WEBVTT - Bonus: The making of 'Nomadland' with director Chloé Zhao 0:00:03.080 --> 0:00:06.280 Hi everyone, I'm Katie Curic and this is next question. 0:00:07.160 --> 0:00:09.719 The Oscars are on the horizon, and though it's been 0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:12.680 a strange year for the movie industry, the race for 0:00:12.720 --> 0:00:17.320 the Golden Statue is nothing short of historic. Notably, there 0:00:17.400 --> 0:00:21.040 is not one, but two women nominated for Best Director, 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:24.200 and I know you're probably rolling your eyes at the 0:00:24.200 --> 0:00:28.960 Academy's glacial progressive pace, but it's at least a hopeful sign. 0:00:29.680 --> 0:00:34.720 Those historic directors are Emerald Finell, nominated for Promising Young Woman, 0:00:34.840 --> 0:00:39.480 starring Kerrie mulligan, and Chloe's Ou nominated for Nomad Land, 0:00:39.760 --> 0:00:43.480 which stars Frances McDorman as Fern, a woman living out 0:00:43.479 --> 0:00:47.040 of her van, traveling the country, working seasonal jobs and 0:00:47.120 --> 0:00:51.760 meeting a community of like minded itinerant Americans along the way. 0:00:52.159 --> 0:00:55.920 You are one of those lucky people who can travel anywhere. Yes, 0:00:56.560 --> 0:01:04.120 and they'll sometimes call you no maad my mom. So 0:01:04.319 --> 0:01:07.959 that's your homeless. Who's that true? No, I'm not homeless, 0:01:08.200 --> 0:01:14.360 I'm just houseless. Not the same thing, right. Chloe, I 0:01:14.360 --> 0:01:17.640 should note, is the first woman to receive four nominations 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:20.600 in a single year and the first non white woman 0:01:20.640 --> 0:01:24.320 to be nominated in the director category, and recently, I 0:01:24.360 --> 0:01:26.479 had the pleasure of speaking with Chloe, as well as 0:01:26.520 --> 0:01:31.039 three producers of Nomad Land, Peter Spears, Molly Asher, and 0:01:31.160 --> 0:01:38.640 Dan Jampi, about this extraordinarily beautiful and strangely prescient film. Peter, 0:01:38.760 --> 0:01:42.720 let me start with you. You and Francis option Nomad Land, 0:01:42.880 --> 0:01:46.640 Surviving American the twenty one Century, Frances mcdormomand, who also 0:01:46.680 --> 0:01:49.200 stars in the film. It was written by someone named 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:52.440 Jessica Brewder, And I'm curious what made you believe that 0:01:52.520 --> 0:01:55.880 this could be translated into film and would actually make 0:01:55.920 --> 0:02:00.600 a really compelling movie. Well, when it was sent to us, uh, 0:02:00.720 --> 0:02:05.320 we read it with an eye to something that Francis 0:02:05.400 --> 0:02:09.040 might play herself in the movie. But Linda May, who 0:02:09.120 --> 0:02:14.080 is the main character of the book, uh, is also 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.760 in our film. But the book itself follows sort of 0:02:17.800 --> 0:02:21.400 the journey of Linda from unemployment to eventually buying some 0:02:21.520 --> 0:02:25.880 land and making an earthship on that land. And I 0:02:25.919 --> 0:02:30.359 think what both Francis and I responded to in that 0:02:30.480 --> 0:02:35.560 book felt like a bit of a flare going up 0:02:36.120 --> 0:02:40.359 while in a warning to us all that that there was, 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:42.440 as it says in the book that the Titanic is 0:02:42.480 --> 0:02:46.680 going down and that we needed to get the lifeboats ready. 0:02:46.760 --> 0:02:49.200 And I know that the book itself takes place in 0:02:50.000 --> 0:02:52.000 two thousand and eleven, in the in the wake of 0:02:52.040 --> 0:02:56.720 the two thousand and eight recession, but something really felt 0:02:56.760 --> 0:02:59.519 prescient about it in the reading of it in two 0:02:59.560 --> 0:03:03.840 thousands sent team and it felt like, really was something 0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:07.480 afoot in a way that I think we all came 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:12.880 to realize in the ensuing year was even more widespread 0:03:12.960 --> 0:03:16.280 and deeper than than we had ever had the ability 0:03:16.280 --> 0:03:19.000 to look into a crystal ball and see and when 0:03:19.040 --> 0:03:22.360 you think about Dan, what that was, you know, and 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:27.320 what this this whole population represented, you know what struck 0:03:27.440 --> 0:03:31.440 you about the message that that their way of life 0:03:31.639 --> 0:03:35.640 and their situation was sending that that Peter talked about. 