1 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:07,480 Speaker 1: You're listening to Math and Magic, a production of iHeart Podcasts. 2 00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:10,520 Speaker 2: What drove me was not like, oh, I need to 3 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 2: make a whole lot of dope, and that was never 4 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:14,400 Speaker 2: motivating for me, and I did well in working for 5 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:17,479 Speaker 2: other people. But here's the truth. How hard can it 6 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:19,720 Speaker 2: be when someone hands you a business card that says 7 00:00:19,760 --> 00:00:24,280 Speaker 2: president of twentieth century Fox doing something totally from scratch, 8 00:00:24,440 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 2: Like totally from scratch. That's challenging and that'll be a 9 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 2: real test. 10 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:33,239 Speaker 1: Hi. 11 00:00:33,240 --> 00:00:36,080 Speaker 3: I'm Bob Pittman, and welcome to Math and Magic. Today. 12 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:38,199 Speaker 3: We have someone who has built a career and a 13 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:41,199 Speaker 3: life by excelling at both. He manages to find the 14 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:43,960 Speaker 3: next creative spark and nurtured well and at the same 15 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 3: time put a strong business foundation under it, whether it 16 00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:50,080 Speaker 3: be large or small businesses, or cutting edge or traditional. 17 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 3: He wears a number of hats, but his two main 18 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 3: ones are as chairman and CEO of Take two Interactive Software, 19 00:00:56,000 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 3: the publisher of Grand Theft Auto, and as an astute 20 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:02,920 Speaker 3: and successful inventster best known for Zelnik Media Capital, his 21 00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:06,880 Speaker 3: private equity firm focused on media and technology investments, and 22 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:10,480 Speaker 3: he is a longtime friend. He's Straus Selnik. Strauss had 23 00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,920 Speaker 3: business success at an early age and has an incredible resume. 24 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 3: Let me give you a few examples. In the eighties, 25 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:19,720 Speaker 3: he was president and Chief Operating officer of twentieth Century Fox, 26 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 3: and had been president and COO of Vestron Video back 27 00:01:23,400 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 3: when Vestron was the dominant player in the home video business. 28 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:30,560 Speaker 3: In the early nineties, he was the president and CEO 29 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 3: of Crystal Dynamics, a super hot interactive entertainment software company startup, 30 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:37,759 Speaker 3: and in the late nineties he was President and CEO 31 00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:40,800 Speaker 3: of BMG Entertainment, at that time one of the world's 32 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:44,319 Speaker 3: largest music and entertainment companies with more than two hundred 33 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 3: record labels and operations in fifty four countries. He also 34 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,120 Speaker 3: has an impressive academic resume. He has an MBA from 35 00:01:51,160 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 3: the Harvard Business School and a jd from the Harvard 36 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,680 Speaker 3: Law School. He's known for his incredible commitment to physical 37 00:01:56,680 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 3: fitness and his commitment to the life he really wanted 38 00:02:00,200 --> 00:02:02,480 Speaker 3: to lead. I've been close to him for about forty 39 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:05,640 Speaker 3: years and looking forward to digging in with him today. Strauss, welcome, 40 00:02:05,880 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 3: Thanks for having Dog. 41 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:07,680 Speaker 2: Great to be here. 42 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 3: Before we jump in, I want to do you in 43 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:13,640 Speaker 3: sixty seconds if you prefer cats or dogs, dogs early 44 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:17,080 Speaker 3: riser or night out early Rassler West Coast or East Coast, 45 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:22,440 Speaker 3: East Coast, New York or Boston, New York. Soccer or basketball, basketball, 46 00:02:22,720 --> 00:02:28,079 Speaker 3: sleep or workout, workout, coke or pepsi coke, beach or mountains, beach, 47 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 3: rock and roller, country country, coffee or tea coffee, walking 48 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:38,040 Speaker 3: or running, walking, books or movies, books, cook or read out, cook, 49 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 3: Godfather or Star Wars, Star Wars, comedy or drama, comedy, 50 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:48,679 Speaker 3: Hamburger or Tofu rap Hamburger caller text text about to 51 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 3: get harder. All time favorite music artist. 52 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:57,040 Speaker 2: James Taylor, first job, Columbia Pictures, Television favorite TV show. 53 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:02,720 Speaker 2: But that's really tough, friends, smartest person you know David Remnick, 54 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 2: childhood hero, John F. Kennedy, secret talent, personal trainer. 55 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:11,639 Speaker 3: What did you want to be when you were growing up? 56 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 2: Head of the film studio? 57 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 3: Okay, let's jump in. One of your hallmarks is how 58 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:21,320 Speaker 3: well you manage creative people and creative hits driven businesses 59 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 3: yet still make them successful businesses. How do you strike 60 00:03:25,280 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 3: that balance and how do you build and manage your teams? 61 00:03:28,680 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: You know, I try to build businesses that take enormous 62 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:36,160 Speaker 2: creative risks and no financial risks. I try to be 63 00:03:36,240 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 2: creatively risk forward and financially risk averse. So my companies 64 00:03:41,080 --> 00:03:45,000 Speaker 2: are all underleveraged. If they're leveraged at all, and they 65 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 2: are I hope, rationally run and cash flow generating businesses. 66 00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:52,800 Speaker 2: And it's amazing how many people in the entertainment business 67 00:03:53,000 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 2: don't bother to think about that part. That's important because 68 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 2: if you have a strong P and L and a 69 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:02,280 Speaker 2: strong balance sheet, creative teams understand that even if they 70 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 2: make a mistake, the company can live to play another day, 71 00:04:05,440 --> 00:04:07,920 Speaker 2: and the company can afford to make creative mistakes. And 72 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:12,480 Speaker 2: if you're unable to take meaningful creative risk and therefore 73 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 2: run the risk of making horrible creative mistakes, then you 74 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:21,480 Speaker 2: can't play in this business. I try really hard to recruit, retain, 75 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 2: and motivate the best talent in the business. I'm proud 76 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,040 Speaker 2: of the fact that I've run every kind of entertainment 77 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:32,440 Speaker 2: business there is, and my teams have had the highest 78 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 2: hit ratios of any teams operating the business at that time. 79 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:40,320 Speaker 2: And that's without exception, and put that in context. I'm 80 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 2: not the one sitting in the corner office calling someone 81 00:04:42,760 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 2: up and giving them notes. I'm not reading scripts, I'm 82 00:04:46,200 --> 00:04:49,599 Speaker 2: not making video games, I'm not producing music, I'm not 83 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 2: directing TV shows, and I've never done any of that, 84 00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 2: So what's the trick. The trick, in my opinion, is 85 00:04:56,520 --> 00:05:01,279 Speaker 2: truly being able to distinguish talent from almost talent, or 86 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:05,480 Speaker 2: near talent or not talent, and then creating a structure 87 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:10,160 Speaker 2: that not only allows talented people to pursue their passions, 88 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 2: but insists that they do so. I'm not sure this 89 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:16,280 