1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:16,920 Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A family camping slaughtered, murdered 2 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: in their sleep. Why I mean, see Grace, this is 3 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:24,920 Speaker 1: crime Stories. Thank you for being with us here at 4 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 1: Fox Nation and serious XM one eleven. First of all, 5 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,199 Speaker 1: take a listen to this. He did run just to 6 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:34,360 Speaker 1: the first set of adults, and she is the one 7 00:00:34,360 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: they called nine one. DCI isn't releasing some details out 8 00:00:37,800 --> 00:00:40,480 Speaker 1: of respect for the family. But one thing they say 9 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:45,480 Speaker 1: we might never know is why you try to wrap 10 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:50,040 Speaker 1: our rational minds of around a very irrational behavior. And 11 00:00:50,240 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 1: more from Bo Bowman in at kse CCI. The Iowa 12 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: Division of Criminal Investigation says Tyler, Sarah and Lulish Mint. 13 00:00:57,600 --> 00:01:00,840 Speaker 1: We're all shot at the Mucocata Caves on July twenty second. 14 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,759 Speaker 1: The autopsies found the mother and the father were also stabbed, 15 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:07,600 Speaker 1: and their six year old daughter was strangled. Get a 16 00:01:07,640 --> 00:01:10,679 Speaker 1: woman on the phone till the kid came up. Third campers, 17 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: his parents were shot. That scanner audio was the first 18 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 1: call for assistance at the campgrounds. We knew that child 19 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:23,240 Speaker 1: was nine year old Arlow Schmidt. The little boy wandering 20 00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:26,639 Speaker 1: from tent to tent, trying to tell someone that mommy 21 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: and Daddy have been shot. Can you even imagine that? 22 00:01:31,040 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: And now we know the six year old little sister 23 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:39,520 Speaker 1: was strangled. Who would do this to a family quietly 24 00:01:39,680 --> 00:01:44,839 Speaker 1: sleeping in their tent on a camp out, especially because 25 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: of Scouts now but forever, we have taken our twins 26 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:54,280 Speaker 1: camping r ving all across the country, especially during COVID 27 00:01:55,160 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 1: to think that someone would use a campground as a 28 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,960 Speaker 1: hunting ground. Again, I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. 29 00:02:03,200 --> 00:02:06,760 Speaker 1: Thanks for being with us. We have an incredible panel 30 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:09,320 Speaker 1: to make sense of what we know right now. But 31 00:02:09,440 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 1: first I want to go to a special guest joining us. 32 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 1: It's Adam Moorehouse. This is one of the mom, Sarah Schmidt, 33 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: who was murdered in her own tent on a family 34 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:27,800 Speaker 1: camp out. This is her brother, Adam. Thank you for 35 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:30,400 Speaker 1: being with us, Hi, good morning, Thank you. You know, Adam, 36 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:33,920 Speaker 1: I hated to even introduce you that way because I 37 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,720 Speaker 1: know it must be so hard to put your mind 38 00:02:36,760 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 1: around what you and your family are living through. But 39 00:02:39,520 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 1: first of all, how is little Arlow? The nine year 40 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:45,160 Speaker 1: old son Arlo was doing well. He's got a great 41 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:47,880 Speaker 1: support network of family and friends surrounding him on a 42 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:54,079 Speaker 1: daily basis, and the outpouring of support from everybody all 43 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 1: around the world has been absolutely incredible through all of this. 44 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:01,080 Speaker 1: Is Arlow living with relatives with family, that's correct, He's 45 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 1: currently still living in the in that area and he 46 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,400 Speaker 1: is with immediate family at this time. Can I ask you, Adam, 47 00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 1: will he'd be able to go back to his regular 48 00:03:09,639 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 1: school that he was already less see nine years old? 49 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 1: Is that third or fourth grade? Yes, ma'am, I believe 50 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: he's going into fourth grade. I could be wrong on that, 51 00:03:17,440 --> 00:03:20,640 Speaker 1: but you know a lot of people ask and have 52 00:03:20,720 --> 00:03:22,880 Speaker 1: been asking, you know, Whens, what do we think is 53 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: a normal to get back to? And as we can 54 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 1: all imagine, there's no such thing as going back to 55 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:32,160 Speaker 1: normal for Harlowe in any sort of sense. No, there's 56 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:35,400 Speaker 1: really not. I know you're saying, Adam that he's got 57 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 1: support and relatives, which a lot of children don't have 58 00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: after a tragedy like this, But there's just no replacing 59 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:47,440 Speaker 1: mom and dad and little sister. Because Adam, my children, John, 60 00:03:47,520 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: David and lose your twins and they do everything together, 61 00:03:52,040 --> 00:03:58,280 Speaker 1: everything to go forward with out his little sister and 62 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:03,880 Speaker 1: mom and dad. That's that's just a horrible horrible burden 63 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 1: for Arl. I'm just so grateful that you and your family, 64 00:04:09,400 --> 00:04:11,400 Speaker 1: you're all there to try to help him through this. 65 00:04:11,480 --> 00:04:14,600 Speaker 1: And I wonder how he's ever going to get past 66 00:04:14,960 --> 00:04:18,479 Speaker 1: his memories of that night, because he's the one that 67 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:22,359 Speaker 1: sounded the alarm. Adam, when did you first realize something 68 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 1: horrible had happened? So? I was notified by phone from 69 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:31,680 Speaker 1: one of my other sisters. She lives in South Dakota, 70 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:35,600 Speaker 1: and after the tragedy happened, they immediately started the first 71 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,960 Speaker 1: responders started trying to find next to the kin, and 72 00:04:39,279 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 1: they notified a local police department in South Dakota, where 73 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:44,599 Speaker 1: my other sister is living, who did a home visit 74 00:04:44,640 --> 00:04:48,719 Speaker 1: for her, and so she called me and I was 75 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,680 Speaker 1: notified about six and a half, seven hours after the 76 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,800 Speaker 1: incident over the phone. What went through your mind? Do 77 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:58,160 Speaker 1: you remember that moment? I do. It's definitely something I'll 78 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: never forget. It's it's a thing that several