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Speaker 1: Ready, all right, looka motis. So today we come to

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Speaker 1: the studio a little shaken. Honestly, I texted Theosa and

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Speaker 1: Jackie this morning SOS because I was really stressed out

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Speaker 1: while I was walking my dog and I'm going to

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Speaker 1: get emotional because it just happened and I'm still processing.

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Speaker 1: But when I was walking my dog bought us on

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Speaker 1: our morning walk. Typical day, I wanted to get everything

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Speaker 1: going early so that I could get to campus and

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Speaker 1: work on producing this movie I'm producing, and then get

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Speaker 1: to Hollywood to record with Loka Thoida. And as we're

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Speaker 1: out and about, there was this group of white men

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Speaker 1: who were walking in the opposite direction that I was,

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Speaker 1: so they were walking towards me. I was walking towards them.

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Speaker 1: And you know that moment when, especially I think, as

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Speaker 1: women were out and about and there's a group of

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Speaker 1: men and they're talking and they're laughing and they're chattering,

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Speaker 1: and then when they get close to you they get

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Speaker 1: really quiet. Well that happened that moment. So they're passing

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Speaker 1: by me. There's like six or seven of them, and

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Speaker 1: they got really quiet, and then one of them says,

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Speaker 1: Ice is going to get you. And then the others

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Speaker 1: started to repeat it, and then they started like laughing

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Speaker 1: about it, and you know, they were like passing me

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Speaker 1: on both sides of the sidewalk, so I felt very

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Speaker 1: much like surrounded by them. They didn't stop, they didn't

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Speaker 1: touch me, they didn't say anything else, but they said

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Speaker 1: ice is going to get you. And then they all

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Speaker 1: started repeating it and laughing, and it took me a

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Speaker 1: minute to realize that the comment was directed towards me,

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Speaker 1: and it definitely was, and so I just wanted to

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Speaker 1: like get out of there and get home as soon

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Speaker 1: as possible and get to campus and go on with

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Speaker 1: my day. And so you know, I know you all

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Speaker 1: out there in your own in your own communities and

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Speaker 1: in your own families are experiencing scary things. I'm much

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Speaker 1: scarier than what I experience this morning. But it was

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Speaker 1: one of those moments where like they felt so bold

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Speaker 1: to say something to me, a complete stranger, and I

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Speaker 1: was not bothering them. And also a reminder that, you know,

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Speaker 1: it reminded me in that moment that like when they

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Speaker 1: looked at me, they saw somebody who is other and

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Speaker 1: who could be targeted for things like this, Like I

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Speaker 1: look like somebody who could be snatched up. And I

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Speaker 1: know that we're all seeing the news and the reports

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Speaker 1: about the way that Ice that how they have quotas

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Speaker 1: that they're trying to meet, and Maria, you know Hosa

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Speaker 1: recently was talking about how there simply aren't enough you know,

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Speaker 1: quote criminal undocumented people to round up, and so in

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Speaker 1: order to meet their quotas, they're just detaining anybody and

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Speaker 1: everybody indiscriminately without asking names or documentation. They're definitely acting

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Speaker 1: first and asking questions later. And so after that experience,

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Speaker 1: all of that was coming to mind for me, and

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Speaker 1: it just made me hyper aware of how close the

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Speaker 1: threat is and how even just seemingly pedestrian people on

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Speaker 1: the street might have that hatred in their heart. And

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Speaker 1: you know, it was scary to experience that they were

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Speaker 1: so close to me and so close to where I live,

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Speaker 1: and that when I walk out on the street that

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Speaker 1: somebody might see me or someone like me, or someone

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Speaker 1: like our listeners, or like my co host, or like

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Speaker 1: my friends and family and think that it's funny that

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Speaker 1: were being targeted. So I just wanted to share that

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Speaker 1: this morning. And you know, I know we've been covering

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Speaker 1: the ice raids on the podcast, and what a scary

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Speaker 1: time it is. And it's scary for a lot of

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Speaker 1: different reasons, politically, economically, This administration is basically touching all

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Speaker 1: parts of our lives. And you know, I don't think

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Speaker 1: that there's necessarily a smooth transition from today's experience into

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Speaker 1: the topic of our episode, but we did want to

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Speaker 1: talk about all the different reasons why people in our

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Speaker 1: community are maybe changing, maybe their wants and desires and

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Speaker 1: their plans for themselves, whether that has to do with

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Speaker 1: travel or how they move through the world, or whether

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Speaker 1: or not they start families, not only because of the economy,

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Speaker 1: but because of the climate and how scary it is

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Speaker 1: even just to be an adult. But how do you

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Speaker 1: bring a child into all of this? So, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: bring this to you, and you know, I'm here with Yosa,

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Speaker 1: And she said to me before we recorded, you don't

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Speaker 1: have to talk about it if you don't want to,

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Speaker 1: But I said, no, no, Like, if not here, then where,

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Speaker 1: you know, if not on the podcast, if not on

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Speaker 1: our archive, then where do we have the conversation? Because

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Speaker 1: I don't want it to be content, but I do

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Speaker 1: want it to be part of like our our dialogue.

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Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere, look amotives. We'll be right.

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Speaker 1: Back, and we're back with more of our episode.

