WEBVTT - Episode 8: Wanting To Hurt Stuff 0:00:00.040 --> 0:00:03.360 The Miniwak Caves is intended for mature audiences. It contains 0:00:03.400 --> 0:00:07.280 strong language and depictions of bullying, violence, and sexual assault 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:10.840 that some may find disturbing. Listener discretion is advised. Also, 0:00:10.920 --> 0:00:14.280 this is an extremely immersive experience and headphones are recommended. 0:00:23.079 --> 0:00:26.400 You're listening to The Maniwak Caves, a production of iHeartRadio, 0:00:27.000 --> 0:00:29.800 Blumhouse Television and Psycopia Pictures. 0:00:32.600 --> 0:00:36.960 Were there any other injuries of love there were? And 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:38.800 can you describe these wounds? 0:00:39.640 --> 0:00:42.559 There were puncture wounds and cuts. 0:00:44.520 --> 0:00:46.919 Was there anything about the pattern of these injuries that 0:00:46.920 --> 0:00:49.160 would indicate that type of weapon used? 0:00:50.000 --> 0:00:52.919 Insized wounds are caused most obviously by knives, but are 0:00:52.920 --> 0:00:58.000 also caused by well, scissors and even blunter instruments like screwdrivers. 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:03.120 These type wounds have certain They're usually slit like, but 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:06.520 when the object is removed or pulled from the flesh, 0:01:06.959 --> 0:01:11.199 the skin contracts, leaving a wound that is slightly shorter 0:01:11.319 --> 0:01:15.800 than the blade width. Also, the center wound often widens 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:20.360 a bit. Scissors stab wounds with closed scissors leave a 0:01:20.480 --> 0:01:24.080 Z shape like the ones found on these victims. 0:01:24.160 --> 0:01:30.560 Yes, so scissors like this pair here found in James 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:34.720 Pincher's house would certainly cause such injuries. 0:01:34.720 --> 0:01:36.000 Ejection, your honor. 0:01:36.040 --> 0:01:38.840 The expert is here to testify to factual matters. 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:43.080 Questions presented do not presuppose or suggests the answer. 0:01:43.400 --> 0:01:46.840 Your honor. We are only asking the expert's opinion. 0:01:46.880 --> 0:01:48.520 Here overruled. 0:01:49.200 --> 0:01:56.360 Can the prosecution please rephrase the question in your expert opinion? 0:01:56.880 --> 0:01:59.840 Could scissors like these found in the home with the 0:02:00.120 --> 0:02:04.440 choosed all such injuries? 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:19.720 Yes, August tenth, it's almost midnight. I'm at Denis Place. 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:24.560 I remember going to Solomon Smith's place. I remember getting 0:02:24.560 --> 0:02:27.680 out of my car and walking around his house. I 0:02:27.800 --> 0:02:30.959 remember strange, dear, and that's it. 0:02:32.240 --> 0:02:32.760 That's it. 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:37.839 Next thing I know, I'm sitting in a jail cell 0:02:38.200 --> 0:02:41.280 duly arrested me for arson, But anyone could tell that 0:02:41.320 --> 0:02:43.519 they were just trying to hold me in place while 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:45.960 they figured out all the short of details of how 0:02:46.000 --> 0:02:50.560 it happened, how the house burned down. They had nothing 0:02:50.560 --> 0:02:54.280 to go on. I called Joe Campbell and she called 0:02:54.280 --> 0:02:54.960 the Blanc. 0:02:56.800 --> 0:03:08.400 Made veil your stuff. Thanks, you got everything I believe, 0:03:08.440 --> 0:03:16.680 so you're freety, go mister Sauce, mister lebloc. 0:03:17.720 --> 0:03:19.560 Look, I'm really sorry for all the trouble. 