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Speaker 1: Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic

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Speaker 1: episode was.

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Speaker 2: Produced by the team at Pandora Ladies and Gentlemen. This

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Speaker 2: QLs classic we're about to present is one of my

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Speaker 2: personal favorites.

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Speaker 1: That's writing my personal favorites. You know.

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Speaker 2: I always say, if you want to know about your

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Speaker 2: favorite artists, you kind of got to get in with

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Speaker 2: their circle. Well, this Great Film Games episode is an

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Speaker 2: amazing example. His Stevie Wonder, Michael Jackson, and Quincy Jones

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Speaker 2: stories are gold, solid gold. This is one of my

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Speaker 2: top ten of all time QLs episodes. It's funny, informative,

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Speaker 2: dramatic and amazing. Here it is the Great Filling Games

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Speaker 2: QLs classic Part one.

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Speaker 1: All right, here we go Hit It one two three, sub.

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Speaker 3: Premo, sub Bramo, Subprema Sun Sun, Subprema Role Call Son

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Speaker 3: Son Supremo, Role called Supreme, So Supremeo.

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Speaker 4: Roll Games is the man. Yeah, HiT's on the shelf. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: but on Michaels, don't stop to getting up? Yeah, did

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Speaker 4: that bridge is right itself?

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Speaker 5: Supreme Sun, Supreme Roll Call Suprema Son Sun Supremo Roll Called.

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Speaker 1: My name is Fante. Yeah, and I'm a winner. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: With filling gangs. Yeah, now let it simmer.

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Speaker 5: Supre Supremo roll call Supremo, Supremo roll call.

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Speaker 1: My name is Sugar. Yeah, I got the sugars. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm having significant pains.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I'm making significant games.

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Speaker 5: Supremo roll call, Supreme Son Son Supremo.

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Speaker 1: Roll call Sunshine Yeah moonlight.

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Speaker 5: Yeah good Yeah, blame it on Supreme Son Son Supreme

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Speaker 5: Suprema Son Son Supremo roll like yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 6: I can't help it. Yeah, Greg, Yeah, the reason you

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Speaker 6: felt it?

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Speaker 5: Call Supreme Son said Rome Suprema.

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Speaker 1: Why you're around?

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Speaker 5: Wow?

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Speaker 1: Called my name is Greg.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with a mir Yeah, but I can't believe,

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Speaker 2: Yeah that he's right here.

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Speaker 5: Supprema Son some Supremo role came Subprema Son Son Supremo

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Speaker 5: role called Suprema Son Son Supremo.

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Speaker 1: Roll called Suprema something some Supreme roll call. Yes, Yes,

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Speaker 1: I am right here. Wow, what's up? Y'all? Welcome to

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Speaker 1: another episode of Quest Love.

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Speaker 4: I mean, we are live at United Recording Studios, the

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Speaker 4: legendary United Recording Studios. I believe that this is where

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Speaker 4: Frank Sinatra and many a.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this Man's World recorded here too.

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Speaker 2: The other room here here yes, yes, we're in the legendary,

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Speaker 2: legendary United Recording sten.

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Speaker 4: I'm just let the QLs listeners know that our guest

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Speaker 4: today always always accuses me of putting my nerdom for

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Speaker 4: useless music trivia information ahead of our friendship. Absolutely, so

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Speaker 4: I will start off before I even start the the

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Speaker 4: the introductions, I will just start with Greg filling games.

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Speaker 1: How are you? Then?

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Speaker 2: I mean, I'm just fine, And it's so good to

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Speaker 2: see you at the beginning of twenty eighteen.

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Speaker 4: Yes, it's great to see too, all right, So, ladies

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Speaker 4: and gentlemen, welcome to the quest Siphony.

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Speaker 1: Our guest today is one.

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Speaker 4: Of the heaviest heavyweights of musicians and producers and arrangers.

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Speaker 4: This is the man that you call when you want

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Speaker 4: the special sauce or as Marlon Jackson said, now it's soup.

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Speaker 4: I've never heard that served my life, but he said,

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Speaker 4: we got we got.

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Speaker 1: Filling Games involved. Yeah, now it's soup. Wow, he said that. Yes,

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Speaker 1: he said that.

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Speaker 2: He says a lot of wacky things.

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Speaker 1: Well, I kind of understood what he meant. And you know,

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Speaker 1: your your your presence on you know when you read

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Speaker 1: some of.

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Speaker 4: Our our favorite records and and and productions of of

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Speaker 4: the last forty years. Your name is always involved on

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Speaker 4: some of the most life changing albums that we've experienced,

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Speaker 4: and we want to welcome Greg filling Games to of course,

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Speaker 4: you know why I love you.

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Speaker 2: Mayor because you're you're such an intense nerd about this

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Speaker 2: curator of this, but you're you're keeping the history alive.

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Speaker 1: But you're doing it in the creepiest way possible.

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Speaker 2: No no, no, no, no, no no, no, seriously, all

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Speaker 2: jokes aside, you're doing it in in the absolute best

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Speaker 2: way possible. You're you're making it fun. You're using your

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Speaker 2: platform from your celebrity to do this. And I for one,

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Speaker 2: really appreciate because I don't get out very often these

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Speaker 2: days because I'm older now and I have twin boys

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Speaker 2: who are almost three they'll be three. That's that's a

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Speaker 2: whole and my twelve year old daughter. But but you know,

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Speaker 2: I'm I'm older now, and you know, it's it's a

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Speaker 2: new day and it's a new world out there, and

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Speaker 2: you know, I'm just trying to stay with it.

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Speaker 1: So I appreciate.

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Speaker 4: But the thing is is that you've you've made some

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Speaker 4: of the best graffiti that will never ever be replaced

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Speaker 4: no matter what. And yeah, and even if people don't know,

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Speaker 4: like it's it's there, like it's no racing the history.

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Speaker 2: Well it's I've been very, very blessed in that way.

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Speaker 2: And it's true. I've always said, you know, my whole career,

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Speaker 2: those that know no and those that don't don't, And

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Speaker 2: it's fine with me. And actually I kind of preferred

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Speaker 2: that way because I love. This happens to me all

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Speaker 2: the time. You know, I'll be talking to someone who

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Speaker 2: has no clue of who I am, right, and they

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Speaker 2: so you play, you play, you're you're a musician.

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Speaker 1: I go, yeah, oh what do you play? Keyboards? Oh?

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Speaker 1: You in the band?

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Speaker 2: I said, well, I've been in a couple of bands,

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Speaker 2: but you know, and I mean, I just I loved it.

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Speaker 2: And I have this I have this thing playing in

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Speaker 2: my head. Like I was at this incredible museum the

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Speaker 2: other day called another cup museum. It's over in Silmar,

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Speaker 2: and the curator of all these incredible musical instruments actually

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Speaker 2: a mirror. You should see it because it's unbelievable and

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Speaker 2: and he one of the things on display was was

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Speaker 2: an actual gramophone. And I mentioned to the guy, I said, well,

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Speaker 2: you know, you can explain to the to the to

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Speaker 2: the tourists there that gramophone is you know where where

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Speaker 2: the term Grammy came from? You know, the Grammy Awards,

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Speaker 2: you know is Yeah, you're absolutely right, he says, you

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Speaker 2: ever been to the Grammys?

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Speaker 1: It's really fun.

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Speaker 2: And so I have this thing when I get asked

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Speaker 2: a question like that, this this this vision runs through

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Speaker 2: my mind of like, you know, different times that I've

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Speaker 2: mded the Grammys, like you know, like for the segment

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Speaker 2: or the segment, and so these things go through my

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Speaker 2: head before I answer the question, going yes, I've been

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Speaker 2: there a few times, but I never explained that. But

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Speaker 2: I just go, yeah, I've been a few times, and

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Speaker 2: it's hysterical.

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Speaker 4: You acknowledge it because I'm just trying to throw off

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Speaker 4: the set, like yeah, hear that a lot.

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Speaker 1: But now well sometimes I do that too, you know.

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Speaker 2: But it's it's always fun engaging in those conversations and

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Speaker 2: still leaving the people not having a clue ifore I am.

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Speaker 1: I love that. No, but you never been like yo,

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Speaker 1: you're that intro and we are the world.

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Speaker 2: Yeah no, no, no, no, okay, no, so something are

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Speaker 2: better left?

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Speaker 4: Actually you're you're my favorite type of person to interview

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Speaker 4: because often you said that the other night. But I'm

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Speaker 4: gonna say what's weird is that often when people are

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Speaker 4: in the eye of the storm or inside the tornado,

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Speaker 4: they really can't give you a good perspective. And I'm

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Speaker 4: saying that he has great stories. But for me, in

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Speaker 4: talking to engineers is way better than talking.

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Speaker 1: To like the guy. Yeah, like I'd rather talk to Susan.

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Speaker 4: Rogers about Prince's work habits than Prince himself.

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Speaker 1: You know what I mean.

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Speaker 2: That's okay, right, because you'll get that, Yeah, you'll get

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Speaker 2: a different times exactly. And I feel as though you're

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Speaker 2: probably the best eyewitness to some crazy historic shit. I

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Speaker 2: mean just between songs in the Key of Life and

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Speaker 2: Thriller and I mean the list stop right there, like

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Speaker 2: the average person's whole.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll give you that. So where you originally from Detroit?

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Speaker 1: You're from the D.

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Speaker 2: I'm from the D east side or west side. Well,

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Speaker 2: it started in Highland, like you know, listen.

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Speaker 1: Some of you know some of my my key records

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Speaker 1: were created in Detroit as well.

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Speaker 4: I'm a lover of Detroit, Okay, but I know that

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Speaker 4: people from the West Side sometimes front and tell me

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Speaker 4: east side for some credibility, right, so I wanted to

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Speaker 4: know where you east side or west?

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Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I don't need credit.

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Speaker 1: See I already know your west side because you didn't

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Speaker 1: even say what up though.

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Speaker 2: To No, No, Actually I started in Highland Park if

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Speaker 2: you know that, which virtually doesn't exist anymore. And then

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Speaker 2: I moved to the northwest side by eight mile. Okay,

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Speaker 2: all right, I see, So you're you're, you're your your

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Speaker 2: credigenous are still there?

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Speaker 4: You're in there side. Note when you read the purple

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Speaker 4: ring uh liner notes, Prince actually gives.

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Speaker 6: A what up?

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Speaker 4: Though, Oh yeah, really he gives what up to Billy

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Speaker 4: Sparks from Detroit from Detroit, So.

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Speaker 2: Are you as far as your your your era or

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Speaker 2: your your period of growing up. We've also interviewed Ray

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Speaker 2: Parker Jr. On the show, So lord, how did how

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Speaker 2: did that go?

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Speaker 1: Amazing? How did you manage to leave? Because we didn't

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Speaker 1: want to? No.

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Speaker 2: One loves talking about themselves more than.

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Speaker 1: I love Ray.

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Speaker 2: But he knows, he knows what it's like. You know,

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Speaker 2: you sit him down and you want to hear more

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Speaker 2: about me. Great, later that same week, you want to

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Speaker 2: hear more he makes it entertaining, but he basically said

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Speaker 2: that for or from Stevie's Music of My Mind period

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Speaker 2: up until fulfilling this first finale, he basically wanted, you know.

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Speaker 1: All Detroit Cats and his crew as his band.

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Speaker 2: And I didn't know if that was just a preference

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Speaker 2: of the something water in Detroit or he just wanted

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Speaker 2: to make sure that all the homeboys on the block

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Speaker 2: got gigs or that sort of thing.

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Speaker 1: But you're incigdnifically younger, though, So how you come to

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Speaker 1: his attention?

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Speaker 2: I don't Oh really, you don't know the story. Okay, Well,

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Speaker 2: settle back and I'll tell you the whole thing.

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Speaker 1: Yes, that's what we.

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Speaker 2: Want fire hats with well, Uncle Greg, but Uncle Greg, Yeah, Well,

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Speaker 2: hello kids, let me tell you about So this is

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Speaker 2: what happened. It's a year after I graduated. I'm in Detroit.

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Speaker 2: I graduated high school, which was cast Tech in nineteen

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Speaker 2: and seventy four, and I was very excited and very

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Speaker 2: much looking forward to going to college because you know.

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Speaker 1: That's just what you did.

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Speaker 2: And I, you know, it was like straight out of

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Speaker 2: the Charlie Brown comics. I got my little Joe cool

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Speaker 2: briefcase and I was like, I'm going to college. I

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Speaker 2: went to Wayne State, and I gradually just started sucking

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Speaker 2: at everything, even the even the subjects I liked, Like

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Speaker 2: I really liked psychology sucking.

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Speaker 1: Wait, you were there for music.

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Speaker 2: It was a Liberal arts. I took a Liberal Arts

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Speaker 2: because I was lazy and I didn't want to, you know, anything.

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Speaker 2: So I took a liberal arts course and one of

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Speaker 2: the courses was psychology. And I was really into it.

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Speaker 2: But I sucked. I just could not get it together,

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Speaker 2: you know. And so I remember telling my mom that,

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Speaker 2: you know, college just wasn't working out, and she says, well,

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Speaker 2: you know, just give it another chance and and see

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Speaker 2: what happens. And I was gaining a lot of notoriety

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Speaker 2: in Detroit from playing in a couple of different bands

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Speaker 2: fairly regularly and playing around town. And I absolutely idolized

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Speaker 2: Steve Steve, you know, the whole I had posters of

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Speaker 2: him in my bedroom all and I really internalized, I

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Speaker 2: really absorbed his music. I was to his music what

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Speaker 2: you are to music in general. I mean I just

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Speaker 2: nerd it out, but not in a cerebral way like you,

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Speaker 2: more of an organic, spiritual musical way, you know. And

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Speaker 2: I mean I really connected with with his approach musically

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Speaker 2: and vocally, even though I was really shy about singing.

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Speaker 2: I would sing with him in the shower or whatever,

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Speaker 2: you know. And you know, I was just mesmerized by

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Speaker 2: by his covers of other things, his arrangement. I mean,

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Speaker 2: how do you go from v in my way?

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Speaker 1: Blame want to uh? You know, we can't work it out.

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Speaker 1: We don't work it out. I mean, who does that?

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Speaker 2: And not to not to mention the who does that

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Speaker 2: on a clavinet? So I was mesmerized, right. I remember

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Speaker 2: telling friends of mine in high school that I would

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Speaker 2: eventually play with Stevie wonder I don't know why I

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Speaker 2: did that. I don't know where that came from. Well,

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Speaker 2: actually I do it came from the Lord, because he

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Speaker 2: put that dream in me and I and I remember

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Speaker 2: just spewing it out, like telling people I was gonna

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Speaker 2: play with.

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Speaker 1: So here's what happened.

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Speaker 2: A dear, dear, dear friend of mine who's a drummer

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Speaker 2: was asked to audition for Steve in New York by

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Speaker 2: a former band member by a former Wonderland band member.

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Speaker 2: He got to my friend and asked and asked him

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Speaker 2: if he'd be interested in auditioning for Stevie in New York,

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Speaker 2: So the obvious answer was yes. The night before he left,

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Speaker 2: the night before my friend left, I went to see

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Speaker 2: him because I was just so thrilled for him, and

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Speaker 2: you know, he's packing, and you know, we're talking and

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Speaker 2: we're all excited and everything. But he insisted that I

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Speaker 2: play some things on a cassette and he would give

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Speaker 2: that cassette to Steve. This is the kind of friend

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Speaker 2: he was, so he insisted I do this. So I

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Speaker 2: played some things, but I played I remember one of

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Speaker 2: the things I played was you are the Sunshine of

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Speaker 2: My Life, but I played it the same way he

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Speaker 2: did on the record, to kind of let him know

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Speaker 2: I understand, spoke to how you're right, how he thinks.

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Speaker 1: And I played some other things, including sun.

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Speaker 2: Goddess, I remember playing it, and I played like maybe

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Speaker 2: one or two other things, and then he my friend

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Speaker 2: took the cassette and flew to New York the next day,

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Speaker 2: and it seemed like time stopped. I don't know how

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Speaker 2: long he was there, but I remember, uh, one day,

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Speaker 2: maybe two three days later, my friend called me early

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Speaker 2: in the morning and said.

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Speaker 1: Stevie wonderwats to see you in New York today? Wow?

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Speaker 2: Exactly. So I'm running around the house screaming like a banshie.

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Speaker 2: My mom My mom is like, you know, she's on

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Speaker 2: her way to work. You know, she was working at

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Speaker 2: a hospital. I said, director of nurses, And she said, but.

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Speaker 1: What's the matter with you? What did you do it?

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Speaker 2: So I so She's like, well, just bring clean underwear,

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Speaker 2: no matter what, no matter how bad of an accident

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Speaker 2: you get. If you die, the first thing your mother's

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Speaker 2: gonna ask was his under the work or then he stands.

