Speaker 1: This is Out of the Shadows, a podcast about America's
Speaker 1: tangled history of immigration.
Speaker 2: I'm Patti Rodriguez America LINDO.
Speaker 1: Last season, we tackled Ronald Reagan's nineteen eighty six Amnesty Act.
Speaker 1: This season, we're tracing the origins of DACA, or Deferred
Speaker 1: Action for Childhood Arrivals, a contentious executive order to protect
Speaker 1: on documentary young people from being.
Speaker 2: Deported issued by former President Barack Obama in twenty twelve.
Speaker 2: DACA was meant to be a temporary stop gap on
Speaker 2: a broken immigration system. It was like putting a bucket
Speaker 2: under a leaky roof, But with multiple Supreme Court challenges
Speaker 2: and looming presidential elections, the roof feels like it may
Speaker 2: collapse at any moment, impacting the US economy and American
Speaker 2: culture as we know it.
Speaker 3: Meanwhile, the future.
Speaker 2: Of millions of lives aims in the balance.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Out of the Shadows, Dreamers. In twenty thirteen,
Speaker 1: a year after DOCA was announced, many people, including those
Speaker 1: who fought to get President Obama to issue the DOCA
Speaker 1: executive order, felt the administration wasn't doing enough to stop deportations.
Speaker 1: Enter Lisabet Matteo, Lulu Martinez, Marcos of Adra, and Mohammed
Speaker 1: mo Abdullahi. After months of planning and years of organizing,
Speaker 1: this daring group of undocumented organizers embarked on their biggest
Speaker 1: and most dangerous demonstration yet.
Speaker 2: The mission bring home six undocumented dreamers who are now
Speaker 2: living in Mexico and could not benefit from DACA, Adrea Navias, Sefreno,
Speaker 2: Santiago Glaviamao, Luis Leone, and Maria Yes Venice. The campaign
Speaker 2: was called hashtag bring Them Home and was designed to
Speaker 2: accomplish its goals using the pressures of the press, social media,
Speaker 2: and some good old fashioned do the right thing. Mohammed
Speaker 2: stayed back in the US to coordinate the mission, and
Speaker 2: the rest of the group met at the Tomales, Mexico
Speaker 2: border dressed in cap and gowns to bring attention to
Speaker 2: the immigration crisis and those who were left out by DACA.
Speaker 2: They were all arrested and held in captivity for seventeen days.
Speaker 2: This is their story.
Speaker 1: Told by them.
Speaker 4: My name is Mohammed, usually just go by Mo only.
Speaker 5: My name is Claudia Amado. I am from Tijuana, Mexico
Speaker 5: and I lived in Wichita, Kansas.
Speaker 6: My name is lisped Matteo. I was born and raised
Speaker 6: in Wahaka, Mexico, in a small town called Fantomaslant. I
Speaker 6: lived there until I was fourteen. Ever since I can remember,
Speaker 6: I will always tell my parents I want to be
Speaker 6: an attorney. And even though we grew up in a small,
Speaker 6: you know, ural community, and I had never met an
Speaker 6: attorney in my life, my parents always said, yes, you're
Speaker 6: going to be someone attorney. They never said no. They
Speaker 6: never encouraged me. But of course I grew up and
Speaker 6: they realized it's going to be impossible for us to
Speaker 6: pay for this. I knew it was a document. I mean,
Speaker 6: I knew how that I have papers. I crossed the
Speaker 6: border and it was an as pleasant experience, right, But
Speaker 6: I didn't understand how difficult life was going to be
Speaker 6: being an adostmenter person. I mean I became an dostment
Speaker 6: at Agel fourteen. What led to the dream nine, I
Speaker 6: think was years and years of organizing and trying different
Speaker 6: things and being, you know, playing the game of I'm
Speaker 6: going to tell you my story and hopefully that's going
Speaker 6: to make you feel something, and I'm going to beg
Speaker 6: and I'm going to really show how American I am
Speaker 6: so Dream nine is or was a project that was
Speaker 6: organized by the National Thing within us alives. So the
Speaker 6: National Resuth Alliance was an organization that came out of
Speaker 6: United with Dreams. I was at that first meeting when
Speaker 6: United Dream was performed of an organization. That's where I
Speaker 6: met Muhammad and other adoption media and people.