people have 79 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:04,840 Speaker 1: gone through before, and I have actually helped and talk 80 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 1: to others as well through events like that, and then 81 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 1: to have it happened to me was I went through 82 00:05:10,440 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 1: the different stages of shock pretty much immediately from grief 83 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:18,120 Speaker 1: to sadness, to absolute rage, back to sadness and disbelief 84 00:05:18,120 --> 00:05:22,000 Speaker 1: and everything in between. Guys, Adam moorehouses with me, the 85 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,800 Speaker 1: mom who was martyred in her tent along with her 86 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:32,359 Speaker 1: husband Tyler, their six year old daughter, Layla. Her brother 87 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:35,960 Speaker 1: is with us. Adam, where were you when you got 88 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:39,240 Speaker 1: that call? So I live in the Detroit area, and 89 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 1: actually my children were at church camp that whole week 90 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:46,160 Speaker 1: and I was picking them up from church camp when 91 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:50,640 Speaker 1: I got notified over the phone, which was a blessing 92 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 1: in disguise to be surrounded by a whole family of 93 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 1: faith that we have along with our pastors that were 94 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 1: right there, to be able to to sit there and 95 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:03,680 Speaker 1: just be with each other for about an hour. Adam, 96 00:06:04,560 --> 00:06:08,640 Speaker 1: were you told immediately how they were killed? When did 97 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 1: you find out they had actually been murdered and their 98 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 1: camping tent at night while they're asleep. So I didn't 99 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:17,599 Speaker 1: find out. I found out saying that they were that 100 00:06:17,640 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: they were shot and killed. That is the only information 101 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: that I was given. And then after the investigation was 102 00:06:25,279 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: getting closer to completion towards the end of the following week, 103 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 1: was how I found out that they were what the 104 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 1: caliber handgun was that was used and everything in between. 105 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: But I have purposely stayed away from all media outlets. 106 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 1: I still have never read a report on what actually happened. 107 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:45,480 Speaker 1: I was not told any details, and I'm doing that 108 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: kind of twofold but for my own grief process as 109 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 1: well as trying to be kind of unbiased in all 110 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: of this, because the way I'm dealing with it is 111 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: I know the outcome, and the outcome is four lives 112 00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,400 Speaker 1: are gone and there's nothing we can do to go 113 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 1: back and grieving with all of this, I still don't 114 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,920 Speaker 1: know many details, Adam, can I tell you something? And I, 115 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 1: of all people, you would never suspect this. I have 116 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:15,560 Speaker 1: never gone back. I've never gone to the site where 117 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: my fiancee was murdered. I don't want to. I've never 118 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:24,160 Speaker 1: read the police report. I know what the prosecutor told 119 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:30,880 Speaker 1: me at the trial, but it's so painful that it 120 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 1: can throw me into a depression that it will take 121 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 1: me I don't know how long to get out of. 122 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 1: And now I have the children and I don't want them, 123 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 1: you know, to be around me being sad and depressed, 124 00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:45,960 Speaker 1: So I you know, it's probably not healthy. I'm sure, 125 00:07:46,000 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 1: doctor Georry crawls and is going to pull me aside 126 00:07:47,880 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 1: after today. But I think it's called compartmentalization. I completely 127 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:56,600 Speaker 1: understand what you're saying. I hardly know which way to 128 00:07:56,600 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 1: go next. I don't know if you've ever been in 129 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 1: that spot where I have so many questions in such 130 00:08:02,040 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 1: an incredible panel with me, but I'm going to go 131 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: to the facts with me. High profile reporter out of 132 00:08:08,480 --> 00:08:12,800 Speaker 1: a case RGTV nine that's Ode of Iowa. Brian Tabbot 133 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:15,240 Speaker 1: is with us and you can find him on Facebook 134 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:18,640 Speaker 1: at Brian Tabot k c RG. Brian. I really appreciate 135 00:08:18,680 --> 00:08:21,800 Speaker 1: you being with us today. Where did this happen? Brian? 136 00:08:21,880 --> 00:08:24,920 Speaker 1: Explain that to me? Because you know, I just wrote 137 00:08:24,920 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 1: a book, another book, and this is called Don't Be 138 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:33,120 Speaker 1: a Victim, fighting Back against America's Crime Wave. And because 139 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 1: we my family are big camperers and r Vier's high 140 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 1: cur swimmers. All that I wanted to write about dangers 141 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:46,720 Speaker 1: are being in camping. And I first really keyed into 142 00:08:46,720 --> 00:08:49,240 Speaker 1: it when I heard about a serial killer Israel Keys, 143 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 1: because he would actually stalk campgrounds where you think you're 144 00:08:57,040 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 1: out in nature and you're safe, and typically you are, 145 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 1: there are people that are like wolves, like the hyena 146 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:10,720 Speaker 1: at the watering hole on the Savannah, waiting to attack 147 00:09:10,800 --> 00:09:13,960 Speaker 1: an innocent person. I got to hear about this. Tell 148 00:09:14,000 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: me about this location. So it's in Jackson County. It's 149 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 1: in the eastern part of the state. It's about an 150 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 1: hour east of Cedar Rapids. The caves are popular for 151 00:09:24,280 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 1: it's a state park. It's popular for its bluffs, pine trees, 152 00:09:28,240 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 1: thirteen caves and six miles of trails. Do you mind 153 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:34,679 Speaker 1: saying that again? I want to take that in. How 154 00:09:34,679 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 1: many caves? Thirteen caves, Bryan Tabec. From what I've learned, 155 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:43,440 Speaker 1: there are three hundred and twenty three acres at least, 156 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 1: and the caves are incredibly deep, like one hundred feet 157 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,200 Speaker 1: deep based on what you've told me, Brian. So out 158 00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:55,440 Speaker 1: of all of that land, we have this family who 159 00:09:55,679 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: goes camping and they are the ones singled out, correct, Yes, Now, 160 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 1: where where is the part located? Works? Located again in 161 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:07,719 Speaker 1: Jackson County, Iowa's the eastern part of the state. It's 162 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:11,920 Speaker 1: about an hour east of Cedar Rapids to Adam Moorehouse. 