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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, it's built Courtney with an army of normal folks.

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Speaker 1: And we continue now with part two of our conversation

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Speaker 1: with doctor Ronda Smith right after these brief messages from

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Speaker 1: our general sponsors. So where do you go from there?

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Speaker 1: And how do you become doctor Ronda Smith?

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Speaker 2: Okay, the rest of that year was pretty rough that year,

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Speaker 2: and then the beginning of the next year was probably

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Speaker 2: one of the hardest seasons of our family's life if

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Speaker 2: you remember, and you probably we probably didn't know it then,

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Speaker 2: but two thousand and one was when oxy cotton was

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Speaker 2: being developed and over prescribed and overused.

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Speaker 1: In fact, it was being over pushed and sold by

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Speaker 1: many doctors actually intentionally. There's actually a movie about that

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Speaker 1: that was out recently that was awesome. But it was

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Speaker 1: basically legalized pharmaceutical while drust drug pushers yep, and highly

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Speaker 1: used in rural areas among people who really trusted their doctors. Absolutely, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I remember all that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, that's part of our story too. So and

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Speaker 2: that's also that was Roger's drug of choice was oxy cotton,

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Speaker 2: and so I found out later that he had been

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Speaker 2: injecting he'd been using that regularly and that's that comes

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Speaker 2: later also, but I don't think that it had started

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Speaker 2: at that point. But so September twenty eighth and twenty

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Speaker 2: ninth was when the major that abuse happened in Houston,

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Speaker 2: that Roger heard us so bad. And then the day

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Speaker 2: before Thanksgiving in November, my dad's mother, my grandmother, died

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Speaker 2: by suicide.

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Speaker 1: Oh gosh.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. She had been diagnosed with MEAs with elioma earlier

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Speaker 2: in the year.

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Speaker 1: That's lung lung can. That's a big word for lung.

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Speaker 2: Can, yep. And she had uh. They had lived in

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Speaker 2: New Orleans and lived down the street from a shingle

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Speaker 2: uh manufacturing factory.

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Speaker 1: So she wasn't a smoker, new was.

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Speaker 2: She didn't smoke, drink because nothing. Wow, she was a saint, right.

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Speaker 2: So she ends up with lung cancer and was prescribed

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Speaker 2: one hundred milligrams of oxycotton twice a day.

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Speaker 1: Holy smokes, and she was stoned as a rat. Didn't

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Speaker 1: even know it. None of us knew she was using

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Speaker 1: what the doctor gave her. So back then everybody trusted

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Speaker 1: the meds the doctor gave.

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Speaker 2: And so none of us knew. And my mom and

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Speaker 2: dad would go over they lived just down the street

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Speaker 2: from them, and they would go over and check on them,

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Speaker 2: you know, every day. My mom would spend all day

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Speaker 2: with them, just about and she'd been over there with

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Speaker 2: them that day and they would go check on them

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Speaker 2: that night. And that particular night they went by and

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Speaker 2: the lights were off like they were already gone to bed,

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Speaker 2: and so they said, well, we'll come back in the morning.

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Speaker 2: For whatever reason, that night, she did not take her

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Speaker 2: nightmns and so she did not have her one hundred

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Speaker 2: milligram oxy cotton that night. And so what we know now,

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Speaker 2: you know, hindsight is twenty twenty. What we know now

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Speaker 2: is that she probably woke up in those terrible withdrawal symptoms, which.

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Speaker 1: Is pain, very much pain with also doing with lung cancer, yep,

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Speaker 1: and so she.

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Speaker 2: She chose to end her life.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So that was you know, dealing with the death

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Speaker 2: of a parent and a grandparent, it's one thing, but

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Speaker 2: then the suicide makes it it's another layer, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's it's more of a tragic You asked all the questions, why,

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Speaker 2: how did we not know? How how did we not

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Speaker 2: see this coming? What was she feeling? How did why

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Speaker 2: did she not talk to us? You know? So and

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Speaker 2: a lot of it's a guessing game and it's hard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, tough, tough.

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Speaker 2: Hear then to make it worse the next may, I

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Speaker 2: lose my job at Mississippi Power.

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Speaker 1: Why you don't seem like the person do something to

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Speaker 1: lose their job.

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't think so either, But I did, And you know,

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Speaker 2: just reflecting on it, I think I just was not

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Speaker 2: in a good head space and may not have been

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Speaker 2: handling things the best way that maybe I should. And

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Speaker 2: I didn't do anything outright, I didn't, you know, I

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Speaker 2: didn't steal money or do I mean? I didn't do anything.

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Speaker 1: Did you go outside and throw a bunch of tacos

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Speaker 1: off somebody?

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Speaker 2: I did not do that either, Well, I don't. I

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Speaker 2: think it was more of a I do think that

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Speaker 2: there was some of it was Roger was kind of

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Speaker 2: stalker ish calling up.

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Speaker 1: There or wondering about that actually.

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Speaker 2: And I was working with an older lady who was

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Speaker 2: very easily She was probably shared and we didn't she

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Speaker 2: didn't understand me. I didn't understand her, and I think

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Speaker 2: that probably and she had been there for twenty five years,

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Speaker 2: and you know, so you're out, I'm out, so now, So.

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Speaker 1: Now that's your trauma daughter.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 1: No income, yep.

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Speaker 2: So I find jobs the best I could with an

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Speaker 2: associate business crap degree, right, I'm using your words. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: So I had a really good job. I was working

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Speaker 2: at the casino. I was a credit supervisor up there,

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Speaker 2: and I learned all the inner workings of the casinos.

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Speaker 2: Don't like, they don't build those things from people winning

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Speaker 2: a bunch of money.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's kind of how it works, right.

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Speaker 2: So Okay, So I learned a lot there, but I

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Speaker 2: really learned that I knew it was time for me

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Speaker 2: to leave there. Whenever they raised a little man that

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Speaker 2: he had a credit limit of like two hundred dollars

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Speaker 2: because it was his play money. He was on so security,

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Speaker 2: but that was his play money and he could do that.

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Speaker 2: And so I came back one Monday and someone had

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Speaker 2: raised it to like fifteen hundred dollars and like he

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Speaker 2: could never repay that, And so I knew, like, were

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Speaker 2: why why would you do that? So I knew it

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Speaker 2: was time for me to go.

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Speaker 1: Just wasn't comfortable for you.

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Speaker 2: That's just not good practice. I just didn't. That went

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Speaker 2: against my gut, Like, you can't do that to people.

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Speaker 1: So unfortunately you can.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you can, should we.

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Speaker 1: Shouldn't should we should and can are two different things.

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Speaker 2: Maybe there are lots of other people that can and do.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't do it.

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Speaker 1: I get it.

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Speaker 2: It's not for me, right, It made me feel really

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Speaker 2: yucky inside.

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Speaker 1: So but if you're like a credit manager at a casino,

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Speaker 1: you're working in the back office, so you probably are

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Speaker 1: making a nice living. And okay, you figured it out.

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Speaker 1: I was doing all right, but now you're gonna quit

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Speaker 1: because some little man got his pay money raised.

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Speaker 2: I know, I know that's right. Yeah, so yeah, So

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Speaker 2: of course, you know, Caitlyn's dad rogers in and out

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Speaker 2: like wanting to see her. You'll have periods of sobriety

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Speaker 2: and Okay, I decided to move to Hattiesburg. So I

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Speaker 2: find a job law from I was still a Meridian.

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Speaker 1: Some Meridian got it, yep.

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Speaker 2: So I decide to move to Hattiesburg. So I called

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Speaker 2: my old mentor, the old teacher that taught me junior

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Speaker 2: college right when I got my associate's degree, and I said,

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Speaker 2: Ms McQueen, do you know of anybody that's hiring around

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Speaker 2: Hattiesburg or Laurel, Because I really want to come back

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Speaker 2: she said, as a matter of fact, we need somebody

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Speaker 2: here in my department. Would you come? And I said yes,

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Speaker 2: and she said, okay, but it only pays eight dollars

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Speaker 2: an hour nikes, And I said, okay, okay.

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Speaker 1: When you were in the credit apartment, did you hearn

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Speaker 1: anything about math? I?

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Speaker 2: Oh, math is horrible. I don't ask me what six

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Speaker 2: times nine is because I don't know. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: Social workers don't do math. So I took eight dollars

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Speaker 2: an hour working at the junior college. So I think

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Speaker 2: it was New Year's Day, two thousand and four. I'm

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Speaker 2: at my parents. My landlord calls and he says, Rohnda,

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Speaker 2: there is a brown truck down here in the woods.

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Speaker 2: And I don't know if this guy is down here

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Speaker 2: like he's going to kill himself or he's waiting to

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Speaker 2: hurt you. But somebody needs to come down here and

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Speaker 2: see what's going on. So me and dad call the

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Speaker 2: sheriff's department and we go from his house to where

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Speaker 2: I had just rented this house. And I'm like, I'm

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Speaker 2: going to get kicked out of this place. And so

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Speaker 2: we get there and Roger is there at my house.

