WEBVTT - The Alabama Murders - Part 3: A Peculiar Institution 0:00:15.356 --> 0:00:21.076 Pushkin Hello, hello Malcolm. Here, Before we get to the episode, 0:00:21.476 --> 0:00:23.076 I want to let you know. You can get this 0:00:23.476 --> 0:00:28.636 entire season now ad free by subscribing to Revisionist History 0:00:28.636 --> 0:00:31.356 on Pushkin Plus. Sign up on the show page on 0:00:31.396 --> 0:00:36.676 Apple Podcasts, or at pushkin dot fm, slash Plus. Pushkin 0:00:36.716 --> 0:00:42.636 Plus subscribers can access ad free episodes, full audiobooks, exclusive binges, 0:00:42.956 --> 0:00:45.356 and bonus content for all Pushkin. 0:00:45.036 --> 0:00:53.196 Shows previously on Revisionist History. 0:00:53.996 --> 0:00:55.396 Thirty five years. 0:00:55.956 --> 0:01:01.116 That's how long Elizabethsonnett's family waited for justice to occur. 0:01:02.116 --> 0:01:03.756 He backhanded is child. 0:01:04.356 --> 0:01:05.796 I don't want the child had done. 0:01:05.956 --> 0:01:08.196 You just don't do that to a child across its faith. 0:01:09.196 --> 0:01:14.516 Thirty five long years. And I entered the call, and 0:01:14.556 --> 0:01:18.356 I got all the information on who done it, who 0:01:18.436 --> 0:01:21.236 was all involved in all the particular. 0:01:21.836 --> 0:01:24.676 The viciousness was there that he could do something like that. 0:01:24.716 --> 0:01:25.436 I don't know who. 0:01:34.316 --> 0:01:37.596 When Elizabeth Sennett was murdered, Patterson Hood, one of the 0:01:37.676 --> 0:01:40.316 lead singers of the legendary Southern rock band the Drive 0:01:40.356 --> 0:01:42.476 By Truckers, was living in the shoals. 0:01:43.356 --> 0:01:47.516 Obviously, it was the big front page story for you know, 0:01:48.236 --> 0:01:52.796 weeks because it was such a horrific Grizzly murderer and 0:01:53.116 --> 0:01:56.516 all of the different As more details started coming out 0:01:56.556 --> 0:02:00.596 about it, you know, it just kept getting worse and worse. 0:02:01.116 --> 0:02:03.876 He was twenty four working at a pharmacy in Florence, 0:02:04.236 --> 0:02:05.316 looking for a way out. 0:02:06.196 --> 0:02:10.036 They closed the Ford Plant in nineteen eighty two, which 0:02:10.156 --> 0:02:12.716 was the year I graduated from high school. And when 0:02:12.716 --> 0:02:15.836 it was gone, not only was it gone, but then 0:02:15.916 --> 0:02:20.076 all these other businesses it depended on people who made 0:02:20.116 --> 0:02:23.396 the money working at the Forward Plant. That stuff started going. 0:02:23.556 --> 0:02:27.356 It's really bounced back in the last last fifteen to 0:02:27.436 --> 0:02:31.276 twenty years. The town's almost unrecognizable because of all the 0:02:31.396 --> 0:02:34.276 really positive things that have happened. But in eighty eight 0:02:34.356 --> 0:02:35.716 it was pretty fucking grim. 0:02:36.676 --> 0:02:38.956 Years went by, and the story of what happened to 0:02:38.996 --> 0:02:40.596 Elizabeth Senna stayed with him. 0:02:41.236 --> 0:02:43.036 I don't know why it resonated with me, but I 0:02:43.156 --> 0:02:46.076 first started writing it thinking in terms of writing it 0:02:46.116 --> 0:02:50.036 more as like a short story or a book or 0:02:50.076 --> 0:02:53.396 something like that, and I kind of wrote it in 0:02:53.516 --> 0:02:57.356 that form, and then at some point started and turning 0:02:57.396 --> 0:02:58.156 it into a song. 0:02:58.996 --> 0:03:02.076 The song was called The Fireplace Poker. He released it 0:03:02.276 --> 0:03:04.196 on the album Go Go Boots, which came out in 0:03:04.196 --> 0:03:06.476 twenty eleven, maybe you've heard. 0:03:06.276 --> 0:03:13.196 It before, God. 0:03:17.316 --> 0:03:22.796 And answered, make it. 0:03:24.356 --> 0:03:24.556 Right. 