1 00:00:00,960 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, breaking news tonight. 2 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:12,880 Speaker 2: A Mountain Dew bottle baby, four year old little girl Carmody, 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 2: dad of acute diabetes after mommy feeds her baby nothing. 4 00:00:20,079 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 3: But Mountain dew baby bottles. The baby's teeth rotted out. 5 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 3: What nobody saw that. All I can say tonight is 6 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:34,199 Speaker 3: there is a very special car to Hell for mommy 7 00:00:34,479 --> 00:00:38,680 Speaker 3: and daddy. You're riding shotgun. Good evening. I'm Nancy Grace. 8 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 3: This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being with us. 9 00:00:41,760 --> 00:00:45,200 Speaker 3: Your world cares so or that resulted in her death. 10 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 4: Her was actually terrible. She has was called baby bottle 11 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 4: carries it sort of she decay this cause. 12 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,600 Speaker 1: By drinking a sugary liquid usually. 13 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 4: Out of a deliricystm. Sort of like a wow. What 14 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 4: turns out four child's dream? 15 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 3: Now do have a bob every day? 16 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 4: So much so all of her teething. 17 00:01:06,280 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 3: As of our friends at Local twelve WKRCTV. And you 18 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:15,959 Speaker 3: are hearing the description of what was done to a 19 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 3: four year old little girl Carmity aka Mountain do Baby 20 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 3: bottle Baby, Mountain do Baby bottle Baby with me it 21 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,200 Speaker 3: all start panel to make sense of what we are 22 00:01:35,319 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 3: hearing right now But first, what happened when this little 23 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:43,240 Speaker 3: baby girl was rushed. 24 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:44,240 Speaker 1: To the hospital. 25 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:48,680 Speaker 5: Toward the end of January, Carmody Hole becomes lethargic. The 26 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:52,120 Speaker 5: normally busy four year old is not active at all. 27 00:01:52,800 --> 00:01:56,040 Speaker 5: After four days of her symptoms getting worse each day, 28 00:01:56,480 --> 00:02:00,880 Speaker 5: Carmody turns blue and stops breathing. Her mother finally calls 29 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:04,680 Speaker 5: ninety one one for help. First responders are able to 30 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 5: revive the little girl and she is taken to children's hospital. 31 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:13,000 Speaker 5: Carmody Hobe seems malnourished and her teeth appear to be 32 00:02:13,120 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 5: rotted out. 33 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 3: Her overall care so poor it results in her death. 34 00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 3: Her diet was exclusively baby bottles full of mountain dew. Really, 35 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 3: how many grams of sugar are in this thing? Whoa 36 00:02:30,800 --> 00:02:37,440 Speaker 3: seventy seven grams of sugar and a twenty fluid ounce bottle. 37 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:44,839 Speaker 3: The baby's teeth were rotted out after drinking mountain dew 38 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:50,920 Speaker 3: baby bottles. She had exclusively mountain dew baby bottles. She 39 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:58,080 Speaker 3: got diabetes as she died after the diabetes affected her brain. 40 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:04,760 Speaker 1: That doesn't happen overnight? Okay? With me an all star panel. 41 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 3: Carmoedy Hub, a four year old little girl, beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. 42 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:15,239 Speaker 1: Now dead. Back to our All Star panel. 43 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:17,520 Speaker 3: First, I want to go straight out to Lauren Colin, 44 00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:22,000 Speaker 3: joining US investigative journalists and star of the Outlier podcast. 45 00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:24,200 Speaker 3: You can find her on YouTube. Lauren, thank you for 46 00:03:24,240 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 3: being with us. What happened? 47 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 6: Yeah, so this is a case of neglect, as the 48 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:35,240 Speaker 6: prosecution stated, and look, poor Carmony. There was no evidence 49 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 6: that her parents had ever taken her to the dentist before. 50 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:41,480 Speaker 6: She didn't go to the pediatrician for regular visits. I 51 00:03:41,480 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 6: mean the photos you see of Carmody, there's dorrito bags everywhere, 52 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 6: There's there's the mountain dew stacks. I mean, it's so sad. 53 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 6: So this was a true case of neglect here. And 54 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 6: as you stated, her mother wasn't even going to take 55 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:58,680 Speaker 6: her to the hospital until she saw that she wasn't 56 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 6: breathing and she turned and then obviously we know she 57 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 6: later passed away. It's completely tragic and could have been prevented. 58 00:04:06,280 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 3: Again with me an All Star panel, I'm trying to 59 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 3: figure out how this happens. What do we learn upon 60 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 3: an autopsy? 61 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 7: Listen, Carmody Hope arrives at Cincinnati Children's Hospital Medical Center, 62 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:23,599 Speaker 7: after being revived by first responders at her home, doctor's 63 00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:26,320 Speaker 7: order a brain scan and determined that the little girl 64 00:04:26,360 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 7: with a big personality is brain dead. An autopsy is done, 65 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:33,479 Speaker 7: it reveals Carmody died from a diabetes related brain injury. 66 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:38,840 Speaker 7: Investigators determined Krmody has never been formally diagnosed with diabetes. 67 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:41,400 Speaker 1: Okay, let me understand what I'm hearing. Joining me. 68 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:47,800 Speaker 3: Doctor Michelle Dupree a renowned forensic pathologist, medical examiner, and importantly, 69 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:51,719 Speaker 3: former detective with the Sheriff's Department. She is the author 70 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 3: of multiple books, including Money, Mischief and Murder, The Murdog 71 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 3: Saga That's all about Alex Murdog. Do I need to 72 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 3: relive that double homicide? But important for me Homicide Investigation 73 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 3: field Guide and Investigating Child abuse field Guide. How I 74 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 3: don't totally understand diabetes. I know you can be born 75 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:21,000 Speaker 3: with it. I know that it can develop over a 76 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 3: period of time. I know my dad was borderline diabetic 77 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:29,039 Speaker 3: and we had to watch every gram of sugar in 78 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:32,840 Speaker 3: his yogurt, in his food, and his everything. But how 79 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:38,640 Speaker 3: does diabetes affect your brain? I don't understand that, Doctor Dupree. 80 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 3: You know what you just need to start at the 81 00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:43,160 Speaker 3: beginning about what happened with carmeny, doctor Dupree. 82 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:44,720 Speaker 1: If you don't mind, sure, well. 83 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:49,040 Speaker 8: Diabetes is basically too much sugar in your blood. Sugar 84 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,120 Speaker 8: is used as energy for the cells your liver processes 85 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 8: the sugar. When there is not enough insulin to help 86 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:59,840 Speaker 8: the liver do that, then the liver becomes overburdened and 87 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 8: actually begins to burn fat instead of sugar for energy. 