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Speaker 2: He had already been inside my house, and I don't

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Speaker 2: think he had been in my house yet. No, he

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Speaker 2: we were afraid he was going in the house. So

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Speaker 2: he's there at the house. He tries to come in

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Speaker 2: the house. When we get there, Dad, instead of punching

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Speaker 2: him in the face, he just pushed him down the

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Speaker 2: stairs in front of the sheriff's deputy, and the deputy

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Speaker 2: was okay with it because he kind of knew the backstory.

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Speaker 2: And so Dad finally says, Roger, how much money would

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Speaker 2: it take to get you out of Mississippi. He says,

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Speaker 2: I don't know, Robert, what you got. And Dad pulls

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Speaker 2: out his wallet and handed him whatever cash he had

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Speaker 2: in his wallet. It was a couple hundred dollars. Roger said,

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Speaker 2: all right, and that's the last time I saw him.

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Speaker 1: You're kidding me. Two hundred bucks.

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Speaker 2: About two hundred bucks.

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Speaker 1: Best two hundred bucks ever spelt, I think so.

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Speaker 2: So. But before he left town, we left. We left

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Speaker 2: before because we were scared. We went back because Caitlyn

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Speaker 2: was at Mom and Dad. That's how so while we

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Speaker 2: were gone, he broke into my house, destroyed, you know,

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Speaker 2: broke the washer and dryer, the stove, wrote little hateful

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Speaker 2: notes and hid everywhere, put a bullet in my shower,

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Speaker 2: wrote notes in a magic marker on the mirror. Vengeance

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Speaker 2: is mine, just little reminders that he was going to

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Speaker 2: get me. Always be looking over my shoulder. I never

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Speaker 2: saw him again until I got a call. Well through

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Speaker 2: the years. He called a few times, and when he called,

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Speaker 2: when I got a call from Texas, because I knew

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Speaker 2: he was going to Texas. When I got a call

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Speaker 2: from Texas, I answered it because I wanted to make

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Speaker 2: sure where he was. I want to make sure you're

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Speaker 2: not here, You're not in Mississippi. Where are you? So

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Speaker 2: I would talk to him, what are you up to?

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Speaker 2: And he was usually waiting for the liquor store to open.

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Speaker 2: A couple times he asked me to help him find

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Speaker 2: a rehab facility, and I would look up numbers and

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Speaker 2: give him numbers. But that's about as far as it

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Speaker 2: would go. He ended up living in a homeless shelter

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Speaker 2: in San Antonio, Texas, and around the middle of June

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Speaker 2: of twenty sixteen, we got a phone call from the

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Speaker 2: Medical Examiner's office looking for his next of ken and

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Speaker 2: so he had. He passed away on Father's Day twenty sixteen.

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Speaker 1: On the one hand, sadly that had to have been

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Speaker 1: a little bit of a relief because the truth as

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Speaker 1: you were being stalked after everything else. On another hand,

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Speaker 1: addictions of beast and the god, what's it?

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Speaker 2: He was very sick. And those are the conversations that

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Speaker 2: I've had with my daughter over the years. She hasn't

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Speaker 2: seen her dad since she was four.

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Speaker 1: And again, on the one hand, that's probably great. On

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Speaker 1: the other hand, taking it from a guy whose stab

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Speaker 1: left when he was four, you always wonder, and it's

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Speaker 1: easier when you can reconcile it against a disease. But

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Speaker 1: I mean, that has a long time to deal with

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Speaker 1: that stuff. But you're an asperg. Yeah, you're working for

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Speaker 1: eight bucks an hour. Yeah, and you're trying to find

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Speaker 1: a future. Yeah, so how'd that work?

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Speaker 2: So after about six months of living on my own,

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Speaker 2: someone at the college came to me. You know, I'm struggling.

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Speaker 2: I'm a single mom and like eight bucks and Bill's

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Speaker 2: eight dollars an hour, car note, rent all that stuff, daycare.

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Speaker 2: Someone comes up and they say, hey, Rhonda, how would

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Speaker 2: you like to come live in the dorm and be

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Speaker 2: a dorm mom. You can live here in this three bedroom,

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Speaker 2: dorm room for free. The electricity is free, the phone

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Speaker 2: is free, cable is free. I'm like, okay, how long

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Speaker 2: do I have to get there? And so I moved

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Speaker 2: into the dorm like it was like it just fell

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Speaker 2: from the sky, like it was great. And it was

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Speaker 2: good for my daughter too, because she was on campus

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Speaker 2: with all the girls and she got to do hair

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Speaker 2: and dress up and all that good stuff. So it

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Speaker 2: was really fun for her. So I did that for

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Speaker 2: about a year, and that's about all I could take

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Speaker 2: because we had nightly fire drills.

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Speaker 1: Because of hair spray.

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Speaker 2: And burnt toast and you name it, you know. So

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Speaker 2: it was hard on one hand, but it certainly gave

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Speaker 2: me the time to get my stuff together and figure

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Speaker 2: out what I was going to do next. Yes, very

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Speaker 2: much so, so then we were able to move out

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Speaker 2: of there into a house. But while I was working there,

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Speaker 2: those same mentors, the people in my department, you know,

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Speaker 2: they said, you know, you really need to go back

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Speaker 2: to school. I'm like, for what, Like, what am I

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Speaker 2: going to do? What am I going to do? And

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Speaker 2: you know, they saw potential in me that I did

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Speaker 2: not see in myself at that point. And so the

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Speaker 2: only thing I could think of to do was to

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Speaker 2: try to figure out why people do the things they do.

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Speaker 2: That was my motivation for going back.

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Speaker 1: This is where the connection to the past starts with

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Speaker 1: the future right here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, why do people? Why would a man who had

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Speaker 2: everything give it up for a drug? And so that

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Speaker 2: was my mission to figure that out. And so I

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Speaker 2: enrolled at the University of Southern Mississippi to go to

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Speaker 2: night classes in psychology because I thought, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: didn't really know much about you know, what I could

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Speaker 2: do with that job, but I just wanted to figure

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Speaker 2: that out. I wanted to knowledge. And so I went

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Speaker 2: to night classes and I got my bachelor's degree in psychology.

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Speaker 2: And so did that at night while I was working

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Speaker 2: full time. And I mean, you just do what you

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Speaker 2: gotta do. And then and then I went to work

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Speaker 2: for community mental health and that's where I found my people.

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Speaker 2: So I started working with individuals who struggle with severe

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Speaker 2: mental illness, So people that have schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, people

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Speaker 2: who may be suicidal, people who struggle with depression, anxiety,

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Speaker 2: women who have been through abusive relationships, people who deal

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Speaker 2: with addictions, like all of those people. Those are my

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Speaker 2: people who people I get. I don't know. I guess

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Speaker 2: I can relate on some level. I don't know. There's

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Speaker 2: so much empathy, and I don't know. I just I see,

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Speaker 2: I see the hope maybe when other people don't. I

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Speaker 2: think there's always hope. There is always, always, always hope.

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Speaker 1: I'm being redundant because I use this phrase very recently

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Speaker 1: in another interview, but I'm going to say it again

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Speaker 1: because it's appropriate. I don't think people care at all

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Speaker 1: how much you know, until they know how much you care.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And.

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Speaker 1: I get why those are your people, because you know

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Speaker 1: either through your own experience through women who are in

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Speaker 1: abusive relationships and all of that, or you know through

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Speaker 1: your experience with Roger what addiction and mental illness can

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Speaker 1: look like. You've experienced all of it, and because you

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Speaker 1: understand and experience it, you can relate to it, relate

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Speaker 1: to it. You have the ability to help.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 1: But you're not a doctor yet, not yet, So how's

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Speaker 1: that happening?

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Speaker 2: So I'm working at the community Mental Health Center as

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Speaker 2: a case manager, and so that means that I'm going

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Speaker 2: out to people's houses. I'm picking them up for doctor's appointments,

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Speaker 2: making sure that they have their.

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Speaker 1: Medication full on social work, full on.

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Speaker 2: Social work, but I just have a degree in psychology,

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Speaker 2: Like I don't know, I don't even know what social

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Speaker 2: work is at this point. But I was working for

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Speaker 2: a social worker. His name is Scott Ratcliffe, and he

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Speaker 2: tells people that he raised me as a baby social worker.

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Speaker 2: He had been a social worker since nineteen seventy two. Wow,

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Speaker 2: And so he has seen it all and he is

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Speaker 2: my cheerleader, my mentor. One of the reasons that I

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Speaker 2: am a doctor in social work because he said, do

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Speaker 2: you want to He just came back in my office

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Speaker 2: one day and said, do you want to be a

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Speaker 2: case manager your whole life? And I'm like, I don't know, Scott,

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Speaker 2: Like what else is there to do, because you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm still kind of ignorant to the profession itself. I'm

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Speaker 2: just doing my job. I'm trying to raise a kid

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Speaker 2: by myself. I'm trying to pay my bills, you know.