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:40.040 But the moment that I became involved in the film, 0:03:40.160 --> 0:03:44.240 Chloe had a very specific vision for the movie and 0:03:44.560 --> 0:03:49.160 one of the primary um one of the primary adaptations 0:03:49.160 --> 0:03:53.040 that Chloe made was creating the character of Firm in 0:03:53.120 --> 0:03:56.920 collaboration with Francis. And so at the moment that we 0:03:57.040 --> 0:04:00.120 entered the film, there was this notion of for and 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:03.000 going on a journey through the American West following these 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:07.600 various jobs, and so cinematically. For me, I was quite 0:04:07.720 --> 0:04:11.640 drawn to the idea of new, a new entry from 0:04:11.720 --> 0:04:16.040 Chloe into the American road movie and into the American Western. 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:20.000 And I felt that Chloe's approach to this, for me, 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:23.560 I was as much influenced by playing with classic genres 0:04:23.560 --> 0:04:27.800 of American cinema and radically new ways. So fascinating. And 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:29.960 I'm going to talk to Chloe about her vision in 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:32.320 a moment. But Molly, I'm just curious when you got 0:04:32.520 --> 0:04:34.960 involved in this project, and I think I'm a pretty 0:04:35.000 --> 0:04:40.159 well read person, I didn't realize that there were all 0:04:40.200 --> 0:04:44.400 these nomads traveling across the country from place to place, 0:04:44.480 --> 0:04:48.640 from job to job, from location to location, um, you know, 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:55.119 really making this very charipatetic life for themselves. And I'm curious, Molly, 0:04:55.200 --> 0:05:00.080 if you were aware of this segment of the population. No, Oh, 0:05:00.160 --> 0:05:03.080 I wasn't at all, and you know, not until reading 0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:06.200 the book and then even more so how striking it 0:05:06.320 --> 0:05:08.840 was then meeting Swanky and then the may and Bob 0:05:08.839 --> 0:05:12.320 Wells and realizing that, like I think what people, the 0:05:12.320 --> 0:05:14.920 notion people might have of someone who lives in their 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:17.680 van is very different. You know, this could be somebody 0:05:17.720 --> 0:05:20.359 who's sitting next to you at a restaurant, or behind 0:05:20.400 --> 0:05:22.360 you in line at the bank, or you know, it's 0:05:22.480 --> 0:05:31.320 it's um. I found that fascinating and also really um warming. Yeah. 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:34.120 You know, initially you think, oh, you'll feel sorry for 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:36.520 these people, and then you receive the way that they're 0:05:36.560 --> 0:05:40.200 living and how connected they are to both the land 0:05:40.320 --> 0:05:43.160 and ultimately each other. And then I think it gives 0:05:43.200 --> 0:05:46.039 you a brand new perspective. I know, Peter, you and 0:05:46.120 --> 0:05:50.240 Francis or Francis rather was at the Toronto Film Festival 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:55.280 and you saw the work of a remarkable, uh young 0:05:55.400 --> 0:06:02.400 filmmaker who's drinking her tea right now. Francis came back 0:06:02.440 --> 0:06:05.760 and said, I think we found our director. What was 0:06:05.800 --> 0:06:08.080 it about Chloe in that work? And I promised Chloe, 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:13.240 I'm going to get team the next your time. But 0:06:13.400 --> 0:06:16.159 what was it about Chloe's work? I believe it was 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:19.839 a film called Writer. I think the Writer, Yes, and 0:06:20.120 --> 0:06:23.200 Molly was the producer on that as well, and uh, 0:06:23.440 --> 0:06:27.039 you know, we had really never seen anything quite like it, 0:06:27.080 --> 0:06:30.400 and mine and Francis's experience we had come up in 0:06:30.440 --> 0:06:36.520 a more