0:03:20.400 --> 0:03:21.880 I don't know what happened exactly. 0:03:21.919 --> 0:03:23.679 I was just trying to find out more about what 0:03:23.840 --> 0:03:24.560 Solomon Smith. 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:28.400 Yeah, let's not overthink it. There's a lot happening and 0:03:28.480 --> 0:03:30.760 emotions are all on high. 0:03:30.880 --> 0:03:31.959 How much was my veil? 0:03:32.120 --> 0:03:35.400 Don't worry about that right now. Pulled a few strings, 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:37.360 I was able to get it considerably reduced. You will 0:03:37.400 --> 0:03:39.960 have to come back for an arrangement, okay, But the 0:03:40.040 --> 0:03:43.160 important thing is that you're all right. I want you 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:45.120 to get some rest. You and insisted you stay with 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:47.480 her tonight. But between us, I think it would be 0:03:47.480 --> 0:03:48.640 best for you not to overstay. 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:49.200 You're welcome. 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:51.839 We need her calm and collected right now. We don't 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:54.680 need her playing hostess this week. Of course, she's outside. 0:03:55.160 --> 0:03:56.600 You ride with her, and I'm gonna meet you all 0:03:56.640 --> 0:03:58.280 over there and every group in a bit after I 0:03:58.360 --> 0:04:02.280 take care of some court documents. I still need your signature, though, 0:04:02.600 --> 0:04:05.040 right I'm afraid we're out of time for any changes. 0:04:05.080 --> 0:04:07.000 But this clearly states that your two thousand and seven 0:04:07.080 --> 0:04:08.400 testimony was false. 0:04:10.200 --> 0:04:10.840 And Julian. 0:04:11.840 --> 0:04:17.799 They found Tyler Wilson were on Griff Washington's property. Apparently 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:23.000 he had some homemade explosives. We think he was trying 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:24.520 to blow up the entrance to the cave. 0:04:27.600 --> 0:04:30.000 Is he he's dead? 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:49.919 The piece of. 0:04:50.120 --> 0:04:57.960 Dom to you, the true blood, like the suit. 0:05:00.360 --> 0:05:02.400 To leave behind. 0:05:05.480 --> 0:05:10.760 They were about to press charges, but it was Dinah retaliated. 0:05:11.800 --> 0:05:14.920 The DNA test proven Deacon was the father of her 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:19.000 own born child. She rebunded with a proof of the 0:05:19.000 --> 0:05:21.640 Happy Boy's own guilt if any legal moves were made 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:24.920 against her brother, and so she created a stalemate. 0:05:26.080 --> 0:05:27.200 If her brother was going to. 0:05:27.240 --> 0:05:31.680 Jail, so were Bobby Hadley's sons. And if Bobby would 0:05:31.720 --> 0:05:35.400 back down, she'd keep the right out of the papers 0:05:35.400 --> 0:05:37.920 and no one would ever know about it. 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:44.360 Somebody scream like, hell no, we'll see by Luke. 0:05:49.720 --> 0:05:50.200 When you. 0:05:53.760 --> 0:05:57.000 Totally I'm telling you that's no pluck, not run around 0:05:57.040 --> 0:06:05.800 feel get your hand right. 0:06:07.480 --> 0:06:07.920 They can't. 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.200 We'll be held against you in a court of law, 0:06:11.000 --> 0:06:11.919 don't mocker. 0:06:19.920 --> 0:06:28.680 Dina, I'm so sorry you keep saying that. Jesus, what 0:06:28.720 --> 0:06:29.880 the fuck is wrong with you? 0:06:31.200 --> 0:06:34.640 Jesus? Could you believe this? 0:06:34.680 --> 0:06:37.120 Say the first time I've been to the shriff station today, Julian. 