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Speaker 1: It was this discovery of me that those who are

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Speaker 1: interested in you in this business, by and large are

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Speaker 1: interested in taking advantage of the level that you are

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Speaker 1: at when you don't need them, as opposed to offering

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Speaker 1: you a new step up to the next level.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to Off the Cuff, my personal anti anxiety antidote.

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Speaker 2: One of the best parts of this podcast for me

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Speaker 2: is getting to interview really creative people. I admire people

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Speaker 2: who can create their own opportunities and carve out their

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Speaker 2: own spaces, people who make genuinely new stuff, not the

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Speaker 2: stuff they're told to make to climb the ladder of success.

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Speaker 2: And it's especially nice when those people are rewarded for

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Speaker 2: that creativity, when that works, when that creativity and ingenuity

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Speaker 2: and sense.

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Speaker 3: Of self pays off.

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Speaker 2: Today's guest is Mark Duplas, whose career has modeled this

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Speaker 2: creative arc in a way that's super impressive and frankly,

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Speaker 2: I'm jealous. He's a filmmaker, actor, writer, musician, writer, director,

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Speaker 2: star of The Puffy Chair, co writer and star of

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Speaker 2: the Creep Horror series, Star of the League, Emmy winning

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Speaker 2: producer of the incredible documentary Wild Wild Country, and Emmy

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Speaker 2: nominated actor of the Morning Show.

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Speaker 3: Welcome Mark to Plus.

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Speaker 1: Well, thank you, and you just made my mother so

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Speaker 1: happy with that introduction. Send this to her and good boy,

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Speaker 1: that's my baby.

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Speaker 4: Boy.

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Speaker 2: Well, I really do admire your career arc and we

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Speaker 2: want to get into it. But to start a lot

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Speaker 2: of guests that I've had on here, I've known a

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Speaker 2: little bit or maybe even a lot.

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Speaker 3: We don't know each other.

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Speaker 2: We don't know each other, but I did consult on

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Speaker 2: The Morning Show before you came on it.

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Speaker 1: Oh.

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Speaker 3: I was brought in by Apple early.

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Speaker 2: When the show was first being conceived and it was

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Speaker 2: meant to be a comedy, and so I was brought

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Speaker 2: out to La to join the writer's room and helping

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Speaker 2: to like round out Reese's character because she was like

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Speaker 2: a center right, you know, that's right like me, and

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Speaker 2: Hollywood doesn't know how to write conservative and so I

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Speaker 2: mostly told like scenario stories.

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Speaker 3: They'd be like, what would happen in this scenario?

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Speaker 2: And I had consulted for Aaron Sorkins the newsroom as well,

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Speaker 2: so helping with verisimilitude in the media landscape was really fun.

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Speaker 2: But of course then the Morning Show morphed into a

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Speaker 2: drama mostly, but you were you were apprehensive about taking

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Speaker 2: this role, were you not?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for a number of reasons. I think the first

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Speaker 1: was more of a pragmatic consideration of you know, I

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Speaker 1: run my own company and I have to be available

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Speaker 1: for them. And when you take a job like there's

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Speaker 1: a big job like this, particularly with Apple, you know,

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Speaker 1: it introduces a new overlord in my life, and so

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Speaker 1: that when they say jump, I have to say how high,

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Speaker 1: and particularly I have to say when. So I had

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Speaker 1: sort of promised myself and a bunch of people, like,

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Speaker 1: you know what, my days of doing long term acting

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Speaker 1: TV gigs where I'm not the boss, I think those

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Speaker 1: are numbered, you know. But what I had an accounted

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Speaker 1: for is the size of my own ego because when

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Speaker 1: when a big job, when Aiston calls and Witherspoon calls

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Speaker 1: and Steve Carrell's riding shotgun, you know, I'm a human

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Speaker 1: I'm a human being, and I'm like, I get to

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Speaker 1: hang out with all my favorite stars that I've you know,

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Speaker 1: all the men and women I've been crushing on, you know,

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Speaker 1: for years. So I had to say yes. But you know,

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Speaker 1: I think there were other considerations I had about the show,

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Speaker 1: because you know, it's such really anathema to everything I

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Speaker 1: believe in terms of the creative process and what I do.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, keep it cheap, keep it small, and keep

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Speaker 1: it on the air, you know. And this thing was

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Speaker 1: just this bloated monson had to be so massively successful

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Speaker 1: for it to work, and go figure it. It does work.

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Speaker 1: And I'm so glad that I took the gig and

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Speaker 1: didn't allow my preconceptions or fears to stop me, because

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Speaker 1: there have been so many wonderful things that have happened.

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Speaker 1: Not only you know, just the accolades, all that stuff

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Speaker 1: has been great, But honestly, I've learned so much watching

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Speaker 1: that machine operate together. Yeah, yeah, and can apply to

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Speaker 1: my own life. And and it's just it's just a

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Speaker 1: wonderful job. Everybody is so nice. And I know you're

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Speaker 1: supposed to come on podcasts and say how nice everybody is,

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Speaker 1: but I really really mean it, Yeah, and I mean

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Speaker 1: it in a surprised way of you know, big international

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Speaker 1: celebrities everywhere you turn. It should it should be honestly

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Speaker 1: a shit show of personality disorders. It should be awful,

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Speaker 1: you know, And and it's really friendly and lovely and

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Speaker 1: basically it's the greatest day job anybody like make it

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Speaker 1: ask for because I you know, it makes my face

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Speaker 1: more popular on an international flaught, it provides seed capital

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Speaker 1: for my own company. Right, It's just it's great.

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Speaker 3: It's great, great all around.

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Speaker 2: The relationship between producer and anchor is very special, sometimes

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Speaker 2: very fraught. It's honestly very hard to capture in fiction

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Speaker 2: or a scripted material because it's it's both so codependent, yes,

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Speaker 2: and sometimes very unhealthy. But also if it works, it's

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Speaker 2: the best relationship you have, like better than any personal

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Speaker 2: or professional relationship, because this person knows you so well

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Speaker 2: that it's not just a work relationship. It becomes, like

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Speaker 2: I said, one of your most important relationships. How did

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Speaker 2: you go about trying to capture this complicated relationship.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I would love to say that I have

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Speaker 1: some sort of formula and we followed it and worked.

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Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of luck and Jen and

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Speaker 1: I having to really really like each other. And I

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Speaker 1: think that's the most important thing of this is that,

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Speaker 1: you know, the scenes are full of us just being

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Speaker 1: horrific to each other, mostly horrific to me. Let's fix it.

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Speaker 1: But what's beneath all of that is how much Jen

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Speaker 1: and I actually love each other. So that little formula

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Speaker 1: is pretty simple, and I don't want to be reductive

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Speaker 1: about it, but that's a big, big part of it.

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Speaker 1: And then I think that I do have some experience

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Speaker 1: with a type of relationship like this because of how

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Speaker 1: long I have worked in lockstep with my brother as

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Speaker 1: my best friend, my brother, my creative partner. The ugly sides, yes, Jay,

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Speaker 1: the ugly sides of ourselves that we've shown each other,

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Speaker 1: and then you keep returning back and you feel that

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Speaker 1: despite what you showed, you are still loved provide. It's

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Speaker 1: the kind of incredible safety that you need to survive

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Speaker 1: and sort of a Machiavelian environment like yeah, independent film

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Speaker 1: in my life or in this case, you know, live

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Speaker 1: news television, you know. Yeah, So that that really resonated

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Speaker 1: with me. When you've been horrific and somebody shows up

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Speaker 1: and they're still there for you, Yeah, that's that. That

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Speaker 1: to me is a secret ingredient in the recipe of

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Speaker 1: you know, that that strange codependence that keeps on It

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Speaker 1: takes a licking and keeps on ticking.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it really is.

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Speaker 2: And I've I've had some terrible producers but I've mostly

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Speaker 2: had some wonderful producers.

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Speaker 3: Some of them are like my family, basically family.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but those relationships can get so tricky because as

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Speaker 2: an anchor or host, you don't want to feel undermined,

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Speaker 2: and you can get very paranoid about what this person

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Speaker 2: who controls your fate is really trying to do. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it can really play mind games with you. And I

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Speaker 2: think you guys do a really good job of, thank you,

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Speaker 2: of capturing that.

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Speaker 1: It's fun. It's a fun one.

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Speaker 2: So through the lens of the morning show, what has

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Speaker 2: it made you think about the news?

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Speaker 1: That was a great question, you know. The first the

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Speaker 1: first thing that really occurred to me when I started

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Speaker 1: playing this role and getting immersed in this world, which

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Speaker 1: you know, of course is just a mere fact simile

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Speaker 1: of what you guys do. Was just shocked at how

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Speaker 1: high the stress levels must be because of the live

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Speaker 1: element of it. You know, I really told myself, like,

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Speaker 1: I'm a producer, I'm a producer of independent films. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I know what it's like to play Kate, difficult personalities,

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Speaker 1: to try and bring the whole three ring circus, you know,

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Speaker 1: in clack Quadjet and all those kinds of things. And

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Speaker 1: then immediately I was like, oh, but I have.

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Speaker 2: Take two yeah, and those live audience of people watching

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Speaker 2: in real time.

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Speaker 1: You don't have take two yes, And that just really

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Speaker 1: shocked me. Seem like an obvious thing, you know. So

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Speaker 1: that was like the first thing that I sort of

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Speaker 1: walked away with, you know. And then you know, the

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Speaker 1: second thing that I really loved, And this is something

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Speaker 1: I can identify with a lot, is that it's very

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Speaker 1: very easy when you're in the middle of a flawed ecosystem, politics,

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Speaker 1: the news, Hollywood, to convince yourself that you are the

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Speaker 1: last bastion of integrity, because all you do is you

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Speaker 1: see the flaws, and so the way that you operate

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Speaker 1: is like, well, I'm going to be either the one

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Speaker 1: that saves it or it's up to me in order

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Speaker 1: to do this right. And so it's the easiest way.

