1 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:13,320 Speaker 1: This is me eat your podcast coming at you shirtless, severely, 2 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: bug bitten and in my case, underwear. Listening Hunt podcast, 3 00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: you can't predict anything presented by First Light, creating proven 4 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: versatile hunting apparel from Marino bass layers to technical outerwear. 5 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: For every Hunt, First Light, go farther, stay longer. All right, everybody, 6 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: we've got a great episode for you today. We're joined 7 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: right now by Yanni cal Seth Jester, Seth Night here, 8 00:00:45,440 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 1: Seth Night here. Good in the special guests, Uh, John Miller. Now, 9 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: we're gonna play you a titilating little clip here just 10 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:58,920 Speaker 1: to get utitilated. I used it twice in one sentence 11 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:03,920 Speaker 1: to the late tittilating clip to get you titilated. Tittilate 12 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:10,560 Speaker 1: and Phil, we came down this path right here, saw 13 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 1: and two cubs cans rolling across tax I put a 14 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:18,680 Speaker 1: three in wind meg in the bear's back on top. 15 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:23,119 Speaker 1: He shoots a pistol round ten. Mill comes to me. 16 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 1: It starts making this way after what six rounds in 17 00:01:28,880 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 1: it it does there. That was the voice of our guest, 18 00:01:34,319 --> 00:01:37,040 Speaker 1: John Miller, and engineer who's interesting for two reasons. One 19 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:39,920 Speaker 1: he's involved in this is just this hunting season. Right, 20 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:42,360 Speaker 1: it was saved a friend of his who was getting 21 00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:46,320 Speaker 1: mauled by a bear hunting Wyoming. Um, and here's the 22 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:49,440 Speaker 1: only reason you're interesting your friends with my friend from 23 00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: growing up, Matt Mallard. Yeah, it's a weird coincidence. He 24 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: he he's probably he's in a weird spot when he 25 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: gets asked what he does. Why is that? Because I 26 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 1: hate talking about the brother while he's not here. If 27 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:11,119 Speaker 1: you're engineering a part and you need to know how 28 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,440 Speaker 1: it's going to hold up over thousands of hours of 29 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 1: use and abuse. He makes equipment didn't mimics abuse like 30 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:27,320 Speaker 1: automotive aerospace makes equipment that mimics the abuse. So you 31 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:29,280 Speaker 1: can put the part in a room, turn the abuser 32 00:02:29,360 --> 00:02:34,840 Speaker 1: machine on and vibrated at certain frequencies, and then watch 33 00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:38,840 Speaker 1: what will happen. Right, that's correct. That's actually how we 34 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:42,200 Speaker 1: know each other. We work in the same industry, vibration technologies. 35 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:45,000 Speaker 1: We're My company is a little more general. But yes, 36 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 1: whose company is better? Oh? Of course mine? Ill I'll 37 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:53,359 Speaker 1: you know, I always like Matt Mallard a lot growing up. 38 00:02:53,440 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: And um, you know how later in life you look 39 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:56,919 Speaker 1: back on dudes from growing up and you sort of 40 00:02:56,919 --> 00:02:59,679 Speaker 1: have realizations about them that you didn't at the time 41 00:02:59,760 --> 00:03:01,919 Speaker 1: used to like a nice guy, I'm telling you, And 42 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: I can't say this about myself, and I can't say 43 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:09,119 Speaker 1: to what most people if I review, I don't think 44 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 1: that that man ever uttered a negative word about anybody. 45 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 1: And to say that coming out of junior high and 46 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:26,919 Speaker 1: high school, that's impressive. Just an honorable guy, certainly. UM 47 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:29,639 Speaker 1: he's the one who introduced us, right he is. Shout out, 48 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 1: ma'am Millard. If you want to find out what some 49 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 1: of your ship's gonna do and it vibrates real bad, 50 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: call Matt. He'll build a machine for you. Do you 51 00:03:39,320 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: want to say what company you work for to plug it? D? 52 00:03:43,840 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 1: Why not? What is it? Did you go to the 53 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: same school mat went to? I did not, So did 54 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:50,800 Speaker 1: you study engineering? I studied in South Dakota State my 55 00:03:50,880 --> 00:03:53,640 Speaker 1: undergrad and then UH. I got my graduate degree in 56 00:03:53,760 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 1: University of Minnesota UM. But the company I worked for 57 00:03:57,320 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: is UH do we soft so we make test equipment 58 00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 1: for all sorts of UM R and D, specifically in 59 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:08,800 Speaker 1: the automotive, airspace and UH defense, power and energy type markets. 60 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:10,600 Speaker 1: Did you when you went to graduate school as you 61 00:04:10,640 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 1: get a master's degree or a PhD. I got a 62 00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:15,320 Speaker 1: master's degree. Yeah. Usually if you get the PhD, you 63 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 1: kind of end up there forever and him to be 64 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 1: calling you Dr Miller right now. Okay, before we get 65 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:25,040 Speaker 1: back to this, uh real interesting hunting story. UM, I 66 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,520 Speaker 1: got a couple things to cover off on once Chester. No, 67 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: sess not here right now, but I was gonna there's 68 00:04:30,960 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 1: something I want to like. Oh, call call, you know 69 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:36,039 Speaker 1: what call set up? Is he available? Yeah? He's available? 70 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:38,080 Speaker 1: Should I throw him on speaker phone? Guys want to 71 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: tell him something? All right? This is about Seth upcoming 72 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:51,960 Speaker 1: wedding Chester, Seth. Can you hear me? Steve? You know 73 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:53,839 Speaker 1: how I got to become I need to become a 74 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: minister to to do your wedding. Yeah, I was reading 75 00:04:57,640 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 1: up on that. It's real easy. Um. I can't remember 76 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,919 Speaker 1: the name of the church, but it's like some church 77 00:05:04,920 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 1: out of Seattle. I'll become ordained. It takes about three seconds. 78 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 1: But you know what I was reading in Montana? You 79 00:05:12,120 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 1: can actually get because you know how you and Chester 80 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:16,679 Speaker 1: have this problem where you can't do the walleye tournament. 81 00:05:18,080 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 1: Well we can't do that one? You can? You can? 82 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 1: You Montana is one of two states where you can 83 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 1: have a proxy stand in for you at your wedding. 84 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 1: I'm serious. In Montana you can have a proxy stand 85 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 1: in for you at I could do you and Chester 86 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 1: can fish. I can like officiate and stand proxy. Wow, 87 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: or do you just have cold be there because it's 88 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:50,599 Speaker 1: like cal stand proxy. I wouldn't be bouncing back and 89 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:52,640 Speaker 1: forth a whole bunch. Yeah, you just let me know 90 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:57,480 Speaker 1: where to put my hands. I'll do the rest. Hey, Steve, 91 00:05:57,480 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: why don't you tell me this like three weeks but 92 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 1: I actually got married? It is Oh, you got married 93 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 1: in Montana three ds ago. You could have done it 94 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: by proxy. I could have went fishing. So Seth, you're 95 00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 1: back on um. And this is just a shot out 96 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:14,359 Speaker 1: because I know that as we try to court a 97 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:17,760 Speaker 1: boat a boat sponsor for you guys, a lot of 98 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 1: boat sponsors might be like, yeah, well they're not fishing 99 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,240 Speaker 1: all the tournaments because what he's got to go to 100 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 1: that wedding. Now, I think boat sponsors are going to 101 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: be perked right up knowing that you, in fact, will 102 00:06:27,120 --> 00:06:31,599 Speaker 1: be able to hit all tournaments perfect man. And I'm 103 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:34,240 Speaker 1: sure Kelsey will have no problem with this whatsoever. Yeah, 104 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:37,599 Speaker 1: ask her about who she wants to proxy. Um, alright, 105 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:40,159 Speaker 1: for you, I'll do it. I don't okay, Ill said 106 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: he'll do it. Whatever, figure it out. That's when you 107 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:47,039 Speaker 1: know you work with a good group of guys, is 108 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:49,960 Speaker 1: when they'll stand in for you at your wedding. It's 109 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:52,040 Speaker 1: problem solving. It's a perk here. It's a perk when 110 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:55,279 Speaker 1: you come into get employment here. So good luck, rest 111 00:06:55,320 --> 00:06:59,000 Speaker 1: easy now on the Walleye tournament. Everything's in shape, awesome, Well, 112 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:02,279 Speaker 1: thank you guys, really appreciate it. No problem, man, my 113 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:08,840 Speaker 1: pleasure later seth Uh. Oh, here's the thing. So our 114 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 1: season ten on Netflix, which launched in two chunks February second, 115 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 1: part two. A bunch more episodes coming up February second. Uh. 116 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:24,000 Speaker 1: Spear fishing, I mean Caligro spear fishing with Kimmy Werner. 117 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,000 Speaker 1: Um that that was one of my favorites. Man, That 118 00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: was a very turned out to be a very good episode. 119 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:35,920 Speaker 1: Go Hunt in Hawaii. Uh, shooting bows at goats. Feral 120 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:37,560 Speaker 1: goats looks a lot like a goat you'd find in 121 00:07:37,600 --> 00:07:41,640 Speaker 1: your farm barnyard. But they're they're just running around? Were 122 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:44,880 Speaker 1: they too? Are they tough to kill? What else is 123 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 1: in there. It's just there's just so many of them. 124 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: Any individual one is but when like any and if 125 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 1: I said, like, oh go get that one out there, 126 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,560 Speaker 1: you might find that to be extraordinarily difficult. But it's 127 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 1: like once bump, that one just turned slightly to the right, 128 00:08:04,360 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: and here comes another three, you know, I mean, it's 129 00:08:06,400 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: just like it's just mean we at all do they smell? 130 00:08:10,160 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: Yet each individual one seems to be slightly varying degrees 131 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:19,680 Speaker 1: of wariness. There's just so many, and they're not all 132 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 1: doing the same thing, and they're not hip to your 133 00:08:22,560 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: effective range. So like they have great eyesight, they can 134 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:32,680 Speaker 1: see you, but they also are aware of how close 135 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:36,040 Speaker 1: other dangerous things get to them. And I believe the 136 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 1: most dangerous thing out there is a vehicle going sixty 137 00:08:41,920 --> 00:08:43,920 Speaker 1: and then one of the things like you imagine a 138 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:46,560 Speaker 1: herd out They all are sort of operating on the 139 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 1: same information, meaning like if you went into an area, 140 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 1: if you go into an area and like you know, 141 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:57,720 Speaker 1: spooked the bijeebas out of like a pack of cows, 142 00:08:58,200 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: it's not like the ones over fifty. It's a way 143 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 1: they're probably gonna go leave too, but they're not on 144 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 1: that program, and some might be like grazing north, but 145 00:09:13,160 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 1: they're sort of passing a group that's grazing south. It 146 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:19,800 Speaker 1: just it doesn't It's just it's there are so many 147 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:23,520 Speaker 1: of them. Um. I think we even talked about this, 148 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 1: I think now and then. Didn't they in the past 149 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:28,959 Speaker 1: cal do a thing and drove a bunch of them 150 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 1: into the ocean? This sounds horrible and despicable, but if 151 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 1: you were to get an idea of how many, you 152 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 1: quickly see how many goats there are out there and 153 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: how and if somebody were to say, like, do you 154 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: think these could out eat the cattle on the ground, 155 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,440 Speaker 1: then you're the wheels would start turning as to why 156 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:54,720 Speaker 1: that's an issue. And I've heard this from a number 157 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 1: of different sources, so I think in some regards it 158 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:03,920 Speaker 1: has to be true where a means of culling would 159 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 1: be to get a bunch of folks together and do 160 00:10:07,200 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: a big push goat jump they call it, and get 161 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:14,480 Speaker 1: them down to the cliffs above the sea and try 162 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 1: to push the goats into the sea. I gotta point 163 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:19,440 Speaker 1: out too, that there's a lot of people pounding it 164 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:21,760 Speaker 1: out on public ground in Hawaii, and it's probably not 165 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 1: the case. But we're on a private ranch where they 166 00:10:24,640 --> 00:10:26,199 Speaker 1: want to get rid of goats. But it's not like 167 00:10:26,600 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 1: you can't just pull over and start, you know, go on, 168 00:10:29,520 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 1: there's a real it's because I asked Jimmy about this 169 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 1: a bunch because down on the Captain Cook site, UM, 170 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 1: that state park there, they um had to cull some 171 00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: goats and they had a lottery for people to just 172 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:45,960 Speaker 1: come pick up a goat to take to take home, 173 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:47,320 Speaker 1: just to get a dead goat and bring it home 174 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:51,080 Speaker 1: or a live goat live or dad, I believe um. 175 00:10:51,120 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: And I was like, is anybody going to participate in this? 176 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,280 Speaker 1: And she was like, yeah, everybody's about like the easiest 177 00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 1: goat meat. But for some reason, it's like if somebody's 178 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 1: gonna go head out into the tall jungle grass with 179 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:09,400 Speaker 1: their archery equipment, they don't want to go after a goat. 180 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 1: They want to go after a sheep or access to her. 181 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: You know, wherever they are depending hunting farm animals. But 182 00:11:18,360 --> 00:11:23,640 Speaker 1: pretty much exceptionally take those places in Hawaii and there's 183 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:28,440 Speaker 1: place and why were there hunting? Um, you can hunt 184 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:35,600 Speaker 1: feral cattle freezer. There were so many of them while 185 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,120 Speaker 1: you guys were out hunting. I was just seeing how 186 00:11:38,160 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 1: close I could sneak up to him. Yeah, I'm just 187 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:47,400 Speaker 1: for funzies. Yeah. So Netflix February two, Oh Grant pointed 188 00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 1: out too, it's also Groundhog Day that day, but they're 189 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,640 Speaker 1: changing the national holiday and meeting or Season ten Part 190 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: two day. They're gonna make a Bill Murray movie called that. 191 00:11:56,520 --> 00:12:03,439 Speaker 1: Um here's another thing. Man struck me like a diamond bullet. Uh, 192 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:07,400 Speaker 1: next year's calendar and and you know, and we sold 193 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:11,440 Speaker 1: a mountain of funked up old tree stands calendars. Picture 194 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:16,320 Speaker 1: this funked up old taxidermy. That's Part two. A lot 195 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:18,640 Speaker 1: of material there. We already got the website, we already 196 00:12:18,679 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 1: got the email address set up. So here's what. Here's 197 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:26,800 Speaker 1: what we're not doing, much to Karne's chagrin, Krin is 198 00:12:26,880 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: into and it's just like it's just karn is into 199 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 1: the type of tax dremy where people make like, like, uh, 200 00:12:34,640 --> 00:12:39,959 Speaker 1: Harry Potter type stuff. Yea. Like when I say, if 201 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:41,520 Speaker 1: I hear the word taxing, which is the thing that 202 00:12:41,520 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: comes to my mind, which is like getting your buck 203 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,559 Speaker 1: stuffed so you hang it onto your wall. You're hunting lodge, 204 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:55,120 Speaker 1: what comes to Krin's mind is a griffin. It's just 205 00:12:55,200 --> 00:13:00,400 Speaker 1: like the you know, uh panda with a pheas his head. 206 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 1: I don't know, it's just like where her mind. That's her. 207 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:06,240 Speaker 1: This is not this calendar. Maybe we'll give in the 208 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:08,319 Speaker 1: back on the back page, we can give a page 209 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:10,719 Speaker 1: with a bunch of things to satisfy cringe needs, and 210 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:12,760 Speaker 1: she can just leave hers open to that page all year. 211 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,040 Speaker 1: It'll be a bunch of these things people make, like 212 00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:19,280 Speaker 1: a bunch of things people make to ourn't animals. But 213 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,880 Speaker 1: we're looking for like pictures of legitimate like the worst 214 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,959 Speaker 1: tax dury on the planet. I have a private museum 215 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 1: that I've told you about in Idaho that we can 216 00:13:30,200 --> 00:13:31,920 Speaker 1: go do a photo shoot and that it is like 217 00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:35,680 Speaker 1: just pulling up right now. Don't send in the ones 218 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:38,440 Speaker 1: that are already circulating the internet. No, these need to 219 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:40,720 Speaker 1: be original, they can't be a favorite. Sets sent one 220 00:13:40,760 --> 00:13:42,520 Speaker 1: in the idea it was like some guy had it 221 00:13:42,600 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 1: up was like the worst coyote you've ever seen. The 222 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: caption on Instagram with sir, your Kyle is ready for 223 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 1: pick up. Hey, you know there's a really good one 224 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: where we're going to be next week. That's like I 225 00:13:55,040 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 1: desperately want to go, Yeah, we have the worst mountain 226 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:03,200 Speaker 1: lion mount you've ever seen, um bad. And then yeah, 227 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:05,640 Speaker 1: that's the crane that's right up Cran's alley. I feel 228 00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:09,160 Speaker 1: like that's off that Christmas movie, Ye little kids Christmas movie. 229 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:14,360 Speaker 1: So the emails, Oh you know who's got an go 230 00:14:14,559 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 1: Matt Cook those weasels he's got on his fireplace, mantle 231 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,160 Speaker 1: contenders Navy. Here's what you might need to do, though, 232 00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 1: I think like, send what you got, and what might 233 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:27,600 Speaker 1: happen is if it's if it's appropriate. When we make 234 00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: our selections, we might either if possible, we might and 235 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,200 Speaker 1: we'll pay for all this. We might box, we might 236 00:14:36,240 --> 00:14:38,560 Speaker 1: have you like we'll pay for shipping, but we might 237 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:42,200 Speaker 1: have you package your stuff to send us to photograph. 