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Speaker 2: Hello Next Picture Show listeners, here's a friendly reminder that

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Speaker 3: It's very difficult to keep the line between the past.

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Speaker 2: And the press.

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Speaker 4: You believe that someone out of the past can enter

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Speaker 4: and take possession of a living being.

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Speaker 2: We may be true with the past, but the past

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Speaker 2: is not true with us. Welcome to the Next Picture Show.

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Speaker 2: A Movie the Week podcast devoted to a classic film

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Speaker 2: and how it shaped our thoughts on a recent release.

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Speaker 2: I'm Scott to Buy Us Here with.

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Speaker 5: Keith Pepps and Genevieve Koski Dude.

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Speaker 2: A Mechanical Failure. Our regular co host, Tasha Robinson is

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Speaker 2: currently entering Russian airspace and we have been unsuccessful in

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Speaker 2: calling her back, but nevertheless, we have decided to press

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Speaker 2: on and invite our friend Jason Bailey to host in

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Speaker 2: her place. Jason is a freelance film critic, author, and podcaster.

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Speaker 2: You have seen his work in The New York Times, Vulture, Slate,

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Speaker 2: Rolling Stone, Crooked, Marquee, and Bloomberg. He currently co hosts

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Speaker 2: Guide for the Film Fanatic, a podcast inspired by the

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Speaker 2: Great Danny Peery book. He's also the author of several books,

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Speaker 2: most recently the biography Gandolfini, Jim Tony, and the Life

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Speaker 2: of a Legend. Welcome Jason. You're busy. You sound really busy, Jason.

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Speaker 2: This is a lot of stuff.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 6: I've discovered cocaine and I'm fine. I'm getting everything done.

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Speaker 6: It's all said. Thank you guys so much for having me.

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Speaker 7: It worked out well for Gandolfini, so you.

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Speaker 6: Know, it really is such a thrill to come on.

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Speaker 6: I love this show. I admire all of you so

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Speaker 6: very very much from clearback in the av Club days.

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Speaker 6: Thank you for having me.

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Speaker 2: Yes, for sure, it's been a long time coming. So

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Speaker 2: there was a nice long stretch, especially during the Cold War,

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Speaker 2: when the threat of nuclear annihilation heavily clouded the nightmares

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Speaker 2: of multiple generations who believe that the world was vulnerable

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Speaker 2: to technical or political failures, or more simply the impulses

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Speaker 2: of a madman. Those fears seem to have dissipated with

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Speaker 2: the breakup of the Soviet Union and the emergence of epidemics,

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Speaker 2: climate change, and other threats. But are we any more

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Speaker 2: safe from nukes? Now? That's not a question we'll be

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Speaker 2: answering directly on our Humble Movie podcast, but it's certainly

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Speaker 2: one that our pairing this week has us thinking about. Genevieve.

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Speaker 2: Pick up the red phone and please tell our listeners

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Speaker 2: what we're talking about this week.

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Speaker 5: With her new thriller A House of Dynamite, Catherine Bigelow

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Speaker 5: approaches a nuclear scenario with the same docu drama intensity

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Speaker 5: as previous films like The hurt Locker, Zero, Dark thirty

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Speaker 5: and Detroit. The premise of the movie is simple. A

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Speaker 5: single nuclear missile has been launched toward the American Midwest

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Speaker 5: by an unknown enemy. The ICBM is initially assumed to

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Speaker 5: be a test, but when it's determined to be a

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Speaker 5: genuine threat, various high level officials spring into action and

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Speaker 5: face an ever more narrowing series of options. This scenario

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Speaker 5: more or less mirrors the one in Sidney Lamette's nineteen

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Speaker 5: sixty four classic Failsafe, a chillingly realistic thriller about a

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Speaker 5: technical error that sends a group of US strategic bombers

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Speaker 5: toward Moscow with a nuclear payload. When calling the bomber's

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Speaker 5: back becomes impossible, the President in his military brass have

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Speaker 5: to consider drastic stuff to prevent a war that will

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Speaker 5: annihilate both sides.

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Speaker 2: So this week we'll turn back the clock over sixty

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Speaker 2: years to see how the fear of nuclear catastrophe is

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Speaker 2: expressed in seeing the limits failsafe. Then we'll come back

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Speaker 2: next week to discover those fears haven't changed much at

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Speaker 2: all in a house of dynamite, which is not the

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Speaker 2: Jimmy Walker biopic you may have been expecting. Please join us.

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Speaker 9: Those a Vindicator bombers of a Strategic Air Command on

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Speaker 9: routine patrol. Each plane carries two twenty megaton hydrogen bombs

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Speaker 9: designed to detonate over enemy targets at any given moment,

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Speaker 9: night or day. Flights of those airplanes are in the

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Speaker 9: air set fail safebox open operational days.

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Speaker 2: In nineteen sixty four, Columbia Pictures released two black and

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Speaker 2: white movies with virtually identical premises. A fleet of American

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Speaker 2: bombers with nuclear missiles are incorrectly ordered to drop their

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Speaker 2: payload in the Soviet Union, and they cannot be called back,

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Speaker 2: leading to awkward conversations between the American president and his

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Speaker 2: Soviet counterpart. Both even feature a character named Buck. The

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Speaker 2: first of the two was released in late January Stanley

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Speaker 2: Kubrick's Doctor Strangelove and inspired send up of Cold War

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Speaker 2: tensions that is widely considered the greatest satire in film history.

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Speaker 2: The second was released in early October Sidney Lumet's Failsafe,

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Speaker 2: which opened to stronger views but tanked at the box office.

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Speaker 2: It would have been like releasing Airport after airplane for audiences.

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Speaker 2: It was deja vus without the laughs. Yet fail Safe

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Speaker 2: deserves to be loved on its own formidable merits. Once

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Speaker 2: you get past its similarities to Doctor Strangelove, you can

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Speaker 2: pick up on the differences, starting with a commitment to

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Speaker 2: its no nuke's message that pursues a frighteningly plausible premise

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Speaker 2: to the bleakest imaginable conclusion. Those who argue for deterrence,

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Speaker 2: which is to say, the mutual incentive for countries with

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Speaker 2: nuclear bombs not to fire on each other, are given

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Speaker 2: no quarter. In Failsafe, the argument that triggers American planes

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Speaker 2: to move forward with a peremptive strike on Moscow happens

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Speaker 2: by accident and cannot be reversed, due ironically to the

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Speaker 2: safeguards the military has placed on such a scenario. But

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Speaker 2: what's so compelling about the film is that the President

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Speaker 2: and his top military officials are quickly forced to consider

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Speaker 2: drastic options, from shooting down their own planes at a minimum,

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Speaker 2: to offering up the destruction of a major American city

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Speaker 2: as a show of good faith just to prevent an

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Speaker 2: all out nuclear holocaust. It's one thing for Buck Turgenson

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Speaker 2: and doctor Shot Rangelove to talk about ten or twenty

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Speaker 2: million dead Americans as getting our hair must. It's quite

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Speaker 2: another to look that possibility square on the eye. Much

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Speaker 2: like the Kubrick film, fail Safe reserves plenty of contempt

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Speaker 2: for the decadence of powerful men throwing such numbers around casually.

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Speaker 2: In an early scene in Failsafe, a fervent anti communist

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Speaker 2: professor played by Walter Mathau, startled guests at an elite

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Speaker 2: soiree with his cavalier language about the possibility of nuclear

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Speaker 2: war ending the threat of communism. It's more startling still

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Speaker 2: to see him turn up later as an influential voice

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Speaker 2: in the middle of a genuine nuclear crisis. Due to

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Speaker 2: a series of technical errors, a fleet of six Mockti

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Speaker 2: Vindicator bombers are given the signal to fly across the

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Speaker 2: Arctic and into the Soviet territory, with the lead bomber

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Speaker 2: is to drop two nuclear bombs on Moscow. The planes

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Speaker 2: cannot be recalled through radio because past a certain point

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Speaker 2: the pilots are trained to ignore voices that the enemy

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Speaker 2: could imitate. Several important men convene to consider some grim options.

