Speaker 1: Episode one two, Financial Independence one oh one with Jimmy
Speaker 1: Lassy Front Welcome to the Frugal Friends podcast, where you'll
Speaker 1: learn to save money, embrace simplicity, rights, and liver with
Speaker 1: your life. Here your host Jen and Jill. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the Frugal Friends podcast. My name is Jen, my name
Speaker 1: is Jill, and today we are talking about financial independence.
Speaker 1: If any of you are familiar with the Fire movement,
Speaker 1: we're specifically talking more about the five part of Fire,
Speaker 1: not the retire early part, because that's what we like
Speaker 1: more mm hmm yeah, just freedom with our money, not
Speaker 1: necessarily not working anymore. So Jamila has a really great
Speaker 1: perspective on this, tons of freedom to find ourselves somewhere
Speaker 1: along the spectrum ways to get there. I think wherever
Speaker 1: you're at in your journey, this is a really helpful
Speaker 1: episode and I think she gives a lot of really
Speaker 1: great tips. Absolutely. But first let's shout out our sponsors.
Speaker 1: This episode is brought to you by the Frugal Friends
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Speaker 1: from decluttering and increasing your income to having healthy conversations
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Speaker 1: be completed on your own, it's actually created to be
Speaker 1: gone through in pairs or small groups. That's why every
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Speaker 1: ever offer it. Also brought to you by Autonomy, that
Speaker 1: feeling of being your own person with the agency to
Speaker 1: make your own decisions with freedom. Autonomy is reminding us
Speaker 1: that even when stuck at home with limited opportunities, at
Speaker 1: least we can choose what we need for dinner and
Speaker 1: where our money goes. Amen. That's the end of that
Speaker 1: point blank. Um. Yeah. So today we have Jamilist who
Speaker 1: front on. She is the host of the Journey to
Speaker 1: Launch podcast and Journey to Launch dot com. She is
Speaker 1: one of those podcasters that we as podcasters look up to.
Speaker 1: She has a great show. She gives great information and
Speaker 1: so it is definitely she is someone to look up
Speaker 1: to and I think you're gonna love this interview with her.
Speaker 1: Without further ado, here's Jamila. Jamila, thank you so much
Speaker 1: for coming on the show. Thank you ladies for having me.
Speaker 1: So thrilled to talk with you, Jamila, and here all
Speaker 1: of the wisdom and insight you have on this topic.
Speaker 1: It's amazing. If you google your name, so much comes up.
Speaker 1: You are all over the place when all this talk
Speaker 1: about look at what this millennial did, Look how much
Speaker 1: they saved, I mean, just crushing it. And so you
Speaker 1: really are an expert on this topic. So we couldn't
Speaker 1: be more thrilled for you to be with us today.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to talk about it with your audience. Yes,
Speaker 1: I especially love that. I feel like you bring such
Speaker 1: a level headed view to financial independence. There's so much
Speaker 1: out there that's very extreme and it can be off putting,
Speaker 1: and everything you put out is just like makes a
Speaker 1: lot of sense. So I'm excited to especially talk with
Speaker 1: you about this. Yeah, I mean that was my biggest thing.
Speaker 1: It's like, how can I talk about this in a
Speaker 1: way that's actually really authentic to the way I feel
Speaker 1: about it that I'm not super I know the name
Speaker 1: of this is frugal. You know, you guys are frugality,
Speaker 1: but like for me, like, I'm not super frugal. Maybe
Speaker 1: frugal in some areas, but not really overall. And so
Speaker 1: I wanted to talk about financial independence and the pursuit
Speaker 1: of it in a way that was more attainable or
Speaker 1: more desirable to people like myself who wants to have
Speaker 1: a more balanced approach to freedom. Love that frugality absolutely
Speaker 1: intersex with financial freedom and autonomy and independence, and so
Speaker 1: certainly the message that you have absolutely intersex with what
Speaker 1: we're doing. Even if you don't wash out your zip
Speaker 1: block bags when you're done with them. I don't do
Speaker 1: that either, by the way, Yeah, who does that? But
Speaker 1: the thing about it too is like you know, sometimes
Speaker 1: you put these labels on things and it's like either
Speaker 1: good or bad, like we label it one way or
Speaker 1: the other, and I think there's so much in the
Speaker 1: middle where you know, frugality is not bad. If you
Speaker 1: don't enjoy certain things or you don't think it's something
Speaker 1: that you need, that's fine, But it's not like we
Speaker 1: always have to look at financial independence is bad it's
Speaker 1: only one way. Frugality is bad or good, It's only
Speaker 1: one way. I just think there's a spectrum that we
Speaker 1: can pick and choose what works for us and move
Speaker 1: on with our lives in a way that feels good. Yes,
Speaker 1: that message of freedom. Thank you so much for bringing
Speaker 1: that to our audience, because that is, at the end
Speaker 1: of the day, what we want to drive home is
Speaker 1: personal to each one of us, and we need to
Speaker 1: figure out what works for us. So yeah, thanks for that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you got to find your radical middle Yes, okay, So
Speaker 1: Jamila walk us a little bit through, like what is
Speaker 1: financial independence and how did you get into it? Yeah? So,
Speaker 1: I mean the technical term, you know, if there are
Speaker 1: financial independence police out there on innet are listening. But
Speaker 1: the technical term is having enough say they're invested in
Speaker 1: your portfolio, your investment portfolio, retirement portfolio, where you have
Speaker 1: enough money from that portfolio to not have to actively
Speaker 1: work anymore, so that portfolio spends off income in which
Speaker 1: you now are financially independent. You don't have to work anymore.
