1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:04,680 Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is 2 00:00:04,760 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,079 Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A 4 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:26,040 Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show. 5 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Null. They called 6 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,040 Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined as always with our super 7 00:00:32,040 --> 00:00:37,080 Speaker 1: producer Paul Mission controlled decond. Most importantly, you are you, 8 00:00:37,080 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 1: You are here, and that makes this stuff they don't 9 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: want you to know. This is the second part of 10 00:00:44,400 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: a two part series asking whether dreams have really predicted 11 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 1: the future. We ended the earlier episode without getting to 12 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: several things facts for one, uh, science, although we're able 13 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:03,360 Speaker 1: to put some science in the first episode, and um, 14 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:07,840 Speaker 1: perhaps most importantly, questions that we had promised at the 15 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 1: beginning of the last episode. So please listened to part 16 00:01:12,480 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: one of have Dreams Really Predicted the Future before you 17 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 1: dive into part two. This is mostly crazy stuff in 18 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 1: the second act. So here's where it gets crazy. Mass 19 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 1: the quickest we've gotten crazy. I think maybe ever. I 20 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:31,080 Speaker 1: love it. Uh. Do you want to do a little 21 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: quick recap of some of the hallmarks from our last episode? UM, 22 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:38,839 Speaker 1: some of the historical figures we've got Abraham Lincoln who 23 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:43,319 Speaker 1: seems to have predicted his own assassination and dream. Um 24 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:46,920 Speaker 1: we have Samuel Clemens a k a. Mark Twain, who 25 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:51,000 Speaker 1: seems to have had a premonition of his brother's demise 26 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:53,320 Speaker 1: in the form of of of a dream where he 27 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:55,440 Speaker 1: was laid out his brother in a in a metal 28 00:01:55,560 --> 00:02:00,760 Speaker 1: casket wearing a suit, a borrowed suit and also bedecked 29 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: with like a particular spray of flowers. That that that 30 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: lined up with what he saw in his dream, my 31 00:02:05,680 --> 00:02:09,080 Speaker 1: crazy dream about Bennett Moon and then that manifesting in 32 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:12,079 Speaker 1: reality and the form of her calling into wait, wait, 33 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:15,519 Speaker 1: don't tell me. Um what else we got? I think 34 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,680 Speaker 1: your great aunts Ben and then her potential Obo playing 35 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 1: or lack of in the realm. No, no, I didn't 36 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 1: want to take time in the show. Uh, with my 37 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 1: own personal anecdotes. I always think of that scene and 38 00:02:28,240 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: it's always sunny in Philadelphia where Dennis Reynolds is his 39 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: sister in the show, is talking about her dreams and 40 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,680 Speaker 1: he tells her stop, no one wants to hear about 41 00:02:40,720 --> 00:02:44,680 Speaker 1: anybody else's dreams. So I think that affected me because 42 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 1: the great the great aunts Obo Portugal, example, is just 43 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:54,040 Speaker 1: is just made up to show the credulous, the credulous 44 00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:59,000 Speaker 1: nature of dreams. But we also talked about how dreams 45 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: can function as a way of problem solving. Right. Our 46 00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 1: brains as problem solvers are sometimes more effective when our 47 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:14,440 Speaker 1: consciousness is less involved. That's how the periodic table was formulated. 48 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 1: That's how um many authors discovered great works like Samuel 49 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 1: Coleridge wrote Kubla Khan after he awoke from uh from 50 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: a dream. He wrote the poem in his sleep kind of. 51 00:03:30,720 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 1: He was also on a lot of opium at the time. 52 00:03:33,480 --> 00:03:36,840 Speaker 1: I don't think I mentioned this earlier, but the sewing 53 00:03:36,920 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 1: machine was also inspired by a dream. Yeah, it was 54 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:44,280 Speaker 1: a weird one too, a really violent dream where I 55 00:03:44,320 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 1: believe the inventor was being like boiled in a pot 56 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 1: by cannibals and being stabbed with like spears. And in 57 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: the dream he recognized that the spears had holes in 58 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:57,160 Speaker 1: the tips, and that's what gave him the idea for 59 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: the way you thread the needle or the whatever. I'm 60 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: not in a selling expert on a sewing machine, and 61 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,160 Speaker 1: it actually is tied to the very tip of the needle, 62 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 1: and that's what allows it to kind of continue to 63 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:10,840 Speaker 1: thread and hold on or whatever. But he what a 64 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 1: weird way to come to that conclusion. And just for 65 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:20,120 Speaker 1: a couple of other examples, Albert Einstein, by his own account, 66 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 1: discovered the you know, hit upon some of his own 67 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 1: revelations in the world of dreams. At this point, I'd 68 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:33,800 Speaker 1: like to recommend a fantastic book about the nature of 69 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:37,720 Speaker 1: time by a guy who I think he was at 70 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 1: M I T an author named Alan Lightman. He wrote 71 00:04:41,680 --> 00:04:48,160 Speaker 1: a book called Einstein's Dreams, and it's entirely almost an 72 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 1: anthology or a series of vignettes of young Einstein working 73 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:58,159 Speaker 1: as a sleepy patent clerk, and every time he falls 74 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:05,800 Speaker 1: asleep he encounters another theory of time, which will also 75 00:05:05,880 --> 00:05:10,719 Speaker 1: be very very important for today's show. We The point 76 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:14,280 Speaker 1: is that if you're listening today, or if you're if 77 00:05:14,320 --> 00:05:17,159 Speaker 1: you're if you're like many listeners who have written to 78 00:05:17,279 --> 00:05:20,000 Speaker 1: us over the years and said, I love turning on 79 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: this show as I fall asleep, which thank you. I 80 00:05:24,200 --> 00:05:28,480 Speaker 1: still think that's a compliment. Essentially, if you have slept 81 00:05:28,600 --> 00:05:33,480 Speaker 1: regularly over any period of significant time, then odds are 82 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,200 Speaker 1: that your brain has done the same thing. Your brain 83 00:05:36,279 --> 00:05:39,719 Speaker 1: is attempting to solve problems for you. Some of those 84 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:44,360 Speaker 1: I think it's a point somebody made earlier in previous episode. 85 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:47,239 Speaker 1: Some of those may be emotional problems, you know, things 86 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:52,440 Speaker 1: with which you are grappling, and some may be scientific things. 87 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:56,800 Speaker 1: Some maybe like uh, like Paul McCartney waking up and 88 00:05:56,839 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: writing a song? Which song was that? Was it? Yesterday? Yesterday? 89 00:06:00,880 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: Which is the most covered song of all time. It's 90 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:08,359 Speaker 1: been covered like more than three thousand times. That's pretty 91 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: cool claim to fame. But yeah, and I mentioned like 92 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:13,239 Speaker 1: even being a musical guy, I don't really remember melodies 93 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:15,719 Speaker 1: very much. But all of this stuff. The way dreams 94 00:06:15,760 --> 00:06:18,280 Speaker 1: work kind of depend on the way your brain works, right, 95 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 1: Like all of our brains work a little bit differently. 