traditional filmmaking storytelling away and it just it 0:06:36.560 --> 0:06:41.880 blew our socks. Off. We we really were both mesmerized 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:47.920 by the uh proficient UM way of storytelling, but also 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:53.479 how immersive the experience was and how strong the filmmaker's 0:06:53.480 --> 0:06:55.400 point of view was. And that's always what you're looking 0:06:55.400 --> 0:06:58.520 for when you're looking, uh to find a director for 0:06:58.560 --> 0:07:02.200 a project. And so we reached out to Chloe. We met. 0:07:02.240 --> 0:07:05.520 The three of us, Chloe, Francis, and I met on 0:07:05.560 --> 0:07:09.120 the afternoon of the Independent Spirit Awards in Los Angeles 0:07:09.160 --> 0:07:11.680 that year. All three of us had been working on 0:07:11.760 --> 0:07:14.480 separate films. UH. I was coming off Called Me by 0:07:14.480 --> 0:07:17.520 Your Name, and Francis doing three Billboards and and Chloe 0:07:17.600 --> 0:07:20.880 was just beginning UH with Molly the The The Ride. 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:23.040 You know, these sort of awards season right for for 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:27.000 the writer. And we decided then and there that we 0:07:27.040 --> 0:07:29.000 wanted to make this film. But it was Chloe who 0:07:29.040 --> 0:07:32.840 suggested to us that instead of a straightforward adaptation, perhaps 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:35.160 the movie was more in the style of of the 0:07:35.200 --> 0:07:38.520 way she had made her earlier two movies and UH 0:07:38.560 --> 0:07:41.080 and we were very, very excited, And the next day 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:43.600 she was off packed her car and was driving to 0:07:43.640 --> 0:07:47.440 the Rubber Tramp Rendezvous to meet Bob Wells and Linda 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.040 and all the folks there and uh, we were off 0:07:50.080 --> 0:07:54.080 and running. So Chloe, finally, um, tell me when you 0:07:54.520 --> 0:07:57.120 first of all, when you get when you met with 0:07:57.120 --> 0:08:00.880 Peter and Francis. I'm such a huge Francis M. Dormant fan. 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:04.760 I love her work. I admire everything about her and 0:08:05.000 --> 0:08:08.960 had the the privilege of interviewing her on multiple occasions. 0:08:09.000 --> 0:08:11.880 And I'm just curious when you were sitting there talking 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:16.560 with them, I mean, how cool was that? Chloe? You 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:19.240 have interviewed her, you know, you know, you can't keep 0:08:19.240 --> 0:08:22.440 your eyes off of her. She has that she has 0:08:22.440 --> 0:08:25.080 that ability to just draw you in, you know, because 0:08:25.080 --> 0:08:29.040 she is very, very curious about people and about the 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:31.480 world around her, which makes her makes her not only 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:34.520 great actress, but a really great producer in that sense. 0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:37.200 I think instinctually when she saw the writer, she thought, oh, 0:08:37.240 --> 0:08:40.520 maybe there's another way to to to do this, you know, 0:08:40.640 --> 0:08:43.440 So it was it was exciting. So when you thought 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:49.240 about us not doing a straightforward adaptation, but doing something 0:08:49.320 --> 0:08:54.840 altogether different and so visually I think original. Tell me 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:59.079 when when you when you first conceived of that, how 0:08:59.120 --> 0:09:02.200 would you describe the way you wanted this film to 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:05.439 unfold and the way you wanted to share the stories 0:09:05.960 --> 0:09:10.240 of the nomads in it, including firm of course, Well 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:13.959 for me making these decisions are we're such um, we're 0:09:14.000 --> 0:09:17.760 always such a god. Feeling very hard to pimp on 0:09:17.880 --> 0:09:21.959 why and how until later when the film is done, 0:09:22.280 --> 0:09:25.280 And why I realized when normal and went out into 0:09:25.320 --> 0:09:28.440 the world is that people really take away different things, 0:09:29.280 --> 0:09:33.360 drastically different messages from the film and different experiences. And 0:09:33.400 --> 0:09:35.439 that's how I felt when I was reading the book. 