1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:03,680 Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here, 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,280 Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of 3 00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:08,559 Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election. 4 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade 5 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about, 7 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: it just means the absolute world to have your support. 8 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:38,559 Speaker 1: But enough with that, let's get to the show. Hello, everybody, 9 00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:42,440 Speaker 1: breaking an extraordinary news right now. President Donald J. Trump, 10 00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 1: former President of the United States. Attorney Susan Nechls has 11 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:51,360 Speaker 1: now confirmed that President Trump was indicted today in New 12 00:00:51,440 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 1: York by Manhattan DA. They have not yet told us 13 00:00:56,360 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: exactly what the charge is, although we can likely surmise 14 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:02,760 Speaker 1: that it involves the hush pun money payment made to 15 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:05,720 Speaker 1: Stormy Daniels of one hundred and thirty thousand dollars. So 16 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:07,800 Speaker 1: we'll first put the breaking news up there on the screen. 17 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:10,160 Speaker 1: It was first reported by the New York Times, quickly 18 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:12,960 Speaker 1: confirmed by all media outlets as well as President Trump's 19 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:15,760 Speaker 1: legal team. Now let's go to the second one here. 20 00:01:15,880 --> 00:01:18,679 Speaker 1: What exactly is all of this and what's going on 21 00:01:19,040 --> 00:01:21,200 Speaker 1: for those who are just joining us as to why 22 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,080 Speaker 1: such an indictment might have even happened. All of it 23 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:27,000 Speaker 1: comes back to the one hundred and thirty thousand dollars 24 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:30,839 Speaker 1: hush money payment made from Donald Trump and his lawyer 25 00:01:30,959 --> 00:01:34,600 Speaker 1: Michael Cohen to Stormy Daniels to cover up an alleged 26 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 1: tryst between the two of them in two thousand and 27 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 1: six that happened in Lake Tahoe. So you can go 28 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 1: and read the details of that if you're interested elsewhere. 29 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:45,479 Speaker 1: I'm not going to get into it. But effectively, all 30 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 1: of this came to light in twenty and eighteen in 31 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 1: a felony case against Michael Cohen in which federal prosecutors 32 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: alleged that that one hundred and thirty thousand dollars payment 33 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: was illegally recorded as a personal payment from the Trump 34 00:02:00,080 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 1: organization to Michael Cohen for legal services, when it might 35 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 1: have had instead to do with the campaign finance violation. Basically, 36 00:02:07,600 --> 00:02:09,960 Speaker 1: the allegation was that the only reason that they were 37 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: paying this one hundred and thirty thousand dollars was not 38 00:02:12,440 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: for the personal embarrassment that Trump would have suffered, but 39 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:18,720 Speaker 1: because it would have damaged it twenty sixteen campaign. Thus, 40 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:21,560 Speaker 1: they should have recorded it properly. Cohen pled guilty to 41 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:25,120 Speaker 1: that charge, but ultimately no charge was actually brought against Trump. 42 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,080 Speaker 1: Now how does that relate to New York state law. Well, 43 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: let's take a step back and realize that the actual 44 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:34,639 Speaker 1: charge here is not only do we know that Trump 45 00:02:34,720 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 1: was indicted in the Manhattan by the Manhattan Grand jury, 46 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: but also he was indicted with the felony. So what 47 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:43,680 Speaker 1: does that mean. Now, the only real charge here that 48 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:46,000 Speaker 1: makes sense. We don't have a confirmation of this, but 49 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:51,799 Speaker 1: peer speculation out is a falsifying business wreckers or felony 50 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 1: bookkeeping fraud under Article one seventy five of the New 51 00:02:55,440 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: York Penal Law. Now, a conviction for felony bookkeeping fraud 52 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:00,400 Speaker 1: in the state of New York carries a sentence of 53 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: up to four years. But to prove that it's actually 54 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:05,240 Speaker 1: going to be pretty difficult. So what do they have 55 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:08,559 Speaker 1: to prove to be a felony rather than a misdemeanor. 56 00:03:08,720 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 1: Prosecutors have to show Trump falsified the business records with 57 00:03:12,480 --> 00:03:16,120 Speaker 1: the intention of committing, aiding, or concealing a second crime. 58 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:20,280 Speaker 1: So then we have to ask what was the second crime. Well, 59 00:03:20,360 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 1: they are thinking of invoking that alleged campaign finance violation 60 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 1: that I already described. The problem is is that federal 61 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: election law is by definition going to be governed by 62 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:36,600 Speaker 1: federal law. So since that second crime was never actually convicted, 63 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:39,440 Speaker 1: and it's not even a state campaign law technically that 64 00:03:39,480 --> 00:03:41,680 Speaker 1: Trump would have violated, then how is he going to 65 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: prove felony? Now, again, it was enough to convince a 66 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 1: grand jury, so maybe it's possible. It's you know, maybe 67 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:50,680 Speaker 1: he has non publican evidence of some other intended offense 68 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:54,040 Speaker 1: that is around this, like if there was any intention 69 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,120 Speaker 1: to deduct the payments as a business expense on the 70 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 1: state tax return. That also could be one that they 71 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 1: were looking for bookkeeping fraud itself as a two year 72 00:04:03,280 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 1: statue of limitations misdemeanor, and the statute of limitations also 73 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 1: expires after five years, including taking into consideration the time 74 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 1: that Trump went out of state. So overall, that's basically 75 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 1: from the people that we've spoken to the lawyer that 76 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: we had on our show, Brad Moss, to discuss this 77 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:23,919 Speaker 1: novel theory of the case never been tried before in 78 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 1: New York before a judge, so very quickly we know 79 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:29,479 Speaker 1: that Trump himself will easily be able to contest some 80 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 1: of this far before it gets to trial. Even if 81 00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: it does so, it's very possible that a judge could 82 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,120 Speaker 1: throw it out. Now, in terms of also the optics, 83 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: now here's what we know they're going to by the 84 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:46,320 Speaker 1: time that they release the Act, by the time they 85 00:04:46,400 --> 00:04:50,280 Speaker 1: released the indictment before the public, they will have not 86 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:53,919 Speaker 1: only notified the lawyer, they will have negotiated some sort 87 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,920 Speaker 1: of either surrender or release or you know, it also 88 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:00,440 Speaker 1: sets up politically here will there be a standoff, will 89 00:05:00,480 --> 00:05:03,840 Speaker 1: he refuse to be extradited? What will Ron DeSantis say? 90 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:07,599 Speaker 1: What will all of President Trump's quote unquote opponents in 91 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:12,279 Speaker 1: the race say about this indictment? And then politically, I mean, 92 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 1: it's just extraordinary, which he's a former president of the 93 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 1: United States, He's now been indicted in the state of 94 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,080 Speaker 1: New York. What is the major Democratic party going to say? 95 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 1: What are the Fulton County Grand Jury? How will it 96 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: impact all these federal investigations. So there's a myriad of 97 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 1: different things. Also, you know, do have to say that 98 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,239 Speaker 1: clearly there seems to have been some sort of scheduling 99 00:05:30,320 --> 00:05:33,160 Speaker 1: fake out because the schedule originally was not known to 100 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:36,359 Speaker 1: the press. Not only that they had told everybody that 101 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:39,280 Speaker 1: they were disbanding for an entire month and going out 102 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:41,320 Speaker 1: of town, leaving a lot of them, including us you 103 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:43,960 Speaker 1: know this morning talking about how it seemed that they 104 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:46,680 Speaker 1: may be skipping town. But it seems that, you know, 105 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 1: this was all done in secret. Possibly the feint was 106 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:51,760 Speaker 1: to fake out everybody to think that they had gone 107 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:53,839 Speaker 1: home and they weren't going to be doing anything before 108 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:58,440 Speaker 1: they ultimately did so. Look an absolutely absolutely extraordinary act. 109 00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 1: Here done my best to synthesize both what happened, why 110 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: it happened, the potential impact, the politics, and all of that. 111 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:08,240 Speaker 1: Let's all just take a step back and see what 112 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:11,839 Speaker 1: extraordinary actions come in the coming days. But history is 113 00:06:11,839 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: being made right before our eyes, and I guess things 114 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:16,680 Speaker 1: are just going to get interesting. Thank you all to 115 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:20,200 Speaker 1: our premium subscribers who are signing up at Breakingpoints dot com, 116 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:22,479 Speaker 1: watching the full video on Spotify and all that. We 117 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 1: love you all. Thank you for making it so that 118 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:26,880 Speaker 1: me and the staff can get these things turned around 119 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,480 Speaker 1: very quickly. For breaking news videos and we'll continue to 120 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:35,280 Speaker 1: keep you guys updated. Thanks. Lots of discussion around COVID 121 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:37,720 Speaker 1: and profiteering some of it on the drug companies, and 122 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 1: they certainly did make billions and billions of dollars, but 123 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: they're not the only ones who profited. New Forms magazine piece. 124 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:44,760 Speaker 1: Let's go and put this up there on the screen. 125 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:49,200 Speaker 1: Meet the forty billionaires who got rich fighting COVID nineteen. 126 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 1: Fighting is one way to put it. Certainly, a lot 127 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,760 Speaker 1: of these people are just Chinese, and many of them 128 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 1: are consumer products manufacturers who quote made billions of masks 129 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:03,440 Speaker 1: and millions millions of protective overalls and gowns for healthcare workers. 