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Speaker 2: I'm just doing the best I can, dealing with my

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Speaker 2: own trauma, dealing with my own stuff too at the

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Speaker 2: same time. And so but I'm getting it. I'm getting there,

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Speaker 2: you know. And so he says, why don't you go

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Speaker 2: back to school for social work that USM has a

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Speaker 2: great graduate degree program. I'm like, oh, I don't know

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Speaker 2: if I can do it, like a master's degree. I

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Speaker 2: don't know. I'm like, you can do a master's degree,

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Speaker 2: you need to go do it. So I call USM,

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Speaker 2: what do I have to do to get in this program?

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Speaker 2: And I'm accepted into the program. Oddly enough, I am

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Speaker 2: able to go to classes like in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the day they arrand they let me go like during hours,

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Speaker 2: like it is supernatural. Like how I was able to

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Speaker 2: get this done. I got internships at the place that

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Speaker 2: I work, so it was kind of paid internships. We

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Speaker 2: don't get to do that anymore. Like that was back

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Speaker 2: before I guess before they caught on what we were doing.

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Speaker 2: So I was able to do my internships there. As

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Speaker 2: soon as I finished. I got my graduate degree, Scott

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00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:31,600
Speaker 2: did my You have to have two years of clinical

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Speaker 2: supervision after you get your graduate degree to get your

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Speaker 2: clinical license. We started that immediately, so Scott was my

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Speaker 2: clinical supervisor for two years postgraduate. Then while I was

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Speaker 2: doing that, I was working at an inpatient psychiatric facility

340
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Speaker 2: and so that was very interesting because it's a different

341
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Speaker 2: day every day because you just don't know. And that's

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Speaker 2: when I really really learned about people are really really

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Speaker 2: it's an illness, Like people are really sick. And when

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Speaker 2: we see people that we say are homeless on the street,

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Speaker 2: I know because I've seen them in the hospital. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's not always what people think. And so I have such.

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Speaker 1: A big that the demographics of the homelesses that over

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Speaker 1: eighty percent are have a clinically diagnosed mental illness and

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Speaker 1: or substance abuse problem, and most have both. Absolutely, So

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Speaker 1: when you look down on that homeless person on the

351
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Speaker 1: sidewalk acting crazier, looking nuts or whatever, and they are

352
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Speaker 1: scary and not particularly attractive most times, we really got

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Speaker 1: to check ourselves and remember they're sick. Those are no

354
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Speaker 1: different than a person with cancer, except their sickness is

355
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Speaker 1: just a lot more socially unacceptately.

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Speaker 2: Those are my people, Bill, those are your people.

357
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Speaker 1: We'll be right back. So after two years this impatient thing,

358
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Speaker 1: you decide to be doc.

359
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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, yes, so I get a job offer. After

360
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Speaker 2: I get my LCSW, I get a job offer to

361
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:34,040
Speaker 2: go LCSW licensed Certified social Worker, got it? Okay, that's

362
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Speaker 2: the highest licensure that you can get as a social worker.

363
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Speaker 2: And so I get a job offer to go work

364
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Speaker 2: in a clinic for our community hospital that's in Laurel

365
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Speaker 2: South Central Regional Medical Center. And so I'm working at

366
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Speaker 2: the clinic there and just doing one on one therapy,

367
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Speaker 2: cognitive behavioral therapy, whatever people need. And so for about

368
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Speaker 2: three years, I was the only therapist in the clinic. Wow,

369
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Speaker 2: and certainly the only one in our area that took

370
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Speaker 2: Medicaid medicare other than the community Mental Health center that

371
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Speaker 2: is like governed by the Department of Mental Health.

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Speaker 1: That have to have been an enormous workload.

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Speaker 2: It's forty hours a week, forty people a week, eight

374
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Speaker 2: hours a day. And my dad brought it up at

375
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Speaker 2: dinner last night. He said that I came to his

376
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Speaker 2: house one day with tears in my eyes, and I

377
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Speaker 2: sat down and said, can you imagine having a job

378
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Speaker 2: where every single person that you talk to cries for

379
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Speaker 2: a whole hour in front of you? And sometimes those

380
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:44,240
Speaker 2: were the days. Can't imagine that, right, Sometimes I.

381
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Speaker 1: Can't imagine that in going home and being able to

382
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:47,919
Speaker 1: put a smile on your face and be normal.

383
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:54,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. Sometimes, yeah, Well, we have to take care of ourselves, right, right,

384
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Speaker 2: And so that's a full time job to you do that.

385
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Speaker 2: You have to learn how to separate what's going on

386
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Speaker 2: in someone else's life and what I have control over.

387
00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 2: And so there's an art to that. It's a it's

388
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:11,200
Speaker 2: a skill that we have to as clinicians, as a therapist,

389
00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:14,160
Speaker 2: that's what we have to do. We have to figure

390
00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,679
Speaker 2: out how to do that for ourselves. And so I

391
00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 2: did that for about eight and a half years, and

392
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:26,480
Speaker 2: very interesting, very rewarding work. For sure. You grow very

393
00:24:26,480 --> 00:24:30,240
Speaker 2: attached to the people that tell you everything about their

394
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Speaker 2: lives that they have never told anyone ever before.

395
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Speaker 1: Yeah, like the stuff that you wouldn't tell anybody. Yeah, absolutely,

396
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:39,880
Speaker 1: the same exact dynamic.

397
00:24:39,600 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 2: Same thing, yep. And so I got it and I

398
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,800
Speaker 2: could tell the men and a woman would walk in

399
00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:51,080
Speaker 2: my office abuse I knew what it was. Wow, Yeah,

400
00:24:51,119 --> 00:24:51,919
Speaker 2: and I would tell her.

401
00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 1: Don't you think those people could also tell that you

402
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,280
Speaker 1: why you empathized? Think?

403
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,840
Speaker 2: So there were a few occasions, you know, they teach

404
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:06,959
Speaker 2: us there are boundaries you don't tell. Done a lot

405
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,359
Speaker 2: a lot of self disclosure, you know. There were times

406
00:25:10,359 --> 00:25:12,199
Speaker 2: that I said, I'm going to tell you how I

407
00:25:12,240 --> 00:25:15,840
Speaker 2: know and this is what this is what has to happen.

408
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:17,800
Speaker 1: I get that, But I'm going to tell you something

409
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:21,159
Speaker 1: I think everybody has experienced, even in just a medical doctor,

410
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:28,680
Speaker 1: the difference and an anhiseptic professional approach and an empathetic

411
00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 1: approach that illustrates, I know what you're going through. You

412
00:25:33,160 --> 00:25:36,359
Speaker 1: don't even you don't even have to tell somebody often

413
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:43,680
Speaker 1: for someone to feel that empathy and that and that connection. Yeah,

414
00:25:43,760 --> 00:25:45,879
Speaker 1: so I got to believe many of the people you

415
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,879
Speaker 1: worked with. Okay, so eight years.

416
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Speaker 2: Eight years, and during that time, when I first started

417
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,760
Speaker 2: that job, there were some cases that walked in the

418
00:25:55,800 --> 00:26:00,080
Speaker 2: door and I was like, ugh, I don't know how

419
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 2: to help this person, Like I don't know, I didn't

420
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:05,920
Speaker 2: know the clinical approach.

421
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 1: Did you ever look at him and say, sir, you're

422
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,720
Speaker 1: messed up as a soup sandwich? No, I don't know if.

423
00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,879
Speaker 2: I was shaped it like I just and then I looked.

424
00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 2: I did some research when I got home, and so

425
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:19,120
Speaker 2: that I knew what to do the next time they came.

426
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 1: Okay, so you never say that to I'm kidding Roder obviously, Okay,

427
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: so got it.

428
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 2: Never knew Yeah, But so I said to myself, you

429
00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:34,520
Speaker 2: need more knowledge, you need to go back to school,

430
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:40,399
Speaker 2: and so I enrolled at the University of Tennessee at Knoxville.

431
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:44,159
Speaker 1: At what age at that time?

432
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:47,040
Speaker 2: Well, I graduated when I was forty eight, so I

433
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:48,480
Speaker 2: was about forty five.

434
00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:54,080
Speaker 1: That is incredible that you are still yearning for more

435
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:57,639
Speaker 1: and advancing yourself long after most people have said, all right,

436
00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 1: I'm just cruising here.

437
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:01,000
Speaker 2: Well, I wanted to. I want to help people the

438
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 2: best that I could. I did not want to halfway

439
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 2: do it.

440
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 1: Right, That's the same fabric of the same person who

441
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: with crusted blood on their ears and dried up blood

442
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:15,119
Speaker 1: on their T shirt, looked at their parents and was

443
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 1: more concerned about how their heart hurt. That is the

444
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:22,520
Speaker 1: same fabric, it is.

445
00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:27,280
Speaker 2: Well, so that's how I got to be a doctor.

446
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:35,080
Speaker 2: So I graduated with a near four point zero with

447
00:27:35,560 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 2: my doctorate at University of Tennessee. And so what did

448
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:49,120
Speaker 2: I do next? Well, I finished working at South Central

449
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 2: for that eight and a half years, and then I

450
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:55,720
Speaker 2: just kind of thought, am I really doing as much

451
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:59,760
Speaker 2: as I can for the most people? Am I getting

452
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,159
Speaker 2: the most bang from a book? You know, it was

453
00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:08,800
Speaker 2: one at a time. How can I how can I

454
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,800
Speaker 2: help the most? How can I do the most good,

455
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 2: and I thought, we really need to change the system.