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:38.680 Looking back at it, it wasn't just one thing, you 0:09:38.720 --> 0:09:42.719 know there because Jessica did a great job of capturing. Yes, 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:46.280 there was an event that led to everyone in the 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:48.720 book to to make choices and or or to have 0:09:48.840 --> 0:09:52.319 to to do something different with their lives, but that 0:09:52.360 --> 0:09:55.960 brings out different humanity and different kind of human struggle 0:09:56.200 --> 0:09:59.720 in each of them, and that diversity was so interesting 0:09:59.720 --> 0:10:01.920 to me that I didn't want to I want us 0:10:01.920 --> 0:10:04.360 to be able to create a character that can allow 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:07.800 me to bring as many aspects of that those stories 0:10:08.160 --> 0:10:13.400 as possible. You see that this is my husband's old 0:10:13.400 --> 0:10:15.680 fishing box. I put this whole latch on it, and 0:10:15.679 --> 0:10:18.800 then when I opened it, the stopper holds it and 0:10:19.120 --> 0:10:22.640 creates more counter space, and then I keep my really 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:25.640 nice stuff inside my dishes that my dad gave me. 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:29.040 He collected theesel into may from yard sales, and when 0:10:29.080 --> 0:10:31.600 I graduated from high school, he gave me the whole set. 0:10:32.920 --> 0:10:37.360 Is it that great? Yeah, it's called Automn. I don't 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:39.520 have that many pieces with me. But you know what 0:10:39.679 --> 0:10:45.840 did you name your van Vanguard? Ah? That is very strong? 0:10:46.240 --> 0:10:51.800 She is. Mhm. It's such a quiet, contemplative movie, which 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:55.360 I think the power is almost in the the quiet 0:10:55.440 --> 0:10:59.920 of the film. And uh and and I think Fern 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:05.600 character remains somewhat an enigma throughout it. Um, kind of 0:11:05.720 --> 0:11:08.760 understanding her and her motivations, you kind of put the 0:11:08.800 --> 0:11:14.480 pieces together. But um, how much was Francis involved with 0:11:14.679 --> 0:11:19.559 really kind of infusing Burn? Because Burn is a little 0:11:19.600 --> 0:11:24.440 bit of Francis, and Francis is a little bit of Fern, right, Chloe, Yeah, 0:11:24.440 --> 0:11:26.320 I think friend said she takes a little bit of 0:11:26.360 --> 0:11:29.839 a character that she played with her every time. So 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:32.120 now so in a way, Firn is also a little 0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:35.040 bit of every character she's ever played, so because she 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:39.200 really lives her art, you know, so, I think she 0:11:39.280 --> 0:11:42.040 always said I didn't become an actual stuff my pictures taken. 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:46.040 I think I'm actress to to live different lives. And 0:11:46.160 --> 0:11:49.679 Frannon was very much involved in creating firm the way 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:54.000 that I really heavily on the non professional actors that 0:11:54.080 --> 0:11:57.760 work with in creating their characters. Uh yeah, so everything 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:02.160 from the way she moved her her outfit to her hair, 0:12:02.360 --> 0:12:04.959 to the things that she bring into the vent, which 0:12:05.120 --> 0:12:07.760 if you only bring fifties things with you, they say 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:10.040 a lot about who you are. And that was a 0:12:10.080 --> 0:12:14.680 big part of friends contribution as well. I'm curious about 0:12:15.000 --> 0:12:19.960 working with performers and non actors. And and I know 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:23.480 that there were some people from the book Swanky I 0:12:23.520 --> 0:12:26.400 know and Linda May were in the book Nomad Land, 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:28.600 which I'm dying to read, which I haven't read but 0:12:28.640 --> 0:12:33.080 I'm going to read. But um, you found them because 0:12:33.160 --> 0:12:37.040 they were characters, as as we mentioned in Jessica Brewder's book. 0:12:37.480 --> 0:12:40.480 But there were also a lot of other characters as well. 0:12:41.040 --> 0:12:44.480 And I'm curious, who have you really had to I know, 0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:48.280 all of you in a way embedded yourselves into these worlds, 0:12:48.360 --> 0:12:52.679 into these communities, almost as if you were making a documentary. 