1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:04,560 Speaker 1: Dear listener, a warning. This episode deals with depression and 2 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:06,960 Speaker 1: mentions violence against women. Take care. 3 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:12,360 Speaker 2: All of my writing is based in part on my ancestors, 4 00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,800 Speaker 2: and in a lot of ways, I'm trying to honor 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:18,640 Speaker 2: them and I'm trying to make them seen. When I 6 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,320 Speaker 2: was growing up, I could never pick up a book, 7 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:25,120 Speaker 2: turn on the TV, listen to the radio and find 8 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 2: people like us or people like us who are allowed 9 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:31,319 Speaker 2: to talk about the nuance of their identity. Everything was 10 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:35,239 Speaker 2: always sort of neatly put into categories, and those categories 11 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:37,040 Speaker 2: did not represent who we were. 12 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:45,239 Speaker 1: Brock Putromedia and PRX. It's Latino USA. I'm Marie jo 13 00:00:45,320 --> 00:00:49,720 Speaker 1: Josa Today. Author Kali Fajardo Einstein on how she's honoring 14 00:00:49,760 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: her ancestors through her writing. Collie Fajardo and Stein was 15 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:03,960 Speaker 1: a high school senior in Denver, Colorado, in the early 16 00:01:04,040 --> 00:01:07,960 Speaker 1: two thousands when she begged an English teacher to let 17 00:01:08,040 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: her into an advanced placement English class. Collie says she 18 00:01:12,360 --> 00:01:15,040 Speaker 1: knew then she wanted to become a writer. 19 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 2: She looked at my grades, and she looked at my 20 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:24,399 Speaker 2: track record, and she was like, there's no way that 21 00:01:24,440 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 2: you're going to be able to withstand this workload. 22 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:31,679 Speaker 1: At the time, Collie was struggling with depression. She fell 23 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: into a deep depressive episode and missed school for several days. 24 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:39,319 Speaker 3: And when I came back, it was my English teacher. 25 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,039 Speaker 2: She pulled me aside and she told me that I 26 00:01:42,160 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 2: wasn't cut out for school and she didn't think that 27 00:01:44,600 --> 00:01:47,120 Speaker 2: I should continue on. And she said, you know, you 28 00:01:47,200 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 2: might be a pretty good writer someday, but you're just 29 00:01:49,600 --> 00:01:50,680 Speaker 2: not cut out for school. 30 00:01:56,600 --> 00:02:00,680 Speaker 1: Collie did drop out of high school. She got her 31 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: ged and went on to get a Bachelor of Arts 32 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: in English, a minor in Chicano Chicana studies, and an MFA. 33 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:12,919 Speaker 1: She was also an independent bookseller in Denver for more 34 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 1: than a decade. 35 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 2: I wanted to share that because, you know, I was 36 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,919 Speaker 2: one of those students, ones that people looked at and said, 37 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:22,560 Speaker 2: this person will never amount to anything. I know that 38 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 2: there are so many students out there that are really struggling, 39 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 2: and I want them to know that they can achieve 40 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:30,040 Speaker 2: what they want if they really do set their mind 41 00:02:30,080 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 2: to it. 42 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:35,240 Speaker 1: Collie is the author of Sabrina and Gorina, a collection 43 00:02:35,320 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: of short stories based on the lives of mixed Chicano 44 00:02:39,160 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 1: and Chicana people in and around Denver. Collie herself identifies 45 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 1: as a mixed Chicana woman. She also has Indigenous, Filipino, 46 00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: and German ancestry. These nuanced identities and stories can be 47 00:02:54,240 --> 00:02:57,919 Speaker 1: found within the pages of her work. But the road 48 00:02:58,000 --> 00:03:00,080 Speaker 1: to getting published wasn't. 49 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:06,520 Speaker 2: You know. Sometimes when I look back through my old emails, 50 00:03:07,080 --> 00:03:09,280 Speaker 2: it makes me feel so sad to just see the 51 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:12,840 Speaker 2: hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of rejections. I was told 52 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:14,840 Speaker 2: that nobody would want stories like this. 53 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:19,400 Speaker 1: Sabrina and Karina became a finalist for the National Book 54 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:21,200 Speaker 1: Award in twenty nineteen. 