1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:10,160 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. Welcome to the Bloomberg 2 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:15,960 Speaker 1: This Weekend podcast with David Gura, Christina Raffini, and Lisa Matteo. 3 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:20,600 Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us for today's selection of conversations from 4 00:00:20,640 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 2: the show. 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:23,479 Speaker 3: You can listen to our favorite discussions right here on 6 00:00:23,520 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 3: the podcast, but also make sure to join us live 7 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:29,000 Speaker 3: every Saturday and Sunday morning starting at seven am Easter. 8 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:32,800 Speaker 4: We're on Bloomberg Television, Radio and the Bloomberg Business App, 9 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:37,640 Speaker 4: bringing you unique takes and in depth interviews on news, politics, 10 00:00:37,680 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 4: lifestyle and culture. 11 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:44,120 Speaker 3: Breaking news that RUNI and state media reporting mediators have 12 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:46,720 Speaker 3: submitted their response to the US proposal and the war 13 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:47,480 Speaker 3: via Pakistan. 14 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 2: This comes ten weeks into the conflict and frankly into 15 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 2: our show, which launched the same weekend as those attacks. 16 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 2: The conflict has disrupted global energy supplies. We're still waiting, 17 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 2: as Lisa mentioned, on more details on what exactly is 18 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 2: in that Ron response. But joining us now is Bloomberg 19 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,120 Speaker 2: News White House correspondent Jeff Mason, who is on White 20 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:08,240 Speaker 2: House duty this weekend. Jeff, are we hearing anything from 21 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 2: the White House yet? Were we expecting this today or 22 00:01:10,680 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 2: we all just kind of waiting to see when this 23 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:15,039 Speaker 2: popped into our inboxes and flashed across a terminal. 24 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 5: It's a wait and see situation, Christina, I have asked 25 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 5: the White House act for a reaction or a response, 26 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:23,440 Speaker 5: and haven't heard back from them yet. I imagine that 27 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:27,080 Speaker 5: the White House and the US administration broadly is still 28 00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:30,720 Speaker 5: digesting this response in terms of when we expected it. 29 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 6: The President had told reporters. 30 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:35,840 Speaker 5: On Friday that he was expecting to have that response 31 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:39,200 Speaker 5: that night, So they've been waiting all weekend for it 32 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 5: to come in, and now it's in. And now what 33 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 5: we'll want to be asking and seeing is whether or 34 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:48,560 Speaker 5: not it's acceptable to President Trump what they've responded to, 35 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 5: and whether the conditions are enough that this ceasefire will 36 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 5: continue so that they can move on to talk about 37 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:58,720 Speaker 5: the nuclear program at Iran that President Trump said was 38 00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 5: the actual reason for getting into this war in the 39 00:02:01,120 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 5: first place. 40 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 3: Jeff, we talked about a ceasefire. It's a funny kind 41 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 3: of ceasefire because the attacks keep coming. We saw drone 42 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:08,519 Speaker 3: attacks this morning on some tankers in the straight of 43 00:02:08,560 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 3: hor moves. Of course, we saw the US retaliate on 44 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:14,040 Speaker 3: Iran after some attacks earlier in the week on other vessels. Here, 45 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:16,640 Speaker 3: the President continues to be so adamant that we do 46 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 3: have a ceasefire in place. He talks about the prospects 47 00:02:19,040 --> 00:02:21,280 Speaker 3: of extending one. To go back to what I said, 48 00:02:21,320 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 3: it is a funny one in that there still seems 49 00:02:23,000 --> 00:02:24,280 Speaker 3: to be a lot of attacks taking place in the 50 00:02:24,320 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 3: region while this is in place. 51 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:30,120 Speaker 5: Yeah, I couldn't say it beout her David. It's a 52 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 5: war and a messaging of contradiction. And that's really been 53 00:02:33,919 --> 00:02:37,200 Speaker 5: characteristic of how the President and the US has talked 54 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:39,440 Speaker 5: about or engaged in this war from the very beginning, 55 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,120 Speaker 5: from some confusion over what the actual aims were, to 56 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:46,840 Speaker 5: the status of the ceasefire, to what is acceptable now 57 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:51,160 Speaker 5: during a ceasefire. I think the President has wanted to 58 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:55,120 Speaker 5: portray this ceasefire as not being threatened because he wants 59 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 5: it to continue, and he wants there to be a deal. 60 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 5: And I might add he wants there not to be 61 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 5: any major hostilities going into his trip next week or 62 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:07,160 Speaker 5: this week now, I should say on Tuesday to China. China, 63 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 5: of course, will excuse me, I ran, of course, will 64 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:11,880 Speaker 5: be one of the big topics on that summit between 65 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 5: President Trump and President she and it's not the backdrop 66 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 5: he wants to have continued fighting in there, even if 67 00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:21,480 Speaker 5: they haven't agreed on a full on piece deal yet. 68 00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:25,240 Speaker 2: And speaking of that, Jeff, there is also this sequencing 69 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 2: issue wherein if the US agrees to the ceasefire and 70 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:32,959 Speaker 2: reopening up the Strait, the US will then lose a 71 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:36,320 Speaker 2: lot of their leverage going into nuclear negotiations which are 72 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:39,960 Speaker 2: supposed to take place maybe possibly after this is settled. 73 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 2: Has any of that been resolved and what are the 74 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 2: two big sticking points that still exist between these two 75 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 2: proposals in these two nations. 76 00:03:47,280 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 5: Well, nothing has been resolved that I can tell anyway. 77 00:03:50,280 --> 00:03:53,840 Speaker 5: I mean, they haven't announced any progress yet other than 78 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:56,120 Speaker 5: the fact that they are talking, and that is something, 79 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 5: and talking through the Pakistani mediators of course. 