1 00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:15,880 Speaker 1: Wild booze and sex fueled parties become the talk of 2 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:16,440 Speaker 1: the town. 3 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:19,560 Speaker 2: But what is also. 4 00:00:19,400 --> 00:00:23,239 Speaker 1: Talked about is the fact that the party goers are 5 00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 1: as young as thirteen, fourteen, and fifteen. You heard me right, 6 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:36,519 Speaker 1: Wild booze and sex fueled parties for teens, all at 7 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:40,559 Speaker 1: the home of the so called cool mom. 8 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:42,800 Speaker 2: I mean to see grace. This is crime Stories. 9 00:00:42,920 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: Thank you for being with us here at Foxination in 10 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:46,920 Speaker 1: series XEM one eleven. 11 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 2: I can't help but think. 12 00:00:49,040 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 1: About in the movie Mean Girls with Lindsay Lohem and 13 00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:57,600 Speaker 1: the cool mom would just let the. 14 00:00:58,080 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 2: Girls do whatever they want to choose. 15 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 1: A little made herself and played into drugs and alcohol 16 00:01:05,720 --> 00:01:11,560 Speaker 1: and sex. Well, art imitates life. Take a listen to 17 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:12,920 Speaker 1: our friends at NBC. 18 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,119 Speaker 3: The first complaint about Shannon O'Connor to Los Gato's High 19 00:01:16,120 --> 00:01:19,200 Speaker 3: School came from a parent in December twenty twenty. According 20 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:22,959 Speaker 3: to internal school emails obtained exclusively by the Investigative Unit, 21 00:01:23,160 --> 00:01:27,200 Speaker 3: Shannon Bruga or O'Connor buys alcohol for teenagers. My daughter 22 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:31,319 Speaker 3: overdosed on edibles then entering. Principal Paul Robinson responded the 23 00:01:31,319 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 3: same day, we will follow up on this and inform 24 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,520 Speaker 3: the police. Two months later, February seventeenth, a different parent 25 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:41,360 Speaker 3: sent an assistant principal a detailed, multi page email saying 26 00:01:41,400 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 3: she had just filed the police report alleging criminal contact 27 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 3: by O'Connor with her child and at least five other 28 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 3: fourteen year old girls, as well as at least one 29 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 3: Fisher middle school student, a. 30 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:57,440 Speaker 1: Middle school student, fourteen year old girls going to sex 31 00:01:57,560 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 1: and booze stoked parties, and criminal contact by the cool 32 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:08,720 Speaker 1: mom with a girl student aged fourteen? What in the 33 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: hey with me and all Star panel to make sense 34 00:02:11,919 --> 00:02:14,880 Speaker 1: of what we know right now? But first I want 35 00:02:14,880 --> 00:02:18,120 Speaker 1: to go to Drew Penner, investigative reporter with the Los 36 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 1: Gatten newspaper. Drew, thank you for being with us. Who 37 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 1: is this quote? Cool mom? Doesn't sound cool to me? 38 00:02:25,520 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 1: It sounds criminal. Does she have a child? 39 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 4: Oh yeah, definitely. This is Shannon O'Connor. And she has 40 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:36,959 Speaker 4: other names that she's gone by in the past, Shannon Bruga, 41 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:42,720 Speaker 4: Shannon Amarol. But she is a local woman here from 42 00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 4: the Los Gatos area, and that's in Silicon Valley, and 43 00:02:47,800 --> 00:02:52,799 Speaker 4: she gained a reputation over the months for being, as 44 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 4: you said, someone that would have parties and someone who 45 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 4: would invite folks over to her house that were younger 46 00:03:00,639 --> 00:03:03,640 Speaker 4: than maybe you would invite over to your host. And 47 00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:04,520 Speaker 4: that's putting it lightly. 48 00:03:04,680 --> 00:03:08,000 Speaker 1: And she does have children, She's got two teen sons, 49 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:12,320 Speaker 1: thirteen and fifteen. And you know to doctor Angie Arnold, 50 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,840 Speaker 1: renowned psychiatrist joining us out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, you 51 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:19,600 Speaker 1: can find her at Angelo Arnold MD dot com. You 52 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:24,160 Speaker 1: heard what Drew Pinter just told us that everybody in 53 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 1: the neighborhood knew rumor gossip. They knew what was going on, 54 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 1: but did anybody stop it, not until things got even 55 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:34,079 Speaker 1: more out of hand. In addition to what Drew Pinner 56 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 1: told us, Angie, how many times have I told the children, 57 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: starting at a very young age, about drugs and alcohol. 58 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 5: All the time? 59 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 2: What it does to you? 60 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: Cases I've seen in court specifically, I remember when I 61 00:03:50,000 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: was a brand new assistant district attorney. I was taking 62 00:03:53,120 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 1: a guilty plea of this beautiful woman and she was 63 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: taking a plea duy HV habitual violator And I looked 64 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 1: around for her family. There was no family, but I 65 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:12,440 Speaker 1: knew she was married with three children. Alcohol cost her 66 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: her stockbroker's license that she worked so hard for, had 67 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: worked her way. 68 00:04:17,839 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 2: Up the ladder in that business. 69 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 1: She had a horrible car crash when drunk. 70 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 2: Her husband divorced. 71 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:30,160 Speaker 1: Her and he got custody of three children because of alcohol. 72 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:35,039 Speaker 1: And I remember she just stood there in court just 73 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:40,240 Speaker 1: like she was numb, Like she didn't even cry. You know, 74 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:42,120 Speaker 1: like when you take the dog to the vet and 75 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:44,240 Speaker 1: they have to get a shot and they sit on 76 00:04:44,279 --> 00:04:46,360 Speaker 1: the table. They know something bad it's about to happen, 77 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:47,000 Speaker 1: but they. 78 00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 2: Just sit there stoically. That's what she looked like. 79 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 1: Alcohol And this is a mom with teens throwing this 80 00:04:56,080 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 1: kind of party, not just alcohol but drug and sex. 81 00:05:01,120 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 6: So ninsy. Why would why would no one have said anything? 82 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 6: Because look at all of the other people that can 83 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 6: be hurt by not saying anything, starting with the offender. 84 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 6: She needed help? 85 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 2: Okay, you know why did I ask you a question? 86 00:05:19,560 --> 00:05:20,880 Speaker 2: She does not need help. 87 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:26,800 Speaker 1: She needs jail because these aren't just wild parties. This 88 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: is sex, assault, child moless, station felony, child endangerment. 89 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,040 Speaker 2: So I don't know what you're talking about. She needs help, well, 90 00:05:37,120 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 2: she needs an a nice. 91 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:43,520 Speaker 1: Long vacation in the pen in the big dollhouse, so 92 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:45,760 Speaker 1: she can think about her actions. 93 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 6: But Nancy, at the very least, if the neighbors knew 94 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 6: what was going on, and they didn't know the extent 95 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 6: to what was going on. 96 00:05:52,279 --> 00:05:56,760 Speaker 2: Oh please, have you ever seen Bewitched? Yes? No, have you? 97 00:05:57,040 --> 00:05:59,960 Speaker 1: And you're familiar with Gladys Kravitz, right, the nosy name 98 00:06:00,000 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 1: paper who knows everything? 99 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 2: You want to tell me? 100 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: These neighbors didn't know exactly what was happening, hearing Tamee 101 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: screaming and cavorting in the backyard around the cag Oh 102 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:13,280 Speaker 1: they knew, but this is my question, Drew Panner Back 103 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 1: to Loscotta newspaper, Drew, I understand that the first complaints 104 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:22,159 Speaker 1: from made to the school principle and they had an 105 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:23,080 Speaker 1: assistant principle. 