1 00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:11,719 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Savor production of iHeartRadio. I'm Annie 2 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:13,720 Speaker 1: Reese and I'm one vocal bum and today we have 3 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:18,439 Speaker 1: an episode for you about tapach. Yes fun with pronunciation, 4 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:24,079 Speaker 1: at least for me. Yeah, I did not know what 5 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:26,880 Speaker 1: this was and I actually had to go back and 6 00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:31,200 Speaker 1: revise because I started researching it. I was like, okay, okay, 7 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: and then I continued researching it and I was like no, oh, okay, no, no, 8 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: it all worked out in the end. 9 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 2: Well, okay, I'm pretty sure that our friend of podcast, 10 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 2: Julia Skinner, has served some to you at some point 11 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:52,680 Speaker 2: in your life. She is a big fan of this beverage. 12 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 2: I even like, I don't recall this. She's given us 13 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,400 Speaker 2: a lot of things because she's wonderful that way. Yes, yeah, 14 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 2: I'm kind of human. You You you go to her 15 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 2: house and she just starts pouring you little bits of 16 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:09,559 Speaker 2: and giving you little snacks of all of the wild 17 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 2: things that she is fermenting. That's a that's a yeast 18 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 2: pun right there. But yeah, many more to come. 19 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: Yes, I believe I faintly remember that, but I didn't 20 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:24,399 Speaker 1: connect the name with the drink. But yes, she is 21 00:01:24,880 --> 00:01:30,920 Speaker 1: wonderful and even before you had mentioned that. I was like, 22 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: I bet this sounds like Julia has done this, has 23 00:01:36,080 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 1: made this, wrote about it. 24 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:42,679 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, oh yeah, yes, yes absolutely she She does 25 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:46,480 Speaker 3: have a recipe for it in her book Our Fermented Lives, 26 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 3: which we which we had her on the show to 27 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 3: talk about. 28 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:54,000 Speaker 1: Yes, yes we did. It's a great book. Was there 29 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 1: any reason this was on your mind? 30 00:01:56,600 --> 00:01:56,919 Speaker 2: No? 31 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:03,120 Speaker 1: I kind of thought it might be like a version 32 00:02:03,160 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: because I had timidly suggested kombucha. 33 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:09,919 Speaker 2: Maybe you were like, no, yeah, maybe that was it. 34 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 2: Maybe yeah, Well I was a searching for in my 35 00:02:14,200 --> 00:02:16,600 Speaker 2: rotation of topics, I was looking for a drink to 36 00:02:16,639 --> 00:02:20,440 Speaker 2: talk about, and uh yeah, I'm not sure if it 37 00:02:20,480 --> 00:02:23,440 Speaker 2: was on our list or if I was just you're like, 38 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:24,519 Speaker 2: oh that one. 39 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:29,680 Speaker 1: Sometimes topics just yeah, they just happened, you know. Maybe 40 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 1: there was a kombucha seed in there though maybe maybe. 41 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:35,679 Speaker 1: I don't know, but it was just very funny because 42 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: you were like a drink, I'm thinking about a drink 43 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:39,720 Speaker 1: and I was like kombucha and you were like. 44 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:46,600 Speaker 3: No, absolutely not, No, I'm not going to be an ambitious. 45 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,359 Speaker 1: I will say I was talking about with the mutual 46 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:54,079 Speaker 1: friend Lyle I got to hang out with him the 47 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:58,519 Speaker 1: other day, and I was talking about teach a Maratah, 48 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:03,400 Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about chicha. But it was just interesting. 49 00:03:03,480 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: Sometimes a lot of times you listeners write in about 50 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:07,840 Speaker 1: this and you're like, wow, what are the odds you 51 00:03:07,840 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 1: were talking about this. 52 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:11,399 Speaker 2: While I was making it. Well, there you go. 53 00:03:11,880 --> 00:03:13,359 Speaker 1: It happens to us too. 54 00:03:16,639 --> 00:03:19,600 Speaker 2: And it's glorious when it does. But okay. You can 55 00:03:19,639 --> 00:03:25,519 Speaker 2: also see our episodes on pineapple various kinds of sugar, cinnamon, 56 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 2: beers and wines, maybe kafir h. 57 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 1: I don't know, all kinds of thing, yeah, kinds of 58 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 1: h Yeah, well, I guess that a ser question does 59 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 1: topach What is it? 60 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 2: Well? Tapache is a type of beverage made from pineapple scraps, 61 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,600 Speaker 2: unrefined cane, sugar and water, lightly fermented and then strained, 62 00:03:55,800 --> 00:04:00,360 Speaker 2: resulting in a sweet, tart, tangy, and bubbly drink served. 63 00:04:01,080 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 2: It often has like a very low, like negligible alcohol content, 64 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 2: but it can be made to be more alcoholic as well, 65 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:10,080 Speaker 2: or used in like a cocktail for a boozy punch. 66 00:04:11,720 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 2: I've never had it because by the time I realized 67 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:19,480 Speaker 2: that it existed, I realized I had also realized that 68 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 2: I shouldn't eat pineapple, and I'm not positive that it 69 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:25,920 Speaker 2: would set me off, But you know, I've just never 70 00:04:25,960 --> 00:04:27,640 Speaker 2: had a day where I was like, you know what, 71 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:30,280 Speaker 2: I want to mess around and find out about Papache, 72 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 2: Like I have time for potential gastro upset. That sounds 73 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: like a good way to spend my day. So what 74 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:41,279 Speaker 2: I'm saying is that I'm given to understand that Apache 75 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:45,720 Speaker 2: is just so refreshing, like bright and fruity, not too sugary, 76 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 2: with that little zing of carbonation and a little bit 77 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:52,000 Speaker 2: of tang or funk of ferment. You can also add 78 00:04:52,040 --> 00:04:54,719 Speaker 2: any kind of spices you want, often something warming like 79 00:04:54,800 --> 00:04:58,719 Speaker 2: cinnamon or allspice or other fruit too for a personal flare. 