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Speaker 2: These include the present played by Henry Fonda, who brings

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Speaker 2: much the same decency and gravity here as he did

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Speaker 2: as a skeptical juror in Lumette's debut feature Twelve Angry Men.

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Speaker 2: In the War Room, the President communicates chiefly with General

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Speaker 2: Bogan played by Frank Overton, who's in charge of Strategic

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Speaker 2: Air Command, but there are other influential thinkers in the

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Speaker 2: room too, including Air Force Colonel Cassio played by Fritz Weaver,

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Speaker 2: who objects vociferously to the order to shoot down the

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Speaker 2: US bombers, and Brigadier General Black played by Dan o'hurleyhey,

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Speaker 2: who's been haunted by just such a nightmare in his dreams.

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Speaker 2: There's also the President's interpreter, Buck played by Larry Hagman,

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Speaker 2: who's told to listen as much to the tone of

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Speaker 2: the Soviet Premier's voice as to the words he's sang.

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Speaker 2: Among the more compelling of Failsafe's themes is the relationship

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Speaker 2: between human beings and machines. The whole idea of nuclear

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Speaker 2: war is so odious that no one wants to take

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Speaker 2: responsibility for triggering one, and so these machines exist as

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Speaker 2: a kind of buffer between human beings and the potential

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Speaker 2: for mass death. Yet those machines prove as fallible as

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Speaker 2: the humans who rely on them. The computer short that

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Speaker 2: results in the wrong signal being sent to US bombers

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Speaker 2: turns out to be a collaboration between American equipment and

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Speaker 2: the Soviet's ability to jam radio communications. By contrast, the

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Speaker 2: conversations between the President and the Soviet premiere are quite

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Speaker 2: rational and thoughtful, even if the situation leads them both

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Speaker 2: to consider the least tragic of unimaginably catastrophic outcomes. The

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Speaker 2: ending of Failsafe is uncompromising and bleak, intended to rattle

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Speaker 2: audiences out of complacency. Over sixty years later, we seem

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Speaker 2: quite a lot more complacent. Even though we might imagine

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Speaker 2: the conversation between our current president and his Russian counterpart

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Speaker 2: to be far less measured than it is in the movie,

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Speaker 2: Failsafe still has the power to shock. We'll see how

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Speaker 2: much it rattled us after this. We do not think

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Speaker 2: we have much of a check. I know.

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Speaker 4: You assume, and yet this was nobody's fault. I don't agree.

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Speaker 4: No human being did wrong. No one is to be blamed.

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Speaker 4: We're to blame both of us. We let our machines

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Speaker 4: get out of hands. It was an accident. Two great

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Speaker 4: cities may be destroyed, millions of innocent people killed. What

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Speaker 4: do we say to the mister chairman, accidents will happen.

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Speaker 4: I won't accept that. Yes, all I know is that

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Speaker 4: as long as we have we all I know is

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Speaker 4: that men are responsible. We're responsible for what happens to

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Speaker 4: us today. We had a taste to the future. Do

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Speaker 4: we learn from her to run the way we have?

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Speaker 4: What do we do, mister chairman, what do we say

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Speaker 4: to the dead?

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Speaker 2: Let's start with the question suggested by the end of

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Speaker 2: my keynote sixty years later. Are you rattled by the

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Speaker 2: experience of watching Failsafe?

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Speaker 6: I mean, I definitely am. I find this picture to

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Speaker 6: be so nerve jangling and so unnerving, and partly because

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Speaker 6: of you know, we mentioned the sort of docu drama

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Speaker 6: immediacy that Bigelow is using, and I think that is

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Speaker 6: a pretty direct lift from what's happening here. I mean,

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Speaker 6: part of the reason that this film is so upsetting

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Speaker 6: is because it seems so immensely credible, because it seems

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Speaker 6: eavesdropped upon, because there's a sort of a hypnotic hyper

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Speaker 6: logic to it, like nothing that happens stretches credibility. You

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Speaker 6: understand all of the small pieces, all the sort of

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Speaker 6: nuts and bolts of how something like this could occur

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Speaker 6: and how it would be reacted to, all the way

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Speaker 6: up to and including the ending, which I'm sure we'll

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Speaker 6: talk about in greater depth, but is one of the

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Speaker 6: most sort of merciless endings I think that's ever been

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Speaker 6: attached to a major studio release, at least to my knowledge.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, I very much was unsettled by it, and I

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Speaker 10: realized that my previous exposure to this film, I think

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Speaker 10: I personally kind of went to the same reaction as

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Speaker 10: the American public in the sixties where I saw Doctor

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Speaker 10: Strange Love. I love Doctor Strange Love, and then I

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Speaker 10: always thought of this as sort of like the lesser,

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Speaker 10: you know, square companion piece that I think I watched

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Speaker 10: in history class, and I'm not sure I went back

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Speaker 10: to it since sin and boy did it really work

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Speaker 10: on me this time though it was It was for

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Speaker 10: all the reasons you laid out, plus, like you know,

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Speaker 10: I just Lumette is just so good at like bringing

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Speaker 10: the immediacy of his television background to this really but

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Speaker 10: with these really cinematic compositions, like it's kind of the

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Speaker 10: best of both worlds. So in this film, I thought

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Speaker 10: it's remarkable, and the performances too, were fantastic.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, this is my first time with this film, and

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Speaker 5: I saw it after The Big Low, which I kind

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Speaker 5: of regret because they are so kind of similar than

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Speaker 5: their setup that it's kind of hard not to compare

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Speaker 5: what this is doing to the more immediate to my

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Speaker 5: experience feeling House of Dynamite. You know, so sort of

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Speaker 5: the Cold War context of this movie, it places it

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Speaker 5: somewhat of a remove you know, just on a narrative level,

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Speaker 5: And not that that narrative is any less distressing being removed,

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Speaker 5: because as this pairing shows, these are these fears have

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Speaker 5: not gone away. So the question was, like, was the

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Speaker 5: experience or was I rattled by watching this after sort

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Speaker 5: of the experience of House of Dynamite, I was almost

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Speaker 5: like relieved for the certainty of this, of this narrative.

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Speaker 5: I won't get more into it than that at this point,

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Speaker 5: but just the fact that it had a clear arc

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Speaker 5: to it I found comforting after the big olow that said,

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Speaker 5: all of the filmmaking of it does have that sort

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Speaker 5: of like really close claustrophobic immediate feeling right from the

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Speaker 5: very beginning with the dream of the Matador and that

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Speaker 5: squealing sound that the high pitch squealing sound might be

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Speaker 5: what sticks with me most about this movie and just

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Speaker 5: such a simple, unfussy choice that is so effective. And

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Speaker 5: also the Walter Mathou character is just so upsetting on

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Speaker 5: different levels. But the obviously the performance is great as

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Speaker 5: are many others in this film.

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Speaker 10: The Mathol character is precursor to like all the sort

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Speaker 10: of like you know, public intellectuals and chattering class types,

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Speaker 10: who is like, why does anyone listen to these people

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Speaker 10: like you so much?

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Speaker 7: Without naming names, he's just so much.

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Speaker 10: Like like there's people to pop up and have a

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Speaker 10: say and whatever's going on, And was like why why?

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Speaker 10: But I think I think part of why that is

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Speaker 10: so is you can see he is charismatic. I mean,

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Speaker 10: he's he's talking about nuclear wars, apparently quite erotic for

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Speaker 10: some of his listeners. But also but you can see

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Speaker 10: the confidence with someone like that carries himself. You can

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Speaker 10: see how that like that kind of confidence can take

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Speaker 10: a whole nation and a whole globe into some very

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Speaker 10: bad places.

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Speaker 7: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I really was struck by the way that Mathou

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Speaker 6: uses volume, or doesn't use it, the extent to which

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Speaker 6: he never, through the course of this thing, really raises

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Speaker 6: his voice in any kind of a meaningful way, and

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Speaker 6: that he's one of those people that, in fact, when

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Speaker 6: other people raise their voice, he gets quieter and more calm.