Speaker 1: That's the technical definition. Awesome, what got you interested in? Right,
Speaker 1: I'm still on a journey to financial independence, But what
Speaker 1: really like pique my interest in this whole movement, and
Speaker 1: I've actually changed my ideas on it since I started
Speaker 1: Journey to Launch, which is my platform. Is that I was,
Speaker 1: I would say, stuck quote unquote stuck in a commute
Speaker 1: and a job that I wasn't in love with, and
Speaker 1: so I was working in corporate Americas after graduating from college,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of got on the trajectory of climbing
Speaker 1: the corporate ladder. Although I always wanted to have more
Speaker 1: freedom in my life. Like I was always one of
Speaker 1: those kids, right, you know, I didn't like people telling
Speaker 1: me what to do. I don't know what kid does,
Speaker 1: but I mean just like I wanted to just be
Speaker 1: my own boss. I knew I felt like when I
Speaker 1: graduated from college, I wanted to, Like, I really had
Speaker 1: this idea that I was going to like not work
Speaker 1: for anyone past thirty years old. And then I didn't
Speaker 1: know how that was gonna happen. I thought, maybe, okay,
Speaker 1: I need to start a business when the lottery, I
Speaker 1: don't know, I had to do something big to make
Speaker 1: that happen. Then I started businesses in my twenties or
Speaker 1: I attempted to do different things outside of my corporate career,
Speaker 1: and none of them panned out, and so I kind
Speaker 1: of got into this thing where I guess I need
Speaker 1: to work until I'm sixty five, like everyone else in
Speaker 1: this building around me does, and that's it, Like who
Speaker 1: are you to have these big dreams? So I kind
Speaker 1: of forgot about it, or at least, you know, I
Speaker 1: thought I wouldn't be possible for me to requit my job.
Speaker 1: And then early thirties now, so I passed this mark
Speaker 1: of that I set for myself that I wasn't gonna
Speaker 1: work for anyone past thirty. I was in this commute
Speaker 1: that was really long, but at this stage I was
Speaker 1: pregnant with my first son, and so being pregnant with
Speaker 1: my son and the typical commute at that time was
Speaker 1: like an hour and a half one way, which I
Speaker 1: got used to, like being like no kids, single, you know,
Speaker 1: my life progressed to the point where I was like
Speaker 1: married by the time I was pregnant. But you know,
Speaker 1: it's different when it's just you or it's just you
Speaker 1: and your partner. So if I got home at seven
Speaker 1: thirty five, but that day when I was pregnant with
Speaker 1: my first son, it took like four hours. Like the
Speaker 1: commute was horrible one way to get home that day,
Speaker 1: and like the traffic gods were not pleased, Like everything
Speaker 1: that could go wrong that day went wrong. And so
Speaker 1: I remember just being pregnant and saying to myself, like,
Speaker 1: I can't this can't be my life. And I knew
Speaker 1: I wanted more kids, and I just said, you know,
Speaker 1: I can't do this like anymore. I need to figure
Speaker 1: out a way out. And I started to just think about, Okay,
Speaker 1: what can I do to get me into a position
Speaker 1: where this doesn't have to be my life forever? Started
Speaker 1: googling how to quit my job, like all these things right,
Speaker 1: like that maybe people do if they're in a job
Speaker 1: they don't like, how to quit my job, how to retire,
Speaker 1: Like I didn't know about financial independence in this way
Speaker 1: that I spoke about it. But then of course all
Speaker 1: these blogs started to come up. I discovered must their money,
Speaker 1: must Dash, and all these things that I actually don't
Speaker 1: follow as much anymore, but they were an entry point
Speaker 1: to open my eyes up to a way in which
Speaker 1: you can save and invest your income over time to
Speaker 1: be able to become financially into pennant. We can quit
Speaker 1: said job one day and do what you want, and
Speaker 1: so that really hooked me because I said, Okay, there's
Speaker 1: a way I can do this without necessarily being like
Speaker 1: entrepreneur or winning the lottery, Like I can do this
Speaker 1: from my job and just be smarter with the way
Speaker 1: I save and invested. And that's what really prompted me
Speaker 1: to start the journey. Awesome, It's amazing to me, Jamila.
Speaker 1: So often, not every time, but a lot of times,
Speaker 1: when we talk with people who are in this process
Speaker 1: towards reaching financial goals or kind of caught the bug
Speaker 1: of becoming debt free or whatever it is, there is
Speaker 1: typically this pivotal moment and that you can remember kind
Speaker 1: of vividly, like there's images attached to it, there's specific
Speaker 1: life circumstances attached to it. For you, it was this
Speaker 1: for our commute, pregnant and wanting something different as kind
Speaker 1: of the breaking point. But also another theme that I've
Speaker 1: realized with that is it's usually some sort of difficult moment.
Speaker 1: It's that almost like Okay, this felt off well and
Speaker 1: I didn't want to feel this again, and kind of
Speaker 1: it offers a helpful reframe, I think even for our
Speaker 1: listeners what you're describing, because it can be those very
Speaker 1: difficult moments that are the catalysts to something new that
Speaker 1: finally give us what we need to say enough, we're
Speaker 1: gonna go a different direction. We're going to be creative,
Speaker 1: We're going to find some freedom for ourselves. So I
Speaker 1: think there's a lot of really beautiful tenants in what
Speaker 1: you're describing here that can be helpful for folks. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm a big believer in It sounds corny, but I
Speaker 1: do believe everything happens for a reason. Every life experience,
Speaker 1: good or bad, you know, develops you into the person
Speaker 1: yord today. So like the trials and tribulations you're currently
Speaker 1: going through or have been through, like are preparing you
Speaker 1: for something else and possibly better, but it's pushing you forward,
Speaker 1: and it's the way you frame that. And so I
Speaker 1: definitely once I discovered that this was a thing, I
Speaker 1: use it as fuel for me to figure out a plan. Um,
Speaker 1: you know. I call it like the gift and the
Speaker 1: curse when you find about and I think this is
Speaker 1: not just financial independence but just money, just anything that
Speaker 1: like pushes you to make better decisions, but specifically financial independence. Like,
Speaker 1: once I realized it was a thing, it was a
Speaker 1: gift because I thought, Okay, so there's a way in
Speaker 1: which with my income, you know, at times married, we're
Speaker 1: starting our family, that we could do better with our
Speaker 1: lives or with our money. And in the same regard,
Speaker 1: I also felt and when I mapped it out and
Speaker 1: how long it will take us to reach our goals
Speaker 1: as like wow, like now that I know about this thing,
Speaker 1: it kind of made me more a little bit more
Speaker 1: impatient about what this could look like because I was like, wow,
Speaker 1: like I actually now have to wait seven ten years,
Speaker 1: which in the grand scheme of things is not long.
