Speaker 1: Time out for another episode of Phats in the Past
Speaker 1: podcast Matt Smith along with Brian Morey, and we're pleased
Speaker 1: to be joined today by the best selling author of
Speaker 1: the book that you might not be able to find
Speaker 1: in the shells because it's flying off the shells. The
Speaker 1: book is called The Dynasty. The author is Jeff Benedict,
Speaker 1: who joins us now. And Jeff, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for your time in joining us. How's things going.
Speaker 2: Things are going great, and I really appreciate a chance
Speaker 2: to be on the podcast with you guys.
Speaker 1: So I guess the first question that maybe Patriots fans
Speaker 1: would want to know Jeff as an author, And I
Speaker 1: know that I thoroughly enjoyed the Tiger Woods book that
Speaker 1: you did. It's one of the best books I think
Speaker 1: I've ever read. This isn't your first rodeo. You've written
Speaker 1: so many books and so many really good books. How
Speaker 1: does this story come across Jeff Benedict's desk and say,
Speaker 1: you know what, I'd like to tackle the Patriots in
Speaker 1: their dynasty? How did it come up?
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I'm a New England native born
Speaker 2: and raised in Connecticut. I grew up watching this team
Speaker 2: and actually rooting against them. I was a Miami Dolphins
Speaker 2: fan as a kid and would go to the stadium
Speaker 2: once a year when the Dolphins were in town. I
Speaker 2: think my first memory of thinking of the sort of
Speaker 2: book potential of the Patriots story would have been on
Speaker 2: the final game of the two thousand and seven regular season,
Speaker 2: when the Patriots were in the Meadowlands to face the
Speaker 2: Giants and see if they could finish the season sixteen
Speaker 2: and oero and watching that game on television, particularly the
Speaker 2: way it ended, and especially with what had gone on
Speaker 2: that season early in the year, I remember sitting in
Speaker 2: my house and when Brady connected with Moss and silenced
Speaker 2: Giants fans and basically silenced the largest stadium in the NFL.
Speaker 2: I was thinking to myself at that time, and that
Speaker 2: was obviously way before they would win three more Super Bowls,
Speaker 2: that there's a there's something going on here that's bigger
Speaker 2: than just football. The Patriots had become something iconic and
Speaker 2: something that was becoming part of the American fabric. And
Speaker 2: when I look for books to write you mentioned Tiger Woods.
Speaker 2: I mean it's I'm looking for stories that transcend the
Speaker 2: sport and leave a cultural imprint on a country around
Speaker 2: the world, and I think the Patriots as an organization
Speaker 2: and as a team have done that over the last
Speaker 2: twenty years. Now. I'm not telling you that that night
Speaker 2: I thought I want to write a book about this team.
Speaker 2: I'm just saying that that's like sort of the first
Speaker 2: origin seed for me. And then by the time you
Speaker 2: get to the twenty fourteen twenty fifteen timeframe, that's when
Speaker 2: I was starting to think seriously about a book and
Speaker 2: what it might look like, and that process of thinking
Speaker 2: about it takes time. I wrote two books during that period,
Speaker 2: one with Steve Young's autobiography and then one with Tiger
Speaker 2: Wood's biography, and those are huge undertakings. But I'm just
Speaker 2: saying a lot of thought went into this from my perspective,
Speaker 2: and I think that this is a team that deserves
Speaker 2: that kind of thought. They've earned it.
Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, Jeff, in listening to you speak
Speaker 1: right there and using the words or the phrase, this
Speaker 1: is something bigger than football. That hits me right between
Speaker 1: the eyes when I hear you say that. And the
Speaker 1: first thing I think of when you say that is, man,
Speaker 1: I'm too close to the situation. Here is somebody who
Speaker 1: works here look at what a quote unquote outsider and
Speaker 1: how he views this from the outside. And when you
Speaker 1: say that, it almost gives me chills, quite honestly, Jeff.
Speaker 1: You know, and when you say that, you go, man,
Speaker 1: he's right. This is a cultural As you said, Jeff,
Speaker 1: this is a cultural phenomenon, and we just think of
Speaker 1: this as a very successful organization. Just think of this
Speaker 1: as a very successful just like every football team. But
Speaker 1: to hear you say that puts it in a perspective Jeff.
Speaker 1: That my guess is people who are around it, and
Speaker 1: maybe even real diehard Patriot feans maybe are spoiled. I
Speaker 1: don't know if that's the right thing to say, Brian
Speaker 1: or not, because when you hear very clearly articulate that, Jeff,
Speaker 1: that's that's an interesting perspective.
Speaker 2: I think that for me, again, I try to take
Speaker 2: a big and distant view of topics that I want
Speaker 2: to write about, because when you think about it, you
Speaker 2: have to invest years of your life to write a book.
Speaker 2: It becomes your life. So Steve Young was my life
Speaker 2: for a number of years. Then Tiger Woods was my life,
Speaker 2: and then the New England Patriots became my life and
Speaker 2: they still are my life right now because that book
Speaker 2: is just out, and so you've become fully immersed. And
Speaker 2: in order to want to be fully immersed in something,
Speaker 2: from my perspective, that's something has to be really big
Speaker 2: and engrossing and engaging, and I think it has to
Speaker 2: tap into America. And I think what I love about
Speaker 2: the Patriots story, I mean, the winning is obvious, like
Speaker 2: you can look at it and see, now there's a
Speaker 2: body of work to say, well, I mean, look at
Speaker 2: all the Lombardi Trophies and the goal the rings, and
Speaker 2: the incredible victories and the statistics and all that stuff
Speaker 2: that we already know all that. When you look broader though,
Speaker 2: and you see how this team has fit into Americana
Speaker 2: for the last twenty years. What's beautiful about the architecture
Speaker 2: is in the year two thousand, so at the turn
Speaker 2: of the century, Robert Kraft makes what I would call
Speaker 2: the greatest trade in the history of sports. I think
Speaker 2: the greatest trade in the history of sports used to
Speaker 2: be Babe Ruth from the Red Sox to the Yankees.
Speaker 2: Most lopsided trade, and it had the most impact. But
Speaker 2: I think there's a new trade now. When Craft wrestles
Speaker 2: Belichick away from Parcels and away from New York and
Speaker 2: brings him to Foxborough. And then within months Bill Belichick
Speaker 2: makes the draft choice of a lifetime by picking the
Speaker 2: quarterback that clearly nobody else wanted. All of that happens
Speaker 2: in the same year, two thousand. The beautiful symmetry there
Speaker 2: is that is the start of a new century, and
Speaker 2: that's the start of the machine that gets built in Foxborough.