130 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:05,839 Speaker 1: We should remember that one of the problems with personal 131 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:08,599 Speaker 1: protective equipment the PPE in the early days that we 132 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: didn't know how to manufacture any of it. So it's great, actually, Crystal, 133 00:07:11,880 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 1: we created multiple Chinese billionaires who made them for us 134 00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 1: while we bought them instead of manufacturing themselves. Glad at 135 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 1: least they got made somewhere. Yeah. Cool, that really worked 136 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 1: out well for us. Not a surprise that the CEOs 137 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 1: and several executives at Maderna, at Pfizer, and at Biotech 138 00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 1: all became billionaires off of the COVID nineteen vaccine. But 139 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: really what stuns me is it's like, look, we've talked 140 00:07:36,280 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: a lot about the pharmaceutical companies that have made billions, 141 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 1: but really what came away from this was every single 142 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 1: person who became a billionaire fighting COVID from a from 143 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 1: a supply perspective, and from a health technology perspective. Not 144 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:53,560 Speaker 1: one of them lived in the United States. Every single 145 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 1: one was in China. COVID nineteen test manufacturer China, Medical 146 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:01,960 Speaker 1: equipment China, Personal protective Equipment China. And first of all, 147 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:04,200 Speaker 1: there's no such thing as a real billionaire in China. Okay, 148 00:08:04,200 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 1: they're one of those where the CCP is like, yeah, 149 00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: you're allowed to become a billionaire in this category, and 150 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 1: you got to cough up and do whatever we tell you. 151 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 1: But second, I'm like, why do we not do any 152 00:08:12,560 --> 00:08:15,160 Speaker 1: of this ourselves? You know? It's every let me read 153 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 1: you this one that health it the founder of the 154 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: healthcare tech firm, which uses AI and big data to 155 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:24,680 Speaker 1: help cities conduct contract tracing and coordinate China. It's like, 156 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,840 Speaker 1: in every case, even in the pharmaceutical many of these 157 00:08:27,840 --> 00:08:31,720 Speaker 1: people came from China. From the inputs into the vaccines itself. 158 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:35,720 Speaker 1: Do we just make nothing anymore? Like? Not one person 159 00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: on this list from the US had anything to do 160 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:42,640 Speaker 1: with manufacturing. It was only with respect to biotech from 161 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:45,600 Speaker 1: the Pfizer vaccine. That's all we apparently are good at 162 00:08:45,840 --> 00:08:48,880 Speaker 1: is using government backed resources to make a vaccine that 163 00:08:48,880 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 1: they didn't even use. Yeah, or sorry that they didn't 164 00:08:51,480 --> 00:08:54,480 Speaker 1: even make. They didn't even do any of the research, right, 165 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: I mean, I have to say things like this make 166 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: me more and more radicalized of the number of industry 167 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: that should just be like straight up nationalized or at 168 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,320 Speaker 1: least a very heavy government involvement. But yeah, I mean, 169 00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:09,199 Speaker 1: especially if you look at the vaccines, how much was 170 00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: the government involved and did a good job spinning things 171 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:15,280 Speaker 1: up quickly. But then it's you know, we do we 172 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 1: fund all the research and not just in that moment, 173 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,440 Speaker 1: but over years, and then all the profit goes to 174 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:25,280 Speaker 1: these like new billionaires. And then yeah, because we have 175 00:09:25,600 --> 00:09:30,200 Speaker 1: stripped our manufacturing base over decades, when we have a 176 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: crisis such as this, and it's like, oh, we need 177 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:37,560 Speaker 1: masks for our frontline caregivers, and we need other ppe, 178 00:09:37,760 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: and we need these ingredients to make these vaccines, and 179 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:42,880 Speaker 1: we need, you know, to have capability to spit it up. 180 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: We just don't have it. It just isn't there, so 181 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 1: there's no other choice, and so you become completely dependent 182 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: on a country that you know, like it or not. 183 00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:57,720 Speaker 1: We increasingly have an adversarial relationship with not a great 184 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 1: state of affairs. So it it was really really exposed 185 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: just how incredibly vulnerable we have made ourselves on every 186 00:10:06,600 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: front by not valuing the basic capacity to make things 187 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 1: that are essential for daily survival at this point. Yeah, no, 188 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:18,200 Speaker 1: it's just totally ridiculous. Like reading this, I did that 189 00:10:18,240 --> 00:10:20,760 Speaker 1: monologue recently about how to become a billionaire in America, 190 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:22,320 Speaker 1: and the point that I made was in the third 191 00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 1: world countries that what they were not basically second world 192 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,640 Speaker 1: at this point, they become billionaires off of building things. 193 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:33,800 Speaker 1: We are billionaires off financialization and you know, biotech, which 194 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,040 Speaker 1: is basically using government backed research to manufacturer and then 195 00:10:37,080 --> 00:10:39,320 Speaker 1: get legal monopoly with immunity and all of that from 196 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:41,959 Speaker 1: the government. To become a billionaire, tell me which one 197 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: you prefer, Like, how do you want your people to 198 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,400 Speaker 1: actually get rich, Because they all got rich by producing 199 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:51,480 Speaker 1: stuff in labs, building things in manufacture facilities and shipping 200 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: and doing business and hard assets. We don't have any 201 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,360 Speaker 1: of that. It's all conceptual. It's all just like moving 202 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 1: money around in a new exotic way, right. Yeah. And 203 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:02,560 Speaker 1: the Indians too in same thing, manufacturing, manufacturing, manufacturing and 204 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 1: all their generic drug makers and all of that which 205 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:07,800 Speaker 1: deliver an actually cheap product to their billion citizens. You know, 206 00:11:07,840 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: that's how you really should be able to deliver value. 207 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:12,920 Speaker 1: None of what we are our people. Every person on 208 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:15,840 Speaker 1: our list is just some biotech manufacturer or sorry, some 209 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 1: biotech executive involved in the vaccine process itself. You tell 210 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:23,400 Speaker 1: me what you want. Absolutely fascinating development with Elon Musk, 211 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,040 Speaker 1: Steve Wozniak and a number of other tech leaders coming 212 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:29,040 Speaker 1: out and saying we need a moratorium right now on 213 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:31,280 Speaker 1: AI development. So let's go and put this up there 214 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: on the screen, the open letter, which was distributed with 215 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:38,240 Speaker 1: about eleven hundred signatories. To be clear, you know, some 216 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 1: people dispute that they didn't understand what they were signing, 217 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:44,800 Speaker 1: but Elon and Steve Wozniak's signatures are not in dispute 218 00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 1: here at all. Say that technology companies need to cease 219 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:50,719 Speaker 1: AI training systems that would be more powerful than the 220 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: latest large language processing system, not as GPT four. So 221 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,360 Speaker 1: AI power, they say, tends to correlate with the model 222 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: size and the number of specialized computer chips that are 223 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 1: needed to train it. They're outspoken in their concerns about 224 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 1: AI as a threat to humanity. And really what it 225 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 1: comes back to is that we shouldn't forget that Elon 226 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 1: was actually an original founder of open ai and decided 227 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,959 Speaker 1: to leave the organization because he didn't think that they 228 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 1: were developing in the right direction. Since then, he has 229 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,280 Speaker 1: actually warned about censorship within the AI open ai chatch 230 00:12:20,280 --> 00:12:23,559 Speaker 1: ept platform and what he's been pointing to. The reason 231 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:25,719 Speaker 1: I found this really interesting is this is a big 232 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:28,280 Speaker 1: split in technology right now. A lot of people are 233 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,520 Speaker 1: i wouldn't say AI purists, or they're excited about the 234 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:34,160 Speaker 1: developments of AI. They're excited about the computational and you 235 00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: can't help but be. But then there are others, you know, 236 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:38,680 Speaker 1: more visionary founders, people like him and others who have 237 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:40,760 Speaker 1: been warning about what some of the dangers are and 238 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,120 Speaker 1: they say, hey, we need to develop rules around this, 239 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: We need to develop some sort of protocol about how 240 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:49,040 Speaker 1: we would approach these very tricky political questions. I'm not 241 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,200 Speaker 1: sure where I fall. I'm curious what you think, like 242 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:53,760 Speaker 1: if you think about the original development of social media 243 00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:56,040 Speaker 1: because nobody knew how it was, what it was going 244 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:58,560 Speaker 1: to do. We didn't have preset rules around the First 245 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:01,679 Speaker 1: Amendment or other principles, but set us up for disasters 246 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:04,160 Speaker 1: in the future, right, So maybe it would make sense like, Hey, 247 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 1: we're in the burgeoning stages. Let's set the agreed upon 248 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:09,720 Speaker 1: thing and let's not deviate from it for when the 249 00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,560 Speaker 1: inevitability comes. They're like, look, this is the standard. This 250 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: is what we've all agreed upon. I tend to be 251 00:13:14,559 --> 00:13:16,959 Speaker 1: sympathetic to the idea of, hey, let's have a pause 252 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,440 Speaker 1: and figure out what the hell this means, because this 253 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 1: is unfolding incredibly quickly, and the ramifications of it are 254 00:13:23,640 --> 00:13:27,439 Speaker 1: far reaching in terms of the labor market, in terms 255 00:13:27,520 --> 00:13:31,080 Speaker 1: of like information distribution, in terms of things that we 256 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:34,560 Speaker 1: aren't in terms of newscapt like everything. This is a 257 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 1: small example, but there's just recently this picture of the 258 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,439 Speaker 1: pope that went y had like a puffy jacket on fun. 259 00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 1: Everyone thought this thing was real. Oh really, Oh I 260 00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 1: didn't know that. It was initial to me fake Initially, 261 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 1: like this thing was widespread and it looks super real 262 00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: and obviously it's minor and of no consequence, but it 263 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: shows you were already at that level where there can 264 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:00,800 Speaker 1: be you know, pictures, images, videos, information that goes down 265 00:14:00,920 --> 00:14:04,079 Speaker 1: that is wildly inaccurate, that gets taken up and consumed 266 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: really quickly. Again, this is a small example. I thought 267 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:12,559 Speaker 1: one piece of Elon's concern about the direction of open 268 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:14,719 Speaker 1: ai actually did a monologue on this and I thought 269 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 1: was really well founded, which is like he says, when 270 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 1: I signed up to be co founder of open ai, 271 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:24,680 Speaker 1: the idea was open like open to the public, transparent, 272 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 1: open source, and now in nonprofit. Now they've sold this 273 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: off to Microsoft to use it to you know, profit them, 274 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: probably at the expense of everybody else, because that's the 275 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:40,000 Speaker 1: way that these developments mostly work. We saw from the 276 00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:42,600 Speaker 1: TikTok hearings. We may love to live in a world 277 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 1: where our legislators are like really super on it and 278 00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: with it about what this is and what it means 279 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 1: and how to regulate and wrap their arms around it. 280 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: But we all know that that is not the case. 281 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 1: So the idea of not saying, all right, we got 282 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:56,480 Speaker 1: to shut this down, but let's have a pause, let's 283 00:14:56,760 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 1: think about what this means, let's think about where this 284 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:02,840 Speaker 1: is going, and let's be intentional about it from the beginning. 