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:54.920 And in some ways it was a weird. I think 0:12:55.040 --> 0:12:59.720 hybrid of both film and documentary UM and and how 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:03.839 challenging was that to a when the trust of those 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:06.840 people and a film and these real locations where you 0:13:06.960 --> 0:13:11.280 had a lot of authenticity about the life they were leading. 0:13:11.600 --> 0:13:13.720 I think well as far as like how the how 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:16.760 the other UM actors came to be, there was kind 0:13:16.760 --> 0:13:18.720 of we did it in sort of three different ways. 0:13:19.160 --> 0:13:21.360 One of them is that we had you know, traditional 0:13:21.360 --> 0:13:24.520 sort of open calls in various areas. And then we 0:13:24.600 --> 0:13:27.960 also had UM two people who were doing local casting, 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:32.319 and they were actually also combining location scouting and local 0:13:32.360 --> 0:13:34.960 casting um and in that sense, so that's that's actually 0:13:34.960 --> 0:13:38.359 how we found Derek the Young Traveler in the film UM. 0:13:38.400 --> 0:13:41.800 And then the other part was just specifically for the 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:45.960 r TR was you know, get getting getting advice from 0:13:46.400 --> 0:13:50.040 Linda May, Swanky, Jessica possibly other nomads that might like 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:52.800 to be in the film, reaching out and then and 0:13:52.800 --> 0:13:55.720 then sort of you know, becoming part becoming part of 0:13:55.720 --> 0:13:57.800 the community as much as we could, which is I 0:13:57.840 --> 0:14:01.120 think then how UM there was this this trust and 0:14:01.160 --> 0:14:05.240 comfortable feeling once we run set and working with everyone. 0:14:05.280 --> 0:14:07.360 I actually think that is also a really good at 0:14:07.600 --> 0:14:12.880 talking about better than me this fine line between the 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:16.599 documentary aspect and the fictional aspect, which the trick is 0:14:16.640 --> 0:14:19.760 always making you feel like it feels like a documentary, 0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:21.520 but it actually the work went into it is not 0:14:21.680 --> 0:14:26.760 like that at all. Damn sure. Yeah, and Chloe, I 0:14:26.800 --> 0:14:30.720 think it's one of your The most miraculous aspects of 0:14:30.760 --> 0:14:34.280 how you make movies is for me, the degree to 0:14:34.320 --> 0:14:37.840 which you give people an experience as if this is 0:14:37.880 --> 0:14:40.760 really happening. That's that's the magic trick, is that the 0:14:40.840 --> 0:14:44.240 end result is the movie feels lived in. And I 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:48.240 think when people talk about documentary, they're talking about a 0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:51.680 sense of, um, a notion of this is the world 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:53.600 that we live in, this is a real world. And 0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:56.880 I think that that's absolutely a goal of the work 0:14:57.040 --> 0:15:01.000 is to give the end result. From a production standpoint, 0:15:01.360 --> 0:15:04.000 I think that we actually there's an unbelief. Like any 0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:06.840 great magic trick, there's an unbelievable amount of things happening 0:15:07.360 --> 0:15:10.720 off stage, blow stage, and with the group around us 0:15:10.920 --> 0:15:15.240 kind of end up without illusion. Um. So the best 0:15:15.280 --> 0:15:19.120 example