96 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:23,640 Speaker 1: We process things in the waking world differently. So how 97 00:06:23,920 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 1: dreams function, I think is a big product of who 98 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 1: we are as people. Right. But what if this whole 99 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 1: idea of dream you know, sort of precognitive dreams, isn't 100 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: so much our brains doing a thing as it is 101 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:47,000 Speaker 1: like a bigger picture thing that we're experiencing, something tied 102 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 1: in with physics, something tied in with a force larger 103 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 1: than ourselves. So how do we explain these anecdotes, right, 104 00:06:58,240 --> 00:07:01,359 Speaker 1: You know, many of which are unprovable, many of which 105 00:07:01,400 --> 00:07:06,360 Speaker 1: are one person telling you their opinion about what happened 106 00:07:06,400 --> 00:07:12,640 Speaker 1: to them. And how do we explain the robustly documented tales. Right? 107 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:17,160 Speaker 1: One idea involves exactly what you're talking about, Noel, the 108 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 1: idea of something larger. This is the science I want 109 00:07:20,040 --> 00:07:25,280 Speaker 1: to bring to bear today. It involves the concept of 110 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:31,560 Speaker 1: a thing known as retro causality. Strap in we're headed 111 00:07:31,600 --> 00:07:35,840 Speaker 1: for bad country here. M hm, Yes, causality. You've heard 112 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 1: this cause and effect. It's the thing that happens when 113 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:40,720 Speaker 1: you hold a glass out in front of you and 114 00:07:40,760 --> 00:07:43,080 Speaker 1: then you drop it and it hits the ground. Why 115 00:07:43,080 --> 00:07:46,360 Speaker 1: did it do that? Well, it's because gravity exists, and 116 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:50,120 Speaker 1: that's what happens when you drop something with mass, it 117 00:07:50,200 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: falls to the ground because of gravity. Um. By the way, 118 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 1: gravity is maybe a whole episode that we could do 119 00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:01,760 Speaker 1: just about what that really means, what it is. There's 120 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 1: not like gravity doesn't want us to know something, but 121 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:09,320 Speaker 1: it's an odd phenomenon that we don't fully grasp. That 122 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 1: sounds weird to even say that, but it's true. Um. 123 00:08:12,000 --> 00:08:14,280 Speaker 1: But this chain of cause and effect happens in a 124 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: very predictable order, right, as long as there's not no 125 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:21,160 Speaker 1: other thing coming in, Like with the glass example, there 126 00:08:21,200 --> 00:08:23,840 Speaker 1: isn't someone jumping to catch the glass, or there isn't 127 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 1: a string wrapped around the glass that pulls it down 128 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:30,920 Speaker 1: and actually makes it swing or hang from another surface. 129 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 1: But so that's that's causing effect, right, that's causality. So 130 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:40,000 Speaker 1: what is retro causality? The same thing, but backwards. Have 131 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,400 Speaker 1: you ever liked a song so much that you said, 132 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:45,360 Speaker 1: let's play it backwards? I don't know, probably not. It 133 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 1: would have to be you know, maybe the perfect palindrome 134 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:51,480 Speaker 1: of a song to have that kind of symmetry. But 135 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 1: you're right. Retro causality backwards causation. This is a concept 136 00:08:57,400 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 1: of cause and effect, where and affect somehow proceeds its 137 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,079 Speaker 1: cause in what we experience as linear A to B 138 00:09:07,320 --> 00:09:12,200 Speaker 1: to C one to two to three time, such that 139 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:18,520 Speaker 1: we have to walk slowly through this. Later events affect 140 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:24,439 Speaker 1: earlier events. Decisions made in the future in the lens 141 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 1: of retro causality may affect events in the past. This 142 00:09:30,880 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: means this, This could mean huge things for science if 143 00:09:34,440 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 1: it is ever uh proven or agreed upon. It could 144 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:44,560 Speaker 1: explain nagging questions about many things in the physical world. 145 00:09:45,080 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 1: But to explain those things, we have to understand what 146 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: retro causality is and perhaps just as importantly, what it 147 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:54,800 Speaker 1: is not. So yeah, I mean, it's it's literally the 148 00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 1: idea of backwards causation, a reverse of cause and effect 149 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:06,720 Speaker 1: fact uh preceding cause. Uh. It's a concept that is 150 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: is very much tied up into quantum physics and things 151 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:13,760 Speaker 1: like string theory and you know, the idea of how 152 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 1: you know, maybe even a multiverse kind of situation, because 153 00:10:17,000 --> 00:10:19,720 Speaker 1: it does sort of lay out this framework of like, 154 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:24,000 Speaker 1: how can something that happens on a certain timeline affect 155 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:27,559 Speaker 1: things that precede it in a different timeline or earlier 156 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:31,720 Speaker 1: on the same timeline. So Lisa Ziga puts it pretty 157 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:36,240 Speaker 1: succinctly writing for fizz dot org Um. She describes retro 158 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 1: causality as not meaning that signals can be communicated from 159 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:43,600 Speaker 1: the future to the past uh no um. Such signaling 160 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:46,839 Speaker 1: would be forbidden even in a retro causal theory due 161 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:52,520 Speaker 1: to thermodynamic reason. Instead, retro causality means that when an 162 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:57,840 Speaker 1: experiment or chooses the measurement setting with which to measure 163 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,440 Speaker 1: a particle. That decision can influence the properties of that 164 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: particle or another particle in the past, even before the 165 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:09,160 Speaker 1: experiment or made their choice. Um. In other words, a 166 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:13,880 Speaker 1: decision made in the present can influence something in the past. 167 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:17,319 Speaker 1: Tough to wrap your head around. I was thinking of 168 00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:25,400 Speaker 1: different examples to the ground this. It's sort of like said, uh, 169 00:11:26,520 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 1: it's sort of It's it's a weird distinction, right, because 170 00:11:32,360 --> 00:11:35,440 Speaker 1: a decision made in the present should not be able 171 00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:38,480 Speaker 1: to alter the past from everything we know. You know 172 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: what I mean. And we can put it in whimsical 173 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: in a whimsical sense by saying, if you concentrate hard 174 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:58,440 Speaker 1: enough in and think I never watched Police Academy for something, 175 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:03,440 Speaker 1: then that would mean in retro causality that you might 176 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:07,360 Speaker 1: end up not watching it, right, That's that's kind of 177 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: It's still that it means that you're not telling yourself 178 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 1: in the past to do something different, You're not communicating 179 00:12:16,160 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 1: with yourself. The fact that you made the decision in 180 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:27,800 Speaker 1: the present means that the past is changed. Yeah, it's 181 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 1: an odd thing. I'm just gonna go back to Lisa's 182 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:35,080 Speaker 1: example here, saying that the experiment or a scientist somewhere 183 00:12:35,080 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 1: in a lab chooses, you know, use the dial or 184 00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: something to decide what wavelength they're going to be looking 185 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 1: at these particles with. Right. So the concept is that 186 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: just by making that choice to select that setting is 187 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:56,480 Speaker 1: going to affect the way those particles exist essentially. But 188 00:12:56,559 --> 00:13:00,680 Speaker 1: I think more of what's happening here is that the 189 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 1: the setting to measure those particles is going to measure 190 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:09,320 Speaker 1: those particles at that wavelength where at that energy level, right, Um, 191 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:12,440 Speaker 1: Rather than the particle actually changing the properties of the 192 00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:16,520 Speaker 1: particle changing, you're just measuring different properties. So it's it's 193 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:22,040 Speaker 1: tough for me to right maybe understand fully what what 194 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 1: at least is saying, just because maybe I just don't 195 00:13:24,360 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 1: have that particle physics degree in meaning to get that. 196 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 1: By the way, well it's related to you know, I'm 197 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,320 Speaker 1: being a big glib with the I'm playing fast and 198 00:13:34,400 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 1: loose with the idea of any kind of comparison or 199 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:43,080 Speaker 1: analogy that involves a human being. That's the nature of 200 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:45,439 Speaker 1: this show. And we are going somewhere with this, fellow listeners. 