285 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 1: Given how fast this is all developing. To me, I'm 286 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 1: very sympathetic to that poside, right, I am as well. 287 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: I also just don't know if it's going to be private. 288 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 1: At the look the name of technology that people were like, hey, 289 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: let's hit pause on this. It never happens, like unless 290 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:18,400 Speaker 1: the government comes in and is like, listen, this is 291 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:20,920 Speaker 1: the way it's going to be. Voluntarily, somebody will just 292 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 1: depart from the consensus and then they'll get all of 293 00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: the benefits. So it's kind of a prisoner's dilemma. Yeah, Honestly, 294 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 1: I just think it's going to happen regardless. I'm not 295 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: sure that if there's anything that we can do about it. 296 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 1: By the way, I don't even believe some of the 297 00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:33,200 Speaker 1: hype around it. They're like, oh, it's going to replace 298 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 1: all white collar work. I'm like, maybe some you know, 299 00:15:35,480 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 1: maybe something. But my point is we'll see, Like we 300 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 1: should have also some hubris about how much technology or 301 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 1: this type of technology actually can fully replace some things. 302 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:47,920 Speaker 1: It can automate a lot, and I think that's great. 303 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:50,280 Speaker 1: You know. I saw one example of somebody put in 304 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:52,840 Speaker 1: their blood work and open AI was a chat GPT 305 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:55,200 Speaker 1: was better than their doctor. I'm like, okay, that's great, 306 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: but like that's not the reason that people go to 307 00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:58,400 Speaker 1: the doctor, you know what I mean, Like they're not 308 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 1: going to be able to like sit there and so 309 00:16:00,360 --> 00:16:02,760 Speaker 1: open your eye. Maybe maybe we can get to that, 310 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:04,640 Speaker 1: but there's still a lot of finesse in things that 311 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:07,560 Speaker 1: still that you're going to require at least some human input, 312 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,920 Speaker 1: like the raw input output like a for example, like 313 00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: a diagnosis is very different from like emotional therapy or 314 00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: you know, many of the other things that people even 315 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 1: go to the doctor use medicine in the first place. 316 00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: So that's part of what Kevin Russe, yeah, talks about 317 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 1: the type reporter for the New York Times who wrote 318 00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,840 Speaker 1: a book about where some of this is going right, 319 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 1: and he said, you know, it's easy to discount how 320 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:35,480 Speaker 1: much we sort of have a bias towards humanity. Where 321 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:37,920 Speaker 1: how are you going to feel about, for example, like 322 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:40,920 Speaker 1: a work of art that you know was crafted by 323 00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 1: human with all of their complex emotions and backstory and 324 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 1: all of that, versus something that was spit out by AI. 325 00:16:49,440 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 1: You're not going to have perhaps the same emotional reaction 326 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:54,960 Speaker 1: to those things. That's one example. The other example is like, 327 00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 1: you know, we talked to Starbucks, Barisis who are organizing. 328 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 1: Sometimes I could certainly imagine a coffee shop where everything 329 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:05,439 Speaker 1: was automated. You punch in your thing, it does your 330 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,840 Speaker 1: order whatever. But in reality, that's not the whole reason. 331 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 1: People are not just going to their favorite coffee shop 332 00:17:11,600 --> 00:17:14,080 Speaker 1: because they like the coffee. That's part of it. Part 333 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:16,199 Speaker 1: of it is you like that little exchange with the 334 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: person that you see every morning, and being in the 335 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 1: line with the other people who are going through their 336 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 1: routine as well, Like the humanity of it is part 337 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:26,199 Speaker 1: of what you were buying in that experience. And so 338 00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:28,920 Speaker 1: I agree with you that perhaps some of the most 339 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,359 Speaker 1: maximus claims about what this means in the short term 340 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 1: I am also skeptical of. But I'm also open to 341 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:36,920 Speaker 1: the idea that even some of the small changes, like 342 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:39,280 Speaker 1: for example, in the news business, could in and of 343 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 1: themselves be tranching. Yeah, we can still acknowledge titanic change. Well, 344 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 1: also being like, hey, let's not take it too far. 345 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I always use example, but you know, self 346 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:50,879 Speaker 1: driving is a good example. So like, for example, if 347 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: you've ever in a Tesla and they're on full self 348 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 1: driving and you're exiting off of the highway right, well, 349 00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:58,720 Speaker 1: it will slow down to like thirty miles per hour 350 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 1: on the ramp. Who actually goes thirty miles an hour? Nobody? 351 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,320 Speaker 1: And actually, whenever it fully slows down, you're now a 352 00:18:05,440 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: danger to everybody in traffic because the flow of the 353 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:11,760 Speaker 1: flow of traffic is seventy not thirty. But technically it's 354 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:13,000 Speaker 1: like we got to go to the speed and then 355 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:15,439 Speaker 1: you manually will have to change it back up. It's 356 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 1: actually pretty weird. And or you know, when you turn left, 357 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,760 Speaker 1: who actually makes a right angle left turn? Everybody cuts 358 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 1: the line right, but the AI doesn't want to cut 359 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,360 Speaker 1: the line because that's against the rules. Or if you're 360 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:29,359 Speaker 1: in a tunnel and there's like there's like green lights 361 00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:31,760 Speaker 1: or whatever, they'll be like, oh, it's emergency light. They 362 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:34,440 Speaker 1: are all these little things and you're like, oh okay, 363 00:18:34,520 --> 00:18:37,040 Speaker 1: Like there's a reason that humans, you know, humans drive 364 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:39,720 Speaker 1: like we drive very differently. Technically the speed limit is 365 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:42,560 Speaker 1: this what idiot goes to speed limit when the flow 366 00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:44,359 Speaker 1: of traffic is sixty five miles an hour and a 367 00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:48,160 Speaker 1: forty mile zone. That's the perfect thing that you computing 368 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 1: that or like changing that that's very, very difficult to solve. Yeah, 369 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:54,399 Speaker 1: I just don't see it yet. Yeah, I agree with that. 370 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 1: So anyway, we'll keep looking at it because it is 371 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:00,440 Speaker 1: a fascinating debate. Low glimpse into our future. Sure, there 372 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:05,720 Speaker 1: you go. Joining me now is my old friend Amber Athey. 373 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:08,119 Speaker 1: She's the Washington editor at The Spectator, and she's the 374 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: author of a new book, Let's go and put it 375 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:13,240 Speaker 1: up there on the screen, The Snowflakes Revolt, How woke 376 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 1: Millennials hijacked American media. Amber's an old friend of mine, 377 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:18,960 Speaker 1: as I said, and then also a former member of 378 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:22,720 Speaker 1: the White House Correspondent, and she witnessed both of us 379 00:19:22,800 --> 00:19:26,040 Speaker 1: some interesting shenanigans inside the press briefing room at the 380 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 1: time that I thought the audience would be interested in. 381 00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: So welcome to the show. Amber, It's good to see you. Yeah, 382 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,320 Speaker 1: it's good to see you two Saga. Thanks for having me. Yes, 383 00:19:33,359 --> 00:19:35,159 Speaker 1: all right, So let's dig into a little bit. We 384 00:19:35,400 --> 00:19:38,000 Speaker 1: were talking a little bit before about the WHCA and 385 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:40,199 Speaker 1: what we can get into how the entire system is 386 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:42,720 Speaker 1: rigged something our audience is really interested in. What do 387 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:44,199 Speaker 1: you talk about in the book and what did you 388 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:48,680 Speaker 1: witness there that you saw. Yeah. Absolutely, I'm actually still 389 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 1: a member of the WHTA. Believe it or not. They 390 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,840 Speaker 1: haven't provoked my credentials yet. I know. It's truly amazing. 391 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,280 Speaker 1: But what we uncovered, and you know what I write 392 00:19:57,280 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 1: about in the book, is the fact that the entire 393 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:03,920 Speaker 1: system of the WHDA is set up to benefit establishment 394 00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:06,760 Speaker 1: and corporate media outlets. And for those who don't know, 395 00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 1: most of the access that's given to reporters in that 396 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:13,719 Speaker 1: White House Briefing Room is given to them by the WHDA. 397 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,640 Speaker 1: It's not an administration decision. So this is something that 398 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:21,679 Speaker 1: cuts across all political parties in terms of who's actually 399 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 1: in office. The WHDA is responsible for deciding, for example, 400 00:20:26,600 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 1: who gets permanent seats in the briefing room. And it 401 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 1: wouldn't surprise anyone, I think, to hear that the corporate 402 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: big outlets get the first two rows, which are of 403 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:39,680 Speaker 1: course the rows that guarantee you a question, and everybody 404 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:41,720 Speaker 1: else is either relegated to the back of the room 405 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:44,399 Speaker 1: or in our case Saga, we actually had to stand 406 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:48,000 Speaker 1: in the aisle and just pray that the Press Secretary 407 00:20:48,040 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 1: could see us around all the cameras and all the 408 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: other clowns who were in the briefing room on any 409 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,000 Speaker 1: given day. Yeah, so it was a real pain. We've 410 00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 1: both worked through it. But the system, you know, itself, 411 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:01,600 Speaker 1: it shouldn't be so difficult for somebody who's not traditionally 412 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:03,719 Speaker 1: in the corporate media to be able to get a 413 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:06,119 Speaker 1: question in there. I mean, how does the book and 414 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:08,959 Speaker 1: itself some of the stuff that you uncovered just align 415 00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 1: with some of the media coverage that we found so 416 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:15,439 Speaker 1: frustrating at that time. Yeah. Well, I think the major 417 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,760 Speaker 1: problem in the media is that it's become an echo 418 00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:21,359 Speaker 1: chamber filled with people who all basically have the same background. 