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Speaker 3: As women in their thirties, I have definitely noticed the

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Speaker 3: conversation about are you gonna have kids or not? And

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Speaker 3: it's not just questions we're getting from our families, but

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Speaker 3: questions that we're having with each other internally, with ourselves

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Speaker 3: and just with our friend group. But there's no way

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Speaker 3: of talking about deciding to have children or deciding to

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Speaker 3: be child free without identifying and naming that we're in

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Speaker 3: late stage capitalism. We're living in a fascist regime. There

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Speaker 3: are so many reasons women are choosing to not have

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Speaker 3: children that extend beyond the individual choice of motherhood is

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Speaker 3: not for me. There are systemic reasons that women may

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Speaker 3: be choosing to not have children. And so we're going

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Speaker 3: to use some of that idea and that theory to

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Speaker 3: really ground us in the conversation today and really look

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Speaker 3: at the macro before we dive into the personal conversations

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Speaker 3: that we're having with each other and with our friends.

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Speaker 1: I think that there's this tendency to look at a

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Speaker 1: person's child freeness and automatically find fault with it and

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Speaker 1: then place blame on them. And we're seeing this conversation

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Speaker 1: not only on social media, not only in our families,

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Speaker 1: but also like in the broader political and social conversation

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Speaker 1: in the news, on the political level, going all the

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Speaker 1: way up to the White House, where people like JD.

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Speaker 1: Vance and Donald Trump and Candice Owens, who's you know,

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Speaker 1: not in the White House, but a talking head who

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Speaker 1: has been very supportive of the White House, where folks

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Speaker 1: have a very particular desire to like zero in on

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Speaker 1: focus in on childless women and blame them for things

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Speaker 1: like their own misery, but also blaming them for this

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Speaker 1: sort of social like sort of social decline and a

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Speaker 1: decline to the quality of life in the United States

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Speaker 1: and the power of the United.

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Speaker 3: States definitely, And I think that there's a blaming of

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Speaker 3: feminism that like feminism has rotted our brains, has taken

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Speaker 3: us so far away from like quote traditional values and

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Speaker 3: instilled in us these like quote toxic feminist values that

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Speaker 3: were like forgetting our quote purpose of what it means

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Speaker 3: to be a woman, which is to child bear children.

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Speaker 3: And so I do see that that type of ideology

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Speaker 3: at like the highest levels of power in the United States.

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Speaker 1: Right from Oprah Daily. Quote, child free people like me

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Speaker 1: are all over the news at the moment, and this

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Speaker 1: is due to ongoing studies reporting that millennial women are

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Speaker 1: having fewer children, but also due to off the cuff

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Speaker 1: remarks such as JD Vance's dig at Kamala Harri and

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Speaker 1: all quote childless cat ladies who are apparently living miserable lives,

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Speaker 1: and this type of rhetoric is all over the place.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I now identify very strongly as a childless cat

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Speaker 3: lady because that is my life right now. I do

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Speaker 3: have a bunch of cats, and I am childless, and

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Speaker 3: so I'm actually not miserable. I'm quite happy.

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Speaker 1: I mean, look at you. You're thriving, You're glowing.

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Speaker 2: I'm thriving.

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Speaker 3: Come on, Yes, I'm not thriving. I'm surviving today. But

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Speaker 3: generally speaking, yeah, I'm not living a miserable life. I'm

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Speaker 3: living a pretty happy life in spite of fascism. And

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Speaker 3: I think that these men like JD Vance and these

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Speaker 3: politicos that are trying to talk about the declining birth

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Speaker 3: rate are intentionally ignoring the policy that they're writing, the

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Speaker 3: policy that they're backing and supporting that do not support

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Speaker 3: women having children. Just recently, snap food benefits were cut,

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Speaker 3: Medicaid is being cut. There are so many things that

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Speaker 3: are supposed to help children in working people mothers that

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Speaker 3: are intentionally being reduced or cut, and so that actually

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Speaker 3: does lead to a miserable life.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So, in spite of the fact that all these

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Speaker 1: factors which are really impacting our quality of life, in

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Speaker 1: the quality of life of any future children in a

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Speaker 1: negative way. In spite of all of these social safety

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Speaker 1: nets being cut and even things like student loans being cut,

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Speaker 1: there is still pressure to reproduce from Amy Wilkinson, despite

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Speaker 1: the growing number of people saying no thanks to parenthood.

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Speaker 1: In twenty twenty three, forty three percent of US homes

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Speaker 1: were childless, which is an increase by seven percent from

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Speaker 1: twenty twelve according to the US Census Bureau. So there

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Speaker 1: is an ongoing increase in the number of child free

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Speaker 1: homes in the United States and the birth rate is declining,

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Speaker 1: but people seem to target this as a fault of

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Speaker 1: women who are exercising free choice, like women who are

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Speaker 1: child free are to blame for the declining birth rate,

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Speaker 1: and these other social and economic factors are never really considered.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think It's important to note that while

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Speaker 3: there is a declining birth rate in the United States.

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Speaker 2: It's also globally. Globally, people are.