Speaker 4: Our goal was in power, educate, escalate. Our focus was
Speaker 4: undocumented folks, those directly affected by the issue. The goal
Speaker 4: was all these like anti immigrant laws and legislations that
Speaker 4: were passing. If those members in the state houses or
Speaker 4: wherever actually had a population of undocumented folks that were
Speaker 4: not afraid of them, that would confront them, that would
Speaker 4: be in their office, this type of legislation would not exist.
Speaker 4: Maybe that was our goal around that time, was to
Speaker 4: get more folks on actually fighting making everyone undeportable.
Speaker 6: Dreams ended up sailing in twenty ten, so a month
Speaker 6: later we formed the National Movietic Alliance. We had already
Speaker 6: done a student or actually several students. We're undocumenting young
Speaker 6: people essentially force the government to arrest us. We knew
Speaker 6: that then documenting young people, the community that we have
Speaker 6: formed was ready to fight and could actually stop our
Speaker 6: own deputation. So as a result of that, we continue
Speaker 6: to do more more and more people will call it radical.
Speaker 6: I don't necessarily like that works. Other people will be
Speaker 6: anything radical about it. We were just kind of dramatizing,
Speaker 6: but was already happening in our community. Young people were
Speaker 6: being detained and deported, parents will betained and reported in families.
Speaker 6: The entire time was was being destroyed. So we wanted
Speaker 6: to use the privilege that we had as undocumingly young
Speaker 6: people and share our stories. There were a lot of
Speaker 6: promises and different presidents and lected officials that will come
Speaker 6: and talk to us about immigration about how they wanted
Speaker 6: to pack the dream at and all kinds of things,
Speaker 6: and then really nothing happening except thousands of thousands of
Speaker 6: dipretations that some of them touched us personally, including my family.
Speaker 6: So I think we just said, Okay, we're going to
Speaker 6: we're going to go and stuff support and bring back
Speaker 6: other Dreamers. So I wanted to come home because this
Speaker 6: is their home and we're going to prove a point
Speaker 6: and we're going to pressure the government and getting more.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So Dream nine. The way that we operated was every
Speaker 4: action that we did sort of led to the next action,
Speaker 4: and so the concept of asylum became something that we
Speaker 4: started becoming more familiar with, like the different like levers
Speaker 4: within requesting asylum that acted sort of as discretion or
Speaker 4: stay of removal sort of in that same concept. And
Speaker 4: then through doing that work, we also started having we
Speaker 4: were very like angry people, I got to say that
Speaker 4: of like, we had some cases that got deported that
Speaker 4: we were really fucking pissed off about of how dare
Speaker 4: the Obama administration deport X Y Z person? And so
Speaker 4: those personal grudges really is what drove us to find solutions.
Speaker 4: And so we fell on this sort of concept after
Speaker 4: doing like three or four infiltrations of different detention centers
Speaker 4: of like what happens to someone when they are deported
Speaker 4: from the US. And so, yeah, we set up this
Speaker 4: campaign where we could find dreamers in Mexico or other
Speaker 4: parts of the world that wanted to come back to
Speaker 4: the US and we would sort of do this public
Speaker 4: action traditional caps and gowns. And in order to make
Speaker 4: this action successful, we would have to send some of
Speaker 4: our folks from the US to self deport essentially, because
Speaker 4: we very much believed and we can't ask anybody else
Speaker 4: to do something that we're not willing to do ourselves
Speaker 4: and take those risks personally ourselves.
Speaker 5: In twenty thirteen, they reach out to me and they
Speaker 5: asked me if I wanted to join us Emble disobedience,
Speaker 5: which I immediately say yes.
Speaker 3: They called me one Thursday and.
Speaker 5: A Friday morning, I was already on a plane with
Speaker 5: my son, who is a US citizen, flying to a Nogalist,
Speaker 5: Arizona or Mexico. First, even though my identity is one
Speaker 5: of those like the Dreamers, because of my age, politically
Speaker 5: didn't fit into it. So nobody expected my case to
Speaker 5: be successful when DAKA came up, even some of my
Speaker 5: sisters are worked the US by one year.
Speaker 3: They instead part of that action was inspired on like
Speaker 3: why are many of us left out?
Speaker 5: I mean that the goal was directed to President Obama
Speaker 5: right where at the time that he was saying like
Speaker 5: we're only deporting criminals, and.
Speaker 3: Then we were just like bringing the fact that that
Speaker 3: wasn't true.