Speaker 1: But I call it the gift in curse because you're
Speaker 1: you're opened up now to this new world, a new
Speaker 1: way of doing things, which is exciting. But then now
Speaker 1: you have to make changes. You have to be patient
Speaker 1: because it's not overnight that these things happened either that
Speaker 1: the changes happen. It makes me want this like one
Speaker 1: of those signs that you get from Marshals that like says,
Speaker 1: embrace the struggle, Like there is so much growth and
Speaker 1: joy that comes out of struggles, whether they are from
Speaker 1: us or from external factors, and when we are in it,
Speaker 1: we definitely don't want to embrace it. But it's such
Speaker 1: a great reminder that it's out of the struggles that
Speaker 1: come these great things, the things that make us truly joyful. Yeah, Jamila,
Speaker 1: you mentioned that a lot has changed for you since
Speaker 1: that time, since that moment of being pregnant in the
Speaker 1: car traffic gods against you up until this point on
Speaker 1: your financial independence journey, and even not even following some
Speaker 1: of the same people, I'm curious what else you've noticed
Speaker 1: about how your pursuit of financial independence has shifted over
Speaker 1: the years. Yeah, this is a great question because when
Speaker 1: I started so initially when I was pregnant and I
Speaker 1: started to google and look into this concept. It's not
Speaker 1: that I started to write away Journey to Launch, Like,
Speaker 1: so Journey to Launch right now, it's like, you know,
Speaker 1: it's a podcast, it's all things. But in the beginning,
Speaker 1: it was just meant to be a blog because I
Speaker 1: was so inspired by the other bloggers and you know,
Speaker 1: um guests on other podcasts documenting their journey, and so
Speaker 1: I said, you know what, I'm going to document my journey.
Speaker 1: So I started Journey to Launch to do that. And
Speaker 1: at the time, myself and my husband, we're working on
Speaker 1: our job, so I was in Corporate America, and I
Speaker 1: had a pretty good job, you know, where I got
Speaker 1: bonuses and the career trajectory was where I could earn
Speaker 1: a lot of money over time. My husband's um a teacher,
Speaker 1: but together our income living in New York City was
Speaker 1: pretty good. And so you know, it was all about
Speaker 1: how much can we save and invest, like how aggressively relatively,
Speaker 1: like where we can still enjoy the things we did,
Speaker 1: but that we can like save as much as of
Speaker 1: our income as possible so that I could possibly And
Speaker 1: at the time when I started officially started Journey to Launch,
Speaker 1: I was like, I'm gonna quit and reach financial independence
Speaker 1: my version of it by forty years old. But at
Speaker 1: the time we had our jobs, we had income to
Speaker 1: do that. So the first two years that we intentionally
Speaker 1: started this, I was able to We were able to
Speaker 1: save a hundred and sixty nine thousand dollars between our
Speaker 1: four one k's, our four three B plan, like using
Speaker 1: all the tax advantage retirement accounts. As I started to
Speaker 1: document this to be a Journey to Launch, um, you know,
Speaker 1: I eventually did. I had a podcast and all these things.
Speaker 1: I started to realize, like, wait a second, there's a
Speaker 1: lot going on here because now I'm working this job. Um,
Speaker 1: by then I forgot how many kids I have at
Speaker 1: that at that time, I had three now, but they
Speaker 1: started started to grow, right, and so I didn't like
Speaker 1: so um my first was already born by the time
Speaker 1: I started Journey to Launch. But then as I started
Speaker 1: to get really into financial independence and figuring out my path,
Speaker 1: I started to have more kids. And so by then
Speaker 1: I was like juggling a full time job which was
Speaker 1: pretty demanding, a really crazy commute kids and then two
Speaker 1: at the time because I had my second son by then,
Speaker 1: and then Journey to Launch, which was kind of taken off.
Speaker 1: So I would come home after the kids go to bed,
Speaker 1: and then I would do the podcast and blogs and
Speaker 1: all this stuff. And you guys know how much work
Speaker 1: that is. And so I started to like think to myself, like,
Speaker 1: there's no way I can sustain this for the next
Speaker 1: you know, five six years at that time, right, because
Speaker 1: my goal was to work in my job, you know,
Speaker 1: get that money, save and invest, and then be able
Speaker 1: to quit do my own thing and like not have
Speaker 1: to worry about money. And I was like, wait a second,
Speaker 1: I can't that's not going to be sustainable with as
Speaker 1: much as I have going on, And so I had
Speaker 1: to come to the decision of if I was going
Speaker 1: to continue to do all the things or drop something.
Speaker 1: And you know, the job didn't make the cut. I
Speaker 1: had to actually leave my job in order to really
Speaker 1: create balance in my life and continue on this path
Speaker 1: at my own pace. Yeah, most people would have dropped
Speaker 1: the podcast. Most people do drop their podcast. It's impressive
Speaker 1: when somebody podcasts past ten episodes. Well, this is so.