0:03:27.516 --> 0:03:30.876 Pattison Hood got his inspiration from one of the regulars 0:03:30.916 --> 0:03:34.396 in that Florence drug store. A local police officer told 0:03:34.476 --> 0:03:36.956 him back in nineteen eighty eight he was a. 0:03:36.996 --> 0:03:40.196 Chief of police in Florence, and so he was all 0:03:40.276 --> 0:03:44.676 up in any police business anywhere in the area, whether 0:03:44.716 --> 0:03:47.116 it was in his jurisdiction or not. So he would 0:03:47.116 --> 0:03:50.676 come in and just talk about stuff, and it was 0:03:50.796 --> 0:03:56.396 interesting to hear for sure. He hearized really early on 0:03:56.756 --> 0:04:01.556 that it wasn't like it was like it was supposed 0:04:01.556 --> 0:04:02.796 to be looking like it was. 0:04:03.756 --> 0:04:06.956 What everyone first thought was that Elizabeth Sennatt had been 0:04:07.036 --> 0:04:11.276 murdered by two local kids, Smith and John Force Parker. 0:04:11.836 --> 0:04:14.196 They were the ones who drove out to Kondogs Cemetery 0:04:14.276 --> 0:04:17.796 Road on that March morning. It was Parker's knife found 0:04:17.796 --> 0:04:20.876 in a pond behind the house. They confessed. They were 0:04:20.956 --> 0:04:24.236 charged with capital murder. Everything that would happen in the 0:04:24.276 --> 0:04:26.876 Senate case over the course of the next thirty five years, 0:04:27.316 --> 0:04:31.236 the controversies, the outrage, the moral calamity that would ultimately 0:04:31.276 --> 0:04:34.036 take place in home and prison, was based on the 0:04:34.076 --> 0:04:38.396 assumption that the justice system in Alabama had correctly determined 0:04:38.716 --> 0:04:43.356 who was responsible for what happened that morning, namely, Charles 0:04:43.396 --> 0:04:46.556 Sennett was the mastermind who ordered the hit on his wife, 0:04:46.916 --> 0:04:51.036 and Parker and Smith were the killers. But that's not 0:04:51.556 --> 0:04:53.996 what the Florence police chief told Patterson. 0:04:53.996 --> 0:05:09.716 Hood found five was fall from grasp. 0:05:10.436 --> 0:05:11.356 Still she. 0:05:12.876 --> 0:05:20.396 Tried. No one ever know what she told him, No 0:05:20.796 --> 0:05:30.876 way told her the rare and is biden fifteen wax 0:05:31.676 --> 0:05:33.156 fireplace poker. 0:05:35.476 --> 0:05:38.796 The Reverend came home from work and found the missus dying. 0:05:39.436 --> 0:05:42.356 Life was falling from her grasp, But still she lay 0:05:42.396 --> 0:05:46.636 there trying. No one will ever know what she told him, 0:05:47.076 --> 0:05:50.356 or know what he told her, because the Reverend did 0:05:50.356 --> 0:05:57.516 his wife in fifteen whacks fireplace poker. Wait, the Reverend 0:05:57.836 --> 0:05:58.276 did his. 0:05:58.196 --> 0:05:58.636 Wife in. 0:06:03.916 --> 0:06:06.636 My name is Malcolm Gladwell. You're listening to my podcast 0:06:06.676 --> 0:06:11.396 about Things Overlooked and Misunderstood. This episode of the Alabama 0:06:11.476 --> 0:06:14.876 Murders is about the trial of John Forest Parker, one 0:06:14.876 --> 0:06:17.036 of the three young men charged in the killing of 0:06:17.076 --> 0:06:20.676 Elizabeth Sennett, and all of the ways that the catastrophe 0:06:20.676 --> 0:06:23.916 that unfolded in the shoals the failure cascades set in 0:06:23.996 --> 0:06:27.836 motion by the murder could have been averted. The counterfactual 0:06:27.956 --> 0:06:35.276 version of events, the what ifs episode three a peculiar institution. 0:06:51.396 --> 0:06:56.716 I've had, you know, other cases that technically we're probably 0:06:57.316 --> 0:07:03.796 factually more complex, but this is, Yeah, this is the 0:07:03.836 --> 0:07:07.956 one that I will is still on my mind even 0:07:07.996 --> 0:07:08.876 without chilcoming. 0:07:10.116 --> 0:07:14.676 Tom Hefflin was John Forrest Parker's attorney. He remembers exactly 0:07:14.676 --> 0:07:16.956 where he was today Elizabeth Sennett was murdered. 0:07:18.076 --> 0:07:20.956 I had been to Red Bay, Alabama, which is on 0:07:20.956 --> 0:07:25.556 the Mississippi border, down the same highway where this happened. 