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Speaker 3: Having less children, and there's its own conversation to be

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Speaker 3: had about climate change and climate disaster and how that

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Speaker 3: could be a reason that folks globally are not having

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Speaker 3: children in addition to socio political reasons. Climate change is

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Speaker 3: of course also under that umbrella, but that is also

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Speaker 3: a factor that cannot be ignored. So it's not just

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Speaker 3: folks in the US, but there is a declining birth

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Speaker 3: rate globally as well. Also want to mention that there

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Speaker 3: is some research that we did when prepping for this episode,

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Speaker 3: and that the falling birth rate is not necessarily due

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Speaker 3: to a less desire to have children. And I quote,

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Speaker 3: it's hard to have children in the United States right now.

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Speaker 3: There's not a lot of support for parents in the US,

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Speaker 3: and young adults face a lot of challenges student loans,

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Speaker 3: at the high cost of housing, job insecurity that may

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Speaker 3: lead them to delay or maybe even give up on

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Speaker 3: having children.

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Speaker 1: And even though there are all of these really intense

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Speaker 1: it's like a pressure cooker, all these factors that may

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Speaker 1: get so scary and untenable to reproduce. It's still also

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Speaker 1: seen as a woman's responsibility and primary role to bring

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Speaker 1: children into the world. I don't see a conversation about

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Speaker 1: men having a responsibility to making the world a safe

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Speaker 1: and welcoming place for their own children, right that they

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Speaker 1: wish to bring into the world. It's a very lopsided conversation.

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Speaker 1: And from an opinion piece in the La Times, I

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Speaker 1: chose to be child free. The Pope called a selfish

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Speaker 1: and Elon Musk went as far as suggesting we lose

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Speaker 1: our right to vote. The Supreme Court eliminated the federal

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Speaker 1: right to abortion, while some states are limiting access to

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Speaker 1: certain forms of birth control, all but forcing some women

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Speaker 1: to have children.

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Speaker 3: It's not just the Jdvances of the world, and of

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Speaker 3: course they are influencing the cultural conversation, but it's also

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Speaker 3: conservative women that are pushing these ideologies, this pro natalist

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Speaker 3: ideology as well. The Times, which is a London based publication,

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Speaker 3: covered this conference of conservative women in Dallas, and something

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Speaker 3: that I thought was really notable from this article and

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Speaker 3: this profile is that the type of rhetoric that's being

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Speaker 3: spewed by some of these women is quote less prozac,

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Speaker 3: more protein, less burnout, more babies, less feminism, more femininity.

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Speaker 3: Let's be honest, it's never been hotter to be a conservative.

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Speaker 3: And the woman who said this is Alex Clark, and

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Speaker 3: she was a speaker at this conference, and so I

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Speaker 3: think that really encapsulates the conservative woman right now. And

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Speaker 3: they're also propping up this idea that our role in

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Speaker 3: life and in society is to raise children and to

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Speaker 3: be mothers. And it's almost like we saw the Girl Boss,

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Speaker 3: and it is this rejection of the Girl Boss, and

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Speaker 3: I think what they're not maybe piecing together is like, yeah,

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Speaker 3: you were burnt out, probably from climbing the corporate ladder.

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Speaker 2: Maybe you're rejecting that, and now.

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Speaker 3: You're going like an entirely different route into like I'm

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Speaker 3: not going to work at all, when probably what you

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Speaker 3: needed was a safety net, not necessarily like this conservative viewpoint.

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Speaker 2: But that is like where it's heading.

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Speaker 1: And it's so odd how feminism continues to be positioned

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Speaker 1: as oppositional to that choice right, because feminism is all

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Speaker 1: about protecting women's right to choose the life that they

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Speaker 1: want to live that if they want to be, if

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Speaker 1: they want to be mothers, if they want to get married,

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Speaker 1: if they want to stay at home, that there be

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Speaker 1: the proper protect in place socially, economically, medically that they

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Speaker 1: can do that without being trapped and without being abused,

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Speaker 1: and with having access to all the medical care that

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Speaker 1: they need, and still being able to have a bank

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Speaker 1: account and still being able to drive a car. Like

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Speaker 1: it's about protecting women no matter what life choices they

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Speaker 1: want to make. If a woman wants to be a

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Speaker 1: sex worker, feminism would say that, at least, in the

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Speaker 1: very least, our society should not criminalize sex workers, should

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Speaker 1: not abuse sex workers. If women want to work full

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Speaker 1: time and never have kids, you know, like, leave that

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Speaker 1: woman alone. And so this notion that feminism is antithetical

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Speaker 1: to having babies when feminism has also entailed like making

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Speaker 1: sure that we're not subjected to eugenics and for sterilization

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Speaker 1: in hospitals, right so that we can have babies if

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Speaker 1: we choose to. So it's a very gross sort of

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Speaker 1: interpretation of feminism.

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Speaker 3: I think what's really interesting about this conference that the

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Speaker 3: Times covered is that it is a lot of young women,

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Speaker 3: So it's a lot of gen Z women. And there

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Speaker 3: was a woman who they interviewed who is twenty three

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Speaker 3: years old, and she felt that she wanted the opposite

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Speaker 3: of what millennials had. And so it's like gen Z

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Speaker 3: grew up seeing us maybe struggling, maybe in student loan debt,

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Speaker 3: not being able to buy a home, not having kids,

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Speaker 3: and they're rejecting that. And so in this quote, this

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Speaker 3: woman says, kind of seeing everything that's happened with millennials

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Speaker 3: and just the way they're going. They're not having kids,

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Speaker 3: They're just stressing themselves out, burning themselves out. I think

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Speaker 3: we're really leaning towards a family, Christian just a strong

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Speaker 3: moral code, because I think that's something that's lacking for

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Speaker 3: a lot of us. And so it really is this

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Speaker 3: pushback I think on the progressive ideologies, beliefs, political views

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Speaker 3: that millennials have because we grew up in this era,

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Speaker 3: like we some of the gen Z folks, I don't

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Speaker 3: remember the Me Too movement the way we did, right.