Speaker 1: This is why you know my ideas and what I
Speaker 1: believe and think about financial independence have shifted and evolved
Speaker 1: over time. Is because you know, if you look at
Speaker 1: why people want financial independence or financial freedom, if you
Speaker 1: don't you know that term is too much for you
Speaker 1: or to pay off that and all these things, you
Speaker 1: just you want more options, you want more flexibility, you
Speaker 1: want ownership of your time. And so if you are
Speaker 1: able to create that without necessarily all the money in
Speaker 1: the bank just yet and more flexibility and freedom, like
Speaker 1: you won or you're winning in a way. And so
Speaker 1: realizing that while I wouldn't be financially independent, while this
Speaker 1: would be a big risk because my income at the
Speaker 1: time was you know, more than half the income of
Speaker 1: the household. I had the most potential to earn more
Speaker 1: money than my husband did as a teacher, and so
Speaker 1: for me to walk away from that to have the
Speaker 1: flexibility that I have now, I mean, it's not like
Speaker 1: it's not hard work to be a full time entrepreneur,
Speaker 1: but to have the flexibility to have a bit more
Speaker 1: freedom and options, I was like, that is the goal, right,
Speaker 1: And so I said to myself, if it's going to
Speaker 1: be more money at this job versus like my sanity,
Speaker 1: my health, just my happiness versus who knows what's going
Speaker 1: to happen with this business, but hey, we'll be okay,
Speaker 1: and I would have, you know, more, just balance in
Speaker 1: my life. It was like a no brainer for me
Speaker 1: at that point that had to pick myself and journey
Speaker 1: to launch and the kids more than the job. I
Speaker 1: appreciate the calculated risks that you're describing in your story
Speaker 1: that it was a risk to step away from what
Speaker 1: you're describing a pretty decent job, but yet wasn't providing
Speaker 1: you the flexibility. But you didn't do that immediately. It
Speaker 1: was a learning process of following others. It was alright,
Speaker 1: beginning to look at your own story it was staying
Speaker 1: in your job for a little while and building this
Speaker 1: other thing to see if this is worth investing more into.
Speaker 1: And that is such a good point because you know,
Speaker 1: this was a calculated risk. I didn't like decide one
Speaker 1: day and just like quit. So the moment that I
Speaker 1: did know that I wanted to quit, like I we
Speaker 1: got pregnant with my third um child, and I said
Speaker 1: to myself, by the time, like I'm off from maternity leave,
Speaker 1: I would like not to have to go back to work.
Speaker 1: And so that gives us, you know, a year and
Speaker 1: a half to figure this out, you know, to start
Speaker 1: saving money in order to support this big life change
Speaker 1: because my husband's job at that point and still today
Speaker 1: doesn't cover all of our expenses. So we needed to
Speaker 1: create like this runway, this f you fund um, you
Speaker 1: know where it was going to sustain us while I
Speaker 1: figured Journey to launch out, while I figured out what
Speaker 1: was going to be happening. And you know, at the time,
Speaker 1: Journey Songs wasn't making it like hardly anything compared to
Speaker 1: what I was bringing in, but there was potential and
Speaker 1: I knew that if I had more time to focus
Speaker 1: on it, I could grow it to something bigger, But
Speaker 1: I think on the calculated risk are important in terms
Speaker 1: of if you have a job. So I'm not for
Speaker 1: like everyone should be entrepreneur with their jobs. Like I
Speaker 1: think working is amazing if you can find a job
Speaker 1: that you love and that you know pays you what
Speaker 1: you want to be paid and has great benefits, Like
Speaker 1: that's not a bad thing. You know, you can use
Speaker 1: that job to help you know, fund the things you
Speaker 1: love and your investments and your life, like that's not horrible. Um,
Speaker 1: I don't think everyone is meant to become an entrepreneur.
Speaker 1: So for me, it's like if you're doing something, if
Speaker 1: you're working somewhere right now, whether you love it or not.
Speaker 1: If you love it, that's great, But like be intentional,
Speaker 1: you that money like has something that's going to propel
Speaker 1: you forward, like you know, look at what the income
Speaker 1: can do for you as you you know, grow in
Speaker 1: the job or the position or what you want to
Speaker 1: do in life. Because that's honestly, without my job, I
Speaker 1: would not have been able to do all the things
Speaker 1: that I've done, um so far. Absolutely, and thanks for
Speaker 1: saying that, Jamila. It's not as if anyone out there
Speaker 1: has to start their own blog. That was your process,
Speaker 1: and I know that's the message that you're speaking of
Speaker 1: freedom of whatever it is. There can be financial independence
Speaker 1: available to people. A lot of what you're describing is
Speaker 1: just going aggressively at saving and investing. For you, the
Speaker 1: pathway forward in that was blogging and teaching other people
Speaker 1: how to do this. But it doesn't have to be that.
Speaker 1: The primary focus is what can we be doing to
Speaker 1: be getting at these goals more aggressively rather than just
Speaker 1: going about life status quo. There are more options out there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And I do want to say about the aggressive part,
Speaker 1: because we were more aggressive in the beginning when we
Speaker 1: had the income, because we had the flexibility to do that.
Speaker 1: But when I made the decision to stop that, I
Speaker 1: didn't wanted to quit. The whole time working up to
Speaker 1: that while I was pregnant, we had to save that money.
Speaker 1: So we have to stop investing all together in our
Speaker 1: investment accounts in order to save enough cash to have
Speaker 1: to be comfortable. And even after that, now working full time,
Speaker 1: the first two years almost we weren't investing again because
Speaker 1: we needed that money to be able to live. And
Speaker 1: so every journey, every path is going to be different
Speaker 1: depending on your circumstance. And so if you're in a
Speaker 1: position where you can aggressively save and invest because you
Speaker 1: have the income and or you're super frugal and you
Speaker 1: enjoy the lifestyle, then do that, right. But I find
Speaker 1: that sometimes people feel really bad, which I don't want
Speaker 1: them to feel that they can't do as much, because
Speaker 1: if you have small kids and you have to work
Speaker 1: and pay for daycare, that's an expense you can't get
Speaker 1: out of, right, Like if you are commuting or just
Speaker 1: there's life happening, Like you have to adjust for that
Speaker 1: in your journey. And it's okay if there are some
Speaker 1: points where you can't do the most, especially in the pandemic, right, Like,
Speaker 1: we're still going through this and people's situations have changed
Speaker 1: so much. So I just want to just caution that
Speaker 1: everyone's journey looks different. And I had to adjust the
Speaker 1: way we say and invested as a family based on
Speaker 1: our circumstances, and most likely you will have to also. Yeah,
Speaker 1: thank you for saying that. Sometimes, like not investing on
Speaker 1: financial independence can be like big red x is. But
Speaker 1: I mean we we did the same thing. I got
Speaker 1: laid off six weeks before I had my first son,
Speaker 1: and we stopped investing for the first year just to
Speaker 1: make sure and then loan hold the pandemic happen. And
Speaker 1: my husband works in aircraft maintenance, so we still weren't investment.