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Speaker 6: And there's something about that way of carrying yourself that

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Speaker 6: is that that really can can come off as borderline

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Speaker 6: sociopathic when you're talking about some of the things that

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Speaker 6: he's talking about, you.

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Speaker 2: Know, yeah, I mean just that incredible arrogance. And I

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Speaker 2: think that I think Keith makes a good point about

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Speaker 2: that particular type of elite. And you know, we see

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Speaker 2: it all the time where there's this profound disconnect between

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Speaker 2: what they're talking about and the lived experience of human beings. Right,

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Speaker 2: It's like, you know, you can you can toss around

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Speaker 2: numbers so casually at a dinner party and shock people

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Speaker 2: a little bit, but it's not there's nothing. It's almost

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Speaker 2: like a game, you know. And I think that the

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Speaker 2: movie really kind of sets it up that way, and

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Speaker 2: then and then brings you into the dreadful, you know,

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Speaker 2: inescapable logic of something like this actually happening, Like Okay,

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Speaker 2: what if we can't reach these planes? What then? Okay,

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Speaker 2: what's that scenario about it? Okay, so what we need

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Speaker 2: is then try to shoot down the planes. What do

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Speaker 2: we tell our counterparts and how can we aid them?

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Speaker 2: And try to shoot Ley's planes? And then when you

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Speaker 2: get to the to the worst case scenario of just

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Speaker 2: like we can't stop this one from going through this

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Speaker 2: is going to happen. What next? How do we prevent

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Speaker 2: something really a world annihilating from happening? And then you

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Speaker 2: have to make those choices. And I think that you know,

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Speaker 2: the way that this the logic that this film kind

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Speaker 2: of traps you in and then it brings you right

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Speaker 2: to the very end, that really startling conclusion. I think

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Speaker 2: it is and it's why I opened the with this

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Speaker 2: question about being rattle. I think I think the purpose

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Speaker 2: of this movie is is just to absolutely just shake

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Speaker 2: people up in a massive way, and I think it's

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Speaker 2: hugely successful in doing that because you know, what can

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Speaker 2: happen is what what I think has happened, you know,

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Speaker 2: since the end of the Cold War, which is this

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Speaker 2: false feeling of complacency even though nuclear weapons have gotten

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Speaker 2: you know, I think are you know, there's more of them,

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Speaker 2: and there are more more hands and people people who

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Speaker 2: we should have no faith in, you know, have access

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Speaker 2: to to them. And it's you know, it's not like

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Speaker 2: the scenario that that people had night nightmares about in

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Speaker 2: nineteen sixty four has not changed. And so I think

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Speaker 2: that I think it was It's fun, it's fun, it's

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Speaker 2: very uh, it's it's it's.

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Speaker 5: It's all hypotheses, of course, but it's fun to play

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Speaker 5: around with, right.

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Speaker 2: It's just, you know, it is it's still riveting to

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Speaker 2: watch this film. I mean, I have I have strong

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Speaker 2: memories of seeing it as well with my dad. It

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Speaker 2: and Doctor Strangelove. I watched both, watch them the films

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Speaker 2: with my dad and I and I recall, you know,

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Speaker 2: not feeling like the Kubrick had really sort of blunted

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Speaker 2: the experience of Lulu Mett. But it kind of does

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Speaker 2: kind of lead me to this question, which is that,

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Speaker 2: given it's all of its similarities to Strange Love, what

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Speaker 2: kind of sets it this fail safe apart? You know,

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Speaker 2: you know, what kind of makes it a film worth

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Speaker 2: considering on its own merits?

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Speaker 6: I mean, I think that ending, you know, which is

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Speaker 6: not obviously the ending of Strange Love, is no more

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Speaker 6: of a happy ending, but the absurdity with which it

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Speaker 6: is handled, you know, the overall tone of that conclusion.

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Speaker 6: You know, it's grim, but it's also funny. And this

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Speaker 6: shit is just grim. This is you know, I've only

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Speaker 6: seen it a couple of times. I saw it, I

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Speaker 6: believe the first time when Criterion brought it out a

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Speaker 6: few years ago. And then rewatched for this. So I've

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Speaker 6: seen it infrequently enough that I was shocked again by

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Speaker 6: the ending, by the fact that we are so used

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Speaker 6: to movies pulling their punches that we are sort of

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Speaker 6: conditioned to wait for the miracle, that we are not

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Speaker 6: used to movies that will literally end with the bomb

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Speaker 6: dropping and like cut to black, and that does pack

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Speaker 6: a genuine punch, especially also comparatively to the fact that,

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Speaker 6: like we've seen, even if you've only seen Strange Love

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Speaker 6: a handful of times, you've seen that ending many more,

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Speaker 6: like it pops up in montages, it pops up in

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Speaker 6: Kubrick documentaries, like we've sort of gotten used to that

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Speaker 6: in a way that we haven't gotten used to the

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Speaker 6: sort of bluntness and starkness and scariness of the closing

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Speaker 6: frames of this one.

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Speaker 7: I just realized.

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Speaker 10: Also, it's pretty directly, pretty obviously the inspiration for the

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Speaker 10: famous Daisy's ad Lnda B. Johnsone oh yeah, anti goldwater

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Speaker 10: thing and with a countdown and a freeze frame on

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Speaker 10: a girl. Yeah, so it lived on.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I think just the layer of satire, absurdity,

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Speaker 5: however you want to characterize it. On the Strangelove just

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Speaker 5: allows a certain level of remove. I mean, it's entertainment value,

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Speaker 5: and this movie is like not really striving to entertain.

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Speaker 5: In fact, I think like through that scene, that the

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Speaker 5: dinner party scene in Matthou's character, it's kind of like

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Speaker 5: even interrogating the idea of being entertained by a scenario

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Speaker 5: like this. So I think that again is part of

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Speaker 5: why the ending hits so differently from that very iconic

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Speaker 5: ending of Strange Love, which is in a way the

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Speaker 5: same ending. But you know, it's literally like Hootin and

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Speaker 5: hollerins through Annihilation, and there's no such tonal barrier I

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Speaker 5: guess to the experience here. You're just kind of experiencing it,

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Speaker 5: you know, necessarily being entertained by it.

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Speaker 2: So I think the other element here brings me sort

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Speaker 2: of my enough. Next question is that, you know, doctor

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Speaker 2: Strange Love, that whole scenario is kind of instigated by

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Speaker 2: a madman, if I recall, right, and so we can

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Speaker 2: sort of point to a human flaw in creating this crisis.

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Speaker 2: What I think is so compelling about about fail Safe

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Speaker 2: and certainly something I think that's what we're talking about, is

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Speaker 2: how deep it goes into the relationship between people and

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Speaker 2: these machines that are designed both as safeguards and I

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Speaker 2: think as a buffer kind of of just like I

390
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Speaker 2: am not cannot be held responsible for this level of destruction,

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Speaker 2: and so I am going to put these machines in

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Speaker 2: place that are going to automate it, and it keep

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Speaker 2: my you know, Paul prints all over these you know,

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Speaker 2: from getting on these decisions. I mean, what do you

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Speaker 2: all think of that piece of it?

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Speaker 5: I mean it's not just that, but it's also the

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Speaker 5: element of these soldiers being trained to a certain point

398
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Speaker 5: not respond to or take human orders, you know, Like

399
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Speaker 5: this is maybe the like the best use I can

400
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Speaker 5: think of of a wailing wife in a movie, you know,

401
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Speaker 5: a hysterical wife figure, but like just building to that

402
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Speaker 5: moment where this pilot cannot be called back by a human,

403
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Speaker 5: you know, because of a mechanical error. It really underlines

404
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Speaker 5: how I guess divorced technology makes us from our humanity

405
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Speaker 5: and a very in a way that I had never

406
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Speaker 5: considered before. Like obviously that is not a new notion

407
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Speaker 5: in film or life, but this particular scenario and the

408
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Speaker 5: way it played out is, like I said, one that

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Speaker 5: I hadn't encountered before.