238 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: But just start making your submissions now, because that's got 239 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: nothing to do. Um. You can send them to fucked 240 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,040 Speaker 1: Up Old Taxidermy at the meat eater dot com, or 241 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:56,160 Speaker 1: if you're a kid and you're not allowed to swear yet, 242 00:14:56,880 --> 00:15:05,160 Speaker 1: send it to f you oh at the mediator dot com. 243 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: So message to my kids. If you submit, you better 244 00:15:08,360 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: submit under f U O T at the meat eater 245 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:14,880 Speaker 1: dot com and not the other version and we will 246 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 1: start digging through. But your worst old like I'm talking 247 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 1: Grandpa's old deer with the newspaper print sticking out of 248 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: his ear, bad taxidermy great calendar, a lot of audience blowback, Brodie, 249 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:31,440 Speaker 1: you better speak to this. Uh, my opinion hasn't changed 250 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:36,440 Speaker 1: based on the blowback. So Brodie doesn't even remember saying 251 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: because that's how much how how I just don't think 252 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:44,320 Speaker 1: it's important. But obviously some people really love their Golden Retrievers. 253 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: And Brody said they're the dumbest dogs in the world, 254 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: and he got he might as well have said that 255 00:15:50,920 --> 00:16:00,280 Speaker 1: he like, Um, I don't know, like beat up mother Teresa, yep, exactly. Anyway, Um, 256 00:16:00,360 --> 00:16:03,200 Speaker 1: people really love their Golden Retrievers. They're not and and 257 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: and they're not the dumbest dogs ever, according to all 258 00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,680 Speaker 1: these people that wrote into us. Um. Here's a quote 259 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 1: here from a listener named Pat who's a pheasant hunter, 260 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:16,440 Speaker 1: and he ends with an invite to go pheasant hunting. Yeah, 261 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,400 Speaker 1: I might take him up on it. At the end 262 00:16:19,400 --> 00:16:21,480 Speaker 1: of that trip he takes his spot. You gotta be 263 00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:26,720 Speaker 1: like that dog really is dumb Um, that really is 264 00:16:26,720 --> 00:16:29,960 Speaker 1: the dumbest dog I've ever seen. Uh So for the correction, 265 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: he says, my dog's name is Tucker, and he's a 266 00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:34,880 Speaker 1: four year old Golden Retriever. He is not only a 267 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 1: phenomenal hunting dog, he's also the best family dog I 268 00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: have ever had, which you know, family dog, I don't. 269 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: I don't disagree with that. I gotta see the dog 270 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: hunt first though. Um. He is with me seven and 271 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:52,880 Speaker 1: also enjoys the podcast. He's a damn smart lab the podcast. Um. 272 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,480 Speaker 1: He can have his dumb moments like all animals, but 273 00:16:55,520 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 1: when it comes to work, Golden Retrievers are not the 274 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 1: dumbest animal in the world. Yeah, invited out of the 275 00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:04,840 Speaker 1: North Dakota, which isn't terribly far away. Who wasn't trying 276 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: to fend you fat Pat or any other Golden retriever 277 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:12,560 Speaker 1: Well Krin said some people were likely actually legitimately mad. 278 00:17:12,720 --> 00:17:15,680 Speaker 1: People get worked up about dogs, and you got to 279 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,200 Speaker 1: keep in mind when you're an angry Golden Retriever owner, 280 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:22,520 Speaker 1: you have hours and hours of brushing birds out of 281 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:29,000 Speaker 1: their hair with you this stuff. Here's a mad email 282 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:34,200 Speaker 1: we got. Okay, but here's the thing. The guy's got 283 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:36,080 Speaker 1: a tone of like the guy's got points he's got 284 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: legitimate points. This guy is mad about our and we've 285 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,880 Speaker 1: see here's the thing Americ like. You know, I heard 286 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:50,080 Speaker 1: a really funny joke one time. Um, A TV executive 287 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 1: once said to me, I think he's the guy from 288 00:17:53,160 --> 00:17:55,960 Speaker 1: History Channel. Yeah, guy from History Channel once said to me. 289 00:17:57,000 --> 00:18:04,640 Speaker 1: The only other country our audiences in arrested in is Alaska. 290 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 1: But Europe is a big old place. Okay, Europe is 291 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 1: a big old place full. You know, how are you 292 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:16,680 Speaker 1: countries in Europe? Bunch, it's continent. They got them packed 293 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 1: in way tighter. US Americans don't know the answer to that. 294 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 1: But they pack in countries like we pack in states. 295 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:25,919 Speaker 1: And they all got their own little governments, cute little garments, 296 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 1: all their free this and free that somewhere care uh 297 00:18:31,880 --> 00:18:35,280 Speaker 1: So we're always talking about what goes on in Europe 298 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 1: as though it's like a place and our credit. We 299 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:43,080 Speaker 1: have mused, we have mused about finding a sort of 300 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 1: pan European hunting authority who would come in and be like, 301 00:18:49,320 --> 00:18:51,200 Speaker 1: here's the lay of the land, the same way someone 302 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:55,080 Speaker 1: might come in and do a seminar on the differences 303 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 1: in the way the fifty States, the fifty U s 304 00:18:57,760 --> 00:19:01,680 Speaker 1: States the differences in how they manage, like from management approaches. Right, 305 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 1: you got like this, you can actually still you know, 306 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:07,000 Speaker 1: set a bear trap in Maine. You know, you can 307 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:09,200 Speaker 1: ventce your deer in in Texas and like walks through 308 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:11,760 Speaker 1: Like here's how they're all different, but here's all they're 309 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:16,320 Speaker 1: the same. Different. We've mused about this. Yanni is actually 310 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:23,280 Speaker 1: going to Latvia to do an investigative dig deep on 311 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 1: lavian hunting. So we're trying to get educated, well at 312 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:32,639 Speaker 1: least know how one of the hunting in Europe goes down. Okay, 313 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 1: so letter goes like this, Hey, Steve, you can start 314 00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:37,760 Speaker 1: making that noise you use to describe people who hears 315 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:40,920 Speaker 1: something on your podcast, then rite to you to say 316 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: you're full of ship that annoying. No, no, no, I 317 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:49,440 Speaker 1: think it's not that. It's not no, no, no no, it's this. 318 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 1: So you'd have to replace the ends with d s 319 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:58,359 Speaker 1: because in this case, you are full of ship, he says, 320 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 1: and you're see this is Here's the thing is, I 321 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:03,679 Speaker 1: got this email a long time ago and I just 322 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: didn't get to it and then it was resent to me. 323 00:20:06,760 --> 00:20:09,760 Speaker 1: So this sent is resent to me yesterday, just like 324 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:12,879 Speaker 1: a heads up, like a follow up on its anniverse. 325 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:16,080 Speaker 1: It was the anniversary of the original scent. But it's 326 00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:18,560 Speaker 1: all fair stuff, you said. In your recent podcast covering 327 00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:21,360 Speaker 1: the flooding in South Dakota and the challenges that presents 328 00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: to sort out the legal issues of access, both you 329 00:20:24,640 --> 00:20:27,600 Speaker 1: and Callahan blurted out righteous intonation at the concept of 330 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,560 Speaker 1: landowners setting bag limits for fish in the water they 331 00:20:30,640 --> 00:20:36,920 Speaker 1: own quote own. We're talking about these floods in North 332 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:38,879 Speaker 1: Dakota and South Dakota that like you think of a 333 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:40,680 Speaker 1: flood like goes up and comes back down, but these 334 00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:45,480 Speaker 1: are floods that stayed. So in this old podcast episode, 335 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:47,639 Speaker 1: maybe maybe you can find it and tell us what 336 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 1: it was called. That was one where we had a 337 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,720 Speaker 1: guy on that blew was trying to jump up out 338 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 1: of his layout B line. Oh yeah, and blew two 339 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:00,880 Speaker 1: of his toes off, and you think helew the edges off, 340 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:04,760 Speaker 1: but he blew the middle toes out. Yeah, great guy. 341 00:21:05,920 --> 00:21:08,040 Speaker 1: It happened so fast he still shot at the goose. 342 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 1: But during shooting at the goose he realized what had 343 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:14,679 Speaker 1: happened and didn't know if he even hit the goose. 344 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:17,879 Speaker 1: He like blew his toes out, shot at the geese 345 00:21:18,080 --> 00:21:19,960 Speaker 1: then was like, oh, just blew my toes out. I 346 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 1: think said his foot fell hot or something. Let me 347 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 1: laugh at the brother. Well he was laughing about it, 348 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: but his foot looks funny. I think we put it 349 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:38,720 Speaker 1: on your Instagram. Was this hunting the anthroposyne? Yes, So anyways, 350 00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: you got farmers who or whatever. You have landowners whose 351 00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,639 Speaker 1: land is now under a lake, and so like state 352 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,880 Speaker 1: managed fish swim over your land and it's covered in water, 353 00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:51,359 Speaker 1: and and these are lakes that used to exist, but 354 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 1: they've they've taken over farm So there's there's this dispute 355 00:21:55,400 --> 00:21:59,520 Speaker 1: like can a farmer go? And what's going to really 356 00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:02,040 Speaker 1: confuse was we also just talked about the same thing 357 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 1: the other day in North Dakota, but I'm talking about 358 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 1: we talked about it a year ago in South Dakota, 359 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:09,520 Speaker 1: UM where landowners were like putting out strings of Booey's 360 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 1: to sort of like hold portions of the lake that 361 00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,000 Speaker 1: sat over their property as their own thing. And it's 362 00:22:16,000 --> 00:22:19,200 Speaker 1: just a lot of big piston match. Anyway, in this conversation, 363 00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 1: apparently calnt I blurted out with righteous, righteous indignation, I'm 364 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:26,440 Speaker 1: back to quoting at the concept of landowners setting bag 365 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: limits for fishing the water they own, of course, being 366 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,720 Speaker 1: totally this quote from the writer the person writing in 367 00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 1: of course being totally clueless. You boys compared that to 368 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:40,960 Speaker 1: the European system, where landowners set bag limits. He says, 369 00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 1: not that's not true, and he says it's something you've 370 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: done before. I hope this email prevents you from doing 371 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:50,120 Speaker 1: it again. Goes on to say, I try to give 372 00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: this information to Calahan, but he just blew it off. 373 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:55,679 Speaker 1: My take on you is that you're more of a 374 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,840 Speaker 1: fact based person who does not blow information off just 375 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:02,480 Speaker 1: because it contradicts your finally held beliefs. He attached some 376 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 1: articles which John he's gonna read up on a new 377 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,160 Speaker 1: book reports down the road here when he gets a minute. 378 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,920 Speaker 1: He goes on to mention a fella that that we're 379 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: all familiar with. And I've met Chris Eberhardt, who tragically 380 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:18,040 Speaker 1: passed away quite young, um, not too long ago, but 381 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,080 Speaker 1: the guy right and then says, you know Chris Eberhart. 382 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 1: I discussed the problem of ill informed American hunting celebrities 383 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: with him, and he made some interesting observations. First off, 384 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,199 Speaker 1: it's pretty typical of you and every other American to 385 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,080 Speaker 1: dismiss all of Europe as an elitist hunting and fishing 386 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:40,680 Speaker 1: club controlled by wealthy landowners. Wrong on count one. Second, 387 00:23:41,320 --> 00:23:45,400 Speaker 1: that game management is a private affair with landowners making myriad, 388 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: potentially harmful decisions all across the landscape. Wrong, continuing to 389 00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,879 Speaker 1: quote it's all dictated by state biologists and failure to 390 00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,720 Speaker 1: follow their management plan will result in fines. And finally, 391 00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:02,359 Speaker 1: Chris points out that the American model is great and 392 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 1: it's phenomenal at increasing populations, However, it sucks at controlling populations. 393 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:12,560 Speaker 1: The European model excels at that. Because private landowners are 394 00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:16,720 Speaker 1: not allowed to make hunting off limits or restrict the 395 00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,879 Speaker 1: take in hopes of growing trophies, it is easy to 396 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,760 Speaker 1: manage populations. That is a problem we are facing in 397 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 1: many places in the US where private non hunting land 398 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:30,440 Speaker 1: as a haven for overpopulation. Too quick counterpoints. I feel 399 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:33,439 Speaker 1: a little bit like the person, like this individual is 400 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: sort of committing the same mistake that we're committing, where 401 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:40,360 Speaker 1: he's generalizing in a way that I'm sure there are 402 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,760 Speaker 1: probably exceptions. I don't think that all of Europe is 403 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:49,160 Speaker 1: by mandate open to hunting. I bet you how many 404 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:52,359 Speaker 1: countries they got over there. They count in half of Russia. 405 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:59,960 Speaker 1: M I'm not sure if they're uh so. The other 406 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:03,800 Speaker 1: to Shay is that in my life, um, in my 407 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,560 Speaker 1: adult life, I've really come to rethink what people mean 408 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:11,600 Speaker 1: when they say overpopulated wildlife. I had a kid right 409 00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 1: in m This is not quoting. I had a kid 410 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:15,240 Speaker 1: right in the ore day. He's a high schooler and 411 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:17,680 Speaker 1: he wanted to interview me for a school project he's doing. 412 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:19,359 Speaker 1: And he's doing a thing about how you should be 413 00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: able to hunt bears in his state. You can't currently 414 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:23,679 Speaker 1: hunt bears in the state. And he's like, maybe he 415 00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 1: wants to make a documentary shown that you should be 416 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:29,840 Speaker 1: able to hunt bears because they'll become overpopulated. And I don't. 417 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,359 Speaker 1: I've never been in a place where I thought there 418 00:25:31,400 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 1: was too many bears, Like I can't think I've ever 419 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:39,680 Speaker 1: think of there's too many bears. New Jersey might be 420 00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: headed that way. I don't know him, right, but yeah, 421 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:46,119 Speaker 1: but you also have never been like a farmer in 422 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:49,800 Speaker 1: have you populated bear country where bears are raiding your 423 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:52,840 Speaker 1: It's it's yeah, I think that When I was Yeah, 424 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:54,560 Speaker 1: you're right, I was gonna say it's a very it's 425 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,480 Speaker 1: a very subjective thing, right, it's a very SUBJECTI thing. 426 00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,879 Speaker 1: When I'm sitting in my dear stand, I seldom of 427 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: thinking there's too many dear it's a suggest. It's like 428 00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,359 Speaker 1: a farmer probably think there's way too many. A vehicle 429 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:09,159 Speaker 1: insurance person probably think there's too many. Someone in the 430 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 1: state that this kid is talking about, probably and he 431 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:13,640 Speaker 1: has an orchard, or he's a b person that has 432 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:17,120 Speaker 1: what's that called an apiary m what's the beekeeper called? 433 00:26:17,680 --> 00:26:20,919 Speaker 1: That's that's correct, an apiarist. I don't know beekeeper. He 434 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,440 Speaker 1: probably think there's too many bears. But a bear hunter 435 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 1: who just drew a bear tag, why not think there's 436 00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:33,040 Speaker 1: too many bears? I'm saying subjective. Um, read the articles. 437 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: This is going back and to say, even if you 438 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:37,560 Speaker 1: don't want to provide your listeners with the truth, you'll 439 00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,439 Speaker 1: be informed enough to make too. Maybe stop feeding them 440 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:44,920 Speaker 1: a pile of horse ship cut the crap. Quit being 441 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 1: an idiot. Oh, I forgot a little bit a buttlepart. 442 00:26:51,080 --> 00:26:54,160 Speaker 1: European hunters are no less passionate and committed to conservation 443 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 1: than are we Americans. You do them a horrible disservice 444 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,360 Speaker 1: and insult them when you slander their system without knowing 445 00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 1: shit about it. That's fair, like, it's fair. It's fair point, 446 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:07,679 Speaker 1: and I do think he makes it. Also, there's a 447 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:11,119 Speaker 1: good point he makes in there also. I can read 448 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 1: here and quote that in Germany over six the population 449 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 1: eats while the game because it is available commercially. He asks, 450 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:21,480 Speaker 1: what do you do? What do you think that does 451 00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:25,080 Speaker 1: to encourage the general population to approve of hunting. My 452 00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 1: personal experience is that in Germany the populace looks forward 453 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:36,040 Speaker 1: with relish to the availability of wild as they call venison. Nope, 454 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:38,880 Speaker 1: not into that, not into it. Not into it. I'll 455 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 1: never give. I should say i'll never give because I 456 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,280 Speaker 1: like to stay open to information. But I I know, 457 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 1: I understand all the arguments how you should be able 458 00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:47,879 Speaker 1: to sell venison in the areas where there's like a 459 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 1: wide consensus the deer overpopulated. But I'm not into it. 460 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:53,160 Speaker 1: I don't think it's a good idea. Well, I think 461 00:27:53,200 --> 00:27:54,679 Speaker 1: you would think it was a good idea if it 462 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: meant that we would get your offspring and your afstrings 463 00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,520 Speaker 1: aspring would get to continue hunting in our country. If 464 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:05,240 Speaker 1: that was the only way. If God came down to 465 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:07,199 Speaker 1: me and said, the only way your children will be 466 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:09,000 Speaker 1: able to hunt, as if people can sell venice in 467 00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:11,160 Speaker 1: New Jersey, I'd have it would be a different conversation 468 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:15,400 Speaker 1: until that point. Yeah, that's why I said I'm open 469 00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,359 Speaker 1: to change in my mind, because he might. I always 470 00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 1: think of wild mushrooms, just mushroom sitting there on a hillside, 471 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,200 Speaker 1: mine its own business until somebody puts a price tag 472 00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:30,160 Speaker 1: on it, and then it said, God damn battle ground 473 00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:35,480 Speaker 1: of people being assholes to each other in parking lots, 474 00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 1: packing guns around, all sorts of nasty unts, including giant piles, 475 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:50,920 Speaker 1: are human feces you mean at the morel spots, at 476 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 1: the morrel spots, or the commercial guys come in and okay, 477 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 1: you're like, oh, kind of ceased to be a mushroom 478 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:01,760 Speaker 1: once there was a price tag on it. And that's 479 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: a thing that can't run away, get in front of 480 00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: other people. It's just plugged right into the ground. You've 481 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 1: also got the public land private land thing here that 482 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:13,880 Speaker 1: like isn't an issue there, you know what I mean, 483 00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 1: Like market hunting on public land, you know what I'm 484 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:21,520 Speaker 1: saying here, versus like you know, I understand all the 485 00:29:21,560 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 1: arguments against it. I just think that it's also a 486 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: very interesting argument, something that should make you think that 487 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:31,400 Speaker 1: if we don't have six approval of hunting, do we? Yeah, 488 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,280 Speaker 1: it's much higher in the US until you started asking specifics, 489 00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:39,160 Speaker 1: it's higher than six. You call people. You can find 490 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 1: all these studies online, all these serveys online. But it 491 00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 1: only works until you get specific. If you call people 492 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: and say, do you support the regulated do you support 493 00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:52,640 Speaker 1: like regulated hunting for food? Right? I don't know. I 494 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:55,080 Speaker 1: don't think you gotta put that way. Then you get 495 00:29:55,120 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 1: I don't know. It's it's higher now than it wasn't 496 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,520 Speaker 1: the nineties. The minute you say something like do you 497 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:06,000 Speaker 1: support um hunting grizzly bears with traps? Trapping grizzly bears? 