55 00:03:21,639 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: Nobody was really talking about that book when it first 56 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,240 Speaker 2: came out, but the people were, my community was, and 57 00:03:28,400 --> 00:03:31,679 Speaker 2: my community really carried that book and pushed it up 58 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:33,840 Speaker 2: and out into the national sphere. 59 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: And now Collie, who is thirty five years old, has 60 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 1: just released her debut novel, Woman of Light. In this episode, 61 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:46,760 Speaker 1: Collie talks about how her life, experiences, and identity blend 62 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:50,360 Speaker 1: into her work and how she's honoring her ancestors from 63 00:03:50,360 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 1: the American Southwest. Here's Collie Fajardo Einstein in her own words. 64 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 3: My family, my ancestors. 65 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 2: You know, we've been in Denver now for over one 66 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 2: hundred years, and we still run in to prejudice and 67 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,599 Speaker 2: to people saying, this isn't your place, this isn't your city, 68 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:24,200 Speaker 2: this isn't where you belong. And so Woman of Light 69 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 2: is really my attempt to show the world that we exist, 70 00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:32,560 Speaker 2: and not only do we exist, we have really big, entertaining, 71 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:36,240 Speaker 2: dramatic stories, and I hope I'm providing that space for 72 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: others who maybe come from these ancestries that are. 73 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:41,919 Speaker 3: Oftentimes very confusing. 74 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 2: They've been taken away from us, our stories have been 75 00:04:44,800 --> 00:04:49,720 Speaker 2: stripped of us. From eighteen sixty eight to nineteen thirty four, 76 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 2: this novel spans the Lopez family. We focus on Loose 77 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:57,799 Speaker 2: Lopez and her brother Diego, and they're raised by their 78 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 2: anti Maria Josie, the matriarch of the novel. Their mother 79 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 2: has been abandoned by her Belgian partner he never married her, 80 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 2: and she has succumbed to alcoholism and she's not well 81 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 2: enough to care for them, so she sends the children 82 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 2: north to the city, hoping that they'll have a better 83 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 2: life with her sister. Maria Josie insisted Diego and Luos 84 00:05:24,160 --> 00:05:26,839 Speaker 2: must learn the map, as she called it, and she 85 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 2: showed them first on foot and later by the streetcar. 86 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 2: The siblings learned to be cautious. It was dangerous to 87 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 2: stroll through mostly Anglo neighborhoods. Their streetcar routes equally unsafe. 88 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:43,279 Speaker 2: There were Clan picnics, car races, cross burnings on the 89 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 2: edge of the foothills, flames like tongues licking the canyon walls, 90 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 2: hatred reaching into the stars. This is about the midway 91 00:05:56,560 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 2: in Woman of Light. When I was writing this book, 92 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,800 Speaker 2: I was really thinking about the stories that my ancestors 93 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:06,640 Speaker 2: told about the things that they had gone through coming 94 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 2: from southern Colorado and northern New Mexico and the Philippines 95 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 2: and other places. And I was thinking about really trying 96 00:06:14,040 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 2: to set the record straight, because something that happened in 97 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:21,160 Speaker 2: my education in Denver was the Clan was referred to 98 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:25,400 Speaker 2: primarily in my college classes as a social club, as 99 00:06:25,440 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 2: something that was just a little club that Protestants could join. 100 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:31,800 Speaker 2: But we know that that's not the truth, That this 101 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:34,479 Speaker 2: is a terrorist organization, that this is a hate group. 102 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:43,360 Speaker 2: Loose and Diego were once walking downtown when a man yelled, 103 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:45,680 Speaker 2: go back to your own country and spat at them. 104 00:06:45,720 --> 00:06:46,680 Speaker 3: From a truck window. 105 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:50,560 Speaker 2: Luce had cried, wiping the stranger's hot phlegm from her 106 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:55,280 Speaker 2: tiny face. Diego cursed, held up both arms, but he 107 00:06:55,440 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 2: lowered them cautiously and told Luce he finally recognized where 108 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 2: they were. He pulled his little sister by the sleeve 109 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:04,279 Speaker 2: of her oversized dress. 110 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 3: Into the market. 