0:07:25.676 --> 0:07:30.756 I may well have seen John Forrest Parker and Kenny 0:07:30.756 --> 0:07:33.156 Smith in their car. I don't know that for a fact, 0:07:33.156 --> 0:07:36.676 but it might well add Then I got the call 0:07:38.756 --> 0:07:41.236 that the court was going to appoint me and Gene 0:07:41.276 --> 0:07:42.836 Handby to represent. 0:07:43.196 --> 0:07:46.436 Heflin is the son of the former US Senator from Alabama, 0:07:46.676 --> 0:07:50.276 Howell Heflin. In his living room, Heflin has a portrait 0:07:50.316 --> 0:07:52.716 of his famous father, and father and son looked very 0:07:52.756 --> 0:07:56.596 much alike. The Heflins have large leonine heads and the 0:07:56.716 --> 0:08:01.236 kind of rumbling southern gravitas. So you were quart appointed attorneys. 0:08:00.876 --> 0:08:01.996 Quarter pointed attorneys? 0:08:02.076 --> 0:08:02.476 Yeah? 0:08:02.596 --> 0:08:05.116 Yeah, how much of your practice would have been that 0:08:05.236 --> 0:08:06.956 kind of work in those days. 0:08:08.156 --> 0:08:09.516 Zero usual. 0:08:10.476 --> 0:08:13.076 So how did it come about? 0:08:14.716 --> 0:08:17.316 I think we'd had a string of capital murder cases, 0:08:17.596 --> 0:08:21.596 and you know, everybody kind of is expected to serve. 0:08:24.956 --> 0:08:27.596 Parker's trial took place in May of nineteen eighty nine 0:08:27.756 --> 0:08:31.956 at the Cobra County Courthouse, a graceful white neoclassical building 0:08:32.276 --> 0:08:34.476 on the town square in the center of Tuscumbia. 0:08:35.436 --> 0:08:39.036 All right, we're at the Copper County Courthouse. If we 0:08:39.076 --> 0:08:45.676 look across, you see a three story building with a 0:08:45.796 --> 0:08:49.076 razor wire around it in a fence. That's the county jail. 0:08:49.556 --> 0:08:52.076 Heflin gave my colleague Ben Adaf Haffrey a tour of 0:08:52.076 --> 0:08:52.676 the courthouse. 0:08:53.596 --> 0:08:55.076 We don't have full life. 0:08:59.276 --> 0:09:01.876 The courtroom was small, gray and white. On the wall, 0:09:01.916 --> 0:09:03.876 there's a portrait of the judge in the Parker case 0:09:04.316 --> 0:09:07.036 inga Johnson, long blonde hair, blue eyes. 0:09:08.076 --> 0:09:11.476 So where did you guys there? And so the jury 0:09:11.676 --> 0:09:16.236 box that's interesting, it sort of faces the judge food 0:09:16.276 --> 0:09:23.276 boxes there. Witness would be there, Court Clark over there, obviously, 0:09:23.396 --> 0:09:26.596 judge court reporter here, like some of the jurors would 0:09:26.596 --> 0:09:28.836 have had like a direct view of John like from 0:09:28.916 --> 0:09:32.076 feet away. Yeah, he would have been probably, we probably 0:09:32.116 --> 0:09:34.476 would have sat him there. I think we did well 0:09:35.076 --> 0:09:37.796 inside where we blocked him off to a certain extent. 0:09:38.076 --> 0:09:39.756 Why do you want to block him off, Well, he 0:09:39.876 --> 0:09:46.476 is shackled, you know, that's basically I just don't want 0:09:46.516 --> 0:09:51.316 to emphasize that he is a prisoner at that point, 0:09:51.836 --> 0:09:53.076 even everybody knows he is. 0:09:55.076 --> 0:09:59.476 Most criminal trials, particularly older ones, don't have an audio 0:09:59.596 --> 0:10:03.196 or video record. There's just a transcript created by the 0:10:03.196 --> 0:10:06.916 court reporter. The transcripts can run for thousands of pages, 0:10:07.196 --> 0:10:11.316 and they're their own unique literary Because there's no description 0:10:11.996 --> 0:10:16.836 or elaboration or context. They read us flat banal. It 0:10:16.916 --> 0:10:18.796 takes a little bit of time to learn how to 0:10:18.916 --> 0:10:22.236 use your imagination to fill in the empty spaces. And 0:10:22.276 --> 0:10:25.276 in the case of John Parker, what becomes clear when 0:10:25.276 --> 0:10:27.916 you learn how to fill in those empty spaces is 0:10:27.916 --> 0:10:37.596 that the prosecution's case was really, really weak. The state's 0:10:37.596 --> 0:10:40.676 problem started with Parker sitting there in the docket a 0:10:40.716 --> 0:10:43.876 few feet from the jurors. This was a case about 0:10:43.916 --> 0:10:47.356 a murder for hire, a contract killer, and he just 0:10:47.476 --> 0:10:50.796 didn't look the part of a contract killer. Tell us 0:10:50.796 --> 0:10:51.876 about Parker. 