88 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 8: When this happens, the person goes into something called keto acidosis, 89 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 8: and keto is from the fat. 90 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:18,039 Speaker 3: You know what, doctor Dupree, really keto acidos? Dummy down, woman, 91 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,080 Speaker 3: I'm just a trial lawyer. I did not go to 92 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 3: medical school. I haven't performed ten thousand autopsies like you. 93 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:28,760 Speaker 3: How does diabetes affect your brain? 94 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 8: Because when that happens, the blood brain is broken and 95 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 8: that is toxic to the brain. When you have too 96 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 8: much and so your brain begins to shut down. In fact, 97 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 8: some of the symptoms of this are lethargy, you become 98 00:06:44,400 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 8: convulsive even and eventually you go into a coma because 99 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 8: it depresses your central nervous system. And then if it's 100 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 8: not taken care of, if that isn't resolved, then you 101 00:06:54,560 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 8: can actually die from this, and unfortunately that's what happened 102 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:00,560 Speaker 8: in this case. Too much Sugar Listen to. 103 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:02,039 Speaker 1: Our friends a crime online. 104 00:07:02,080 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 7: The cause of death for Carmody Hope is listed as 105 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 7: diabetic keto acidosis which spread to her brain. Eminently treatable. 106 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 7: Her death could have been prevented had she received proper 107 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 7: medical care. While denying Carmody proper medical care, her mother, 108 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 7: Tamra Banks, did not deny her own medical care, regularly 109 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:22,440 Speaker 7: filling prescriptions and even getting her doctor to make a 110 00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 7: house call to their apartment to make sure her health 111 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:25,920 Speaker 7: needs were met. 112 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 3: What so no pediatrician, no dennist, no anything for Carmity, 113 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 3: while the mom actually somehow fenangled house calls from a doctor. 114 00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 1: I didn't know they even did that anymore. 115 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 3: In addition to Lauren Colin joining US investigative journalist and 116 00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 3: doctor Michelle Dupree, doctor Bethany Marshall is with US renounced psychoanalyst, 117 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:57,520 Speaker 3: star on TV, author of a deal Breaker, went to 118 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,440 Speaker 3: work on a relationship and went to walk away. You 119 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 3: can find her at doctor Bethany Marshall dot com doctor Bethany, So, 120 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:08,320 Speaker 3: mommy actually somehow wrangled house calls from doctors, but she 121 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 3: never thought to say to that doctor, Hey, could you 122 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 3: look at my little Karmity, what's wrong with her? She's 123 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 3: lethargic sometimes she seems like she's in a comma and 124 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 3: all our teeth that run it out. You think she 125 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 3: might do that? 126 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 4: Nancy, did you notice in the picture of Carmity sitting 127 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 4: in the tub that it was equipped with a handicap 128 00:08:28,160 --> 00:08:31,239 Speaker 4: handle and had that white handle going over the side. 129 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 4: So that tells us that somebody in that household was 130 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:35,840 Speaker 4: being cared for. 131 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 3: The mom was extremely obese and probably needed that ladder 132 00:08:41,520 --> 00:08:43,679 Speaker 3: to get in and out of the bathtub. 133 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:47,320 Speaker 1: Back on the mom is me, me, me, me, me, 134 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:47,640 Speaker 1: me me. 135 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 3: According to this mommy forget about the baby. What were 136 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 3: you saying, doctor Bethany? 137 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:54,559 Speaker 4: Okay, Well, so the mom was taking care of herself 138 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 4: medically and that. But because of that, we can rule 139 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:02,520 Speaker 4: out mental illness or person disorder. She knew what medical 140 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 4: care was and she purposely deprived Carmity of that. Fatal 141 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 4: starvation is extremely rare. It's the most rare form of 142 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,680 Speaker 4: child abuse. And you know what I find in clinical practice, Nancy, 143 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 4: Children who are hit, children who are beaten, children who 144 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:22,560 Speaker 4: are raped fair better than children who are starved. And 145 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 4: the reason for that is that when the child is raped, beaten, 146 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 4: I don't know, verbally abused, they at least know they 147 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 4: exist in the eyes of the parent. They know there's 148 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:35,480 Speaker 4: some attachment, even if it's a ratual, full or a 149 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:39,560 Speaker 4: sexual attachment, Whereas when the child is starved and neglected, 150 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 4: the child feels like an it. The child feels like 151 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 4: there's no attachment with the parent, the parent does love them, 152 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,640 Speaker 4: and that they're not even a person. And so these 153 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,400 Speaker 4: types of neglects that children grow up into adults who 154 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 4: are very, very compromised by the way this kind of 155 00:09:56,160 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 4: starvation disrupts all of the brain circuits the developing So 156 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:04,880 Speaker 4: even if Carmedy had lived, she would have had gross 157 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:09,319 Speaker 4: dysfunction in the areas of learning, problem solving, and attaching 158 00:10:09,360 --> 00:10:10,120 Speaker 4: to other people. 159 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:13,319 Speaker 3: Speaking of the pictures, Dr Bethany Marshall, that's a really 160 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:14,360 Speaker 3: good idea. 161 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:17,439 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Liz. Can we go through. 162 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 3: The photos one by one because I'm noticing something in 163 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 3: these photos. 164 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:22,840 Speaker 1: Let's see the photos. 165 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:28,599 Speaker 3: Okay, look around at everything. You see lots of toys, 166 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:34,319 Speaker 3: but you can't see Carmeny's teeth. Keep going she's got 167 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:38,079 Speaker 3: a smile. Okay, there you go. They're rotting. Why are 168 00:10:38,120 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 3: her teeth rotting? Is she not going to the dentist? 169 00:10:41,440 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 3: And of course okay, wait, wait, wait wait, this little 170 00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 3: girl only has many of her baby teeth. She doesn't 171 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 3: have all of her adult teeth, and they're not falling 172 00:10:52,200 --> 00:10:54,319 Speaker 3: out naturally for the tooth fairy to show up. 173 00:10:54,679 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 1: They're rotting out. 174 00:10:56,600 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 3: There's mommy in the background, teeth falling out. Some of 175 00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:06,680 Speaker 3: these we got from the funeral home. Look around, you 176 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 3: heard Lauren con Okay, that one strikes me. You can 177 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:17,240 Speaker 3: buy multiple beanie babies, but you can't take your daughter 178 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 3: to the dentist or the doctor. In every shot she 179 00:11:24,000 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 3: has teeth problems, and she's getting. 