201 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:49,400 Speaker 1: So I want to see, Um, you're familiar with the 202 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 1: uncertainty principle, right, the famous experiment where the double slit experiment, 203 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,400 Speaker 1: which we've talked about in the past. It's similar to that, 204 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:03,680 Speaker 1: the idea that and observe erver effects what is being observed, 205 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:08,600 Speaker 1: and to some degree may determine it by taking a measurement. 206 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 1: I mean, this is this is fascinating stuff. But maybe 207 00:14:13,160 --> 00:14:16,240 Speaker 1: we put this de side and keep building our case 208 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,920 Speaker 1: and then come back because to your point, Knell, we 209 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:25,040 Speaker 1: need to consider how retro causality may give us a 210 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 1: new perspective on quantum theory and have a real life 211 00:14:29,480 --> 00:14:32,560 Speaker 1: story about this too. And I can't wait to hear 212 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 1: it really quickly too. It is also kind of tied 213 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 1: up in one of my favorite scientific, uh descriptive things 214 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 1: of all time, Einstein's concept of spooky action at a 215 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:47,400 Speaker 1: distance or quantum entanglement, which is the idea that objects 216 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:51,760 Speaker 1: can be affected by other objects without being physically touched. 217 00:14:52,040 --> 00:14:54,520 Speaker 1: And that's sort of the basis for this, the idea 218 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:58,440 Speaker 1: that these completely separate things in time and space can 219 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 1: have an effect on one and other. All right, So 220 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:03,680 Speaker 1: let's dive deep into that. And to do so, we're 221 00:15:03,680 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 1: gonna have to get out our text books. You don't 222 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:08,280 Speaker 1: have to, don't worry. We're we're gonna get ours out. 223 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: You can, you can just keep listening. We'll do that 224 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:21,440 Speaker 1: right after a word from our sponsor, and we're back. Okay, 225 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 1: we're opening our textbooks now and we're gonna talk about 226 00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 1: quantum physics. So the one we hear about in schools 227 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:34,720 Speaker 1: often is called the Copenhagen interpretation, and this version argues 228 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 1: that until a systems properties are physically measured in some way, 229 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:43,600 Speaker 1: they can encompass essentially a myriad, a large number of 230 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:49,880 Speaker 1: different values, different properties. Right, solid matter is a conspiracy. 231 00:15:50,920 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 1: That's kind of what the argument becomes at this level. 232 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: At a at a like, the closer and closer you 233 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:03,840 Speaker 1: look further and further you dive down into reality, you 234 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 1: see that particles do not behave the way that solid 235 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:13,480 Speaker 1: matter would behave. Imagine reality is a big pool table. 236 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: It's not the most creative idea, but fine, we need 237 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: to like, yes, like billiards exactly met So so the 238 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:27,040 Speaker 1: the these every particle in the universe of this pool 239 00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 1: table is maybe a little a little ball, a little 240 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,600 Speaker 1: ball on the pool table, a six ball and eight ball, 241 00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:38,680 Speaker 1: a que ball, and they should be their solid matter 242 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:43,920 Speaker 1: rolling from one definite point in space and time to 243 00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:48,560 Speaker 1: another definite point in space and time. That is not 244 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 1: the case at a fundamental level. Instead, these particles are 245 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:58,840 Speaker 1: like this blurry, shifting cloud of possibility. You know, think 246 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:04,280 Speaker 1: of the old descriptions of angels or divine beings that 247 00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:07,879 Speaker 1: were constantly like their faces were shifting and and all 248 00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:13,400 Speaker 1: this sort of stuff. Right, these particles, these billiard balls, 249 00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 1: pool balls, aren't just shifting on the table there like 250 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 1: also and maybe other tables that also may exist, or 251 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 1: there's another there in the air, there under the floor. 252 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 1: Meaning we can be aware of the cloud of possibility. 253 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:35,560 Speaker 1: We know that a cue ball could be hitting an 254 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 1: eight ball, We know it could be missing inn eight ball. 255 00:17:37,480 --> 00:17:40,959 Speaker 1: At the same time, we know it could be doing 256 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:46,639 Speaker 1: any number of things, maybe specially scratching, right, especially scratching. 257 00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:51,960 Speaker 1: The probability is high. Uh. And the weird thing is 258 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 1: the spooky thing, and we do have spooky action coming 259 00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 1: up here later in the show. The weird thing is 260 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: as soon as you look at that cub ball, as 261 00:18:03,000 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 1: soon as you focus on measuring that in some way 262 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 1: and seeing how it hits the eight ball, you will 263 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:17,720 Speaker 1: only ever see that cube ball, let's say, hitting the 264 00:18:17,760 --> 00:18:21,080 Speaker 1: eight ball in one place into one of four corner pockets. 265 00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 1: You'll never see those countless cube balls hitting countless eight 266 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:28,160 Speaker 1: balls into every pocket or every direction at once. Think 267 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,520 Speaker 1: of Schrodinger's cat, right, this is Schrodinger's cat as a 268 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:35,639 Speaker 1: pool shark. Wow, you know it reminds me a video 269 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:41,200 Speaker 1: in a way. I'm just imagining, um, someone dancing very 270 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:45,320 Speaker 1: very fast, or dancing with lots of intensity. Right, if 271 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:48,119 Speaker 1: you're watching on video, you get kind of the full picture. 272 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:50,760 Speaker 1: But if it's just a snapshot, it's just that one 273 00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: moment right in time, it just looks like somebody in 274 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:57,280 Speaker 1: a kind of a strange position or a weird pose, right, 275 00:18:57,800 --> 00:18:59,880 Speaker 1: but you wouldn't get the full picture of what's occurring. 