80 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 6: But you're spot on. 81 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 5: Christina to mention that in terms of the straight of 82 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:07,840 Speaker 5: hour moves, and that is another broader consequence of this war. 83 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:11,200 Speaker 5: In general, Iran has ended up flexing its muscles and 84 00:04:11,240 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 5: its leverage with the Strait in a way that it 85 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 5: never had before this war. 86 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 6: And so that will. 87 00:04:16,160 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 5: Be a really interesting thing to see, is how the 88 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:22,040 Speaker 5: two sides work that out going forward. I think the 89 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 5: US would like to see Iran not involved at all 90 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:29,680 Speaker 5: in governing House ships get through the straight of hour moves. Iran, however, 91 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:32,239 Speaker 5: has realized that that is a huge piece of leverage 92 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 5: that it has and seems unlikely to just throw that 93 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 5: away or give that up. But that is in terms 94 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:42,000 Speaker 5: of sequencing. As you said, that's the first question. Getting 95 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 5: that fixed so that Iran can start getting more money 96 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 5: back into its economy and so that the global economy 97 00:04:48,040 --> 00:04:49,480 Speaker 5: is not hamstrung. 98 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 6: By the Strait being blocked. 99 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 2: I think a lot of regional allies and Gulf nations 100 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 2: have that same concern. All right, Jeff, thank you for 101 00:04:57,520 --> 00:04:59,360 Speaker 2: the scrabble. Always nice to see you this morning. Thanks 102 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:00,640 Speaker 2: for breaking down that breaking news. 103 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 7: Thanks so much, Jeff. We're gonna bring another voice now. 104 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 3: Democratic Congressman from Maryland, Johny of Cheskey, known as Johnny 105 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 3: Owe to his friends and constituents in the second Congression 106 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:11,240 Speaker 3: district there in Maryland, Baltimore City, Baltimore County, Carroll County 107 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:12,760 Speaker 3: as well, I believe. 108 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:13,640 Speaker 7: Congressman, thanks for being here. 109 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:15,360 Speaker 3: You sit on the Foreign Affairs Committee, and I just want 110 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:16,720 Speaker 3: to start with the news that we're kind of going 111 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 3: through this morning. The fact that we have reporting that 112 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 3: that response to the US proposal has been conveyed via 113 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 3: the pakistanis to the US. Your reaction to that, and 114 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 3: what do you need to see in that response to 115 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:29,599 Speaker 3: feel better about the prospects of this conflict coming to 116 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:30,000 Speaker 3: an end. 117 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 8: Some great reporting there, and like everyone else, I'm waiting 118 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:36,680 Speaker 8: to see what the details are. But we have to 119 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 8: take a step back and remember that we're waiting for 120 00:05:39,640 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 8: agreement on a ceasefire that is only necessary because of 121 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,360 Speaker 8: a problem that President Trump created in the first place. 122 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 8: You know, Iranians would not know that they had this 123 00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:51,839 Speaker 8: potentially powerful tool in closing the strait of our moves 124 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:55,000 Speaker 8: but for our attack. And so this is, as you 125 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,559 Speaker 8: were pointing out, just one step and a much larger 126 00:05:57,600 --> 00:06:01,560 Speaker 8: conversation about the very real concern about having a nuclear 127 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 8: armed Iran. But we're really in a place now where 128 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 8: the President, I think, is looking to save face as 129 00:06:08,040 --> 00:06:10,520 Speaker 8: a war that we know now there was not a 130 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 8: clear imminent threat. 131 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:13,640 Speaker 6: But as has been true throughout this war. 132 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 8: As a member of the Foreign Affairs Committee, I've gotten 133 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 8: zero up to date real time information from this administration. 134 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,279 Speaker 8: There have been no public hearings and so it's really 135 00:06:23,720 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 8: a little bit like poking in the dark to try 136 00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 8: to figure out where we are and where this administration 137 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 8: hopes to land ultimately. 138 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:33,680 Speaker 2: Are you concerned about the lack of what you just 139 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:37,479 Speaker 2: talked about consultation with Congress as well as something people 140 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:39,760 Speaker 2: keep talking about with US is the lack of technical 141 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:43,640 Speaker 2: experts going into these negotiations. When they negotiated the original 142 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:46,280 Speaker 2: Iran nuclear deal, which the Trump administration pulled out of 143 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 2: during the first term, that was months and months of 144 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:52,640 Speaker 2: negotiations in Geneva with multilateral partners, with States Apartment officials, 145 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 2: junior officials, people from IAEA. The State's Apartment, as far 146 00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:57,919 Speaker 2: as we can tell, has been largely cut out of 147 00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:00,599 Speaker 2: these negotiations. It has really only three people, and the 148 00:07:00,600 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 2: President seems making these decisions. Are you confident that they 149 00:07:03,960 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 2: have the knowledge they need to go into these rooms 150 00:07:06,680 --> 00:07:08,480 Speaker 2: and come out with a deal that is advantageous to 151 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 2: the United States? 152 00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 6: Fortunately, I'm not confident. 153 00:07:11,760 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 8: What I can tell you is what I do know 154 00:07:13,720 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 8: from sitting on the Foreign Affairs Committee is that even 155 00:07:16,320 --> 00:07:19,560 Speaker 8: if the State Department were at the table, that department 156 00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 8: has been absolutely gutted. So a lot of the support 157 00:07:21,800 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 8: infrastructure that should be in place doesn't exist. And the 158 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 8: fact that this president also on top of that, likes 159 00:07:27,680 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 8: to go it alone so much is really problematic for 160 00:07:31,640 --> 00:07:35,280 Speaker 8: I think finding those kind of sustainable deals. What worries 161 00:07:35,400 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 8: me in all of this is that we're going to 162 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 8: end up with a deal that is equal to or 163 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 8: maybe even worse than that JOA, which was imperfect by 164 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:49,200 Speaker 8: the way, there were opportunities for improvement. But President Trump 165 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 8: created this environment in the first place by ripping up 166 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 8: that original agreement, allowing Iran to really go at their 167 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 8: enrichment program with great following, ripping up that deal that, 168 00:08:03,080 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 8: as you mentioned, was very involved in, very detailed, and 169 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:07,800 Speaker 8: so now we're back at a place where if we 170 00:08:07,840 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 8: can get through a ceasefire agreement and if we can 171 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 8: get back to the table, I'm hopeful that we can 172 00:08:13,440 --> 00:08:16,240 Speaker 8: get back to a place where there's not enrichment happening. 