Speaker 2: And so for the first twenty years of the twenty
Speaker 2: first century, they are the juggernaut of American sports. And
Speaker 2: as a result, as major things happen in American history,
Speaker 2: starting with the nine to eleven terror attacks in two
Speaker 2: thousand and one, this team is front and center in
Speaker 2: the storyline because that's the magical year that they go
Speaker 2: to the Super Bowl and win against all odds, and
Speaker 2: then we get that great phrase that Patriots are world champions,
Speaker 2: and tonight we're all Patriots. That that, to me is
Speaker 2: what I mean when I say a team that's been
Speaker 2: in the center of American culture.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's It's an incredible story, and I
Speaker 3: love the book, and I told you separately that I
Speaker 3: got very emotional at times during it. But I want
Speaker 3: to know to build on that's question, how like, how
Speaker 3: did you get in the door to do this?
Speaker 1: You know, it's been a very kind because it's such
Speaker 1: a welcoming organization.
Speaker 3: It's very it's been very it's very tight, right and
Speaker 3: you know, than David Halberstam's book Education of a Coach,
Speaker 3: there really hasn't been what you normally see from championship
Speaker 3: teams or franchises.
Speaker 1: College coaches write a book as soon as they win
Speaker 1: a title.
Speaker 3: You know, there's all these books about success, and none
Speaker 3: of that has really come out of this organization.
Speaker 1: How did you get to do it?
Speaker 2: I can only speak to my part of that. I mean,
Speaker 2: there's obviously questions that the Patriots organization can answer from
Speaker 2: their perspective of how and why, But from my perspective,
Speaker 2: I certainly read there have been a lot of books
Speaker 2: written about this team, and some good ones. I mean,
Speaker 2: I've read Michael Holly's books first. Sure, I certainly read
Speaker 2: David Halberstam's book about Belichick. I am a huge Halberstam
Speaker 2: fan and have been for a long time. But my
Speaker 2: approach was that again trying to look at things differently
Speaker 2: and also look at them wide, So a wide Lens.
Speaker 2: I started with the idea that, look, there are three
Speaker 2: central figures in the creation of the dynasty, and they
Speaker 2: are the two obvious ones, Brady and Belichick, but then
Speaker 2: third the owner, Robert Kraft. And of the three, it
Speaker 2: was Craft who has been least explored and least discussed
Speaker 2: in the conversation about who's most responsible. And so I
Speaker 2: also knew that there really haven't been any good sports books.
Speaker 2: And by the way, I see this as more than
Speaker 2: a sportsbook, but it's in that genre of sportsbooks, and
Speaker 2: there hasn't been a really good sports book where the
Speaker 2: owner is a central figure in the book. And so
Speaker 2: to me, it was sort of begging to go to
Speaker 2: that direction. Plus, it is his team, it's a franchise,
Speaker 2: and it's a family business for the Crafts. And so
Speaker 2: I approached Robert first before anybody else. I did it
Speaker 2: in a sort of an old fashioned way, but I
Speaker 2: wrote him a letter and I introduced myself and I
Speaker 2: did things there that are this will sound kind of quirky,
Speaker 2: perhaps to some of your audience, but I did what
Speaker 2: I would do if I was a college kid right
Speaker 2: out of college trying to get my first job. Is
Speaker 2: I essentially provided him some references, you know, reference letter,
Speaker 2: and you know, I invited him to talk to Steve Young,
Speaker 2: because Steve led me in his life for a few
Speaker 2: years to write that book. I invited him to reach
Speaker 2: out to coach Krzyzewski because Coach K had allowed me.
Speaker 2: I was the first journalist that Coach K ever allowed
Speaker 2: inside the Duke basketball program. And so I took a
Speaker 2: similar approach here with the Patriots. I wanted to write
Speaker 2: a very intimate, personal inside account of how this dynasty
Speaker 2: was built and how it was sustained. And I wanted
Speaker 2: to start at the top because I really did want
Speaker 2: to tell the story literally, not only from the inside out,
Speaker 2: but from the top down. And so that was the
Speaker 2: approach I took. And I spent a couple of years,
Speaker 2: and you guys know this to a certain degree because
Speaker 2: you saw me in your facility, and you guys were
Speaker 2: helpful in providing me with lists of video and audio
Speaker 2: that I wanted to see the kinds of things that
Speaker 2: I was trying to do in this story. I spent
Speaker 2: a ton of time at NFL Films in Mount Laurel,
Speaker 2: New Jersey, looking at video and listening to audio that's
Speaker 2: never been seen or heard before. I was trying to
Speaker 2: find as many intimate ways as I could to tell
Speaker 2: this story, not from my perspective because nobody cares about that,
Speaker 2: but literally tell it through the eyes and the minds
Speaker 2: of the people who lived in.
Speaker 1: You know, you mentioned the trade, Jeff, and you think
Speaker 1: that this trade, you know, least rivals if doesn't surpass
Speaker 1: Ruth to the Yankees. And it's interesting to hear you
Speaker 1: talk about that. Robert doesn't necessarily get there. You know,
Speaker 1: the first two those are easy. But Robert's position in
Speaker 1: this and my two cents, and I'd be interested in
Speaker 1: yours on this is you're talking about. I think everybody
Speaker 1: agrees that builds the greatest coach in NFL history, and
Speaker 1: Tom's the greatest quarterback in NFL history, And clearly central
Speaker 1: to this story, or certainly a part of this story,
Speaker 1: is how did you keep those guys together? Can we
Speaker 1: only imagine the work that Robert had to do to
Speaker 1: try to keep those guys on the same page as
Speaker 1: much as you can subject. You know, everybody talks about
Speaker 1: subjugating your ego when you come to work here at
Speaker 1: this place, and I don't think that they're saying that
Speaker 1: and it's bs I think they mean it. But to
Speaker 1: be able to mediate and keep these two people who
Speaker 1: are at the very highest of their profession, and to
Speaker 1: do it and succeed on the field. And again, nothing's perfect,
Speaker 1: but that's truly a remarkable accomplishment, isn't it.
Speaker 2: I think it's Robert's greatest accomplishment as an owner. And
Speaker 2: that's coming from a guy who has a long list
Speaker 2: of great accomplishments. But I think the one this is
Speaker 2: from my perspective, if I was going to identify the
Speaker 2: biggest one, the most important one, it is the work
Speaker 2: he's done behind the scenes to keep Bill and Tom
Speaker 2: together for twenty years. And let me just share a
Speaker 2: couple of quick anecdotes that sort of helped me see that,
Speaker 2: and then it informs why I wrote it the way
Speaker 2: I did in The Dynasty. But I remember the first
Speaker 2: time that I went to Robert's New York City apartment.
