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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of I Heart Radio. Hello, welcome back to the show.

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Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is Noel. They called

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Speaker 1: me Ben. We are joined as always with our super

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Speaker 1: producer Alexis code named dot Holiday Jackson. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 1: are you, You are here, and that makes this the

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Speaker 1: stuff they don't want you to know. This is our

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Speaker 1: weekly listener Males segment fellow conspiracy realist, but it is

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Speaker 1: a little bit different in some ways. It's more like

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Speaker 1: an episode. Here's what happens. Every so often, Matt Nolan,

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Speaker 1: I will do an episode that genuinely sparks a ground

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Speaker 1: swell of responses, feedback, and it don'ts Sometimes eight mail,

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Speaker 1: firsthand experience and more. And so for this week's listener

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Speaker 1: mail segment, we wanted to focus on one conversation that

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Speaker 1: clearly hit home with a lot of our fellow listeners.

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Speaker 1: Here the Facts. A few weeks ago, we did a

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Speaker 1: two part series on controversy, facts, fiction myths surrounding both

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Speaker 1: unions and union busting and UH it gets into some

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Speaker 1: weird places. You can listen to it now. We talked

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Speaker 1: about the history of unions in the West, from their

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Speaker 1: roots and guild systems up to the present day. I

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Speaker 1: want to shout out ridiculous history. Uh, Noel, You and

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Speaker 1: I did an episode on some Pinkerton related stuff which

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Speaker 1: you should very much check out. There's a deep dive

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Speaker 1: right which episodes were those I don't recall, but it's

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Speaker 1: just such a common trope in in history, especially when

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Speaker 1: it comes to rich people trying to wield control over

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Speaker 1: the less fortunate with an iron fist. The Pinkerton's essentially

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Speaker 1: served as like a private police force who could do

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Speaker 1: everything from bust unions to intimidate essentially like mafioso type

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Speaker 1: activities like you know, uh, you better pay your what

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Speaker 1: do you call it protection fee or else would be

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Speaker 1: a shame of something happened to that nice little shotgun

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Speaker 1: shock of yours exactly. We did look at the union

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Speaker 1: busting the people who want to prevent unions from happening historically.

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Speaker 1: We also looked at some of the corruption and dark

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Speaker 1: side of unions. So we wanted to really take a

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Speaker 1: full picture look at this thing and give you everything

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Speaker 1: we could find when it comes to what can go

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Speaker 1: wrong right when you're either trying to form a union

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Speaker 1: or when you're trying to break up a union or

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Speaker 1: prevent one from forming. Yeah. Absolutely, because we already knew

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Speaker 1: going into this that we're unfortunately multiple cases of corruption

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Speaker 1: and conspiracy, both amid union busters and sometimes amid unions. Uh,

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Speaker 1: entirely unrelated. Want to extend particular thanks to our fellow

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Speaker 1: conspiracy realist in the world of TV and film production,

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Speaker 1: many of whom shared hilarious scary stories about teamsters, and

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Speaker 1: many many folks several reached out to be directly asking

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Speaker 1: to entirely be off the record. Uh so just give

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Speaker 1: it you all the acknowledgement as much as we can. Well,

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's a good time to talk about this

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Speaker 1: topic too, and to even follow up because in the news,

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Speaker 1: you know, there was a big win when a New

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Speaker 1: York branch of Amazon warehouse workers were able to unionize

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Speaker 1: or voted to establish a union, and now another branch

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Speaker 1: has voted to reject the union. Um but the lawyers

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Speaker 1: that are working for I believe the other party are

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Speaker 1: claiming all kinds of nefarious activities in terms of union

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Speaker 1: busting type stuff on the part of Amazon managers. And

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Speaker 1: we know that this is this kind of stuff is

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Speaker 1: not beyond them, just in terms of like what they

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Speaker 1: are willing to do to get things done, to get

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Speaker 1: the packages you know, where they're supposed to be on time,

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Speaker 1: come you know, inclement, whether life threatening situations or what

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Speaker 1: have you. Um So things like disciplinary action against you know,

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Speaker 1: folks that are supporting the union, all kinds of anti

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Speaker 1: union rhetoric in the workplace. And you know, again this

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Speaker 1: is just allegations, but I just wouldn't put it past them. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's interesting. We're gonna here today insight and first hand

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Speaker 1: experience from people who have been going through those processes,

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Speaker 1: people who have been a part of union for years,

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Speaker 1: some people who are trying to start some It's we're

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Speaker 1: gonna get lots of real insight, first hand stuff from you.

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Speaker 1: In fact, someone named you called in guys. Yes. Uh,

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Speaker 1: And there's something I want to add here that Uh,

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Speaker 1: many of many union busting activities are conspiratorial, but they're

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Speaker 1: not theoretical. I mean, they did happen, they are happening now.

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Speaker 1: In this exploration. You know, we took two episodes for it.

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Speaker 1: Because it wanted to be transparent and objective to the

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Speaker 1: best of our ability. We also knew there's much more

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Speaker 1: to both sides of this proverbial coin, so we asked

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Speaker 1: you for your opinions, for your insight, for your experiences,

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Speaker 1: and since you're the best audience and all the podcasting

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Speaker 1: you delivered. Here's where it gets crazy. We received tons

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Speaker 1: of voicemails, emails, other correspondence, and before we dive in,

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Speaker 1: I just gotta say I was profoundly impressed by the

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Speaker 1: level of discourse. The Like you said, Matt, the stories

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Speaker 1: we're about to share do not all agree, they do

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Speaker 1: not all reach the same conclusions, but every single person

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Speaker 1: or entity who wrote to us wrote in a unique, respectful,

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Speaker 1: very well thought out response, So thank you. You know,

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Speaker 1: some of these messages we had to edit for length,

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Speaker 1: but we did our best to keep the substance of

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Speaker 1: each one intact. Well I can we also to say

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Speaker 1: that you know we have firsthand experience with this, as

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Speaker 1: the I Heart Podcast Network recently unionized with the support

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Speaker 1: due to the efforts of many of our colleagues, UM

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Speaker 1: and I think we're all intensely proud of those folks

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Speaker 1: in the work they did, and kind of proud of

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Speaker 1: our company that there wasn't that kind of Amazon level

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Speaker 1: of push back and uh and negativity. And it was

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Speaker 1: a very even handed discussion that ultimately got both sides

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Speaker 1: on the same page. But just wait till you hear

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Speaker 1: what Text has to say about it. Oh, text, text

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Speaker 1: has some thoughts. Get into it. Yeah, we're not going

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Speaker 1: to get to everything today. But again, we we had

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Speaker 1: so many responses that we wanted to dedicate this weekly

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Speaker 1: listener mail segment just to this. Uh, let's start with

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Speaker 1: let's jump around here, jump around. I've never mind a

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Speaker 1: little bit, and I stay in my seat. Is it okay?

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Speaker 1: If I don't get out in my seat, you spiritually jump,

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Speaker 1: you know, metaphorically jump jump with your heart. That's what counts.

