Speaker 1: Welcome to decisions decisions.
Speaker 2: I don't think you should say decisions decisions.
Speaker 3: It sounded like you was talking to Kirsty.
Speaker 1: You definitely say to welcome, welcome to the new podcast.
Speaker 1: You want to say together the decisions decisions.
Speaker 3: All right, ready, I can't.
Speaker 1: All these texts. People in the house.
Speaker 2: That's all I want to do.
Speaker 3: Take this is in the building, y'all. We are joined
Speaker 3: out how they do it?
Speaker 4: Here?
Speaker 2: You go, Oh, you know what, what is it? The
Speaker 2: D that is crazy?
Speaker 3: Now?
Speaker 1: This the D you you're throwing up? Houston whoop?
Speaker 2: Is like that is?
Speaker 1: People say you have a rapper voice? No you do? No,
Speaker 1: They say, I got to pass the voice too.
Speaker 3: I have a male path all the time when I
Speaker 3: really get it too. Let me tell you you know
Speaker 3: I do when I get it to it, bro, don't
Speaker 3: do that. Don't even got a black.
Speaker 1: Past the voice. I got an identity crisis.
Speaker 3: That I either got as okay, I'm even that for
Speaker 3: they say, jadis But either way.
Speaker 1: Bye.
Speaker 3: We are joined by Kitty Rose y'all, and she is
Speaker 3: a certified relationship coach, speaker and happy wife. She's also
Speaker 3: the host of the Talk to Me Kitty podcast and
Speaker 3: author of Hella books to help you niggas find love
Speaker 3: and get married. Now, I'm really excited to really dive
Speaker 3: into the conversation around today because even you saying that
Speaker 3: you're a happy wife, I've constantly talked on this podcast
Speaker 3: about not really seeing or hearing healthy relationships. Yes, and
Speaker 3: also as a woman in my mid thirties, the final
Speaker 3: goal for me is not marriage, and I have very
Speaker 3: like staunch views on those. So I'm really excited to
Speaker 3: dig deep into this. But for our audience, we did
Speaker 3: have a dating coach on towards the end of last year,
Speaker 3: mister an Waugh, And we've also had sham Boudremond, who
Speaker 3: is also talking about to her need to go to
Speaker 3: school because she's out here coaching and giving advice and
Speaker 3: all those things. So I want to start at the
Speaker 3: top of that. Hey, what's a relationship coach? And girl,
Speaker 3: what's your certifications? And do you have any or you
Speaker 3: just like, bitch, I'm married, So I'm gonna help y'all
Speaker 3: get buried.
Speaker 5: No, I think you need to have some type of
Speaker 5: professional backing if you're gonna be doing this. You know
Speaker 5: my so my major is in neuroscience, my miners and
Speaker 5: family services. Okay, so a lot of people don't understand
Speaker 5: that I'm in school for my psyche d So that's.
Speaker 1: What backs me up.
Speaker 5: I am a clinician, Okay, I am a you know,
Speaker 5: but I'm a clinician.
Speaker 1: A lot of people.
Speaker 5: I don't talk about it online just specifically because I
Speaker 5: am coaching in the social media space and you know
Speaker 5: how they are.
Speaker 1: They're very critical.
Speaker 5: But people get upset when you say things online, so
Speaker 5: they'll try to come for your license and stuff like that.
Speaker 5: So to play it safe. Plus, as a coach, you
Speaker 5: have more freedom online. So if y'all ever see any
Speaker 5: therapist or anything like that online and they're advertising at coaching,
Speaker 5: that's the.
Speaker 1: Reason why I didn't know that either.
Speaker 5: So if you ever look up certain therapists, you may
Speaker 5: see that they may have like sex relationship coaching, intimacy coaching,
Speaker 5: any forms of healing and it to say coaching. Yeah,
Speaker 5: that's the reason why one of my closest friends, who
Speaker 5: is a therapist in Dallas, mad he actually advertises a
Speaker 5: coach as well, but he's a therapist.
Speaker 1: It's just smarter to do it.
Speaker 5: If you're going to be doing stuff online, to protect
Speaker 5: your license, just go as coaching.
Speaker 3: Okay, And then with coaching you just said it's coaches
Speaker 3: normally help with healing, but also coaching is direction too. No,
Speaker 3: Like when we have the conversation with ann Y, he
Speaker 3: was like, this is how you get married, this is
Speaker 3: how you get a mad Do you advise coaching in
Speaker 3: terms of dating to be for only those people looking
Speaker 3: for the end goal of marriage, if they're not looking
Speaker 3: to be healed from a breakup.
Speaker 1: For a relationship coaching?
Speaker 5: Yes, no, okay, I only say that because I believe
Speaker 5: that the relationship that you have, the client coach relationship
Speaker 5: that you have, it has to be a line based
Speaker 5: on values. So for instance, me, I'm Christian woman, so
Speaker 5: of course the end goal is going to be marriage,
Speaker 5: of course for me. But some coaches know if they
Speaker 5: believe in like long term relationships and stuff like that,
Speaker 5: it can simply be that. But most people who come
Speaker 5: to me, they know that the end goal is going
Speaker 5: to be marriage. Coaches have a forte too, and war
Speaker 5: is really known for like getting to the what's the alter?
Speaker 5: Speaking of which, when he was on here, he talked
Speaker 5: about the amount of time that it takes for man
Speaker 5: to propose if he really cares about you, loves you.
Speaker 2: Whatever, ask everybody it is.
Speaker 3: I thought you, yeah, I thought, yeah.
Speaker 2: How long did it take for your husband to propose?
Speaker 3: Oh?
Speaker 1: Let me see how long?
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 1: Three years?
Speaker 5: Now we've been together. Uh, now, we haven't known each
Speaker 5: other three years. We known each other since middle school.
Speaker 5: We were friends. Then we decided to go ahead and
Speaker 5: give it a try. We did it the right way, honestly,
Speaker 5: I want to say maybe four months in maybe four
Speaker 5: months four months.
Speaker 2: Any he proposed?
Speaker 1: Yeah, a four months?
Speaker 2: Did you guys have said, like, I know you're a
Speaker 2: Christian woman.
Speaker 6: Y'all just mouth and asked was it the I just
Speaker 6: saw her body when she go No, So let me
Speaker 6: be honest with you.
Speaker 5: So, like, we've been friends for a very long time
Speaker 5: and then we got reconnected back in I think twenty
Speaker 5: eighteen probably, and then we just kept a friendship steady.
Speaker 5: No sex, no kissing, no, none of that, no hugging
Speaker 5: on none, no kissing, but knowing that you wanted to
Speaker 5: pursue romantically. No, oh okay, no, I think we realized
Speaker 5: we had feelings. But because both of us, I mean,
Speaker 5: we had rosters. So let's just be real. We weren't
Speaker 5: trying to do that. And then plus we just looked
Speaker 5: at each other as friends, like let's just keep it platonic,
Speaker 5: let's keep it here. But then over time, you know,
Speaker 5: went through my stuff, he went through his, and it
Speaker 5: was like when we came back again, because you know,
Speaker 5: whenever I was talking to somebody, I was like, all right,
Speaker 5: let me just back off because I don't want to
Speaker 5: you know, when we came back again, it was.
Speaker 1: Like, you know what, let's get this a shot. Listen, Wow,
Speaker 1: four months. How old were you at that time?
Speaker 3: Both of you?
Speaker 5: Girl, I'm in my thirties. Yeah, okay, you mean when
Speaker 5: when he proposed my early thirties? Yeah, So this really
Speaker 5: starting to put this nigga right.
Speaker 3: But you mean okay, okay, and you you had that
Speaker 3: as an end goal, right, Like has every partner that
Speaker 3: you've had, even before him, was it, Hey, I'm only
Speaker 3: going to stick around for but so long because I
Speaker 3: want to be a wife. Nor were you willing to
Speaker 3: let it kind of No.
Speaker 5: A lot of the relationships that I had, any SITUATIONIP
Speaker 5: or relationship, I really, honestly, I'm not even gonna lie
Speaker 5: to you, A lot of it was just to heal
Speaker 5: my attachment.
Speaker 1: That's really what it was, to be honest with you.
Speaker 1: I was an anxious person.
Speaker 5: I was an anxious I was an insecure attachment and
Speaker 5: so a lot of it was just like a false
Speaker 5: sense of security. As long as I had you there,
Speaker 5: I was cool. But many of those I was like,
Speaker 5: you're not a potential husband. You don't even have the
Speaker 5: quality of being a husband.
Speaker 7: I wish I would have brought that up in our book,
Speaker 7: like I talk about there's a chapter where I dated
Speaker 7: a guy we call old band a podcast, and there's
Speaker 7: no big arc of why I broke up, like he
Speaker 7: kind of always was fucking around, kind of always doing things,
Speaker 7: but I always stuck around because it was just like, Okay,
Speaker 7: he's there, he's there, he's there, and do therapy. I
Speaker 7: realized how to do with attachment style. But what I
Speaker 7: talked about mainly was like then I believe people can
Speaker 7: get to the altar with a person like this, good
Speaker 7: job and some friends like them, family like them.
Speaker 1: Whatever.
Speaker 2: He was just there and it was just a relationship.
Speaker 1: Companionship.
Speaker 7: I think once you get in your thirties is a
Speaker 7: scary thing because you're like, well, I don't have many
Speaker 7: options after this, which isn't necessarily true.
Speaker 1: You really got to put yourselves out there.
Speaker 7: But yeah, I really just talked about how you can
Speaker 7: end up with a person that's just okay.
Speaker 1: Yeah, once you transition, because we go through different tiers
Speaker 1: of womanhood.
Speaker 5: Once you transition in your thirties, you know, now it's
Speaker 5: probably some form of commitment somewhere, whether it's commitment to
Speaker 5: a career or just simply companionship. It doesn't have the
Speaker 5: necessarily mean you want to marry, but you want someone there.
Speaker 5: That's a form of a partner almost in a sense.
Speaker 5: Once you transition, things are different in your twenties. A
Speaker 5: lot of that's playing time. It's like we're trying to
Speaker 5: know who we are. He's just trying to figure out
Speaker 5: who we are. We're having fun. I'm trying to see
Speaker 5: exactly what it is that I won't. The problem is
Speaker 5: in our twenties back to attachments, because we have attachment deficits.
Speaker 5: We attach to people insecurely, prematurely, and we don't actually
Speaker 5: think about compatibility when it.
Speaker 1: Comes to being Christian.
Speaker 7: Because a lot of my friends that have a Christian background,
Speaker 7: or even Muslim girls like religious background because they believe
Speaker 7: in marriage.
Speaker 2: As a forefront of dating. Mainly it seems like they're
Speaker 2: getting married earlier or encouraging that. However, being that you
Speaker 2: at a roster y'all went through y'all phases, I really
Speaker 2: actually believe people need that to come together strong. Do
Speaker 2: you think, as a relationship coach advising someone at twenty
Speaker 2: four twenty.
