1 00:00:00,520 --> 00:00:03,320 Speaker 1: Why from our nations this budget thing is going to 2 00:00:03,400 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: do nothing space forts. I still think it's interesting President 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: Trump not playing his cards yet headlines Policy and Politics 4 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: Coliding sound on with Kevin's relate, the insiders, the influencers, 5 00:00:14,760 --> 00:00:17,600 Speaker 1: the insiders. I would rather see a congressional solution. It's 6 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,560 Speaker 1: part of my DNA. The Senate map in looks a 7 00:00:20,600 --> 00:00:22,919 Speaker 1: lot different than it looked in. You really have a 8 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,200 Speaker 1: divide within Team Trump. The president has to do exactly 9 00:00:26,239 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 1: what people send him here to do, which is to 10 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: get it done. He's sound on with Kevin's your relate 11 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:35,680 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg one and one seven f M h D 12 00:00:35,760 --> 00:00:40,040 Speaker 1: two Boltimore rough day for Stephen Moore. He's out at 13 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: the Fed Board nominee, President Trump saying he will not 14 00:00:43,880 --> 00:00:48,879 Speaker 1: nominate Stephen Moore to the Fed Board. This after a 15 00:00:49,000 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 1: dizzying day for the conservative economist. He part of that 16 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:57,160 Speaker 1: day spent here inside of the Bloomberg News Washington d 17 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: C Bureau. We'll go through the TikTok all out for 18 00:01:01,400 --> 00:01:05,120 Speaker 1: Steven Moore. Meanwhile, Attorney General William bar quote unquote lie 19 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: to Congress and President Donald Trump is obstructing justice by 20 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:13,120 Speaker 1: refusing to honor subpoenas from House Democrats. And this is 21 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:18,320 Speaker 1: according to House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. She's digging invokes and 22 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: she has a lot to say this week about the 23 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:27,320 Speaker 1: fallout from a g Bars testimony, but doesn't matter. Does 24 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:31,200 Speaker 1: it matter because Republicans disagree all of that, plus the 25 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:35,800 Speaker 1: continuing situation that we are carefully monitoring in Venezuela, and 26 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: we zip around the world to Iran, particularly with the 27 00:01:39,440 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: regard regarding those oil waivers, and all Star panel to 28 00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: help walk us through the politics, the policy, the fallout. 29 00:01:47,800 --> 00:01:52,520 Speaker 1: Hagar Camali, CEO of Greenwich Media Strategies and former former 30 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:57,920 Speaker 1: Treasury spokesperson for Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. She's also the 31 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 1: former spokesperson for the US Mission into the u N 32 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 1: and Ambassador Samantha Power. She's with us for the hour, 33 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 1: a good friend of the program, and she had a 34 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:09,720 Speaker 1: petty piece, another good friend of the show of myself. 35 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: She's Bloomberger News White House reporter, and we'll hear exclusively 36 00:02:14,400 --> 00:02:18,359 Speaker 1: from Mark short he is Vice President Mike Pence's chief 37 00:02:18,480 --> 00:02:20,800 Speaker 1: of staff before we get to all of that, though, 38 00:02:21,520 --> 00:02:24,640 Speaker 1: what a day. Shannon Petty pieces Bloomberg News, a White 39 00:02:24,639 --> 00:02:27,480 Speaker 1: House reporter and we were just talking about how up 40 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: in the House of Representatives today, Attorney General William Barr 41 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:35,800 Speaker 1: was supposed to testify before the House Judiciary Committee, and 42 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:37,880 Speaker 1: he said he wasn't going to do it because of 43 00:02:37,919 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: the back and forth of the House members, controlled by 44 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:45,040 Speaker 1: Democrat Chairman Jerry Nabler, a Democrat from New York. They 45 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:48,480 Speaker 1: wanted to allow counsel to testify him, so other folks 46 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:51,080 Speaker 1: beyond just the members of the Judiciary Committee, and the 47 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:53,160 Speaker 1: Attorney General said no, I'm not going to do that. 48 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 1: So regardless of where you fall on that issue. The theater, 49 00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 1: I always say this on this program, the theater of 50 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:04,160 Speaker 1: these House hearings. Sometimes it's good theaters. Sometimes it's bad theater. 51 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:08,080 Speaker 1: Sometimes it makes you hungry, because Shannon, there was this photo. 52 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:12,079 Speaker 1: There was this photo that happened of who was it, 53 00:03:12,520 --> 00:03:17,320 Speaker 1: the Democratic congressman with a box of KFC chicken, and 54 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 1: I guess it was like a play on words, calling 55 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:24,839 Speaker 1: him chicken bar. Yes, the House doesn't disappoint. I mean, 56 00:03:24,919 --> 00:03:28,160 Speaker 1: you know, yesterday there was the Senate. You know, it 57 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: was contentious, but it was, you know, a congressional hearing 58 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:34,600 Speaker 1: um and yet the House again didn't disappoint. Today they 59 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,920 Speaker 1: were in session. The Committy, the Judiciary Committee was there 60 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:40,280 Speaker 1: for about thirty minutes. They had an empty chair with 61 00:03:40,320 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: a nameplate for Bar, even though they knew he wasn't 62 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 1: showing up. And yet one of the members, uh said, 63 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 1: referred to Bars Chicken Bar and brought a bucket of 64 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:53,560 Speaker 1: Kentucky Fried chicken that he ate during the hearing to 65 00:03:53,600 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: symbolize that Bar was a chicken for not showing up. 66 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:01,560 Speaker 1: Representative Steve Cohen, a Tennessee demick crat he he said 67 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:06,680 Speaker 1: he brought in the KFC uh chicken quote unquote, this 68 00:04:06,680 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 1: is what he told reporters. Chicken Bar should have shown 69 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 1: up today and answered questions. End quote. We're gonna have 70 00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 1: much more on the escalating situation. I'm not even trying 71 00:04:15,400 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 1: to be funny. I mean literally, a congressman brought KFC 72 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 1: chicken the Capitol Hill today. Can't make it up, folks. 73 00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 1: But we'll talk about what House Speaker Nancy Pelosi has 74 00:04:24,279 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 1: to say about all of this situation. I want to 75 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 1: stick with policy. Shannon's with me. Hagar Kamali is also here. 76 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:33,680 Speaker 1: She is with us in studio, CEO of Greenwich Media Strategy. 