Speaker 2: I had interviewed him and been with him many times
Speaker 2: prior to this, but this was my first time meeting
Speaker 2: him in New York and it was in the midst
Speaker 2: of the heated debate about whether Tom was finished in
Speaker 2: New England or whether he'd come back and all that.
Speaker 2: And I remember when I walked in the apartment, the
Speaker 2: first thing you see is you look across the room
Speaker 2: and there's these two beautiful windows that overlook Central Park.
Speaker 2: They're big, and in between the windows were two framed
Speaker 2: pictures of the Beatles and they were signed by all
Speaker 2: four Beatles, and they were from the first time that
Speaker 2: the Beatles came to America to perform on the Ed
Speaker 2: Sullivan Show, and they had actually stayed in the building
Speaker 2: that Robert now has his apartment in, and I as
Speaker 2: we sat down on the sofa to talk, I asked
Speaker 2: him about the photos and the Beatles. This led to
Speaker 2: a really interesting conversation which helped me make a comparison
Speaker 2: in the book where I compare Belichick and Brady to
Speaker 2: Lennon and McCartney. That whole thought idea came out of
Speaker 2: this meeting in Robert's apartment because what occurred to me
Speaker 2: as he was talking about he started talking about the
Speaker 2: breakup of the Beatles and how it was so premature
Speaker 2: that they were really just at the peak, you know,
Speaker 2: when they came apart, and they really came apart because
Speaker 2: Lennon and McCartney couldn't get along anymore. They couldn't stand
Speaker 2: to be on the same stage together any longer. And
Speaker 2: they were the two brightest, biggest stars in music, and
Speaker 2: I just thought, Wow, like that's what's happened in Foxboro.
Speaker 2: Brady and Belichick are the two biggest, brightest stars in
Speaker 2: the National Football League. They have been for the better
Speaker 2: part of two decades. Robert Kraft has had them on
Speaker 2: his payroll for all that time, and starting in about
Speaker 2: twenty ten, when Brady was halfway through his career. But
Speaker 2: if you looked at the actuary charts, he was really
Speaker 2: at the end of his career, especially for a guy
Speaker 2: who had just had reconstructive knee surgery, had missed a
Speaker 2: whole season, and you start looking at guys like Elway
Speaker 2: and Montana and Young and far and you know that
Speaker 2: he's really rounding the clubhouse turn. He's kind of getting
Speaker 2: to the end. But Tom knew he wasn't getting to
Speaker 2: the end, despite what Bill might have thought. And that's
Speaker 2: where Robert's relationship with Tom becomes so crucial and pivotal
Speaker 2: in keeping him in New England for an extra ten years,
Speaker 2: that extra decade. And I think the relationship that he
Speaker 2: has with Tom and the relationship he has with Bill,
Speaker 2: and those are two very different kinds of relationships. I
Speaker 2: wouldn't value one above the other in importance, but they're
Speaker 2: both critical to keeping them married for an extra ten years.
Speaker 2: And I'll close with this anecdote. I interviewed Rupert Murdoch
Speaker 2: for this book. He's not quoted in the book. He's
Speaker 2: one of numerous people that I interviewed that aren't actually
Speaker 2: in the book. But Rupert made a really interesting observation
Speaker 2: to me, and he said, you know that he's known
Speaker 2: Craft for a long time. And he said, if Robert
Speaker 2: had gone into politics, he may have gone down in
Speaker 2: history as one of the greatest diplomats in the country's history.
Speaker 2: But instead he went into professional sports. And in my mind,
Speaker 2: this is Rupert talking. In my mind, he is the
Speaker 2: greatest diplomat in sports. And exhibit number one is how
Speaker 2: he's kept Brady and Belichick together. That's what Rupert said
Speaker 2: to me. I think when you look at all that
Speaker 2: that's hard to see. It's Brady's always got a ball
Speaker 2: in his hand. Bill's always got a headset on. They're
Speaker 2: on television every week throughout this dynasty. Robert is not seeing,
Speaker 2: you know, the owner is invisible. The stuff that he
Speaker 2: does you can't see on television, but it's every bit
Speaker 2: as important as what Bill and Tom did during that
Speaker 2: twenty years.
Speaker 3: So, Jeff, do you think that it war on Tom
Speaker 3: over time to be treated like one of fifty three
Speaker 3: despite his accomplishments, Because I always felt like, you know,
Speaker 3: that's part of what made it work is that Tom
Speaker 3: allowed that he never brought his ego out publicly. He
Speaker 3: allowed Bill to cheat him that way, so to speak.
Speaker 3: And the fact that Bill did, you know, did that
Speaker 3: wear on him a little bit?
Speaker 2: You think that's a great question, and let me answer
Speaker 2: it by starting with another anecdote. One of the great
Speaker 2: interviews I did for this book was with Randy Moss,
Speaker 2: who doesn't do interviews, And there is a great scene
Speaker 2: in this book where Randy Moss first arrives in Foxborough
Speaker 2: and again he's a superstar, and when he comes to
Speaker 2: New England in his first meeting team meeting, he's sitting
Speaker 2: next to Dante Stalworth, who's also in his first meeting
Speaker 2: because he and Wes Welker and Moss have all come
Speaker 2: at the same time. And in that meeting, Belichick rips
Speaker 2: into Brady Brady is the king of the NFL at
Speaker 2: this point, I mean, he's the man. And Stalwart and
Speaker 2: Moss are sitting in the back and they're listening to
Speaker 2: and watching Belichick basically verbally undressed Tom in front of
Speaker 2: the entire team, and Moss and Stalwarth are looking at
Speaker 2: each other. They're not saying anything, but with their eyes
Speaker 2: they're saying, Holy, you know what, what have we got
Speaker 2: ourselves into here? And Moss made the observation is which
Speaker 2: was Wow. If Tom Brady is taking this, everybody else
Speaker 2: has got to get in line. And that's the power
Speaker 2: of Tom Brady's This is a strange word to say
Speaker 2: about the king of the sport, but the humility of
Speaker 2: Tom Brady is based in his willingness to absorb and
Speaker 2: endure that kind of thing for years. And what it
Speaker 2: did was it made Bill Belichick's job a lot easier.
Speaker 2: Because the veterans, the other stars, the other accomplished players
Speaker 2: that came to New England, the Rodney Harrison's, the Corey Dillons,
Speaker 2: the Randy Mosses, the Wes Welkers, the Danny Ammondolas. As
Speaker 2: they come into the program New and they see this
Speaker 2: from Tom, they do get in line because he is
Speaker 2: the leader. And I think that that part of Tom's
Speaker 2: contribution has been tremendously understated. So to your question, Brian,
Speaker 2: does it wear on him? Of course it wears on him.