106 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:23,760 Speaker 2: Is that correct? 107 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:24,120 Speaker 3: Yeah? 108 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:26,600 Speaker 4: You know, this has been an interesting case in our 109 00:06:26,640 --> 00:06:30,440 Speaker 4: town because it's it's sparked off a whole discussion around 110 00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 4: what we do, you know, when people are having parties 111 00:06:33,839 --> 00:06:36,160 Speaker 4: in their own private home. But then it's you know, 112 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,760 Speaker 4: these the ramifications can spill out into the public sphere, 113 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 4: including as you mentioned, at the high school. And you 114 00:06:43,160 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 4: know there's stories that we're hearing and that have come 115 00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 4: out through the you know, throughout the various discussions that 116 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:54,680 Speaker 4: we've been hearing is that basically, you know, Shan O'Connor 117 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:59,919 Speaker 4: had a really good way of manipulating the whole situation, basically, 118 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 4: you know, being able to spend things one way and 119 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,840 Speaker 4: in fact enlisting the children that she was inviting and 120 00:07:08,000 --> 00:07:11,840 Speaker 4: many say manipulating over to her house into kind of 121 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:15,480 Speaker 4: going on the forefront and helping her spread false stories 122 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 4: in order to continue her behavior. And you know that's 123 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 4: something that we hear time and time again, and you know, 124 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:26,360 Speaker 4: the extent to which perhaps the authorities at the school 125 00:07:26,360 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 4: should have done more. That's been a hot button issue, 126 00:07:29,440 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 4: so that over into even the local councils come up 127 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 4: indirectly as well, and yeah, it's been the talk of 128 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:36,119 Speaker 4: the town. 129 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:38,000 Speaker 2: You know, that's a really good point. 130 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:40,760 Speaker 1: I'm going to go to Annisonota, a child grooming expert, 131 00:07:40,840 --> 00:07:46,240 Speaker 1: but first let me just swing to Sam Doordulian. He 132 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:52,720 Speaker 1: is a renowned attorney, former LA County prosecutor and founder 133 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:54,840 Speaker 1: of the Dordulian Law Group. 134 00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 2: You can find them at d lawgroup dot com. Sam, 135 00:07:57,920 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 2: thanks for being with us. 136 00:07:59,640 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: Just think looking through what Drew Pinner told us from 137 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:06,920 Speaker 1: the losgotten. You know, Sam, here's the rub, here's the 138 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 1: fly in the ointment. So you have the parents, they 139 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 1: are speaking out to the wrong person. They contact the 140 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: school principle and the assistant principle. So do they get 141 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:24,200 Speaker 1: the idea they're doing the right thing? And how much 142 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 1: can a school really control what students or quote cool 143 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:32,640 Speaker 1: moms are doing off school premises? 144 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 2: Sam Ordulian, Yeah. 145 00:08:34,040 --> 00:08:36,560 Speaker 5: Nancy, And actually that's that's a good question. Why didn't 146 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:39,200 Speaker 5: they call the police? And I think it's a lot 147 00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 5: to do with who this person is. If this was 148 00:08:42,440 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 5: a male, if this was a male, if this is 149 00:08:45,080 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 5: a teacher, if this was a coach, a male coach, 150 00:08:47,679 --> 00:08:50,679 Speaker 5: I think people would react differently because she's a woman, 151 00:08:50,800 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 5: because she's a mom. In particular, I think they're treating 152 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 5: it differently. They're contacting the school instead of contacting the police. 153 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:00,400 Speaker 5: I mean, you brought up the word grooming. This is 154 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 5: the definition of grooming. It doesn't have to be a 155 00:09:02,880 --> 00:09:06,679 Speaker 5: male teacher, coach, or a priest. She was grooming not 156 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 5: just the children, but the other parents, the whole community 157 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:13,600 Speaker 5: with her conduct. So I think a lot has to 158 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 5: do with who she is as a woman and as 159 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 5: a mom. 160 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 1: Oh, you know you just struck me to the core 161 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:24,079 Speaker 1: as a mom, because you know Anna Sonoda going from 162 00:09:24,400 --> 00:09:27,720 Speaker 1: Sam Dordoulian, doctor Angie Arnold, Andrew Panner. 163 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:31,600 Speaker 2: Let me tell you who. Anna Sinoda is. 164 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:36,959 Speaker 1: Child grooming expert, clinical social worker, author of Dut dut 165 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:40,720 Speaker 1: Groom Understanding How a Child becomes a target, and you 166 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:45,679 Speaker 1: can find her at Annasinoda dot com. Anna, I want 167 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:51,000 Speaker 1: you to take a listen to our friend Amanda del Castillo. 168 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 7: Shannon O'Connor, the Lost Atus mother, was accused of throwing 169 00:09:54,480 --> 00:09:57,640 Speaker 7: drunken parties where she encouraged young teens to participate in 170 00:09:57,720 --> 00:10:02,360 Speaker 7: sex acts, sometimes non consent well and sometimes while she watched. 171 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,640 Speaker 7: The teens, mostly fourteen and fifteen years old, included her 172 00:10:05,679 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 7: own son. O'Connor would use Snapchat or text to invite 173 00:10:09,160 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 7: them to her home, warning the teens to keep silent. 174 00:10:11,800 --> 00:10:12,920 Speaker 2: Or she could go to jail. 175 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: It's not exactly your classic grooming, but it has all 176 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:24,800 Speaker 1: the elements of a classic grooming, luring, desensitizing the victim, 177 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: where this little fourteen year old girl says, well everybody 178 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,480 Speaker 1: else is doing it. The mom is sitting there watching 179 00:10:30,559 --> 00:10:34,640 Speaker 1: me having a sex act with her son, so maybe 180 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 1: it's not as bad as I thought because the mom 181 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 1: thinks it's okay, and then getting them getting a vow 182 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 1: of silence warning them not to speak out. 183 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:48,079 Speaker 8: Nancy, this is a gruesome, gruesome example of grooming. And 184 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:51,160 Speaker 8: just so that everybody's on the same page, grooming is 185 00:10:51,200 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 8: the intentional and selective process of using assumed trust to 186 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:59,200 Speaker 8: gain access and space with an identified prey. And it 187 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:01,560 Speaker 8: is a process of been trapping a child. So we've 188 00:11:01,559 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 8: got to set the trap with compliments. These children were selected, 189 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:08,440 Speaker 8: she was pre vetting the girls who are attending these parties. 190 00:11:08,760 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 8: Then you've got to bait the trap with favors, so 191 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:14,520 Speaker 8: giving the kids things they want, like access to free 192 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 8: food alcohol. Then you've essentially rigged the trap with guilt. 