Speaker 4: I mean at that time, like looking back, yeah, we
Speaker 4: were some brave kids.
Speaker 1: When we come back, the Dream nine arrived in Nogles,
Speaker 1: Mexico to stage one of the most dangerous demonstrations in
Speaker 1: the history of the immigration rights movement. That's after the break.
Speaker 2: It's late July and twenty thirteen, and the dream Nine
Speaker 2: are preparing to launch one of the riskiest acts of
Speaker 2: civil disobedience and immigration rights history. They walk arm in
Speaker 2: arm to the US point of entry in Nogales, Mexico.
Speaker 2: They wore the graduation caps and gowns, an un official
Speaker 2: symbol of the Dreamer movement, meant to expose the flaws
Speaker 2: in the current immigration system. Here's Lizabeth Matteo again.
Speaker 6: They were taking a successity right away. So when we
Speaker 6: present ourselves, you know, we were actually had a pie style.
Speaker 6: We had something to obviously legally entry to the US,
Speaker 6: and so we said no, we have this letter basically
Speaker 6: saying hey, like we're here to speak humanitarian role, we
Speaker 6: have family in the US, we want to go back
Speaker 6: to homes, blah blah blah. As soon as each one
Speaker 6: of us arrived at the gates, they offered their roll
Speaker 6: taper clapping down in pancafes. So we were basically changed
Speaker 6: and put in a an a van. There evans are
Speaker 6: ready to wait for us, right, so we didn't really
Speaker 6: have to stand there and see what you know, see,
Speaker 6: the guards tried to figure out what was going on.
Speaker 6: They were prepared, you know, we kind of gave their
Speaker 6: heads up by doing a press release and then media
Speaker 6: also reached out to them asking for comment. So it
Speaker 6: was it was super fast, it was super quick. They
Speaker 6: didn't they didn't really say anything. They didn't they didn't
Speaker 6: really question us. They didn't. I don't want to say
Speaker 6: they went along with it, but I think they wanted
Speaker 6: just to remove us from the from all the media
Speaker 6: attention and all that, you know, supporters as quickly as possible.
Speaker 6: So we just put up an event and drove us
Speaker 6: another place.
Speaker 5: We spent several hours at the processing center at the border,
Speaker 5: and then probably close to midnight, I want to say,
Speaker 5: they took us out and to the icebox or they
Speaker 5: called the berretta very uncomfortable kind of like a minivan
Speaker 5: with no seats. The girls were taken in one of those,
Speaker 5: and the boys were taking in a different one, and
Speaker 5: we were handcaffed super cold. And then they will like
Speaker 5: drive like crazy. They will like we need the tracks.
Speaker 5: So we were moving very uncomfortable. We bumped our heads.
Speaker 5: We will ask them to please turn off the AC
Speaker 5: and they will just start laughing or like turn the
Speaker 5: music up. It was a really bad experience. It felt
Speaker 5: like it was an eternity. Then later we found out
Speaker 5: that it was a couple hours. First night they took
Speaker 5: us to Florence in Arizona and that detention center where
Speaker 5: we only spent that night. What we heard is that
Speaker 5: the ladies they were not allowed to talk to us,
Speaker 5: so they blocked communications.
Speaker 3: So the Dream nine we declared hunger strike.
Speaker 5: And then I think some of the women in other
Speaker 5: parts they hear that in the TV and they decided
Speaker 5: they were going to join us, and that was hard
Speaker 5: for the for the detention center, like they were not
Speaker 5: happy at all, So most of us were placed in isolation. Unfortunately,
Speaker 5: some of us just couldn't handle it that long. I
Speaker 5: think some of us started like little by little, leaving
Speaker 5: that hunger strike. In my case, my sugar. They had
Speaker 5: to take me to the nurse because my sugar levels
Speaker 5: went pretty low and I had to quit that. And
Speaker 5: the only one that really was for like five days
Speaker 5: in hunger strike was.
Speaker 6: This that so I refused to eat. So we did
Speaker 6: a hunger strike because we didn't have asked to our
Speaker 6: phone or to the phone every time we try to
Speaker 6: place a phone call, it wouldn't go through. And I
Speaker 6: wanted to talk to my family. I wanted to talk
Speaker 6: to you know, to someone outside, and no, I'm okay,
Speaker 6: because I was worried about my parents. I was worried about,
Speaker 6: you know, my family. Eventually I was able to see
Speaker 6: them on TV. Because then my parents became very public
Speaker 6: and started organizing and then going around and doing interviews.