173 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:17,560 Speaker 6: But we have a long way to go. 174 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,520 Speaker 8: And in the meantime, there's been an incredible amount of 175 00:08:21,560 --> 00:08:26,080 Speaker 8: pain inflicted upon not just Americans in terms of service members' lives, lost, 176 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 8: hundreds of not at least tens of billions of dollars 177 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:33,720 Speaker 8: spent painted the pump for Americans and frankly across the globe. 178 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:37,079 Speaker 8: And so we're asking here, you know, to what end? 179 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:39,319 Speaker 8: And I think at this point the president can't really 180 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:40,480 Speaker 8: answer that question. 181 00:08:41,120 --> 00:08:43,320 Speaker 3: Let's talk a bit about what this has to bear 182 00:08:43,360 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 3: on US politics. I'm just going to note here Chris Wright, 183 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 3: the Energy Secretaries on Meet the Press with Christen Weilcrin 184 00:08:47,880 --> 00:08:49,719 Speaker 3: in NBC News. He said, the US isn't going to 185 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:51,840 Speaker 3: take off any options off the table when it comes 186 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:54,560 Speaker 3: to Iran. An interram run deal has got to be possible, 187 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 3: he said. And then you noted gasoline and diesel prices 188 00:08:57,240 --> 00:09:00,199 Speaker 3: are going to remain up while this war continues. I'm 189 00:09:00,200 --> 00:09:02,960 Speaker 3: curious how you see that pressure mounting as you talked 190 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 3: to constituents and make your way around the district. You 191 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:07,599 Speaker 3: mentioned you haven't been briefed formally by this administration on 192 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:10,319 Speaker 3: the Foreign Affairs Committee. We did see the Secretary of 193 00:09:10,320 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 3: Defense gope and speak to the Armed Services Committee. There 194 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:16,840 Speaker 3: is some speculation that maybe we're reaching a greater appetite 195 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 3: for war powers resolution on Capitol Hill. What's going to 196 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 3: change the conversation or the political terrain? 197 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:23,559 Speaker 7: Is it going to be. 198 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:27,160 Speaker 3: Gas prices diesel prices continuing to rise a pace or 199 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 3: is it going to be that the longer this lasts 200 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:30,960 Speaker 3: without any indication of sort of where the direction of 201 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 3: this war is headed from the administration is going to 202 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:35,160 Speaker 3: finally lead you and your colleagues to do more, try 203 00:09:35,160 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 3: to do more, to get administration officials up to Capitol 204 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 3: Hill to give you some answers. 205 00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 8: Appreciate those questions. I'll start with the war power for resolution. 206 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,160 Speaker 8: I mean, this is now beyond the sixty days and 207 00:09:44,200 --> 00:09:47,120 Speaker 8: the flexibility that my colleagues on the Republican side have 208 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,079 Speaker 8: said the president deserves. So it's not a suggestion, it's 209 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:53,599 Speaker 8: the law. If the president wants to continue military operations, 210 00:09:53,600 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 8: he has to have authorization from Congress. At this point, 211 00:09:56,559 --> 00:10:00,480 Speaker 8: I think the law is clear, and so on that point, 212 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:01,079 Speaker 8: I would. 213 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:04,559 Speaker 2: Say energy really quickly. Do you think that would concern 214 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:08,080 Speaker 2: this particular president. Do you think anything Congress passes, even 215 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:10,320 Speaker 2: if it would pass the war powers of resolution, do 216 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 2: you think that would stop him? 217 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:15,120 Speaker 8: Well, that's not a reason for Congress not to try 218 00:10:15,120 --> 00:10:17,679 Speaker 8: to stop him. But if the president blows past war 219 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 8: powers restrictions, then I think we have to sort of 220 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:23,360 Speaker 8: up our game as members of Congress to hold this 221 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 8: president accountable. This is a president who has consistently shown 222 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:31,080 Speaker 8: a disdain for any sort of check and unfortunately, my 223 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:35,640 Speaker 8: Republican colleagues have largely deferred to the President on those issues. 224 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 8: And I hope that given the consequence and given the 225 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,640 Speaker 8: impact to the other point, I think that the costs 226 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 8: at the pump, and it's not just that the pump. 227 00:10:44,160 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 8: We're seeing it on airline tickets. We're seeing it through 228 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 8: surcharges and places like Amazon, We're seeing it through what's 229 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:54,840 Speaker 8: happening with food prices. This is having impact across the 230 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:57,480 Speaker 8: lives of all Americans. And so I think what's happening 231 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 8: is in particular, Republican colleagues in Congress are seeing that 232 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 8: this is going to be a real drag on their 233 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:08,360 Speaker 8: election prospects in November. And I think this is really 234 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:13,080 Speaker 8: going to fuel a Democratic majority in the House of Representatives. 235 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:14,560 Speaker 8: I think we're going to see a closing, if not 236 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 8: a democratic takeover of the Senate. 237 00:11:16,960 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 6: So I think these issues are real. People are really hurting. 238 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,200 Speaker 8: As I talked to my constituents, and I think it's 239 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 8: really interesting to note that usually when it's whether one 240 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 8: of the secretaries or the President himself. These are millionaires 241 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 8: and billionaires who are members of this administration, taling Americans 242 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:36,440 Speaker 8: it's going to be okay, it's only temporary. That's not 243 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,080 Speaker 8: acceptable to people who are trying to put a roof 244 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:40,760 Speaker 8: over their head and food on the table. 