419 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:24,480 Speaker 1: And this goes back to the credentialing system that was 420 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 1: implemented in the mid nineteen hundreds. One of the major 421 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 1: problems with the underlying journalistic ethos of objectivity is that 422 00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:35,159 Speaker 1: they also decided at that time that you had to 423 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:38,919 Speaker 1: have some type of higher education in order to be objective. 424 00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:43,199 Speaker 1: You had to have basically a training ground, and that 425 00:21:43,240 --> 00:21:47,200 Speaker 1: training ground was typically through journalism school or at the 426 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:52,240 Speaker 1: very least a bachelor's degree at a major prestigious university. 427 00:21:52,560 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 1: And the big corporate outlets like The New York Times 428 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,920 Speaker 1: and the Washington Post still hire mostly from those universities. 429 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,199 Speaker 1: So you have a group of people who tend to 430 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:03,760 Speaker 1: come from backgrounds where their parents were white collar, they 431 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:06,160 Speaker 1: tend to be wealthier, they're more likely to have lived 432 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,200 Speaker 1: in a city their entire life, and they're more likely 433 00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:12,160 Speaker 1: to be liberal. So everyone who's in that briefing room, 434 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,280 Speaker 1: for the most part, there's a five to one conservative 435 00:22:14,320 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: split in terms of who actually gets a seat in 436 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: the briefing room. They're all kind of asking questions from 437 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:22,199 Speaker 1: the same perspective. So that's why you hear over and 438 00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: over and over again. Everybody is asking basically the same thing, 439 00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 1: and any undercovered story really just doesn't get airtime in 440 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:31,520 Speaker 1: that room. Yeah, I think it's really interesting too, you know, 441 00:22:31,560 --> 00:22:33,480 Speaker 1: if you take it out a little bit further, you know, 442 00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,920 Speaker 1: something we witnessed a lot was just the complete absence 443 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 1: in a lot, not even editorially, but from the way 444 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 1: that they approach news stories is always from a framework 445 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:45,520 Speaker 1: that is both group think and also happens to align 446 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,240 Speaker 1: mostly kind of with establishment thought. So since the time 447 00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,400 Speaker 1: that you wrote the book, do you think that things 448 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 1: have gotten better or worse? It's kind of split. I 449 00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: was actually in the briefing room yesterday with Karine Jean Pierre, 450 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:03,399 Speaker 1: and I heard basically the same thing that we would 451 00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: hear five years ago or three years ago when we 452 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:09,119 Speaker 1: were in the briefing room, which was question after question 453 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:14,199 Speaker 1: on the exact same topic. And yesterday John Kirby was 454 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: in there talking about this upcoming democracy summit, and they 455 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: were asking, you know, about which countries are allowed to 456 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,040 Speaker 1: be included in which ones aren't, And none of them 457 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 1: were really asking interesting questions except for Steven Nelson, who 458 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:35,359 Speaker 1: was asking about the IRS's targeting of Matt Tayibi, and 459 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 1: that was met with irols from creating Sean Pierre because 460 00:23:39,119 --> 00:23:43,160 Speaker 1: how dare he actually go off script? But I will 461 00:23:43,200 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: say in terms of the larger media, there's been a 462 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:50,760 Speaker 1: bit of pushback recently against the illiberal progressives who have 463 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:54,399 Speaker 1: been trying to turn journalism into purely activism, specifically at 464 00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:58,080 Speaker 1: the New York Times, when reporters sided with Glad, the 465 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: LGBTQ plus advocacy organization, to accuse The New York Times 466 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 1: of transphobia, the New York Times newsroom leadership actually said 467 00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:09,360 Speaker 1: that they were going they weren't going to tolerate reporters 468 00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 1: citing with activist groups any longer, and that they were 469 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: going to start disciplinary proceedings for the reporters who had 470 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 1: done so. And that's a huge shift, of course, from 471 00:24:18,080 --> 00:24:22,200 Speaker 1: how they reacted to staffers accusing the paper of putting 472 00:24:22,200 --> 00:24:24,720 Speaker 1: black lives in jeopardy when they published an op ed 473 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,520 Speaker 1: from Tom Cotton calling for sending in the National Guard 474 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,320 Speaker 1: to called riots in the summer of twenty twenty. Yeah. Yeah, 475 00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:32,600 Speaker 1: that's a good point. Yeah, I agree. You know, you 476 00:24:32,960 --> 00:24:35,119 Speaker 1: could see two sides of where things are headed. But 477 00:24:35,119 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 1: I encourage people to go by the book or of 478 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:38,399 Speaker 1: a linked down in the description as a said Amber 479 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: as an old friend of mine, and I appreciate you 480 00:24:40,040 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 1: joining us. Thanks for the platform, Sager, of course. All right, 481 00:24:43,960 --> 00:24:48,680 Speaker 1: we'll see you guys later. Fire at the Mexican border 482 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 1: has killed at least thirty eight migrants, potentially more held 483 00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:57,199 Speaker 1: at a detention center just south of the US border, 484 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:03,479 Speaker 1: exposing what is the what is the consequence of years 485 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:11,960 Speaker 1: of failed immigration policies coupled with recent surges. Biden administration 486 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,720 Speaker 1: announcements to that they're going to get rid of Title 487 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:16,639 Speaker 1: forty two and then immediately saying, well, actually, we're not 488 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:18,480 Speaker 1: getting rid of Title forty two until later. And in 489 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 1: the meantime, we're going to put in these other restrictions, 490 00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:21,520 Speaker 1: and people are going to have to stay south of 491 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: the border, and you're gonna have to use this app 492 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:26,199 Speaker 1: to get across the border. And oh, of course the 493 00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,640 Speaker 1: app doesn't work because government contract and there's some corruption 494 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,320 Speaker 1: who knows what corruption is involved that they can't make 495 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:36,800 Speaker 1: an app, and so you wind up with people crammed 496 00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:40,720 Speaker 1: into these holding sales. This is apparently, and we could 497 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:43,160 Speaker 1: put up this second one pair of this rets reporting 498 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:46,520 Speaker 1: that there are some sixty eight people held without water 499 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,640 Speaker 1: all day in a sellment for fifty people. They started protesting, 500 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:53,800 Speaker 1: fire ended up breaking out, and you end up with 501 00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 1: this tragedy. Are What have you made of the reaction 502 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:03,000 Speaker 1: so far to this. I think it's been shockingly quiet. 503 00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: I think there hasn't been much reaction to this news, 504 00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 1: despite the fact that we're talking about thirty eight people 505 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:13,080 Speaker 1: just south of the American border war as so very 506 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,840 Speaker 1: very close to the United States in an official Mexican 507 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:21,680 Speaker 1: immigration facility, in an I in m facility. The level 508 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:26,840 Speaker 1: of death, I mean, that is just an tragic number, incredible, 509 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,160 Speaker 1: and I feel like there's been sort of crickets from 510 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:34,480 Speaker 1: American observers in this question, despite the fact that American 511 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:39,199 Speaker 1: immigration policy is almost certainly to blame. It's a huge 512 00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: poll factor. There are plenty of push factors that we 513 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,920 Speaker 1: can talk about too. But the reason that so many 514 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:49,359 Speaker 1: people are packed into these migrant facilities in Mexico is 515 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:52,640 Speaker 1: because right now they feel they have a pretty good 516 00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:56,920 Speaker 1: chance of getting humanitarian parole in the United States. There 517 00:26:56,920 --> 00:26:59,960 Speaker 1: are a lot of Guatemalan migrants in this particular facility. 518 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:03,159 Speaker 1: According to this is at least twenty eight Guatemala nationals 519 00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,640 Speaker 1: were among the dead. That's according to Guatemala, their Institute 520 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:10,959 Speaker 1: of Migration. One man was Colombian, one was Ecuadorian, twelve Versalvadorans, 521 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,240 Speaker 1: thirteen were on DURAN, thirteen we Venezuelan. So people from 522 00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:19,400 Speaker 1: all over south in Central America who you reference CBP 523 00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,600 Speaker 1: one that's the app that has all kinds of problems 524 00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,600 Speaker 1: and corruption. And that's the thing right now, there's just 525 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,639 Speaker 1: no clear pattern of who gets in when. So enough 526 00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:33,119 Speaker 1: people believe if they come up to Siadad Warres or 527 00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:37,879 Speaker 1: to Matamoros or Rainosa, they have a good enough chance 528 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,000 Speaker 1: to sort of wade it out, and that's why there's 529 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:45,520 Speaker 1: just this incredible overcrowding. Obviously the push factors are involved too, 530 00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:49,199 Speaker 1: but the overcrowding is not tenable. None of what's happening 531 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:51,919 Speaker 1: in these border towns is tenable. Whether it's Ciadad Warres 532 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: or El Paso, whether it's Brownsville and Matamoros, it is 533 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,960 Speaker 1: not tenable. It is not a sustainable situation. And we're 534 00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:00,760 Speaker 1: going to see more of this. Eight people done in 535 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:02,840 Speaker 1: a fire, not less of it. And I think we 536 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 1: should name names here too. And Susan Rice somehow has 537 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:10,840 Speaker 1: managed to skate by without much focus on her role 538 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 1: in immigration policy within the Biden administration. Her presence in 539 00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: the Biden administration is completely inscrutable, beyond just pure kind 540 00:28:21,359 --> 00:28:27,600 Speaker 1: of nepotism and inertia in the sense that she is 541 00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 1: a foreign policy expert. Her entire career, she has focused 542 00:28:33,880 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 1: on foreign relations by all accounts, utterly qualified and talented 543 00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 1: person when it comes to foreign relations, well educated, well 544 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 1: lots of experience, an appropriate appointee for a Biden type 545 00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:52,440 Speaker 1: administration to put into its kind of foreign relations apparatus. 