80 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:00,720 Speaker 2: You don't even have to make it with pineapple. More 81 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:03,800 Speaker 2: on that later. It is often made at home or 82 00:05:03,839 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 2: by small shops or street vendors in small batches, though 83 00:05:07,680 --> 00:05:10,680 Speaker 2: it's beginning to be produced commercially as well. It's just 84 00:05:10,720 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 2: a really simple, rewarding homebrew that also uses up parts 85 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:19,679 Speaker 2: of a whole pineapple that would otherwise go to waste. 86 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 2: It's like an actual pineapple soda. Yeah, It's like it's 87 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:31,560 Speaker 2: like on a hot day when you first dip your 88 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:36,159 Speaker 2: toe into a cool swimming pool or stream and you're like, oh, 89 00:05:36,200 --> 00:05:39,320 Speaker 2: that is cold. But then pretty immediately you're like, oh 90 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 2: that is so nice. 91 00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:44,400 Speaker 1: Yeah like that, I love that feeling. 92 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:54,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, right, refreshment, yes, but okay, let's go through those ingredients, 93 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 2: all right. Pineapple, in case you just got to here. 94 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:01,680 Speaker 2: By here, I mean earth, is a lovely, juicy, tangy 95 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:05,719 Speaker 2: sweet fruit with a thick, sort of leathery, vaguely spiky, 96 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:11,039 Speaker 2: definitely inedible skin and a core that is technically edible, 97 00:06:11,080 --> 00:06:14,239 Speaker 2: but so fibrous that it can cause balls of fiber 98 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 2: to build up in your digestive tract, which nobody wants. 99 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:22,400 Speaker 2: So Tapacha uses these things. You just cut them up. 100 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 2: You can also use the fruit if you want to, 101 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:28,200 Speaker 2: for like an extra kick of flavor up to you water. 102 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 2: I feel like this is self explanatory for a beverage. Yeah, 103 00:06:33,160 --> 00:06:38,560 Speaker 2: good ingredient for a beverage. Love it, uh huh. Unrefined 104 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 2: cane sugar okay, so kind of going off our recent 105 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:47,479 Speaker 2: episode about golden syrup. If you just boil down cane 106 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 2: juice without refining it, you'll wind up with this like thick, 107 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:57,960 Speaker 2: sweet caramelized paste that'll cool into a solid block, sort 108 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:03,040 Speaker 2: of like solidified brown sugar. Okay, modernly in Mexico where 109 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 2: tapate is from, it's sold in these solid cones called piloncillos, 110 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 2: like brown sugar. It can range from light in color 111 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 2: and flavor to like really rich and sort of bitter 112 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 2: and mineral into pach. This is going to give you 113 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 2: some depth of flavor and also help fuel the fermentation 114 00:07:22,240 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 2: process because the final main ingredient here is wild bacteria 115 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,560 Speaker 2: and yeasts. You do not have to add them. They 116 00:07:30,600 --> 00:07:33,640 Speaker 2: occur naturally on the skin of pineapple and other fruits 117 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 2: and in the air around us. They live comfortably in water, 118 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:39,119 Speaker 2: and we'll eat some of the sugars and the fruit 119 00:07:39,240 --> 00:07:43,239 Speaker 2: and the sugar that you've added and poop carbon dioxide, bubbles, 120 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:53,280 Speaker 2: a little bit of alcohol and flavors, bacteria and yeas fool. Yeah, 121 00:07:52,400 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 2: So the final flavor of your tapache is going to 122 00:07:55,800 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 2: be individual to your area, to your kitchen, to your batch. 123 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 2: I mean, like it's a good bet that you're going 124 00:08:04,240 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 2: to wind up with a lot of lactococcus and sacaro 125 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 2: mices in there. You know, things that we commonly talk 126 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 2: about as being helpful bacteria and yeasts in the production 127 00:08:14,320 --> 00:08:18,520 Speaker 2: of everything from yogurt to beer, because they not only 128 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 2: produce stuff like flavors and alcohol that we like, but 129 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 2: they also help crowd out and kill off potentially harmful microbes, 130 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:31,240 Speaker 2: frequently with those flavors themselves. Anyway, Yeah, it's just not 131 00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 2: going to be as standardized as anything that you ferment 132 00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 2: using a mother or a scobie or a kaffir grains. Yeah, 133 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 2: of course, in commercialized production, I'm guessing they probably use 134 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:47,200 Speaker 2: something a little more standardized, but they haven't consulted me, 135 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:48,560 Speaker 2: so I can't tell you for sure. 136 00:08:50,200 --> 00:08:53,480 Speaker 1: I know right what's going on there. 137 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:58,200 Speaker 2: But yeah, okay, aside from aside from those basic things, 138 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:02,160 Speaker 2: you can add other choppeds like apples or oranges or 139 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 2: tamarind or mango, spices like cinnamon or alspice or ginger, 140 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 2: or cloves or peppercorns or a nise. You can serve 141 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:13,120 Speaker 2: it with a chili pepper rim if you want to. 142 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:18,360 Speaker 2: That sounds delicious and I would never stop you. But yeah, 143 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:22,120 Speaker 2: if you buy some from vendors in like different parts 144 00:09:22,200 --> 00:09:25,560 Speaker 2: of Mexico and Central America, you might get a version 145 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 2: that doesn't contain pineapple at all, but rather corn or 146 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 2: cactus fruit or whatever fruit is in season. Pineapple is 147 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 2: perhaps the most popular iteration, but it's not like a 148 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:43,679 Speaker 2: necessary ingredient. Yeah right, yes, if you're gonna make it 149 00:09:43,720 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 2: at home, you really only need the skin and core 150 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:50,320 Speaker 2: of a pineapple, a little bit of sugar, and enough 151 00:09:50,360 --> 00:09:52,880 Speaker 2: water to cover them both in a food safe container. 