245 00:11:41,360 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 3: Let's move if we can to the summit that's going 246 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:44,959 Speaker 3: to take place this week, invasion between the President and 247 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:47,560 Speaker 3: President ution Ping. And we had your colleague, your Democratic colleague, 248 00:11:47,600 --> 00:11:50,280 Speaker 3: Rocana of California on the show yesterday and we asked 249 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:53,320 Speaker 3: him what he's looking for as an outcome from that 250 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 3: meeting between those two world leaders. Let's take a listen 251 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:56,839 Speaker 3: to what he had The same reply, Well. 252 00:11:56,840 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 9: He has a lot that he has to reverse, had 253 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 9: China hold us hostage on rares and critical minerals. I 254 00:12:03,840 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 9: want a deal that actually helps American farmers, American shipbuilders, 255 00:12:08,000 --> 00:12:09,880 Speaker 9: American manufacturers, and I. 256 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 6: Hope he will work to get that. He hasn't so far. 257 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 3: Connors's been kind of looking for an economic resolution to 258 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:18,200 Speaker 3: come out of this meeting and engaging similar goals on 259 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:19,559 Speaker 3: your part, what would you like to see these two 260 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:21,080 Speaker 3: leaders announce at the end of those meetings. 261 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:23,240 Speaker 6: I think that's part of it. 262 00:12:23,559 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 8: What I can tell you is this is a president 263 00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:27,600 Speaker 8: who's been very soft on China. The one place where 264 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:30,080 Speaker 8: he's been hard is on tariffs, and that has negative 265 00:12:30,080 --> 00:12:31,079 Speaker 8: impacts for everyone. 266 00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:32,920 Speaker 6: No one wins in a trade war. 267 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:35,440 Speaker 8: But what we do know is that this president's been 268 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 8: very soft in terms of advanced chips and the selling 269 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,520 Speaker 8: of those, and that really is, I think putting our 270 00:12:41,679 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 8: national security at risk. You see a ton of pieces 271 00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:48,480 Speaker 8: of legislation around export controls and the Foreign Affairs Committee. 272 00:12:48,520 --> 00:12:50,960 Speaker 8: I think it speaks to this concern of the way 273 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:54,720 Speaker 8: this administration is acting and in general on the issue. 274 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 8: So Yes, in addition to what Representative Kanna had said, 275 00:12:57,840 --> 00:12:59,959 Speaker 8: I actually want to see our president take a heart 276 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 8: stand on some of these expert control some of this 277 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 8: advanced chips and looking more in the American interest. I'm 278 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:11,160 Speaker 8: also looking to making sure that this president, that President Trump, 279 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:14,840 Speaker 8: takes a much more affirmative stance and support of our 280 00:13:15,360 --> 00:13:19,400 Speaker 8: friend and partner Taiwan. I know that I just introduced legislation, 281 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,080 Speaker 8: bipartisan legislation I'm a co league with Representative Kim that 282 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:25,520 Speaker 8: would have the United States do a survey of all 283 00:13:25,559 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 8: the potential responses if there were to ever be an 284 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 8: invasion of Taiwan by China, and so I'm hoping that 285 00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:34,719 Speaker 8: the President not only step up for American farmers and 286 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 8: American interests from a national security perspective, but also to 287 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 8: be a much more ardent supporter of Taiwan's interest in 288 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:43,600 Speaker 8: these meetings. 289 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:45,480 Speaker 7: Johnny oh Carson, John L. 290 00:13:45,520 --> 00:13:49,000 Speaker 3: Jesske joining us that I feel like we can. I 291 00:13:49,040 --> 00:13:50,839 Speaker 3: feel the level of familiarity here. Over the course of 292 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:53,080 Speaker 3: this interview, people call you that I'm not making that up. 293 00:13:53,120 --> 00:13:53,560 Speaker 7: Is that right? 294 00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:54,640 Speaker 6: That's right, that's right. 295 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,720 Speaker 3: I'm former school teacher. I've read the bios. 296 00:13:58,080 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 2: Thank you for being here and for putting up with 297 00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 2: us this morning. I will have to have you back sometime. 298 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:07,199 Speaker 3: Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend. Right 299 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:20,760 Speaker 3: after this, all right, we have. 300 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:23,840 Speaker 2: More breaking news. This morning, the country's health minister, in 301 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 2: coordination with WHO and twenty two other countries, began evacuating Haunt, 302 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 2: a virus striking cruise ship in Spain's Canary Islands. 303 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 10: All the passengers remain asymptomatic. The boat has arrived at 304 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:41,720 Speaker 10: six thirty am. The entire operation is proceeding normally, and 305 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:47,000 Speaker 10: I said the first to Disembard will be the Spanish 306 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:50,840 Speaker 10: citizens and then the flight to the Netherlands will depart. 307 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:53,120 Speaker 7: Choris now is doctor Carlos til Rio. 308 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 3: He is a distinguished professor at Emory School of Medicine's 309 00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 3: Division of Infectious Diseases. 310 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 7: Doctor del Rio, thank you very much for being here. 311 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:00,680 Speaker 3: And let's pick up from what we just heard there 312 00:15:00,680 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 3: what we expect to happen here over these next few hours. 313 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 3: It sounds like many countries are marshaling aircraft to the 314 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:10,720 Speaker 3: Canary Islands to bring their citizens back to their respective countries. 315 00:15:11,200 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 3: Perhaps can just take the US as an example here. 316 00:15:13,280 --> 00:15:14,840 Speaker 3: What's going to happen here over the next twenty four 317 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 3: to thirty six hours. 318 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:20,800 Speaker 11: Well, thank you for having me. The first thing is that, unfortunately, 319 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:22,560 Speaker 11: what we hear is that the passengers that are being 320 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:25,240 Speaker 11: disembarked are old asymtomatic. In other words, they don't have 321 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,880 Speaker 11: any symptoms of ntavirus, which means maybe they're not infected yet. 322 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 11: We don't know. They could still have been infected and 323 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:33,000 Speaker 11: they're going to have developed symptoms later. So the first 324 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:35,640 Speaker 11: thing that's going to happen is all passengers will undergo 325 00:15:35,680 --> 00:15:38,000 Speaker 11: a health screening. They're going to be you know, question, 326 00:15:38,080 --> 00:15:40,400 Speaker 11: they're going to have physical exams, they may draw some blood, 327 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 11: and then after they decide whether they're truly a symtomatic 328 00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:45,240 Speaker 11: or not, they'll put them on a plane and the 329 00:15:45,280 --> 00:15:48,760 Speaker 11: American citizens are going to come over to a serious 330 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:51,560 Speaker 11: communical disease unit at the University of Nebraska, which is 331 00:15:51,600 --> 00:15:53,960 Speaker 11: fairly large, and they're going to be then a process 332 00:15:54,000 --> 00:15:56,800 Speaker 11: again over there, and if they happen to be sintomatic, 333 00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 11: if there's anything that suggestions of infection, they'll be kept 334 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:04,320 Speaker 11: in isolation. Otherwise that they still cline to be asyantobatic, 335 00:16:04,760 --> 00:16:08,160 Speaker 11: they'll be sent home and encouraged to quarantine and to 336 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 11: watch themselves for the next six to eight weeks. 