498 00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 1: The word trophy in there, Yeah, but any like it 499 00:30:10,000 --> 00:30:11,720 Speaker 1: would be like if you went instead like do you 500 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:15,520 Speaker 1: support hunting game birds with the use of dogs, it'll 501 00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:20,200 Speaker 1: go down like any detail puts it down. But the 502 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: general idea of like regulated hunting is acceptable until you 503 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: put a face to it. If you had a little 504 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 1: picture of a little fawn and you're like, do you 505 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: support hunting this? Right, you'd probably have a low score. Yeah. 506 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:38,520 Speaker 1: I mean, one thing you gotta keep in mind too, 507 00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:41,040 Speaker 1: it's a big difference between the US and and and 508 00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 1: Europe is cultural. Right, So you have in the US, 509 00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:46,920 Speaker 1: we all share a common language and we have slight 510 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:51,560 Speaker 1: cultural differences. But in Europe, I mean it's it's almost, um, 511 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,560 Speaker 1: it's almost like you know, different ends of the world 512 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:55,760 Speaker 1: where you have different languages, you have different cultures, you 513 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:58,080 Speaker 1: have different mannerisms, and a lot of that goes and 514 00:30:58,080 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 1: plays into um, you know what the the I guess hunting. Yeah, 515 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 1: like less likely to find some well traveled person who 516 00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:11,479 Speaker 1: has a detailed, nuanced understanding of all the different states 517 00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 1: game management approaches because you can go to a conference 518 00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 1: and hear all their biologists talking in English. Yeah. And 519 00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 1: I think that even the environment is quite a bit different. 520 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 1: So what you're gonna find in like the old Slavic 521 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:28,160 Speaker 1: region versus the Scandinavian region versus Spain. You know, they're 522 00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:33,920 Speaker 1: very different, Um, just language wise, weather wise, check out, 523 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 1: though it's not as different as the north slope of 524 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:49,760 Speaker 1: the Brooks Range is from the Buyou country of Louisiana. 525 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,360 Speaker 1: You're You're absolutely right. And I think the big big 526 00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,840 Speaker 1: is that is that there's you know, it's tough to 527 00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,120 Speaker 1: have somebody that's an expert in all those languages as 528 00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 1: well to do that, So might have to get three 529 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:06,120 Speaker 1: or four people. Karn's gonna figure it out. Sure, there's 530 00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:08,200 Speaker 1: a lot of people who have traveled across Europe and 531 00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:11,200 Speaker 1: hunted a lot of different places. Do you know who 532 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: I bet would know all this stuff? Man, Um, Craig Boddington, 533 00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:23,440 Speaker 1: That dude is hunted, he's probably, he's probably he's hounty 534 00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:28,480 Speaker 1: countries I don't even know about, never heard of. That 535 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:32,880 Speaker 1: might be interesting. He's a gun writer, Craig real, real, 536 00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:37,200 Speaker 1: nice fella. He's military to write. Colonel Colonel Craig Boddington 537 00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:42,160 Speaker 1: put that new notes, Krim put that new notes and 538 00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 1: smoke it. A badger found a bunch of Roman treasure 539 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 1: in Spain? You like that segue? John's um. The guy 540 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,720 Speaker 1: was looking at a badger burrow. You know about this 541 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,200 Speaker 1: count Let's be up here here. Guy was looking at 542 00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 1: a badger burrow and like some gold coins are laying 543 00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:04,080 Speaker 1: out where he'd been digging around. They blame it on 544 00:33:04,120 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 1: the unsea. They blame it on the very severe weather 545 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,840 Speaker 1: that northern Spain had as though this particularly harsh winter 546 00:33:11,680 --> 00:33:16,160 Speaker 1: caused this badger to work extra hard and insert its 547 00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,440 Speaker 1: legs and the even smaller cracks than normal next to 548 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:22,880 Speaker 1: his den, and this hard winner drove him to discover 549 00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:27,280 Speaker 1: this cash of coins. It's a nice hypothesis to not 550 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,040 Speaker 1: once someone went and checked it out. Two nine coins 551 00:33:30,120 --> 00:33:35,360 Speaker 1: dating back to what between the third and fifth centuries? 552 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:39,320 Speaker 1: A d uh way back when in my youth, when 553 00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 1: I was guiding antelope points outside of win At, Montana, 554 00:33:44,400 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 1: there was a badger, maybe a family of badgers that 555 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: had inhabited the win At Cemetery, and I mean just 556 00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:01,080 Speaker 1: had no respect for the folks buried out there at 557 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 1: the win At Cemetery. He's like, hey, you would you 558 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:08,520 Speaker 1: respect where my ancestors are buried? But not. Uh. Many 559 00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:12,960 Speaker 1: times over the course of several years, I witnessed firsthand 560 00:34:13,040 --> 00:34:17,200 Speaker 1: people shooting into the women went at cemetery trying to 561 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 1: protect the bones of their grandfather's. Yeah, and every year, man, 562 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:26,040 Speaker 1: you'd see those tombstones and and uh, things just get 563 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 1: like more and more Caddie want us as everything was 564 00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:33,120 Speaker 1: getting undermined in there see a badger of carrying around 565 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:38,320 Speaker 1: an old flask or something like that. Carrying around granny 566 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,400 Speaker 1: shoulder blade. Yeah, one of the ranch hands on one 567 00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:44,680 Speaker 1: of the places that we knew had had passed away. 568 00:34:44,880 --> 00:34:49,040 Speaker 1: And you know, so we uh were real, real familiar 569 00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:54,280 Speaker 1: with the date of internment and uh gotta gotta witness 570 00:34:55,960 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: the progression of badger activity out there off of off 571 00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:06,000 Speaker 1: of a known date. Yeah. The this this article about 572 00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:09,760 Speaker 1: the this article about the badge you finding those coins 573 00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,759 Speaker 1: ends with a very interesting superlative because they wanted to 574 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,520 Speaker 1: close it with a superlative. So it's it's highly qualified. 575 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:23,360 Speaker 1: This was the largest trove of Roman coins found in 576 00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:28,800 Speaker 1: a cave in the north of the country on Tuesday. 577 00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 1: I want to know what happened at the bad I 578 00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:35,320 Speaker 1: want to know how big a stash of Roman coins 579 00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 1: were found in the central There's some wealthy match out 580 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 1: there that they're not talking about. Uh, okay, do this 581 00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:47,200 Speaker 1: little uh do your report. This is not a call 582 00:35:47,239 --> 00:35:49,880 Speaker 1: to action, but this is a ridiculous I think this 583 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:58,720 Speaker 1: is ridiculous. Oh yeah, so this past fall, a muzzle 584 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: loader hunter in Colorado shot and fatally wounded a archery 585 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:11,839 Speaker 1: hunter killed. Yeah, well, fatally killed would be redundantouldn't it. 586 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:14,560 Speaker 1: I was gonna say that I stopped myself. I heard 587 00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 1: you stop yourself. I just wanted people to know that 588 00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:23,960 Speaker 1: he was dead. Well all right, so he uh yeah, 589 00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:28,919 Speaker 1: nothing to laugh about anyways. That has spurred people talking 590 00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:35,080 Speaker 1: about how to make um the UH coinciding muzzleloader and 591 00:36:35,280 --> 00:36:39,880 Speaker 1: archery season in Colorado safer. Um. Both of these groups 592 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:43,320 Speaker 1: have over the years since they've started having these seasons, 593 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 1: which is sometimes in the seventies, when they've had a 594 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:50,880 Speaker 1: coinciding UH muzzloader season and an archery season. Right, Muzlowos 595 00:36:50,880 --> 00:36:53,760 Speaker 1: have a little farther range. Um, you know, it's a rifle. 596 00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:57,320 Speaker 1: They're both primitive, so they both both archery and mussloders 597 00:36:57,320 --> 00:36:59,640 Speaker 1: are primitive, so they've both requested to hunt during the 598 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:03,560 Speaker 1: run to make the hunt easier. And so basically the 599 00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:07,279 Speaker 1: musloder hunters get a nine day season roughly the third 600 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,360 Speaker 1: week right rodeo September, and archery season goes basically the 601 00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,279 Speaker 1: whole month of September, give or take the dates a 602 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:17,879 Speaker 1: little bit, but um, you have a nine day period 603 00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:21,920 Speaker 1: where it overlaps. To this point. Archie hunters just get 604 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 1: to go in full camo. Musloder hunters have to wear 605 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:28,040 Speaker 1: just like rifle hunters in Colorado five square inches of 606 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:39,480 Speaker 1: daylight orange. It's a lot um so uh. Since uh 607 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:42,400 Speaker 1: that year in the nineteen seventies, there has been three 608 00:37:43,719 --> 00:37:47,839 Speaker 1: uh instances where hunters have been or archie hunter has 609 00:37:47,880 --> 00:37:50,400 Speaker 1: been shot by muzzloader hunters. Two of them were fatal 610 00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:55,520 Speaker 1: um but one a decade, no one more than a 611 00:37:55,560 --> 00:38:01,080 Speaker 1: decade to five. We gotta get just like a person 612 00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: in here from around it's like, oh we got one. Yeah, 613 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,239 Speaker 1: it would be like you know, point seven five or 614 00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:10,680 Speaker 1: point eight? Oh sorry I met one point five decades yeah, 615 00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:14,279 Speaker 1: um yeah, man, we should do a lot of math 616 00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:21,080 Speaker 1: stuff with this guy. Uh. So they're proposing now that 617 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,879 Speaker 1: during that nine day season that archery hunters, to make 618 00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:29,799 Speaker 1: it safer, that during that nine day coinciding season, that 619 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:32,319 Speaker 1: the archer hunters would also be required to wear the 620 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,440 Speaker 1: five square inches. Oh they're so, they're throwing down on 621 00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:40,960 Speaker 1: the full freaking five five. Yeah. I read up. I 622 00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,279 Speaker 1: read up, and it is a full five hondo. Um, 623 00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:49,000 Speaker 1: but only while muzzle order season is in. Uh is 624 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:52,200 Speaker 1: in and only on public land? Do you know how 625 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:57,879 Speaker 1: long that muzzle latter season is? Not only public land only? 626 00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: While most loaders let you report it's over because I'm 627 00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:04,440 Speaker 1: gona tell you what I would do. Ah, they have 628 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:06,839 Speaker 1: they have other options that are getting thrown out there, 629 00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 1: other alternatives like separating the regular archery and muzzleloader seasons, um, 630 00:39:13,080 --> 00:39:17,880 Speaker 1: leaving it the same. Ah. But yeah, it's getting actually 631 00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 1: voted on today as we're as we're discussing this. Mm hmm. 632 00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:25,760 Speaker 1: What would you do, Steve? If I was the Emperor 633 00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:31,080 Speaker 1: of Colorado, I would and I probably wouldn't get it 634 00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:33,760 Speaker 1: done immediately. I would scrap all this talk. I'd scrap 635 00:39:33,800 --> 00:39:37,040 Speaker 1: all the orange talk for archery hunters, and I would 636 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:42,120 Speaker 1: put my best people. Um, I'll put my best people 637 00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:45,799 Speaker 1: on bringing our this is the Omber of Colorado. I'd 638 00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:48,680 Speaker 1: be like, I want you guys to call everybody all 639 00:39:48,719 --> 00:39:54,600 Speaker 1: the other states that have elk archery hunts and muzzleloader hunts, 640 00:39:55,320 --> 00:39:57,560 Speaker 1: and I want you to come to me with proposal 641 00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:03,120 Speaker 1: that separates the hunts so that when it's archery season, like, 642 00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:09,160 Speaker 1: the archery season stays as a archery rut hunt. And 643 00:40:09,440 --> 00:40:13,080 Speaker 1: we're gonna make like everybody else, We're gonna make Um, 644 00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:15,920 Speaker 1: We're gonna figure out what that like allocation is and 645 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:19,320 Speaker 1: impacts on her dynamics and wintering range and all that garbage, 646 00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:22,080 Speaker 1: like a very well calculated thing. We're going to figure 647 00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:25,279 Speaker 1: out how to have archery during the rut. We're gonna 648 00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:28,160 Speaker 1: run our firearms seasons. Then we're gonna run the muzzloader 649 00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,200 Speaker 1: stuff later, and the muzzleloader is gonna be like on 650 00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:33,160 Speaker 1: its own late season. It's not going to be You're 651 00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:35,719 Speaker 1: just gonna kick the muzzlers right on out of September. Hey, 652 00:40:35,719 --> 00:40:37,640 Speaker 1: this is coming from a guy that's hunted muzzleloader in 653 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:41,600 Speaker 1: Colorado during archery season. Okay, that's if I was the 654 00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,959 Speaker 1: Emperor of Colorado, I would say, I want to buy 655 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:50,759 Speaker 1: twenty twenty three season. I want this all separated. You 656 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,080 Speaker 1: would have to be the emperor to get that ship passed. 657 00:40:53,160 --> 00:40:59,520 Speaker 1: I think in this hypothetical it's only valuable to talk 658 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:05,080 Speaker 1: about like like it's just like if you're talking about 659 00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,000 Speaker 1: what you would do. I'm just something like if I, yeah, 660 00:41:08,000 --> 00:41:10,120 Speaker 1: if I was not the emperor, that that won't be 661 00:41:10,160 --> 00:41:11,840 Speaker 1: the answer. I'm saying, like, if someone came to me 662 00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:14,040 Speaker 1: with the problem, that's what I would say, because it's 663 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:16,840 Speaker 1: it's it's a proven formula all around the damn country 664 00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:19,040 Speaker 1: it is, but the only place where you've got muzzloader 665 00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:20,680 Speaker 1: guys and archery guys. Why I can await at the 666 00:41:20,680 --> 00:41:23,840 Speaker 1: same time. But you've you're all about traditional use patterns, 667 00:41:23,920 --> 00:41:28,120 Speaker 1: and that's a traditional use. I'm not taking it away. 668 00:41:28,239 --> 00:41:31,000 Speaker 1: I'm not taking it away. You're taking that rut hunt 669 00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:34,600 Speaker 1: away from buzzleloader hunter. Yes I am, which is traditional 670 00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:40,680 Speaker 1: in Colorado. Okay, but not it's twenty five years. I'm 671 00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:45,040 Speaker 1: not stripping a privilege. I'm finding a way. Like, what, 672 00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:50,120 Speaker 1: what's your big I mean, I'm just what's the big 673 00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:54,279 Speaker 1: qualm with wearing some orange during archery season? I think 674 00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:57,440 Speaker 1: I know the answer, but like, what what you know? 675 00:41:57,520 --> 00:41:59,840 Speaker 1: What you're here's the thing I'm here's if I was 676 00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:05,640 Speaker 1: the Emperor, my plan? Uh isn't I'm not responding. I 677 00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:08,239 Speaker 1: should clarify this. I'm not responding to the orange part. 678 00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:10,239 Speaker 1: The orange part. I would say, there's an inherent risk 679 00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:13,120 Speaker 1: of going outside with with weapons and wild animals and stuff, 680 00:42:13,160 --> 00:42:15,719 Speaker 1: and like, yes, we've had a couple of fatalities over 681 00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 1: twenty five years. Um, we've had a lot more people 682 00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:21,360 Speaker 1: die from exposure. It's like it's inherently risky. You have 683 00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:25,400 Speaker 1: a weapon, you're dealing with animals up close, people shoot 684 00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:27,959 Speaker 1: elk and then the elk stands up and kills them. 685 00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:32,480 Speaker 1: That happened last year. It's like, I like, we can't 686 00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:35,920 Speaker 1: like there is risk involved in life. We're not gonna 687 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:40,720 Speaker 1: legislate to We're not gonna like create legislation to prevent 688 00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:46,080 Speaker 1: a fatality every eight years among a user group that 689 00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:50,200 Speaker 1: is wilfully going to engage in an activity. That's the 690 00:42:50,200 --> 00:42:51,720 Speaker 1: first thing I would say if I was an emperor, 691 00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:55,360 Speaker 1: and I'd say, but I do think it's goofy. Separate 692 00:42:55,440 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 1: them because I just think it's a little bit goofy. 693 00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:04,120 Speaker 1: And I've done it and I'll do it again, but 694 00:43:04,200 --> 00:43:07,560 Speaker 1: I think it's a little goofy. That's all I was 695 00:43:07,680 --> 00:43:12,440 Speaker 1: just interested in. You know, the state Idaho, all of 696 00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:16,960 Speaker 1: their firearm seasons require zero orange. It's like if you 697 00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,920 Speaker 1: want to wear it, great. Um. When I was hunting 698 00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:23,200 Speaker 1: Idaho all the time, Uh, I always have like a 699 00:43:23,239 --> 00:43:26,640 Speaker 1: blaze orange cap with me. Um, and I'll wear it 700 00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:28,560 Speaker 1: all the time or wear it some of the time, 701 00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:33,279 Speaker 1: just depending on what's going on. Um. You know all 702 00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:36,520 Speaker 1: these stupid pictures of people when they pack out bucks 703 00:43:36,600 --> 00:43:38,759 Speaker 1: that for whatever reason, the fad now is to put 704 00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:40,560 Speaker 1: the antler straight up the way you look like a 705 00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:41,920 Speaker 1: buck coming You know that way you look like a 706 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:45,680 Speaker 1: buck coming through the woods season right? Uh, like a 707 00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:49,120 Speaker 1: buck back and through the woods. I don't do that, 708 00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,080 Speaker 1: but I always throw a chunk of Blaze Orange up 709 00:43:52,120 --> 00:43:55,840 Speaker 1: on top of my pack during those circumstances. UM. I 710 00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:59,520 Speaker 1: just want to say that the interesting thing that pertains 711 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:03,200 Speaker 1: to this kind of station is UM. I was like, boy, 712 00:44:03,239 --> 00:44:07,640 Speaker 1: Idaho must not have a lot of hunting fatalities, because 713 00:44:07,640 --> 00:44:11,839 Speaker 1: it rarely comes up that they need to start requiring 714 00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:17,120 Speaker 1: blaze orange for hunting seasons. UM. But certainly in comparison 715 00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:22,400 Speaker 1: to the Colorado statistics that Johannes rattled off, Idaho's on 716 00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:29,319 Speaker 1: par with hunting related UH shootings and fatal shootings. Are they? Are? 717 00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:32,400 Speaker 1: They ahead of the curve it went when calibrated for 718 00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:40,480 Speaker 1: percentages since nineteen eighty, which was the um as is 719 00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:42,560 Speaker 1: for a lot of places the start of the hunter 720 00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:48,520 Speaker 1: education program. UM, the average is one point nine fatalities. 