Speaker 2: He's human. I mean it would wear on anybody, and
Speaker 2: I think it would be disingenuous to suggest that it
Speaker 2: doesn't wear on him. It does. It's hard, brutal at times.
Speaker 2: It wears on your whole family. I mean that's the thing.
Speaker 2: Tom is a person. You know, he has a heart,
Speaker 2: he has a soul, he has feelings, And I think
Speaker 2: this takes it back to craft. This is where Robert
Speaker 2: becomes so important, though, because Robert understands that, and that's
Speaker 2: where the father son kind of relationship that he has
Speaker 2: is so important. Because if it wasn't for that, there
Speaker 2: is no way that Tom stays here and endures it
Speaker 2: for that long. And I'll add one more thing to that.
Speaker 2: If you want to talk about other great quarterbacks, you
Speaker 2: want to talk about Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning or
Speaker 2: Brett Farv or any of the other ones I mentioned earlier,
Speaker 2: here's the question, do you think any of them would
Speaker 2: have endured that for ten years? My answer is. I
Speaker 2: don't think any of them would endure it for three years.
Speaker 2: I just think that that's part of what makes the
Speaker 2: magic of Belichick and Brady is deeply rooted in personalities.
Speaker 2: And I think Tom is the only quarterback in the game.
Speaker 2: And you can go back as many generations as you want.
Speaker 2: I'm not just talking about right now quarterbacks. I'm talking
Speaker 2: about all quarterbacks who could have done what he did
Speaker 2: here for twenty years. I think so much of that
Speaker 2: is in his makeup.
Speaker 1: And so the flip side of that, Jeff, is this,
Speaker 1: you know, you talk about how accommodating or flexible or
Speaker 1: how humble Tom is and allows himself to be coached
Speaker 1: this way and put up as a you know, as
Speaker 1: a symbol when he does wrong, so that the other
Speaker 1: fifty two can see what's going on. But from Bill's perspective,
Speaker 1: Bill can't change, you know, He's got to remain true
Speaker 1: to himself and say, you know, he always says famously,
Speaker 1: I'm going to do what's best for the team, and
Speaker 1: he means that. And he needed twelve to buy in
Speaker 1: because that meant everybody else bought in. But if Tom
Speaker 1: becomes bigger or his star gets bigger, and his performances
Speaker 1: are bigger, and he becomes you know, it's not just
Speaker 1: Tom Brady becomes Tom Brady. Bill's got to wrestle with Well.
Speaker 1: I still need to crack the whip the same way,
Speaker 1: don't I. I mean, that's his genius, isn't it.
Speaker 2: I think, And I don't throw the word genius around
Speaker 2: like cavalierly, and I think the word gets used way
Speaker 2: too often on way too many people. But I think
Speaker 2: in Bill's case, the word is very fitting. It fits
Speaker 2: on Bill. He can wear that word like a new suit.
Speaker 2: It belongs with Bill. And I think part of the
Speaker 2: reason that Bill is a genius coach is because if
Speaker 2: you look at Bill's upbringing, the way he was raised
Speaker 2: by his parents, and not just his father, but also
Speaker 2: his mother, which he does pay tribute to her very
Speaker 2: eloquently at his dad's funeral, where you really see the
Speaker 2: way that she was also very critical in Bill's sort
Speaker 2: of nurturing and upbringing to become who he is as
Speaker 2: a man. But I think, look, Bill was groomed to
Speaker 2: coach basically almost out of the womb. I mean, the
Speaker 2: things that he learned from his dad, and the fact
Speaker 2: that his dad was such a good dad, the way
Speaker 2: he included him and brought him along, always had him
Speaker 2: at his side, the fact that he was at the
Speaker 2: Navy field having a toss with Roger Staubach as a
Speaker 2: little boy. He learned to coach by experience, by feel by.
Speaker 2: He is that kind of child prodigy coach. He was
Speaker 2: never made to be a football player. He was made
Speaker 2: to be a coach, and so I think you have
Speaker 2: to give him his due that you can't question his style.
Speaker 2: You can't question what he does, because that's the thing
Speaker 2: about geniuses. Geniuses are unique. They are the one and only.
Speaker 2: So of course he's going to be different than everyone else.
Speaker 2: Of Course he's going to behave in a way that
Speaker 2: people go, why is he doing that? That's what geniuses do.
Speaker 2: I really gained it a pre siation for this in
Speaker 2: writing Tiger Woods's biography. He's one of a kind. I mean,
Speaker 2: we compared Tiger Woods to Shakespeare. I think you could
Speaker 2: make a similar comparison to Bill in the ranks of coaching,
Speaker 2: and I think that that. I mean, look, it wouldn't
Speaker 2: be a stretch to one day change the Lombardi Trophy
Speaker 2: name to the Belichick Trophy. I mean he's done those
Speaker 2: kinds of things, and so I think when you see him,
Speaker 2: and that's again why I compared him to Lenin in
Speaker 2: the book. I mean, I think that that's the perfect
Speaker 2: analogy here is you have these two personalities, Lennon and McCartney,
Speaker 2: Belichick and Brady. They are on one hand like oil
Speaker 2: and water. When McCartney and Lennon come out of the studio,
Speaker 2: they don't go out and have dinner together. But when
Speaker 2: they're in the studio, they do things that no one
Speaker 2: else can do. And I think that's Bill and Tom.
Speaker 2: Did they go out for beers, No they didn't. Were
Speaker 2: their families close, No they weren't. But when they are
Speaker 2: in a meeting, or when they are on the practice
Speaker 2: field or on some when the lights come on, they
Speaker 2: do things that everybody else can only gape at. And
Speaker 2: I think that that's really why the people of New
Speaker 2: England have witnessed something in the last twenty years that
Speaker 2: I just think you're never going to see it again
Speaker 2: in any.
Speaker 3: Era, you know, Jeff, I think I know that dynamic
Speaker 3: helped maintain the culture that Bill built when he got here,
Speaker 3: that team first culture. People always pay lip service to
Speaker 3: that in sports but he got the players to buy
Speaker 3: into that, and then I think over time the fact
Speaker 3: that what we just talked about with Brady allowed some
Speaker 3: sustainability there. But how do you think he got all
Speaker 3: those egos to buy into the team first mentality and
Speaker 3: then sustain that.
Speaker 2: I think simply because the leadership of the organization, Craft, Belichick,
Speaker 2: Brady are three men who have a license to have
Speaker 2: outsized egos, and yet all three of them, in their
Speaker 2: own sphere, have limited their ego. In other words, they've
Speaker 2: kind of sequestered it. Belichick constantly, whenever given the opportunity
Speaker 2: to blow his own horn, he always holds up the
Speaker 2: mirror and reflects it back on the players. It's a
Speaker 2: player's game, he likes to say. Coaches can screw it up,
Speaker 2: but players are the ones who win it. He constantly,
Speaker 2: constantly gives credit to the guys on the field. Brady,
Speaker 2: who certainly would have every right to blow his own horn,
Speaker 2: what does he do. He's always talking about somebody else.