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Speaker 2: That's all they want to know. So now, but I'm

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Speaker 2: asked to go to New York that day, but I'm

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Speaker 2: also asked to stop by Stevie's house to pick up

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Speaker 2: one of his brothers. So now I'm sitting inside Stevie

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Speaker 2: Wonders and I knew where he lived. There were many

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Speaker 2: of us that knew where he lived. But now I'm

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Speaker 2: sitting inside the house.

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Speaker 1: Going, Okay, well I'm just here sitting inside Stevie Wonder's house.

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Speaker 2: All right, I'm just waiting for his brother, one of

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Speaker 2: his brothers to come down and we're gonna go to

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Speaker 2: the airport, all right, let me just absorb this right now.

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Speaker 2: So Timothy comes down, we go to the airport. Now

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Speaker 2: there are a few backstories.

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Speaker 1: Now.

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Speaker 2: The first backstory is, remember I was telling you how

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Speaker 2: I was sucking in college and Mom said to give

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Speaker 2: it one more try, and I remember saying to myself,

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Speaker 2: all right, look, I'm gonna try this one more time,

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Speaker 2: and I'm going to.

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Speaker 1: If nothing.

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Speaker 2: Earth shattering happens, I'll register for the spring quarter on

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Speaker 2: the last data register.

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Speaker 1: Okay, The day I was.

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Speaker 2: Leaving for the airport to meet Stevie in New York

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Speaker 2: was the final data register for the state. Look at God,

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Speaker 2: And I remember being on you know, going to the

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Speaker 2: metro report and it started snowing, you know, and it's

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Speaker 2: just like and it was April first, on top of

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Speaker 2: all that, so flat of New York. Get settled at

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Speaker 2: the hotel, going to the studio. I'm sitting on pins

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Speaker 2: and needles because I realized I'm about to meet my

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Speaker 2: idol that i'd only seen twice in concert before, and

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Speaker 2: I'm getting ready to meet this guy like face to face,

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Speaker 2: and I'm sitting I'm really trying to cool. The engineer

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Speaker 2: is just like, you know, we're making small talk but

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Speaker 2: I'm just your hand sweating. Everything is just I'm I'm

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Speaker 2: really just is this at the record play? This was

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Speaker 2: at the Hit Factory, the original one okay with the

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Speaker 2: one elevator and the.

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Speaker 1: Street Mariah carry boysmen in the elevator there.

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Speaker 2: You go and also known as the Greg Filling Gangs

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Speaker 2: elevator because I have a story about that, that particular elevator.

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Speaker 2: Yeah I do. It'll crack you up. But anyway, so

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Speaker 2: I'm waiting on Pensilan. Finally elevated door opens, and you know,

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Speaker 2: because you're you're in the studio and there's a monitor

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Speaker 2: that's there's a camera this pointing at the elevator to

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Speaker 2: see who goes in and out. Elevator door finally opens,

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Speaker 2: in out he comes he.

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Speaker 1: You know thing.

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00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,720
Speaker 2: His sister Rene is towing him and he just he

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Speaker 2: comes in.

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Speaker 1: And I go, oh my god, because you know, that's

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Speaker 1: what you do. Yeah, that is what you do.

341
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Speaker 2: You don't say, but this is what's going on. So

342
00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:08,720
Speaker 2: you know, and he's coming in and so they say

343
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Speaker 2: Steve Gregs here and so he how you doing? And

344
00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:17,800
Speaker 2: that handshake, that single handshake was a thing that changed

345
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Speaker 2: my life. We uh, from that point on, we made

346
00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:27,320
Speaker 2: small talk, and you know, he actually showed me, uh

347
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Speaker 2: an original unreleased song of his, and he wanted to

348
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Speaker 2: see if I could play it. I see, of course,

349
00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,320
Speaker 2: Well there's an answer for that mirror, and it was

350
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Speaker 2: called Spring High.

351
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Speaker 5: Oh.

352
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Speaker 1: He ended up cutting it on Ramsey Lewis.

353
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Speaker 2: You're good, You're good, You're good. You over there, you're good. Wow,

354
00:20:56,680 --> 00:20:57,960
Speaker 2: I've seen good. You're one of them.

355
00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:01,840
Speaker 1: So yes, but.

356
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Speaker 2: You know, at some point, you know, early on he

357
00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:06,399
Speaker 2: said it was going to give it to me, but

358
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Speaker 2: you know, I'm not better because I know and love

359
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:14,640
Speaker 2: Ramsey and it was fantastic. So that's the first song

360
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:19,119
Speaker 2: I learned. How about that? That was the first one

361
00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:22,840
Speaker 2: I learned, right.

362
00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,399
Speaker 1: Come on, you know, I didn't read my credits, but

363
00:21:27,440 --> 00:21:30,320
Speaker 1: I know that song very well. We have the h track, so.

364
00:21:31,840 --> 00:21:34,359
Speaker 2: Okay, okay, but when you think about it, how about

365
00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:48,439
Speaker 2: that chorus? He goes, right, so there, you know, Uh,

366
00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:51,359
Speaker 2: too bad. I don't have a keyboard anyway, don't say that.

367
00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:56,880
Speaker 2: But but yeah, So that was the first one I learned.

368
00:21:56,920 --> 00:22:03,159
Speaker 2: Now that's the night of April Fools. Next day is

369
00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:04,439
Speaker 2: more of the formal audition.

370
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:10,000
Speaker 1: H wait, one quick question. Yes, this is nineteen seventy five.

371
00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:11,399
Speaker 2: This is nineteen seventy five.

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00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,320
Speaker 1: So Songs and Key Life did not come out yet.

373
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Speaker 2: No, he was still working on it, okay, seventy five.

374
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:19,520
Speaker 2: Next day is more of the formal audition. It's between

375
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Speaker 2: me and an older looking white guy, which I came

376
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,360
Speaker 2: to find out later on much later, years years later,

377
00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:31,880
Speaker 2: that guy was sent to audition by Chick Korea.

378
00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:34,640
Speaker 1: Wow, because Chick.

379
00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:38,960
Speaker 2: Heard about Steve auditioning, and he sent this guy and

380
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:42,680
Speaker 2: wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute. His

381
00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:45,960
Speaker 2: name Mike Garson.

382
00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:47,040
Speaker 1: Okay.

383
00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 2: And the reason why I know this is because it

384
00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:53,760
Speaker 2: was just like maybe a few years ago, this guy

385
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,600
Speaker 2: approached me at the Nam Show and Anaheim and said,

386
00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:02,240
Speaker 2: I know you, but you may not know me. I go, Wise,

387
00:23:02,320 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 2: it's because I'm the one that auditioned against you for

388
00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:08,560
Speaker 2: Wonder Love. I go, You've got to be kidding me,

389
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,120
Speaker 2: Mike Garson, And he told me the whole story from

390
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:12,879
Speaker 2: his side. He told me that Chickory has sent him,

391
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:14,920
Speaker 2: and I'm like, you've got to be kidding. So I

392
00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:18,200
Speaker 2: put his name, uh, you know, my contact list, and

393
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,800
Speaker 2: there's there's a there's a picture of us, uh you know,

394
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:22,880
Speaker 2: standing side by side.

395
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:28,000
Speaker 1: But there's another picture of me going like, you're the one, right.

396
00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,680
Speaker 2: So so it's between between me and Mike, you know,

397
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:34,240
Speaker 2: and we're at We're at Bill's rehearsal.

398
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 1: I remember Bill's.

399
00:23:36,119 --> 00:23:38,360
Speaker 2: You don't know about that, no, okay, it was called

400
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:42,879
Speaker 2: but okay, fine, Right, So it's a place called Bill's.

401
00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:50,880
Speaker 2: And I met everybody in Wonder Love, including Ali, Raymond Raymond,

402
00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:57,119
Speaker 2: and and and oh my Nissi okay, and Nice was

403
00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:00,680
Speaker 2: very very precocious. She would, you know, run up to

404
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 2: me from time to time. It pins me on the butt.

405
00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 2: I was going through the process, and from time to

406
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:07,119
Speaker 2: time different band members would come up to me on

407
00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:11,480
Speaker 2: the side and go, it's okay, you got it. And

408
00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:13,600
Speaker 2: so and I'm still a little nervous. But I don't

409
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:16,000
Speaker 2: even remember what I did was. I have no idea

410
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 2: we were playing all day. I have no idea. I

411
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 2: don't remember anything about it. I just remember going through

412
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,920
Speaker 2: the process and playing with everybody and and kind of

413
00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,120
Speaker 2: you know, feeling my way through and this other guy, Mike,

414
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:31,760
Speaker 2: you know, and that was that. Uh So, after that

415
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,240
Speaker 2: whole day, back in the car with Steve, it's evening time.

416
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:39,240
Speaker 2: Now we're on our way back to the Hit Factory.

417
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:40,680
Speaker 2: I'm in the back, Steve's in the front, and he

418
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:45,240
Speaker 2: turns around at one point goes, so, how does it

419
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:54,440
Speaker 2: feel to be a member of Wonderlove? So my in

420
00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:59,120
Speaker 2: my head I'm thinking is because now all these things

421
00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 2: are coming back to me out like how I heard

422
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 2: he was a practical joker, and he never you know,

423
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 2: all these things right? So I wasn't sure, so I said,

424
00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:09,480
Speaker 2: are you serious? He goes, of course, I'm serious.

425
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:10,200
Speaker 5: What?

426
00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: Oh? Really?

427
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,159
Speaker 2: So now I'm trying to think how can I prove this?

428
00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:14,760
Speaker 1: How can I prove that?

429
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:18,920
Speaker 2: I said, well, would you mind telling my mom? Because

430
00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 2: it's not gonna lie to them? Okay, the instagram is Mom,

431
00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 2: you ain't gonna lie to the mob. So he says sure.

432
00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:29,879
Speaker 2: So we get to the studio, I dial the house

433
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 2: and give him the phone. The first voice my mom

434
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 2: hears is Stevie Wonders telling her that he wants to

435
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,280
Speaker 2: have her son in his band and he'll take care

436
00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 2: of him, and he thinks he's very talented, and this

437
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:45,040
Speaker 2: and this and this and this and this, and they

438
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:46,800
Speaker 2: talked for a couple of minutes, and then he has

439
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 2: the phone back to me, and for the next few minutes.

440
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:58,159
Speaker 1: This is what you hear. So you made it.

441
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 6: Yeah, like at that moment, did you like your mother's response?

442
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:03,359
Speaker 6: That was the first time you ever probably got that.

443
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,520
Speaker 2: Well that I well, we were doing that to each other.

444
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 2: I was just screaming. But the thing is that, you

445
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:11,200
Speaker 2: know she thought, because she told me later on, she

446
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 2: thought that it was just going to be a weekend

447
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:17,119
Speaker 2: fleing and I was gonna, you know, meet him and

448
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,239
Speaker 2: have a little thing and then come back home, back

449
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,520
Speaker 2: and go to school. Well it was a weekend flaying.

450
00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 2: I did meet him, and I did go back home

451
00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 2: to get the rest of my shit.

452
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:29,040
Speaker 1: She was happy.

453
00:26:29,080 --> 00:26:30,440
Speaker 6: That's a music thing to make you some money.

454
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,399
Speaker 1: You were, Oh, and that's the punchline.

455
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 2: It was a month before my nineteenth birthday, but it

456
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,639
Speaker 2: was a month before Stevie's twenty fifth.

457
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 1: Okay, let's say that again.

458
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:49,680
Speaker 2: A month before Stevie's twenty fifth birthday, which means he

459
00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 2: was working on songs in the Key of Life at

460
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:53,960
Speaker 2: twenty four.

461
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,679
Speaker 1: That's crazy, Yes, it is. That is crazy.

462
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 2: So when he after he turned twenty five, was when

463
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:05,879
Speaker 2: that was released twenty five. I was still trying to

464
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:09,440
Speaker 2: learn how to time my shoelaces. This guy songs in

465
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 2: the Key of Life. So let that marinate.

466
00:27:13,359 --> 00:27:18,320
Speaker 4: Yeah, you put it in perspective because I wait, this

467
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 4: is something I want to ask you about your your

468
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:24,840
Speaker 4: Stevie experience. And I have two other backstories. No, no, okay,

469
00:27:25,440 --> 00:27:27,199
Speaker 4: but that SCO asked me for you. Well see now

470
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 4: I'm asking for another backstory, and.

471
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 2: Okay, I'd rather you go. Okay, all right, So here's

472
00:27:32,080 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 2: the thing. The thing is, my dear friend, the drummer

473
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 2: did not get the gig.

474
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 6: I was wondering, okay, who was he?

475
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:46,399
Speaker 2: Well, unfortunately you have to ask in that you know,

476
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:50,359
Speaker 2: in that grammar, you have to say it was because Ricky,

477
00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:51,560
Speaker 2: Ricky last.

478
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:54,720
Speaker 1: Ricky.

479
00:27:56,520 --> 00:28:01,000
Speaker 2: You have not experienced friendship until Ricky was a friend

480
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:01,399
Speaker 2: of yours.

481
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:01,920
Speaker 1: Wow.

482
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:07,720
Speaker 2: Man, Ricky Lawson was the very definition of friend in

483
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 2: every aspect. I mean, you know you hear there's there's

484
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:12,480
Speaker 2: a line that goes, he will give you the shirt

485
00:28:12,480 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 2: off your He literally would give you the shirt.

486
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:19,080
Speaker 1: Off his back. Wow.

487
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:22,680
Speaker 2: Their story after story, after thousands of stories about how

488
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 2: he impacted people's lives just quietly, and he was the

489
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 2: sweetest guy ever ever. And it will never be another

490
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:32,480
Speaker 2: Ricky Lawson.

491
00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 1: Dennis used to talk about it. You told you told

492
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 1: this story on Soul Train.

493
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 4: You're the first cat I knew that didn't even talk

494
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 4: about your album. It was a tribute to Ricky Lawson.

495
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:43,840
Speaker 4: I was like, this is the weirdest thing you usually have.

496
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 4: You got two minutes to sell your product at don

497
00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 4: Yes a new album and this one single, and Donna

498
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 4: asked you, like, tell us about your beginning. He just said,

499
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 4: it's all because this man right here, and it was

500
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,040
Speaker 4: like it was almost a tearful moment. I was like, wow,

501
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:58,280
Speaker 4: Like damn, I gotta treat the roots better.

502
00:28:58,200 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 6: Because so can you tell the drummer story then? Because

503
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 6: Ricky didn't get the gig. But I know she used

504
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:06,920
Speaker 6: to talk about Ricky all the time.

505
00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 2: Weird well, but you know, and it turned out Dennis Davis.

506
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,480
Speaker 2: But it turned out that Steve was just trying to

507
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 2: I don't know, intimidat or strike fear into the But

508
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,640
Speaker 2: actually the drummer that was there was Raymond Pounds. Raymond Pounds,

509
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,720
Speaker 2: So that's where I'm at. But Ricky didn't get it

510
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,880
Speaker 2: with Steve. But Roy Airs was hanging around a lot

511
00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 2: at the time, and Roy said, if you don't get

512
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:34,160
Speaker 2: it with him, you got it with me. So he

513
00:29:34,440 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 2: ended up with Roy, and technically.

514
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:43,400
Speaker 6: Because with Roy and Stevie and but Dennis and Ricky were.

515
00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:45,959
Speaker 2: Like yes, yes, so it was it was a lot

516
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:49,239
Speaker 2: of ancestual action going on there. But here's the thing.

517
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,720
Speaker 2: So technically, even though I just joined Steve's band and

518
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 2: I was working on songs in the Life, songs in

519
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 2: the Key of Life, technically the first album that was

520
00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 2: released and I'm on is Everybody Loves the Sunshine. Yes, yes,

521
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,400
Speaker 2: that's you as me, not on not on everything. I

522
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 2: think on two songs, but there's one song that I

523
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,880
Speaker 2: have a solon at the end that it was I'm

524
00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 2: just I was just blazing and I was very young

525
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,880
Speaker 2: and crazy and hungry, and I was just like, you know,

526
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 2: so uh yeah, that was the first thing that was released.

527
00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 1: That I'm on. What equipment were you using at the

528
00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:30,920
Speaker 1: time and whatever the hell I wanted to what was out?

529
00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 1: I was working with Stevie Wanner. Dude, he had two

530
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 1: of everything. Well I'm just saying, now, you know, we

531
00:30:36,800 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 1: get a chord, we get a you know, no, because no, no, no, no.