180 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:29,920 Speaker 1: Thinner and paler in every shot. 181 00:11:31,520 --> 00:11:33,960 Speaker 3: Here she is with a little little was like a 182 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:41,800 Speaker 3: disney looking guitar and toys in the background, but in everyone, 183 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 3: look how pale. And look at her teeth and some 184 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:48,400 Speaker 3: of them that Lauren Colin pointed out, you see junk 185 00:11:48,440 --> 00:11:54,520 Speaker 3: food everywhere lying around right there. The teeth are practically 186 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 3: all gone. But mommy's smiling for the camera like she 187 00:11:58,520 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 3: doesn't know anything is wrong. So what happened to baby 188 00:12:04,400 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 3: Oh there you go there, Look at all that junk food. 189 00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:10,600 Speaker 3: I would do a backflip if my children were having 190 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 3: junk food day in day out. As a matter of fact, 191 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 3: Doctor Bethany Marshall, let me go back to you. The 192 00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:21,719 Speaker 3: other day, John David and I had it out, my 193 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 3: son now sixteen, one of my twins, had it out. 194 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 3: Means we sat at the kitchen table and had a discussion, 195 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:32,959 Speaker 3: a stern discussion because I heard I heard he said 196 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 3: the S word. 197 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 1: You know what the S word is in our house. 198 00:12:36,760 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 1: There's two of them. 199 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 3: One is shut up, we don't say that, and the 200 00:12:41,600 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 3: other s word not what you're thinking, get your mind 201 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 3: out of the gutter. 202 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:47,600 Speaker 1: Is soda. 203 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 3: I got wind that, John David Lynch, my big boy 204 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:58,760 Speaker 3: had gotten soda at school. Okay, so then I had 205 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 3: to show him all the articles online about what it 206 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 3: does to your stomach, how it rots nails if you 207 00:13:06,040 --> 00:13:08,520 Speaker 3: leave the nail in the soda for an. 208 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 1: Extended period of time. Just on and on and on 209 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,760 Speaker 1: about soda. Of course, he probably ran out and got 210 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 1: another one. 211 00:13:16,640 --> 00:13:23,720 Speaker 3: I wasn't around, but that said what this child had 212 00:13:23,800 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 3: nothing nothing but baby bottles full of mountain do Doctor 213 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:32,520 Speaker 3: Bethany Nancy, this child was. 214 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:33,600 Speaker 1: Not a person to them. 215 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:37,319 Speaker 4: This child wasn't it. And all those toys, you see, 216 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,800 Speaker 4: you can get toys for free. You can go to 217 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:43,080 Speaker 4: a shelter, you can go to a toy giveaway, you 218 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 4: can go to the neighbors. You know, toys get tossed 219 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 4: around and you know, passed from household to household. So 220 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,840 Speaker 4: that didn't cost them anything. Food cost them something. And 221 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 4: they resented any need this child had. They didn't want 222 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 4: that child there. This child was prop and Nancy. Look 223 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:08,760 Speaker 4: at how Carmody is smiling and all of those photos. Tragically, Tragically, 224 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,800 Speaker 4: she loved her parents even though her parents did not 225 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 4: let her back. That's what children do. They want the 226 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 4: love of the parent, even when the parent does not 227 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 4: care about them. But this fatal starvation, I think is 228 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 4: worse than just deprivation. These parents wanted to see this 229 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 4: child deteriorate because there were visible signs of it. I 230 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 4: think at some point they wanted this child to die 231 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 4: and they were hoping she would just go away. And 232 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:38,400 Speaker 4: the toys is to distract her so they don't have 233 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 4: to play with her or take care of her. 234 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:43,960 Speaker 7: The lack of medical care for Carmody shocks investigators as 235 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 7: they find Karmody's mother, Tamera Banks, had nearly lost a 236 00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:50,560 Speaker 7: child ten years before the death of Carmody in much 237 00:14:50,640 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 7: the same way. At that time, a four year old 238 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 7: son of Banks falls into a coma from previously undiagnosed diabetes. 239 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:02,040 Speaker 7: Even after that child recovered, continued to neglect his medical needs, 240 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 7: failing to have him seen by a doctor, and never 241 00:15:04,480 --> 00:15:07,360 Speaker 7: attended any of his follow up appointments. 242 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 3: As is so often the case, This is not the 243 00:15:11,960 --> 00:15:17,320 Speaker 3: first time a baby girl Carmedy dead after living off 244 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 3: nothing but mountain dew, baby bottles. 245 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 1: Nothing. 246 00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 3: Choice Slaton is with me, high profile LA criminal defense 247 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 3: attorney as Layton Lawyers named after himself. No one would 248 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:40,520 Speaker 3: claimed that's narcissistic at all, but Choice Layton. This is 249 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 3: not her first time. 250 00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:46,120 Speaker 1: At the rodeo. Did you hear the reporter? The investigative reporter. 251 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 3: They find out that Carmody's mother, Tamra Banks, nearly lost 252 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 3: a child ten years before Carmody's death the same way 253 00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 3: a four year old son same age Carmony falls into 254 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 3: a coma for previously undiagnosed diabetes. Even after that little 255 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 3: boy Banks recovered, she continued to neglect his medical needs. 256 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 3: A why did the children get to stay in the home? 257 00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:22,560 Speaker 3: But B there's no way she can claim what diabetes? 258 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:27,600 Speaker 3: Her son, then four, almost died the very same way. 259 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:30,680 Speaker 3: What about that, Troy Slayton, What are you going to 260 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 3: do at trial now after I bring in that similar 261 00:16:33,800 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 3: transaction on you, because you know I will. 262 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 9: The death of any child is a tragedy, and the 263 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:43,160 Speaker 9: death of that beautiful little girl is absolutely a tragedy. 