276 00:19:00,640 --> 00:19:04,960 Speaker 1: And when you're when you're thinking about video in general 277 00:19:05,080 --> 00:19:07,520 Speaker 1: or life in general, in the way to capture things, 278 00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:12,800 Speaker 1: we we can only capture images as frames essentially, right 279 00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:17,160 Speaker 1: as the really I really like this comparison that, right, 280 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 1: So there's no way for us to just have like 281 00:19:18,920 --> 00:19:21,399 Speaker 1: the video that you're watching now or any video you 282 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:26,199 Speaker 1: watch online, you're seeing frames of moments, and there is 283 00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:29,560 Speaker 1: no way for us to just have to just measure 284 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:34,480 Speaker 1: a constant or or a measure all moments at all 285 00:19:35,600 --> 00:19:38,520 Speaker 1: times when you're looking at something or observing something. It's 286 00:19:38,600 --> 00:19:40,640 Speaker 1: very strange to think about that. Well, and that that's 287 00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:42,879 Speaker 1: a really great example because that's on like sort of 288 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:45,800 Speaker 1: like a micro level, but on a macro level, it's like, 289 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 1: think of the universe in those terms, like what would 290 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,000 Speaker 1: a snapshot of the universe of all points at all, 291 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:55,879 Speaker 1: like you can observable, you know, measure these things in 292 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:58,440 Speaker 1: a person like I was doing a goofy dance when 293 00:19:58,520 --> 00:19:59,879 Speaker 1: you just saying that a minute ago, and then you 294 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:02,520 Speaker 1: freeze and you might get a sense of like, Okay, 295 00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: I'm frozen in this horrible rictus kind of pose, but 296 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:11,119 Speaker 1: you can't understand the badasseness of my dance moves surrounding 297 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,960 Speaker 1: it in the same way that you couldn't understand like 298 00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:19,719 Speaker 1: the totality of all possible moments happening, you know, in 299 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:21,520 Speaker 1: time and space. You know, I mean, I think that's 300 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:26,040 Speaker 1: really apt. Maw, that's super cool. And this is this 301 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:30,720 Speaker 1: is strange because this touches on actually, uh, some concepts 302 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:36,400 Speaker 1: that are present in ancient religions. This kind of implies 303 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: the idea maybe of destiny, the idea of some sort 304 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:44,520 Speaker 1: of I don't know, it would be misleading to call 305 00:20:44,560 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 1: it predetermination. We're not we're not being calvinist here, but 306 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:51,359 Speaker 1: in no offense to calvinist in the audience. But the 307 00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:57,199 Speaker 1: point is this cloud of possible, unobserved potential possibility, this 308 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 1: cloud of unobserved possibility exists free of a fixed position 309 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: in time or space. And shout out to one of 310 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,359 Speaker 1: my favorite pieces of listener mail, ha ha ha remember 311 00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 1: that guy, Uh the morphic residence. Yes, that's my favorite laugh. 312 00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 1: I hope you're still listening, but yes, uh, time space 313 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:24,639 Speaker 1: six and one hand. This, this idea of existing and 314 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:30,240 Speaker 1: more than one spot at once is commonly called super position. 315 00:21:30,520 --> 00:21:34,520 Speaker 1: It only collapses into a single state or position when 316 00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:41,400 Speaker 1: the systems observed. Everyone observing, even the most accomplished physicist, 317 00:21:41,920 --> 00:21:49,399 Speaker 1: can never precisely predict what state will will what the 318 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:53,680 Speaker 1: state will be when it collapses. And and some physicists 319 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:56,959 Speaker 1: believe a very controversial idea because we have to keep 320 00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: in mind, when you go far enough to the edge 321 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:03,000 Speaker 1: of physics, you in the realm of metaphysics, philosophy, and 322 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 1: sometimes spirituality. So some physicists for a long time believed 323 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:16,480 Speaker 1: that this collapse of superposition upon observation meant that consciousness 324 00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:21,000 Speaker 1: the mind itself, the software of the brain, not the hardware. 325 00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:28,600 Speaker 1: The presence of an observer caused right causation, caused the 326 00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,359 Speaker 1: superposition to collapse into a single point in space, time, 327 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 1: universe forty two, etcetera. This is weird because it implies 328 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:43,199 Speaker 1: some very strange things about time, things that we wish 329 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:49,399 Speaker 1: Einstein was here in our in our franchise of time 330 00:22:49,680 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: to to talk about and think about. Because you know, 331 00:22:52,400 --> 00:22:57,560 Speaker 1: to your earlier pointnal those quirky, quirky things about quantum mechanics, 332 00:22:57,640 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 1: spooky action at a distance entangled one bit of one 333 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:06,240 Speaker 1: bit of something on one side of the universe. It's 334 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:09,640 Speaker 1: very misleading way to describe the universe. But one bit 335 00:23:09,680 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 1: of something very far away uh turns left or up 336 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: or down in some direction, and then at the same time, 337 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: in an immensely uh far away place on the other 338 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:26,640 Speaker 1: side of the universe, the same thing happens. These are 339 00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:31,760 Speaker 1: these are connected, right, There's like a push pull symmetry. 340 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:36,400 Speaker 1: This is called spooky action because there's not a local 341 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: action that can explain it. But what if it is 342 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:46,920 Speaker 1: evidence of time symmetry. What if at this level of reality, 343 00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:50,880 Speaker 1: instead of flowing in one direction, a two B, two 344 00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:56,679 Speaker 1: C one to two to three time flows at the 345 00:23:56,760 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 1: same speed in multiple directions. What if, um, What if 346 00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 1: at the quantum level, time as we understand it flows 347 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:11,520 Speaker 1: in the past, the present, the future, all possible futures, 348 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:16,040 Speaker 1: all possible presence. What if on an extraordinarily fundamental level, 349 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:21,000 Speaker 1: time becomes less like an arrow shot to a particular 350 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 1: destination and more like the air through which that concept 351 00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 1: of an arrow moves. Yeah, I mean it seems like 352 00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:33,879 Speaker 1: quantum physics in general as a discipline, it seeks to 353 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:37,080 Speaker 1: explain this kind of phenomenon. Because you know, what we 354 00:24:37,240 --> 00:24:39,920 Speaker 1: heard from Lisa Ziga at the beginning of the episode 355 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: was what retro costality is not is the concept that 356 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:47,280 Speaker 1: a signal can be communicated from the future to the past. 357 00:24:47,359 --> 00:24:50,040 Speaker 1: It's more about the relationship of those two events and 358 00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:53,040 Speaker 1: less about like sending messages back and forth in time. 359 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,040 Speaker 1: I just wanted to put that out there again. Now 360 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: that's it's a good thing to keep in mind. I 361 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:01,560 Speaker 1: it's a massive tangent and I'm not going to go 362 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:06,480 Speaker 1: down into it, but this concept beend of time flowing 363 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:11,640 Speaker 1: and like in all directions equally. It reminds me of 364 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 1: the physical representations that UH, physicists and scientists used to 365 00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:21,359 Speaker 1: represent gravity. Um, when you know you you show like 366 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:28,520 Speaker 1: a essentially the warp of space time right, Um, it 367 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:31,439 Speaker 1: reminds me of that kind of only in the opposite 368 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 1: as in wherever the present is, wherever that is located, 369 00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,600 Speaker 1: like the moment of consciousness, of being aware. It feels 370 00:25:41,600 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 1: as though it's almost like in a mountaintop and then 371 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 1: in all directions is moving downwards and all of the 372 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:53,120 Speaker 1: various possibilities in all directions. Um, I don't know. It's 373 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 1: not a very good image, but I'm just imagining it 374 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,800 Speaker 1: in the same way we represent gravity and mass and 375 00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:04,840 Speaker 1: how that affects gravity. Like it's almost as if conscious 376 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:09,840 Speaker 1: awareness or observation is that same thing for time. You're 377 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 1: reading my mind. This was something I wanted to I 378 00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: was going to save till the end of the episode. 