546 00:28:52,840 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 1: They made her domestic policy head. Why still an unanswered 547 00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 1: question we have absolutely no idea why Susan Rice's domestic 548 00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 1: policy head and she still is. It's twenty twenty three, 549 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: she still is domestic policy head, and so with zero 550 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:17,320 Speaker 1: experience in any domestic policy issue, particularly in zero experience 551 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:22,720 Speaker 1: and immigration, she is kind of driving the Biden administration's 552 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:28,440 Speaker 1: immigration policy, which has just been a disaster. And the 553 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: on top of the unanswerable question of how and why 554 00:29:32,680 --> 00:29:35,600 Speaker 1: she's even in that position is how has she escaped 555 00:29:35,640 --> 00:29:40,240 Speaker 1: scrutiny from the press for her role in this? That part, 556 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 1: to me, I'm still trying to figure out, because normally, 557 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,320 Speaker 1: when something has gone as badly as it has for 558 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:50,280 Speaker 1: an administration, the press will figure out, okay, well, who 559 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:53,000 Speaker 1: is the person that we can write about, and who 560 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:57,440 Speaker 1: can we kind of, you know, who can we investigate 561 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:01,040 Speaker 1: and ask the question of what decisions made at what point? 562 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:06,200 Speaker 1: And you basically never see Susan Rice's name in any 563 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:10,560 Speaker 1: of these immigration articles, which actually might be the answer 564 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:14,040 Speaker 1: to the first question, because that is the sign of 565 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:17,680 Speaker 1: somebody who is a very effective kind of internal political 566 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:21,360 Speaker 1: player if they can be kind of leading the charge 567 00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 1: on an issue that is going poorly and still managed 568 00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:26,200 Speaker 1: to keep their name out of it. That's the sign 569 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 1: of somebody who really knows how to operate within Washington. 570 00:30:29,960 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: But you might want instead somebody who has an idea 571 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:35,280 Speaker 1: of what they're doing when it comes to this. Well, 572 00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 1: and yes, domestic policy has just been a complete success 573 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:40,720 Speaker 1: for the Biden administration. So there are no questions to 574 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,160 Speaker 1: be asked of Susan Rice. But this comes as a hunter. 575 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:50,600 Speaker 1: Majorcas was grilled by congressional Republicans. I mean they let 576 00:30:50,680 --> 00:30:53,760 Speaker 1: him up. The Senate Republicans let him up. Ted Cruz 577 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:56,640 Speaker 1: In particularly let him up. Ma Orcus didn't know why 578 00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:59,320 Speaker 1: migrants were coming to our border with wristbands. It was 579 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:01,720 Speaker 1: one of the most basic things that if you spend 580 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:06,120 Speaker 1: time in border facilities you know about. If you follow immigration, 581 00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: probably a lot of you watching this know exactly why 582 00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:10,760 Speaker 1: people are wearing wristbands is because they're given to them 583 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 1: by cartels, because they paid cartels, or they owe money 584 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:17,960 Speaker 1: to cartels. Majorcis didn't know that. In a congressional hearing 585 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,520 Speaker 1: in front of the Senate, he did not know how 586 00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:24,800 Speaker 1: many migrants died in US custody. And that's an increased 587 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,520 Speaker 1: number under his tenure. By the way, he's getting lit 588 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,440 Speaker 1: up by Senate Republicans for it just lacking basic knowledge 589 00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,760 Speaker 1: of the crisis that's unfolded over his tenure. And then 590 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:38,280 Speaker 1: you see the other side of this, the humanitarian crisis 591 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:40,760 Speaker 1: of this, and I know it's unusual for people to 592 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:45,160 Speaker 1: see it Republicans, especially if you're Republican skeptical, conservative skeptical 593 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:49,840 Speaker 1: talking about human rights, talking about humanitarian crises in other countries. 594 00:31:50,000 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 1: I understand the skepticism, I do, but it is a 595 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 1: direct result of United States immigration policy and the fact 596 00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 1: that Ahuro Majorcis can't even answer these questions with like 597 00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:03,120 Speaker 1: basic knowledge. He doesn't even seem to know what's happening, 598 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: let alone have an ability to explain why it's happening. 599 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,920 Speaker 1: It's just an embarrassment, not just for us on the 600 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: world stage, but to us as the American people that 601 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,720 Speaker 1: are affected by this too. It's unbelievable how the Biden 602 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:18,520 Speaker 1: administration has bungled thus, and it's remarkable that the bid 603 00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:21,239 Speaker 1: administration has started to make things even less efficient than 604 00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:24,120 Speaker 1: they already were. So you used to have a policy 605 00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:30,240 Speaker 1: where you would have attorneys who were steeped in immigration law, 606 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 1: who would be on the Mexican side of the border, 607 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:38,800 Speaker 1: who would identify the most vulnerable people who had the 608 00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: best chance of making asylum claims and otherwise moving through 609 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:45,680 Speaker 1: the system, and they oftentimes would kind of physically walk 610 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,680 Speaker 1: those people and oftentimes people who had health issues and 611 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 1: didn't have time to wait. Now they've replaced that with 612 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:57,160 Speaker 1: this CBP one app that doesn't work. So now you 613 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,200 Speaker 1: have tens of thousands or more people who are all 614 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:02,920 Speaker 1: just trying to get an appointment through this app. Whether 615 00:33:03,040 --> 00:33:05,479 Speaker 1: or not they are there're somebody who is in the 616 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:09,840 Speaker 1: most legitimate and immediate need or isn't. And that's the point. 617 00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,719 Speaker 1: Times or somebody else wrote about a four month old 618 00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 1: child who in the past, there's a four month old 619 00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,600 Speaker 1: child who's having a medical crisis, who in the past 620 00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:22,680 Speaker 1: system would have just been walked by an attorney over 621 00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 1: to the border patrol. Border patrol would have quickly kind 622 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 1: of move them, moved them through the system and gotten 623 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:32,840 Speaker 1: them medical care. Instead, the app doesn't work, the four 624 00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 1: month old dies. It's like gambling. Yeah, the app, there's 625 00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,960 Speaker 1: just no rhyme or reason into who gets in when 626 00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,960 Speaker 1: no ostensible rhyme or reason. I'm sure immigration officials on 627 00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:45,160 Speaker 1: the border have whatever reason they have. You can i mean, 628 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:47,800 Speaker 1: you see it like nobody knows what's happening. You will 629 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,440 Speaker 1: talk to people who run the migration facilities and they're like, 630 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 1: we literally do not know. We just get a list, 631 00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:55,360 Speaker 1: and then we call people from the list, We put 632 00:33:55,400 --> 00:33:57,560 Speaker 1: them on the bus, we take them across the border, 633 00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 1: and they're give it. They're they're put it a facility 634 00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 1: on the American side and they're given humanitarian parole. And again, 635 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:07,400 Speaker 1: that's why you have so many people gambling, because there 636 00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:09,400 Speaker 1: is a chance and it's worth it to make a 637 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:11,840 Speaker 1: better life for your four month old, for yourself, and 638 00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 1: people die. Again, this is Cruse talking to Mayorcus. How 639 00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:18,080 Speaker 1: many people died in twenty twenty two. So CRUs says, 640 00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:21,280 Speaker 1: how many migrants have died under President Joe Biden. Mayorkus says, 641 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,600 Speaker 1: I do not know. Cris says, of course you don't. 642 00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:25,960 Speaker 1: Eight hundred and fifty three. Eight hundred and fifty three 643 00:34:26,040 --> 00:34:29,719 Speaker 1: is to increase. And you would think that the flippant 644 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:34,560 Speaker 1: answer that Mayorcus gave to that question would be and 645 00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 1: the fact that he didn't have the numbers in front 646 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:37,920 Speaker 1: of him, right, like your staff preps you and they 647 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,120 Speaker 1: put the important numbers and documents in front of you, 648 00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 1: you know that stuff. The fact that he came so 649 00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,440 Speaker 1: unprepared should be a mass of embarrassment to the Biden administration. 650 00:34:45,560 --> 00:34:47,600 Speaker 1: They stand by my Orcus. They don't seem to have 651 00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:52,080 Speaker 1: any concerns about Mayorcus not knowing these like extremely basic thought. 652 00:34:52,120 --> 00:34:56,640 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just unthinkable. I cannot believe how he's 653 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:58,719 Speaker 1: he's gotten away with this and to show up in 654 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,080 Speaker 1: front of the Senate and not even have basic facts 655 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:03,480 Speaker 1: that your fingertip. It's just unreal. And one root of this, 656 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,960 Speaker 1: of course, is that the immigration process and system is 657 00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:09,320 Speaker 1: completely broken and Congress has no ability to come together 658 00:35:09,560 --> 00:35:11,560 Speaker 1: and fix it. But the other root of it is 659 00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,240 Speaker 1: that for people like Susan Rice who are running this policy, 660 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: they're running it based on optics, Like what they care 661 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,320 Speaker 1: about is numbers, like what are the numbers of encounters, 662 00:35:21,360 --> 00:35:24,080 Speaker 1: what are the numbers we saw at the border this month? 663 00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:26,799 Speaker 1: Or are the numbers that have been released? And all 664 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,200 Speaker 1: they care about is manipulating those numbers. And so then 665 00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:30,960 Speaker 1: they come up with these policies that will say, well, 666 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:32,759 Speaker 1: what if we keep and Trump was doing the same thing, 667 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 1: what if we keep these people or on this side 668 00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,040 Speaker 1: of the border, then they don't count for the numbers. 