532
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 2: First of all, I had several Pristine Roads that's what

533
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:46,360
Speaker 2: that's what I want to know. Like okay, I mean

534
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 2: like roads like you cannot believe, like roads, like the

535
00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 2: intro to Superwoman. I mean, I'm like roads, right, and

536
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 2: uh oh we had the Yamaha stuff, the CS eighty,

537
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,400
Speaker 2: the Our twenty six hundred, the Mini Moons, and of

538
00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:09,960
Speaker 2: course the dream Machine. Tanto no no, no, no, you

539
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:12,880
Speaker 2: know about the dream Machine. This is glav no no no, no, no,

540
00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 2: way before Sintklaviy. This is what Sintklavier was trying to be.

541
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 1: Like, is this what's the one black man that little

542
00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:21,680
Speaker 1: automated No, no.

543
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:25,440
Speaker 2: No, no, this is this is a custom keyboard from Yamaha,

544
00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:33,760
Speaker 2: three tier keyboard, all white and chrome. And the speakers

545
00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:35,719
Speaker 2: are about as tall as I am. And for those

546
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 2: of you who don't know, that's like five six feet

547
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 2: n right, no, five seven five eight on a good day.

548
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:49,560
Speaker 2: But they're they're tall, beautiful speakers. And I have beautiful,

549
00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:53,000
Speaker 2: fond memories of sitting next to Stevie, just the two

550
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 2: of us, wagging our heads together, playing the parts to Saturn,

551
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 2: playing the string hearts to Joy inside my DearS, just

552
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 2: the two of us.

553
00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:07,480
Speaker 1: Wow, Okay, that's just a couple of things and then

554
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 1: and there are I believe four of these in the world.

555
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:17,000
Speaker 2: Of course Steve bones two of them, and they're not

556
00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 2: cheap and they're not even they're not even in production anymore.

557
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: They stopped, you know, years ago.

558
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:27,920
Speaker 2: But yeah, incredible instrument and so yeah, I mean I had,

559
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 2: you know, well, my clavanets and all that other kind

560
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:33,080
Speaker 2: of stuff.

561
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 4: So let me ask if usually in a musician's life,

562
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,360
Speaker 4: I mean, they're just a sponge when you know, if

563
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 4: they discovered music early from like ten eleven twelve, you

564
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:44,840
Speaker 4: know they're sponge.

565
00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:45,640
Speaker 1: They're open to anything.

566
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 4: Usually your first taste of maturity comes when you're like

567
00:32:49,800 --> 00:32:53,080
Speaker 4: fifteen sixteen years old, when you start like putting away

568
00:32:53,160 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 4: childish things and you you know, something affects you. Can

569
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 4: you tell me I've heard I like to hear the

570
00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 4: ounce of people when they first discovered music of my mind?

571
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:04,960
Speaker 5: Was that?

572
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 1: Was that? Did that album have an effect on you

573
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 1: as far as like a huge whoa what is this huge? See?

574
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 1: Because I love it so much.

575
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:15,480
Speaker 4: But of course I was born in seventy one, so

576
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,840
Speaker 4: me discovering it in nineteen seventy nine is way different

577
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:22,120
Speaker 4: than being there in real time listening what was that

578
00:33:22,280 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 4: moment like to hear those patches and those.

579
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: Like music like that.

580
00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:29,920
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I just it just made me

581
00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:36,600
Speaker 2: realize that he was a visionary when it came to

582
00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,040
Speaker 2: creating sounds that.

583
00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,480
Speaker 1: That you know, that.

584
00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 2: Accurately described his feelings, you know, and the the amazing

585
00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:02,920
Speaker 2: way he used the new technology of that time to

586
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:08,920
Speaker 2: essentially orchestrate, because you know when you hear things like uh,

587
00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:16,200
Speaker 2: you know again Superwoman and his use of those high

588
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 2: sense and everything and and and and how he combined uh,

589
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 2: you know, the newer instruments with traditional instruments like piano,

590
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 2: drums and so forth. So uh and of course the songwriting,

591
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 2: every aspect of it, the songwriting, the vocal approach, the

592
00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 2: level of musicianship, because you know, let's let's remember he

593
00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:41,080
Speaker 2: played everything.

594
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:44,640
Speaker 1: And uh so that had a huge effect.

595
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 2: But you know, it was it was a it was

596
00:34:46,680 --> 00:34:48,719
Speaker 2: a gradual progression because I didn't just get into him

597
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 2: as songs in the key of live cousin. It was like,

598
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:53,920
Speaker 2: you know, from yeah, it was from that, but then

599
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:59,520
Speaker 2: you know, just just going along the ride, the journey

600
00:34:59,600 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 2: with him, the progression you know, from fingertips to uh,

601
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 2: you know, from even before no, no, before that, like

602
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:13,600
Speaker 2: signs to Delivery place, you know, the cover of we

603
00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:17,560
Speaker 2: can work it out, Uh should be dude ot day,

604
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:21,439
Speaker 2: you know, uh right now, Yeah, I met your match,

605
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 2: you know, things like that, and then from that, uh,

606
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:30,840
Speaker 2: solely crossing over into uh, the more mature era, you know,

607
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:33,200
Speaker 2: starting with Where I'm Coming From, which was of course

608
00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 2: a precursor to to uh line, and and where I'm

609
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:40,000
Speaker 2: Coming From kind of doesn't get enough credit because Where

610
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,320
Speaker 2: I'm coming from had a couple of gems like I

611
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:50,399
Speaker 2: never dreamed. Let's not forget that exactly, sugar, and take

612
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 2: your course in happiness, you know, not science delivery, do yourself,

613
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 2: educate your mind, you know, so gadget that. Yeah there,

614
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:10,359
Speaker 2: you know, so all that kind of stuff, and uh

615
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 2: so going along that journey and then ending up at

616
00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 2: the beginning of the five Great album era, starting with

617
00:36:20,640 --> 00:36:24,839
Speaker 2: songs with Music in My Mind because the reason why

618
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,560
Speaker 2: I call it that is because there were five albums

619
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:32,279
Speaker 2: that were completely great, where every song was great. There

620
00:36:32,360 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 2: are other albums before and after that had great songs

621
00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 2: but not complete. Music in my Mind was a complete

622
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 2: great album, Intervisions was a complete great album. Talking Book

623
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 2: was a complete great album feeling This first Finalitey was

624
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:48,560
Speaker 2: a complete great album, and we won't even discuss songs

625
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 2: in Key of Life. So that's five right there, that

626
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:56,879
Speaker 2: five album run by the Way that ended at twenty five. Wow,

627
00:36:56,960 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 2: it's reminding you that because he was twenty five when

628
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 2: songs in the Keep Life was exactly that's the perspective.

629
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:12,920
Speaker 2: But can I just give you one last backstory about.

630
00:37:14,760 --> 00:37:15,000
Speaker 1: Okay?

631
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:19,879
Speaker 2: So I was given another perspective years later by one

632
00:37:19,920 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 2: of Steve's former managers who explained from his end how

633
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:30,959
Speaker 2: the process went down from my audition. So Ricky goes

634
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:34,880
Speaker 2: to the studio and the auditions and he's told he

635
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,719
Speaker 2: doesn't get the gig. He kind of leaves with his

636
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 2: tale between his legs, you know, and he's like obviously disheartened,

637
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:45,279
Speaker 2: and he leaves the studio. He's outside the studio, he

638
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 2: feels in his pocket and he remembers that my cassettes

639
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:50,120
Speaker 2: in this that he still has my cassette. He goes

640
00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 2: back to the studio and says to one of the

641
00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 2: managers at the time, Listen, you know I got this friend,

642
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 2: his name is Greg, and you know I promised him

643
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 2: that I give this tape to he's a keyboard player,

644
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:03,959
Speaker 2: and I promise it, I'd give this cassette to Steve

645
00:38:04,000 --> 00:38:05,719
Speaker 2: so he could check him out. Would you mind just

646
00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:07,480
Speaker 2: making sure he gets it? And the guy says sure.

647
00:38:08,239 --> 00:38:11,440
Speaker 2: He puts it on a table with a pile of

648
00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:14,360
Speaker 2: other cassettes. Steve was not there at the time. He

649
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 2: stepped away. Some time later, he comes back. He sits

650
00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:20,560
Speaker 2: down at the table with the cassettes. He's fishing around.

651
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 2: All of a sudden, he just grabs one at random,

652
00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:28,879
Speaker 2: grabs random, sticks it in press his plays listening. He's

653
00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:34,200
Speaker 2: and then he stops wagging his head because he's got

654
00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,440
Speaker 2: like a kind of disconcerted look on his face. And

655
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:41,640
Speaker 2: he said still, and he goes He takes the cassette

656
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:46,439
Speaker 2: out and goes, what's to say? So the guy says, Greg,

657
00:38:46,719 --> 00:38:50,279
Speaker 2: of course he butchered my last name, and so Steve

658
00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 2: reportedly said get him.

659
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:53,880
Speaker 1: Wow.

660
00:38:54,880 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 2: So because apparently, well I'll I'll forget to that, and

661
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 2: so he they they they call Ricky back. They see

662
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:06,440
Speaker 2: a Ricky and he goes.

663
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 1: Oh, then he changed his mind. Well, well not exactly,

664
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:17,600
Speaker 1: but but you know your friend, can you call him? Oh?

665
00:39:19,000 --> 00:39:22,080
Speaker 2: Okay, So so I know right, So so that's what.

666
00:39:22,360 --> 00:39:26,280
Speaker 2: But then the reason why Steve reacted the way he did, apparently,

667
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:27,080
Speaker 2: legend has it.

668
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,680
Speaker 1: Is because he thought it was him.

669
00:39:32,080 --> 00:39:34,880
Speaker 2: Oh, he thought it was him playing and he couldn't

670
00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:39,279
Speaker 2: quite figure it out. Well, I guess I left a

671
00:39:39,320 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 2: bit of an impression, which is kind of what I

672
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:41,360
Speaker 2: wanted to do.

673
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:45,000
Speaker 1: So that's damn. That is crazy.

674
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:48,840
Speaker 2: It's bananas. And I actually remember telling Steve that, like

675
00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:54,520
Speaker 2: maybe like a couple of years ago, and he said,

676
00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:57,000
Speaker 2: all right, well that sounds yeah, we'll go with that.

677
00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 4: He didn't, right, So you were just auditioning to be

678
00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 4: in the band, but you wound up on songs in

679
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,480
Speaker 4: the Key of Life four times.

680
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 1: So okay, being in the eye of the storm? What?

681
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:21,800
Speaker 4: Because I remember, like now, it doesn't seem like a

682
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 4: year and a half was all that long to wait

683
00:40:24,239 --> 00:40:27,000
Speaker 4: from seventy four till seventy six.

684
00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:27,960
Speaker 1: Oh, but it was.

685
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:31,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it was if you're Berry Gordy exactly right, right.

686
00:40:32,239 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: So one, what what was taking so long? And why? Well,

687
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,759
Speaker 1: of course I know that, you know, fine wine takes

688
00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 1: it's time.

689
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:47,399
Speaker 2: But there's fine wine and then there's Stevie Wonder.

690
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:49,960
Speaker 4: So by the time you're there, do you know that

691
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:52,919
Speaker 4: it's going to be a double album or two point

692
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:53,640
Speaker 4: five albums.

693
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,120
Speaker 1: No, I just know it's a lot. Did he know that?

694
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:00,759
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know.

695
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:04,439
Speaker 2: It was just because for every one song that ended

696
00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:07,560
Speaker 2: up on the record, there's about three or four that didn't.

697
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,480
Speaker 1: So you multiply, you do the maath on that, and

698
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:14,120
Speaker 1: so how many songs do you think around doing just

699
00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:14,960
Speaker 1: during that period?

700
00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,440
Speaker 2: It's endless because you know what, I have.

701
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:21,040
Speaker 1: A few.

702
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:28,279
Speaker 2: Cassettes of unreleased stuff. Yeah, it was one, two, I'm

703
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:32,000
Speaker 2: pretty sure too, pretty sure, I have to and just

704
00:41:32,120 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 2: and that's not even you know, that's barely the typically

705
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:41,200
Speaker 2: aspert and that's from back then, okay, you know, so

706
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 2: it's it's added up over the decades. So yeah, he

707
00:41:47,520 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 2: had a lot of stuff, and he had he had

708
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:53,839
Speaker 2: things like, oh, oh, you got to hear this story.

709
00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:54,799
Speaker 1: You gotta hear this. You gotta hear.

710
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:59,799
Speaker 2: Because it's sort of uh, ties in with your question,

711
00:42:02,000 --> 00:42:06,239
Speaker 2: all kinds of unreleased stuff. And the night before my

712
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:10,560
Speaker 2: first show with him, which was in DC for a

713
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:13,000
Speaker 2: little thing called Human Kindness Day, which was on the

714
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:16,879
Speaker 2: grounds of the Washington Monument, two hundred and fifty thousand people.

715
00:42:16,920 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 2: That's my first show. Wo there's an audition for you.

716
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 1: Yeah.

717
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:28,320
Speaker 2: So it's the night before and you know, usually, or traditionally,

718
00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:31,000
Speaker 2: Steve would have a massive black bag full.

719
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 1: Of tapes of guess what.

720
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 2: So I somewhere found the you know, intestinal fortitude to

721
00:42:42,080 --> 00:42:48,279
Speaker 2: ask him if I could borrow the bag, and do

722
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:53,840
Speaker 2: you know, he said, yes, what about that I have?

723
00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 2: I'm nineteen years old, I have Stevie barely nineteen. I

724
00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:03,959
Speaker 2: have Stevie Wonders bag of unreleased music in my room

725
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:05,840
Speaker 2: with a pair of headphones.

726
00:43:05,960 --> 00:43:07,719
Speaker 1: What are you gonna do? Stay in there for like

727
00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:08,080
Speaker 1: a week?

728
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:11,920
Speaker 2: Okay, So I'm just rifling through stuff. I can't I

729
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:12,920
Speaker 2: can't believe he said yes.

730
00:43:13,120 --> 00:43:13,840
Speaker 1: To this day.

731
00:43:15,400 --> 00:43:18,799
Speaker 2: And I'm playing stuff and Amir, for the first time,

732
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 2: I'm hearing the original version of sem on Your Love

733
00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:27,759
Speaker 2: and I cannot tell you. I cannot describe to you

734
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:30,759
Speaker 2: what it was like, Amir. All I can say was

735
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:34,400
Speaker 2: that it was an instrumental and all the synthesizers were

736
00:43:34,440 --> 00:43:40,640
Speaker 2: singing what we're singing, Amir. Now you know how it goes,

737
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:41,080
Speaker 2: you know, do.

738
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 1: Right?

739
00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 2: But in addition to the melody, they had these background

740
00:43:49,640 --> 00:43:53,839
Speaker 2: since going doo doo wop doo doo doo up doo

741
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:58,040
Speaker 2: doop in harmony. I'm telling you, it was otherworldly. I

742
00:43:58,160 --> 00:43:59,879
Speaker 2: never heard anything like it in my life. And I'm

743
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:04,919
Speaker 2: in They're like, it was like LSD and the best

744
00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:08,000
Speaker 2: way you ever can and I don't do drugs, but

745
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:10,280
Speaker 2: I'm talking about it was like all of those combined.

746
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 1: It was just like, oh my god, I can't believe.

747
00:44:16,120 --> 00:44:18,640
Speaker 2: And that's one thing I heard. And I heard all

748
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:22,880
Speaker 2: kinds of stuff that I I can't even describe, uh,

749
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:26,680
Speaker 2: the feeling, and and I gave it all back to

750
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,279
Speaker 2: him the next day and I was a changed man.

751
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:32,640
Speaker 1: Yeah wow.

752
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:34,320
Speaker 2: So none of this stuff has ever come out of

753
00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,600
Speaker 2: the outtakes from from songs in them and all that.

754
00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:41,800
Speaker 2: There was another song called living for Your Love, and

755
00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:45,480
Speaker 2: I think he has since released that, but the original

756
00:44:45,560 --> 00:44:49,040
Speaker 2: version of that was the best. And that was done

757
00:44:49,080 --> 00:44:52,120
Speaker 2: on the dream Machine too. And all these weird sounds and.

758
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:56,840
Speaker 1: What wo.

759
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:03,000
Speaker 2: They're knowing what I mean, just crazy stuff, you know,

760
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:06,239
Speaker 2: and original sin when Your Love that was, I mean,

761
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:09,040
Speaker 2: the version you heard was what seventy five, seventy six,

762
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:14,240
Speaker 2: seventy five sounds about seventy five man sounds about yeah, God.

763
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 1: And usually when we get stuff, especially that. Yeah.

764
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:20,800
Speaker 2: Years later, Yeah, it's been water that has been a

765
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:22,160
Speaker 2: little bit yeah, yeah.

766
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:22,759
Speaker 1: God, you know.

767
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:27,360
Speaker 2: To just leave it off the record, like yeah not

768
00:45:27,520 --> 00:45:30,759
Speaker 2: yet yeah yeah yeah that one and so the one

769
00:45:30,800 --> 00:45:31,759
Speaker 2: you know about.