111 00:07:05,720 --> 00:07:08,760 Speaker 2: A place called tikis a ringing of bells? 112 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 3: What happened to the little one? 113 00:07:11,040 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 2: A voice called, and Loose saw that it was the 114 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 2: older boy, David, the shopkeeper's son, watchful behind the counter. 115 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:23,480 Speaker 2: See that, he said, Those are the mountains. They'll always 116 00:07:23,520 --> 00:07:27,360 Speaker 2: be west. Loose looked to the horizon, allowing the line 117 00:07:27,360 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 2: of sunlight to bathe her eyes. David pointed to the 118 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:37,240 Speaker 2: mountains once more, which direction west, said Loose. David gestured, right, 119 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 2: good work, He said, now say this, this is my city. 120 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 3: Loose didn't say anything, and David nudged her to go on. 121 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 3: This is my city. 122 00:07:48,520 --> 00:07:52,800 Speaker 2: She said quietly, All right, said David, now once more, 123 00:07:52,920 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 2: like you mean it, This is my city. They yelled 124 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 2: together until their voices boomed high and arching, rattling streetcar 125 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 2: cables and smoggy windows, soaring between stone tenements. 126 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:11,000 Speaker 3: And factory tufts. This she repeated is ours. 127 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,960 Speaker 2: When I was working on the book, I was actually 128 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 2: surprised that it was such a window into the reality 129 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:27,520 Speaker 2: of today. And it saddened me to think that what 130 00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:31,160 Speaker 2: my great grandmother went through in her childhood is so 131 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,960 Speaker 2: similar to what is happening to little girls and people 132 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 2: all across America right now, one hundred years later. And 133 00:08:39,200 --> 00:08:42,000 Speaker 2: so in that way it did become a direct mirror 134 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 2: to the present day. But in the beginning that was 135 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:50,160 Speaker 2: completely accidental putting this book together over a ten year span. 136 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:53,720 Speaker 2: At first, I thought I didn't need to do very 137 00:08:53,800 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 2: much historical research because I come from this big oral 138 00:08:57,880 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 2: history family that. 139 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 3: Is constantly to tell stories. 140 00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:07,439 Speaker 2: So the beginning research really is my childhood and listening 141 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:11,840 Speaker 2: to my elders, my great grandma, my great grandpa, my aunties, 142 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:14,920 Speaker 2: and my uncles, and they would tell these stories about 143 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 2: their lives in the nineteen thirties in Denver and earlier 144 00:09:18,160 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 2: in the nineteen twenties. A lot of these stories also 145 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 2: were beautiful, but these stories were very difficult in some 146 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,320 Speaker 2: cases because they talked about the extreme prejudice that they faced. 147 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:34,680 Speaker 2: I always knew from the time that I was a 148 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 2: teenager that I wanted to tell this big story of 149 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:42,400 Speaker 2: my family. I wanted to tell the story of Chicano's 150 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 2: from southern Colorado and northern New Mexico, these very blended, 151 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:52,840 Speaker 2: ancestrally connected people. And I remember it. It was twenty 152 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:56,400 Speaker 2: fifteen and I turned in a draft to my literary agent, 153 00:09:56,840 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 2: and so my agent she read the draft and she 154 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:02,520 Speaker 2: called me up and she sort of had this very 155 00:10:02,559 --> 00:10:06,240 Speaker 2: somber tone, and she said, how much research have you. 156 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 3: Done for this book? 157 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:09,800 Speaker 2: So what do you mean? I lived the research like 158 00:10:09,840 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 2: this is my family, these are my people. 159 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 3: And she said, yeah, but have you even looked. 