669 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 1: Obama manipulated the numbers in a ridiculous way when he 670 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:43,200 Speaker 1: was president. What he started doing is saying, we're going 671 00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:45,920 Speaker 1: to count these encounters of people at the border in 672 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 1: the early part of my administration as deportations. Under Bush 673 00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:54,399 Speaker 1: and presidents before that, if border patrol caught somebody right 674 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,000 Speaker 1: across the border and put them on a bus and 675 00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,880 Speaker 1: send them back, that was recorded, but it wasn't counted 676 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,759 Speaker 1: as a deportation. So then Obama started counting that as 677 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:05,279 Speaker 1: a deportation, so it went on his record. Look how 678 00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:08,120 Speaker 1: tough I am on enforcement. He starts getting called the 679 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:10,719 Speaker 1: porter in chief, which he liked from the left because 680 00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:12,480 Speaker 1: then he thought, oh, I'm going to go to the 681 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,280 Speaker 1: Republicans having proven how tough I am on the border, 682 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: and then they're going to work with me because I'm 683 00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:21,719 Speaker 1: tough guy. Yeah, And of course that didn't happen. Well, 684 00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:24,839 Speaker 1: that's what CBP one is. It's a trick like what 685 00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 1: the Biden administration is doing is even worse than as 686 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:29,600 Speaker 1: you mentioned, it's worse than that. It's less efficient than 687 00:36:29,600 --> 00:36:31,680 Speaker 1: all of that, because what they're doing is to get 688 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,759 Speaker 1: the number of illegal crossings down granting humanitarian parole on 689 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:41,919 Speaker 1: this totally arbitrary basis or on inscrutable basis via CBP one, 690 00:36:42,120 --> 00:36:45,160 Speaker 1: and so that takes down illegal crossings. And so they've 691 00:36:45,200 --> 00:36:47,920 Speaker 1: actually even said you're not going to be eligible for 692 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:52,120 Speaker 1: asylum if you are caught crossing illegally, which doesn't mean 693 00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:54,080 Speaker 1: that people aren't coming into the United States. It means 694 00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:58,800 Speaker 1: the government is giving them humanitarian parole and higher numbers 695 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:02,120 Speaker 1: to come into the United States. And humanitarian parole we 696 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:04,399 Speaker 1: can have a debate about that. I think the way 697 00:37:04,400 --> 00:37:06,760 Speaker 1: that it's administered in this country is a damn shame 698 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,120 Speaker 1: because there are people who deserve to be prioritized. There 699 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:11,960 Speaker 1: are people with legitimate asylum claims who shouldn't have to 700 00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:15,359 Speaker 1: live in the shadows of American society on this like 701 00:37:15,800 --> 00:37:22,719 Speaker 1: totally you know, tenuous humanitarian parole, legal designation, which is difficult, 702 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:25,680 Speaker 1: and just wait for a court date in two years. 703 00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:30,120 Speaker 1: I mean, it's just absurd. And it's all getting funneled 704 00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,359 Speaker 1: through CBP one and higher and higher numbers so that 705 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:35,520 Speaker 1: Joe Biden can bring down his illegal crossings. And the 706 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,919 Speaker 1: poignant part of it all is that it appears that 707 00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:46,960 Speaker 1: the people in Honduras, Guatemala, El Salvador, Venezuela, Haiti, elsewhere, 708 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:55,520 Speaker 1: watched the democratic rage at Stephen Miller's immigration policies, watched 709 00:37:55,640 --> 00:38:00,799 Speaker 1: the compassion that they showed toward migrants and believed it 710 00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:04,200 Speaker 1: was real right, and believed that when Democrats came into 711 00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:07,320 Speaker 1: power that there would be a shift in immigration policy, 712 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:13,440 Speaker 1: not not understanding that it's the same United it's roughly 713 00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:17,640 Speaker 1: the same United States immigration policy, but with a kind 714 00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:22,319 Speaker 1: of a smile, and they don't instead of kind of nativism, right, well, 715 00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:24,360 Speaker 1: they don't even know. I mean, that's the thing with like, 716 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:28,200 Speaker 1: I think Democrats have gotten into this habit of dismissing 717 00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:32,239 Speaker 1: concerns about the humanitarian crisis on the border as just 718 00:38:32,400 --> 00:38:37,080 Speaker 1: republican cultural war posturing and don't even look at the situation. 719 00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:39,440 Speaker 1: Like the fact that may Orcus doesn't know about the 720 00:38:39,480 --> 00:38:42,000 Speaker 1: wristbands is insane. But I bet a lot of people 721 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:44,439 Speaker 1: on the left don't know about the ristbands and don't 722 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:47,560 Speaker 1: know about cartel control over migrant flow. It's become this 723 00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:54,479 Speaker 1: like massive industrialized system an economy. If some if we're 724 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,440 Speaker 1: not going to organize it, somebody's going to organize it 725 00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,640 Speaker 1: and make money off to the tune of tons, and 726 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,680 Speaker 1: they make money off of it and then hold these 727 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:06,120 Speaker 1: countries hostage to their illegal rule. I mean, it's just 728 00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:11,000 Speaker 1: a complete disaster. And Democrats, if they, if they had 729 00:39:11,160 --> 00:39:13,480 Speaker 1: the compassion as you say that they projected during the 730 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 1: Trump era, would look at things like this migrant fire 731 00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:19,480 Speaker 1: and be able to connect the dots between Joe Biden's 732 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:23,399 Speaker 1: policy and what happened there very easily. But I doubt 733 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 1: that will be the case. Yeah, I think again they 734 00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:28,640 Speaker 1: should just gets just open up the border. I know 735 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:32,239 Speaker 1: that's what you think. Just open it up. There's not 736 00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,520 Speaker 1: that many people on the North American continent like we 737 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:39,800 Speaker 1: can we can work collectively as various cultures together and 738 00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,960 Speaker 1: find a solution to this. It's and I've said this 739 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:47,120 Speaker 1: a million times before, but like we're entering a period 740 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:50,320 Speaker 1: of we're going to enter a period of population decline, 741 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:54,160 Speaker 1: and countries that are able to attract immigrants are actually 742 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:57,359 Speaker 1: going to be the countries that outcompete the ones whose 743 00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,840 Speaker 1: populations are aging and declining. Nobody wants to hear that 744 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:04,600 Speaker 1: because they think that they're gonna they're gonna lower wages, 745 00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:06,760 Speaker 1: are gonna take something from them. There's not enough room. 746 00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:10,080 Speaker 1: That's that's not the case. The countries that are keeping 747 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:12,400 Speaker 1: people out are gonna be the ones that are that 748 00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:14,719 Speaker 1: are gonna be the ones that are gonna suffer. I mean, 749 00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:16,600 Speaker 1: I generally agree with that. I just don't agree that 750 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,640 Speaker 1: open borders is the best way to accomplish it. A 751 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:22,200 Speaker 1: little more open and you can you can still like 752 00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:26,480 Speaker 1: check passports and stuff, obviously. Yeah, but like this like 753 00:40:26,520 --> 00:40:29,520 Speaker 1: thing where you just people can't move just feels wrong. 754 00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:31,920 Speaker 1: We should do a full segment on this in a 755 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:33,759 Speaker 1: future episode, because I don't think we've ever had that. 756 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:37,319 Speaker 1: Like there we go all right before, so yeah, look 757 00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,239 Speaker 1: forward to that and we go all right, So we'll 758 00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:41,439 Speaker 1: stick around for that at some point. See you later, 759 00:40:44,520 --> 00:40:47,719 Speaker 1: all right. I'm Maximilian Alvarez. I'm editor in chief of 760 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,480 Speaker 1: the Real News Network and host of the podcast Working People, 761 00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:55,360 Speaker 1: and this is the Art of class War on breaking points. 762 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:59,200 Speaker 1: While coverage in the corporate media of the general strike 763 00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:03,600 Speaker 1: rocking Grants has increased of late, the fact remains that 764 00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:06,800 Speaker 1: for the past six months, one of the most massive 765 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:11,440 Speaker 1: stories not covered with corresponding urgency in North American media 766 00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:16,280 Speaker 1: has been the massive, sustained and growing strikes by workers 767 00:41:16,400 --> 00:41:20,520 Speaker 1: across sectors in the UK and in France, but also 768 00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:26,320 Speaker 1: large strikes in Spain, Greece, Belgium and elsewhere. Between inflation 769 00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:31,560 Speaker 1: and endless war spending and corporate price gouging affecting everything 770 00:41:31,640 --> 00:41:35,840 Speaker 1: from energy costs to rent and grocery bills. Working people 771 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,399 Speaker 1: across Europe and around the world are being pummeled by 772 00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,400 Speaker 1: a cost of living crisis right now, and we are 773 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:48,440 Speaker 1: seeing organized labor, namely unions, resort to using industrial action, 774 00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:53,160 Speaker 1: namely strikes, as a means of forcing the bosses, the 775 00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:58,960 Speaker 1: business class and the elite serving ruling class, serving politicians 776 00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:03,120 Speaker 1: and government to halt their multi fronted attack on the 777 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:09,240 Speaker 1: working class. And they're being joined by students, retirees, delegations 778 00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:15,120 Speaker 1: from other countries and organizations representing other social movements. The 779 00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:19,160 Speaker 1: top down assault on working people is taking many forms 780 00:42:19,600 --> 00:42:23,960 Speaker 1: from French President Emmanuel Macron's deeply unpopular plan to raise 781 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:28,640 Speaker 1: retirement ages and further weaken the country's beloved pension system, 782 00:42:29,120 --> 00:42:33,880 Speaker 1: changes he has opted to force into reality by controversially 783 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:40,239 Speaker 1: and undemocratically invoking constitutional special powers to override Parliament, to 784 00:42:40,280 --> 00:42:44,880 Speaker 1: the French police's brutal crackdown on strikers to the Tory 785 00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:48,960 Speaker 1: government in the UK drawing out and throwing a wrench 786 00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:53,920 Speaker 1: into negotiations in the National rail dispute involving the National 787 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:58,360 Speaker 1: Union of Rail, Maritime and Transport Workers or the RMT, 788 00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:02,880 Speaker 1: and on top of that, responding to the massive wave 789 00:43:03,000 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 1: of strikes in the UK by ramming through a draconian 790 00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:11,080 Speaker 1: anti labor law that will force striking workers to cross 791 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,239 Speaker 1: their own picket lines. When I say these strikes are 792 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:17,760 Speaker 1: a massive story, I mean it. If you've been watching 793 00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:21,279 Speaker 1: our continued coverage over at the Real News or our 794 00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:24,680 Speaker 1: reports here on Breaking Points, then you know that both 795 00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:27,840 Speaker 1: France and the UK are in the midst of history 796 00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:33,760 Speaker 1: making nationwide strike waves. Whether they're fighting against Macron's Wall Street, 797 00:43:33,880 --> 00:43:37,880 Speaker 1: serving attack on pensions, or fighting for real pay raises, 798 00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:42,160 Speaker 1: lower energy and housing costs, or more job security and 799 00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:46,560 Speaker 1: safer staffing levels, workers have been hitting the streets and 800 00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:51,520 Speaker 1: holding picket lines, from freight and passenger rail workers, oil 801 00:43:51,600 --> 00:43:57,920 Speaker 1: refinery and sanitation workers, civil servants and farmers, to school teachers, 802 00:43:58,120 --> 00:44:04,600 Speaker 1: university lecturers, post workers, nurses, ambulance drivers, and Amazon workers. 