Speaker 6: Is talking about their daughter and why she should bring me,
Speaker 6: she should come home, which is not something that we
Speaker 6: planned or that I asked them to do. I actually
Speaker 6: told them not to do any effect, but they said, no,
Speaker 6: we're gonna fight. We're gonna fight for you. So because
Speaker 6: I did the hunger strike, I refused to eat for
Speaker 6: like five days. So I was I was placed in
Speaker 6: solitary's confinements and the guards will come and bring me food,
Speaker 6: and they well started making popcorns, which is not something
Speaker 6: they do, but they will, you know, they will bring
Speaker 6: like a little car and make popcorns so that I
Speaker 6: would smell the food and they will, you know, make
Speaker 6: me eat. But I refused. I only ate ut because
Speaker 6: I had to do an interview with Emmigration the next
Speaker 6: day so many attorneys said you have to leave, you
Speaker 6: have to be loosing, you have to be strong, and
Speaker 6: I said, okay, I'll eat.
Speaker 3: I think she lost like ten percent of her body
Speaker 3: mass or something.
Speaker 2: She was.
Speaker 5: I mean, she's little by mighty. I totally admire her.
Speaker 5: And I remember things were getting like so out of
Speaker 5: control that I am.
Speaker 3: I used to see her.
Speaker 5: We couldn't talk, so I used to see her and
Speaker 5: I just make sience like cut the hunger straight.
Speaker 3: We need you.
Speaker 6: So how long were you entertaining?
Speaker 3: Seventeen days?
Speaker 4: We were talking to a lot of folks, young people
Speaker 4: that had been deported or had self deported, and in
Speaker 4: Mexico or in other countries, they were not treated as equals.
Speaker 4: They couldn't go to school because they had lived in
Speaker 4: the US, they couldn't get a job, their accent, they
Speaker 4: were targeted by cartels, and so this sort of like
Speaker 4: concept of being American was what was creating a target
Speaker 4: on their backs. We came up with this idea of
Speaker 4: there's an asylum. There's five essentially race, religion, sexual orientation,
Speaker 4: particular social group. If you're a part of sort of
Speaker 4: these categories, you can claim asylum. And so we wanted
Speaker 4: to create Dreamer as a particular social group. The fact
Speaker 4: that people living in Mexico get affiliated with being American,
Speaker 4: therefore they get targeted for cartel violence, other things.
Speaker 5: So what are at Turney West ask and it was
Speaker 5: humanitarian for all and they didn't move in that direction, so.
Speaker 3: They started the attorney decided that we asked for asylum,
Speaker 3: and like you know, my father.
Speaker 5: Was killed, my husband's brother was killed by police officers
Speaker 5: in Mexico, and my husband was kidnapped.
Speaker 3: My husband's last name is never in common in Mexico,
Speaker 3: so we were like a target for them.
Speaker 5: So we had a lot of brands, so that we
Speaker 5: moved into the asylum case and then we were taking
Speaker 5: one day to Florence to those interviews that they do,
Speaker 5: the credible fear interviews, and apparently all of us past
Speaker 5: those credible fear interviews and that's when they order our release.
Speaker 2: After the break, the dream nine is released from the tension.
Speaker 2: But what happened after and was it worth it stay
Speaker 2: with us? After spending seventeen days in a detention center,
Speaker 2: the dream Nine were finally released. Here's Claudia Amado, the
Speaker 2: oldest member in the group and the only mother remembering
Speaker 2: what it was like to be reunited with her family
Speaker 2: and reflecting on her life as an organizer.
Speaker 5: We were released and they took us into the Greyhound
Speaker 5: bus station and some family members, my mom, my son
Speaker 5: definitely was the war there. And then after that, I
Speaker 5: remember we were received, They took us to a restaurant,
Speaker 5: they fed us, and then I remember was split. I
Speaker 5: don't remember all the details, but I remember a group
Speaker 5: went to a place and we were still working on
Speaker 5: the organizing side. My perspective from organizing is just like
Speaker 5: just by sharing my story right and being like even
Speaker 5: when I still talk to people and they asked me
Speaker 5: about detention, immigration attention is like, it's just giving them
Speaker 5: my perspective that not even an immigration attorney's going to
Speaker 5: keep like what happened inside.