456
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,879
Speaker 2: The systems are what's broken because I see all the

457
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 2: same problems over and over and over.

458
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,320
Speaker 1: Is just say, Alex, is that not deja vous all

459
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 1: over again? I don't know whose episode is going to

460
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,200
Speaker 1: air first, so I don't even know how to tease this,

461
00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:40,720
Speaker 1: but okay. So Trina with One Hour Give an Hour,

462
00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 1: Given Hour said that their entire approach to improving mental

463
00:28:47,560 --> 00:28:52,240
Speaker 1: health is recognizing that the system as it is can't

464
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:54,280
Speaker 1: do enough and we have to break it down and

465
00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 1: be more creative and reach more people. Yes, yes, it is,

466
00:28:58,800 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: I swear. I feel like I'm listening to the same

467
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:07,360
Speaker 1: conversation this part the same conversation, and what they are

468
00:29:07,360 --> 00:29:10,560
Speaker 1: doing is fascinating. But in a microcosm of that, you're

469
00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:14,040
Speaker 1: thinking that in your head. So what's the answer for you?

470
00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 2: Well, I just thought, to reach more people, we have

471
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:21,800
Speaker 2: to have more people, more boots on the ground, we

472
00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:25,120
Speaker 2: have to have more people that are equipped to help

473
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:25,880
Speaker 2: more people.

474
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:29,200
Speaker 1: I should just interviewed you and train it together. That

475
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 1: is incredible, That's exactly what she says.

476
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 2: So I applied for a job as a professor at

477
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:43,000
Speaker 2: the university where I got my master's degree. I started

478
00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 2: actually doing some adjunct teaching work at Tennessee first, just

479
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:49,120
Speaker 2: to test the waters to see if it was what

480
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 2: I really wanted to do. And I loved it, and

481
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 2: so I did adjunct teaching at Tennessee for a couple

482
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:57,600
Speaker 2: of years.

483
00:29:57,840 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 1: And so when did you become a professor at.

484
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 2: This is my second year.

485
00:30:03,520 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: So twenty twenty two. So at the ripe age of

486
00:30:07,880 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 1: somewhere around.

487
00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,880
Speaker 2: Fifty fifty one or two.

488
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,560
Speaker 1: You decided I'm going to start a new career. I'm

489
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:21,400
Speaker 1: going to be a professor of social work and some

490
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 1: other stuff. I guess, yes. So what do you teach?

491
00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:28,800
Speaker 2: So I teach in the Bachelor of Social Work program

492
00:30:28,840 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 2: and the Master of Social Work program. So I think

493
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:34,959
Speaker 2: next year I will just be teaching in the graduate school.

494
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: All right, But what are the classes?

495
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:42,160
Speaker 2: Okay? So I teach policy classes, social welfare policy.

496
00:30:41,840 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: I e.

497
00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:46,000
Speaker 2: Systems, systems, social entrepreneurship.

498
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,440
Speaker 1: That's an interesting what is that.

499
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:55,640
Speaker 2: Is one of my favorites. So these students are graduate students,

500
00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:00,000
Speaker 2: and at the beginning of the semester, I asked them

501
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 2: to what is your passion? What are you passionate about?

502
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,680
Speaker 2: What's the population that you want to work with, who

503
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 2: are they and why? And so we spend the first

504
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:15,040
Speaker 2: few classes talking about that, and then okay, how are

505
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:19,320
Speaker 2: you going to help them? Give me an idea outside

506
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,720
Speaker 2: of government programs, because we know how well that's working

507
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:27,040
Speaker 2: out for us, right if we were all to come

508
00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:30,600
Speaker 2: up with an idea kind of like what they do

509
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,920
Speaker 2: on the Army of normal folks?

510
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:36,040
Speaker 1: Right, nice plug, Thanks.

511
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:38,000
Speaker 2: Well, I use that in my class.

512
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:41,560
Speaker 1: Well, we're going to talk about that, so ironically enough,

513
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 1: and I'm not pitching Triena to you, but that's also

514
00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: what they look for is creative entrepreneur outside of the

515
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:57,800
Speaker 1: box system breaking ideas to reach more people, and theirs

516
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 1: is in creating sort of five peer group leaders and

517
00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 1: all this other thing. What you're doing is trying to

518
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:08,560
Speaker 1: train their first level, which is therapist, that's right.

519
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 2: Just social workers that may work in the systems themselves.

520
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 1: Right right, But you are also challenging them to be

521
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 1: creative and think outside the construct of even their own curriculum. Absolutely,

522
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 1: which is cool. We'll be right back. So here we go. Yes,

523
00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 1: all of that to get to this point, and now

524
00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:59,880
Speaker 1: we're going to set the table. So your dad, through

525
00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:05,840
Speaker 1: a bunch of tacos on the ground and you move

526
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:11,480
Speaker 1: to Mississippi, White Picket Fens, wonderful family. You get into

527
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:16,800
Speaker 1: a really toxic relationship that is controlled by alcohol and

528
00:33:16,880 --> 00:33:20,040
Speaker 1: drug abuse while you're trying to be a mother and

529
00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:23,040
Speaker 1: you're trying to deal with your own demons. You finally

530
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: get out of it after a near death experience. You

531
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 1: were stalked, and through all of it you bounce around

532
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:33,480
Speaker 1: from power and Light to a casino, to mentors telling

533
00:33:33,560 --> 00:33:37,960
Speaker 1: you you've got more to give, get educated, move on up,

534
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 1: and you help people and all the while using your

535
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:44,959
Speaker 1: experience and your empathy to help folks. To then become

536
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:48,000
Speaker 1: a doctor because you decide I can help people one

537
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:51,000
Speaker 1: on one every hour, where I can take classes of

538
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 1: these people to go out and do exponentially more than

539
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: I could do by myself. And that's where you end up.

540
00:33:57,640 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 2: That's right.

541
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,000
Speaker 1: And one day you're screwing around and you hear an

542
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 1: episode of an army and normal folks.

543
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 2: That's correct.

544
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: Where did you first hear an army in normal folks?

545
00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:09,760
Speaker 2: Well, that's kind of a weird story too. I met

546
00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 2: Ryan with Iron Light.

547
00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 1: Ryan is the president of Iron Lights, who is who

548
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:20,560
Speaker 1: Alex our producer works with and for to put together

549
00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 1: all of the production, the music, the artwork, the social

550
00:34:24,480 --> 00:34:29,160
Speaker 1: media and everything else. They are our production arm right

551
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:31,640
Speaker 1: Lights out of Chicago. Yes, So how do you meet Ryan?

552
00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:35,800
Speaker 2: So? I met Ryan in New York last year at

553
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:42,799
Speaker 2: a songwriting workshop slash retreat in New York. Got it

554
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:46,160
Speaker 2: with our favorite band, Blue October. Like I love Blue October,

555
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 2: Love Love Love. So we're up there. It's spend a

556
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:52,040
Speaker 2: week up there. No, it didn't really talk to him,

557
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,719
Speaker 2: didn't know much about him. And then my daughter and

558
00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 2: I decide the next month or so to go to

559
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:02,080
Speaker 2: Knoxville to a Blue October concert and there's Ryan and

560
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:04,160
Speaker 2: his wife and we run into him again there and

561
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:07,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my gosh, Ryan, so dere in the

562
00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:09,440
Speaker 2: middle of the set. We're like, what do you do

563
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:11,960
Speaker 2: for a living? Oh? Well, and if you know Ryan,

564
00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:14,719
Speaker 2: you know, He's like, well, I have this little thing

565
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:19,000
Speaker 2: and we do this policy stuff. And I'm like, oh

566
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:21,600
Speaker 2: my god, I teach policy. And so we hit it

567
00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:23,520
Speaker 2: off and we start talking about all these things. I said,

568
00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,040
Speaker 2: I need you to come talk to my classes. Oh,

569
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 2: that'd be great. And so we get to talking about

570
00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:30,800
Speaker 2: all the things that we do, and so he invites

571
00:35:30,840 --> 00:35:36,880
Speaker 2: me to the summit in Nashville, which is where I

572
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 2: heard your voice. Well, let me back up a little bit.

573
00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,080
Speaker 2: After I had met Ryan at that con. You know,

574
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,040
Speaker 2: after the concert, he tells me about iron Light. So

575
00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,120
Speaker 2: I'm like, what is iron Light? So I started looking

576
00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:52,760
Speaker 2: around and then I stumbled across army and normal folks.

577
00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 2: I start listening to it. I'm like, oh, this is

578
00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:59,840
Speaker 2: what I'm talking about. This is exactly what I'm talking about.

579
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:01,520
Speaker 1: I want to be a part of this.

580
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,320
Speaker 2: I love this, this is what I'm talking about.

581
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:08,160
Speaker 1: Did you know then you'd be interviewed for No I'm.

582
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:10,040
Speaker 2: Wondering, now what am I doing here?

583
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:12,160
Speaker 1: Well, we're about to tell everybody.