is the RTR festival that's in our movie is 0:15:19.160 --> 0:15:23.200 actually a staged RTR. And I think that what's interesting 0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:26.240 about this way of making movies is like any great 0:15:26.280 --> 0:15:30.040 magic trick, the boundaries start to get blurred. So you 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:33.760 stage in our tr means you you cast the performers, 0:15:34.240 --> 0:15:37.040 you bring them to a site that you control, but 0:15:37.080 --> 0:15:39.880 then the performers end up actually end up having their 0:15:39.920 --> 0:15:43.320 own r TR. And then on top of that, Chloe 0:15:43.320 --> 0:15:48.640 and Josh's shooting style is actually very fiction cinema based, 0:15:49.200 --> 0:15:52.160 like the references that they would use, like Chloe, the 0:15:52.200 --> 0:15:53.920 one that's always stood out to me as One car 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:56.440 Wise Happy Together, which is one of my favorite movies, 0:15:57.120 --> 0:16:00.800 are your your visual language references are not documentary cinema 0:16:00.800 --> 0:16:04.880 at all. It's actual narrative storytelling and then combined with 0:16:04.920 --> 0:16:07.480 your incredible sense of how the footage is going to 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:10.800 end up in the edit. So I think that the 0:16:10.840 --> 0:16:14.760 whole experience is about creating an infrastructure to end up 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:18.080 with that magic trick of and and I would add 0:16:18.120 --> 0:16:21.080 to that that meanwhile, while all that's going on, Chloe 0:16:21.120 --> 0:16:25.200 has created this bond with the not with the performers 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:29.400 Francis and David, but and also the non performers. Where 0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:32.160 because the footprint of the movie and the crew is 0:16:32.200 --> 0:16:36.240 so small, because we've all been living together for so long, uh, 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:41.000 that they trust implicitly and so with compassion and pat 0:16:41.040 --> 0:16:44.680 patients and and the ability to just want to listen 0:16:44.720 --> 0:16:48.880 and hear the stories from, you know, just the deepest 0:16:48.920 --> 0:16:52.640 parts of their beings they that they offer up. Uh. 0:16:52.680 --> 0:16:54.640 And with the camera there and all the other things, 0:16:54.720 --> 0:16:57.400 it's it's it melts away. And I see performers who 0:16:57.440 --> 0:17:01.280 have performed for decades who who don't have the kind 0:17:01.280 --> 0:17:04.080 of comfort that that Chloe is able to create in 0:17:04.119 --> 0:17:06.600 the space for for non performers and performers alike. And 0:17:06.760 --> 0:17:08.720 that's the last part I think of the magic trick 0:17:08.800 --> 0:17:12.080 that Chloe does. I'm gonna be seventy five this year, 0:17:12.800 --> 0:17:15.160 and i think I've lived a pretty good life. I've 0:17:15.160 --> 0:17:20.280 seen some really neat things kayaking all those places, and 0:17:20.320 --> 0:17:23.479 you know, like moose in the wild, a moose family 0:17:23.720 --> 0:17:30.000 on a river in Idaho, and um, big white pelicans 0:17:30.080 --> 0:17:32.640 landing just six ft over my kayak on a lake 0:17:32.680 --> 0:17:39.639 in Colorado. Or um come around it been was a 0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:42.639 cliff and find hundreds and hundreds of swallow nests on 0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:45.159 the on the wall of the cliff, and the swallows 0:17:45.200 --> 0:17:48.960 flying all around and reflecting in the water. So it 0:17:49.000 --> 0:17:51.720 looks like I'm flying with the swallows, and they're under 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:54.520 me and over me and all around me, and little 0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:57.280 babies are hatching out and eggshells are falling out of 0:17:57.280 --> 0:17:59.320 the nest, landing on the water and floating on the 0:17:59.320 --> 0:18:02.639 water these little white chills. It was like, it's just 0:18:02.720 --> 0:18:05.480 so awesome. I felt like I've done enough. My life 0:18:05.560 --> 0:18:08.479 was complete If I died right right then that moment 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:13.600 perfectly fine. And when they're speaking, a lot of it 0:18:13.640 --> 0:18:17.879 is is it not scripted? It's just them telling their stories. 