379 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 1: But I think we're we're on the edge of time 380 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:21,040 Speaker 1: now right. As a concept, it doesn't really matter apparently 381 00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:25,040 Speaker 1: when things happen. So so what I like about this 382 00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,200 Speaker 1: concept I think you and I are on the same 383 00:26:27,240 --> 00:26:32,520 Speaker 1: page here is that I you're you're talking about distortion, right, 384 00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 1: the way mass can distort gravity, right when you drop 385 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:41,800 Speaker 1: a ball onto a taut sheet. Right, So I was 386 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:44,920 Speaker 1: thinking of the same thing, and I had followed it 387 00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 1: down the rabbit hole of information as mass observation is mass. 388 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 1: So perhaps a specific event in what we understand as 389 00:26:57,280 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: living your time, perhaps the more it is observed, the 390 00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:04,320 Speaker 1: more concrete or quote unquote heavier it becomes, and the 391 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,920 Speaker 1: more it distorts, you know, that that sort of ambient 392 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 1: field or fertile soil of reality and time. I know. 393 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,760 Speaker 1: But so that's don't worry. We're getting to dreams. We're 394 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,160 Speaker 1: talking about this trippy stuff for a reason. In two 395 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 1: thousand and twelve, there was a physicist named q. Price 396 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 1: who claimed that if the strange things we know to 397 00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: be true about quantum states reflect something real, and if 398 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,600 Speaker 1: nothing restricts time to one direction, not the band, just 399 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 1: the direction of linear time, then the eight ball in 400 00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 1: our earlier example, in that pool hall cloud of maybes 401 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:55,919 Speaker 1: and what ifs, could theoretically roll out of the corner 402 00:27:55,960 --> 00:28:00,199 Speaker 1: pocket and knock the cue ball itself. I love is 403 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:02,360 Speaker 1: this so much in the in the way they talk 404 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 1: and the concepts that they that they have to attempt 405 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:09,680 Speaker 1: to distill for people like me who just don't get 406 00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:11,840 Speaker 1: it a lot of times. Well it's so interesting too, 407 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:13,479 Speaker 1: because so much of this stuff is like, you know, 408 00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:18,160 Speaker 1: thought experiments until it becomes real. Like I mean, even 409 00:28:18,200 --> 00:28:20,760 Speaker 1: like Einstein and his whole idea of quantum entanglement and 410 00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,040 Speaker 1: spooky action at a distance, he sort of wrote it 411 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,920 Speaker 1: off himself, was like, this is way too weird, and 412 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:28,200 Speaker 1: I'm going to kind of let this go. And then 413 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:32,560 Speaker 1: sure enough science came around a study shown that quantum 414 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,280 Speaker 1: entanglement very likely is a thing, very much in the 415 00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:37,760 Speaker 1: way Einstein envisioned it. But he had to have done 416 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,960 Speaker 1: it on a purely conceptual level at the time, because 417 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: it's not like it's something that could ever be tested, 418 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:44,760 Speaker 1: especially in those days. So it really is a whole 419 00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 1: different set of equipment that these folks have, you know 420 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: what I mean, that allows them to think in these 421 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:53,880 Speaker 1: purely conceptual realms that end up kind of connecting with 422 00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,000 Speaker 1: reality a lot of the time. It's it's it's fabulous, agreed, 423 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,760 Speaker 1: And this may seem like a tangent, but it is 424 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:05,200 Speaker 1: an important tangent, even if it does not seem immediately 425 00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:09,320 Speaker 1: related to dreams. What we're saying is that as you 426 00:29:09,360 --> 00:29:13,800 Speaker 1: are listening to this episode, some of the most intelligent 427 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 1: people in the world are arguing over the fundamental concept 428 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:24,080 Speaker 1: of linear time. Wow, I'm just trying to think all 429 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:26,480 Speaker 1: of the other things I have to do today, and 430 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 1: I'm wondering if they're actually gonna come later or maybe 431 00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:34,840 Speaker 1: already did them just tomorrow. Decide that you've done them 432 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:41,360 Speaker 1: tomorrow perfect or maybe because you are deciding that you 433 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,719 Speaker 1: maybe because tomorrow you are thinking of doing these and 434 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 1: remembering that you have done them, that means you've already 435 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,440 Speaker 1: done I don't you see the problem? If if, if 436 00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,960 Speaker 1: only it were so simple, and it absolutely isn't. And 437 00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:57,960 Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about why that is and how this 438 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,880 Speaker 1: connects up with dreams after one more quick sponsor break 439 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:14,040 Speaker 1: and we're back. Bell's theorem plays a big role here. 440 00:30:14,200 --> 00:30:18,200 Speaker 1: It's an idea proposed by one John Stewart Bell, the 441 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:21,760 Speaker 1: concept that bizarre things happening in quantum physics can never 442 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 1: be explained by actions taking place nearby. It's like we 443 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,960 Speaker 1: know that billiard balls are moving in all these different directions, 444 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 1: but we have no idea what's causing them. We don't 445 00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:35,959 Speaker 1: see the great Grand pool queue. I guess, which some 446 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,040 Speaker 1: people say is God. You know what I mean that's 447 00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 1: how that's how strange this stuff becomes the prime mover, right? 448 00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 1: Is that another name for God in the situation? And 449 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,680 Speaker 1: so this this leads us to ask, then what if 450 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:55,080 Speaker 1: we're what if we're looking in the wrong realm? What 451 00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 1: if the cause of these movements is not happening somewhere else, 452 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: somewhere nearby, but some when else? If causality, Yeah, if 453 00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:11,040 Speaker 1: causality runs backwards, it means that this particle can carry 454 00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,240 Speaker 1: the action of its measurement back in time too, when 455 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 1: it was originally entangled, affecting its partner, which is this other, 456 00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 1: this thing observed in another version of time. Anyway, this 457 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:26,040 Speaker 1: is all still considered fringe science, but the problem is real. 458 00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 1: We do not fully understand the actions of the quantum realm. 459 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:32,400 Speaker 1: And one of the things affecting our lack of understanding 460 00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:38,640 Speaker 1: maybe our assumption of linear time. So the big question 461 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 1: is what does this mean for dreams? Where does the 462 00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: brain come in? Is the brain somehow quantum? Uh? Well, 463 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: I mean it's made up of the same things that 464 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:56,200 Speaker 1: the poolballs are made of in our example, right, It's 465 00:31:56,240 --> 00:32:01,080 Speaker 1: all just a lot of atoms arranged very intricately in 466 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:09,640 Speaker 1: there at least I hope they're intricately arranged. Um m hmm, gosh. Okay, 467 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:14,080 Speaker 1: so we know that if if our cells are made 468 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:20,480 Speaker 1: up of atoms, and atoms follow these laws of quantum physics, um, 469 00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 1: even though we don't fully understand them, right, then yeah, 470 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:28,640 Speaker 1: our brains are quantum What a weird thought. I'm just 471 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,280 Speaker 1: gonna I'm just gonna sit here for a while and 472 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:36,120 Speaker 1: think about that. Yes, do we I mean, you're right, 473 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,800 Speaker 1: we're made of the same stuff right, The within our 474 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:44,440 Speaker 1: bodies are the building blocks of the stars and the cosmos, 475 00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:49,040 Speaker 1: dirt and everything else. But do we need quantum physics 476 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:54,000 Speaker 1: to explain this thing, this phenomenon that we call consciousness? 