721 00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:55,680 Speaker 1: Since Let's see, since the inception of Idaho's hunter Education program, 722 00:44:56,360 --> 00:45:00,360 Speaker 1: hunting seasons have averaged one point nine fatality the's and 723 00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:05,680 Speaker 1: five point eight non fatal shootings per per season. Once 724 00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:08,600 Speaker 1: someone who's real good on the internet. Find uh find 725 00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:12,480 Speaker 1: that for Michigan. I know that the Hunter's Safety program 726 00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:17,160 Speaker 1: cause fatalities to plummet. Yeah, I think Dirkin wrote an 727 00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:19,120 Speaker 1: article about that on our website. You know what's funny 728 00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:22,439 Speaker 1: about Colorado is they don't require orange for small game 729 00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:26,359 Speaker 1: and bird hunting, like you're using a gun, and yeah, 730 00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:29,040 Speaker 1: I wouldn't. You don't need it here for bird hunting. 731 00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:30,680 Speaker 1: But I wouldn't gripe if they if all of a 732 00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:32,200 Speaker 1: sudden you had to wear an orange hat bird hunt, 733 00:45:32,239 --> 00:45:33,879 Speaker 1: I wouldn't have I wouldn't have a fit. But it's 734 00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:37,080 Speaker 1: just weird how their nitpicking this situation and in the 735 00:45:37,200 --> 00:45:41,120 Speaker 1: regulations because obviously we're all reading them all the time. 736 00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:46,360 Speaker 1: It's amazing how much print each state that doesn't require 737 00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:50,319 Speaker 1: orange for upland bird hunting, how much print they take 738 00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:55,920 Speaker 1: up in the rags strongly encouraging to wear. And they 739 00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:57,480 Speaker 1: could have been quicker just to make it that you 740 00:45:57,480 --> 00:46:00,239 Speaker 1: head to wear. It would just be quicker. Yeah, you know, 741 00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:04,000 Speaker 1: it's such a part of upland bird culture anyway, It's like, yeah, 742 00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:06,440 Speaker 1: like they build it into bird vests and stuff. You know, 743 00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:09,680 Speaker 1: it's gotta be related to why they don't do. It's 744 00:46:09,719 --> 00:46:14,400 Speaker 1: got to be like a mechanism to free up wardens 745 00:46:14,480 --> 00:46:18,480 Speaker 1: to do like more important warden work, I imagine than 746 00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:23,160 Speaker 1: just chasing around people with not enough orange on. In Michigan, 747 00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:26,080 Speaker 1: they felt that the remember being a kid and people 748 00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:28,320 Speaker 1: saying that the reason they had on a hunters orange 749 00:46:28,400 --> 00:46:30,760 Speaker 1: laws is sold the game wardens could find you quicker. 750 00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:36,920 Speaker 1: Maybe you couldn't hide from game wardens. Um you'd be like, well, 751 00:46:36,960 --> 00:46:39,440 Speaker 1: I thought it was because people shoot each other a lot, right, 752 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,120 Speaker 1: and you know the bad guys aren't taking those vests off. Yeah, 753 00:46:44,200 --> 00:46:46,759 Speaker 1: it's like, ah, I'm gonna give up poach now they 754 00:46:46,840 --> 00:46:51,080 Speaker 1: passed this hunter sword law. My whole program sunk. Do 755 00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:52,600 Speaker 1: you want to hear how many people have died in 756 00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:57,680 Speaker 1: Michigan real quick? Please? Uh? Thirty eight hunting related injuries 757 00:46:57,760 --> 00:47:02,759 Speaker 1: eighteen deaths between need put that to our engineer, Well, 758 00:47:02,840 --> 00:47:05,160 Speaker 1: we really need to know how many hunters on each 759 00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:07,640 Speaker 1: It's that's just seasons, you know what I mean? Is 760 00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:10,120 Speaker 1: there quite a bit more? And then the other other 761 00:47:10,239 --> 00:47:12,280 Speaker 1: side too, is that's probably a lot more wooded hunting. 762 00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:14,680 Speaker 1: So are you shooting that is like a lot of 763 00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:18,200 Speaker 1: that people shooting through brush obviously that's unacceptable, but much 764 00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:22,080 Speaker 1: higher density of hunters. Hey has an engineer? Have you 765 00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:26,440 Speaker 1: been in? Uh? Where are they? No? I haven't do him. Well, 766 00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:28,279 Speaker 1: we took him down to put the tiki bar sign 767 00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,560 Speaker 1: up there, and I haven't put it back up, son 768 00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:33,319 Speaker 1: of a bitch. Phil. You might want wander over later 769 00:47:33,360 --> 00:47:35,960 Speaker 1: on and take a look at that. Oh sure, the 770 00:47:35,960 --> 00:47:37,799 Speaker 1: odds of the turkeyo walk pass if you don't do 771 00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:42,200 Speaker 1: anything I like that in the woods. Um, thank you, Johnnie. 772 00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:45,320 Speaker 1: Well we'll get back, Like I said, Durkin wrote a 773 00:47:45,320 --> 00:48:03,520 Speaker 1: whole thing about this, all right, So ready we can't 774 00:48:03,520 --> 00:48:05,719 Speaker 1: go on all damn day. Man, do do do do 775 00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:07,759 Speaker 1: do do do do do do do do do do 776 00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:14,799 Speaker 1: do do Friends and neighbors coming to you. I'll be good, Okay, 777 00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:18,719 Speaker 1: agree to disagree on that. Should have gone with it, 778 00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:22,600 Speaker 1: never give up. Well, yeah, there's the Uh we shall 779 00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:25,600 Speaker 1: fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the seas. 780 00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:29,400 Speaker 1: That one. So this fights about Yellowstone. Um back to 781 00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:32,680 Speaker 1: the wolf desk, fighting the hot springs. Uh. We've been 782 00:48:32,719 --> 00:48:34,880 Speaker 1: following this off and on for I don't know how long, 783 00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:41,040 Speaker 1: a few months now, right, this northern Yellowstone wolf situation 784 00:48:41,719 --> 00:48:47,840 Speaker 1: where uh, wolves that live at Den in the park 785 00:48:48,640 --> 00:48:53,720 Speaker 1: are wandering past the northern border of Yellowstone onto public 786 00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:57,560 Speaker 1: land in in Montana and getting shot. And I think 787 00:48:57,560 --> 00:48:59,600 Speaker 1: it was a few months ago the first one got 788 00:48:59,640 --> 00:49:01,920 Speaker 1: shot and they've been whittling him away. One of the 789 00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:06,440 Speaker 1: first things I want to tackle is do they wander? Well? Sure, 790 00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:08,839 Speaker 1: I mean that, that's the whole thing, like this, this 791 00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:13,719 Speaker 1: whole situation wandering, That's the whole thing is this situation 792 00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:17,160 Speaker 1: is based on the premise that these are somehow quote 793 00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:21,920 Speaker 1: yellow Stones wolves they got lost, um, which is that's 794 00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,120 Speaker 1: a really good point. He might not think that he 795 00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:26,719 Speaker 1: wandered anywhere, and if you asked him where he lived, 796 00:49:26,760 --> 00:49:29,200 Speaker 1: he might point to Montana. Yeah, he goes, No. When 797 00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:32,960 Speaker 1: I'm over in Yellos, I'm occasionally wander over there. Yeah, 798 00:49:34,680 --> 00:49:37,000 Speaker 1: but I just happened to get my picture taken a 799 00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:39,640 Speaker 1: lot more when I'm over that way, which lends people 800 00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:42,320 Speaker 1: to think that, Yeah, let's assume that these wolves spend 801 00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:47,160 Speaker 1: the majority of their time in Yellowstone, they den there, 802 00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:49,720 Speaker 1: they raise their pups there, whatever, I think that's probably 803 00:49:49,760 --> 00:49:53,480 Speaker 1: the case. Um. Anyway, I think the last time we 804 00:49:53,600 --> 00:49:56,320 Speaker 1: checked in, like three of these wolves had been killed. 805 00:49:56,400 --> 00:50:01,719 Speaker 1: Now we're up to twenty and uh, the Phantom Lake 806 00:50:01,800 --> 00:50:05,920 Speaker 1: pack has now considered eliminated after most are all of 807 00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:11,839 Speaker 1: its members were killed h since October UM, so an 808 00:50:12,000 --> 00:50:16,680 Speaker 1: entire pack basically is considered eliminated from Yellowstone part of 809 00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:20,279 Speaker 1: the park. Is the calling it a setback species long 810 00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:24,320 Speaker 1: term viability. Uh, which that's a debated point. With a 811 00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:27,359 Speaker 1: setback of research, I have a hard time behind me. Yeah, 812 00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:30,120 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think so. Um these will like 813 00:50:30,360 --> 00:50:35,960 Speaker 1: Montana relaxed some regulations or changed some regulations just north 814 00:50:36,000 --> 00:50:39,160 Speaker 1: of the park to allow more wolves to be harvested 815 00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:45,080 Speaker 1: in that that region of Montana. Um, the park superintendent 816 00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:49,160 Speaker 1: is not happy about it. Some wolf advocates are not 817 00:50:49,320 --> 00:50:53,600 Speaker 1: happy about it, and uh kind of button heads. Park 818 00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:59,080 Speaker 1: superintendent called cam Shaley has raised concerns kind of calling 819 00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:03,520 Speaker 1: out Montana Governor Gen Forte to to shut things down, like, 820 00:51:03,800 --> 00:51:06,720 Speaker 1: you know, just end the season now g and Forte 821 00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:10,799 Speaker 1: is not having that, and U basically says, you know, 822 00:51:10,880 --> 00:51:13,399 Speaker 1: this is we're gonna manage wolves in our state, how 823 00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:18,000 Speaker 1: we're going to manage them. And the season is continuing. 824 00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:21,280 Speaker 1: So that's kind of where we're at. Remember that quote 825 00:51:21,400 --> 00:51:25,880 Speaker 1: Yellowstone is two point two million acres of paradise surrounded 826 00:51:25,880 --> 00:51:32,359 Speaker 1: by Reality's um you know, like I understand if an 827 00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:37,040 Speaker 1: entire pack has been you know, essentially eliminated, that you know, 828 00:51:37,160 --> 00:51:43,560 Speaker 1: there's some concerns there maybe, But um, I just I 829 00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:48,200 Speaker 1: don't I feel like this as usual, This wolf thing 830 00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:53,520 Speaker 1: is definitely being portrayed in the media without a real 831 00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:56,839 Speaker 1: deep dive into things, into the wildlife management. It's just 832 00:51:56,880 --> 00:52:00,560 Speaker 1: like twenty wolves killed, twenty Yellowstone wolves. They you're never 833 00:52:00,560 --> 00:52:03,560 Speaker 1: gonna hear here and referred to it and half probably 834 00:52:03,560 --> 00:52:08,400 Speaker 1: had names. Sure, they had numbers, for sure, callers and numbers, 835 00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:13,160 Speaker 1: and well, I mean who did the population level quote? 836 00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:16,239 Speaker 1: Like that's that, I'll eat my hat if that's biologist 837 00:52:16,280 --> 00:52:18,920 Speaker 1: who said that, Like, oh that there's only ninety four 838 00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:24,239 Speaker 1: wolves in Yellowstone? Know that the taking these wolves out 839 00:52:24,360 --> 00:52:27,440 Speaker 1: is going to have a population level effect on these things? 840 00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:29,560 Speaker 1: What's the main headline? Sure? How many puffs are going 841 00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:32,359 Speaker 1: to be born this spring? Right? Yeah? I mean it's 842 00:52:32,400 --> 00:52:34,680 Speaker 1: just not and when we're talking we want to talk 843 00:52:34,719 --> 00:52:37,319 Speaker 1: about a population, talk about a population if you want 844 00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:42,040 Speaker 1: to talk about um individuals within a population. But the 845 00:52:42,080 --> 00:52:44,759 Speaker 1: other thing it's not mentioned is like wolves go to 846 00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:47,080 Speaker 1: war with each other all the time, and like one 847 00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:49,960 Speaker 1: wolf will go pack will go wipe out another, and 848 00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:53,600 Speaker 1: you know, this vacuum of space is created where there 849 00:52:53,640 --> 00:52:55,640 Speaker 1: are no wolves for a while, and then it's filled 850 00:52:55,640 --> 00:52:59,799 Speaker 1: back up. You know. I think although these are human, 851 00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:02,880 Speaker 1: fatality is you're probably gonna run into the same the 852 00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:06,320 Speaker 1: same situation, like some wolves are gonna occupy that territory 853 00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:09,480 Speaker 1: at some point. Yeah. That was my main takeaway from 854 00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:13,040 Speaker 1: Diane boys podcast with us was that, like that population 855 00:53:13,120 --> 00:53:18,120 Speaker 1: fluctuates by every year, so if it truly is ninety four, 856 00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:20,640 Speaker 1: then when all those pulps are born, it'll bump up 857 00:53:20,680 --> 00:53:24,960 Speaker 1: to h Come on quick, math. Yeah. She said that 858 00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:29,719 Speaker 1: that at pupping season the population is usually down, then 859 00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:33,319 Speaker 1: it bounces doubles, and then it probably goes, you know 860 00:53:33,440 --> 00:53:37,600 Speaker 1: back down. Yeah. If they're so mad or worried about 861 00:53:37,640 --> 00:53:41,360 Speaker 1: all these wolves getting you know, killed, then they should 862 00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:44,680 Speaker 1: stop the other packs from killing the other wolves because 863 00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:48,200 Speaker 1: that's what kills wolves as Also, that's what she said 864 00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:50,920 Speaker 1: that the number the lead caused of death and Yellowstone 865 00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:53,480 Speaker 1: wolves as Yellowstone wolves, Well, I don't even think we'd 866 00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:57,120 Speaker 1: be hearing about it if these weren't Yellowstone wolves. No, 867 00:53:57,160 --> 00:53:59,680 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think you would. The two primary 868 00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:03,680 Speaker 1: things that I remain interested in, Like, the main interesting 869 00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:09,000 Speaker 1: points to me are that we're still the yell the 870 00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:11,799 Speaker 1: greater yellostone ecosystem, a term that I want to think 871 00:54:11,840 --> 00:54:17,439 Speaker 1: of a replacement for, um, the g y E. We're 872 00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:22,759 Speaker 1: still above the objective that everyone agreed to in the 873 00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:25,919 Speaker 1: early nineties as what recovery would look like. So I'm trying. 874 00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:28,319 Speaker 1: I'm kind of like, I have a hard time understanding 875 00:54:29,840 --> 00:54:33,839 Speaker 1: why did that understanding of a recovery objective? Like what 876 00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:38,759 Speaker 1: has happened to make that so wrong? Yeah? Why is 877 00:54:38,800 --> 00:54:42,960 Speaker 1: that recovery objective now dismissed? The other part that I 878 00:54:43,040 --> 00:54:45,600 Speaker 1: think it's interesting just to just to watch from the sidelines, 879 00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:47,279 Speaker 1: I guess I'm not on the sidelines. I'm I'm in 880 00:54:47,320 --> 00:54:50,480 Speaker 1: it is um to what degree is y also national 881 00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:55,320 Speaker 1: park or any national park gonna dictate wildlife management across 882 00:54:55,360 --> 00:54:59,160 Speaker 1: its borders, Which is like a really interesting fight, and 883 00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:02,600 Speaker 1: it has implications for bison, has implications for predators, Like 884 00:55:02,800 --> 00:55:04,879 Speaker 1: you have a national park and it has its own 885 00:55:04,960 --> 00:55:08,319 Speaker 1: rules and it has its supporters and visitors. To what 886 00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:12,239 Speaker 1: degree does that rule bleed beyond those borders? With these 887 00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:14,800 Speaker 1: buffer zones and other things we've toyed with. It's just 888 00:55:14,840 --> 00:55:17,439 Speaker 1: a really interesting, like look at wildlife law and it's 889 00:55:17,520 --> 00:55:20,520 Speaker 1: it's this fed versus state thing that's building up, like 890 00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:22,759 Speaker 1: you're gonna see it with grizzlies too. Yeah, that's like 891 00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:25,000 Speaker 1: there's an undertone of that, right, there's the undertone of 892 00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:28,400 Speaker 1: local management, federal oversight, Washington d C. Telling you how 893 00:55:28,440 --> 00:55:32,080 Speaker 1: to live and that As soon as the debate was 894 00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:36,000 Speaker 1: happening with the introduction of wolves into Yellowstone, there was 895 00:55:36,080 --> 00:55:39,000 Speaker 1: also the yeah, but what happens when they go out 896 00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:45,560 Speaker 1: of Yellowstone? Like the same breath, same page. There was 897 00:55:45,719 --> 00:55:50,000 Speaker 1: never a thought that, oh, no, these are Yellowstone wolves, 898 00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:54,800 Speaker 1: therefore they will stay in Yellowstone and that's going to 899 00:55:54,880 --> 00:55:56,759 Speaker 1: be that. I'll tell you what happens when they go 900 00:55:56,800 --> 00:56:01,160 Speaker 1: out of Yellowstone. They go down to Colorado and kill 901 00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:05,400 Speaker 1: the first cattle and first beef cow in seventy years. 902 00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:09,480 Speaker 1: Great segue, bread hit it. Yeah, that was way better 903 00:56:09,520 --> 00:56:12,520 Speaker 1: that thing about those badgers. Um in a in a 904 00:56:13,160 --> 00:56:16,600 Speaker 1: place Walden, Colorado, where Jannest and I have spent some time. 905 00:56:17,120 --> 00:56:22,880 Speaker 1: Um a few weeks back. First livestock predation by wolves 906 00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:28,040 Speaker 1: confirmed live stock predation by wolves in seventy years just happened. 907 00:56:28,160 --> 00:56:32,080 Speaker 1: They should put a roadside attraction sign there, like you 908 00:56:32,160 --> 00:56:33,400 Speaker 1: go down the road and says like you know, a 909 00:56:33,480 --> 00:56:35,560 Speaker 1: historic side ahead. And they got one those wooden signs 910 00:56:35,600 --> 00:56:43,719 Speaker 1: of someone chiseled into words. But here's the first. This 911 00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:47,839 Speaker 1: is where the first UH commins seventy years is killed 912 00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:50,480 Speaker 1: by wolf in Colorado. Yeah, and it gets juice here 913 00:56:50,560 --> 00:56:53,520 Speaker 1: because the I assume wolves from the same pack just 914 00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:56,680 Speaker 1: killed a ranch dog, a border Collie named Buster. May 915 00:56:56,719 --> 00:57:01,160 Speaker 1: he rest in peace. Remember New Mexico and that woman's 916 00:57:01,680 --> 00:57:06,240 Speaker 1: um dog got caught in a snare and the dog 917 00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:09,200 Speaker 1: they made a law. Yep, that was like, what the 918 00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:11,800 Speaker 1: hell's that dog's name? Pucci. Let's say it's like Pukam's 919 00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:17,040 Speaker 1: anti trapping law. The anti trapping law became like Pugam's law. Yep. 920 00:57:17,280 --> 00:57:19,160 Speaker 1: I want there's gonna be an anti wolf law called 921 00:57:19,160 --> 00:57:22,800 Speaker 1: Buster's law. I don't know. This is for a Buster. 922 00:57:23,640 --> 00:57:25,960 Speaker 1: My buddy, his bird dog just got caught in kyote 923 00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:29,880 Speaker 1: trap in Pennsylvania. To get it out, he did, yeah, 924 00:57:29,960 --> 00:57:32,840 Speaker 1: and he was fired up and wanted to get something 925 00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:34,200 Speaker 1: done about it. The game was, do you want to 926 00:57:34,200 --> 00:57:37,680 Speaker 1: get some traps? The game. They wanted to see that 927 00:57:37,720 --> 00:57:40,320 Speaker 1: guy punished somehow. It's like, dude, like, was the guy 928 00:57:40,360 --> 00:57:42,760 Speaker 1: doing anything illegal? No, there's a name on the trap. 929 00:57:42,800 --> 00:57:45,880 Speaker 1: It was legally placed. Game. Warden was like, sorry, I 930 00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:51,560 Speaker 1: can't do anything. Keep Dog on Leach buddy. Now, rud, 931 00:57:51,720 --> 00:57:55,040 Speaker 1: who's going to remake the set? What's that is a foothold? Yeah? 932 00:57:55,160 --> 00:57:59,840 Speaker 1: Dog was fine. Yeah, who's gonna remake the set? Very 933 00:58:00,120 --> 00:58:04,040 Speaker 1: some scent proof gloves and remake this set? But moving on. 934 00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:12,680 Speaker 1: Good job Brodie, everybody, Brodie Anderson, thanks speaking speaking speaking 935 00:58:12,680 --> 00:58:16,320 Speaker 1: on gloves, if you had any chance to try out those, Yeah, 936 00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:19,560 Speaker 1: we're good. Yeah, I really like them. I'm worried about durability, 937 00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:24,320 Speaker 1: but so far so Yeah. I wear uh for cold weather, 938 00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:27,040 Speaker 1: wet stuff, setting decoys, pulling shrimp pots and whatnot. Like 939 00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:29,760 Speaker 1: an insulated atlet. Wherever the hell that the atlas Vinyl 940 00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:34,120 Speaker 1: Love it's called Vinyl Love. You know, like seven eight bucks. 941 00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:36,120 Speaker 1: I feel like I still like to say the three 942 00:58:36,120 --> 00:58:38,680 Speaker 1: four bucks, but not three four bucks. They have that 943 00:58:38,680 --> 00:58:43,120 Speaker 1: that insulated glove on the inside. Yeah, um well no, 944 00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:45,120 Speaker 1: not the one that comes out, but I have both 945 00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:46,880 Speaker 1: so that the kind of comes out, which is far 946 00:58:46,960 --> 00:58:50,160 Speaker 1: superior because when you're the other one's wet. I mean 947 00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:53,600 Speaker 1: they're wet for like three years, especially up at the shack. Yeah, 948 00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:55,760 Speaker 1: you get the kind of where the insulation doesn't come out, 949 00:58:55,840 --> 00:59:00,360 Speaker 1: you get that soaked. Uh took mom up to the 950 00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:03,960 Speaker 1: fish shack. Steve noticed that she had the kind where 951 00:59:04,000 --> 00:59:06,800 Speaker 1: the insulation stays on the inside, and you made that 952 00:59:06,880 --> 00:59:12,760 Speaker 1: comment to her, and uh, she gripped on the inside 953 00:59:12,760 --> 00:59:17,160 Speaker 1: with her fingernails, I'm guessing, pulled the liners out, cut 954 00:59:17,200 --> 00:59:20,600 Speaker 1: a little lying around them. So now they're removable, and 955 00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:24,760 Speaker 1: fix that some bit. Yeah, my whole life. She made 956 00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:29,120 Speaker 1: it removable. That's a thirty seconds out the removable and 957 00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:37,440 Speaker 1: now it was removable liners. So but dexterity is poor. Um. 958 00:59:37,520 --> 00:59:41,160 Speaker 1: And then Yanni discovered a new kind word. Man, you 959 00:59:41,160 --> 00:59:44,720 Speaker 1: could do brain surgery and those things. Yeah, I'm bummed. 