163 00:10:12,040 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: This is the mom Sarah Schmidt's brother, who has stayed 164 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:21,080 Speaker 1: away from media but has kindly joined us today and 165 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:26,760 Speaker 1: I'm really grateful, Adam, thank you. Were was Sarah and 166 00:10:27,080 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 1: her family outdoor people. They were extremely outdoorsy. They love 167 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 1: to get out and hike as a family. Um they 168 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 1: even bought snowshoes as previous Christmas h stay could start 169 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:39,640 Speaker 1: enjoying the winter months and everything together. So as the 170 00:10:39,720 --> 00:10:42,160 Speaker 1: children were growing, they became more and more comfortable staying 171 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: overnight outside in campsite. So they frequented many areas in 172 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: the Wisconsin, Iowa, Minnesota area, leaving out of Sea Falls there. 173 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:55,800 Speaker 1: I bet her Facebook or whatever she had insta was 174 00:10:56,840 --> 00:11:02,360 Speaker 1: full of pictures of her family out camping and hiking, 175 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:08,000 Speaker 1: right They absolutely are. Yep, there's several pictures that are 176 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: out there, including all the social media posts and the 177 00:11:11,040 --> 00:11:14,079 Speaker 1: media outlets that I've provided all the photos from, and 178 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:16,800 Speaker 1: every single one of that one that we have of 179 00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 1: them as a family in the past two years are 180 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:38,080 Speaker 1: all outdoors hiking and camping together. Time stories with Nancy Grace. 181 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 1: I want to go to a special guest joining us, 182 00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:47,160 Speaker 1: Greg Smith. You know him. Will is a special Deputy 183 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 1: Sheriff Johnson County Sheriff's Office in Kansas, and he's the 184 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:55,080 Speaker 1: executive director of the Kelsey Smith Foundation, named after his 185 00:11:55,240 --> 00:12:00,079 Speaker 1: daughter Kelsey that was murdered. Greg, Can I ask you 186 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:04,000 Speaker 1: when we talk about these cases you and I, does 187 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 1: it bring back or stir up losing Kelsey? Oh? Yeah, absolutely. 188 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,920 Speaker 1: In fact, it brings back any case that I've been 189 00:12:14,920 --> 00:12:19,839 Speaker 1: involved in that has something like this. You know, the 190 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:23,920 Speaker 1: kar Kopetski case, which happened right about the same time 191 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: as Kelsey, is one that comes to mind. You know, 192 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: I was listening and I think one of the things 193 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:35,559 Speaker 1: that we talk about and some of our training is 194 00:12:36,160 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: that a homicide is a unique crime in that it 195 00:12:41,040 --> 00:12:44,120 Speaker 1: touches so many people. There are so many victims, there 196 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 1: are so many additional assaults that occur after the homicide 197 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:53,040 Speaker 1: that it causes so much emotional trauma. I mean, you 198 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 1: even represent Nancy when you were talking. It's just one 199 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 1: of those things there's you can't fix it, you can't 200 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:06,280 Speaker 1: make it better. There's no matter what happens, even if 201 00:13:06,320 --> 00:13:10,320 Speaker 1: there's a successful arrest, conviction, you know, the whole nine yards, 202 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:12,600 Speaker 1: it still doesn't bring back your love. And you know, 203 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:16,360 Speaker 1: it's interesting to Katherine Marsh joining me. In addition to 204 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: Greg Smith, Adam Moorehouse and Brian Tabbock. Catherine a special 205 00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:24,120 Speaker 1: victim's liaison at the State Attorney's Office. She is joining 206 00:13:24,160 --> 00:13:28,760 Speaker 1: us out of Maryland. Katherine, when I first learned about 207 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:33,880 Speaker 1: the murders of this family camping sleeping in their tent 208 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:38,960 Speaker 1: at night on this wonderful, idealic trip. When I heard 209 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:41,120 Speaker 1: about it, you know what I was doing, Katherine, I 210 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:44,960 Speaker 1: was right in the middle of folding up my son's 211 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 1: camp hammock. He is a camper that he likes to 212 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:53,400 Speaker 1: pitch a hammock and not a tent, and he camps 213 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:57,160 Speaker 1: in the hammock. We put out a tent, and he 214 00:13:57,240 --> 00:14:00,360 Speaker 1: camps in the hammock, and then at night may or 215 00:14:00,360 --> 00:14:04,200 Speaker 1: may not put a covering that goes over like a 216 00:14:04,360 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: inverted over mat. He stays in there all night. I 217 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 1: was rolling it up, getting ready to go camping, and 218 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:18,120 Speaker 1: I heard about this taste, and I've got to tell 219 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 1: you it just I felt like I got the wind 220 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:23,360 Speaker 1: not to out of me, and it made me wonder, 221 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:27,320 Speaker 1: first of all, what happened with Arlo Schmidt, the nine 222 00:14:27,400 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: year old little boy that was running from tent to 223 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 1: tent trying to get help. But it made me worry 224 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:39,800 Speaker 1: about how safe it really is to take our family camping. Absolutely, 225 00:14:39,880 --> 00:14:42,000 Speaker 1: there are certain things that I think we all grew 226 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:46,760 Speaker 1: up are thinking. Our safe family camping trip is the 227 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,520 Speaker 1: top of the list. You're with your family, You're in 228 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:53,840 Speaker 1: a state park, You're in a safe place. You're protected. 