Speaker 3: I didn't detain two times by.
Speaker 5: Immigration, so I know exactly like you know that they
Speaker 5: give you a three second, three minute call.
Speaker 3: I know that you have to have your ain numbers,
Speaker 3: so all those things that you have to know.
Speaker 5: And how different it was the first time that the
Speaker 5: detainment detained me. Even though it was only one night,
Speaker 5: it was like a nightmer for me than when I
Speaker 5: was already prepared.
Speaker 3: Personally. Like I said, my son's life is totally different.
Speaker 3: Now he's married. I'm going to be a grandma. And
Speaker 3: he had to go through a lot of therapy in Mexico.
Speaker 3: His healthier here.
Speaker 5: He has a good social life and normal life that
Speaker 5: I don't think he would have it in Mexico.
Speaker 3: And again, I love.
Speaker 5: Mexico, but it just wasn't for us anymore. And then
Speaker 5: I had been able to move from just being an
Speaker 5: activist or being seen as an activist, as a respected
Speaker 5: woman of business here and which in our community, and
Speaker 5: people know my story, people know I'm still undocumented in
Speaker 5: a way.
Speaker 3: People will call me all the time, Hey, my husband
Speaker 3: was arrested, What should I do?
Speaker 5: And just being able to help them, giving them the
Speaker 5: calm and some tools for them to fight for their cases.
Speaker 3: That just huge for me.
Speaker 5: And again, all of that I learned through the action
Speaker 5: that we didn't jord Night.
Speaker 1: This incredible action by the Dream nine highlighted the urgency
Speaker 1: of addressing their legal status and demonstrated their power, contributing
Speaker 1: to the national conversation, which was covered up close and
Speaker 1: personal by two legendary journalists. One of those was Mariaino
Speaker 1: Hosa Hostel Latino, USA.
Speaker 7: I just remember hearing about the Dream nine at the
Speaker 7: very beginning and again just thinking like, wow, what kind
Speaker 7: of extraordinary human being an activist does it take to
Speaker 7: risk everything? What they did is really extraordinary. I don't
Speaker 7: like to make comparisons in terms of civil rights actions
Speaker 7: because each one of them is so important. But to me,
Speaker 7: the Dream nine have not been recognized yet. I know
Speaker 7: they will be. But they are like the people who
Speaker 7: participated in the Montgomery bus boycott. They are people who
Speaker 7: crossed the bridge in Selma, Alabama. They are the people
Speaker 7: who you know, protested the murders of the little girls
Speaker 7: in Little Rock. So we are all part of a
Speaker 7: country that says it believes in democracy. And so the
Speaker 7: dream that I just simply were carrying on that tradition.
Speaker 1: The other was Ramo's renowned journalist.
Speaker 8: I think that's incredibly important because when you were born
Speaker 8: in a house, in a family in which your parents
Speaker 8: and your grandparentsslitos, it was papass when they tell you,
Speaker 8: mikho miha, be silent, Please be silent, because that's the
Speaker 8: only way to survive. And you know something, they were right,
Speaker 8: because back then you needed to be silent in order
Speaker 8: to survive in this country, because if you didn't, then
Speaker 8: you would be detained and you would be deported. So
Speaker 8: the idea of being silent and being invisible was very important.
Speaker 8: But the big change was to realize that the political
Speaker 8: momentum had changed, that there was the possibility to present
Speaker 8: themselves to the country in a different way, and that
Speaker 8: that strategy wasn't going to work anymore. I mean, for
Speaker 8: how long can you sustain a policy of being invisible
Speaker 8: and being silent and succeed And so being unafraid and
Speaker 8: being openly undocumented I think was incredibly important because it
Speaker 8: gave them a sense of identity. So the fact that
Speaker 8: they were out and they could tell the world I'm
Speaker 8: undocumented and I need your help and this has to change,
Speaker 8: I think was incredibly important just to be out there.
Speaker 2: Well, the Dream nine demonstration brought a lot of attention.
Speaker 2: It was also a double edged sword for this Beth,
Speaker 2: who I dreamt of being a lawyer. Her participation in
Speaker 2: the Dream nine meant that she was banned from applying
Speaker 2: for DHAKA.