152 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:54,840 Speaker 2: You know you like stir it to dissolve the sugar, 153 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:57,439 Speaker 2: but yeah, just cover it loosely with a dishcloth to 154 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,720 Speaker 2: keep out bugs, and in a couple of days have nice, 155 00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: bubbly tapache. In about a week, it'll be alcoholic. You 156 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:06,680 Speaker 2: can strain it and then store it in your fridge 157 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 2: for a couple months. 158 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:12,360 Speaker 1: Oh wow, hmm, I want to do it. I want 159 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:12,719 Speaker 1: to do it. 160 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 2: It is apparently so easy. I have not tried it yet, 161 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 2: but I'm like, I could try this with a different fruit. 162 00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:25,640 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, opportunities abound. 163 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 2: I have so many jars, you guys, they're just asking 164 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:31,840 Speaker 2: to be used. 165 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:36,839 Speaker 1: Lauren, Come on, you need it for your rec room 166 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:39,080 Speaker 1: where I'm going to play my Star Wars toy game 167 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:41,079 Speaker 1: that I told you about last night. I need you? 168 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 2: Do you do? Yes? Oh god? Sure? 169 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,439 Speaker 1: Alcoholic to passion would only help. 170 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 2: Y'all if I have not mentioned mentioned it before. The 171 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 2: home that I have purchased and is still a heck 172 00:10:56,880 --> 00:11:00,439 Speaker 2: and wreck. It's a fixer upper. Pardon me, pardon me. 173 00:11:00,520 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: House has a wreck room that is wood paneled, and 174 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:10,400 Speaker 2: I am unironically excited about it, like secretly, I am 175 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 2: just a Midwestern dad and this is it makes me 176 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 2: so happy. I am gonna play Super Nintendo in that 177 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:20,200 Speaker 2: wreck room and it's gonna be great. 178 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:27,120 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it is gonna be great, very happy 179 00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:28,640 Speaker 1: about this for you and for me. 180 00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:36,560 Speaker 2: Anyway. Tapache Okay. Tapache is often made at home or 181 00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:39,760 Speaker 2: purchased from a street cart like ladled straight from a 182 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:42,400 Speaker 2: croc or a barrel, or maybe served in like a 183 00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:45,080 Speaker 2: little individual plastic bag that's sealed up tight and has 184 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:47,800 Speaker 2: a straw stuck in it. Yeah, but but these days, right, 185 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,679 Speaker 2: you can find commercial versions outside of the local area 186 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 2: as well, and it can be consumed as is or 187 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,480 Speaker 2: mixed with other juices or with like a beer or 188 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:57,600 Speaker 2: liquor if you want to. 189 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:02,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, yep, Well, what about the nutrition? 190 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:07,320 Speaker 2: That depends on exactly how you make it, But generally speaking, 191 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 2: it's not super sugary. It will probably contain some like 192 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 2: good micro nutrients and various other compounds that have positive 193 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 2: effects in your body. If it is a treat, if 194 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 2: it is a little bit sugary, sugar is a treat. 195 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:24,360 Speaker 2: Treats are nice. Try not to get too many calories 196 00:12:24,400 --> 00:12:29,200 Speaker 2: from from beverages eat food. I think that's the first time. 197 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:31,040 Speaker 2: Is that the first time I've ever had to say that. 198 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: I don't know. We've been here for a minute. We have, 199 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:37,480 Speaker 1: that's the first time. It's impressive. 200 00:12:37,520 --> 00:12:42,360 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, our seven year anniversary is coming up. I know, 201 00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:47,640 Speaker 2: I thought it was something less than that. Huh. 202 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:54,440 Speaker 1: We've been kicking around for a while, Lauren. Yes, well 203 00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:57,120 Speaker 1: we have number for you. 204 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 2: We have one single set of numbers. Okay. So, because 205 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 2: has this tends to be a very locally produced kind 206 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:09,920 Speaker 2: of product, there aren't really global production numbers or anything 207 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 2: like that to report upon. But as I was reading 208 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:22,520 Speaker 2: some of the excellent research going into the microbiome of tapach, 209 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 2: which there is a bunch of now, which is so exciting. Yeah, 210 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:29,560 Speaker 2: this one paper that was published in July of twenty 211 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:33,680 Speaker 2: twenty two that profiled the genes of microbes growing in 212 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 2: this batch of tapache that they made over the course 213 00:13:36,360 --> 00:13:40,640 Speaker 2: of a seventy two hour period the study, they found 214 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 2: yeasts from to Phila thirteen classes, eighteen orders, twenty five 215 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:52,839 Speaker 2: families and forty one genera, and then bacteria from nine 216 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 2: Fila twenty four classes, thirty eight orders, seventy one families, 217 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:03,960 Speaker 2: and one hundred