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Speaker 1: Can I get Oh yes, you can always always get down,

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Speaker 1: you know, usually I jump up to get down generally. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: one time I missed the bush. Jeez. All right, So

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Speaker 1: Justine writes in to say, hi, guys, I was listening

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Speaker 1: to or union busting episodes and I thought I right in.

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Speaker 1: Since I work for a union. I currently represent classified

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Speaker 1: public school employees everyone but the teachers and administrators, and

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Speaker 1: I mostly negotiate contracts and handle employee grievances. There's so

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Speaker 1: much I can say about unions, but I'll try to

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Speaker 1: keep it brief. This is, by the way, this is

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Speaker 1: a positive as a pro union message. Uh. You ask

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Speaker 1: for one thing I wish everyone knew, and I have

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Speaker 1: two answers. One, if you have a union, get involved,

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Speaker 1: even if just going to our union meetings and making

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Speaker 1: your voice heard acounts. The union is what you make

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Speaker 1: of it. Two, if you don't have a union, you

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Speaker 1: can still affect real change for you and your co

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Speaker 1: workers if you're willing to put in the legwork. Even

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Speaker 1: non unionized workers have the right to protected concerted activity.

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Speaker 1: That means anytime two or more workers act collectively to

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Speaker 1: improve wages or working conditions, it still counts. There's a

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Speaker 1: ton of different things you could do and it works.

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Speaker 1: Just google protected concerted activity and collective actions for ideas.

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Speaker 1: That's it for me. Thinks for a great show. So

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Speaker 1: I thought that was kind of a safer place to start,

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Speaker 1: right someone who clearly works with a union and enjoys it.

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Speaker 1: Thank you Justine for writing in Oh Yeah, I love

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Speaker 1: Justine's concept of if you don't have a union maybe

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Speaker 1: if you don't even want to have a union or

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Speaker 1: plan on creating a union, but you still have workers

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Speaker 1: who are working together and want to see some kind

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Speaker 1: of change, you can still do something that makes a

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Speaker 1: ton of sense. I just wanna again shout out those uh,

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Speaker 1: those keywords that she said to Google protected, concerted activity

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Speaker 1: and collective actions. That's very cool, and so that is

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Speaker 1: that is obviously, as we said, that's a message from

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Speaker 1: someone who finds themselves very much in support of their union,

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Speaker 1: their workers organization, and they've had a great experience. What

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Speaker 1: if we go to someone who had a negative experience, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: let's hear from samurai. This is a pretty and handed

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Speaker 1: sort of two prong approach to thinking about unions, with

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Speaker 1: some good and some bad. It's probably the way we

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Speaker 1: should look at most things, um Samurai rights. In my

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Speaker 1: many years on this planet, I have had the chance

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Speaker 1: to work with three unions. Jemco slashed Lucky Foods Food

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Speaker 1: Services Union. They were both terrible, only there to support

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Speaker 1: themselves and their lobbyists, provided no discernible benefit to me

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Speaker 1: or any of the other members, and when we went

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Speaker 1: on strike, they provided next to no benefits to us.

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Speaker 1: I crossed the line and returned to working was fired

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Speaker 1: as soon as the strike was over. Yikes, that is

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Speaker 1: all the bad things that people say potentially can can

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Speaker 1: result from unionizing. But I guess it all depends on

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Speaker 1: the union and the organizing committee and uh and just

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Speaker 1: the how how much you trust the work that the

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Speaker 1: union has done. Can you guys dissolve some of my

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Speaker 1: ignorance when when Samurai says, crossed the line that means

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Speaker 1: the pickets, Yeah, broken the strike. Um, it's called being

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Speaker 1: a scab, right, yeah, And so we'll we'll actually run

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Speaker 1: into someone who encountered that later on in this episode.

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Speaker 1: And I think one reason we we all maybe collectively

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Speaker 1: aren't big fans of Uber is that the company allegedly,

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, the proof was in the pudding.

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Speaker 1: It was something that could be observed acted as scabs

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Speaker 1: when New York Taxi Workers Alliance Union members UM, which

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Speaker 1: is an affiliate of the a f l c I

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Speaker 1: O that represents many immigrants, UM, we're striking, and then

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Speaker 1: Uber essentially looked at it as an opportunity to you know,

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Speaker 1: fill a demand and come in there and and you know,

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Speaker 1: essentially undermine those those efforts. So yeah, it's a big

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Speaker 1: deal to be a striker. But if you're striking and

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Speaker 1: your union is not doing anything for you, this Samurai

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Speaker 1: was basically like, well, screw this, I need the work.

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Speaker 1: I'm not actually working towards any benefits, so why should

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Speaker 1: I bother? Um If all this is for is for

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Speaker 1: you know, the lobbyists and for the interests of the union,

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Speaker 1: that's so I totally get that. Okay, back to Sam

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Speaker 1: c w A Communications Workers of America. Great union, though

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Speaker 1: a little top heavy and hard to get answers from

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Speaker 1: for complaints. Not great about raises, but not terrible either. Okay,

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Speaker 1: unnamed school district president employer c s e A. I

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Speaker 1: am not a teacher, but as I have mentioned to

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Speaker 1: you in the past, i am an I t Stochka.

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Speaker 1: This union is one of the best ones I've ever

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Speaker 1: worked for good benefits, and I've had three really good raises.

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Speaker 1: I do not mind paying about two a year and

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Speaker 1: dues because I have made that back several fold. My

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Speaker 1: main point is that if the union is there for

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Speaker 1: the people and works for them, then they are great.

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Speaker 1: C w A and c s A are both good

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Speaker 1: examples of that. Fs W was terrible. They were more

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Speaker 1: about getting the company what it wanted than the employees,

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Speaker 1: which makes sense because that's an experience that I've heard

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Speaker 1: relayed by many people, especially folks who have had multiple

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Speaker 1: cre years or multiple gigs that found them with multiple unions.

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Speaker 1: As we said in our two part episode, they're very

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Speaker 1: much not all created equally, right, Like you can say

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Speaker 1: the word sandwich, that could be literally thousands of different things.

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Speaker 1: Not my best analogy. It's good to hear about the

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Speaker 1: c s e A in particular, just because many of

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Speaker 1: us listening and talking right now have family members who

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Speaker 1: have been a part of a teachers union. Um you guys, Hey,

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Speaker 1: we got that message from TEXTS that told you about

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Speaker 1: a little kind of hinted at it earlier. You want

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Speaker 1: to hear somebody who is not cool with the unions, absolutely,

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Speaker 1: because we started with very pro union, We started with

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Speaker 1: somewhere in the middle, and like we said, we got

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Speaker 1: a lot of responses. So here's someone who found themselves

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Speaker 1: very much against unions, right, Matt. Right after a quick

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Speaker 1: message from our sponsors, we will hear from text. We'll

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Speaker 1: be right back and we've returned and everyone I present

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Speaker 1: to you text Ben, not no doc. It's your old

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Speaker 1: pal text. Let me tell you unions suck. They are

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Speaker 1: as you describe, little tiny thiefdoms. They are h o

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Speaker 1: as for employment. Okay, it gives little tiny people big

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Speaker 1: platforms and lots of money that will of the time

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Speaker 1: corrupt them. Absolutely, we need to do away with unions

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Speaker 1: permanently in our nation, but not for the reason you think.