Speaker 2: is much of a skill, but the skill that I 90 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 2: have is that I seem to be able to identify 91 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,200 Speaker 2: talent in others, and then I seem to be able 92 00:05:21,240 --> 00:05:25,240 Speaker 2: to encourage those talented people to work within the system 93 00:05:25,279 --> 00:05:27,960 Speaker 2: that I'm managing and to do their best work. And 94 00:05:28,000 --> 00:05:31,000 Speaker 2: I'm very proud of the fact that in my entire career, 95 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:33,599 Speaker 2: I've never lost any talent that I didn't want to lose, 96 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:38,359 Speaker 2: not once actually, and to this day, I think even 97 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 2: my competitors would have to acknowledge that Take two in 98 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,800 Speaker 2: its affiliates have the best collection of creative talent in 99 00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:47,840 Speaker 2: the interactive entertainment business. I mean by a wide margin, 100 00:05:48,080 --> 00:05:50,680 Speaker 2: and our results reflect that our hit ratio reflects that. 101 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 3: So I'm going to dig into this little bit. I've 102 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 3: watched you do this for decades. You've taken an interest 103 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 3: in developing people, not people who already had skills, not 104 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:04,000 Speaker 3: people that everybody's bidding on because they're the person, but 105 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 3: you really had an interest in developing the next generation 106 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 3: of leaders. How do you think about that and how 107 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:12,839 Speaker 3: do you do it? And is it driven by just 108 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:16,919 Speaker 3: good business giving back or something else. 109 00:06:17,960 --> 00:06:21,440 Speaker 2: There's an element of giving back because people bet on 110 00:06:21,520 --> 00:06:24,240 Speaker 2: me when I was young and inexperienced, and I like 111 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:26,279 Speaker 2: to think that that paid off over and over again. 112 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 2: It's true that some of the very talented people who 113 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 2: run businesses for me today are people who I recruited 114 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:38,040 Speaker 2: when they were unknown and inexperienced and in their twenties. 115 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 2: Carl Slatoff, was the president of Take two, has worked 116 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:45,000 Speaker 2: with me in one enterprise or another since you graduated 117 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 2: from business school twenty seven or twenty eight years ago. 118 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,880 Speaker 2: Andrew Vogel and Jordan Turkoitz were co CIOs of ZMC, 119 00:06:52,520 --> 00:06:56,159 Speaker 2: started with me when they were associates, very very early 120 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 2: in their careers, and now they're very senior at ZMC. 121 00:07:00,040 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 2: And it's a very long list actually across all of 122 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 2: my enterprises, and I have a whole alumni base as well. 123 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 2: I like to think, of course, there's an element of 124 00:07:09,120 --> 00:07:11,559 Speaker 2: being of service to others. I spend twenty to twenty 125 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 2: five percent of my time coaching and mentoring people, try 126 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 2: to help people, and most of those people are not 127 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 2: in any economic system of mind now and then they 128 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 2: are though, So it seems to me that the hardest 129 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 2: thing to do is convince established talent to leave where 130 00:07:29,480 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 2: they're happily employed and come to your system. And it's 131 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 2: a lot easier to develop your own if you have 132 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 2: a facility for identifying and developing talent to people, whether 133 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:42,320 Speaker 2: they're on the creative or executive side. And as I said, 134 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:45,320 Speaker 2: I think it's probably my only true skill in business. 135 00:07:45,400 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 2: Well maybe I'm a reasonably good capital alligator, but yes 136 00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:52,560 Speaker 2: you are. But really, I mean, because I work in 137 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 2: creative businesses, knowing the difference between good and great, that's 138 00:07:56,760 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 2: the whole shooting match, and then being willing to you know, 139 00:08:00,480 --> 00:08:03,080 Speaker 2: to work with them. So I don't think this is 140 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:06,160 Speaker 2: talking out of school. When I got to Fox, Jim 141 00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,120 Speaker 2: Cameron was finishing up the ABYSS and he had a 142 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 2: reputation for being a challenging person to work with. And 143 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,200 Speaker 2: I worked closely with Jim Cameron, which is to say, 144 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:19,440 Speaker 2: whatever he wanted to do, I basically said yes to 145 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:21,280 Speaker 2: because it was obvious to me that he was a 146 00:08:21,320 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 2: creative genius. It was, by the way, equally obvious that 147 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:25,960 Speaker 2: I could say no or yes and he was still 148 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 2: going to do what he wanted. We could do this 149 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:29,440 Speaker 2: easy way of the hard way, like why not do 150 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:32,120 Speaker 2: it the easy way? So what I basically did was 151 00:08:32,280 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 2: to the extent he ever was interested in it, I 152 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 2: tried to hold his hand and support him, very very 153 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 2: very Occasionally he would be interested in my opinion or 154 00:08:41,559 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 2: ask for advice and I would offer it, and you know, 155 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:48,400 Speaker 2: I was there to support and encourage him. And as 156 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 2: a result, he made more pictures for Fox, including after 157 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:55,920 Speaker 2: I left. He had great success because I was right, 158 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 2: he was immensely talented, and I wasn't going to add 159 00:08:59,520 --> 00:09:02,559 Speaker 2: anything all to the creative quality of what he was doing. 160 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:06,199 Speaker 2: So my choice was to say, let's make this experience 161 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 2: great for all involved, and like, let's get that hit 162 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:09,679 Speaker 2: to market. 163 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,079 Speaker 3: Let's talk about the people you help too. You've helped 164 00:09:13,120 --> 00:09:16,040 Speaker 3: people some on their way up, some already there. But 165 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 3: what do you learn from them? 166 00:09:18,200 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 2: I think you can learn from everyone, you know. I 167 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:25,240 Speaker 2: have numerous friends who are decades younger, and by the way, 168 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 2: numerous fends who are decades older, and I can learn 169 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 2: and do learn from all of them. I find that today. 170 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,320 Speaker 2: One of the reasons that I can continue to be 171 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:35,679 Speaker 2: relevant and capable is that I spend a lot of 172 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 2: time with young people, so I don't have to play 173 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 2: catch up to figure out what TikTok is. I was 174 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:43,959 Speaker 2: involved with Discord like days after it launched because I 175 00:09:44,320 --> 00:09:46,959 Speaker 2: have my ear of the ground with people who are 176 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:51,360 Speaker 2: decades younger. That's very much informed what I do, particularly 177 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:54,720 Speaker 2: in businesses like interactive entertainment, a big segment of which 178 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 2: is youth oriented. 179 00:09:56,280 --> 00:09:58,480 Speaker 3: We're talking about people here. Let's take a one more 180 00:09:58,520 --> 00:10:02,040 Speaker 3: step talk a little about the power of teams and collaboration. 181 00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 2: I have mixed feelings about that. You know, it's funny. 