193 00:11:19,760 --> 00:11:22,439 Speaker 8: Here are these kids who are breaking rules that their 194 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:24,760 Speaker 8: parents have for them. And then you've got to keep 195 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 8: that trap shut with threats. You can't tell anybody, keep 196 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 8: this a secret. So worse than being a cool mom, 197 00:11:30,920 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 8: she was perceived and the community defaulted to her being 198 00:11:34,400 --> 00:11:36,840 Speaker 8: a safe mom. And she was the one who was 199 00:11:36,840 --> 00:11:39,880 Speaker 8: communicating with other parents to confirm that she would be 200 00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:42,760 Speaker 8: in attendance and she would be supervising and This is 201 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:45,440 Speaker 8: why parents need to keep a keen eye to show 202 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 8: up at places where their kids are going, and when 203 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 8: in doubt, verify, even if it means showing up. 204 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:53,720 Speaker 1: I was trying to drink in everything that you just said. 205 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:58,839 Speaker 1: Whenever the twins have anybody over throughout the evening or 206 00:11:58,880 --> 00:12:00,959 Speaker 1: the afternoon, or whatever it be, I like to take 207 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:03,559 Speaker 1: pictures of them and send to the mom. 208 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 2: Because that's what I like. 209 00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 1: I don't know if the other moms even want that, 210 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,200 Speaker 1: but I like that to see what the twins are 211 00:12:10,240 --> 00:12:12,000 Speaker 1: doing when they're not at home and make sure they're 212 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 1: safe in alife. I haven't even thought about an adult 213 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:25,840 Speaker 1: plying them with alcohol and drugs and having sex with them. Hi, guys, 214 00:12:25,920 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 1: Nancy Grace here. Please join us now on Fox Nation 215 00:12:30,040 --> 00:12:34,439 Speaker 1: for a brand new investigation, Parallels of Evil the Bundy 216 00:12:34,520 --> 00:12:40,200 Speaker 1: and Idaho killings. In this gripping special investigation, we bring 217 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:45,439 Speaker 1: together an incredible panel of guests who analyze disturbing similarities 218 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:51,840 Speaker 1: of evil between these horrible crimes. We speak with two 219 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:57,680 Speaker 1: female Ted Bundy survivors, Karen Pryor and Cheryl Thomas, who 220 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:02,920 Speaker 1: described their life before and after they were victims of 221 00:13:03,040 --> 00:13:07,800 Speaker 1: Ted Bundy. We also speak with the renowned private investigator 222 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 1: Bill Warner, who worked in the cases, and Ted Bundy's 223 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 1: defense attorney, John Henry Brown. We traveled to Moscow, Idaho 224 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:20,840 Speaker 1: to speak with Washington State University students and interview neighbors 225 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 1: of Brian Coburger. One neighbor shares exclusive insights about the 226 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: suspect in the Idaho killings, Brian Coburger. Don't miss Parallels 227 00:13:32,320 --> 00:13:36,560 Speaker 1: of Evil the Bundy and Idaho Killings, streaming now exclusively 228 00:13:37,040 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 1: on Fox Nation Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. You know, 229 00:13:57,559 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 1: wait a minute, Michael Boughton joining mere NYPD sergeant detective 230 00:14:02,640 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 1: squad supervisor, a special victims unit owner, a first rate 231 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:14,000 Speaker 1: investigations and that specializes an adult and child survivor civil 232 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:19,320 Speaker 1: cases at first rate Investigations and consulting dot com. That 233 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:22,080 Speaker 1: is the mouthful Michael Bock. I want you to change 234 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:26,160 Speaker 1: that website immediately. Hey, Michael, I know you've dealt with 235 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:30,400 Speaker 1: a lot of cases where adults molested children. 236 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:33,880 Speaker 2: I rarely see I don't know that I've ever seen. 237 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:35,640 Speaker 2: I got to think this thing through. 238 00:14:36,320 --> 00:14:41,440 Speaker 1: I've seen female sex predators on children, but for a mom. 239 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 2: A cool mom, and I'm talking about. 240 00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 1: Amy Pohlar, who I adore Amy Polar who played the 241 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: cool mom June. 242 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:54,960 Speaker 2: George in Mean Girls. 243 00:14:55,840 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 1: Hilarious, But this is not funny in the least, Michael Back, 244 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 1: have you ever seen a case where the mom lures 245 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:10,480 Speaker 1: in the child victims to have sex with tea boys 246 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 1: while she sits there and watches. 247 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 9: It's not a frequent occurrence, especially inside the city. I'd 248 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 9: say this is probably more of a suburban issue than 249 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 9: it would be inside the city with apartments and stuff, 250 00:15:23,320 --> 00:15:25,720 Speaker 9: So it's not a common case that we would come 251 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:26,720 Speaker 9: across in the city. 252 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:29,760 Speaker 2: I don't think I've ever come across anything quite like it. 253 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: And these people, Michael Bock, I mean, this is Silicon 254 00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 1: Valley with all of that tech money just rolling around. 255 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 1: The median income in this area is one one hundred 256 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,680 Speaker 1: and sixty seven thousand dollars. 257 00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:47,080 Speaker 2: That's the median. 258 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:48,160 Speaker 10: That's big money. 259 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, they've got a lot. 260 00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 1: Of money to roll around in and a lot of 261 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: money to throw parties with for children. I mean, doctor Angie, 262 00:15:56,440 --> 00:16:00,200 Speaker 1: you hear Michael Buck speaking, What frame of my is 263 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:04,360 Speaker 1: that where a grown woman gets sex gratification off of 264 00:16:04,680 --> 00:16:10,480 Speaker 1: watching little girls and teen boys have sex in her home? 265 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:13,720 Speaker 6: Oh? Nancy, this is such a horrible subject, isn't it. 266 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:16,560 Speaker 2: Yes, but I was expecting a little something, a little 267 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:18,640 Speaker 2: more clinical from you than this is horrible. 268 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:21,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, I know it's horrible. I can ask anybody on 269 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,720 Speaker 1: the street that, doctor Angie, I know it's horrible. But 270 00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:26,200 Speaker 1: what is what kind of a criminal mind? 271 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 6: Is that these kind of people can suffer from a 272 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:29,960 Speaker 6: very low self esteem? 273 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 2: Oh, dear Lord in Heaven, low self esteem? 274 00:16:33,720 --> 00:16:36,760 Speaker 6: Well, I mean, Nancy, this is you ask for a definition. 275 00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:38,080 Speaker 2: She's a child molester. 276 00:16:38,520 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 6: Well, okay, but we have to kind of look at 277 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 6: all of the things that can First of all, female 278 00:16:45,920 --> 00:16:47,880 Speaker 6: child predators. 279 00:16:47,600 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 2: Are on the rare side. Okay. 280 00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:55,200 Speaker 6: They can have antisocial personality disorder, they can have very 281 00:16:55,240 --> 00:17:00,880 Speaker 6: poor social skills, they can have PTSD from something or another. 282 00:17:01,160 --> 00:17:06,480 Speaker 1: Don't even try to make me feel badly for her rejection, 283 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: low self esteem, not about child molester. Here is doctor Jackie, 284 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:14,640 Speaker 1: and you're waving a sign saying voyeurism. 285 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:16,760 Speaker 2: Okay, you know what that is, right, doctor? 286 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 1: And Jimmy, you are the strength to be a psychiatrist. 287 00:17:19,359 --> 00:17:22,240 Speaker 1: Don't you have to be a medical doctor and a psychiatrist. 288 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 6: I'm a medical doctor. 289 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:26,320 Speaker 2: Okay, and I'm having to tell you the word voyeurism. 290 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:31,640 Speaker 6: And Nancy, I've had to treat women who were female 291 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 6: sexual predators. I've treated only a very few, because only 292 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 6: a very few exempts. 293 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:39,120 Speaker 2: What is wrong with them? 294 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:42,440 Speaker 1: Not that the state has to prove motive or kick 295 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:44,159 Speaker 1: around inside the mind of a perpetrator. 296 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:46,400 Speaker 2: But it's very hard. 297 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:48,639 Speaker 1: For me to take in. I know it exists, but 298 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:49,880 Speaker 1: it's hard for me to take in. 299 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:55,119 Speaker 6: But doesn't it also sound like this woman, this particular criminal, 300 00:17:56,040 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 6: was exerting a lot of control over hers. They we're 301 00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:05,200 Speaker 6: very young, she's forty seven, they're thirteen and fourteen years old. 302 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:08,320 Speaker 6: You know, she's got to she's got to be getting 303 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:11,400 Speaker 6: some sort of sexual pleasure out of this. At the 304 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:13,040 Speaker 6: very baseline. 305 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:15,480 Speaker 1: I've already said that. That was my question that I 306 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 1: formed for you. What grown woman enjoys watching little children 307 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:23,280 Speaker 1: have forced sex? 308 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:25,879 Speaker 6: A very thick grown woman. 