0:06:38.200 --> 0:06:39.960 They also arrested my son last night. 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:43.240 Oh no, Dina, on you're what. 0:06:44.800 --> 0:06:50.160 Oh wait, let me guess you're sorry. He snuck out 0:06:50.200 --> 0:06:53.520 again and they caught him smashing windows at Carter High School. 0:06:53.760 --> 0:06:58.719 What excellent question. All he said was it wasn't his idea, 0:06:59.360 --> 0:07:00.800 said his friends told him to do it. 0:07:01.800 --> 0:07:03.159 Well, that's the fucking thing, Julian. 0:07:03.200 --> 0:07:04.920 I don't know who Jimmy's friends are, which is why 0:07:04.920 --> 0:07:14.160 I'm so fucking troubled. And also I heard about Tyler. 0:07:16.960 --> 0:07:19.080 I know he was your friend. So now I guess 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:22.800 it's my turn to say it. I'm sorry, Julia. 0:07:24.400 --> 0:07:26.560 Yeah, well I don't know what to think. 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:29.640 How about we just be quiet? 0:07:31.040 --> 0:07:47.680 Sure you can't ever escape it, Dina was riding. 0:07:48.320 --> 0:07:51.600 This town is like purgatory for her, most of all 0:07:52.240 --> 0:07:54.840 a series of winding pass all leading the dead hands 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:59.080 unbreakable cycles. The poor stay poor, the rich day rich, 0:07:59.160 --> 0:08:04.800 the victims stay victimized. She might have made it out 0:08:05.040 --> 0:08:07.440 a long time ago, if it hadn't a been for 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:11.160 what happened. I found this yearbook on the table here 0:08:11.200 --> 0:08:13.760 in Dena's house, caught her high class of seven. 0:08:14.640 --> 0:08:15.600 We were babies. 0:08:16.520 --> 0:08:20.560 I've forgotten how long my hair was. That finch was 0:08:20.560 --> 0:08:24.040 in there, his eyes like that of a child. During 0:08:24.040 --> 0:08:29.119 the war, and Tyler with his mullet and shit eating grin, 0:08:29.760 --> 0:08:34.439 looking authentically tough. I flipped past his picture before getting 0:08:34.480 --> 0:08:38.560 lost in thought, I'm not yet ready to deal with 0:08:38.600 --> 0:08:43.720 the idea that he's no longer here. Then I saw 0:08:43.800 --> 0:08:49.120 Dina's picture, maybe the last picture taken of her previous self, 0:08:50.080 --> 0:08:53.160 last image from across the border and time and space 0:08:53.240 --> 0:08:56.199 that separates what she is now from who. 0:08:56.040 --> 0:08:58.840 She could have been. Now. 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:03.000 She's a single mom with a shit job, working her 0:09:03.120 --> 0:09:07.440 ass off to support her delinquente son, Jimmy, no family, 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:11.360 no support in a town that scorns her, all for 0:09:11.480 --> 0:09:14.360 the slim hope that she can somehow right all the 0:09:14.400 --> 0:09:18.560 wrongs that she herself never committed, Long hours on her feet, 0:09:18.840 --> 0:09:22.440 bagging groceries for people who whisper behind her back, just 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:25.240 to pay the rent on a rickety shthole house at 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:31.840 the edge of town, Her child unclaimed by his paternal family, who, 0:09:31.880 --> 0:09:34.680 with the stroke of a pen could cast light into 0:09:34.720 --> 0:09:37.440 a dim present and give hope to an uncertain future. 0:09:41.600 --> 0:09:47.240 Dina was isolated. She and Jimmy were alone, alone in 0:09:47.280 --> 0:09:51.320 the world. Why didn't you take Jimmy and leave this place? 0:09:51.600 --> 0:09:53.920 A beast, get the hell out of Potsville for crass sakes. 