Speaker 7: Three to be a hope? No, I look for marriage? Yeah,
Speaker 7: is really the right thing to do? Do you not
Speaker 7: think women should be exploring themselves, like, what's the perfect age?
Speaker 5: I really think that looking for marriage is something you
Speaker 5: should be doing. I'm only let me let me go
Speaker 5: ahead and explain why we bring on. No, we end
Speaker 5: up adopting a lot of trauma along the way from
Speaker 5: the attachments and the relationships that we form in our twenties,
Speaker 5: and because in this day and time, in this mounter time,
Speaker 5: it's all about sexual liberations, sexual freedom and stuff like that.
Speaker 5: But then we start having these soul ties and we
Speaker 5: connect people and that becomes a problem as well. So
Speaker 5: although you think you're finding your identity, you're losing bits
Speaker 5: and pieces of you because by the time you're getting
Speaker 5: your thirties, you're looking back like, oh, and I invest
Speaker 5: around so much into this person.
Speaker 1: I lost this part of me. I've had to work
Speaker 1: to find this.
Speaker 5: I've it becomes it starts to feel more like a
Speaker 5: loss rather than something that you gained.
Speaker 7: That might be one of my favorite pieces of advice
Speaker 7: I've heard on this podcast, getting trauma along the way,
Speaker 7: because for me, I feel like a lot of my
Speaker 7: explorative years, like my whole years, I really needed to
Speaker 7: shape me. Yeah, but I definitely developed trauma along the way.
Speaker 7: Where would have been if I just stopped hoing at
Speaker 7: a certain age, or stopped or really was intentionally dating.
Speaker 7: But for me, as someone that's ethically no monogamous, I
Speaker 7: think I actual needed that. I needed to kind of
Speaker 7: date every type of guy. I think I needed to
Speaker 7: go through those phases. I needed the Homeboys to show
Speaker 7: me how men work. There's a lot of issues that
Speaker 7: my friends have in relationships that I don't seem to have,
Speaker 7: and I think it's because of the framework I've had
Speaker 7: from dating up until now. However, I really like what
Speaker 7: you said because we're discounting a lot when we talk
Speaker 7: about go have fun, that fun can be painful exactly exactly.
Speaker 5: I will say this, though I do understand the whole
Speaker 5: fase I understand why people do it because I had
Speaker 5: one too, so I understand it. But as a woman
Speaker 5: who's healed, I can actually say I have really put
Speaker 5: in the work to heal. I look back and I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 5: I wish I never would have did that. I wish
Speaker 5: I would have prioritized me, took in the time. I
Speaker 5: would have dated Differently, I can say that it wouldn't
Speaker 5: have been the sexual encounters that I had. I would
Speaker 5: have actually been dating to really learn who I am.
Speaker 5: So it would have been like, I'm going out on
Speaker 5: a date with you tonight, not to sleep with you.
Speaker 1: I don't even want to get physical.
Speaker 5: I don't want nothing that's going to cause us to
Speaker 5: bond in a sense outside of quality time. I want
Speaker 5: to learn what I don't like. I want to look
Speaker 5: at you and say, Okay, this is what I like.
Speaker 5: I'm gonna check this off. This is a new standard,
Speaker 5: this is a new expectation.
Speaker 3: I'm gone.
Speaker 1: I love that I'm.
Speaker 3: Going through that phase right now, so within therapy from
Speaker 3: my journey of being sober right now, because I do
Speaker 3: understand too the rock star lifestyle that I had in
Speaker 3: my twentieth and the bond that I made from you know,
Speaker 3: dancing on couches and getting ship based and like, let's
Speaker 3: don toe to toe and being able to keep up
Speaker 3: with a nigga with drinks who six ' eight and
Speaker 3: I'm five to one and I'm keeping up. Like those
Speaker 3: attachments weren't healthy. Those attachments didn't lead to anything of
Speaker 3: purpose or anything like that. So I'm currently in this
Speaker 3: phase of, even with being celibate, figuring out the importance
Speaker 3: of even sex now in my relationships. Like I'm at
Speaker 3: this crossroad right now with talking to my therapists and
Speaker 3: even I won't say blame my mom, but me and
Speaker 3: my mom are having a lot more conversations because she's
Speaker 3: now in therapy and so she's calling me to tell me,
Speaker 3: and I was like, oh, bitch, this is why how
Speaker 3: I'm blame me. You put everything. And then also just
Speaker 3: having the conversations with my sister who's seven years younger
Speaker 3: than me, and the same kind of trickle effect on
Speaker 3: how it's impacted her. But my relationship with men, specifically
Speaker 3: black men, because that's all I've dealt with, that's all
Speaker 3: that's been around me, is really coming to the forefront
Speaker 3: with how I feel safe with them, how I feel
Speaker 3: respected by them, and how to communicate the needs that
Speaker 3: I need to be in a space where I feel
Speaker 3: like this makes sense. And what I realize is a
Speaker 3: lot of those past relationships in my twenties when I
Speaker 3: look back, and some of them are still in my life. Unfortunately,
Speaker 3: when I look back, I'm like, none of that made
Speaker 3: sense to me. How we communicated, how we coexisted, how
Speaker 3: we fucked, how we tried old, how we none of
Speaker 3: literally none of it makes sense to me currently.
Speaker 5: Yeah, and our twenties were dopamine seeking. That's the reason why.
Speaker 5: So by the time you hit your thirties, your reward
Speaker 5: system and your pleasure system changes. So instead of having
Speaker 5: sex and the thrill of a different partner and stuff
Speaker 5: like that in your twenties where you get that rush
Speaker 5: and it's like, oh, I have this high, and then
Speaker 5: you get that that dumb when you get in your thirties,
Speaker 5: it's like, now I see pleasure as other things.
Speaker 1: I see pleasure. It's more recreational things. I see pleasure.
Speaker 5: It's more time with my partner actually getting to know
Speaker 5: this person instead of me just having a one nice
Speaker 5: standard have something toxic to say.
Speaker 3: I love the toxic take.
Speaker 1: I agree yeah.
Speaker 7: I don't think I got there without having a friends
Speaker 7: with benefits the whole time, mainly because I was so
Speaker 7: when I was like dating intentionally whatever. Sometimes I kind
Speaker 7: of was rushing for the intimacy because I didn't have
Speaker 7: it anywhere else. When you're single for a minute, and
Speaker 7: y'all know what I'm talking about, men or women listening,
Speaker 7: it doesn't even matter.
Speaker 2: When you're single for a minute, you kind of like, damn,
Speaker 2: I missed this.
Speaker 7: Then I was kind of getting a little like, oh,
Speaker 7: we should do this on Saturday, or a little too
Speaker 7: pressed because there was no one else there. I actually
Speaker 7: kind of think you need that one solid person in
Speaker 7: your life kind of when you kind of want to
Speaker 7: get your shit off, we're going to see a movie,
Speaker 7: cuddling whatever, so that you can actually date this way.
Speaker 7: I know that sounds crazy toxic, but it's really work.
Speaker 3: It also works on the opposite. I don't think I realized,
Speaker 3: what if y'all listen to the first six years of
Speaker 3: this podcast, I didn't really need intimacy. On the flip side,
Speaker 3: I didn't realize how much I needed and crave it
Speaker 3: until my last relationship.
Speaker 1: Intimacy.
Speaker 3: What intimacy in the forms of just laying down, cuddling,
Speaker 3: making and quality time. I was cool with being flown out. Baby.
Speaker 3: We got twenty four hours as fuck times. I don't
Speaker 3: know the next time on the sea, and I was
Speaker 3: good on that, you know, and that just being the exchange,
Speaker 3: fucking you as much as I can within a short
Speaker 3: window of time. And now I'm not. I turned down
Speaker 3: a trip to motherfucking Columbia and Panama. I was like,
Speaker 3: I'm good, don't need a trip, don't want that anymore,
Speaker 3: because it's I want to cuddle, you want.
Speaker 5: To You're you're getting fulfillment from somewhere else now and
Speaker 5: it sounds like it's you. And that's the difference when
Speaker 5: we get fulfillment in our twenties or when we're just
Speaker 5: being a little wild at those times we get off
Speaker 5: fulfillment from the ins and outs from external factors.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 5: Once you get to that place of healing, which is
Speaker 5: what it sounds like for you, the fulfillment or maybe you,
Speaker 5: I'm not sure what your story is, but the fulfillment
Speaker 5: starts to come from within. Now it's I'm actually creating
Speaker 5: genuine connections. It's not off of the excitement. It's not
Speaker 5: because I'm being impulsive. It's not because I'm bored. It's
Speaker 5: not even because i'm trying to be at ventures. I'm
Speaker 5: literally finding fulfillment in myself and what aligns with what
Speaker 5: it is that I actually want from my lining.
Speaker 4: Go.
Speaker 2: Hold you being hill sucks. It ain't it's fun, it's.
Speaker 3: God. I'm like, I'll do that.
Speaker 1: Maybe you're not. I think you're not. No offense. I
Speaker 1: think you're in the healing thing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, I love that.
Speaker 6: I I read that.
Speaker 5: I'm glad you said that. Let me correct myself. We
Speaker 5: never one hundred percent healed. We managed, so with me,
Speaker 5: I'm still managing my healing. Yeah, let me not say
Speaker 5: that I've healed one hundred percent because I still have triggers.
Speaker 1: I like that way, and I manage them.
Speaker 7: Yeah, when you said didn't know my story, I would
Speaker 7: say the only thing I think that changed where I
Speaker 7: was able to meet someone that was right. I kind
Speaker 7: of this is very corny, and I'm not religious, but
Speaker 7: I dead ass just had faith that like that person
Speaker 7: would come a lot of my friends right now.
Speaker 1: Where is it corny?
Speaker 7: Because I think saying I just had hope it's very wrong.
Speaker 7: Calm to say no and I just did. Something happened
Speaker 7: to me at thirty after a breakup where I was like,
Speaker 7: I'm gonna meet them, I just gotta live first. Living
Speaker 7: life along the way really helped whether it was fulfillment
Speaker 7: for myself, even fun experiences along.
Speaker 1: The way travel.
Speaker 7: I think having faith that someone is there instead of
Speaker 7: freaking out that they aren't let it happen for me.
Speaker 7: The pressure that I put unknowingly on people from maybe
Speaker 7: the word desperate is too heavy, but just being like
Speaker 7: I have to cling onto this guy because he's here,
Speaker 7: all that shit went away when I was just like
Speaker 7: it'll happen. My mother found love at forty with my dad,
Speaker 7: like a lot of my friends just got married at
Speaker 7: thirty eight.
Speaker 1: I was thirty three.
Speaker 7: I'm like that nigga coming up me, Like, why am
Speaker 7: I freaking out right now? But the patriarchy really been
Speaker 7: making me feel like I need that baby right now.
Speaker 7: I need that ring right now.
Speaker 2: People in the motherfucking comments making me feel like.
Speaker 1: Niggas don't want it.
Speaker 7: I've been a whole all these years. It's all of
Speaker 7: that shit feeding in my head. How to let it go?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm glad you do.