309 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 2: Once again, I knew that myself, and I am not 310 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 2: an MD. 311 00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:32,160 Speaker 6: Nancy. She may have been abused in her past. 312 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 1: Oh dear great, you know what, Just go ahead and 313 00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:36,320 Speaker 1: cut her mic because all you're doing is wine wine, 314 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 1: wine about how badly this one well, I still hear her. 315 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 6: Helloc women, the woman that I'm. 316 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 1: Going to give you a moment to reconsider your opinion, 317 00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 1: Doctor Angela Arnold, What more do we know? 318 00:18:49,359 --> 00:18:51,920 Speaker 2: Take a listen to our forensic kr N four. 319 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:56,399 Speaker 11: O'Connor has two sons, ages thirteen and fifteen, the same 320 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,879 Speaker 11: age range that the victims are in this case. Deuty 321 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 11: in Idaho determined her sons were in imminent danger and 322 00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 11: placed them under the custody of the Idaho Department of 323 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:10,879 Speaker 11: Health and Welfare. Law enforcement first began to investigate O'Connor 324 00:19:10,920 --> 00:19:13,600 Speaker 11: after a boy was injured when he fell from her 325 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:16,959 Speaker 11: SUV in the Los Gatto's High School parking lot. The 326 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,160 Speaker 11: district attorneys said O'Connor went to great lengths to keep 327 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 11: the parties secret from other parents, law enforcement, and her 328 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:26,760 Speaker 11: own husband. She would only invite teens over to the 329 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 11: house for a wild night of drinking when she knew 330 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 11: her husband would not be home. She communicated with students 331 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:33,440 Speaker 11: using Snapchat. 332 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,040 Speaker 1: So I didn't realize is drey Pinner. She was married 333 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: and the husband knew nothing about what was going on. 334 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:42,679 Speaker 4: Well, that's kind of an open question. You know, there's 335 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:46,760 Speaker 4: some evidence that shows that she had, you know, seemed 336 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:51,440 Speaker 4: to be hiding the beer cans or whatnot from her 337 00:19:51,520 --> 00:19:54,520 Speaker 4: husband prior to him getting home, so he didn't find 338 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:57,480 Speaker 4: out about these parties that were going on. On the 339 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:01,159 Speaker 4: other hand, there does seem to be, you know, a 340 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:06,360 Speaker 4: close connection between them. They are codefendants in a previous 341 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:10,879 Speaker 4: action and you know, so that is something that is 342 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:11,560 Speaker 4: still coming out. 343 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:12,640 Speaker 2: It's really hard for. 344 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:14,480 Speaker 1: Me to believe that he had no idea what was 345 00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:16,840 Speaker 1: going on. Guys, I want you to listen to the 346 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 1: Samdordulian sex assault lawyer, former La County sex crimes prosecutor. Now, 347 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 1: this is going down in Lascatto's, California and a very 348 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 1: prestigious community. Parties also took place in Santa Cruz and 349 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:42,560 Speaker 1: Lake Tahoe, where the cool mom Shannon O'Connor would ply 350 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,720 Speaker 1: fourteen to fifteen year olds with vodka and then hand 351 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: out condoms, encourages my encouraging miners to have sex, and 352 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 1: laughing when the teams would engage in sex acts, many 353 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: of allegedly weren't non consensual. 354 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:07,120 Speaker 2: Take a listen to our cut. Four KGO. 355 00:21:07,359 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 7: Investigators say the party spanned from June twenty twenty to 356 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,720 Speaker 7: May twenty twenty one and often involved O'Connor pushing the 357 00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,720 Speaker 7: teens to drink until they became sick or blacked out. 358 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 7: The DA's office as some of the assaults against the 359 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 7: young victims happened while they were drunk. Document show teens 360 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,159 Speaker 7: also told authorities drinking led to heavy vomiting, a broken finger, 361 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 7: and a girl reporting sho almost drowned in a hot tub. 362 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,960 Speaker 7: In a release, DA Jeff Rosen said it took a 363 00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,679 Speaker 7: lot of brave children to come forward and to untangle 364 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 7: this deeply disturbing case. In another case, the DA's office 365 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:42,080 Speaker 7: says O'Connor let a team drive her SUV in the 366 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 7: Lost Attus High parking lot while two other teens held 367 00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,320 Speaker 7: onto the back. One fell off knocked unconscious. 368 00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:52,200 Speaker 1: Okay, Also take a listen to Amy Larson Kron, a. 369 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:55,320 Speaker 11: Forty seven year old mom, is accused of throwing sex 370 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:59,959 Speaker 11: parties at her Lost Gattos mansion. She pressured underage teenagers 371 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 11: to binge, drink, and encourage boys to have consensual and 372 00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 11: non consensual sex with girls, according to the Santa Clara 373 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:12,120 Speaker 11: County District Attorney's Office. Investigators said dozens of Los Gatto's 374 00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:16,520 Speaker 11: high school students went to Shannon O'Connor's disturbing parties between 375 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:20,240 Speaker 11: June of twenty twenty and May of this year. The 376 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:23,560 Speaker 11: mom recently moved to Ada County in Idaho, where she 377 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:27,560 Speaker 11: continued to invite teens over to her new house. Detectives 378 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:29,439 Speaker 11: told me that when they went to the house to 379 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 11: arrest her last weekend, there were twelve underage teenagers with her, 380 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 11: most of whom had spent the night. 381 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,400 Speaker 1: So let me understand this, Drew Pinner. The students would 382 00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:41,119 Speaker 1: actually spend the night in the home. 383 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,359 Speaker 4: Well, some of these parties would go on for an 384 00:22:43,400 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 4: awful long time, and you know, I at one point 385 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 4: I tried knocking on the doors of some of the 386 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:52,080 Speaker 4: neighbors homes, and I didn't really want to say too 387 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:54,679 Speaker 4: much to me about what they had seen or hadn't seen. 388 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 4: I don't know if you know, if people felt it's 389 00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:01,399 Speaker 4: guilty for not saying things sooner, or you know, maybe 390 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 4: they did keep certain things under wrap. But you know, 391 00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 4: there's definitely a lot of questioning, even by Shannon O'Connor, 392 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,760 Speaker 4: who was you know, googling, as we have reported, you know, 393 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 4: things like what to do with the concussion and a 394 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 4: teenager and you know, kind of concussion cause eye problems, 395 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 4: and you know, investigating, you know people and investigators seem 396 00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:25,560 Speaker 4: to think that that may be related to that car 397 00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 4: incident exactly you had just heard about there on that 398 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 4: news report. 399 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,960 Speaker 1: Guys, it's not the first time a mom has broken 400 00:23:33,040 --> 00:23:37,120 Speaker 1: the law in order to be the cool mom at 401 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 1: the school. Take a ust to our cut twenty seven. 