77 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:38,839 Speaker 1: She's a former Treasury spokesperson for Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. 78 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 1: She's the former spokesperson for the US Mission to the 79 00:04:42,200 --> 00:04:45,040 Speaker 1: U N and too. Ambassador Samantha Power. The willed to 80 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: have you here in studio today on Thanks Kevin. A 81 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:53,039 Speaker 1: busy day with Iran with Venezuela, and we'll we'll talk 82 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:56,000 Speaker 1: about that coming up, but but let's start with Steven Moore, 83 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: the Conservative Economy two was embattled as a potential nominee. 84 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 1: I guess he was never technically formally nominated, but he 85 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: was who the President wanted to nominate to the Fedboard. 86 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:14,000 Speaker 1: So he comes into Bloomberg today, comes into the Bloomberg 87 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 1: News Bureau, the Washington d C Bureau and the UH 88 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 1: and the Cabinet room we call it here, comes down 89 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:23,480 Speaker 1: for an editorial board meeting. I'm sitting in there with 90 00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 1: my with my esteemed colleagues, the best in the business, 91 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:30,280 Speaker 1: especially the FED reporters, and he is questioned by question 92 00:05:30,400 --> 00:05:33,919 Speaker 1: and I'm and I'm watching him answer these questions. And 93 00:05:35,160 --> 00:05:37,440 Speaker 1: he almost had me convinced that he was going to 94 00:05:37,480 --> 00:05:40,400 Speaker 1: be able to convince some of these Republicans who have 95 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: been on the record as saying that they were not 96 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:48,920 Speaker 1: going to vote for him. He the way he described it, Shannon, 97 00:05:49,080 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: was he he believed that this would happen. And and 98 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:58,880 Speaker 1: obviously as the morning turned into the afternoon, it became 99 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: very apparent the President Trump withdrew his support for this 100 00:06:04,600 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 1: conservative firebrand. Is what I'm going to use it. I 101 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: think it's an accurate depiction. Yeah, I mean, he was 102 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,120 Speaker 1: all in this morning, as you said, nine am, ten am. 103 00:06:14,160 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 1: He was confident he was gonna get confirmed. He was 104 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,880 Speaker 1: all in. We had him on um Bloomberg TV. Uh. 105 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:24,480 Speaker 1: And then the President's tweet came around twelve thirty saying 106 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 1: that Moore was pulling his nomination for the FED board. 107 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 1: And you know, it made me think that before this 108 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 1: is all done, someone will be fired by tweet while 109 00:06:34,480 --> 00:06:37,760 Speaker 1: they are live on TV. We got very close there today. 110 00:06:37,760 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 1: But yeah, that ends the more saga. And remember, uh, 111 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:44,120 Speaker 1: there was Herman Kane just right just a few weeks ago. 112 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 1: There was all these questions about whether Herman Kane was 113 00:06:46,400 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: gonna get on the FED boards. So now they have 114 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 1: two FED boards seats open. We've been hearing some names. 115 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 1: There doesn't seem to be a huge consensus, uh at 116 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 1: this point. So it's really kind of a mystery. I mean, 117 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 1: if you were down, if you were at Herman Kane 118 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:03,239 Speaker 1: and Stephen Moore too. I think unorthodox candidates who had 119 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:07,520 Speaker 1: backgrounds that could have presented trouble in the Senate. Who 120 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 1: do you then go to next? If those were your 121 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 1: previous two choices. And if you're in your car on 122 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 1: your way home from work, and drive safe because the 123 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 1: roads are slick and it is this weather has been 124 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:21,120 Speaker 1: bizarre here Washington, thunderstorming nice, It's like I can't even 125 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 1: keep up with it. But I just couldn't help when 126 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 1: I was sitting in that edboard. And then when I 127 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:29,920 Speaker 1: watched Tom Keep brilliantly questioned Stephen Moore on Bloomberg Television, 128 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 1: just just how when you cover the Central Bank, it's it's, 129 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:37,920 Speaker 1: for lack of a better word, supposed to be boring. 130 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: It's it's supposed to be independent, it's supposed to be 131 00:07:41,760 --> 00:07:47,920 Speaker 1: nonpartisan institution. And to watch this Trumpian candidate come in 132 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,120 Speaker 1: and really shake things up, and look, there are folks 133 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: who think that is brilliant, and there are folks who 134 00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:57,080 Speaker 1: are concerned. But I want to play for what for 135 00:07:57,120 --> 00:08:00,600 Speaker 1: our audience? What Steven Moore said on Bloomberg Television before 136 00:08:01,200 --> 00:08:04,600 Speaker 1: this tweet came out from President Trump and his how 137 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 1: how unconcerned he was trying to give off he was 138 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:11,320 Speaker 1: Stephen Moore just hours before President Trump's tweet comes out 139 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 1: that he doesn't want Stephen Moore. Here's Stephen Moore saying 140 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:17,840 Speaker 1: he's not concerned on Bloomberg Television. I'm not too concerned 141 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:21,320 Speaker 1: about this. Um. I actually think if we can steer 142 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 1: the uh, the discussion away from things I wrote five 143 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,120 Speaker 1: years ago and more towards what I believe and in 144 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:31,520 Speaker 1: towards of the economy and FED policy and how to 145 00:08:31,640 --> 00:08:34,560 Speaker 1: create growth and stable prices, I think I'm going to 146 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: win a big majority. But see Hogar, there was criticism 147 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,080 Speaker 1: of him the comments that he's referring to, the comments 148 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 1: that he made about women, but there was also concern 149 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: on policy. Right. Well, you know, the one of the 150 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:50,679 Speaker 1: biggest problems with him is he has no almost no credibility, right, 151 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:52,160 Speaker 1: I mean, like, can we talk about the fact that 152 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:56,720 Speaker 1: he said on air that the biggest problem to happen 153 00:08:56,760 --> 00:08:58,719 Speaker 1: in our economy over the last twenty five years is 154 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:03,160 Speaker 1: the decline supposedly in male wages. I mean, he literally 155 