337 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:13,800 Speaker 2: Deta, I want to ask you how this spreads, because 338 00:16:14,320 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 2: I know that it is usually something that you get 339 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 2: by coming into contact with animal droppings that have this virus. 340 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:22,800 Speaker 2: It is not usually spread from person to person, or 341 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:25,600 Speaker 2: there can be prevailing wisdom is that if you get 342 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 2: it from person person, you have to be in very 343 00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 2: close contact. That some of the reports we're seeing from 344 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:31,840 Speaker 2: the ship is that not all of these individuals who 345 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 2: have tested positive for this virus were in close enough 346 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 2: contact that virologists would usually assume they were susceptible to 347 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:40,560 Speaker 2: contracting the virus. I know this is a different strain 348 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 2: than we have here in the US, and that is 349 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 2: more possible. But is that concerning that this seems to 350 00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,520 Speaker 2: be a method of transmission that this virus doesn't usually take. 351 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 11: No, it actually does this, and hintavirus is the only 352 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,240 Speaker 11: one that's spressed person to person. And there was an 353 00:16:55,240 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 11: outbreak in Argentina in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen where some 354 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:01,120 Speaker 11: of the things that you're mentioning actually had some person 355 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:03,080 Speaker 11: just got infected because they were in the same room 356 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:05,040 Speaker 11: with another person that was infected, or they were in 357 00:17:05,080 --> 00:17:07,720 Speaker 11: the same bathroom. It is very clear that if you 358 00:17:07,800 --> 00:17:10,879 Speaker 11: have very close intimate contact, for example, in this case 359 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:13,720 Speaker 11: the index case, then his wife got infected. They were 360 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 11: in the same cabin, they could have been you know, 361 00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:19,240 Speaker 11: intimate sexually. There's a lot of reasons why the wife 362 00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 11: got infected so quickly and then developed symptoms, But that 363 00:17:23,320 --> 00:17:25,280 Speaker 11: doesn't mean, you know, it's an all or non phenomena. 364 00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 6: And clearly there's a lot. 365 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 11: Of things about the transmission we don't fully understand. And 366 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:32,159 Speaker 11: I think this this outbreak is going to help us 367 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:34,960 Speaker 11: try to understand that it is very clear that the 368 00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:37,640 Speaker 11: closer you are, the more intimate contact, the more likely 369 00:17:37,680 --> 00:17:40,360 Speaker 11: you are to get infected. But that doesn't mean that 370 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:42,879 Speaker 11: we have not seen sort of what appears to be 371 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 11: fairly casual mechanisms of infection. 372 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:49,640 Speaker 3: I'm curious about the global public health apparatus that's being 373 00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,120 Speaker 3: marshaled to bear here in tenter Reef. So the United 374 00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:54,159 Speaker 3: States has pulled out of the World Health Organization. That's 375 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,919 Speaker 3: something that's changed since the COVID nineteen pandemic, and I 376 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 3: wonder what the consequences are to that as you see them, 377 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:03,639 Speaker 3: as we watch this this effort unfold, and what we 378 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,680 Speaker 3: can learn from this experience. Yes, this may not lead 379 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:07,719 Speaker 3: to the kind of global pandemic that we saw with 380 00:18:07,720 --> 00:18:10,159 Speaker 3: with COVID nineteen, but what can we learn from the 381 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,880 Speaker 3: way that governments respond to this crisis that's breaking out 382 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:13,359 Speaker 3: on this ship. 383 00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 11: Well, you know, first of all, I want to say 384 00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 11: that the World Herald Organization has really done a remarkable job, 385 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:22,359 Speaker 11: starting with their Director General, doctor Tedrose, and then the 386 00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:25,960 Speaker 11: rest of the WHO team, Maria van Kerhoven and her team, 387 00:18:26,280 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 11: They've done a tremendous job. You know, doctor Tedros is 388 00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 11: there inside in Tenerief, helping and providing leadership and talking 389 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:35,320 Speaker 11: to the Spanish government and ensuring that the boat was 390 00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 11: able to dock over there and the passengers can be 391 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:42,080 Speaker 11: safely and securely disembarked. I think we have seen a 392 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 11: much diminished CDC. If you think about a prior outbreak, 393 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 11: let's think the outbreak of Ebola. CDC very quickly was involved, 394 00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:52,919 Speaker 11: very CDC very quickly sent a team over there. CDC 395 00:18:53,080 --> 00:18:56,440 Speaker 11: was providing something very important, which is technical assistance. We're 396 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:58,760 Speaker 11: not seeing a lot of technical assistance happening for CDC 397 00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 11: right now. In fact, it almost seems like the CDC 398 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:06,080 Speaker 11: response occurred after many, many days. It was almost too late, 399 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:09,479 Speaker 11: too little, too late. And that's unfortunate because you know, 400 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:12,160 Speaker 11: we need a strong CDC. As American citizens, we want 401 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:14,600 Speaker 11: a strong CDC. We want a CDC that as a 402 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,600 Speaker 11: leader in global health, not only naturally but globally. And 403 00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:21,280 Speaker 11: to see such a diminish CDC to me, as an 404 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:24,800 Speaker 11: infectiousy physician and as a public health expert, is actually 405 00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:26,000 Speaker 11: quite painful. 406 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,639 Speaker 2: And that seems to compound the concern. People really are 407 00:19:28,680 --> 00:19:30,479 Speaker 2: stressed about this. We were talking yesterday about how we've 408 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,400 Speaker 2: literally heard people on the street in Manhattan talking about it, 409 00:19:34,280 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 2: and then the WHO director, doctor Tedros, was talking about 410 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 2: the concern of a wider spread of this virus. I 411 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:42,080 Speaker 2: want you to listen to what he said. 412 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 12: The concern is legitimate because we have all experience because 413 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:55,720 Speaker 12: of COVID, especially in twenty twenty, and that trauma is 414 00:19:55,760 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 12: still in our minds. So people will have questions, people 415 00:19:59,720 --> 00:20:02,800 Speaker 12: who have concerns, and that's what I try to address 416 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 12: in my message to the people of Tenerife. We hear you, 417 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:11,720 Speaker 12: we understand, but the situation is much better now. 418 00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:14,119 Speaker 2: How worried should people be that this is not an 419 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:15,160 Speaker 2: isolated outbreak? 