Speaker 2: Well.
Speaker 3: I do want to get toxic real quick time. We
Speaker 3: got to ice, break this ice a little bit, get
Speaker 3: it out, all right, y'all know, we got a little
Speaker 3: hypothetical segment in this show now and this one you
Speaker 3: know I really like, uh, just because shout out to
Speaker 3: Kevin Gates and anyone else who has ever what I
Speaker 3: can't shout out Kevin Gates.
Speaker 2: Don't look like that. Don't look like that.
Speaker 3: So here's the hypothetical and ed and feel free to
Speaker 3: join in on here, just so we could get a
Speaker 3: male perspective as well. All right, So one day you
Speaker 3: have successfully dated someone that you truly now love, and
Speaker 3: after a while, you and said person end up happily married.
Speaker 3: Come on, happy wife. However, you go to the doctor
Speaker 3: and decide to perform a medical check with your partner
Speaker 3: to prepare for family planning, and you actually find out
Speaker 3: that your partner is your long lost sibling. What do
Speaker 3: you do next in the relationship? I do want to
Speaker 3: go ahead and get y'all's opinions before I share what
Speaker 3: the results were on the pole that was taken.
Speaker 7: You would throw hell yeah, but you've been already fucking
Speaker 7: your sister now, you've already been in it. So it's like,
Speaker 7: get at it shut.
Speaker 3: Just not okay.
Speaker 2: Yeah, your mind first goes where break up with him?
Speaker 1: But then I hit reality.
Speaker 7: Okay, if I've been married to you for five years
Speaker 7: and we're just finding out through family planning we're related, Okay,
Speaker 7: we've already gone too far.
Speaker 2: We just can't have kids.
Speaker 3: Okay, so you're not having kids with them, but you're
Speaker 3: gonna keep sucking and sucking and being married. But we're
Speaker 3: already five years. We ain't gonna have a baby.
Speaker 2: You're still going to have them, so it is ain't
Speaker 2: gonna be protected.
Speaker 7: No, no, no, So the baby part is literally for the
Speaker 7: sake of the child. We know, like the increase in
Speaker 7: deficiencies that children are.
Speaker 3: Still love that baby. No oh wait, that.
Speaker 2: You're bringing a life into this world that's going to have.
Speaker 3: You know, there's high chances of it, but they could be. Okay,
Speaker 3: So wait, kitty, have you seen the oh yeah.
Speaker 1: The Whitakers or whatever on YouTube? You've seen this.
Speaker 7: It's a family of incests. I don't know what their
Speaker 7: name is because it's the whole family. It's from software,
Speaker 7: like ten of them and they all like the chances
Speaker 7: aren't just hot?
Speaker 3: Okay, yeah, Okay, l one is in Miami. Let's just
Speaker 3: say that what are doing? What are you doing?
Speaker 2: If you find out your husband is a long lost
Speaker 2: sibling like marital annoyedment?
Speaker 1: We're done. Absolutely nobody else know. We're done.
Speaker 5: We're going through grief counseling and I'm going to my
Speaker 5: parents because why y'all lied to me? And if my
Speaker 5: parents are deceased, I'm going to their grave because it's
Speaker 5: still on site.
Speaker 1: What do you mean?
Speaker 5: And even if you're afterlife, you got questions that need answers. Honey, yes,
Speaker 5: a long lost sibling. What if it was just like adoption,
Speaker 5: like no one knew?
Speaker 2: Okay, now you added because I'm saying, okay, what happens?
Speaker 1: It is not your parents, let's look at Okay, so
Speaker 1: we can look what if he was half? What somebody?
Speaker 5: I'm still don't even know my parents because you should
Speaker 5: have told them simply can.
Speaker 3: Still be half?
Speaker 2: So wait, does the does the rate of deficiency.
Speaker 3: I don't know is still fully instance because cousins, it is,
Speaker 3: even cousins get.
Speaker 5: A higher risk of So if you have okay, so
Speaker 5: anything that's interfamilial, that means that your DNA has a
Speaker 5: specific coding that looks similar, there's a higher risk for
Speaker 5: genetic deficiency.
Speaker 1: Do you know this goes down to dogs?
Speaker 7: What she's saying goes I will know they say that
Speaker 7: dogs is how dogs have issues. So let's just say
Speaker 7: you want to get a toy puppy that's popular.
Speaker 3: Just abnormalties, not not not issues definitely.
Speaker 7: Okay, let's just say they're breeding toy dogs. Everybody wants
Speaker 7: this three pound dogs. A lot of these dogs are
Speaker 7: getting sick or something's wrong with them, or they like
Speaker 7: they are super hyper, and it's all because of the
Speaker 7: in bringing.
Speaker 2: So I guess are you giving your brother?
Speaker 3: Bitch? I ain't gonna hold you. I don't want kids,
Speaker 3: no way, right, So I think the conversation then if
Speaker 3: we want kids, because I'm going for family planning, I'm
Speaker 3: cool with adopting. I don't think I divorced them. This
Speaker 3: might be the only person I'll ever love in my life.
Speaker 3: Like we're married now, I love you, you.
Speaker 1: Know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Like, so I didn't I didn't have a follow up question?
Speaker 3: Then okay, wait, well what'd you just.
Speaker 1: Like absolutely love somebody else? Manufficiency?
Speaker 3: You know what? I don't even want kids. Okay, so
Speaker 3: then let me ask, Okay, is there any relative that
Speaker 3: you don't think would warrant the same scrutiny or it
Speaker 3: wouldn't be such a big deal. Because we talked about cousins,
Speaker 3: what about like third cousins or someone through married.
Speaker 7: Being a cousin fucker is crazy, But being a brotherfucker's crazy.
Speaker 3: It's crazy. Let me ask you.
Speaker 2: You find out you keeping it.
Speaker 1: At least taking up again.
Speaker 3: I mean, okay, well, I did want to read some
Speaker 3: of the results. So for this the Thrones was fine.
Speaker 3: But but Jordi said, uh, they would first have the
Speaker 3: conversation with their spouse whether they should stay together or not.
Speaker 3: That's the first thing. The second one divorce, speedy divorce.
Speaker 3: I can't bear it. I'm immediately going. The next one
Speaker 3: is I'll keep it a secret. So women were saying
Speaker 3: they would keep it a secret from their spouse that
Speaker 3: they're related.
Speaker 1: Because you gotta thinking. There we go.
Speaker 7: Let me tell you why my brain is going this way.
Speaker 7: I'm super in love right now. Okay, we're a.
Speaker 1: Couple of go to restaurants. They'd be like, you want
Speaker 1: to another play. We'd be like, no, bitch, we're on
Speaker 1: the same side, saying for it. We got in love.
Speaker 7: I just feel like I wouldn't have I can't see
Speaker 7: breaking it.
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 7: Maybe a regular marriage where people are just like a
Speaker 7: lot of people hate their wives. Wom Yeah, I'm gonna
Speaker 7: walk around and just not saying.
Speaker 3: There are people that would. There are people saying that
Speaker 3: they would keep it to themselves.
Speaker 7: Oh I thought they men keep it to themselves. I
Speaker 7: don't know, don't because I'm not telling my hot I'll
Speaker 7: keep it a secret. That's a secret within yourself. I
Speaker 7: ain't telling nobody because y'all ain't gonna judge me.
Speaker 5: Now.
Speaker 2: I'm probably tell my best friend Chris, she'll understand.
Speaker 3: Maybe I'll just fell love. I'm married. We've never thought
Speaker 3: I would get here anyways, What the fuck I am married?
Speaker 3: Out of said on this podcast for eight years saying
Speaker 3: I ain't getting married. It's that nigga my daddy. I'm
Speaker 3: staying married probably. Oh wait, I mean if I didn't
Speaker 3: know my dad and then found out, Okay, my dad.
Speaker 1: Is my heart.
Speaker 2: Oh if you found out it was your dad, that's
Speaker 2: my heart.
Speaker 7: Nu yo, y'all ever seen an old boy, y'all know
Speaker 7: what I'm talking about. Sorry, it has to do with
Speaker 7: the ending. But it's one of them. It's my favorite movies.
Speaker 7: It's a Korean film. But basically, I don't know how
Speaker 7: to say it eddying. I'm trying to think it's a
Speaker 7: prisoner like, it's this way of revenge. But they basically
Speaker 7: placed this woman in his so he fantasizes about this woman,
Speaker 7: ends up seeing her, then they end up getting married,
Speaker 7: falling in love, and then towards the end of the movie, boom,
Speaker 7: he finds out it's his daughter. Oh, but that was
Speaker 7: their biggest way of like giving him revenge, like getting
Speaker 7: their revenge on him.
Speaker 3: Oh, now you fell in little with your daughter, yo. Well,
Speaker 3: as long as they're both consenting adults. I did want
Speaker 3: to share. I did just want to share a fun fact.
Speaker 3: Rutgers anthropologist Robin Fox has actually estimated that the majority
Speaker 3: of all marriages throughout history were actually between first and
Speaker 3: second cussin.
Speaker 1: Here we go through these generalized statements in generalized studies.
Speaker 3: Don't do that. Hold on. This is cited from Live Science.
Speaker 3: Let me look now, you got me trying to figure
Speaker 3: out how they did this. Oh, it's actually according to
Speaker 3: the Journal of plos Genetics. So they possibly went through
Speaker 3: genetic testing of these people.
Speaker 1: Even so when.
Speaker 5: People make these type of statements and we do this
Speaker 5: type of study, I'm looking to see exactly where you
Speaker 5: performed study it like what regions, what area?
Speaker 2: Now when they started dying, it was digging up their
Speaker 2: grades and.
Speaker 5: Was like, I want to know because certain cultures maybe,
Speaker 5: but when we say, oh so you know.
Speaker 7: What I was just thinking of. There's a documentary on
Speaker 7: Netflix with the guy.
Speaker 3: Who had given the sperm.
Speaker 7: Yes, yes, and they were talking about how it literally
Speaker 7: affects a country. Yes, because now what happens is he
Speaker 7: did sperm donation with so many women in one particular
Speaker 7: area that these kids are going to meet one day
Speaker 7: and be slightly connected to their half brother ten percent
Speaker 7: not knowing.
Speaker 2: Y'all should look at it.
Speaker 3: It's called uh, I have a thousand Babies or something
Speaker 3: like that, something like that, and it's on Netflix, and
Speaker 3: it's literally the conversation around sperm donating because if you
Speaker 3: if you donate your sperm to a small demographic. These
Speaker 3: kids are all technical.
Speaker 7: So they were talking about being on a playground, putting
Speaker 7: the kids in a playground and just like naturally get
Speaker 7: a little crush on someone, like you really have to
Speaker 7: keep these kids apart.
Speaker 2: But the naturally you go have a crush on your
Speaker 2: siblings to.
Speaker 5: No naturally have a crush on because of the chemistry,
Speaker 5: you won't know, oh not.
Speaker 7: Science talk about that. Let me tell you it's crazy
Speaker 7: about you saying that. Yeah, oh my god, she's the
Speaker 7: only child.