264 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 9: But for us to sit here on our high horses, 265 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:51,120 Speaker 9: with our advanced degrees, you and me with juris doctorate degrees, 266 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 9: everyone else here with doctorate degrees, and you with the 267 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:57,400 Speaker 9: smarts to know that you're not going to feed your 268 00:16:57,480 --> 00:17:00,640 Speaker 9: child soda. I don't think that this was an issue 269 00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 9: of a mother not loving her daughter. This is a 270 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:11,240 Speaker 9: situation where somebody was just dumb. Somebody was really really stupid, 271 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:15,360 Speaker 9: and stupid does not equal criminal. This is somebody who 272 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:18,760 Speaker 9: clearly wanted to provide. She wanted to provide for her. 273 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:25,119 Speaker 9: There's toys everywhere, there's smiles, yes, there's Dorito's stained fingers. 274 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:29,959 Speaker 9: But this is a person who was stupid, not a 275 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 9: person who wanted her child to be dead. 276 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:34,119 Speaker 1: Are you three. I hope so. 277 00:17:34,359 --> 00:17:37,320 Speaker 3: But I'm just checking Curv brand joining me, and I'm 278 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:41,000 Speaker 3: so glad he's with US tonight. Former US Marshall in 279 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:45,800 Speaker 3: the International Investigations Branch, author of Flying Solo, Top of 280 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 3: the World. 281 00:17:46,240 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 1: That's part of a series of solo novels. 282 00:17:51,359 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 3: Oh, here's a new one Solo Journey boot up Nights, 283 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:59,680 Speaker 3: Jack Solo mystery novel. Okay, Irv Brandt, I'd love to 284 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 3: keep going on and on about all of your accomplishments 285 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:06,199 Speaker 3: in all of your books about Jack Solo AKAAU. But 286 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:11,080 Speaker 3: how many times have you heard a defense attorney be 287 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 3: a horrible defense attorney or an excellent defense attorney renowned 288 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 3: in his feel like Slayton. 289 00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 1: Say they're not bad, Du're just stupid. 290 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,880 Speaker 3: You think stupid people can't commit horrible crimes like letting 291 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:27,960 Speaker 3: this little girl die. 292 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:31,840 Speaker 10: Me And see, you're exactly right. Stupid is not a 293 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:36,720 Speaker 10: defense and for defense counsel. I don't have an advanced degree. 294 00:18:36,800 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 10: You see my degree over my shoulder. It's a bachelor's degree. 295 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:41,960 Speaker 10: I don't have a doctorate like the rest of you. 296 00:18:42,520 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 10: And so I'll tell you, from my point of view, 297 00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:52,280 Speaker 10: this is horrifying and this is criminal. It's not neglect, 298 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 10: it's not a mistake. This is criminal intent when you're 299 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:02,119 Speaker 10: talking about this type of abuse. And unfortunately, this little girl, 300 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 10: I can't believe that a family member or a friend 301 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:12,200 Speaker 10: or someone didn't call child welfare services. If she would 302 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:15,800 Speaker 10: have lived long enough to get into school, perhaps that 303 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 10: could have saved her life, because I know teachers and 304 00:19:19,800 --> 00:19:23,520 Speaker 10: people like that. You know that this would have been 305 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 10: reported if she would have made it into school, and 306 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 10: you know, possibly, you know, teachers, healthcare workers would have 307 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:34,520 Speaker 10: been able to see her, and this tragedy could have 308 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:35,360 Speaker 10: been prevented. 309 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:38,680 Speaker 1: Well, I guess so, Brandt. All of her teeth were 310 00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:39,719 Speaker 1: rotting out. 311 00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 3: That have to know something was very, very wrong, Doctor 312 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 3: Michelle Duprey again, and I know it's really hard for you, 313 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 3: with all of your medical degree and experience and education 314 00:19:52,960 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 3: to please talk regular English, not Latin phrases or medical phrases. Please, 315 00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 3: What does diabetes do to you? Why are this child's 316 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:08,399 Speaker 3: teeth rotted out? Nancy is because of the sugar. Sugar, 317 00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:11,760 Speaker 3: As you know, sugar causes cavities in our teeth. And 318 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:16,240 Speaker 3: she had no dental care whatsoever. She had too much sugar. 319 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:17,720 Speaker 3: In fact, thirty six. 320 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 8: Grams of sugar for a woman adult is the max. 321 00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 8: She had much more than that in the Mountain do 322 00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:25,919 Speaker 8: and it basically rotted out her. 323 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:27,880 Speaker 1: But what does it do to your body? 324 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:33,040 Speaker 3: Like? Why did she and her brother both go into 325 00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:35,879 Speaker 3: a coma again because of too much sugar and not 326 00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:38,400 Speaker 3: being able to handle that in your body? Let me see, 327 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 3: This is why I had to go over every line 328 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 3: of an autopsy report with the doctor until I could 329 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 3: understand what she's saying. 330 00:20:52,320 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. 331 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 3: Let me take you back in time, remember still Magnolia's. 332 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 3: Remember when Julia Roberts, who is diabetic, fell over and died. 333 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 3: She went into a diabetic coma and she died. Okay, 334 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:16,560 Speaker 3: why did she die? I know it's because you have 335 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:19,240 Speaker 3: too much sugar. I get that, But what happens to 336 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 3: your body? I mean, I can say she had too 337 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 3: much sugar, but what physically happens to your body? 338 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:26,639 Speaker 1: Why do you go into. 339 00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:29,440 Speaker 8: A coma because there's too much sugar overload and your 340 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:33,080 Speaker 8: liver then starts to break down fat in our body, 341 00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:37,920 Speaker 8: fat produces acid when it's an overload, and that acidic 342 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 8: are in your blood then causes you to go into 343 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:44,480 Speaker 8: this coma. If it's not resolved, you die from that. 344 00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:47,720 Speaker 3: Okay, I'm starting to understand a little bit of what 345 00:21:47,720 --> 00:21:51,440 Speaker 3: you're saying. This little girl is dead after a very 346 00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:58,720 Speaker 3: short life, subsisting on nothing but baby bottles of mountain dew. 347 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:03,880 Speaker 1: That's what she had for four years. But what more 348 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: do we. 349 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:10,919 Speaker 3: Learn about the fingerprint crime committed on her brother? 