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Speaker 1: It's well, it just it feels very obvious, you know,

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Speaker 1: And so you get on your high horse very very quickly, right,

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Speaker 1: And I think that some blinders kind of show up,

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Speaker 1: at least in my opinion, of like, you know, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm doing the great work and it must be the

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Speaker 1: right thing to do because everything next to me is

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Speaker 1: so the wrong thing to do, and so you get

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Speaker 1: blinded as to the own cracks in your own morality.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's what's so fun about my character there.

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Speaker 1: He is, he really is in some ways, you know,

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Speaker 1: in a show of morally questionable people and behavior, a

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Speaker 1: little bit of the moral center. But he's not clean, right, well,

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Speaker 1: no one is, No one is, you know. So that's

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Speaker 1: that's the part that's so fun for me to play.

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Speaker 1: And like, yes, what is it like when awareness starts

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Speaker 1: to creep in on you that, like you really do

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Speaker 1: imagine yourself, you know, the Clinicewood riding in on a

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Speaker 1: horse to save the broken town of News and you realize, yes, man.

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Speaker 3: I'm part of the problem.

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Speaker 1: I'm part of the problem.

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Speaker 3: Am I the problem? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I love it. I love that.

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Speaker 2: Oh, I mean that's so brilliant too, because maybe it's

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Speaker 2: obvious to you, but I feel like inside the business,

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Speaker 2: this is not obvious.

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Speaker 3: And you're right about the blinders.

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Speaker 2: And it takes maybe an election, or it takes maybe

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Speaker 2: some kind of day six Macina event, or or just

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Speaker 2: some you know, some introspection or ratings crashes, whatever it

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Speaker 2: takes for you to say, oh maybe I am not

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Speaker 2: as morally superior as I think I am. And maybe

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Speaker 2: I'm doing this in a way that isn't actually great.

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Speaker 1: I think that that that to me, you know, and

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Speaker 1: this really is where my reflection takes hold, is that

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Speaker 1: to me makes really compelling television, you know. And so

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Speaker 1: I'm only going to be able to understand the news, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, so far as the fact sim lady of

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Speaker 1: a TV show allows me. But but it keeps coming back. Wow,

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Speaker 1: what a fun character to play, What a fun world

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Speaker 1: to play in, and changing and moving so quickly, just

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Speaker 1: when you think you've got a handle on what might

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Speaker 1: be working, all of a sudden, you know, oh no, no,

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Speaker 1: Now we're moving into the streaming service and plus and

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Speaker 1: this and everything, and then and then these two people

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Speaker 1: that I trusted are fired now, and it's like, yes, were.

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Speaker 2: The show I had is gone jettison because we're doing

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Speaker 2: something else now.

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Speaker 3: But I was doing fine? What happened?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, that's a bitch. That's the bitch of I

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Speaker 2: have a.

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Speaker 1: Lot of I have a lot of empathy. Yeah, yeah

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Speaker 1: we could. I'll take it.

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Speaker 2: Two Emmy nominations. We're going to get into your independent

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Speaker 2: film career. But did you think you'd get here, nominated

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Speaker 2: for Emmy's in a big role in a big budget

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Speaker 2: streaming series with a list movie stars, Apple backing like,

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Speaker 2: this is not where you envisioned being.

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Speaker 1: No, it's not where I envisioned being You're absolutely right,

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Speaker 1: But it's a little bit of a securitist journey. And

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Speaker 1: I won't suck up too much time saying this, but

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Speaker 1: I just want to be a little honest about it

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Speaker 1: because I don't like false humility. So, you know, I

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Speaker 1: came up in the independent sphere and it was definitely

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Speaker 1: this sense of, Oh my god, I was making three

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Speaker 1: dollars movies in the kitchen with my brother. You know,

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Speaker 1: I'm just so grateful to be here, right. That's like

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Speaker 1: the first phase, you know. But then I'm around for

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Speaker 1: a little while, you know. Yeah, And if I'm being honest,

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Speaker 1: there was a part of me, you know, in my

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Speaker 1: mid thirties doing shows like Togetherness for HBO. Yeah, where

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Speaker 1: I was kind of like, bro, where's my fucking Emmy?

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Speaker 3: I killed this.

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Speaker 1: I killed this and it kind of snuck up on

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Speaker 1: me and mister Ego got tapped again, you know. So

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Speaker 1: there was that phase for me and I felt like,

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Speaker 1: oh God, I guess they just don't see the value

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Speaker 1: of me. Oh well, you know, so that happened for

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Speaker 1: a couple of years, and then what happened is I

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Speaker 1: was just like, you know what, this is stupid. Award

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Speaker 1: shows are just ridiculous. It's ego bullshit. Just let it

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Speaker 1: go and it doesn't matter at all. So by the

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Speaker 1: time it did come around for the Morning show, I

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Speaker 1: was a surprised and then be perfectly willing to throw

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Speaker 1: out my philosophy that awards show were bullshit to embrace

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Speaker 1: them as the greatest thing that ever happened, because you

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Speaker 1: gotta be fluid, you gotta adapt, you got to adapt. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so that's kind of what happened to me there. So

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Speaker 1: I came, I came full circle on it, and it

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Speaker 1: was a surprise and I loved it.

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Speaker 3: It was great. Right, well, let's go back. I always

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Speaker 3: like to ask what kind of kid were you I was?

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Speaker 1: I think people would be a little surprised, knowing me

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Speaker 1: now how I was as a kid. I was very,

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Speaker 1: very brash. It was extremely confident walking into any room

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Speaker 1: and almost borderline like a bully, just southern male like

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Speaker 1: temper driven kid, and there was no limitter on the behavior,

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Speaker 1: you know. And and I hadn't learned yet that well,

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Speaker 1: that kid might not win so much in the world.

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Speaker 1: That's not kid's not going to win in every room.

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Speaker 1: And it wasn't until I sort of realized, Okay, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to try to become an artists. I have no

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Speaker 1: connections to this industry. If I am going to do this,

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Speaker 1: I can't really walk into a room like wreck at Ralph.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to need to learn how to read rooms.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to need to learn how to shape shift

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Speaker 1: a little bit and people please and do all these things,

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Speaker 1: which is a dangerous, slippery slope, but it's probably something

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Speaker 1: you can identify with as a woman coming up in

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Speaker 1: a male dominated industry. Yes, you kind of you kind

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Speaker 1: of feel like, if I'm going to make my way

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Speaker 1: here as someone who's not connected, I'm gonna have to

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Speaker 1: shape shift a little bit, you know. So I learned

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Speaker 1: that and that that can be a little dangerous to

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Speaker 1: the soul. So I wouldn't say that that was a,

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Speaker 1: you know, a particularly clean way to do it. But

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Speaker 1: I did those things, and so I think it helped me.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, I think you'd be if you went and

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Speaker 1: saw a video footage, you'd be like, whoa Mark duplus

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Speaker 1: was a little insensitive and braddy and had a real

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Speaker 1: rock and temper.

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Speaker 2: Like, well, I don't have any I didn't find any videos,

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Speaker 2: but I did find.

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Speaker 1: Oh look at that man, you yeah, that's senior high school.

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Speaker 3: Mm hm, I found out what a hunk. I mean,

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Speaker 3: you look good to me.

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Speaker 1: All right, I'll take it this.

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Speaker 3: Was you were on the newspaper.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, baby, I'm holding up pictures of from Mark's yearbook

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Speaker 2: for I'm a newsman.

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Speaker 3: Tell I looked around. I mean you did. I looked

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Speaker 3: through your entire yearbook.

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Speaker 2: And you did a lot of stuff, but you weren't

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Speaker 2: like front and center, and you.

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Speaker 1: Look at my yearbook and you're not going to be

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Speaker 1: like this guy is going to go out in the world.

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Speaker 1: My high school is not a microcosm of the domination

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Speaker 1: to come. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. By the time I

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Speaker 1: was eighteen, I went to an all boys Catholic school

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Speaker 1: in New Orleans, very conservative, very rigid with academics. Very

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Speaker 1: good for me, like because I was really really creative

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Speaker 1: and I and I had that to fight against and

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Speaker 1: it was nice to have that little you know, I

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Speaker 1: don't want to do my Latin five homework, I want

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Speaker 1: to write this song. And Yeah, but the rigid of

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Speaker 1: my and the discipline that I received from that school

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Speaker 1: and taking that rigor and applying it to the artistic

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Speaker 1: process is probably besides my parents loving me the way

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Speaker 1: they did and supporting me the way they did, and

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Speaker 1: my brother being such a good big brother, that's like

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Speaker 1: probably in the top three things that helped make me

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Speaker 1: who I am. Yeah, it was really helpful.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't tell from year book, but were you? It

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Speaker 2: didn't seem like correct me if I'm wrong. Didn't seem

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Speaker 2: like you were in Chicago or a funny thing happened

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Speaker 2: on the way to the forum.

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Speaker 1: I wasn't.

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Speaker 3: You didn't do drums.

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Speaker 1: I didn't do any of that stuff. No, I was,

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Speaker 1: you know, primarily a musician in the first phase of

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Speaker 1: my life. I loved music. It was my first love.

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Speaker 1: And while I did go to film school and study

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Speaker 1: those things, when I went to I went to University

335
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Speaker 1: of Texas in Austin, Yeah, and got an education in it,

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Speaker 1: and I loved it and it was really good for

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Speaker 1: me and my brother and I used to work a

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Speaker 1: lot as editors, and I used to edit. I used

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Speaker 1: to edit a church television show in Austin. From I

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00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:08,840
Speaker 1: took the night shift from like nine pm till seven

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Speaker 1: am on a Monday and a Tuesday, And over the

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Speaker 1: course of those twenty hours, I would make enough to

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Speaker 1: pay my rent and then the rest of the time

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Speaker 1: I would spend as a musician. So really until my

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Speaker 1: mid twenties, you know, I was a touring singer songwriter.

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Speaker 1: I was in indie rock bands, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, tell me talk about small hands.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so that was a I made a record when

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Speaker 1: I was like twenty one years old. This pretty much

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Speaker 1: sums it up. My friends called me the Indigo Boy.

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Speaker 1: It was a singer city, it was a it was

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Speaker 1: a it was a very earnest singer songwriter record, you know.

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Speaker 1: And I loved Sean Colvin and the Indigo Girls, and

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Speaker 1: you know, it's just that's that's what I was doing.