Speaker 1: My aunt Dally.
Speaker 7: I don't have something or anything, but I was in
Speaker 7: a Walmart talking to this lady.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I told this on Horrible.
Speaker 7: This was in DeLand, Florida, years ago. I'm like nineteen
Speaker 7: years old. This lady, something about her energy just made
Speaker 7: me excited about her. So basically we start talking. She's
Speaker 7: in her fifties. I'm nineteen years old. I'm like, oh
Speaker 7: my god, you just remind me of my mom. She's like,
Speaker 7: where's your mom from. I was like, it's from New York,
Speaker 7: but she moved down here. My grandma moved here too.
Speaker 7: And she's like, what's your mom's name?
Speaker 1: I said, Jewel.
Speaker 7: She starts crying and she's like, that's my niece. Oh
Speaker 7: wo like removed or whatever, like not like super close,
Speaker 7: but like the next one.
Speaker 1: I'm like what. She's like, I'm your auntie.
Speaker 3: Bro.
Speaker 7: Literally spent maybe every other thing's given with them and
Speaker 7: oh wow, met her in a Walmart. Say that to
Speaker 7: say there is something about chemistry between family, which is crazy.
Speaker 3: I can't get my sister but for my daddy.
Speaker 7: So you can actually need someone must just say that
Speaker 7: was a romantic connection.
Speaker 3: I felt attached to this person. I might be adopted.
Speaker 3: Then I might need to talk to my parents now
Speaker 3: because I ain't got some of my some of my
Speaker 3: mother like a family. No connection and no connection. No no, no,
Speaker 3: me and my mam are the same person.
Speaker 1: But you said no connection. Chemistry is different from connection.
Speaker 3: Oh okay, girl, That's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 6: You know what, No shade, but we got chemistry week, dude,
Speaker 6: I'm just saying, you have we do?
Speaker 3: We do? It could be a biracial thing.
Speaker 2: I have a lot of biracial No, I'm just saying
Speaker 2: that might be.
Speaker 3: I hated it. It could be biracial in Orlando.
Speaker 7: I just don't like talking about it right now because
Speaker 7: after this election and ver Roads, I just hate being biracial.
Speaker 6: Bro.
Speaker 2: No, no, no, I love my father, but we got it.
Speaker 2: I wish my mom just went a little more to
Speaker 2: the other side of Africa instead of the middle East,
Speaker 2: he's a different one.
Speaker 3: We can't claim the Biracials that really want to know, it's.
Speaker 7: Not we're all in the same. No, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 7: there's different birational. There's not Patrick mahons all these niggas.
Speaker 7: Patrick mahonmesay like he's leaning a little more on the
Speaker 7: palm side.
Speaker 3: Zoe.
Speaker 1: There different, there's a difference.
Speaker 3: I don't claim a Biracials, but I'm saying they muddy.
Speaker 1: The water for us. I get you.
Speaker 7: Do you understand why we got so many black women
Speaker 7: that because we are the opposite of racials.
Speaker 3: They know.
Speaker 1: But then once in the blue we come out.
Speaker 3: We ain't muddy ship. Let's stilly. They're gonna be like,
Speaker 3: see only Mandy and the brother history money. We're not
Speaker 3: gonna do that. We ain't muddy ship, no money and
Speaker 3: in the blood she would have divorced them.
Speaker 2: Look at us, A screw is loose, ain't And I
Speaker 2: talk to yourself.
Speaker 1: That connection.
Speaker 3: We are different viracials.
Speaker 2: All right, y'all.
Speaker 3: We we got our reaction. These are these are some
Speaker 3: uh touch topics. Because this next one, baby, we have
Speaker 3: a video to play, and I'm really excited because with
Speaker 3: this clip, I want to talk about how we kind
Speaker 3: of connect as human beings. Right, Because when you're married,
Speaker 3: there of course is a romantic relationship. But before a
Speaker 3: romantic relationship, it's specifically with you, there was a friendship, right.
Speaker 3: I will say our friend zone before I get romantic,
Speaker 3: like in a way to when our friends on you,
Speaker 3: I don't think of you as a partner. If I
Speaker 3: think of you as a partner, I jump right into
Speaker 3: I see you as a partner, not friendship.
Speaker 1: Where you you can compartmentalize it.
Speaker 2: It's different.
Speaker 3: I do a lot. That's the word from them. I'm sorry, okay, no,
Speaker 3: So I'm gonna play this. I want to play this clip. Dave,
Speaker 3: you got it put up for us, and we're gonna
Speaker 3: I'm excited to kind of see your thoughts on this.
Speaker 4: I don't particularly want to be a mother have children
Speaker 4: to me. I think it's basically for us, you know,
Speaker 4: companionship and security. And I think it'd be rather interesting
Speaker 4: to marry a homosexual for this, because you could establish
Speaker 4: a good relationship, a sort of deep respect for relationship,
Speaker 4: and yet you could your own life apart.
Speaker 3: So this is a woman from nineteen sixty four. I'm
Speaker 3: going to summarize it. She basically said that she would
Speaker 3: like to marry all homosexual because she believes that in relationship,
Speaker 3: the companionship comes from being friends, and it would be
Speaker 3: easier for her to be married with someone who's homosexual
Speaker 3: because they can respect each other. They could allow each
Speaker 3: other to have separate lives apart, but still have respect
Speaker 3: for each other within the relationship, almost to insinuate that
Speaker 3: when you're with someone maybe on a heterosexual scale, or
Speaker 3: lean in romantically with the love of your life that way,
Speaker 3: that you lose the respect, you lose the friendship, you
Speaker 3: lose the fun out of it. I think that that's
Speaker 3: kind of a bit been my perception as well.
Speaker 2: We always say, right, sex complicates things.
Speaker 3: We always put these boundaries with our romantic partnerships that
Speaker 3: we don't necessarily put with our friendships. And I think
Speaker 3: Weezie and I have been talking about that a lot,
Speaker 3: like how we show up differently with our romantic partners,
Speaker 3: differently than how we show up as daughters to our parents,
Speaker 3: and different how we show up as friends within our friendships.
Speaker 3: So I want to ask you specifically your thoughts on
Speaker 3: this video, and then we're gonna deep die.
Speaker 5: Okay, So first, on the video with her desiring to
Speaker 5: marry someone that is homosexual, and she's known the orientation
Speaker 5: of them, so I'm looking at different factors. If you're
Speaker 5: wanting to marry someone solely for companionship, then that's the
Speaker 5: only aspect that you're really prioritizing. So it doesn't have
Speaker 5: the heterosexual expectations that you see in a heterosexual relationship.
Speaker 1: It's not there. So sex and stuff and all that.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so sex and stuff like that doesn't necessarily mean
Speaker 5: that it has to be a part of companionship. She
Speaker 5: just wants someone to give her a sense of emotional fulfillment,
Speaker 5: but also be able to help I guess with parenting
Speaker 5: or whatever it is that she wants with Some people
Speaker 5: actually do that.
Speaker 2: Can I break this energy for a second.
Speaker 7: This is a really sadass video to me, okay, and
Speaker 7: I feel like a lot of the conversations we've been
Speaker 7: having recently are all disappointment from men. Can we just
Speaker 7: talk about how your relationship and marriage is healthy? Tell
Speaker 7: us things that I don't know, just way acts of
Speaker 7: love you Shovije. I just want to hear about it
Speaker 7: because I'm almost a little tired of like, no shade
Speaker 7: I know you picked the slip even I bring it up.
Speaker 7: I feel like we talk so much about the bad,
Speaker 7: Like we're sitting here with well, your husband's on all
Speaker 7: the mic, but just talk about having a healthy marriage
Speaker 7: and how it's possible.
Speaker 1: And you're young.
Speaker 7: Why are you happy? How have you found this happiness?
Speaker 7: How do you navigate good conversations? Like I kind of
Speaker 7: want to hear that.
Speaker 1: Well, I'm gonna give you healthy by my definition.
Speaker 5: Yeah, healthy by my definition is really creating a safe
Speaker 5: space for both of us. That means that you get
Speaker 5: to be yourself authentically and I get to beat myself
Speaker 5: authentically as well, And that leans back to that friendship.
Speaker 5: Friendship is us being able to open up even about
Speaker 5: our insecurities, about our worries, about our doubts, without the judgment,
Speaker 5: without criticizing one another. Also practicing a lot of connective skills,
Speaker 5: a lot of connection activities. So being emotionally intimate is
Speaker 5: what a lot of people actually lack in their relationships.
Speaker 1: So we do.
Speaker 5: Things together Togetherness is prioritize us. Being able to sit
Speaker 5: and talk and be able to reveal what we're truly
Speaker 5: feeling is important. Also, our identities we merge but we
Speaker 5: have limits on how much we merge.
Speaker 1: That's where a lot of people fail.
Speaker 5: They get in, they merge identities, and then the life
Speaker 5: becomes what can I do for you?
Speaker 2: That's not our life a library emerging identities. For example,
Speaker 2: when you said.
Speaker 7: That just now, I thought about working together. Couples that
Speaker 7: started business together, tell me how you don't money?
Speaker 1: See that?
Speaker 5: And that's not necessarily merging identities when we're if we're
Speaker 5: speaking about just being in a partnership, a business partnership,
Speaker 5: that's completely different. In a business partnership, you can separate
Speaker 5: your actual emotional partnership from the business.
Speaker 2: So how's a merging of an identity? Is it like
Speaker 2: sharing friends?
Speaker 4: Like?
Speaker 1: What does that look like?
Speaker 5: It's when I take on all of your interests, Like
Speaker 5: I lose myself by trying to do exactly I'm conform
Speaker 5: to what I believe you want of me, or I'm
Speaker 5: conforming to what I see that you do. That's merging
Speaker 5: your identity. Like at this point, we're not doing things
Speaker 5: for ourselves. We're not still having our own friendships, we're
Speaker 5: not pursuing our own hobbies, we're not engaging in our
Speaker 5: own interests. We're just living for one another. Me and
Speaker 5: my husband don't do that. We have that's a hard boundary.
Speaker 5: It's like, look, I'm here for you, yes I will.
Speaker 5: I'm married to you, but i still have my friendships.
Speaker 5: As long as I'm respecting my marriage, as long as
Speaker 5: I'm still being an integral person, that's fine.
Speaker 1: How do you do?
Speaker 2: Tell me more about the connective activities.
Speaker 5: So if we're talking about emotional connection, because it's different
Speaker 5: forms of intimacy, I'm speaking on intimacy when I say
Speaker 5: that we have physical, we have emotional, we have intellectual,
Speaker 5: we have sexual, we have financial intimacy.
Speaker 1: There's different forms of intimacy.