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Speaker 2: I mean, The dramatic impact of that scene with a

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Speaker 2: wife is so powerful that I that I that I

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Speaker 2: did feel somewhat guilty of having the thought like just

413
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Speaker 2: say something that only the two, only two, you know,

414
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Speaker 2: like some detail from your first date or something like

415
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Speaker 2: what please like.

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Speaker 10: Uh, you know, just yes, but she kind have been compromised,

417
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Speaker 10: as Scott you don't, you know, I mean right.

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Speaker 2: Goes to that.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and and like that hits harder than ever in

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Speaker 5: our current day, what with you know, AI and surveillance

421
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Speaker 5: and all that, you know, like it does. It's the

422
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Speaker 5: the context is different, but the truth of the matter

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Speaker 5: is still there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true, and I and I And as a

425
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Speaker 2: dramatic effect, it is certainly powerful of this, of of

426
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Speaker 2: having the having finally gotten this guy's wife on the

427
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Speaker 2: line and her just you know, desperate please is this

428
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Speaker 2: is so it's so chilling to watch, you know, give it,

429
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Speaker 2: given just the momentum that the film has at this

430
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Speaker 2: at that point and where things are at, where it's

431
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Speaker 2: just that the finality of this kind of last desperate

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Speaker 2: plea really chilling. So again, I was thinking there there

433
00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 2: might be another approach to try to convince the pilot,

434
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:07,359
Speaker 2: but I also recognized that that would make a bad movie.

435
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:09,840
Speaker 2: And I don't want, I don't want, I don't want

436
00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,160
Speaker 2: to be here. I don't want to be the human

437
00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:16,080
Speaker 2: being responsible for making the bad movie.

438
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:20,680
Speaker 6: Can I ask this just a genuine curiosity question without

439
00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:22,879
Speaker 6: getting into the weeds of the thing. You know, the

440
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 6: fact that these films were released, This and Strange Love

441
00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:30,560
Speaker 6: were releasing such close Proximity Colombia as part of sort

442
00:24:30,560 --> 00:24:32,760
Speaker 6: of the wrangling between the two of them, and there

443
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:35,879
Speaker 6: was copy you know, there was a copyright question or

444
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:40,680
Speaker 6: plagiarism question ended up buying. You know, they were making

445
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,640
Speaker 6: Strange Love. They picked up the rights to Fail Safe,

446
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 6: which had been an independent production, and Kubrick insisted that

447
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:50,919
Speaker 6: Strange Love was released first, So it comes out in

448
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,960
Speaker 6: January sixty four. Fail Safe comes out in October sixty four.

449
00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:56,359
Speaker 6: Strange Love is a big hit and Fail Safe is not,

450
00:24:57,119 --> 00:25:01,320
Speaker 6: mostly the theory being because people had already seen the

451
00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 6: satirical take on this material and that sort of deflated

452
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,720
Speaker 6: the dramatic take. Do you all think it would have

453
00:25:08,760 --> 00:25:11,840
Speaker 6: done better and or Strange Love would have done worse

454
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,280
Speaker 6: if the order of the release had been altered. If

455
00:25:15,520 --> 00:25:16,960
Speaker 6: this film had come out first.

456
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 2: Yes, I suspect I suspect absolutely fail Safe would have

457
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:24,400
Speaker 2: had a much better chance at success than it did because.

458
00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 7: Would have been fine though.

459
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, that's my question. Yeah, yeah, I put it

460
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:32,040
Speaker 2: in the keynote. It was like it was like, this

461
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 2: is like if Airplane had come out before Airport, you

462
00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:38,280
Speaker 2: know what I mean, Like Airport would have totally totally

463
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:41,520
Speaker 2: flopped if Airplane had come out first. You know, So

464
00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 2: it is, uh, I think it's probably comparable here. I mean, obviously,

465
00:25:45,320 --> 00:25:47,960
Speaker 2: who knows what audience is in nineteen sixty four or

466
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 2: thinking and wanted from a movie. But you know, if

467
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,120
Speaker 2: you think think of film, yeah with some pretty recognizable

468
00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 2: stars and you know, really good reviews, is you know,

469
00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,280
Speaker 2: an important subject is coming out, maybe this is maybe

470
00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:01,320
Speaker 2: would have a you know, a better chance than it had.

471
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:01,879
Speaker 7: Yeah.

472
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 6: The comparison that I had sort of thought of was

473
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:07,399
Speaker 6: of in ninety six when Independence Day came out in

474
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:10,960
Speaker 6: the summer and then Mars Attacks came out in December,

475
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 6: and so it almost sort of felt like a satire

476
00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:17,360
Speaker 6: of this this big hit that had like just come out.

477
00:26:17,359 --> 00:26:20,040
Speaker 6: But then the satire didn't do very well, So I'm

478
00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 6: not sure how that would have yeah.

479
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 5: I mean, obviously this is a hypothetical week and not

480
00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:28,680
Speaker 5: not Safe and Share. But my instinct is that fail

481
00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:32,280
Speaker 5: safe would have performed better than it did, but probably

482
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 5: still not at the level of Strange Love. And I

483
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 5: think Strangelove probably still would have been fine, just kind

484
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:43,359
Speaker 5: of to go back to that entertainment value element, you know,

485
00:26:43,520 --> 00:26:46,840
Speaker 5: like it like Strangelove. I wouldn't go so far to

486
00:26:46,880 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 5: call it a crowd pleaser, but it's definitely like more

487
00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 5: of that than fail Yeah. Yeah, you know, and you've

488
00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,639
Speaker 5: got you know, Sellers doing all his roles, you know,

489
00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 5: so you know, I think that you know, is probably

490
00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,640
Speaker 5: more of a draw than Henry Fonda, as great as

491
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 5: he is. So there's it's just if Strange Love just

492
00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:12,359
Speaker 5: feels like more of a pack him in the theaters. Uh,

493
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 5: you know, endeavor no, but.

494
00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:17,200
Speaker 7: I mean, not to get two side talk, but does it.

495
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:18,640
Speaker 10: I mean, it's kind of weird to me that there's

496
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,600
Speaker 10: a moment when Strange Love, as great as it is,

497
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 10: it was on the public's wavelength the same like you know,

498
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:28,520
Speaker 10: a humor wavelength as a movie going public. But it

499
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 10: was when we're better you know, better world forward, I guess.

500
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:33,479
Speaker 10: But but it is It is odd to me that

501
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 10: that was that was the hit of these two.

502
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:38,719
Speaker 2: We have a little more discussion we want to do

503
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,200
Speaker 2: about fail Safe, but we're gonna take a quick break

504
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:43,679
Speaker 2: and we'll be back after that.

505
00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 3: Tomorrow morning. Is knocking stock your fridge? Now? How about

506
00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,520
Speaker 3: a creamy mocha Frappe China drink or a sweet Manilla

507
00:27:56,920 --> 00:28:00,200
Speaker 3: smooth caramel maybe, or a white chocolate mocha which, whatever

508
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:04,199
Speaker 3: you choose, delicious coffee wights find Starbucks, Rapportina Drinks wherever

509
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 3: you buy your groceries.

510
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,199
Speaker 2: And we're back. Just a couple more questions I have

511
00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,520
Speaker 2: for you all, A few more questions about Failsafe. One

512
00:28:15,520 --> 00:28:17,640
Speaker 2: has to do with just the setting of the film

513
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:19,480
Speaker 2: and the style of the film. You know, this is

514
00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:22,760
Speaker 2: a film that takes place largely in these small, hidden

515
00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:26,320
Speaker 2: rooms where the decisions get where big decisions get made,

516
00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 2: the room where it happens as I guess, if we

517
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 2: want to call it that. What do you think of

518
00:28:30,359 --> 00:28:34,879
Speaker 2: the strategy cinematically? And how does Lumett make that work?