0:10:52.076 --> 0:11:01.196 Parker was like eighteen. Actually a good family, solid people. 0:11:01.636 --> 0:11:06.756 He had had some prior childhood trauma that I think 0:11:06.996 --> 0:11:10.756 probably created a little mittal. He had some drug problems. 0:11:11.756 --> 0:11:17.196 Tell me more about your impressions of him. 0:11:17.476 --> 0:11:20.076 A kid who had been drugged out and didn't know 0:11:20.116 --> 0:11:21.116 what they were doing. 0:11:22.356 --> 0:11:25.436 John Forest Parker had been arrested on multiple occasions for 0:11:25.596 --> 0:11:30.316 minor crimes, breaking into cars, stealing gas. It failed ninth 0:11:30.356 --> 0:11:34.076 grade three times. In one of his psychiatric evaluations done 0:11:34.116 --> 0:11:38.476 after one of his previous arrests, there's this quote. John's 0:11:38.556 --> 0:11:42.236 childhood history includes a brain concussion at the age of two. 0:11:43.076 --> 0:11:47.196 He reportedly was unconscious for thirty six hours following his concussion. 0:11:48.316 --> 0:11:51.636 His parents reported that due to his brain concussion, they 0:11:51.636 --> 0:11:59.196 had not expected very much of John. On the drive 0:11:59.236 --> 0:12:02.876 to Coondog Cemetery Road on the morning of Elizabeth sentence murder, 0:12:03.396 --> 0:12:05.876 Parker and Smith had a bottle of whiskey between them 0:12:05.876 --> 0:12:09.396 on the front seat. Parker injected himself with a healthy 0:12:09.476 --> 0:12:12.436 dose of opioids. On the way over, Charles Sennitt gave 0:12:12.476 --> 0:12:14.756 them some money to buy a gun. They used it 0:12:14.796 --> 0:12:18.836 to buy drugs instead. In every description of the crime, 0:12:19.356 --> 0:12:23.996 they come across as completely clueless. Parker is nineteen, Smith 0:12:24.196 --> 0:12:28.396 twenty two. They're so lackadaisical that after beating and stabbing 0:12:28.396 --> 0:12:31.436 Elizabeth Sennet, they threw the knife and the walking stick 0:12:31.516 --> 0:12:34.876 they used into the pond behind her house, when there 0:12:34.916 --> 0:12:38.396 are literally thousands of acres of wooded wilderness on the 0:12:38.476 --> 0:12:41.436 drive back home where something could be thrown away and 0:12:41.476 --> 0:12:46.276 it would never ever be found. Yes, Parker and Smith 0:12:46.836 --> 0:12:50.196 heard Elizabeth Senne badly and took money to commit acts 0:12:50.196 --> 0:12:53.316 of violence. But when we hear the phrase contract killers, 0:12:53.556 --> 0:12:58.556 we think of assassins, mafia hitman Stone called hard bitten lethal, 0:12:59.396 --> 0:13:05.796 These were screwed up kids. One of the biggest points 0:13:05.796 --> 0:13:09.316 of weakness for the prosecution emerged d in the testimony 0:13:09.396 --> 0:13:11.476 of the surgeon who was on duty at Helen Keller 0:13:11.516 --> 0:13:15.396 Hospital when Elizabeth Senate was brought into the er, David 0:13:15.476 --> 0:13:18.716 Parkes McKinley. He was the one who first saw her injuries, 0:13:19.076 --> 0:13:21.556 who tried to save her life, who pronounced her dead. 0:13:22.196 --> 0:13:25.396 The direct examination by the prosecutor is brief and to 0:13:25.436 --> 0:13:29.076 the point. The police had found a knife, a hunting knife, 0:13:29.276 --> 0:13:32.076 in the pond behind the Senate house. This was a 0:13:32.156 --> 0:13:34.956 knife that both Smith and Parker admitted to bringing with 0:13:35.076 --> 0:13:39.516 them to Koondok Cemetery Road. The prosecution just wanted to 0:13:39.676 --> 0:13:47.796 establish the connection between that knife and Elizabeth Sennett's death. Question, doctor, 0:13:48.156 --> 0:13:50.876 can you tell us what you recall about her physical appearance? 