229 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 1: It's like the violation of a crime in your home. 230 00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: It's the place that's to be protected. It's not where 231 00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:03,160 Speaker 1: you ever expect this kind of crime to occur. And 232 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:06,520 Speaker 1: to doctor Jory Crows and joining Us Psychology and faculty 233 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: Saint Leo University, author of Operations, doctor Jorry thics for 234 00:15:11,880 --> 00:15:16,440 Speaker 1: being with us the dichotomy of feeling so safe and 235 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:22,080 Speaker 1: then being exposed to an unspeakable crime wiping out nearly 236 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 1: an entire family on top of them being asleep on 237 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: a vacation trip. The dichotomy of that is is jarring, 238 00:15:32,240 --> 00:15:34,680 Speaker 1: doctor Jory. It's hard to get your mind around. Yeah, 239 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:40,440 Speaker 1: and the reciprocating throughout society. To everybody that reads that, 240 00:15:40,680 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: of course, you're shocked because I think all of us 241 00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 1: have been outdoors. You know, I not camping, just being 242 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 1: out in a safe place, especially state parks. You know 243 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:54,680 Speaker 1: the majority of them have officers on duty at the gate, 244 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,520 Speaker 1: but they also patrol, so you feel this sense of 245 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:01,880 Speaker 1: security there even sleep. I know you're in Florida. They 246 00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:06,360 Speaker 1: do they make rounds just like regular patrol officers, and 247 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:12,760 Speaker 1: to have that violated it really impacts people. To Adam 248 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,840 Speaker 1: Moorehouse kind enough to join us. He has not been 249 00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: doing media rounds and trying to deal with the loss 250 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: of his sister, his brother in law, his little niece, 251 00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:28,600 Speaker 1: Lulage just six years old. And I am so grateful, 252 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:32,080 Speaker 1: Adam Moorehouse, that you were joining us. And while you're here, 253 00:16:32,360 --> 00:16:35,000 Speaker 1: I'd like to tell everyone about to go fund me. 254 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 1: You only have to google Arlo Schmidt go fund me 255 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 1: and you'll see it to help Adam Adam, to help 256 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: Arlo as he grows up with all of the expenses 257 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 1: of school and hopefully college and having a life therapy, 258 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: whatever he's going to need after being in that tent, 259 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 1: discovering his mom and dad and little sister Dad. That's 260 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 1: the way we find it, right, Adam Arlo Schmidt, go 261 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,320 Speaker 1: fund me. That is correct, yep. And so many people 262 00:17:09,320 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 1: have already donated, and there's no way to say thank 263 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,399 Speaker 1: you for all the support from our families, from the 264 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:19,240 Speaker 1: Schmidt family and the Moorhouse family. For everything that everybody 265 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: has done for Arlow up until this point and in 266 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:26,159 Speaker 1: the future, the Cedar Falls area and everybody worldwide who 267 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 1: has tapped into that is just absolutely incredible. Adam, was 268 00:17:30,359 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 1: Sarah your sister? Was she always an outdoors parson? Yes, 269 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:36,960 Speaker 1: she was. So she went to school at Truman State 270 00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:40,320 Speaker 1: University up in Kirchil, Missouri, and then followed that on 271 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:44,000 Speaker 1: to work and went to school at Kansas University and 272 00:17:44,280 --> 00:17:47,160 Speaker 1: she worked in the science department there and was involved 273 00:17:47,160 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 1: with a program called monarch Watch and was attempting to 274 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:54,000 Speaker 1: get her doctorate for the longest time, doing a big 275 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,959 Speaker 1: study of the Kansas River in the insects that are 276 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 1: in that area. And she'd always been out on the water. 277 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:03,560 Speaker 1: She's always been outside, camping and hiking, all two girls 278 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:07,240 Speaker 1: scouts growing up and all the way until this event. 279 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,800 Speaker 1: You know, I noticed, Adam, and I still do it too. 280 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: You're referring to their murders as this event. It's really hard. 281 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:21,200 Speaker 1: It's really hard to call it anything else. I understand. 282 00:18:21,760 --> 00:18:27,240 Speaker 1: Back to the facts too. Ryan Tabot Casey RGTV nine 283 00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:31,160 Speaker 1: joining us. When did you first learn about this family 284 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:35,480 Speaker 1: being attacked and killed? That day. That Friday night, I 285 00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:37,439 Speaker 1: saw the mayor and made a post when the air 286 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,239 Speaker 1: Ceater Falls made a post on Facebook and I had 287 00:18:40,280 --> 00:18:43,280 Speaker 1: reached out to him to see what he had known 288 00:18:43,320 --> 00:18:48,960 Speaker 1: about it immediately. What happened that evening? Take a listen 289 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:52,679 Speaker 1: to our friends at GMA. Tyler and Sarah Schmidt and 290 00:18:52,720 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 1: their six year old daughter Lula were found dead in 291 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,440 Speaker 1: their tent at the Mccota State Park campground Friday, their 292 00:18:58,520 --> 00:19:01,879 Speaker 1: nine year old son Marlow running to get help a 293 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:06,240 Speaker 1: great for the childhood in for another camper a friend 294 00:19:06,359 --> 00:19:10,040 Speaker 1: that there was a possible shooting in his camper. Parents 295 00:19:10,040 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 1: are in there, this family camping, three of them killed 296 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:18,200 Speaker 1: seemingly randomly. When authorities found them, they evacuated the campground. Investigators, 297 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:22,680 Speaker 1: family friends, and community members all seek the same answer tonight. 298 00:19:23,119 --> 00:19:26,480 Speaker 1: Why why would somebody do this to a Cedar Falls 299 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: family enjoying time together while they camped, But the why 300 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:34,160 Speaker 1: may never come. According to the Division of Criminal Investigations 301 00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: Assistant Director, the DCI says that the Schmidtz had been 302 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 1: camping in a tent in mccata Caves State Park Friday morning. 