770
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:33,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, doesn't hold it.

771
00:45:33,160 --> 00:45:36,480
Speaker 2: It doesn't even compare, doesn't even you think you like that?

772
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:38,680
Speaker 5: Wow?

773
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:44,400
Speaker 4: So I gotta know why did he part ways with

774
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 4: the Tanto guys with Bob and Malcolm.

775
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:51,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, Bob and Malcolm. I don't think it was anything.

776
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 1: I think it was just there the program.

777
00:45:55,520 --> 00:45:57,920
Speaker 2: Well, I mean they they introduced him to the whole

778
00:45:58,360 --> 00:46:01,840
Speaker 2: world of sense with with Tato, and I think it

779
00:46:01,960 --> 00:46:07,480
Speaker 2: was just time to change.

780
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:08,040
Speaker 1: Yeah.

781
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:12,920
Speaker 2: I don't think it was anything, you know, negative. I

782
00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:15,680
Speaker 2: don't really know much about this split, but I don't

783
00:46:15,719 --> 00:46:20,359
Speaker 2: think it was anything, you know. I don't think it's

784
00:46:20,400 --> 00:46:23,759
Speaker 2: because of any issues. Well no, no, I don't mean,

785
00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 2: like was it amicable.

786
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:27,759
Speaker 4: But I was just trying to figure out, if you know,

787
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 4: for what they were doing with him between seventy one

788
00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:35,760
Speaker 4: and seventy four with you know, synthesizes were the size

789
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:39,440
Speaker 4: of rooms. He suddenly Yamaha is making these because of

790
00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:46,160
Speaker 4: what I want to know is is the ability to

791
00:46:46,200 --> 00:46:50,120
Speaker 4: play chords with these patches. And what year was it

792
00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 4: that you were able to play more than one note

793
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 4: at the.

794
00:46:54,440 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 1: Well that kicked? Oh, I can't remember the exact year, but.

795
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:02,360
Speaker 2: It it was kind of going on when I was

796
00:47:02,400 --> 00:47:04,440
Speaker 2: there because of the dream machine and because of the

797
00:47:04,520 --> 00:47:07,880
Speaker 2: cs AD you had polyphony with those instruments. But I

798
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,280
Speaker 2: think as far as the split from Malcolm and Bobby,

799
00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 2: he just he just it just seems to me thinking

800
00:47:16,239 --> 00:47:19,840
Speaker 2: about it, that he wanted a more hands on approach

801
00:47:20,040 --> 00:47:22,480
Speaker 2: and he was able to do he felt he could

802
00:47:22,520 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 2: do more on his own with the technology of that time,

803
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:30,640
Speaker 2: because you know, you got the R twenty six hundred

804
00:47:30,680 --> 00:47:33,839
Speaker 2: now and you know, but that was that was even there,

805
00:47:33,920 --> 00:47:36,640
Speaker 2: that was around even during a before songs didn't keep

806
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 2: life because that was on you know, it was the

807
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:42,560
Speaker 2: bass sound for boogiey On. So I mean, you know,

808
00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 2: you know that it was around. But I just think

809
00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:49,320
Speaker 2: he wanted to take more of a hands on approach

810
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:51,439
Speaker 2: and just do just create the sounds on his own.

811
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 1: So what songs are you on as far as the

812
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:57,120
Speaker 1: actual tracking in right?

813
00:47:57,440 --> 00:48:02,640
Speaker 2: So Saturn, Okay, Intusion, contusion, And the only reason why

814
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:06,040
Speaker 2: I'm on contusion is because that crazy line that Mike

815
00:48:06,360 --> 00:48:10,919
Speaker 2: Simbela came up with. He couldn't play it, and I said,

816
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:16,120
Speaker 2: well I can't, so he said, okay, go So in

817
00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:20,719
Speaker 2: the ridge that's me doing doubling. Yeah, that's me. That's

818
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:25,200
Speaker 2: me doubling Michael on a on a synth. Yeah, and

819
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:26,400
Speaker 2: that's the only reason why I'm on that.

820
00:48:26,520 --> 00:48:27,040
Speaker 5: And then.

821
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:34,040
Speaker 2: Probably isn't my my favorite? Well, one of my favorites

822
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:39,279
Speaker 2: for sure? Well, yes, isn't She love laim?

823
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:39,440
Speaker 5: On that?

824
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:41,759
Speaker 2: And one of my favorites for sure, joy inside my

825
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 2: tears string parts of that, so and I played the

826
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 2: Roads on Isn't She Lovely?

827
00:48:48,360 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 5: Yeah?

828
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 1: Yeah? So were those songs all tracked together with a

829
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:53,600
Speaker 1: group of people?

830
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 2: No, No, Isn't She Lovely? Was an overdub I I

831
00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:03,720
Speaker 2: definitely remember that. But I also remember meeting the subject

832
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:07,200
Speaker 2: of that song in a little crib at his brownstone

833
00:49:07,200 --> 00:49:09,520
Speaker 2: in New York, and I remember going up stairs and

834
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:11,719
Speaker 2: looking down on the crib and going, oh, she's cute.

835
00:49:15,120 --> 00:49:18,120
Speaker 2: But yes, it was a Roads over dub on Isn't

836
00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:18,560
Speaker 2: She Lovely?

837
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:22,040
Speaker 1: It was kind of like.

838
00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:28,719
Speaker 2: What was overdub On on Confusion as well. Steve and

839
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:34,120
Speaker 2: I did the string parts and the the orchestral parts

840
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:38,160
Speaker 2: together on Joy Inside My Tears and Saturn.

841
00:49:39,000 --> 00:49:41,080
Speaker 1: So when the album comes out in seventy six.

842
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:44,080
Speaker 2: By the way, we we he actually had t shirts

843
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:47,839
Speaker 2: made up. We're not done yet, We're almost finished. We're

844
00:49:47,840 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 2: almost finished yet, So Steve.

845
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:53,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, you guys are gonna do that for Voodoo. They

846
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:59,480
Speaker 1: did that. We was taking five years with Voodoo. Oh yeah, yeah,

847
00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:01,879
Speaker 1: I shirts there, you know, and you can still wear

848
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:08,520
Speaker 1: them today. So I do love that guy. Though.

849
00:50:09,000 --> 00:50:12,799
Speaker 4: When when in seventy six, in September seventy six, when

850
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:17,560
Speaker 4: this comes out? Yeah, what was I just recently found

851
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:20,799
Speaker 4: Have you guys ever seen that ePK that's online when

852
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:23,880
Speaker 4: the press is hearing songs in the Keep Life for

853
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:24,359
Speaker 4: the first time.

854
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:25,520
Speaker 1: Have any of you guys seen this?

855
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:29,359
Speaker 4: No, So when you like google songs in the Key

856
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:32,560
Speaker 4: of Life ePK and it's like a listening session of

857
00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:36,800
Speaker 4: really of yeah, like fifty key rock critics, even like

858
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:39,120
Speaker 4: Robert Cristagala was there when he was in like his

859
00:50:39,280 --> 00:50:43,520
Speaker 4: younger days. But they're all listening together and to watch

860
00:50:43,600 --> 00:50:48,680
Speaker 4: them collectively jaw drop, like after they hear Sir Duke

861
00:50:48,760 --> 00:50:51,359
Speaker 4: for the first time, and you know it's it's one

862
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:54,200
Speaker 4: of the coolest things I've ever seen. But yeah, it's

863
00:50:54,280 --> 00:51:01,000
Speaker 4: on YouTube, but for YouTube to watch people, Well that album.

864
00:51:01,120 --> 00:51:02,680
Speaker 4: You know, like I was in first grade by the

865
00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:05,280
Speaker 4: time it came out, and what was it, September?

866
00:51:05,680 --> 00:51:09,440
Speaker 1: No homework, no home. I've got socks older than you

867
00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,160
Speaker 1: the first grade. Yeah, like my homework was you know,

868
00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:16,760
Speaker 1: have mom and dad by this album?

869
00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 4: And you know we all had our copies in in

870
00:51:18,920 --> 00:51:21,759
Speaker 4: school the next day and we're reading the liner notes

871
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:24,000
Speaker 4: and all this stuff. No, the liner notes alone, like

872
00:51:24,400 --> 00:51:27,560
Speaker 4: changed my life. But what was it just in in

873
00:51:28,120 --> 00:51:30,280
Speaker 4: real time? And to tour behind this album?

874
00:51:31,160 --> 00:51:32,080
Speaker 1: What was it like to.

875
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,680
Speaker 2: Well, first of all, it wasn't he didn't tour off

876
00:51:37,719 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 2: of this.

877
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, you sure. I'm kind of sure because.

878
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:45,759
Speaker 4: He was like you guys were in the episode of

879
00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:47,840
Speaker 4: the Grammy Awards where he was in Africa.

880
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:50,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that wasn't a tour. We went.

881
00:51:50,800 --> 00:51:57,320
Speaker 2: We went to Legos, Nigeria because he wanted to perform

882
00:51:57,400 --> 00:51:59,680
Speaker 2: down there, and it was it turned out to be,

883
00:52:00,760 --> 00:52:04,279
Speaker 2: you know, in time or during the Grammys, and we

884
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:06,600
Speaker 2: did a remote segment and that's the that's where you

885
00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:10,040
Speaker 2: you you have Andy Williams asking the immortal question.

886
00:52:09,880 --> 00:52:14,600
Speaker 1: Stevie, can you see us? Yea, that was the weirdest

887
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 1: thing to watch us a seven year old.

888
00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:20,280
Speaker 4: He was like on this telephone but okay, that explains

889
00:52:20,320 --> 00:52:22,840
Speaker 4: why he was dressing all that African garb was fla.

890
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:27,400
Speaker 2: After the shows, I I think, I think so, I

891
00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:30,480
Speaker 2: don't remember. I don't remember, but I think so I

892
00:52:30,880 --> 00:52:33,520
Speaker 2: have kind of I only have one memory of Legos.

893
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:39,120
Speaker 2: But anyway, what it is well that that we we

894
00:52:39,320 --> 00:52:42,360
Speaker 2: rolled up and we stayed in this very opulent hotel

895
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:46,360
Speaker 2: and it was like, you know, gold fixtures in the

896
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:49,839
Speaker 2: bathrooms and everything. And I remember, I remember my room

897
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:53,160
Speaker 2: was high up, and I remember looking down on the

898
00:52:53,239 --> 00:52:56,680
Speaker 2: beach and seeing people squatting on the beach and and

899
00:52:56,880 --> 00:53:02,200
Speaker 2: and being in huts. I remember that, but it was

900
00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 2: wild man. I also remember like the auditorium we we

901
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:08,560
Speaker 2: actually performed that, you know, the crowd was great. They

902
00:53:08,600 --> 00:53:11,359
Speaker 2: were rack us, you know, and and I'm like, can

903
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:14,480
Speaker 2: we're doing a remote broad broadcast to the Grammys.

904
00:53:14,719 --> 00:53:15,640
Speaker 1: This is crazy?

905
00:53:16,680 --> 00:53:20,440
Speaker 2: Ah, But that's it. So we didn't tour off of

906
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:25,319
Speaker 2: that album. He didn't really do formal tours, just did

907
00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:30,919
Speaker 2: one offs, like playing Jamaica and having Bob Marley open

908
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:31,359
Speaker 2: for us.

909
00:53:33,760 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 1: That didn't suck, you know.

910
00:53:37,680 --> 00:53:40,359
Speaker 2: And I remember when we were rehearsing and he told

911
00:53:40,480 --> 00:53:43,120
Speaker 2: us that we were going to Jamaica, Like, I immediately

912
00:53:43,160 --> 00:53:49,080
Speaker 2: went out and got uh, Marley's Marley's album which was, uh,

913
00:53:51,000 --> 00:53:51,360
Speaker 2: what was.

914
00:53:51,360 --> 00:53:54,120
Speaker 1: That hallmark album? What was the name of that? No,

915
00:53:57,840 --> 00:53:58,320
Speaker 1: it had.

916
00:53:59,840 --> 00:54:01,279
Speaker 2: I remember the name of the album, but it had

917
00:54:01,280 --> 00:54:02,319
Speaker 2: you know, lovely.

918
00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:06,160
Speaker 1: And it had looking.

919
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:09,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, look it's it's as you know he said.

920
00:54:09,080 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 1: No, catch a fire burning, Natty Dread must be Natty Dredd.

921
00:54:12,840 --> 00:54:18,239
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, roots rock run, Okay, Okay, that's music, that's

922
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:19,240
Speaker 2: roster Man vibration.

923
00:54:19,719 --> 00:54:20,080
Speaker 1: That one.

924
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:25,360
Speaker 2: Okay, well I remember, yeah, okay, So I remember getting

925
00:54:25,400 --> 00:54:27,719
Speaker 2: that and just playing it over and over again, and

926
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:30,480
Speaker 2: then like next thing, you know, we'rett Marley's opening up

927
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:30,680
Speaker 2: for us.

928
00:54:31,160 --> 00:54:35,760
Speaker 1: Damn. It's crazy. So that no touring though, because he's.

929
00:54:35,600 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 2: Steady wonder, it's just different. He's just you know, all

930
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:40,279
Speaker 2: over the place. No, he's just he was just all

931
00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:43,120
Speaker 2: over the place. He talked for those albums, like those songs,

932
00:54:43,239 --> 00:54:45,359
Speaker 2: and that's so weird.

933
00:54:45,640 --> 00:54:48,160
Speaker 4: I thought he didn't tour behind a Secret Life of Plants,

934
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:49,200
Speaker 4: but I definitely thought he tour.

935
00:54:49,360 --> 00:54:52,759
Speaker 1: He didn't know, no, no, no, no, we like I said,

936
00:54:52,840 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: my five days with Secret Life, Yeah no, my My

937
00:54:56,040 --> 00:54:59,080
Speaker 1: My first gig was.

938
00:55:00,960 --> 00:55:06,000
Speaker 2: The Human Kindness Day in DC, and I don't remember

939
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:10,520
Speaker 2: what what happened consecutively after that, but I know Jamaica,

940
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:16,200
Speaker 2: you know, legos and things like that. But but not

941
00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:20,080
Speaker 2: a lot of not a lot of action, not a

942
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 2: lot of action, not anything for more or consistent that

943
00:55:24,239 --> 00:55:26,920
Speaker 2: you would you would you know, classify as a tour.

944
00:55:26,880 --> 00:55:29,759
Speaker 4: But did he want you exclusively his? Because I'm trying

945
00:55:29,760 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 4: to figure out exactly when did you ease to the Jacksons.

946
00:55:33,360 --> 00:55:35,480
Speaker 2: Well, we were all on retainer and that was that

947
00:55:35,680 --> 00:55:39,040
Speaker 2: was the other cool thing about being in the band.

948
00:55:39,160 --> 00:55:43,120
Speaker 2: And it's like I just joined, I just turned nineteen,

949
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:45,399
Speaker 2: and I'm making five hundred dollars a week and I'm like, okay,

950
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:47,480
Speaker 2: this is it, this is it, but this is it

951
00:55:47,640 --> 00:55:48,799
Speaker 2: on retainer like every week?

952
00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:53,480
Speaker 1: And was that? Okay, I'm so glad you said that.

953
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:57,680
Speaker 1: What for a working musician? Yeah? Was that a good

954
00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 1: living in nineteen seventy five, seventy six that time? Yeah?

955
00:56:00,800 --> 00:56:03,359
Speaker 2: Okay, oh for it was great for me. Okay, yeah,

956
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:08,439
Speaker 2: today that's not even an hour.

957
00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:13,320
Speaker 4: Well, but I know that but like your five hundred

958
00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:16,600
Speaker 4: back then today would probably be like, you know, four thousand,

959
00:56:16,920 --> 00:56:18,760
Speaker 4: five hundred a week or something.

960
00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:21,000
Speaker 2: But yeah, something like that, but or at least ten

961
00:56:21,080 --> 00:56:23,560
Speaker 2: times as much as that. But no, it was great,

962
00:56:25,360 --> 00:56:28,759
Speaker 2: and uh so I was with him from seventy five

963
00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:33,719
Speaker 2: till the beginning of seventy nine. January seventy nine, the

964
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:37,160
Speaker 2: last chat chat with him was in Atlanta. I remember that,

965
00:56:38,440 --> 00:56:42,360
Speaker 2: and then it was it was tough to say goodbye,

966
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:47,200
Speaker 2: but I realized that I needed to or else I

967
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:49,240
Speaker 2: was gonna remain stagnant.

968
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 1: It's gonna be comfortable. Yeah. So you had a goal

969
00:56:52,239 --> 00:56:55,080
Speaker 1: to be a producer or was it just no? I had.