Speaker 1: We're and besides our I R S and so now
Speaker 1: we're kind of like starting to get back into that
Speaker 1: like aggressive. But yeah, we took time off and like
Speaker 1: part of me was feeling like guilty, and I had
Speaker 1: to keep reminding myself, like you don't get that money back.
Speaker 1: Sometimes you just need to pay for things and you
Speaker 1: need to have money. Well, so interesting is so this
Speaker 1: whole talk, And you know, I think it's interesting because
Speaker 1: you can make all the plans in the world about
Speaker 1: what you're gonna do when you get to a certain point,
Speaker 1: and then it happens and it feels totally different because
Speaker 1: we essentially created this fund, this few fund, and I
Speaker 1: don't know if I don't think I need to explain
Speaker 1: what that is, or maybe I do. But it's like
Speaker 1: enough money to sustain you right, like for a long time.
Speaker 1: So it's more than maybe an emergency fund, but like
Speaker 1: it's money where you can use this to walk away
Speaker 1: from something or do something different and not have to
Speaker 1: really worry about your bills, and so we planned that
Speaker 1: this money would start to decrease over time because journey
Speaker 1: to launch was not making money um and contributing to
Speaker 1: the household income. And even with that, even knowing that
Speaker 1: and planning for it and having this big like you know,
Speaker 1: lump sum, seeing it like deplete every month was like
Speaker 1: it was like it was crazy. It was actually like
Speaker 1: that wasn't a good feeling because I was so used
Speaker 1: to being able to grow money, save and invest. But
Speaker 1: to see it now going down every month, even though
Speaker 1: I knew that what was going to happen, but to
Speaker 1: see it actually happened definitely, um like it was I'm comfortable,
Speaker 1: but also remembering that this is what you plan for,
Speaker 1: like and also to understand the trade off, right, So
Speaker 1: the tradeoff for me taking that money out of our savings,
Speaker 1: it was me being home, being able to work on
Speaker 1: my business, having more flexibility, Like not just seeing the
Speaker 1: money depleting, but seeing what that money was giving back
Speaker 1: to me, Like that actually wasn't an investment, even though
Speaker 1: what it didn't seem like it at the time. It
Speaker 1: was an investment into what I'm doing now, my happiness
Speaker 1: and my time and so you know, you have to
Speaker 1: reframe the way you think about things a lot of
Speaker 1: the times. Yeah, definitely. So for people who want to
Speaker 1: pursue financial independence, what do you think is something that's
Speaker 1: like most helpful to note for people starting out that journey. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so you have to break this out into steps to
Speaker 1: make it more desirable or attainable. Because if you think
Speaker 1: about so, technically, if you wanted to pursue the technical definition,
Speaker 1: the quick rule of thumb is multiplying how much you
Speaker 1: want to spend um annually by twenty right, So that's
Speaker 1: what the point in which you reach financial and the
Speaker 1: penance because then you can withdraw four percent of that
Speaker 1: portfolio every year without technically running out of money. If
Speaker 1: you do that calculation based on how much you spend,
Speaker 1: that can possibly be a big number. Like for certain
Speaker 1: people who are maybe frugal, don't spend a lot, maybe
Speaker 1: it's not as huge. But if you are, you know,
Speaker 1: I have kids, spend a lot and or like certain
Speaker 1: things that maybe a lot of money. And so when
Speaker 1: you make that compulation and you look at where you
Speaker 1: are currently, it can seem like a long ways away, right,
Speaker 1: Like if you have debt, if you're not earning enough
Speaker 1: all these things, and I think that can sometimes just
Speaker 1: be you know, that's why most people, and you know,
Speaker 1: I don't necessarily disagree with them, think that financial independence
Speaker 1: is not possible. But I do think what's possible is
Speaker 1: so I break down the journey to financial independence in
Speaker 1: stages because I want people to understand that it's a
Speaker 1: marathon and there are different things that you have to
Speaker 1: do to get to this ultimate goal. And so like
Speaker 1: the first stage um is becoming just financially like stable,
Speaker 1: that you can pay your bills, pay your debt and
Speaker 1: not go into the red every month and put money
Speaker 1: on your credit card. Like that's just stage one, right,
Speaker 1: stage two, and I call them the journey or stages
Speaker 1: in my content. But stage two I call it like
Speaker 1: the cadet stage, where like you're paying off debt, consumer debt,
Speaker 1: and so that stage can take a while depending on
Speaker 1: what kind of consumer debt you have. You know, I
Speaker 1: don't include like a mortgage or student loan debt in
Speaker 1: there because those balances can tend to be high. And
Speaker 1: then once you pay for your debt, which can take
Speaker 1: years or you know, who knows how long, the next
Speaker 1: stage is stage three, the aviator stage, you're building your assets,
Speaker 1: so you paid off most of your debts, so now
Speaker 1: you can focus on growing your assets, your investments. And
Speaker 1: then stage four is where you can get to work flexibility,
Speaker 1: which is what I currently have. So I believe everyone
Speaker 1: can get to stage four. I do believe that it
Speaker 1: can be possible for everyone, meaning work flexibility defined as
Speaker 1: you can choose what you want to do. So it
Speaker 1: doesn't mean you don't have to work. You still have
Speaker 1: to bring in money, but you have more flexibility and
Speaker 1: what you choose to do, maybe you can take a break,
Speaker 1: you know, whether that's to have kids, travel the world.
Speaker 1: But because you set up such a solid foundation by
Speaker 1: passing all those other steps, you have more options. You're
Speaker 1: not like stuck in a bad situation or place because
Speaker 1: you can't pay your bills. And then stage five, like
Speaker 1: that's the next stage that is complete financial independence. So
Speaker 1: I tell people when they're looking at this is to
Speaker 1: break it up in the stages. Identify the stage you're in.