0:13:51.796 --> 0:13:52.156 Answer? 0:13:52.716 --> 0:13:56.516 The most striking thing was a multiple stab wounds, particularly 0:13:56.556 --> 0:13:58.996 over the right side of the chest and at the 0:13:59.036 --> 0:14:02.356 base of the neck. There were also some wounds of 0:14:02.436 --> 0:14:06.676 the forehead and scalp. McKinney testified that the cuts on 0:14:06.716 --> 0:14:09.236 the forehead and scalp looked like they were from a 0:14:09.236 --> 0:14:13.076 blunt object. The wounds to the chest and neck were 0:14:13.116 --> 0:14:16.036 caused by a knife. He went on to say, it 0:14:16.156 --> 0:14:18.356 is likely that the chest wounds were by and large 0:14:18.436 --> 0:14:23.476 the cause of her death. Prosecutor thank you doctor. That's 0:14:23.516 --> 0:14:29.476 all halflin knew the prosecution was calling McKinley, so he 0:14:29.516 --> 0:14:31.076 did a little homework beforehand. 0:14:31.796 --> 0:14:37.516 We're starting trial on the Tuesday following Memorial Day. I 0:14:37.596 --> 0:14:44.796 know they're calling state medical examiner was coming up testify 0:14:44.916 --> 0:14:48.596 what the fate wounds were describing. Then they were bringing 0:14:48.876 --> 0:14:52.436 the doctor who treated her in the emergency room there, 0:14:53.276 --> 0:14:56.596 and I called up the doctor and said, what are 0:14:56.636 --> 0:15:00.316 you going to say tomorrow? And we talked about and 0:15:00.396 --> 0:15:01.636 visited kind knew each other. 0:15:03.396 --> 0:15:06.076 What the doctor told him made Heflin realize he could 0:15:06.156 --> 0:15:09.436 lay a trap. So in court, Hefflin gets up and 0:15:09.436 --> 0:15:15.356 a cross examination asks McKinley about the knife. Question, have 0:15:15.476 --> 0:15:17.556 you ever been shown the knife that the state removed 0:15:17.556 --> 0:15:20.956 from the pond in this case? Answer? I have not 0:15:21.076 --> 0:15:25.356 seen it, no, sir. Heflin turns to the prosecutors. Do 0:15:25.436 --> 0:15:28.476 y'all have the knife? This is one of those moments 0:15:28.556 --> 0:15:31.396 when the transcript is of little help. You have to 0:15:31.436 --> 0:15:35.516 fill in the empty space. The prosecutors are anxious. They 0:15:35.556 --> 0:15:38.516 thought the identity of the murder weapon was a settled fact, 0:15:39.236 --> 0:15:42.916 So why does Hefflin want McKinley to see it? They hesitate. 0:15:43.476 --> 0:15:47.316 The judge immediately intervenes, Can I see y'all at the bench. 0:15:48.076 --> 0:15:51.076 Both sides huddle with the judge. The judge says to Hefflin, 0:15:51.316 --> 0:15:54.436 do you just want to show him the knife? Hefflin says, 0:15:54.516 --> 0:15:58.196 uh huh. The judge turns to the prosecutor, why don't 0:15:58.196 --> 0:16:02.356 you get it? More hesitation from the prosecutors. The judge 0:16:02.356 --> 0:16:06.676 repeats herself, y'all go get it. The prosecutor's rummage in 0:16:06.716 --> 0:16:10.076 their evidence box, take it out. Heflin hands it to 0:16:10.116 --> 0:16:13.076 the doctor. I asked Heflin to read aloud from the 0:16:13.076 --> 0:16:17.036 trial transcripts from the crucial moment of his exchange with McKinley. 0:16:17.436 --> 0:16:22.116 You saw the wounds inflicted on miss fresh when she 0:16:22.276 --> 0:16:26.076 came in host, didn't you, Yes, sir as said examining 0:16:26.116 --> 0:16:28.636 that knife, do you have any opinion whether or not 0:16:28.996 --> 0:16:32.156 that was the instrument that could have inflicted those wounds? 0:16:32.756 --> 0:16:35.236 And McKinley answers, simply. 0:16:35.196 --> 0:16:38.396 I would frankly be surprised this was the knife based 0:16:38.396 --> 0:16:41.436 on what I saw, or the sharp project based on 0:16:41.556 --> 0:16:45.996 what I saw on the patient. I don't have any 0:16:45.996 --> 0:16:46.796 further questions. 