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 1: is making this up. And you know, so between that 156 00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:09,680 Speaker 1: and between what I found personally is you know, a 157 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 1: struggle to actually understand his policy, struggled to understand where 158 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 1: on earth he was going what on earth he was 159 00:09:14,880 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: going to be proposing. So between that and and and 160 00:09:18,800 --> 00:09:22,680 Speaker 1: really unsubstantiated lies, it just you know, where do you 161 00:09:22,679 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 1: go with that? This is a really reputable position here. 162 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:27,960 Speaker 1: This came up with with Tom kick my mentor colleague 163 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 1: here at Bloomberg his hit durn on air, but also 164 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:32,800 Speaker 1: came up in the ED board to hear these FED 165 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 1: reporters say, Sir, at one point prior to President Trump's election, 166 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:40,000 Speaker 1: you said the national deficit was was a major problem. 167 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:43,240 Speaker 1: Now you've since backed off. In this book that you wrote, 168 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:46,640 Speaker 1: you said that you know this should happen, and now 169 00:09:46,720 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 1: and now you have this, I want to play I 170 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: just quickly before we before we switch gears here, I 171 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 1: do want to play what he said about convincing Republican 172 00:09:57,000 --> 00:10:01,319 Speaker 1: senators to get their support, because just put yourselves in 173 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 1: US reporter shoots. Here's here's Stephen Moore talking to senators 174 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:07,319 Speaker 1: about how he would talk to Republican senators uh to 175 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:11,440 Speaker 1: get their support. Here is just because a senator today 176 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: says they won't vote for me, it doesn't mean three 177 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:15,040 Speaker 1: months from now they want it. It's gonna be a 178 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:17,240 Speaker 1: different world, you know, two or three months from now 179 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 1: when this comes up before the Senate. And in that time, 180 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,040 Speaker 1: I hope to talk to all the Republican senators and 181 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 1: and you know, I think the case for me is, 182 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: look at this blooming economy. It happened in large part 183 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,360 Speaker 1: because of the Trump economic agenda, which is great for women, glass, 184 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:36,000 Speaker 1: great for minorities, great for every group. And here's Senator 185 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 1: Joanie Earnest to me on Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio, 186 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: a Republican from Iowa. I asked her if she'd support 187 00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: Stephen Moore. Here's literally what she told me on there. 188 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 1: Here she is, I would vote no against them should 189 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 1: he come up for a vote. I'm gonna leave it there. 190 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 1: Coming up, we talked more policy. That's it for Stephen Moore, 191 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:56,720 Speaker 1: Penal Stay. She had a petty peace Bloomberg News, a 192 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 1: White House reporter, Bagar Camali, CEO of Grettitch Me You Strategies, 193 00:11:00,800 --> 00:11:05,559 Speaker 1: and former Treasury spokesperson for Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. You 194 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:09,480 Speaker 1: can download the sound on podcast on Apple iTunes, at 195 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:12,839 Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg Business app. 196 00:11:13,000 --> 00:11:15,200 Speaker 1: You can also find us on Radio dot Com, I 197 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: Heart Radio and Spotify. Had Kevin Crelli and thanks for 198 00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:27,320 Speaker 1: listening to Bloomberg. This is sound On with Kevin's really 199 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:31,400 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg and one oh five point seven of m 200 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: h D two Baltimore. History will judge us for how 201 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 1: we face this challenge. We will all be held accountable 202 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 1: in one way or the other. And if he does 203 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: not provide this committee with the information at demands and 204 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 1: the respect it deserves, Mr Barr's moment of accountability will 205 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:55,440 Speaker 1: come soon enough. That was House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerry Nadler, 206 00:11:55,640 --> 00:11:59,840 Speaker 1: a Democrat from New York, speaking today to an empty chair, 207 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 1: as well as two the audience within the room of 208 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: the House Judiciary Committee, chair of the House Committee room, 209 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: and and of course the American people because A. G. Barr, 210 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:15,520 Speaker 1: Attorney General William Barr, was supposed to testify before the 211 00:12:15,559 --> 00:12:21,160 Speaker 1: Democratic controlled House Judiciary Committee. Remember yesterday A. G. Bar 212 00:12:21,280 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 1: testified before the Senate Judiciary Committee, but he decided not 213 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 1: to show up because there was this back and forth 214 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 1: about protocol. I'm Kevin Cirelli, Chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg 215 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:36,000 Speaker 1: Television and Bloomberg Radio. Shannon Petty piece, my colleague, my friend. 216 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:39,840 Speaker 1: She has Bloomberg News White House reporter joining me here 217 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: in studio, as is Hagar Shamali. I've been saying your 218 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 1: name wrong regard forever, and you just tell me that 219 00:12:46,280 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 1: it's sham You know, with a name like mine, you 220 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:50,319 Speaker 1: get used to you don't even notice how I apologize. 221 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:52,079 Speaker 1: There's no excuse to that, and I feel bad that 222 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,880 Speaker 1: you didn't tell me. Friend of the program, friend of mine, 223 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:58,480 Speaker 1: CEO of Greenwich Media Strategies and former Treasury spokesperson for 224 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:03,520 Speaker 1: Terrorism and Financial Intelligence. Remember her name, Hagar Shamali. She's 225 00:13:03,559 --> 00:13:06,200 Speaker 1: a former spokesperson for the US Mission to the United 226 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 1: Nations and to Ambassador Samantha Power. Shannon, I don't think 227 00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: the White House cares about the fallout of a g 228 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:21,959 Speaker 1: bar not testifying before the House. No. Uh, the democratically 229 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:25,880 Speaker 1: controlled House. No. I think they're feeling was there was 230 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:29,480 Speaker 1: really no upside that could come from it. Uh. One 231 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,360 Speaker 1: risk is he could say something and the Democrats could 232 00:13:33,360 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 1: accuse him of lying to Congress, which they are already 233 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:39,160 Speaker 1: doing from his previous testimony. One of the things they've 234 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:42,520 Speaker 1: brought up that Pelosi brought up already is that um, 235 00:13:42,559 --> 00:13:45,080 Speaker 1: he seemed to have contradicted his testimony saying that he 236 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:48,560 Speaker 1: did not know that members of the Special Council's team 237 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 1: had had issues with his four page summary to Congress. 