477 00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,640 Speaker 1: Right now, A lot of physicists and philosophers are gonna 478 00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: say no, because science is about explaining things in the 479 00:33:03,080 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: most efficacious, accurate, and simple way. Right. We talked about 480 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 1: brevity being the soul of wit in literature and in 481 00:33:14,400 --> 00:33:17,280 Speaker 1: the creative realm, but the realm of science takes it 482 00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:21,440 Speaker 1: to another level. People like Paul for the Guard, who 483 00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:25,400 Speaker 1: is a philosopher at the University of Waterloo, says there 484 00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:29,560 Speaker 1: is evidence building that says we can explain everything in 485 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:34,920 Speaker 1: the human mind in terms of interactions of neurons, So 486 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 1: we wouldn't need to add quantum physics and and the 487 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 1: dilemmas inherit in in this concept would need to add 488 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,760 Speaker 1: that to the engine for the engine to run and 489 00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:53,080 Speaker 1: for us to understand the process. It's like, if you 490 00:33:53,120 --> 00:33:57,160 Speaker 1: already have a working car, why would you add a 491 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:01,560 Speaker 1: another engine on top of right? Why why would you 492 00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:05,000 Speaker 1: need two engines if you can already drive with just one? 493 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 1: Because really fast, right, Because you think linear time exists, 494 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:17,120 Speaker 1: things can happen faster. So I mean, it's true. You're 495 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 1: right though, and this is of course a statement from 496 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,240 Speaker 1: a philosopher, but we we know physicists tend to agree 497 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:26,840 Speaker 1: that's right. And then we have David Deutsch, who is 498 00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:31,040 Speaker 1: a physicist at the University of Oxford, who says, quote, 499 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:35,319 Speaker 1: is there any need to invoke quantum physics to explain cognition? 500 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:37,919 Speaker 1: I don't know of one, and I'd be amazed if 501 00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 1: one emerges. That's interesting. He's sort of like putting these 502 00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,360 Speaker 1: in two distinctly different buckets um, So you kind of 503 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,920 Speaker 1: have two sides of that argument there. So if the 504 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:52,520 Speaker 1: brain does engage in any of this quantum you know 505 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:57,880 Speaker 1: shenaniganry Uh during what we call thought um. Then there's 506 00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:00,919 Speaker 1: a particularly popular theory about how all of this could 507 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:06,040 Speaker 1: go down, and it involves something called microtubules, which are 508 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 1: protein tubes that make up the neurons and in our 509 00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:12,640 Speaker 1: in our brains, in our bodies um, specifically the support 510 00:35:12,719 --> 00:35:17,680 Speaker 1: structures within neurons UM. And and that is what potentially 511 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:22,440 Speaker 1: quantum you know, physics would would enact upon um the 512 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:27,399 Speaker 1: idea that microtubules can exploit quantum physics quantum effects rather 513 00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:33,600 Speaker 1: to exist in superpositions of two different shapes at the 514 00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,759 Speaker 1: same time. UM. So this goes back to what you 515 00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,200 Speaker 1: were talking about earlier with the idea of superposition. We 516 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:42,360 Speaker 1: want to do a quick refresh on that. Well, you 517 00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:46,839 Speaker 1: can think about it quickly this way. Those neurons are 518 00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:50,880 Speaker 1: if if this is to be believed, all of your 519 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 1: neurons are simultaneously activated and not activated. If you think 520 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:58,520 Speaker 1: about it as an io switch or something a state 521 00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:02,239 Speaker 1: of being on or off. All of your neurons are 522 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:04,160 Speaker 1: both on and off at all times. That's what this 523 00:36:04,239 --> 00:36:07,680 Speaker 1: is essentially saying. Unless I'm getting that incorrect, it's yeah, 524 00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:12,960 Speaker 1: it's it's existing in multiple states that we would normally 525 00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:18,200 Speaker 1: think are mutually exclusive. Right, So each of these shapes 526 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:25,759 Speaker 1: in this theory amounts to a tiny bit of what 527 00:36:25,800 --> 00:36:29,319 Speaker 1: you're talking about, Matt, classical information. We would consider it. 528 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:35,200 Speaker 1: So this shape shifting quantum bit a cubit, Right, that's 529 00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,880 Speaker 1: the fundamental unit here. Uh, each of those can store 530 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:45,439 Speaker 1: twice as much information as their classical counterparts. And then 531 00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 1: we add entanglement to the mix. I would love to 532 00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: see this explained in the format of a of a 533 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:58,160 Speaker 1: YouTube cooking show. Right, So this is where someone sprinkles 534 00:36:58,200 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 1: in entanglement and starts during that stuff in. This is 535 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:06,800 Speaker 1: the feature we've been talking about that allows these units, 536 00:37:06,880 --> 00:37:10,799 Speaker 1: these cupid states, to remain intertwined even when they're not 537 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:15,600 Speaker 1: in local contact. That means that we can rapidly build 538 00:37:16,280 --> 00:37:19,840 Speaker 1: what's called quantum computer, something that can manipulate and store 539 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:24,839 Speaker 1: information far more efficiently than a classical computer. Because to 540 00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:29,560 Speaker 1: your point, Matt, they do not have to they do 541 00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:32,560 Speaker 1: not have to be restricted to a one zero one 542 00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 1: thing one at a time. So if retro causality is 543 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:41,280 Speaker 1: also in play, that means that these tiny, tiny, tiny tubes, 544 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 1: these tubes of protein that you just described, Nol, these 545 00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:49,839 Speaker 1: pieces of neuron structure could be interacting with time in 546 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:56,120 Speaker 1: a way that we do not understand. Fascinating, funky, an 547 00:37:56,160 --> 00:38:00,919 Speaker 1: amazing concept, also very far from proven as we as 548 00:38:00,920 --> 00:38:03,719 Speaker 1: we record this right now, all the quantum stuff we're 549 00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:10,880 Speaker 1: talking about is incredibly fragile. It's not it's not a 550 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:13,520 Speaker 1: house of cards in a windy room. A more accurate 551 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:19,440 Speaker 1: description would be like an upside down pyramid constructed out 552 00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:25,400 Speaker 1: of the idea where cards might sometime be balanced on 553 00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:29,520 Speaker 1: the nose of a blindfolded circus cloud with big clown 554 00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:32,840 Speaker 1: shoes writing a unicycle across a very high tight rope 555 00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,080 Speaker 1: for the very first time at their first day working 556 00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:41,240 Speaker 1: for the circus. The slightest change in anything will cause 557 00:38:41,280 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 1: a quantum state to break down, as far as we know. 558 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:49,000 Speaker 1: And here's the other thing about your brain, you guys, Um, 559 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:54,600 Speaker 1: it isn't exactly fit for this kind of quantum system, 560 00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:58,280 Speaker 1: at least from what we understand right now, right uh, 561 00:38:58,760 --> 00:39:01,640 Speaker 1: deep inside there in your head of years. You go ahead, 562 00:39:01,640 --> 00:39:03,319 Speaker 1: go ahead and feel it if you can, if you've 563 00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:06,560 Speaker 1: got a freehand. Um, that's just your skull. Remember that's 564 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:10,160 Speaker 1: the hard part inside there. It's really warm, it's wet, 565 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:14,759 Speaker 1: it's kind of gross, really um and it's just not 566 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:17,720 Speaker 1: suitable for any kind of quantum system to really survive 567 00:39:17,800 --> 00:39:21,839 Speaker 1: for any length of time. But again, that's our understanding 568 00:39:21,840 --> 00:39:25,080 Speaker 1: of matter and how quantum systems work right now, because 569 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:29,240 Speaker 1: it's what we have been able to achieve thus far. Yeah, 570 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:32,719 Speaker 1: and as we're recording this, they are numerous people who 571 00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:39,360 Speaker 1: are chasing down the possibilities right trying to determine whether 572 00:39:39,400 --> 00:39:42,200 Speaker 1: there is a possibility of a quantum state in the 573 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:47,480 Speaker 1: human brain. Well, one person particular note would be Matthew Fisher. 