182 00:10:04,320 --> 00:10:06,959 Speaker 2: I worked for Joe Roth at Fox, who was chairman 183 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:09,720 Speaker 2: of the studio when I was president, and he said, 184 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 2: you know, creativity is ultimately a singular exercise. I agree 185 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 2: with that. I defy you to show me a big 186 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:20,200 Speaker 2: hit that truly was created by a massive team. Generally 187 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:24,199 Speaker 2: there was one powerful creative voice driving that. On the 188 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 2: other hand, particularly in businesses like interactive entertainment, you can't 189 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:29,920 Speaker 2: execute anything without a big team, at least not currently. 190 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:33,160 Speaker 2: So the true creative genius is in our business as 191 00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:37,199 Speaker 2: someone who can add value as an individual contributor creatively 192 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:40,959 Speaker 2: and motivate a massive team to create value and then 193 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 2: ultimately pull the property together with some element of singular 194 00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 2: focus to deliver a hit. I mean, I think that's 195 00:10:49,240 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 2: what a great director does. I think the showrunners play 196 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 2: that role in television, and producers play that role and 197 00:10:56,080 --> 00:11:00,280 Speaker 2: record of music and that's why you can listen into 198 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:06,560 Speaker 2: music and certain producers had very specific sounds associated with 199 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:09,679 Speaker 2: their approach. So I think it's both. To answer your question, 200 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 2: there's an element of singular creative leadership and engagement, and 201 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 2: then there is an element of encouraging and leading and 202 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:23,439 Speaker 2: managing and motivating a big team to usher that vision 203 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:24,200 Speaker 2: into reality. 204 00:11:24,800 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 3: You had a great career we touched on a little 205 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 3: bit at a very young age, huge jobs in your twenties. 206 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 3: Did that early head start shape you and make you 207 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:37,960 Speaker 3: different from the leaders who are probably in their forties 208 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,559 Speaker 3: before they reach those levels. 209 00:11:40,000 --> 00:11:42,520 Speaker 2: Well, I mean, there's nothing more pathetic than dining out 210 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,599 Speaker 2: on your early success in life. I think maybe what 211 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 2: shape me is that I didn't get diverted later on 212 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:52,680 Speaker 2: by stuff that maybe diverts people. So, you know, I 213 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 2: met all the stars, and I had a parking space 214 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 2: with my name on it very early in my career. Thankfully, 215 00:11:59,040 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: I'm not a person if it motivated by stuff like that, 216 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 2: So the thrill wore off really quickly, and I think 217 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:08,720 Speaker 2: that allowed me to work and create a fields because 218 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 2: I'm not looking for an invitation to your cocktail party, 219 00:12:13,040 --> 00:12:17,840 Speaker 2: and I'm not starstruck, and ultimately, I don't confuse myself 220 00:12:17,920 --> 00:12:22,760 Speaker 2: with talent, and I'm not there for social purposes. I'm 221 00:12:22,760 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 2: there because I'm passionate about making extraordinary entertainment and because 222 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,000 Speaker 2: I like running really good businesses. So I think maybe 223 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:36,559 Speaker 2: doing well early allowed me to not get diverted by 224 00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:41,400 Speaker 2: stuff that does. Sometimes people who have access to these 225 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,160 Speaker 2: fields later on where they're like, wow, this is amazing, 226 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,319 Speaker 2: Like I can meet so and so and they can 227 00:12:47,360 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 2: come to my house and like next thing, you know, 228 00:12:49,679 --> 00:12:52,760 Speaker 2: they're making horrible business decisions as a result. 229 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:54,680 Speaker 3: Yes, we've seen a lot of those. 230 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:56,800 Speaker 2: Well I'll give you an example actually, because it's a 231 00:12:56,800 --> 00:12:59,480 Speaker 2: fun one, go for it. So as a twentieth century Fox, 232 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 2: and we were signing a deal to make a movie 233 00:13:03,480 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 2: with Warren Batty. So we're signing up this deal and 234 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 2: it had been long negotiated, was very tough. His order 235 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:11,720 Speaker 2: was bird Fields. He didn't have an agent, and he 236 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,800 Speaker 2: was intimately engaged with his own business affairs, and there 237 00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:17,560 Speaker 2: were some contentious elements of the deal. But finally had 238 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:20,360 Speaker 2: gotten done and it was ready to be signed, and 239 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,680 Speaker 2: I get a call from someone on his team saying 240 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:26,680 Speaker 2: we're going to have a closing and we want you 241 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:30,440 Speaker 2: to be there to sign the documents. And I was like, 242 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 2: I don't really do that, like like you just signed 243 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:36,200 Speaker 2: the document, like you know, we're closing. So it wasn't 244 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 2: like we're buying a house. But okay, so there he said, Nope, nope, 245 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 2: mister Baty wants to have a closing and it's very 246 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 2: important that you'd be there to sign the documents. He 247 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 2: will be there to sign the documents. So I'm like 248 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:49,599 Speaker 2: picking up the pen, ready to sign, like completely not 249 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,240 Speaker 2: understanding why we're there. Very happy to meet him. By 250 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 2: the way, and he says, wait, wait, you know before 251 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 2: we sign, there are a couple things in the contract 252 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:00,720 Speaker 2: that really, like, you know, just like mean a lot 253 00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 2: to me if we could change. And he had fully 254 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:08,080 Speaker 2: contemplated that the three or four sticking points it ultimately 255 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 2: had been resolved that he really wanted in a different direction. 256 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,319 Speaker 2: He figured if he could get into a room with anyone, 257 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 2: they'd be so starstruck that they would just sign the documents. 258 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 2: And I said to him, Oh, sorry, I thought we're 259 00:14:21,160 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 2: here to have like a ceremonial closing, like I'm not 260 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 2: here to renegotiate the deal with you, mister Batty, And 261 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 2: I left the room. That was the end of it. 262 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 3: Did you ever change the points? 263 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 2: No? Then when you realized the gamp it didn't work, 264 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:35,160 Speaker 2: they sent over the signed documents. 265 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:39,720 Speaker 3: We did not have a certain very funny so New York. 266 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 3: Do you think you would have had the same level 267 00:14:42,640 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 3: of success if you had not been in and around 268 00:14:45,520 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 3: New York? Just New York give you an edge in 269 00:14:47,960 --> 00:14:48,400 Speaker 3: any way? 270 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 2: You know. I did work in California for five years 271 00:14:51,880 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 2: so and they were the right locations for those jobs. 272 00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 2: But when I had the opportionity to turn around and 273 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 2: build up a record company I was located in New York. 274 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:03,560 Speaker 2: I was actually happy to come back, because the truth is, 275 00:15:03,600 --> 00:15:05,720 Speaker 2: I was always more of a New York type person, 276 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 2: East Coast person in California when I was in the 277 00:15:09,320 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 2: movie business in the eighties and nineties and the Tellivision business, 278 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:17,560 Speaker 2: the home entertainment business. Speaking grammatically wasn't necessarily like a benefit. 