303 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:46,160 Speaker 1: Adam Moorehouse is joining us. This is the mom Sarah's 304 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:49,399 Speaker 1: brother Adam. Were they all in the same tent or 305 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: did they have separate tents? I know they were all 306 00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:57,359 Speaker 1: camping in one tent. So the little boy, Arlo age nine, 307 00:19:57,400 --> 00:20:02,040 Speaker 1: who lived was in the tent at the time of 308 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:05,080 Speaker 1: the shootings and stabbings. We knew that Arlow was in 309 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:09,040 Speaker 1: the tent at least at the beginning. We don't know 310 00:20:09,119 --> 00:20:12,399 Speaker 1: exactly how he was able to get out, And the 311 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:14,919 Speaker 1: only information really that we do know is that the 312 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:19,600 Speaker 1: DCI investigators and the first responders and the detectives who 313 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,159 Speaker 1: first spoke to Arlow said that he was an absolute 314 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:26,479 Speaker 1: ideal witness. Poor little guy. I mean, doctor Tory Crawsen, 315 00:20:26,520 --> 00:20:29,640 Speaker 1: you're the psychologist. How is he ever going to get 316 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 1: beyond being in the tent at the time and escaping 317 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 1: while mom and dad and little sister are killed and 318 00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 1: running from tent to tent trying to get help. Any 319 00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:48,560 Speaker 1: with trauma, there's this psychological dynamic of time compression where 320 00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 1: things slow down as the body starts to experience that 321 00:20:52,200 --> 00:20:55,879 Speaker 1: high level of stress and trauma has almost like electrifies 322 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 1: the body again into this denial, and some people have 323 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,640 Speaker 1: that fight or flight somehow that freeze and submit, but 324 00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 1: the time just seems to stop where it compresses. The 325 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:10,800 Speaker 1: best way to get through that is with you have 326 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:14,239 Speaker 1: to decompress time, and it just takes time to do that. 327 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:18,200 Speaker 1: And just like what you said as being an ideal witness, 328 00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:24,480 Speaker 1: you know he has that ability, and especially properly interviewed, 329 00:21:24,520 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 1: you know he'll be able to decompress that time and 330 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:33,600 Speaker 1: that trauma together. Hello guy, oh, age of nine. I'm curious. 331 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:38,040 Speaker 1: Doctor Michelle Dupree joining me right now. Forensic pathologist, former 332 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:44,320 Speaker 1: medical examiner, author of Homicide Investigation Field Guide. Doctor Dupree, 333 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. I find it very 334 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 1: unusual that the killer used three modes of murtyr He 335 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:58,880 Speaker 1: shot the family in their sleep. I bet you don't 336 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: say that a lot someone in their sleep, stabbed some 337 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:08,160 Speaker 1: of them and strangled the little girl. I don't. That's 338 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:12,199 Speaker 1: very odd, killing them three times over, essentially, Nancy, that 339 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: is very odd. Most people obviously don't do that, and 340 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: so he obviously most likely brought the weapons with him, 341 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: and we know that he brought the gun with him. 342 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,000 Speaker 1: That's very strange. Guys, take a listen to our friend 343 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 1: at GMA. You're going to hear some police dispatch. Listen, 344 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: the family from Cedar Falls was on vacation. Stranger wearing 345 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:36,240 Speaker 1: all black, Yeah, and the tent had some service small 346 00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:40,080 Speaker 1: gun and he took off running. A stranger wearing all 347 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: black got in the tent, had some sort of a 348 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:49,040 Speaker 1: small gun and then took off running. Greg Smith's special 349 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:53,119 Speaker 1: Deputy Sheriff joinings out of Johnson County wearing all black. 350 00:22:53,320 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 1: That tells me the killer had dressed up ninja style 351 00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,960 Speaker 1: to attack an innocent family in their leap. What does 352 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 1: that tell you, Well, it sounds like it was calculating, 353 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:09,360 Speaker 1: that was pre planned, but it doesn't necessarily mean that 354 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:13,720 Speaker 1: that family was the target or known to the killer. 355 00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 1: And I can tell you just right now, Catherine Marsh, 356 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:18,919 Speaker 1: We're going to know the killer is a man, and 357 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: I'm basing that on statistics right off the bat. It's 358 00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:27,000 Speaker 1: highly unlikely the killer would be a female. Agree. Agreed, 359 00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,640 Speaker 1: especially when you add in the mode of that we're 360 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:34,960 Speaker 1: used in this case, specifically strangulation, that is almost always 361 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 1: predominantly a male method of killing guys. This is not 362 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:44,440 Speaker 1: the first time that an innocent family has been attacked camping. 363 00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut fourteen our friends at 364 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:52,200 Speaker 1: k ABC, the investigation continues into who shot and killed 365 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: just In Boudette during a camping trip with his two 366 00:23:54,800 --> 00:23:58,320 Speaker 1: little girls at Malibu Creek State Park in Calabasas had 367 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:01,600 Speaker 1: Allergan and Irvine, where thirty five year old scientist helped 368 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:04,680 Speaker 1: with research and development. The company says it is rare 369 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,560 Speaker 1: that we lose a friend and colleague, especially in an 370 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 1: event that was senseless and difficult to understand. Tristan will 371 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 1: be remembered as a talented scientist who was admired by 372 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 1: all who knew him. There's nothing you can describe that 373 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,040 Speaker 1: losing a family member like that, particularly like this, a 374 00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,720 Speaker 1: family man like this with two small children. Tristin Boudette 375 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:28,919 Speaker 1: had taken his children camping as two little girls. I 376 00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:31,959 Speaker 1: recall Jackie correct me if I'm wrong. The mom was 377 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: studying for some exam and he took them for the 378 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 1: weekend so she could have complete total quiet so she 379 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:46,959 Speaker 1: could study. And the case lingered for a long time 380 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:52,240 Speaker 1: as authorities try to determine who would shoot into a 381 00:24:52,440 --> 00:24:56,520 Speaker 1: tent of a sleeping a family about to go to sleep. 