420 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 11: I think about this one. 421 00:20:18,520 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 6: I would not be worried. 422 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:21,560 Speaker 11: I agree with doctor Tenders. I think there's still a 423 00:20:21,640 --> 00:20:23,960 Speaker 11: lot of trauma left from COVID, But I would say, 424 00:20:23,960 --> 00:20:24,679 Speaker 11: don't be worried. 425 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 6: But this is not. 426 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 11: The first outbreak. 427 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:28,080 Speaker 6: This is not the last outbreak. 428 00:20:28,119 --> 00:20:30,280 Speaker 11: What I were worried about is that we will continue 429 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,280 Speaker 11: to see these kind of outbreaks. Were continue to have 430 00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 11: outbreaks like this one. Believe me, a hand of ours 431 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:36,840 Speaker 11: in a cruise ship was not in my bigger card 432 00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:38,680 Speaker 11: of things that was going to happen in a cruise ship, 433 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 11: and yet it happened. So we're going to see more 434 00:20:40,600 --> 00:20:43,440 Speaker 11: things like this one. And what people in the US 435 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 11: need to be worried about is our public health infrastructure. 436 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 11: They need to be worried about. We can CDC. The 437 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:52,199 Speaker 11: CDC has been significantly diminished in relevance and a lot 438 00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:54,720 Speaker 11: of people have left, all lot of expertise have left CDC. 439 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:56,879 Speaker 11: So I would say that what. 440 00:20:56,760 --> 00:20:58,639 Speaker 6: We need to ask for and what we need to 441 00:20:58,640 --> 00:20:59,240 Speaker 6: be worried. 442 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 11: About is the state or public health and global health 443 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,840 Speaker 11: expertise in our country rather than this specific outburg. 444 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,560 Speaker 3: Carlos Silrio, Professor, Demberg University, thank you very much for 445 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:09,920 Speaker 3: the time on this Sunday mornings who watched those images 446 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:13,359 Speaker 3: from tenor Reef, those passengers getting off of that cruise 447 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,720 Speaker 3: vessel getting onto a series of plans. Christina and I 448 00:21:15,720 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 3: think what we heard there about what happens next is 449 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,520 Speaker 3: just fascinating. That US pastors will be brought to Nebraska. 450 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:22,959 Speaker 3: We talked a bit about that yesterday. The sophisticated facility 451 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 3: there at the University of Nebraska has and they'll be 452 00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:27,440 Speaker 3: a quarantine that I think will last many days, if 453 00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:29,919 Speaker 3: not several weeks. It has been used for abola and 454 00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 3: for COVID nineteen. 455 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:36,120 Speaker 2: After that, stay with us for more on Bloomberg this Weekend. 456 00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:51,200 Speaker 4: Right after this, welcome back to Bloomberg this weekend. I'm 457 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 4: Lisa Matteo. Now as we take a moment today to 458 00:21:53,760 --> 00:21:56,720 Speaker 4: reflect on the moms in our lives, we're also aware 459 00:21:56,760 --> 00:22:00,960 Speaker 4: of the emotional but also the financial that parents are 460 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:03,119 Speaker 4: putting into their children. It is a topic of the 461 00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:06,639 Speaker 4: Bloomberg Weekend essay as well as the book over Invested, 462 00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:10,600 Speaker 4: The Emotional Economy of Modern Parenting. Joining us now is 463 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,920 Speaker 4: Nina Bundel. She is professor of sociology at U SEE Irvine. 464 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:17,520 Speaker 4: She is the author and joins me now. Nina, thank 465 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:21,320 Speaker 4: you and pleasure speaking with you today. This article itself, 466 00:22:21,359 --> 00:22:24,240 Speaker 4: let's start there first, it's about how parenting is changing 467 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:27,120 Speaker 4: in the twenty first century. There's a lot of things 468 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,760 Speaker 4: that parents are going through, right, the money, the time, 469 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 4: the investment into our children. The big question is always 470 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:36,919 Speaker 4: on our minds. Are we doing enough? My question to 471 00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 4: you is is enough? Exactly? 472 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:40,399 Speaker 2: Like? 473 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 4: What is that enough? What is are we looking for? 474 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:45,000 Speaker 4: What is enough? Exactly? 475 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:50,440 Speaker 13: Well, thank you so much Lisa for asking this question, 476 00:22:50,960 --> 00:22:55,680 Speaker 13: because lots of parents are so concerned and so exhausted 477 00:22:55,720 --> 00:23:00,919 Speaker 13: this these days, because we invest emotionally in financially and 478 00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 13: we want to do the best for our children, and 479 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:09,640 Speaker 13: I think partly continuously asking this question is very burdensome. 480 00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:14,040 Speaker 13: It creates this slow grade dread in our gut that 481 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,399 Speaker 13: we think we need to listen to all the time, 482 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 13: and it's hard to quiet it. So I would say 483 00:23:19,320 --> 00:23:24,560 Speaker 13: it's important to know that social forces influence how we 484 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 13: behave as parents, how we even feel as parents, and 485 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:31,720 Speaker 13: these days, this exhaustion listening to all of the advice 486 00:23:32,119 --> 00:23:34,800 Speaker 13: is making us really tired and drained. 487 00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:37,640 Speaker 4: I feel you in it. I have to admit personally 488 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 4: I've invested a lot, but both of my kids are athletes, 489 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,560 Speaker 4: and so the private lessons, the hotel stays, the car 490 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:47,640 Speaker 4: rental is the best top equipment. I mean, you name it, 491 00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:49,879 Speaker 4: we've invested in it. But I want to bring you 492 00:23:49,920 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 4: something something that you say. You say kids are viewed 493 00:23:52,800 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 4: through the lens of human capital, So what exactly do 494 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 4: you mean by that? 495 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,879 Speaker 13: So this investment that you just pointed to Lisa, in 496 00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:07,080 Speaker 13: extracurricular activities in sports and skills that kids can develop 497 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:11,119 Speaker 13: in addition to going to school. Those are the capabilities 498 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:16,880 Speaker 13: and skills overall that we call human capital, and economists 499 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 13: have proposed that if we invest in human capital of children, 500 00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:28,440 Speaker 13: then children could reap returns on this investment in their adulthood. 