519
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:38,200
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean I feel like it's obviously it's a

520
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,840
Speaker 6: really conscious decision on his part, partly, like you say,

521
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:44,680
Speaker 6: because of his background sort of working in the golden

522
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,720
Speaker 6: age of television and the sort of limited location work

523
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 6: that they could do on those live TV plays. The decision,

524
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 6: I think to stay inside those rooms and to keep

525
00:28:55,800 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 6: it that claustrophobic is incredibly effective. What I kept thinking about,

526
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:04,640
Speaker 6: and I didn't I meant to revisit making movies and

527
00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 6: just kind of ran out of time. I don't recall

528
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,080
Speaker 6: him getting into the specifics of this production, but I

529
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,080
Speaker 6: kept thinking about the stuff that's in that book, about

530
00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:18,880
Speaker 6: the almost mathematical precision of his shooting strategy for Twelve

531
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 6: Angry Men, the extent to which he had sort of

532
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,760
Speaker 6: made a camera plot for the thirds of the movie,

533
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 6: the three acts, if you will, to what lenses he

534
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 6: was using and how those created claustrophobia and the sort

535
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 6: of height of the camera in each of those sections.

536
00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,600
Speaker 6: And I didn't see sort of obvious markers of that

537
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,560
Speaker 6: kind of plotting, but I found myself with that in mind,

538
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:50,160
Speaker 6: extremely aware of what he's doing in terms of camera movement,

539
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 6: camera blocking, steady but not showy zooms, sort of the

540
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:58,680
Speaker 6: push in on Fonda when he's trying to order the

541
00:29:58,720 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 6: plane back from like a tight close up to an

542
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:06,320
Speaker 6: even tighter close up. He's so conscious of composition and

543
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:10,720
Speaker 6: of the effect that these compositions have on the overall

544
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 6: claustrophobia visually of the story, and I think throughout those

545
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 6: decisions are really really impactful.

546
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 10: Yeah, and the idea that everything is taking place in

547
00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:24,440
Speaker 10: these these you know, these far flung locations, but it's

548
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 10: all heading towards the same crisis. I think that's really

549
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 10: effective as well. That even people don't see each other,

550
00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:33,479
Speaker 10: often don't even talk to each other, but they're all

551
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 10: kind of contributing to the same problem. Although it's not

552
00:30:36,560 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 10: even the right way to put it, though, it's like

553
00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:40,960
Speaker 10: they're all stuck in the same impossible situation.

554
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:42,000
Speaker 2: Mm hmmm.

555
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 5: And also, like within what you were saying, Jason, just

556
00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:49,000
Speaker 5: about the blocking and the staging of just I knows

557
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 5: how populated a lot of these scenes are, you know,

558
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 5: really a strategic air command, Like you have just so

559
00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:59,280
Speaker 5: many sort of lower ranking folks kind of in the background.

560
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,320
Speaker 5: One of them gets pulled up front for a pretty

561
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:06,320
Speaker 5: harrowing moment, but it's not quite the same in terms

562
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,640
Speaker 5: of crowdedness. But you know, the president and the translator

563
00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:13,520
Speaker 5: being in this room together, like there's different types of

564
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:17,600
Speaker 5: character populating the same space, and that creates a sort

565
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 5: of inherent almost like audience, you know, within the space,

566
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 5: and kind of different angles from which to consider what's happening,

567
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,880
Speaker 5: or different characters in which to project you know, you're

568
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:32,680
Speaker 5: watching what's happening. So yeah, just the dynamism of the

569
00:31:33,400 --> 00:31:36,920
Speaker 5: characters populating the space I think also contributes on like

570
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 5: a storytelling level.

571
00:31:38,280 --> 00:31:38,720
Speaker 7: Very much so.

572
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,400
Speaker 6: And I was really aware this time of how from

573
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:44,960
Speaker 6: just the perspective of lighting that it gets darker as

574
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 6: the movie gets grimmer, even though it's getting deeper, like

575
00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 6: into the day into daylight. That really jumped out. There's

576
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,560
Speaker 6: this incredible shot of Fonda and Hagman in that small

577
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,680
Speaker 6: room towards the end, as things are really getting bleak,

578
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 6: where they're facing each other and it's it's so dark

579
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:06,280
Speaker 6: that it's almost like silhouettes, two silhouettes facing each other,

580
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:10,880
Speaker 6: and then he does these like slow camera dollies from

581
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:15,120
Speaker 6: profile to straight on in that sequence, Like, I know,

582
00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 6: you're not supposed to notice those sorts of things. They're

583
00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:20,000
Speaker 6: not supposed to call attention to themselves, and I'm sure

584
00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 6: they didn't the first time I saw it, but this

585
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:25,040
Speaker 6: time I was. I was just so aware of his

586
00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,760
Speaker 6: brilliance at finding ways to keep the film visually dynamic.

587
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 6: Even when it's just like a couple of people in

588
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 6: a really dull room, you are still fully visually engaged

589
00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:38,719
Speaker 6: in those sequences.

590
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was going to say what everyone else has

591
00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 2: already said, really about the differences between I guess vibe

592
00:32:45,760 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: and those two different rooms in the room, the room

593
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,400
Speaker 2: where you have the president and his interpreter, and then

594
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 2: you have the room in Strategic Air Command, which is

595
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,280
Speaker 2: everyone else. Because there is this sense of quiet, of

596
00:32:56,280 --> 00:33:00,920
Speaker 2: intimacy between the presidents interpreter. I think often about the

597
00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 2: water that they're pouring for each other and kind of

598
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 2: like the you know, they're they're the presence is coaching

599
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 2: as interpreter through this situation, and the mood there is

600
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:13,360
Speaker 2: is calm, rational, obviously tense as well. But then you

601
00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,280
Speaker 2: get in the other room and it's it's contentious, you know,

602
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:19,440
Speaker 2: because you have all these different voices and there are

603
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 2: decisions being made that really put people at odds in

604
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 2: a in a very intense, intense fashion. So I like

605
00:33:26,720 --> 00:33:29,560
Speaker 2: the dynamic that the contrast between those two rooms. And

606
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:33,400
Speaker 2: then I think the other thing strategically is that because

607
00:33:33,440 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 2: so much of the film takes place in these rooms

608
00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:39,400
Speaker 2: that when Lumett finally breaks out of them and gives

609
00:33:39,440 --> 00:33:41,720
Speaker 2: you shots of New York City and then gives you

610
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 2: that ending, it's like, Oh, this is what it actually means.

611
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:46,640
Speaker 2: Like this, all this abstracts, all this stuff that seemed

612
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,400
Speaker 2: to abstract to us before, all this scenario, the scenario

613
00:33:49,480 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 2: that's been painted to us. Let's just show you, like

614
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 2: what Let's give you like a really authentic, you know,

615
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:58,720
Speaker 2: city lament street street scene. Let's give you street scenes

616
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:00,920
Speaker 2: in New York. Then you're gonna really feel it all

617
00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:03,080
Speaker 2: and all all of these streets that you're going to

618
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 2: visit in one way, you're going to visit another way

619
00:34:05,680 --> 00:34:07,200
Speaker 2: at the end of the movie, in the in that

620
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 2: succession of final shots. And I think it just makes

621
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:13,719
Speaker 2: makes it so much punchier not to have to have

622
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:17,040
Speaker 2: no real time in the real world until you get

623
00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:18,279
Speaker 2: to that point right to.

624
00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:20,319
Speaker 10: Ills feel like we are a little bit robbed of

625
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:22,839
Speaker 10: Larry Hagman dramatic performances.

626
00:34:23,040 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 7: Just this movie.