960 00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:48,000 Speaker 1: I bought four pairs. One pair was for me, and 961 00:59:48,160 --> 00:59:50,600 Speaker 1: uh my wife was like, oh, but you know, my 962 00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:52,880 Speaker 1: your father in law would probably also like to have 963 00:59:52,920 --> 00:59:55,000 Speaker 1: a set of those gloves. So I can't even don't 964 00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:57,560 Speaker 1: even have a set. All my buddies and family are 965 00:59:57,600 --> 01:00:04,800 Speaker 1: wearing it. What Showa tamriy s smile to eighty two Yeah, 966 01:00:04,840 --> 01:00:10,120 Speaker 1: it's like an insulated rubber. When you find online, you'll 967 01:00:10,120 --> 01:00:12,760 Speaker 1: think you're looking at those vinyl Atlas gloves. Yeah, but 968 01:00:12,840 --> 01:00:14,200 Speaker 1: I said, you could do brain surgery and you can 969 01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:18,840 Speaker 1: count coins in it. But um uh, I'm a little 970 01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:20,920 Speaker 1: worried that I don't. I don't know. I was tipped 971 01:00:20,960 --> 01:00:24,960 Speaker 1: off by product designer about him, who said that a 972 01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:30,200 Speaker 1: lot of uh, like ice climbing mountaineer folks that do 973 01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:32,520 Speaker 1: a lot of climbing in the winter and ropes and whatnot, 974 01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:35,160 Speaker 1: that they were using that glove. They're probably good for 975 01:00:35,200 --> 01:00:37,240 Speaker 1: ice fishing too. You can get a pack of those 976 01:00:37,320 --> 01:00:40,480 Speaker 1: Atlas gloves twelve or forty bucks on him. That's how 977 01:00:40,520 --> 01:00:42,960 Speaker 1: I buy them. Yeah, that's how I buy them. Put 978 01:00:43,000 --> 01:00:47,040 Speaker 1: him Like Steve said, you can actually do things with these, 979 01:00:47,240 --> 01:00:49,280 Speaker 1: but I buy them in packs. And you know what 980 01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:51,760 Speaker 1: I do when I leave people, I think this is wasteful. 981 01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:55,320 Speaker 1: When I leave my fish shack, the last thing I 982 01:00:55,320 --> 01:00:58,240 Speaker 1: do on my way out is burn my pair. So 983 01:00:58,280 --> 01:01:00,440 Speaker 1: I'm never tempted to wear him again. It's like guarantee 984 01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:03,040 Speaker 1: their full of holes. They get, they get funk. I 985 01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:05,280 Speaker 1: used always trying to keep them nice. Now I'm like, 986 01:01:05,480 --> 01:01:07,000 Speaker 1: once they get a hole on them. I just get 987 01:01:07,120 --> 01:01:11,240 Speaker 1: rid of them. Uh watch this transition. You know how 988 01:01:11,240 --> 01:01:14,720 Speaker 1: elk you know how wolves eat out sometimes. Yeah, Well, 989 01:01:15,000 --> 01:01:18,720 Speaker 1: they got an elk hunt in Virginia first whatever mm hmm. 990 01:01:21,680 --> 01:01:25,160 Speaker 1: Virginia is gonna have its first elk draw. They're opening 991 01:01:25,200 --> 01:01:28,120 Speaker 1: up an elk hunt lottery. This year. They did their 992 01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:30,400 Speaker 1: this is a quick turnaround. They did their reintroduction of 993 01:01:30,440 --> 01:01:34,200 Speaker 1: elk into Virginia between two thousand and twelve and two 994 01:01:34,240 --> 01:01:38,360 Speaker 1: thousand fourteen. February one, application period will open for the 995 01:01:38,400 --> 01:01:42,760 Speaker 1: inaugural hunt. They got bulls running around already that they're 996 01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:48,240 Speaker 1: They got three bulls running around nine pounds three the hunt. 997 01:01:48,840 --> 01:01:53,280 Speaker 1: So this will be the hunt for the three season now. 998 01:01:55,240 --> 01:01:59,720 Speaker 1: The hunt will be October eight of this year, October four, 999 01:02:00,760 --> 01:02:07,480 Speaker 1: five antlered tags. Application period opens February one, closes March thirty. 1000 01:02:09,760 --> 01:02:12,720 Speaker 1: It's probably residents only, right, I don't know. I was 1001 01:02:12,720 --> 01:02:15,480 Speaker 1: gonna ask if it was open and on. Great news 1002 01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:20,680 Speaker 1: for Virginia, man. Pretty soon those all those eastern elk 1003 01:02:20,720 --> 01:02:23,440 Speaker 1: populations are gonna start connecting with each other. It'll be 1004 01:02:23,440 --> 01:02:25,960 Speaker 1: cool and that happens. I got a hot tip for 1005 01:02:26,000 --> 01:02:32,320 Speaker 1: you if you want some easy pickings. Draw the first year. Yeah, 1006 01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:35,640 Speaker 1: I think that you will get a close standing still shot, 1007 01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:41,080 Speaker 1: I imagine, so uh quick note, we covered real heavily 1008 01:02:41,080 --> 01:02:42,800 Speaker 1: and uh what was the name of that episode kran 1009 01:02:43,800 --> 01:02:46,920 Speaker 1: get out of my airspace? What was it called? No? 1010 01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:53,720 Speaker 1: The last thing we do with Dave Wilms, all up 1011 01:02:53,720 --> 01:02:57,200 Speaker 1: in your airspace, all up in your airspace, in all 1012 01:02:57,240 --> 01:02:59,480 Speaker 1: up in your airspace. We covered this corner crossing issue 1013 01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:03,160 Speaker 1: where um, some guys did a corner jump on a 1014 01:03:03,160 --> 01:03:06,640 Speaker 1: corner that had been Uh they had to use a 1015 01:03:06,720 --> 01:03:11,800 Speaker 1: ladder to get over obstructions that the landowner who owned 1016 01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:15,360 Speaker 1: the private chunks of the corner had put up. And 1017 01:03:15,400 --> 01:03:17,760 Speaker 1: a lawyer wrote into us, He's got a picture of 1018 01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:19,640 Speaker 1: the corner. I'm not gonna tell what the sign says, 1019 01:03:19,680 --> 01:03:23,840 Speaker 1: but it's a no trespassing sign and a chain strung up. 1020 01:03:24,600 --> 01:03:28,800 Speaker 1: And a lawyer wrote in saying that why is the 1021 01:03:28,920 --> 01:03:38,520 Speaker 1: landowner not being cited for having his obstruction chains in 1022 01:03:39,680 --> 01:03:44,560 Speaker 1: the public airspace? So he's violating the same airspace argument 1023 01:03:45,240 --> 01:03:48,240 Speaker 1: that he's arguing. He's saying, when you step from when 1024 01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:52,360 Speaker 1: you do a corner hop, your body is crossing my airspace. 1025 01:03:52,760 --> 01:03:58,040 Speaker 1: Yet his obstructions, his chains are in public airspace is problem. 1026 01:03:58,440 --> 01:04:03,360 Speaker 1: Your argument for has to acknowledge the argument against right, 1027 01:04:03,920 --> 01:04:10,360 Speaker 1: Like if you believe in evil, thereby you believe in good. Yeah. Yeah, 1028 01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,320 Speaker 1: So he's like, I don't want your stuff over my airspace, 1029 01:04:14,360 --> 01:04:17,000 Speaker 1: so to prevent that, I will put my stuff over 1030 01:04:17,080 --> 01:04:24,439 Speaker 1: your airspace. Man, we took this to Dave Willis even 1031 01:04:24,440 --> 01:04:27,920 Speaker 1: has some Latin that I don't understand, but he said, um, 1032 01:04:27,960 --> 01:04:30,600 Speaker 1: it sure seems he doesn't know. He hasn't looked into it. 1033 01:04:30,680 --> 01:04:33,160 Speaker 1: He's just he said, taking it like so he's like 1034 01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:35,840 Speaker 1: cursory inspection. He points out that there is a thing 1035 01:04:35,880 --> 01:04:40,600 Speaker 1: called the Unlawful Enclosures Act guarantees the right of access 1036 01:04:40,600 --> 01:04:44,920 Speaker 1: to all public lands UM, which dates back to the 1037 01:04:44,920 --> 01:04:48,160 Speaker 1: eighteen which backs dates back to five. He goes on 1038 01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:50,480 Speaker 1: to say, I don't I haven't done enough research know 1039 01:04:50,680 --> 01:04:52,440 Speaker 1: how it's pertinent here, but there is a thing here, 1040 01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:55,360 Speaker 1: And he said it it's an interesting idea to look into. 1041 01:04:56,040 --> 01:04:58,280 Speaker 1: Um And well, we'll cover updates on that case again 1042 01:04:58,520 --> 01:05:01,960 Speaker 1: sometime soon. Okay, want to speed to the Minnesota deal. 1043 01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:04,520 Speaker 1: I like it because of the guy bleaches his hair. 1044 01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:09,760 Speaker 1: That's a sure tip off. You know how in these 1045 01:05:09,840 --> 01:05:12,560 Speaker 1: articles they always like to point out if the purp 1046 01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:15,600 Speaker 1: has a like a prior rap sheet that was real 1047 01:05:15,680 --> 01:05:20,680 Speaker 1: prominent in this that UM. I can't remember if it 1048 01:05:20,760 --> 01:05:24,800 Speaker 1: was like domestic abuse or like substance abuse. Anyway, the 1049 01:05:24,840 --> 01:05:27,680 Speaker 1: guy apparently was a bad egg, which isn't supposed to matter. 1050 01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:31,320 Speaker 1: But a Minnesota deer farmer had a Minnesota deer farm. 1051 01:05:31,400 --> 01:05:35,280 Speaker 1: He had c w D infected animals, and what was 1052 01:05:35,320 --> 01:05:38,120 Speaker 1: he doing with him? He was dumping them on public 1053 01:05:38,160 --> 01:05:44,080 Speaker 1: ground right outside his enclosure. And the what was the 1054 01:05:44,160 --> 01:05:51,960 Speaker 1: DNR found, UM evidently like evidence of prions in the 1055 01:05:52,080 --> 01:05:55,640 Speaker 1: area where these deer were being dumped, And so the 1056 01:05:55,720 --> 01:05:58,040 Speaker 1: deer farm got shut down. They said, you gotta put 1057 01:05:58,080 --> 01:06:01,480 Speaker 1: some up ten ft high bearrier around this to keep 1058 01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:05,920 Speaker 1: other deer and humans out of the area. He refused 1059 01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:12,240 Speaker 1: to do so, UH got charged with several different things. UM. 1060 01:06:12,240 --> 01:06:18,040 Speaker 1: Whereas it Beltram County pronounce where it lays out what 1061 01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:22,720 Speaker 1: he got charged with. UM broke the law in four ways, 1062 01:06:22,760 --> 01:06:25,720 Speaker 1: moving quarantine deer off his farm, dumping their carcasses on 1063 01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:28,520 Speaker 1: public land, failing to test all his worms dead deer 1064 01:06:29,160 --> 01:06:33,240 Speaker 1: for c w D, and failing to maintain accurate herd records. 1065 01:06:34,080 --> 01:06:39,880 Speaker 1: Included unreported dear death, so they nailed him. Uh, he 1066 01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:43,840 Speaker 1: refused to put up the barrier, so the state of 1067 01:06:43,880 --> 01:06:50,240 Speaker 1: Minnesota did at the cost of a thousand dollars. And uh, 1068 01:06:51,840 --> 01:06:54,520 Speaker 1: they're trying to get this guy to pay for it. 1069 01:06:54,440 --> 01:06:57,080 Speaker 1: It's probably not gonna happen. I don't know, maybe it will. 1070 01:06:57,280 --> 01:06:59,680 Speaker 1: But anyway, if you found a guy passed out behind 1071 01:06:59,680 --> 01:07:07,560 Speaker 1: a street club in Las Vegas and rolled him over exactly, Um, anyway, 1072 01:07:07,640 --> 01:07:13,480 Speaker 1: he's he's his argument again there. The argument against his 1073 01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:16,200 Speaker 1: argument is that this is government overreach. It's not the 1074 01:07:16,280 --> 01:07:18,919 Speaker 1: kind of barrier they put up around other places. It's 1075 01:07:19,040 --> 01:07:23,760 Speaker 1: it's overstepping what needs to be done. You know, I'd argue, 1076 01:07:23,880 --> 01:07:26,959 Speaker 1: not enough is being done, but uh, I was gonna 1077 01:07:27,000 --> 01:07:29,760 Speaker 1: say better not let Doug durn get ahold of this guy. 1078 01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:33,640 Speaker 1: He sent it to us. But they don't say how 1079 01:07:33,680 --> 01:07:36,880 Speaker 1: big this guy is. I guarantee would take this guy 1080 01:07:37,280 --> 01:07:41,840 Speaker 1: from Richland County. UM. A good point here is c 1081 01:07:42,080 --> 01:07:46,080 Speaker 1: w D represents a major economic threat. Deer hunting represents 1082 01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:50,080 Speaker 1: a five hundred million dollar industry in Minnesota. And what 1083 01:07:50,120 --> 01:07:54,560 Speaker 1: does the captive servant industry represent economically? And I would 1084 01:07:54,600 --> 01:07:57,920 Speaker 1: think the captains servant industry would say this guy is 1085 01:07:57,960 --> 01:08:01,760 Speaker 1: a poor representation of captains. It would be like if 1086 01:08:01,800 --> 01:08:06,080 Speaker 1: if someone yeah, this can't be taken because if if 1087 01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:10,120 Speaker 1: some guy had poached like thirty deer, okay, would we 1088 01:08:10,160 --> 01:08:12,400 Speaker 1: be sitting here being like just goes to show them hunters. 1089 01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:15,360 Speaker 1: It's like, yeah, I don't wanna this is not a 1090 01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:18,599 Speaker 1: I don't think this can be taken as as like 1091 01:08:18,840 --> 01:08:21,840 Speaker 1: that's how they are. But it is just like an 1092 01:08:21,840 --> 01:08:25,240 Speaker 1: extraordinarily kind of like shitty thing to do. Yeah, to 1093 01:08:25,320 --> 01:08:27,960 Speaker 1: take a bunch of a bunch of infected deer then 1094 01:08:27,960 --> 01:08:30,280 Speaker 1: in haulm off off your land and dump them on 1095 01:08:30,360 --> 01:08:33,040 Speaker 1: private land and then act like it's not your problem 1096 01:08:33,320 --> 01:08:38,240 Speaker 1: when they want, I'm sorry, you take infected deer off 1097 01:08:38,320 --> 01:08:40,840 Speaker 1: your place, dump on public land and then be that 1098 01:08:40,880 --> 01:08:43,479 Speaker 1: it's not my problem when they want to fence it off. 1099 01:08:43,520 --> 01:08:45,760 Speaker 1: So more so, do you aren't running around on your 1100 01:08:45,840 --> 01:08:50,880 Speaker 1: little homemade toxic site, which I mean this is. This 1101 01:08:51,000 --> 01:08:53,920 Speaker 1: is the entire argument wrapped up in a nutshell. It's 1102 01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:57,479 Speaker 1: like this guy read the history of the conflict between 1103 01:08:57,720 --> 01:09:05,120 Speaker 1: the captive servant industry, the UH proposed regulation history of Okay, well, 1104 01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:09,800 Speaker 1: we need stricter testing, we want a double barrier so 1105 01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:16,480 Speaker 1: wild individuals cannot come in contact with captive or farmed individuals. 1106 01:09:18,040 --> 01:09:22,600 Speaker 1: And he's like, uh, huh, got it, got it? It 1107 01:09:22,720 --> 01:09:27,720 Speaker 1: was a there was a dozen deer more that they Yeah, well, 1108 01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:32,360 Speaker 1: I think at one last point that's important here is uh, 1109 01:09:32,560 --> 01:09:37,000 Speaker 1: this is being watched closely by hunters, officials, lawmakers, and 1110 01:09:37,120 --> 01:09:42,280 Speaker 1: the commercial deer farm industry because what this what ultimately 1111 01:09:42,680 --> 01:09:46,040 Speaker 1: deer farmers end up being responsible for clean up? Wise 1112 01:09:46,080 --> 01:09:49,080 Speaker 1: could like this could have applications on that in the future. 1113 01:09:49,320 --> 01:09:51,120 Speaker 1: I can see that. Yeah, I can see that this 1114 01:09:51,160 --> 01:09:54,360 Speaker 1: could wind up the chunker grounds eleven acres as we 1115 01:09:54,400 --> 01:09:59,720 Speaker 1: say that, So you just lost eleven acres of public land. Well, 1116 01:09:59,800 --> 01:10:06,519 Speaker 1: his is enclosure was eleven acres m this spot they're 1117 01:10:06,640 --> 01:10:10,280 Speaker 1: they're fencing all right. Yeah, you know people in that 1118 01:10:10,439 --> 01:10:13,760 Speaker 1: area just lost not a catastrophic loss, but they lost 1119 01:10:13,760 --> 01:10:16,600 Speaker 1: eleven acres of public ground, which is now behind a 1120 01:10:16,720 --> 01:10:20,240 Speaker 1: fence to keep people out. Yeah, you're bumbing if you 1121 01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:22,439 Speaker 1: had a tree standing at eleven acres with a nice 1122 01:10:22,439 --> 01:10:25,400 Speaker 1: deer trail walking underneath it. All right, John Miller, you ready, 1123 01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:28,200 Speaker 1: First thing I gotta say, did you know that John 1124 01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:34,040 Speaker 1: Miller from Minnesota? Yeah, that's how you could use that 1125 01:10:34,080 --> 01:10:40,840 Speaker 1: as John from Minnesota got a baritack. John Miller, you 1126 01:10:40,920 --> 01:10:42,880 Speaker 1: gotta be hard to look up. I bet your old 1127 01:10:42,920 --> 01:10:45,120 Speaker 1: girlfriend's ears can't even begin to try to find you 1128 01:10:45,160 --> 01:10:48,720 Speaker 1: on on on Facebook, John Miller. How many does think 1129 01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:52,000 Speaker 1: John Miller running around? I'm actually the sixth. So my 1130 01:10:52,080 --> 01:10:54,640 Speaker 1: dad's John Miller and his dad's John Miller, and you 1131 01:10:54,640 --> 01:10:57,520 Speaker 1: know about six of them that you're related to at least. Yeah, 1132 01:10:57,840 --> 01:11:03,360 Speaker 1: hard gutta fun. Okay, how does how does the story begin? Um? So? 1133 01:11:03,560 --> 01:11:06,080 Speaker 1: I think the first thing I gotta start with is, 1134 01:11:06,160 --> 01:11:09,760 Speaker 1: you know, kind of um building up, you know, the 1135 01:11:09,800 --> 01:11:13,120 Speaker 1: situation from you know, the actual grizzly attack. Right, Yeah, 1136 01:11:13,240 --> 01:11:14,439 Speaker 1: you know what when I say how it's the beginning? 1137 01:11:14,479 --> 01:11:17,280 Speaker 1: What were you doing? So we're out out con um 1138 01:11:17,400 --> 01:11:19,200 Speaker 1: and so it's something you do a bit like you 1139 01:11:19,280 --> 01:11:20,759 Speaker 1: like to get around. You do a lot of hunting, 1140 01:11:21,000 --> 01:11:22,599 Speaker 1: so yeah, I do. I do a lot of traveling 1141 01:11:22,640 --> 01:11:26,600 Speaker 1: for work, and uh, I like to experience a lot 1142 01:11:26,680 --> 01:11:29,800 Speaker 1: of different unique types of hunts and fishing and things 1143 01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:32,840 Speaker 1: like that. And this is my first big elkhonic trip. 1144 01:11:32,880 --> 01:11:36,160 Speaker 1: Actually I've I've had a cow tag before, but this 1145 01:11:36,200 --> 01:11:39,280 Speaker 1: is my first bull tag, and um, so we went 1146 01:11:39,280 --> 01:11:41,880 Speaker 1: out for a gun season. I'm more of an archery guy, 1147 01:11:41,960 --> 01:11:44,679 Speaker 1: like the archery hunt, but um, you know, it takes 1148 01:11:44,680 --> 01:11:47,679 Speaker 1: a lot more time. And so this time we drew 1149 01:11:48,120 --> 01:11:51,439 Speaker 1: general tags and uh we went for the rifles season 1150 01:11:51,439 --> 01:11:54,320 Speaker 1: and you were in what mountain range? There? The astroca 1151 01:11:54,479 --> 01:11:57,080 Speaker 1: or some people call him a zorkis, Um, how do 1152 01:11:57,080 --> 01:12:01,840 Speaker 1: you pronounce them? Well, there's two different things, um, the 1153 01:12:01,880 --> 01:12:06,640 Speaker 1: Absorker arrange, but the Absorkies is something different. Right when 1154 01:12:06,640 --> 01:12:08,320 Speaker 1: people say I thought it was a city at one 1155 01:12:08,320 --> 01:12:10,160 Speaker 1: point in time, but then I've heard people use it, 1156 01:12:10,240 --> 01:12:17,599 Speaker 1: there is a there is a little town over there. Yeah, okay, 1157 01:12:17,920 --> 01:12:22,160 Speaker 1: well anyway, um, so we went out and season started 1158 01:12:22,200 --> 01:12:26,519 Speaker 1: on October one. So in October one, one of the 1159 01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:29,640 Speaker 1: guys in the group shot a bull and uh so 1160 01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:32,880 Speaker 1: we quartered that out. One of the guys in your party, correct, Yeah, 1161 01:12:33,000 --> 01:12:35,080 Speaker 1: So there were six of us in camp and one 1162 01:12:35,120 --> 01:12:37,280 Speaker 1: of them shot a bull on October one, and so 1163 01:12:38,160 --> 01:12:40,120 Speaker 1: we quartered out, brought all the meat back to camp, 1164 01:12:40,200 --> 01:12:43,559 Speaker 1: hung it, and uh, but left kind of the I 1165 01:12:43,560 --> 01:12:46,160 Speaker 1: guess the gut pile and carcass, if you will, deboned 1166 01:12:46,160 --> 01:12:50,120 Speaker 1: and as one does, as one does, Um, I'll just 1167 01:12:50,160 --> 01:12:51,600 Speaker 1: throw that in there. Some people didn't think that was 1168 01:12:52,360 --> 01:12:56,360 Speaker 1: it would be a lot to pack. Um. So there 1169 01:12:56,400 --> 01:12:58,640 Speaker 1: was a carcass sky in that area that night. I 1170 01:12:58,640 --> 01:13:01,080 Speaker 1: went out on October one in and to a different 1171 01:13:01,080 --> 01:13:03,920 Speaker 1: area couple miles south and didn't see anything. And with 1172 01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:07,320 Speaker 1: horses are on ft um. We had horses there in 1173 01:13:07,439 --> 01:13:09,240 Speaker 1: camp and we'd kind of used them, but you know, 1174 01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:11,479 Speaker 1: if you got close to something, obviously you tie up 1175 01:13:11,479 --> 01:13:14,759 Speaker 1: the horses and go off on foot. But um, so 1176 01:13:15,240 --> 01:13:19,559 Speaker 1: let's just fast forward to day two. UM. So October two. UM, 1177 01:13:19,760 --> 01:13:21,400 Speaker 1: you know that on that first day we had seen 1178 01:13:21,400 --> 01:13:24,559 Speaker 1: a herd of elk beyond where that first bowl was 1179 01:13:24,600 --> 01:13:28,000 Speaker 1: killed that got spooked after after that, UM, so we 1180 01:13:28,040 --> 01:13:29,600 Speaker 1: went back to see if you know, that herb was 1181 01:13:29,640 --> 01:13:32,479 Speaker 1: still there. And so we actually we went up to 1182 01:13:32,520 --> 01:13:34,400 Speaker 1: this this really nice knob where we could see this 1183 01:13:34,439 --> 01:13:36,720 Speaker 1: whole valley and it's kind of a burned area. So 1184 01:13:36,960 --> 01:13:39,000 Speaker 1: just kind of describing it for the listeners. You know, 1185 01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:41,320 Speaker 1: it's really open, really and you could see quite a 1186 01:13:41,320 --> 01:13:44,360 Speaker 1: long ways. UM. The part of the area that was 1187 01:13:45,080 --> 01:13:47,280 Speaker 1: um that had vegetation was all burned off, and then 1188 01:13:47,320 --> 01:13:49,960 Speaker 1: there was a really barren ridge that kind of went 1189 01:13:50,080 --> 01:13:53,880 Speaker 1: down and while we were glassing, we saw a herd 1190 01:13:53,920 --> 01:13:57,599 Speaker 1: elk at maybe yards to our north and and we 1191 01:13:57,600 --> 01:13:59,320 Speaker 1: were sitting there and we're no hurry. They were all 1192 01:13:59,320 --> 01:14:03,240 Speaker 1: bedded down. We could see the carcass from yesterday. Um, 1193 01:14:03,320 --> 01:14:05,479 Speaker 1: and so we we even talked about it. We looked 1194 01:14:05,520 --> 01:14:07,640 Speaker 1: at it and it's how many yards from you I 1195 01:14:07,640 --> 01:14:10,639 Speaker 1: would say at that time about five Um, so it's 1196 01:14:10,680 --> 01:14:13,320 Speaker 1: it's a decent bit. But and and you know, we 1197 01:14:13,320 --> 01:14:16,679 Speaker 1: could see a hundred two hundred yards all around that carcass, 1198 01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:18,880 Speaker 1: and and it looked like it hadn't been touched or 1199 01:14:18,920 --> 01:14:22,360 Speaker 1: moved or drug around or anything like that. And obviously 1200 01:14:22,479 --> 01:14:24,880 Speaker 1: see elk quite a ways out, and so your your 1201 01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:28,040 Speaker 1: focus kind of switches to, you know, to the elk. 1202 01:14:28,280 --> 01:14:31,479 Speaker 1: And so we started to make a play on these elk, 1203 01:14:31,920 --> 01:14:35,080 Speaker 1: um me and another guy and um, so you know, 1204 01:14:35,280 --> 01:14:38,639 Speaker 1: we started walking down, walking down this ridgeline that there 1205 01:14:38,680 --> 01:14:40,680 Speaker 1: was a trail that kind of it was cutting to 1206 01:14:40,680 --> 01:14:43,280 Speaker 1: the side of this hill and to probably ten ten 1207 01:14:43,360 --> 01:14:46,800 Speaker 1: fifteen yards to our to our right. Um, it was 1208 01:14:46,840 --> 01:14:49,639 Speaker 1: almost like a cliff that dropped into this real big valley. 