160 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:18,360 Speaker 2: Into the cars or the radio stations, or the music, 161 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,000 Speaker 2: or the clothes or the food, you know, all these 162 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:25,440 Speaker 2: very distinct things from the nineteen thirties. And I was just, 163 00:10:25,559 --> 00:10:28,040 Speaker 2: you know, I drew a blank and I said no, 164 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:33,120 Speaker 2: I just thought I knew it. And so that sort 165 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 2: of felt like a challenge to me. And at that 166 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 2: point I was set off on this very hung research 167 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:42,600 Speaker 2: for research, and that is how I ended up visiting 168 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:48,000 Speaker 2: archives and libraries really across the Southwest region. I remember 169 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:51,880 Speaker 2: a particular day I went to the Denver Public Library 170 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 2: Western History and Genealogy Floor, which is one of the 171 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:59,840 Speaker 2: largest archives in the Western United States, and I walked 172 00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 2: up up to the reference desk and I asked the 173 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:04,760 Speaker 2: archivist there. I said, I want to know how my 174 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 2: Filipino great grandfather met my Chicana great grandmother, and I 175 00:11:09,760 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 2: don't have anywhere to start, and. 176 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 3: He sort of just looked at me blankly. 177 00:11:13,600 --> 00:11:16,199 Speaker 2: But then we started, you know, writing down like certain 178 00:11:16,240 --> 00:11:19,000 Speaker 2: notes and references, and that's when I really started to 179 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 2: look at the newspapers at the clips. But there was 180 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 2: one big issue. Our people were not really in the 181 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:30,040 Speaker 2: archives in the way that Anglos were in the archives. 182 00:11:30,480 --> 00:11:32,439 Speaker 3: And I got really lucky that year. 183 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:36,280 Speaker 2: Because I also found a VHS tape. My mother had 184 00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 2: conducted an oral history with my great grandmother, and I 185 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:43,160 Speaker 2: found this tape and I transcribed it. Did she tell 186 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:46,839 Speaker 2: you guys that anything about what had happened? Or why 187 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 2: do you know that? I remember distinctively when I found 188 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:55,320 Speaker 2: the tape. I found the VHS tape in my mother's closet. 189 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,040 Speaker 2: She's the one who conducted the oral history, and I 190 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:01,840 Speaker 2: took the tape with me and I was living far. 191 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:02,760 Speaker 3: Away from Dever at the time. 192 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,200 Speaker 2: It's about a six hour drive through the mountains. Every 193 00:12:06,200 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 2: time I would leave, I would remember my mom saying, 194 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:18,440 Speaker 2: now we're entering the Kingdom of the Mountains. And so 195 00:12:18,559 --> 00:12:20,640 Speaker 2: I drove all the way down to Durango, and I 196 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:23,080 Speaker 2: had the tape and I had to go to the 197 00:12:23,120 --> 00:12:26,320 Speaker 2: library to find a way to play it, and I 198 00:12:26,360 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 2: plugged it into this VHS tape and I was sitting 199 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 2: there with headphones and I was watching it and the 200 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 2: first thing that really struck me was just to see 201 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:37,480 Speaker 2: my great grandma again. I mean, I haven't seen her 202 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:39,880 Speaker 2: since I was a little girl and she died, but 203 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:43,280 Speaker 2: also like since she's visited me in dreams. And there 204 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,760 Speaker 2: was one more thing that just really blew me away. 205 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 3: My family. 206 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:51,199 Speaker 2: Now, besides the few siblings of mine that have been 207 00:12:51,200 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 2: able to reclaim Spanish and learn Spanish fluently, we are 208 00:12:56,080 --> 00:13:01,439 Speaker 2: monolingual English speakers because of the abuse of the past. 209 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:06,840 Speaker 2: And my family talks about people being beaten school for 210 00:13:06,920 --> 00:13:10,679 Speaker 2: speaking Spanish, for being attacked on the streets for speaking Spanish. 211 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:13,640 Speaker 2: And my mother asked her in the tape. She says, 212 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:15,560 Speaker 2: what languages did. 213 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:16,240 Speaker 3: You speak at home? 214 00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 2: And my grandmother looks at her and she says, well, 215 00:13:20,080 --> 00:13:23,200 Speaker 2: we spoke Spanish, of course, and my mom says, okay, 216 00:13:24,679 --> 00:13:27,640 Speaker 2: you know, did you speak anything else? And my grandma says, well, yeah, 217 00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:30,080 Speaker 2: of course we spoke our old languages too. 218 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:33,720 Speaker 3: We did not just speak Spanish. 