402 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,600 Speaker 12: At forty years old, Sheriylyn McDonald wanted to be known 403 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 12: as the cool mom. She wanted the kids to call her, share, 404 00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 12: invited boys to be a part of family outings, and more. 405 00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:52,760 Speaker 12: The former cool mom is now behind bars, charged with 406 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:56,800 Speaker 12: engaging in sexual activity with a minor, encouraging sex among miners, 407 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:00,440 Speaker 12: six felony charges of loud and illascivious battery, and three 408 00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 12: counts of contributing to the delinquency of a child. The 409 00:24:03,359 --> 00:24:05,920 Speaker 12: cool mom party came to an end when a real 410 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:08,720 Speaker 12: mom saw that her teenage son was getting text messages 411 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:12,640 Speaker 12: from McDonald. That real mom questioned her son, found out 412 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,399 Speaker 12: about teens playing beer pong and McDonald's, and turned it 413 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 12: all over the police. The investigation is ongoing and McDonald 414 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 12: could face additional charges. 415 00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:23,199 Speaker 1: McDonald not alone. Take a listen hour cut twenty are 416 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:24,280 Speaker 1: friends at WSB. 417 00:24:24,640 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 13: Georgia mother is facing charges after official essays she hosted 418 00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 13: a party with drugs and alcohol for a teenage daughter 419 00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:34,480 Speaker 13: and her friends. According to an incident report, Rachel Lynn 420 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:39,520 Speaker 13: Linhardt's sponsor from Alcoholics Anonymous, came to officials about the incident, 421 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 13: and the woman said Lenhart allowed a group of miners 422 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:46,199 Speaker 13: to drink and smoke marijuana at her home in Evans, Georgia, 423 00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 13: near Augusta. The woman claimed lin Hart played naked twister 424 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:54,399 Speaker 13: with the teens and engaged in sexual relations with an 425 00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:58,879 Speaker 13: eighteen year old and her daughter's sixteen year old boyfriend. 426 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:01,280 Speaker 13: She's charged with t two counts of contributing to the 427 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 13: delinquency of a minor and has been released on bond. 428 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:08,919 Speaker 1: Samdorduley and joining a sex assault lawyer former LA County 429 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:13,840 Speaker 1: sex crimes prosecutor Naked twister with a bunch of teen 430 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 1: girls and boys in your home. I mean I cringed 431 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:23,480 Speaker 1: when I heard doctor Angel Arnold talking about Oh, she's 432 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 1: got low self esteem. 433 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:26,520 Speaker 2: She's probably been rejected. 434 00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:32,680 Speaker 1: Don't care. This is child molestation. I mean, Dordiliyan, do 435 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 1: you have any children? 436 00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 5: I have two children, in fact, wondering about the same 437 00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:37,639 Speaker 5: age as these kids. 438 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 1: At thirteen going to the mom's house down the street, 439 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,800 Speaker 1: and then to find out later she was egged into 440 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 1: sex acts and given drugs and alcohol by the so 441 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:50,920 Speaker 1: called cool mom. 442 00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:52,800 Speaker 2: I would do a backflip. 443 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 5: Yeah, I can't even imagine. And look, Nancyen twenty five 444 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 5: plus years I've been doing sex crimes. I haven't heard 445 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,560 Speaker 5: a story like this. And again, we I think a 446 00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 5: lot has to do The reason why this continued and 447 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 5: it was allowed to fester, and she was allowed to 448 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,600 Speaker 5: do all these things is because of her status as 449 00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:12,199 Speaker 5: a mom, as a woman. I've prosecuted a lot of 450 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:14,399 Speaker 5: these cases. I've tried in civil court a lot of 451 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 5: these cases. You don't see a lot of sexual predators 452 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,399 Speaker 5: who are women. I do have them, I've had them before, 453 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 5: nothing like this. And we have an inherent trust of mothers, 454 00:26:24,200 --> 00:26:26,600 Speaker 5: don't we. You know, you believe, you want to believe, 455 00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:29,399 Speaker 5: especially since she's a mom of someone a child of 456 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 5: your child's age, She's not going to hurt them. She's 457 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:34,959 Speaker 5: going to protect them. That's what we all want to believe. 458 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:38,919 Speaker 5: And I think that belief allowed this to continue. And 459 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:40,919 Speaker 5: the reason why you know, parents are going to the 460 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,719 Speaker 5: school instead of the police. We have a different impression 461 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,240 Speaker 5: of female sexual offenders, but they're just as dangerous as 462 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:48,680 Speaker 5: we see in this particular case. 463 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 1: Well, you know an interesting point, samder Dulian, is a 464 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:57,400 Speaker 1: dad was throwing a party. I don't know how many 465 00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 1: ten girls parents would even let them go. 466 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,720 Speaker 5: I wouldn't. I certainly wouldn't let my daughter go. Have 467 00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:05,040 Speaker 5: a distrust of milk. 468 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: O ha double l n O. I say, you're not 469 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,400 Speaker 1: going to a party at some pervy dad's house. That's 470 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,359 Speaker 1: not happening. Oh okay, cringe. You know I want to 471 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: go back to doctor Angeley Arnold. I guess we can 472 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 1: turn our mic back on. You know, you've given me 473 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,840 Speaker 1: just enough information over the years to throw something back 474 00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:29,879 Speaker 1: at you. You're talking about how she has low self 475 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,800 Speaker 1: esteem and low self worth and was probably rejected in 476 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: her life. I assume the next thing you're going to 477 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:38,639 Speaker 1: say is this is a desperate cry for help. How 478 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:42,879 Speaker 1: about a manipulative narcissist with no conscience? 479 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 2: Would that she fit? 480 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:48,640 Speaker 6: Yes? It would, Yes, it would, Nancy. And I'll tell 481 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:52,040 Speaker 6: you something else. The reason nobody's calling and reporting her 482 00:27:52,720 --> 00:27:57,200 Speaker 6: is because the research has shown that if you report 483 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 6: that you have done abused by as female more times 484 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,240 Speaker 6: than not. You are not believed. 485 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,920 Speaker 1: I didn't think of that. You're absolutely correct. And guess 486 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:14,920 Speaker 1: what else gave her? The en disha of responsibility and 487 00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,440 Speaker 1: her mom's status secured. She's living at a four point 488 00:28:19,640 --> 00:28:22,720 Speaker 1: seven million dollar mansion. 489 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 2: I bet they've got a pool. 490 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 1: I know they've got a hot toub because one girl 491 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,960 Speaker 1: almost drowned in their hot tub drunk. Four point seven 492 00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:33,639 Speaker 1: million dollars home up there in Los Gato's a quote 493 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:40,040 Speaker 1: tech savvy predator who taught the teens to lie using 494 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:44,520 Speaker 1: gifts in order to bait the girls. WHOA wait, we 495 00:28:44,560 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 1: haven't even touched on that, Drew Pinner. Drew Pinner, investigative 496 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: reporter at the Los Gatta What kind of gifts did 497 00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:54,600 Speaker 1: she use to bait the teen girls? 