238 00:13:53,400 --> 00:13:55,679 Speaker 1: And then now we know that Muller had written him 239 00:13:55,679 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 1: a letter in that time period, so he technically was 240 00:13:58,679 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: aware there were concerns. And of course it could be 241 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 1: back and forth about the language and the wordy of 242 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:05,760 Speaker 1: the questions. But Pelosi has come out and said that 243 00:14:05,800 --> 00:14:09,320 Speaker 1: she believes that was aligned to Congress and that you know, 244 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:11,040 Speaker 1: they're going to look at what the next steps are 245 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:12,840 Speaker 1: on this, and that's the type of thing that can 246 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 1: happen when you testified. Let's let's here, let's hear directly 247 00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,920 Speaker 1: from Speaker Nancy Pelosi. As you mentioned, I mean, she 248 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:23,080 Speaker 1: has really ratcheted up the pressure on the Trump administration 249 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 1: to comply with Congressional subpoenas here Speaker Pelosi, Uh, well, 250 00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:31,240 Speaker 1: in her own words, the Attorney General of the United 251 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:34,240 Speaker 1: States of America was not telling the truth to the 252 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: Congress of the United States. That's a crime, Hagar. But 253 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 1: I don't want to ask you people care obviously people care. 254 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 1: But is there it is this, Is there any direct 255 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 1: threat to President Trump, to the administration, or has this 256 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: just become part of the drumbeat, drumbeat, drumbeat? Right? It 257 00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: all feels like a game. I mean even when I 258 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: heard it, part me obviously, I agreed with her, you know, 259 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 1: and for a second there, I was like, you know what, 260 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,920 Speaker 1: she is right, And you know, at first I got angry, 261 00:15:06,920 --> 00:15:08,120 Speaker 1: and then I was thinking to myself, I was like, 262 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: what am I Why am I getting all banned out 263 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:12,600 Speaker 1: of shape? Nothing's going to change. Um, this isn't the 264 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: first time that somebody from the White House or someone 265 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:17,360 Speaker 1: from the administration is lying, certainly not like you know, 266 00:15:17,440 --> 00:15:19,840 Speaker 1: lying to Congress included. Um, And so I just don't 267 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: really expect much. It just feels like a lot of banter, right, 268 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 1: It feels like a lot of pomp and circumstances. And 269 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 1: so it's at her guards point. I mean, you hear 270 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: from her guard she served in democratic administrations. I mean, 271 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:32,280 Speaker 1: you hear what she's saying. The White House, the sources 272 00:15:32,280 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 1: that I talked to, it seems that they understand that. 273 00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: It seems that they understand that fatigue, that news fatigue 274 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:41,240 Speaker 1: and it's not Trump fatigue, the news fatigue of what 275 00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:44,360 Speaker 1: her car saying. Yeah, I mean, there's all there's a 276 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,440 Speaker 1: bit of concern politically on these things when it comes 277 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 1: to the people who are in the margins, who are 278 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 1: the independent voters in Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin, maybe Ohio, who 279 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 1: see all this and it leaves a bad taste in 280 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: their mouth. They make them think the President's behavior is questionable, 281 00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:04,400 Speaker 1: it's not presidential. They don't like, you know, the way 282 00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:06,720 Speaker 1: the attorney generals may be handling themselves and those people 283 00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 1: they do have to worry about in the margins. But 284 00:16:09,160 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: um on a whole, I think that the White House 285 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 1: sees this as a winning political issue. I think they 286 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 1: would prefer everyone be talking about well as a that 287 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:21,360 Speaker 1: that the more that this they believe that the more 288 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 1: the Democrats hammer on this Muller investigation, uh that Democrats 289 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:28,320 Speaker 1: are going to overplay their hand, and particularly if the 290 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: Democrats moved to an impeachment, that the Democrats will overplay 291 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:33,200 Speaker 1: their hand and there will be a backlash the way 292 00:16:33,240 --> 00:16:36,720 Speaker 1: there was with Clinton where his approval went up following impeachment. 293 00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 1: And respectfully, when they start showing up with KFC, I mean, 294 00:16:40,600 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: we joked about it earlier in the show, but Congressman 295 00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: Cohen literally showed up in the House Judiciary Committee hearing room. 296 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: He's a Tennessee Democrat with k f C chicken to 297 00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 1: call a g bar chicken bar. And politically they see 298 00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 1: that as everything that Americans hated about Washington and drew 299 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:07,080 Speaker 1: them to Trump. And and also you have how many 300 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,440 Speaker 1: I mean, are how many people who running form in 301 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:12,840 Speaker 1: the Democratic office aren't in Congress. I mean you have 302 00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: more than a dozen of them who hold offices in Congress. 303 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:18,359 Speaker 1: That that is the drain the swamp. That is what 304 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 1: pushed people away from a traditional washingt candidate den towards Trump. 305 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:25,439 Speaker 1: In to your point, here's White House Press Secretary Sarah 306 00:17:25,480 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 1: Sanders about the House Judiciary Committee Chairman Jerry now There. 