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Speaker 1: The reason that we need to do away with unions

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Speaker 1: is the fact that they need to exist in the

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Speaker 1: first place. Think about it. When there were little children

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Speaker 1: losing their hands changing bobbins in the factories, unions were

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Speaker 1: the answer. No, they were not federal regulation that says, hey,

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Speaker 1: don't put children in dangerous situations and make them lose

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Speaker 1: their hands. So instead of Amazon creating a union so

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Speaker 1: that their employees don't have to pee in bottles, which

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Speaker 1: frankly is horrifying and I feel terrible for those employees

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Speaker 1: that have to go through that. But the fact is,

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Speaker 1: collected bargaining isn't the answer. Legislation that forces companies to

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Speaker 1: treat people as humans is the answer. That's it simple,

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Speaker 1: is that every time a union forms, whatever their platform is,

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Speaker 1: whatever the reason for existence is, probably needs to be

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Speaker 1: codified into law. To event that from happening across the board.

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Speaker 1: That's the failure. And so when we use unions as

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Speaker 1: a stop gap, we end up with corruption. We end

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Speaker 1: up with little people with big power and big money.

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Speaker 1: What could go wrong? Hey, gentlemen and ladies, have yourselves

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Speaker 1: a great weekend. Thanks for everything you do, such a

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Speaker 1: great show. That's somebody who's saying, you know, you don't

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Speaker 1: have to agree with the person. But again, what I'm

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Speaker 1: saying about the discourse here is you wrote in text,

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Speaker 1: and I remember what I was just as playing. I thought, oh,

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Speaker 1: text text, But this it wrote in clearly anti union,

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Speaker 1: UM with a different spin on it, and still wasn't

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Speaker 1: lambasting anyone, wasn't, you know, obviously a reasonable guy. This

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Speaker 1: is his conclusion. I don't know what do you guys think?

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Speaker 1: I mean, I do feel like the the need for

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Speaker 1: unions in the first place is the byproduct of a

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Speaker 1: corrupt system that's built around the money first mentality that

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Speaker 1: has been the legacy of this country and that continues

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Speaker 1: to be UM. It's the same thing that goes into

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Speaker 1: the fact that nobody can get reasonable health care unless

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Speaker 1: you make a lot of money. The foundation of this

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Speaker 1: country is is kind of based on enriching the super

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Speaker 1: rich um and it's kind of stomping on the little

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Speaker 1: guy at the expense of the little guy. So of

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Speaker 1: course the little guy is gonna want some protection from

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Speaker 1: this corrupt system that doesn't look after them. And because

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Speaker 1: it's a byproduct of a corrupt system, it sometimes becomes

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Speaker 1: corrupt itself. Well, I would also point out labor movements

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Speaker 1: are responsible for things like the weekend and even uh,

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Speaker 1: the eight hour work there's things that do exist. Those

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Speaker 1: workers protections that do exist did come about because of organization,

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Speaker 1: and that's you know, I'm not opinion here, I'm just

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Speaker 1: gonna say that's a fact. Uh, those are laws to

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Speaker 1: to our our callers point, those are the product of

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Speaker 1: labor movement, you know, That's what I'm saying. But but

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Speaker 1: not they're not something that the union itself guarantees that

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Speaker 1: it requires the union. Those are things changes that have

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Speaker 1: been pushed for that have been turned into law, which

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Speaker 1: is what Texas point is that that's what we need

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Speaker 1: to push for and not think we can solve all

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Speaker 1: this stuff via unions. But labor movements are made by unions.

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Speaker 1: Unions were doing labor movements, so like their long term

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Speaker 1: effect was those laws. I understand what you're saying, and

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Speaker 1: I agree with you functionally, but the union isn't required

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Speaker 1: to have a movement. You can have a movement with

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Speaker 1: or without a union. The union is a organization that

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Speaker 1: has its own by laws and is its own system.

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Speaker 1: I don't have to have it. Yeah, yeah, I understand.

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Speaker 1: I'm saying that the labor movements that created those laws

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Speaker 1: were in many cases you me empowered. Now they don't.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it's a maze puzzle puzzle maze situation. They do

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Speaker 1: always have to be the same thing. But I do

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Speaker 1: think that's a really interesting perspective that that text has.

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Speaker 1: The question. The question I would pose is how does

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Speaker 1: it get to the point where it is legislation? That's

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Speaker 1: the question, like, how can you do that? Look what

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Speaker 1: you did, text, Look what you've done. No, I just

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Speaker 1: wanted I would reiterate it's a great question, Ben, I

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Speaker 1: don't have the answer for you, but it's a it's

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Speaker 1: a great perspective that I don't see very often an

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Speaker 1: anti union pro federal regulation standpoint right, I mean often

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Speaker 1: those things. I don't know, it seems like they kind

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Speaker 1: of go together in the point you're making. Often the

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Speaker 1: unions are the things, or the labor movements are of

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Speaker 1: the things that get change and acted in Congress, because

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Speaker 1: in order to have a law, you've got to get

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Speaker 1: it through that messed up labyrantine thing um. But text,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I kind of agree with him in un

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Speaker 1: respects that if it was on the books officially for everyone,

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Speaker 1: you wouldn't need the labor union, right, But unfortunately we're

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Speaker 1: not in that maybe utopian set up right now. It

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Speaker 1: might be a question, yeah, where where does that if

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Speaker 1: come into play? How do you how do you have

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Speaker 1: something as strong as the labor movements of the past

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Speaker 1: that started, you know, the worker rights that are often

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Speaker 1: enjoyed today, at least in theory, How do you start

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Speaker 1: that without some kind of organizing. In the past, those

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Speaker 1: were union created. But but to your point, no, they

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Speaker 1: don't necessarily have to be, especially in the age of

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Speaker 1: social media. It could just be a bunch of people

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Speaker 1: who say we want a four day work week, and

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Speaker 1: if billions do and just stop showing up, you're gonna

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Speaker 1: fire everybody. The technology is not there yet. You nailed

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Speaker 1: something really important there then, and like, well, well, I

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Speaker 1: do think there are things that unions can achieve. The

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Speaker 1: individual rules that want to start a movement would take

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Speaker 1: them a lot longer to to get the support to achieve,

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Speaker 1: because unions have their own internal mechanisms and lobbyists, and

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Speaker 1: they're are part of the system at this point in

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Speaker 1: a way where they can you know, affect change in

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Speaker 1: some ways if they're good. Um, but the social media

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Speaker 1: angle does It's almost like, why do we need record

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Speaker 1: companies anymore? When individual artists can make a SoundCloud account

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Speaker 1: and get discovered and that's not easy to do, but

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Speaker 1: it does happen, and then you're not beholden to this

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Speaker 1: record company. So I just wonder if there is some

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Speaker 1: some point to be made that the unions in the

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Speaker 1: old school model are a little outdated, or maybe there's

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Speaker 1: like a union two point oh that hasn't really developed yet. Um.