219 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 2: And that, to me it just felt like such loss, 220 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 2: Like I had no idea. I mean, she was referencing 221 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:42,559 Speaker 2: their indigenous languages. It was incredible to me to realize 222 00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 2: that my family had lost so many languages, and so 223 00:13:45,760 --> 00:13:58,480 Speaker 2: quickly it happened, really in one generation. All of my 224 00:13:58,559 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 2: writing is based in part on my ancestors, and in 225 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:06,720 Speaker 2: a lot of ways, I'm trying to honor them, and 226 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 2: I'm trying to make them seen. When I was growing up, 227 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:13,240 Speaker 2: I could never pick up a book, turn on the TV, 228 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 2: listen to the radio and find people like us or 229 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 2: people like us who are allowed to talk about the 230 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 2: nuance of their identity. Everything was always sort of neatly 231 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 2: put into categories, and those categories. 232 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:27,560 Speaker 3: Did not represent who we were. 233 00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:31,600 Speaker 2: And so Sabrina and Karina was really my first attempt 234 00:14:31,760 --> 00:14:35,120 Speaker 2: to say, Okay, there are these Chicanos in Denver, and 235 00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:38,720 Speaker 2: they're incredibly mixed people, and their lineage goes all the 236 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:41,840 Speaker 2: way back to their indigenous ancestry. And all of the 237 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 2: characters in that book represent that on the morning the 238 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:52,200 Speaker 2: flyers appeared across the city like snow. In early July, 239 00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 2: Dodi went outside to fetch the newspaper after starting breakfast 240 00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:57,320 Speaker 2: with Tina. 241 00:14:58,200 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 3: She stepped out of. 242 00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 2: Their duplexus screen door with her hair crisp and black curls. 243 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,040 Speaker 2: The flyers were printed on cheap brittle paper, with a 244 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 2: photograph of the girl borrowed from the nineteen fifty five 245 00:15:09,600 --> 00:15:13,320 Speaker 2: North Denver High School yearbook, sitting dead center on the page, 246 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 2: missing Lucia Barrera, nineteen year old girl of Filipiano descent. 247 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,280 Speaker 2: Doty's chest ached with heartened sadness. 248 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:26,560 Speaker 3: She lifted her gaze. 249 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 2: Eyeing the quiet street, almost hoping the missing girl would 250 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 2: suddenly appear beside a mailbox or a parked automobile. This 251 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 2: was on our tree, Doty said in Spanish. Setting the 252 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 2: flyer on the table and taking a seat. Tina gave 253 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:45,920 Speaker 2: it a glance. She shrugged. Lucilla was very beautiful, with strong, 254 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 2: precise eyes, and Dody felt an urge to know her. 255 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 2: Doty said to Tina, I know you've seen her at church. 256 00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 2: What could have happened to her? Maybe she's dead, Tina 257 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 2: gulped a glass of orange juice could have chopped her 258 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 2: ride up. Don't say something so ugly, that's horrible. Fine, 259 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 2: she probably had a boyfriend, Tina suggested, her voice strained 260 00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 2: with annoyance. I bet they ran off and wanted to 261 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 2: get married in a hurry. I don't think so, said Dody. 262 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 3: She didn't seem interested in that. 263 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:27,040 Speaker 2: I just read from my short story Sisters, that is 264 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 2: based on my family history with one of my aunties. 265 00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 2: My family has a very deep queer lineage, So that 266 00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 2: character that I read from Dody, she's a queer woman 267 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 2: and she's basically lost this person that she's had a 268 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,479 Speaker 2: crush on for a really long time and hasn't. 269 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:47,360 Speaker 3: Been able to express it. 270 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 2: But I really wanted to show these Chicana lesbians in 271 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 2: their historical spaces because my family queerness has always been 272 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 2: so important and we've been so accepting and my godmother 273 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 2: as a queer woman, and I really wanted to show 274 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:07,160 Speaker 2: that they're a vital part of my family, my community. 