382 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at CBS News. Tristan 383 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,480 Speaker 1: Bondette was shot in the head as he lay sleeping 384 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 1: with his two young daughters in a tent. The suspect 385 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: has a lengthy criminal background, including illegal weapons possession, and 386 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:15,160 Speaker 1: apparently picked his victims at random. Anthony Rowda was blocked 387 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 1: from cameras by his public defender as he appeared in 388 00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 1: a Los Angeles courtroom Monday. Authorities reportedly say the forty 389 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,040 Speaker 1: two year old was a survivalist who lived off stolen 390 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 1: food while often sleeping outside in the Malibu area. He 391 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 1: now faces multiple charges, including the murder of thirty five 392 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:36,240 Speaker 1: year old Tristan Bondette to Adam Moorehouse. This is mom 393 00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:40,640 Speaker 1: Sarah Schmidt's brother. Sarah lost her life in the tent 394 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: with her family that night. Adam so hard and I 395 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: dealt with this too. It's so hard to comprehend that 396 00:25:50,240 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 1: this could have been a random killing, because in Tristan 397 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:56,240 Speaker 1: Badette's case, the dad with the two little girls I 398 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:59,720 Speaker 1: just told you about, the killer didn't know them. He 399 00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,639 Speaker 1: just targeted campers, just like shooting a bird up in 400 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:08,280 Speaker 1: the sky. You don't know the victim. He just targeted campers. 401 00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 1: That's really hard to take in. No real no connection whatsoever, 402 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 1: no motive, no grudge, no angry argument, nothing, adam, nothing 403 00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:23,520 Speaker 1: at all. That's definitely been the one of the hardest struggles, 404 00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 1: and this entire thing for everybody is uh. We were 405 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:31,159 Speaker 1: immediately asked by severally investigators did we did we know 406 00:26:31,240 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 1: the families involved? Do we know any of the alleged individuals? 407 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,919 Speaker 1: Was there any contact? And that's one thing I've been 408 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,240 Speaker 1: stressing from the beginning of all this is this was 409 00:26:41,359 --> 00:26:45,640 Speaker 1: one random that there was no interaction. Nobody knew each other. 410 00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:50,359 Speaker 1: This individual just decided on a whim that morning to 411 00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:52,879 Speaker 1: pick a tent and to walk into a tent and 412 00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 1: inflict evil. And now my family and the Schmidt family, 413 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 1: and more importantly Arlo Schmidt is living with that forever. 414 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:07,959 Speaker 1: You said that morning, what time did the shootings occur? 415 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:13,320 Speaker 1: I don't know that to the correct extent. I I 416 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:17,280 Speaker 1: just know that I was notified later that day in 417 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:20,560 Speaker 1: the early afternoon period. Brian Taboc joining his case rg 418 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,680 Speaker 1: TV nine out of Iowa. You've been on the case 419 00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:25,920 Speaker 1: from the get go, Brian, What time do we believe 420 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:31,399 Speaker 1: the shootings occurred? We believe around six am Friday morning. Interesting. 421 00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:35,520 Speaker 1: Doctor Michelle du Pree joining me, forensic pathologist and author 422 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:39,880 Speaker 1: doctor G. Pree. You don't see a lot of crimes 423 00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 1: of this ilk occurring at six a m. But those 424 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,639 Speaker 1: are the heavy sleeping hours, when you know, the early 425 00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:51,880 Speaker 1: morning hours, between say two am and six am, when 426 00:27:51,920 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 1: you're fine, we've finally got into sleep on a hard 427 00:27:54,680 --> 00:28:00,400 Speaker 1: service the ground and completely unaware what's going on around you. Yes, 428 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:03,480 Speaker 1: now see that's exactly right, and so I mean, if 429 00:28:03,480 --> 00:28:06,560 Speaker 1: you look at it, it's unfortunately a perfect opportunity for 430 00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:11,440 Speaker 1: something like this because the people are unaware, completely unaware. Earlier, 431 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 1: I mentioned to you a serial killer, Israel Keys, that 432 00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:19,199 Speaker 1: stalked victims at campgrounds. Listen to our friends at crime 433 00:28:19,240 --> 00:28:23,400 Speaker 1: online dot com. Serial killer Israel Keys was set apart 434 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,400 Speaker 1: from other serial killers. He had no victim type. It 435 00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 1: didn't matter whether it was a man or a woman 436 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:33,480 Speaker 1: he killed, or ethnicity. But the thing that Keys victims 437 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,879 Speaker 1: had in common was where he would find them. Listened 438 00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:42,680 Speaker 1: to Keys speaking to the FBI, I would let them 439 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: come to Memo area remote area design anywhere in here 440 00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:53,800 Speaker 1: and where you live that other people going to as well. 441 00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 1: Those remote areas, according to Keys, included lakes, beaches, national parks, 442 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:03,880 Speaker 1: camp grounds, especially wooded areas. He was very comfortable out 443 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: in the woods and in wilderness areas. Key's told the 444 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: FBI that by the age of fourteen, he realized that 445 00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,280 Speaker 1: he could sit in the woods for hours on end 446 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 1: without making a move, you know, at a moorhouse, joining 447 00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:21,040 Speaker 1: me special guests. Today, this is mom Sarah, who lost 448 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:26,160 Speaker 1: her life and her camping tent with her family. It 449 00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: just I don't know really how to react to hearing 450 00:29:31,040 --> 00:29:38,480 Speaker 1: a killer speak so calmly, so nonchalantly about stalking his 451 00:29:38,680 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 1: victims at campgrounds. It's like there's no idea the wake 452 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:49,240 Speaker 1: of pain he's leaving behind him. That's exactly right. And 453 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:51,720 Speaker 1: I think the biggest thing to remember and all that 454 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 1: when you hear individuals who are still around who have 455 00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:57,920 Speaker 1: committed such heinous acts, that it's the big part of 456 00:29:58,320 --> 00:30:02,240 Speaker 1: the mental instability that other folks kind of have a 457 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:07,680 Speaker 1: hard time I think dealing with that others somebody like myself. 