498 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 4: Well, I mean, if you know the Bay area at all, 499 00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 4: you know that, you know just over the hill, you 500 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 4: know you've got Santa Cruz and that's a pretty pretty 501 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,040 Speaker 4: awesome destination to go to, and people like going on 502 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:09,160 Speaker 4: trips there. Same with Tahoe. So if you get invited 503 00:29:09,440 --> 00:29:11,600 Speaker 4: along to trip to one of those places, I mean, 504 00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 4: who wouldn't want to go? Keep in mind, these are 505 00:29:13,880 --> 00:29:16,120 Speaker 4: kids that don't have access to just head on on 506 00:29:16,160 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 4: a weekend trip on their own, you know, and you know, 507 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 4: so that's that's one thing, you know, getting these the 508 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 4: the alcohol supplied. I mean, that's not exactly easy when 509 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 4: you're near a kid, and you know, I just I 510 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 4: think that there's a lot of this affection that's been 511 00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:35,280 Speaker 4: showered on them as well by miss O'Connor, as we 512 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:37,880 Speaker 4: hear and from some of the stories that we've been 513 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,520 Speaker 4: reporting on, including you know that that may have been 514 00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 4: a technique, this flattery in order to build trust in 515 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:50,280 Speaker 4: bonds classic panner. Well, one other thing I wanted to say, 516 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 4: I wanted to say too, was was just that if 517 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:56,120 Speaker 4: you don't mind, was just that it's I think that 518 00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:58,840 Speaker 4: we have to keep in mind that this is this 519 00:29:58,920 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 4: is someone that you know, she had on her phone. 520 00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:06,680 Speaker 4: It turns out, as we've now reported, like a video 521 00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:09,800 Speaker 4: of a girl saying that, you know, talking about her 522 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:11,960 Speaker 4: own body image, and we don't know if this is 523 00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 4: someone she knew or is something she download from TikTok, 524 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 4: But this is pointing to the fact that you know, 525 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,840 Speaker 4: she had not just a desire to help her own child, 526 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,959 Speaker 4: perhaps hook up, but you know, there's some question around 527 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 4: was she maybe looking for having, let's say, a bad 528 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,160 Speaker 4: interest in sixteen year olds. For example, one of her 529 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:37,840 Speaker 4: the searches on her phone was hot sixteen year old 530 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:41,440 Speaker 4: teenage girls and prettiest sixteen year old girl Good books 531 00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 4: with young sex. That's something that just came out recently. 532 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 2: Well, Isrea Penner certainly given me something to think. 533 00:30:47,720 --> 00:31:03,960 Speaker 14: About prime stories with Nancy Grace. 534 00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:10,280 Speaker 1: Also, we know that one young girl who is going 535 00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 1: only by the name Jane Doe eight, says that cool 536 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:15,160 Speaker 1: MoMA O'Connor quote. 537 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:17,840 Speaker 2: Tore my life apart. I've suffered and had. 538 00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 1: To deal with the reputation of being quote the girl 539 00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 1: that got raped. I will live my high school years 540 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 1: with this cloud over me. Victims say that O'Connor befriended 541 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: them through her children and social media when they were 542 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:36,440 Speaker 1: just freshmen at Los Gato's High This Jane do eight says, 543 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:38,600 Speaker 1: Shannon does not have a conscience. 544 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:39,600 Speaker 2: She's a con artist. 545 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 1: I will never have the life I once had, and 546 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:47,480 Speaker 1: neither should she. She says that O'Connor would have boys 547 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:53,120 Speaker 1: get drunk and then drunkenly sex assault the girls. While 548 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:59,200 Speaker 1: O'Connor watched one of these girls. Jane Doe nine actually 549 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:03,320 Speaker 1: had to take out a protection order against O'Connor after 550 00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:07,240 Speaker 1: she realized O'Connor had been following her around with no 551 00:32:07,400 --> 00:32:13,640 Speaker 1: headlights on. The girl still has nightmares today. One girl 552 00:32:13,720 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: says that O'Connor moved into her town and the little 553 00:32:17,280 --> 00:32:20,760 Speaker 1: girl got twenty seven calls with no caller ID, but 554 00:32:20,880 --> 00:32:24,760 Speaker 1: with Shannon O'Connor on the other end breathing into the phone. 555 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,720 Speaker 1: Does anybody have a concern about what took so long 556 00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:31,560 Speaker 1: to bring this woman to justice? 557 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:33,280 Speaker 2: Here's another theory. 558 00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:37,440 Speaker 1: In addition to jury Pitter's theory that she was sexually 559 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:41,840 Speaker 1: interested in young teen girls and boys, did she actually 560 00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:46,200 Speaker 1: want to be a child again? Take a listen to 561 00:32:46,280 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 1: our cut twenty eight WNYT camerom. 562 00:32:50,600 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 15: Durham School District Superintendent Anthony Tuvy says thirty two year 563 00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,200 Speaker 15: old Michael Ann Goodrich came in to register for classes 564 00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 15: on December nineteenth. He says administrators immediately felt something was off, 565 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:05,160 Speaker 15: but Taybe says under the McKinney Vento Act, the district 566 00:33:05,240 --> 00:33:08,080 Speaker 15: had to admit good Rich immediately because she claimed to 567 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 15: be homeless. 568 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,520 Speaker 16: She did attend school for one day and she didn't 569 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 16: in fact right the school was to and from school 570 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 16: that day. 571 00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:17,240 Speaker 8: He says. 572 00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:19,760 Speaker 15: Goodrich was absent on the twenty first, and then the 573 00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:22,960 Speaker 15: holiday break began the following week. She was arrested on 574 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:25,960 Speaker 15: the twenty eighth and charged with offering a false ffailing, 575 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:30,000 Speaker 15: falsifying business records, and criminal trespassing and more. 576 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,240 Speaker 2: In our cut twenty five from APay. 577 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,560 Speaker 17: A thirty year old sex offender who posed as a 578 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 17: child has pleaded guilty to seven criminal charges and will 579 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:42,280 Speaker 17: now serve at least seventy years in prison. Neil Havens 580 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 17: Roderick the Second faced twenty eight counts, but pleaded guilty 581 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:47,920 Speaker 17: to only a quarter of them, according to a plea 582 00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:50,920 Speaker 17: agreement document. Two of those charges stem from when he 583 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,600 Speaker 17: posed as a twelve year old boy and enrolled in 584 00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:56,720 Speaker 17: this Arizona charter school in January two thousand and seven. 585 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 18: If it's a society's been putting on, he's very good 586 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:04,360 Speaker 18: at it because obviously fooled educators, He fooled train and 587 00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 18: experience investigators. So if it's a facade, then he's an 588 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:09,520 Speaker 18: absolute magician. 589 00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:11,240 Speaker 2: So this spans I understand. 590 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:15,800 Speaker 1: Adrea Pinner from Los Gato's to Idaho is that correct. 