584
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:16,160
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. And so at the summit, I hear

585
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:19,480
Speaker 2: your voice across the room. I'm like, that's Bill Courtney.

586
00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:22,440
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, that's Bill Courtney. So that's when I

587
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:25,080
Speaker 2: go over to you and I'm like, you're Bill Courtney,

588
00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 2: aren't you.

589
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:30,360
Speaker 1: Yep? And that's when you tell me that you made

590
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:35,280
Speaker 1: an army normal folks part of your teaching curriculum. Yes,

591
00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: which is at the top of the show. I said,

592
00:36:39,680 --> 00:36:43,080
Speaker 1: I have been complimenting. Look this is not me. But

593
00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:49,440
Speaker 1: I've got a national bestseller book, Academy Award winning film,

594
00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:53,319
Speaker 1: and all kinds of stuff, and I've been overrun with

595
00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:58,360
Speaker 1: complimentary things, and you know, you always want to be gracious,

596
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,000
Speaker 1: but I don't. I really do not take myself that seriously.

597
00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 1: And most all of this just kind of happened. And

598
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 1: I'm still not sure why. But when I heard that

599
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 1: you were using our podcast as part of your curriculum

600
00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:18,359
Speaker 1: to teach people, that mattered to me. That really meant

601
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:22,600
Speaker 1: something that what we're doing can actually do exactly what

602
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:25,160
Speaker 1: we sought out to do. We want an army normal

603
00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: folks to be entertaining. We want people to laugh, we

604
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:30,359
Speaker 1: want people to cry, we want people to think, much

605
00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:33,000
Speaker 1: like you have done in this interview so far, that

606
00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: is what we want. It has to be entertaining or

607
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:39,760
Speaker 1: else people aren't going to listen every week. But wrapped

608
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 1: up in all of that as a greater purpose, and

609
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,000
Speaker 1: I'm not going to say it's a movement, I'm going

610
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:48,359
Speaker 1: to call it just something that matters, you know, And

611
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 1: if the stuff we're producing can be used in a

612
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:55,480
Speaker 1: way that matters to young people and their education, is

613
00:37:55,520 --> 00:38:02,000
Speaker 1: they go out to help the masses. Then we've succeeded. Yes,

614
00:38:02,280 --> 00:38:04,799
Speaker 1: And so when you've told me that I really mean

615
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:09,560
Speaker 1: this forbab my heart, I was so humbled by that

616
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:14,880
Speaker 1: and really honored. And so why you here is to

617
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:18,160
Speaker 1: share with our audience, to say, look at this normal

618
00:38:18,200 --> 00:38:22,240
Speaker 1: person who came from a great, normal middle class, upper

619
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:25,120
Speaker 1: middle class family, went through her own trauma, came out

620
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 1: the backside, redeemed and doing amazing things. But in the process,

621
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 1: through a weird sort of circumstances, found an army and

622
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 1: normal folks and is now using it. And we just

623
00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: couldn't be more honored. So what does using it look like?

624
00:38:46,280 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: And I'm going to let you go because you got

625
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:50,240
Speaker 1: some paper in front of you. Girl.

626
00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 2: I am a professor and I always have paper in.

627
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:57,480
Speaker 1: Front of it. Yeah, your doctor teach school, You're going

628
00:38:57,520 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 1: to have paper.

629
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:02,640
Speaker 2: Yes, I've brought the assignment with me just so you

630
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:04,000
Speaker 2: would know kind of what it looks like.

631
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:05,279
Speaker 1: Well, I want everybody to know.

632
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 2: In the policy classes that I teach, we spend a

633
00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 2: lot of time talking about how broken everything is because

634
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:19,239
Speaker 2: we a lot of our systems are broken, and so

635
00:39:20,200 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 2: there's a lot of bleakness, a lot of dreariness, a

636
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 2: lot of depression, a lot of and so the students

637
00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:32,320
Speaker 2: are sometimes very disillusioned and they're just not feeling great

638
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 2: about what are we going into in this profession, right

639
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:40,240
Speaker 2: because well, at this at the point in the semester

640
00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 2: that we're talking about how terrible the systems are, they

641
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:44,359
Speaker 2: don't see that just yet.

642
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:49,400
Speaker 1: The systems include our politics. Yes, so we're talking about

643
00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:54,120
Speaker 1: a broad policy discussed, not just mental health policy, but

644
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 1: all of the policy that.

645
00:39:55,480 --> 00:40:01,200
Speaker 2: Affects me on it's healthcare, racism, U In events, I

646
00:40:01,239 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 2: have them like you need to find a current event

647
00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 2: and write about it. Things in state, in the state government,

648
00:40:07,800 --> 00:40:10,120
Speaker 2: in the area, like what's going on right now? The

649
00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:13,200
Speaker 2: Jackson water crisis, Like what is it that's going on

650
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:16,359
Speaker 2: that effects our people? Got it right? And so there's

651
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:21,120
Speaker 2: a lot of yuck for a while, and so I

652
00:40:21,120 --> 00:40:24,800
Speaker 2: could tell that they were getting a little bit ugh,

653
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:27,279
Speaker 2: and so I thought, you know what, they need to

654
00:40:27,320 --> 00:40:31,000
Speaker 2: hear that change is possible. They need to hear that

655
00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 2: people can really do some things.

656
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 1: That normal folks can make a.

657
00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:38,200
Speaker 2: Different normal people because they're normal.

658
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 1: They see themselves as do we all see ourselves as

659
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:41,479
Speaker 1: normal people?

660
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 2: Right? And I think there's a sense of hopelessness when

661
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 2: you are standing in the middle of all of this

662
00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:52,600
Speaker 2: and it seems so big. What can I do to

663
00:40:52,680 --> 00:40:53,239
Speaker 2: fix this?

664
00:40:54,160 --> 00:40:55,839
Speaker 1: Right? That's the challenge.

665
00:40:56,200 --> 00:41:00,360
Speaker 2: Yes, and so I needed them to see that people

666
00:41:00,440 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 2: are doing even little things to change it. And this

667
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:11,040
Speaker 2: was the perfect example, because you're talking every week about

668
00:41:11,239 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 2: people that are doing things to help people every single day.

669
00:41:19,280 --> 00:41:23,640
Speaker 2: And so I have them go and listen to an

670
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:25,920
Speaker 2: episode of Army of Normal Folks.

671
00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:27,320
Speaker 1: Do you choose it or one of their chooses?

672
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:31,239
Speaker 2: No, they choose it. So I tell them here's the assignment.

673
00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:34,719
Speaker 2: Listen to an episode of the podcast An Army of

674
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:37,759
Speaker 2: Normal Folks and choose an episode that is meaningful to you,

675
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 2: and I give them a list and a synopsis of

676
00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 2: all of the episodes. Do not choose the first one

677
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:46,600
Speaker 2: on the playlist. I have to tell them that because

678
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,040
Speaker 2: if I don't know, they will, I said, unless it's

679
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:52,440
Speaker 2: particularly meaningful to you. And then I want them to

680
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,239
Speaker 2: give me a synopsis so that I know that they

681
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:58,839
Speaker 2: really listened. Describe the population that they serve, what they did,

682
00:41:58,920 --> 00:42:03,839
Speaker 2: and why, how did their actions affect issues on the

683
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:08,920
Speaker 2: micro and the macro level, like as an individual and systemic,

684
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:12,359
Speaker 2: like at the bigger level and be specific. And then

685
00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:15,560
Speaker 2: I asked them to explain why they chose that particular episode.

686
00:42:16,239 --> 00:42:18,919
Speaker 2: Was it meaningful to them? What made it meaningful to them?

687
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:24,319
Speaker 2: Explain the importance of everyday citizens taking action in their

688
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 2: communities and how this action affects change in society as

689
00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:30,840
Speaker 2: a whole on a systemic level. And what are some

690
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:34,160
Speaker 2: ways to encourage each other to model what these normal

691
00:42:34,200 --> 00:42:37,600
Speaker 2: folks have done. How do we encourage action that will

692
00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 2: help populations on a greater level. So the goal of

693
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,880
Speaker 2: this assignment is to get them thinking about how do

694
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:49,760
Speaker 2: they do that? How can I be thinking about affecting

695
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:53,719
Speaker 2: change just as a normal person in Hattiesburg, Mississippi.

696
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:06,760
Speaker 3: We'll be right back, so tell me what happened.

697
00:43:07,040 --> 00:43:12,880
Speaker 2: So they turned in some very very thoughtful answers, and

698
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 2: I'm extremely proud I can this person chose Luke Michelson.

699
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:21,879
Speaker 1: Always one of my favorite. Oh shoot, I shouldn't say that,

700
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 1: y'all are my favorite, but Luke Michelson is particularly interesting.

701
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,120
Speaker 1: Sleep in Heavenly Peace right. I can't believe I remember that, Luke?

702
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:31,880
Speaker 1: I remember you? Go ahead.

703
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:36,080
Speaker 2: This person chose this particular episode because many of my

704
00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:39,719
Speaker 2: friends were resorting to using two or three blankets on

705
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:41,120
Speaker 2: the Florida find comfort.