458 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 1: I understand the repercussions and I know what its pain 459 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,320 Speaker 1: it could cause and everything in between. And now I'm 460 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:17,920 Speaker 1: part of it. And I think listening and hearing other 461 00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,640 Speaker 1: serial killers who are talking about this, or individuals who 462 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 1: have done this obviously are in a mental state that 463 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,880 Speaker 1: are different than what I can even comprehend. And that's 464 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 1: the hardest struggle to try to figure out as a 465 00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 1: as a human being. Time Stories with Nancy Grace, you know, 466 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:53,400 Speaker 1: doctor Jordy Cause and I want to follow up on 467 00:30:53,440 --> 00:30:56,880 Speaker 1: Adam Morehouse. Special guest joining us just said he's referring 468 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:02,680 Speaker 1: to the nonchalant discussion this killer is having of his victims. 469 00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:06,479 Speaker 1: He's talked at campgrounds. It's not a mental illness. I 470 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 1: think it's a characteristic that you don't feel someone else's pain. Yeah, 471 00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:17,960 Speaker 1: they're able to well, really that feeling doesn't exist in them. 472 00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: If you follow some psychological theories, they're just incapable. And 473 00:31:22,920 --> 00:31:28,080 Speaker 1: when you listen to them verbalize, there's no emotionality. You 474 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:31,400 Speaker 1: notice the flat tone. Plus they don't use if they 475 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:35,000 Speaker 1: use any emotional words, they have no meaning to them. 476 00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:37,760 Speaker 1: They're not something where you can actually see that it 477 00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:41,560 Speaker 1: has impacted them, like love or caring for people. You know. 478 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,920 Speaker 1: Katherine Mars joining Ours Special Victims Liaison, State Attorney General's 479 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:49,680 Speaker 1: Office and Starve a No Gray Zone podcast. Katherine, I 480 00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: have sat in court so many times and when the 481 00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,720 Speaker 1: jury wasn't looking or wasn't in the courtroom, I'd look 482 00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:58,480 Speaker 1: over at the defendant and they would be so calm 483 00:31:58,880 --> 00:32:03,400 Speaker 1: and cool, like nothing had ever happened. They show very 484 00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 1: little emotion at times. They will, as you know, they 485 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:08,920 Speaker 1: can sit there and just doodle and act like nothing 486 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:12,280 Speaker 1: else is going on around them, especially when they are 487 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 1: detached emotionally from what they did in the harm that 488 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,720 Speaker 1: they've caused. A family on a camping ship slaughtered by 489 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:22,080 Speaker 1: a gunman as they slept in their own tent. The 490 00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 1: sole survivor, a nine year old little boy orlowe, set 491 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:33,080 Speaker 1: for a life time of trauma after escaping that tent. 492 00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 1: Of course, Israel kay is not the only one. These 493 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:39,600 Speaker 1: are a pair of victims that came to light during 494 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 1: the Gabby Petito investigation. Crystal Turner and Kayland Shulty murder. 495 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 1: To listen to our friends at ABC four, friends say, 496 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,160 Speaker 1: twenty four year old Kylan Schulton thirty eight year old 497 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 1: Crystal Turner were married on April twentieth of this year 498 00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:01,200 Speaker 1: and often camped together with their pet rabbit. Moab resident 499 00:33:01,320 --> 00:33:05,120 Speaker 1: Cindy Sue Hunters shopped at the food cooperative where Kaylan worked. 500 00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:07,960 Speaker 1: When the couple hadn't been heard from in three days, 501 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,920 Speaker 1: Hunter got a phone call from Kayland's father in Montana. 502 00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 1: He said, I just found out that there was a 503 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:19,280 Speaker 1: creeper dude that they were scared of. That they were 504 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:22,760 Speaker 1: saying they needed to move their camp and more from 505 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,080 Speaker 1: our friends at Fox thirteen. The Grand County Sheriff's Office 506 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:29,160 Speaker 1: has identified forty four year old Adam Pinkowitz as a 507 00:33:29,280 --> 00:33:33,719 Speaker 1: suspect in the murders of Kayland Shulty and Crystal Turner. 508 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: The newlyweds were camping in the LaSalle Mountains. Their bodies 509 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: were found with multiple gunshot wounds on August eighteenth of 510 00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:47,360 Speaker 1: last year. Pinkowitz was a former employee at McDonald's, where 511 00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:52,600 Speaker 1: Crystal Turner worked, just outside of downtown Moab. So, as 512 00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 1: it turns out, there was a connection between that killer 513 00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:03,120 Speaker 1: and the two women ed as they camped. So in 514 00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:07,440 Speaker 1: this particular case that we're talking about Adam Moorehouse, the 515 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:12,160 Speaker 1: resolution was a hard one to fathom. Take a listen 516 00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:16,319 Speaker 1: to our friends at wqaight D police say this all 517 00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:20,359 Speaker 1: started just before six thirty this morning. Three people were 518 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:23,200 Speaker 1: found dead in the park's camp around then. A short 519 00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: time later, a fourth person was discovered nearby. That person 520 00:34:27,640 --> 00:34:31,040 Speaker 1: was identified as the suspected shooter twenty three year old 521 00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:34,880 Speaker 1: Anthony Sherwin of Nebraska, who authorities say died from a 522 00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:38,200 Speaker 1: self inflicted gunshot wound. The mother of the suspect, who 523 00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:40,280 Speaker 1: was also at the park at the time of the shooting, 524 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:42,680 Speaker 1: writing in a statement to ABC News, he gave us 525 00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:44,960 Speaker 1: no warning that he was planning anything of this sort. 526 00:34:45,120 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 1: Anthony was not capable of this sort of violence. But 527 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:51,640 Speaker 1: authorities say all indicators point to the suspect, and there's 528 00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: nothing to indicate that there was anyone else responsible or 529 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,520 Speaker 1: anyone else acting with him. Sara Schmidt's brother says nine 530 00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:01,240 Speaker 1: year old Arlow is safe with family in Cedar Falls, 531 00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,400 Speaker 1: and he described him as an amazing, bright young child 532 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:06,960 Speaker 1: who's been a courageous little man in all of this. 533 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:11,839 Speaker 1: To Bryan's having joined his casey RGTV nine, who is 534 00:35:12,080 --> 00:35:16,319 Speaker 1: the suspect, Anthony Sherwin, h twenty three, We know very 535 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:19,759 Speaker 1: little at bottom. We just know that he's from La Vista, Nebraska. 