350 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:14,680 Speaker 7: Tamra Banks's oldest son, Jerry Banks, says what happened to 351 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 7: Carmody isn't a first for his mother. Jerry Banks says, 352 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 7: ten years ago, his little brother went lethargic, wouldn't move. 353 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:24,760 Speaker 7: The only thing he would respond to his sugar. Jerry 354 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,560 Speaker 7: Banks says this goes on for about thirty six hours 355 00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,119 Speaker 7: until he forces Tamra Banks to take his brother to 356 00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,120 Speaker 7: the hospital. Doctors were able to save the boy, who 357 00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:35,400 Speaker 7: was four years old at the time, the same age 358 00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,880 Speaker 7: as Carmody. Looking into the diabetes related brain injury death 359 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:42,080 Speaker 7: of Carmody Hope, investigators find the little girl has never 360 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:45,680 Speaker 7: been formally diagnosed with diabetes. They also discover her mother, 361 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:48,639 Speaker 7: Tamra Banks, has been feeding the four year old a 362 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,199 Speaker 7: mixture of mountain dew and baby formula through a bottle 363 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:54,720 Speaker 7: long after she should have been weaned off the bottle, 364 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:58,679 Speaker 7: causing her teeth to rot. Her teeth are almost all rotted, 365 00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 7: but no record can be found of her parents taking 366 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 7: her to a dentist. 367 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:07,840 Speaker 3: Okay, doctor Michelle Duprey joining me. Okay, doctor Dupriy, Sorry, 368 00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:11,439 Speaker 3: but I feel like I'm wrestling you on this, but 369 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 3: I'm not giving up. I'm going back in the ring 370 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:18,960 Speaker 3: with you. Duprey does Okay? I know diabetes. You can 371 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:23,480 Speaker 3: be born with diabetes. You can develop diabetes even if 372 00:23:23,520 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 3: you have a good diet. But can a regular diet 373 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 3: of nothing but this mountain dew? How many grams of sugar? 374 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:37,880 Speaker 3: Does seventy seven grams of sugar in one of these? 375 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 3: So if she had three or four, five or six 376 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:44,720 Speaker 3: baby bottles a day of this, sometimes mixed with formula, 377 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 3: can you create diabetes because of your diet? Can you 378 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,560 Speaker 3: eat so many sweets and just so much mountain dew 379 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:55,639 Speaker 3: that that gives you diabetes? 380 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:56,200 Speaker 1: Yes? 381 00:23:56,359 --> 00:23:59,959 Speaker 8: Essentially, Nancy, You're absolutely correct, because again, the sugar overall, 382 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,480 Speaker 8: it's what causes you to starve then not being able 383 00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 8: to handle it, and your body starts breaking down fat 384 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 8: causing the acid. You know, our body is in a 385 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,960 Speaker 8: state of equilibrium between acid and base, and when one 386 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:15,200 Speaker 8: of those is out of whack, then it causes serious 387 00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:18,080 Speaker 8: injury to the body, and in this case, it's over 388 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 8: and over acid and that's what caused the death. 389 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:25,440 Speaker 3: As we're trying to figure out exactly how the mom 390 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 3: could have not known what was happening. 391 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:32,960 Speaker 1: Back to Troy Slayton, dare I do it? Troy? Your 392 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 1: argument that, hey, she doesn't have a PhD like all 393 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 1: of you do. 394 00:24:36,440 --> 00:24:38,040 Speaker 3: I hear you, And if I were used that you 395 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 3: have nowhere else to go, I'd probably argue the same 396 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:45,320 Speaker 3: thing if I was a defense attorney. But that said, 397 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:49,440 Speaker 3: duly noted, what about the fact that the same thing 398 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 3: happened a few years before with Carmeny's older brother when 399 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,880 Speaker 3: he was four years old, he went into a diabetic 400 00:24:56,920 --> 00:25:01,200 Speaker 3: coma after being fed the Lord only knows what, almost died. 401 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:03,840 Speaker 1: And the mom was. 402 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,880 Speaker 3: Forced to take him to the hospital by family members. 403 00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:10,280 Speaker 1: He was in a diabetic coma, same. 404 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 3: Thing, So how can you argue with a straight face 405 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,800 Speaker 3: she didn't have a PAHD where she knew this because 406 00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:20,000 Speaker 3: it happened before to her son. 407 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:23,479 Speaker 9: So this is what we would call in the defense business. Nancy, 408 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:27,560 Speaker 9: A bad fact. That's something that you're gonna have to 409 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 9: deal with. This is a woman who clearly couldn't deal 410 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:34,680 Speaker 9: with her own self. All the pictures that you show 411 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,960 Speaker 9: she is morbidly obese. Her own teeth are decayne. She's 412 00:25:39,000 --> 00:25:42,800 Speaker 9: brought into courtroom in a wheelchair. She can't even support 413 00:25:42,920 --> 00:25:47,040 Speaker 9: her own weight. This is not the picture of health. 414 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,760 Speaker 3: Guess who else just got wheeled into the courtroom and 415 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,200 Speaker 3: a cut his mic? Guess who else just got wheeled 416 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 3: into the court in a wheelchair? Harvey Weinstein? You think 417 00:25:56,400 --> 00:25:59,360 Speaker 3: I care that he now has his lawyers by him 418 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 3: atop of the wine wheelchair to get rolled into the courtroom. Atlno. 419 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:10,320 Speaker 3: And the fact that this mom comes in in a wheelchair, really, 420 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 3: you know what, I don't care. I don't care because 421 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 3: even in a wheelchair, this mom could have ordered this 422 00:26:16,640 --> 00:26:19,720 Speaker 3: child food. She didn't have to prepare it. And in 423 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:21,720 Speaker 3: all the photos you see, she's not in a wheelchair. 424 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,320 Speaker 3: She's in a wheelchair now now that she's charged with 425 00:26:24,359 --> 00:26:25,400 Speaker 3: the death of her child. 426 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,360 Speaker 9: She didn't keep her house clean, she didn't know how 427 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:30,760 Speaker 9: to manage her own weight, she didn't know how to 428 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:35,520 Speaker 9: manage her own teeth. Her husband also not the picture 429 00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 9: of health. These are not people that knew how to 430 00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,040 Speaker 9: take care of themselves, let alone know how to take 431 00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 9: care of a child. 432 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,680 Speaker 3: You really think that's going to win over a jury. Okay, 433 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 3: you know what, doctor Bethany Marshall. Can you hear him? Yes, 434 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:53,880 Speaker 3: it's like a mosquito buzzing around my head. I keep 435 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:54,680 Speaker 3: hearing it and. 436 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:58,640 Speaker 1: I can't catch it and make it stop. Respond to him. 437 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:04,200 Speaker 4: Okay, Nancy. Defense attorneys use the word stupidity. It drives 438 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:08,400 Speaker 4: me crazy because this was not stupidity. That's not a defense. 