803 00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:07,520 Speaker 1: To get an on the ground update on the class 804 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:11,120 Speaker 1: struggle playing out across France in the UK. I'm honored 805 00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:15,240 Speaker 1: to be joined today once again by Matu Bodeadat, calling 806 00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,880 Speaker 1: in from France. Matteu is a train operator and general 807 00:44:18,960 --> 00:44:22,520 Speaker 1: secretary of the Versailles branch of the CGT Union or 808 00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,760 Speaker 1: the General Confederation of Labor. We're also joined by Gaz 809 00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:31,000 Speaker 1: Jackson calling in from England, another familiar face for real 810 00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:34,920 Speaker 1: news viewers. Gaz worked on the rails for fifteen years 811 00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:38,080 Speaker 1: as a train guard and now serves as the rmt's 812 00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:43,560 Speaker 1: regional organizer in Yorkshire and Lincolnshire. Gaz Matteu, thank you 813 00:44:43,600 --> 00:44:46,320 Speaker 1: both so much for joining me today on Breaking Points. 814 00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:49,719 Speaker 1: I really appreciate it. I know it's late on a 815 00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:53,200 Speaker 1: Sunday and you guys have been fighting your asses off 816 00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:56,759 Speaker 1: four months on end, so I promise I won't ask 817 00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:00,439 Speaker 1: you guys like I have in past interviews, to give 818 00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:04,360 Speaker 1: us the full backstories behind these strikes across France and 819 00:45:04,440 --> 00:45:08,440 Speaker 1: the UK. If folks are looking for that background context, 820 00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:12,200 Speaker 1: we've got a treasure trove of reporting for you. You 821 00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:15,680 Speaker 1: can go watch our past segments on Breaking Points, including 822 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:19,799 Speaker 1: my last interview with Matthu. Go watch the many documentary 823 00:45:19,880 --> 00:45:23,000 Speaker 1: reports that we've published over at the real news on 824 00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:27,600 Speaker 1: the strikes in Greece, Spain and across the UK and France. 825 00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:30,959 Speaker 1: You can listen to podcast interviews with Gazz and other 826 00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:34,640 Speaker 1: great British rail workers that we publish. But for right now, 827 00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:38,640 Speaker 1: I just want to give people an update on where 828 00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:41,840 Speaker 1: things are right now. So, you know, why don't we 829 00:45:42,040 --> 00:45:45,880 Speaker 1: just start by, you know, telling people from your vantage 830 00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:49,760 Speaker 1: points as members of in fighters for the working class 831 00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:54,080 Speaker 1: what has been happening in your countries over the past week. 832 00:45:54,320 --> 00:45:56,319 Speaker 1: So Gas, why don't we start with you and then 833 00:45:56,360 --> 00:46:00,160 Speaker 1: Mattheu will go to you. Yeah, good, even everybody. So 834 00:46:00,200 --> 00:46:04,000 Speaker 1: over the last week within the r MT, we've suspended 835 00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:09,280 Speaker 1: our industrial action on the National Rail dispute because we've 836 00:46:09,360 --> 00:46:13,759 Speaker 1: seen some movement from the government and the train operating companies. 837 00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:16,279 Speaker 1: What this is going to allow us to do is 838 00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,200 Speaker 1: get the information out to our members so they can 839 00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:22,520 Speaker 1: make a judgment on whether or not they want to 840 00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:28,560 Speaker 1: accept the proposals from the government and the train operating companies. 841 00:46:29,600 --> 00:46:33,040 Speaker 1: Being a democratic union, that's only right that we believe 842 00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:36,480 Speaker 1: that our members should have the final say. But just 843 00:46:36,560 --> 00:46:40,239 Speaker 1: generally across the UK, we're seeing people winning these disputes. 844 00:46:40,360 --> 00:46:43,279 Speaker 1: You know, the doctors have got to pay rise. The 845 00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:47,200 Speaker 1: nurses are in depth talks and the Communication Workers Union 846 00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:51,480 Speaker 1: are also in depth talks with the government as well 847 00:46:51,520 --> 00:46:55,120 Speaker 1: to try and get their disputes. So what we're seeing 848 00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,960 Speaker 1: really in the UK, certainly in the last month or so, 849 00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:02,319 Speaker 1: is some victories, which is really good to see. So 850 00:47:02,320 --> 00:47:05,000 Speaker 1: we just want that to carry on and our members 851 00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:08,000 Speaker 1: will have the final say on whether the dale is 852 00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:11,000 Speaker 1: acceptable that the government will give them. Matthew, you can 853 00:47:11,040 --> 00:47:16,680 Speaker 1: happen whenever you're ready. Okay, Hi, everybody, thank you Max 854 00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:23,520 Speaker 1: for this calling. Good evening to all brothers and sisters 855 00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:29,240 Speaker 1: in Baltimore and all cameras from USA, so from across 856 00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:34,279 Speaker 1: the ocean. I have my report to do for you 857 00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:38,440 Speaker 1: about the situation in France. Of course, you know, since 858 00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:43,400 Speaker 1: the seventh of March there is an unlimited strike in 859 00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:49,040 Speaker 1: France of strategic sector in the economy to blockade the economy, 860 00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:55,520 Speaker 1: so right way, of course, but metro and a bus 861 00:47:55,680 --> 00:48:01,000 Speaker 1: of course, and electric and gas power and the worker 862 00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:05,440 Speaker 1: from our finery and the people from you know, the 863 00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:10,080 Speaker 1: collecting garbage, the collecting trash in Paris and in seven 864 00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:13,800 Speaker 1: big cities in France. So we are a limited strike 865 00:48:14,600 --> 00:48:22,880 Speaker 1: since the beginning of March and we u and one 866 00:48:23,000 --> 00:48:28,480 Speaker 1: day by week there is general strike with other sectors 867 00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:32,239 Speaker 1: come with us, uh to to go and strike. So 868 00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:38,440 Speaker 1: as you know, maybe because it was on the on 869 00:48:38,520 --> 00:48:42,040 Speaker 1: the every newspaper and all over the world the last 870 00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:47,040 Speaker 1: last week. The government is a minority in the country, 871 00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:52,520 Speaker 1: of course, because there is all the oppositional party, political party, 872 00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:56,839 Speaker 1: all the trade unions. Trade unions are against the law. 873 00:48:57,440 --> 00:49:02,720 Speaker 1: But with discovery is he was in a minority even 874 00:49:02,880 --> 00:49:07,080 Speaker 1: in the parliament, at the parliament, so he used tricks 875 00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:10,480 Speaker 1: in our constitution to bypass the parliament and pass the 876 00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:16,880 Speaker 1: law without vote. So of course it's this uh, this 877 00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:24,200 Speaker 1: off and uh there is not just a limited strike 878 00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:28,840 Speaker 1: of the strategic sector of the economy. There is the 879 00:49:28,960 --> 00:49:33,080 Speaker 1: young people. For the first time since the beginning of 880 00:49:33,120 --> 00:49:38,080 Speaker 1: the movement, the youth. They came every night, every evening, 881 00:49:38,200 --> 00:49:42,560 Speaker 1: every night in the to demonstrate in the center of Paris, 882 00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:50,279 Speaker 1: but in plenty cities of friends and demonstrate, burn garbage, 883 00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,040 Speaker 1: a fight with the police, and I think it was 884 00:49:53,200 --> 00:49:56,800 Speaker 1: it's very brutal fight. A lot of people was enjured, 885 00:49:57,360 --> 00:50:00,960 Speaker 1: was hurt during the fight against the police. So the 886 00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:04,560 Speaker 1: movement continue, but it takes the new crossing line now 887 00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:08,440 Speaker 1: because with the entrance of the US people in the movement. 888 00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:11,880 Speaker 1: So it's very important because we the working class, we 889 00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:14,960 Speaker 1: still continue to be on strike, but we will not less. 890 00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:20,720 Speaker 1: Our children will be beaten, badly beaten by the police 891 00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:25,359 Speaker 1: during the night in the streets, you know. So it's 892 00:50:25,920 --> 00:50:29,520 Speaker 1: a new development, a new motion of this movement and 893 00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,359 Speaker 1: we will continue. You have to see Paris. You have 894 00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:37,279 Speaker 1: to see Paris now. There is trash everywhere, there is 895 00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:41,160 Speaker 1: rats everywhere. It's ugly, you know, you have to see that, 896 00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:45,640 Speaker 1: very nasty. It's definitely not the show Emily in Paris, 897 00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:51,560 Speaker 1: you know, with good selfie in the monument. Every night. 898 00:50:51,719 --> 00:50:55,000 Speaker 1: There is several places the BA still place, the Bastill Square, 899 00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:58,840 Speaker 1: as you know, the Concord Square. They are occupied by children, 900 00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:01,840 Speaker 1: by young people and the fight against the police. So 901 00:51:02,200 --> 00:51:07,160 Speaker 1: that's the situation now. Of course, for the President Macron 902 00:51:06,080 --> 00:51:12,120 Speaker 1: and the forty nine point three it's the article of 903 00:51:12,200 --> 00:51:16,440 Speaker 1: the tricks of the Constitution to bypass the parliament. For 904 00:51:16,560 --> 00:51:19,640 Speaker 1: him it was the end of the process, but for 905 00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:23,399 Speaker 1: us is the beginning of the new process of the mobilization. 906 00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:28,080 Speaker 1: May I just sorry say a few more words about 907 00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:36,319 Speaker 1: the international solidarity with our with our movement, if I may, okay, cool. 908 00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:44,240 Speaker 1: So it's very important because we knew that every working 909 00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:48,280 Speaker 1: class and people in all over Europe, including across the ocean, 910 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,200 Speaker 1: look at for you, for us, look at our situation, 911 00:51:53,440 --> 00:51:57,080 Speaker 1: look at our movement, and wait for our winning. We 912 00:51:57,200 --> 00:52:00,760 Speaker 1: know that we know for them it could be a tool, 913 00:52:01,040 --> 00:52:06,400 Speaker 1: a leverage, you know, to see and that's our way, 914 00:52:06,640 --> 00:52:09,560 Speaker 1: the way of struggle of classes is the winning way. 915 00:52:10,160 --> 00:52:14,359 Speaker 1: We know that. But now is not just an expectation. 916 00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:21,160 Speaker 1: Every week we have a delegation from different countries to 917 00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:25,959 Speaker 1: demonstrate with us, and gas Jackson comes one months ago 918 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:30,200 Speaker 1: to demonstrate in Paris, people from Belgium, people from Portugal, 919 00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:34,680 Speaker 1: people from Italy, people from Greece, people from Germany, from Denmark, 920 00:52:34,719 --> 00:52:41,320 Speaker 1: et cetera. Story. And every day we receive statement of solidarity. 921 00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:44,879 Speaker 1: And we know there is a lot of a lot 922 00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:48,440 Speaker 1: of country in Europa, including in America. I saw it 923 00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:53,000 Speaker 1: two days ago in Los Angeles. There is trade unionist 924 00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:58,160 Speaker 1: protests in the front of French ambassadory and that's very important. 925 00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:03,760 Speaker 1: And in different countries, the collect money, the rise money 926 00:53:03,800 --> 00:53:09,480 Speaker 1: for our solidarity fonts and we receive my union, receive 927 00:53:10,080 --> 00:53:14,360 Speaker 1: ten thousand euro two days ago from Italy. The collect 928 00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:18,280 Speaker 1: money from US, etcetera, etcetera. So that's very important for us. 929 00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:23,239 Speaker 1: There is an international solidarity. There is a national solidarity 930 00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:27,040 Speaker 1: because we collect a lot of money three weeks ago. 931 00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:32,680 Speaker 1: There is peasants, poor farmers. The collect two towns, two 932 00:53:32,760 --> 00:53:40,000 Speaker 1: towns of food, meat, food, vegetable, honey, bread, cheese, et cetera, 933 00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:45,600 Speaker 1: and all the good things of our big country. The 934 00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:50,279 Speaker 1: collect two tons from my station for the striker of 935 00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:54,239 Speaker 1: their side, and they bring to us. So that's incredible 936 00:53:54,280 --> 00:53:58,040 Speaker 1: because we know, and you have to know, an unlimited strike. 937 00:53:59,040 --> 00:54:04,479 Speaker 1: Our what's enemy is the feeling of loneliness. But now 938 00:54:04,600 --> 00:54:08,480 Speaker 1: we don't feeling lonely. Okay, we know we are support. 939 00:54:08,680 --> 00:54:12,240 Speaker 1: We have loved, We are loved by people in France, 940 00:54:13,440 --> 00:54:17,839 Speaker 1: in Europe, in all over the world. People expect our 941 00:54:18,080 --> 00:54:22,560 Speaker 1: victory and vox for Pili Volks Day, we will give 942 00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:27,320 Speaker 1: to them the biggest victory of the twenty one century. 