and five genera, And like it changed 218 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:07,200 Speaker 2: over time, like really dramatically, which is I mean a 219 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 2: common occurrence, but so cool. The researchers referred to this 220 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 2: as the ecosystem of Mexican depace. Oh that is cool, Yeah, 221 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 2: very cool. I love it. 222 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:33,920 Speaker 1: Yes, well, we have quite a history for you. 223 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 2: We do. We do, and we are going to get 224 00:14:37,440 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 2: into that after we get back from a quick break 225 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:50,280 Speaker 2: for a word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank 226 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 2: you sponsor, Yes, thank you. 227 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:58,280 Speaker 1: Okay, So yes. A fermentation, often largely accidental in the 228 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: early days, is one of the world's oldest practices used 229 00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 1: by humans. Accidents learn not when it comes to food 230 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 1: and drink. 231 00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:11,520 Speaker 2: Yes, The aforementioned Julia Skinner writes in her book Our 232 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 2: Fermented Lives that Apache's roots go back, you know, like 233 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 2: twenty thousand years, because you know, cultures in the area 234 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 2: like by which I mean central Mexico into Central America. 235 00:15:27,360 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 2: Cultures in the area, like cultures pretty much everywhere, learned 236 00:15:30,680 --> 00:15:34,200 Speaker 2: that if you put fruit or other vegetation in water, 237 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:38,320 Speaker 2: it will ferment all on its own. We know today 238 00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 2: that that's because of wild bacteria and yeasts that live 239 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 2: on the skin of most vegetation and in the air 240 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:48,080 Speaker 2: around us. And people then learned to help the process along. 241 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:51,680 Speaker 2: And yeah, again like this has been going on for 242 00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 2: quite a long time. We figured out fermentation before we 243 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:59,480 Speaker 2: figured out the wheel. Yep, yep. Old. 244 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: But yes, to pache, which is a product of such fermentation, 245 00:16:07,160 --> 00:16:11,560 Speaker 1: goes back to pre Columbian Mexico, that area and cultures 246 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:12,360 Speaker 1: like the Maya. 247 00:16:12,560 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, the Maya and the Noah. Yes. 248 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 1: It is just one of many fermented beverages from the 249 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:22,920 Speaker 1: region and the time, most of which have very little 250 00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 1: historical documentation, if any at all. But one of the 251 00:16:27,480 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 1: important ones that often comes up when you're talking about 252 00:16:30,160 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 1: this is Chicha. So Chicha historians believe that it goes 253 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:39,800 Speaker 1: back to three thousand BCE, when people's in Central and 254 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: South America would chew corn into a pulp and their'sliva 255 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:49,480 Speaker 1: would transform the mash into sugars. Essentially like I'm really, 256 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: I'm really making this a much shorter explanation, I guess, 257 00:16:55,320 --> 00:16:57,480 Speaker 1: and chewing corn is a pretty common way to make 258 00:16:57,520 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: it easier to work with it. So then people would 259 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:03,760 Speaker 1: put the chewed corn in a container where it would 260 00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:06,880 Speaker 1: be exposed bacteria or yeast in the air, and within 261 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 1: as little as a handful of hours. Perhaps they had 262 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:14,679 Speaker 1: an alcoholic beverage that could be boiled and sterilized, and 263 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,479 Speaker 1: this drink was highly prized and may have even been 264 00:17:17,560 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: used in ceremonies. However, the Spanish did not approve of 265 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 1: it when they arrived in the fifteen hundreds, and its 266 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: popularity fell in a lot of places. However, it remained 267 00:17:28,520 --> 00:17:33,320 Speaker 1: as staple in Colombia, and vendors stands called chicheriez serving 268 00:17:33,359 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 1: the drink acted as both bars and communal spaces in 269 00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: the eighteen hundreds, and from what I read, there were 270 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:46,840 Speaker 1: hundreds in Bogata alone. So popular, but this changed after 271 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:50,959 Speaker 1: a law requiring that fermented drinks be industrially produced and 272 00:17:51,000 --> 00:17:54,160 Speaker 1: packaged in glass that was passed in Colombia nineteen forty eight. 273 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:58,199 Speaker 1: Lawmakers blamed chicha for a lack of hygiene, violence, and 274 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:02,320 Speaker 1: a pseudo scientific condition that some claims was worse than alcoholism, 275 00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 1: termed cheese mo chicha. Yes, Chicho was largely supplanted by beer, 276 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:14,720 Speaker 1: and this is part of a push to erase the 277 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:19,360 Speaker 1: past of this country, of this area and modernized. 278 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, the chichiese mall thing reminds me of the panic 279 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:31,520 Speaker 2: about absinthe that occurred, yes, over in France. But yeah, yeah, okay, 280 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:37,120 Speaker 2: but to pache To pache at first was primarily composed 281 00:18:37,119 --> 00:18:39,240 Speaker 2: of crushed corn fermented in clay pots. 282 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 1: Corn is native to central Mexico. That is also an 283 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:44,760 Speaker 1: ambitious episode we have put off for a very long time. 284 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:49,280 Speaker 2: We just I think we have to divide it into 285 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 2: like dent corn versus sweet corn. But yes, two are 286 00:18:52,600 --> 00:18:56,320 Speaker 2: very closely related anyway. Okay, yeah, yes, it's going to 287 00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:58,400 Speaker 2: be a thing. Yeah, but it's gonna be it's gonna 288 00:18:58,400 --> 00:19:00,680 Speaker 2: be a whole thing. It's going to be whole thing. 