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Speaker 2: Well, you could have been the Indigo Boys. Did your

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Speaker 2: brother no part of this?

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Speaker 1: He didn't want to. Yeah, he was done with that

358
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Speaker 1: at this point. Yeah. This was like nineteen ninety eight,

359
00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:55,960
Speaker 1: you know, Lil a Fair tours were out there. This

360
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Speaker 1: is what we were doing. Yeah, And but it was

361
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Speaker 1: it was also it's part and Arsel with the way

362
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Speaker 1: that I ended up building my film career, which was there.

363
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Speaker 1: I've had an inherent impatience in me my whole life,

364
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Speaker 1: which has been helpful to also dovetail with this sense

365
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Speaker 1: of independency and just doing things my own way. Because yes,

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Speaker 1: there was no one giving me a record deal at

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Speaker 1: the time. So I was like, well, the technology is

368
00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:25,439
Speaker 1: here now, Like, I can buy a tape machine record

369
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Speaker 1: this record. I can press a thousand CDs. It'll cost

370
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Speaker 1: me like two grand I will book my own tour.

371
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Speaker 1: I like traded in my car and got an old

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Speaker 1: conversion van and I just lived in my van for

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Speaker 1: four months and traveled around the country and made my

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Speaker 1: own version of being on tour. And that was critical

375
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Speaker 1: for me, being like can I do this? I dropped

376
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Speaker 1: out of college for a semester and I did it.

377
00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,399
Speaker 1: And that taught me like, oh wow, if I just

378
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Speaker 1: put my head down and keep banging on these doors,

379
00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:58,679
Speaker 1: I will be able to get through, you know. And

380
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Speaker 1: it was a wild time. I talked to my daughters

381
00:20:01,640 --> 00:20:03,280
Speaker 1: about it all the time. I daught I was sixteen

382
00:20:03,320 --> 00:20:05,959
Speaker 1: and twelve, and you know, they're having their figuring out

383
00:20:06,000 --> 00:20:08,679
Speaker 1: their relationships to technology. Right now. And you know, I

384
00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:11,320
Speaker 1: had no smartphone out there. I can only find these

385
00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 1: venues by a Rand McNally map that I had.

386
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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I.

387
00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:17,920
Speaker 1: Would, you know, sleep in my van and I would

388
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Speaker 1: sometimes go three to four days without speaking to anyone.

389
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Speaker 1: And I've had all of this reflective time with myself

390
00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:26,760
Speaker 1: because I didn't have this device that I could just

391
00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,359
Speaker 1: pick up and distract myself. I just had to be

392
00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:33,399
Speaker 1: with myself and I think it really helped develop me

393
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Speaker 1: as a person.

394
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Speaker 2: But how do you get the courage to just go

395
00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:41,240
Speaker 2: out and say, I'm just going to go do it.

396
00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:42,600
Speaker 2: I'm going to go do it. I'm going to go

397
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:43,440
Speaker 2: make it myself.

398
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Speaker 1: Part of it is that brash, cocky kid that I

399
00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:49,280
Speaker 1: am in my DNA, but a huge part of it

400
00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:52,080
Speaker 1: is the way that I was raised, which you know,

401
00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:54,959
Speaker 1: it's not perfect because it has its downfall, but I

402
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,840
Speaker 1: was given very strong message for my parents, You're incredible,

403
00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:03,960
Speaker 1: you can do any thing. I love you. And then

404
00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,520
Speaker 1: also the wonderful privileges I had of growing up middle

405
00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:13,879
Speaker 1: class and having no high school or college debt, so

406
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,879
Speaker 1: I wasn't in a hole already. So subconsciously I had

407
00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:18,720
Speaker 1: this feeling, well, I can just go, I can just

408
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:23,199
Speaker 1: spring forward, you know. So that was very helpful. But

409
00:21:23,240 --> 00:21:25,840
Speaker 1: that confidence boost I got from my parents, you know,

410
00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:28,639
Speaker 1: I heard that voice in the back of my head. Now,

411
00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,040
Speaker 1: the problem with that approach is when you're twenty four

412
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:36,879
Speaker 1: and you're not killing it, you get real down on

413
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:39,360
Speaker 1: yourself because you're, like my.

414
00:21:39,359 --> 00:21:43,440
Speaker 3: Mom told me, I was also, mom, what the fuck

415
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:46,280
Speaker 3: making it?

416
00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,720
Speaker 1: And you feel like you're disappointing everyone you love, and

417
00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:54,760
Speaker 1: you feel like you are somehow wasting this like beautiful

418
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,080
Speaker 1: life you've been given. So that was really really hard

419
00:21:57,080 --> 00:21:59,200
Speaker 1: for me, and I had to get a handle on that. Still,

420
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:01,240
Speaker 1: I wouldn't trade it, it was I'd rather have the

421
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:04,800
Speaker 1: confidence with that with that downside. Yeah, So yeah, that's

422
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:07,919
Speaker 1: how I came out blasting and I try to do

423
00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:10,040
Speaker 1: as much of that. It's gonna sound like I'm getting

424
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:11,919
Speaker 1: my high horse. I don't want to sound like this,

425
00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:15,560
Speaker 1: but like now that I am in a position of like,

426
00:22:16,359 --> 00:22:17,800
Speaker 1: so I have a little bit of influence and I

427
00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,879
Speaker 1: have a little bit at your wealth, Like that's my

428
00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:24,560
Speaker 1: big like give back thing. It's like to try and

429
00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:28,120
Speaker 1: when I see people who don't have either the financial

430
00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 1: stability to have the confidence, I had and or the

431
00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,639
Speaker 1: person in their life that was like, I see you,

432
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,679
Speaker 1: I believe deeply in you. You've got this. Yeah, you know,

433
00:22:36,840 --> 00:22:38,919
Speaker 1: that's how like my survivor's skill plays out. It's like

434
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:39,800
Speaker 1: trying to pay that stuff.

435
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:40,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, I get that.

436
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:48,400
Speaker 2: So after the success of the Puffy Chair, Yeah, did

437
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:51,359
Speaker 2: doors just open wide for you or did you still

438
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,520
Speaker 2: have to like prove yourself to get where you wanted

439
00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:55,360
Speaker 2: to get with the next thing you wanted to do.

440
00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was a yes and no to that, you know.

441
00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,440
Speaker 1: So it's all relative, right, you know. For me having

442
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 1: done everything myself up until that point, no one had

443
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 1: ever helped me or offered to do anything. There was

444
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 1: I never had a mentor, I never had any I

445
00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:14,640
Speaker 1: had j side by side working together, so I had

446
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:17,720
Speaker 1: a compatriot, you know. And then I had my girlfriend

447
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 1: then who's now my wife, Katie, who then kind of

448
00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:21,800
Speaker 1: joined us, and so we were kind of like arm

449
00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:25,239
Speaker 1: and arm. But after the Puffy Chair hit Sundance, I'm

450
00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:28,679
Speaker 1: twenty seven, this is the first time I have the

451
00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:32,000
Speaker 1: experience of, well, now I have an agent who's going

452
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 1: to go out and represent for me. And the movie

453
00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:38,679
Speaker 1: did hit well at Sundance, and so I have people

454
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:42,920
Speaker 1: coming to me, which feels good, but of course it's

455
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,840
Speaker 1: not what it all seems. You know. Most of the

456
00:23:45,880 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 1: attention I received was like, well, we heard you made

457
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,920
Speaker 1: this movie for fifteen thousand dollars and it sold well

458
00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,639
Speaker 1: at Sundance, So sure I would love to give you

459
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,360
Speaker 1: fifteen thousand dollars to make a movie and take half

460
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:01,800
Speaker 1: of you of your equity and take all the credit

461
00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:03,680
Speaker 1: for it, you know, because are the offers I was getting.

462
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:07,280
Speaker 1: And I was like, no, I don't really need you.

463
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:10,479
Speaker 1: And it was this discovery of me that those who

464
00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:13,439
Speaker 1: are interested in you in this business, and maybe it's

465
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:15,720
Speaker 1: the same as others I don't know, by and large,

466
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 1: are interested in taking advantage of the level that you

467
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:21,800
Speaker 1: are at when you don't need them, as opposed to

468
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,600
Speaker 1: offering you a new step up to the next level

469
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,360
Speaker 1: when you need it, when you need it, Yeah, exactly.

470
00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,399
Speaker 1: It was like, huh, so I'm getting attention. This is cool,

471
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 1: but I'm kind of still in the same boat. But

472
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 1: you know, there were some really cool things that happened,

473
00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:39,439
Speaker 1: Like we met with the folks at Universal and they

474
00:24:39,440 --> 00:24:41,399
Speaker 1: were really interested in us, and they gave us one

475
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,680
Speaker 1: hundred thousand dollars to write a script for them, which

476
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:48,280
Speaker 1: was more money than I ever thought I would ever

477
00:24:48,320 --> 00:24:50,000
Speaker 1: make in my life. I was like, I can't believe

478
00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 1: this is happening. So immediately what we did is Jay

479
00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:55,920
Speaker 1: and I took that money. We each took twenty five

480
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:57,879
Speaker 1: of it. We took the next fifty and went and

481
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 1: made another independent film with it. Yeah, we get to

482
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 1: blow It's like an episode of Dumb and Dumber here,

483
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,360
Speaker 1: you know, just like that's what you're doing. You get

484
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:10,000
Speaker 1: money blow out on more independent films. But it was

485
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:12,399
Speaker 1: it was a really interesting thing that happened, which is

486
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 1: to your point of did the doors open? I thought

487
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:17,320
Speaker 1: the doors would open up top. What happened is the

488
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,879
Speaker 1: doors opened below in a way. And I'll explain this,

489
00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:24,400
Speaker 1: which was we were the first people in our group

490
00:25:24,440 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 1: of friends to make money, of the group of artists.