Speaker 5: So when I'm talking about connection on an emotional level,
Speaker 5: that means we're sitting, We're talking about our bad things,
Speaker 5: we're talking about our good things. We're talking about our traumas,
Speaker 5: we're talking about our past. We're talking about how we
Speaker 5: feel in this moment, and we're providing that safety. We're
Speaker 5: not interrupting each other, we're not being this fact that
Speaker 5: we're actually listening. Those are forms of emotional intimacy, but
Speaker 5: we bring in other forms of intimacy as well. Intellectual
Speaker 5: we talk a lot about things that are happening in
Speaker 5: the world. We do a lot of intellectual things together.
Speaker 5: It helps us expand our minds, like financial intimacy, talking
Speaker 5: about your finances and things like that. Working through these
Speaker 5: things while still maintaining connection, physical intimacy, holding hands, cuddling,
Speaker 5: doing stuff like that, sexual intimacy, engaging of course, and sex,
Speaker 5: benetrative sex and stuff like that. You got it, So
Speaker 5: I think that if you. But I think because I
Speaker 5: always say, the foundation of any form of intimacy is
Speaker 5: your emotional intimacy.
Speaker 1: That's the breeding ground for everything.
Speaker 2: Now let me ask you this.
Speaker 7: I've got a homegirl of mine who's a little more
Speaker 7: old school to me, and she heard me say something
Speaker 7: on the phone so my man, and she goes, you
Speaker 7: share too much. I can't remember what it was. It
Speaker 7: was an insecurity I had on I like her. She's like,
Speaker 7: you shared too much. You shouldn't have told him that
Speaker 7: you're insecure about that, And I'm like.
Speaker 1: How now, hold on?
Speaker 7: I think I started to maybe okay because I because
Speaker 7: you just said so. Her and I like were not arguing,
Speaker 7: but she was like, you shouldn't. I really want to
Speaker 7: tell y'all what it was. I have no shame I
Speaker 7: just can't remember if. Okay, but it was something about
Speaker 7: a physical insecurity I was having, maybe I was feeling
Speaker 7: I don't know if it was weight or what.
Speaker 2: I don't remember what it was.
Speaker 7: But basically in this conversation, she goes, he can't be
Speaker 7: or everything. You need to dump that onto me. You
Speaker 7: need to jump that onto your homegirls, don't let this
Speaker 7: man see you. Okay, you like to take it back?
Speaker 2: Now, why can't I share with him how I'm feeling because.
Speaker 1: I want him to know that.
Speaker 5: It's not necessarily that. I think she's looking more at
Speaker 5: possible codependent tendencies. I think that's what she's highlighting because
Speaker 5: in certain situations, in certain relational dynamics, when you're sharing
Speaker 5: a lot, when you're sharing insecurities, if you're looking for
Speaker 5: them to be the sole source of securing that insecurity,
Speaker 5: that's when it's a problem. It's fine with you sharing
Speaker 5: certain things, but there are certain conversations that you probably
Speaker 5: should just out with your friends and let your friends
Speaker 5: help you navigate that.
Speaker 7: So, then how do we fix this If I'm feeling, uh,
Speaker 7: I don't know something with my body issues right because
Speaker 7: I have fibroids, and so since I was working through
Speaker 7: getting them smaller. I couldn't really work out, and I'm
Speaker 7: starting to see like weight get put on. I'm like, well,
Speaker 7: I'm not feeling good. I'm not feeling good about this.
Speaker 7: I really hold that all in and don't tell my
Speaker 7: partner that I'm feeling.
Speaker 5: Like you can. This is where we're's that codependency. Set
Speaker 5: your boundary with yourself because you have to understand any
Speaker 5: problem that you present to a man, his natural instinct
Speaker 5: is to solve it anything. So this becomes a burden
Speaker 5: when it becomes continuous. So yes, we can. I can
Speaker 5: tell you if I constantly feel like that, Yeah, now
Speaker 5: you can feel that you have the right to feel it.
Speaker 5: I can tell you that, hey, today i'm feeling insecure.
Speaker 5: I'm not really feeling myself. And then, of course, every day, if.
Speaker 2: You wake up telling me I.
Speaker 3: Don't have time every day, you look great.
Speaker 5: Right, I can give you the reassurance, But we can't
Speaker 5: make this something that's own going because then it's going
Speaker 5: to feel like his reassurance is going board.
Speaker 1: You can't be dumping on somebody.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I actually have a question too, because we talked
Speaker 3: about healthy relationships and healthy marriages and things like that.
Speaker 3: But we also we're talking about friendship. She wanted companionship,
Speaker 3: and so because so many people start as friends before
Speaker 3: they get into a relationship and then eventually end up
Speaker 3: married if that's their end goal, how is it possible
Speaker 3: to maintain a healthy friendship when betrayal is introduced into
Speaker 3: the romantic relationship?
Speaker 1: Or I gotta go through steps on this one.
Speaker 3: Because that's the thing that's the reality too, right, like damn?
Speaker 3: Like as a partner, Yeah, okay, you betrayed me because
Speaker 3: you cheated on me, like again in romance. In romantic partnerships,
Speaker 3: there's a level of that, there's different boundaries that are set,
Speaker 3: there's different expectations on them. When when they're a friend,
Speaker 3: those are completely different expectations and boundaries as well. And
Speaker 3: so when you're merging this person to show up as both,
Speaker 3: how do you keep a healthy relationship when they're fucking
Speaker 3: up as a partner? And is it possible to keep
Speaker 3: that friendship after so many boundaries across romantically?
Speaker 5: Well, I think healthy is subjective, So I'm be the
Speaker 5: light on that term. When someone betrays you, whether it's
Speaker 5: intentional or not, it becomes an attachment injury. So there's
Speaker 5: no way when it damages the connection for that to
Speaker 5: stay healthy in that moment. So if you realize that
Speaker 5: now this person has betrayed me in some sense, now
Speaker 5: we have to do the restorative work. We have to
Speaker 5: recognize that there is now an attachment injury.
Speaker 1: There's been. So either you broke my trust, you broke
Speaker 1: the security.
Speaker 5: Because when we're speaking of attachment, certain attachments need trust,
Speaker 5: they need security, they need loyalty and things like that.
Speaker 5: So now you've injured that. So now my perception of
Speaker 5: security looks completely different. Now we need to have these conversations.
Speaker 5: We need to talk about what this act of betrayal
Speaker 5: was because when if you're speaking of a friendship in
Speaker 5: a relationship and things like that, and you're prioritizing the
Speaker 5: friendship or the companionship, it's like it's like a double
Speaker 5: effect almost in a sense. So now I have to
Speaker 5: look and see that how you as my friend and
Speaker 5: how you as my partner has betrayed me.
Speaker 1: I have different levels to this.
Speaker 5: Now I need to look at the severity and intensity
Speaker 5: of the betrayal, how it has truly affected me, and
Speaker 5: I need to be able to talk to you about it.
Speaker 5: It means you can't be dismissing, you can't be justifying,
Speaker 5: you can't be arguing, you can't be shift and blame.
Speaker 5: You need to hear exactly how you have impacted me
Speaker 5: and then truly own up to what it is that
Speaker 5: you did. The safety measures are important when we're talking
Speaker 5: about restoring, because we need to be able to talk.
Speaker 5: I need to be able to ask those questions because
Speaker 5: now I have difficult Yeah, I have assumption and curiosity,
Speaker 5: and oftentimes we see when people betray someone and they
Speaker 5: hurt someone, they try to speed up the process. No,
Speaker 5: in this process, I need emotional space. Now I need
Speaker 5: to process my emotions. I need to process the assumptions
Speaker 5: that are attached with these emotions as well. I need
Speaker 5: to process these triggers, and I may not be able
Speaker 5: to process them around you. So now I'm going to
Speaker 5: create this emotional space to be able to get through this.
Speaker 5: But I do have questions. Most people will ask, why
Speaker 5: did you do it? Was I not good enough? Did
Speaker 5: you not love me? Did you not think about me?
Speaker 5: You have all of these assumptions that start to come up,
Speaker 5: and a person who is the offending partner needs to
Speaker 5: be able to sit through that. That's where that test
Speaker 5: of friendship is going to come through. If we remove
Speaker 5: the title of lovers and we are here just as friends.
Speaker 5: As a friend, you would hear me, because I know
Speaker 5: you would hear your friends.
Speaker 3: Yep.
Speaker 5: Let's remove the expectations of a relationship and let's just
Speaker 5: talk friendship. Can you provide a space to where I
Speaker 5: can actually talk to you? Can you provide that safety
Speaker 5: for me to express what's going on and guess what
Speaker 5: I'm gonna talk about it today. I may talk about
Speaker 5: it again next week. I may talk about it the
Speaker 5: week after that. But can you provide that space? Can
Speaker 5: you take ownership for what it is that you did?
Speaker 5: And can you apologize genuinely with that? Apology means that
Speaker 5: we need correction as well. Can you do that without
Speaker 5: necessarily apologizing just because you feel guilty? Can't I apologizing
Speaker 5: because you want me to hurry up here?
Speaker 3: But where does it come from? Within our heads? And
Speaker 3: men and women? This isn't even gender base where yet
Speaker 3: we absolutely can hear our friends out a lot more
Speaker 3: easily and receive it and digest it way more than
Speaker 3: a romantic partner hear them out for what hear them
Speaker 3: out for yeah, like it, damn it really, I was really,
Speaker 3: you know, upset that you weren't able to show it
Speaker 3: to my birthday dinner.
Speaker 2: I was really upset that you kind of came late day.
Speaker 3: Why you Like, there's just more casualness in telling friends
Speaker 3: how they kind of slided, how they showed up for you,
Speaker 3: and there becomes so much pressure or anxiety around letting
Speaker 3: your partner know they let you down. Well.
Speaker 5: Condition and expectation is completely different in those dynamics. For one,
Speaker 5: we're conditioned with our relationships to be one to be
Speaker 5: truly a partner, So it looks different from an actual friendship.
Speaker 5: You can still have separate identities in a friendship, but
Speaker 5: it doesn't necessarily feel the same in a relationship. It's
Speaker 5: the way one point I'm going to make Biologically, we
Speaker 5: are completely different. If you ever study a man's brain
Speaker 5: versus a woman's brain, we don't have the same into
Speaker 5: personal skills. So as women, we can sit with our friends,
Speaker 5: we can talk to ten thousand people, and we can
Speaker 5: take in everything that they're saying and consider it.
Speaker 1: Men don't do that.
Speaker 5: That's the reason why in their friendships they don't have
Speaker 5: to talk about birthdays and stuff, and they don't trip
Speaker 5: if you miss a birthday party because they don't have
Speaker 5: that same interpersonal effect. Yes, it's certain things in the
Speaker 5: brain that just it doesn't signal the same. So we
Speaker 5: have different hormones as well that send different messages. So
Speaker 5: when we look and say when we have these conversations,
Speaker 5: that's why I say women need to have friends when
Speaker 5: we have conversations. For men, if you come and dump
Speaker 5: back to your point, if you come and dump all
Speaker 5: of this stuff on them and they keep hearing it
Speaker 5: and it's on repeat, eventually it's going to become white
Speaker 5: noise to them. And that's the reason why you sound
Speaker 5: like you're being That's why you feel like you're being dismissed.