279 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 2: You may recall, and my multiple degrees from elite Eastern schools, 280 00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 2: that was not a benefit that was detriment. There was 281 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:27,760 Speaker 2: there no doubt that New York was maybe a little 282 00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 2: more congenial. But it's a great question because as you know, 283 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 2: I started ZMC and that led to Take two. And 284 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:37,520 Speaker 2: I do think that only could have worked in New 285 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 2: York because we had access to capital and access to 286 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 2: counterparties and access to deals that I don't think would 287 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 2: have come our way outside of New York. 288 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 3: Your book, Becoming Ageless The Four Secrets to Looking and 289 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 3: Feeling Younger than Ever, was put out in twenty eighteen. 290 00:15:57,120 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 3: Your four secrets are forever fuel eating for you, unlocking 291 00:16:01,160 --> 00:16:04,800 Speaker 3: inner strength, fitness three, bulletproofing the body, health and prevention, 292 00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 3: and finding your soul connection. Community purpose? What motivated you 293 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 3: to write the book and seven years later, would you 294 00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 3: amend any of the secrets? 295 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 2: What motivated me was people ask me all the time 296 00:16:18,480 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 2: how I managed to stay in reasonably good shape while 297 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 2: having an active professional life and an active personal life. 298 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:31,920 Speaker 2: David Dizenko, who was at the time the editor in 299 00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 2: chief of Men's Health, encouraged me to write the book 300 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:39,080 Speaker 2: and published it through his label through Simon and Schuster. Ultimately, 301 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:41,080 Speaker 2: I actually did it from a point of view being 302 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 2: of service to others. There are a number of things 303 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,160 Speaker 2: I would amend. Probably the area that has evolved most 304 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:49,480 Speaker 2: would be diet. So there's a whole bunch of diet 305 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 2: recommendations in the book, and they sort of err on 306 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 2: the side of ultra low carb and I'm no longer 307 00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 2: of the view that that's a really good idea. 308 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:00,280 Speaker 3: I like this. You're saying we can eat a lot 309 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:02,640 Speaker 3: of carbs. Now this is the best news I have heard. 310 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:05,919 Speaker 3: I'm saying you can eat a balanced diet that includes carbs, 311 00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 3: and that I was low CARBD for a while. I 312 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:12,119 Speaker 3: wouldn't publish something that wasn't accurate, and what I found 313 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:14,600 Speaker 3: was that it really didn't allow me to be my 314 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 3: best self in any way, but certainly not physically. Actually 315 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:20,360 Speaker 3: went on a cycling trip when I was in sort 316 00:17:20,400 --> 00:17:23,680 Speaker 3: of really low carb diet. I kept cramping up because 317 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:27,359 Speaker 3: you can't really retain enough water to avoid cramping if 318 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:30,040 Speaker 3: you're ultra low carb. I defy you to find a 319 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:33,719 Speaker 3: runner a marathon or who's truly low carb, it's virtually 320 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,879 Speaker 3: impossible to do. In the late nineteen nineties, we were 321 00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 3: in Jamaica together and we worked out, and I remember 322 00:17:40,960 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 3: at that workout saying, oh, this guy's pretty serious about 323 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:46,280 Speaker 3: his workout, but you looked nothing like you do today 324 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,720 Speaker 3: in terms of what you've done. So what was it 325 00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 3: that sort of brought this about? What sort of coalesced 326 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:54,840 Speaker 3: around the idea of I'm going to be in shape 327 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 3: and I'm going to wake This very important in my life. 328 00:17:57,760 --> 00:18:00,879 Speaker 2: If someone's avidly going to the gym and I acknowledge 329 00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:03,960 Speaker 2: some element of vanity, then they're just not being candid. 330 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 2: So there is an element of wanting to look my best. 331 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,600 Speaker 2: My view actually is it looking your best is a 332 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 2: sign of respect for yourself, and part of that is 333 00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:17,480 Speaker 2: being in reasonably good shape. In my case, working out 334 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:20,359 Speaker 2: speaks to me in so many ways. First, because I 335 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:24,199 Speaker 2: actually enjoy the process itself, and secondly because I like 336 00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:27,159 Speaker 2: the result, and then third and now these days, probably 337 00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:29,840 Speaker 2: most importantly, I work out with a huge fitness community 338 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 2: and these people who become my tribe. 339 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:35,840 Speaker 3: And so do you work out every day or do 340 00:18:35,920 --> 00:18:36,960 Speaker 3: you take some days off? 341 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:40,240 Speaker 2: Well, here's what one should do. If you work out avidly, 342 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 2: you probably ought to take one or two rest days 343 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:45,040 Speaker 2: a week. And rest day does not mean like workout, 344 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 2: just less. Seriously, rest day means actually rest. In my case, 345 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:51,560 Speaker 2: I take a rest day somewhere between you know, zero 346 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:54,239 Speaker 2: and one day a week, but certainly within a two 347 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 2: week span, I will take at least one rest day. 348 00:18:56,320 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 2: And I do have days where the workouts are pretty light, 349 00:18:59,600 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 2: but I sometimes work out twice a day, So in 350 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 2: any given week, I typically work out between eight and 351 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:06,280 Speaker 2: ten times. 352 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:10,000 Speaker 3: What kind of parallel do you see between your success 353 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:13,199 Speaker 3: and business and exercise? How are the two related? 354 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:17,080 Speaker 2: I think they're related in that I'm willing to defer 355 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:21,600 Speaker 2: gratification and I can find pleasure in doing hard things. 356 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:24,240 Speaker 3: Tell us one more piece. Tell us about your daily 357 00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:27,600 Speaker 3: practice of silent prayer and what that does for you 358 00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 3: and those around you. 359 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,680 Speaker 2: You know, I've engaged in a prayer practice for fourteen years, 360 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,199 Speaker 2: and to be clear, it's not a particularly religious practice. 