439 00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 4: This is a mother who resented the needs of her child. 440 00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 4: That is a psychology of this. She did not want 441 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:19,000 Speaker 4: to provide for her child, so she was hoping that 442 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:22,719 Speaker 4: her child would die as soon as possible. That is 443 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,600 Speaker 4: the bottom line. You can't get around it if you 444 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:29,439 Speaker 4: look at Okay, Troy, look at any scholarly article on 445 00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:34,679 Speaker 4: fatal starvation, and what you'll see called philicide. 446 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 9: Oh my goodness, she had every toy. She had every 447 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 9: toy available for her child. 448 00:27:40,400 --> 00:27:42,320 Speaker 1: She had the Mickey Mouse guitar. 449 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 9: She's in a sea of mini mouses. 450 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:49,240 Speaker 3: No, no, no, A lot of those came free from McDonald's. 451 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:51,880 Speaker 1: Go ahead. Okay, So if you look at the. 452 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:57,760 Speaker 4: Literature on fatal starvation, it's interchangeably used with philicide. So 453 00:27:57,920 --> 00:28:02,399 Speaker 4: all the scholarly literature really links starving a child to 454 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:07,120 Speaker 4: purposely killing the child. This is Childreywhere in the literature, 455 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,960 Speaker 4: this is just the Troy. I'm sure you do. I'm 456 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,280 Speaker 4: sure you do research when you go into court. You 457 00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:18,119 Speaker 4: cannot get around the psychology of this woman. This woman 458 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:20,840 Speaker 4: was also a hoarder, so she did not even take 459 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:23,640 Speaker 4: care of her house, herself, her child. But I want 460 00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:26,320 Speaker 4: to say furthermore, she did not want this. 461 00:28:26,280 --> 00:28:27,480 Speaker 1: Child to have needs. 462 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:33,480 Speaker 4: She did not. She used the cheapest form of keeping 463 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 4: a child alive so she wouldn't have to spend her 464 00:28:36,520 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 4: own money. I mean, how shallow is that? And do 465 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 4: you know what, hey, okay, you know what, Troy, all 466 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 4: those toys. She was trying to keep the child busy 467 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 4: so she didn't have to take care of the child. 468 00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:50,440 Speaker 3: I would like to point something out, guys, very quickly, 469 00:28:50,840 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 3: Troy Slayton, you got to think again about your argument. 470 00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:58,440 Speaker 3: And I know what you're doing, Troy. You're doing what 471 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 3: any good defenses turning would do when your back is 472 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:01,760 Speaker 3: against the wall. 473 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:07,360 Speaker 1: You have nowhere to go. You make something up. My mom, my. 474 00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:11,520 Speaker 3: Brother, and sister, and I are first generation college Okay. 475 00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:17,760 Speaker 3: My mother didn't have a PhD. She didn't even have 476 00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 3: a Bachelor of Arts or Bachelor of Science a four years. 477 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:22,280 Speaker 3: She didn't have an associates degree two years. 478 00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:23,560 Speaker 1: Okay. 479 00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 3: She grew up working on a farm with an anonymous 480 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,120 Speaker 3: donor providing her music lessons so she could go on 481 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 3: to play cello in the symphony and the piano and 482 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:38,680 Speaker 3: the organ where you play with your hands and your 483 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 3: feet at the same time. She never ever had the 484 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:45,640 Speaker 3: kind of education you're talking about, nor. 485 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 1: Did my dad. But on the weekends, you know what 486 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,800 Speaker 1: we did while other kids are out of arcade. 487 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 3: We were in the fields of our friends, our neighbors, 488 00:29:57,040 --> 00:30:01,400 Speaker 3: and our church friends because they would allow us, because 489 00:30:01,400 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 3: my mom played for the church for free, to pick 490 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,600 Speaker 3: produce and then we will cook it, and then we 491 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:13,520 Speaker 3: would have it fresh veggies, fresh fruit that we would 492 00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:17,560 Speaker 3: pick ourselves. I'm not telling your hard luck story. 493 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,680 Speaker 1: I'm glad that happened. But my mom didn't have what 494 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 1: you're talking about, a PhD. 495 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:27,360 Speaker 3: Her mother grew up working in a tile factory for 496 00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:31,920 Speaker 3: Pete's sake, working a farm. They didn't have a PhD. 497 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,240 Speaker 3: But they cared about their children. And you want to 498 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:41,280 Speaker 3: tell me everybody on that jury wouldn't care about their children. 499 00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 3: It's complete bs. I don't think you're being fair to 500 00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 3: all the parents out there that didn't have the benefits 501 00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 3: and luxuries. 502 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,800 Speaker 1: My parents gave me to get through law school. 503 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,800 Speaker 9: Because most parents have basic common sense, which clearly this 504 00:30:55,880 --> 00:31:00,239 Speaker 9: woman didn't. Most people have a basic moticum of an 505 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:04,640 Speaker 9: understanding of basic nutrition, but that doesn't mean everybody does. 506 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:07,600 Speaker 9: I would venture to guess that this woman wasn't working, 507 00:31:07,840 --> 00:31:12,200 Speaker 9: and that she was on some sort of disability welfare program. 508 00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:16,480 Speaker 9: She was just being given money. She wasn't didn't have 509 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 9: the street smarts that your mom and grandma had. She 510 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 9: didn't have that institutional knowledge in her family. She just 511 00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:27,480 Speaker 9: gave the child what she thought was needed in that moment, 512 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 9: to make the child happy, to put a smile on 513 00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:31,000 Speaker 9: the kid's face. 514 00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:32,040 Speaker 4: When you give a kid. 515 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 9: Candy, does a kid smile or does a kid say, Oh, no, 516 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 9: I don't want to eat that candy. That's not healthy 517 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:37,680 Speaker 9: for me. 518 00:31:38,120 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 1: The kid's gonna gobble it all up. 519 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 9: Whatever they can. 520 00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:49,720 Speaker 1: Crime stores with Nancy Grace. 521 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:58,520 Speaker 5: Carmody dies as a direct result of neglect and abuse 522 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 5: from her parents. Carmody dies from diabetic keto acidosis or 523 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:09,360 Speaker 5: d KA, which is an extreme complication of untreated diabetes. 