0:16:49.236 --> 0:16:53.596 The government's own witness testifies that the alleged murder weapon 0:16:54.236 --> 0:16:57.236 isn't actually the murder weapon. The chest wounds are of 0:16:57.276 --> 0:17:01.636 a much smaller knife, Yes, that was. The neck wounds 0:17:02.396 --> 0:17:05.956 are consistent with the large knife that Kenny and John have. 0:17:06.436 --> 0:17:08.836 The chest wounds, which are the fatal wounds, seem to 0:17:08.836 --> 0:17:10.956 be made by a smaller knife, and we can't find 0:17:10.956 --> 0:17:15.116 the smaller knife. That's right from there, you would think 0:17:15.756 --> 0:17:20.236 the reasonable doubts grow were Kenny Smith and John Parker 0:17:20.836 --> 0:17:24.516 actually the ones who stabbed Elizabeth Sennate to death. The 0:17:24.596 --> 0:17:28.596 pathologist who conducted the autopsy on Elizabeth Sennett's body testifies 0:17:29.316 --> 0:17:34.396 she described sentence chess wounds as rapidly fatal. When asked 0:17:34.396 --> 0:17:38.356 about this by prosecutors, she said bluntly, I don't think 0:17:38.396 --> 0:17:42.516 she lived very long after those wounds were inflicted. Once again, 0:17:43.356 --> 0:17:47.396 one of the government's own witnesses undermines their case. Think 0:17:47.476 --> 0:17:51.356 about the timing. At eleven forty four in the morning, 0:17:51.836 --> 0:17:55.596 Charles Sennett calls Ronnie May in hysterics to report that 0:17:55.636 --> 0:17:59.316 his wife has been attacked. At twelve fifteen, the paramedics 0:17:59.316 --> 0:18:02.596 discover that Elizabeth Senate has a pulse. At one pm, 0:18:02.836 --> 0:18:07.076 she arrives at Helen Keller Hospital and she's still alive. McKinley, 0:18:07.076 --> 0:18:10.436 in fact, doesn't pronounce her as dead until two five, 0:18:11.036 --> 0:18:15.156 a full hour later. But according to the prosecution's own 0:18:15.196 --> 0:18:18.596 witness John Parker and Kenny Smith were back home in 0:18:18.716 --> 0:18:21.956 Florence by eleven thirty that morning. It's a thirty to 0:18:21.996 --> 0:18:25.796 forty minute drive from Coondog Cemetery Road to Florence and 0:18:25.876 --> 0:18:30.116 it's pouring rain outside. Timing doesn't work. They must have 0:18:30.196 --> 0:18:32.756 left the Senate's house by at least eleven. There's no 0:18:32.836 --> 0:18:36.596 way Parker and Smith could have inflicted rapidly fatal wounds 0:18:36.636 --> 0:18:38.996 at mid morning if she was still alive at two 0:18:39.036 --> 0:18:43.356 o'clock in the afternoon, meaning Smith and Parker must have 0:18:43.436 --> 0:18:46.316 been long gone by the time the fatal wounds were inflicted. 0:18:50.036 --> 0:18:52.956 Later in the trial, another pathologist who had examined the 0:18:52.956 --> 0:18:58.356 Senate autopsy made the same point. Here is heflin questioning him? 0:18:58.836 --> 0:19:02.076 Question if the evidence in this case shows that the 0:19:02.156 --> 0:19:06.076 Cherokee Rescue squad detected a heartbeat on Missus Senate at 0:19:06.116 --> 0:19:10.356 approximately twelve to fifteen pm on March eighteen, nineteen eighty eight, 0:19:10.836 --> 0:19:14.076 Based upon your years of experience as a pathologist and 0:19:14.156 --> 0:19:17.156 your review of the exhibits that you just named, do 0:19:17.236 --> 0:19:19.796 you have an opinion as to what time prior to 0:19:19.836 --> 0:19:25.036 twelve fifteen pm the fatal wounds were delivered? Answer within 0:19:25.076 --> 0:19:30.916 a very few minutes. The judge, the jury, the lawyers 0:19:30.916 --> 0:19:34.436 on both sides, the journalists covering the trial are all 0:19:34.476 --> 0:19:39.956 listening to this testimony with its unmistakable implication someone else 0:19:40.236 --> 0:19:42.796 must have stabbed Elizabeth Sennett in the chest with a 0:19:42.836 --> 0:19:45.916 smaller knife, and who was the only person at the 0:19:45.916 --> 0:19:47.516 house at the time of the nine one one call 0:19:48.556 --> 0:19:52.316 Charles Sennet. If Senate does it, the timing makes a 0:19:52.356 --> 0:19:55.396 lot more sense. He shows up after they've left, Stabs 0:19:55.476 --> 0:19:58.436 calls Stabs and calls. 