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:56.880 I guess when you're alone in the world, running away 0:09:56.880 --> 0:09:58.880 to some other part of it doesn't really change much. 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:07.120 Probably a little clutter. 0:10:07.280 --> 0:10:09.560 So oh, seriously, don't worry about it. 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:17.480 Jimmy, Caroline, Hey, miss Fincher, is is everything? 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:18.959 Okay? Where's Jimmy? 0:10:19.160 --> 0:10:20.960 He's in his room. 0:10:21.120 --> 0:10:21.840 How was a lesson? 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:26.440 He wouldn't come out. What do you mean he locked 0:10:26.520 --> 0:10:28.200 himself in his room and wouldn't let me in either. 0:10:29.240 --> 0:10:34.480 He called me some nasty things, well things, It's okay. 0:10:34.520 --> 0:10:36.439 I don't want to talk about it, so there was 0:10:36.480 --> 0:10:37.040 no lesson. 0:10:37.520 --> 0:10:38.480 I tried to call you. 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:44.400 I'm sorry, Caroline. I don't know what's gotten into him. 0:10:44.440 --> 0:10:48.480 Well, if I may say so, I think it's his friends. 0:10:49.320 --> 0:10:50.000 Friends. 0:10:50.600 --> 0:10:53.040 He keeps talking about them, says they told him to 0:10:53.080 --> 0:10:53.360 call me. 0:10:53.480 --> 0:10:56.320 What he called me were other kids over today? 0:10:57.000 --> 0:11:01.280 No, I maybe his high school friends. I don't I 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:02.199 have to go home. 0:11:02.040 --> 0:11:03.199 Now, let me just. 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:07.199 Thirty Okay, it's okay. 0:11:07.280 --> 0:11:08.880 Like I said, there was no lesson. 0:11:08.679 --> 0:11:12.199 So that's not your fault, though, please take it. 0:11:12.440 --> 0:11:14.440 I'm sorry, Miss Fincher. I think this is gonna need 0:11:14.480 --> 0:11:15.400 to be my last session. 0:11:15.520 --> 0:11:18.520 Wait, what what did he say? To you. 0:11:18.880 --> 0:11:22.720 It wasn't that. It's before he went to his room. 0:11:22.760 --> 0:11:23.160 He was. 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:30.680 Inappropriate. He he touched me, groped me. 0:11:31.160 --> 0:11:36.360 Oh my god, Caroline, I don't know what to say. 0:11:36.559 --> 0:11:40.120 Sorry, I need to go. 0:11:40.120 --> 0:11:41.000 God damn it. 0:11:42.640 --> 0:11:46.480 James Morgan Fincher get out here. Now, you mind brewing 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.720 some coffee filters above the coffee maker grounds or in 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:53.120 that jar. Joe and Ed are gonna be here any minute, Jimmy, 0:11:53.160 --> 0:11:54.280 I swear to God. 0:11:55.679 --> 0:11:57.040 What the fuck'll comment? 0:11:57.200 --> 0:11:57.440 God? 0:11:58.360 --> 0:12:01.080 I tried not to listen in but that's when I 0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:03.000 noticed the yearbook on the table. 0:12:03.600 --> 0:12:04.880 I picked it up in some truck. 0:12:05.080 --> 0:12:06.200 Did you ever lock the door again? 0:12:06.240 --> 0:12:08.360 I'll take it off the fucking hinges? Now look at me, 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:16.480 brook me in the eye. What what did you do? 0:12:17.720 --> 0:12:18.040 Nothing? 0:12:18.520 --> 0:12:20.160 What the hell happened with Caroline? 0:12:20.240 --> 0:12:23.240 Jimmy, what happened? 0:12:23.280 --> 0:12:23.960 Said? Nothing? 0:12:24.880 --> 0:12:25.679 Did you touch her? 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:31.080 They made me do it? Who made you do what? 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:33.480 It tacked me? Had to tell her she was nothing 0:12:33.520 --> 0:12:37.920 but a fat breader. I'm sorry what I didn't. 