524 00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:13,480 Speaker 5: Left untreated, it can cause coma and death, as in 525 00:32:13,600 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 5: Carmody's case. 526 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: So, day by day, she watched her. 527 00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:21,800 Speaker 3: Little girl get more and more pale. She watched her 528 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:27,120 Speaker 3: daughter's teeth wrought out one by one, and she continued 529 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 3: to feed her nothing but baby bottles full of mountain dew, 530 00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,760 Speaker 3: seventy plus grams of sugar for one of these? How 531 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,920 Speaker 3: many of these did the baby girl have every day? 532 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:43,000 Speaker 1: And it's not just Carmedy. 533 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 3: Carmeny's older brother went into a diabetic coma when he 534 00:32:47,680 --> 00:32:50,680 Speaker 3: was also four years old and had to be rushed 535 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:53,440 Speaker 3: to the hospital in a coma. He lived, but after 536 00:32:53,560 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 3: that faithful night, mommy continued to ignore the child's medical 537 00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,760 Speaker 3: niece And hey, daddy, I'm not letting you off the hook. 538 00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:08,000 Speaker 3: You're going down to You're just as responsible as mommy. 539 00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 3: I'm trying to figure out how this was kept from relatives, family, friends, neighbors. 540 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:21,560 Speaker 3: I'm very curious why people don't come forward. IRV Brent 541 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,840 Speaker 3: is joining us who has traveled all around the world 542 00:33:24,920 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 3: apprehending dangerous criminals. 543 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:28,920 Speaker 1: You know what, I think part of it is IRV. 544 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,680 Speaker 3: And the reason I introduced you that way is people 545 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:35,040 Speaker 3: have in their minds who is a killer, what that 546 00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 3: killer would look like. You might think of a sex 547 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:42,920 Speaker 3: pervert as a guy wearing a trench coat at the 548 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:47,160 Speaker 3: corner of a children's park. You may think a killer 549 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:52,360 Speaker 3: as showing up and a malaclava over his face, or 550 00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:58,520 Speaker 3: carrying two guns. You don't think the mommy and the 551 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:02,680 Speaker 3: home next to you are in the apartment next to you. 552 00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,080 Speaker 3: The mommy that smiles at you as she goes through 553 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 3: a car during the day, or spot her at the 554 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:12,439 Speaker 3: grocery store, you don't think of her being a killer, right, 555 00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:16,760 Speaker 3: But you've seen killers in all shapes and sizes way. 556 00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:20,840 Speaker 10: In No, that's exactly right, Nancy. It's just what you said. 557 00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:25,239 Speaker 10: In your mind, you have a preconceived notion of what 558 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:28,520 Speaker 10: this person should look like, what this person should act like. 559 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:33,000 Speaker 10: An evil person, you know, something from the movies, something 560 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:37,520 Speaker 10: from a novel, and there is no type. I'm sure 561 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:40,440 Speaker 10: this woman the neighbors. If you went and talked to 562 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:44,440 Speaker 10: the neighbors about how nice she was, and they can't 563 00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:48,040 Speaker 10: believe that this happened because they could never conceive of 564 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:51,560 Speaker 10: it in their mind. This is the part that I 565 00:34:51,640 --> 00:34:56,319 Speaker 10: find most complexing about this case is that no one 566 00:34:56,680 --> 00:35:00,880 Speaker 10: took notice that this little girl was dying right in 567 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:05,799 Speaker 10: front of them, to watch her waste away like she 568 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:09,520 Speaker 10: did until she finally went into a coma and couldn't 569 00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:14,640 Speaker 10: be revived. That's the part that I just can't understand, 570 00:35:14,719 --> 00:35:18,440 Speaker 10: and it's so tragic because it was so avoidable. 571 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,960 Speaker 3: Parents that think they're doing the right thing, could they 572 00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:22,920 Speaker 3: really be thinking that? 573 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:25,719 Speaker 1: I don't believe it. 574 00:35:26,600 --> 00:35:30,640 Speaker 3: This mom is by far not the first to kill 575 00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 3: their child by what they feed them. 576 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:35,560 Speaker 1: Listen. 577 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:37,680 Speaker 7: She lo O Leary calls nine to one one in 578 00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:40,439 Speaker 7: Cape Coral, Florida, seeking help for her eighteen month old 579 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:42,839 Speaker 7: son who is cold and not breathing. I thought he's 580 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:46,000 Speaker 7: arrived and the malnourished child is pronounced dead. Ohlary tells 581 00:35:46,040 --> 00:35:49,200 Speaker 7: police they are vegans on a raw food diet of mangoes, bananas, 582 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,839 Speaker 7: and avocados, but the toddler had not eaten solid food 583 00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:53,920 Speaker 7: in a week due to teething, so he had just 584 00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:56,840 Speaker 7: had breast milk. The medical examiner says the boy weighed 585 00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:59,920 Speaker 7: just seventeen pounds and died for malnutrition. She Lo Oliria 586 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,919 Speaker 7: convicted a first degree murder and more sentenced to life 587 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:03,360 Speaker 7: in prison. 588 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:07,920 Speaker 3: Okay, what about that Slatin feeding the baby a raw 589 00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:14,360 Speaker 3: sued diet of mangoes, bananas, and avocados till the baby dies? 590 00:36:14,680 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 3: What about them? They're enlightened vegans. 591 00:36:17,840 --> 00:36:21,600 Speaker 9: It's the same. It's awful, it's tragic, and it's clearly 592 00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:26,480 Speaker 9: people that don't understand how to nourish a human. I mean, 593 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:31,080 Speaker 9: we can have days of discussions versus veganism, versus carnivore, 594 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:35,279 Speaker 9: versus all types of other diets, but clearly this is 595 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:39,279 Speaker 9: just another parent who didn't have the brains to know 596 00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 9: how to take care of themselves, let alone take care 597 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 9: of a child. 598 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:47,440 Speaker 3: I bet you that mom wasn't living off nothing but soda. 599 00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,200 Speaker 3: I bet she was having full on meals and the 600 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:55,560 Speaker 3: dad too, So why not the child? Dr Bethany Marshall, 601 00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:56,160 Speaker 3: you know this. 602 00:36:56,239 --> 00:37:00,719 Speaker 4: Mother besides not wanting this child to live, the mother 603 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,840 Speaker 4: was not bonded with this child. I've treated mothers in 604 00:37:03,880 --> 00:37:06,839 Speaker 4: my practice who are not bonded with their children. They 605 00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:09,640 Speaker 4: love to go out in public, go to parties, smile, 606 00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 4: get a lot of attention. One moment in this past week, 607 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:16,080 Speaker 4: a female patient said, you know, my happiest moment today 608 00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:18,719 Speaker 4: was when I was grocery shopping and saying hi to 609 00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:23,480 Speaker 4: everybody and seeing people I knew. Meanwhile, she spoke viciously 610 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:28,200 Speaker 4: about her child. So not only are these mothers not bonded, 611 00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:31,520 Speaker 4: but I think we have to consider that homicide can 612 00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:35,239 Speaker 4: be formulated at an unconscious level. So while she may 613 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,680 Speaker 4: not even consciously say, oh, I'm going to starve my 614 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:41,560 Speaker 4: child to death, at some level, she's thinking, oh, goodie, 615 00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:45,320 Speaker 4: my child is not going to be here at some point. 