706
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:42,799
Speaker 1: For the night because they didn't have a bat as a.

707
00:43:42,920 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: Jeft experience yep. And she said it indeed starts with

708
00:43:46,840 --> 00:43:51,040
Speaker 2: ordinary people living their everyday lives, setting off a domino

709
00:43:51,120 --> 00:44:00,120
Speaker 2: effect of positive change. And so this person chose Jessica.

710
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,759
Speaker 2: Several people chose Jessica Lamb's et.

711
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:05,320
Speaker 1: Jessica Lamb is pretty cool.

712
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:08,640
Speaker 2: Yep. I think it's important for everyday citizens to do

713
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:11,080
Speaker 2: their best to help people around them. This goes from

714
00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:14,560
Speaker 2: working with a certain population to just giving others in

715
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:18,280
Speaker 2: your community a helping hand or resource to someone who

716
00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:19,720
Speaker 2: can help them better.

717
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:25,080
Speaker 1: Jessca Lamb another person who was through some unbelievable trauma.

718
00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 2: Yes she did. She said it can become something bigger

719
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:31,440
Speaker 2: and help a wide range of people. I think a

720
00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:35,319
Speaker 2: good way to encourage people model the podcast or those

721
00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:38,120
Speaker 2: on it would be just to speak up. Speak up

722
00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:40,919
Speaker 2: in your community about what you believe in and find

723
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 2: a population that you want to help. So just speak up,

724
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:49,520
Speaker 2: make connections as a future social worker. This was very

725
00:44:49,640 --> 00:44:54,480
Speaker 2: ee opening episode. This was Tiani Shoemaker Clyde.

726
00:44:54,880 --> 00:45:00,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, she is in Salt Lake, and they go and

727
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:04,440
Speaker 1: basically give an unwed mother with a bunch of kids

728
00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 1: a day out to be normal while they go clean

729
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 1: and fix up their house.

730
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 2: And how simple of a concept is that?

731
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 1: How hard is it?

732
00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 2: How hard is that? Right? So she chose this. She

733
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 2: said it was very eye opening because most communities are

734
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:24,320
Speaker 2: very welcoming and willing to support other people. It shows

735
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:28,560
Speaker 2: why community engagement matters. When the community is engaged, it

736
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:32,400
Speaker 2: brings out other ideas and it improves people's knowledge and

737
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:35,560
Speaker 2: makes the community more aware. That put a star by

738
00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:38,600
Speaker 2: this one. This one was Aaron Smith advocating for Thomas

739
00:45:38,640 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 2: because he was an Old Myths student.

740
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:47,480
Speaker 1: So Aaron Smith is from Oxford and Thomas was somebody

741
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:53,320
Speaker 1: that was in foster care that she helped. Thomas was whipped,

742
00:45:55,080 --> 00:46:01,719
Speaker 1: sexually assaulted, abused from childhood all the way into college

743
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: and was basically dropped off at Ole Miss had great grades,

744
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:09,520
Speaker 1: great act scores, basically dropped off at college with no love,

745
00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:14,520
Speaker 1: no sport. And he found an advocate in Aaron Smith

746
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:18,439
Speaker 1: and he is now wanting to go into social work

747
00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 1: and psychology. Yay, Yeah, what they say about that?

748
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 2: She said, by knowing that it took one person and

749
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,399
Speaker 2: a lot of hard work to get this done. It

750
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:32,440
Speaker 2: encourages me to put something in the works for my

751
00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:45,800
Speaker 2: community one day just by listening to this one episode.

752
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:51,120
Speaker 2: Some way we can encourage other people to model normal

753
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 2: folks by spreading awareness, advocating, and holding each other accountable

754
00:46:56,000 --> 00:46:59,840
Speaker 2: and connecting with each other. Sometimes thinking about acting for

755
00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:03,200
Speaker 2: the bigger population can seem daunting, but there have been

756
00:47:03,239 --> 00:47:06,600
Speaker 2: so many times that encouraging smaller action plans lead to

757
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:11,200
Speaker 2: huge organizations and much bigger action because of the growth

758
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:13,120
Speaker 2: and connection they affect on the world. This was a

759
00:47:13,239 --> 00:47:13,920
Speaker 2: Jessica Lamb.

760
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:16,440
Speaker 1: I love that one because it's true. So many of

761
00:47:16,440 --> 00:47:18,920
Speaker 1: the people we've interviewed just started out with a small

762
00:47:18,960 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 1: thing they never expected to be something, and now they're

763
00:47:21,200 --> 00:47:25,000
Speaker 1: helping hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of people. And

764
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:28,080
Speaker 1: the point is, so many people say, I want to help,

765
00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:30,600
Speaker 1: but where do I start? We start with the people

766
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:33,680
Speaker 1: closest to you and help five, help ten who knows where?

767
00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 2: Yep, this one was Troy and Erica Andrews. Yeah they adopted. Yeah.

768
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:47,480
Speaker 2: Let's see. If we do not take action on our

769
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:50,200
Speaker 2: communities and just wait for everything to be done for us,

770
00:47:50,960 --> 00:47:52,120
Speaker 2: nothing will likely be.

771
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:57,799
Speaker 1: Done that emulates the somebody out to do something about that,

772
00:47:58,040 --> 00:48:00,760
Speaker 1: And the question is who's somebody, right.

773
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:06,719
Speaker 2: Amy Crenshaw.

774
00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:09,560
Speaker 1: Amy Crenshaw is awesome.

775
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:13,239
Speaker 2: I chose this episode because community based work is what

776
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:15,719
Speaker 2: I've always wanted to do. I think the best way

777
00:48:15,719 --> 00:48:18,280
Speaker 2: to start change is by getting involved in the community

778
00:48:18,320 --> 00:48:21,360
Speaker 2: and helping anyone in need. I like the unique fact

779
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:24,440
Speaker 2: that everyone is treated equally and with respect. This organization

780
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:27,120
Speaker 2: is important because they take donations that allow them to

781
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:30,400
Speaker 2: give back to the community. They also allow anyone to

782
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 2: volunteer and help out.

783
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:36,919
Speaker 1: Community cafe, which is you go and eat and that's

784
00:48:36,960 --> 00:48:39,359
Speaker 1: a first class meal, and you pay what you can

785
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:41,879
Speaker 1: afford to pay, and if you can afford to pay more,

786
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:44,520
Speaker 1: you do, and if you can afford to pay less,

787
00:48:44,560 --> 00:48:46,960
Speaker 1: you do. Everybody eats, and if you can afford to

788
00:48:46,960 --> 00:48:49,719
Speaker 1: pay nothing, you still eat a great meal, but you

789
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:52,120
Speaker 1: owe an hour and they'll kitchen to wash dishes, whatever,

790
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:55,239
Speaker 1: And so the entire community can go to a place

791
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:57,480
Speaker 1: and eat. And the irony of that is you will

792
00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:00,279
Speaker 1: have homeless people sitting next to lawyers eating lung munch

793
00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:03,440
Speaker 1: and they interact and learn about each other. Community Cafe.

794
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:09,400
Speaker 2: So this one is about Deb Ellinger, who works with

795
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 2: women who are trafficked right.

796
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 1: Which is an intense podcast.

797
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:17,759
Speaker 2: She said, I chose this topic because of the population.

798
00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:21,759
Speaker 2: Professors often ask what population we want to work with,

799
00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:24,839
Speaker 2: and I'm too nervous to say because I don't have

800
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:27,680
Speaker 2: a population. I only know that I have a purpose.

801
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:31,839
Speaker 2: My purpose is to be that person that made me

802
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:34,200
Speaker 2: feel worthy in deserving of the life that I want

803
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:37,200
Speaker 2: to achieve. Maybe that's why this story hit home.

804
00:49:38,120 --> 00:49:40,440
Speaker 1: Wow, that's awesome.

805
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:45,560
Speaker 2: This story meant so much to me. I also learned

806
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 2: something from it that showed me how to take action

807
00:49:47,760 --> 00:49:50,400
Speaker 2: in a community the way that I was wanting to

808
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:53,040
Speaker 2: do when you mentioned it in class, but didn't know

809
00:49:53,080 --> 00:49:55,880
Speaker 2: how to start it. I thought it had to have

810
00:49:55,960 --> 00:50:00,480
Speaker 2: a big outcome first. Her story shifted my focus to

811
00:50:00,640 --> 00:50:03,800
Speaker 2: one action and way of life rather than the outcome,

812
00:50:04,360 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 2: because we cannot control the outcome.

813
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:10,120
Speaker 1: Wow, that is so awesome.

814
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:13,160
Speaker 2: And it goes on and on and on. Give me

815
00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:22,319
Speaker 2: one more and one more, Guoddy, Tianni Schoemaker Clyde, So

816
00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:26,480
Speaker 2: there's two more for her, Lissie. I chose this episode

817
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:28,720
Speaker 2: because I'm a single mom and I love the idea

818
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:32,040
Speaker 2: of helping other single mom. No one understands how stressful

819
00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 2: it is except for someone who's going through it too.

820
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:41,640
Speaker 1: Well.