275 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 2: So in Sisters, that story it's a lot about violence 276 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 2: against women, but it's also about having to be forced 277 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 2: into a sexual identity that is not your own. Because 278 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 2: the act of violence comes when she's basically been set 279 00:17:20,880 --> 00:17:22,399 Speaker 2: up with men that she does not want to go 280 00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:25,240 Speaker 2: on dates with because her sister wants them to find 281 00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:29,159 Speaker 2: husbands who can provide for them and give them a 282 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:35,639 Speaker 2: better space and a better ability at life. So, throughout 283 00:17:35,680 --> 00:17:39,000 Speaker 2: my childhood and really into my early twenties. 284 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:41,240 Speaker 3: I deeply struggled with depression. 285 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:45,159 Speaker 2: And I didn't understand that a lot of this depression 286 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:48,159 Speaker 2: came from the fact that I didn't feel seen, that 287 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:49,439 Speaker 2: I didn't really. 288 00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:51,200 Speaker 3: Have an outlet to talk about the. 289 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 2: Things that I was experiencing or seeing in my community. 290 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,399 Speaker 2: I didn't have a way to intellectualize them or to 291 00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:03,199 Speaker 2: analyze them. I mean, I'm talking about like seeing women 292 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:08,120 Speaker 2: being beat by their husbands, going to funerals for young 293 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 2: young people that who were. 294 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:10,879 Speaker 3: Killed in gang violence. 295 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 2: From the time I was really little, seeing people die 296 00:18:15,280 --> 00:18:19,200 Speaker 2: young because they don't have access to adequate healthcare, that 297 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:21,720 Speaker 2: all of this was sort of weighing down upon me. 298 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,920 Speaker 2: But I do think in a lot of ways writing 299 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:30,439 Speaker 2: through these situations, thinking about violence against women, thinking about 300 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 2: people that are so depressed that they're falling into alcoholism 301 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 2: and they don't feel seen, and they're experiencing displacement because 302 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:43,400 Speaker 2: of gentrification. I think exploring those psychees it really allowed 303 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 2: me to analyze my own psychology and to think about 304 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,880 Speaker 2: the choices that I was making. And I do think 305 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 2: in many many ways that if I had not written 306 00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:54,960 Speaker 2: Sabrina and Karna, I'm not sure if I would even 307 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:59,000 Speaker 2: be alive today because I was so lost in terms 308 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:01,719 Speaker 2: of bingeret, in terms of my depression. 309 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:13,680 Speaker 3: This book really did save me as a writer. 310 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 2: I am writing naturalistic, realist pros and stories that are 311 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:22,959 Speaker 2: really focused on the reality of my existence and the 312 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:24,160 Speaker 2: entire center. 313 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:27,960 Speaker 3: Of my world is It's always been this. 314 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,840 Speaker 2: Very mixed Chicano community from Denver, and so when I 315 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:34,880 Speaker 2: looked out from you know, my little center of the universe, 316 00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:38,480 Speaker 2: that's what I saw first, and everything else about the 317 00:19:38,520 --> 00:19:40,480 Speaker 2: American West that came second. 318 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:41,360 Speaker 3: Or third or fourth. 319 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:44,800 Speaker 2: You know. I remember being in my Auntie Lucy's house 320 00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,760 Speaker 2: and she would put on you know, Turner classic movies, 321 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:50,800 Speaker 2: and sure enough, like a John Wayne movie would come 322 00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:54,000 Speaker 2: on or something Get Down off Them Horses. I don't 323 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:56,960 Speaker 2: favor looking up to the likes of you, and you know, 324 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:00,719 Speaker 2: we would watch The Searchers together and it's it always 325 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 2: seemed like such fantasy, like that was not the existence 326 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:07,919 Speaker 2: that we knew, Those were not the stories that we told. 327 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,359 Speaker 2: And so to me, that version of the American West 328 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 2: that was such a fantasy that when I started writing, 329 00:20:15,800 --> 00:20:18,800 Speaker 2: when I started telling these stories, it wasn't my intention 330 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:23,200 Speaker 2: necessarily to redefine the American West, but to just offer 331 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 2: a perspective that to me felt like the truth. I 332 00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 2: think early on, when I first started writing, there was 333 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,399 Speaker 2: some worry that I was sort of going to air 334 00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:35,720 Speaker 2: the dirty laundry, so to speak, because I am addressing 335 00:20:35,800 --> 00:20:38,679 Speaker 2: very difficult topics. And one of the things that my 336 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 2: family and a lot of other families did is they 337 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 2: tried not to talk about the ugly things that they 338 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:48,119 Speaker 2: had experienced. They tried to move on really quickly. But 339 00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:51,520 Speaker 2: growing up, you know, that was sort of a silent thing. 