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Speaker 3: They don't remember what it was like to vote in

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Speaker 3: the twenty sixteen elections. They don't remember Donald Trump and

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Speaker 3: the Axis Hollywood tapes. They were children, how could they?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: And so there is I think this collective misremembering because

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Speaker 3: they were children and so there's a then rejection of

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Speaker 3: the things that we have been fighting for as millennial women.

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Speaker 1: This is also important to have the conversation that these

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Speaker 1: conservative women are I think, largely white women, and so

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Speaker 1: there is something really important in a white woman led

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Speaker 1: movement to have more babies and return to traditional values.

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Speaker 1: And there's a eugenics here because these women are not

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Speaker 1: advocating that women of color have the opportunity to stay

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Speaker 1: home and have as many babies they want.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, they don't like when we do that.

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Speaker 1: Actually, no, it is a very specific movement to increase

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Speaker 1: the white birth rate, and there is a propaganda element

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Speaker 1: here that is directed towards white women. You will have

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Speaker 1: a softer, better, less stressful life if you just forget

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Speaker 1: about all this feminism nonsense and this making your own

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Speaker 1: money nonsense, and stay home and have as many babies

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Speaker 1: as your uterus will allow. And there are those natalist

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Speaker 1: women out there who are doing press junkets basically talking

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Speaker 1: about how they absolutely plan to have babies until their

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Speaker 1: uterus is removed. And this is not something that they

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Speaker 1: are extending again to immigrant women, to black and brown women,

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Speaker 1: and therefore it is a movement of eugenics. It's poor

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Speaker 1: and white supremacy.

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Speaker 3: It is because as we know, historically Latino women, Black

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Speaker 3: women have been sterilized without their consent, without their knowledge,

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Speaker 3: even because they don't want us having babies. And I

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Speaker 3: think that that is an important piece to remember when

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Speaker 3: we are choosing to have children or not, Like they

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Speaker 3: actually don't want us to have kids. They don't want

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Speaker 3: us to reproduce in this country. Specifically, they're tearing away

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Speaker 3: immigrant mothers from their babies in this current moment.

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Speaker 1: And if we do have children, they want our children

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Speaker 1: to not have access to higher education. They want our

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Speaker 1: children to be low wage labor that can be discarded

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Speaker 1: when no longer needed, or can be labor that is

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Speaker 1: detained and arrested. And then you are basically, per constitution,

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Speaker 1: you can still enslave people if they're imprisoned, right, And

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Speaker 1: so this is another piece that people talk about when

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Speaker 1: it comes to ice raids, immigration, detention, the prison industrial

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Speaker 1: complex that once a person is in state custody in

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Speaker 1: that way, has been criminalized and is detained, they are

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Speaker 1: susceptible to being exploited for their labor. And since we

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Speaker 1: can't just enslave civilians, what we can technically enslave, imprisoned people.

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Speaker 1: There is a political and economic motivation to criminalize and

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Speaker 1: detain as many non white people as possible. So it's

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Speaker 1: all connected here. And not to sound like a conspiracy theorist,

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Speaker 1: but I think that the research has been done, the

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Speaker 1: writing has been done, absolutely, you know, the policies have

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Speaker 1: been passed, the statements have been made by the president

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Speaker 1: and folks who work for him, that we can understand

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Speaker 1: what's happening here. They don't want us to have babies,

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Speaker 1: but if we do, then they want our babies to

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Speaker 1: be labor labor.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, and we're not the only ones connecting

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Speaker 3: these dots and having these conversations. Recently, NPR put out

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Speaker 3: a report titled the Politics of Fewer Babies, and there's

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Speaker 3: this SoundBite of our president Trump saying, quote, I'll be

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Speaker 3: known as a fertilization president. And that's okay, that's not bad.

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Speaker 2: That's not bad. I've been called much worse.

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Speaker 3: And so there is definitely a pattern here where the

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Speaker 3: political figures, the politicians are very outspokenly talking about the

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Speaker 3: falling birth rate and who they want to have more

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Speaker 3: children is white people.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and what have they been calling the children of

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Speaker 1: immigrants for years. Anger anchor babies, not like oh oh great,

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Speaker 1: you know, oh great, we're repopulating, Oh great, Like babies

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Speaker 1: are being born. No, these babies are bad babies. They're

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Speaker 1: anchor babies.

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Speaker 3: And research has shown the research is there that immigrants

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Speaker 3: do contribute to the birth population because they are having

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Speaker 3: babies here.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's not the type of babies that they want

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Speaker 2: born here.