361 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:37,680 Speaker 2: Although it is prayer, it's non denominational, and my prayer 362 00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 2: practice takes three or four minutes. It doesn't depend on 363 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:43,720 Speaker 2: a belief that there's anyone on the other end listening 364 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 2: to it, although there are days when I feel that 365 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:47,360 Speaker 2: that might be the case, or also plenty of days 366 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:52,160 Speaker 2: when I don't. The first part is to express gratitude 367 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 2: for all of the blessings of my life, both people 368 00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:02,119 Speaker 2: and things. The second is to ask for blessings for 369 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,359 Speaker 2: people I care about and, with a little more difficulty, 370 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:08,680 Speaker 2: people I resent. Luckily, that's a very short list. Usually 371 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:10,359 Speaker 2: there's no one on that list, but if there is 372 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:12,439 Speaker 2: someone on the list, I do pray for that person 373 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 2: for good things to happen in that person. And then, finally, 374 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,160 Speaker 2: the third part is to set an intention for the day, 375 00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:22,360 Speaker 2: which involves not trying to barrel through life, but rather 376 00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:25,040 Speaker 2: trying to go through life with a bit of grace 377 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:28,920 Speaker 2: and trying to listen and find beauty in the day. 378 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 2: That's where my practice looks like many people. I think 379 00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:34,159 Speaker 2: they'll relate to the notion that when I wake up 380 00:20:34,160 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 2: first thing in the morning, my head can be full 381 00:20:36,040 --> 00:20:41,359 Speaker 2: of random thoughts or anxiety provoking thoughts, and I find 382 00:20:41,359 --> 00:20:44,600 Speaker 2: that the prayer practice will come and center me and 383 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 2: set me up for a better day. 384 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:49,880 Speaker 3: So you talked about your community when you work out, 385 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 3: Let's talk about friends. How many do you need and 386 00:20:54,119 --> 00:20:57,119 Speaker 3: how important is that to life? This is such a 387 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:01,400 Speaker 3: personal decision. In my case, it all depends on how 388 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 3: you define a friend. In terms of truly intimate friends, 389 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:08,240 Speaker 3: I actually have a lot, but that numbers I don't 390 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:11,960 Speaker 3: know ten people, twenty people. In terms of people that 391 00:21:12,000 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 3: I would say I really care about and know about. 392 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 2: And connect with. In my case, that's a couple hundred people. 393 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 2: Bob as examples our friendship, like, we don't see each 394 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 2: other all that often. We probably get together a few 395 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:27,879 Speaker 2: times a year, But every time we get together we 396 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 2: talk about real stuff, not superficial stuff. We actually know 397 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 2: one another's story, we have a long history. We connect, 398 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:41,119 Speaker 2: and we leave one another's presence feeling energized and happy 399 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,200 Speaker 2: that we saw one another. We just to say, even 400 00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 2: though we don't see each other all that frequently, I 401 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,439 Speaker 2: consider it a relatively intimate friendship, and I'm blessed that 402 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 2: I have a relationship like that with many people. 403 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:55,439 Speaker 3: Yes, I just saw I was scrolling on Instagram and 404 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 3: saw somebody say, why is it that the people we 405 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 3: are really intimate with really get us and we really 406 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 3: care about live a bazillion miles away. You said, we 407 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:06,639 Speaker 3: see each other a couple of times a year. But 408 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 3: to me, the mark of the friend is that when 409 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:12,000 Speaker 3: I see you, it's like we just saw each other yesterday, 410 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 3: that we just pack up and keep going. 411 00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,760 Speaker 2: And then we talk about actually real stuff. I have 412 00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,320 Speaker 2: a friend I don't see that often, and when we 413 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:22,080 Speaker 2: sit down, he'll say, Okay, tell me the bad stuff. 414 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 2: I know there's a bunch of good stuff, tell me 415 00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 2: the bad stuff, or which is his way of saying, 416 00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:28,400 Speaker 2: I want to connect with you on what really matters. 417 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's great. So you've talked about waking up in 418 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:36,360 Speaker 3: the morning, all those ideas anxiety in your head. Tell 419 00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,960 Speaker 3: me about sleep? Is it important? How much do we need? 420 00:22:39,160 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 2: Sleep is really important? And unless you're an actual short sleeper, 421 00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:47,600 Speaker 2: and those people do exist, you probably need seven plus 422 00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 2: hours a night to be refreshed and to be at 423 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 2: your best. Candidly, I probably get somewhere between six and 424 00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 2: seven and a half hours. No matter how much I try, 425 00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:01,399 Speaker 2: I can't generally fine time for more and still do 426 00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 2: everything else I care about. But if I get much less, 427 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,440 Speaker 2: I really have a rotten day. Short sleepers are people 428 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 2: who really can be active and refreshed and healthy on 429 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 2: three and a half four hours of sleep. I'm pretty 430 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 2: sure carl Icon is a short sleeper. For example. Being 431 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:21,040 Speaker 2: a short sleeper is very different than someone who just 432 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:23,680 Speaker 2: is sleep deprived all the time. And that's not a 433 00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 2: good thing, and it takes a terrible toll on your 434 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 2: physical and mental health. 435 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,120 Speaker 3: You said you get that much sleep. How much time 436 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:31,399 Speaker 3: in bed are you to get that amount of sleep? 437 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 2: My wife can confirm my head hits the pillow and 438 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,199 Speaker 2: about fifteen seconds later I'm asleep. 439 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 3: God, I'm jealous. I could just do a one hour 440 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:41,800 Speaker 3: tossing and turning in the night. I consider that a 441 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 3: big win. Let's jump to philanthropy. You are very generous, 442 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:49,800 Speaker 3: you and your wife. How do you think about philanthropy 443 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,840 Speaker 3: in your life and business and personal and how do 444 00:23:52,880 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 3: you decide where are you're going with it? Who gets 445 00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:58,160 Speaker 3: to be the BENEFICIARYA what's kind of you to ask 446 00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:03,280 Speaker 3: very broadly I try and really emphasize try to be 447 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:06,440 Speaker 3: of service in my life. We have a family foundation 448 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 3: and our sons are on the board, and we have 449 00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 3: three or four areas of interest, and we try to 450 00:24:12,840 --> 00:24:16,159 Speaker 3: focus most of our giving on those areas of interest. 451 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 3: I have a friend who's very wealthy and a philanthropist, 452 00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:22,600 Speaker 3: and her view is, look, you know, I like to 453 00:24:22,640 --> 00:24:24,919 Speaker 3: be supportive of my friend's interests. 