307 00:17:29,080 --> 00:17:31,440 Speaker 1: Here she is, we lost confidence in Jerry nab were 308 00:17:31,440 --> 00:17:33,880 Speaker 1: a long time ago, but it's surprising to find out 309 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 1: that he's actually lost confidence in himself and his capability 310 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 1: to do his job. Now. I think Chairman now There 311 00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:42,639 Speaker 1: would disagree, but we'll have to leave it there with 312 00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 1: the KFC chicken aside. Coming up, we hear from Mark 313 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:50,720 Speaker 1: Short he is former or he is current Vice President, 314 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:54,520 Speaker 1: Mike Pence is chief of staff all of it because 315 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,880 Speaker 1: with Biden running, it's like, you gotta guess, it's two 316 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 1: very different people. Trust me, I know. But Mark Short 317 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:03,440 Speaker 1: will hear about his take off the US trade policy 318 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:07,359 Speaker 1: regarding U S m c. A. Panels are Hagar stage Shannon, 319 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:09,199 Speaker 1: and you've got to leave us appreciate you dropping in. 320 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,680 Speaker 1: I'm Kevin Ceirelli, cheap Washington, correspondent for Bloomberg Television and 321 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio. You're listening to Bloomberg. He's sound on with 322 00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:26,800 Speaker 1: Kevin cereally on Bloomberg and seven f M h D 323 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 1: two Baltimore. What Paid Day. I'm Kevin Cerelli cheap Washington, 324 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:38,359 Speaker 1: correspondent for Bloomberg Television and Bloomberg Radio. Major headlines, Major headlines. 325 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:41,240 Speaker 1: Let's start with what we've been talking about. Speaker Nancy 326 00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:45,639 Speaker 1: Pelosi says Attorney General William Barr lied to Congress and 327 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 1: the President Trump obstructed justice. There's that, and then there's 328 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:54,760 Speaker 1: this whole back and forth in terms of Stephen Moore. 329 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 1: President Trump says that he is no longer going to 330 00:18:57,400 --> 00:19:01,720 Speaker 1: nominate Steven Moore to the Fedboard. And then you've got 331 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 1: the whole situation with trade policy. And that's where I 332 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: want to pick things up because earlier today on Bloomberg Television, 333 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:10,960 Speaker 1: I interviewed Mark Short. He is Vice President Mike Pence's 334 00:19:11,119 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 1: chief of staff. And believe me when I tell you, 335 00:19:13,920 --> 00:19:17,720 Speaker 1: the Vice President's office is working in lockstep with this 336 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:23,159 Speaker 1: administration to convince Republicans to get on board with the 337 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: president's trade policies. We've covered it here, we talked about 338 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:30,480 Speaker 1: it basically every day. There are many Republicans, many Republicans, 339 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:35,440 Speaker 1: including the chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, Chuck Grassley, 340 00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:40,760 Speaker 1: Republican from Iowa, who are urging the president aggressively, urging 341 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:44,440 Speaker 1: the President to back off of those tariffs, especially those 342 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 1: steel and aluminum tariffs. And that's where I picked up 343 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,919 Speaker 1: the conversation with Mark Short. Take a listen. I know 344 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 1: that U s m c A is something that that 345 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:56,959 Speaker 1: the administration is crucially focusing on. But you know, if 346 00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:00,960 Speaker 1: you look at Senate Finance Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley's comments 347 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:03,440 Speaker 1: over the last several days, he says, in an op 348 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:07,040 Speaker 1: ed quote, if these tariffs aren't lifted, U s m 349 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,320 Speaker 1: c A is dead. There is no appetite in Congress 350 00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:14,159 Speaker 1: to debate U S M c A with these tariffs 351 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:17,199 Speaker 1: in place. He's referring to steal and aluminum tariffs. The 352 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:21,680 Speaker 1: White House is response, well, Chairman Grassli has actually been 353 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:23,440 Speaker 1: a strong partner of ours in a lot of these 354 00:20:23,440 --> 00:20:26,919 Speaker 1: meetings will be have in SENTI Finance Chairman over today 355 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:29,119 Speaker 1: at the White House to meet with the President. I 356 00:20:29,119 --> 00:20:31,040 Speaker 1: think in conversations he has had with them is to 357 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:33,520 Speaker 1: recognize that some of these terrorists helped bring Canada in 358 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:36,480 Speaker 1: Mexico to the table to negotiate a stronger trade deal. 359 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,159 Speaker 1: And uh, I think that he has flexibility that if 360 00:20:39,160 --> 00:20:42,199 Speaker 1: we get this deal done, there could be adjustment on 361 00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:44,960 Speaker 1: those tariffs. But it's let's get this deal done and 362 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:47,280 Speaker 1: then we can readdress that. I think that you look 363 00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:50,520 Speaker 1: at what the President's economy has done from the reggatory front, 364 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: the tax front, and the tremendous growth we're having in 365 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 1: jobs and the growth we're having in GDP. I think 366 00:20:56,080 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 1: the piece that's missing so far is is completing some 367 00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 1: of these trade deals, and the President has negotiate a 368 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:03,760 Speaker 1: better deal. We're quite confident that it will pass if 369 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:06,120 Speaker 1: it gets a vote in Congress. The challenge for US 370 00:21:06,200 --> 00:21:08,520 Speaker 1: is is whether or not. Speaker Pelosi decides to give 371 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 1: it actually a vote in the House, seeking with what 372 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:13,399 Speaker 1: you just said, you said adjustment in those terrorists. What 373 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:17,000 Speaker 1: does that specifically mean. I think that that's for the 374 00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:19,560 Speaker 1: President to announce Kevin in a later day. But I 375 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,760 Speaker 1: think he's heard the concerns from from some senators who 376 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:26,399 Speaker 1: have said that trade with Canada Mexico is great. We 377 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 1: liked the new deal, but let's let's remove the existing 378 00:21:29,119 --> 00:21:31,439 Speaker 1: steal in luminum terrorists. I think the President said that 379 00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:33,679 Speaker 1: he would be willing to revisit that, but let's get 380 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,280 Speaker 1: the U. S m c A deal done first. And 381 00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 1: and in particularly know when I when I talk to 382 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 1: folks in the business community, they've got concerns about the 383 00:21:41,400 --> 00:21:44,439 Speaker 1: uncertainty that some of these terrorifts has have impacted on 384 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 1: their bottom lines. What's your message to the business community. 