0:18:18.040 --> 0:18:21.320 Chloe about who they are and what their wishes are, 0:18:21.320 --> 0:18:26.719 and Linda May talking about her situation or Swanky and 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:30.760 you know, all the different people. Kind of I'm just 0:18:30.840 --> 0:18:34.000 curious how much of it was action that you just 0:18:34.119 --> 0:18:37.439 kind of set up and let the let the people 0:18:37.560 --> 0:18:42.160 go with it and share, or how much it was actually, 0:18:42.880 --> 0:18:46.879 you know, orchestrated dialogue. I got the feeling and maybe 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:49.879 this is part of the magic too, that it was 0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:55.119 just people talking about their lives and somehow it all 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:59.719 just worked together beautifully. Can you explain how that worked? 0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:04.840 That that somehow is the uh, the magic trick part, 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:08.360 Because if you just show up and have people talk 0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:10.880 about their lives, what you're gonna end up is our. 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:13.280 I mean, hundreds of hours of footage has had nothing 0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:16.719 to do with your film. So the process is actually 0:19:16.720 --> 0:19:18.840 really straightforward. People ask me how do you work with 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:22.480 non professional actors? I said, you start with the writing, right. 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:26.440 You have to know for a movie what's the main 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:30.600 emotional art, and then you need to pick moments that 0:19:30.640 --> 0:19:33.960 are going to supplement this main emotional arc. You can't 0:19:34.000 --> 0:19:36.200 go off, you know, Linda main swan Ki talking about 0:19:36.200 --> 0:19:38.520 something nothing to do with the Ferns plot, but it 0:19:38.640 --> 0:19:41.280 has to have something to do with Firn's plot on 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:44.959 the very deep level. So then you pick your non 0:19:45.000 --> 0:19:47.560 professional actors. First of all, they have to be okay 0:19:47.600 --> 0:19:50.000 on a camera. You put a camera on them right away, 0:19:50.119 --> 0:19:52.280 let them speak and see if there I can't do 0:19:52.359 --> 0:19:56.360 it right and uh and so then when and then 0:19:56.400 --> 0:19:59.320 you spend days with them and sometimes just a few 0:19:59.320 --> 0:20:01.920 hours because us all the time we have. And then 0:20:02.240 --> 0:20:07.240 you you listen really really carefully of what they're really 0:20:07.280 --> 0:20:10.920 trying to say about themselves, and then you do a 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:12.919 lot of that too. You know, I'm sure you know 0:20:13.000 --> 0:20:14.719 what how that feels that you have to really go 0:20:14.800 --> 0:20:18.480 beyond because people have a lot of wars they put up. 0:20:18.840 --> 0:20:20.480 And then that's where you have to push a little 0:20:20.520 --> 0:20:24.320 further and go, but tell me about that day. And 0:20:24.359 --> 0:20:26.320 then and then when you hear these things and you 0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:28.280 go out, that is really going to that's going to 0:20:28.400 --> 0:20:31.960 represent what who they really want to say about who 0:20:31.960 --> 0:20:35.159 they are. And then that's also gonna work for first 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:37.800 Journey because the audience has to care in that moment 0:20:38.200 --> 0:20:40.400 because they're invested in furns, so they have to care 0:20:40.480 --> 0:20:42.959 what Swan kid is going to say for that moment 0:20:43.040 --> 0:20:48.879 to feel emotional. So I put those words, those specific 0:20:49.000 --> 0:20:52.560 lines onto the script and then my DP is gonna 0:20:52.600 --> 0:20:54.919 read it, and and you know, my producer gonna they 0:20:54.960 --> 0:20:57.000 are gonna read it and go and my my sound 0:20:57.240 --> 0:21:00.520 you know wolf are our sound recorders make He's gonna 