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:39.400 Want to say? Why did you? 0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:40.160 Because I damned me? 0:12:40.280 --> 0:12:41.280 You called me a pussy? 0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:42.640 They said that was gonna hurt my burn? 0:12:42.800 --> 0:12:43.120 Who? 0:12:44.280 --> 0:12:44.480 Who? 0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:45.920 Jimmy? 0:12:46.960 --> 0:12:47.360 Shots? 0:12:47.720 --> 0:12:51.959 What times are these boys from your school? No, then, boo, 0:12:52.400 --> 0:12:56.000 it's none of your damn business. You are mistaken about that? 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:59.400 Who God's from a cane? 0:13:00.120 --> 0:13:00.320 Wait? 0:13:00.440 --> 0:13:05.080 What what did you just say? I told you to 0:13:05.200 --> 0:13:09.400 never ever ever go there? Have you been going there? 0:13:09.480 --> 0:13:09.840 Jimmy? 0:13:10.040 --> 0:13:11.480 No, I didn't go there. 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:17.800 They're just from there, Jimmy, we are and I've done 0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:20.040 with this conversation. You are grounded in definitely. 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:23.840 No video games, no TV, and don't forget the feet 0:13:23.880 --> 0:13:27.040 and start to give the dog as medicine. 0:13:28.160 --> 0:13:31.760 Hey, Dina, I'm fine to find another hotel. 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:32.960 Standing here is too much. 0:13:34.679 --> 0:13:35.120 What's that? 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:36.599 Oh? 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:39.000 I saw this lying on the table with you're old 0:13:39.120 --> 0:13:39.600 year book. 0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:41.760 I figured it was yours or finches. 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:48.280 No, my, mone come on in hope. 0:13:48.320 --> 0:13:49.840 The driver wasn't too bad for you. 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:52.840 Ran some weather near Johnson City, But that's to be 0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:54.040 expected this time of. 0:13:54.120 --> 0:13:56.080 Year, ain't Julian. 0:13:56.720 --> 0:13:57.920 We were worried about. 0:13:59.200 --> 0:13:59.880 Who the hell can that? 0:14:01.040 --> 0:14:03.360 We expecting any more surprise guests? 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:10.440 There know nothing I know of? Can I help you? 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:16.199 Comm well? 0:14:16.200 --> 0:14:16.800 Who is it? 0:14:19.600 --> 0:14:20.840 Jesus Christ? 0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:39.480 Bobby Hadley, Hey, folks, this is Bobby Hadley of Hadley 0:14:39.520 --> 0:14:40.560 Pontiac Chevrolet. 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:43.680 And if there's one thing I know, it's the importance 0:14:43.680 --> 0:14:46.920 of family. With my dad had Big Bobby first open 0:14:46.960 --> 0:14:50.520 Hadley Pontiac Chevrolet. He had one goal in mind to 0:14:50.600 --> 0:14:54.400 give you and your family a safe, reliable ride home, 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:57.760 had a fair price. We've carried on that family tradition. 0:14:57.840 --> 0:15:00.000 Isn't that right, honey, that's right baby. 0:15:00.360 --> 0:15:03.160 This month we're running a special on these gorgeous family 0:15:03.240 --> 0:15:05.320 bands to take your kids to school or to camp 0:15:05.360 --> 0:15:06.720 out during summer break. 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:10.200 Oh you got something to add, Thomas, just as the 0:15:10.240 --> 0:15:14.400 prices are out of this world. Good job, son, Hey Diacon, 0:15:14.880 --> 0:15:16.040 ain't you got something to say? 0:15:17.080 --> 0:15:20.480 Adlee bonniec Chevrolet e't a family. 