289 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 1: But historians suspect peoples in this region were drinking tapace 290 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: by like the thirteen hundreds to fifteen hundred CE. To 291 00:19:11,080 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: Pach's components changed when colonizers introduced pineapple, which produced a 292 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:18,919 Speaker 1: sweeter flavor when it was added to the mash, and 293 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,879 Speaker 1: eventually pineapple went on to largely replace corn when it 294 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,560 Speaker 1: came to tapace. But like you said, Lauren, there were 295 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 1: a bunch of different variations. 296 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:30,080 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, oh yeah. Though the word tapace itself shows 297 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 2: the beverages history with corn that there are a few 298 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:37,359 Speaker 2: theories about where exactly it comes from, but generally it 299 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:40,520 Speaker 2: seemed a historians seem to agree that it comes from 300 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:44,639 Speaker 2: the novel out words for like tender corn drink and 301 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:47,720 Speaker 2: also for stone ground, like there's influence from a couple 302 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:51,800 Speaker 2: in there. So yeah, it's a stone ground corn drink. 303 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:56,920 Speaker 2: There you go, it makes sense. Side note here, researchers 304 00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:00,760 Speaker 2: also kind of like to argue about whether pineapp was 305 00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:03,720 Speaker 2: in fact present in what's now central Mexico and down 306 00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 2: into the Maya region prior to colonization. From what I understand, 307 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 2: it seems more likely that the colonizers did indeed bring 308 00:20:14,840 --> 00:20:19,600 Speaker 2: pineapple in from the Caribbean or maybe South America, like 309 00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:24,160 Speaker 2: pretty early on in the late fourteen to early fifteen hundreds, 310 00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 2: and that it just really spread fast that it became 311 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:32,720 Speaker 2: commonplace across the area within one hundred years, to the 312 00:20:32,800 --> 00:20:37,200 Speaker 2: point that the Spanish then started spreading that local pineapple 313 00:20:37,320 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 2: to other places in the world by the end of 314 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:43,159 Speaker 2: the fifteen hundreds, so super quick. But it's kind of 315 00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 2: it's kind of you know, Histori's mysteries. Yeah, yeah, Okay. However, 316 00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:56,320 Speaker 2: because cinnamon, and specifically ceylon cinnamon was definitely introduced by 317 00:20:56,359 --> 00:21:00,440 Speaker 2: the Spanish as a trade product in Mexico the mid 318 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 2: fifteen hundreds where it really caught on and apparently Mexico 319 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 2: today is the world's largest consumer of celon cinnamon. Huh yeah, huh. 320 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:17,399 Speaker 1: Well, like pretty much everything we talk about, tapace is 321 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:22,000 Speaker 1: no different. People started experimenting based on taste and local ingredients, 322 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:25,959 Speaker 1: adding in botanicals, herbs, and spices like salon cinnamon. A 323 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:28,840 Speaker 1: lot of these recipes were handed down through the generations 324 00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:31,479 Speaker 1: in indigenous communities, and this is one of the reasons 325 00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:32,120 Speaker 1: I think. 326 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,920 Speaker 2: Numbers are difficult. As you said, was it for. 327 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:39,199 Speaker 1: A long time, It has been you make it in 328 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:41,160 Speaker 1: your home or you buy it from a local vendor, 329 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:43,000 Speaker 1: like yeah, that's where you get it. 330 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, totally, but okay. So part of the partially 331 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 2: enforced and partially voluntary cultural shift that occurred both during 332 00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:58,919 Speaker 2: several waves of colonization in Mexico and Central America, and 333 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:04,199 Speaker 2: then later through through industrialization and globalization, was the introduction 334 00:22:04,760 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 2: of other and perhaps competing beverages like beers and sodas. 335 00:22:10,520 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 2: I've read that SODA's, especially starting in the nineteen fifties, 336 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:18,160 Speaker 2: cut into and even i've read the word endangered the 337 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:24,880 Speaker 2: consumption and production of traditional beverages like tapach. Like there 338 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:28,879 Speaker 2: are fewer places that specialize only into pach to pata 339 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:32,960 Speaker 2: villas in Mexico City today than there were in prior generations, 340 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:36,480 Speaker 2: but it is still a popular product and still from 341 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 2: what I understand, very nostalgic for a lot of people, 342 00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:42,399 Speaker 2: you know, like for what their grandma brewed in her 343 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 2: kitchen or what they got from like a particular vendor 344 00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,400 Speaker 2: when they went walking with their parents. 345 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:53,199 Speaker 1: Yes, and I just realized I really never explained, but 346 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 1: chichi marada is purple corn drink. Oh, yes, very popular 347 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 1: in Peru. And when I was in Peru, everybody there 348 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,399 Speaker 1: was like, teacher, marada, here's where we're going to go. 349 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:05,760 Speaker 2: To get it. 350 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:07,920 Speaker 1: So that is how I found it. People had like 351 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:11,160 Speaker 1: their specific vendors. I liked, we have to get this here, 352 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:16,240 Speaker 1: so very similar vibe tipach is experiencing a bit of 353 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: a glow up in the US right now, both as 354 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 1: a health food and as a cocktail ingredient. Dita Kaye 355 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:29,520 Speaker 1: looked up I Guess that's right launched in twenty Thank 356 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:34,919 Speaker 1: You Lauren launched in twenty twenty, selling a variety of 357 00:23:34,920 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: flavored canned tapach. In June twenty twenty three, Tipach Saison 358 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:47,119 Speaker 1: launched the first commercially produced alcoholic tapach, also called Tipach Saison. 