591 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:19,480 Speaker 4: So it is true that what happened is that as 592 00:34:19,520 --> 00:34:25,000 Speaker 4: the investigation was progressing into the conduct of Shannon O'Connor, 593 00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:30,080 Speaker 4: she leaves. She goes to Idaho. And you know, you 594 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:32,800 Speaker 4: might say, Okay, maybe that's a nice coincidence or whatever 595 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,040 Speaker 4: for her, but you know, the truth is is that 596 00:34:36,600 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 4: we're starting to see that she's very aware of the 597 00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 4: fact that you know that it's there's different rules when 598 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:47,080 Speaker 4: you have authority, local authorities investigating here, it's harder for 599 00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:51,440 Speaker 4: them to reach across state lines. And in fact, at 600 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:56,480 Speaker 4: one point she's she's Internet searching Ida Idaho Statute of 601 00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,880 Speaker 4: Limitations criminal She's going, hey, can I get across it 602 00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:02,080 Speaker 4: in California if I live in Iaho. 603 00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:07,120 Speaker 1: She's very savvy, Dre what about it, Sam Doordulian, She's 604 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 1: looking for statue limitations? How long can they prosecute me 605 00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:12,000 Speaker 1: in another jurisdiction for this? 606 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:16,120 Speaker 5: She's incredibly manipulative and it's just terrifying. The other parts 607 00:35:16,120 --> 00:35:18,319 Speaker 5: that you mentioned about the whole stalking part of it, 608 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,440 Speaker 5: I worked the stocking unit as well, and I can 609 00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:23,399 Speaker 5: tell you I'm working with the DA's office prosecute all 610 00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,040 Speaker 5: sorts of criminals there's only two that I was really 611 00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 5: truly frightened up, hardcore game members and stalkers. And she 612 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:32,480 Speaker 5: seems to not only just be a sexual predator, but 613 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:35,120 Speaker 5: it has to those stalking elements on top. And it's 614 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:37,800 Speaker 5: just terrifying that she would move to a different state 615 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,320 Speaker 5: be so manipulative. And there's some reference to her moving 616 00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:44,880 Speaker 5: to another state where there's one of the victims actually lived. 617 00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,880 Speaker 5: Its terrifying what this woman was doing. And to suggest 618 00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:49,759 Speaker 5: that the husband had no idea about all of this, 619 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:52,760 Speaker 5: I think it's just foolish, absolutely foolish. 620 00:35:52,800 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 1: Well, we do know that he has recently filed for divorce, 621 00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,440 Speaker 1: and do you blame him? What about a doctor Angie 622 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: Arnold Hydras out of Atlanta. I gave you two examples 623 00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,200 Speaker 1: of many, many where adults have actually enrolled in middle 624 00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,800 Speaker 1: school and high school posing as teens to be aroundings. 625 00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:12,800 Speaker 1: It's like they want to be a teen. Is that 626 00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:15,120 Speaker 1: some sort of a designated ailment? 627 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,840 Speaker 6: You know, Nancy, I don't That ailment doesn't necessarily have 628 00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 6: a name. It all goes under the it's all under 629 00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:24,799 Speaker 6: the guise of sexual predators, and it's just another way 630 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,319 Speaker 6: that they manipulate the system. I mean, Nancy, I have 631 00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:30,000 Speaker 6: to wonder. I mean, there's so many things that are 632 00:36:30,000 --> 00:36:33,680 Speaker 6: going on in our world right now that are predatory 633 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:36,480 Speaker 6: to children that we have to keep an eye out 634 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:37,759 Speaker 6: for all of those things, you know. 635 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:41,520 Speaker 1: I want to follow up with Anna Sonoda, child grooming 636 00:36:41,560 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 1: expert and author of Duck Duck Groom. 637 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,080 Speaker 2: We're talking about various motives. 638 00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,560 Speaker 1: Did this so called cool mom o connor actually want 639 00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:53,319 Speaker 1: to be a teen again? Take a listen to this 640 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 1: and Sonoda our cut nine from KGO. 641 00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:59,280 Speaker 16: The DIA's office believe an early motive for O'Connor's alleged 642 00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:03,239 Speaker 16: actions is sexual gratification. Court documents say she would use 643 00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:07,080 Speaker 16: social media to lure minors to her home, give them alcohol, condoms, 644 00:37:07,120 --> 00:37:10,279 Speaker 16: and private rooms to commit sexual acts that sometimes we're 645 00:37:10,280 --> 00:37:11,120 Speaker 16: not consensual. 646 00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,520 Speaker 19: One of the crimes that we have charged involves committing 647 00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:18,960 Speaker 19: the crime for sexual gratification, So we can certainly say 648 00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:22,200 Speaker 19: that sexual gratification is one of the motives in this case. 649 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 2: What about Ana Sineta. 650 00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:25,920 Speaker 8: Well, Nancy, I think we have to back up a 651 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:30,440 Speaker 8: second and say that all sex, all sexual acts with 652 00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:35,440 Speaker 8: anyone under the age of eighteen in California, aslong with Idaho, 653 00:37:35,960 --> 00:37:39,520 Speaker 8: is always non consensual. These children don't even have the 654 00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:43,080 Speaker 8: ability to consent to sex. So let's get that on 655 00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:45,239 Speaker 8: the table. First of all, I think one of the 656 00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:48,720 Speaker 8: things we have to keep in mind, sixty six percent 657 00:37:48,920 --> 00:37:51,640 Speaker 8: of child sex abuse victims are between the ages of 658 00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 8: twelve and seventeen. This is a ripe atmosphere. This woman 659 00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:02,760 Speaker 8: took her position. It's easy to impress teens. She was likable, 660 00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:09,120 Speaker 8: she was powerful, and she was popular. She was providing money, alcohol, 661 00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:12,160 Speaker 8: Everything was free to these kids. We don't know the 662 00:38:12,200 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 8: socioeconomics of the children who are in that position, and 663 00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:17,799 Speaker 8: we know that there were no other authority figures. She 664 00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,960 Speaker 8: always set it up so that she was the sole adult, 665 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:24,880 Speaker 8: and she convinced other adults to trust her to supervise, 666 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,759 Speaker 8: protect and prevent any damage, and she did nothing of 667 00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:32,120 Speaker 8: the sort. Instead, she was pretending that she was forever 668 00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:35,920 Speaker 8: twenty one, if you will, and disregarding any sort of 669 00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,000 Speaker 8: obligation as an adult or as an authority figure. 670 00:38:39,160 --> 00:38:44,560 Speaker 1: So would you say, Anna Sonoda that she has some 671 00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:52,719 Speaker 1: sort of an age regression mental ailment or as the 672 00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:56,080 Speaker 1: motive here, or do you believe it's for her pure 673 00:38:56,200 --> 00:39:00,799 Speaker 1: sex gratification or so somehow she can be the cool mom. 674 00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,160 Speaker 8: I actually don't think it matters why now, It doesn't 675 00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:08,840 Speaker 8: matter why we're so fixated on why somebody would do something. 676 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:12,319 Speaker 8: The message that listeners need to get out of this 677 00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:17,760 Speaker 8: example is that people who are entrusted with your child, 678 00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,720 Speaker 8: as long as you send them into environments in which 679 00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:25,520 Speaker 8: they have space and access away from proper supervision, the 680 00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:28,920 Speaker 8: highest risk environment your child can ever be in is 681 00:39:28,960 --> 00:39:32,600 Speaker 8: your home or someone else's home. So if these parents 682 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:37,040 Speaker 8: had just eliminated the house parties, this wasn't happening at school, 683 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:41,000 Speaker 8: This wasn't happening at church, This wasn't happening in the 684 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:44,520 Speaker 8: local playground. This was happening at her home. Let's all 685 00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:47,839 Speaker 8: wake up to the reality that our homes, and when 686 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:50,480 Speaker 8: we allow our children to go to other people's homes, 687 00:39:50,840 --> 00:39:55,120 Speaker 8: that is the highest risk environment. So honestly, I don't 688 00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:57,759 Speaker 8: care what reason she had for acting like a teen 689 00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:02,680 Speaker 8: other than grooming and looking cool and having access and 690 00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:05,480 Speaker 8: then suddenly being the one almost like a big sister 691 00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:09,320 Speaker 8: with a proper id. Here are these kids who are 692 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:12,200 Speaker 8: trying to test the boundaries because that is the appropriate 693 00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:15,600 Speaker 8: developmental stage that they are going through in their own adolescents. 694 00:40:15,840 --> 00:40:20,680 Speaker 1: Jane dough two did not want to testify, claiming she 695 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,200 Speaker 1: wants to quote forget this ever happened, but her mother 696 00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,279 Speaker 1: spoke out, saying she's not here because she doesn't want 697 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,640 Speaker 1: Shannon O'Connor to own one more minute of her life. 698 00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:32,440 Speaker 1: My daughter is not here because she's busy doing what 699 00:40:32,560 --> 00:40:36,920 Speaker 1: kids their junior years should be doing, studying for AP tests, SATs, 700 00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:39,600 Speaker 1: prom dress fitting, dreaming about colleges. 