0:15:32.520 --> 0:15:34.600 I don't know how Bobby had. They couldn't have known 0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:37.120 he was raising monsters. 0:15:37.960 --> 0:15:38.600 They're checking, but. 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:49.760 There's a kind of benign neglect that leads to malignancy. 0:15:48.800 --> 0:15:53.400 Being't too soft to parent, leaving children to their own 0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:58.840 devices can make them into monsters. 0:16:00.040 --> 0:16:04.640 Well, and not be such a pussy. 0:16:05.680 --> 0:16:06.640 I'm just messing with you. 0:16:07.360 --> 0:16:11.479 Bobby and Mona were soft parents. Bobby busy with the dealership, 0:16:11.520 --> 0:16:13.880 Mona with her wine and the Women's Club of Pottsville. 0:16:15.120 --> 0:16:19.560 The boys did as they pleased, and. 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:21.119 We all know how that ended. 0:16:23.080 --> 0:16:23.720 At any rate. 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:26.120 After the Hathley brothers were found murdered at the mouth 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:28.680 of the cave, Bobby Havley went underground for a little 0:16:29.040 --> 0:16:29.800 to mourn. 0:16:30.440 --> 0:16:31.760 His whole future wiped away. 0:16:32.960 --> 0:16:36.000 Mona dealt with the loss differently. She left a week 0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:38.720 after the funeral, took half of their savings with her. 0:16:38.840 --> 0:16:43.560 As the story goes, maybe she couldn't stand all the ghosts. 0:16:45.280 --> 0:16:48.400 Bobby slowly returned to his business over the course of months, 0:16:48.680 --> 0:16:51.240 still made it to church Sundays, still went to the 0:16:51.240 --> 0:16:56.680 occasional town hall meeting, but he wasn't the same thinner, 0:16:56.840 --> 0:17:02.600 less joe, feel less, brash, just less, a man who 0:17:02.680 --> 0:17:07.720 had everything except the thing they counted. I know he 0:17:07.800 --> 0:17:11.199 must have known about his grandson, Denis baby Jimmy. Everyone 0:17:11.200 --> 0:17:13.280 else in town did. But he couldn't seem to reconcile 0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:16.080 the thought of his beloved sons being involved in an 0:17:16.080 --> 0:17:18.960 act that would lead to Jimmy's existence. And so he 0:17:19.040 --> 0:17:21.400 created a wall in his mind and in his heart. 0:17:22.520 --> 0:17:25.880 A wall of denial, and he kept his distance. 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:31.520 Until Jesus Christ. 0:17:33.640 --> 0:17:36.480 Bobby Hadley Deputy Campbell. 0:17:37.440 --> 0:17:38.760 It's just miss Campbell. 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:42.320 Now, mister Hadley, can you remember Julian Solace from the 0:17:42.359 --> 0:17:46.000 trial alsoome, Oh well I am, and this is James's 0:17:46.000 --> 0:17:52.159 defense attorney, mister the blank, you remember my brother, James Fincher. 0:17:55.359 --> 0:17:58.200 Let's see here to support our kids. 0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:04.160 Uh no, I'm here to talk to miss Fincher Dina 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.040 about what about the. 0:18:09.640 --> 0:18:13.199 About the boy, about Jimmy. 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:16.879 Uh yeah, I was connor. 0:18:20.680 --> 0:18:22.000 Let me get you some coffee. 0:18:23.000 --> 0:18:25.080 Ok, okay, we. 0:18:25.119 --> 0:18:25.800 Have sugar bowl. 0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:26.440 We're out of milk. 0:18:26.880 --> 0:18:30.399 Oh no, just black, thank you. 