491
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:29,320
Speaker 1: So we signed that universal deal. I'll sign a deal

492
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:31,679
Speaker 1: with Fox Searchlight to write this movie Cyrus that we

493
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:35,080
Speaker 1: eventually made. We made this movie bag Head for like

494
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:37,159
Speaker 1: fifty thousand dollars. It sold it Sundance for like a

495
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:40,040
Speaker 1: half a million dollars. So we started the ownership of

496
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,000
Speaker 1: our business, and so all of our friends were coming

497
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,440
Speaker 1: to us like, hey, you know you guys have connections

498
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,000
Speaker 1: with Sundance, could you help us get our movie into Sundance?

499
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 1: Or Hey, you know you guys are really good editors,

500
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:53,119
Speaker 1: will you help us edit our movie and make it

501
00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,040
Speaker 1: a little better? Or hey, I heard your friends with

502
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,040
Speaker 1: Jonah Hill, could you help me in our movie? Or

503
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:00,359
Speaker 1: we lost ten thousand dollars of our finance saying you

504
00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 1: guys have money. So we were doing all these things

505
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:06,840
Speaker 1: as friends, and then a friend of mine, Michael Costigan,

506
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:09,359
Speaker 1: he's a producer. He looked at me and he's like,

507
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:12,400
Speaker 1: you know, that's what producing is, right, Like everything you're

508
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:15,880
Speaker 1: doing is reducing And I was like, oh, I never

509
00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:17,320
Speaker 1: thought of that. I always thought I was going to

510
00:26:17,320 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: be a writer, director, just artists, you know. And that's

511
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,080
Speaker 1: when sort of the producing element of my career was

512
00:26:24,119 --> 00:26:26,600
Speaker 1: born and I realized that that probably is more of

513
00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 1: my superpower actually than being a director. Is that team

514
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 1: building and the putting together and the supporting of artists

515
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:38,639
Speaker 1: is something that I never envisioned for myself. And to

516
00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 1: put a finer point on that, I think it's important

517
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:45,280
Speaker 1: to talk about this. I was raised in the generation

518
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 1: where a lot of the media in the early nineties,

519
00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:52,440
Speaker 1: the independent film books was kind of a fuck commerce

520
00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:54,679
Speaker 1: kind of thing, and if you try to if you

521
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,360
Speaker 1: try to combine art and commerce, you're a sellout, right,

522
00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 1: And I kind of bought into that. But the thing

523
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:02,160
Speaker 1: is like.

524
00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 3: Sort of the reality bites theme.

525
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 1: Yes, exactly exactly, but but the truth is, like I've

526
00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 1: always loved numbers, and I grew up in a very

527
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:18,200
Speaker 1: like conservative environment. All my friends with the business school

528
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: all this, and I love that stuff, you know, and

529
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:22,639
Speaker 1: I have my little stocks and I want and I

530
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:24,560
Speaker 1: always felt like a little ashamed, like I need to

531
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:26,879
Speaker 1: like hide that from people, because like I'm supposed to

532
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:30,160
Speaker 1: be an artist, I'm the indigo boy, right, and these

533
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 1: things don't these things don't mix, right, you know. But

534
00:27:34,960 --> 00:27:38,639
Speaker 1: once I learned to embrace the ven diagram overlap of

535
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:42,679
Speaker 1: art and commerce and know that, like, I love the

536
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:45,120
Speaker 1: business game of this. I love making a movie fifty

537
00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 1: thousand dollars and taking it back and selling it and

538
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: getting profit margins and cutting people into the points and

539
00:27:51,440 --> 00:27:53,200
Speaker 1: grinding the deals, you know. And people meet me and

540
00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 1: they're just like, wait, you're business man, what is this?

541
00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:00,840
Speaker 1: I thought you were gonna tell me about your yeah,

542
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 1: and I guess I'm both is really the case? You know?

543
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 1: Once I learned to love that embrace that I think

544
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 1: that's been a key to the sustainability of my career

545
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:09,360
Speaker 1: is understanding the business.

546
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 2: Next, I talk to Mark Duplas about anxiety and turning

547
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,120
Speaker 2: the bad stuff into.

548
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:32,160
Speaker 3: The good stuff. I want to talk to you about anxiety.

549
00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:33,800
Speaker 3: It's why I do it.

550
00:28:33,960 --> 00:28:37,040
Speaker 2: I was so looking forward to this interview because you've

551
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,160
Speaker 2: been very honest about mental health struggles with depression and anxiety,

552
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,760
Speaker 2: and I talk a lot about mine as well. I

553
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:48,920
Speaker 2: suffer from severe anxiety disorder, and it's debilitating, it's isolating,

554
00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,120
Speaker 2: it's depressing, it's exhausting.

555
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 1: Most of the exhausting is key.

556
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:57,480
Speaker 3: Exhausting is what it's mostly. And it's a liar.

557
00:28:57,680 --> 00:29:00,480
Speaker 2: It lies to me, lies to me about whether I'm safe,

558
00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:03,600
Speaker 2: whether I'm happy, whether my loved ones are safe.

559
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:04,200
Speaker 3: It's a liar.

560
00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 2: And I'm writing a book about it right now because

561
00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 2: I want to graphically explain.

562
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 3: What it means.

563
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: Because people hear anxcieited, they think, well, everybody's worried about something.

564
00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 1: I get nervous. I get worried.

565
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I get nervous when I fly.

566
00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,320
Speaker 2: Okay, Yeah, it's a different thing, and I feel for

567
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 2: you and that is awful. I'm sorry, but that's a

568
00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:23,520
Speaker 2: very different thing. And so I feel like if you

569
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 2: don't talk graphically about it, people don't really get it.

570
00:29:28,160 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 2: So I'm wondering if you can just talk a little

571
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 2: bit about how long you've battled your mental health and

572
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:35,520
Speaker 2: what it is in particular that you deal with.

573
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course I would love to, and thank you

574
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:41,479
Speaker 1: for inviting me to talk about this. So, you know,

575
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:44,960
Speaker 1: as with most people who grew up in the seventies

576
00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:49,840
Speaker 1: in the South, identifying this was extremely difficult. You know,

577
00:29:50,840 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 1: the generation previous who was raising us was not well

578
00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 1: versed in what this was. There was just a lot

579
00:29:56,640 --> 00:30:00,040
Speaker 1: of a tough aout mentality. I get it, No no

580
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,560
Speaker 1: blame or you know, it just wasn't in the lexicon.

581
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,480
Speaker 1: So the first things that I can identify looking back

582
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: now are are I remember waking up, you know, five six,

583
00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:16,640
Speaker 1: seven years old and feeling this extreme pit of emptiness

584
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:19,560
Speaker 1: in my stomach and not feeling like I can't go

585
00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:21,520
Speaker 1: to school, I can't get out of bed, and I

586
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:23,400
Speaker 1: remember theme it was, that's so weird. Did I eat

587
00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,720
Speaker 1: dinner last night because I'm so hungry, my stomach so empty,

588
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:28,680
Speaker 1: and I have no energy. And that's how I would

589
00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:31,120
Speaker 1: explain it. It's just like and I would I would

590
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:33,680
Speaker 1: like actually eat these like huge dinners sometimes in the

591
00:30:33,760 --> 00:30:36,440
Speaker 1: hopes that it would give me enough fuel for the morning.

592
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 1: But I had no idea that that was just depression,

593
00:30:40,400 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: you know, exhibiting itself in a way that I just

594
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 1: couldn't identify, you know. But here's the good and the

595
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 1: bad news is that I have a really strong constitution.

596
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 1: I have a really big drive, so I can actually

597
00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:54,760
Speaker 1: put my head down and muscle through quite a bit.

598
00:30:55,320 --> 00:30:58,320
Speaker 1: And that's what I did, is these things came to me,

599
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,440
Speaker 1: and I just was quiet about it, and I swallowed it,

600
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 1: and I put my head down and I just kept

601
00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:07,920
Speaker 1: banging on doors and banging on doors. And the next

602
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 1: thing I can really remember is from the ages like

603
00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:14,720
Speaker 1: sixteen to eighteen, you know, feeling a little lost, feeling

604
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:16,840
Speaker 1: like I don't really belong in this school that I'm in,

605
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: feeling some nerves about where I'm headed for college and whatnot.

606
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: And that's when I first started having panic attacks. It

607
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 1: was manifesting as anxiety, you know, the sweats I feel

608
00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:29,479
Speaker 1: like I'm going to throw out. I feel like I'm

609
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: going to pass out. I feel like I'm going to die,

610
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 1: you know. And that's when I spent a good two

611
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 1: years convinced that, like, yeah, I probably have cancer or

612
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 1: something like that, right, but I wouldn't talk about it

613
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:42,800
Speaker 1: with anyone. And I really wish I could go back

614
00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:45,640
Speaker 1: and say, you can open up and talk about this.

615
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: And that's one thing I'm very excited about for this

616
00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:50,880
Speaker 1: new generation is they are talking. Yeah, so much by

617
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 1: the way to talk about it right. And then the

618
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,280
Speaker 1: next way it manifested in me because again I muscled

619
00:31:57,280 --> 00:31:59,680
Speaker 1: through it, and my anxiety and my depression was like,

620
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,200
Speaker 1: we're going to get you to pay attention. I tried

621
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 1: to make your stomach hurt when you were five and

622
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:06,960
Speaker 1: didn't listen. Then I gave you panic attacks at sixteen,

623
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:11,080
Speaker 1: and you somehow muscle through this. So now you're twenty three,

624
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 1: you identify as a musician. That's all you can do.

625
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 1: And I developed crippling carbal tunnel and repetitive stress injuries

626
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:22,000
Speaker 1: in my hands and all through my neck and shoulders

627
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 1: from the tension and everything because I was like, we're

628
00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:25,560
Speaker 1: gonna put it in your body now now I'm gonna

629
00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:29,440
Speaker 1: try and slow you down. Yeah, and still I would

630
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 1: not listen. I didn't know that I should be going

631
00:32:31,240 --> 00:32:34,200
Speaker 1: to therapy. I didn't know about medication. I still thought

632
00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: that like Prozac was this evil drug that was find control,

633
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 1: do that and then you're weak if you do that.

634
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,680
Speaker 1: All those things, you know. So what I learned, so

635
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:45,680
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, well I can't play acoustic guitar anymore.