0:19:58.116 --> 0:20:07.716 Yeah, or even had called and then yeah. 0:20:05.396 --> 0:20:09.116 A knife that doesn't fit, a timeline that makes no sense. 0:20:10.036 --> 0:20:12.476 And if the jury still had any lingering doubts about 0:20:12.556 --> 0:20:14.036 Charles Sennett's culpability. 0:20:14.396 --> 0:20:15.396 There was also what they. 0:20:15.396 --> 0:20:18.716 Heard from Elizabeth Sennett's friend who had a front row 0:20:18.796 --> 0:20:23.116 seat to the inner life of her marriage. That's after 0:20:23.156 --> 0:20:40.276 the break. Susan Moseley was a nurse at a weight 0:20:40.316 --> 0:20:44.156 loss clinic in Muscle Shoals. Elizabeth Senate was one of 0:20:44.156 --> 0:20:45.276 her patients. 0:20:45.796 --> 0:20:56.276 And I noticed she was extremely why introbility, no self staying. 0:20:57.916 --> 0:20:59.236 What was a brilliant. 0:20:59.796 --> 0:21:03.756 Moseley sat down with a local reporter named Lee Hedgebeth, 0:21:03.996 --> 0:21:06.236 who has written about the Senate case and did some 0:21:06.316 --> 0:21:09.516 interviews for us. She shared with him what she remembered 0:21:09.516 --> 0:21:12.116 about Elizabeth in the months leading up to the murder. 0:21:12.956 --> 0:21:16.756 So she would come once a we to the Planic 0:21:17.316 --> 0:21:19.676 and I would boil her. I would weigh her to 0:21:19.716 --> 0:21:22.916 her blood pressure, talk to her about okay, how's your 0:21:22.956 --> 0:21:23.316 wait doing. 0:21:23.916 --> 0:21:27.156 Mosey said that. Elizabeth said it didn't seem happy. She 0:21:27.196 --> 0:21:29.996 would sit in the waiting room with a napkin crushed 0:21:29.996 --> 0:21:36.356 in her fist. One day, Mosey decided to confront her. 0:21:37.756 --> 0:21:42.796 And I said, Liz, and listen to him. You've been 0:21:42.876 --> 0:21:46.236 going up and down and wait. So I'm going to 0:21:46.636 --> 0:21:51.076 close this chart and I'm just gonna turn it down. 0:21:51.156 --> 0:21:54.476 Lunch shut miles, puggade bread and how about you he 0:21:54.596 --> 0:22:00.076 close your eyes and just tell me what you think. 0:22:01.556 --> 0:22:05.116 It's the biggest problem. If you eat coctato, ships will 0:22:05.116 --> 0:22:07.796 holly we every night we'll get baked one. So we 0:22:07.836 --> 0:22:10.396 will do something to just let me know. And I 0:22:10.796 --> 0:22:12.556 never need no bus. And I had the chair Russell 0:22:13.516 --> 0:22:18.316 and I still every shovel and she said I need 0:22:18.316 --> 0:22:18.636 a dope. 0:22:20.156 --> 0:22:23.316 Open your eyes, she said, turn around here, and I'll 0:22:23.316 --> 0:22:25.596 never forget. I've turned to my lap if the lamb 0:22:26.476 --> 0:22:29.356 walked this, and she was standing there, and I'm gonna 0:22:29.356 --> 0:22:33.316 tell you before we go any puddle, I'm gonna shit. 0:22:33.396 --> 0:22:40.156 I've gone to Barls p whaty bells pub about an inch. 0:22:42.636 --> 0:22:43.116 Bute book. 0:22:46.596 --> 0:22:48.356 Well, sure sleep would come. 0:22:51.556 --> 0:22:53.116 All in the chest. 0:22:54.796 --> 0:23:01.036 Pap he thought her butts and legs to a certain 0:23:01.076 --> 0:23:02.476 area where a skirt would. 0:23:02.196 --> 0:23:05.396 Come the black. 0:23:06.676 --> 0:23:10.356 Black the Senate was covered and bruises. 0:23:11.996 --> 0:23:13.756 I got up and have this whole boy. I didn't 0:23:13.756 --> 0:23:17.516 ask no questions. I didn't ask anything. I had to 0:23:17.556 --> 0:23:20.036 butt a little thing back up and now one like that. 0:23:20.236 --> 0:23:26.236 She said, down, you won't talk about this, and she 0:23:26.356 --> 0:23:31.476 began to kill me. This story about her relationship. 0:23:32.956 --> 0:23:40.036 With mister sid. She began to kill me, but she 0:23:40.756 --> 0:23:44.196 was didn't know how, but that he was going. 