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:34.440 Dina went for the coffee and left Bobby standing there, 0:18:34.880 --> 0:18:38.639 sweat forming on his brow, his face red, struggling to 0:18:38.680 --> 0:18:41.560 Breathe normally staring at the pictures on the wall and 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:46.080 on the mantel, pictures a little Jimmy in his baseball uniform, 0:18:46.400 --> 0:18:49.080 Pictures of James Fincher too, from when he was a boy. 0:18:50.240 --> 0:18:52.800 I could see the wheel spinning behind his eyes. Maybe 0:18:52.840 --> 0:18:55.280 the first time he'd ever considered either of those people, 0:18:55.520 --> 0:18:59.040 James Fincher or his grandson Jimmy, as actual human beings. 0:19:00.800 --> 0:19:03.520 Nobody said a word until Dina came back with a 0:19:03.600 --> 0:19:04.440 mug of coffee. 0:19:05.280 --> 0:19:05.800 Here you go. 0:19:07.200 --> 0:19:10.240 What you got there the box? 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:19.159 Oh, it's just some family stuff for your son, for Jimmy, 0:19:21.200 --> 0:19:24.439 in case you in case you want him to know 0:19:24.600 --> 0:19:31.280 about the other side of his family, maybe we should 0:19:31.320 --> 0:19:32.119 step outside. 0:19:32.160 --> 0:19:37.359 No, you can say, everybody stay. What would you want 0:19:37.440 --> 0:19:39.040 him to know about the other side of his family, 0:19:39.040 --> 0:19:40.200 mister Hadley. 0:19:40.840 --> 0:19:44.400 Well, I just I thought, I thought, why are. 0:19:44.280 --> 0:19:47.600 You showing up right now here at my house? 0:19:47.960 --> 0:19:52.280 I just can I put the box down? Go on, 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:57.680 Miss Spencer. I didn't mean to intrude. I mean, I 0:19:59.160 --> 0:20:05.440 didn't have your number, but I've been thinking about well, 0:20:05.520 --> 0:20:08.960 the past and the future, and I've been thinking about 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:12.880 all that for a very long time now, and well, 0:20:12.920 --> 0:20:14.880 I didn't know. I didn't know whether I should ever 0:20:14.920 --> 0:20:17.640 try to contact you, or if you'd even well, you'd 0:20:17.680 --> 0:20:21.600 even be willing to listen. But now that I'm here, 0:20:21.800 --> 0:20:26.920 I'm just look, I'm really sorry about everything about how 0:20:27.960 --> 0:20:34.320 my God, about all the things that well, jeez, listen, 0:20:34.680 --> 0:20:40.840 I've been praying about it, yes I have. And Reverend 0:20:40.840 --> 0:20:44.360 Perkins came to me and suggested that maybe I come 0:20:44.440 --> 0:20:49.000 talk to you, and he did it unbidden, and I thought, well, 0:20:49.040 --> 0:20:52.960 I just thought, I thought, maybe that's something. Maybe that's 0:20:53.000 --> 0:20:58.960 the Lord telling me the Lord. Look, all I'm saying 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:06.040 is is I want to meet him, the boy Jimmy 0:21:07.440 --> 0:21:12.040 and and I don't know, just think about it, just 0:21:12.880 --> 0:21:17.639 pray on it. Maybe I don't know if you pray anyway, 0:21:19.320 --> 0:21:23.800 I guess just consider it and well. In the meantime, 0:21:23.800 --> 0:21:27.520 I brought some things about his history about us. Look 0:21:27.600 --> 0:21:34.000 them over. Please left my number in an envelope in 0:21:34.040 --> 0:21:37.879 the box. I'm gonna leave you all to it. 0:21:40.400 --> 0:21:49.199 Jesus Christ, cigarette break anybody. Dina went through the box immediately. 