359 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:51,000 Speaker 1: All of this has caused some to worry that the 360 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,720 Speaker 1: culture and history behind the beverage will be lost. There's 361 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,480 Speaker 1: a lot of comparisons to kombucha and that the wrong 362 00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,760 Speaker 1: people will will be making money off of it. 363 00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, but both of those brands are run by people 364 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 2: who are connected to and who are also directly working 365 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:10,879 Speaker 2: with local communities. But you know, like, is that going 366 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 2: to be the case in the future, because right, yeah, like, 367 00:24:13,760 --> 00:24:17,399 Speaker 2: is it going to turn into another kombucha or another 368 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:21,959 Speaker 2: kafir where the people profiting from it will have no 369 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 2: connection to or maybe even no idea where it's from, right. 370 00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:33,159 Speaker 1: Right, especially because again, it has so long been like 371 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:35,840 Speaker 1: something you make your grandma makes at home, ork, Like 372 00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 1: it's something you get from the vendors. 373 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,920 Speaker 2: So it's and also something that like that, like wealthy 374 00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:44,120 Speaker 2: Europeans looked down on. Right. 375 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:48,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I felt weird because I was like, oh, 376 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,159 Speaker 1: where can I get it? I was like, wait, I 377 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,159 Speaker 1: have to make sure it's that I'm doing. I'm not 378 00:24:53,240 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 1: doing the thing, not doing har Yeah, that's just what 379 00:24:57,960 --> 00:24:59,760 Speaker 1: happens in a lot of the episodes. We talk about 380 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:04,600 Speaker 1: something we have to grapple with. But I do want 381 00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:07,440 Speaker 1: I feel like you're right, and I did have it 382 00:25:07,480 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 1: with Julia that I would like to have it again 383 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:12,119 Speaker 1: now that I know what it is in mystery of it. 384 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna read up on like 385 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 2: what other fruits, yeah, are like a good substitute. Yeah, 386 00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 2: and use one of those heck in jars. You know 387 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 2: I might. 388 00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:29,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, you use those jars. I might make this. I 389 00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:30,639 Speaker 1: feel like I could. 390 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:32,880 Speaker 2: I feel like you could too. Yeah. 391 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:37,199 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I have a ton of pineapple frozen, but 392 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,520 Speaker 1: not the part that I need. 393 00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:45,720 Speaker 2: Blast. You're just gonna have to go buy a pineapple. 394 00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:51,680 Speaker 1: Oh oh, dear dear, I have such a nerdy thing 395 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 1: that's about to happen, Lauren. If I may indulge in 396 00:25:54,880 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 1: this particularly yes, So listen. You might not know this, 397 00:26:01,160 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 1: but I had a huge cress on Ryan Gosling when 398 00:26:03,520 --> 00:26:07,600 Speaker 1: I was a kid in the show Young Hercules. Okay, 399 00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:13,600 Speaker 1: and this show has never been available to buy for me, 400 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: but through some successful searches and bidding, I now have 401 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 1: the DVDs of Young Hercules. 402 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:22,160 Speaker 2: Wow. 403 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 1: And me and my friend were like planning because we 404 00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:29,320 Speaker 1: would watch it together. We're planning a themed menu, of course, 405 00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 1: and one of the things on there, she was like, 406 00:26:31,840 --> 00:26:35,840 Speaker 1: you should make ambrosia, which for me is basically just 407 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:40,919 Speaker 1: pineapple and juice. So now I'm like, maybe I could 408 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:43,159 Speaker 1: work this in somehow. 409 00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:46,159 Speaker 2: Yeah, go go get your fresh pineapple, you know. 410 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,600 Speaker 1: Yes, then I take the ambrosia. 411 00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:52,680 Speaker 2: Take the fruit, you know, brewier tapach. 412 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:53,960 Speaker 1: Yeah. 413 00:26:55,080 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 2: Oh it's gonna be good. So excited it. That's that's amazing. 414 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 2: And I would say, given the fact that you ran 415 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,800 Speaker 2: a D and D game for me and several of 416 00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:11,959 Speaker 2: our other co workers last night, that's not like the 417 00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:18,680 Speaker 2: most nerdy thing I've ever heard of you doing. No, No, 418 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:19,919 Speaker 2: but it's up there. 419 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,359 Speaker 1: It's embarrassing because I like wrote a fan letter that 420 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:25,720 Speaker 1: I hope he never read. I was nine years old 421 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:28,360 Speaker 1: and I like dotted the eyes with her. It was fine, 422 00:27:28,600 --> 00:27:36,680 Speaker 1: but like, oh, come on, it's adorable. Oh no, I'm blushing. Wow, 423 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 1: it was. This is a timely episode for me, is 424 00:27:39,840 --> 00:27:40,480 Speaker 1: what I'm saying. 425 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:44,080 Speaker 2: Okay, that's great. I'm I'm I'm here for you. I'm 426 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:45,800 Speaker 2: here for you in this moment, of course. 