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Speaker 3: They're currently they're trying to President Trump is trying to

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Speaker 3: revoke birthright citizenship and make it a state thing versus

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Speaker 3: a federal policy, a federal law. And so that's also

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Speaker 3: really important to consider too, Like you could be in

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Speaker 3: the state of California or you could be in Texas

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Speaker 3: and you might not have access to citizenship depending on

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Speaker 3: where you're born.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, we have this idea maybe that oh, I'm a

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Speaker 1: citizen and so it protects me and it can't be

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Speaker 1: taken away from me. But like it can be, it

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Speaker 1: can be. It's happened before in other places. I mean,

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Speaker 1: a lot of people have been making a lot of

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Speaker 1: connections to the current moment, and of course Nazi Germany

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Speaker 1: and the setup and the way that things happened before

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Speaker 1: the Holocaust was full the full blown Holocaust, because it

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Speaker 1: didn't just happen overnight. You know, there were policies being passed,

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Speaker 1: there was rhetoric, there was propaganda, there were hateful, racist

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Speaker 1: cartoons and speeches. Eventually people started getting snatched up and

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Speaker 1: criminalized and sent away and detained, including people who were

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Speaker 1: German born right, but who were at the time were

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Speaker 1: not fitting the white supremacist German definition of what a

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Speaker 1: German citizen truly is, right, and we see something very

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Speaker 1: similar happening here now. And a JD. Vance again recently

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Speaker 1: was so boxing and talking about how if your ancestors

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Speaker 1: fought in the Civil War, if you're descended from people

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Speaker 1: who fought in the Civil War, you have way more

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Speaker 1: claim to Americanness than any of these other people.

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Speaker 3: I'm like, which side of the Civil War? I think

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Speaker 3: we know which one. But that is a very interesting,

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Speaker 3: very not even coded, that's so explicit, that's so fucking explicit.

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Speaker 1: Very explicit. So it's crazy times. And it is interesting

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Speaker 1: how back in the day, of course, propaganda was predominantly

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Speaker 1: spread through political figures, press conferences and speeches, broadcast news journalism,

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Speaker 1: because news and journalism of course can also be conservative, can.

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Speaker 2: Be part of the propaganda machine.

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Speaker 1: Can be part of the propaganda machine. However, in today's

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Speaker 1: day and age, we have the propaganda machine on our

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Speaker 1: cell phones, yes, and civilians, regular people can contribute to

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Speaker 1: the propaganda with their lifestyle content, with the tradwife content right,

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Speaker 1: or can consume the propaganda so much more quickly and

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Speaker 1: easily and constantly than I think has ever been possible.

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Speaker 2: Don't go anywhere, lookamotives, We'll.

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Speaker 1: Be right back, and we're back with more of our episode.

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Speaker 3: And I think one of the women that has been

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Speaker 3: very much of that propaganda is Candice Owans, Yes bodly

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Speaker 3: very much influencing this culture of and soapboxing that women

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Speaker 3: should be staying home, when notably she does not stay home.

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Speaker 3: She's working, she's a political, she's a talking head yas

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Speaker 3: she has a YouTube like, she's actually not quote traditional,

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Speaker 3: she could be actually maybe the furthest from traditional.

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Speaker 1: In so many ways. And I think so many of

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Speaker 1: these sort of tradwife influencers are not traditional in any way,

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Speaker 1: shape or form, because showing the outside world insight into

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Speaker 1: like your home and your kitchen, Yeah, there's nothing traditional

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Speaker 1: about that.

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Speaker 3: And we've been talking about that here at look atra

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Speaker 3: radio internally because you know, in so many ways, Latina mom,

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Speaker 3: like our mothers and our grandmothers fall into what we

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Speaker 3: consider trad wives. Oh yeah, they were making the food.

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Speaker 3: They're making the food from scratch. They were serving their

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Speaker 3: husbands quite literally. I remember, like growing up, my mom

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Speaker 3: would you know, work make the meal and then serve

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Speaker 3: my father a plate. My dad would just be sitting

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Speaker 3: at the table and my mom would serve him, take

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Speaker 3: him his plate, and then would serve herself.

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Speaker 2: Right, yeah, And so my mom would never be putting

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Speaker 2: that online, right.

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Speaker 3: You know, obviously there's generational differences, but that idea of

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Speaker 3: like trad wives being new is not necessarily a new concept,

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Speaker 3: but it is a new type of content that we're seeing.

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Speaker 3: It's like a subset on the Internet, and it does

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Speaker 3: influence and encourage women to take on this more subversive

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Speaker 3: role in their lives and in their families. I have

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Speaker 3: not seen This doesn't mean it's not out there, but

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Speaker 3: I haven't seen like queer women doing tradwive content.

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Speaker 1: Interesting.

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Speaker 3: Maybe they're out there, but I for what I've seen,

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Speaker 3: it has been like heterosexual women making content about taking

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Speaker 3: care of their husbands and their families and making the

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Speaker 3: food and doing the quote traditional things. And that's quote

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Speaker 3: softer life, which is also a co opted term.

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Speaker 1: Now, yeah, soft life, because what about staying home and

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Speaker 1: raising ten kids is soft? Nothing, nothing at all. That

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Speaker 1: is a very difficult, laborious life. And your husband, if

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Speaker 1: he's working, like a traditional husband is working, he's not

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Speaker 1: helping you.

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Speaker 2: He's not helping you. He's also not supposed to help you.

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Speaker 1: He's not supposed to help you.

436
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:09,880
Speaker 3: In traditional in a traditional viewpoint, right, he's or traditional values.

437
00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:12,680
Speaker 3: He's actually not supposed to help you because he's supposed

438
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:15,520
Speaker 3: to work and you're supposed to do everything else. You

439
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 3: carry the house, you carry the children.