574 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,600 Speaker 1: Fisher is an expert in developing quantum computers and he 575 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: believes there is more to this story. If you're interested, 576 00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:58,880 Speaker 1: I highly recommend reading a little bit more about his 577 00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:05,000 Speaker 1: proposed experiments because we have to remember, as mentioned in 578 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:09,960 Speaker 1: a previous episode, science is a long conversation and it 579 00:40:10,080 --> 00:40:12,799 Speaker 1: argues with itself and there are many many things that 580 00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:17,239 Speaker 1: for one reason or another, our species rejected as nonsense, 581 00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:21,799 Speaker 1: only to later learn that those things are true. So 582 00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:27,200 Speaker 1: to bring it all back around precognitive dreams. There are 583 00:40:27,239 --> 00:40:32,120 Speaker 1: so many anecdotes, there's so many arguments, there's so many 584 00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:37,239 Speaker 1: fascinating experiments. I wanted to mention one that got me 585 00:40:37,320 --> 00:40:42,400 Speaker 1: involved in retroactive causality a number of years ago. You 586 00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:46,640 Speaker 1: guys have heard of mc sweeney's, right, yeah, so you 587 00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:49,960 Speaker 1: you've heard then of Walfen. I know I'm cheating. I 588 00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:51,760 Speaker 1: know you guys have heard about it because I wouldn't 589 00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:54,120 Speaker 1: shut up about it off air when I was very 590 00:40:54,160 --> 00:41:00,000 Speaker 1: into it. So Wolfen is sort of like a magazine 591 00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:05,400 Speaker 1: need of short films, and wolf Thin issue number seven 592 00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:12,279 Speaker 1: included a strange bonus, like a bonus article. There's a 593 00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:19,360 Speaker 1: bonus DVD that had a scientific experiment in retroactive causality. 594 00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:23,799 Speaker 1: And the idea was that you, without spoiling it, you 595 00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:30,480 Speaker 1: as the audience, the observer of the experiment that is 596 00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:36,440 Speaker 1: on this DVD, may somehow affect the results of the 597 00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:39,840 Speaker 1: experiment just by watching it. I still have it somewhere. 598 00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:41,319 Speaker 1: I'll send it to you guys if you want to, 599 00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:44,759 Speaker 1: if you want to check it out. It's it's controversial, 600 00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:49,440 Speaker 1: but you don't have to don't have to buy it, 601 00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:54,320 Speaker 1: just borrow it. But the but the idea here is 602 00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:58,880 Speaker 1: is that, um, we see experiments with this stuff. It's ongoing, 603 00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:02,000 Speaker 1: and we know with that people many listening in the 604 00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:05,920 Speaker 1: audience today do feel and do believe that they have 605 00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:13,680 Speaker 1: had some inexplicable encounter with reality through the world of dream. So, 606 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:18,560 Speaker 1: if retro causality is real, if time, as we understand it, 607 00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:21,919 Speaker 1: flows in more than one direction at the quantum level, 608 00:42:22,600 --> 00:42:26,920 Speaker 1: and if the neurons in the human brain function in 609 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:30,120 Speaker 1: some way like what we would call a quantum computer 610 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:33,680 Speaker 1: or a quantum system, a lot of ifs here, And 611 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:38,719 Speaker 1: if this system in a human brain is somehow able 612 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:45,440 Speaker 1: to not even communicate information, but to influence information on 613 00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 1: what we call the consciousness or the subconsciousness in an 614 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:54,800 Speaker 1: understandable way, then there may just be a theoretical way 615 00:42:54,840 --> 00:43:00,960 Speaker 1: for our brains to understand time beyond the concept of 616 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:05,239 Speaker 1: one second forward to the next. It took a long 617 00:43:05,280 --> 00:43:06,719 Speaker 1: time for us to get there, but we had to 618 00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:09,040 Speaker 1: lay out, we had to lay out the case. There 619 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:12,240 Speaker 1: is actual science, and that's really what this comes comes 620 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:16,200 Speaker 1: down to. There's already some science that appears to show 621 00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:21,280 Speaker 1: it could be true, which is, you know, fascinating hopeful 622 00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:24,760 Speaker 1: to me thinking that there might be a way for 623 00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:30,040 Speaker 1: us to uh see a mistake that's coming our way, 624 00:43:30,200 --> 00:43:34,280 Speaker 1: or to see, you know, to to help somebody who 625 00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:39,800 Speaker 1: may need our assistance and somehow we could be aware 626 00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:43,959 Speaker 1: of that through this connection in some way. I love. 627 00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:48,319 Speaker 1: I love the possibility that exists here and and just 628 00:43:48,400 --> 00:43:52,319 Speaker 1: knowing that if there's already science that's leaning, you know, 629 00:43:52,760 --> 00:43:55,000 Speaker 1: in this way, or at least hinting at this, then 630 00:43:55,040 --> 00:43:58,799 Speaker 1: it probably says that within you know, our lifetimes, we're 631 00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:02,279 Speaker 1: going to find out more and we're we we may 632 00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:05,400 Speaker 1: even be able to prove at some point that we 633 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:09,320 Speaker 1: are more deeply connected to each other and to ourselves 634 00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:13,400 Speaker 1: and to everything than we already understand. Yeah, that's the mission, 635 00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:18,719 Speaker 1: right to have to in some way illuminate a bit 636 00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:25,160 Speaker 1: more of this cavernous, strange thing called the universe, reality 637 00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:29,160 Speaker 1: and life as we know it, this giant shadowy Jim Bay, 638 00:44:29,200 --> 00:44:33,440 Speaker 1: that we all exist in the shadowy Jim Bay. I 639 00:44:33,520 --> 00:44:36,080 Speaker 1: love that. Such a vision. No, it's such a good 640 00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:39,759 Speaker 1: visual and it's fun to say in your lighting looks 641 00:44:39,800 --> 00:44:42,520 Speaker 1: really really awesome. This is a plug to check out 642 00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:46,600 Speaker 1: the YouTube channel, which has been resurrected if you are 643 00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:52,080 Speaker 1: listening in the audio version. So I have to ask. 644 00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:55,719 Speaker 1: I know that the three of us have various questions 645 00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:57,160 Speaker 1: that we want to ask each other. So I have 646 00:44:57,239 --> 00:45:02,640 Speaker 1: to ask you, guys, do you believe that precognitive dreams exist. 