Speaker 1: They can't process it.
Speaker 7: I had a conversation recently about what I share with friends,
Speaker 7: and I think keeping any major disagreement private and something
Speaker 7: I never really did before. And we have this conversation
Speaker 7: of do you really need to share anything? He asked me,
Speaker 7: do you always feel like you need a sounding boy
Speaker 7: if we get in a disagreement or can you ever
Speaker 7: work on it with your own And I was like, yo, wait, wait,
Speaker 7: Katy got a face, what does it it's a real
Speaker 7: question that I had to sit with myself with. He
Speaker 7: was like, ain't not mad when he asked it all?
Speaker 7: He was like, do you always need a sounding for you?
Speaker 7: I think, yeah, why, I think I've always had it?
Speaker 7: So you don't try to judgment and you struggle with
Speaker 7: this not my judging.
Speaker 1: Let me get to it.
Speaker 5: No, I'm gonna get to it because I'm listening to
Speaker 5: what you're saying. Well, let me finish why Okay, I'm sorry,
Speaker 5: go ahead, because I do agree with you with trusting judgment.
Speaker 5: I need to vent it out sometimes for what because
Speaker 5: that feels like the release for me?
Speaker 2: What if you write it down well that I'm not
Speaker 2: sure about to.
Speaker 7: Write you down like I thought about that when I
Speaker 7: was having this conversation. But it isn't always advice, so
Speaker 7: it's not a sounding. It's two things, right, comfort or solution.
Speaker 7: That's what I asked when my homegirls call me now,
Speaker 7: But you want me to comfort you or tell you
Speaker 7: what to do? Favorite thing to say now because I've
Speaker 7: been a little too mean for me When I okay,
Speaker 7: so sounding, I guess word to my head is listened.
Speaker 7: But I really don't need the advice. Sometimes I just
Speaker 7: want to be like, Oh tell me then, if I'm
Speaker 7: that person, is that still something that's a problem. Should
Speaker 7: I really just be getting angry on my own or
Speaker 7: is it okay to release it?
Speaker 5: It's okay to release it. I'm still curious as to
Speaker 5: why you need to vent it to other people. I
Speaker 5: want that answer. I honestly don'tn't know. I think it's
Speaker 5: an only child thing. I think that maybe it could
Speaker 5: be a cop out, but I really believe this. My
Speaker 5: friends with siblings seem to be in him included, seem
Speaker 5: to be a lot better with managing emotions alone, and
Speaker 5: for some reason I can't do it, not in this
Speaker 5: super needy way, but I kind of do like and
Speaker 5: enjoy having someone there to hold my hands. I'm not
Speaker 5: going to get too clinical, but I am going to
Speaker 5: ask you, when you were younger and you had to
Speaker 5: process certain events and process the transitions and things like that,
Speaker 5: who did you talk to as an only child when
Speaker 5: you had things that were going on in your life.
Speaker 5: Who was the person that you were able to talk
Speaker 5: to about those things?
Speaker 2: Nobody?
Speaker 3: If you?
Speaker 1: So you were self comfort Yeah, but I didn't enjoy it.
Speaker 5: Oh, so that's the reason why you need it down
Speaker 5: that that's the reason why, so that self comfort now
Speaker 5: can feel like a threat to you internally, you've gotten
Speaker 5: to that place to where it's like now I have
Speaker 5: a sense of security when I can talk and I
Speaker 5: can be open because I didn't have it, You're shifting dynamics.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie because baby, I'm in a place
Speaker 3: where I will take it to the grave. If I
Speaker 3: know I don't care about what anyone's gonna say about it,
Speaker 3: and my decisions already made up, that's when I know
Speaker 3: I don't share anything. If I've already made the decision
Speaker 3: in my head, I have no reason to share with
Speaker 3: my friends what I'm about to do. Or I don't
Speaker 3: need a soundboard, I don't need to share it. I'll
Speaker 3: let you know when I do it. I don't do
Speaker 3: the as soon as I know, I don't care what
Speaker 3: anyone says.
Speaker 7: Maybe I ain't been to, I ain't shared. I'm just
Speaker 7: I think for me, I'm not gonna lie for major arguments.
Speaker 7: I actually don't do it those and it's not really
Speaker 7: because I don't want to. It's out of respect for
Speaker 7: the partner I have. I'm not gonna let you know
Speaker 7: that this just happened between us because it may have
Speaker 7: something to do with him or meet this personal when
Speaker 7: it comes to the little ship, like that whole tep
Speaker 7: argument I talked about. He wanted me to fast yea
Speaker 7: for some fibraid shit.
Speaker 2: I'm like, but I'm bleeding. I can't fast. He's like,
Speaker 2: you don't want to get healthy?
Speaker 7: To me, this is small, right, That's something I'm gonna
Speaker 7: call my homenger about every time. But when it's real deal,
Speaker 7: I feel like I can. I can manage it. However,
Speaker 7: I do like getting on the phone and I realized
Speaker 7: some people don't necessarily like or can't handle that. One
Speaker 7: other thing I wanted to bring up that you kind
Speaker 7: of just taught me about myself in a breakup I
Speaker 7: had before with betrayal and pain. I didn't realize how
Speaker 7: codependent I was on him until this moment because he
Speaker 7: was the one who hurt me, but he was also
Speaker 7: fixing it.
Speaker 2: I didn't want That's narcissism. What That's what a lot
Speaker 2: of narcissists do.
Speaker 3: It was trait of narcissism. I know, like that was
Speaker 3: a wanted it. No no, no no, but like that's uh,
Speaker 3: it's the highs and lows of dopamine and them crashing
Speaker 3: you and then being the to be your savior as well,
Speaker 3: like yeah, but I get that, but no, no, no, people
Speaker 3: are intentional about doing that. Let me, let me hurt
Speaker 3: you to save you.
Speaker 7: I don't think that was what happened to me. My
Speaker 7: ex wasn't necessarily that. But basically what would happened is
Speaker 7: if I got angry at him, I didn't want to
Speaker 7: release it to anybody else. You didn't want to talk
Speaker 7: to anybody else. I kept it in house with if
Speaker 7: I was sad, if he cheated, if he did something,
Speaker 7: I was like, okay, well I have to solve it
Speaker 7: with him. And that is real codependency. I don't know
Speaker 7: if that's narcissism, but that to me, it was me
Speaker 7: that sound like no, this one this codependency.
Speaker 1: One.
Speaker 5: Codependency falls on the spectrum so you have certain people
Speaker 5: who need to be needed, and you have certain people
Speaker 5: who need other people. So she falls more on the
Speaker 5: spectrum of I need other people. You were you were
Speaker 5: using him, Like if you're using somebody to help you heal,
Speaker 5: to help you feel secure, to help you feel stable,
Speaker 5: to help you regulate, and you feel like you can't
Speaker 5: do so that's a form of especially when he fucking
Speaker 5: hurt my bod.
Speaker 3: I want to make sure we get into the history
Speaker 3: of marriage here, and before we start, I do have
Speaker 3: a quote that I don't like to read. This does
Speaker 3: come from Marriage, A History How Love Conquered Marriage. This
Speaker 3: is a two thousand and six book written by Stephanie Coomes,
Speaker 3: and the quote is what marriage had in common was
Speaker 3: that it really was not about the relationship between a
Speaker 3: man and woman. It was a way of getting in laws,
Speaker 3: of making alliances and expanding the family labor force. Now,
Speaker 3: why I wanted to bring this up, and there's a
Speaker 3: few different things in which I want to dive into
Speaker 3: in terms of the history of managed marriage, is because
Speaker 3: for so long, which is kind of where my brain
Speaker 3: still is, we have now gotten to a place where
Speaker 3: marriage is for love. You are marrying for love, and
Speaker 3: now it is completely removing what actual marriage was about,
Speaker 3: which was more of a business arrangement decision between families.
Speaker 3: It was a financial one. It was why cousins were
Speaker 3: marrying each other. It was to keep the family name.
Speaker 3: The wealth only was in the family. And so I
Speaker 3: want to start there because bringing forth love as the
Speaker 3: premise leans more so into Christianity, And I only want
Speaker 3: to talk about where we see marriage today and kind
Speaker 3: of how we've gotten so far from what it is,
Speaker 3: because that's where we lean into monogamy. That's where we
Speaker 3: lean into well I should marry you because I love you,
Speaker 3: or these timelines. Right, yeah, Well if you really liked you,
Speaker 3: he would have proposed to you back now, So can
Speaker 3: we start there. It started about in the nineteen fifties
Speaker 3: where we started marrying more for love.
Speaker 2: It was actually earlier than that, earlier than the fifties.
Speaker 3: Can we talk about it, Yeah, because it started with
Speaker 3: the church.
Speaker 1: It was at a time it was more so on
Speaker 1: a romantic era.
Speaker 5: Is when you start seeing the shift before it was
Speaker 5: for the lineage, it was for yeah, yeah, because at first,
Speaker 5: if you look at the roots of marriage, it was
Speaker 5: for lineage, it was for wealth, it was us to
Speaker 5: keep the family name.
Speaker 1: It was you know, forming alliances and things like that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, all right, keep it in Okay, I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 1: They did do that.
Speaker 5: It was such things as a brother marriage where they
Speaker 5: they actually did stuff like that. So stuff like that
Speaker 5: did happen. And then there are certain countries and stuff
Speaker 5: like that, like Saudi Arabia, Susin, African and Asian cousins.
Speaker 7: And one of my friends told me, who's running that
Speaker 7: your father is her mother's cousin, and she told it
Speaker 7: to me because she wanted me to know. Like, I
Speaker 7: don't want you to judge this, but when you come
Speaker 7: to this family event, like they're all connected.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so a lot of times you saw them marrying
Speaker 5: like relatives and stuff like that because most times, traditionally
Speaker 5: they shared the same value, so you already knew that
Speaker 5: they had a suitable partner to begin with. It was
Speaker 5: already a suitable spouse. You didn't have to do the
Speaker 5: looking and stuff like that. But in regards to now,
Speaker 5: which I don't like. In today's time, it is like
Speaker 5: it's marriage is polished. It's polished and it's advertised as
Speaker 5: it's supposed to just be about love and romantics. And
Speaker 5: it's not like I'm a true believer in my opinion
Speaker 5: that you're marrying for yourself and others. I don't think
Speaker 5: that it's just for you. Yes, you can have personal fulfillment,
Speaker 5: but we're thinking about our current generation, the generation after us.
Speaker 5: Plus marriage does strengthen communities as well. We're looking at
Speaker 5: the community for the community, for your own personal community,
Speaker 5: your own personal community, like with your children and stuff
Speaker 5: like that, your children, your family, not necessarily the outside community.
Speaker 5: Just I'm talking about familiar backgrounds and familiar community. So
Speaker 5: for our own personal families, we're bringing families together, we're multiplying.
Speaker 5: When it comes to wealth, we're investing, we're saving, we're
Speaker 5: doing stuff like that. But we're also thinking about the
Speaker 5: future generation of our kids and our cousins and our and.