501 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:31,640 Speaker 13: So not only do we do this when kids get 502 00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:37,000 Speaker 13: to school or even higher education to get their occupations, 503 00:24:37,280 --> 00:24:41,040 Speaker 13: but parents should be concerned about this earlier and earlier, 504 00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:44,720 Speaker 13: potentially even in the womb. Right, make the womb the 505 00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:47,920 Speaker 13: first classroom by worrying a lot about what we do 506 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 13: when we're even pregnant as moms. 507 00:24:50,359 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 4: Well, let's talk about this parental shift in reasoning and thought. 508 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:56,120 Speaker 4: There's a quote you have in the article. I want 509 00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 4: to get to it. It says, a century ago, children labored 510 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:03,200 Speaker 4: for families. Today parents labor for their children, not just financially, 511 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:07,719 Speaker 4: We toil at parenting. So what driving this shift? 512 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:13,480 Speaker 13: That's an excellent question, a million dollar question, if I may, 513 00:25:13,920 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 13: And it took me ten years to write this book 514 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,920 Speaker 13: and research this phenomenon over the course of decades, but 515 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,040 Speaker 13: to be very brief, we you know, at the turn 516 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 13: of the twentieth century saw transformation when children were useful 517 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:32,240 Speaker 13: in the home, they were working, contributing to the family 518 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:37,560 Speaker 13: economically and even in the factories on the farm. Of course, 519 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:42,160 Speaker 13: a childhood chores in the home, and then they became 520 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:48,119 Speaker 13: emotionally priceless, mostly seen as vulnerable, and we would start 521 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:51,720 Speaker 13: investing into their education. And this new period is when 522 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:56,400 Speaker 13: we as parents think of children as investment projects. We 523 00:25:56,560 --> 00:26:00,439 Speaker 13: in a way bring the logic from the workplace into 524 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 13: the home. We think about all of the things that 525 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:06,400 Speaker 13: we need to do toil at parenting, as I say 526 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 13: in the book, overinvested, and try to think about what 527 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:15,840 Speaker 13: is needed from us so that children could be set 528 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,120 Speaker 13: up as well as possible for success. 529 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,439 Speaker 4: And it seems like moms are taking a lot of 530 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,320 Speaker 4: the brunt of this to you, what are the consequences 531 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 4: to what you call actually child rearing on steroids? Right? 532 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:31,600 Speaker 13: Trying to be a little bit provocative here to note 533 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,359 Speaker 13: that this is not just run of the mill child rearing. 534 00:26:35,440 --> 00:26:39,399 Speaker 13: This is not natural, does not have to be the case. 535 00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:44,719 Speaker 13: We've seen differences across time and in different countries. And 536 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:48,439 Speaker 13: so because it's exhausting us so much, it's time to 537 00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,520 Speaker 13: ask the question, what do we really owe our children? 538 00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 13: Is it this exhausting, draining financially and emotionally parenting or 539 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 13: is it time to think of about how much this 540 00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:05,119 Speaker 13: impacts us as parents to the point of parental burnout 541 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:08,840 Speaker 13: that US Surgeon General noted in an advisory in twenty 542 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,639 Speaker 13: twenty four, calling it a public health crisis, but also 543 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 13: the consequences for our children. Are they doing all right 544 00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:18,800 Speaker 13: with all that over involved parenting? 545 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:22,159 Speaker 4: Well, Nina, you're a mother yourself. How do you find 546 00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:24,679 Speaker 4: that right balance? What's the answer? 547 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:27,960 Speaker 2: Very? 548 00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 13: Very hard. I will be the first one to admit 549 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:34,439 Speaker 13: that it's so hard to change. It feels impossible to 550 00:27:34,560 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 13: do differently. And I live in the same reality as 551 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:42,160 Speaker 13: everyone else. But it is social pressures and social norms 552 00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,240 Speaker 13: and the structures that we have in our society that 553 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:51,879 Speaker 13: are not very supportive of families that influence how we 554 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:56,639 Speaker 13: are in this modern parenting reality, very troubled parenting reality. 555 00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:01,399 Speaker 13: So I say to myself from time to time, Nina, 556 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:07,240 Speaker 13: your child is not an investment project. Parenting is not 557 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:11,439 Speaker 13: supposed to be grueling labor. It's not supposed to be 558 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:15,320 Speaker 13: so stressful. What can we do differently today? How can 559 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:19,880 Speaker 13: I seek other moms to think about this together? Because 560 00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:23,560 Speaker 13: only as a society we can make true change. 561 00:28:23,840 --> 00:28:26,640 Speaker 4: Oh, Nita, you make it sound so easy. Thank you 562 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:29,080 Speaker 4: so much, really appreciate the time. The name of the 563 00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:34,080 Speaker 4: book again is over Invested the emotional Economy of modern parenting. 564 00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:39,320 Speaker 4: Stay with us for more on Bloomberg this weekend. Right 565 00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 4: after this. 566 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,200 Speaker 7: Both time for this weekend's pointed news quiz. I'm excited 567 00:28:54,280 --> 00:28:56,000 Speaker 7: as always to see how I fare. 568 00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:57,680 Speaker 3: I know you're excited as well. Let's go to Lisa 569 00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 3: my Table's the categories. 570 00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,360 Speaker 2: What torture do you have for today? 571 00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,240 Speaker 4: Okay, So for those of you playing at home, maybe 572 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 4: you're not familiar with the game. Okay, so we have 573 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:06,880 Speaker 4: three different categories. They each have ten chips and groups 574 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:09,040 Speaker 4: of three, so thirty ships total in front of them. 575 00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 4: They will base their bets on each category. So if 576 00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,240 Speaker 4: they feel comfortable about the first one, you can maybe 577 00:29:14,240 --> 00:29:16,480 Speaker 4: put ten, maybe you want to put twenty, depending on 578 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 4: which you have your whiteboards and you write your answers. 579 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 4: There are you ready for your Yeah. 580 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 3: In the past, I've not put ten on each and it's. 581 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 2: So I'm just gonna split. 