385 00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 1: Is it stay patient? Is it stay uh, stay optimistic? 386 00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,399 Speaker 1: Because a lot of the business lobbying groups, you know 387 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: this mark, they are very much vocally against these tariffs. Kevin, 388 00:21:59,040 --> 00:22:00,920 Speaker 1: I think that the reality is that what we hear 389 00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,000 Speaker 1: from the business community is a lot of support for 390 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,119 Speaker 1: the presidence agenda. In fact, many who who do a 391 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,480 Speaker 1: lot of trade with actually Asia have expressed, you know, look, 392 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:12,440 Speaker 1: the reality is that a lot of administrations have avoided 393 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 1: the problems that this administration is finally trying to address, 394 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:18,480 Speaker 1: whether or not that is stealing intellectual property, forced transfer 395 00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:22,159 Speaker 1: of ownership, or or even the deficit issue as it stands. 396 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 1: And so we get a lot of support. I next, 397 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: I recognize it for a while of them in the 398 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:28,920 Speaker 1: short term, removing the tarroffts would help their bottom line, 399 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: and I think the President is sympathetic to that, but 400 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:34,320 Speaker 1: recognizing that these have been forcing mechanism to get people 401 00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:36,919 Speaker 1: to the table, and the President has said repeatedly, he 402 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:38,840 Speaker 1: has said his ideal goal is get to a point 403 00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 1: where where there are no terrorists and it's it's true 404 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,800 Speaker 1: free trade. But he feels like we're a disadvantage because 405 00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:46,359 Speaker 1: other nations have been imposing terrorists on us for a 406 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,119 Speaker 1: lot longer period of time and we have not responded 407 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 1: action negotiate better trade deals, which is what he's in 408 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,960 Speaker 1: the process of doing. Mark, I got to be honest 409 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:55,640 Speaker 1: earlier this week at the White House when I saw 410 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,040 Speaker 1: Speaker Pelosi and sentim a alarity Leader Chuck Schumer come 411 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,720 Speaker 1: out to the sticks of the microphones, and they were positive. 412 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: They have this glowing meeting with President Trump on the 413 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:09,240 Speaker 1: issue of infrastructure, especially after what was a rocky, to 414 00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:13,080 Speaker 1: put it mildly, relationship in tents in the past. UH, 415 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,840 Speaker 1: is infrastructure really doable? And if so, how are you 416 00:23:15,880 --> 00:23:18,920 Speaker 1: going to pay for it? I think infrastructure is doable 417 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 1: with the president campaigned on in two thousand sixteen. He's 418 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,639 Speaker 1: a builder, he wants the infrastructure package. He believes that 419 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:26,919 Speaker 1: there's a lot that we can do for crumbling infrastructure 420 00:23:26,920 --> 00:23:29,400 Speaker 1: in this country. I think that you're right. A big 421 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: question means remains how will get paid for? Will be 422 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,880 Speaker 1: a fault conversation the one that has had earlier this week, 423 00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:38,479 Speaker 1: in three weeks, time for us to compare suggestions as 424 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 1: ways to pay for it. I think one thing this 425 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,719 Speaker 1: administration will not support is raising taxes and UH, and 426 00:23:43,760 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 1: that whether or not that is looking to roll back 427 00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,280 Speaker 1: the tax cuts that we think have been so impactful 428 00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:51,960 Speaker 1: the economy. Having said that, the we're encouraged at least Democrats, 429 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:56,280 Speaker 1: instead of looking to continue to harass the administration additional investigations, 430 00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:58,880 Speaker 1: are actually looking to have conversations on policies that will 431 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 1: benefit the American people. That was Mark Short, the Vice President, 432 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:06,960 Speaker 1: Mike Pence's chief of staff, discussing a host of different 433 00:24:07,840 --> 00:24:11,199 Speaker 1: areas in which he's hopeful Democrats and Republicans will be 434 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:14,199 Speaker 1: able to work together on coming up. Another one of 435 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:18,840 Speaker 1: those areas, the escalating situation in Venezuela. I'm Kevin Cirilli. 436 00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 1: You can download the Sound On podcast on Apple iTunes, 437 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com, or by downloading the Bloomberg Business app. 438 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:26,800 Speaker 1: You can also check us out on Radio dot com, 439 00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:33,639 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio and Spotify here listening to Bloomberg. This 440 00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:38,760 Speaker 1: is Sound On with Kevin's your relate on Bloomberg and 441 00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:41,480 Speaker 1: one oh five point seven of m HD two Boltemore. 442 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: The brutal repression of the Venezuelan people must end, and 443 00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:51,480 Speaker 1: it must end soon. That was President Trump speaking earlier 444 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,439 Speaker 1: today in the Rose Garden at the White House. He 445 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:56,960 Speaker 1: was speaking he was hosting a National Day of Prayer 446 00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:00,320 Speaker 1: service and kicked off the event with prayers for the 447 00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:05,400 Speaker 1: people of Venezuela. The escalating situation in Venezuela has been 448 00:25:06,119 --> 00:25:13,600 Speaker 1: captivating the world's attention, even beyond the Bloomberg crowd. Venezuelan 449 00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:17,679 Speaker 1: President Nicolas Maduro took to State Television on Thursday and 450 00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:23,919 Speaker 1: made mundane comments on the Bolivarian Revolution, the importance of 451 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,520 Speaker 1: military unity, and criticizing the United States. It was quite 452 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:33,040 Speaker 1: standard fair. As my colleague Fabiola's ORPA reports on the 453 00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: Bloomberg terminal, it's been a busy day in Washington. We've 454 00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 