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Speaker 1: I don't know the answer. I'm just asking a bunch

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Speaker 1: of questions. We need labor, Oh God, there's plenty of that.

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Speaker 1: All you have to do is look at HAFA. But

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Speaker 1: but yeah, Like the question is how how does a

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Speaker 1: group in acts systemic change? And it's a question that

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Speaker 1: people have quarreled with throughout the majority of written human history.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the United States itself was founded by a

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Speaker 1: group of people asking how do we affect systemic change?

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Speaker 1: But the systemic change they wanted, of course, primarily benefited them.

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Speaker 1: I know that makes people that rufflesome feathers sometimes, but

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Speaker 1: it is true. You know. Uh so text, I'm gona

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Speaker 1: needs you to send a voicemail in responding to that

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Speaker 1: statement alone. Please, Well, it's true systemic change, But this

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Speaker 1: is These are the kind of conversations that we were having,

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Speaker 1: and we were grateful for these. How about we go

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Speaker 1: to uh an email from someone who had experience as

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Speaker 1: a working union buster working with the union busting company.

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Speaker 1: To do this, I know, to do this, We're gonna

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Speaker 1: go to Chris and again, everybody in these conversations they're

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Speaker 1: being incredibly insightful and respectful or grateful for all of these.

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Speaker 1: Chris writes soon and says, Hi, guys, first off, love

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Speaker 1: the show, longtime listener, first time caller. I listened to

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Speaker 1: the union Busting part one episode yesterday. I used to

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Speaker 1: work for a PR firm that partnered with a law

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Speaker 1: firm called They were a management side union negotiating firm.

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Speaker 1: Their primary interests was working with management either stop a

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Speaker 1: union vote or make sure it went in their favor.

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Speaker 1: And you know what I'm saying, that's me adding that

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Speaker 1: not Chris. Uh. The PR firm I was with partnered

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Speaker 1: with them on what language to use in communicating with

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Speaker 1: the employees and how to deliver that messaging flyers, videos, websites,

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Speaker 1: et cetera. This is modern day union busting, says Chris,

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Speaker 1: and Uh, I'm gonna alide over some of this. I

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Speaker 1: want to highlight one part. These guys, including our team

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Speaker 1: he's referring to lawyers Uh that he worked with. These guys,

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Speaker 1: including our team, used any dirty tricks they could to

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Speaker 1: prevent a vote or make the employees think the union

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Speaker 1: was not going to be good for them. They used

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Speaker 1: overly can using language and math relating to fees and

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Speaker 1: raises and so on to keep them off ballance. I

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Speaker 1: used to say that one hundred years ago, our job

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Speaker 1: was done by guys wearing ten stars carrying axe handles.

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Speaker 1: Cough cough, Pinkerton's. Of course, they didn't tell me that

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Speaker 1: they did this kind of work before I accepted the job.

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Speaker 1: I was stuck there for a few years to support

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Speaker 1: my family. It's I could get away from all these

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Speaker 1: horrible people. So this guy did not have a good

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Speaker 1: experience with union invusity christened Um So, yeah, that's interesting

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Speaker 1: because I don't know about you guys, but I wasn't

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Speaker 1: particularly expecting someone who had worked in one of these

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Speaker 1: firms true write to us as well. Uh So, just

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Speaker 1: to give you a sense of of how many folks

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Speaker 1: are are reaching out here. People aren't just reaching out

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Speaker 1: with those opinions. We had a lot of folks relating

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Speaker 1: personal experience, and we have people not just from the

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Speaker 1: US but around the world. All right, well here's one

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Speaker 1: for kind of a more international perspective. Can admit my

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Speaker 1: own ignorance and not fully realizing unions were an international phenomenon.

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Speaker 1: Of course it makes sense. I just think of it

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Speaker 1: as an American thing because you know, of all the

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Speaker 1: corruption and horrible things that need to be dealt with.

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Speaker 1: But these problems are not unique to the United States

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Speaker 1: of America, though maybe they're a bit more prominent here.

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Speaker 1: Um in this one Humble Podcasters perspective. Uh So, here

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Speaker 1: we go from Peter. Peter says high Team. I'm writing

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Speaker 1: this with my tinfoil hat on in Brisbane, Australia, loving

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Speaker 1: the pod guys, keep up the great content in the

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Speaker 1: non biased way you present it onto business. I worked

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Speaker 1: from twenty nineteen for an m NC that manufactured fiberglass insulation.

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Speaker 1: The major manufacturing plant is in Melbourne and at the

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Speaker 1: time employee close to a hundred staff, many of them

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Speaker 1: belong to a major manufacturing union. This union was historically

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Speaker 1: very effective and winning excellent conditions and remuneration for its

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Speaker 1: members working on this site. For example, completely unskilled workers

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Speaker 1: were paid fifty dollars an hour, which is around double

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Speaker 1: what most factory workers arend in Australia. It's more than

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Speaker 1: what many skilled trades people are in the e B.

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Speaker 1: A enterprise bargaining agreement came up for renewal. I'm not

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Speaker 1: privy to the details of the negotiation, but I know

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Speaker 1: the GM of the time was ready for to get real.

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Speaker 1: As the business started to stockpile stock at locations around

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Speaker 1: the country. It appears that the workers did not like

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Speaker 1: what was offered, as approximately eighty eight of them walked

429
00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:28,520
Speaker 1: off the job in March. The strike lasted longer than expected,

430
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:32,080
Speaker 1: I believe as a result, the business asked the sales,

431
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:35,680
Speaker 1: marketing admin and non union warehouse staff if they would

432
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:39,959
Speaker 1: relocate to Melbourne to run the manufacturing plant. I immediately agreed,

433
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,160
Speaker 1: as I felt it was important to keep the company

434
00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:45,720
Speaker 1: going and therefore keep my job. We went in groups

435
00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:48,640
Speaker 1: to Melbourne and ran the plant. This involved driving through

436
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:50,720
Speaker 1: the picket line of workers into the factory, which was

437
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,280
Speaker 1: pretty cool to see their faces as we entered to

438
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,399
Speaker 1: foil their plans. This went on for a couple of

439
00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:58,800
Speaker 1: months until they agreed to come back to work. The

440
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 1: upshot of their action was that a lot of smart

441
00:26:01,320 --> 00:26:03,760
Speaker 1: people got to work in the factory and realized that

442
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 1: there were many improvements, especially in the area of automation,

443
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: that could be made. After a month or so, of

444
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:14,959
Speaker 1: the strikers were made redundant fancy talk for for fired.