Speaker 2: If he talks about himself, he's usually talking about what
Speaker 2: he needs to do better. And then there's Craft, who
Speaker 2: just recognizes that when you have two stars like Belichick
Speaker 2: and Brady, give them the spotlight. Those are the two
Speaker 2: guys that you want under the light, not yourself. Other
Speaker 2: owners in the NFL that have never learned that lesson
Speaker 2: and have real trouble would have trouble living that way.
Speaker 2: But Robert's goal is the same goal that Bill has,
Speaker 2: and it's the same goal that Tom always had, which
Speaker 2: was first and foremost win.
Speaker 1: Jeff, do you think, as you're talking about you know
Speaker 1: that this was maybe something bigger than football? And you
Speaker 1: know Bill's not one to reflect. I think he's famously said,
Speaker 1: you know, many many times there will be a time
Speaker 1: for that down the road. But do you think that
Speaker 1: they you know, as you're writing this and you're kind
Speaker 1: of living in this space and talking to all different people,
Speaker 1: do you think that after a certain amount of time
Speaker 1: they knew or they got it. I'm not talking about
Speaker 1: Super Bowls necessarily or rings, but do you think that
Speaker 1: they knew We've got something here? This is special and
Speaker 1: this is different.
Speaker 2: So that's a great question. I think when you're in
Speaker 2: the moment, sometimes it's hard to see the significance of
Speaker 2: the moment. But one of the interesting things about the
Speaker 2: season of a football team is it's like the four
Speaker 2: seasons of weather in New England, you get a period
Speaker 2: after the Super Bowl where there is downtime and where
Speaker 2: you're not in football. It's where you you know, if
Speaker 2: you're Tom Brady, it's when you go to the Islands
Speaker 2: with your wife and kids and you get away. And
Speaker 2: if it's Bill, you know, you go out to Nantucket,
Speaker 2: and if it's Robert, you travel. I think that as
Speaker 2: this team started to accumulate hardware and they were repeatedly
Speaker 2: in the hunt to get back to the Super Bowl
Speaker 2: every year, even though they didn't necessarily get there every year,
Speaker 2: they were in the hunt every year, I think they
Speaker 2: all realized they had something going here that was different. Because, look,
Speaker 2: Belichick's a student of history. He knows the history of
Speaker 2: the NFL. Probably unlike any other coach in the game today.
Speaker 2: Certainly he could see as the years wore on that
Speaker 2: what they were doing was different than what the forty
Speaker 2: nine Ers did under Walsh and de Barlow and Montana.
Speaker 2: It was different than what the Steelers did with Rooney
Speaker 2: and Bradshawn Knowle, and it was even different than what
Speaker 2: the Packers did with Starr and Lombardi. He could see
Speaker 2: that because he knows the history and you know, Brady
Speaker 2: is a student of history as well, and then so
Speaker 2: is Craft, and I think they recognize that. And I
Speaker 2: think in Robert's case in particular, i'll just talk about
Speaker 2: that for a minute, is as an owner. I think
Speaker 2: he is super alert to the significance of history and
Speaker 2: legacy matters for him, for his family, for this organization.
Speaker 2: And I think so when you look at his behavior
Speaker 2: in what I'll refer to as the back half of
Speaker 2: the dynasty that's post twenty ten. From my perspective, Robert
Speaker 2: is really focused on maintaining and sustaining that dynasty that
Speaker 2: has now been built, and that's where the focus on
Speaker 2: keeping Tom and Bill together becomes paramount. I think there
Speaker 2: was a moment with Tom. I remember one of the
Speaker 2: interviews that I did with him. We were in his
Speaker 2: suite at the stadium, where normally his family would be
Speaker 2: on game day watching him perform, but this was not
Speaker 2: a game day, so we were in there and the
Speaker 2: stadium was empty, and Tom was looking out through the
Speaker 2: glass at an empty to Lette Stadium. Was a perfect
Speaker 2: late summer or early fall day in New England. It
Speaker 2: was right before the opening game against the Steelers in
Speaker 2: the twenty nineteen regular season, and I asked him a
Speaker 2: question that would require him to sort of reflect on
Speaker 2: what has gone on here in Foxborough, and he was
Speaker 2: looking out and then out loud said, you know, how
Speaker 2: did all this happen? And I remember when he said that,
Speaker 2: I was thinking, that is a line that needs to
Speaker 2: be in the book and in the scene because of
Speaker 2: where he was at that point. That would be the
Speaker 2: beginning of his last you know, of the end for
Speaker 2: him in New England. And I think that whole question
Speaker 2: how did all of this happen? Was really settling on
Speaker 2: him as a man. You know, at this point, he's
Speaker 2: in his early forties. When he came there, he was
Speaker 2: right out of college, he was single, he was a bachelor,
Speaker 2: he was you know, he was a third stringer. Now
Speaker 2: he's a married man with children, he owns his own business,
Speaker 2: he's built a home in Boston. He's like he's made
Speaker 2: his life here and he in this stadium became the
Speaker 2: greatest quarterback the game's ever seen. And there he was
Speaker 2: finally taking a moment saying how did all this happen?
Speaker 3: Well, it wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for a
Speaker 3: very critical decision in his second year in the league.
Speaker 3: Maybe maybe it would have happened. But you reference the
Speaker 3: Bill Tree as the greatest trade. I look back on
Speaker 3: the decision for Bill to stick with Tom Brady in
Speaker 3: two thousand and one over Drew Bledsoe after clear to
Speaker 3: play from his chest injury as one of the most
Speaker 3: important football decisions in team history. I don't want to
Speaker 3: relive that as much as I want. I want to
Speaker 3: know how that affected Robert. How difficult was that period
Speaker 3: for Robert because he had a very say, similar relationship
Speaker 3: with Drew Bloodshell.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that that single decision that Belichick made.
Speaker 2: First of all, that is the gutsiest call you'll see
Speaker 2: from a coach if you remember the context that the
Speaker 2: call was made in. Earlier that Yeah, I know, you
Speaker 2: guys do, right. But earlier that year, Robert Kraft rewarded
Speaker 2: Drew Bledsoe with a one hundred and three million dollar
Speaker 2: contract extension, which made him at the time the highest
Speaker 2: paid player in the National Football League. And that was made.