1: been following the developments. Steven Moore, the conservative economist firebrand, 455 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: officially will not be named to the FED Board. He 456 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:50,120 Speaker 1: will not be nominated. Meanwhile, Speaker Nancy Pelosi, she says 457 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 1: the President Trump obstructed justice and that Attorney General William 458 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 1: Barr lied and committed a crime in his testimony. And 459 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,880 Speaker 1: even beyond that, we heard earlier in the program from 460 00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 1: Mark Short, Vice President Mike Pence's chief of staff about 461 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,760 Speaker 1: the White Houses positioning and pressure that they're pushing back 462 00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:15,119 Speaker 1: on with Republicans who are raising concerns about tariffs in 463 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 1: US China trade policy, and of course U S m 464 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:21,960 Speaker 1: c A with Mexico and Canada. But let's stick with Venezuela, 465 00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:26,360 Speaker 1: let's stick with foreign policy. Agar Shamali she is CEO 466 00:26:26,640 --> 00:26:30,399 Speaker 1: of Greenwich Media Strategy. She's the former Treasury spokesperson for 467 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:35,119 Speaker 1: Terrorism and Financial Intelligence and a former spoked spokesperson for 468 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:38,760 Speaker 1: the US Mission to the United Nations and to Ambassador 469 00:26:38,840 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 1: Samantha Power. She's been with us for the hour. I 470 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 1: can't think of a better day to have you with 471 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 1: us in studio. Every every single lead store, every topic today, 472 00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:50,399 Speaker 1: it's like what would her gard what what would her 473 00:26:50,440 --> 00:26:54,760 Speaker 1: garth thinks? So you know, there's always a national security crisis. Wow, 474 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,840 Speaker 1: always news to discuss. Always, there's always always a big 475 00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:01,640 Speaker 1: news day exactly all right, Well let's start with Venezuela. 476 00:27:01,720 --> 00:27:06,719 Speaker 1: I mean, it really is. It's intense, and it feels 477 00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:10,600 Speaker 1: like the situation is so volatile that it could change 478 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:18,080 Speaker 1: within hours hours, particularly as Dictator Maduto clings to power. 479 00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:23,640 Speaker 1: As Juan Guido, who is the National Assembly leader, who 480 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 1: the Venezuelan people have elected freely, democratically, and who has 481 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:31,800 Speaker 1: the support of the Venezuelan people, has the support of 482 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: the US Speaker Nancy Pelosi, President Trump, Emanuel McCrone at 483 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:44,640 Speaker 1: the international community, can he can he get power from Medoro? 484 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:48,119 Speaker 1: I mean, I think this is gonna be a long 485 00:27:48,320 --> 00:27:51,520 Speaker 1: time in the making. You know, when I handled the 486 00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:53,639 Speaker 1: Syria crisis when I was at the White House, and 487 00:27:54,480 --> 00:27:56,440 Speaker 1: you know Syria, there are not a lot of similarities 488 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,240 Speaker 1: to Syrian Venezuela as countries, but there are I see 489 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,159 Speaker 1: a lot of similarity in terms of the crises and 490 00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 1: in terms of how the administration is responding. And you know, 491 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 1: one of the things, there were a number of mistakes 492 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:08,679 Speaker 1: that we made and a number of false assumptions we 493 00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: made with Syria that I see playing out with Venezuela. 494 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,600 Speaker 1: And among them is this expectation that the military is 495 00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 1: going to defect and that did not you know, in Syria. 496 00:28:17,440 --> 00:28:19,680 Speaker 1: I you know, it's it's a different situation. Obviously, in 497 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:23,000 Speaker 1: Syria they were trying to fight for allegedly the survival 498 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 1: of a religious minority, so there's a different goal there. 499 00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:30,680 Speaker 1: But you've only had one major defection UM in Venezuela 500 00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:34,840 Speaker 1: since the anti government protests started this week. It was 501 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:37,280 Speaker 1: it's the head of the secret police, the seven UM 502 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 1: intelligence agency, and it is a significant defection, but it's 503 00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,400 Speaker 1: only one. I expect more to take place. But that 504 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,239 Speaker 1: being said, I think that this is a slow This 505 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,600 Speaker 1: is going to be a slow process. Now. Russia plays 506 00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 1: a really key role here. Right The administration has allegedly 507 00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:54,719 Speaker 1: said that that Maduro was waiting to go, that there 508 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,680 Speaker 1: was an airplane on the tarmac. Um, you know, hopefully 509 00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,640 Speaker 1: that's true. I don't know, because that really would be 510 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,120 Speaker 1: signific thinking if that were true. But that Russia stepped 511 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: in and said, you know no. And the reason that's 512 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,640 Speaker 1: very interesting is for I mean, first, this is our hemisphere, right, 513 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,680 Speaker 1: this is this is literally our business. It's right across 514 00:29:10,720 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: the water. And number two, so we have greater staked 515 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:16,520 Speaker 1: in the in the in the in the fight than 516 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 1: then Russia does. And number two, Um, this is where 517 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: Syria becomes important again because if you know, Russia could 518 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 1: easily say, like, look, you know, hanging there, We backed 519 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:27,560 Speaker 1: that guy and he said, is still sitting there? So 520 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:31,800 Speaker 1: don't it? Can Russia afford to even get involved in Venezuela? 