440
00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:22,199
Speaker 1: That's that's that's traditional. And you don't complain, right, and

441
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:23,960
Speaker 1: you don't complain and you do with the smile.

442
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 3: Sounds miserable actually absolutely, And not only that, I mean

443
00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 3: these these influencers, these tradwafe influencers, they're making money. Every

444
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,159
Speaker 3: woman and every person should have access to their own money.

445
00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 3: That is like how abuse can permeate in relationships. I

446
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 3: don't think like, oh, you shouldn't be monetizing. But if

447
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:45,080
Speaker 3: we're pushing back on this idea that tradwives are traditional

448
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,359
Speaker 3: and they're they have traditional values and they want like

449
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:50,879
Speaker 3: a life from the nineteen fifties. You couldn't have a

450
00:26:50,880 --> 00:26:53,160
Speaker 3: bank account, Nope, you could not have a credit card,

451
00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:55,400
Speaker 3: you could not buy a car, you could not buy property,

452
00:26:55,480 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 3: you could not rent without a co signer.

453
00:26:57,200 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: Oh, and you're going to broadcast yourself without a petty

454
00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: coat on to the world.

455
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:04,200
Speaker 2: Put your petty coat on, you.

456
00:27:04,080 --> 00:27:08,120
Speaker 1: Absolute Jezzebel. No, it's just it's not what we're doing.

457
00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 1: Is I think pointing out the flaws and the logic? Yes, right,

458
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:14,159
Speaker 1: And I think going back to Candace Owens being, for

459
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 1: whatever reason, just so adamant about women's specific point. There

460
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,680
Speaker 1: was a Jubilee episode that it was like Candace Owens

461
00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 1: versus I don't know, twenty one feminists or something, and

462
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,679
Speaker 1: so Candace is just going on and on and on

463
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 1: about how women should be home. But again, Candace is

464
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:35,280
Speaker 1: on tour. Yes, Canada's is on tour. There's a comedian,

465
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,920
Speaker 1: I think it was Yvonne Orgy whom she's a stando comedian.

466
00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:42,080
Speaker 1: She's Nigerian. She talks about this in her comedy and

467
00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 1: she's she was talking to her mom about how she

468
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,280
Speaker 1: goes on tour and she performs on stage in front

469
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,560
Speaker 1: of crowds as a stand up comedian, and then her

470
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: mom says something like, oh, so you're a prostitute are

471
00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:56,360
Speaker 1: you're performing? You're creating yourself around for many in front

472
00:27:56,359 --> 00:27:58,920
Speaker 1: of all these people. So you're a whore. And I'm

473
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,440
Speaker 1: not calling Candace owns. I just think that it's a

474
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:06,200
Speaker 1: funny joke that reminds me of her, right, because what's traditional? Yes,

475
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:07,440
Speaker 1: about being on tour?

476
00:28:07,960 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, And she has so much to say

477
00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 3: about the individual choices women are making, whether that be

478
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,360
Speaker 3: having children on their own right, she like fiercely critiques

479
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:21,679
Speaker 3: mothers or women who are choosing to be mothers on

480
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 3: their own that is still a problem for her because

481
00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:26,399
Speaker 3: they're single mothers. And then what is that going to

482
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 3: do to that's supposedly detrimental to the child in her worldview.

483
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:36,800
Speaker 3: She also spews incredibly homophobic things about men, about gay men,

484
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 3: and so she is not someone that I would want

485
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:44,120
Speaker 3: to be taking any type of information from. But she

486
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 3: does have a following. She does, and she is shaping

487
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:53,320
Speaker 3: this conservative viewpoint and this conservative ideology and community that's growing.

488
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 1: It's true. There's this other quote from Candace that women

489
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 1: are being socially engineered to hate men, men are being

490
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:05,520
Speaker 1: socially engineered to be gay, making men be more in feminine.

491
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,600
Speaker 1: I don't think men have to be engineered to be gay.

492
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:10,160
Speaker 1: I think they're just gay on their own.

493
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:11,440
Speaker 2: I think they're just born gay.

494
00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 1: I think they're just gay on their own. I don't

495
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,800
Speaker 1: think anybody has to do anything. But also, like there

496
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: is such.

497
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:20,400
Speaker 2: A clear hatred of the feminine.

498
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,240
Speaker 1: The feminine of women. I think there's a lot of

499
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: self hatred that I see from Candice Owens and women

500
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 1: like her who so publicly demand that we all agree

501
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 1: that women are inept and unable to live decent lives

502
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:40,560
Speaker 1: on our own or based on our own choices and desires,

503
00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: and that we in like choosing for ourselves are like

504
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 1: the biggest detriment right to men into society. And it's

505
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:52,560
Speaker 1: just so sad to see that amount of like self

506
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:56,240
Speaker 1: doubt and lack of confidence, self hatred, and that amount

507
00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 1: of self hatred. And I don't know, I just want

508
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,320
Speaker 1: to as all so like when we hear this stuff

509
00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,160
Speaker 1: and they try and blame us for like living life

510
00:30:05,160 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 1: on our own terms, and I don't know, somehow try

511
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:12,920
Speaker 1: to tie social demise to our freedom, like, don't let

512
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: them get to you. Yeah, don't let it happen, don't

513
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,120
Speaker 1: fall for it. We're doing just fine.