Speaker 1: Realize that you know each stage has its own moleth
Speaker 1: zones within it, to be very proud of yourself for that,
Speaker 1: but to look at this in a way that motivates
Speaker 1: you instead of like deters you like, you know, don't
Speaker 1: set like the goal of all I need to like
Speaker 1: save an invest two million, I'm only at negative thirty thousand,
Speaker 1: or you know, depending on where you are, and this
Speaker 1: feels like I can't do it. Set your mouth zones
Speaker 1: within those different stages so that you can, you know,
Speaker 1: feel good about the progress you make. I love the
Speaker 1: way that you succinctly identified kind of how you can
Speaker 1: move through this. I think that's so much of the battle.
Speaker 1: Is this goal competition or what should I be focusing
Speaker 1: on first or next? Or I know that something we
Speaker 1: run into with people and myself of okay, I'm debt
Speaker 1: free now what that took so much of my time,
Speaker 1: energy and attention. What do I do now? And I
Speaker 1: have a clear pathway forward, but again, as you say,
Speaker 1: with milestones in it, with freedoms within that to define
Speaker 1: how that's gonna look. And thank you for certainly tempering
Speaker 1: me with my use of the word aggression, but also
Speaker 1: with identifying that work flexibility doesn't necessarily mean that everyone
Speaker 1: gets to just sit at home and work on not
Speaker 1: just sit at home working computer that comes with its
Speaker 1: sound difficulties do but that it looks different. We still
Speaker 1: need all of the different trades and career paths, but
Speaker 1: really that flexibility to not feel stuck, that you can
Speaker 1: move into something else if what you are currently doing
Speaker 1: is not for you, it's not making enough income for
Speaker 1: your family or your needs, or you're just not enjoying it.
Speaker 1: So just this message of freedom that's woven throughout here
Speaker 1: is so appreciated. I don't know, Jamila, if you have
Speaker 1: anything outside of these stages, and you've outlined this beautifully,
Speaker 1: but if somebody is kind of hearing this and saying, yeah,
Speaker 1: I want to aim at this, is there something that
Speaker 1: they should be considering doing first, maybe even before entering
Speaker 1: into stage one, or maybe in the midst of stage one.
Speaker 1: Like if someone saying, yes, I want this, what would
Speaker 1: you advise as one of the very first steps to take. Well,
Speaker 1: first you need to know where you currently are. So
Speaker 1: like assessment and like getting the numbers out there is
Speaker 1: key because you can define like your target point, where
Speaker 1: you ultimately want to be and how much you ultimately
Speaker 1: want to have, which, by the way, it can change
Speaker 1: because your life, what you prefer the things change over time, right,
Speaker 1: But it's important to understand what you're starting point is,
Speaker 1: and so you're gonna have to take inventory of what
Speaker 1: your current liabilities are, where your current assets are, what's
Speaker 1: your income, what's your expenses, like the four major things income, expenses, assets, liabilities,
Speaker 1: and really get that in front of you on paper.
Speaker 1: And for most people, right like the big idea, like
Speaker 1: we talk about this a lot, like the big concepts,
Speaker 1: or at least I do the big concepts of freedom
Speaker 1: and financial independence. But then people like, it's everyday life
Speaker 1: people need to live, including myself, Like what on every
Speaker 1: day like in scenario, what are you doing with your
Speaker 1: money where it's not overwhelming, where you're you feel in
Speaker 1: control of it? And so the first step is to
Speaker 1: know your numbers and then figure out how money money
Speaker 1: management like system and tool that you can use to
Speaker 1: now help you get to your goals. So whether that
Speaker 1: is getting that budget together. You have debt that you
Speaker 1: need to work on, okay, so what is a debt
Speaker 1: payoff plant and how does that look and how we
Speaker 1: accomplish it. But the first step ultimately is understanding where
Speaker 1: you are. So assessment. We just cannot skip over this
Speaker 1: phase as much as people want to. Oh and that yeah,
Speaker 1: that can be a big barrier for people. I don't.
Speaker 1: I am surprised by how many people listen to the
Speaker 1: show and pursue like financial education and then I ask, Okay,
Speaker 1: how much debt do you have and you're like, I don't.
Speaker 1: I don't haven't taken a tally, And I'm like, but
Speaker 1: you have to know your numbers before you can completely
Speaker 1: like move from them. Well, and some people don't want to,
Speaker 1: like you don't want to actually see it, and you
Speaker 1: don't want to know like how much you're spending. Like
Speaker 1: it never fails every time that I have someone to
Speaker 1: do this exercise where they are actually like looking back
Speaker 1: at how much they spent over the last three months,
Speaker 1: Like they're like, I never knew I was spending that
Speaker 1: much on like going out or groceries or all these
Speaker 1: little items. And so, you know, it can seem a
Speaker 1: little bit overwhelming at earth, but you know it's necessary.
Speaker 1: You have to at least take inventory or where you
Speaker 1: currently are in order to figure out how you're going
Speaker 1: to move forward. It's the first step in being able
Speaker 1: to then have any level of control over it or
Speaker 1: determine how you're moving forward. You know, I would like
Speaker 1: to point out something here because I know I'm talking
Speaker 1: about like you know, tactical, like you know, numbers, but
Speaker 1: ultimately I am a big believer of mindset and habits.
Speaker 1: It's I always say, people do want to go strictly
Speaker 1: to like how can I reduce my expenses? How can
Speaker 1: I make more money? Which are important, Like those are
Speaker 1: the two things that are going to get you to
Speaker 1: your goals, like earning more and optimizing for expenses. But
Speaker 1: none of that can be completed or done or sustained
Speaker 1: without the mindset to do it and the habits to
Speaker 1: help you do it. And so I actually believe that
Speaker 1: you know, if you're listening to this podcast and you know,
Speaker 1: it's great that you're aware. Awareness is the first step
Speaker 1: that this is something that you should be into or
Speaker 1: thinking about. But it's really mindset and habits that are
Speaker 1: going to sustain you and determine what the journey is
Speaker 1: like for you. So I wanted to just like say,
Speaker 1: you know, working on your money mindset, working on your
Speaker 1: overall health and quality of life and how you feel
Speaker 1: about yourself and money is extremely important. I affirm this
Speaker 1: were whole people. We're not just financial or just relational, right,
Speaker 1: we are emotional, mental, spiritual relational beings, and they all
Speaker 1: work in conjunction. And so the more we're able to
Speaker 1: care for all aspects of our personhood, the better off
Speaker 1: will be. Yes, speaking of just taking care of importance
Speaker 1: and things that make us better off. Bill, Bill, that's right,
Speaker 1: it's time for the best minute of your entire week.