427 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:48,600 Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Well. 428 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,840 Speaker 2: If you have any fan letters that you want to 429 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:57,040 Speaker 2: tell us about having written to someone else really embarrassingly, yes, 430 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 2: if you have a personal memory of depach or anything else, 431 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:05,840 Speaker 2: we would love, we would love to hear from you. 432 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:08,760 Speaker 2: We do already have some listener mail for you, though, 433 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:10,840 Speaker 2: and we are going to get into that as soon 434 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:12,520 Speaker 2: as we get back from one more quick break for 435 00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:24,200 Speaker 2: word from our sponsors, and we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, 436 00:28:24,320 --> 00:28:36,360 Speaker 2: thank you, and we're back with school SpongeBob. Oh. 437 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:38,680 Speaker 1: Okay, I show. 438 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:42,240 Speaker 2: No idea what you're talking about. 439 00:28:42,280 --> 00:28:46,000 Speaker 1: I love it. That's another. That's another one that's been 440 00:28:46,000 --> 00:28:54,040 Speaker 1: on the list for a long time. One Day, One day, Okay, 441 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,640 Speaker 1: John wrote loved the recent episode on dim Sum and 442 00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:01,680 Speaker 1: just had to chime in. Growing up, Chinese food was 443 00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 1: a staple for my family, and in fact, my mother 444 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:06,040 Speaker 1: worked at one restaurant for several years while I was 445 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 1: a child, Dumplings aka potstickers were always a favorite treat, 446 00:29:10,880 --> 00:29:13,160 Speaker 1: but something that had eluded me for a long time 447 00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:18,880 Speaker 1: was the fabled jiaolongboo or soup dumplings. Maybe I'm misremembering, 448 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 1: but when Bruce Lee is giving his famous bee like 449 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,880 Speaker 1: water speech and enter the Dragon, he does so while 450 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 1: eating jiaolongboo, demonstrating how to properly tear open a corner 451 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,600 Speaker 1: of the dumpling to let the soup in actuality a 452 00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 1: neat aspect or gelatin that melts from the steaming process 453 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 1: fill your spoon and prevent you from burning your mouth. 454 00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 1: It wouldn't be till my wife and I honeymooned in 455 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:45,560 Speaker 1: California that the stream was made of reality. We went 456 00:29:45,600 --> 00:29:48,440 Speaker 1: to a lovely little dim sum restaurant in San Francisco 457 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 1: right when they opened, and took time to savor our 458 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 1: tasty treat, accompanied by delightful chrysanthemum tea. Of all the 459 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 1: things we tried, the phoenix talons, fried and marinated chicken 460 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:03,120 Speaker 1: fee we're the hardest to swallow. We gave it a 461 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,280 Speaker 1: daring China nibvel, but the texture defeated it. Still, it's 462 00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:09,400 Speaker 1: been a happy memory for us, and it's nice to 463 00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: know that there are some places nearby in Atlanta that 464 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:16,280 Speaker 1: served dim sum, even if it's without the cute little carts. 465 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, now there's a there's plenty of dim sum 466 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 2: around Atlanta. Yes, oh yes, yeah, I tended to go 467 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:31,680 Speaker 2: to Canton House, but that's just like my basic that's 468 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:35,400 Speaker 2: like the one that I was introduced to first. So yeah, yeah, 469 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 2: there's a bunch of them. Yeah. 470 00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:39,360 Speaker 1: We have kind of like twenty minutes outside of the 471 00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:43,640 Speaker 1: heart of Atlantic, kind of a Chinatown, a China market area, 472 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,960 Speaker 1: and it has a lot of restaurants here there. But yeah, yeah, 473 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 1: I love this. I recently ordered a bunch of soup 474 00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:54,479 Speaker 1: dumplings now because after you told me how to eat them, 475 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:56,320 Speaker 1: I was like, well, now I've got to try. I've 476 00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,040 Speaker 1: done it right this whole time, so I'm very excited. 477 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:02,720 Speaker 1: I think they're coming tomorrow. Oh oh fine, I will 478 00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 1: report back on that. 479 00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:03,960 Speaker 2: Okay. 480 00:31:04,120 --> 00:31:08,880 Speaker 1: It is funny about the the chicken feet. I ate 481 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: that a lot in when I was in China. 482 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,280 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, because it was kind of just sold like I. 483 00:31:14,200 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 1: Don't know, like how in the US we sell candy 484 00:31:16,720 --> 00:31:17,800 Speaker 1: bars when you're checking out. 485 00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 2: It was sort of just kind of everywhere. 486 00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, and especially when I first got there and I realized, like, 487 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,760 Speaker 1: oh my Mandarin is not very good. Nothing's in English. 488 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 1: I'll just I see this thing, I'll buy it. So 489 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:31,800 Speaker 1: I really liked it, but it took My friends were like, 490 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:35,240 Speaker 1: it is work to get some of the meat. It's 491 00:31:35,240 --> 00:31:37,520 Speaker 1: one of those things you get a yeah, it's effort. 492 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:39,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, and it is a lot of a lot of 493 00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:41,880 Speaker 2: skin and kind of like a little bit of fat. 494 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,400 Speaker 2: I find it very chewy, which can be a difficult 495 00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:50,120 Speaker 2: texture sometimes, especially if it's combined with a flavor that 496 00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:55,840 Speaker 2: you're not expecting to get from chewy. But uh, it's 497 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 2: not a thing that I order. But I certainly wouldn't 498 00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 2: turn my nose bad. If someone was like, here, try this, 499 00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:02,400 Speaker 2: I would be like. 500 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:07,920 Speaker 1: Of course, yeah, yeah, pretty good. Yeah, I'm glad. 501 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:09,160 Speaker 2: I love these memories. 