1209 01:14:50,960 --> 01:14:53,599 Speaker 1: And uh, you know, we're walking towards the elk at 1210 01:14:54,320 --> 01:14:57,240 Speaker 1: yards and we're taking our time, stopping kind of glassing 1211 01:14:57,240 --> 01:14:59,080 Speaker 1: to our left because that's where we can see everything 1212 01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:01,920 Speaker 1: is often this burn vegetation, and you know, we're just 1213 01:15:01,960 --> 01:15:04,200 Speaker 1: looking for we don't want to spook anything to our 1214 01:15:04,240 --> 01:15:06,439 Speaker 1: herd or anything like that. Taking our time. And I 1215 01:15:06,439 --> 01:15:08,240 Speaker 1: would say probably on that we would walk about a 1216 01:15:08,320 --> 01:15:11,439 Speaker 1: hundred yards, stop glass a little bit, you know, taking 1217 01:15:11,439 --> 01:15:14,080 Speaker 1: our time, and you got a blunt to the right, 1218 01:15:15,080 --> 01:15:17,519 Speaker 1: You've got sort of it rolls over a blind spot 1219 01:15:18,000 --> 01:15:20,519 Speaker 1: but then drops off sharp. Yeah, and and you know 1220 01:15:20,560 --> 01:15:23,400 Speaker 1: we've been over there and looked at um kind of 1221 01:15:23,400 --> 01:15:25,720 Speaker 1: over that that ledge and it really you would not 1222 01:15:25,800 --> 01:15:29,080 Speaker 1: expect anything, you know, it's just it's just I would say, 1223 01:15:29,640 --> 01:15:32,439 Speaker 1: six hundred feet kind of down into this big valley 1224 01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:35,479 Speaker 1: and you know, there's just there's really not much there. Um, so, 1225 01:15:36,000 --> 01:15:39,559 Speaker 1: are you going towards the gut pile? We are, but 1226 01:15:39,960 --> 01:15:43,960 Speaker 1: we're probably we're probably gonna stay the closest we would 1227 01:15:43,960 --> 01:15:46,080 Speaker 1: have gone on that on that trail would probably about 1228 01:15:46,080 --> 01:15:48,599 Speaker 1: a hundred yards, you know, but we're we are headed 1229 01:15:48,640 --> 01:15:51,840 Speaker 1: in that general vicinity. And uh so, I would say, 1230 01:15:51,840 --> 01:15:54,000 Speaker 1: in our third stop. But you've already seen the gut 1231 01:15:54,040 --> 01:15:56,479 Speaker 1: pile this. We've seen it and everything around it. Yeah, 1232 01:15:56,520 --> 01:15:59,080 Speaker 1: and it's just it's not disturbed. Yeah, so you're kind 1233 01:15:59,120 --> 01:16:01,360 Speaker 1: of your guards down little bit, you know. And uh 1234 01:16:01,439 --> 01:16:03,519 Speaker 1: so we stopped maybe the second or third time, just 1235 01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:07,360 Speaker 1: to glass to our left, and I just remember hearing 1236 01:16:07,640 --> 01:16:11,120 Speaker 1: it was more like a squeal than anything, your brody squeal. 1237 01:16:12,160 --> 01:16:16,040 Speaker 1: Let's let's hear your best squeal. It was like that 1238 01:16:20,720 --> 01:16:23,280 Speaker 1: a little bit more aggressive than that. Ma, just can 1239 01:16:23,320 --> 01:16:25,400 Speaker 1: you can? I don't even to embarrass you, but I 1240 01:16:25,439 --> 01:16:29,040 Speaker 1: just like, yeah, I knew you're gonna ask me. Um, 1241 01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:32,280 Speaker 1: let's let's do like a like do like a similar 1242 01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:37,080 Speaker 1: to similar to like almost what you think like a 1243 01:16:37,160 --> 01:16:40,720 Speaker 1: wart hog or something we do, you know, yeah, kind 1244 01:16:40,760 --> 01:16:47,720 Speaker 1: of who did that? Um? Yeah? And so and so 1245 01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:50,680 Speaker 1: I'm I'm literally looking and both of us, both of 1246 01:16:50,760 --> 01:16:53,920 Speaker 1: us are looking through our binoculars to our left, you know, 1247 01:16:53,960 --> 01:16:56,000 Speaker 1: into the burn, and you hear the when you hear 1248 01:16:56,040 --> 01:16:59,559 Speaker 1: the noise, which is effectively over our right shoulder. So 1249 01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:02,040 Speaker 1: so we look over our right shoulder and there is 1250 01:17:02,120 --> 01:17:06,880 Speaker 1: a surly bear at it's ten a fifteen yards, I 1251 01:17:06,920 --> 01:17:09,960 Speaker 1: mean it's close, and it is running full speed ahead, 1252 01:17:10,280 --> 01:17:14,120 Speaker 1: and and there's two cubs trailer and coming from the 1253 01:17:14,160 --> 01:17:16,120 Speaker 1: direction of the gup pilor like as far as you know, 1254 01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:18,640 Speaker 1: like not related to the gut pose. So well, we 1255 01:17:18,640 --> 01:17:21,640 Speaker 1: can come back to that, but over the cliff effectively, 1256 01:17:21,800 --> 01:17:24,160 Speaker 1: so to our right. She came up out of that stuff, 1257 01:17:25,280 --> 01:17:28,600 Speaker 1: not out of the stuff I meant really off the 1258 01:17:28,640 --> 01:17:32,479 Speaker 1: other edge is a rock cliff that you would you 1259 01:17:32,520 --> 01:17:34,800 Speaker 1: would struggle to walk up without ropes. It's like a 1260 01:17:34,920 --> 01:17:38,320 Speaker 1: ridge line right skyline. It's a ridge line. She's coming 1261 01:17:38,320 --> 01:17:41,519 Speaker 1: from that stuff. She's coming from that ridge on the 1262 01:17:41,520 --> 01:17:45,520 Speaker 1: other side of that ridge. And you know, I would say, 1263 01:17:45,760 --> 01:17:48,240 Speaker 1: I would say, so, so let let me kind of 1264 01:17:48,280 --> 01:17:52,680 Speaker 1: describe the I guess the situation here. I'm standing with 1265 01:17:52,720 --> 01:17:55,839 Speaker 1: my binoculars looking to my left, look over the right, 1266 01:17:55,960 --> 01:17:58,200 Speaker 1: over to the right, and there's the silence two cubs. 1267 01:17:58,920 --> 01:18:01,040 Speaker 1: And you know, the first thing, you know, the first 1268 01:18:01,040 --> 01:18:02,360 Speaker 1: thing I would love to say, The first thing went 1269 01:18:02,360 --> 01:18:04,040 Speaker 1: through my mind was like, let's fight. You know that 1270 01:18:04,040 --> 01:18:05,519 Speaker 1: that is not what happened, you know, is how do 1271 01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:07,840 Speaker 1: we get out of this? Right? So I took a 1272 01:18:07,880 --> 01:18:10,760 Speaker 1: couple of steps back and I watched that that sou 1273 01:18:10,880 --> 01:18:17,280 Speaker 1: basically um kind of redirect redirect her her trajectory and 1274 01:18:17,640 --> 01:18:19,879 Speaker 1: you know it started. It went for the other guy 1275 01:18:20,320 --> 01:18:23,320 Speaker 1: and ahead of you. He was ahead, he was ahead 1276 01:18:23,320 --> 01:18:25,479 Speaker 1: of me. Um. And I may have seen it, seen 1277 01:18:25,560 --> 01:18:27,200 Speaker 1: her first because I kind of had a better vantage 1278 01:18:27,200 --> 01:18:30,519 Speaker 1: point from looking over my shoulder and whatnot. And so 1279 01:18:30,760 --> 01:18:32,840 Speaker 1: you know, I kind of described that as almost like 1280 01:18:33,000 --> 01:18:36,759 Speaker 1: a national geographic film of like watching a bear attack, 1281 01:18:36,880 --> 01:18:39,440 Speaker 1: like a clueless animal or something. It was just real graceful, 1282 01:18:40,120 --> 01:18:42,439 Speaker 1: just real fast, and like her mind was made up 1283 01:18:43,160 --> 01:18:45,240 Speaker 1: before we saw her that she was coming to eat 1284 01:18:46,160 --> 01:18:51,400 Speaker 1: and um. And so you know, I've listened some of 1285 01:18:51,439 --> 01:18:53,280 Speaker 1: your podcast and you talk about your big mistakes. I'm 1286 01:18:53,280 --> 01:18:55,439 Speaker 1: gonna talk about three of my big mistakes right here. 1287 01:18:55,840 --> 01:18:58,400 Speaker 1: So I have a have a I have a cannabaar spray. 1288 01:18:59,000 --> 01:19:03,080 Speaker 1: I also have a rifle. Um, I do not have 1289 01:19:03,080 --> 01:19:04,759 Speaker 1: a side and we can talk about that in a second. 1290 01:19:04,840 --> 01:19:06,720 Speaker 1: But um, you, hare's only so much gear guy I 1291 01:19:06,760 --> 01:19:09,640 Speaker 1: can take, but in my rifle. So I'm kind of 1292 01:19:09,640 --> 01:19:12,160 Speaker 1: a meticulous guy, right. I like to keep my gear 1293 01:19:12,479 --> 01:19:14,360 Speaker 1: really nice. And you know, I've kind of changed my 1294 01:19:14,400 --> 01:19:17,679 Speaker 1: mind since this incident, but you don't want it nice anymore. Well, 1295 01:19:17,720 --> 01:19:21,519 Speaker 1: I had a scope cover on, which is a little absurd, right. 1296 01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:25,760 Speaker 1: So I had a scope cover on and UM, I 1297 01:19:25,800 --> 01:19:29,400 Speaker 1: had UM. I had bullets in the magazine, but not 1298 01:19:29,520 --> 01:19:33,760 Speaker 1: in the chamber in my scope as people do, yes, 1299 01:19:34,080 --> 01:19:36,960 Speaker 1: as people do. UM. And I had my scope set 1300 01:19:37,000 --> 01:19:39,519 Speaker 1: to it wasn't max. I think it was at ten power. 1301 01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:44,280 Speaker 1: Now I do think you're dumb. The first two I'm like, 1302 01:19:44,320 --> 01:19:47,240 Speaker 1: I could see it. I could see it. But that's inexcusable. 1303 01:19:47,560 --> 01:19:49,400 Speaker 1: That is excusable. But I'm not saying that from a 1304 01:19:49,400 --> 01:19:53,639 Speaker 1: bear persuctive. I'm saying that for like no doubt, no doubt. Um. 1305 01:19:53,720 --> 01:19:55,280 Speaker 1: And And the other thing that's have you been the 1306 01:19:55,320 --> 01:19:58,880 Speaker 1: guy who killed the elk the prior day? Then I'd 1307 01:19:58,920 --> 01:20:03,400 Speaker 1: be like, sure, I get it, you're sure long shot 1308 01:20:03,600 --> 01:20:05,880 Speaker 1: never adjusted it. The other thing is, you know I 1309 01:20:05,960 --> 01:20:08,880 Speaker 1: kind of got into, um, you know, some some long 1310 01:20:09,000 --> 01:20:12,280 Speaker 1: range stuff. So I really you guys probably totally arguing 1311 01:20:12,320 --> 01:20:15,200 Speaker 1: the here. I like the first focal plant scopes, UM, 1312 01:20:15,360 --> 01:20:18,360 Speaker 1: nobody uses them from hunting for really like for hunter. 1313 01:20:18,840 --> 01:20:21,920 Speaker 1: UM use I guess you correct me if I'm wrong, 1314 01:20:21,960 --> 01:20:24,120 Speaker 1: But do you have do you use the first vocals? 1315 01:20:24,240 --> 01:20:26,680 Speaker 1: I've had them, but no, not not on my hunting guns. No, 1316 01:20:26,960 --> 01:20:29,000 Speaker 1: Because the big complaint there is obviously like you know, 1317 01:20:29,200 --> 01:20:32,080 Speaker 1: your cross hairs are real fine when you're zoomed way 1318 01:20:32,080 --> 01:20:35,200 Speaker 1: out and whatnot, and so um, anyway, so I had 1319 01:20:35,200 --> 01:20:37,280 Speaker 1: the first focal plant scope scope. That's what you're saying 1320 01:20:37,280 --> 01:20:39,479 Speaker 1: is as you dial the scope, the cross hairs get 1321 01:20:39,479 --> 01:20:43,040 Speaker 1: thicker and thinner. Correct, like the cross hairs magnify out, 1322 01:20:43,120 --> 01:20:45,639 Speaker 1: magnify it. And what's neat about it is like you're 1323 01:20:46,880 --> 01:20:49,960 Speaker 1: you know, your Christmas tree below is always correct regardless 1324 01:20:49,960 --> 01:20:52,200 Speaker 1: of what power you're on, right, And so it's great 1325 01:20:52,240 --> 01:20:55,000 Speaker 1: if you're making five, but not I think you can 1326 01:20:55,040 --> 01:20:57,840 Speaker 1: have Yeah, I should say that because I have. You 1327 01:20:57,880 --> 01:21:01,040 Speaker 1: can have those that are extremes, and you can have 1328 01:21:01,080 --> 01:21:04,400 Speaker 1: those that it always stays pretty nice. I'm not sure 1329 01:21:05,200 --> 01:21:08,280 Speaker 1: you don't they you can get them where it's like 1330 01:21:09,040 --> 01:21:14,599 Speaker 1: very fine threads right or where it's sort of like 1331 01:21:15,240 --> 01:21:20,200 Speaker 1: uh like a usable thickness no matter where you are, 1332 01:21:20,840 --> 01:21:24,320 Speaker 1: where you can still find it against a dark object. Sure, 1333 01:21:24,640 --> 01:21:28,960 Speaker 1: but I think we're getting hung up. Yeah, um, well 1334 01:21:29,280 --> 01:21:31,439 Speaker 1: just one last comment there. If you have illuminated, it 1335 01:21:31,479 --> 01:21:34,479 Speaker 1: really helps. But anyway, um, there wasn't time to throw 1336 01:21:34,479 --> 01:21:37,120 Speaker 1: that on. But so anyway, I've got some issues here. 1337 01:21:37,439 --> 01:21:40,960 Speaker 1: So within I would say, let's kind of run down 1338 01:21:40,960 --> 01:21:43,960 Speaker 1: the timeline here. I have no idea there's a bear. 1339 01:21:44,080 --> 01:21:47,000 Speaker 1: Looking through binoculars, I see a bear, and then within 1340 01:21:48,080 --> 01:21:51,559 Speaker 1: I would say, within a probably a second, maybe a 1341 01:21:51,600 --> 01:21:54,519 Speaker 1: second and a half, that bear is eating the individual 1342 01:21:54,520 --> 01:21:57,439 Speaker 1: in front of me. Um, it's on top, just going 1343 01:21:57,479 --> 01:22:02,320 Speaker 1: to town. And I actually can't see describe what a 1344 01:22:02,360 --> 01:22:06,400 Speaker 1: grizzly bear eating your buddy looks like. Well, um, so 1345 01:22:06,439 --> 01:22:10,759 Speaker 1: there's so. I would say. When it was a couple 1346 01:22:10,920 --> 01:22:13,639 Speaker 1: maybe ten feet away from him is when I started 1347 01:22:13,640 --> 01:22:17,679 Speaker 1: scrambling to get a rifle. So I missed. I missed 1348 01:22:17,720 --> 01:22:21,360 Speaker 1: the the event where it smoked him, like you know J. J. 1349 01:22:21,520 --> 01:22:24,599 Speaker 1: Watt would like, you'd expect a linebacker just to blindside somebody. 1350 01:22:24,680 --> 01:22:29,519 Speaker 1: That's really about what happened. Um. And from my vantage 1351 01:22:29,560 --> 01:22:31,920 Speaker 1: point at this time, I can't see a human at all. 1352 01:22:32,280 --> 01:22:35,000 Speaker 1: I can see just a bear and I can't see 1353 01:22:35,000 --> 01:22:38,439 Speaker 1: the head, but I can see the neck muscles like 1354 01:22:38,560 --> 01:22:45,120 Speaker 1: it's devouring, right, So I can see like they're both 1355 01:22:45,160 --> 01:22:48,360 Speaker 1: looking away from me effectively so that the bears. I 1356 01:22:48,360 --> 01:22:51,360 Speaker 1: can see the bears rear and I can't see its head. 1357 01:22:51,560 --> 01:22:54,640 Speaker 1: Is your partner on his belly around his back, you know, 1358 01:22:55,240 --> 01:23:00,120 Speaker 1: tough dude, great, great reaction to everything. He actually got 1359 01:23:00,160 --> 01:23:03,559 Speaker 1: on his back, and what was going on at the 1360 01:23:03,600 --> 01:23:06,400 Speaker 1: time was he had stuck his left arm out trying 1361 01:23:06,400 --> 01:23:08,800 Speaker 1: to draw his side arm, which is in a shoulder holter. 1362 01:23:09,600 --> 01:23:13,360 Speaker 1: But the bear, it immediately just grabbed his hand. And 1363 01:23:13,400 --> 01:23:16,360 Speaker 1: so from from my perspective, I can't see any of that. 1364 01:23:16,439 --> 01:23:18,680 Speaker 1: I could just see a bear and I know my 1365 01:23:19,000 --> 01:23:21,760 Speaker 1: you know, my buddies underneath him, and so that's that's 1366 01:23:21,760 --> 01:23:34,280 Speaker 1: what I see. So I remember a couple like very 1367 01:23:34,320 --> 01:23:37,120 Speaker 1: cognitive decisions going through my head right The first one 1368 01:23:37,120 --> 01:23:39,400 Speaker 1: is how do we get away? The second one is, 1369 01:23:39,560 --> 01:23:41,760 Speaker 1: you know, we're not getting away? This is this is 1370 01:23:41,800 --> 01:23:45,240 Speaker 1: happening right now. And so I I grabbed the rifle, 1371 01:23:45,520 --> 01:23:47,720 Speaker 1: chambered around, threw the cover off, and brought it up, 1372 01:23:48,080 --> 01:23:52,920 Speaker 1: you know, to my cheek, and and uh, surprisingly, I 1373 01:23:53,360 --> 01:23:56,320 Speaker 1: remember like immediately finding the bear, you know, like you 1374 01:23:56,320 --> 01:23:59,599 Speaker 1: would think the bear and only the bear, you know. 1375 01:24:00,160 --> 01:24:01,920 Speaker 1: I think I must have been having like two eyes 1376 01:24:02,000 --> 01:24:05,519 Speaker 1: open or something. It's I seemed incredibly confident where I 1377 01:24:05,560 --> 01:24:10,920 Speaker 1: was aiming at that time, you know, especially incredibly confident. 1378 01:24:11,000 --> 01:24:13,360 Speaker 1: And I remember thinking to myself, like, well, I can't 1379 01:24:13,360 --> 01:24:15,479 Speaker 1: shoot here, which is where I would like to shoot, 1380 01:24:15,760 --> 01:24:19,280 Speaker 1: because I'm shooting you know, three D three hundred wind 1381 01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:23,000 Speaker 1: mag twitter and eighty five grain bullet at six yards 1382 01:24:23,000 --> 01:24:25,760 Speaker 1: ten yards and it's probably coming out the other side, right, 1383 01:24:26,240 --> 01:24:27,720 Speaker 1: so you don't want to you know, I didn't want 1384 01:24:27,760 --> 01:24:30,439 Speaker 1: to shoot there. And so what actually went through my 1385 01:24:30,439 --> 01:24:32,080 Speaker 1: head was, you know, if if I just shoot, the 1386 01:24:32,120 --> 01:24:35,599 Speaker 1: barrel probably gets booked and run off, which is well, 1387 01:24:35,640 --> 01:24:37,879 Speaker 1: we can get in that later. But so I remember 1388 01:24:37,960 --> 01:24:40,479 Speaker 1: just aiming where I thought kind of the vitals were, 1389 01:24:40,800 --> 01:24:42,600 Speaker 1: and I was like, well, I can't shoot here, so 1390 01:24:42,640 --> 01:24:45,080 Speaker 1: I just brought it up to kind of the higher 1391 01:24:45,120 --> 01:24:47,120 Speaker 1: part of its back. That's what I was kind of 1392 01:24:47,120 --> 01:24:50,559 Speaker 1: trying to explain video where I had an adrenaline running, 1393 01:24:50,600 --> 01:24:52,320 Speaker 1: but so I kind of brought it up higher on 1394 01:24:52,320 --> 01:24:55,880 Speaker 1: the back and just squeezed and she went off, and 1395 01:24:55,880 --> 01:25:01,120 Speaker 1: that that bear immediately let up turn earned and started 1396 01:25:01,160 --> 01:25:04,840 Speaker 1: charging me, and and I guess I would describe it 1397 01:25:04,880 --> 01:25:07,559 Speaker 1: as like, you know, the the film kind of changed, right, 1398 01:25:07,600 --> 01:25:09,599 Speaker 1: So at first it was this now this beautiful national 1399 01:25:09,680 --> 01:25:13,600 Speaker 1: geographic film of a bear kind of going going in 1400 01:25:13,680 --> 01:25:15,080 Speaker 1: for a kill, and then all of a sudden, it 1401 01:25:15,120 --> 01:25:19,040 Speaker 1: was like the Revenant where the bears angry, really angry, 1402 01:25:19,479 --> 01:25:23,479 Speaker 1: and so um, so the bear immediately starts letting up, 1403 01:25:23,520 --> 01:25:27,400 Speaker 1: which actually allows um, you know, the other guy to 1404 01:25:27,400 --> 01:25:32,599 Speaker 1: to to draw his side arm on his left hand, 1405 01:25:33,320 --> 01:25:35,800 Speaker 1: draw his side arm with his right and kind of 1406 01:25:35,840 --> 01:25:40,280 Speaker 1: get up while while discharging around, which was awesome. And 1407 01:25:40,360 --> 01:25:44,960 Speaker 1: I remember thinking to myself after the shot, Um, you know, 1408 01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:49,680 Speaker 1: I really hope that you know that the individuals live 1409 01:25:49,720 --> 01:25:51,400 Speaker 1: on the other side. And so I remember kind of 1410 01:25:51,400 --> 01:25:54,519 Speaker 1: looking around the bear and he was standing up and 1411 01:25:54,920 --> 01:26:01,080 Speaker 1: you know, like victory, right, and immediately followed by oh shit, 1412 01:26:02,439 --> 01:26:04,000 Speaker 1: now hold on when he's getting up he said, he 1413 01:26:04,080 --> 01:26:07,040 Speaker 1: discharged a shot too. He also did, Yes, so the 1414 01:26:07,080 --> 01:26:12,120 Speaker 1: bears between you guys, consider your location as you were 1415 01:26:12,120 --> 01:26:18,559 Speaker 1: of his location. Um, I think for sure. Honestly, he 1416 01:26:18,640 --> 01:26:21,160 Speaker 1: kept his wits real quite quite well. And he's got 1417 01:26:21,160 --> 01:26:25,360 Speaker 1: a ten millimeter pistol, you said, correct, correct, you know, Um, 1418 01:26:25,439 --> 01:26:27,720 Speaker 1: the sample size is very small. But there was a 1419 01:26:27,760 --> 01:26:30,479 Speaker 1: statistic floating around after these guys that just sort of 1420 01:26:30,520 --> 01:26:33,040 Speaker 1: meta analysis of all these bear encounters, and it was 1421 01:26:33,080 --> 01:26:36,519 Speaker 1: in context of spray versus pistols, And I do you 1422 01:26:36,560 --> 01:26:41,400 Speaker 1: guys remember this that pent of the time a firearm 1423 01:26:41,520 --> 01:26:44,639 Speaker 1: is discharged during a bear attack, it hits a person. Geez, 1424 01:26:46,280 --> 01:26:48,200 Speaker 1: it was a lot. That's crazy. I can think of 1425 01:26:48,280 --> 01:26:51,320 Speaker 1: like multiple stories of things just in the last few 1426 01:26:51,360 --> 01:26:54,280 Speaker 1: years of that happening. Well, I don't know, but like 1427 01:26:54,320 --> 01:26:55,599 Speaker 1: I said, man, it's like, how big is this saying? 1428 01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:57,080 Speaker 1: You know, I don't know. I don't know about I 1429 01:26:57,080 --> 01:27:02,040 Speaker 1: remember that was just that was out there floating around. Um. So, 1430 01:27:02,040 --> 01:27:04,719 Speaker 1: so back to the story. So the bears now charging 1431 01:27:04,760 --> 01:27:10,280 Speaker 1: me another you know, he discharged the one round and 1432 01:27:10,320 --> 01:27:14,960 Speaker 1: then I remember trying. Um, I basically took two steps back, 1433 01:27:15,360 --> 01:27:18,080 Speaker 1: and you know, actually after the incident, I listened to 1434 01:27:18,160 --> 01:27:20,920 Speaker 1: your guys podcast about you diving out of the way, 1435 01:27:21,040 --> 01:27:24,439 Speaker 1: Steve and and um who is the other individual, Alex 1436 01:27:24,520 --> 01:27:28,840 Speaker 1: maybe from Alex Messenger, the guy, the canoe guy. He 1437 01:27:28,920 --> 01:27:31,920 Speaker 1: also out of the way, Like you guys are crazy. 1438 01:27:32,680 --> 01:27:35,800 Speaker 1: My my philosophy was get on my back. So I 1439 01:27:35,960 --> 01:27:39,160 Speaker 1: dove to my back and I had my rifle basically 1440 01:27:39,360 --> 01:27:41,800 Speaker 1: kind of a front of my neck, and I stuck out. 1441 01:27:41,920 --> 01:27:44,519 Speaker 1: You know, I brought my foot up and I my 1442 01:27:44,560 --> 01:27:46,439 Speaker 1: philosophy was kind of a hail Mary, I'm gonna kick 1443 01:27:46,479 --> 01:27:49,000 Speaker 1: it in the face. I'm gonna kicking this out. There's 1444 01:27:49,040 --> 01:27:52,080 Speaker 1: no time to rack another round, no, I mean and 1445 01:27:52,080 --> 01:27:58,439 Speaker 1: and actually, UM, I think subconsciously I tried because like 1446 01:27:58,479 --> 01:28:01,519 Speaker 1: my my hand got jammed under my bolt which was out. 1447 01:28:01,760 --> 01:28:04,679 Speaker 1: So I had pulled the bolt out and hadn't even 1448 01:28:04,960 --> 01:28:07,640 Speaker 1: really been able to drive another round in. And so 1449 01:28:07,680 --> 01:28:11,800 Speaker 1: I'm on my back and the bears coming, jaw open, snapping, 1450 01:28:12,280 --> 01:28:15,200 Speaker 1: and you know, it gets to that last step and 1451 01:28:15,280 --> 01:28:19,400 Speaker 1: I kick and I just kind of mess and I 1452 01:28:19,520 --> 01:28:23,240 Speaker 1: hit something, you know, but I miss, I don't really 1453 01:28:23,280 --> 01:28:26,880 Speaker 1: hit anything solid, right, and um, and the bear now 1454 01:28:27,000 --> 01:28:30,639 Speaker 1: is all of a sudden kind of quartering away and 1455 01:28:30,720 --> 01:28:33,640 Speaker 1: you know, trying, trying almost I don't get away or 1456 01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:38,559 Speaker 1: circle around or or something. But something happened, right, So 1457 01:28:38,560 --> 01:28:40,600 Speaker 1: so the other digital follows the bear, you know, it 1458 01:28:40,600 --> 01:28:43,559 Speaker 1: gets um gets quite close. And when the bears kind 1459 01:28:43,560 --> 01:28:48,240 Speaker 1: of circling around or or making its way away, UM, 1460 01:28:48,280 --> 01:28:50,559 Speaker 1: he's looking at his his hand, which his thumb is 1461 01:28:50,800 --> 01:28:55,360 Speaker 1: quite quite mangled. UM. And and I see his pistol, 1462 01:28:55,840 --> 01:28:58,280 Speaker 1: and so I go and grab that pistol. And I'm 1463 01:28:58,320 --> 01:29:01,280 Speaker 1: thinking to myself, I'm not doing around two of this, UM, 1464 01:29:01,320 --> 01:29:04,080 Speaker 1: and so I put three more UM pop pop pop 1465 01:29:04,280 --> 01:29:08,280 Speaker 1: and uh and a real quick yeah. And the bear 1466 01:29:08,320 --> 01:29:10,400 Speaker 1: is not that far away when you're in the video, correct, 1467 01:29:10,720 --> 01:29:13,840 Speaker 1: And at that time the cubs were actually um and 1468 01:29:13,880 --> 01:29:15,920 Speaker 1: I kind of left that out. The cubs almost were 1469 01:29:15,960 --> 01:29:18,320 Speaker 1: near me almost the whole time. And so I am 1470 01:29:18,479 --> 01:29:20,880 Speaker 1: I'm kind of finishing off the bear with the cubs 1471 01:29:20,960 --> 01:29:25,400 Speaker 1: running past me to go to that south um, and 1472 01:29:26,160 --> 01:29:29,120 Speaker 1: the bear kind of was the what was the age 1473 01:29:29,600 --> 01:29:33,880 Speaker 1: class on the cubs? Um, the year cubs last year? 1474 01:29:33,960 --> 01:29:35,840 Speaker 1: You know, it's this year's cubs and they were real 1475 01:29:35,920 --> 01:29:41,160 Speaker 1: small um and so yeah, so um, effectively, you know, 1476 01:29:41,280 --> 01:29:44,760 Speaker 1: five rounds are fired, the situation is neutralized, and now 1477 01:29:44,760 --> 01:29:48,719 Speaker 1: it's time to kind of attend the medical situation because 1478 01:29:48,760 --> 01:29:52,799 Speaker 1: that's obviously the as. So the bear has been shot twice, 1479 01:29:52,840 --> 01:29:55,240 Speaker 1: it runs, you shoot a cup more times and then 1480 01:29:55,360 --> 01:29:57,360 Speaker 1: it does like piles up like dead or and dead 1481 01:29:57,439 --> 01:30:00,680 Speaker 1: or like piles up like and then rolls round for 1482 01:30:00,720 --> 01:30:02,800 Speaker 1: a long time. Um. There was no like, you know, 1483 01:30:03,040 --> 01:30:05,240 Speaker 1: like a death moan. People talk about death moans of bears. 1484 01:30:05,400 --> 01:30:08,280 Speaker 1: It really didn't do that. Um. So so just to 1485 01:30:08,320 --> 01:30:10,760 Speaker 1: kind of run through it, you know in fast you know, 1486 01:30:10,800 --> 01:30:14,320 Speaker 1: in fast motion, so maybe one or two seconds before 1487 01:30:14,360 --> 01:30:16,600 Speaker 1: the bear is on top of the other other individuals. 1488 01:30:17,320 --> 01:30:21,120 Speaker 1: The bear is shot, you know, probably half a second second. UM, 1489 01:30:21,280 --> 01:30:24,800 Speaker 1: well on top Um then immediately charges me. You can 1490 01:30:24,840 --> 01:30:27,320 Speaker 1: imagine how long that took. Maybe half a second or 1491 01:30:27,320 --> 01:30:29,800 Speaker 1: a second. And then it's trying to get away. The 1492 01:30:29,880 --> 01:30:31,840 Speaker 1: three other shots are fired. You know, I grabbed the pistol, 1493 01:30:31,840 --> 01:30:34,759 Speaker 1: fire three other shots, and the whole event I would 1494 01:30:34,760 --> 01:30:38,360 Speaker 1: say six to eight seconds from from not knowing there's 1495 01:30:38,400 --> 01:30:42,479 Speaker 1: a bear to firing the last round thinking to myself 1496 01:30:42,920 --> 01:30:46,479 Speaker 1: that did it. And and I would say the last 1497 01:30:46,600 --> 01:30:49,639 Speaker 1: round it kind of just buckled, you know what I mean. 1498 01:30:49,800 --> 01:30:52,719 Speaker 1: It just you know when you hit something that you're like, okay, 1499 01:30:52,720 --> 01:30:56,320 Speaker 1: that hurt, you know. Um. And so so then the 1500 01:30:56,360 --> 01:30:58,559 Speaker 1: cubs go and they go and hang out on on 1501 01:30:58,600 --> 01:31:01,599 Speaker 1: that sell and uh. And so then we're kind of 1502 01:31:01,640 --> 01:31:06,760 Speaker 1: addressing the situation. And so UM, I go through my 1503 01:31:06,800 --> 01:31:11,240 Speaker 1: pack and another mistake we also, I don't have a 1504 01:31:11,800 --> 01:31:14,960 Speaker 1: I have a first aid kit back at camp right, 1505 01:31:15,000 --> 01:31:16,519 Speaker 1: I don't have any in my back, but I do 1506 01:31:16,600 --> 01:31:19,880 Speaker 1: have a spare set of woolf socks. And so we 1507 01:31:19,960 --> 01:31:23,240 Speaker 1: kind of put the thumb back in the where it's 1508 01:31:23,240 --> 01:31:25,920 Speaker 1: supposed to be, and and I wrapped one sock around 1509 01:31:25,960 --> 01:31:28,839 Speaker 1: real tight and almost tight like a knot or a splint, 1510 01:31:29,200 --> 01:31:31,519 Speaker 1: and then put the other sock over the top just 1511 01:31:31,560 --> 01:31:35,160 Speaker 1: to kind of apply pressure to the wound. UM, and 1512 01:31:35,200 --> 01:31:40,280 Speaker 1: then obviously keeping it elevated and whatnot. UM. Pretty much 1513 01:31:40,360 --> 01:31:43,360 Speaker 1: that whole area we did not have any cell service, 1514 01:31:43,680 --> 01:31:47,200 Speaker 1: but actually right on that ridge, UM, we were able 1515 01:31:47,240 --> 01:31:52,040 Speaker 1: to call nine one one and and uh explain the situation. UM. 1516 01:31:52,080 --> 01:31:55,680 Speaker 1: At that time they mentioned the helicopter or to get 1517 01:31:55,680 --> 01:31:59,120 Speaker 1: a helicopter, it would have come from Riverton, UM, which 1518 01:31:59,200 --> 01:32:02,880 Speaker 1: is little ways out, and they couldn't take off for 1519 01:32:02,880 --> 01:32:05,360 Speaker 1: another hour. So as you were talking, three or four 1520 01:32:05,360 --> 01:32:08,360 Speaker 1: hours before a helicopter would come. And really, if you 1521 01:32:08,400 --> 01:32:11,519 Speaker 1: looked at the you know, the scenery, it wasn't really 1522 01:32:11,520 --> 01:32:14,240 Speaker 1: somewhere you could land it nicely. Let's just say that. 1523 01:32:15,439 --> 01:32:18,880 Speaker 1: So we made the decision to ride out. UM. So 1524 01:32:19,520 --> 01:32:23,400 Speaker 1: UM we contacted the other UM a couple other folks 1525 01:32:23,400 --> 01:32:25,800 Speaker 1: in the hunting party, and they brought the horses down 1526 01:32:26,200 --> 01:32:30,160 Speaker 1: UM and we rode out, and uh we were met 1527 01:32:30,200 --> 01:32:34,040 Speaker 1: by a mirage of people that obviously at the trailhead. UM. 1528 01:32:34,120 --> 01:32:37,400 Speaker 1: You know, you got your game in fish UM Search 1529 01:32:37,439 --> 01:32:43,040 Speaker 1: and Rescue teams, helicopter that had landed the trailhead, um ambulance, 1530 01:32:43,080 --> 01:32:46,400 Speaker 1: so on and so forth. For it was actually, um, 1531 01:32:46,439 --> 01:32:50,280 Speaker 1: this is kind of a funny. Jim Zombo was there, um, 1532 01:32:50,320 --> 01:32:52,920 Speaker 1: just to see what's going on. Yeah, I'm not really sure. 1533 01:32:53,160 --> 01:32:58,120 Speaker 1: Um and uh, you know, it's kind of embarrassing probably 1534 01:32:58,120 --> 01:33:00,760 Speaker 1: on my my behalf. But another I that was there 1535 01:33:00,920 --> 01:33:02,200 Speaker 1: was like, hey, you know who this is? You know? 1536 01:33:02,479 --> 01:33:04,280 Speaker 1: And I look at him and no, I have no idea. 1537 01:33:04,840 --> 01:33:06,680 Speaker 1: I did not know who Jim Jumbo was at the time. 1538 01:33:06,720 --> 01:33:10,559 Speaker 1: But um, so anyway, I can't say i'd recognize him either. 