Speaker 2: That deal was made right after Brady completed his rookie
Speaker 2: year where he was basically a practice squad player. Now
Speaker 2: we're going into the two thousand and one season, and
Speaker 2: Belichick has decided by the end of training camp in
Speaker 2: one that if he were going to start the quarterback
Speaker 2: who is better for this team, it would be Brady,
Speaker 2: and he actually tells Robert that in a private meeting
Speaker 2: right before the home opener that year against the Bengals.
Speaker 2: Of course, he doesn't put Brady in the lineup, but
Speaker 2: a few weeks later, after the nine to eleven terror attacks,
Speaker 2: when play resumes the first game back against the Jets,
Speaker 2: when mo Lewis takes out Bledsoe. At that point, it's
Speaker 2: not a gutsy call to put Brady in, because it
Speaker 2: was basically just bumping him ahead of the number two
Speaker 2: guy and giving him the reins. He plays so well
Speaker 2: that the real critical decision becomes a month and a
Speaker 2: half later, when Bledsoe's cleared to play, and under any
Speaker 2: other circumstance with any other coach, he gets his job back,
Speaker 2: but not with Belichick. And that's the moment where Bledsoe
Speaker 2: goes to Craft and I totally understand why Bledsoe did that.
Speaker 2: I remember I talked to Drew about this. I understand it.
Speaker 2: You don't have a heart if you don't understand why
Speaker 2: he wouldn't go to the owner. They were like he
Speaker 2: treated Bledsoe like a fifth son. And so he goes
Speaker 2: to Kraft and tells him how frustrated he is. He
Speaker 2: wants Robert to intervene on his behalf. And here's where
Speaker 2: you see how Robert works is he does go to
Speaker 2: see Bill, and he does talk to him, but most
Speaker 2: of the time that he's there, he's not talking. He's
Speaker 2: listening and he's hearing out Bill's perspective on the situation.
Speaker 2: And after hearing all that, then he has to decide
Speaker 2: what do I do now? And what he decides to
Speaker 2: do is nothing. And to me, this is the sign
Speaker 2: of brilliant leadership right here, because most people in his
Speaker 2: position would have been too tempted to tell Bill, first
Speaker 2: of all, I'm not paying this guy one hundred and
Speaker 2: three million dollars to hold a clipboard, you know, he's
Speaker 2: our quarterback. But he doesn't, and instead he goes to
Speaker 2: Drew and says, Drew, you know, I've talked to Bill
Speaker 2: and I've decided I'm not going to intervene. I could.
Speaker 2: I could intervene, but I don't think it would be
Speaker 2: good for you. That's a pretty incredible statement. Does Drew
Speaker 2: like it? No, he doesn't like it, but Drew accepts
Speaker 2: it or says something about Drew as well, And that
Speaker 2: is the turning point in the dynasty to me, Like,
Speaker 2: this is where it really turns, because if this had
Speaker 2: been handled differently by the owner, it could have been
Speaker 2: a very different historical role that they went down. Similarly,
Speaker 2: if Belichick didn't have the courage to stick with his gut,
Speaker 2: things would have turned out different. And then there's Tom.
Speaker 2: And the thing about Tom is I think Tom understood
Speaker 2: at a very young age the amount of risk that
Speaker 2: Bill took in placing the reins in his hand. Because
Speaker 2: if this goes south and this doesn't work and one
Speaker 2: Bill could lose his job. I mean, there's so many
Speaker 2: things that could go differently, And that's why I think
Speaker 2: that one season.
Speaker 1: Is pivotal, you know, just a quick aside, Jeff, because
Speaker 1: my guess is you've heard Robert say this, But Brian,
Speaker 1: how many times have you heard Robert publicly say I
Speaker 1: want to hire good people. I want to empower them
Speaker 1: to make decisions. They're smarter than I am, they're experts
Speaker 1: in their field. And then I want to get out
Speaker 1: of the way and I want to support them, and
Speaker 1: in essence, Jeff, that's exactly what he does there, Right,
Speaker 1: That's the quintessential moment. Basically, that isn't it?
Speaker 2: It is the I think that that one season. There's
Speaker 2: a reason that I you know, this book forty four
Speaker 2: chapters in a plus of prologue and an epilog, so
Speaker 2: technically you could say almost forty six chapters. The one
Speaker 2: season is the only season that I dedicated four chapters to.
Speaker 2: And the reason for that is because I think that
Speaker 2: single season was the most pivotal. It's the watershed year
Speaker 2: for this franchise because of the decisions that are made
Speaker 2: not on the field. These are the decisions that were
Speaker 2: made off the field by Robert, by Bill and by
Speaker 2: Tom that changed the future and not only of the team,
Speaker 2: they changed the future of the NFL. And you know,
Speaker 2: I think that all one season is it's magical in
Speaker 2: many ways.
Speaker 1: So you talked earlier about a little bit about your
Speaker 1: strategy in how you were going to get involved in
Speaker 1: this project and what was important to you and how
Speaker 1: you're going to handle it. There's obviously people that you
Speaker 1: need to talk to. You spent a considerable amount of
Speaker 1: time with the three principles. I want to know if
Speaker 1: there's a person that you had on your list that
Speaker 1: you said, oh, no, I got to interview this, and
Speaker 1: I'm just using this obviously hypothetical I got to interview
Speaker 1: Matt Smith. Well, I know I have to do it,
Speaker 1: but let's see. Was there a surprise of the people
Speaker 1: that you needed to talk to and when you did
Speaker 1: talk to them, you said, holy smokes, I didn't realize
Speaker 1: that boy, that was a real home run, and that
Speaker 1: person gave me insight that I never would have believed.
Speaker 2: Hm, I haven't thought of that. I you know, off
Speaker 2: the top of my head. I can't think of anybody
Speaker 2: that I, you know, was sort of has in or had,
Speaker 2: you know, sort of reservations about interviewing and then learned
Speaker 2: great things. What I will say, though, is there were
Speaker 2: clearly people who overwhelmed me with great information that I
Speaker 2: didn't expect, and that that happened sort of repeatedly. One
Speaker 2: of the people that for me, I would put on
Speaker 2: that list is Jonathan Kraft because he he doesn't really
Speaker 2: do interviews, you know, he doesn't talk to the press.
Speaker 2: I actually have tremendous admiration for people that don't talk
Speaker 2: to the media. And that sounds funny for a guy
Speaker 2: in the media to say that, But what I mean
Speaker 2: by that is my experience over the years is that
Speaker 2: people who don't talk to the press usually have incredible
Speaker 2: things to say, and because they never open their mouths publicly,
Speaker 2: there's like this treasure trove of insight and stories and
Speaker 2: things of that nature that are inside them. And so
Speaker 2: Steve Young was actually like that. I mean, you know,
Speaker 2: they're just full of things because they don't talk about
Speaker 2: themselves or their own accomplishments or their own experiences. And
Speaker 2: Jonathan's been there with his dad from the very beginning.