970
00:56:55,200 --> 00:57:01,920
Speaker 2: I had a goal to expand to the to the

971
00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:08,200
Speaker 2: extent that I could because this was based on promises,

972
00:57:09,520 --> 00:57:14,160
Speaker 2: unkept promises of you know, producing an album on Wonderlove.

973
00:57:15,719 --> 00:57:18,400
Speaker 2: Everyone has that story. Yeah, he kept promising us he

974
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:22,880
Speaker 2: was gonna, uh, you know, do an album, and it

975
00:57:23,000 --> 00:57:25,120
Speaker 2: got to the point where we believed him less and less,

976
00:57:25,240 --> 00:57:27,120
Speaker 2: and then one day he said, all right, look, I'm

977
00:57:27,160 --> 00:57:29,320
Speaker 2: doing this, and this is where we're gonna do it.

978
00:57:29,360 --> 00:57:32,160
Speaker 1: We're gonna go We're gonna leave here, We're going out

979
00:57:32,200 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 1: of here.

980
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:36,000
Speaker 2: And we're going to Louisiana. We I don't know how

981
00:57:36,080 --> 00:57:38,440
Speaker 2: he found this place, but there is. I don't even

982
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:41,080
Speaker 2: know if it still exists now, but there was back

983
00:57:41,160 --> 00:57:48,919
Speaker 2: then a studio called studio in the country. Never more

984
00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:55,240
Speaker 2: was there an appropriate name for a facility, because this

985
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:57,560
Speaker 2: place was in Boga Usa, Louisiana.

986
00:57:59,080 --> 00:58:01,760
Speaker 1: Thank you, look that up. Google it.

987
00:58:01,800 --> 00:58:04,280
Speaker 2: I don't even know if bol exists anymore, but it

988
00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:07,640
Speaker 2: did then. And it was deep, deep, deep in the country,

989
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:12,000
Speaker 2: and it was a studio and it was a cool studio.

990
00:58:12,880 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 2: It was. It was a it was a proper studio.

991
00:58:14,920 --> 00:58:16,640
Speaker 2: It was how deep in the country and the l

992
00:58:17,080 --> 00:58:19,400
Speaker 2: it was. It was deep, it was, it was it.

993
00:58:19,440 --> 00:58:20,919
Speaker 1: Was in the sticks. But it was great. The people

994
00:58:20,960 --> 00:58:24,040
Speaker 1: were wonderful. It's still okay.

995
00:58:24,080 --> 00:58:26,920
Speaker 2: How about that studio in the country and Bogel, Louisiana.

996
00:58:27,240 --> 00:58:29,840
Speaker 2: We went down there and uh, you know, we hung

997
00:58:29,920 --> 00:58:37,320
Speaker 2: out and I have to tell you about my most

998
00:58:37,400 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 2: memorable experience of being there. Because you haven't lived until

999
00:58:41,440 --> 00:58:43,320
Speaker 2: you've been in a car with Stevie Wonder.

1000
00:58:43,760 --> 00:58:45,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was waiting for the car driving story.

1001
00:58:45,600 --> 00:58:52,000
Speaker 2: So you haven't lived until you've been driven. No, So

1002
00:58:52,040 --> 00:58:54,240
Speaker 2: here's what happened. So we're feeling frisky. We're in the

1003
00:58:54,280 --> 00:58:59,120
Speaker 2: hotel and you know, we're just like, you know, messing around,

1004
00:58:59,240 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 2: and all sudden I don't remember who else I was with,

1005
00:59:03,000 --> 00:59:06,840
Speaker 2: but it's a small group of us, and somebody said, hey, Steve,

1006
00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:11,880
Speaker 2: you want to drive? Sure, So we go down go

1007
00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:14,920
Speaker 2: to somebody's car in the parking lot. It was it

1008
00:59:15,040 --> 00:59:17,560
Speaker 2: was open, you know, there were very few cars in

1009
00:59:17,600 --> 00:59:20,080
Speaker 2: a lot. And we all get in the car and

1010
00:59:20,240 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 2: he gets behind the wheel and it's like, is.

1011
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:31,240
Speaker 1: He having the time of his life?

1012
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:35,480
Speaker 2: He's cracking up, and whoever was sitting next to him

1013
00:59:35,640 --> 00:59:37,720
Speaker 2: was like, okay, go this go right, go laft. He's

1014
00:59:37,760 --> 00:59:43,120
Speaker 2: like okay, and it's hysterical and we're just dying laughing.

1015
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 2: We're cracking up, and I go, okay, this is something

1016
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:50,600
Speaker 2: to remember. Ship. Yeah, so that was the most memorable

1017
00:59:50,640 --> 00:59:51,760
Speaker 2: thing unfortunately that happened.

1018
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 1: We made.

1019
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:54,920
Speaker 2: We made a good amount of music. We all took

1020
00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:59,520
Speaker 2: turns trying to be junior Stevie's you know, I I

1021
01:00:01,000 --> 01:00:03,640
Speaker 2: came up with a couple of songs that weren't really great,

1022
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:08,560
Speaker 2: but you know whatever. And but then at one point

1023
01:00:08,840 --> 01:00:14,080
Speaker 2: he left went to New York and that was the

1024
01:00:14,120 --> 01:00:16,280
Speaker 2: beginning of the end, and he started phoning things in

1025
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:17,920
Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden he just kind of

1026
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:22,080
Speaker 2: left us to fend for ourselves. And I was like, okay,

1027
01:00:22,120 --> 01:00:27,640
Speaker 2: you know what, this isn't really gonna happen. So I

1028
01:00:27,840 --> 01:00:31,280
Speaker 2: had to make up my mind and it was a

1029
01:00:31,360 --> 01:00:34,200
Speaker 2: tough decision. But there were two times in my life

1030
01:00:34,720 --> 01:00:40,440
Speaker 2: when I felt spiritually depleted and it was crucial for

1031
01:00:40,520 --> 01:00:42,280
Speaker 2: me to move, and that was the first time.

1032
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:47,280
Speaker 1: Man, Yeah, so what this was so now at the

1033
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 1: beginning of secret Life of Plants or no, well, let's see, no, because.

1034
01:00:55,760 --> 01:00:57,120
Speaker 2: I was still in the band when he was working

1035
01:00:57,160 --> 01:01:01,040
Speaker 2: on that. Okay, I didn't play, that was all him.

1036
01:01:01,520 --> 01:01:03,960
Speaker 4: What was the I mean the general but general, what

1037
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:08,360
Speaker 4: was the general conversation? Because you know, usually with what

1038
01:01:08,520 --> 01:01:11,760
Speaker 4: they call the departure record, it's supposed to be seeing

1039
01:01:11,840 --> 01:01:13,800
Speaker 4: as yes, this is my artistic left turn and da

1040
01:01:13,880 --> 01:01:16,480
Speaker 4: da da da da. But I guess later in life,

1041
01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:18,760
Speaker 4: all of us here sort of discovered that the departure

1042
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:19,320
Speaker 4: record is.

1043
01:01:19,520 --> 01:01:26,160
Speaker 1: Kind of a uh means to ruin it before you

1044
01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:31,960
Speaker 1: get ruined, or it's the self sabbage sabotage move. And

1045
01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:34,600
Speaker 1: as what you think Life for Plants was well, I

1046
01:01:34,680 --> 01:01:35,040
Speaker 1: mean just.

1047
01:01:35,280 --> 01:01:39,920
Speaker 4: Most most departure albums usually happened after your biggest your

1048
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:43,840
Speaker 4: biggest album, and you don't want to express the fear of.

1049
01:01:45,360 --> 01:01:47,920
Speaker 1: You having run hour of ideas or that sort of thing.

1050
01:01:48,080 --> 01:01:49,880
Speaker 4: So it's sort of like it's safe to do with

1051
01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:52,880
Speaker 4: let me do the Yeah, let me do the absolute

1052
01:01:53,080 --> 01:01:55,920
Speaker 4: left turn trouble man, Yeah.

1053
01:01:55,960 --> 01:01:59,400
Speaker 1: Trouble around the world in the day peers.

1054
01:01:59,760 --> 01:02:02,560
Speaker 4: I mean, sometimes it backfires and it becomes it becomes

1055
01:02:02,600 --> 01:02:05,600
Speaker 4: even bigger. So, I mean, what was just the general

1056
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:08,120
Speaker 4: movement like, Hey, I'm gonna do an all instrumental album.

1057
01:02:08,360 --> 01:02:10,800
Speaker 2: Another world's waiting. No, I don't think it had anything

1058
01:02:10,840 --> 01:02:13,400
Speaker 2: to do with that. I think you have to look

1059
01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:16,120
Speaker 2: at it like this. I think it had to do

1060
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:20,360
Speaker 2: with wanting to take on the challenge of doing a score.

1061
01:02:22,320 --> 01:02:24,320
Speaker 2: This was a score to a movie done by a

1062
01:02:24,400 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 2: blind guy.

1063
01:02:25,160 --> 01:02:28,280
Speaker 1: Let's just let's just know that the movie he was

1064
01:02:28,320 --> 01:02:31,680
Speaker 1: done by, the score was the score the score itself.

1065
01:02:35,280 --> 01:02:38,000
Speaker 2: Okay, I get a blind guy doing a score for

1066
01:02:38,080 --> 01:02:38,360
Speaker 2: a movie.

1067
01:02:39,000 --> 01:02:44,040
Speaker 1: Who does that? Who does that? I see so he

1068
01:02:44,760 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 1: who hires that guy?

1069
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:55,320
Speaker 2: Somebody really crazy or somebody really extra visionary? But no

1070
01:02:55,800 --> 01:03:00,840
Speaker 2: he I think he just dug the challenge. M he

1071
01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:03,160
Speaker 2: was really into the challenge of doing it, and that

1072
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:06,760
Speaker 2: was the premiere of Semone Your Love. But he really

1073
01:03:06,880 --> 01:03:08,800
Speaker 2: got into it. He really got into the challenge and

1074
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:12,560
Speaker 2: wanted to know as much about the movie, you know,

1075
01:03:12,760 --> 01:03:16,120
Speaker 2: as many details as he could get, and he just forced.

1076
01:03:17,920 --> 01:03:20,760
Speaker 1: His entire being into that. For the record, that's my

1077
01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:22,280
Speaker 1: favorite Stevie record.

1078
01:03:22,800 --> 01:03:25,240
Speaker 2: And not to be kind really, I mean it's just

1079
01:03:25,440 --> 01:03:27,200
Speaker 2: you know, I was eight years old and that was

1080
01:03:27,360 --> 01:03:30,360
Speaker 2: that was my Pink Floyd Dark side.

1081
01:03:30,160 --> 01:03:30,560
Speaker 1: Of the movement.

1082
01:03:31,240 --> 01:03:33,720
Speaker 4: Put the headphones on my eyes and imagine stuff and

1083
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:35,880
Speaker 4: sure it just like I didn't know about oh this,

1084
01:03:36,120 --> 01:03:38,440
Speaker 4: I have pop hooks. Like my dad hated it. So

1085
01:03:38,560 --> 01:03:41,040
Speaker 4: he's like, here you take it, ha ha. And it

1086
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:43,480
Speaker 4: just spoke to me as as an eight year old.

1087
01:03:43,560 --> 01:03:45,520
Speaker 1: So it that's pretty well. You know.

1088
01:03:45,960 --> 01:03:51,400
Speaker 4: Actually we're talking to him right now about doing some

1089
01:03:52,840 --> 01:03:55,800
Speaker 4: hopefully some some dates like to do it.

1090
01:03:55,920 --> 01:04:01,000
Speaker 1: And it's entirety for plants. Yeah, that's okay. Did I

1091
01:04:01,120 --> 01:04:05,800
Speaker 1: just let the cat We'll just we won't guide this

1092
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:10,000
Speaker 1: until after four words for you, bro, good luck with that.

1093
01:04:12,600 --> 01:04:16,680
Speaker 1: I mean, we're in the talking stage. It's we'll be talking.

1094
01:04:18,800 --> 01:04:21,520
Speaker 1: The longest dream it's our dreams. So I mean that's

1095
01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:24,040
Speaker 1: basically dreams can't come true. But I just good luck

1096
01:04:24,080 --> 01:04:27,240
Speaker 1: with that. I'll be calling you. You don't need to

1097
01:04:31,720 --> 01:04:37,920
Speaker 1: arms crossed the audience. So, was Destiny your first foray

1098
01:04:38,120 --> 01:04:39,400
Speaker 1: into arranging?

1099
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:44,800
Speaker 4: And really, to me, it's producing and like, why, okay,

1100
01:04:45,080 --> 01:04:47,959
Speaker 4: we gotta get into the titles of because I only

1101
01:04:48,040 --> 01:04:49,960
Speaker 4: saw these credits on jackson Down.

1102
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:51,400
Speaker 1: Like Fingersnap arranger.

1103
01:04:53,160 --> 01:04:56,520
Speaker 2: You know that's because they were all dying for credit. Yeah,

1104
01:04:56,800 --> 01:04:58,960
Speaker 2: I get it, because they wanted they were so desperate

1105
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,200
Speaker 2: to be on their own and they just wanted to

1106
01:05:01,360 --> 01:05:03,280
Speaker 2: do Okay, look, I'm the one that set the mic,

1107
01:05:04,120 --> 01:05:06,840
Speaker 2: you know. I you know, I'm the one that chose

1108
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:07,840
Speaker 2: the studio whatever.

1109
01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:11,360
Speaker 1: The Jackson's have the strangest album credits of all time.

1110
01:05:11,560 --> 01:05:14,600
Speaker 1: That stuck with me for life. So talk to me

1111
01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:16,760
Speaker 1: about you coming aboard for Destiny.

1112
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:19,200
Speaker 2: I will. But to answer the question, no, it wasn't

1113
01:05:19,280 --> 01:05:23,480
Speaker 2: my first for foray into arranging because I was cutting

1114
01:05:23,560 --> 01:05:28,080
Speaker 2: my teeth. I was allowed to cut my teeth arranging wise,

1115
01:05:28,600 --> 01:05:35,720
Speaker 2: thanks to the partnership of Dick Griffy and Don Cornelius.

1116
01:05:35,280 --> 01:05:40,360
Speaker 1: Thank you, WHOA served some time in Griffyville. Yeah, Soul

1117
01:05:40,400 --> 01:05:43,840
Speaker 1: Training Records. Yeah. No, don't say don't don't you dare

1118
01:05:43,880 --> 01:05:49,160
Speaker 1: say Uptown festivals. Please don't say it. Shalla Mars Discoogarden. No,

1119
01:05:50,040 --> 01:05:52,760
Speaker 1: but let me see. Did I do some You did

1120
01:05:52,800 --> 01:05:53,880
Speaker 1: the souling Ging album?

1121
01:05:55,680 --> 01:05:57,760
Speaker 2: Oh god, I remember that, but I remember doing I

1122
01:05:57,800 --> 01:06:00,600
Speaker 2: remember working on different artists. If there's of course, I

1123
01:06:00,720 --> 01:06:07,960
Speaker 2: believe it. Of course, uh Dix Dix Uh, I did

1124
01:06:08,840 --> 01:06:09,800
Speaker 2: a couple of her albums.

1125
01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:11,520
Speaker 1: I did, uh uh.

1126
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:15,240
Speaker 2: There there was another Oh god, it was another band.

1127
01:06:15,280 --> 01:06:19,160
Speaker 2: It was like two guys and they had sort of

1128
01:06:19,280 --> 01:06:21,800
Speaker 2: like an Indian name, and I can't remember right now,

1129
01:06:23,560 --> 01:06:25,480
Speaker 2: but they had all these They had a small stable

1130
01:06:25,520 --> 01:06:29,800
Speaker 2: of artists and including the Whispers. And I did a

1131
01:06:29,840 --> 01:06:31,840
Speaker 2: lot of stuff and then they let me just do

1132
01:06:32,360 --> 01:06:33,360
Speaker 2: they just let me arrange.

1133
01:06:33,960 --> 01:06:37,160
Speaker 1: Wait, you know what's weird in your Wikipedia.

1134
01:06:38,000 --> 01:06:43,080
Speaker 2: It's just that I know Carrie. No that is so

1135
01:06:44,000 --> 01:06:46,080
Speaker 2: I don't know who, and they won't take it away.

1136
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:48,200
Speaker 2: I don't know who to write to make that correction.

1137
01:06:48,320 --> 01:06:50,280
Speaker 2: But it's really annoying. It doesn't matter because one of

1138
01:06:50,320 --> 01:06:52,840
Speaker 2: the Dixie humming Birds was my grandfather. Okay, and I

1139
01:06:53,240 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 2: got you know, I had to get embarrassed on National

1140
01:06:55,360 --> 01:06:58,720
Speaker 2: TV once he told me like, he's not your grandfather.

1141
01:06:58,880 --> 01:07:00,000
Speaker 1: Oops, yeah exactly.