1539 01:33:10,920 --> 01:33:14,599 Speaker 1: So just there would be like, what's going on? Um, 1540 01:33:14,680 --> 01:33:19,400 Speaker 1: he must live nearby. Yeah, I know he's in Northern Wyoming. 1541 01:33:19,840 --> 01:33:22,960 Speaker 1: He's playing the Captain Quint character. Like when you get there, 1542 01:33:23,040 --> 01:33:28,760 Speaker 1: he's like, I'll catch you a bear. Yeah, is your 1543 01:33:28,760 --> 01:33:32,240 Speaker 1: buddy real quick? Is your Is it just his hand 1544 01:33:32,280 --> 01:33:36,439 Speaker 1: that's messed up? Yes? So, um, it seemed like from 1545 01:33:36,439 --> 01:33:38,519 Speaker 1: my perspective that that took a long time, but I 1546 01:33:38,520 --> 01:33:42,640 Speaker 1: think it was quite quick. Um. And and yeah, um 1547 01:33:42,680 --> 01:33:46,080 Speaker 1: really the uh, the only the only real injury is 1548 01:33:46,120 --> 01:33:48,680 Speaker 1: the hand, um you know, I had. I actually had 1549 01:33:48,720 --> 01:33:52,639 Speaker 1: a little tiny scratch on my on my shin which 1550 01:33:52,840 --> 01:33:54,200 Speaker 1: I still have a little bit of a mark there, 1551 01:33:54,240 --> 01:33:57,479 Speaker 1: but from the bear, that's correct. Yeah, what's that do 1552 01:33:57,640 --> 01:34:00,439 Speaker 1: through nail? You know that that half and when I 1553 01:34:00,479 --> 01:34:03,000 Speaker 1: tried to kick and it tried to lunge. Are you 1554 01:34:03,120 --> 01:34:08,800 Speaker 1: just hoping it's the bear? Could have been it's a 1555 01:34:08,840 --> 01:34:11,840 Speaker 1: little it's it's really just it'll be gone. And it's 1556 01:34:12,120 --> 01:34:15,040 Speaker 1: like it'll be gone in six months. Right, it's not 1557 01:34:15,080 --> 01:34:17,680 Speaker 1: really scar but I would go see if someone could 1558 01:34:17,720 --> 01:34:21,960 Speaker 1: help me keep that. Um so you you made it 1559 01:34:21,960 --> 01:34:25,439 Speaker 1: to the trailhead. I'm really curious. On the hook for 1560 01:34:25,479 --> 01:34:31,120 Speaker 1: the helicopter. Um so there was um the individual um 1561 01:34:31,200 --> 01:34:34,840 Speaker 1: that that got that needed the quick medical attention actually 1562 01:34:34,880 --> 01:34:38,719 Speaker 1: had helicopter insurance. Um So not necessarily on the hook, 1563 01:34:38,800 --> 01:34:41,920 Speaker 1: but good timing. I guess purposely get it for that 1564 01:34:42,000 --> 01:34:43,960 Speaker 1: hard or you had it for work. He had had 1565 01:34:44,000 --> 01:34:47,080 Speaker 1: it for UM some time before. So um you know, 1566 01:34:47,280 --> 01:34:48,880 Speaker 1: you never you never know when you're gonna need it. 1567 01:34:48,920 --> 01:34:51,479 Speaker 1: But it makes you wonder if I had that, do 1568 01:34:51,520 --> 01:34:53,120 Speaker 1: you have that without knowing it? I wonder is it 1569 01:34:53,200 --> 01:34:55,679 Speaker 1: like a real specific that I don't know? I think 1570 01:34:55,880 --> 01:34:59,920 Speaker 1: I think we we have God that was somewhere when 1571 01:35:00,160 --> 01:35:03,720 Speaker 1: he when you thought he was being eaten barrows on 1572 01:35:03,800 --> 01:35:07,640 Speaker 1: top of him. Uh, what was what? What's his perspective? 1573 01:35:07,840 --> 01:35:11,080 Speaker 1: What was going on? Um? His perspective was kind of 1574 01:35:11,120 --> 01:35:15,120 Speaker 1: like that. It was playing with him like a dog almost, Yeah, 1575 01:35:15,360 --> 01:35:19,120 Speaker 1: mauling his thumb. Yeah. So it stayed on his hand 1576 01:35:19,200 --> 01:35:22,000 Speaker 1: as it grabbed his hand, grabbed his hand and pushed 1577 01:35:22,040 --> 01:35:25,599 Speaker 1: him down. It stayed with his hand in his mouth. Yeah, 1578 01:35:25,680 --> 01:35:27,640 Speaker 1: his hand was in its mouth the whole time, in 1579 01:35:27,680 --> 01:35:34,000 Speaker 1: her in her mouth yeah. Um. Maybe not even plural, um, 1580 01:35:34,040 --> 01:35:37,760 Speaker 1: but close, you know. Um. And it's what's amazing is 1581 01:35:38,040 --> 01:35:40,240 Speaker 1: no claws were used, right, I mean you would think 1582 01:35:40,320 --> 01:35:42,720 Speaker 1: that you got the leverage. You're the bear, You got 1583 01:35:42,720 --> 01:35:46,599 Speaker 1: the leverage. All you gotta do is stretch the stretch 1584 01:35:46,680 --> 01:35:48,080 Speaker 1: the arm out with one of your claws and you 1585 01:35:48,600 --> 01:35:51,080 Speaker 1: I mean, who knows, she probably would have gotten to 1586 01:35:51,160 --> 01:35:54,960 Speaker 1: that if you hadn't a shot or sure. Um so um. 1587 01:35:55,000 --> 01:35:57,479 Speaker 1: So that's kind of the um. That was the first 1588 01:35:57,600 --> 01:35:59,599 Speaker 1: run through, and that was kind of what I had 1589 01:35:59,720 --> 01:36:03,120 Speaker 1: learned and and I guess um went through the first time. 1590 01:36:03,920 --> 01:36:05,840 Speaker 1: Then then all of a sudden, now it's kind of 1591 01:36:05,880 --> 01:36:07,880 Speaker 1: what you're bringing. Now, now we gotta bring the game 1592 01:36:07,880 --> 01:36:12,000 Speaker 1: and fish back, um to to evaluate the situation as 1593 01:36:12,600 --> 01:36:17,200 Speaker 1: as everyone would know and understand. And so yeah, uh 1594 01:36:17,680 --> 01:36:22,920 Speaker 1: this just for listeners, this is a the grizzly bear 1595 01:36:23,160 --> 01:36:28,280 Speaker 1: in the Rocky Mountains and lower forty eight is listed 1596 01:36:28,360 --> 01:36:35,440 Speaker 1: as threatened and has endangered species at protections, which means that, um, 1597 01:36:35,560 --> 01:36:37,400 Speaker 1: if you kill one, they're going to make sure that 1598 01:36:37,479 --> 01:36:40,519 Speaker 1: it was legal. And it's like obviously legal to kill 1599 01:36:40,560 --> 01:36:43,280 Speaker 1: one in defensive life, but they're still gonna come check 1600 01:36:43,280 --> 01:36:46,040 Speaker 1: it out. And I believe that's the only reason that 1601 01:36:46,120 --> 01:36:49,360 Speaker 1: you can kill it defensive property right or game or 1602 01:36:49,400 --> 01:36:53,200 Speaker 1: anything like that. So UM, so we ride in. UM 1603 01:36:53,240 --> 01:36:57,400 Speaker 1: there's uh, four folks from the state that come in. UM. 1604 01:36:57,720 --> 01:37:01,080 Speaker 1: There's a biologist, um I think kind of an apprentice. 1605 01:37:01,160 --> 01:37:05,800 Speaker 1: There's the game warden for that region, and then his supervisor. UM. 1606 01:37:05,840 --> 01:37:08,040 Speaker 1: So we ride in about six miles so it took 1607 01:37:08,080 --> 01:37:10,960 Speaker 1: about it was about six miles there one way. UM. 1608 01:37:10,960 --> 01:37:13,880 Speaker 1: So we ride in six miles UM and then I 1609 01:37:14,160 --> 01:37:18,640 Speaker 1: basically reenact what happened, UM, and and it was you know, 1610 01:37:18,680 --> 01:37:21,800 Speaker 1: pretty clear, there was blood trails and and things like that. 1611 01:37:21,880 --> 01:37:25,479 Speaker 1: And actually when we arrived, UM, you know, the cubs 1612 01:37:25,479 --> 01:37:28,200 Speaker 1: were still there. UM. So we we they have to 1613 01:37:28,240 --> 01:37:31,600 Speaker 1: do an investigation. So, um, we needed to remove the 1614 01:37:31,640 --> 01:37:34,439 Speaker 1: cubs from the from the sow in order to perform 1615 01:37:34,479 --> 01:37:40,200 Speaker 1: the investigation. It's in the news that they euthanize the cubs. Um. 1616 01:37:40,320 --> 01:37:44,200 Speaker 1: And so I go through, I kind of uh, you know, 1617 01:37:44,280 --> 01:37:49,360 Speaker 1: run through, reenact my position, reenact to the other individual's position, 1618 01:37:49,520 --> 01:37:52,280 Speaker 1: and kind of follow, you know, where the bear had 1619 01:37:52,320 --> 01:37:55,120 Speaker 1: come from and and gone, and you know, the whole 1620 01:37:55,280 --> 01:37:58,040 Speaker 1: just to kind of paint the radius for the listeners. 1621 01:37:58,040 --> 01:38:01,280 Speaker 1: You know. Um, it starts maybe ten or fifteen yards 1622 01:38:01,320 --> 01:38:03,960 Speaker 1: to to to my right and ends maybe ten or 1623 01:38:03,960 --> 01:38:05,960 Speaker 1: fifteen yards to my left. So the whole thing, I mean, 1624 01:38:05,960 --> 01:38:09,080 Speaker 1: the whole situation is a thirty yard line. I mean 1625 01:38:09,120 --> 01:38:14,280 Speaker 1: it's very close quarters. Um. And so I wonder above 1626 01:38:14,360 --> 01:38:18,040 Speaker 1: treeline again, so it's it's all clear field of view, 1627 01:38:18,680 --> 01:38:20,960 Speaker 1: not a lot of brush, not a lot of deadfall. 1628 01:38:21,640 --> 01:38:25,719 Speaker 1: There is, um, you know, where where the grizzly died 1629 01:38:26,120 --> 01:38:28,240 Speaker 1: was kind of the beginning of the timber line, but 1630 01:38:28,280 --> 01:38:31,559 Speaker 1: it was a burned area, so it's kind of uh, 1631 01:38:31,600 --> 01:38:34,280 Speaker 1: you know, it's easy to see, but that's where. So 1632 01:38:34,320 --> 01:38:35,880 Speaker 1: it was kind of a burned area. Just to paint 1633 01:38:35,880 --> 01:38:40,439 Speaker 1: the picture. Um, And so UM, one thing they wanted 1634 01:38:40,520 --> 01:38:44,120 Speaker 1: is they wanted to find some brass for the for 1635 01:38:44,160 --> 01:38:47,679 Speaker 1: the investigation, if you will. UM. And so I knew 1636 01:38:47,720 --> 01:38:52,080 Speaker 1: there were five five rounds. UM. The rifle was obviously 1637 01:38:52,160 --> 01:38:57,479 Speaker 1: easy one to find. UM. And UM we only found 1638 01:38:57,600 --> 01:39:00,599 Speaker 1: one one of the pistol rounds. But one of the 1639 01:39:00,600 --> 01:39:03,400 Speaker 1: the one pistol round that we found, UM was actually 1640 01:39:03,840 --> 01:39:07,360 Speaker 1: UM kind of covered in blood. So the casing was 1641 01:39:07,400 --> 01:39:10,559 Speaker 1: covered in blood, which, UM, it's kind of interesting and 1642 01:39:10,600 --> 01:39:12,799 Speaker 1: we can kind of I think I have some ideas 1643 01:39:12,840 --> 01:39:17,040 Speaker 1: of where that came from. UM. And then and then 1644 01:39:17,320 --> 01:39:21,200 Speaker 1: the next step in the the the investigation, if you will, 1645 01:39:21,240 --> 01:39:24,400 Speaker 1: is to really you know, go look at the story 1646 01:39:24,560 --> 01:39:27,240 Speaker 1: and then look at you know, the the evidence or 1647 01:39:27,360 --> 01:39:32,040 Speaker 1: or the I guess, the makeup of the bear. How 1648 01:39:32,080 --> 01:39:37,160 Speaker 1: long is this whole like investigation procedure taking. Are they 1649 01:39:37,240 --> 01:39:42,000 Speaker 1: all like detail business oriented like taking their time or um? Yeah, 1650 01:39:42,040 --> 01:39:44,880 Speaker 1: it's pretty thorough. Um, you know, it's obviously it's not 1651 01:39:44,920 --> 01:39:46,920 Speaker 1: something that happens every day. I think they mentioned that 1652 01:39:46,920 --> 01:39:50,800 Speaker 1: I was the fifth um that year. Um. However, it 1653 01:39:50,880 --> 01:39:54,720 Speaker 1: was the first bear recovered. So I don't know if 1654 01:39:54,760 --> 01:39:57,680 Speaker 1: that means that somebody got attacked and got away. I 1655 01:39:57,720 --> 01:39:59,320 Speaker 1: don't know, and I don't know if that means, you know, 1656 01:39:59,320 --> 01:40:01,400 Speaker 1: shot was fired to the bear. I'm not really sure 1657 01:40:01,439 --> 01:40:04,639 Speaker 1: what that means. But um, you know, the the ride 1658 01:40:04,640 --> 01:40:07,719 Speaker 1: obviously took the longest amount you know, you're twelve miles 1659 01:40:07,800 --> 01:40:11,599 Speaker 1: round trip, um. But the investigation, I mean it took 1660 01:40:11,800 --> 01:40:16,120 Speaker 1: you know, hours, um and right there, Yeah, I I 1661 01:40:16,439 --> 01:40:19,080 Speaker 1: assisted in that, so you know, it's kind of from 1662 01:40:19,120 --> 01:40:22,880 Speaker 1: my perspective, it was kind of um, you know, it 1663 01:40:22,920 --> 01:40:24,360 Speaker 1: was kind of neat to be a part of that, 1664 01:40:24,600 --> 01:40:27,040 Speaker 1: you know, because you know, you you know how it 1665 01:40:27,040 --> 01:40:30,439 Speaker 1: played out, right, and then so then you can see, 1666 01:40:30,760 --> 01:40:33,760 Speaker 1: you know, where the individual bullets landed on that, on 1667 01:40:33,840 --> 01:40:36,479 Speaker 1: that bear, and you can kind of then start to 1668 01:40:36,520 --> 01:40:39,479 Speaker 1: put the pieces together on like why did this happen? 1669 01:40:39,600 --> 01:40:41,599 Speaker 1: Why did it play out that way? Why did the 1670 01:40:41,640 --> 01:40:46,160 Speaker 1: bear um change direction and not lunge at me at 1671 01:40:46,160 --> 01:40:49,360 Speaker 1: that last second? Right um? And so there were some 1672 01:40:49,400 --> 01:40:53,479 Speaker 1: things that were really really evident, um. And so skinning 1673 01:40:53,479 --> 01:40:56,840 Speaker 1: out the bear, you know, I mean the first thing 1674 01:40:56,880 --> 01:40:59,920 Speaker 1: that was remarkable and it's obvious kind of when you 1675 01:41:00,040 --> 01:41:03,000 Speaker 1: say it out loud now, but the difference in damage 1676 01:41:03,080 --> 01:41:06,400 Speaker 1: from the three wind bag to the ten millimeter right 1677 01:41:06,680 --> 01:41:09,360 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a high powered rifle versus a handgun, right, 1678 01:41:09,360 --> 01:41:12,200 Speaker 1: so you obviously expect a lot more. But so let's 1679 01:41:12,240 --> 01:41:15,280 Speaker 1: let's kind of talk about the the individual bullets. Right. 1680 01:41:15,320 --> 01:41:19,880 Speaker 1: So the the shot with the rifle had entered um 1681 01:41:20,000 --> 01:41:23,840 Speaker 1: kind of upper mid but the right side of the 1682 01:41:24,160 --> 01:41:27,639 Speaker 1: back of the of the bear, and the exit hole 1683 01:41:28,080 --> 01:41:31,400 Speaker 1: was kind of out near the neck front front, right quarter, 1684 01:41:31,640 --> 01:41:34,800 Speaker 1: and the exit hole was quite large. UM. And so 1685 01:41:34,840 --> 01:41:37,040 Speaker 1: that's the first thing that you're kind of like, well, 1686 01:41:37,040 --> 01:41:41,639 Speaker 1: I'm glad that exit hole didn't you know, contact anybody. UM, 1687 01:41:41,680 --> 01:41:46,920 Speaker 1: And you know that's um. But UM. Then then we 1688 01:41:47,000 --> 01:41:49,200 Speaker 1: kind of started looking for more more bullet holes just 1689 01:41:49,240 --> 01:41:51,960 Speaker 1: to see, um, you know, play it out and so 1690 01:41:53,400 --> 01:41:56,080 Speaker 1: zipping out you know, more of the more of the hide. UM. 1691 01:41:56,080 --> 01:41:59,519 Speaker 1: There were two ten millimeter rounds that had passed UM 1692 01:41:59,720 --> 01:42:02,759 Speaker 1: through are the kind of like almost gut shots really UM. 1693 01:42:02,800 --> 01:42:05,120 Speaker 1: And you know, when you're shooting a running animal in 1694 01:42:05,200 --> 01:42:09,880 Speaker 1: a couple of yards, you never know, so there's a 1695 01:42:10,080 --> 01:42:12,960 Speaker 1: kind of it was basically a clean pass you know, 1696 01:42:13,080 --> 01:42:15,599 Speaker 1: kind of you know, a rear gut shot that kind 1697 01:42:15,600 --> 01:42:17,880 Speaker 1: of came out the other side, and then another one 1698 01:42:17,880 --> 01:42:19,640 Speaker 1: that kind of came out the other side, so like 1699 01:42:19,680 --> 01:42:22,160 Speaker 1: kind of quartering away gut shots, if you will. Two 1700 01:42:22,160 --> 01:42:24,400 Speaker 1: of those passed all the way through, all the way 1701 01:42:24,400 --> 01:42:27,800 Speaker 1: through um and what do they look like? There was 1702 01:42:27,840 --> 01:42:32,120 Speaker 1: a lot of trauma there or so those were using 1703 01:42:32,120 --> 01:42:36,519 Speaker 1: those buffalo boar rounds, which you know deep penetration and 1704 01:42:36,600 --> 01:42:38,080 Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of people talk about deep 1705 01:42:38,080 --> 01:42:40,639 Speaker 1: penetration and whatnot. And one thing in the brain, another 1706 01:42:40,680 --> 01:42:45,639 Speaker 1: thing in the right soft parts, right right, and so 1707 01:42:46,160 --> 01:42:50,000 Speaker 1: you know, originally we found those three shots, and everybody 1708 01:42:50,040 --> 01:42:53,000 Speaker 1: knows they're gonna punch it right between the eyes, right. 1709 01:42:53,400 --> 01:42:55,760 Speaker 1: I mean, when you're like getting already, you're like a 1710 01:42:55,760 --> 01:42:57,880 Speaker 1: long I hit him right head exactly right. And so 1711 01:42:57,960 --> 01:43:00,120 Speaker 1: every you know, we found those three shots originally, and 1712 01:43:00,240 --> 01:43:02,040 Speaker 1: you know, I kind of I was thinking of myself, 1713 01:43:02,080 --> 01:43:04,600 Speaker 1: there's gotta be more, right, like you know, and I 1714 01:43:04,640 --> 01:43:07,040 Speaker 1: know we shot five times, and so I kept carving 1715 01:43:07,040 --> 01:43:11,879 Speaker 1: away and I actually found another one that was almost 1716 01:43:12,000 --> 01:43:14,880 Speaker 1: like dead center of the back in the vertebrae, and 1717 01:43:14,920 --> 01:43:17,920 Speaker 1: it kind of like got lodged in the vertebrae, and 1718 01:43:17,960 --> 01:43:19,400 Speaker 1: like I don't know if I got tracked, you know, 1719 01:43:19,439 --> 01:43:22,160 Speaker 1: like there's like a hollow area there and kind of 1720 01:43:22,160 --> 01:43:25,640 Speaker 1: got lodged in there. I kind of thing that was 1721 01:43:25,720 --> 01:43:27,400 Speaker 1: the one that clammed it up, you know what I mean, 1722 01:43:27,439 --> 01:43:32,240 Speaker 1: almost paralyzing it the final shot there um. But you know, 1723 01:43:32,320 --> 01:43:36,680 Speaker 1: so so that's really um did you find the last shot? Um? 1724 01:43:36,840 --> 01:43:39,320 Speaker 1: You know it could have been on there um. Sometimes 1725 01:43:39,320 --> 01:43:41,559 Speaker 1: it's hard to see through fat when there's not a 1726 01:43:41,560 --> 01:43:44,160 Speaker 1: lot of trauma and you have just a bullet, you know, 1727 01:43:44,200 --> 01:43:47,240 Speaker 1: a bullet hole. Um, it's just you're you're searching for 1728 01:43:47,479 --> 01:43:50,800 Speaker 1: quite a small target and you know, we're not really 1729 01:43:50,880 --> 01:43:52,880 Speaker 1: caping this thing out. We're not saving a cape or 1730 01:43:52,920 --> 01:43:55,160 Speaker 1: anything like that. So it's not like it's a nice 1731 01:43:55,240 --> 01:43:58,320 Speaker 1: clean you know. And I don't get the impression with 1732 01:43:58,400 --> 01:44:02,759 Speaker 1: the spine shot you were like, oh, here's this massive 1733 01:44:02,880 --> 01:44:07,400 Speaker 1: broken spine on this bear. No, it was clearly so 1734 01:44:07,479 --> 01:44:10,280 Speaker 1: that one we found an entrance hole. And uh, I 1735 01:44:10,280 --> 01:44:11,920 Speaker 1: mean the Game of Fish had a metal detector and 1736 01:44:11,920 --> 01:44:13,960 Speaker 1: we're trying to like find the bullet and carve it 1737 01:44:14,000 --> 01:44:17,200 Speaker 1: out and whatnot. We never found anything, but um, we 1738 01:44:17,200 --> 01:44:18,559 Speaker 1: didn't spend a ton of time on it. We also 1739 01:44:18,600 --> 01:44:20,719 Speaker 1: didn't really have the right tools. They brought a melo detector, 1740 01:44:20,800 --> 01:44:23,000 Speaker 1: they did. You know, me and my six year old 1741 01:44:23,040 --> 01:44:25,360 Speaker 1: just got a melod detector. We're gonna get into that 1742 01:44:25,400 --> 01:44:28,599 Speaker 1: big time. I'll save that for another episode though, sure sure, 1743 01:44:29,479 --> 01:44:35,200 Speaker 1: um and so uh yeah. So those are the four 1744 01:44:35,280 --> 01:44:37,400 Speaker 1: bullet holes that we found. There could have been another 1745 01:44:37,400 --> 01:44:39,320 Speaker 1: one kind of in the back or in a fatty air. 1746 01:44:39,360 --> 01:44:41,320 Speaker 1: You know, these guys taken note of all this stuff. 1747 01:44:42,000 --> 01:44:43,719 Speaker 1: You know, they're taking a lot of pictures and notes 1748 01:44:43,880 --> 01:44:47,519 Speaker 1: and collecting samples and um, doing stuff that's you know 1749 01:44:47,720 --> 01:44:49,800 Speaker 1: that I'm not really paying that much attention to. You 1750 01:44:50,240 --> 01:44:53,679 Speaker 1: gotta still be a little razzled. Is that a word? Razzle? Yeah? 1751 01:44:54,320 --> 01:44:59,040 Speaker 1: The same day, same day, Yeah, same day, long as day. 1752 01:44:59,680 --> 01:45:01,479 Speaker 1: I hapened right away in the morning. I mean it happened. 1753 01:45:02,040 --> 01:45:04,320 Speaker 1: I think it was like some fifteen am rolled out, 1754 01:45:04,479 --> 01:45:06,640 Speaker 1: rolled back in again. I'm a little surprised that they 1755 01:45:06,680 --> 01:45:09,040 Speaker 1: kind of put you back into that situation after going 1756 01:45:09,520 --> 01:45:11,519 Speaker 1: through that, I would say, they didn't put me in 1757 01:45:11,520 --> 01:45:16,040 Speaker 1: that situation, you know, And they weren't. I mean they 1758 01:45:16,080 --> 01:45:18,559 Speaker 1: are certainly actually they I got a lot of respect 1759 01:45:18,600 --> 01:45:20,160 Speaker 1: for the folks that we worked with. I mean they 1760 01:45:20,200 --> 01:45:23,080 Speaker 1: were they were very good about it and very did 1761 01:45:23,120 --> 01:45:25,400 Speaker 1: you professional and did you get a sense of like 1762 01:45:25,520 --> 01:45:29,320 Speaker 1: their attitude like oh no, not again, or like they're like, 1763 01:45:29,920 --> 01:45:31,720 Speaker 1: you know what kind of how they felt about the 1764 01:45:31,720 --> 01:45:37,479 Speaker 1: whole like grizzlies in general and probably not. But you know, 1765 01:45:37,520 --> 01:45:39,599 Speaker 1: I think they were real professional about it. You know, 1766 01:45:40,439 --> 01:45:45,760 Speaker 1: um yeah, nobody likes nobody likes um. You know, they 1767 01:45:46,040 --> 01:45:48,840 Speaker 1: were certainly more excited to investigate a dead bear than 1768 01:45:48,880 --> 01:45:52,960 Speaker 1: a dead human. You know. Their thing is it's got 1769 01:45:52,960 --> 01:45:55,519 Speaker 1: to set the mood when you have an injured person. 1770 01:45:56,720 --> 01:45:59,240 Speaker 1: Were they're not going into it like these guys panic, 1771 01:45:59,400 --> 01:46:01,960 Speaker 1: Sure he shot at forty yards away just because I 1772 01:46:02,040 --> 01:46:05,040 Speaker 1: was looking at Yeah, you got like a wounded dude, 1773 01:46:05,400 --> 01:46:09,280 Speaker 1: so probably you're probably going to not so much with 1774 01:46:09,320 --> 01:46:13,920 Speaker 1: your like, uh you know, inspector mode. Right. Yeah. I 1775 01:46:14,479 --> 01:46:16,720 Speaker 1: was just curious if it's like, oh, the's like if 1776 01:46:16,760 --> 01:46:21,599 Speaker 1: they had yeah at the trail, had did they split 1777 01:46:21,680 --> 01:46:25,519 Speaker 1: you guys up and get each story? Um? I mean 1778 01:46:25,960 --> 01:46:29,000 Speaker 1: it was such a cut and dry story, you know, 1779 01:46:29,080 --> 01:46:30,920 Speaker 1: like like Steve says, you know you've got a guy 1780 01:46:31,360 --> 01:46:34,559 Speaker 1: with with with a bite. You know, obviously you're close 1781 01:46:34,600 --> 01:46:38,000 Speaker 1: if you're getting bit um. I do believe they took 1782 01:46:38,000 --> 01:46:40,080 Speaker 1: a DNA sample of the bite to match it to 1783 01:46:40,080 --> 01:46:48,400 Speaker 1: the bear. Umi, a friend of mine who was a journalist. 1784 01:46:48,439 --> 01:46:50,080 Speaker 1: He was always when he was interviewing people who were 1785 01:46:50,120 --> 01:46:52,920 Speaker 1: involved and stuff like this, he was always, Um. One 1786 01:46:52,960 --> 01:46:55,799 Speaker 1: of the things he would look for is anytime someone 1787 01:46:55,880 --> 01:46:59,240 Speaker 1: said and then I proceeded to he said that that 1788 01:46:59,280 --> 01:47:01,439 Speaker 1: always sort of made like a little alarm and his 1789 01:47:01,479 --> 01:47:03,960 Speaker 1: head go off, like they had thought about what they're 1790 01:47:03,960 --> 01:47:06,240 Speaker 1: gonna say, ahead, it's out, and then I proceed you 1791 01:47:06,240 --> 01:47:07,920 Speaker 1: to do. And you said, you'd be surprised. How often 1792 01:47:07,920 --> 01:47:09,600 Speaker 1: do you hear that when you're hearing a story, that 1793 01:47:09,760 --> 01:47:15,840 Speaker 1: maybe everything doesn't add up right right? Um? So you 1794 01:47:15,840 --> 01:47:18,600 Speaker 1: know that that was, Um, that was kind of the investigation. 1795 01:47:18,640 --> 01:47:21,160 Speaker 1: So as you know, they took recording of what I 1796 01:47:21,680 --> 01:47:24,640 Speaker 1: you know, me going through the motions. Um. You know, 1797 01:47:24,680 --> 01:47:28,240 Speaker 1: the bear was kind of dissected, um, and you know 1798 01:47:28,439 --> 01:47:30,760 Speaker 1: each shot was kind of analyzed. Now, they took a 1799 01:47:30,760 --> 01:47:34,639 Speaker 1: bunch of pictures and documentation and whatnot. I didn't, um, 1800 01:47:34,680 --> 01:47:37,000 Speaker 1: you know, I didn't really know if that was my place, 1801 01:47:37,520 --> 01:47:40,439 Speaker 1: you know, per se did they impound your weapons? They 1802 01:47:40,520 --> 01:47:44,000 Speaker 1: keep your No, they did not, um you know it 1803 01:47:44,520 --> 01:47:47,000 Speaker 1: the day I'm sure impounded your bear hide right. Um. 1804 01:47:47,760 --> 01:47:51,160 Speaker 1: They actually kind of just destroy everything, um, you know, 1805 01:47:51,240 --> 01:47:54,680 Speaker 1: and yeah, I respect that. I mean, you know you're not. 1806 01:47:54,760 --> 01:47:57,400 Speaker 1: Oh they're taking they're taking the hide, so nobody else 1807 01:47:57,439 --> 01:48:01,479 Speaker 1: does you didn't? No, no, Um, you know it's pretty 1808 01:48:01,520 --> 01:48:05,599 Speaker 1: they're they're pretty strict about you know. Um, everything's got 1809 01:48:05,600 --> 01:48:08,640 Speaker 1: to be destroyed or you know, there's no there's no trophies. Right. 