821
00:50:41,640 --> 00:50:45,239
Speaker 2: There were three of them that mentioned her. Some of

822
00:50:45,280 --> 00:50:51,600
Speaker 2: them are I mean, they're probably in their thirties. I

823
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:54,319
Speaker 2: chose this episode for two reasons. The first reason is

824
00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:57,040
Speaker 2: because I was raised by a single mother. I did

825
00:50:57,080 --> 00:50:59,400
Speaker 2: not truly understand how hard it must have been for

826
00:50:59,480 --> 00:51:01,840
Speaker 2: my mom until I had my own daughter and realized

827
00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:04,239
Speaker 2: how blessed I am to have her father to be

828
00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:07,040
Speaker 2: an active part of her life. The second reason I

829
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:09,480
Speaker 2: chose this episode is because at one point in my

830
00:51:09,560 --> 00:51:13,080
Speaker 2: life I wanted to open a shelter that provided services

831
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:21,600
Speaker 2: for single mothers and children. And so I think by

832
00:51:21,640 --> 00:51:24,279
Speaker 2: doing this assignment, it helps them to really see that

833
00:51:24,360 --> 00:51:27,640
Speaker 2: you can do these things that because several of these

834
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:30,239
Speaker 2: have said I've wanted to do it but didn't know

835
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:31,600
Speaker 2: how well.

836
00:51:31,640 --> 00:51:33,839
Speaker 1: And that's part of the whole idea is we want

837
00:51:33,920 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 1: to encourage people to listen long enough to find a

838
00:51:37,960 --> 00:51:41,440
Speaker 1: place where they're passion and their discipline, their passion and

839
00:51:41,480 --> 00:51:45,279
Speaker 1: their abilities meet at opportunity. And if you have the

840
00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 1: ability and you're passionate about it, and you see an opportunity,

841
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:52,080
Speaker 1: and then you have the temerity, Yes, to simply do it,

842
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:59,759
Speaker 1: then we can change our society. And to hear your

843
00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 1: students say, I'm encouraged by this person because it shows

844
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:09,720
Speaker 1: me I can. That's the nexus of the show.

845
00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,200
Speaker 2: Yes, And.

846
00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:17,799
Speaker 1: To see a person who's wound through life to get

847
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:22,319
Speaker 1: where you are now using the show to encourage her

848
00:52:22,400 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 1: students to become a part of the army of normal folks,

849
00:52:28,840 --> 00:52:32,399
Speaker 1: which I maintain is the only thing that's really going

850
00:52:32,480 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 1: to have a significant effect on changing our society. Is

851
00:52:38,800 --> 00:52:45,480
Speaker 1: so humbling and rewarding all at once. What's next, Well.

852
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:48,600
Speaker 2: I hope I will teach the social entrepreneurship class again

853
00:52:49,000 --> 00:52:50,200
Speaker 2: because this last.

854
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:51,319
Speaker 1: Is that what this class came from.

855
00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:54,320
Speaker 2: Oh, I think this class was in my policy class.

856
00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:58,080
Speaker 1: Got it, but it could certainly be used in social entrepreneurship.

857
00:52:58,080 --> 00:53:02,080
Speaker 2: I did use it, but I used They had to

858
00:53:02,120 --> 00:53:05,720
Speaker 2: listen to a podcast, but they an episode of the podcast.

859
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:08,640
Speaker 2: But they didn't necessarily have to do this assignment because

860
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:11,799
Speaker 2: that class is more about coming up with.

861
00:53:11,719 --> 00:53:15,000
Speaker 1: Your own Yeah, but the creativity of many of our

862
00:53:15,040 --> 00:53:16,520
Speaker 1: guests is a way for them to.

863
00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 2: So they have to watch clips. So they watched a

864
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 2: clip of Cherry Garcia.

865
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:27,920
Speaker 1: She's hilarious, hilarious.

866
00:53:28,000 --> 00:53:30,880
Speaker 2: Yes, I told you when I first listened to her.

867
00:53:31,320 --> 00:53:34,279
Speaker 2: When I listened to her episode, I sobbed like a

868
00:53:34,320 --> 00:53:39,120
Speaker 2: baby because it just hit me somewhere, just the whole

869
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,319
Speaker 2: just the whole thing just got me. And I told

870
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:44,759
Speaker 2: her that as you met her, Yes, I did, Yes,

871
00:53:44,920 --> 00:53:48,600
Speaker 2: And I told her. I told her that. But they

872
00:53:48,640 --> 00:53:52,520
Speaker 2: have to watch Let's see, they watched Cherry Garcia, they

873
00:53:52,600 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 2: watched Chad Howser. Yes, Oh my goodness, I wish I

874
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:07,360
Speaker 2: could remember them all. But there were several they have

875
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:13,160
Speaker 2: been on this podcast that I had them watch, you know,

876
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:17,480
Speaker 2: YouTube videos or whatever on them to get ideas about

877
00:54:17,640 --> 00:54:22,480
Speaker 2: what is your if your passion is this population, Here

878
00:54:22,520 --> 00:54:25,319
Speaker 2: are some ideas of what people have done. Call them,

879
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:28,440
Speaker 2: listen to the podcast. They give you their number and

880
00:54:28,480 --> 00:54:32,200
Speaker 2: their email address. Get some ideas, find out how you

881
00:54:32,280 --> 00:54:37,200
Speaker 2: can start this in Mississippi. Why can't we right?

882
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:41,560
Speaker 1: Which is always the question we should be asking, not

883
00:54:42,760 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 1: how can I? But why can't I?

884
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,799
Speaker 2: Yes, I had a student in this last semester whose

885
00:54:47,880 --> 00:54:52,760
Speaker 2: name is Joe. He was a corrections officer in Harrison

886
00:54:52,800 --> 00:55:00,279
Speaker 2: County Jail System or I guess Sheriff's department. And then

887
00:55:00,360 --> 00:55:04,880
Speaker 2: got into social work. He is originally from Liberia, Africa,

888
00:55:05,800 --> 00:55:10,360
Speaker 2: immigrated here when he was a child and had to

889
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:14,520
Speaker 2: spend I think two years in a I'm telling his

890
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:17,000
Speaker 2: story for him, but I don't think he would mind

891
00:55:17,320 --> 00:55:19,879
Speaker 2: two years in a refugee camp before they actually got

892
00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:23,320
Speaker 2: to the United States. Came over here, became a citizen,

893
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:27,520
Speaker 2: joined the Air Force, then became a sheriff's deputy. Now

894
00:55:27,560 --> 00:55:30,520
Speaker 2: he's becoming a social work getting his master's degree in

895
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:35,040
Speaker 2: social work. Just graduated. Listen to the podcast, Listen to

896
00:55:35,120 --> 00:55:41,799
Speaker 2: Cherry Garcia's podcast, watched her video. His idea because he's

897
00:55:41,840 --> 00:55:45,960
Speaker 2: worked in the prison system, was to help bridge the

898
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:50,000
Speaker 2: gap between people coming out of the jail system and

899
00:55:50,080 --> 00:55:54,200
Speaker 2: into the job market and wants to also do similar

900
00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:54,480
Speaker 2: to what.

901
00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 1: Arry davisous time.

902
00:55:56,960 --> 00:56:03,080
Speaker 2: Yes, and that's where his passion is. So we have

903
00:56:04,000 --> 00:56:07,960
Speaker 2: an a part of the business school at USM is

904
00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 2: an incubator and they put into small businesses, like they

905
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:14,680
Speaker 2: help you develop business ideas and things like that. They

906
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:18,040
Speaker 2: have a Golden Pitch Idea every year that you can

907
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:21,640
Speaker 2: pitch your idea to them and they help you develop it.

908
00:56:22,120 --> 00:56:26,160
Speaker 2: But it's a competition and so I announced it. Hey

909
00:56:26,480 --> 00:56:31,480
Speaker 2: here's money for your idea. In my entrepreneurship class, Joe

910
00:56:31,560 --> 00:56:37,160
Speaker 2: was the only one that entered the competition. He made

911
00:56:37,200 --> 00:56:38,320
Speaker 2: it to the final round.

912
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:39,320
Speaker 3: Wow.

913
00:56:39,480 --> 00:56:42,200
Speaker 2: Out of I don't know thirty people in the college

914
00:56:42,239 --> 00:56:46,480
Speaker 2: that entered, he made it to the top eight. And

915
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:51,319
Speaker 2: so I went and listened. Of course, you know, there's

916
00:56:51,400 --> 00:56:55,440
Speaker 2: no return on investment with social entrepreneurship with it, you know,

917
00:56:55,880 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 2: So he didn't win because apps, you know what I mean.

918
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:02,839
Speaker 1: Still vetting and learning and going through it.

919
00:57:02,920 --> 00:57:04,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I know.

920
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:07,840
Speaker 1: It was honest, this guy starting a refugee camp in

921
00:57:07,960 --> 00:57:10,279
Speaker 1: Iberia and at least presenting to a bunch of people

922
00:57:10,320 --> 00:57:14,319
Speaker 1: at Southern Minister ideas on how to help curb purcidivism.