Speaker 1: Maybe a baby was born and his name is William.
Speaker 1: Maybe you paid off your mortgage, maybe your car died,
Speaker 1: and you're happy to not have to pay that bill anymore.
Speaker 1: Tough bills, Buffalo bills, Bill Clinton, this is the bill
Speaker 1: of the week, Jamila. Every week we invite a listener
Speaker 1: or our guests, we have one on to share with
Speaker 1: us their bill of the week, and we sprung this
Speaker 1: on you very last minute, Jamila, you can just start
Speaker 1: off with your bill. Yes, whilst I've had some time
Speaker 1: a little bit of time to think about this. And
Speaker 1: the bill that I actually love paying is help with
Speaker 1: for my kids. So I am, you know, working from home,
Speaker 1: and luckily I do have help where know, someone can
Speaker 1: watch my kids while I'm doing my work, and so
Speaker 1: I gladly play and this someone I'm acting like this person.
Speaker 1: I don't know. This someone is my aunt. So I
Speaker 1: am really grateful that I'm able to, you know, provide
Speaker 1: her with income and then also get some you know,
Speaker 1: relief and space so that I can do what I
Speaker 1: you know, love to do, which is journey to launch.
Speaker 1: So I am that's a bill I gladly pay, and
Speaker 1: I wish I could pay her more. And that's when
Speaker 1: I need to like, I'm with you. Daycare is the
Speaker 1: best money I pay every other week, and I will pay.
Speaker 1: I tried to pay her more so I could leave
Speaker 1: him there longer, and she's like, no, this is fine,
Speaker 1: and I was like, please, no, you keep him on
Speaker 1: the weekend maybe like I don't know, Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I can't. I know. I'm really lucky to have that.
Speaker 1: And so yeah, I gladly pay her her money and
Speaker 1: whenever I can value space spending, I love that. That's
Speaker 1: what comes with financial independ sundance and frugality. Absolutely. If
Speaker 1: you want to submit your bill of the week, if
Speaker 1: it's a bill about having people care for your sweet
Speaker 1: young cherubs or anything else, please visit Frugal Friends podcast
Speaker 1: dot com slash bill, leave us your bill, surprise us,
Speaker 1: let us know, and now it's time for I left
Speaker 1: you hanging there I'm so sorry to the lightning round.
Speaker 1: We are going to go around and share the next
Speaker 1: financial milestone we are each working on. So Jamila as
Speaker 1: our guest, you can go first, all right, my next
Speaker 1: financial milestone. Okay, So here's the thing. We have started
Speaker 1: to invest again. Feels amazing, and before the end of
Speaker 1: the year opened up my SOULO four one K. I'm
Speaker 1: waiting like to do my whole like tax returns first
Speaker 1: to see like the max that I feel like I
Speaker 1: want to put into that solo for O one K.
Speaker 1: So I'm really excited about that too, invest into that
Speaker 1: account for the first time since you know, leaving my job.
Speaker 1: Being able to invest in a pre tax with time
Speaker 1: and account, that's awesome. That is actually almost the same
Speaker 1: thing that I'm saying. So our next goal is to
Speaker 1: have like we hit the hundred thousand milestone for both
Speaker 1: of us, and now we want to hit a hundred
Speaker 1: thousand each. And so my husband's starting a new job
Speaker 1: in two weeks, I guess um and he won't have
Speaker 1: a four oh one k, like a good four oh
Speaker 1: one k anymore. So I have to open my solo
Speaker 1: for one K and I will have Yeah, I have
Speaker 1: to do that in the next few weeks. So I
Speaker 1: was just researching before we got on this interview. Yeah,
Speaker 1: well yeah, it's I mean, it was super simple for
Speaker 1: me to do. I just opened it up because from
Speaker 1: what my tax person said, like I needed to open
Speaker 1: it up before the end of twenty twenty in order
Speaker 1: to contribute it like after the fact. Whatever, all this
Speaker 1: tax talk. But all I know is I'm excited to
Speaker 1: start investing again in that way, because you know, I
Speaker 1: like investing in saving um and growing money. So it's
Speaker 1: really exciting to get back here. I'm in a bit
Speaker 1: different of a place than you both. So here's the
Speaker 1: here's the real time freedom that's happening over here. I've
Speaker 1: got so much goal competition with money, and so there's
Speaker 1: this element. And Jen has been so helpful with this.
Speaker 1: So Okay, where can I put small amounts of money,
Speaker 1: but where can I also really be going hard right now?
Speaker 1: And so one of our goals my husband and I
Speaker 1: just bought a home and it needs renovations. As Jen
Speaker 1: so lovingly describes my new home, it's a dumpster fire.
Speaker 1: It's got good livable, it's got good bones, and it's
Speaker 1: going to be lovely. But we want to cash flow
Speaker 1: our home renovations. We are out of debt, of course,
Speaker 1: other than this mortgage we just saddled ourselves with. But
Speaker 1: I don't want to get into more debt, and so
Speaker 1: we're cash flowing home renovations. That's our goal for this
Speaker 1: year is to put as much money as we can
Speaker 1: to go at that hard, so that in the coming
Speaker 1: year or two we can then look at going at
Speaker 1: greater money into investments and retirement accounts. But for this year,
Speaker 1: it's a new kitchen. But we we did set up
Speaker 1: your roth IRA contributions. I pulled out my computer one
Speaker 1: night she was at my house, and I was like, girl,
Speaker 1: we need to get you invested. I was like, but
Speaker 1: I see putting money into my home as an investment,
Speaker 1: and you're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, I support you. You
Speaker 1: were so good with me. But let's put a little
Speaker 1: bit of money in so that you're not completely halting
Speaker 1: this and then still go hard at your home renovation.