1142
01:07:01,520 --> 01:07:02,600
Speaker 5: So you.

1143
01:07:04,200 --> 01:07:06,000
Speaker 1: Did some time under Soul Train Records.

1144
01:07:06,080 --> 01:07:10,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, but I enjoyed it. And I remember working a

1145
01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:12,560
Speaker 2: lot with the Whispers, and I remember one of the

1146
01:07:12,640 --> 01:07:15,120
Speaker 2: twins saying to me, you know what your problem is? Like, oh, no,

1147
01:07:15,360 --> 01:07:16,440
Speaker 2: because you know too much.

1148
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:18,920
Speaker 5: Go out.

1149
01:07:21,080 --> 01:07:26,439
Speaker 2: Of backhanded compliment, but you know yeah, he's like, yeah,

1150
01:07:26,680 --> 01:07:28,400
Speaker 2: I didn't understand it then, but I sort of get

1151
01:07:28,400 --> 01:07:28,640
Speaker 2: it now.

1152
01:07:28,840 --> 01:07:35,439
Speaker 1: Did you work on Let's Go all the Way? Yeah? Yeah, yes, yeah.

1153
01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:39,200
Speaker 4: So when you're brought aboard, like what were you there?

1154
01:07:39,320 --> 01:07:43,120
Speaker 4: Just recession work or like what what was your title?

1155
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:46,360
Speaker 2: I don't really think I had a title. I wasn't

1156
01:07:46,440 --> 01:07:49,920
Speaker 2: like a I wasn't like a staff producer or anything

1157
01:07:49,960 --> 01:07:52,760
Speaker 2: like that. I was just brought into play sessions and

1158
01:07:53,120 --> 01:07:56,400
Speaker 2: sometimes arrange either horns or rhythm or whatever.

1159
01:07:56,760 --> 01:08:03,400
Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, now I want to get to the Jackson. Okay.

1160
01:08:04,680 --> 01:08:11,720
Speaker 2: So dear friend of mine, Bobby Colombia, uh tears right, Yeah, okay,

1161
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:16,439
Speaker 2: the drummer who became an executive at CBS said.

1162
01:08:16,280 --> 01:08:18,840
Speaker 1: You know, you need to do more arranging, and I go, well,

1163
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:21,920
Speaker 1: really seriously no, actually you do.

1164
01:08:22,120 --> 01:08:24,400
Speaker 2: And here's who you here here, here's who you're gonna

1165
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:26,400
Speaker 2: do it with. Next thing, you know, I'm in a

1166
01:08:26,479 --> 01:08:33,040
Speaker 2: room with the Jackson's. So I met all the brothers

1167
01:08:33,160 --> 01:08:36,320
Speaker 2: and uh, you know, now you have to remember the time.

1168
01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:42,519
Speaker 2: This was when they finally left the clutches of Motown

1169
01:08:42,760 --> 01:08:47,080
Speaker 2: and uh, this was after the Philly thing, you know.

1170
01:08:47,880 --> 01:08:52,480
Speaker 2: And so now they're trying to establish themselves as producers.

1171
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:56,360
Speaker 2: But CBS was cautious, so they they brought in Bobby

1172
01:08:56,560 --> 01:08:58,639
Speaker 2: Yes to make sure things didn't get too out of hand,

1173
01:08:58,720 --> 01:08:58,880
Speaker 2: you know.

1174
01:08:59,600 --> 01:09:06,360
Speaker 1: And so were you aware? I mean, was okay, dude?

1175
01:09:06,400 --> 01:09:07,920
Speaker 4: I mean you were part of songs in the Keev

1176
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:11,160
Speaker 4: life by then, Like, was the Jackson's or going places

1177
01:09:11,360 --> 01:09:12,759
Speaker 4: on your radar by then.

1178
01:09:12,960 --> 01:09:13,240
Speaker 5: Or was it?

1179
01:09:13,280 --> 01:09:16,320
Speaker 2: Like dude, no, no, no, no, no, no, no you

1180
01:09:16,560 --> 01:09:20,320
Speaker 2: I love the Jacksons. I had just as many dreams

1181
01:09:20,320 --> 01:09:24,280
Speaker 2: about them, just about as I had of Steve. Oh no, absolutely, man,

1182
01:09:24,360 --> 01:09:27,240
Speaker 2: Because the thing well, first of all, when I was

1183
01:09:27,320 --> 01:09:33,200
Speaker 2: eight and I saw the Beatles on Sullivan, I said, right,

1184
01:09:33,439 --> 01:09:37,800
Speaker 2: that's what I want to do. So the Beatles just

1185
01:09:38,400 --> 01:09:43,720
Speaker 2: changed my life. And then the Monkeys changed my life

1186
01:09:43,720 --> 01:09:47,280
Speaker 2: because they were the American Beatles, and then the Jackson

1187
01:09:47,479 --> 01:09:49,120
Speaker 2: Five are.

1188
01:09:49,000 --> 01:09:52,800
Speaker 7: The Black Beatles, Like is this fantastic? I mean they

1189
01:09:52,880 --> 01:09:56,920
Speaker 7: even have their own cartoon show. What brand you know

1190
01:09:57,080 --> 01:09:59,880
Speaker 7: has her own cartoon show on Saturdays. It's fantastic.

1191
01:10:00,600 --> 01:10:02,920
Speaker 1: So I was all, you know, please, I want you back.

1192
01:10:02,960 --> 01:10:04,800
Speaker 1: Are you kidding me? Are you kidding me?

1193
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:05,160
Speaker 5: Right now?

1194
01:10:05,240 --> 01:10:08,040
Speaker 2: So it's like, yeah, I was all about the Jackson Five,

1195
01:10:08,360 --> 01:10:10,479
Speaker 2: and I had visions on the Wow, wouldn't it be

1196
01:10:10,560 --> 01:10:13,280
Speaker 2: great if I could actually like meet them or work

1197
01:10:13,439 --> 01:10:15,120
Speaker 2: what's incredible? Next thing, you know, I'm in a room

1198
01:10:15,160 --> 01:10:19,120
Speaker 2: and here they are, and we're doing the Destiny album.

1199
01:10:19,160 --> 01:10:24,639
Speaker 2: And my first assignment was this little overly white bread

1200
01:10:24,680 --> 01:10:26,000
Speaker 2: tune called Blame It on the Boogiet.

1201
01:10:27,160 --> 01:10:32,759
Speaker 1: I was like, blame it on the Dane. I'm like, okay,

1202
01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:34,519
Speaker 1: well girl, let's see how we can funk this up.

1203
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:38,880
Speaker 1: Mick Jackson.

1204
01:10:39,200 --> 01:10:41,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, well back then it seemed cute, kind it's kind

1205
01:10:41,680 --> 01:10:44,280
Speaker 4: of white. It works now because no one expects it

1206
01:10:44,360 --> 01:10:45,400
Speaker 4: when when.

1207
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:48,559
Speaker 2: They spin it exactly, But back then I was like, really,

1208
01:10:48,920 --> 01:10:50,720
Speaker 2: we're gonna make this a Jackson thing.

1209
01:10:51,720 --> 01:10:54,720
Speaker 1: So my my, so Bobby brought that song to you guys.

1210
01:10:56,439 --> 01:10:58,559
Speaker 1: I I can't remember if Bobby brought it to them.

1211
01:10:59,360 --> 01:11:10,519
Speaker 2: But well, actually yeah, yeah, you know, uh generally speaking. Yeah,

1212
01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:13,680
Speaker 2: But my monitor back then was all right, I'm out

1213
01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:14,920
Speaker 2: here on my own. What would Stevie do?

1214
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:15,640
Speaker 1: That was my thing.

1215
01:11:15,720 --> 01:11:18,439
Speaker 2: What would Stevie do? What would Stevie do? So, you know,

1216
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:21,880
Speaker 2: and I would bring in like former band members to

1217
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:22,320
Speaker 2: play on.

1218
01:11:23,120 --> 01:11:23,240
Speaker 5: Uh.

1219
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:26,519
Speaker 2: You know, those are early recordings, and so I'm always

1220
01:11:26,520 --> 01:11:29,280
Speaker 2: thinking what would Stevie do? So it's like, all right, see,

1221
01:11:29,520 --> 01:11:30,320
Speaker 2: gotta make it funny.

1222
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:37,120
Speaker 1: So that's what you know.

1223
01:11:37,200 --> 01:11:39,280
Speaker 2: That was the basis of that, and then you know,

1224
01:11:39,680 --> 01:11:43,920
Speaker 2: things built from there. I didn't do the Horner arrangers

1225
01:11:43,960 --> 01:11:45,439
Speaker 2: for that song, but they did turn out cool.

1226
01:11:46,560 --> 01:11:47,360
Speaker 1: Was that Tom Tom?

1227
01:11:47,520 --> 01:11:50,479
Speaker 2: Or it wasn't It wasn't Tom yet, I don't I

1228
01:11:50,520 --> 01:11:52,760
Speaker 2: don't remember who did the horns for that, but Tom

1229
01:11:52,840 --> 01:11:55,760
Speaker 2: Tom didn't come until later on. I mean Tom Tom

1230
01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:58,160
Speaker 2: did the horns for shake Your Body Down. I mean

1231
01:11:58,160 --> 01:12:01,280
Speaker 2: that was you know, they they they wanted that, but

1232
01:12:01,800 --> 01:12:03,960
Speaker 2: that by that point, they definitely wanted the earth winding

1233
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:06,120
Speaker 2: fire influence, you know, so we got a little little

1234
01:12:06,160 --> 01:12:08,800
Speaker 2: Tom Washington come in with his crazy stelf. I love Tom,

1235
01:12:09,680 --> 01:12:13,160
Speaker 2: but for Destiny, yeah, that's that was the first song,

1236
01:12:13,240 --> 01:12:14,640
Speaker 2: and then we just took it from there and it was,

1237
01:12:17,240 --> 01:12:19,479
Speaker 2: you know, marriage made in Heaven.

1238
01:12:20,280 --> 01:12:23,080
Speaker 1: How do you even approach like you're dealing with the

1239
01:12:23,160 --> 01:12:28,320
Speaker 1: five of them? Who's the alpha as far as like

1240
01:12:28,640 --> 01:12:33,160
Speaker 1: the music ideas? Who do you have to like? Who's

1241
01:12:33,200 --> 01:12:33,519
Speaker 1: the dad?

1242
01:12:33,560 --> 01:12:35,880
Speaker 4: Who's who's the person that you have to get the

1243
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:39,080
Speaker 4: idea from? Because I'm certain then it's like, well, my

1244
01:12:39,200 --> 01:12:40,720
Speaker 4: piece and it was all of them.

1245
01:12:41,000 --> 01:12:42,479
Speaker 1: It was all of them in that way, you know.

1246
01:12:43,000 --> 01:12:44,960
Speaker 4: But was it a psychological thing where it's like you

1247
01:12:45,040 --> 01:12:48,559
Speaker 4: have the Jedi mind trick? And I don't like this arrangement.

1248
01:12:48,560 --> 01:12:50,080
Speaker 4: I don't like the song in my mind?

1249
01:12:50,160 --> 01:12:54,360
Speaker 1: Your mane was broke vocal? Okay, so Jackie was vocal?

1250
01:12:54,800 --> 01:12:59,840
Speaker 2: No, no, Jackie was actually not as vocal. It certainly

1251
01:12:59,880 --> 01:13:00,920
Speaker 2: not a vocal as Jermaine.

1252
01:13:01,680 --> 01:13:01,800
Speaker 6: Uh.

1253
01:13:02,520 --> 01:13:06,439
Speaker 2: I think that the the the main characters and give

1254
01:13:06,479 --> 01:13:11,519
Speaker 2: me yeah, sorry, I lost something. I found it okay.

1255
01:13:16,760 --> 01:13:22,559
Speaker 1: Wrong? You know, I'm having so much fun right now,

1256
01:13:22,960 --> 01:13:26,280
Speaker 1: I want to do another one. I mean, did Jermaine

1257
01:13:26,320 --> 01:13:26,880
Speaker 1: come around?

1258
01:13:27,000 --> 01:13:27,280
Speaker 5: I just.

1259
01:13:28,920 --> 01:13:37,960
Speaker 2: Okay, stop, you had the crush? Okay, all right, marlin girl,

1260
01:13:38,560 --> 01:13:46,080
Speaker 2: let's see. Okay, So we had Michael Randy Randy, uh, Marlon,

1261
01:13:46,960 --> 01:13:54,120
Speaker 2: Jackie and Okay, so the the most vocal were Michael,

1262
01:13:54,160 --> 01:13:59,000
Speaker 2: Marlon and Randy. Randy was one of the more creative ones,

1263
01:13:59,600 --> 01:14:05,840
Speaker 2: okay for sure, yea, And but all the ideas were

1264
01:14:05,920 --> 01:14:10,720
Speaker 2: just kind of run through the the the general pipeline

1265
01:14:10,760 --> 01:14:15,040
Speaker 2: between all of them. It wasn't I don't I don't

1266
01:14:15,040 --> 01:14:21,240
Speaker 2: remember being as difficult as you might think. But you know,

1267
01:14:21,400 --> 01:14:24,679
Speaker 2: here's the thing though, so the question they usually loved.

1268
01:14:24,680 --> 01:14:27,720
Speaker 2: They generally loved my ideas, you know, what was the

1269
01:14:27,800 --> 01:14:31,040
Speaker 2: division of labor, like at working on Destiny, like who

1270
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:42,200
Speaker 2: did what? Oh? Gosh, well, uh, A little foggy on

1271
01:14:42,280 --> 01:14:48,800
Speaker 2: the best way to answer that. They all kind of

1272
01:14:48,880 --> 01:14:59,160
Speaker 2: wanted to chip in, for instance, with with with Ken

1273
01:14:59,240 --> 01:15:02,080
Speaker 2: you feel was on Triumph, right, Okay, so I gotta

1274
01:15:02,080 --> 01:15:04,040
Speaker 2: I gotta go to that album as as an example,

1275
01:15:04,160 --> 01:15:09,280
Speaker 2: so can you feel it? Specifically? I had, you know,

1276
01:15:09,880 --> 01:15:14,760
Speaker 2: several orchestral ideas, and one of them was, like, you know,

1277
01:15:14,880 --> 01:15:19,560
Speaker 2: during the main part of the Vamp, you know, so

1278
01:15:19,720 --> 01:15:21,200
Speaker 2: you got that thing going on, and then you got

1279
01:15:23,240 --> 01:15:26,959
Speaker 2: so I had to where you know, you'd have an

1280
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:31,280
Speaker 2: orchestra chime followed by a gone, I mean by a timpany,

1281
01:15:31,560 --> 01:15:37,280
Speaker 2: so you'd be like like that, so you'd have that,

1282
01:15:38,160 --> 01:15:41,120
Speaker 2: you know, you'd have like one ethnot being the orchestra

1283
01:15:41,240 --> 01:15:43,839
Speaker 2: chime and then the very next eight being the timpany.

1284
01:15:44,360 --> 01:15:46,640
Speaker 2: And so they you know, we had one guy do

1285
01:15:46,760 --> 01:15:49,760
Speaker 2: the chime and another guy do the timpany. Everybody wanted to,

1286
01:15:50,240 --> 01:15:52,320
Speaker 2: you know, play a part in it, and it was cool,

1287
01:15:52,360 --> 01:15:56,320
Speaker 2: you know. So I would just answered by saying they

1288
01:15:56,400 --> 01:15:59,800
Speaker 2: all kind of wanted to do whatever they could.

1289
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:01,759
Speaker 1: It was reasonable just to contribute.

1290
01:16:01,880 --> 01:16:04,880
Speaker 4: Yeah, question about things I Do for you? Oh yeah,

1291
01:16:06,040 --> 01:16:11,080
Speaker 4: now it's seventy eight, so all in all, by Earth

1292
01:16:11,120 --> 01:16:15,240
Speaker 4: Winding Fire is about a year old. How much did

1293
01:16:15,400 --> 01:16:20,320
Speaker 4: Jupiter have to do with that song? Because basically, like East.

1294
01:16:20,280 --> 01:16:25,240
Speaker 2: Dude five minutes later, fifteen seconds later, that like literally

1295
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:29,080
Speaker 2: the first verse and the bridge of things I Do

1296
01:16:29,240 --> 01:16:34,400
Speaker 2: for You is like from the DNA of Jupiter by

1297
01:16:34,479 --> 01:16:36,599
Speaker 2: Earth Wind and Fire, of which I mean I can

1298
01:16:36,680 --> 01:16:40,080
Speaker 2: imagine that, you know, most songs. I mean, I even

1299
01:16:40,120 --> 01:16:44,040
Speaker 2: think that the DNA of Teddy Pendergrass is get up,

1300
01:16:44,040 --> 01:16:48,120
Speaker 2: Get down, can funk, Get loose was somewhat of a

1301
01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:50,040
Speaker 2: basis for Shaky Body down to the ground.