445
00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 1: Um just I didn't learn that term until actually the

446
00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,880
Speaker 1: British office. So I'm not trying to talk down to anybody.

447
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:25,199
Speaker 1: Just some people might not know what being made redundant is.

448
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:27,920
Speaker 1: For me, it was a stressful time as we had

449
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 1: to run my sales territory as well as doing a

450
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: twelve hour day of the factory hopefully a once in

451
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,119
Speaker 1: a lifetime experience. But I'm glad I had it. Wow. Okay,

452
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:37,760
Speaker 1: So I just want to make sure I fully understand

453
00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:43,520
Speaker 1: this guy's My understanding here is that the company and

454
00:26:43,680 --> 00:26:47,919
Speaker 1: the union were negotiating. Those negotiations weren't going well, so

455
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:52,280
Speaker 1: the company made the decision to relocate to a different city,

456
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:56,479
Speaker 1: and person who wrote in, Peter relocated with the with

457
00:26:56,600 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 1: the company to continue working like essentially as a scap. Well,

458
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:04,640
Speaker 1: from what I understand, what's happening here is that there

459
00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:09,120
Speaker 1: was a lot of non manufacturing staff right the ADMIN

460
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,959
Speaker 1: the marketing sales, and Peter was in sales. He had

461
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:18,159
Speaker 1: a sales territory. And because the negotiations went sideways and

462
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,080
Speaker 1: the strike occurred, the company asked people who would not

463
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:24,399
Speaker 1: ordinarily be working at the plants to go work at

464
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:28,159
Speaker 1: the plants because the union workers were striking while the

465
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: negotiations were going. Yes, and those union workers were being

466
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:37,120
Speaker 1: paid more than normal. Okay, got it. And they're saying

467
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:42,320
Speaker 1: that automation and what what peters calling skilled workers actually

468
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:46,199
Speaker 1: stepped in and improved the factory. And so now we

469
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:51,400
Speaker 1: have a story from someone who participated in breaking the line. Right,

470
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 1: So just again, it was fascinating to see how many

471
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:58,919
Speaker 1: facets of experience we got here. Record of pause for

472
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,640
Speaker 1: word from our spawn. Sure, and then maybe we jump

473
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: back to voicemail. Huh, let's do it all right, we're back,

474
00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:17,040
Speaker 1: and we're going to a message from you. Yes you, Yes,

475
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,920
Speaker 1: it's it's good evening, gentlemen. And of course, code named Doc,

476
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:24,960
Speaker 1: my name is you and I have been witness to

477
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:29,440
Speaker 1: some of the union hijinks your episodes of late have described,

478
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: including a major retailer that I worked for that had

479
00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:40,080
Speaker 1: signs plastered all over for eight hundred numbers for managers

480
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 1: to call if any of the employees mentioned the union.

481
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 1: We of course would get off work on our overnight shift,

482
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,240
Speaker 1: go out at seven o'clock in the morning for several

483
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:53,959
Speaker 1: years and referred to this as the union meeting. Uh.

484
00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 1: Doing this in front of the star role higher ups

485
00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 1: in the company resulted in our direct supervisors being pulled

486
00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:03,960
Speaker 1: doing for an interrogation with the company union busters. It

487
00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:07,000
Speaker 1: was quite hilarious. Feel free to use my name and

488
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:10,000
Speaker 1: voice on the air again. This is you. Thank you

489
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:14,480
Speaker 1: for your time. Have a great day union. Uh. I

490
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:20,080
Speaker 1: heard what you did there, so I mean that happens, right,

491
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: That happens so often, and you don't hear about a

492
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 1: lot of recourse taken or any options for recourse on

493
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 1: the parts of employees. You know, I UM, in another life,

494
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:40,680
Speaker 1: very brief anecdote, I worked with a logistics company in

495
00:29:40,760 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: the United States and abroad, and stuff like unions in

496
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 1: Osha were a joke. Let me say it this way.

497
00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:51,280
Speaker 1: Osha was a joke that all the upper management found

498
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: unfailingly hilarious. And unions unionization was as you've depicted you

499
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 1: a fireable offense and it's not. You know, there's not

500
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:04,240
Speaker 1: much you can do about it, depending on where you're

501
00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:06,240
Speaker 1: at in life, how much money you have to self

502
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:09,280
Speaker 1: fund a legal battle, or the state you work at,

503
00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 1: like so called right to work state. Well, yeah, it

504
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,120
Speaker 1: is funny. You know, I've only worked in one place,

505
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: been really well to places, but mostly one place. UM.

506
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:23,920
Speaker 1: And in our offices, we've always had all the ocean

507
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:26,080
Speaker 1: signage that you have to have up, you know, required

508
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 1: by law. Yeah, yeah, and nobody looks at that. Nobody

509
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,600
Speaker 1: pays attention to those things. Those are laws, those are

510
00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:37,560
Speaker 1: important things, and they're for you as an employee, as

511
00:30:37,560 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 1: a worker, but they're just kind of disregarded, at least

512
00:30:39,960 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 1: it in my experience. Often, yeah, often that seems to

513
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 1: be the case. And you know. I. I don't know

514
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 1: about you guys, but I don't have the visibility to

515
00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:52,000
Speaker 1: say that is the case in the majority of industries

516
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,600
Speaker 1: or anything like that. But I know that I I

517
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,560
Speaker 1: see that stuff, like you said, ignored. It's a it's

518
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: a dusty, laminated sign some where and nobody. Nobody really

519
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,800
Speaker 1: looks at it these days unless they screwed up and

520
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:09,040
Speaker 1: forgot their phone. Right, So people forget their phones, they'll

521
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:15,840
Speaker 1: read anything, you know. Yeah, when you're making coffee ving something,

522
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:19,360
Speaker 1: you're like, what am I gonna do for this three minutes? Uh? Okay?

523
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 1: Oh shaw? What's up? What I have the right to?

524
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:27,959
Speaker 1: What is this? Man? Let's let's go to another message

525
00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 1: from somebody. Thank you for writing in Oh you, oh

526
00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 1: you you specifically you and milk Crate. Uh. Milk Crate

527
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 1: has written to us uh to talk a little bit

528
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,720
Speaker 1: about this. Seems like maybe pro union, but milk Crate,

529
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,040
Speaker 1: as will come to find, feels that they have run

530
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 1: into some sketchy things that go on on what they

531
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 1: call the laborer's side of the union. Matt, you ever

532
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:58,960
Speaker 1: read an email yet? Do you want to do the

533
00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: honors on this one? Do you know? Milk crea Yeah,

534
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I'll read voicemail all day, but email I

535
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:08,800
Speaker 1: don't know. All Right, here, here we go this from

536
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 1: Milk Create. They say, hey, guys, you can call me

537
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,280
Speaker 1: the milk Crate if you want to know more about

538
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,680
Speaker 1: me in the name. I can tell you the story later.