Speaker 2: He's been through all of this, and so I found
Speaker 2: that my interviews with him and the times that I
Speaker 2: had to spend with him were we're also roughly the
Speaker 2: same age. I mean, we're just a couple of years
Speaker 2: of part in age that we come from the same generation,
Speaker 2: you know, listen to the same kind of music, interested
Speaker 2: in a lot of the same things. And I found
Speaker 2: the interviews with him because I had no expectation going
Speaker 2: in other than the fact that I knew he didn't
Speaker 2: do interviews, but that's about it. And he was a
Speaker 2: fantastic person to talk to and very enlightening for me
Speaker 2: and I look as a writer, there's nothing better than
Speaker 2: coming out of an interview and feeling like you're a
Speaker 2: lot smarter than when you went in. And that's how
Speaker 2: I felt every time I talked to him, and so
Speaker 2: I would probably put him at the top of that list.
Speaker 1: Fantastic if really fascinating there.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, listen, I think Jonathan, even when you
Speaker 3: hear him speak publicly, he's.
Speaker 1: So he's so articulate. Yeah, and he's like an encyclopedia,
Speaker 1: I no question.
Speaker 3: So I want to go back to the beginning a
Speaker 3: little bit, Jeff, and I want to know what your
Speaker 3: thoughts were in learning about the Bill Parcells dynamic here
Speaker 3: and what Robert and the Crafts and Jonathan learned from
Speaker 3: that experience that maybe helped them later on.
Speaker 2: So to me, the Parcels years are, at least personally,
Speaker 2: some of the most interesting years in the dynasty. Obviously
Speaker 2: they predate Brady and they sort of predate Bill, although
Speaker 2: Belichick is part of the Parcels years in New England
Speaker 2: to a certain extent. But I think that the Parcels
Speaker 2: dynamic is just so explanatory. It's why I devoted as
Speaker 2: much time as I did in the book to Parcels.
Speaker 2: He is this looming figure in Foxborough. He's on the
Speaker 2: ground before Robert buys the team, because Orthwine brings him
Speaker 2: in a year before he sells the team to the Crafts.
Speaker 2: So you have this figure who is like big in stature. Physically,
Speaker 2: he is a big man to begin with, but he's
Speaker 2: a big figure in the league because of what he'd
Speaker 2: done in New York. And I think that there's also
Speaker 2: this sort of beautiful dichotomy with him, is that Parcells
Speaker 2: represents the old guard of the NFL. Craft is the
Speaker 2: new guard. I mean, Robert Craft buys the team right
Speaker 2: as the NFL is making this enormous transition to parody.
Speaker 2: And it's happening because of the introduction of two brand
Speaker 2: new things, free agency and the salary cap, neither of
Speaker 2: which Bill Parcells has ever had to coach with, because
Speaker 2: in all his years in New York, they didn't have
Speaker 2: either of those things. And so these are new concepts
Speaker 2: to an old coach, but for a new owner it's like, Okay,
Speaker 2: this is the new league. And I think that the
Speaker 2: Robert and Jonathan Kraft and Andy wasenchuck they were all
Speaker 2: about taking advantage of these new sort of the new
Speaker 2: lay of the land. And so you actually had a
Speaker 2: built in conflict before the marriage even started between Craft
Speaker 2: and Parcels because they're looking at it differently. It's like
Speaker 2: Bill is looking at it from the way it used
Speaker 2: to be and Robert's looking at it from the way
Speaker 2: it's going to be. And that, to me is where
Speaker 2: it starts. When I say it, I mean the friction.
Speaker 2: And that friction is evident from the very first time
Speaker 2: that Parcells calls Craft, which is like the night after
Speaker 2: he buys the team and tells him he wants to
Speaker 2: spend ten million dollars to resign Bruce Armstrong as a
Speaker 2: free agent, and right away there are questions about whether
Speaker 2: that's a good idea. And so I found the Parcels
Speaker 2: part it's really important. It's it's also entertaining, I will say,
Speaker 2: as a writer, because you have great drama there. You
Speaker 2: have yelling, shouting and disagreements, and you have the Will
Speaker 2: McDonough angle because Will has a great relationship with Robert,
Speaker 2: but he also has this relationship with Parcels. That becomes
Speaker 2: a triangles never work in relationships, and that one didn't work.
Speaker 2: So there's a lot there, And then I would say this, finally,
Speaker 2: let's face it, Parcells has a lot to do with
Speaker 2: why Bill Belichick gets on Robert Craft's radar, because it's
Speaker 2: Parcels who goes to Robert after Roberts on the team
Speaker 2: for a couple of years and they're not getting along well,
Speaker 2: and Parcels is trying to talk Craft into trying to
Speaker 2: talk Belichick into coming to New England as an assistant coach.
Speaker 2: And no one could have imagined at that point, certainly
Speaker 2: not Parcels, that where that would ultimately lead is to
Speaker 2: where it did.
Speaker 1: Unbelievable. It's great symmetry there, Jeff. It really is. Sales
Speaker 1: are one item as far as selling books and everything
Speaker 1: like that. And I'm not trying to dismiss the importance
Speaker 1: of that, Jeff. But with such a big project here,
Speaker 1: one that's been so highly publicized and has gotten a
Speaker 1: lot of interest, how would you gauge what the reaction
Speaker 1: has been? You know, you're in a community with writers
Speaker 1: and media, and you know, you talk about how much
Speaker 1: help you got from different people and reading different books.
Speaker 1: What would you say the reaction has been to this
Speaker 1: piece of work?
Speaker 2: I mean in New eng if you're asking specifically about
Speaker 2: sports journalists in New England, I mean, honestly, I do
Speaker 2: care a lot about what people like Michael Holly or
Speaker 2: Tom Curran, guys like that think about the book because
Speaker 2: they've been in the trenches all these years covering this team,
Speaker 2: and so their reaction does matter to me. Plus, I
Speaker 2: just have tremendous respect for them and their work, and
Speaker 2: I was and I've told them this, so I'm not
Speaker 2: telling you anything I haven't said to them, but it
Speaker 2: meant a lot to me to see the way that
Speaker 2: they responded to the book after reading it. Both of
Speaker 2: them were kind enough to call me on the phone
Speaker 2: and tell me what they thought and then say things
Speaker 2: publicly that you know, we're humbling to be honest with you.
Speaker 2: As far as the New England fans, I mean that
Speaker 2: really mattered a lot to me because I am a
Speaker 2: New Englander. And so I thought to myself as I
Speaker 2: went into this project, I don't know the Patriots, I
Speaker 2: don't know the Crafts. I don't know Tom Brady, I
Speaker 2: don't know Drew Bloodsoe. I don't know any of these guys.