0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:02.639 read it. We're all gonna come come to the place 0:21:02.680 --> 0:21:06.879 and go, how do we cinematically best put this moment 0:21:06.920 --> 0:21:10.560 on screen? And now that day, Swanky already know this 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:13.560 part of her own life. That's when instead of hiring 0:21:13.600 --> 0:21:17.040 an actor who talked to Swanky and and do the scenes, 0:21:17.440 --> 0:21:19.720 She's going to do it herself. So on that day 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:23.720 for her, you know, the producers has created environment where 0:21:23.920 --> 0:21:26.920 I feel that it's just in her space that she's 0:21:26.960 --> 0:21:29.000 not being asked to come to a stage. You know, 0:21:29.160 --> 0:21:31.680 with all these lights on her. Our DP has done 0:21:31.720 --> 0:21:33.760 a great job, our sound makes us done a great job, 0:21:33.760 --> 0:21:36.399 And in that moment, she's feels like she's just living 0:21:36.440 --> 0:21:40.800 her own story. But everything else around her is carefully 0:21:40.800 --> 0:21:44.400 planned so that you could make into the film later. 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:46.720 I'm meaning something. I learned that from my first film, 0:21:47.080 --> 0:21:51.119 where I thought spontaneous means not planning, and I mean, like, 0:21:51.200 --> 0:21:53.000 you know, go with the flow, let's just show up 0:21:53.000 --> 0:21:54.960 and do it. And then when I also work on 0:21:55.000 --> 0:21:58.120 the edit my first film and realized it's great stuff, 0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:00.159 but it had nothing to do with the film, and 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:05.240 no one's gonna care. So we'll be right back with 0:22:05.400 --> 0:22:20.160 more Nomad Land in just a moment. I know you've 0:22:20.160 --> 0:22:24.080 all traveled all over. It was shot over six months 0:22:24.400 --> 0:22:28.040 in starting in September two thous eighteen in South Dakota 0:22:28.119 --> 0:22:30.080 for the scenes in the bad Lands and at Wall 0:22:30.200 --> 0:22:37.959 Drug then onto Nebraska, Nevada, UH, the Northern California Coast, Yuma, Arizona, 0:22:38.080 --> 0:22:41.920 and then San Bernardino County. Was it tough moving around 0:22:42.000 --> 0:22:46.399 so much? I know you worked with a pretty small crew. Um, 0:22:46.440 --> 0:22:48.439 and I also know that you kind of lived the 0:22:48.480 --> 0:22:51.800 way the Nomads lived in the process of making this film, 0:22:51.840 --> 0:22:55.359 which must have brought you even closer to to the 0:22:55.480 --> 0:23:00.359 story and to the narrative. But was that challenge Peter 0:23:00.520 --> 0:23:07.840 just slept in all of the country right specifically, was 0:23:07.840 --> 0:23:14.120 it was it hard for you? Uh? You know, I 0:23:14.160 --> 0:23:16.840 think I jokingly say I'm the only eagle scout in 0:23:16.880 --> 0:23:19.800 the world who ever managed to get a badge without camping. 0:23:20.440 --> 0:23:24.479 You know, it was that never my thing, but I 0:23:24.480 --> 0:23:28.880 immediately Chloe had this idea with in conjunction with all 0:23:28.920 --> 0:23:33.440 the producers that because she and Molly uh and and 0:23:33.640 --> 0:23:37.280 Josh the DP had had made movies together before the 0:23:37.320 --> 0:23:41.080 rest of us were new to this process and and 0:23:41.160 --> 0:23:43.679 she needed to quickly kind of get us up and 0:23:43.800 --> 0:23:45.800 running in the style of of how we were gonna 0:23:45.800 --> 0:23:48.600 make this movie so that that hitting together in September. 0:23:48.680 --> 0:23:52.480 Beside needing some summer shots seasonally, she also had had 0:23:52.480 --> 0:23:54.679 the thought that this would be a good boot camp 0:23:54.800 --> 0:23:58.600 for for us all to learn her the language of 0:23:58.600 --> 0:24:01.080 how she does this and to learn about you know, magic, 0:24:01.119 --> 0:24:04.920 our hustle and all the other sorts of components, So 0:24:04.960 --> 0:24:07.119 that when we got to the winter part of the movie, 0:24:07.160 --> 0:24:09.800 which was going to be a lot more extreme and 0:24:10.080 --> 0:24:14.479 shorter days, colder days, and much more emotional material we 0:24:14.480 --> 0:24:17.359 were going to be dealing with, we had we had 0:24:17.400 --> 0:24:19.800 a little more of that muscle memory that the rest 0:24:19.800 --> 0:24:22.320