454 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 2: So we give about twenty five percent of money we 455 00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:30,600 Speaker 2: give away every year to our friend's interests, and we 456 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 2: kind of never say no. And seventy five percent, though, 457 00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:35,879 Speaker 2: we try to direct to the areas of interest of 458 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 2: our interests so that we can make a real impact. 459 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:40,680 Speaker 2: But the bulk of what we give away we try 460 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,399 Speaker 2: to focus on areas of interest, which is our local 461 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:45,960 Speaker 2: community in Bedford, which is where we spend a lot 462 00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:50,479 Speaker 2: of time, and special needs education and support because our 463 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,919 Speaker 2: daughter has special needs, and then a couple other areas 464 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:54,440 Speaker 2: of interest. 465 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,639 Speaker 3: More of math and magic right after this quick break, 466 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:08,920 Speaker 3: Welcome back to math and magic. Let's hear more from 467 00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:14,119 Speaker 3: my conversation with Strausselnik. Well, let's go back in time 468 00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 3: to put you in context. Tell us about where you 469 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:21,560 Speaker 3: grew up and paint a picture of that time and 470 00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:25,200 Speaker 3: pick out those few childhood events that you think looking back, 471 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 3: shaped you the most. 472 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:30,920 Speaker 2: So I grew up in a striving, middle class family 473 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,960 Speaker 2: in Boston. My father was a lawyer, my mom worked 474 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:39,399 Speaker 2: part time. They were both highly educated and very ambitious, 475 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:44,159 Speaker 2: and three siblings. Tragedy struck first. My parents got divorced 476 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:47,000 Speaker 2: when I was quite young, six, and then my mother 477 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:50,320 Speaker 2: suddenly passed away when I was ten, and my father 478 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:54,639 Speaker 2: basically abandoned the family at that point, despite being a 479 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:58,920 Speaker 2: very fancy lawyer Locally. We went to live with my uncle, 480 00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 2: who became my second set of parents in New Jersey 481 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,920 Speaker 2: when I was ten. I had pretty tragic childhood. I mean, 482 00:26:06,119 --> 00:26:08,919 Speaker 2: there are plenty of other attributes of my childhood, but 483 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,119 Speaker 2: those are the things that really stand out. And I 484 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 2: think that childhood tragedy can have one of two effects. 485 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:18,880 Speaker 2: The first is it can make you feel like you're 486 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:21,720 Speaker 2: a victim and that the world is out to get you, 487 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:23,879 Speaker 2: and that does not lead to good things later in life. 488 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:28,040 Speaker 2: The other effect is that it can light a fire 489 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,240 Speaker 2: under you and motivate you. And I had the latter 490 00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:34,359 Speaker 2: happened to me. Not all my siblings did, but I did, 491 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:36,919 Speaker 2: and I was just of the view that if I 492 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,400 Speaker 2: work hard enough, then nothing bad will ever happen to me. Again, 493 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:44,680 Speaker 2: of course, that's a fallacy, wasn't true. Plenty of challenging 494 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 2: things have come my way, but I think I'm more 495 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,920 Speaker 2: than a bit of a perfectionist. I've managed to moderate 496 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 2: that over the years. And a lot of that came 497 00:26:53,640 --> 00:26:57,360 Speaker 2: from my tragic childhood. I wouldn't wish it on anyone, 498 00:26:57,520 --> 00:27:01,320 Speaker 2: but it was highly motivating. There were other elements too. 499 00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,199 Speaker 2: I mean, despite this, my family really believed in me 500 00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:08,159 Speaker 2: and encouraged me. I said I wanted to run a 501 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,919 Speaker 2: movie studio, and no one laughed. And even though like 502 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 2: my family had no connection to the business whatsoever, but 503 00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 2: my family's willing to support me and my ambitions. 504 00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:21,560 Speaker 3: You know, Strauss, I appreciate you sharing that. That is 505 00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 3: very personal and it is a chilling trauma. That's exactly right, 506 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:27,840 Speaker 3: and by the way, we see it in other people 507 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,760 Speaker 3: as well, that you know, get two directions when you 508 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,159 Speaker 3: get hit with that, something good came out of it. 509 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 3: But when did Strauss the entrepreneur emerge? Was that a 510 00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 3: childhood thing or was that later in life? I don't 511 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,199 Speaker 3: think I was a born entrepreneur. You know, I was 512 00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,119 Speaker 3: a good employee. I liked being a professional manager. I 513 00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:50,160 Speaker 3: think I was good at it. I understood like chain 514 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 3: of command. I had respect for my bosses. So I 515 00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 3: was not someone who was like, oh, this is horrible, 516 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:56,480 Speaker 3: I have to get out of here and do my 517 00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:58,480 Speaker 3: own thing. On the one hand, on the other hand, 518 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:02,239 Speaker 3: I did want to build something. The truth is, you know, 519 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:06,040 Speaker 3: by the time I started ZMC, I was not young. 520 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,320 Speaker 3: I was forty three, and I had a really good career. 521 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,120 Speaker 2: I was paid well running a big record business, and 522 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,160 Speaker 2: you know, there were other jobs that would come my way, 523 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:18,400 Speaker 2: and I decided to take you know, one hundred ccent 524 00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 2: pay cut and start a business that was aiming to 525 00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:25,600 Speaker 2: build a multi billion dollar diversified technology driven media business 526 00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:29,120 Speaker 2: from scratch. But what drove me was not like, oh, 527 00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:30,520 Speaker 2: I need to make a whole lot of dop because 528 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:32,800 Speaker 2: that was never motivating for me, and I did well 529 00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:36,439 Speaker 2: working for other people. But here's the truth. Like I 530 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:38,040 Speaker 2: looked at my career and even though I'd done a 531 00:28:38,040 --> 00:28:40,800 Speaker 2: bunch of turnarounds, I thought to myself, listen, how hard 532 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,000 Speaker 2: can it be when someone hands you a business card 533 00:28:43,000 --> 00:28:45,680 Speaker 2: that says president of twentieth century far it's like and 534 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,360 Speaker 2: a balance sheet by the way, and like a safety net, 535 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,240 Speaker 2: and you got Ruper Murdock sitting in the corner of 536 00:28:50,360 --> 00:28:52,120 Speaker 2: It's like, how hard can that be? If you can't 537 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:55,040 Speaker 2: do well in that circumstance, you got to be pretty lame. 538 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 2: But I don't know doing something totally from scratch, Like 539 00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 2: totally from scratch, that's challenging, and that'll be a real test. 540 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:07,400 Speaker 2: And you know, I set out to build a twenty 541 00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 2: billion dollar business from scratch that was, you know, a 542 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,280 Speaker 2: leader in the intersection of technology and entertainment. And today 543 00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 2: we have tweens emc Intake two and they, you know, 544 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,680 Speaker 2: about a fifty five billion dollar enterprise