:20,239 --> 00:52:22,760 Speaker 1: in this in this particular case, I got no problem 901 00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:27,400 Speaker 1: with using DNA evidence to capture contemporary murderers. How about that, alright? 902 00:52:27,600 --> 00:52:33,800 Speaker 1: Or two exculpate then exonerate. Yeah, childs All of a sudden, 903 00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:38,440 Speaker 1: don't you know who that is? Oh? Jackie Child's from Sinville. Yeah, 904 00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:43,879 Speaker 1: totally all right? Great? Uh. Summer to man was Carl Webb, 905 00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:47,440 Speaker 1: an engineer and instrument maker from Melbourne who came to 906 00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:51,719 Speaker 1: Adelaide seeking a reconnection with his estranged wife. The name 907 00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:55,080 Speaker 1: of the tie t Keene was his brother in law. 908 00:52:56,360 --> 00:52:58,160 Speaker 1: The book of Persian poetry still a mystery. So you 909 00:52:58,239 --> 00:53:01,439 Speaker 1: got that going for you. That's good. Uh, And thanks 910 00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:04,080 Speaker 1: for the show. And that is from Rafe and many others. 911 00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:05,960 Speaker 1: But Rafe was the first person we got to so 912 00:53:06,840 --> 00:53:08,759 Speaker 1: or they got to us. Yeah, thanks a lot, Rafe 913 00:53:08,800 --> 00:53:12,600 Speaker 1: and everybody for sending that in. Um yeah, who knows. Well, 914 00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:17,160 Speaker 1: at least the Tamim shoot part is still a mystery. Okay, Yeah, 915 00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:18,839 Speaker 1: that's right. Well, if you want to get in touch 916 00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:21,360 Speaker 1: with us like Rafe did and kind of bring us 917 00:53:21,440 --> 00:53:24,200 Speaker 1: down at me at least, you can do that via email. 918 00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:27,359 Speaker 1: Send it off to stuff podcast at iHeart radio dot com. 919 00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:32,880 Speaker 1: Stuff you Should Know is a production of I heart Radio. 920 00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:36,560 Speaker 1: For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, 921 00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:39,640 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.