627
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:29,920
Speaker 6: He's so good in this movie, Keith. He is incredible

628
00:34:29,920 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 6: in this and oh oh, and the thing that I

629
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:38,399
Speaker 6: love most about that performance is that halting way that

630
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:42,800
Speaker 6: he speaks when he's translating, Like it's maybe the first

631
00:34:42,800 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 6: time I've ever seen a performance by an actor playing

632
00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:49,560
Speaker 6: a translator where it actually sounds like he's hearing this

633
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:52,840
Speaker 6: stuff for the first time and repeating it as quickly

634
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,759
Speaker 6: as possible while still trying to listen. Like the incredible

635
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:59,000
Speaker 6: multitasking of translation, which I can't even wrap my head

636
00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,720
Speaker 6: around as somebody who only speaks one language and barely

637
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:06,480
Speaker 6: speaks it well. That the way that he dramatizes just

638
00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:12,279
Speaker 6: the sound of someone translating is so credible, is so authentic,

639
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 6: it's tremendous performance.

640
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,360
Speaker 7: While putting in his own interjection, it's like kind of

641
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 7: interpreting the tone and everything too. Yeah, that's really good.

642
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 10: The only thing distracted me is I did it at

643
00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 10: certain point realize that Henry Fonds delivery to the on

644
00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 10: the phone when he's talking a little louder than normal,

645
00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:30,879
Speaker 10: it's basically what David Lynch is doing when he's.

646
00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:34,000
Speaker 7: Playing Gordon Cole in that anyone else.

647
00:35:34,920 --> 00:35:41,799
Speaker 11: Yeah, Yeah, My inappropriate reference point was there is that

648
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 11: it's a very cool shot the sort of forced perspective

649
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 11: on the phone when Fonda first goes to call the

650
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:49,880
Speaker 11: Russian premiere, Like all I could think of when it

651
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:52,880
Speaker 11: when I saw that shot was the shot in top secret.

652
00:35:55,040 --> 00:35:56,280
Speaker 7: That it's a giant.

653
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 6: Phone, which was not the thing I should have been

654
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 6: thinking about it that particular moment. But it's not.

655
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,799
Speaker 5: Your brain was just dying for a little bit of levity. Yeah,

656
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:09,799
Speaker 5: it's a pressure release velve. Before we leave the conversation

657
00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:13,439
Speaker 5: about sort of these small phlaostrophobic spaces of this film,

658
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:15,440
Speaker 5: I think we also need to talk about the plane

659
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 5: cockpits briefly or just like a note that, and within that,

660
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:24,520
Speaker 5: we have like an early scene with the pilots like

661
00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:26,799
Speaker 5: kind of it. I think they're playing pool, you know,

662
00:36:27,040 --> 00:36:30,959
Speaker 5: so we get this introduction to them in this sort

663
00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 5: of real world, sort of off duty scenario. You know,

664
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:39,720
Speaker 5: it's not quite analogous to showing us like the people

665
00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:42,560
Speaker 5: on the streets of New York right before they're annihilated,

666
00:36:42,600 --> 00:36:46,120
Speaker 5: but it does kind of serve to give us a

667
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:50,279
Speaker 5: look at these characters as people before they move into

668
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:52,319
Speaker 5: this part of the movie where they're they're soldiers and

669
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 5: they're they're sacrificed basically, you know. The one of the

670
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,319
Speaker 5: more harrowing parts of this movie to me was when

671
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:02,840
Speaker 5: the decision is made to send fighters, send US fighters

672
00:37:02,880 --> 00:37:06,359
Speaker 5: after the bombers to try and take them down before

673
00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,120
Speaker 5: they enter Russian airspace, and it's done so with the

674
00:37:09,160 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 5: knowledge on everyone's part that they don't have enough fuel

675
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,440
Speaker 5: to do it. It's probably not going to work, and

676
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 5: they're all just going to fall into the sea and

677
00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,719
Speaker 5: kind of one by one we watched them disappear from

678
00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 5: the board and fall into the sea, and you know,

679
00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:25,080
Speaker 5: we're experiencing that scene mostly on the big board, you know,

680
00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:28,840
Speaker 5: as little triangles. Yeah, but because I think the film

681
00:37:28,920 --> 00:37:32,759
Speaker 5: does that early work of you know, establishing like these

682
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:35,560
Speaker 5: are people, they're not just like pilots in a cockpit

683
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 5: carrying out orders robotically, it makes that scenario even harder

684
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:44,279
Speaker 5: to endure than it maybe would be without it.

685
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 10: I did find the use of those early sixties electronic

686
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 10: screens and stuff really effective too, and and just the

687
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:53,799
Speaker 10: like sort of the pong level graphics which I didn't

688
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 10: even know where existed that they made this movie. But

689
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 10: just but as you the moment you're talking about when

690
00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,480
Speaker 10: things just kind of disappear, you know what it is,

691
00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:04,160
Speaker 10: and it's it's it's chilling, Like it's like the one

692
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,480
Speaker 10: reminds me it's probably a lift in some ways inspired

693
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:08,719
Speaker 10: by this, but like it reminds me of like the

694
00:38:08,719 --> 00:38:11,439
Speaker 10: one really effective scene of clear and Present danger where

695
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 10: you have like this satellite view and you just see

696
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:16,880
Speaker 10: like sort of silently these little dots limit any one another,

697
00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:21,240
Speaker 10: but they're obviously real people. You know, it's an interesting technique.

698
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:22,040
Speaker 5: So is there.

699
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 2: Anything, uh that should be said about some of these performances,

700
00:38:25,760 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 2: because there's some pretty major ones here. You do have

701
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:31,680
Speaker 2: Henry Fonda, you know, who has played presidents in the past.

702
00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:37,960
Speaker 2: Uh uh he he he he's here. You've got Walter Matthols, professor,

703
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,440
Speaker 2: who's kind of on the opposite end of the spectrum.

704
00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:43,920
Speaker 2: And then and then you have some interesting civilians, particularly

705
00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:47,840
Speaker 2: Dan O'Hurley he as Brigadier General Black, who is the

706
00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:51,000
Speaker 2: guy that we begin in the movie on and in

707
00:38:51,160 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 2: the movie on. So maybe we should start talking about him,

708
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,120
Speaker 2: because it seems pretty significant that that that rather than

709
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:00,160
Speaker 2: starting with the say the president, that were with this

710
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:02,320
Speaker 2: this guy, who's where he is on the pecking order.

711
00:39:02,239 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 5: And I don't think we even like know where he

712
00:39:04,760 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 5: is on the pecking order who he is, you know,

713
00:39:07,320 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 5: like we're introduced to his nightmare before we're introduced to him,

714
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:17,400
Speaker 5: and I think that choice like how the film begins,

715
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:20,160
Speaker 5: which threw me so hard. I have to say, like,

716
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:22,719
Speaker 5: having not seen this film before, I'm you know, but

717
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:24,800
Speaker 5: knowing what it was about going into it, I was

718
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 5: like Matador, like, you know, I was like trying to

719
00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 5: like figure out the connection, and it came together quite

720
00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 5: elegantly by the end. But yeah, just the nightmare and

721
00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,560
Speaker 5: then going into this very domestic scene, you know, of

722
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:40,319
Speaker 5: him and his wife and still not knowing who this

723
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:43,120
Speaker 5: person is or why I'm supposed to care about him.

724
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 5: But I think doing it that way it just kind

725
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,120
Speaker 5: of takes all the characters down to a human level,

726
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 5: you know, like outside of their rank, and this is

727
00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:56,200
Speaker 5: a scenario that affects everyone kind of regardless of rank,

728
00:39:56,520 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 5: unless maybe you're the president and a bunker or whatever,

729
00:39:59,560 --> 00:39:59,799
Speaker 5: you know.

730
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:04,800
Speaker 6: But yeah, a lot of incredible just faces in this movie.

731
00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:08,439
Speaker 6: This is a movie with a lot of lived in,

732
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:13,760
Speaker 6: personality filled faces. It's also sort of insane to see

733
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:18,920
Speaker 6: dom delauise a young and me basically playing a dramatic role.

734
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:21,879
Speaker 6: That's both of those are quite unexpected.

735
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:24,719
Speaker 5: I did not even catch that. I did not even

736
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 5: catch that's who it was until just now looking at

737
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 5: that and say, wait what Now I know exactly who

738
00:40:30,160 --> 00:40:30,480
Speaker 5: it was.