636
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:50,440
Speaker 1: Rather than like sit and think maybe there's something wrong

637
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:52,959
Speaker 1: here that I need to examine inside, I was like, oh,

638
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: I'll just play this like cassio instrument that doesn't hurt

639
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 1: my hands and go to another one hundred and eighty

640
00:32:57,520 --> 00:32:59,560
Speaker 1: days a year, which I did, and I'll go make

641
00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 1: an independ feature film with my brother. And I did.

642
00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:07,840
Speaker 1: And it wasn't until I reached some sort of organic

643
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:11,720
Speaker 1: zenith to this drive, which was making the Puffy Chair,

644
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:14,840
Speaker 1: getting it in Sun Dance, finally making enough money that

645
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:17,480
Speaker 1: I can pay rent, and a little bit of calm

646
00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:21,080
Speaker 1: came with that. And as soon as you know, it's

647
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: almost like when you have like a job, you're like

648
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:25,959
Speaker 1: at the you know, you're at the Republican National Convention.

649
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: You can't let yourself get sick because you got to work,

650
00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:31,160
Speaker 1: and then as soon as it's over, Yeah, right, sure,

651
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 1: that's what happened to me. And I had a nervous

652
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:38,760
Speaker 1: breakdown at twenty eight, consistent panic attacks, couldn't get myself

653
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 1: off the floor, just got engaged in my wife Katie.

654
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:45,160
Speaker 1: So I'm super embarrassed and ashamed and like, this is

655
00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 1: what she signed up for. She's gonna be like and

656
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:49,680
Speaker 1: I'm really that feeling of like I don't know if

657
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,840
Speaker 1: I'm ever going to be the same again. Yea, And

658
00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,640
Speaker 1: so I was. I was. I guess at that point

659
00:33:57,640 --> 00:34:00,320
Speaker 1: around enough artists and I'm in California on the West Coast,

660
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 1: there's enough people and friends around me who are like, oh, yeah,

661
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 1: this is anxiety and depression, and like you need to

662
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:08,320
Speaker 1: go see a specialist. So let's to see a psychologist.

663
00:34:08,440 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 1: Want to see a psychiatrist. I was too afraid to

664
00:34:12,280 --> 00:34:15,000
Speaker 1: take the SSRIs, like you know, the prozacs and the

665
00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:17,839
Speaker 1: selecxis and the zolofts. You know, I'd had enough friends

666
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:19,839
Speaker 1: who take like Xanax and things like that. I was like, oh,

667
00:34:19,920 --> 00:34:22,960
Speaker 1: that's temporary. So so I started there and I was like,

668
00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 1: this helps with the panic attacks doesn't help with the depression.

669
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,440
Speaker 1: Not sustainable. So that's when I had to really make

670
00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:31,799
Speaker 1: the best decision I ever made in my life, which

671
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 1: was to go on SSRIs they and really was tough

672
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:42,520
Speaker 1: because I was like, Okay, started Zoloft first. You know,

673
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 1: I had some of those tough sexual side effects that

674
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 1: you get on those. Sometimes I got to weight gain,

675
00:34:47,640 --> 00:34:48,560
Speaker 1: and I was like, I don't know if this is

676
00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:51,440
Speaker 1: right for me. You know, I'm an actor too, I

677
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,120
Speaker 1: have ego all these things. Yeah, I was able to

678
00:34:54,120 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 1: move over into selects experience less of those side effects,

679
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 1: and then and then the the sky opened up just

680
00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:04,759
Speaker 1: enough for me that I could see how, okay, I'm

681
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:06,239
Speaker 1: going to be able to get myself out of this.

682
00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:08,399
Speaker 1: It's going to take a lot of work. It's gonna

683
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:10,680
Speaker 1: be a little bit of that long, slow road. And

684
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 1: this is where I started doing my deep dive into

685
00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 1: the systems that I have built for myself now, which

686
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 1: is just like minimum eight and a half hours of sleep,

687
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 1: non negotiable, non negotiable, Minimum twenty minutes of hardcore cardio

688
00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:29,640
Speaker 1: exercise per day, non negotiable. Got to have this, you know,

689
00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 1: always eating good foods and healthy foods, all these little

690
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:37,480
Speaker 1: things to keep myself in place, you know. And I

691
00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: got myself on my feet, and I lied to myself

692
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:41,760
Speaker 1: and I convinced myself, as soon as I get myself

693
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:43,799
Speaker 1: on feet, I'll get off the medication. I can wean

694
00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,240
Speaker 1: myself off and it's gonna be fine. And I did,

695
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:48,920
Speaker 1: and I like, wean myself from twenty milligrams then to

696
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,439
Speaker 1: ten milligrams, and I was like, I think I'm doing

697
00:35:51,600 --> 00:35:56,239
Speaker 1: Oh god, no, no, no, I'm not ready, you know. So

698
00:35:56,440 --> 00:36:02,440
Speaker 1: I've been on SSRIs for eighteen years. Yeah, and no,

699
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:07,719
Speaker 1: it's not ideal, but it's it's what I need and

700
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: it's not a fix all of anything. It's as you know,

701
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: it's Yeah, sometimes it's seasonal. Sometimes it comes. I talk

702
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,600
Speaker 1: about the delay where there will be times when I'm

703
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,600
Speaker 1: like really stressed out, like I can see it, but

704
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,120
Speaker 1: the anxiety isn't there. It's the normal everyday stress and

705
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:28,080
Speaker 1: strain and I'm like, I should be tanking right now.

706
00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:30,359
Speaker 1: I can't believe them on my feet. And then three

707
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:33,440
Speaker 1: months later, three months later, it hits me old the

708
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 1: Christmas holidays when I'm totally relaxed, and then whams me

709
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:39,239
Speaker 1: and I'm like, what the fuck man, I'm I'm I'm

710
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 1: relaxed now.

711
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 2: It's a wild part of it. I remember being very

712
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:46,760
Speaker 2: stressed over this summer. I was juggling four different jobs

713
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 2: and I had a vacation coming up.

714
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,680
Speaker 3: But I was like, oh, I'm so excited for this vacation.

715
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 3: And I'd add a couple.

716
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:59,720
Speaker 2: Of traumatic safety security incidents before then, but I felt okay.

717
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,479
Speaker 2: I moved through those. Normally, I would think those would

718
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 2: spiral me.

719
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:06,280
Speaker 3: I didn't. It caught up to me on my vacation.

720
00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 2: Of course, when I'm like really just trying to take

721
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 2: a break from everything, suddenly this is where my anxiety

722
00:37:13,480 --> 00:37:16,080
Speaker 2: decided to pop up and say, no, no, no, those things

723
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:18,719
Speaker 2: that happened did affect you, and I'm just here to

724
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:24,000
Speaker 2: remind you. But what you said a little bit ago

725
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:28,080
Speaker 2: when you said you'd have this nervous breakdown and you

726
00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:31,520
Speaker 2: didn't know if you were gonna be yourself again, and

727
00:37:31,560 --> 00:37:34,000
Speaker 2: I had those same feelings. My nervous breakdown happened at

728
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 2: forty and I thought, I'm not going to be myself again,

729
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:38,920
Speaker 2: and guess what I am not.

730
00:37:39,520 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 3: I am not myself again. And some of that is

731
00:37:41,719 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 3: for the better, yes, but some of that is, like, God,

732
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:47,240
Speaker 3: I used to not care about this stuff.

733
00:37:47,239 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 2: I used to not have to do all this stuff

734
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 2: just to get myself going and feeling okay.

735
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,080
Speaker 1: How fucking exhausting is it that you feel like you

736
00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:57,239
Speaker 1: need four systems just to hit baseline?

737
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 3: Well, yes, I hate thinking so much.

738
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 2: Attention to what my mind is doing so it doesn't

739
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:07,799
Speaker 2: do the unhealthy things is exhausting too. And then when

740
00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:12,040
Speaker 2: I'm not doing well, when I'm catastrophizing and thinking about

741
00:38:12,120 --> 00:38:14,880
Speaker 2: danger around every corner twenty four hours a day, that

742
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,600
Speaker 2: is exhausting, and I feel it physically.

743
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:19,799
Speaker 3: And listen, my brain is not as sharp as it

744
00:38:19,920 --> 00:38:21,799
Speaker 3: was before this. It just is not.

745
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:25,960
Speaker 2: I can now, like if I'm writing or reading something

746
00:38:26,080 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 2: and my son or my husband says something, I used

747
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:31,799
Speaker 2: to be able to do eight things at once. Now

748
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:35,040
Speaker 2: that will completely stop me and my train of thought,

749
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,000
Speaker 2: and I have to separate these things. I have to

750
00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:42,319
Speaker 2: ask my family, like, for total, can I just have

751
00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:45,479
Speaker 2: ten minutes where you're not interrupting my train of thought

752
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 2: for this thing that I'm doing that never used to

753
00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 2: be me So I'm not the same. And I think

754
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,800
Speaker 2: maybe wrapping your mind around that is one of the

755
00:38:53,840 --> 00:38:54,640
Speaker 2: hardest things to do.

756
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 1: It is hard, but you know, I think that like

757
00:38:58,000 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 1: if you look at it and pull out thirty thousand

758
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 1: and feet, it's not dissimilar to the aging process, which

759
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 1: this was a couple of ways to look at aging,

760
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:07,400
Speaker 1: which is just like you can look at as a

761
00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:10,920
Speaker 1: constant series of diminishing loss where it's just like, oh,

762
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: now my lower back is doing something, so I can't

763
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:14,400
Speaker 1: do running like I used to do, so I have

764
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,520
Speaker 1: to do the elliptical. Gosh, oh oh, now I have

765
00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:18,319
Speaker 1: tennis elbows, so I can't do the lip. You know,

766
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 1: you can look at it like that, you weally and

767
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 1: and I don't blame you if you do, you know.

768
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:25,399
Speaker 1: Or you can look at it as just like, well,

769
00:39:25,400 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 1: it's just a change, and it's just a little bit different.