514
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 3: Yeah. And I think with all of that in mind,

515
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 3: like it then begs the question, how does that influence

516
00:30:23,200 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 3: our personal decisions to have children or not?

517
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 2: Is it even a choice anymore?

518
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 3: And I think that that has been one of the

519
00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:35,280
Speaker 3: fundamental pillars of feminism, is that I have the choice

520
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 3: to have children or not. But given the current state

521
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:43,000
Speaker 3: of everything in this country, is it even a choice anymore?

522
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 3: Do I even have the free will to make a

523
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:51,520
Speaker 3: choice to have children, knowing everything that's at stake? And

524
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:55,480
Speaker 3: so it is, I think we cannot talk about the

525
00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 3: individual choice because in so many ways and nothing is individual.

526
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:00,680
Speaker 2: We're all in community.

527
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,760
Speaker 3: My individual choice affects everyone else, whether I want to

528
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:05,400
Speaker 3: believe it or not.

529
00:31:06,080 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, And you know, on that piece, I think

530
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,479
Speaker 1: we still bringing it from the meta to the to

531
00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 1: the micro here. You know, I think we each have

532
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,960
Speaker 1: had these conversations, I think on an ongoing rolling basis

533
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 1: about not having kids. And it's so fascinating because I

534
00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:28,160
Speaker 1: just wonder, like, if I were to just do it

535
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:32,200
Speaker 1: right now, just to do it. Would that like satisfy everybody?

536
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 1: And would everybody be happy? No, because they would still

537
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: want it to be done a particular way, absolutely, but

538
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 1: also hurry up and do it this particular way.

539
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I was thinking about that, and I think

540
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 3: when preparing for this episode, I was thinking about how

541
00:31:46,360 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 3: many goal posts there are for women, especially when you

542
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:53,280
Speaker 3: date men. You know, Pananda was like the first man

543
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 3: I dated and I ended up marrying him, right, and so,

544
00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:58,880
Speaker 3: which is always like so funny to me, but you know,

545
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:03,120
Speaker 3: when we were dating, and I'm sure anyone who dates well,

546
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 3: I think to regardless, if you're partnered, you'll get this

547
00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:07,680
Speaker 3: question right of like when are you getting married? And

548
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,960
Speaker 3: then the goalpost is when are you getting married? And

549
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 3: that's the question that everyone asks, and then it becomes

550
00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:15,320
Speaker 3: when are you having kids? And so my response that

551
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 3: I've been workshopping and I say now is it's not

552
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,840
Speaker 3: something we're prioritizing right now. And that is my way

553
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 3: of being like, cause you know, really, what I want

554
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:26,520
Speaker 3: to say is like it's none of your business actually,

555
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:29,920
Speaker 3: but my like diplomatic way of saying is saying that

556
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:32,640
Speaker 3: is it's not something we're prioritizing right now. A few

557
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 3: years ago fit none and I had like a timeline

558
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 3: and we said, like in five years. And I share

559
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:39,360
Speaker 3: that with my mom because my mom kept asking. I

560
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:41,240
Speaker 3: was like, okay, like, give give me five years.

561
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:43,360
Speaker 2: Right, Well, what does my mom do?

562
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:46,000
Speaker 3: She goes and tells a couple people, Yeah, oh in

563
00:32:46,040 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 3: five years.

564
00:32:47,480 --> 00:32:47,760
Speaker 2: Yes.

565
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:50,360
Speaker 3: And so now my Madrina is like when she sees me,

566
00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:55,480
Speaker 3: she's like the Ressagnasmas and I'm I know, and I like, honestly,

567
00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:58,120
Speaker 3: that timeline has changed. Like it's not five years anymore.

568
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 3: It's maybe ten years. Who knows it? Maybe never right, Yeah,

569
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:04,280
Speaker 3: but there is like that that timeline. I think that

570
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:07,440
Speaker 3: is put on It's an external timeline because I don't

571
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 3: even have a timeline, but it's an external timeline that

572
00:33:09,760 --> 00:33:12,200
Speaker 3: then is put on you by your family and by

573
00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:14,120
Speaker 3: by extension society.

574
00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 2: Given everything we've discussed today.

575
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:20,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, like you have a homework assignment that's due, Yes,

576
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: since you got to turn in.

577
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:22,080
Speaker 2: It's looming.

578
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:26,200
Speaker 1: It's looming. No pressure for me to pop one out,

579
00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:29,840
Speaker 1: just know that. Just no, thank God, take as much

580
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:32,280
Speaker 1: time as you need. Freeze the eggs. Don't freeze the eggs.

581
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:33,840
Speaker 1: There's all kinds of options.

582
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 2: So many options.

583
00:33:35,240 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 3: I mean it for now, for now, for now, there

584
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 3: are options for.

585
00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:41,400
Speaker 1: Now kind of well they're being minimized, but there's a

586
00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 1: couple options left.

587
00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 2: There are a couple options, I mean.

588
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,360
Speaker 3: And even that part of family planning is like under attack,

589
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,400
Speaker 3: like in vitro access to in vitro access to freezing

590
00:33:50,440 --> 00:33:53,360
Speaker 3: your eggs, like all of these things are under attack

591
00:33:53,440 --> 00:33:56,560
Speaker 3: right now by this administration. So it's not just the

592
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:59,440
Speaker 3: right to have an abortion, but even the right to

593
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:01,440
Speaker 3: have children, and in a different type of way that's

594
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 3: not quote traditional.