739
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:36,360
Speaker 7: And Boss Hog from Dukes of Hazzard also a room.

740
00:40:36,160 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 6: Face for lovers of eighties garbage. Right here, you've got

741
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:42,919
Speaker 6: boss Hog and Delauise in this thing. Fonda, I think

742
00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,640
Speaker 6: is just tremendous. Like there's a reason he's playing a

743
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:48,839
Speaker 6: president because he has such There's not a lot of

744
00:40:48,920 --> 00:40:54,320
Speaker 6: room in a momentum bas narrative like this for sort

745
00:40:54,360 --> 00:40:59,480
Speaker 6: of character development or even establishment, and he really is

746
00:40:59,520 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 6: someone it's like, oh, yeah, he's the president. Okay, fine,

747
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:02,560
Speaker 6: let's go.

748
00:41:02,840 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

749
00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:05,879
Speaker 6: The thing that that that I kept thinking about while

750
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,520
Speaker 6: I was watching him in this film. Again, sorry to

751
00:41:09,920 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 6: keep going back to the Loumette book. The thing I

752
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,319
Speaker 6: always think about now from that book whenever I see

753
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 6: Henry Fonda in almost anything, was you know, he's a

754
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:24,080
Speaker 6: he's a tremendously gilt you know, he's emotionally connected, he's

755
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 6: a natural on screen. He was also a really gifted

756
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,920
Speaker 6: technical actor. And the thing I always remember from making

757
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 6: movies is Lumette writing about the inky light. Does anybody

758
00:41:37,000 --> 00:41:40,880
Speaker 6: else remember this from that book, that that he had

759
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:45,080
Speaker 6: like that he always made sure that any cinematographer that

760
00:41:45,120 --> 00:41:49,080
Speaker 6: he worked with had this little like pin light that

761
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 6: they could use on him in close ups that they

762
00:41:53,200 --> 00:41:57,279
Speaker 6: would shine like sort of directly into his eye and

763
00:41:57,320 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 6: it would reflect his eyes. It would make a really

764
00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:03,160
Speaker 6: nice reflection and also if he needed to be a

765
00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:07,920
Speaker 6: little misty eyed, it would help create that. And while

766
00:42:07,960 --> 00:42:11,320
Speaker 6: I'm watching the scene where he's giving the order to

767
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 6: kill his wife and child, I was like thinking in

768
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:18,319
Speaker 6: the back of my oh, yeah, there's the inky light.

769
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 6: He's using the inky light in this scene to great effect.

770
00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:27,400
Speaker 2: That's cool. Yeah, no, I mean that's a very memorable

771
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:30,960
Speaker 2: shot too, And yeah, I know exactly what you're talking about.

772
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:33,680
Speaker 2: I think the other thing too about Henry Fonder, because

773
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:37,080
Speaker 2: he gives us gravity and credibility to this role, is

774
00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:40,680
Speaker 2: that is that I think strategically having the president be

775
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:44,480
Speaker 2: kind of a best case scenario president, it makes the

776
00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 2: film more effective because because here, here, here's a guy

777
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 2: who I think is negotiating this his way through this

778
00:42:51,320 --> 00:42:55,879
Speaker 2: situation with as much care and integrity as possible, and

779
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 2: he can't stop it, you know. I think that's I

780
00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:01,880
Speaker 2: think that's that's kind of of makes the film's point

781
00:43:01,920 --> 00:43:04,799
Speaker 2: a little stronger, and it kind of reinforces to bring

782
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:08,799
Speaker 2: it back to to Dan o'hurlehee's character, it reinforces that

783
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 2: idea of inevitability because that's really where where we're at

784
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,680
Speaker 2: with that character, which is which is this guy having

785
00:43:14,719 --> 00:43:18,000
Speaker 2: a nightmare that he knows is going to happen, you know,

786
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:20,680
Speaker 2: like this is this that that that, and that he's

787
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:24,000
Speaker 2: in this job to prevent from happening for as long

788
00:43:24,040 --> 00:43:28,680
Speaker 2: as possible. But when it actually occurs, like it, there's

789
00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 2: that there's that air of like, Okay, this is this

790
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:33,439
Speaker 2: was going to this is going to be a thing

791
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:36,920
Speaker 2: like this, this is something I had nightmares about and uh,

792
00:43:37,040 --> 00:43:40,080
Speaker 2: clearly something he's thought about and and and was going

793
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 2: to happen and it was not avoidable. And so it

794
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,160
Speaker 2: kind of makes it as a chilling on that and

795
00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:48,879
Speaker 2: just the unstoppability of it, just the unstoppability of this,

796
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:50,600
Speaker 2: of this happening once it's set into motion.

797
00:43:51,239 --> 00:43:53,799
Speaker 5: Just on the fond of tip, I was realizing that

798
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:57,000
Speaker 5: this movie came out just a few months after The

799
00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:00,759
Speaker 5: Best Man, which we covered on this podcast alongside of

800
00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:06,000
Speaker 5: Conclave and which Fonda plays another sort of man of

801
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:11,960
Speaker 5: integrity who makes a tough decision and sacrifice at the end,

802
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:15,880
Speaker 5: you know, and he's not exactly a president, but certainly

803
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:20,600
Speaker 5: you know, in that same space. So it's just interesting

804
00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:23,279
Speaker 5: timing that we get to, you know, these roles that

805
00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:25,319
Speaker 5: are kind of echoes of each other in the same year.

806
00:44:26,239 --> 00:44:30,719
Speaker 2: Audiences, we rely on your recall of our previous episodes

807
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:37,440
Speaker 2: so much. This happens literally every week of just like, guys,

808
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:41,880
Speaker 2: we did this already.

809
00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:43,080
Speaker 5: I will admit it, did. I did have to go

810
00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:45,319
Speaker 5: in check. Was like, wait, best man or wrong Man?

811
00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:51,440
Speaker 5: I can't a lot of rhymes in Fonda's filmography to

812
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:53,040
Speaker 5: make sure you're talking about the right movie.

813
00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:59,880
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, we will continue talking about Henry Fonda and

814
00:45:00,840 --> 00:45:04,560
Speaker 2: nuclear disaster and all that late later on in our

815
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,040
Speaker 2: next week when we bring in a House of Dynamite.

816
00:45:08,080 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 2: But for now, we'll pause this discussion and come back

817
00:45:11,280 --> 00:45:25,920
Speaker 2: with feedback. Now it's time for feedback. But before we

818
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:27,359
Speaker 2: get to it, we want to give a shout out

819
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 2: to Film Spotting. The Next Picture Shows Mothership podcast hosted

820
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,920
Speaker 2: by Adam Kempinar and Josh Larsen. As we record this,

821
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:36,480
Speaker 2: Josh and Adam have released an episode in tribute to

822
00:45:36,480 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 2: the late Robert Redford, and they're working on an episode

823
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:42,160
Speaker 2: next week on Kelly Reichert's new movie The Mastermind, which

824
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:45,400
Speaker 2: I saw today and quite enjoyed. So that's my preview

825
00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:50,359
Speaker 2: of that film. As for feedback, we would usually spend

826
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 2: this time sifting through listener emails or voicemails, but we're

827
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:56,240
Speaker 2: a little short this week. And since we've been talking

828
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:59,680
Speaker 2: a lot about Lumet lately, and we happen to have

829
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:02,080
Speaker 2: Jason and the author of Fun City Cinema on the

830
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:04,600
Speaker 2: podcast today, I thought we would open up the floor

831
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:09,200
Speaker 2: from some for some Lumet recommendations. Let's start. We'll start

832
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:11,520
Speaker 2: with you, Jason. I am shouting you out. He made

833
00:46:11,520 --> 00:46:14,520
Speaker 2: some films New York, about New York, just about you know,

834
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 2: He's made some films just to have that kind of

835
00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:18,560
Speaker 2: grit to them. Is there anything you had in mind?

836
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:18,799
Speaker 4: There?