539
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,840
Speaker 1: But I just finished listening to your Union Busters episodes,

540
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 1: and as an apprentice at my local, I b e W.

541
00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: Do we know what that is? Guys? It's the International Uh,

542
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:33,200
Speaker 1: it's the International Bureau of Elmo Winkers. Before they Tickle

543
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 1: Me Elmo, there was the wink Me Elmo and they

544
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:43,880
Speaker 1: had a union and the International Brotherhood of Electrical Electrical Workers.

545
00:32:44,000 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 1: I think, okay, okay, okay, I don't know what that encompasses.

546
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:56,160
Speaker 1: We're keeping all of this in please come okay if

547
00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 1: we keep it, if we keep the part where you

548
00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 1: said okay, okay, good and this all of this okay.

549
00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:07,600
Speaker 1: So we're going back to Milk Create, the International Brotherhood

550
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: of Electrical Workers. Yes, okay uh, and mill Create is

551
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 1: appreciative of the story being told. This is mil creed.

552
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: Although I am obviously pro union, there's some sketchy things

553
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 1: that go on on the laborer side, depending on which

554
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:24,400
Speaker 1: local you're a part of as a union member, my

555
00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: goal is not to screw over my employer, but to

556
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 1: build up their reputation as well as mine by doing

557
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:34,520
Speaker 1: a good job so that we can both continue to profit. Unfortunately,

558
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,320
Speaker 1: not everyone sees it that way, with some secretive groups

559
00:33:38,400 --> 00:33:41,800
Speaker 1: known as fleas f l e A s within the

560
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 1: union going so far as to sabotage jobs for the

561
00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 1: quote sake of the brotherhood. What's that's right? That's good point, um.

562
00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 1: Some locals have a tight knit personality akin to gangs,

563
00:34:02,400 --> 00:34:03,920
Speaker 1: where they go so far as to say that if

564
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:06,920
Speaker 1: you don't drive a certain makeup vehicle, you'll get your

565
00:34:06,960 --> 00:34:10,719
Speaker 1: tires slashed and you'll be targeted by threats and actual

566
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: violence until you leave that job or that local or

567
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,919
Speaker 1: get an approved vehicle. Other places, like Hawaiian New York

568
00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:22,680
Speaker 1: City are notoriously against having quote outsiders official union ib

569
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:27,680
Speaker 1: W members traveling for work from other locals in their jurisdictions.

570
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:30,560
Speaker 1: That makes sense, I guess in some weird way, but

571
00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 1: not allowing ib W members from another state to come

572
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:38,680
Speaker 1: in um, and they will blatantly discriminate against anyone not

573
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 1: from their home local. The majority of the ib W

574
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 1: isn't like this, but places and people like that do

575
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 1: exist and are a direct result of the nature of unionizing.

576
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:52,480
Speaker 1: Oh interesting, Okay, now that's a statement, a direct result

577
00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:56,160
Speaker 1: of the nature of unionizing. Yeah, please finish. I've definitely

578
00:34:56,200 --> 00:34:59,399
Speaker 1: got some perspective on this. Sure. On a good note, though,

579
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:02,719
Speaker 1: the ib W has been surprisingly pro women since its

580
00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:05,879
Speaker 1: conception in the late eighteen hundreds, same rate of pay

581
00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:09,279
Speaker 1: from the beginning, with equal rights and representation. As far

582
00:35:09,320 --> 00:35:11,919
Speaker 1: as voting in politics, most people I know have views

583
00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:14,520
Speaker 1: that differ from the political party that gives us money,

584
00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:18,080
Speaker 1: and we don't experience negative kickback for having our own

585
00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 1: personal opinions or voices. With everything, there's a good and

586
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,880
Speaker 1: a bad side, but unions are, in my humble opinion,

587
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:27,840
Speaker 1: a good thing in a world where employers can't seem

588
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 1: to retain decent behavior towards their employees. That's a a

589
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 1: statement too, and absolutely accurate. Look. I used to work

590
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:37,800
Speaker 1: in a in a theater um and there was a union,

591
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 1: you know, for for theater workers, stage hands or whatever,

592
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:42,640
Speaker 1: and and a lot of the like older guys that

593
00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:44,120
Speaker 1: have been in it for a long time, not all

594
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 1: of them, but some of them just had this attitude

595
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,080
Speaker 1: of just like doing the bare minimum all the time,

596
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,279
Speaker 1: and just there was this kind of like malaise associated

597
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:54,719
Speaker 1: with well, I'm protected, therefore I don't actually have to

598
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 1: try that hard. Um, maybe that was just my situation.

599
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:02,600
Speaker 1: It sounds like this is a product of kind of

600
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 1: that same attitude. This is a more outward like violent

601
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:09,520
Speaker 1: kind of discrimination. But there is certain kinds of like

602
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,120
Speaker 1: chrony ism and sort of like you know, like you said,

603
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 1: this kind of gang like mentality where it's like, well,

604
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 1: I'm protected, therefore, you know, you can't mess with me.

605
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,840
Speaker 1: Therefore I can kind of do whatever I want. I

606
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:25,600
Speaker 1: feel if to me, well, yeah, I mean, I hear you.

607
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:30,440
Speaker 1: But to me it reads more as someone or some

608
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:34,399
Speaker 1: small groups saying don't take my or our work from us, right,

609
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:37,839
Speaker 1: like stay out of my backyard because that's where I

610
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,960
Speaker 1: work kind of thing. Yeah, there's that, but there's also

611
00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:45,120
Speaker 1: you know, there's also the basic idea from the Journeyman

612
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 1: of Old, which is saying, hey, if we all agree

613
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:51,759
Speaker 1: we have to be paid a living wage for this

614
00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:54,959
Speaker 1: that you know, you could call it price fixing too,

615
00:36:55,000 --> 00:36:57,600
Speaker 1: But if we all agreed to do this, then they

616
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:02,319
Speaker 1: can't exploit other people and so with this we are

617
00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 1: drawing to a close. We know we didn't get to everyone,

618
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:08,279
Speaker 1: fellow conspiracy realists, but it was very important to us

619
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 1: to thank everybody to share these perspectives and to let

620
00:37:12,640 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 1: you know that there's nothing wrong with your perspective or

621
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:20,520
Speaker 1: you know your own personal experience. Knowing can invalidate that,

622
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:24,279
Speaker 1: but it is meaningful, and perhaps we could argue even

623
00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 1: imperative to listen to people that you don't agree with

624
00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: with that. We we we just took some time off

625
00:37:32,080 --> 00:37:34,879
Speaker 1: air to figure out what we were going to end on,

626
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 1: and I think we the three of us unanimously voted

627
00:37:38,719 --> 00:37:45,279
Speaker 1: for voicemail. Yes, a voice message from one Remy. I

628
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:48,360
Speaker 1: am a former employee of a couple of places that

629
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:52,600
Speaker 1: are now and probably the user of resince nivation efforts.

630
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:59,280
Speaker 1: Dive done some occasional knowledge awareness, class consciousness, troublemaking, et cetera.