595
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:10,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a somehow in there, like crusade for freedom.

596
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,840
Speaker 1: They really love like limitations and shackles.

597
00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:15,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, they actually hate freedom.

598
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 1: They hate freedom very very much, or only a very

599
00:34:18,320 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 1: specific type of freedom for a very specific type of person.

600
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 1: But we reject it. Here it look at thot our radio,

601
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 1: we reject it. I know that that was just a

602
00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 1: really heavy back and forth, but we do want to

603
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 1: come back and say we know a lot of our

604
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,839
Speaker 1: listeners are mothers. Yeah, don't know how you do it,

605
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,280
Speaker 1: so proud of you. Keep up the good work.

606
00:34:42,120 --> 00:34:49,279
Speaker 4: Go Momsnestly they're raising like little radical empathic babies and

607
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:51,520
Speaker 4: that is like something to be so proud of in

608
00:34:51,600 --> 00:34:55,040
Speaker 4: a world that makes it so challenging to be a mother.

609
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,440
Speaker 1: Absolutely, and I think in these times more than ever,

610
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 1: we go back to the idea of your community and

611
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:06,120
Speaker 1: your village, and when we don't have social safety nets,

612
00:35:06,600 --> 00:35:10,799
Speaker 1: when it is so volatile out there, when it is

613
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,440
Speaker 1: so expensive and scary and difficult to raise a family,

614
00:35:14,880 --> 00:35:18,320
Speaker 1: we encourage you all to show up for the moms

615
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:21,879
Speaker 1: and the babies in your life, even if you don't

616
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:26,120
Speaker 1: have any yourself. You know, be the cousin that takes

617
00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:28,719
Speaker 1: them to the mall. You know, be the thea that

618
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 1: shows up at the games, that takes an interest and

619
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 1: an investment in the lives of the parents and the

620
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:39,160
Speaker 1: children around you, because that is something that we can do,

621
00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:43,360
Speaker 1: we can still contribute to, like a beautiful childhood for

622
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 1: a kid that isn't that isn't ours, but who is

623
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 1: part of our family or our community. And I think

624
00:35:50,200 --> 00:35:53,280
Speaker 1: that's a really important thing right now and always.

625
00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think it's important to remember that, you know,

626
00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 3: when we think of being in a community, that means

627
00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:03,319
Speaker 3: being an active participant of that community. Right If you

628
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:06,799
Speaker 3: want a village for your family, for your friend who's

629
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:09,040
Speaker 3: a mom, like you have to be a villager, and

630
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:12,440
Speaker 3: that means showing up even when it's not convenient. That

631
00:36:12,520 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 3: means showing up even when the state of the world

632
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:21,000
Speaker 3: is exhausting, tiring, anxiety inducing, like it means still showing

633
00:36:21,040 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 3: up for the people that are in our lives, especially

634
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 3: the moms, especially the children. It's really it's a really

635
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:31,760
Speaker 3: challenging time for everyone, but especially for moms, especially for children.

636
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:36,200
Speaker 3: We're seeing all across LA and LA County that programming,

637
00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 3: that summer programming is being cut because of fear of

638
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:43,120
Speaker 3: ice rates. So now more than ever, your mom friend

639
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:46,480
Speaker 3: needs support and she maybe needs to go get out

640
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 3: for a second without her children, and it's a good

641
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 3: time to step in in that way.

642
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:54,080
Speaker 1: Absolutely. In a previous episode, we also talked about how

643
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:59,560
Speaker 1: do we support our immigrant community members, presumably adults, right

644
00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: We're also seeing is that the children of our immigrant

645
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:06,520
Speaker 1: community members are also doing a lot of caretaking and

646
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 1: helping and stepping up in light of everything that's going on,

647
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:14,600
Speaker 1: so on that level as well, you know, like how

648
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:17,839
Speaker 1: do we support the kids. Supporting the parents means supporting the.

649
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:23,400
Speaker 3: Kids absolutely, absolutely, so thank you Loka Motives for listening.

650
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:25,319
Speaker 2: We know this was a heavy episode.

651
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,200
Speaker 3: Take care of yourselves, take care of each other, step outside,

652
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,440
Speaker 3: always remember to hydrate.

653
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Speaker 2: And we'll catch you next time. See those.

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Speaker 3: Look at Radio is executive produced by Viosa Fen and

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00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:39,480
Speaker 3: Mala Munios.

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00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:41,320
Speaker 1: Stephanie Franco is our.

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00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 4: Producer, Story editing by me viosa.

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00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:46,280
Speaker 1: Creative direction by me Malak.

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Speaker 3: Look at Our Radio is a part of iHeartRadio's Mike

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00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:50,360
Speaker 3: Lupua podcast network.

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00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:53,160
Speaker 1: You can listen to look at Radio on the iHeartRadio

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00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 1: app or wherever you get your podcasts.

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Speaker 3: Leave us a review and share with your pritima or

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Speaker 3: share with your homegirls.

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00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,240
Speaker 1: And thank you to our look more risks our listeners

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Speaker 1: for tuning in. Tchuned every weekitos

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Speaker 2: Log alone