0:21:49.800 --> 0:21:54.240 Old pictures going back generations, xerox copies of diaries, birth certificates, 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:56.800 an old copy of the Bible inscribed to Mona Hadley, 0:21:57.200 --> 0:22:01.919 a little cross section of history, and then video tapes 0:22:02.560 --> 0:22:05.719 three or four Thomas and Deacon's names written in a 0:22:05.760 --> 0:22:08.879 neat feminine hand on the label, and an envelope with 0:22:08.960 --> 0:22:12.000 Dina's name and a slop ofier hand inside, a slip 0:22:12.040 --> 0:22:14.639 of paper with Bobby's sell number on it, and a 0:22:14.840 --> 0:22:19.159 check for ten thousand dollars with the memo reading for 0:22:19.240 --> 0:22:23.360 the future. We wrapped up the meeting shortly thereafter. 0:22:25.240 --> 0:22:30.320 Wanna beer, I don't know whiskey. 0:22:32.119 --> 0:22:36.600 Yes, you don't have to watch the tapes, of course 0:22:36.640 --> 0:22:37.000 I do. 0:22:37.240 --> 0:22:38.840 Why do you think I'm offering you booze. 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:43.359 Huh, you're gonna consider letting them in? 0:22:45.720 --> 0:22:46.199 I don't know. 0:22:48.040 --> 0:22:50.520 On one hand, that family always seemed drawn to the core. 0:22:51.720 --> 0:22:55.040 On the other, it's an escape plan. 0:22:56.080 --> 0:22:59.440 He could go to college, he could get the fuck 0:22:59.480 --> 0:23:03.720 out of here. Yeah, come, old James, think if I 0:23:03.760 --> 0:23:04.399 did let him in. 0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:11.040 I feel like you do understand, Dina, I really do. 0:23:14.320 --> 0:23:17.399 Well the courage Dan. 0:23:19.119 --> 0:23:19.280 Here. 0:23:23.600 --> 0:23:27.720 The videotapes were just what you'd think old family movies 0:23:28.200 --> 0:23:30.280 or with the people you hate most in the world 0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:34.600 Thomas and d can plain t ball, cub Scout. 0:23:34.320 --> 0:23:35.320 Pine with derbies. 0:23:36.720 --> 0:23:39.320 I watched Dina watch these boys at first with a 0:23:39.400 --> 0:23:46.879 cold glare and then an intense sort of curiosity, and 0:23:46.920 --> 0:23:47.800 then I fell asleep. 0:23:49.880 --> 0:23:52.359 Okay, okay, now do the people. 0:23:53.800 --> 0:23:55.040 Julian wake up? 0:24:00.359 --> 0:24:00.679 I'm up. 0:24:00.720 --> 0:24:02.200 I'm up, I'm up. 0:24:02.320 --> 0:24:05.320 Hey, hey, hey, you fell asleep in front of the TV. 0:24:06.640 --> 0:24:08.360 Well so I did. 0:24:09.960 --> 0:24:12.040 Sorry, it's a whiskey. 0:24:12.480 --> 0:24:14.440 Why don't you guy splash some water on your face 0:24:14.440 --> 0:24:15.480 and I'll finish up dinner. 0:24:15.960 --> 0:24:18.920 That sounds good. 0:24:24.040 --> 0:24:25.320 Yeah, thanks. 0:24:31.680 --> 0:24:33.520 A little fucking monstership. 0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:34.320 That's right. 0:24:34.440 --> 0:24:36.400 You're thinking we were born bad? All right? 0:24:37.320 --> 0:24:39.760 I mean that's out the old man things. He thinks 0:24:39.760 --> 0:24:47.879 he made us monsters want the fuck. 0:24:48.160 --> 0:24:48.360 Right. 0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:51.040 Then the lightning strunk a transformer outside of Tina's house 0:24:51.080 --> 0:24:52.040 and the power went out. 0:24:53.400 --> 0:24:53.680 Fuck. 0:24:54.920 --> 0:24:57.320 I moved to the window and saw the fog was back, 0:24:58.040 --> 0:25:01.160 along with hundreds of screeching bats flapping by the window. 0:25:01.200 --> 0:25:10.000 And minute, hey mm, put in the mailbox. 0:25:11.119 --> 0:25:13.400 Oh shit, alright. 0:25:13.560 --> 0:25:14.440 The bottles up. 0:25:16.920 --> 0:25:21.000 Except for the TV. That is, the images of young 0:25:21.040 --> 0:25:23.600 Thomas and Deacon still flickering across the screen. 0:25:23.760 --> 0:25:29.920 I mean that try the best, I guess, but there's 0:25:30.000 --> 0:25:34.160 only so much you can do outside influences and all. 0:25:37.600 --> 0:25:38.200 I ain't shit. 0:25:39.800 --> 0:25:44.520 My earliest memories are wanting to hurt stuff. I guess 0:25:44.600 --> 0:25:46.240