943 00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:33,200 Speaker 1: About the working class fight. Oh yeah, baby, and Gus, 944 00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:34,960 Speaker 1: I just wanted to see if you had had anything 945 00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:38,840 Speaker 1: you wanted to add there about that. The scope of 946 00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:42,120 Speaker 1: all of this, right, like you said, the RMT as 947 00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:45,239 Speaker 1: We've talked about a number of times you me and 948 00:54:45,719 --> 00:54:50,200 Speaker 1: your fellow rail workers Clayton Cat and others at the 949 00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:53,000 Speaker 1: Real News. You know, y'all really were kind of the 950 00:54:53,000 --> 00:54:56,120 Speaker 1: tip of the spear beginning your strikes back in the summer, 951 00:54:56,160 --> 00:54:59,440 Speaker 1: and it feels like things have only grown across the 952 00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:02,759 Speaker 1: UK since then, and we've been seeing this sort of 953 00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:07,080 Speaker 1: like brutal response from the Tories doing what the ruling 954 00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:10,480 Speaker 1: class is trying to do here at the Supreme Court level. 955 00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:13,759 Speaker 1: Folks should watch my past Breaking Points segment about the 956 00:55:13,800 --> 00:55:17,879 Speaker 1: Glacier Northwest case before the Supreme Court right now, which 957 00:55:18,000 --> 00:55:23,040 Speaker 1: may give businesses the ability to sue unions basically out 958 00:55:23,040 --> 00:55:26,400 Speaker 1: of existence for economic damages caused during a strike. And 959 00:55:26,480 --> 00:55:29,880 Speaker 1: causing economic damages is the whole damn point of a strike. 960 00:55:30,040 --> 00:55:32,520 Speaker 1: So over in the United Kingdom, Rishi Sunak and the 961 00:55:32,520 --> 00:55:36,719 Speaker 1: Tory government have been responding to this incredible historic wave 962 00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:41,759 Speaker 1: of strikes and sectors across the UK, not by you know, 963 00:55:41,800 --> 00:55:46,239 Speaker 1: addressing people's dire concerns about costs of living, you know, 964 00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:50,520 Speaker 1: wage stagnation, corporate pillage, YadA, YadA, YadA, but instead you know, 965 00:55:50,600 --> 00:55:55,480 Speaker 1: focusing on taking away workers' power to organize and take 966 00:55:55,520 --> 00:56:00,000 Speaker 1: industrial action by ramming through this draconian anti strike loss. 967 00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:01,279 Speaker 1: So I was wondering if you could just sort of 968 00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:03,040 Speaker 1: say a little bit building on what matth you were 969 00:56:03,080 --> 00:56:06,480 Speaker 1: saying about the scope of these strikes, the response that 970 00:56:06,520 --> 00:56:09,760 Speaker 1: you're getting from the community, from other unions, or even 971 00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:13,359 Speaker 1: from folks around the world. So the sport that we've 972 00:56:13,400 --> 00:56:16,520 Speaker 1: had has been absolutely fantastic. And I think you hit 973 00:56:16,560 --> 00:56:18,640 Speaker 1: the nail on the head, Max when you say that 974 00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:22,319 Speaker 1: the RMT was almost a spearhead of the fight back 975 00:56:22,360 --> 00:56:25,200 Speaker 1: of the UK. I think that the analogy that I 976 00:56:25,360 --> 00:56:28,279 Speaker 1: use is we kind of we dropped a stone in 977 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:31,080 Speaker 1: the pond and we've sent out a ripple effects and 978 00:56:31,120 --> 00:56:33,040 Speaker 1: all of the trade unions have started to join it 979 00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:37,760 Speaker 1: because they've realized that they can't afford to not strike, 980 00:56:37,920 --> 00:56:39,840 Speaker 1: because if we don't strike, we will not get the 981 00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:43,080 Speaker 1: pay rise that we deserve, We'll not keep the terms 982 00:56:43,080 --> 00:56:46,840 Speaker 1: and conditions that we fought for over the years. And 983 00:56:46,880 --> 00:56:49,759 Speaker 1: I just wanted to touch on what Matthew said about 984 00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,600 Speaker 1: the rats in the street in Paris, and is he 985 00:56:53,320 --> 00:57:00,520 Speaker 1: refering to the politicians. Certainly Macron after pulling his dat tricks. 986 00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:04,000 Speaker 1: If you see one with an eighty thousand dollars. Watch 987 00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:07,799 Speaker 1: then you'll know maybe maybe you could sell that for 988 00:57:08,040 --> 00:57:13,600 Speaker 1: the solidarity fund for the CGT. But joking aside, you know, 989 00:57:13,640 --> 00:57:19,400 Speaker 1: we we receive donations from Matthew's branch over over in Paris, 990 00:57:19,480 --> 00:57:23,800 Speaker 1: and we also received many many other donations and our 991 00:57:23,840 --> 00:57:27,840 Speaker 1: solidarity fund last year, and we'll be returning the favor 992 00:57:28,920 --> 00:57:30,840 Speaker 1: in the very near future. I'm hoping to get over 993 00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:33,520 Speaker 1: to Paris again in the next few weeks to show 994 00:57:33,560 --> 00:57:36,680 Speaker 1: some support for Matthew and the guys over there, because 995 00:57:36,680 --> 00:57:38,600 Speaker 1: they've been over here and they've showed support to us. 996 00:57:38,600 --> 00:57:41,000 Speaker 1: So that just goes to show that the international solidarity 997 00:57:42,320 --> 00:57:45,400 Speaker 1: is very important. And what I would say to the 998 00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:48,400 Speaker 1: people out in France is don't feel lonely because they 999 00:57:48,400 --> 00:57:51,920 Speaker 1: are empty right behind you. Hell yeah, love it. And 1000 00:57:52,120 --> 00:57:54,200 Speaker 1: I guess, like on that note, because I again, I 1001 00:57:54,240 --> 00:57:57,360 Speaker 1: know it's late on a Sunday, I gotta let you 1002 00:57:57,360 --> 00:58:00,440 Speaker 1: guys go, but I just wanted to sort of highlight 1003 00:58:00,560 --> 00:58:02,720 Speaker 1: something that it feels like both of you are saying. 1004 00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:05,840 Speaker 1: And this is certainly something we hear in the reporting 1005 00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:09,920 Speaker 1: that we've been publishing at the Real News is these struggles, right, 1006 00:58:10,040 --> 00:58:14,040 Speaker 1: there's so much of it that is focused on you know, 1007 00:58:14,800 --> 00:58:20,360 Speaker 1: workplace issues, right, like, you know, working conditions, raises to 1008 00:58:20,480 --> 00:58:25,120 Speaker 1: keep up with the cost of living, more safer staffing ratios, 1009 00:58:25,120 --> 00:58:28,440 Speaker 1: and education and healthcare, so on and so forth. But 1010 00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:32,640 Speaker 1: it feels like in France, in the UK and increasingly 1011 00:58:32,720 --> 00:58:36,480 Speaker 1: beyond that it's about much more than that too. It 1012 00:58:36,480 --> 00:58:39,960 Speaker 1: feels like this is really sort of the working class 1013 00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:44,400 Speaker 1: and the labor movement, you know, digging their heels into 1014 00:58:44,440 --> 00:58:48,600 Speaker 1: the ground, trying to stop a long backslide that has 1015 00:58:48,600 --> 00:58:51,840 Speaker 1: been going on for years and pushing back to advance 1016 00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:55,440 Speaker 1: a different vision of society. And so I just wanted 1017 00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:59,160 Speaker 1: to ask, by way of closing out, if that feels like, 1018 00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:02,400 Speaker 1: if that track with what you're viewing and seeing over 1019 00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:05,040 Speaker 1: there on the ground, if this is about, you know, 1020 00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:08,680 Speaker 1: what workers are going through immediately, but also what society 1021 00:59:08,760 --> 00:59:12,520 Speaker 1: is going through, and you know what can folks here 1022 00:59:12,560 --> 00:59:16,000 Speaker 1: in North America and beyond do to stand in solidarity 1023 00:59:16,400 --> 00:59:19,080 Speaker 1: with their fellow workers in the UK and France and 1024 00:59:19,120 --> 00:59:27,560 Speaker 1: across Europe. Of course, it's about our immediate claims, of course, wages. 1025 00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:33,680 Speaker 1: In France, it's the subject specifically of pension, but it's 1026 00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:37,760 Speaker 1: a it's a matter of choice of society and model. 1027 00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:43,440 Speaker 1: Strike continue. Well, we're the workers. We talk about that. 1028 00:59:43,720 --> 00:59:49,680 Speaker 1: You know, it's an interesting period, an interesting moment. The 1029 00:59:49,800 --> 00:59:53,240 Speaker 1: time is sustained and we can we can talk about 1030 00:59:53,360 --> 00:59:57,080 Speaker 1: the society we want. I know, in the word books 1031 00:59:57,120 --> 01:00:00,160 Speaker 1: of r Empty there is a world about the The 1032 01:00:02,440 --> 01:00:08,440 Speaker 1: goal of tradingionism is socialism, a new socialist order of society. 1033 01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:11,920 Speaker 1: I think we have the same in France. And of 1034 01:00:12,080 --> 01:00:16,520 Speaker 1: course when we are on strike, we do a demonstration. 1035 01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:22,760 Speaker 1: We are the working class. If we don't work, the country, 1036 01:00:23,080 --> 01:00:29,840 Speaker 1: the entire country collapse. Okay, So we discovery and all 1037 01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:37,080 Speaker 1: the society discovery true things, but a true things hiding. 1038 01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:47,280 Speaker 1: It's we produce. We create because we work. So we 1039 01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:52,960 Speaker 1: have to decide we have to take back our future. 1040 01:00:53,360 --> 01:00:57,080 Speaker 1: We have to take back the power in this society 1041 01:00:57,680 --> 01:01:03,240 Speaker 1: because we are the only used full class in the world. So, 1042 01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:08,400 Speaker 1: and it's difficult to say that because I'm from working class. 1043 01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:16,000 Speaker 1: I'm from a post suburb, Okay. And what we learn 1044 01:01:16,240 --> 01:01:20,560 Speaker 1: when we are child, then we are parasite, we are nothing, 1045 01:01:21,160 --> 01:01:25,160 Speaker 1: and we are losers and the winners. We can sew 1046 01:01:25,200 --> 01:01:30,160 Speaker 1: it on TV show. There are lawyers, they are traders. 1047 01:01:30,400 --> 01:01:35,600 Speaker 1: They are Theogian et cetera, and we are nothing. But 1048 01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:41,680 Speaker 1: during this period we understand finally that we are everything, 1049 01:01:42,640 --> 01:01:46,520 Speaker 1: and if we are not at work, the countries collapse. 1050 01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:53,160 Speaker 1: So we have to decide to rule this country. That's 1051 01:01:53,280 --> 01:01:59,520 Speaker 1: very interesting during this period and that's giving to us confidence. 1052 01:02:00,120 --> 01:02:03,680 Speaker 1: Finally we are the cool class, we have the swag, 1053 01:02:04,160 --> 01:02:09,960 Speaker 1: we walking class are beautiful. Make working class great again. 1054 01:02:11,600 --> 01:02:15,880 Speaker 1: And just for a confusion, you talk about a donational sorinarity, 1055 01:02:15,960 --> 01:02:18,680 Speaker 1: my dear brother Max, I will share to you the 1056 01:02:18,760 --> 01:02:22,560 Speaker 1: links about our solidarity funds and you can you can 1057 01:02:22,680 --> 01:02:26,080 Speaker 1: put in your podcast if you want, Thank you very much. 1058 01:02:26,200 --> 01:02:29,480 Speaker 1: In the UK, we've seen a massive increase in people 1059 01:02:29,600 --> 01:02:34,480 Speaker 1: joining trade unions, certainly with the teachers. I think they've 1060 01:02:34,640 --> 01:02:38,000 Speaker 1: they've gained over fifty five thousand members since they was 1061 01:02:38,040 --> 01:02:41,720 Speaker 1: out on dispute. That's fantastic. We're engaging more with people 1062 01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:45,040 Speaker 1: and we're trying to organize within communities, not just with 1063 01:02:45,200 --> 01:02:47,280 Speaker 1: our trade unions. I think it's important that we go 1064 01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:50,480 Speaker 1: and speak to people that have not had any affiliations 1065 01:02:50,480 --> 01:02:52,640 Speaker 1: to trade unions or don't really know what a trade 1066 01:02:52,720 --> 01:02:56,360 Speaker 1: union are, because if people don't know, they won't understand 1067 01:02:56,800 --> 01:03:00,479 Speaker 1: and like Matthew said, without us, no wheels will turn. 1068 01:03:01,440 --> 01:03:04,880 Speaker 1: The one percent won't earn their money. They're billions of pounds. 1069 01:03:05,240 --> 01:03:08,040 Speaker 1: The ninety nine percent, which is us, We have the power. 1070 01:03:08,160 --> 01:03:11,040 Speaker 1: They don't have the power. They think they have the power, 1071 01:03:11,080 --> 01:03:13,680 Speaker 1: but we do. If we don't work, they don't end. 1072 01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:17,560 Speaker 1: That's as simple as it is. And we will of course, Matthew, 1073 01:03:17,760 --> 01:03:21,880 Speaker 1: we will share all your solidarity funds out within the 1074 01:03:21,960 --> 01:03:24,960 Speaker 1: RMT as well, and I'm hoping to bring over a 1075 01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:27,160 Speaker 1: good donation to here in a few weeks time. Brother. 1076 01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:31,320 Speaker 1: So that is Mattheu Boulder that calling in from France. 1077 01:03:31,640 --> 01:03:34,960 Speaker 1: Matthieu is a train operator and General secretary of the 1078 01:03:35,040 --> 01:03:39,880 Speaker 1: Versailles branch of the General Confederation of Labor or the CGT. 1079 01:03:40,240 --> 01:03:44,800 Speaker 1: And Gaz Jackson calling in from England. Gaz worked on 1080 01:03:44,840 --> 01:03:47,160 Speaker 1: the rails for fifteen years as a train guard and 1081 01:03:47,240 --> 01:03:53,520 Speaker 1: now serves as the RMTS regional organizer in Yorkshire in Lincolnshire. Gazz, Matthieu, 1082 01:03:53,840 --> 01:03:56,360 Speaker 1: thank you both so much for joining me today on 1083 01:03:56,480 --> 01:04:01,080 Speaker 1: Breaking Points Solidarity from across the Pond. Thank you a 1084 01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:04,720 Speaker 1: veryrech You're nice see lights. Thank you for watching this 1085 01:04:04,840 --> 01:04:07,800 Speaker 1: segment on Breaking Points and be sure to subscribe to 1086 01:04:07,840 --> 01:04:10,600 Speaker 1: my news outlet, the Real News Network, with links in 1087 01:04:10,640 --> 01:04:13,720 Speaker 1: the show description. See you soon for the next edition 1088 01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:17,040 Speaker 1: of the Art of Class War. Take care of yourselves, 1089 01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:20,160 Speaker 1: take care of each other. Solidarity Forever.