Speaker 6: So I did qualify for data and I you know,
Speaker 6: I still say that I qualify for that, but I
Speaker 6: didn't apply for it because I knew I was going
Speaker 6: to end up being at a point, so I I
Speaker 6: just said, I'm going to wait, I'm not going to
Speaker 6: apply for DATA. I'm going to go do this thing.
Speaker 6: And that would be basically that's it, because I had
Speaker 6: been trying to stay away from organizing for a while,
Speaker 6: but I just couldn't. And then I decided to apply
Speaker 6: to law school, and I said, Okay, well this is
Speaker 6: going to be it because I have to go to
Speaker 6: lawsuit now I have to concentrate on myself in my dream.
Speaker 6: So I didn't apply to DOCTA because I knew I
Speaker 6: was going to be leaving and doing the whole, the
Speaker 6: whole dream nine experience. So when I came back, I
Speaker 6: was pacing a more proceeding. Then my remote proceedings for
Speaker 6: that Natury week close, and then I applied for DACA.
Speaker 6: Finally was for that one. Was in law school and
Speaker 6: I waited over a year to hear I think over
Speaker 6: a year to hear from USCIS, and I heard from
Speaker 6: us AS the week after I graduated from law school.
Speaker 6: As I was studying for the bar, as I was
Speaker 6: starting my bar press, I just this letter from UCAS
Speaker 6: saying that they hadn't intend to be nine. That's that
Speaker 6: because I left, but that I could explain why I
Speaker 6: should still be granted that. Spent about eight months after that,
Speaker 6: up until January twelfth, trying to trying to fight to
Speaker 6: get that guy. At some point I heard that it
Speaker 6: got denied, and then the end of her mind it
Speaker 6: wasn't denied while we have here's another letter and of
Speaker 6: more evidence of why you should be granted that. So
Speaker 6: I was working with several members of Congress in the
Speaker 6: conclusion that they came to was that it was a
Speaker 6: political decision. That is telarly came to land that they
Speaker 6: would probably give me back up, but if that Trump
Speaker 6: wanted it would deny me dacka because they didn't want
Speaker 6: to put Baca on jeopardy, which I mean now we
Speaker 6: know that would have made no difference, I think. But yeah,
Speaker 6: that's that's why I was denied that by the Environment
Speaker 6: Administration eight days before Trump before. So for the past
Speaker 6: ten almost ten years, I've been just working to First
Speaker 6: I finished boschol Rite, passed the bar, became an attorney.
Speaker 6: I'm not gonna sit here and lie and say that
Speaker 6: it's been easy. I had a really, really difficult time.
Speaker 6: After I was told that I could, I would likely
Speaker 6: not be granted back up because I had job offers
Speaker 6: and I had a plan for my life, and I
Speaker 6: knew what I wanted to do, so I was very
Speaker 6: excited for taking the bar as favor as that sounds,
Speaker 6: I was super happy about that. I was excited, I
Speaker 6: knew what was going to come after. And then all
Speaker 6: of that just disappeared the minute I was told that
Speaker 6: they had been intensively ninety back up.
Speaker 1: Despite heroic actions and sacrifices of Li Sped and the
Speaker 1: Dream Nine, this country's immigration system remains broken and seemingly
Speaker 1: random to those who are stuck between the US and
Speaker 1: the countries where they came from, between documented and undocumented,
Speaker 1: and between the cracks.
Speaker 3: He'd served to be here.
Speaker 9: He came here when he was about one or two,
Speaker 9: but unfortunately the data requirements didn't match his criteria because
Speaker 9: he was too old, even though he had been here
Speaker 9: for like his whole lifetime.
Speaker 1: That's next time on Out of the Shadows. Out of
Speaker 1: the Shadows Dreamers is a Cemeto production in partnership with
Speaker 1: Iheart'smichael Duda podcast network. It's created, hosted, and executive produced
Speaker 1: by me, Patti Rodriguez, and Eric Galindo. This show was
Speaker 1: written by Sessa Hernandez, an executive produced by Jiselle Vancis.
Speaker 1: Our supervising producer is Arlene Santana. It's produced and edited
Speaker 1: by Brianna Flores. Our associate producer is Claudia Marti Gorena
Speaker 1: Down the Sign. Mixing and mastering by Jessica Crain Chitch
Speaker 1: and a special thanks to all our Dreamers. Remember to
Speaker 1: subscribe to the podcast and share it. For more Michael
Speaker 1: Duda podcasts, listen to the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to your favorite shows.