1810 01:48:09,439 --> 01:48:11,200 Speaker 1: Let me tell you a quick story. Understand, tell a 1811 01:48:11,240 --> 01:48:14,320 Speaker 1: quick story. In Alaska, they auction all that stuff off. 1812 01:48:15,080 --> 01:48:18,160 Speaker 1: So they have these like personal like bears killed for 1813 01:48:18,320 --> 01:48:23,360 Speaker 1: property defense, like life and property defense. Um, when you 1814 01:48:23,439 --> 01:48:25,040 Speaker 1: kill one, you guess sam at the hide and school 1815 01:48:25,560 --> 01:48:28,479 Speaker 1: and they have an auction. I know about a guy 1816 01:48:28,680 --> 01:48:33,760 Speaker 1: that skinned his like he did. He skinned his like 1817 01:48:33,800 --> 01:48:37,320 Speaker 1: the gutless method and split it up the back. I 1818 01:48:37,320 --> 01:48:41,800 Speaker 1: don't know why. Okay, he went to the auction. They 1819 01:48:41,800 --> 01:48:43,920 Speaker 1: got all these damn bears and there's only one so 1820 01:48:43,920 --> 01:48:45,479 Speaker 1: he can know which one to say skinned up. I 1821 01:48:45,479 --> 01:48:47,120 Speaker 1: don't know if he was gaming it at the time. 1822 01:48:47,160 --> 01:48:49,000 Speaker 1: That's just how he did because they said bring the hide, 1823 01:48:49,680 --> 01:48:51,880 Speaker 1: So whatever reason, he made a slip the back and 1824 01:48:51,920 --> 01:48:54,759 Speaker 1: somebody got to hide off the thing went to the auction. 1825 01:48:55,760 --> 01:48:59,080 Speaker 1: God his bear and he said he knew it because like, 1826 01:48:59,080 --> 01:49:02,640 Speaker 1: who else would do that? That's what I heard. I 1827 01:49:02,680 --> 01:49:04,439 Speaker 1: don't know the guy, but I heard the story. It 1828 01:49:04,479 --> 01:49:05,920 Speaker 1: could be like a live story. I don't think it's 1829 01:49:05,920 --> 01:49:11,960 Speaker 1: a lie story. Yeah, I do recall, um specifically the skull, right. Um. 1830 01:49:12,000 --> 01:49:14,920 Speaker 1: The supervisor there was and they all feel really bad 1831 01:49:14,960 --> 01:49:17,840 Speaker 1: about everything, you know, I mean they're they're super understanding 1832 01:49:17,920 --> 01:49:19,760 Speaker 1: and yeah, and he was kind of like, you know, 1833 01:49:19,800 --> 01:49:22,000 Speaker 1: I hate to tell you this, but I need you 1834 01:49:22,040 --> 01:49:24,599 Speaker 1: to to give me the skull. You know, my hands 1835 01:49:24,600 --> 01:49:26,920 Speaker 1: already dirty, and I'm just curious. Right, So I got 1836 01:49:26,960 --> 01:49:28,439 Speaker 1: it all out and scutted a lot of it out, 1837 01:49:28,479 --> 01:49:30,640 Speaker 1: and so I cut the head off for him and 1838 01:49:30,680 --> 01:49:33,000 Speaker 1: handed it to him. And they destroyed it with like 1839 01:49:33,120 --> 01:49:36,599 Speaker 1: hatchets or hammers or something like that, just to destroy value, 1840 01:49:36,960 --> 01:49:40,160 Speaker 1: just to Yeah, I mean, which, whatever did you end up? 1841 01:49:40,880 --> 01:49:44,040 Speaker 1: I have a problem. I understand all that. Like, sorry, 1842 01:49:44,240 --> 01:49:47,400 Speaker 1: you end up getting an age on the bear? Um. 1843 01:49:47,439 --> 01:49:50,080 Speaker 1: You know there's gonna be an official report on it. Um. 1844 01:49:50,120 --> 01:49:51,640 Speaker 1: You know, I'm not able to get my hands on 1845 01:49:51,680 --> 01:49:54,800 Speaker 1: it for for some time, but I'm I'm thinking that 1846 01:49:54,840 --> 01:49:56,599 Speaker 1: will all be in there, and I'm curious to read 1847 01:49:56,640 --> 01:49:59,599 Speaker 1: it for sure. Yeah. No, they're collecting a lot of data. 1848 01:50:00,280 --> 01:50:06,400 Speaker 1: Did the UM what what wound up being the relationship 1849 01:50:06,520 --> 01:50:08,439 Speaker 1: you have with the end of the guy that was 1850 01:50:08,479 --> 01:50:15,160 Speaker 1: getting his hand mauled up? M Um, like like what 1851 01:50:15,240 --> 01:50:18,880 Speaker 1: kind of happened when you guys had a chance to talk? Um, 1852 01:50:19,240 --> 01:50:23,799 Speaker 1: you know is kind of a sombering, sombering moment for everybody. 1853 01:50:23,800 --> 01:50:27,000 Speaker 1: You know, UM is you know is uh is once 1854 01:50:27,040 --> 01:50:30,000 Speaker 1: in a lifetime experience. UM. You know, I think we hope, 1855 01:50:30,840 --> 01:50:33,680 Speaker 1: we hope. UM, you know, we built a lot of 1856 01:50:33,720 --> 01:50:35,400 Speaker 1: respect for each other, you know, in the way that 1857 01:50:35,439 --> 01:50:40,400 Speaker 1: the situation was handled, and um as he uh was 1858 01:50:40,479 --> 01:50:42,280 Speaker 1: is he pretty rattled about it? Was he pretty strong 1859 01:50:42,320 --> 01:50:44,080 Speaker 1: about it? That he was really strong about it? I mean, 1860 01:50:44,479 --> 01:50:47,800 Speaker 1: Um'm not afraid of the mountains. No, no, no, you've 1861 01:50:47,800 --> 01:50:51,240 Speaker 1: got any different feelings about Grizzly bearer country besides some 1862 01:50:51,520 --> 01:50:54,320 Speaker 1: procedural ship No, UM, you know, I got a lot 1863 01:50:54,320 --> 01:50:58,600 Speaker 1: more respect for the animal, that's for sure. UM. I definitely, 1864 01:51:00,479 --> 01:51:04,920 Speaker 1: UM yeah, I definitely have a lot more respect for 1865 01:51:04,400 --> 01:51:09,439 Speaker 1: forum grizzly bears. And you know, my my mentality of 1866 01:51:10,120 --> 01:51:13,920 Speaker 1: um staying out of those situations and having different equipment 1867 01:51:13,960 --> 01:51:19,519 Speaker 1: and different um locations of equipment will will be will 1868 01:51:19,560 --> 01:51:22,400 Speaker 1: be changed where it was on the outside of my pack. 1869 01:51:22,439 --> 01:51:25,639 Speaker 1: Did you ever think about grabbing it? Um? Hold on 1870 01:51:25,640 --> 01:51:28,720 Speaker 1: like outside of the pack, like unreachable reach on the 1871 01:51:28,720 --> 01:51:31,400 Speaker 1: waist belt like right here? Do you ever think about 1872 01:51:31,400 --> 01:51:38,479 Speaker 1: grabbing it? I didn't. I mean, like in hindsight, UM, 1873 01:51:38,800 --> 01:51:43,160 Speaker 1: I would say at the moment, the thought process was 1874 01:51:43,760 --> 01:51:46,200 Speaker 1: the rifle is the job, you know, I mean it's 1875 01:51:46,240 --> 01:51:48,320 Speaker 1: kind of like, what are you gonna blind everybody here 1876 01:51:48,320 --> 01:51:50,760 Speaker 1: and hope for the best? You know. Um, I didn't 1877 01:51:50,800 --> 01:51:53,960 Speaker 1: spend I didn't do well much time thinking I'm gonna 1878 01:51:53,960 --> 01:51:56,439 Speaker 1: go after my bear spray, you know what I mean? UM, 1879 01:51:56,640 --> 01:52:00,720 Speaker 1: had that been sixty yards out, yeah, reolutely I think 1880 01:52:00,920 --> 01:52:04,160 Speaker 1: I would like to think that. I think my first 1881 01:52:04,280 --> 01:52:07,680 Speaker 1: choice at sixty yards out in that situation would have 1882 01:52:07,720 --> 01:52:09,800 Speaker 1: been bear spray. So no one what you now know? 1883 01:52:10,280 --> 01:52:14,360 Speaker 1: What would be your like, what's your bear protection system 1884 01:52:14,680 --> 01:52:19,599 Speaker 1: the next time you do it? Um? So before that incident, 1885 01:52:19,880 --> 01:52:22,680 Speaker 1: you know, I really I really had this UM this 1886 01:52:23,960 --> 01:52:27,880 Speaker 1: I'll say it false mentality that you know, if you 1887 01:52:28,680 --> 01:52:30,240 Speaker 1: if you shot a bear with let's say like a 1888 01:52:30,280 --> 01:52:32,559 Speaker 1: forty five a CP or something like that, you know, 1889 01:52:32,840 --> 01:52:37,559 Speaker 1: like it would realize that it's, um, it's up against 1890 01:52:37,640 --> 01:52:39,760 Speaker 1: a real match here, and it would probably deter it 1891 01:52:39,760 --> 01:52:42,600 Speaker 1: and leave after shooting it with a three windmag and 1892 01:52:42,640 --> 01:52:49,800 Speaker 1: watching it charge like a a very piste off animal. Um, 1893 01:52:50,439 --> 01:52:54,719 Speaker 1: bigger the better for if you have to shoot um first, 1894 01:52:54,880 --> 01:52:57,160 Speaker 1: First of all, question on that could when you guys 1895 01:52:57,320 --> 01:53:01,759 Speaker 1: did the netcrops see did you got it to see? 1896 01:53:01,800 --> 01:53:05,840 Speaker 1: When you said that the the path of that went, 1897 01:53:05,960 --> 01:53:07,920 Speaker 1: did it cut? Did you catch vitals on that? I 1898 01:53:08,080 --> 01:53:12,160 Speaker 1: personally gutted it. Um. The heart was fine, The lungs 1899 01:53:12,200 --> 01:53:17,479 Speaker 1: looks fine, the liver looks fine. The intestines which the 1900 01:53:17,520 --> 01:53:20,400 Speaker 1: bullets passed through. I never even saw split in that. 1901 01:53:21,840 --> 01:53:24,559 Speaker 1: So you're three hundred wind bagground went above the vitals, 1902 01:53:24,720 --> 01:53:28,120 Speaker 1: above the vitals. Yeah so um, so actually didn't happen. 1903 01:53:28,360 --> 01:53:30,439 Speaker 1: We didn't really put this all together t you know, 1904 01:53:30,439 --> 01:53:33,200 Speaker 1: obviously then the whole thing's done. Right now, we're the 1905 01:53:33,400 --> 01:53:35,759 Speaker 1: we're back in camp and we're talking about how crazy 1906 01:53:36,080 --> 01:53:39,679 Speaker 1: the event was, and you know a couple of takeaways there. 1907 01:53:39,720 --> 01:53:42,680 Speaker 1: You know, we just started talking about, um, you know, 1908 01:53:42,760 --> 01:53:46,599 Speaker 1: the just the odds of the to two sets of odds, 1909 01:53:46,680 --> 01:53:49,160 Speaker 1: right first set, you know the odds of getting in 1910 01:53:49,160 --> 01:53:53,599 Speaker 1: that situation incredibly unlucky to get in that situation right 1911 01:53:54,000 --> 01:53:56,120 Speaker 1: and and you know the only thing I could think 1912 01:53:56,160 --> 01:53:59,760 Speaker 1: of is the bear had winded that carcass and was 1913 01:53:59,800 --> 01:54:02,160 Speaker 1: made be making its way there and then got like 1914 01:54:02,200 --> 01:54:05,960 Speaker 1: a burst of scent, was starving, ready to eat, and 1915 01:54:06,000 --> 01:54:08,719 Speaker 1: just came ready to came over that tailtop, just ready 1916 01:54:08,720 --> 01:54:12,320 Speaker 1: to eat. Um. So it's obviously very unlucky timing. Had 1917 01:54:12,320 --> 01:54:14,280 Speaker 1: we sit up on that knob for ten more minutes, 1918 01:54:14,360 --> 01:54:16,360 Speaker 1: you might see a bit aware of it and was 1919 01:54:16,400 --> 01:54:18,840 Speaker 1: circling it, trying to figure off as a big board 1920 01:54:18,960 --> 01:54:21,920 Speaker 1: there or whatever something. You know. Um, it is hard 1921 01:54:22,000 --> 01:54:25,720 Speaker 1: to Um, you'll never know. You'll never know that. But 1922 01:54:26,200 --> 01:54:31,840 Speaker 1: obviously no stomach contents undigested help meat. Oh um, that's 1923 01:54:31,840 --> 01:54:35,880 Speaker 1: a great point. I did not open the stomach. Um. 1924 01:54:35,920 --> 01:54:38,560 Speaker 1: I don't know if anybody else there did. Did you 1925 01:54:38,600 --> 01:54:40,880 Speaker 1: guys ever take a look at the carcass afterward to 1926 01:54:40,960 --> 01:54:44,360 Speaker 1: see if it had been it hadn't been messed. No, 1927 01:54:45,600 --> 01:54:47,480 Speaker 1: you have like you don't have to, but you gotta 1928 01:54:47,480 --> 01:54:53,800 Speaker 1: be like there has been some relationship. Is the relationship 1929 01:54:53,840 --> 01:54:56,720 Speaker 1: that predators like to travel on ridgelines or they like 1930 01:54:56,880 --> 01:55:01,200 Speaker 1: to travel on nicely defined trails. You know, I would 1931 01:55:01,280 --> 01:55:05,400 Speaker 1: think that the you know that the bear had winded 1932 01:55:05,440 --> 01:55:08,200 Speaker 1: the carcass and had just been working its way that 1933 01:55:08,240 --> 01:55:11,920 Speaker 1: direction thinking, you know, I'm hungry, there's something here, um, 1934 01:55:12,000 --> 01:55:13,720 Speaker 1: and so so I really think that, you know, that's 1935 01:55:13,760 --> 01:55:16,800 Speaker 1: what kind of brought it to the general vicinity. Um. 1936 01:55:16,880 --> 01:55:20,440 Speaker 1: The tracks of the animal for the last hundred yards 1937 01:55:20,840 --> 01:55:24,000 Speaker 1: indicated that it knew we were there and kind of 1938 01:55:24,040 --> 01:55:26,680 Speaker 1: followed us along the back side of that ridge and 1939 01:55:26,760 --> 01:55:29,000 Speaker 1: popped over when we were when it was close and 1940 01:55:29,040 --> 01:55:32,920 Speaker 1: we were close. Yeah, Um, So it wasn't like we 1941 01:55:32,960 --> 01:55:35,840 Speaker 1: stumbled into it and it was it was defensive. You know, 1942 01:55:36,360 --> 01:55:39,640 Speaker 1: it seemed like it was it smelled us and was starving. 1943 01:55:41,000 --> 01:55:44,080 Speaker 1: A bad news organization would say when the hunter becomes 1944 01:55:44,080 --> 01:55:49,600 Speaker 1: the hunt. So going back to going back to what 1945 01:55:49,600 --> 01:55:51,400 Speaker 1: we're kind of talking about it. You know, back at camp, 1946 01:55:51,440 --> 01:55:54,920 Speaker 1: you know, the odds of the situation were incredibly unlucky 1947 01:55:55,200 --> 01:55:56,560 Speaker 1: or low and unlucky. How do you want to look 1948 01:55:56,560 --> 01:55:59,880 Speaker 1: at it? Then, once we were in that situation with 1949 01:56:00,040 --> 01:56:04,440 Speaker 1: the bear coming, you know at ten fifteen yards, I 1950 01:56:04,480 --> 01:56:07,240 Speaker 1: don't know another situation that plays out that ends up 1951 01:56:07,280 --> 01:56:11,480 Speaker 1: better than that. You know, Um, when it bears on 1952 01:56:11,520 --> 01:56:15,320 Speaker 1: top of somebody you know, had had you know, a 1953 01:56:15,440 --> 01:56:17,800 Speaker 1: shot landed a little bit differently, you know, does it. 1954 01:56:18,800 --> 01:56:21,360 Speaker 1: There's just a lot of different Like it's fame could 1955 01:56:21,360 --> 01:56:23,720 Speaker 1: have punctured his brain pan, it could have like just 1956 01:56:24,160 --> 01:56:28,800 Speaker 1: severed its spine with its claw. Right, there's just I 1957 01:56:28,800 --> 01:56:31,080 Speaker 1: mean I look at that and I think if I 1958 01:56:31,120 --> 01:56:33,560 Speaker 1: redid that nine out of ten times, I think nine 1959 01:56:33,640 --> 01:56:37,760 Speaker 1: of them are really bad. You know. Um, your friend 1960 01:56:37,880 --> 01:56:42,480 Speaker 1: uh said that his perspective was that the bear was 1961 01:56:42,560 --> 01:56:46,560 Speaker 1: playing with him. At what point did his perspective change? 1962 01:56:46,640 --> 01:56:49,240 Speaker 1: Did he ever talk about that? Um? I would say 1963 01:56:49,280 --> 01:56:52,080 Speaker 1: after that, I mean once that rifle shot went off, 1964 01:56:52,360 --> 01:56:54,680 Speaker 1: you know, it let up, you know, I mean, so 1965 01:56:54,720 --> 01:56:57,800 Speaker 1: then it kind of its focus changed, um to coming 1966 01:56:58,000 --> 01:57:04,360 Speaker 1: coming towards me. Um, and really, um, you know kind 1967 01:57:04,360 --> 01:57:06,560 Speaker 1: of kind of putting all those pieces together back at 1968 01:57:06,600 --> 01:57:09,120 Speaker 1: camp actually is when we kind of put it all 1969 01:57:09,120 --> 01:57:13,160 Speaker 1: together where um what what what I think happened was, 1970 01:57:13,840 --> 01:57:17,760 Speaker 1: you know, obviously incredible unlucky timing. The bear comes and 1971 01:57:18,000 --> 01:57:21,320 Speaker 1: not really in a hurry, not really threatened, just ready 1972 01:57:21,360 --> 01:57:24,400 Speaker 1: to eat, and so it's kind of taken its time, um, 1973 01:57:24,480 --> 01:57:28,480 Speaker 1: starts doing its job, gets hit in the back, um 1974 01:57:28,520 --> 01:57:31,200 Speaker 1: and kind of you know, the the rifle shot really 1975 01:57:31,240 --> 01:57:34,400 Speaker 1: rendered the front right useless. I mean, it just it 1976 01:57:34,520 --> 01:57:36,720 Speaker 1: detached a lot of those muscles right, just kind of 1977 01:57:37,040 --> 01:57:41,200 Speaker 1: hamburgered this area. And then it it went and turned 1978 01:57:41,200 --> 01:57:45,600 Speaker 1: around and charged full speed to accelerate. You know, if 1979 01:57:45,600 --> 01:57:48,360 Speaker 1: you kind of look at the anatomy of the animal, 1980 01:57:48,400 --> 01:57:50,600 Speaker 1: it's it's gonna use its high and legs to really 1981 01:57:50,720 --> 01:57:54,040 Speaker 1: drive and start start running. And what it seemed to 1982 01:57:54,080 --> 01:57:57,760 Speaker 1: me is it went to lunge there at the last second, 1983 01:57:58,120 --> 01:58:02,400 Speaker 1: and it went to my I left, which would would 1984 01:58:02,400 --> 01:58:06,000 Speaker 1: line up perfectly with its right shoulder failed, so it 1985 01:58:06,080 --> 01:58:09,080 Speaker 1: basically went to push off. And when it went to 1986 01:58:09,120 --> 01:58:13,040 Speaker 1: push off one side, you know, just pushed it that 1987 01:58:13,080 --> 01:58:18,640 Speaker 1: direction and it probably swiped bit I kicked. We collided 1988 01:58:18,680 --> 01:58:22,960 Speaker 1: in some manner, but not really hard at all, And 1989 01:58:23,040 --> 01:58:26,760 Speaker 1: that was the mental change of the bear for it 1990 01:58:26,840 --> 01:58:31,200 Speaker 1: to realize I've lost some motor skills. And then it 1991 01:58:31,280 --> 01:58:33,840 Speaker 1: was heading out and then it was probably trying to 1992 01:58:33,880 --> 01:58:37,600 Speaker 1: get into a safe zone. But you know, at that time, 1993 01:58:37,800 --> 01:58:39,520 Speaker 1: I didn't even know if I hit the bear, you know, 1994 01:58:39,560 --> 01:58:41,720 Speaker 1: I mean I think I did, but I could have 1995 01:58:41,760 --> 01:58:43,400 Speaker 1: shot clean over the top of it. And you know, 1996 01:58:43,480 --> 01:58:45,680 Speaker 1: I have no idea what's exactly going. I don't No 1997 01:58:45,880 --> 01:58:48,000 Speaker 1: one knows, as much as we like to talk about it, 1998 01:58:48,080 --> 01:58:50,320 Speaker 1: no one knows what they would do in that situation. 1999 01:58:50,480 --> 01:58:52,920 Speaker 1: I like to think that I would have done what 2000 01:58:52,960 --> 01:58:57,760 Speaker 1: you did and shot some more. Ye like the point 2001 01:58:57,760 --> 01:58:59,760 Speaker 1: of commitment, unless you're like one of these guys that 2002 01:59:00,080 --> 01:59:02,360 Speaker 1: like it's it mauled me and then it kind of 2003 01:59:02,360 --> 01:59:03,920 Speaker 1: wanted off, and then it came back and alled me 2004 01:59:03,960 --> 01:59:06,920 Speaker 1: some more. You know. Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, 2005 01:59:06,960 --> 01:59:10,560 Speaker 1: it was just really an impulse decision. And looking back, 2006 01:59:10,600 --> 01:59:13,400 Speaker 1: you know, it's kind of like, well, that bear bite somebody. 2007 01:59:14,120 --> 01:59:16,480 Speaker 1: I think they're probably gonna take DNA sample, try and 2008 01:59:16,480 --> 01:59:18,560 Speaker 1: find the bear and probably put the bear down anyway. 2009 01:59:18,920 --> 01:59:20,920 Speaker 1: You know, I know it's been hit because why else 2010 01:59:20,960 --> 01:59:23,400 Speaker 1: would it not have just completely killed me right there? 2011 01:59:23,840 --> 01:59:26,840 Speaker 1: So you already have an injured animal, it's already known 2012 01:59:26,880 --> 01:59:29,760 Speaker 1: to have bite somebody. Let's just finish the job right here. 2013 01:59:29,960 --> 01:59:31,880 Speaker 1: You know, that was and I don't even think I 2014 01:59:31,880 --> 01:59:34,760 Speaker 1: went through that process. I think my process was more 2015 01:59:34,880 --> 01:59:37,680 Speaker 1: like I have no idea how we just came out 2016 01:59:37,680 --> 01:59:40,960 Speaker 1: of that, But I'm not going for around two. Yeah, 2017 01:59:41,240 --> 01:59:47,320 Speaker 1: how's your buddy's hands? Uh? Remarkable? Um, you know, I 2018 01:59:47,320 --> 01:59:50,640 Speaker 1: mean the doctor kind of mentioned, you know, it's infection 2019 01:59:50,720 --> 01:59:53,640 Speaker 1: that really is the problem, you know, um, And so 2020 01:59:54,360 --> 01:59:58,520 Speaker 1: an hour more later that becomes a much different animal. 2021 02:00:01,080 --> 02:00:05,360 Speaker 1: Did you notice this story for another time? But I 2022 02:00:05,400 --> 02:00:10,839 Speaker 1: have a very similar bear circumstance and nothing ever happened 2023 02:00:10,880 --> 02:00:13,280 Speaker 1: with it other than bears ran away. But it was 2024 02:00:13,320 --> 02:00:19,280 Speaker 1: related to a ridgeline. It was related to elk carcass Um. 2025 02:00:19,440 --> 02:00:21,800 Speaker 1: Did you notice One of the things that I noticed 2026 02:00:21,880 --> 02:00:25,600 Speaker 1: being that close to bears was the smell of him. 2027 02:00:25,680 --> 02:00:30,920 Speaker 1: Did you do you have any like recognition of a 2028 02:00:31,080 --> 02:00:34,280 Speaker 1: distinct smell of a bear, because that's something that I 2029 02:00:34,320 --> 02:00:37,400 Speaker 1: took away. I was like, holy cow, this the smell 2030 02:00:37,480 --> 02:00:40,920 Speaker 1: of a bear? Man? Was you know? I didn't um 2031 02:00:41,320 --> 02:00:47,680 Speaker 1: that that does not come to mind. Ums, that's not 2032 02:00:47,760 --> 02:00:50,800 Speaker 1: what you're thinking. Yeah, I wasn't thinking let's go smell 2033 02:00:50,840 --> 02:00:55,560 Speaker 1: the roses here, you know, I mean, um, you know, um, yeah, 2034 02:00:55,720 --> 02:00:58,280 Speaker 1: I would say that I don't recall a smell from 2035 02:00:58,320 --> 02:01:04,400 Speaker 1: that incident. Yeah. Well, man, I'm glad you're alive. Yeah. Yeah, 2036 02:01:04,680 --> 02:01:07,200 Speaker 1: give Matt millarda hug for me, I will. I will 2037 02:01:07,320 --> 02:01:11,160 Speaker 1: tell him, tell him that I'm glad he's alive and 2038 02:01:11,200 --> 02:01:15,680 Speaker 1: your body I'm glad he's doing good for sure? For sure. 2039 02:01:16,240 --> 02:01:19,200 Speaker 1: You know, I got one last question. For sure. It's 2040 02:01:19,200 --> 02:01:25,120 Speaker 1: a hard one to answer. Are you glad it happened? Um? 2041 02:01:25,160 --> 02:01:30,160 Speaker 1: You know that the experience obviously when it's when it's 2042 02:01:30,240 --> 02:01:34,360 Speaker 1: a um, when it's a good story whenever. What I 2043 02:01:34,360 --> 02:01:37,280 Speaker 1: mean by good is when everybody came away. Okay, you know, 2044 02:01:37,360 --> 02:01:41,800 Speaker 1: I mean some injuries for sure, but you know nobody 2045 02:01:42,240 --> 02:01:46,040 Speaker 1: nobody is you know, crippled, nobody, you know, nothing like that. 2046 02:01:46,200 --> 02:01:50,760 Speaker 1: And so I mean, I definitely appreciate the experience. If 2047 02:01:50,800 --> 02:01:55,600 Speaker 1: you told me would would you go into um, what 2048 02:01:55,720 --> 02:02:01,320 Speaker 1: would you go into that situation again? And um, how 2049 02:02:01,440 --> 02:02:04,680 Speaker 1: how do I weard this? Um? The same scenario doesn't 2050 02:02:04,720 --> 02:02:08,400 Speaker 1: necessarily play out, but you get to redo that situation. 2051 02:02:08,960 --> 02:02:11,560 Speaker 1: I would say no, absolutely no, Like I can't tell 2052 02:02:11,560 --> 02:02:14,360 Speaker 1: you what's gonna happen, but a bear will be on somebody. Yeah, 2053 02:02:14,480 --> 02:02:18,440 Speaker 1: I would absolutely not do that again, UM, because I 2054 02:02:18,480 --> 02:02:22,400 Speaker 1: think that the probability is so low of the outcome 2055 02:02:22,440 --> 02:02:25,760 Speaker 1: that we got, UM, that that is that that that 2056 02:02:25,800 --> 02:02:28,800 Speaker 1: wouldn't be worth it for sure, UM, you know being 2057 02:02:28,800 --> 02:02:31,600 Speaker 1: the problem being that you know, the the outcome that 2058 02:02:31,640 --> 02:02:37,600 Speaker 1: we got. UM, I can appreciate the experience for sure. Um. 2059 02:02:37,680 --> 02:02:41,320 Speaker 1: You know, I think one thing that you just never consider, 2060 02:02:42,000 --> 02:02:45,200 Speaker 1: and you know this is every bear story is unique, 2061 02:02:45,280 --> 02:02:47,960 Speaker 1: you know obviously, Um, but you know this one's unique 2062 02:02:47,960 --> 02:02:50,840 Speaker 1: for different reasons. And the one thing that you know 2063 02:02:51,120 --> 02:02:53,360 Speaker 1: you mentioned, everyone thinks, so I'll shoot square in the eye, 2064 02:02:53,400 --> 02:02:55,280 Speaker 1: you know, square in the square between the eyes, you know, 2065 02:02:55,360 --> 02:02:58,400 Speaker 1: And um, you know, the one thing that I never 2066 02:02:58,440 --> 02:03:01,640 Speaker 1: considered was not only am I not going to be 2067 02:03:01,680 --> 02:03:06,280 Speaker 1: able to like get a good shot, but there there'sn't 2068 02:03:06,360 --> 02:03:10,120 Speaker 1: there's instances out there where you can like actually not 2069 02:03:10,440 --> 02:03:12,960 Speaker 1: shoot the vitals, you know what I mean. Like I 2070 02:03:13,000 --> 02:03:15,480 Speaker 1: would have loved to put that bullet and gave that 2071 02:03:15,520 --> 02:03:19,720 Speaker 1: Barrett Texas heart shot and hope for you know, blow 2072 02:03:19,720 --> 02:03:26,640 Speaker 1: out every right. And that's um, you know that that's 2073 02:03:27,280 --> 02:03:33,360 Speaker 1: that really changes the game. Um, just because had you 2074 02:03:33,400 --> 02:03:35,960 Speaker 1: been using a much smaller caliber. For instance, let's say 2075 02:03:35,960 --> 02:03:37,960 Speaker 1: I did have a side arm there, I would have 2076 02:03:38,000 --> 02:03:40,760 Speaker 1: gone for the side arm just out of habit. And 2077 02:03:41,080 --> 02:03:42,960 Speaker 1: that's what you think you should do, and you could 2078 02:03:42,960 --> 02:03:45,800 Speaker 1: probably get more shots off and so on and so forth, 2079 02:03:45,880 --> 02:03:47,880 Speaker 1: but you might be pretty scratched up right now too. 2080 02:03:48,560 --> 02:03:50,160 Speaker 1: I mean, that side arm is not going to take 2081 02:03:50,200 --> 02:03:54,120 Speaker 1: that quarter out. You know, it might it made you 2082 02:03:54,200 --> 02:03:57,760 Speaker 1: something differently, but I don't think that. You know, the 2083 02:03:57,800 --> 02:04:00,960 Speaker 1: side arm is gonna turn Hamburger into a quarter of 2084 02:04:01,000 --> 02:04:03,680 Speaker 1: that bear and render render that part of the very useless. 2085 02:04:04,760 --> 02:04:07,040 Speaker 1: I wish we had these little awards, said, uh the 2086 02:04:07,120 --> 02:04:13,160 Speaker 1: Mediator podcast Nerve of Steel Award. Well, I'd give you one. Well, 2087 02:04:13,200 --> 02:04:15,320 Speaker 1: I I sure don't think you would, because you know 2088 02:04:15,360 --> 02:04:19,000 Speaker 1: all the listeners are gonna hear that video about steel 2089 02:04:19,160 --> 02:04:26,720 Speaker 1: feels like a best possible outcome certificate. Yeah, but you 2090 02:04:26,800 --> 02:04:29,520 Speaker 1: got the best possible outcome in the world of probabilities. 2091 02:04:30,720 --> 02:04:33,440 Speaker 1: That that one. That one I'll take. Um, I got 2092 02:04:33,480 --> 02:04:35,520 Speaker 1: a guy I work with. It always uses the line 2093 02:04:35,520 --> 02:04:38,320 Speaker 1: and rather be lucky than good. That's one of those, 2094 02:04:38,360 --> 02:04:40,040 Speaker 1: for sure. That's how you're feeling right now. That's one 2095 02:04:40,080 --> 02:04:43,560 Speaker 1: of those, for sure. Well, thanks for coming on. Appreciate it. 2096 02:04:43,560 --> 02:04:50,120 Speaker 1: I appreciate it, man, very instructive. It reinforces uh, my 2097 02:04:50,280 --> 02:04:56,680 Speaker 1: primary theory about bear attacks having never uh is uh. Well, 2098 02:04:56,880 --> 02:04:59,440 Speaker 1: I think it's something like I'm quoting Joe Rogan, who 2099 02:04:59,480 --> 02:05:02,160 Speaker 1: is quoting so one else, which is, um, everybody's got 2100 02:05:02,160 --> 02:05:05,280 Speaker 1: a plan until they get punched in the face. That 2101 02:05:06,640 --> 02:05:08,680 Speaker 1: was that Mike Tison I was remember hearing it from him. 2102 02:05:08,680 --> 02:05:10,840 Speaker 1: But yeah, everybody's got planned till they get punched in 2103 02:05:10,840 --> 02:05:15,320 Speaker 1: the face. It's very accurate, alright man, Thanks a lot, 2104 02:05:15,840 --> 02:05:16,400 Speaker 1: Thanks John,