Speaker 3: We're talking about the health of just the family, the
Speaker 3: community we lead into finances. And so I want to
Speaker 3: ask you, then, do you think it's contradictory then for
Speaker 3: monogamy to be tied to marriage the way it is,
Speaker 3: because then that limits multiplying, That kind of limits the
Speaker 3: resources that you have because you're only supposed to be
Speaker 3: with one person. Clearly, me and WEEZI are ethically non monogamous.
Speaker 3: So with the Church being such a premise as to
Speaker 3: even why you said marriage is a thing I was
Speaker 3: going to do because I'm Christian, monogamy is also a
Speaker 3: Christian thing today, even though in the Bible that wasn't necessarily.
Speaker 3: A lot of people had multiple wow. In the Bible.
Speaker 5: In the Bible, polygamy was real in the Old Testament.
Speaker 5: Let me see Abraham, Jacob, King, David, King, Solomon all
Speaker 5: had multiple and they did it for the exact reasons
Speaker 5: that you highlighted previous. It's not until a New Testament
Speaker 5: where Jesus started referencing monogamous relationships. But the Bible never
Speaker 5: said polygamy was wrong. It never highlightedmy was wrong. What's
Speaker 5: the one for women? Why is there nowhere where women
Speaker 5: can have multiple hookands?
Speaker 1: There was times where women did. They did it.
Speaker 5: The reason why they prefer for men to have multiple
Speaker 5: wives is because they can duplicate more.
Speaker 1: They can have more children.
Speaker 5: You got one child, You got one woman with ten
Speaker 5: husbands and she got to carry a child for almost
Speaker 5: ten months, versus you have one man with multiple wives,
Speaker 5: and we can replicate. We can process this faster, we
Speaker 5: have more hands to work and do stuff like that.
Speaker 5: Although I am a Christian, okay, talk about it at
Speaker 5: my core I am, I still have to I can't
Speaker 5: be a walking hypocrite and say that the Bible did
Speaker 5: not reference that there was polygamy.
Speaker 1: It never said you cannot be a polygamous person.
Speaker 5: It just highlighted the complications of polygamy, like for instance,
Speaker 5: Jacob Abraham, their wives had tension, they had jealousy, they
Speaker 5: had rivalry, and yeah, King Solomon, it just it distracted
Speaker 5: him from God. But the Bible, when I have read
Speaker 5: that Bible throwing through, it never said you cannot be polygamoust.
Speaker 5: It's just it was referenced so much in a New
Speaker 5: Testament that this is the dynamic that is supposed to different.
Speaker 7: Things though, because polygamy is really especially like referencing a
Speaker 7: big like a show that's where America got to see
Speaker 7: sister wives polygamy, like it's a man taking care of
Speaker 7: these households. This is not ethical nominogamy.
Speaker 3: Okay, well if you're.
Speaker 5: If you're talking about ethical nonm monogamy, well that's that's
Speaker 5: different I'm looking at. I'm only highlighting polygamy because of
Speaker 5: what you right, well, and I want to keep it.
Speaker 5: If we're talking about ethical nominogama, we know there's different
Speaker 5: factors today.
Speaker 7: I want but also yeah, like I think it's hard
Speaker 7: to we're talking about marriage and nominogamy. So I just
Speaker 7: want to say, like, as someone who's nominogamoist, this is
Speaker 7: a sexual thing. This is sexual pleasures or even for
Speaker 7: the vanity of just having another lover, whatever it is.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry, but like to me and mind you, I've
Speaker 2: been in a throuble. I'm not saying I might not
Speaker 2: end up.
Speaker 7: With someone like that, but it's hard to cross the
Speaker 7: wires because polygamy really is to strengthen families, right, and
Speaker 7: I don't think ethical homenogamy is.
Speaker 1: It's not interesting.
Speaker 3: Even though I want this life. I wanted to add too,
Speaker 3: because we were talking about the church, the babies, right,
Speaker 3: the procreation, the legacy and all those things. The early
Speaker 3: Church held the position that if you can procreate, you
Speaker 3: must not refuse to procreate. But they always took the
Speaker 3: position that they would annull a marriage of a man
Speaker 3: could not have sex with his wife but they could
Speaker 3: not conceive. So I want to ask you now because
Speaker 3: it says early Christian Church was a trailblazer and arguing
Speaker 3: that marriage was not contingent on producing offspring. So if
Speaker 3: they're saying that if you were, if you're having sex
Speaker 3: or basically you can annul a marriage if your wife
Speaker 3: can't have a child, is there then an option where
Speaker 3: you guys see it where you no longer want to
Speaker 3: have a child, You no longer want to procreate, but your.
Speaker 2: Husband that you can annul a marriage if you can have.
Speaker 3: The church, it says the early Church.
Speaker 1: The book.
Speaker 3: I would look up the stories she told it in
Speaker 3: her book, but she says the early Church held the
Speaker 3: position that if you can procreate, you must not refuse
Speaker 3: to procreate. But they always took the position that they
Speaker 3: would annul a marriage. But man could not have sex
Speaker 3: with his wife. Oh, pretty much a woman keeping sex
Speaker 3: from is us?
Speaker 4: Then?
Speaker 3: Mind you?
Speaker 2: It goes into why in the early stage.
Speaker 1: That's not the first time the early stages, which is.
Speaker 3: Why you couldn't rape your wife. For so long in
Speaker 3: the States, there was no you. If you were married,
Speaker 3: you had to have sex with your husband. There was
Speaker 3: no way that he was taking it from you. I
Speaker 3: want to ask, though, another hypothetical real quick, because I'm
Speaker 3: seeing it with my friends because it's where I am.
Speaker 3: If you no longer wanted children, weasy If you no
Speaker 3: longer wanted children, but you found someone you got married,
Speaker 3: and they wanted to have children you're married, would you
Speaker 3: allow them then to have children with someone else?
Speaker 1: Would you?
Speaker 3: Because you love it? But you no longer. You have
Speaker 3: different family planning.
Speaker 2: You're not compatible though I want to marry, so.
Speaker 1: You believe you're not going But no, I'm gonna be
Speaker 1: honest with you.
Speaker 2: We have someone right now and they want kids and
Speaker 2: you don't.
Speaker 3: You're not already married. We believe that you can change
Speaker 3: your mind. If we get married, you're.
Speaker 2: No longer come if she decided to.
Speaker 3: Already.
Speaker 2: I understand being compatible. We all have different phases of being.
Speaker 3: We also are talking about marriage here, and I understand
Speaker 3: ending a marriage comes with a lot more when you're
Speaker 3: when when the paper and the ink is dried, right,
Speaker 3: So I understand compatibility. Family planning is a is literally
Speaker 3: something that can change over time between health. I may
Speaker 3: not be able to have your children anymore as a woman.
Speaker 3: Should I be able to keep a man from not
Speaker 3: pro creating because he wants to and I maybe not.
Speaker 3: I may physically not be able to anymore, or I
Speaker 3: just may not want children anymore? Should I be able
Speaker 3: to tell my husband he has to accept that decision
Speaker 3: as well? And I think that's very real. I have
Speaker 3: a lot of friends right now in the conversations regarding
Speaker 3: beasectomies and their health not being able to have children
Speaker 3: right now. So if I choose to marry you because
Speaker 3: I love you, because we we we financially we're on
Speaker 3: the same way. We love each other with each other,
Speaker 3: I just either can't or don't want children, and you
Speaker 3: do what does that look like? Should I be able
Speaker 3: to allow my partner to go have children with someone else?
Speaker 5: So then if we're putting it in this type of situation,
Speaker 5: if you didn't have children already, okay, and the family
Speaker 5: planning has changed, yes, there does become a lack of compatibility.
Speaker 5: This is where we start grid locking on perpetual problems
Speaker 5: where it feels like these arguments keep coming up because
Speaker 5: it takes a lot of sacrifice and compromise to be
Speaker 5: able to work through that. If your partner, if you
Speaker 5: don't have kids and they're like you said at the beginning,
Speaker 5: we could have kids and you changed your mind or
Speaker 5: you can't have them, they do have the right to leave.
Speaker 5: They don't have to accept what it is that you're saying.
Speaker 1: They have the right now. Of course, according to the Bible,
Speaker 1: you don't.
Speaker 5: But I'm just saying, okay, I'm speaking now as a
Speaker 5: clinician because I see the problems all the time right.
Speaker 5: If this person's like, I want children, you promise me
Speaker 5: in the beginning, you change your mind and they want that.
Speaker 5: Why do they have to miss out on the opportunity
Speaker 5: to be a parent because of that? Because then you
Speaker 5: change what you vow to. That's different.
Speaker 7: And what about you needs to compromise by letting them
Speaker 7: start another family if you know it wouldn't make you
Speaker 7: happy if you.
Speaker 1: Want when compromise, it makes you feel empty.
Speaker 3: Now I really fuck with you and everything else is there.
Speaker 3: I just don't personally want to be a parent. I think, yeah,
Speaker 3: I understand compromise and sacrifice. But if I really love you,
Speaker 3: I think I would be open to you.
Speaker 5: But built I would say, okay. If I don't want
Speaker 5: to carry, that's different. If I don't, I don't want
Speaker 5: to care.
Speaker 3: Want to be a parent, and as a partner, I
Speaker 3: really want you to be happy and you really want
Speaker 3: to be a dad and I don't. I can't or
Speaker 3: don't want to allow you to be a dad.
Speaker 5: But I want to be with you, And so I
Speaker 5: look at it this way. If you want a child
Speaker 5: and I don't want to carry, then I can say surrogacy,
Speaker 5: We can try that. But if I absolutely just don't
Speaker 5: want children. But I this is the promise I made
Speaker 5: when you decided to marry me. I put that commitment
Speaker 5: out there, and this is one of the reasons why
Speaker 5: you married me. You said I would be able to
Speaker 5: create a family, and I took that away from you.
Speaker 3: That it is.
Speaker 5: I honestly feel like it's your responsibility then to let
Speaker 5: them go and actually have the family and actually honor
Speaker 5: their values like they want to. I don't feel like
Speaker 5: the first aria constant sacrifice their values because.
Speaker 7: Of your own selfishness. So you have a family in
Speaker 7: a marriage, whether there's kids or not. Now you need
Speaker 7: to go create another family outside of my bond to
Speaker 7: satisfy it. And I have to allow it because I
Speaker 7: don't want kids anymore.
Speaker 1: Oh so if they already have kids, no, I'm saying, Okay.
Speaker 7: You said you're married, and you decide, or he decides
Speaker 7: he wants kids. We already have a family, and you're saying,
Speaker 7: I let them, fuck bitches, I'll go let them have
Speaker 7: a kid.
Speaker 1: No.
Speaker 7: I don't want some bump ass nigga like fucking building
Speaker 7: families on some nick Cannon shit to just be outside.
Speaker 2: I don't think it would be that. I think that
Speaker 2: that's literally what it is.