that is a 545 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:24,000 Speaker 2: leader in the intersection of technology and entertainment. This was 546 00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 2: not a singular exercise, to say the least. It was 547 00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,560 Speaker 2: a team exercise. And I have something like twenty thousand 548 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,160 Speaker 2: colleagues across the system who did all the hard work 549 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,880 Speaker 2: and the heavy lifting. But it is also true that 550 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:36,719 Speaker 2: it would not exist if I had not done it, 551 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:40,000 Speaker 2: and that was important to me. And I remember having 552 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:42,480 Speaker 2: the presence of mind because I've always been able to 553 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:46,040 Speaker 2: think far into the future when I was forty, and 554 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 2: I thought to myself, I know, this is incredibly risky 555 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:51,640 Speaker 2: and the odds of failure are incredibly high. But I 556 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 2: don't want to be at the end of my life 557 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 2: and look back and say could it, would have? Should have? 558 00:29:56,920 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 2: I got to give it a try. So maybe in 559 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 2: that way there was an element of, you know, entrepreneurial fire. 560 00:30:04,520 --> 00:30:07,360 Speaker 2: But I don't think it is typical entrepreneurial fire because 561 00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:09,440 Speaker 2: I didn't object to working for other people. 562 00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 3: Even on those jobs. When you were working for others, 563 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,040 Speaker 3: I think of you as an entrepreneurial personality that within 564 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:19,479 Speaker 3: those companies you didn't think like the cog and the wheel, 565 00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,000 Speaker 3: that you really did see things differently. And I must 566 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:23,520 Speaker 3: say I'm gonna tell one story on you. I hope 567 00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:25,880 Speaker 3: you don't mind. Is I was so impressed when you 568 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 3: were running BMG that you were learning German because it 569 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 3: was a German company, and I go, wow, that is 570 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 3: some commitment. And you actually got pretty good at it, 571 00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 3: didn't you. 572 00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. I surprised people too, because I didn't tell anyone 573 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:41,920 Speaker 2: because you tard language. No, I didn't tell anyone in 574 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 2: the company. I was there for about two years before 575 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:45,960 Speaker 2: I could speak it. And then one day I had 576 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:48,120 Speaker 2: had offices all over the world and I was going 577 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,880 Speaker 2: to my office in Munich. The plane was late. I 578 00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:55,520 Speaker 2: was in baggage claim. I called my office in Munich 579 00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,680 Speaker 2: and in German, I said, this is Strauss and I'm 580 00:30:58,760 --> 00:31:01,120 Speaker 2: running late. I apologize if you don't mind, could you 581 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:05,080 Speaker 2: move My first meeting, my assistant was like in German, 582 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,520 Speaker 2: was like who is this. That was like, it's yess 583 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,719 Speaker 2: and she was like, you don't speak German. I was like, well, 584 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,440 Speaker 2: actually I do speak German. I spoke proficiently, not fluently. 585 00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:16,400 Speaker 2: There is a difference, but I did speak well enough 586 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,240 Speaker 2: to attend board meetings and actually conduct business in German. 587 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:21,200 Speaker 2: And I thought it was a sign of respect to 588 00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:23,479 Speaker 2: the organization. But more to the point, you know, I'm 589 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,400 Speaker 2: a good student. I like studying things, and I thought, 590 00:31:25,440 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 2: what a great opportunity I'll learn to speak German. Wall 591 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:28,680 Speaker 2: in here. 592 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 3: That was one more impressive things you've done in my mind. 593 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 3: I know you've done a lot of great business things, 594 00:31:33,000 --> 00:31:35,080 Speaker 3: but I was really impressed with that. Let's get out 595 00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 3: the crystal ball for a minute, Ai, I know you 596 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 3: have some interesting views. How should we think about it 597 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:43,400 Speaker 3: and its impact. 598 00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:48,160 Speaker 2: The technology that people are calling AI is it is 599 00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:51,560 Speaker 2: a massive step forward in digital technology, but at the 600 00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 2: end of the day, it's still an array of digital 601 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:58,400 Speaker 2: tools that minimally create productivity, which is what digital tools 602 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 2: have always done. And I think the productivity opportunities are 603 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:07,440 Speaker 2: really quite significant. But let's not confuse digital tools with 604 00:32:08,440 --> 00:32:13,000 Speaker 2: the singularity, which in my opinion is utter nonsense. That's 605 00:32:13,040 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: the merging of human brain power with digital brain power. 606 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 2: To the extent you can distinguish a human being from 607 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 2: a machine, the machine will be superior. And that is 608 00:32:23,640 --> 00:32:25,720 Speaker 2: not going to occur because the end of the day, 609 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 2: machines are machines that work on data, and data sets 610 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:34,160 Speaker 2: are backward looking, and backward looking data is only going 611 00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:36,479 Speaker 2: to get you so far. Now, there's no doubt that 612 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,040 Speaker 2: backward looking data that is used in a robust way 613 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 2: can answer a lot of questions. So when you see 614 00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,080 Speaker 2: people sort as they have in the last few year, saying, oh, 615 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 2: it's incredible, like AI programs can ace the l SAT, 616 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:54,280 Speaker 2: it's like, well, I'm sorry, machines have been beating human 617 00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,000 Speaker 2: beings at chess for fifteen years, Like why are you surprised? 618 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 2: The l SATs are completely based on data. Of course, 619 00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:05,400 Speaker 2: machines that are data driven and good computational engines are 620 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,920 Speaker 2: going to beat the human mind in anything that's based 621 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:10,880 Speaker 2: on data. But there are a bunch of things that 622 00:33:11,000 --> 00:33:16,000 Speaker 2: machines are highly unlikely ever to do, because data driving 623 00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:21,640 Speaker 2: a predictive model isn't going to answer human questions. Creativity 624 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 2: applied to the entertainment business, which is a little world 625 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:30,160 Speaker 2: in which I live, relies upon the unexpected for its 626 00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 2: biggest hits. The biggest hits are, by their nature unexpected. 627 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 2: So sure, storytelling is informed by Shakespeare data. But great, 628 00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:44,960 Speaker 2: great stories well told reflect human genius that data sets 629 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:50,680 Speaker 2: simply can't replicate. So in my world of interactive entertainment development, 630 00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:55,280 Speaker 2: will coding be much more efficient because of general of AI? 631 00:33:55,760 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 2: Unquestionably it's already happening. But will coving replace human genius? 