770
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 1: And you know, I I I'm trying on a little

771
00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:35,480
Speaker 1: bit of radical optimism these days, and I'm actually kind

772
00:39:35,480 --> 00:39:39,160
Speaker 1: of enjoying it to the to the extent of let's

773
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:42,920
Speaker 1: take your example of you know, I can't multitask the

774
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 1: way I used to. You know, well, the way that

775
00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:48,080
Speaker 1: I would approach that is I would say, okay, that

776
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:52,440
Speaker 1: multitasking probably led to efficiency, and it probably led to success.

777
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:57,319
Speaker 1: Did it definitely lead to happiness? Maybe not? No, And

778
00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 1: is it possible that se in this phase your life,

779
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,799
Speaker 1: you're financially sustainable, you got a nice family, all your

780
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: good systems are in place. Yeah, but that's slow down

781
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:10,360
Speaker 1: and that unilateral focus might actually lead to some more contemplative,

782
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: deep thought and ways of doing things. That might You know,

783
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:16,600
Speaker 1: when you're cooking in the kitchen and it's just the

784
00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: music and you and the vegetables and meditative you.

785
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,120
Speaker 3: Know, I love I just did that last night. I

786
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,359
Speaker 3: put in a little divorgac I my cooking. I tell

787
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 3: the boys to go in the other room. It is

788
00:40:26,040 --> 00:40:26,480
Speaker 3: the best.

789
00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:28,239
Speaker 1: By the way, you and I are gonna have to

790
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:32,080
Speaker 1: have a classical music dorkout session outside of this podcast, because.

791
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:34,520
Speaker 3: Okay, great, no one wants to listen to this.

792
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:38,280
Speaker 1: Well we're gonna, but we're gonna do it. We're gonna

793
00:40:38,280 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 1: do it.

794
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:39,520
Speaker 3: Okay, I'll do that.

795
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:42,680
Speaker 1: But but yeah, that's how I look at the things.

796
00:40:42,719 --> 00:40:45,319
Speaker 1: And maybe it's a rationalization or maybe it's a self

797
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 1: fulfilling prophecy. I don't care. But if I lean into that,

798
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:51,600
Speaker 1: it helps me to reframe it in a way that

799
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:53,640
Speaker 1: can be healthy, you know, the way I take this.

800
00:40:53,760 --> 00:40:57,560
Speaker 2: Like that because you know what, and I I you're

801
00:40:57,600 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 2: just reminding me of this. I've been reading a lot

802
00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:02,399
Speaker 2: about this, and you know what, Multitasking is awful for you.

803
00:41:02,560 --> 00:41:05,360
Speaker 2: It is terrible for you, even when you're healthy.

804
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:07,919
Speaker 3: It is not good. So, actually, you're right.

805
00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:09,960
Speaker 2: Some of these things I wanted to hold on to

806
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 2: that I thought were very much part of my identity

807
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:17,319
Speaker 2: and my ambition and my success, we're probably not great things, and.

808
00:41:17,239 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 3: I just need to view them that way.

809
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:22,839
Speaker 2: This is why marketing plus, this is why I love

810
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:25,840
Speaker 2: talking about mental health because you just told me something

811
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:26,839
Speaker 2: I didn't know.

812
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,120
Speaker 1: And you know, here's the dirty truth about multitasking too,

813
00:41:30,200 --> 00:41:32,759
Speaker 1: which is like you're right about what you just identified.

814
00:41:32,840 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 1: You know. And I think a lot back to ages

815
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 1: zero to twenty eight, before my nervous breakdown, before I

816
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 1: became self aware, you know, and I think to myself, like, God,

817
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: did you have to drive yourself so hard? Did you

818
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:46,959
Speaker 1: have to do all those things to yourself? And here's

819
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:51,160
Speaker 1: the thing, Like, I have a hard time going into

820
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 1: deep regret about that, because the truth is that drive

821
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: that you had, yeah, it actually was cumulative and it

822
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 1: did help builds to this moment where you're at right now.

823
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:01,440
Speaker 4: I know.

824
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 1: So it's not all empirically bad. I know, maybe there's

825
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:06,000
Speaker 1: a balance the way we could have done it. That's

826
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:07,719
Speaker 1: the rub, you know. So what I want to say

827
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,720
Speaker 1: to anyone who's listening to this and you know, is thinking,

828
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:14,720
Speaker 1: either you know what, I'm twenty two, fuck you guys.

829
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:17,080
Speaker 1: You have the luxury and your successful place right now

830
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 1: of saying, don't bang your head against the wall. But like,

831
00:42:20,200 --> 00:42:23,800
Speaker 1: sometimes the balanced life at seventeen doesn't actually lead to success.

832
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:26,520
Speaker 1: So I'm here to say it's it's not the worst

833
00:42:26,560 --> 00:42:28,200
Speaker 1: thing in the world if you want to go overdrive

834
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:30,359
Speaker 1: for a little bit and have an awareness to it

835
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,120
Speaker 1: and then put your systems in place later. Yeah, so

836
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:35,239
Speaker 1: not the worst thing in the world if you are

837
00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,240
Speaker 1: smarter than us and you want to get yourself balanced

838
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:39,919
Speaker 1: now and realize that, well, the success that our drive

839
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:43,000
Speaker 1: brought us didn't necessarily bring happiness. And there's new ways

840
00:42:43,000 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 1: to look at things. You know, there's no one way

841
00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:48,640
Speaker 1: that's definitively right or wrong. The only thing I'm discovering

842
00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:51,600
Speaker 1: for myself is just you know, trying to find the

843
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:54,840
Speaker 1: right framing devices and appreciate the good things that have

844
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:57,359
Speaker 1: come with these crazy things I've had to deal with.

845
00:42:57,440 --> 00:42:59,160
Speaker 1: You know, that has really been the only thing that

846
00:42:59,160 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: I find to be empirically helpful.

847
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 2: Yes, and me too, And even just the way we're

848
00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:08,320
Speaker 2: talking about sort of reframing these things and thinking about

849
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:11,120
Speaker 2: when you're coming up, because I too would advise someone

850
00:43:11,200 --> 00:43:13,800
Speaker 2: coming up in my business or any other competitive business,

851
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:16,800
Speaker 2: work your ass off in your twenties, like that's when

852
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 2: that's when you can do it, before you've got a.

853
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:21,800
Speaker 3: Family and when you're hungry and all of that.

854
00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 1: Maybe be a little more aware than you and I were,

855
00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 1: but still work hard, you know.

856
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:28,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, But I would tell myself as I was

857
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:30,839
Speaker 2: pushing and pushing to the next thing and the next thing,

858
00:43:31,239 --> 00:43:33,759
Speaker 2: I'll take a break eventually, or I'll check in with

859
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 2: my mental health eventually. And especially as I got into

860
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:42,160
Speaker 2: more intense journalism where I was covering wars and awful things,

861
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:46,160
Speaker 2: seeing awful things, i'd compartmentalized do what you did, keep

862
00:43:46,160 --> 00:43:47,799
Speaker 2: my head down. I can push through I can push

863
00:43:47,840 --> 00:43:49,799
Speaker 2: through this anxiety. It can push through depression. I can

864
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:52,840
Speaker 2: push through the awfulness and I'll check in later. But

865
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,200
Speaker 2: I wouldn't and now what I do, because I still

866
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 2: have to do that. It's still my job to do that.

867
00:43:58,040 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 2: I do check in later, I do correct for what

868
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:02,919
Speaker 2: I've just put myself through.

869
00:44:03,920 --> 00:44:05,600
Speaker 3: But I didn't do that growing up because who knew.

870
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 3: I didn't know. I didn't know. I didn't know I

871
00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:09,320
Speaker 3: was anxious until forty something.

872
00:44:09,840 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I'm looking at my you know, my

873
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:15,160
Speaker 1: daughter's journey right now, sixteen. It's her story to tell,

874
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:16,680
Speaker 1: and I don't want to get into the specifics of it,

875
00:44:16,719 --> 00:44:21,200
Speaker 1: but she, you know, very early on cluede into you know,

876
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:23,479
Speaker 1: the mental health journey and what that would mean for her,

877
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:28,000
Speaker 1: and like how she's functioning now at sixteen is incredible.

878
00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: She's in Maine right now with my wife. They're making

879
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 1: an independent film together, and like, I'm just watching the

880
00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:37,560
Speaker 1: way she processes it and what she does with her

881
00:44:37,640 --> 00:44:39,880
Speaker 1: days off and like knows how to give herself rest

882
00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:42,160
Speaker 1: and amazing and puts her boundaries up with us, and

883
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:46,000
Speaker 1: you know, I'm like, whoa, that's so so downstream, and

884
00:44:46,040 --> 00:44:48,520
Speaker 1: I'm really I'm really as much as they have it

885
00:44:48,760 --> 00:44:52,359
Speaker 1: really difficult, particularly you know, visa via the technology element. Yeah,

886
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:54,600
Speaker 1: I'm seeing really good signs of what they're doing well.

887
00:44:54,600 --> 00:44:56,960
Speaker 2: And that's something too My therapist was like, let me

888
00:44:56,960 --> 00:44:58,919
Speaker 2: ask you a question. When you're anxious, do you hide

889
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 2: that from your son? My son's young, and so I

890
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:03,360
Speaker 2: would say, of course, and she'd say, well, don't do

891
00:45:03,400 --> 00:45:07,400
Speaker 2: that like in age appropriate ways, trinity ways.

892
00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:09,480
Speaker 3: Yes, for sure, because.

893
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:11,760
Speaker 2: If you model to your son that you are perfect,

894
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:15,160
Speaker 2: you have all the answers, you have never had a challenge,

895
00:45:15,840 --> 00:45:18,160
Speaker 2: he's not going to know how to be imperfect. And

896
00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:21,680
Speaker 2: you're not raising a perfect son, you know, You're raising

897
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:24,319
Speaker 2: someone who is going to be imperfect and show him

898
00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:28,000
Speaker 2: what it's like to ask for help, to not have

899
00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:31,000
Speaker 2: it all figured out, to take care of your mental health.

900
00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 2: So yeah, that sticks with me too, because if there's

901
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:38,320
Speaker 2: one silver lining to all of this, it's that maybe

902
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:40,080
Speaker 2: the next generation will do it better.

903
00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:41,040
Speaker 4: You know.