701 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:41,680 Speaker 2: Her life will never. 702 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:46,840 Speaker 1: Be the same, and I can think of five women 703 00:40:47,640 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 1: who agree with the victims mothers. Take Allison to our 704 00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:54,640 Speaker 1: cut nineteen kron. 705 00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:57,959 Speaker 20: Five female inmates are scheduled to be arraigned in court 706 00:40:58,040 --> 00:41:00,719 Speaker 20: this week after an attack on another inmate at a 707 00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:04,399 Speaker 20: jail in Milpitis. Court records show the five inmates beat 708 00:41:04,480 --> 00:41:08,160 Speaker 20: this Loscatos woman, Shannon O'Connor. It happened at the Elmwood 709 00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:12,560 Speaker 20: Correctional Facility. O'Connor is accused of throwing secret alcohol fueled 710 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:16,960 Speaker 20: parties for underage boys and girls and pressuring those teenagers into. 711 00:41:16,800 --> 00:41:18,040 Speaker 2: Having sex with each other. 712 00:41:18,480 --> 00:41:21,880 Speaker 20: Prosecutors said O'Connor lured victims to her Los Gatos mansion 713 00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:25,280 Speaker 20: through social media and her sons, who attended Los Gatos 714 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:28,960 Speaker 20: High School. The attack on her happened in October of 715 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,120 Speaker 20: last year. Court documents show deputies broke up the fight 716 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:34,120 Speaker 20: and took O'Connor to a hospital. 717 00:41:34,440 --> 00:41:38,320 Speaker 1: Michael Blot, former NYPD sergeant, Have you ever seen anything 718 00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:40,040 Speaker 1: like it to this extent? 719 00:41:40,360 --> 00:41:43,279 Speaker 10: No, it's crazy. And she knew exactly what she was 720 00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:47,319 Speaker 10: doing was illegal, you know, by keeping it from the 721 00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:50,200 Speaker 10: parents and conspiring with the kids to make sure they 722 00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:52,200 Speaker 10: kept it from the parents. So she knew exactly what 723 00:41:52,239 --> 00:41:55,319 Speaker 10: she was doing. And I do agree with your other 724 00:41:56,360 --> 00:42:01,160 Speaker 10: caller that none of the acts are consentral dute and 725 00:42:01,239 --> 00:42:04,400 Speaker 10: she's basically an accessory to a sexual assault. She's a 726 00:42:04,400 --> 00:42:08,520 Speaker 10: facilitator and she encouraged the behavior. She's just as bad 727 00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:10,920 Speaker 10: as the person committing the sexual assault. And she must 728 00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:12,239 Speaker 10: be getting gratification out. 729 00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,239 Speaker 1: Of it, so much from being a cool mom not 730 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:18,520 Speaker 1: so cool behind bars. Drew Panter, what is a status 731 00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:20,240 Speaker 1: of O'Connor's case. 732 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:23,920 Speaker 4: Oh, man, So this is one of those cases that 733 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:27,200 Speaker 4: just keeps going on and on. There's been many steps 734 00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:32,279 Speaker 4: and we're not even really even into the preliminary inquiry yet. 735 00:42:32,760 --> 00:42:35,279 Speaker 4: It was about to start the preliminary inquiry and then 736 00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:39,160 Speaker 4: there was a legal maneuver that I personally wasn't familiar 737 00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:42,120 Speaker 4: with until now, which is basically going to the judge 738 00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:45,440 Speaker 4: and saying, hey, if I plead to all the charges, 739 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:48,480 Speaker 4: what would you give me? So that's basically the step 740 00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:52,160 Speaker 4: that we are in now where I just spoke with 741 00:42:52,719 --> 00:42:55,759 Speaker 4: a parent yesterday and one of the parents told me that, 742 00:42:56,280 --> 00:43:01,040 Speaker 4: you know, Shannon O'Connor has now been offered seventeen year 743 00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:03,279 Speaker 4: and four month sentence. Of course, this has not been 744 00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:05,479 Speaker 4: put on the record yet, so there is a chance 745 00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:09,800 Speaker 4: that could change before you know, before I hear next. However, 746 00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:13,520 Speaker 4: that's what if she decides to plead to everything. We're 747 00:43:13,560 --> 00:43:16,279 Speaker 4: told that she could go away for seventeen years. It 748 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:19,479 Speaker 4: could have been as much as twenty, but who knows. 749 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:22,600 Speaker 4: Maybe this is just a legal maneuver to draw things 750 00:43:22,640 --> 00:43:26,440 Speaker 4: out and basically start the process all over again of 751 00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:31,760 Speaker 4: the preliminary inquiry, and then if that goes forward, of course, 752 00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:35,239 Speaker 4: there could be a trial later on. And this is 753 00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:39,319 Speaker 4: all going after an earlier process to try to get 754 00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:42,759 Speaker 4: out on bail. She's currently in pre trial custody as 755 00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:46,640 Speaker 4: you heard there at the Elmwood facility there in Santa 756 00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:51,719 Speaker 4: Clara County and basically her lawyer took that all the 757 00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,400 Speaker 4: way to the California Supreme Court. So a lot of 758 00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:58,880 Speaker 4: these kids, as you'd heard earlier, they're saying, you know, 759 00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:02,000 Speaker 4: I want my life back, and in fact they're saying, geez, 760 00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:05,400 Speaker 4: I want to at least be able to get through college, 761 00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:09,320 Speaker 4: you know, and be free from you know, any tormenting 762 00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:12,240 Speaker 4: from her. Of course this is all now. Shannon O'Connor, 763 00:44:12,280 --> 00:44:14,760 Speaker 4: we have to say, has not had a full chance 764 00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:16,719 Speaker 4: to amount to defense. Of course she could have, but 765 00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:20,359 Speaker 4: this is this has not gone to trial. However, from 766 00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,359 Speaker 4: a lot of the evidence that has come out so far, 767 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:27,080 Speaker 4: there are justices in California and judges in the California 768 00:44:27,120 --> 00:44:30,239 Speaker 4: system that have pointed to the strong evidence as they 769 00:44:30,280 --> 00:44:33,000 Speaker 4: see it about some of the stuff that has happened. 770 00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:34,080 Speaker 10: So be careful. 771 00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:35,799 Speaker 4: But at the same time we have to say, hey, 772 00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:39,279 Speaker 4: this is one of those cases where there is it 773 00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:41,680 Speaker 4: seems to be at least some pretty strong evidence of 774 00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:43,719 Speaker 4: a lot of this behavior occurring. I want to say 775 00:44:43,719 --> 00:44:48,080 Speaker 4: one more thing really quickly, and that is clarifying one 776 00:44:48,080 --> 00:44:50,400 Speaker 4: of the comments that was meant that was made earlier, 777 00:44:50,400 --> 00:44:53,359 Speaker 4: and I believe one of the victims had said, you know, 778 00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:56,360 Speaker 4: I'm known as the girl who was raped. I believe 779 00:44:56,400 --> 00:44:59,839 Speaker 4: that's the same person that followed that statement up by saying, hey, 780 00:45:00,520 --> 00:45:03,560 Speaker 4: that's not even my allegation. Now that's not to say 781 00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:06,440 Speaker 4: that she believes that didn't happen to other girls or 782 00:45:06,480 --> 00:45:07,920 Speaker 4: possibly boys. We don't know. 783 00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:09,239 Speaker 2: But what the. 784 00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,160 Speaker 4: Point is is that we also have a responsibility as 785 00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:15,000 Speaker 4: a community in a society to be careful with how 786 00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:18,600 Speaker 4: we look at how these situations play out, because you know, 787 00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:21,920 Speaker 4: and how you know, we don't want a victim shame either. 788 00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:24,279 Speaker 4: You know, if these are victims, they need to be 789 00:45:24,320 --> 00:45:26,960 Speaker 4: seen as victims for what happened to them, and they 790 00:45:27,000 --> 00:45:31,160 Speaker 4: shouldn't be tarnished with any kind of negative reputation when 791 00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:33,560 Speaker 4: if they truly are victims, that's what they are. 792 00:45:33,600 --> 00:45:34,400 Speaker 10: They're victims. 793 00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:38,440 Speaker 1: Guys, if you know or think you know anything about 794 00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:43,680 Speaker 1: this case about so called cool mom, Shannon O'Connor plays 795 00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:48,919 Speaker 1: dial for zero eight eight zero eight four four zero 796 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:56,799 Speaker 1: zero repeat four eight eight eight forty four one hundred goodbye.