Speaker 5: Like, if you you're not going to sleep nobody else,
Speaker 5: that's different. But if, like I said, if you just
Speaker 5: don't want to carry and I'm like, okay, yeah, but
Speaker 5: that means the kids wanting kids, and yes, different, Yeah,
Speaker 5: that's true. Yeah, So if you don't want kids, you
Speaker 5: don't want them in the house. So if you don't
Speaker 5: let them have kids with someone else, he's building a
Speaker 5: bond and starting a family outside of his home. No,
Speaker 5: we can't do that. That's going to create problems anyway.
Speaker 5: You should never do that. But I do understand if
Speaker 5: a person says that they changed their mind and they
Speaker 5: don't have kids, I understand if they they're like, yeah,
Speaker 5: it's time to just walk away from this. But you
Speaker 5: can't force anyone to just accept. Well, no, they can
Speaker 5: accept what you're the position that you have doesn't mean
Speaker 5: they approve of it. I can accept that you're saying
Speaker 5: that you don't want to have kids, right, but I
Speaker 5: don't approve of it. It doesn't align with my value.
Speaker 2: But it's bummy though, Mandy, I'm making home.
Speaker 3: I'm not talking about the nick, but he's single out
Speaker 3: here making a whole bunch of he's not married. He's
Speaker 3: not married to any of those, which what I'm saying,
Speaker 3: he's not, but.
Speaker 1: He's still breaking up homes and family.
Speaker 3: I'm very aware of that. But there are a lot
Speaker 3: of women, my friends included, that would be fine with
Speaker 3: a sperm donor or co parenting. I'm not saying that
Speaker 3: he would be creating a broken home if the other
Speaker 3: person is accepting of you. There's a lot of ways
Speaker 3: in which And that's what I think I really like
Speaker 3: about having these conversations because yes, from the outside of
Speaker 3: looking in you, you could sit here and be like
Speaker 3: they're creating a whole bunch of broke I think it's
Speaker 3: what we're seeing right now with Kim Newton and Jasmine
Speaker 3: and everyone saying, ooh, you let your man go out
Speaker 3: and fuck other people. It's what your friends said about you.
Speaker 3: There's all these outside opinions, right, but if we agreed
Speaker 3: to this dynamic, it doesn't have to be that.
Speaker 1: But sex.
Speaker 7: Sex is not putting another life in the world if
Speaker 7: I could, if a consequences.
Speaker 5: I think with these conversations, we keep them, we think
Speaker 5: we're going deeper, we keep them surface level. Look at
Speaker 5: the damage that it creates when you make a decision
Speaker 5: to go outside of your marital home to co parents
Speaker 5: somewhere else. Even if you to agree to it, you
Speaker 5: now have a child who is living under somebody else's roof.
Speaker 5: There is going to be some forms of psychological damage
Speaker 5: to you and to the person that you're married to.
Speaker 5: Even if they say in the moment to satisfy you,
Speaker 5: I agree to it, once they see that you are
Speaker 5: fathering another child outside of them and you have to
Speaker 5: actually co parent with another woman and there is still
Speaker 5: some form of investment that you have to put into
Speaker 5: that home. A person can say all day they won't care.
Speaker 5: The jealousy, the insecurities, the doubts will start to show
Speaker 5: that that's a deep connection you build with somebody, like
Speaker 5: you do. Bro, When I dated a man, he had
Speaker 5: a six year old, which that's enough time for them
Speaker 5: to you know, yeah, I remember genuinely not even feeling
Speaker 5: jealous of her, but just like wow, that's special. Like
Speaker 5: I don't know how I can compete with this moment
Speaker 5: when there's a birthday party, when there's something going on,
Speaker 5: like I feel like you can't really break that.
Speaker 1: Maybe you can't, but maybe.
Speaker 5: Or child you can't break family, and then that natural
Speaker 5: competition in comparisoness inside of you as a woman, you
Speaker 5: can't run from there.
Speaker 7: Here's the other thing, the thing with your friends with
Speaker 7: sperm donors or whatever. I believe at least eighty percent
Speaker 7: of those women he had kids with would love to
Speaker 7: be when the Cannon in a romantic capacity. Absolutely, maybe
Speaker 7: even a hundred bro I don't believe that sperm donor
Speaker 7: shit with them. I believe they got a rich dude,
Speaker 7: They'll take care of it, and they were like, okay,
Speaker 7: fuck it. But no, there's no way that these women
Speaker 7: don't have him come into their house for the night,
Speaker 7: spend time with their kids, and not want to emotionally connect.
Speaker 2: I get that, but I do just see and I'm
Speaker 2: aware that.
Speaker 3: With the conversations, there are women that want to be
Speaker 3: mothers more than in a relationship, and there are women
Speaker 3: that want kids and are finally getting their romantic relationships
Speaker 3: outside of who the father of their kids are.
Speaker 7: There is the perfect testimony to someone that made that
Speaker 7: decision correctly. You wanted me to believe that Nick Cannon
Speaker 7: wasn't fucking them on a regular and do this is
Speaker 7: not just so transactional with these girls.
Speaker 5: The only way that people can actually cope with that
Speaker 5: is to compartmentalize, and we know that's not healthie. So yeah,
Speaker 5: for those specific people, the only ones. The only way
Speaker 5: you can do that, because you're still coping by compartmentalization
Speaker 5: is to put somebody put that situation in a box
Speaker 5: and emotionally detached from it.
Speaker 1: It's not healthy. Eventually it's going to Yes, it's not healthy.
Speaker 5: Apartmentalizing is not how partmentalization is not healthy. Interesting, You
Speaker 5: are putting people in mental spaces, You are putting them
Speaker 5: in boxes. A lot of times people use it as
Speaker 5: coping mechanisms or to keep themselves emostly detached from what
Speaker 5: it is.
Speaker 7: It's unhealthy, bro, can you imagine how these women feel.
Speaker 7: I don't know how many black, full black children he has.
Speaker 7: I'm going to leave that comment to myself.
Speaker 1: Maybe at work.
Speaker 7: But Nick Cannon made all these black babies, ended up
Speaker 7: with the white woman, Bree, and they all have to
Speaker 7: watch these broken black families while he's with this fucking
Speaker 7: white lady that he had a kid with, biracial whatever.
Speaker 1: Now the sun is black, but like all of this
Speaker 1: is toxic.
Speaker 7: How would you feel as Nick Cannon's thirteen year old
Speaker 7: knowing that he ended up with the white woman and
Speaker 7: not your fucking mom.
Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? All of that is.
Speaker 3: A white mom and a black dad, So that the
Speaker 3: whole situation that way.
Speaker 1: I would hope it that way.
Speaker 2: But if you had a black mother and that father,
Speaker 2: literally she didn't have no, he didn't have no babies
Speaker 2: with no black They're all good.
Speaker 3: Can you pull up the the the women they're all
Speaker 3: like Rachel and Latina, one of they're not. No, there
Speaker 3: might be bro. He did not make a whole baby
Speaker 3: black women. That was the whole conversation too.
Speaker 1: With one black woman, she still got a watch them
Speaker 1: with the white lady.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm gonna be honest.
Speaker 7: The reason I want to get married is to strengthen
Speaker 7: black families. Like most of my married friends aren't black.
Speaker 7: Like I love seeing black love and a serious commitment
Speaker 7: to that way. Like I'm so happy my friends have
Speaker 7: recently gotten married that are black. They're young or whatever.
Speaker 7: But nah, brou like that shit is wrong to me
Speaker 7: that nigga sits up there with a turbine and be
Speaker 7: whole tepping and with this white lady and had twelve kids.
Speaker 1: No Lenisia.
Speaker 3: Yeah he has one black baby mom, Okay, Lenicia, and.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just don't think she's well Mariah Carey.
Speaker 3: They're all white women.
Speaker 1: There's no way.
Speaker 3: I just bro I'm telling you, well anyway are Latina.
Speaker 3: There's Mariah Carey and Lenicia. The rest of them are
Speaker 3: latinathotic or mix girl. The point is that and even
Speaker 3: Maria be putting all his lace front and couse playing
Speaker 3: black lady. And now if his daughter or son is
Speaker 3: watching that, I'm telling you it's gonna fuck them up
Speaker 3: for life.
Speaker 4: Up.
Speaker 1: Yeah. It literally makes you feel.
Speaker 5: Everybody that's involved in that situation, the mothers, the children,
Speaker 5: even Nick Cannon, they all gonna be messed up in
Speaker 5: the hid.
Speaker 1: Nick definitely gonna be messed up in tenures.
Speaker 3: Well, y'all, if you're messed up in your head or
Speaker 3: your relationship is going in a healthy direction where you're
Speaker 3: seeking out marriage and all the things, can you let
Speaker 3: our audience know, Kitty, what you specialize in, how people
Speaker 3: can book you for sessions or get you on a payroll,
Speaker 3: because I know you ain't, But also kind of the
Speaker 3: books and guides and stuff that you also offer.
Speaker 5: I specialize in DBT so dialect with behavior with just
Speaker 5: interpersonal and interpersonal communication. So it's focused on communication and
Speaker 5: strengthening relationships. Fine, you go to Kitty Rose dot com
Speaker 5: where you follow me a kiddy.
Speaker 7: Katy Rose is not a sex toy, you know what,
Speaker 7: Kitty roads dot com, it's gonna take me to d
Speaker 7: VT and not a fucking virator.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: Hearing your name is.
Speaker 1: Saying your name doesn't made me take it. But just
Speaker 1: hearing Kitty Rose dot com. They here, they're here, talk
Speaker 1: to me, kitty, and they make it sexual.
Speaker 3: I'm like, it's not you talking.
Speaker 7: To the cat said your podcast name. As we started,
Speaker 7: I wanted to make the joke, but I was like, now.
Speaker 2: We have our before, it's okay, talk to me.
Speaker 1: It's okay.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 2: It is very sexual.
Speaker 1: What's to a person who has a sexual brain, y'all?
Speaker 1: I do know where I'm man.
Speaker 5: It used to be horrible decisions that y'all gonna have
Speaker 5: to start breaking apartmentalized.
Speaker 1: There you go, I couldn't do it.
Speaker 3: Well, y'all. Make sure you click the link in our bio,
Speaker 3: make sure you follow, make sure you book sessions, make
Speaker 3: sure you purchase the books. There's a lot of options
Speaker 3: on the site as well, and catch kitty rolls on
Speaker 3: tour with's conversations whenever they be in and out and around,
Speaker 3: god damn everywhere. And y'all, if you want the sex,
Speaker 3: if you want to talk to our kiddies, you can
Speaker 3: support us and watch over on our Patreon that's patreon
Speaker 3: dot com backslash Horrible Decisions where we really get into
Speaker 3: the nitty gritty. So this is like, this is like
Speaker 3: the things that you have to talk about before you
Speaker 3: sit here and bust it wide open to these niggas, So.
Speaker 2: Go listen over on Patreon.
Speaker 3: That's patreon dot com backslash Horrible Decisions. However, this right here,
Speaker 3: you were tuned in to decisions, decisions until next time.
Speaker 1: By my