Speaker 2: But the one thing I do know is I think
Speaker 2: I know my audience because I am part of that audience.
Speaker 2: You know, I know how people in New England are.
Speaker 2: I know how we feel about our sports teams. I
Speaker 2: know that in this part of the country, our sports
Speaker 2: teams can in many cases become a substitute for religion.
Speaker 2: That's how serious we take it, and that's how invested
Speaker 2: we get emotionally. Like our families grow up with these teams.
Speaker 2: They become part of the dinner table conversation. It's who
Speaker 2: we are. And so I felt like I understood that audience.
Speaker 2: And so does it matter to me how they feel
Speaker 2: about the book? You bet it does. It matters a lot.
Speaker 2: It matters more to me than what Jets fans or
Speaker 2: Steelers fans or Cowboys fans think. And I think that
Speaker 2: that reaction because I've just heard from so many New
Speaker 2: England people who are total strangers to me, but they
Speaker 2: can get to me through social media or other ways.
Speaker 2: And I've just heard from I mean, I can't tell
Speaker 2: you the number. It's just been a lot. And to
Speaker 2: have people say things like, you know, I grew up
Speaker 2: with his team. My dad and I have had season
Speaker 2: tickets for twenty five years and reading the book made
Speaker 2: me feel like I was back there with my dad.
Speaker 2: That's a great thing to hear as a writer. So
Speaker 2: it's been a good experience for me. I've been just
Speaker 2: you know, it's been good for my family too. My
Speaker 2: family doesn't care about football, my wife and kids, but
Speaker 2: they got pretty invested in this project.
Speaker 1: Well, I can tell you that.
Speaker 3: I mean, I sent you a message privately, but I
Speaker 3: got very emotional at times during it. I mean the
Speaker 3: Myra section I outright cried. There were other parts of
Speaker 3: it that weren't related to that that I just got
Speaker 3: very emotional about. I thought it was terrific and I
Speaker 3: really enjoyed it.
Speaker 1: Jeff, thank you.
Speaker 2: I'm not embarrassed to admit this. I got emotional writing it.
Speaker 2: There were parts I'm sitting in my office right now
Speaker 2: where I wrote the book. I wrote the whole book
Speaker 2: right at the desk I'm sitting at right now. And
Speaker 2: there were multiple times through this process where my emotions
Speaker 2: got the better of me. As I was writing these
Speaker 2: passages when I was in the hospital room with Drew Bledsoe,
Speaker 2: or when I was, you know, in the in Tom
Speaker 2: Brady's apartment hours after he blew his knee out. And
Speaker 2: Robert and Myra show up, and Giselle's there, and Tom's
Speaker 2: in bed with tears in his eyes. I mean, there
Speaker 2: are many places in this story where I felt what
Speaker 2: I was writing, and my whole goal was to try
Speaker 2: to get the readers to be able to feel, you know,
Speaker 2: feel what I was feeling writing about it, because it
Speaker 2: is an emotional story.
Speaker 1: You Okay, so you're talking about that. You're in the
Speaker 1: office where you wrote this, true or false? Were you
Speaker 1: listening to Abbey Road when you were writing the part
Speaker 1: about Brady leaving?
Speaker 2: I was.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's heavy, that's heavy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's heavy. It is. It was a Sunday morning.
Speaker 2: I remember it well. I had. I had drafted the
Speaker 2: trap that scene pretty well, but it was now time
Speaker 2: to really put the polish on it. And I sat
Speaker 2: at my desk Sunday morning, sun up, early, nice and quiet,
Speaker 2: put on Abbey Road and started writing. And I replayed
Speaker 2: it a couple of times, particularly the sort of trilogy
Speaker 2: of songs at the end, because I was writing the
Speaker 2: end and that music for me and everybody's different, but
Speaker 2: for me in this medium, which is the literary medium,
Speaker 2: is a medium you can't see. It's not a film.
Speaker 2: It's not a play, it's not a television show. It's
Speaker 2: the written word. And so ultimately, what you're trying to do,
Speaker 2: or what I'm trying to do, is I'm trying to
Speaker 2: give the reader an experience that's graphic enough that they
Speaker 2: feel like they can see it. And for me, listening
Speaker 2: to music helps me do that better. And in this case,
Speaker 2: Abbey Road was perfect because I was making the analogy
Speaker 2: for that sort of being the end for this relationationship,
Speaker 2: and so I did listen to it, and when it
Speaker 2: was over, I mean I just I sat in this
Speaker 2: chair and had a long, long, just quiet sort of
Speaker 2: like wow, that's the end.
Speaker 1: Unbelievable. I mean, Jeff, you said this about Jonathan, and
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to blow smoke at you here, but
Speaker 1: I've had the privilege of being in your company a
Speaker 1: couple of times, and I always feel smarter after talking
Speaker 1: with you. I mean, I always feel smarter. I always
Speaker 1: learned something. There's a lot of room for growth though. Okay,
Speaker 1: but just to just sort of wrap this up, you
Speaker 1: talked about legacy mattering, and I will say this, Jeff,
Speaker 1: if I'm ever fortunate enough to have grandchildren and people
Speaker 1: want to talk about what is the definitive piece of
Speaker 1: work that you would direct somebody to to describe the
Speaker 1: Patriots Dynasty. We're talking about this book. It's the dynasty.
Speaker 1: You have created the definitive piece and that when you
Speaker 1: talk about Robert, that's the legacy that matters, isn't it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that that that legacy I just felt.
Speaker 2: So that was a thought that was on my mind
Speaker 2: throughout this process. I was very perceptive to that and
Speaker 2: the idea that I was I was getting an opportunity
Speaker 2: here to write a really unique, a uniquely American story
Speaker 2: that took place in my favorite part of the country,
Speaker 2: in New England. It happened here. And yes, at its
Speaker 2: core it is a football story because it's about a
Speaker 2: football team, but it's about so much more than that. Absolutely,
Speaker 2: it really is.
Speaker 3: His name is Jeff a whole family dynamic. Yeah, no question,
Speaker 3: that was that was emotional. I mean it really was.
Speaker 1: His name is Jeff Benedict. The book is called The Dynasty.
Speaker 1: Whether you're a Patriots fan, a sports fan, a fan
Speaker 1: of the human race, a fan of family, as Brian
Speaker 1: likes to say, you must read this book if you
Speaker 1: already have Jeff congratulations on a tremendous piece of work,
Speaker 1: and thank you so much for your time today.
Speaker 2: Thank you, guys, it is really your privilege.
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