904
00:45:41,280 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 1: I have a little story to share of when I

905
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 1: didn't actually do that very well, you know, And a

906
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:51,400
Speaker 1: part of it was some gender preconceptions I had growing

907
00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:53,920
Speaker 1: up in the South, which was like, I have two daughters,

908
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:58,359
Speaker 1: and I wanted to project oak, Yeah, I'm sorry, I'm here,

909
00:45:58,880 --> 00:46:01,640
Speaker 1: you got this, you know, and when they had questions,

910
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:03,719
Speaker 1: I wanted to be able to be there to offer

911
00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:07,600
Speaker 1: them insightful answers that felt like they were coming out

912
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:12,000
Speaker 1: of Nicholas Spark's novel and and and you know what,

913
00:46:12,120 --> 00:46:15,400
Speaker 1: that was helpful to them and good for them. And

914
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:18,440
Speaker 1: there were also times when my wife, Katie, who processes

915
00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 1: things in extremely healthy and ways, where the emotions come

916
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 1: to her big, they explode, she moves on from them.

917
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,239
Speaker 1: It's great, you know. And and there was a time

918
00:46:27,239 --> 00:46:29,719
Speaker 1: where she was really struggling with her career as a filmmaker,

919
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 1: as an actor, you know, and our daughters would walk

920
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 1: in on her a lot, you know, crying in the

921
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:36,840
Speaker 1: kitchen and sobbing, and and and and worrying about is

922
00:46:36,880 --> 00:46:38,200
Speaker 1: this ever going to be okay? And I don't know

923
00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: the existential was And I remember thinking to myself, like,

924
00:46:41,320 --> 00:46:44,319
Speaker 1: where's the oak, Like give these kids the strength, Like

925
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:45,960
Speaker 1: we need to let them know that it's okay in

926
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:46,400
Speaker 1: the world.

927
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:46,640
Speaker 4: You know.

928
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:48,759
Speaker 1: Of course I didn't say anything, because parents have to

929
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:50,720
Speaker 1: parent their own ways, you know. And I was talking

930
00:46:50,719 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 1: to my twelve year old the other day and she

931
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,640
Speaker 1: told me, unprompt out out of anything, she's like one

932
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:57,799
Speaker 1: of the best lessons she got from her parents was

933
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:02,560
Speaker 1: watching her mother in the kitchen crying after she didn't

934
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:05,120
Speaker 1: get those auditions because it allowed her a for the

935
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,680
Speaker 1: first time, to not be the comforted, but to comfort

936
00:47:07,719 --> 00:47:10,240
Speaker 1: someone that she that she assumed was in a position

937
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 1: of house and it gave her confidence that she might

938
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 1: know something that maybe she doesn't and offer her a

939
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:18,520
Speaker 1: little bit of advice. And then subsequently, in the years

940
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 1: to come, she watched her get hit, fall on the ground,

941
00:47:21,760 --> 00:47:24,120
Speaker 1: pick herself back up, go on the audition, get hit,

942
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:26,520
Speaker 1: going there, and she never gave up. So all that

943
00:47:26,680 --> 00:47:30,359
Speaker 1: Nicholas Sparks bullshit modeling I was doing was not the thing.

944
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:32,759
Speaker 1: It was just my wife being real with them and

945
00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,319
Speaker 1: them seeing her do it. That was the thing.

946
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:36,160
Speaker 3: Great to hear.

947
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 2: I'm so glad you shared that, because, yeah, I try

948
00:47:38,680 --> 00:47:40,640
Speaker 2: to envision as my son gets a little.

949
00:47:40,480 --> 00:47:43,839
Speaker 3: Older how that will look. And that's really great. That's great.

950
00:47:44,080 --> 00:47:46,439
Speaker 1: The vulnerability went in doubt, just go that way.

951
00:47:46,840 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, Okay, let's lighten up with a lightning round.

952
00:48:02,719 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 1: Let's do it.

953
00:48:08,920 --> 00:48:09,280
Speaker 3: Okay.

954
00:48:09,520 --> 00:48:13,960
Speaker 2: Many of our guests are graduates of a vaunted Hollywood institution,

955
00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:18,400
Speaker 2: the School of Law and Order. Uh, you did not

956
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:20,439
Speaker 2: matriculate through the School of Law and Order?

957
00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 3: How is that possible? How did it? Miss?

958
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:22,719
Speaker 4: You?

959
00:48:24,000 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 1: So I I came up in this very interesting way,

960
00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:30,560
Speaker 1: which was through the independent film route, you know. And

961
00:48:30,600 --> 00:48:34,680
Speaker 1: then I made a lateral move straight over into the

962
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:37,400
Speaker 1: directing chair and into writing studio movies. And then by

963
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:40,400
Speaker 1: the time I got my first like acting gig, I

964
00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 1: weirdly had like leapfrogged the Law and Order guest star

965
00:48:44,320 --> 00:48:46,760
Speaker 1: because I was like, okay, the leads and independent films,

966
00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:49,080
Speaker 1: so then they, yeah, they would go to it.

967
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:50,919
Speaker 3: You were too too big for it when you start

968
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:51,799
Speaker 3: missed it.

969
00:48:52,040 --> 00:48:56,200
Speaker 1: That being said. That being said, really there's some really

970
00:48:56,440 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 1: fun legal conspiracy shit coming up in season four of

971
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: The Morning Show. Oh okay, good And and every now

972
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 1: and then Reesa and I will look at each other

973
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 1: and joke and be like, this is kind of like

974
00:49:07,120 --> 00:49:07,799
Speaker 1: our Law and Order.

975
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:13,719
Speaker 2: This is the perfect h You and I both did

976
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 2: Celebrity Jeopardy. How did that go for you?

977
00:49:16,239 --> 00:49:18,920
Speaker 1: Dude? It was the dream of a lifetime. I mean,

978
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:22,480
Speaker 1: being on the stage was incredible. I was very nervous,

979
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:25,200
Speaker 1: tons of ego wrapped up in it, like really really

980
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:28,239
Speaker 1: wanted to win, you know. And I did not win,

981
00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 1: and and and came home and was morbidly depressed for

982
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:36,520
Speaker 1: two hours until I realized, you idiot, it's a game,

983
00:49:36,640 --> 00:49:39,919
Speaker 1: it's a game show, you know. But the most fun

984
00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:41,919
Speaker 1: was and I'll have to share this with you later.

985
00:49:42,160 --> 00:49:44,839
Speaker 1: My friend Ike Barnholts had won it the year before, right,

986
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:46,640
Speaker 1: and so I called him. I was like, dude, what

987
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:49,359
Speaker 1: are the tips he did? And he sent me like

988
00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:53,360
Speaker 1: a three minute video with instructions on how to properly

989
00:49:53,760 --> 00:49:57,240
Speaker 1: bring in Yes, and he gave me all the buzzer

990
00:49:57,239 --> 00:49:59,480
Speaker 1: stuff and it's so he took he took a pen back,

991
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:01,160
Speaker 1: you know, and he's like, when you buzzn't it's not

992
00:50:01,200 --> 00:50:02,799
Speaker 1: like this, not like once. He's like, He's like, it's

993
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:05,920
Speaker 1: like you're playing Nintendo's because you lost out, you know.

994
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,480
Speaker 2: Yes, so yeah, and who did you?

995
00:50:09,520 --> 00:50:10,719
Speaker 3: Who were your competitors?

996
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:13,360
Speaker 1: I played with my friend Uktars from the show Ghosts,

997
00:50:14,040 --> 00:50:19,680
Speaker 1: and then Emily Hampshire who is the Levy the Levy Show. Yes,

998
00:50:19,960 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 1: and man, we had so much fun and it was

999
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:24,520
Speaker 1: it was it was great.

1000
00:50:24,760 --> 00:50:27,440
Speaker 3: Uh did you was yours? Did you get to do

1001
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:28,000
Speaker 3: it with Alex?

1002
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: No? No, mine was was post Alex was with Ken? Okay,

1003
00:50:33,239 --> 00:50:33,920
Speaker 1: how did yours go?

1004
00:50:34,360 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 3: It went fine?

1005
00:50:35,160 --> 00:50:36,560
Speaker 2: I got to do it with Alex. It was one

1006
00:50:36,560 --> 00:50:39,560
Speaker 2: of the last years and beautiful.

1007
00:50:39,560 --> 00:50:40,240
Speaker 3: That was lovely.

1008
00:50:41,719 --> 00:50:45,360
Speaker 2: And my competitors were Chuck Todd from MSNBC, who's a friend,

1009
00:50:46,000 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 2: and Jonathan Franzen, novelist very smart.

1010
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:51,960
Speaker 1: I really love his books.

1011
00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:55,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, two very smart guys. It was a joy to

1012
00:50:55,920 --> 00:50:56,520
Speaker 3: beat them both.

1013
00:50:56,920 --> 00:51:01,840
Speaker 2: But but yes, but but I can I tell you

1014
00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 2: I don't get nervous for TV at all, not even

1015
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:06,799
Speaker 2: a little. It doesn't even register like the camera's on.

1016
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:09,520
Speaker 2: I don't There's no difference to me. When I got

1017
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:13,960
Speaker 2: to Jeopardy, man, Yeah, the nerves came out of every

1018
00:51:14,120 --> 00:51:17,759
Speaker 2: pore of my body. And you just I just didn't

1019
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:19,360
Speaker 2: want to be embarrassed. I did not care if I

1020
00:51:19,400 --> 00:51:22,680
Speaker 2: want to hundred percent, I just don't want to be humiliated.

1021
00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:25,240
Speaker 2: Where this is going to live forever somewhere.

1022
00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:28,000
Speaker 1: I do a lot of game shows. I'm on the circuit.

1023
00:51:28,040 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 1: I did a celebrity Wheel of Fortune.

1024
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:31,920
Speaker 3: I get on the circuit. I love game shows.

1025
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:35,359
Speaker 1: It's so fun and you win so much money. It's

1026
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:37,640
Speaker 1: the best robin hooding ever. I want one hundred thousand

1027
00:51:37,680 --> 00:51:42,080
Speaker 1: dollars on Wheel of Fortune for Smallscure Charity. Yeah, it's

1028
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:44,319
Speaker 1: the greatest thing, Like I love it.