647 00:45:03,360 --> 00:45:06,680 Speaker 1: It's tough. It's tough for me. I would have to 648 00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:11,799 Speaker 1: say yes, because I have experienced a few things where 649 00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:17,359 Speaker 1: either I have been given information that I did not have, 650 00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:24,200 Speaker 1: or I came to information that I was seeking within 651 00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:30,160 Speaker 1: a dream state and and it you know, maybe maybe 652 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:33,840 Speaker 1: that is just my brain doing the de frag process 653 00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:37,840 Speaker 1: that we we talked about at the top of last episode, 654 00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:43,359 Speaker 1: but or maybe it is some connection that I don't 655 00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:50,920 Speaker 1: fully understand um, and it is some kind of precognitive situation. Honestly, 656 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:52,920 Speaker 1: I would have to say I would have to say, 657 00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:56,520 Speaker 1: oh God, this is the stance I always take. I 658 00:45:56,560 --> 00:45:59,080 Speaker 1: want to believe it so badly that I'm leaning towards 659 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:02,640 Speaker 1: thinking that something is there. I'm with it, man. I mean, 660 00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:04,680 Speaker 1: it's one of these things too, where it's so arrogant 661 00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:07,560 Speaker 1: of us. We don't understand this quantum physics stuff, and 662 00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:10,320 Speaker 1: we see the smartest people in the world like Einstein 663 00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:12,759 Speaker 1: kind of coming up with these concepts that can't be 664 00:46:12,840 --> 00:46:15,959 Speaker 1: tested and then maybe even abandoning them, and then later 665 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:18,279 Speaker 1: it turns out that oh he was onto something. So 666 00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:20,400 Speaker 1: it's like we were we are not even gonna be 667 00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:23,960 Speaker 1: around long enough potentially to see the stuff you know 668 00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:27,279 Speaker 1: fully play out as to whether there's truth to this 669 00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:30,040 Speaker 1: or not, or the way the human mind works, or 670 00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:31,920 Speaker 1: one of the ideas that we discussed on a recent 671 00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:37,120 Speaker 1: news episode about that sense of communicativeness between like, you know, beings, 672 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:40,160 Speaker 1: like like communicating through a look or knowing if someone 673 00:46:40,320 --> 00:46:42,279 Speaker 1: is uh is staring at you really hard. What was 674 00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:47,040 Speaker 1: the name of that. It was called morphic residents exactly. 675 00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:50,120 Speaker 1: I mean, that's you know, still on the fringes. But 676 00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:53,440 Speaker 1: I sent some truth to that, and I sent some 677 00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:57,200 Speaker 1: truth to this. How about you been? Uh, yeah, well 678 00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:00,359 Speaker 1: that's what I was getting to. There is no um. 679 00:47:00,360 --> 00:47:03,279 Speaker 1: There's one question that people keep missing when they talk 680 00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:07,920 Speaker 1: about precognitive dreams. Whether we consider ourselves skeptics, whether we 681 00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:13,880 Speaker 1: consider ourselves profits or oracles, or just people who know 682 00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:17,319 Speaker 1: there's more to the iceberg of reality than what we 683 00:47:17,400 --> 00:47:25,840 Speaker 1: see drifting above the surface. The question is this, if 684 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:31,200 Speaker 1: someone has a dream and they used what happened in 685 00:47:31,239 --> 00:47:36,839 Speaker 1: the dream to better their situation, right, avoiding the car 686 00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:40,640 Speaker 1: accident that we mentioned earlier, uh, staying away from that 687 00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,640 Speaker 1: dropping piano, which I don't think ever really happens. I 688 00:47:43,680 --> 00:47:45,560 Speaker 1: think that's a cartoon thing. But you know what I mean. 689 00:47:45,640 --> 00:47:50,040 Speaker 1: If if they have a dream and that dream helps 690 00:47:50,120 --> 00:47:53,480 Speaker 1: them somehow in the waking world, does it matter if 691 00:47:53,480 --> 00:47:56,600 Speaker 1: it's precognition, Does it matter if it's coincidence. Does it 692 00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:01,120 Speaker 1: matter if it's the brain playing the probability game? I 693 00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:04,880 Speaker 1: would argue No. I would argue it's very easy to 694 00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:10,320 Speaker 1: get lost in our own personal feelings about what quote 695 00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:15,320 Speaker 1: unquote psychic powers are. If it's like the Turing test, 696 00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:18,720 Speaker 1: kind of like whether or not something is a robot 697 00:48:19,040 --> 00:48:22,320 Speaker 1: or a human, whatever the whatever the behind the scenes 698 00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:27,719 Speaker 1: picture is, if you're still having a good conversation, it's 699 00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:32,359 Speaker 1: still a good conversation. All that being said, without um 700 00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:38,120 Speaker 1: it spend too much time talking about myself here. I 701 00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:43,919 Speaker 1: come from a long history of people who are absolutely 702 00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:49,880 Speaker 1: convinced that they do have some kind of precognitive dream capacity. 703 00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:54,120 Speaker 1: And I'll probably hear from extended family members when this 704 00:48:54,160 --> 00:48:58,640 Speaker 1: episode comes out, and they will probably not be super 705 00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,520 Speaker 1: happy with me for the way that we approach this. 706 00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:04,480 Speaker 1: Maybe they'll get in touch with you prior to the 707 00:49:04,520 --> 00:49:08,200 Speaker 1: episode coming out. That's right. If you can prove precognition, 708 00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:10,359 Speaker 1: we would love to hear from you right to us 709 00:49:10,360 --> 00:49:15,239 Speaker 1: on Friday, August one, will double check our inboxes that 710 00:49:15,400 --> 00:49:20,719 Speaker 1: day and let you know. Does that joke even work? 711 00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:23,360 Speaker 1: I think it does work. But but this is what 712 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:27,919 Speaker 1: this is. I think works better if you truly that 713 00:49:27,920 --> 00:49:32,120 Speaker 1: that was a joke, right, but truly if you are 714 00:49:32,200 --> 00:49:35,960 Speaker 1: experiencing us in some way right now as we were 715 00:49:36,200 --> 00:49:42,319 Speaker 1: as we record this on Friday August twenty one, this 716 00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:43,880 Speaker 1: is what I would say. If you have access to 717 00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:47,600 Speaker 1: a phone, give us a call. Our number is one 718 00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:51,879 Speaker 1: eight three three st d w y t K. Now, 719 00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:54,799 Speaker 1: it's really important. It's vitally important that you do this 720 00:49:55,120 --> 00:50:01,560 Speaker 1: on Friday August one. So any voicemails that come in today, 721 00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:03,680 Speaker 1: I'm checking them for you. I'm going to be listening 722 00:50:03,719 --> 00:50:08,319 Speaker 1: for you. Please do it brilliant. I love it. And 723 00:50:08,360 --> 00:50:12,399 Speaker 1: there's another thing we can check right now from you 724 00:50:13,200 --> 00:50:15,359 Speaker 1: social media. You can find us on Facebook, you can 725 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:18,000 Speaker 1: find us on Instagram. You can find us on Twitter 726 00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:22,160 Speaker 1: where we are conspiracy stuff. On Twitter and Facebook also 727 00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:25,759 Speaker 1: travel to Here's where it Gets Crazy, which has been 728 00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:29,840 Speaker 1: universally lauded by us as the best part of Facebook. 729 00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:33,360 Speaker 1: You can find us on Instagram where we're conspiracy Stuff 730 00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,480 Speaker 1: show and You can also find us should you choose 731 00:50:36,640 --> 00:50:40,279 Speaker 1: as individuals on the social meds. If you would like 732 00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:42,600 Speaker 1: to find me, I am at how now Noel Brown 733 00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:47,240 Speaker 1: on Instagram where I post stuff from my core life 734 00:50:47,280 --> 00:50:53,000 Speaker 1: and you know, um, music production and video game stuff, 735 00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:56,200 Speaker 1: my kids cosplays all that stuff. You can find them 736 00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:58,360 Speaker 1: exclusively on Instagram and it's kind of lurk on Twitter. 737 00:50:59,080 --> 00:51:03,320 Speaker 1: If you wish to free up your stream of various 738 00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:07,920 Speaker 1: posts on Instagram, you can follow me Matt Frederick underscore 739 00:51:07,960 --> 00:51:10,680 Speaker 1: I heeart as you will not see anything from me. 740 00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:14,879 Speaker 1: And if you are opposed to social media, if you 741 00:51:14,920 --> 00:51:20,560 Speaker 1: are against the idea of calling people on the phone, 742 00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:23,200 Speaker 1: if you've had a bad dream about it, but you 743 00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,520 Speaker 1: need to tell us and more importantly your fellow listeners 744 00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:31,440 Speaker 1: a story about dreams, some new information about the possibility 745 00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:35,279 Speaker 1: of precognitive dreams. You can always reach us via our 746 00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:39,279 Speaker 1: good old fashioned email address where we are conspiracy at 747 00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:44,680 Speaker 1: I Heart radio dot com. But wait, remember YouTube dot 748 00:51:44,719 --> 00:51:49,760 Speaker 1: com slash conspiracy stuff. Stay with me YouTube dot com 749 00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:54,440 Speaker 1: slash conspiracy stuff. Just think it all the time, know it, 750 00:51:54,880 --> 00:52:20,880 Speaker 1: feel it and festive. Yes, all right, that's it. Stuff 751 00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:22,799 Speaker 1: they don't want you to know is a production of 752 00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:25,800 Speaker 1: I heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, 753 00:52:25,960 --> 00:52:28,760 Speaker 1: visit the i heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever 754 00:52:28,880 --> 00:52:30,160 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.