923
00:57:14,800 --> 00:57:17,000
Speaker 2: Yes, wow, I am so proud.

924
00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:18,240
Speaker 1: You should be.

925
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,840
Speaker 2: Yes, I was so proud. So he is going to

926
00:57:22,040 --> 00:57:23,160
Speaker 2: do great things.

927
00:57:23,560 --> 00:57:29,800
Speaker 1: I cannot tell you how honored I am that our

928
00:57:29,880 --> 00:57:34,960
Speaker 1: little experiment show here one has grown the way it's

929
00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:37,920
Speaker 1: grown and has the listenership it does, and we are

930
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:41,040
Speaker 1: killing ourselves to continue to grow it. Not because of

931
00:57:41,120 --> 00:57:43,520
Speaker 1: its feathers in our hat, but because the more listeners,

932
00:57:43,520 --> 00:57:45,680
Speaker 1: the more impact, and the more impact, the more things

933
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:49,640
Speaker 1: that can change. But to know that it's being used

934
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:56,840
Speaker 1: in a curriculum, especially with someone with your perspective and

935
00:57:56,960 --> 00:58:02,760
Speaker 1: your life story and your background, trying to help students

936
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:06,280
Speaker 1: see a better way is just so encouraging because your

937
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:10,240
Speaker 1: goal of how can I help the most one on

938
00:58:10,240 --> 00:58:13,040
Speaker 1: one in an hour or teach an army of people

939
00:58:13,080 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 1: to go on and do one on one an hour.

940
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:22,720
Speaker 1: The exponential growth of your efforts through teaching and then

941
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:25,800
Speaker 1: to be even a small part of that effort is

942
00:58:26,800 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 1: Ronda is such an honor and it is such a

943
00:58:29,680 --> 00:58:35,960
Speaker 1: cool story. And I just I don't know. Maybe you're

944
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:38,760
Speaker 1: gonna go into physics when you're sixty three. I don't

945
00:58:38,800 --> 00:58:44,560
Speaker 1: know what I can promise that is no, no, no, no, no, Ronda.

946
00:58:45,040 --> 00:58:48,040
Speaker 1: If they are educators listening, because this could be done in.

947
00:58:48,040 --> 00:58:50,960
Speaker 2: High school, oh absolutely, This.

948
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:53,680
Speaker 1: Could be done in community colleges, This could be done

949
00:58:53,800 --> 00:58:57,400
Speaker 1: outside of social work, This could work in leadership classes,

950
00:58:57,520 --> 00:59:00,640
Speaker 1: This could work in all kinds of stuff. But if

951
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:03,760
Speaker 1: someone wants to get your perspective on it, that's an educator.

952
00:59:04,360 --> 00:59:05,480
Speaker 1: How do they get in touch with you?

953
00:59:06,960 --> 00:59:12,440
Speaker 2: My email address is d R as in doctor d R. R.

954
00:59:12,680 --> 00:59:17,360
Speaker 2: Smith S, M I T H seven zero at gmail.

955
00:59:17,280 --> 00:59:20,200
Speaker 1: Dot com and you'll answer an email.

956
00:59:20,680 --> 00:59:23,320
Speaker 2: Absolutely. I watched my email every minute.

957
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:27,200
Speaker 1: Rhonda, Thanks for coming to Memphis, Thanks for sharing this,

958
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:34,040
Speaker 1: Thanks for sharing, first of all, being so transparent and

959
00:59:34,080 --> 00:59:37,520
Speaker 1: the only word that's coming to my mind emotionally neked

960
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 1: about what you went through to be able to get

961
00:59:45,360 --> 00:59:48,280
Speaker 1: where you are, because I think the redemption is I

962
00:59:48,320 --> 00:59:50,160
Speaker 1: don't think you'd be as good as what you are

963
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:52,640
Speaker 1: right now had you not suffered the measure you suffered.

964
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:55,400
Speaker 1: I agree, So that's got to be the silver lining

965
00:59:55,440 --> 00:59:59,080
Speaker 1: and the blessing and all of it. Yeah, but thanks

966
00:59:59,120 --> 01:00:02,120
Speaker 1: for that you're coming to Memphis and sharing all of that,

967
01:00:02,560 --> 01:00:04,760
Speaker 1: because I do think that's got to be encouraging to

968
01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:08,000
Speaker 1: somebody listening to this. But the other thing is, thanks

969
01:00:08,080 --> 01:00:15,120
Speaker 1: very much for encouraging me. You know, I've got a

970
01:00:15,160 --> 01:00:17,480
Speaker 1: business to run, I've got four kids, two of which

971
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:20,160
Speaker 1: you're getting married. I've got all kinds of things going

972
01:00:20,200 --> 01:00:24,760
Speaker 1: on in my life, and this is encouraging to me

973
01:00:24,840 --> 01:00:27,160
Speaker 1: because maybe what we're doing is making a little bit

974
01:00:27,240 --> 01:00:29,440
Speaker 1: of a difference and at least helping in some corners

975
01:00:29,480 --> 01:00:36,280
Speaker 1: of the world. And I'm humbled, honored again, I'm being redundant,

976
01:00:36,280 --> 01:00:40,240
Speaker 1: but I'm humbled honored and really encouraged by it. And

977
01:00:40,520 --> 01:00:42,200
Speaker 1: I hope you keep using it every year, and I

978
01:00:42,200 --> 01:00:45,560
Speaker 1: hope kids keep growing from it. Maybe one day I

979
01:00:45,600 --> 01:00:50,680
Speaker 1: can get to Hattisburg when school's in and visit your

980
01:00:50,720 --> 01:00:52,640
Speaker 1: students with you. I would really like to do that

981
01:00:52,720 --> 01:00:54,720
Speaker 1: one day. So certainly there's got to be a way

982
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:55,160
Speaker 1: we could do that.

983
01:00:55,440 --> 01:00:57,960
Speaker 2: Absolutely, we're going to make that happen. Yes, And I

984
01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:01,240
Speaker 2: want you to know if I can. If I'm counting correctly,

985
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:04,400
Speaker 2: I teach four classes a semester, I have about twenty

986
01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:09,040
Speaker 2: twenty five. If I use this in every class, I'm

987
01:01:09,080 --> 01:01:16,760
Speaker 2: teaching one hundred students a semester. How many is that?

988
01:01:17,200 --> 01:01:24,440
Speaker 2: In two years? Four hundred people have already had these assignments.

989
01:01:24,880 --> 01:01:29,360
Speaker 1: That's amazing, that's awesome. I hope they're still listening. For goodness,

990
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:30,760
Speaker 1: I hope.

991
01:01:30,560 --> 01:01:32,440
Speaker 2: They're regular college students.

992
01:01:32,480 --> 01:01:35,920
Speaker 1: You know. Odds are of the four hundred, one hundred

993
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:39,000
Speaker 1: and twenty five are so that's great. Maybe we will

994
01:01:39,080 --> 01:01:41,960
Speaker 1: pay you a side fee as a pomation. You should

995
01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 1: you should do that.

996
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:46,000
Speaker 2: I will do it. Yes, I think it's worth it.

997
01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:46,560
Speaker 2: I really do.

998
01:01:47,400 --> 01:01:50,440
Speaker 1: Mom, Dad, thanks for joining, Thanks for thanks for hanging

999
01:01:50,440 --> 01:01:53,520
Speaker 1: out with us, and thanks for coming up to Memphis.

1000
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:55,440
Speaker 1: I hope you enjoy the rest of your time here,

1001
01:01:55,480 --> 01:01:59,120
Speaker 1: and Rohnda we will meet again, I hope.

1002
01:01:59,200 --> 01:02:01,880
Speaker 2: So thank you, thanks so much for having me, thank.

1003
01:02:01,680 --> 01:02:06,440
Speaker 1: You so much for being here, and thank you for

1004
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: joining us this week. If Ronda Smith or other guests

1005
01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 1: have inspired you in general, or better yet, to take

1006
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:17,840
Speaker 1: action by using an army of normal folks in your classroom,

1007
01:02:18,360 --> 01:02:22,520
Speaker 1: your place of worship, with your family, or something else entirely,

1008
01:02:23,120 --> 01:02:25,680
Speaker 1: please let me know. I'd love to hear about it.

1009
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:30,720
Speaker 1: You can write me anytime at Bill at normalfolks dot us,

1010
01:02:30,720 --> 01:02:34,000
Speaker 1: and I swear to you I will respond. If you

1011
01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:37,080
Speaker 1: enjoyed this episode, please share it with friends and on

1012
01:02:37,200 --> 01:02:42,160
Speaker 1: social y'all subscribe to the podcast, rate and review it,

1013
01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:46,480
Speaker 1: become a premium member at normalfolks dot us. All of

1014
01:02:46,520 --> 01:02:49,440
Speaker 1: these things that will help us grow an army of

1015
01:02:49,520 --> 01:02:54,480
Speaker 1: normal folks. Thanks to our producer, Ironlight Laves, I'm Bill Courtney.

1016
01:02:54,920 --> 01:03:02,320
Speaker 1: I'll see you next week. Every don't dunking Bom