582 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,880 Speaker 7: A strategy. I've watched her success week after week. 583 00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 4: I think he's onto. I think he's onto Christina. 584 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 7: Okay. 585 00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 4: The first one is Ted Turner, second is pharmaceuticals, and 586 00:29:41,200 --> 00:29:45,800 Speaker 4: the third is finance. Great categories, all good categories. You 587 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:51,080 Speaker 4: ready for Ted Turner. For those of you playing at home, 588 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:52,800 Speaker 4: why not? There's no multiple choice for you if you're 589 00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 4: playing right now. Ted Turner's idea to broadcast the local 590 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 4: station to a broader range of cable systems started a 591 00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 4: new TV concept called what what is this TV concept? 592 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:10,160 Speaker 7: New TV? Okay, all right, think about it. 593 00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:10,960 Speaker 2: What it's called? 594 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:12,280 Speaker 11: This group? 595 00:30:12,760 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 4: Okay reads superstation TVs, superstation super as well. 596 00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 3: I always wondered what that meant when I was a 597 00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 3: kid watching TV. 598 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:27,480 Speaker 13: That's what that means. 599 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 4: Superstations, super station. 600 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:33,760 Speaker 2: Alright, you're going to ask the ex wife, was I 601 00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:34,640 Speaker 2: was ready for that one? 602 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:36,880 Speaker 4: That's definitely not on. 603 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,120 Speaker 7: Very nice yeah, remarks upon the passing, you. 604 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 2: Called him her favorite ex husband puts it on this aspire. 605 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 7: There you go, such a memory. 606 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 4: Pharmaceutic All right, there we go. Okay, Eli, Lilly's mon duro. Okay, 607 00:30:56,600 --> 00:31:00,600 Speaker 4: it's surpast which mark cancer therapy as the world highest 608 00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:05,000 Speaker 4: grossing prescription medication. What is the name of that cancer 609 00:31:05,200 --> 00:31:08,520 Speaker 4: therapy medication? Prescription medication from. 610 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:13,680 Speaker 7: Merk pills kids. There, it's like a spelling Bee. 611 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:15,200 Speaker 2: This is not going well. 612 00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 4: But interesting though, right Monduro surpassed marks cancer therapy. 613 00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 2: It's kind of crazy. 614 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:23,360 Speaker 4: I know it's an interesting topic. What is the name 615 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,640 Speaker 4: of that cancer therapy description? Do you have no idea? 616 00:31:27,520 --> 00:31:34,440 Speaker 7: You advertising? 617 00:31:34,920 --> 00:31:37,000 Speaker 4: If if you're playing it online, they do give you 618 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 4: multiple choices, you'll have a better chance. 619 00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:45,760 Speaker 2: Going to. 620 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:48,640 Speaker 7: Finance is going to be the secret to our shared success. 621 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:50,320 Speaker 4: Oh you got this one? I know you don't have 622 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 4: this one. 623 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:52,560 Speaker 7: I appreciate that you're going. 624 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,719 Speaker 4: To go all in. Okay, which billionaire ceo rallied against 625 00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 4: New York City Mayor Mondami for signaling him out in 626 00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:01,480 Speaker 4: a plan to tax Second, you just talked we did. 627 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, talked about two of them though, So which one 628 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:05,760 Speaker 3: was it? 629 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,880 Speaker 2: I can't My brain is fried and I don't care 630 00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:15,240 Speaker 2: a smile. All right, that's all I got. That's all 631 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:15,520 Speaker 2: I got. 632 00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 7: What'd you right, Ken Griff? I told you sweet as. 633 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:24,280 Speaker 4: The mayor called him out two hundred and thirty eight 634 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 4: million dollars Central Park. 635 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,480 Speaker 3: So yes, Donna filed this video in which she showed 636 00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:30,720 Speaker 3: that behind him and Ken Griffin didn't appreciate that. I 637 00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:32,400 Speaker 3: should Saykim Griffin, I believe it doesn't live in that 638 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:33,520 Speaker 3: apartment very much. 639 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:35,320 Speaker 2: So he does. 640 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 7: A plus million dollars. We're just gonna take these che No, 641 00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:44,200 Speaker 7: you got a bonus. No, she lost, she's. 642 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,280 Speaker 4: Taking yet nothing, she's lost anything. 643 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:49,560 Speaker 3: Happening it for fun, doing it for fun, and I'm 644 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:50,160 Speaker 3: feeling great. 645 00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:51,160 Speaker 7: He's feeling really good. 646 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:54,640 Speaker 4: Right now, we're going to talk about this elon Musk 647 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 4: is a bonus. The question is SpaceX is proposing to 648 00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,360 Speaker 4: spend at least fifty five billion dollar on a semiconductor 649 00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:06,600 Speaker 4: facility alongside Tesla. It's the first step on what Musk project? 650 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 4: What is the name of this project he's working on 651 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,840 Speaker 4: to make these trips? You remember I got the name 652 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:19,200 Speaker 4: of it HYPERI No, no, no, Terrafab, Tifab yes, Tarafab 653 00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 4: is it. He wants to make the chips for all 654 00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:24,320 Speaker 4: his different enterprises, different business Listen, we didn't. 655 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 3: Get that, boss, but I'm happy that I won the game. 656 00:33:27,240 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 7: You have won. 657 00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:29,960 Speaker 4: We have to mark this down. 658 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:31,680 Speaker 7: This is very thank you. Well, we don't have to 659 00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:33,120 Speaker 7: make that big a deal about it. It's not like. 660 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 13: I mean, but look at your face. 661 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:41,880 Speaker 2: Wait, a long weekend and lots of news are Tansburg 662 00:33:41,960 --> 00:33:43,719 Speaker 2: very hard. It's a nice way to end the weekend. 663 00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:45,080 Speaker 2: We'll give you this one, but I'm coming for. 664 00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:45,560 Speaker 6: You next week. 665 00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,280 Speaker 2: Thanks for joining us on today's Bloomberg This Weekend podcast. 666 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:53,680 Speaker 2: Don't forget to tune in live for the show every 667 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:56,360 Speaker 2: Saturday and Sunday morning, starting at seven am Eastern. 668 00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 3: We're on Bloomberg Television Radio and the Bloomberg Business App, 669 00:33:59,520 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 3: bringing you unique takes and in depth interviews on news, politics, lifestyle, 670 00:34:03,800 --> 00:34:04,360 Speaker 3: and culture.