0:23:44.036 --> 0:23:47.756 To kill her, and that she knew this, and she 0:23:47.916 --> 0:23:58.636 had saved them her money for the bulls, and when 0:23:58.716 --> 0:24:00.796 we were able to attorney, she was going to do this. 0:24:00.836 --> 0:24:05.476 One charge her four hundred dollars. She said, I worried 0:24:05.476 --> 0:24:08.756 about this and worried about this. Once I'll do there, 0:24:17.796 --> 0:24:25.756 she said, I know, I don't think they've all ever 0:24:25.836 --> 0:24:27.716 be three with me with before who kills me. 0:24:32.236 --> 0:24:34.876 She didn't know how, but he was going to kill her, 0:24:35.596 --> 0:24:39.156 and she didn't think she could break free. Mosey said 0:24:39.196 --> 0:24:41.476 she tried to help Elizabeth to find a way to 0:24:41.556 --> 0:24:45.356 leave Charles, leave the marriage. She told Elizabeth, you can 0:24:45.356 --> 0:24:47.676 come and live with me if you want. She tried 0:24:47.716 --> 0:24:50.996 to help her find the words to communicate to her husband. 0:24:51.516 --> 0:24:52.236 It had to end. 0:24:54.116 --> 0:24:57.196 We would say turn Alan literally right off the wood 0:24:57.236 --> 0:25:02.476 thing and say okay, now say say this Charles, we 0:25:02.556 --> 0:25:06.716 need to talk. I cannot continue to be alone with 0:25:06.756 --> 0:25:10.676 all these Ltons. And they go to children lady and 0:25:10.756 --> 0:25:15.556 taught a pego fathers where long's lay shirt a degree there. 0:25:16.276 --> 0:25:19.076 Somebody is going to dig this out. 0:25:19.876 --> 0:25:25.076 Is Mosley gave a deposition to investigators, and her testimony 0:25:25.156 --> 0:25:28.396 was recounted to the jury by Ronnie May from the 0:25:28.436 --> 0:25:32.316 Colbert County Sheriff's office in the flat, effectless tone of 0:25:32.396 --> 0:25:35.756 official speak. But even then, it's impossible to miss the 0:25:35.796 --> 0:25:40.356 power of what she saw. Listen, this is what May said. 0:25:42.196 --> 0:25:44.676 Missus Moseley said that she had been told by Missus 0:25:44.676 --> 0:25:48.436 Senatet that around Christmas of that year, Charles's family came 0:25:48.476 --> 0:25:51.596 to visit and they had come up from Florida. Missus 0:25:51.596 --> 0:25:54.596 Sennett stated that some of the family went hunting. She 0:25:54.716 --> 0:25:58.556 stated that Charles became extremely upset over some conversation between 0:25:58.796 --> 0:26:02.076 he and members of the family, and Missus Sennett stated 0:26:02.076 --> 0:26:05.316 that during that outburst of Christmas with his family members, 0:26:05.916 --> 0:26:08.916 he laid down on the floor and screamed and cried 0:26:09.356 --> 0:26:13.596 and seemed to be paralyzed at different times. Missus Sennett 0:26:13.676 --> 0:26:16.116 stated that this went on for some time at the house, 0:26:16.596 --> 0:26:20.276 and as a result, Charles's family left and returned to Florida. 0:26:20.836 --> 0:26:24.156 Missus Moseley stated that Missus Senate told her during this 0:26:24.276 --> 0:26:27.476 argument that Charles at one point had pulled and waved 0:26:27.476 --> 0:26:34.316 a gun in the direction of his father. On one 0:26:34.356 --> 0:26:36.476 of my visits to the Shoals, I sat in Tom 0:26:36.476 --> 0:26:39.156 Hefflin's living room and tried to make sense of all 0:26:39.156 --> 0:26:42.116 the things that Jerry learned about Charles Sennet, who had 0:26:42.116 --> 0:26:44.796 taken his own life so quickly after his wife's murder. 0:26:45.676 --> 0:26:51.236 I mean, of all of these three potential murderers, Parker 0:26:51.956 --> 0:26:55.236 Smith and Senate Senate is the only one with a 0:26:55.276 --> 0:27:02.036 documented history of violent, highly aggressive behavior. He's the one 0:27:02.076 --> 0:27:04.516 who beat his wife. To me, this is all about 0:27:04.596 --> 0:27:06.556 Charles Sennett, the whole thing. He sets the whole thing 0:27:06.596 --> 0:27:13.356 in motion. He's the charismatic, persuasive adult. He's a predator. 0:27:13.516 --> 0:27:15.276