Speaker 1: So I feel good about that. I'm not completely putting
Speaker 1: other goals on the back burner entirely, but also not
Speaker 1: probably won't be maxing out the roth IRA this year.
Speaker 1: That's okay. A little bit and It's okay. Time in
Speaker 1: the market is more important than the amount invested. Were
Speaker 1: we got you and my home will be where so
Speaker 1: much more money I've specially here and you'll enjoy it too, right,
Speaker 1: Like that's part of just like selecting the things you
Speaker 1: do and why you're doing it. So, yeah, you need
Speaker 1: that new kitchen. Everyone knows there's like exposed wires and
Speaker 1: tile falling off the walls, very weird, but I don't
Speaker 1: want to go into debt for it. So this is
Speaker 1: what needs to happen. Yes, well, Jamila, thank you again
Speaker 1: for coming on. This is a great conversation. And uh,
Speaker 1: I hope that it is kind of made financial independence
Speaker 1: more accessible two more people and believe that it is
Speaker 1: more attainable for them. Where can people get more from
Speaker 1: you if they want to hear your beautiful voice more? Well?
Speaker 1: Thank you And so if wherever you listen to this podcast,
Speaker 1: you can just type in Journey to launch and you'll
Speaker 1: find my podcast which you can listen to. I also
Speaker 1: drop episodes every Wednesday, you know whether it's so episodes
Speaker 1: with me or guests. And you can also find me
Speaker 1: at Instagram, Facebook, or Twitter, and mostly hang out on
Speaker 1: Instagram at Journey to Law Launch and you can go
Speaker 1: to my website which I just got redone by the way,
Speaker 1: so Journey to Launch dot com for more information. Very cool. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Journey to Launch is an amazing podcast, so definitely go
Speaker 1: subscribe right now. Yeah, and it gets me excited about
Speaker 1: space exploration. To your intro music, I'm like, how fitting. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's so funny. I didn't know at the time, like
Speaker 1: I'd go so far, which is why my journey or
Speaker 1: stage is also sound, you know, like I'm based them
Speaker 1: off of like traveling to space and like the position
Speaker 1: people have, Like I was like, I might as well
Speaker 1: just right like here, I am. Well good. Yes, if
Speaker 1: you love space exploration, definitely get financial independence. He's a
Speaker 1: good blend. Thanks so much, Jamila, so great talking with you,
Speaker 1: and best wishes to you with the beginning investing. Again,
Speaker 1: thank you so much. That was fantastic, so so great.
Speaker 1: Just as you said at the beginning of the episode,
Speaker 1: such an approachable way that Jamila presents this concept. And
Speaker 1: I know we keep using this word freedom, but I
Speaker 1: think it's genuine to the way that she positions herself,
Speaker 1: how she messages about this, and I it gets me
Speaker 1: excited at least I know, even as someone who is
Speaker 1: aiding and putting this content out, it's also speaking to
Speaker 1: me something to aim at and ways to get there.
Speaker 1: It's so great. Yeah, absolutely, so definitely. If financial independence
Speaker 1: is something you're interested in or just hearing other great interviews,
Speaker 1: for sure go and subscribe to Journey to Launch. You
Speaker 1: will definitely enjoy it. We highly recommend and please, if
Speaker 1: you like this show in these interviews, leave us a
Speaker 1: review on iTunes or stitchers. We very much appreciate that too,
Speaker 1: and we thank you so much. I have given us
Speaker 1: the goal to get a thousand and reviews this year.
Speaker 1: We are very far away from it, but with your
Speaker 1: help we can do it. Like this one from Hannah
Speaker 1: Jane Price, informed, fun, practical, and it just happens to
Speaker 1: be five stars. She says, if you're not subscribed to this,
Speaker 1: you need to be. After discovering this fantastic resource about
Speaker 1: eighteen months ago and going on a full frugal friends Binge,
Speaker 1: Jen and Jill feel like old friends who just never
Speaker 1: miss with what I need to hear. Sometimes it's a
Speaker 1: new way of looking at something, sometimes just validating or
Speaker 1: reinforcing what needs renewed attention. In my financial life. What
Speaker 1: sets this podcast apart from many others I've tried, it's
Speaker 1: just how informed their perspective is. They aren't afraid to
Speaker 1: acknowledge the underlying emotional side of personal finance and offer
Speaker 1: honest and practical advice that suits all circumstances. There's something
Speaker 1: here for everyone. Can't recommend enough. Wow, that was beautiful
Speaker 1: written and really comprehensive. Not all reviews need to be
Speaker 1: this comprehensive, but we so appreciate it. Some really helpful
Speaker 1: feedback here about what you enjoy about the podcast, and
Speaker 1: it helps others to know if they're going to find
Speaker 1: what they're looking for in our podcast. We know we're
Speaker 1: not for everyone, but we're so glad to be here
Speaker 1: for you who appreciate our style and the way that
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Speaker 1: that if you win. Okay, see you next week. A
Speaker 1: Frugal Friends is produced by Eric Syrian is our assistant producer.
Speaker 1: You are you, Jennifer? No, I've told you about Jennifer before.
Speaker 1: She's my v A and when I have her doing
Speaker 1: Frugal Friends work she's the assistant producer. You have told
Speaker 1: me about her. I just wanted to make sure that
Speaker 1: you weren't referring to yourself and in the third person.
Speaker 1: I would never do that. Good to know, like I
Speaker 1: would never get on TikTok. Yeah, exactly, we know how
Speaker 1: much to take, how serious to take your never's so embarrassing. Well,
Speaker 1: at least you're following me on TikTok. At least you're
Speaker 1: doing it. You're doing the thing. Thank you. Finding your
Speaker 1: own journey