340 00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:55,080 Speaker 2: We really needed to focus on looking forward and not 341 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:55,800 Speaker 2: looking back. 342 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 3: That was what they would tell us. 343 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:03,879 Speaker 2: My godmother is eighty four years old. She know I 344 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,240 Speaker 2: was really nervous what she was going to think of 345 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 2: Woman of Light because essentially this is the story of 346 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:12,639 Speaker 2: her parents in a lot of ways, or it's inspired 347 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 2: by her parents, it's inspired by her aunties and her uncles, 348 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,800 Speaker 2: and you know, when she called me and. 349 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 3: Told me she read it, I was like, what is 350 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:22,399 Speaker 3: she going to say? What does she think? 351 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 2: And she goes, you know, my baby, I read it twice. 352 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 2: I read my book twice. 353 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:30,160 Speaker 3: And I said, what does that mean? 354 00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 2: And she said, I just I can't believe that you 355 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,240 Speaker 2: took the stories and you knew what to do with them. 356 00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 2: And she said, at one point while she was reading, 357 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,879 Speaker 2: she looked up at heaven and she said, look, look, 358 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:43,880 Speaker 2: you're in a book. And she tried to tell all 359 00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 2: of the ancestors that they're here, that they're. 360 00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:48,560 Speaker 3: In this book. And she said, I did a really 361 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 3: good job. 362 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:52,760 Speaker 2: And I think her opinion on this it means so 363 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,199 Speaker 2: much to me. And I'm just I feel so lucky 364 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:58,359 Speaker 2: that she's lived long enough that she got to read 365 00:21:58,359 --> 00:21:59,920 Speaker 2: it and I got to hear what she thought of it. 366 00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:04,679 Speaker 2: And so I just I'm proud that my family is 367 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:08,000 Speaker 2: happy to be seen and to be represented, and also 368 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:11,840 Speaker 2: that there are many many other families who see themselves 369 00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:12,640 Speaker 2: in these books. 370 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 1: This episode was produced by Renaldo Leanos Junior and edited 371 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:34,600 Speaker 1: by Daisy contred As. It was mixed by J. J. 372 00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 1: Carubin The Latino USA. Team includes Andrea Lopez Crusado, Marta Martinez, 373 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:45,199 Speaker 1: Mike Sargent, Julia Ta Martinelli, Victoria Estrada, Alejandra Salasa, Patricia 374 00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:48,760 Speaker 1: Sulvaran and Julia Rocha, with help from Raoul Perez. Our 375 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,679 Speaker 1: editorial director is Julio Ricardo Barela. Our director of engineering 376 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:56,600 Speaker 1: is Stephanie lebou. Our senior engineer is Julia Caruso. Our 377 00:22:56,640 --> 00:23:00,359 Speaker 1: associate engineer is gabriel A Byez. Our marketing man is 378 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 1: Louise Duda. Our theme music was composed by Saniel Rowins. 379 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,679 Speaker 1: I'm your host and executive producer MARIEO Hosa. Join us 380 00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: again on our next episode. In the meantime, look for 381 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: us on all of your social media and rememberes Choo. 382 00:23:14,600 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 4: Latino USA is made possible in part by the Heising 383 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 4: Simons Foundation, unlocking knowledge, opportunity and possibilities more at hsfoundation 384 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 4: dot org, the John D. And Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation, 385 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:34,760 Speaker 4: and the Ford Foundation, working with visionaries on the front 386 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 4: lines of social change worldwide.