536 00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 1: We also know that his mother claims that in no 537 00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:27,640 Speaker 1: way would he ever have done this to Greg Smith 538 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:31,520 Speaker 1: joining US Deputy Sheriff Johnson County Sheriff's Office in Kansas. 539 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,640 Speaker 1: What do you make of that? Because in nearly every 540 00:35:34,680 --> 00:35:37,960 Speaker 1: trial I ever tried, right behind the defendant would be 541 00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:41,960 Speaker 1: his mother, who would never believe our son had done 542 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,560 Speaker 1: such a thing. Yeah, seems to be a common theme, Nancy. 543 00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:47,320 Speaker 1: There's always seems like there's always a family member somewhere 544 00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:51,560 Speaker 1: that it sits right there behind the defendant and as 545 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:54,600 Speaker 1: you know, fully behind them, and that this is a 546 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:59,880 Speaker 1: miscarriage of justice or something along these lines, despite ninety 547 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,840 Speaker 1: nine point nine percent of the time there's overwhelming evidence 548 00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:05,400 Speaker 1: that you points to the contrary. In this case, Doctor 549 00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:10,400 Speaker 1: Michelle Dupree, I would imagine that the part being found 550 00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 1: with the weapon would be the biggest indicator, because he 551 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:21,160 Speaker 1: the suspect, used the weapon on himself, and clearly those 552 00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:24,799 Speaker 1: ballistics can be traced back to the bullets inside the 553 00:36:24,840 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 1: Schmidt tent. Explain how that works? Yes, and see that's 554 00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:31,120 Speaker 1: exactly right. And one of the other most interesting things 555 00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 1: about this is that he used a ghost gun, and 556 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: a ghost gun is either a kit gun or one 557 00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,799 Speaker 1: that is put together without a serial number that the 558 00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,960 Speaker 1: person makes themselves. It can also be three D printed, 559 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:48,279 Speaker 1: And so this was premeditated, this was intentional. And then 560 00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:50,759 Speaker 1: as you said, to find him with the weapon and 561 00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:53,839 Speaker 1: how to have used that weapon on himself. This is irrefutable, 562 00:36:54,000 --> 00:36:59,239 Speaker 1: irrefutable ballistics. And everyone, when I say, Katherine marshould jump 563 00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:02,320 Speaker 1: in because you're all so familiar with this. A bullet 564 00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:07,200 Speaker 1: is like a fingerprint. When a gun is created with 565 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,239 Speaker 1: hot metal, it dries a certain way. Inside the long 566 00:37:12,360 --> 00:37:15,040 Speaker 1: portion of the gun, there are drippings of metal, and 567 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:20,720 Speaker 1: when a bullet hurtles down that cylinder, certain marked striations 568 00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 1: is what they're called, are made on a bullet. So 569 00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:27,839 Speaker 1: you take the known bullet from inside the Schmidt's tent, 570 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,759 Speaker 1: you fire a test shot with a murder weapon, and 571 00:37:31,880 --> 00:37:35,040 Speaker 1: compare the two bullets under a microscope, and that is 572 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:40,239 Speaker 1: really irrefutable evidence, as doctor Dupri said, Katherine marsh absolutely, 573 00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:43,759 Speaker 1: we rely on ballistic as you said, fingerprinting all the time. 574 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:47,719 Speaker 1: Those striations which are basically twists and turned that are 575 00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:51,399 Speaker 1: on the fired bullet can be matched to the gun 576 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,239 Speaker 1: for that test fire, to any other bullets that are 577 00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:56,919 Speaker 1: on scene to show that they all came from one gun. 578 00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:01,959 Speaker 1: We'd probably also be looking here for blood testing on 579 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:07,239 Speaker 1: his body, on DNA evidence within the tent, on fingerprints 580 00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,840 Speaker 1: within the tent. All of those make that overwhelming evidence 581 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 1: picture now the mom, Celia, the mom of the killer, 582 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:18,000 Speaker 1: denies her son could be the killer, or claiming Arlas 583 00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:21,000 Speaker 1: said the gunman was wearing black, but that her son 584 00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:26,600 Speaker 1: was wearing green. Adam Moorehouse is joining us. Adam, thank 585 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:29,920 Speaker 1: you so much for speaking out today, and what is 586 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:34,960 Speaker 1: your message to everyone listening or watching? My message is 587 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 1: definitely the one that the Schmidt's family, Tyler and Sarah, 588 00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:47,880 Speaker 1: Lula and even Arlow were the quintessential Midwestern family that 589 00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:53,040 Speaker 1: a lot of people think about when it comes to volunteerism, 590 00:38:53,040 --> 00:38:58,399 Speaker 1: when it comes to carrying and kindness and faith, and 591 00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:02,560 Speaker 1: knowing who they were was extremely fortunate and loving in 592 00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:10,239 Speaker 1: my situation. But understanding and seeing how many people that 593 00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:16,080 Speaker 1: they affected who have come out and supported us all 594 00:39:16,160 --> 00:39:22,279 Speaker 1: through this entire tragedy has just been absolutely incredible. So 595 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,880 Speaker 1: I want to thank everybody that both families want to 596 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,520 Speaker 1: make sure everybody is thanked for all of their support 597 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:32,359 Speaker 1: now and going forward as well. As it's cliche to say, 598 00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,600 Speaker 1: but enjoy every moment that you have while you're on 599 00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:38,279 Speaker 1: this earth, whether that be with family or doing what 600 00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:43,440 Speaker 1: you love, because you never know, Adam, it's not cliche. 601 00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:46,720 Speaker 1: We all get so caught up in our everyday lives 602 00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:51,000 Speaker 1: or buzzing around like little ants that are so easy 603 00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:56,560 Speaker 1: to forget. To appreciate every moment, and I like you. 604 00:39:57,200 --> 00:40:03,160 Speaker 1: It's totally changed by a tragic murder, and it makes 605 00:40:03,200 --> 00:40:07,959 Speaker 1: me realize every day how blessed we are. Thank you 606 00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,880 Speaker 1: for being with us. Thank you, Thank you, Nancy Grace. 607 00:40:12,200 --> 00:40:14,840 Speaker 1: I'm stories signing up. Goodbye friend.