521 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:39,560 Speaker 1: Can they actually afford financially, politically, investment wise, do they 522 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:44,920 Speaker 1: even have the strength to get involved beyond just being 523 00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:49,520 Speaker 1: a mosquito headache, beyond just prying the US? Can they 524 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 1: actually do anything substantially with Venezuela? Well? Can Cuba? That's 525 00:29:55,920 --> 00:29:58,239 Speaker 1: my next my follow up, So let's go there. So 526 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:02,600 Speaker 1: who is who actually is a bigger prying here? Is 527 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,520 Speaker 1: right putin? Or is it Cuba? Well? So on the 528 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 1: Russia piece, they can be a thorn in our side 529 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,280 Speaker 1: in Venezuela. Um, you know, listen, you have a point 530 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:15,760 Speaker 1: about their financial abilities. Obviously Venezuela is logistically physically far 531 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 1: for Russia, so they can still but you know, as 532 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:21,000 Speaker 1: with Syria, they can still if they wanted to. They 533 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:26,800 Speaker 1: could still provide um military advice if they wanted any. Absolutely, 534 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:28,600 Speaker 1: they definitely want to be annoying. This is this is 535 00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 1: a gift to the Russian's right. I mean, it's literally 536 00:30:31,080 --> 00:30:33,800 Speaker 1: at our it's our hemispheres, this is our business. And 537 00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 1: so um, you know, they know what they're doing by 538 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:39,840 Speaker 1: by sticking, by sticking themselves in there. I'll talk about Cuba. 539 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,320 Speaker 1: So we get, we get that Russia wants to be annoying. 540 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,680 Speaker 1: We get that they want to sow discord in Venezuela. Cuba. 541 00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: Why is Cuba so crucial to this? So Cuba is 542 00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 1: an actual problem, like a real problem in Venezuela because 543 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,640 Speaker 1: they're providing a lot of military systems, they have spies there, 544 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,680 Speaker 1: they have intelligence, they have a lot of aid they're 545 00:30:56,680 --> 00:30:59,320 Speaker 1: giving to Maduro to help prop them up and and 546 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 1: you know, and and secure his power. So now the 547 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:04,760 Speaker 1: Trump administration has responded by saying, you know, well, we're 548 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:06,880 Speaker 1: gonna We're gonna make things even tougher when it tightened, 549 00:31:06,880 --> 00:31:09,480 Speaker 1: the news make the embargo even stronger. And so they've 550 00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 1: now allowed US persons to sue companies in Cuba that 551 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:17,480 Speaker 1: are operating on seized land. The problem with that is 552 00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:21,040 Speaker 1: that those lawsuits, should they take place, would probably go 553 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,720 Speaker 1: against European and Canadian companies that are operating in Cuba 554 00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:28,120 Speaker 1: on said ceased land. And this is not exactly the 555 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:31,160 Speaker 1: time to undermine a relationship with Europe and Canada on 556 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 1: this issue. It's it's critical. It's great that we have 557 00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:36,360 Speaker 1: them on the same page when it comes to supporting 558 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:40,440 Speaker 1: Guido Smali, CEO of greendnich Commedia Strategies, former Treasury spokesperson 559 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 1: for Terrorism UH and Financial Intelligence, and oil. Venezuela and oil, 560 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:47,760 Speaker 1: and we keep talking about this, but I mean, if 561 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: if you look at how Venezuela's they're one of the 562 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:54,760 Speaker 1: world's largest exporters of oil and a founding member of OPEC. 563 00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:58,360 Speaker 1: And in addition to that, I believe it's like of 564 00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: global reserves. So their oil market has been completely decimated completely, 565 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:08,440 Speaker 1: and the volatility in the in the Venezuela market is 566 00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,840 Speaker 1: is completely completely decimated as a result of this. So 567 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:14,960 Speaker 1: there's the oil element, and then there's the issue of refugees. 568 00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:17,719 Speaker 1: And this is where I think people are just starting 569 00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 1: to wake up aigar, which is that the number it's 570 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:25,160 Speaker 1: like a million already have gone to Colombia from three 571 00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:30,239 Speaker 1: million refugees total, not all, but I believe it's more 572 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 1: than one million that have been going into Colombia. And 573 00:32:33,160 --> 00:32:36,440 Speaker 1: and and that is that impact. I don't think we 574 00:32:36,600 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: fully recognize that just the longevity that this crisis, it 575 00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 1: is a crisis, is going to have. This this Venezuelan 576 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,920 Speaker 1: refugee crisis when you look at it in our literal backyard, 577 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 1: when you look at it in comparison for how this 578 00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: nation is having a national dialogue, but it in lack 579 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:55,640 Speaker 1: of a better word about immigration, This is not a 580 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:58,120 Speaker 1: quick fix. This is a commitment that both parties are 581 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,920 Speaker 1: going to have to make for years, years extending beyond 582 00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:05,440 Speaker 1: the Trump administration. And this impact on that. So that's 583 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:07,640 Speaker 1: on Venezuela. We've got two minutes left because there was 584 00:33:07,680 --> 00:33:11,400 Speaker 1: another major development with Iran, speaking of oil on waivers. 585 00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:15,120 Speaker 1: What brings us up to speed there? So the waivers. Uh, well, 586 00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:17,400 Speaker 1: there are groups of countries that are allowed, or have 587 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:20,920 Speaker 1: been allowed, under the oil sanctions to continue importing Iranian 588 00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:24,680 Speaker 1: oil at um a decreasing rate, and the money from 589 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 1: that critically stays in accounts abroad that Iran can only 590 00:33:27,840 --> 00:33:31,560 Speaker 1: use for humanitarian purposes. Um So, Secretary Pompeo last week 591 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:34,840 Speaker 1: announced that those waivers would expire. Today's the expiration date. 592 00:33:35,120 --> 00:33:37,240 Speaker 1: And you have countries you know waivering. I mean, India 593 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:39,560 Speaker 1: has said that they're going to comply, that they're not 594 00:33:39,600 --> 00:33:42,200 Speaker 1: concerned with it. Turkey has said that you know, it's 595 00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:43,800 Speaker 1: going to be difficult. You know, we're gonna have to 596 00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,120 Speaker 1: see how this goes. I think it was an unnecessary move, though, 597 00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:48,640 Speaker 1: you think it was an unnecessary move in terms of 598 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:51,040 Speaker 1: achieving the goal to deter Ron's behavior and bring them 599 00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 1: a negotiating table. Yeah, we'll have to see what happens. 600 00:33:54,440 --> 00:33:57,280 Speaker 1: And to be continued, Hagar Shmali, thanks so much for 601 00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:00,960 Speaker 1: coming in. A former department spokes said, for me, I'm 602 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:06,040 Speaker 1: Kevin Sorelli. 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