1302
01:16:55,160 --> 01:16:58,600
Speaker 1: You it's isn't it.

1303
01:16:58,680 --> 01:17:01,680
Speaker 2: It's frightening because most songs, I don't think of it

1304
01:17:01,920 --> 01:17:02,519
Speaker 2: that deep.

1305
01:17:02,800 --> 01:17:06,320
Speaker 1: But the thing is is that most songs, most songs

1306
01:17:06,360 --> 01:17:08,000
Speaker 1: are usually started.

1307
01:17:07,800 --> 01:17:12,120
Speaker 2: With songs that there's a germ, So how can I

1308
01:17:12,200 --> 01:17:12,560
Speaker 2: twist it?

1309
01:17:13,320 --> 01:17:16,599
Speaker 1: I totally agree with that. I I did not live

1310
01:17:16,640 --> 01:17:21,519
Speaker 1: it up. You know, all about let's dance, Let's shout.

1311
01:17:22,280 --> 01:17:24,760
Speaker 1: Game Funk was all about, like you know that that

1312
01:17:24,880 --> 01:17:25,720
Speaker 1: was seventy six.

1313
01:17:26,080 --> 01:17:29,560
Speaker 2: I can imagine that the DNA of that stuff just

1314
01:17:29,640 --> 01:17:32,240
Speaker 2: being up in the air and then taking it okay. Well,

1315
01:17:32,400 --> 01:17:34,560
Speaker 2: while I didn't, while I never looked at it that

1316
01:17:34,880 --> 01:17:38,640
Speaker 2: way for that song, I do see your point. And

1317
01:17:39,200 --> 01:17:43,320
Speaker 2: to that point, it's very possible because I can tell

1318
01:17:43,400 --> 01:17:47,280
Speaker 2: you that they were highly influenced by EWF as we

1319
01:17:47,360 --> 01:17:57,840
Speaker 2: all were, because for uh Heartbreak Hotel, they wanted the

1320
01:17:58,000 --> 01:17:59,040
Speaker 2: exact same.

1321
01:18:00,360 --> 01:18:02,120
Speaker 1: Sound uh.

1322
01:18:04,360 --> 01:18:10,519
Speaker 2: From Fantasy MM. They wanted that. They specifically talked about

1323
01:18:10,560 --> 01:18:14,040
Speaker 2: that to the point where we brought in Vernie Wow

1324
01:18:14,240 --> 01:18:19,600
Speaker 2: to try to have him duplicated on due right and

1325
01:18:19,760 --> 01:18:24,040
Speaker 2: he couldn't. I mean because you sat him down and

1326
01:18:24,120 --> 01:18:24,719
Speaker 2: asked him.

1327
01:18:24,720 --> 01:18:27,000
Speaker 1: What was that sound? And he was like, I don't know.

1328
01:18:29,200 --> 01:18:31,840
Speaker 2: We couldn't get that thick sound. It was like you

1329
01:18:31,920 --> 01:18:34,160
Speaker 2: know in Fantasy because they wanted to duplicate it for

1330
01:18:37,040 --> 01:18:41,800
Speaker 2: Hartford Hotel and it was close, but it wasn't. Actually,

1331
01:18:41,800 --> 01:18:44,160
Speaker 2: it wasn't even close. It wasn't It wasn't that same

1332
01:18:44,280 --> 01:18:47,800
Speaker 2: sound from Fantasy, and we were slightly disappointed, but you know,

1333
01:18:47,920 --> 01:18:49,000
Speaker 2: we used it anyway.

1334
01:18:53,600 --> 01:18:56,880
Speaker 1: So what what was I gonna say about that? Yeah?

1335
01:18:56,920 --> 01:19:00,439
Speaker 1: So I mean to your point about that, this what

1336
01:19:00,600 --> 01:19:01,519
Speaker 1: was the song you brought up?

1337
01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:05,400
Speaker 2: Things I'll do for you just possible. I just never

1338
01:19:05,479 --> 01:19:07,559
Speaker 2: looked at it that way. But it's an interesting take.

1339
01:19:08,000 --> 01:19:14,920
Speaker 4: Well, also, you're in the thick of disco. Yeah, and

1340
01:19:15,400 --> 01:19:20,559
Speaker 4: I'm super shocked there's no four on the floor. I mean,

1341
01:19:20,640 --> 01:19:23,360
Speaker 4: the remix to blame it on the bookie was four

1342
01:19:23,400 --> 01:19:25,719
Speaker 4: on the floor enough with the little extra Conka things.

1343
01:19:26,560 --> 01:19:32,320
Speaker 4: But you guys were obviously putting all of your eggs

1344
01:19:32,479 --> 01:19:34,719
Speaker 4: in the basket of shake your body down to the ground.

1345
01:19:34,760 --> 01:19:36,160
Speaker 1: Because I was gonna say, what do you think that was?

1346
01:19:36,280 --> 01:19:39,000
Speaker 4: But here's the thing, though, it's like it's that was

1347
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 4: such not since seven seven, seven ninety three eleven have

1348
01:19:43,400 --> 01:19:48,720
Speaker 4: I heard a funk song in which the one, the two,

1349
01:19:48,880 --> 01:19:51,320
Speaker 4: the three, and the four are not even emphasized.

1350
01:19:51,680 --> 01:19:54,160
Speaker 2: Okay, I mair, I have two words for you hit me.

1351
01:19:54,560 --> 01:19:59,160
Speaker 2: You're welcome. Yeah, But it was you know, I came

1352
01:19:59,240 --> 01:19:59,680
Speaker 2: up with the beat.

1353
01:20:00,000 --> 01:20:00,479
Speaker 1: I know you did.

1354
01:20:00,560 --> 01:20:06,479
Speaker 4: That's why you're here. But it's like it's it's it's

1355
01:20:06,640 --> 01:20:11,280
Speaker 4: nineteen seventy eight, yeah, and disco is at.

1356
01:20:12,640 --> 01:20:13,200
Speaker 1: It's flaming.

1357
01:20:13,760 --> 01:20:18,120
Speaker 4: I mean, you guys were basically David to this goliath.

1358
01:20:19,479 --> 01:20:22,559
Speaker 4: I don't know why did y'all decide to take that risk.

1359
01:20:22,840 --> 01:20:25,800
Speaker 2: I didn't even look at it like that. I don't

1360
01:20:25,840 --> 01:20:28,760
Speaker 2: know if they did. I certainly didn't. I just my

1361
01:20:28,920 --> 01:20:31,120
Speaker 2: thing was what would Stevie do? And I wanted to

1362
01:20:31,160 --> 01:20:33,120
Speaker 2: come up with something really cool, and you wanted to

1363
01:20:33,160 --> 01:20:34,360
Speaker 2: go with funk and not disco.

1364
01:20:36,520 --> 01:20:38,960
Speaker 1: That's what That's how it spoke to me.

1365
01:20:39,320 --> 01:20:42,559
Speaker 2: Sure, So I wasn't even I wasn't thinking about disco.

1366
01:20:42,640 --> 01:20:47,120
Speaker 2: I was thinking about what would be the most effective

1367
01:20:47,280 --> 01:20:55,679
Speaker 2: way to make this, this long song remain interesting six

1368
01:20:55,760 --> 01:20:58,719
Speaker 2: minutes later. Was there even a suggestion for a bridge

1369
01:20:58,840 --> 01:21:02,360
Speaker 2: or No? No, because it was cool. We all knew

1370
01:21:02,400 --> 01:21:04,600
Speaker 2: that was cool the way it was. I I just

1371
01:21:04,720 --> 01:21:10,160
Speaker 2: wanted to give it something unique rhythmically that would drive

1372
01:21:10,240 --> 01:21:13,800
Speaker 2: it and my and my and my my inspiration was

1373
01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:18,400
Speaker 2: was Steve's unorthodox drumming style with.

1374
01:21:18,520 --> 01:21:20,880
Speaker 1: The hat ands. Yeah, yeah, so you're thinking like love

1375
01:21:20,920 --> 01:21:22,680
Speaker 1: having you around like that, that whole like.

1376
01:21:23,000 --> 01:21:26,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was thinking, yeah, I was thinking. So that's

1377
01:21:26,479 --> 01:21:30,160
Speaker 2: why I came up with the you know, the high hat,

1378
01:21:30,200 --> 01:21:34,280
Speaker 2: the times everything. And by the way, when we had

1379
01:21:35,200 --> 01:21:38,320
Speaker 2: ed Green, the legendary session drummer play, he couldn't play

1380
01:21:38,360 --> 01:21:38,880
Speaker 2: the whole thing.

1381
01:21:39,760 --> 01:21:41,599
Speaker 1: I don't know. We had to do it in three

1382
01:21:41,680 --> 01:21:45,960
Speaker 1: different okay, so when we got we when yeah, I

1383
01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:48,920
Speaker 1: heard I heard the master of it.

1384
01:21:49,000 --> 01:21:53,759
Speaker 4: Yeah, and once I pulled the second and the third

1385
01:21:54,400 --> 01:21:57,520
Speaker 4: edition of the Drums away and heard just a typical.

1386
01:21:57,479 --> 01:22:02,320
Speaker 1: Boots like, oh this is a normal drum break. Oh yeah, no, no, no,

1387
01:22:02,400 --> 01:22:03,840
Speaker 1: what it was. But it was just.

1388
01:22:05,680 --> 01:22:07,400
Speaker 2: That was the first take I heard that, right, And

1389
01:22:07,479 --> 01:22:10,640
Speaker 2: then then the Times and then the high had So what.

1390
01:22:10,800 --> 01:22:13,000
Speaker 1: Was on your mind when you added those tom toms?

1391
01:22:13,120 --> 01:22:14,760
Speaker 1: And in such an odd.

1392
01:22:14,600 --> 01:22:17,720
Speaker 2: Spot because I didn't add it in my head, I

1393
01:22:17,800 --> 01:22:20,439
Speaker 2: was able to play the whole thing at once. So

1394
01:22:21,120 --> 01:22:26,240
Speaker 2: the the the entire thing is So that's how I

1395
01:22:26,360 --> 01:22:29,519
Speaker 2: was hearing it. And that's but since he could only

1396
01:22:29,720 --> 01:22:33,479
Speaker 2: do one bit at a time. That's how we you know,

1397
01:22:34,160 --> 01:22:36,760
Speaker 2: mapped it out. But for me, it was the whole

1398
01:22:36,840 --> 01:22:41,320
Speaker 2: rhythmic concept that I felt would work for the for

1399
01:22:41,439 --> 01:22:44,840
Speaker 2: the whole song that was not normal. Think him though, well,

1400
01:22:44,880 --> 01:22:45,960
Speaker 2: that's because I'm a keyboard player.

1401
01:22:46,120 --> 01:22:46,719
Speaker 1: It wasn't normal.

1402
01:22:46,840 --> 01:22:49,960
Speaker 4: It's the it's the equivalent I'll explain that. It's the

1403
01:22:50,080 --> 01:22:54,320
Speaker 4: equivalent of all right, if you go to a roulette

1404
01:22:54,320 --> 01:22:57,600
Speaker 4: table with a hundred bucks and then let's say like

1405
01:22:57,720 --> 01:23:00,920
Speaker 4: you got lucky, and then you made three hundred, and

1406
01:23:01,040 --> 01:23:03,120
Speaker 4: you could just you're walking away and you're in the

1407
01:23:03,200 --> 01:23:03,680
Speaker 4: parking lot.

1408
01:23:04,680 --> 01:23:07,360
Speaker 1: Greg basically did the rhythm version of wait, I'll be

1409
01:23:07,439 --> 01:23:07,920
Speaker 1: our back.

1410
01:23:08,000 --> 01:23:12,599
Speaker 4: And he ran and just put everything on like one

1411
01:23:13,080 --> 01:23:14,479
Speaker 4: really not even on all Black.

1412
01:23:15,200 --> 01:23:18,240
Speaker 1: I'm gonna play forty two and see what happens. And

1413
01:23:18,320 --> 01:23:24,759
Speaker 1: there's roulette. He still won and it's Russian roulette.

1414
01:23:25,200 --> 01:23:27,320
Speaker 4: Really is that how you look at it, dude? Because

1415
01:23:27,360 --> 01:23:30,320
Speaker 4: it's like they got three chances. I mean, okay, the

1416
01:23:30,439 --> 01:23:33,599
Speaker 4: Jackson's was fine and they went gold and it was cute,

1417
01:23:33,920 --> 01:23:35,880
Speaker 4: and then you know, the little summer serious thing on

1418
01:23:36,000 --> 01:23:39,600
Speaker 4: the CBS kind of sustained them. But going places was

1419
01:23:39,680 --> 01:23:42,240
Speaker 4: like a decline. And I love that record still, but

1420
01:23:43,240 --> 01:23:48,320
Speaker 4: they needed they needed it, They needed a miracle for sure.

1421
01:23:48,560 --> 01:23:54,000
Speaker 2: And yes, this was Super Bowl Patriots versus the Giants

1422
01:23:54,680 --> 01:23:57,599
Speaker 2: with first time with yes, I'm making a football restaurants seam.

1423
01:23:57,720 --> 01:23:59,840
Speaker 1: Yes I'm waiting. I'm waiting for me to mess up.

1424
01:24:00,760 --> 01:24:03,240
Speaker 4: Well, you saw in the super Bowl the last ten

1425
01:24:03,280 --> 01:24:05,519
Speaker 4: seconds left and the Giants is through a hell Mary

1426
01:24:05,640 --> 01:24:16,360
Speaker 4: pass and okay, all right, reference correct, No, dude.

1427
01:24:16,800 --> 01:24:21,240
Speaker 1: That's it's that's just amazing to me because.

1428
01:24:24,080 --> 01:24:27,360
Speaker 2: Because I wasn't really looking looking at it that way.

1429
01:24:27,439 --> 01:24:30,439
Speaker 2: I just, first of all, if I felt that kind

1430
01:24:30,439 --> 01:24:32,760
Speaker 2: of pressure, I'm sure I wouldn't have come over that.

1431
01:24:33,360 --> 01:24:35,639
Speaker 1: But I mean, I just you know, they they played

1432
01:24:35,680 --> 01:24:37,160
Speaker 1: me the song and I thought, oh, it's so cool.

1433
01:24:37,280 --> 01:24:40,120
Speaker 6: Let's that So you're not conscious of your genius?

1434
01:24:40,520 --> 01:24:42,800
Speaker 1: MS stop that I wasn't. I didn't.

1435
01:24:42,960 --> 01:24:45,640
Speaker 2: All I wanted to do was come up with a

1436
01:24:45,920 --> 01:24:51,800
Speaker 2: really hip and different groove. And again it goes back

1437
01:24:51,840 --> 01:24:54,120
Speaker 2: to what would Stevie do? And that's that was the

1438
01:24:54,200 --> 01:24:55,240
Speaker 2: inspiration for the whole thing.

1439
01:24:55,360 --> 01:24:55,920
Speaker 1: Does he know that?

1440
01:24:56,040 --> 01:24:58,280
Speaker 6: Does he know that you think you approached things that way?

1441
01:24:58,800 --> 01:24:59,280
Speaker 1: Did Steve know?

1442
01:24:59,600 --> 01:24:59,920
Speaker 2: Does he know?

1443
01:25:01,840 --> 01:25:05,040
Speaker 1: I think he does? Or did you know that that

1444
01:25:05,560 --> 01:25:07,280
Speaker 1: was the template for that song. No he didn't know

1445
01:25:07,280 --> 01:25:12,920
Speaker 1: it then. Wow. No, so don't stop, Tea get enough?

1446
01:25:15,520 --> 01:25:23,880
Speaker 1: Did that bridge right itself? We know the song? Guys

1447
01:25:25,479 --> 01:25:26,719
Speaker 1: give background music.

1448
01:25:28,840 --> 01:25:32,160
Speaker 2: Anyway you can play it. But actually I should have.

1449
01:25:32,760 --> 01:25:37,280
Speaker 2: I should have brought my little souvenir. We found it

1450
01:25:37,400 --> 01:25:39,920
Speaker 2: by the way, you found it. It's a podcast. It's

1451
01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:41,760
Speaker 2: not visual anyway. But you know I I have at

1452
01:25:41,800 --> 01:25:45,920
Speaker 2: the house. I have a forty five with both our names.

1453
01:25:46,520 --> 01:25:49,320
Speaker 1: Yeah. We was talking about that. Yeah, yeah, we found

1454
01:25:49,360 --> 01:25:50,200
Speaker 1: about after you.