631
00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:03,760
Speaker 1: In a place site works and you know, on its space,

632
00:38:03,920 --> 00:38:07,759
Speaker 1: getting the working class to work together seems like it

633
00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:11,480
Speaker 1: should be very easy. You know, we just explain how

634
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:16,560
Speaker 1: our labor is valuable versus the desires of often a

635
00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:21,040
Speaker 1: major corporation. But for some reason, people keep siding with

636
00:38:21,040 --> 00:38:23,439
Speaker 1: the corporations. Especially when I talk to people that are

637
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:28,360
Speaker 1: maybe even older generation Gen X or you know, Boomers,

638
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,000
Speaker 1: that they seem to operate on this mode mentality, and

639
00:38:31,000 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: I mean literally a mod mentality. Their idea of a

640
00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:37,279
Speaker 1: union comes from Bob movies. But you know, when you

641
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:40,200
Speaker 1: look at today, the corporate on media still does a

642
00:38:40,440 --> 00:38:45,719
Speaker 1: great job really of showing unions at the a way

643
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: that's easiest to create an anti union narrative. So one

644
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:51,480
Speaker 1: thing I've noticed is that they tend to focus on

645
00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:57,000
Speaker 1: strikes or labor organizing from people like nurses and teachers,

646
00:38:57,760 --> 00:39:01,719
Speaker 1: because those groups are really easy to kind of scapegoat

647
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:05,720
Speaker 1: and point at the people that they are not quote

648
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:09,000
Speaker 1: like helping. Uh you know, teachers you can say out

649
00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,960
Speaker 1: there holding the kids education hostage. With nurses you can say,

650
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,759
Speaker 1: there are patients that they aren't helping. Uh. So it's

651
00:39:14,760 --> 00:39:17,239
Speaker 1: really easy to kind of off the skate um the

652
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:21,000
Speaker 1: actual flavor issues involved and just say, oh men, why

653
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 1: can't they just work and you know, take care of

654
00:39:23,480 --> 00:39:26,919
Speaker 1: these children and these sick people. So music a lot

655
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:32,880
Speaker 1: less focusing, I think, um on labor movements and strikes

656
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:38,319
Speaker 1: at people. It's like Starbucks and Amazon, because it's so

657
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:40,560
Speaker 1: much more cut and dry. You know, it's it's a

658
00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 1: lot easier to say, like this is about coffee or

659
00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,840
Speaker 1: getting your pappies delivered in two days. So yeah, and

660
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:48,720
Speaker 1: then they all obviously like always play into I think

661
00:39:48,880 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 1: this idea that millennials or younger people uh gen z

662
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 1: don't want to work. Um, and that is part of

663
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:01,840
Speaker 1: the demonization of labor movement, is that you know, I

664
00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:05,239
Speaker 1: had to suffer through this, you should too. But yeah,

665
00:40:05,239 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: this is something I've noticed that really kind of makes

666
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,920
Speaker 1: an uphild battle sometimes for what to me, it feels

667
00:40:10,920 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: like there's an easy topic to get people on it too,

668
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,800
Speaker 1: the pro labor side on and Remy went a little

669
00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 1: bit longer than minutes solid ending though, said yeah, because

670
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:27,040
Speaker 1: as long as if you I mean think about it,

671
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:31,759
Speaker 1: if you want to enforce some kind of inequality, as

672
00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:36,560
Speaker 1: has been observed multiple times across multiple human civilizations, then

673
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: you just need to keep the majority of the people

674
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 1: at the bottom fighting each other. It doesn't matter what

675
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:44,400
Speaker 1: they're fighting about, as long as they're fighting about something

676
00:40:44,760 --> 00:40:48,200
Speaker 1: and not looking at where your hands are going and

677
00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:50,279
Speaker 1: what they're putting in their pockets. It is such a

678
00:40:50,320 --> 00:40:52,760
Speaker 1: good point though, the way he highlights you know things

679
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:57,360
Speaker 1: like Starbucks, which is a giant corporation making bookoos of

680
00:40:57,440 --> 00:41:00,600
Speaker 1: money off of something that is a luxury, you know,

681
00:41:00,760 --> 00:41:05,480
Speaker 1: for for the most part middle upper middle to wealthy people.

682
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:10,920
Speaker 1: And Amazon, which is a company that obviously feeds countless

683
00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 1: billions to like you know this one shiny headed ball

684
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:17,600
Speaker 1: guy in his you know, upper management. Um all for

685
00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 1: the luxury of getting are spoiled. American asses are packages

686
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:26,080
Speaker 1: in a day and a half. Um. So it's easier

687
00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:29,799
Speaker 1: to highlight, especially when you see the gross mistreatment of

688
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 1: those employees in the insane hours and all of that

689
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,680
Speaker 1: stuff with the Amazon specifically, so it's an easier thing

690
00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:39,040
Speaker 1: to wrap your head around. But um with like teachers unions,

691
00:41:39,120 --> 00:41:42,520
Speaker 1: the idea of demonizing a teacher for wanting to not

692
00:41:42,600 --> 00:41:45,280
Speaker 1: have to pay for supplies out of their own pocket,

693
00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,400
Speaker 1: which we know still happens to this day all the time.

694
00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:51,840
Speaker 1: UM to basically only be able to go into that

695
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:55,439
Speaker 1: career if you have a spouse who is making more

696
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 1: money than you like it's like even like it's like

697
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:00,960
Speaker 1: a passion thing, and oh but they they're so passionate,

698
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,399
Speaker 1: they're so you know, I hate that argument. No, this

699
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:08,000
Speaker 1: is very personally I see it as unethical and unclean.

700
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:11,480
Speaker 1: I mean, I name one teacher at a public school

701
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,400
Speaker 1: in the United States, not even counting the ones that

702
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:16,879
Speaker 1: I'm related to her that I believe you're related to. Matt,

703
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:19,480
Speaker 1: name one that hasn't had to come out of their

704
00:42:19,520 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 1: own funds for supplies, or that hasn't had to work

705
00:42:24,000 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 1: on weekends or week nights. Uh. To demonize those people

706
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:32,920
Speaker 1: is unconscionable, you know what I mean? In my opinion,

707
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:37,480
Speaker 1: same with the same with Like you're gonna demonize nurses

708
00:42:38,800 --> 00:42:42,120
Speaker 1: because they have to do so much of the work

709
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 1: that doctors do for so much less pay, not so

710
00:42:49,239 --> 00:42:52,239
Speaker 1: many I just it bugs me when you wait for

711
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,120
Speaker 1: ages at a doctor's office for your appointment. You know,

712
00:42:55,320 --> 00:42:57,919
Speaker 1: the physicians assistant or the nurse comes in, does all

713
00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:00,359
Speaker 1: the stuff, They draw all the blood, do all the work,

714
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:02,800
Speaker 1: and the doctor just kind of waltz is in, gives

715
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,400
Speaker 1: you a cursory glance, and then signs off on getting

716
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 1: your meds refilled. Now, I'm not trying to demonize all doctors.