1029
00:51:44,440 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, I did love winning for my charity No

1030
00:51:46,880 --> 00:51:48,680
Speaker 2: Kid Hungry, which was great, But I want to get

1031
00:51:48,680 --> 00:51:49,600
Speaker 2: on the game show circuit.

1032
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 3: It seems really okay, I got it, I got you,

1033
00:51:52,120 --> 00:51:55,280
Speaker 3: Set me up, Set me up. Okay, what's your favorite

1034
00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:56,800
Speaker 3: news show to watch?

1035
00:51:58,680 --> 00:52:00,920
Speaker 1: That's a really good question, and it makes me realize

1036
00:52:00,920 --> 00:52:02,480
Speaker 1: that I don't really watch news shows.

1037
00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:03,759
Speaker 3: Good for you.

1038
00:52:04,200 --> 00:52:08,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I had this moment post twenty sixteen

1039
00:52:08,120 --> 00:52:13,439
Speaker 1: election and my wife Katie got pretty obsessed and kind

1040
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:15,920
Speaker 1: of tanked pretty heavily. So I think in that moment,

1041
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:17,680
Speaker 1: I was trying to model like, hey, maybe we don't

1042
00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 1: do news shows. Maybe we you know, open up our

1043
00:52:19,719 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 1: three sources and we read our articles and then we

1044
00:52:21,640 --> 00:52:26,200
Speaker 1: got that. And then I got a little healthier honestly,

1045
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:28,560
Speaker 1: by yeah, by not doing that.

1046
00:52:28,680 --> 00:52:34,000
Speaker 2: So I applaud that great. Brennan's or Cafe Dumont.

1047
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:38,680
Speaker 1: Oh, what a great question. I'm hitting you hard. Brennan's,

1048
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 1: you know, and they own multiple restaurants. There are restaurants

1049
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:42,160
Speaker 1: in New Orleans for those who are listening.

1050
00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:44,360
Speaker 3: Yes, it's an empire of sorts.

1051
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:46,960
Speaker 1: So for me, for me, Cafe Dumont is it for

1052
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:49,560
Speaker 1: a number of reasons, because when you're grow up in

1053
00:52:49,600 --> 00:52:53,440
Speaker 1: New Orleans. You start drinking at twelve, you start drinking

1054
00:52:53,480 --> 00:52:56,400
Speaker 1: and driving at fifteen. I'm embarrassed to say, and I

1055
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:58,800
Speaker 1: can't believe I'm alive with all the things I did.

1056
00:52:59,840 --> 00:53:03,160
Speaker 1: And what part of that process is when you're done

1057
00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:05,560
Speaker 1: at two in the morning, Like there's no better way

1058
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:08,759
Speaker 1: to soak up the alcohol than you know, big coffee

1059
00:53:09,040 --> 00:53:12,680
Speaker 1: and Begnet's, you know. And then we developed this This

1060
00:53:12,719 --> 00:53:14,399
Speaker 1: is so I can't believe I've never even told the story.

1061
00:53:14,440 --> 00:53:17,680
Speaker 1: You developed a system where the bathrooms a Cafe DeMont

1062
00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:19,959
Speaker 1: in the quarter were just nasty because everybody was coming through.

1063
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:22,360
Speaker 1: Of course, we always had to go to the bathroom.

1064
00:53:22,680 --> 00:53:24,560
Speaker 1: And so what we would do is the boys are

1065
00:53:24,560 --> 00:53:26,160
Speaker 1: fine going to the bathroom standing up, but the girls

1066
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 1: didn't want to sit on the seats, you know. But

1067
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:29,560
Speaker 1: a lot of them are too drunk. They're worried about

1068
00:53:29,560 --> 00:53:31,480
Speaker 1: the squat. So we would go in with our friends,

1069
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 1: the girls into the and then we would hold out

1070
00:53:33,600 --> 00:53:36,080
Speaker 1: our arms and they would like hold on and use

1071
00:53:36,160 --> 00:53:39,759
Speaker 1: that to squat over the caven DeMont toilets. Yeah, good friends,

1072
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:41,520
Speaker 1: you know. And I was a good Southern boy. I

1073
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:44,800
Speaker 1: looked away, you know, it's amazing. Yeah, so deep history

1074
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:46,000
Speaker 1: of Cafe DeMont. Yeah.

1075
00:53:46,640 --> 00:53:48,839
Speaker 3: Do you know what your classmate Michael White does?

1076
00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:53,080
Speaker 1: Now? Yeah, he's a massive head basketball coach. Last I checked,

1077
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:54,320
Speaker 1: he was Florida.

1078
00:53:54,160 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 3: I believe. Now he's University of Georgia.

1079
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:57,440
Speaker 1: He's Georgia now yeah.

1080
00:53:57,480 --> 00:53:59,960
Speaker 3: He he he.

1081
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:03,799
Speaker 1: Mike and we were close in high school and you know,

1082
00:54:03,840 --> 00:54:07,600
Speaker 1: went our separate ways. And he called me like six

1083
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:10,239
Speaker 1: or seven years ago and it was really lovely. He

1084
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:12,359
Speaker 1: was just checking in on me, you know, and I

1085
00:54:12,440 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 1: was like, I was like, I was like, Mike, I

1086
00:54:14,680 --> 00:54:16,319
Speaker 1: was like, I don't want to make this awkward, but like,

1087
00:54:17,080 --> 00:54:20,359
Speaker 1: is the tenor of this call? Basically we're the two

1088
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:23,040
Speaker 1: people who are a public profile, famous from our high

1089
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:24,839
Speaker 1: school and now we're talking about it. Is that what

1090
00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:25,240
Speaker 1: he says?

1091
00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:26,120
Speaker 3: Totally?

1092
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:31,239
Speaker 1: He was like, and he was like kinda yeah. Yeah.

1093
00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:34,120
Speaker 2: So Matt Welch, who seemed to have the lead in

1094
00:54:34,160 --> 00:54:36,239
Speaker 2: every play, did he not go into the business.

1095
00:54:36,680 --> 00:54:40,480
Speaker 1: I don't know, but wait, you are You're incredible. That

1096
00:54:40,680 --> 00:54:44,160
Speaker 1: is a deep dive. No. I ran into him in

1097
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:46,520
Speaker 1: an airport. You don't know what he's doing. Yeah, I

1098
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:49,080
Speaker 1: ran into an airport. I didn't recognize him. Because he

1099
00:54:49,080 --> 00:54:51,640
Speaker 1: didn't have any more hair. Oh okay, you know, yeah,

1100
00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:53,520
Speaker 1: but it was lovely. Yeah.

1101
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:57,360
Speaker 2: The final question is very important to me spiritually culturally.

1102
00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 3: When is iced coffee season?

1103
00:55:00,880 --> 00:55:04,200
Speaker 1: M hmm, well, I have a I have sort of

1104
00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:09,319
Speaker 1: a complicated relationship with coffee these days. I've been I'm

1105
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:15,000
Speaker 1: a big backpacker and hiker, and I've moved into like

1106
00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:18,680
Speaker 1: green tea and mint tea when I'm out in the woods,

1107
00:55:18,719 --> 00:55:20,640
Speaker 1: and so I've tried to like bring that thing back

1108
00:55:20,680 --> 00:55:25,400
Speaker 1: into my life here. So I I swore off of

1109
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:31,600
Speaker 1: coffee about six months ago, and life is less good. Basically,

1110
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:36,200
Speaker 1: it's the answer is the answer, and I'm making I'm

1111
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:39,120
Speaker 1: making do. But but what's fun is like I do

1112
00:55:39,239 --> 00:55:42,400
Speaker 1: treat myself, you know, like every couple of weeks, I

1113
00:55:42,400 --> 00:55:45,360
Speaker 1: allow myself to have one and it is golden.

1114
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 2: If you were not off of coffee, what would you say?

1115
00:55:49,440 --> 00:55:50,520
Speaker 3: Iced coffee seasons.

1116
00:55:50,360 --> 00:55:55,760
Speaker 1: All year round in California, baby, all year round.

1117
00:55:55,880 --> 00:55:57,560
Speaker 3: It doesn't matter where you live, it's your.

1118
00:55:57,480 --> 00:56:00,480
Speaker 1: Right way way and got seasons. We got ice coffee.

1119
00:56:00,520 --> 00:56:01,000
Speaker 3: There you go.

1120
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:05,640
Speaker 2: I knew we'd get along. Mark du Plus, thank you

1121
00:56:05,719 --> 00:56:08,120
Speaker 2: so much. This was really really funny.

1122
00:56:08,120 --> 00:56:12,080
Speaker 1: You blessay, Thanks Pal, Thank you.

1123
00:56:12,120 --> 00:56:15,920
Speaker 2: Next week on Off the Cup, it's Andy Astroy, host

1124
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:18,400
Speaker 2: of In the back Room podcast.

1125
00:56:18,480 --> 00:56:21,759
Speaker 4: I Feel Like My Life is about highs, lows, tragedies,

1126
00:56:21,920 --> 00:56:26,920
Speaker 4: good times, love, heartbreak, insanity, and like I find myself,

1127
00:56:27,280 --> 00:56:30,879
Speaker 4: I have found myself in crazy situations.

1128
00:56:32,920 --> 00:56:35,160
Speaker 2: Off the Cup is a production of iHeart Podcasts as

1129
00:56:35,200 --> 00:56:38,240
Speaker 2: part of the Reasoned Choice Network. I'm your HOSTI Cupp

1130
00:56:38,640 --> 00:56:41,800
Speaker 2: editing and sound designed by Derek Clements. Our executive producers

1131
00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:45,279
Speaker 2: are meet Sie Cup, Lauren Hanson, and Lindsay Hoffman. If

1132
00:56:45,320 --> 00:56:47,800
Speaker 2: you like Off the Cup, please rate and review wherever

1133
00:56:47,840 --> 00:56:50,920
Speaker 2: you get your podcasts, follow, or subscribe for new episodes

1134
00:56:50,960 --> 00:56:58,279
Speaker 2: every Wednesday.