1455
01:25:50,520 --> 01:25:55,080
Speaker 2: Okay, So backstory, Greg did me and Boss bills class

1456
01:25:55,160 --> 01:25:57,720
Speaker 2: and in n y u h where he told us

1457
01:25:57,760 --> 01:26:01,160
Speaker 2: the story that he's about to tell. And since then

1458
01:26:01,520 --> 01:26:04,200
Speaker 2: it's been my mission to find every forty five with

1459
01:26:04,280 --> 01:26:04,880
Speaker 2: your name on it.

1460
01:26:06,479 --> 01:26:07,959
Speaker 1: I have three now really.

1461
01:26:07,960 --> 01:26:11,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, hell yeah, that's that's my obsession. Any an, he

1462
01:26:11,439 --> 01:26:13,120
Speaker 2: don't stop to get enough with your name on.

1463
01:26:13,160 --> 01:26:14,000
Speaker 1: The writer's credits.

1464
01:26:14,960 --> 01:26:18,200
Speaker 2: Wow, I found it, all right, So tell tell the

1465
01:26:18,800 --> 01:26:27,640
Speaker 2: story okay. Well, and you know, Spike asked me to

1466
01:26:28,600 --> 01:26:31,400
Speaker 2: tell the story too when he did the doc.

1467
01:26:33,800 --> 01:26:42,800
Speaker 1: For what was It? And I did and he loved it,

1468
01:26:42,880 --> 01:26:46,760
Speaker 1: but it didn't make it. The state. The state said,

1469
01:26:46,840 --> 01:26:50,760
Speaker 1: I don't think the estate has no control over this show.

1470
01:26:50,880 --> 01:26:53,800
Speaker 2: So yeah, okay, because they say it was like, I

1471
01:26:53,840 --> 01:27:01,040
Speaker 2: don't think so, cause I don't think so. So get

1472
01:27:01,040 --> 01:27:02,760
Speaker 2: a call from Mike. He wants me to come by

1473
01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:10,559
Speaker 2: to write a song, or to hear a song to write.

1474
01:27:10,600 --> 01:27:15,519
Speaker 2: I go okay, So I hop on over to haven

1475
01:27:15,560 --> 01:27:20,320
Speaker 2: Hurst and uh see him and he uh plays me

1476
01:27:20,439 --> 01:27:20,840
Speaker 2: this thing.

1477
01:27:20,960 --> 01:27:25,280
Speaker 1: It's just it just needs something, it just needs another section.

1478
01:27:27,479 --> 01:27:28,640
Speaker 1: So I hear it, and.

1479
01:27:30,200 --> 01:27:32,760
Speaker 2: You know it's fantastic. I mean, you know, everything's there,

1480
01:27:33,200 --> 01:27:38,320
Speaker 2: the first, the hook, you know, it's cool, groove, everything

1481
01:27:38,439 --> 01:27:38,760
Speaker 2: is great.

1482
01:27:39,080 --> 01:27:41,120
Speaker 1: He says, yeah, it just needs one more second section.

1483
01:27:41,280 --> 01:27:41,600
Speaker 1: So I go.

1484
01:27:43,479 --> 01:27:46,560
Speaker 2: And probably in the time that it would take you

1485
01:27:46,800 --> 01:27:51,240
Speaker 2: to hum the Jeopardy theme song, I came up with

1486
01:27:52,280 --> 01:27:52,840
Speaker 2: c Bridge.

1487
01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:14,320
Speaker 1: So I played that and then I said, so what

1488
01:28:14,400 --> 01:28:16,200
Speaker 1: do you think? He goes, I like it.

1489
01:28:17,080 --> 01:28:20,720
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, he says, yeah, this is cool. So and

1490
01:28:20,760 --> 01:28:23,000
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, okay, well, now he did ask me to

1491
01:28:23,120 --> 01:28:27,760
Speaker 2: come over to ride, so I'm guessing I should call

1492
01:28:27,880 --> 01:28:29,519
Speaker 2: myself a co writer.

1493
01:28:31,479 --> 01:28:37,960
Speaker 1: So I says, well, so what am I gonna get it?

1494
01:28:38,400 --> 01:28:38,960
Speaker 1: A piece of this?

1495
01:28:39,120 --> 01:28:43,960
Speaker 2: He goes, yeah it really, he says yeah. I says, well,

1496
01:28:44,400 --> 01:28:45,639
Speaker 2: what do you think? He goes, what do you think?

1497
01:28:45,680 --> 01:28:46,400
Speaker 2: I go, what do you think?

1498
01:28:46,680 --> 01:28:48,280
Speaker 1: So we're doing we're going back and forth on that.

1499
01:28:48,400 --> 01:28:54,760
Speaker 1: So now in my mind there's another sound for what's

1500
01:28:54,800 --> 01:28:56,840
Speaker 1: going on in my mind. But it's just like.

1501
01:28:58,360 --> 01:29:01,439
Speaker 2: The wheels are spinning in and all this is happening

1502
01:29:01,479 --> 01:29:03,479
Speaker 2: in nanoseconds. Right, So I'm thinking, oh my god, what

1503
01:29:03,560 --> 01:29:03,920
Speaker 2: do I say?

1504
01:29:03,960 --> 01:29:05,240
Speaker 1: What do I what do I say?

1505
01:29:06,960 --> 01:29:07,000
Speaker 2: What?

1506
01:29:07,680 --> 01:29:12,479
Speaker 1: How much? No, that's too much? Forty No, not quite

1507
01:29:12,920 --> 01:29:16,439
Speaker 1: thirty five I don't know. Twenty five well maybe I'm

1508
01:29:16,439 --> 01:29:20,799
Speaker 1: not sure. Fifteen I don't know. So I keep talking myself.

1509
01:29:21,680 --> 01:29:23,600
Speaker 1: I talk myself down, I talk myself. I admit it

1510
01:29:23,920 --> 01:29:24,839
Speaker 1: to what numbers?

1511
01:29:25,160 --> 01:29:28,519
Speaker 2: So I says, well, how about ten percent?

1512
01:29:28,680 --> 01:29:33,840
Speaker 1: Oh my, that sounds fair. I know, I know, I know,

1513
01:29:34,000 --> 01:29:36,880
Speaker 1: but stay with me. So I says, what what about

1514
01:29:36,920 --> 01:29:37,360
Speaker 1: ten percent?

1515
01:29:37,400 --> 01:29:42,439
Speaker 2: He goes, okay, I go really, He goes, yeah, I

1516
01:29:42,479 --> 01:29:46,120
Speaker 2: don't even know how I drove home because I'm sure

1517
01:29:46,120 --> 01:29:58,080
Speaker 2: I could have levitated. I'm like, so, I'm just like

1518
01:29:58,400 --> 01:30:00,960
Speaker 2: Lopy at this point, right, and I'm I'm just so excited.

1519
01:30:01,760 --> 01:30:06,320
Speaker 2: Some days past, I get something in the mail. It's

1520
01:30:06,360 --> 01:30:11,439
Speaker 2: a contract. Open it up, and I'm looking and I'm

1521
01:30:11,439 --> 01:30:13,200
Speaker 2: scrolling out. First of all, I don't even pay attention

1522
01:30:13,280 --> 01:30:15,160
Speaker 2: to the fact that they misspelled my name, my last name.

1523
01:30:15,200 --> 01:30:17,439
Speaker 1: I don't care. I don't even care that they use

1524
01:30:17,479 --> 01:30:19,880
Speaker 1: the T instead of a P. I don't care. I

1525
01:30:20,000 --> 01:30:24,040
Speaker 1: don't care games instead of.

1526
01:30:25,760 --> 01:30:25,800
Speaker 5: So.

1527
01:30:26,720 --> 01:30:29,640
Speaker 1: I don't care. I get past that. It's at the

1528
01:30:29,720 --> 01:30:31,639
Speaker 1: top of the contract anyway, I don't care. I scrolled down.

1529
01:30:31,720 --> 01:30:35,080
Speaker 2: I go, man, I'm looking for the punch sign and

1530
01:30:35,320 --> 01:30:39,240
Speaker 2: I see, I go, it's there.

1531
01:30:39,439 --> 01:30:39,759
Speaker 1: Okay.

1532
01:30:44,400 --> 01:30:48,800
Speaker 2: So some more time passes, right, some more days past,

1533
01:30:49,120 --> 01:30:51,479
Speaker 2: and then I got a phone call and it's from

1534
01:30:52,080 --> 01:30:55,360
Speaker 2: one of Mike's managers at the time, it was either

1535
01:30:55,560 --> 01:30:58,400
Speaker 2: Ron Rising or Freddie Demand. It was probably Freddy Freddy

1536
01:30:59,080 --> 01:31:02,839
Speaker 2: and he said, as hey, Greg, you know that contract pretender.

1537
01:31:02,840 --> 01:31:04,720
Speaker 1: I said, yes, no problem, is on the way back

1538
01:31:04,760 --> 01:31:06,559
Speaker 1: to you any any.

1539
01:31:06,439 --> 01:31:08,719
Speaker 2: Second out, no worries. He's like, well, not so fast,

1540
01:31:13,960 --> 01:31:16,400
Speaker 2: and this is where you have the sound effect for

1541
01:31:16,439 --> 01:31:23,400
Speaker 2: a breaking carlic work too, And I go, what do

1542
01:31:23,439 --> 01:31:25,400
Speaker 2: you mean not so fast? Because well, Michael has been

1543
01:31:25,479 --> 01:31:29,680
Speaker 2: thinking about this, and it turns out that he is

1544
01:31:29,800 --> 01:31:35,520
Speaker 2: determined that what you did was more of an arrangement.

1545
01:31:38,600 --> 01:31:41,479
Speaker 2: So that falls into the category of arrangements. So what

1546
01:31:41,600 --> 01:31:46,800
Speaker 2: we're gonna do is we're just gonna We're gonna we're

1547
01:31:46,840 --> 01:31:50,120
Speaker 2: gonna pass on that contract part. So thanks for your

1548
01:31:50,160 --> 01:31:52,240
Speaker 2: contribution and we'll check back with you.

1549
01:31:52,320 --> 01:31:54,960
Speaker 1: What do you get for the arrangement? I mean the difference?

1550
01:31:55,360 --> 01:31:58,400
Speaker 2: Oh god? Yeah, well I got a pat on the back,

1551
01:31:59,320 --> 01:32:03,760
Speaker 2: and liyah, see, this was my introduction to.

1552
01:32:06,479 --> 01:32:10,040
Speaker 1: Business. So do you slight question?

1553
01:32:10,160 --> 01:32:10,320
Speaker 5: Though?

1554
01:32:10,479 --> 01:32:12,680
Speaker 2: Okay, did you because I have a lot more to

1555
01:32:12,680 --> 01:32:15,080
Speaker 2: say about it, but did you know this is let me,

1556
01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:16,479
Speaker 2: this is one of the times I got it in

1557
01:32:16,520 --> 01:32:21,599
Speaker 2: the rut so with destiny and triumph, With destiny and triumph,

1558
01:32:23,040 --> 01:32:25,360
Speaker 2: weren't there any talks of hey guys, can I get

1559
01:32:25,720 --> 01:32:29,120
Speaker 2: co production at least? Or what am I doing here?

1560
01:32:29,720 --> 01:32:32,920
Speaker 2: Because here are those sessions you're like leading that ship?

1561
01:32:33,080 --> 01:32:37,000
Speaker 2: Yeah I know, I know, And and yes there were

1562
01:32:38,680 --> 01:32:42,479
Speaker 2: and there was an answer for that question, and they add, no,

1563
01:32:42,800 --> 01:32:45,800
Speaker 2: there was an answer. The answer came in the form

1564
01:32:45,880 --> 01:32:53,599
Speaker 2: of the term associate producer, which doesn't mean it doesn't

1565
01:32:53,640 --> 01:32:56,320
Speaker 2: mean anything. But you know, they figured they just throw

1566
01:32:56,439 --> 01:32:58,719
Speaker 2: me half of a bone, an old bone, and shut

1567
01:32:58,800 --> 01:33:01,519
Speaker 2: me up. That's the answer to that question. But I

1568
01:33:01,560 --> 01:33:06,160
Speaker 2: got to go back because as I was saying to

1569
01:33:07,240 --> 01:33:13,439
Speaker 2: my introduction to business and and the fact that I

1570
01:33:13,720 --> 01:33:22,000
Speaker 2: was not only young, but of the makeup that didn't

1571
01:33:22,760 --> 01:33:29,879
Speaker 2: want to fight, non confrontational. And this is the difference

1572
01:33:29,920 --> 01:33:34,760
Speaker 2: between me and I'd say nine out of the ten

1573
01:33:36,040 --> 01:33:40,000
Speaker 2: artists in today's world, because they are freaking savvy and

1574
01:33:40,040 --> 01:33:44,400
Speaker 2: they don't care. And I applaud them for that. I

1575
01:33:44,439 --> 01:33:47,479
Speaker 2: applaud them for their their business savvy and their their

1576
01:33:48,320 --> 01:33:56,679
Speaker 2: their their understanding. But unfortunately, in a lot of ways,

1577
01:33:56,760 --> 01:34:02,000
Speaker 2: nothing has changed from what happened to me, and you know,

1578
01:34:02,520 --> 01:34:05,479
Speaker 2: forty years before that in the fifties, to listen to

1579
01:34:05,920 --> 01:34:08,439
Speaker 2: these days, because there's still those horror stories of people

1580
01:34:08,560 --> 01:34:14,760
Speaker 2: just being grossly unfair for virtually no reason. And who

1581
01:34:14,920 --> 01:34:16,840
Speaker 2: did you You said the ten percent would have broken?

1582
01:34:16,920 --> 01:34:19,439
Speaker 2: Of course not, wasn't that? That's not the issue. The

1583
01:34:19,520 --> 01:34:23,680
Speaker 2: issue is the appearance. I want no yeah, I want

1584
01:34:23,760 --> 01:34:26,360
Speaker 2: it all, And the issue is the But now, while

1585
01:34:26,439 --> 01:34:28,920
Speaker 2: this is going on, while these days are passing, and

1586
01:34:29,000 --> 01:34:31,599
Speaker 2: while the the you know, the contracts in the works,

1587
01:34:31,880 --> 01:34:35,640
Speaker 2: and before I get the phone call from Freddy the

1588
01:34:35,760 --> 01:34:39,760
Speaker 2: forty five, the single was already going to print, it

1589
01:34:39,840 --> 01:34:43,320
Speaker 2: was already being pressed. That's why you have initial copies

1590
01:34:44,040 --> 01:34:49,400
Speaker 2: with my name and Michaels because even people like Quincy thought,

1591
01:34:49,479 --> 01:34:50,960
Speaker 2: oh man, Greg is in he's in there.

1592
01:34:51,200 --> 01:34:51,960
Speaker 1: He was so proud of me.

1593
01:34:52,040 --> 01:34:54,240
Speaker 2: And then, you know, because that was the first pressing,

1594
01:34:55,880 --> 01:34:58,800
Speaker 2: so it already went to press with my name on it,

1595
01:35:00,400 --> 01:35:02,080
Speaker 2: only for Michael to change his mind later on.

1596
01:35:02,360 --> 01:35:04,080
Speaker 6: See, that's when we talked to Quincy. He had this

1597
01:35:04,200 --> 01:35:06,280
Speaker 6: kind of disposition of yeah, that's Michael and that was

1598
01:35:06,320 --> 01:35:07,400
Speaker 6: messed up, but that's Michael.

1599
01:35:08,520 --> 01:35:11,760
Speaker 1: Yeah. But guess what, there's a Quincy version of that too.

1600
01:35:14,960 --> 01:35:17,759
Speaker 4: And if you want to hear that Quincy Jones story,

1601
01:35:18,160 --> 01:35:20,439
Speaker 4: make sure you tune in the next week for part

1602
01:35:20,520 --> 01:35:23,479
Speaker 4: two of the Quest Love Supreme Interview with the one

1603
01:35:23,520 --> 01:35:25,400
Speaker 4: and only Greg filling Games.

1604
01:35:25,800 --> 01:35:25,960
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1605
01:35:26,000 --> 01:35:27,800
Speaker 4: I know, I'm sorry to leave y'all hanging like that,

1606
01:35:27,960 --> 01:35:30,519
Speaker 4: but you know how it is, y'all. Make sure y'all

1607
01:35:30,560 --> 01:35:33,040
Speaker 4: come back next week. We'll have more treats for y'all.

1608
01:35:33,160 --> 01:35:35,120
Speaker 4: We'll see you on the next go round see it.

1609
01:35:45,680 --> 01:35:49,439
Speaker 4: Quest Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. This classic

1610
01:35:49,479 --> 01:35:53,880
Speaker 4: episode was produced by the team at Pandora. For more

1611
01:35:53,920 --> 01:35:57,320
Speaker 4: podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app Apple

1612
01:35:57,400 --> 01:36:00,240
Speaker 4: podcasts or wherever you listen to your favorite shows up