616 00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:50,319 Speaker 4: That's why a fatal starvation, child neglect through starvation, and 617 00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:54,440 Speaker 4: philicide are all linked. They are one and the same. 618 00:37:54,719 --> 00:37:58,680 Speaker 4: They're not two separate things. Homicide and neglect go hand 619 00:37:58,760 --> 00:37:59,280 Speaker 4: in hand. 620 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:05,160 Speaker 5: Is a four year old with a big personality nicknamed Boogie. 621 00:38:05,280 --> 00:38:09,080 Speaker 5: She loves being silly and taking pictures, smiling big and 622 00:38:09,160 --> 00:38:13,040 Speaker 5: saying cheese, waking up with great joy and energy. She 623 00:38:13,120 --> 00:38:16,960 Speaker 5: loves playing with her Mickey Buddies and racing car. Carmody 624 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:19,839 Speaker 5: is the type of child that warms the hearts of 625 00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:21,799 Speaker 5: everyone she comes in contact. 626 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:25,040 Speaker 3: You know where we got those words, those exact words 627 00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:30,719 Speaker 3: from four year old Kromeny's obituary that was written by 628 00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:36,520 Speaker 3: her mom and dad that killed her by mountain dew. 629 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:42,680 Speaker 3: The mountain dew baby bottle. Baby four year old Caromeny 630 00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:49,280 Speaker 3: is now dead from horrible implications resulting from diabetes brought 631 00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:53,080 Speaker 3: onto a four year diet of nothing but mountain dew 632 00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:58,439 Speaker 3: and a baby bottle, sometimes mixed with formula. But it's 633 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:02,360 Speaker 3: by far the first time a parent is killed by ingestion. 634 00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:03,120 Speaker 1: Listen. 635 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:05,680 Speaker 7: An obese three year old weighs sixty six pounds. His 636 00:39:05,719 --> 00:39:08,479 Speaker 7: mother is warned about proper diet. She feeds him junk food, 637 00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:10,600 Speaker 7: telling teachers at school he's too sickly to do any 638 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,399 Speaker 7: physical fitness. As a teen, he's hospitalized with a heart 639 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,520 Speaker 7: condition brought on by obesity. In the hospital, mom sneaks 640 00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:18,279 Speaker 7: fast food to her son until he dies of heart 641 00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:21,160 Speaker 7: failure at fifteen. Parents of another more bidle obese boy 642 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:23,239 Speaker 7: are warned he could die if he doesn't lose weight. 643 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:26,200 Speaker 7: At seven, his body mass index should be fourteen, his 644 00:39:26,320 --> 00:39:28,960 Speaker 7: is thirty. Parents ignore doctors and give the boy junk 645 00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:30,799 Speaker 7: food until he weighs over one hundred and seventy five 646 00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:32,800 Speaker 7: pounds at ten years old and has a heart attack 647 00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:33,839 Speaker 7: and his declared brain dead. 648 00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:36,640 Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany, what is wrong with these people? 649 00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:40,080 Speaker 4: You know, it's hard to even say, Nancy, you know, 650 00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:45,600 Speaker 4: little Hart, because there's so many motivations, but always, always 651 00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,560 Speaker 4: at the root of it is not wanting the child 652 00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:54,320 Speaker 4: to have needs and feeling that the child is unconditionally bad. 653 00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 4: I once treated a mother who was not bonded with 654 00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:00,320 Speaker 4: her children. They were all in a business to together, 655 00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:04,560 Speaker 4: and whenever it came time to pay the children their paychecks, 656 00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:06,960 Speaker 4: she would come in and insist to me that her 657 00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:11,760 Speaker 4: adult children were stealing from her. Okay, so she didn't 658 00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,680 Speaker 4: see that she was providing for them. She thought they 659 00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 4: were stealing from her. Furthermore, children that are subjected to 660 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,880 Speaker 4: fatal starvation, you almost always see that there's a padlock 661 00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:25,200 Speaker 4: on the fridge. Have you seen that where the parents 662 00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:29,280 Speaker 4: put chains on the fridge because they do not want 663 00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:32,560 Speaker 4: their children to have food they do not want to provide. 664 00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:37,120 Speaker 3: Doctor Michelle Duprey, renowned forensic pathologists, medical examiner, and a 665 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:41,760 Speaker 3: former detective with the Sheriff's Department. You've conducted well around 666 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:48,480 Speaker 3: ten thousand autopsies. Does it ever matter to you clinically 667 00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:52,239 Speaker 3: or medically, whether the per has a pH D, like 668 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:55,560 Speaker 3: Troce Layton was pointing out or not. 669 00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:59,080 Speaker 8: No, Nancy, it never does. And sometimes in these cases 670 00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:02,960 Speaker 8: we also find that this can be a personality disorder 671 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,319 Speaker 8: of the mother who was trying to get attention for 672 00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 8: herself because her child is always so sick. It's called 673 00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:10,600 Speaker 8: munch house in my prodixy, and that may also be 674 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:15,279 Speaker 8: a fact. But no, this is absolutely she's able to 675 00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:19,560 Speaker 8: take care of herself. She sees a doctor. That's no excuse. 676 00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:21,240 Speaker 8: Stupidity is not an excuse. 677 00:41:21,400 --> 00:41:25,800 Speaker 1: Investigative journalist Lauren Conlin, what happened to these two demons 678 00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:27,280 Speaker 1: from hell? The mom and dad? 679 00:41:27,560 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 6: So Tamra got sentenced nine years and her husband is 680 00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:34,719 Speaker 6: do back in court in the middle of June, and 681 00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:39,040 Speaker 6: he could face up to thirteen years. So let's see 682 00:41:39,080 --> 00:41:39,800 Speaker 6: what happens. 683 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:47,719 Speaker 3: I'm ready nine years, nine years. Carmeny is dead and 684 00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:51,520 Speaker 3: she got a reduced play to involuntary manslaughter on nine years. 685 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:55,399 Speaker 3: She'll be out in about four count on. It we 686 00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:59,600 Speaker 3: stop and we remember American hero Deputy Sheriff Michael Brown 687 00:41:59,680 --> 00:42:05,200 Speaker 3: from Cordel, Georgia, just twenty six. Sheriff Brown shot and 688 00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:09,800 Speaker 3: killed in the line of duty on a traffic stop 689 00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:15,560 Speaker 3: an Army National Guard Vet Deputy. Sheriff Brown leaves behind 690 00:42:16,160 --> 00:42:21,320 Speaker 3: a grieving mother and stepfather, Christina and Tom, brothers Jason 691 00:42:21,640 --> 00:42:29,600 Speaker 3: and Jeff, and his beloved dog Jenny. Sheriff Ty Brown Hero. 692 00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:32,439 Speaker 3: I want to thank all of our guests for being 693 00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,399 Speaker 3: with us tonight, leading us on a very rocky path 694 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:43,760 Speaker 3: to justice. Nancy Gray signing off, good night friend.