502 00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:13,760 Speaker 1: I'm also someone who has like the memories associated with 503 00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:16,960 Speaker 1: entertainment where I'm like, well remember and that scene where 504 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:19,560 Speaker 1: they hate this? Yes, so I'm with you. 505 00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:26,680 Speaker 2: Oh, Jill wrote Happy New Year. Mold wine is one 506 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,200 Speaker 2: of my favorite festive drinks. I first had it during 507 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:32,360 Speaker 2: bonfire night celebrations in England, where it's all about burning 508 00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,560 Speaker 2: guy fox and effigy and shooting off fireworks. Me and 509 00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:37,360 Speaker 2: a couple of my friends walked up one of Durham's 510 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,760 Speaker 2: many hills to watch the fireworks, since many of the 511 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 2: different colleges had their own celebrations and we could see 512 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 2: all the different shows from that vantage point. As it 513 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 2: was November in England, the night was quite cold and rainy, 514 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 2: and we had to press together to share warmth, a 515 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:53,080 Speaker 2: far cry from warm summer night fireworks for the Fourth 516 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 2: of July. The only thing that made it bearable was 517 00:32:56,000 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 2: the glug my finish friend made and kept in a thermos. 518 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 2: The common of hot wine, warm spices, citrus and whiskey 519 00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:05,960 Speaker 2: was all we needed. Since then, I've tried and loved 520 00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:09,440 Speaker 2: many variations of muld wine, including the hippocris you mentioned. 521 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,840 Speaker 2: The long pepper and greens of paradise really make it special, 522 00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 2: floral and more fiery than regular black peppercorns. One of 523 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:19,320 Speaker 2: my friends even sent me some mold wine tea this Christmas, 524 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:22,280 Speaker 2: and I'll have to report back on the flavor. Lauren. 525 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,960 Speaker 2: I think you'll really like a chada. A chada is 526 00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:30,200 Speaker 2: pickled green papaya with other vegetables like carrots. Some recipes 527 00:33:30,240 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 2: even call for reasons it's sweet and vinegary and plays 528 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 2: well with all proteins. However, my favorite application is with 529 00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 2: Crispy Fried pork Belly Lynch and Kohally or even the 530 00:33:42,440 --> 00:33:45,280 Speaker 2: Adobo sa scene that I wrote about a while back. 531 00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:47,720 Speaker 2: There's always a jar of it in my fridge. I've 532 00:33:47,720 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 2: never made it myself, but maybe I'll have a go, 533 00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:56,160 Speaker 2: and then links a recipe and says please enjoy. Yes, yeah, yeah, 534 00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:58,480 Speaker 2: so this is a this is a Filipino dish. And 535 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:03,000 Speaker 2: we're lucky in Atlanta to have had this relatively recent 536 00:34:03,040 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 2: influx of like very popular, very good Filipino restaurants. Yeah, 537 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,320 Speaker 2: a few of them, like during the pandemic, moved from 538 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:15,440 Speaker 2: being like pop up situations to having their own storefronts. 539 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:19,280 Speaker 2: And one of them just got a nod uh Esterltha 540 00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:22,120 Speaker 2: just got a nod from from Heck and Michelin guide 541 00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:27,719 Speaker 2: uh so has offered them delicious food. Oh I he 542 00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 2: can love Filipino food. 543 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:33,279 Speaker 1: Me too. I believe it was Joe that sends in 544 00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: a recipe that I make to this day. Oh yeah, yeah, 545 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,719 Speaker 1: so good. They like a dobo like where it melts 546 00:34:41,760 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 1: with the rice. 547 00:34:44,280 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, so good. 548 00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:48,960 Speaker 1: Oxtail, It was oxtail. That's how I make it. 549 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 2: Oh okay, all right, yes, oh heck yeah. And mulled wine. 550 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,120 Speaker 2: Oh right right, how delightful, how nice on a cold night. 551 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:01,160 Speaker 2: And I agree with you about long pepper. I love 552 00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:06,359 Speaker 2: a long pepper. One of y'all sent in a jar once. Yes, 553 00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:09,600 Speaker 2: and it's so good I'd never had it before. 554 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 1: Yes, that is true. Oh, you listeners are the best. 555 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:17,239 Speaker 1: You are. You introduced us to so much. You send 556 00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:22,279 Speaker 1: us stuff never required but always know. Yeah, so thank you, 557 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:25,359 Speaker 1: and please do report back about this tea. 558 00:35:25,400 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 2: I'm intrigued absolutely yes. 559 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,760 Speaker 1: Well in the meantime, thanks to both of these listeners 560 00:35:31,760 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 1: for writing in. If you would like to write to us, 561 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,279 Speaker 1: you can. Our email is hello at sabrepod dot com. 562 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook, 563 00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:41,920 Speaker 2: and Instagram at saber pod and we do hope to 564 00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:45,040 Speaker 2: hear from you. Savre is production of iHeartRadio four more 565 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:47,920 Speaker 2: podcasts from my Heart Radio. You can visit the iHeartRadio app, 566 00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:51,000 Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 567 00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,960 Speaker 2: Thanks as always to our super producers Dylan Fagan and 568 00:35:53,960 --> 00:35:56,239 Speaker 2: Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope 569 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:57,879 Speaker 2: that lots more good things are coming your way.