632 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:07,960 Speaker 2: Or more pointedly, will someone with you know, chat GPT 633 00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:11,399 Speaker 2: seventy three be able to push a button and make 634 00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:15,120 Speaker 2: a competitor to GTA six. No, And I can say 635 00:34:15,120 --> 00:34:20,439 Speaker 2: that unequivocally equally. Are all things AI going to reduce employment? Well, 636 00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:23,600 Speaker 2: I don't know the history of technology, which is one 637 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:27,160 Speaker 2: thousand years old, and of the technology we understand to 638 00:34:27,239 --> 00:34:31,000 Speaker 2: be technology one hundred years old has been that technology 639 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:37,080 Speaker 2: creates productivity. Productivity drives GDP. GDP growth drives employment. And 640 00:34:37,400 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 2: take a look at how many people were employed to 641 00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:41,879 Speaker 2: take to interactive eighteen years ago when I took over 642 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,400 Speaker 2: about one thousand people. Today we employ thirteen and a 643 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:47,640 Speaker 2: half thousand people. Take a look at the tech we 644 00:34:47,760 --> 00:34:50,560 Speaker 2: used then and the tech we use now. There's no comparison, 645 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:56,360 Speaker 2: Absolutely no comparison. So I'm an optimist about what AI 646 00:34:56,520 --> 00:34:59,920 Speaker 2: can do, and I'm not at all worried about machine 647 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:05,200 Speaker 2: taking over, becoming evil or condemning us to a life 648 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:06,320 Speaker 2: of naval gazing. 649 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:09,359 Speaker 3: It's interesting. We just came out with a study which 650 00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:11,319 Speaker 3: we do every year, we do a massive study of 651 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:14,240 Speaker 3: the consumer. This year we did it on the human consumer, 652 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:18,600 Speaker 3: really about how the consumer's thinking about humanity, being human 653 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,280 Speaker 3: and technology. And it's interesting. Seventy percent of the people 654 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:25,520 Speaker 3: use AI, but ninety percent what they're media created by 655 00:35:25,520 --> 00:35:28,360 Speaker 3: real humans. And it was very clear that the consumer 656 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:31,200 Speaker 3: is saying, I like it as a tool, I don't 657 00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,600 Speaker 3: ever want it masquerading as something it's not. As a 658 00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:37,479 Speaker 3: matter of fact. It's interesting. So from about seventy six 659 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:41,400 Speaker 3: percent to ninety three percent. The idea that the most 660 00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,719 Speaker 3: important thing in my life are human connections. That more 661 00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:48,280 Speaker 3: important than ever. That growth came from twenty sixteen till today. 662 00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:51,319 Speaker 3: So interesting world we're living in. If you could go 663 00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:54,279 Speaker 3: back in time, what advice would you have for your 664 00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:55,400 Speaker 3: twenty one year old self. 665 00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:57,799 Speaker 2: Don't worry so much, It'll be okay in the end. 666 00:35:58,120 --> 00:36:01,680 Speaker 3: Good piece of advice. So we end each episode of 667 00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:04,840 Speaker 3: Matth and Magic with a shout out to the analytical 668 00:36:04,920 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 3: side of business. They just see business as numbers and 669 00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:11,000 Speaker 3: it comes together. And then you have the other side 670 00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,600 Speaker 3: that are people who just have these incredible creative ideas. 671 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:16,000 Speaker 3: By the way, not everybody has the combo you do 672 00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:19,360 Speaker 3: of both. Who would you give the shout out to 673 00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,720 Speaker 3: on both the sort of analytical side, the number side, 674 00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:25,600 Speaker 3: and on the creative side. 675 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:27,320 Speaker 2: From the point of view of the entertainment business. Dick Parsons, 676 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:30,160 Speaker 2: who we both knew well. I think he had an 677 00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 2: extraordinary touch for business and people and data. But there's 678 00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:39,359 Speaker 2: so many other candidates. Really Jeff Ducas or really kind 679 00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:42,239 Speaker 2: of the master in this Steve Ross, and in many 680 00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,960 Speaker 2: ways I tried to model my career after his without 681 00:36:44,960 --> 00:36:48,480 Speaker 2: some of the more colorful elements on the creative side. 682 00:36:48,760 --> 00:36:53,120 Speaker 2: Jeffrey Katzenberg. He really has embodied sort of that intersection 683 00:36:53,239 --> 00:36:56,880 Speaker 2: of understanding the media in which he operates and understanding 684 00:36:56,920 --> 00:37:00,839 Speaker 2: storytelling and engaging with creative people bringing out the best 685 00:37:00,880 --> 00:37:02,640 Speaker 2: of them, and being creative himself. 686 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:06,360 Speaker 3: Of course, Strauss, you've been an amazing friend for I 687 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,240 Speaker 3: guess is more than thirty years. Your story is really 688 00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:12,440 Speaker 3: like no other, and your success is really a testament 689 00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:15,280 Speaker 3: to the leader you are. Thanks for sharing your lessons 690 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:15,880 Speaker 3: with us today. 691 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me. 692 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:22,160 Speaker 3: Here are a few things I picked up from my 693 00:37:22,239 --> 00:37:26,960 Speaker 3: conversation with Strauss. One, Creative risk and financial risk are 694 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:29,719 Speaker 3: two different things, and they don't have to mirror each other. 695 00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:34,399 Speaker 3: Strauss embraces creative risk, but demands financial security. In fact, 696 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:36,840 Speaker 3: he believes a strong balance sheet is what allows bold 697 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:40,920 Speaker 3: creative choices. Only when creatives have the space to make mistakes, 698 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:42,480 Speaker 3: whill you see real innovation. 699 00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:43,399 Speaker 2: Two. 700 00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:47,160 Speaker 3: Recognize talent when you see it. Strauss has thrived in 701 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:50,880 Speaker 3: the entertainment business, but he's never the one directing, writing, 702 00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:54,200 Speaker 3: or even giving notes. What he does exceptionally well is 703 00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:58,120 Speaker 3: distinguish the people who are most talented, continue to develop 704 00:37:58,160 --> 00:38:01,600 Speaker 3: their skills, and encourage their work. His retention rate says 705 00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:05,759 Speaker 3: it all. Three. Proving yourself can be a personal challenge. 706 00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:10,400 Speaker 3: Sometimes people strive for greatness for status or recognition. Strauss 707 00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:13,320 Speaker 3: was successful from her young age and countless people admired 708 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:16,160 Speaker 3: his work, but he needed to prove his abilities to 709 00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:20,240 Speaker 3: himself before jumping into an entrepreneurial journey later in life. 710 00:38:20,600 --> 00:38:24,440 Speaker 3: I see it in his commitment to help and wellness too. Ultimately, 711 00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:28,600 Speaker 3: it comes from the place of respecting himself. Four Yet 712 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:31,879 Speaker 3: more sleep. Lastly, I think we would all do well 713 00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:34,840 Speaker 3: to live by Strauss's example and work to prioritize in 714 00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:38,040 Speaker 3: that department. I'm Bob Pittman. Thanks for listening. 715 00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:42,840 Speaker 1: That's it for today's episode. Thanks so much for listening 716 00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:45,800 Speaker 1: to Math and Magic, a production of iHeart Podcasts. The 717 00:38:45,880 --> 00:38:48,479 Speaker 1: show is created and hosted by Bob Pittman. The Math 718 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,120 Speaker 1: and Magic team is Ali Perry, Jessica Crinchitch, and Dylan Hoyer. 719 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:55,759 Speaker 1: Special thanks to Sidney Rosenbloom for booking and wrangling our 720 00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:59,000 Speaker 1: wonderful talent, which is no small feat. Until next time,