717
00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:12,360
Speaker 1: There are doctors and specialists that we absolutely need and

718
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:14,439
Speaker 1: that that do a very specific thing. But the way

719
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:16,239
Speaker 1: our system is set up is like those people are

720
00:43:16,239 --> 00:43:19,600
Speaker 1: like untouchable and they're getting paid the big bucks. I know,

721
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: they work under a lot of stressful circumstances. But the

722
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,160
Speaker 1: ones that are actually they are doing the work, they

723
00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 1: don't have that protection, you know, and and they are

724
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:29,960
Speaker 1: treated more like lower level employees. They're the ones that

725
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:31,800
Speaker 1: are actually doing the work. And Ben, I mean to

726
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: go back to your personal connection with the teacher situation.

727
00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,160
Speaker 1: I mean, how much more important a job is there

728
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:42,440
Speaker 1: than a teacher to help make the next generation better

729
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,800
Speaker 1: than the current one, or to like ensure that even

730
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:49,320
Speaker 1: those who can't afford private school get a good education.

731
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,200
Speaker 1: And if you don't have people that are willing to

732
00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: just you know, do it for the passion or because

733
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:58,279
Speaker 1: they can afford it, you're not gonna have good quality candidates.

734
00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 1: Or it's just gonna be an uphill battle, a Sisiphian task,

735
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:05,440
Speaker 1: because they're gonna be so piled on with students and

736
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:07,600
Speaker 1: and extra things that they aren't getting paid for they

737
00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:09,840
Speaker 1: have to pay for themselves, and it's not going to

738
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 1: be efficient. I'm sorry, I just it's the well, there's

739
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:17,440
Speaker 1: only one answer. It's the water treatment plant supervisor to

740
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: make sure everybody has water. No, I'm just I've got

741
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 1: you know, I I thought about this idea a lot

742
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 1: from a young age. It is something that gets to me,

743
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: and I do try to be careful not to inject

744
00:44:31,160 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: myself from my opinions in this show. But there's a

745
00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:37,719
Speaker 1: line from Trick Daddy's Thug Holiday I'm going somewhere with

746
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:43,920
Speaker 1: this that introduces a brilliant question. He asked, how come

747
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:47,760
Speaker 1: the judges are making more than the teachers. I'm paraphrasing,

748
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 1: but it's an excellent question. There there is a very

749
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:53,960
Speaker 1: valid argument. You don't have to say the entire system

750
00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: is broken, but there's a very valid argument that parts

751
00:44:57,120 --> 00:45:00,880
Speaker 1: of it need to be completely read. And uh to

752
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:04,319
Speaker 1: do one last lazy car analogy. You know, a car

753
00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:07,239
Speaker 1: will still run without air conditioning, but they're gonna be

754
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:09,640
Speaker 1: times you don't want to ride in that car anymore.

755
00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:13,880
Speaker 1: So there are very difficult questions that have to be asked,

756
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:16,520
Speaker 1: and perhaps one of the best questions to ask when

757
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:19,799
Speaker 1: you hear different stances, do you have to ask about

758
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,239
Speaker 1: the source talked about this all the time. You have

759
00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,880
Speaker 1: to ask what possible motivation that source may have, You know,

760
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:29,760
Speaker 1: like those There was a great send up in last

761
00:45:29,800 --> 00:45:34,759
Speaker 1: week tonight a while back regarding union busting activities, where

762
00:45:34,760 --> 00:45:37,919
Speaker 1: they had this excellent parody video. You know, it's those

763
00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 1: workplace videos that you have to watch when you're an

764
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 1: employee getting on boarded. It's like occasionally you may hear

765
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:47,839
Speaker 1: your co workers say things like the following, and then

766
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:49,759
Speaker 1: some comes out and there's like a little Tim and

767
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:55,000
Speaker 1: Eric thing of you know, collective organizing. But we solve

768
00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 1: our problems one to one because here at Cold Glomco,

769
00:45:58,680 --> 00:46:02,239
Speaker 1: we're a family. You know, there's a reason that people

770
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 1: are spending so much time and so much money for

771
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:08,440
Speaker 1: seeing their employees to watch those videos. That's what I

772
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,319
Speaker 1: think we need to start asking, you know. And that's

773
00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 1: what we ask in Unions Part one and Part two,

774
00:46:14,160 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 1: which are out now wherever you find your favorite shows. Uh.

775
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:21,160
Speaker 1: With this, we want to thank so many of our

776
00:46:21,200 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: fellow conspiracy realists too many to name right now. Thank

777
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:26,600
Speaker 1: you to everyone who went on air with us. Thank

778
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:28,759
Speaker 1: you to all the people who continue to write in

779
00:46:29,640 --> 00:46:32,359
Speaker 1: Stay safe out there, and if you want to be

780
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:35,400
Speaker 1: part of this weekly segment, we'd love to hear from you.

781
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,279
Speaker 1: We tried easy to find online, that's right, you can

782
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:40,960
Speaker 1: find us on Facebook. You can find us on What's

783
00:46:41,000 --> 00:46:43,720
Speaker 1: the other One YouTube? You can find us on Twitter.

784
00:46:43,840 --> 00:46:46,440
Speaker 1: We are at the handle Conspiracy Stuff on Instagram or

785
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: Conspiracy Stuff Show. Check that account out. Lots of new

786
00:46:49,600 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 1: things popping over there. Definitely not the Conspiracy Stuff Show

787
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 1: account of Yesteryear's right. If you want to be like

788
00:46:56,600 --> 00:47:00,520
Speaker 1: text and Remy and even you, why not call one

789
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:03,759
Speaker 1: eight three three st d w y t K and

790
00:47:03,880 --> 00:47:06,920
Speaker 1: leave us a message, give yourself a cool nickname when

791
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: you call in. Let us know if we can use

792
00:47:08,680 --> 00:47:12,600
Speaker 1: your message and voice on the air, and uh, you've

793
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:15,360
Speaker 1: got three minutes. Say anything you want. We're interested in

794
00:47:15,400 --> 00:47:18,680
Speaker 1: your opinions, your experience, especially your experience that is very

795
00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 1: helpful for us, as we illustrated in this episode. I

796
00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:23,480
Speaker 1: believe if you've got more to say, if you've got

797
00:47:23,560 --> 00:47:25,920
Speaker 1: images or anything else you want to share with us links,

798
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:29,120
Speaker 1: why not instead send us a good old fashioned email.

799
00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:51,400
Speaker 1: We are conspiracy at iHeart radio dot com. Stuff they

800
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:53,319
Speaker 1: don't want you to know is a production of I

801
00:47:53,440 --> 00:47:56,560
Speaker 1: Heart Radio. For more podcasts from my heart Radio, visit

802
00:47:56,560 --> 00:47:59,319
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803
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:00,600
Speaker 1: listen to your face vert shows