837
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,480
Speaker 6: Absolutely no. I really do consider Lumet like you know

838
00:46:22,520 --> 00:46:27,840
Speaker 6: that the holy Trinity of New York filmmakers are, you know, Scorsese,

839
00:46:27,960 --> 00:46:32,319
Speaker 6: Spike and Sydney like. I think he's as recognizable in

840
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,720
Speaker 6: the work as they are. I think he his love

841
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:39,040
Speaker 6: for the city is so ever present in all of

842
00:46:39,080 --> 00:46:42,200
Speaker 6: the films that he shot here and shot really a

843
00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 6: nice wide variety of types of movies in New York,

844
00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:50,200
Speaker 6: dipped into a lot of different genres. The ones that

845
00:46:50,239 --> 00:46:53,280
Speaker 6: I specifically wanted to talk about and sort of recommend

846
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 6: are sort of a mixture of known and less heralded,

847
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:02,400
Speaker 6: which is the sort of the core tet of NYPD

848
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:08,799
Speaker 6: corruption pictures that he made between nineteen seventy three and

849
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:13,040
Speaker 6: nineteen ninety seven, so that would be serproco obviously, the

850
00:47:13,120 --> 00:47:17,000
Speaker 6: sort of the established, known, beloved classic of the Bunch,

851
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 6: Prince of the City, which is one that has sort

852
00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:22,879
Speaker 6: of didn't really hit at the time, but has sort

853
00:47:22,920 --> 00:47:27,960
Speaker 6: of gained in reputation and respect as the years have passed.

854
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,560
Speaker 6: And then the two sort of less discussed, lesser knowns

855
00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 6: nineteen nineties Q and A with Timothy Hutton and a

856
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 6: fierce Nick Nolty performance, and then the Last of the

857
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:43,719
Speaker 6: Bunch nineteen ninety seven's Night Falls on Manhattan, which coincidentally

858
00:47:43,880 --> 00:47:49,880
Speaker 6: enough an early pre sopranos James Gandelfini performance, so that

859
00:47:49,920 --> 00:47:51,960
Speaker 6: one gets to tie into both of the books, and

860
00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 6: I think it's a really fascinating opportunity to watch a

861
00:47:56,400 --> 00:48:00,920
Speaker 6: filmmaker revisit themes that are clearly of interest to him

862
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,319
Speaker 6: and of import to him at sort of different points

863
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 6: in his career. You see the sort of evolution of

864
00:48:05,640 --> 00:48:08,720
Speaker 6: his thinking, the evolution of his filmmaking, getting to see

865
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:12,560
Speaker 6: a lot of different actors sort of playing in that space.

866
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 6: I think these are all terrific movies. I really think

867
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 6: Night Falls on Manhattan it's a movie that holds a

868
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:20,960
Speaker 6: real special place in my heart. It may have been

869
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:24,080
Speaker 6: the first Luet movie I saw in a theater, just

870
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,520
Speaker 6: by virtue of when it came out in ninety seven.

871
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:29,520
Speaker 6: I was really taken with it. At that time, I

872
00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:32,480
Speaker 6: had only seen Surpiico of this bunch, so it sort

873
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:34,920
Speaker 6: of compelled me to go check out the other pictures

874
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:38,920
Speaker 6: as well. And then this one just got finally a

875
00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:41,359
Speaker 6: really nice Blu Ray release. I want to say about

876
00:48:41,360 --> 00:48:44,800
Speaker 6: a year ago from Arrow, I think it's a phenomenal movie.

877
00:48:44,800 --> 00:48:47,719
Speaker 6: I think Andy Garcia is tremendous in it. Great Ian

878
00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:51,960
Speaker 6: home performance again, a wonderful Gandelfini turn, and an unbuilt

879
00:48:52,040 --> 00:48:55,080
Speaker 6: Richard Dreyfus doing some really interesting work as a sort

880
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:58,279
Speaker 6: of civil liberties attorney. It's worth seeking.

881
00:48:58,000 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 2: Out that's one I've actually never seen me just because

882
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:03,120
Speaker 2: its reputation is I mean, it's not certainly doesn't have

883
00:49:03,120 --> 00:49:06,080
Speaker 2: a terrible reputation, but it is not usually mentioned among

884
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:07,879
Speaker 2: his greatest I mean the ones of the other ones

885
00:49:07,920 --> 00:49:10,560
Speaker 2: you mentioned, I mean those are all, you know, pretty

886
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:12,920
Speaker 2: well established as great films. I think Parts of the

887
00:49:12,960 --> 00:49:15,000
Speaker 2: City is truly.

888
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:18,319
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's a monster. It's a monster. No, I mean

889
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:20,399
Speaker 6: I think I think at the time it came out,

890
00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:23,360
Speaker 6: because it was sort of in that realm, it was

891
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,719
Speaker 6: compared unfavorably to those movies, And I don't think it

892
00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 6: is the equivalent of any of them, but I certainly

893
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,640
Speaker 6: think it's worth watching and thinking about in the same

894
00:49:32,680 --> 00:49:33,040
Speaker 6: sort of.

895
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,920
Speaker 2: Breath for sure, for sure, Keith, did you have anything

896
00:49:35,960 --> 00:49:36,480
Speaker 2: in mind?

897
00:49:36,840 --> 00:49:39,839
Speaker 10: Yeah, I have a lou Matt New York film they

898
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 10: just caught up with by coincidence before we turned into

899
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:46,960
Speaker 10: a full time to do that podcast called The Anderson

900
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:52,080
Speaker 10: Tapes nineteen seventy one, which is it stars Sean Connery

901
00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:53,799
Speaker 10: as a safe cracker who gets out of jail after

902
00:49:53,800 --> 00:49:57,759
Speaker 10: ten years and immediately reconnects with his girlfriend played by

903
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 10: Diane Cannon. I guess Sean Connery if you're going to

904
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:01,960
Speaker 10: wait ten years for anybody.

905
00:50:01,600 --> 00:50:03,360
Speaker 7: I guess he's the one.

906
00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 10: But he basically sets about robbing an entire apartment building,

907
00:50:08,120 --> 00:50:09,879
Speaker 10: which is it's a which is kind of a fun

908
00:50:09,880 --> 00:50:12,680
Speaker 10: setup for the film anyway, although film kind of takes

909
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:16,000
Speaker 10: a dark turn toward the end. But what sets it

910
00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 10: apart is this really early seventies interest in surveillance techniques

911
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:25,600
Speaker 10: and recording and just sort of like this early like

912
00:50:25,640 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 10: electronic stuff, and it's it's really prescient in a lot

913
00:50:28,719 --> 00:50:32,399
Speaker 10: of ways of where the surveillance state was going. It's

914
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 10: it's really worth your time. I don't it's not entirely successful,

915
00:50:34,960 --> 00:50:38,080
Speaker 10: but but it's definitely definitely worth a look. And it's

916
00:50:38,120 --> 00:50:40,440
Speaker 10: a couple of things going for it. It's it's the

917
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,440
Speaker 10: last appearance by Margaret Hamilton, who's the wicked Witch of

918
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:45,120
Speaker 10: the West, so we say goodbye to her, but we

919
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:47,200
Speaker 10: say hello. I think even gets I think he even

920
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:50,520
Speaker 10: gets an introducing credit in the beginning to a young

921
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:52,439
Speaker 10: actor played a character known as the Kid.

922
00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:54,439
Speaker 7: That men's name is Christopher.

923
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:57,319
Speaker 10: Walking, So it's a very early, almost unrecognizable yeah, just

924
00:50:57,320 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 10: for walking performance. But the other thing is it's got

925
00:50:59,360 --> 00:51:04,040
Speaker 10: a really cool quincy Jones score that's like occasionally interrupt

926
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:08,040
Speaker 10: it quite jarringly by these electronic noises to to that

927
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 10: that that I don't even know if they're Jones's creation

928
00:51:11,880 --> 00:51:14,120
Speaker 10: or if they're kind of, you know, dropped into the

929
00:51:14,160 --> 00:51:17,040
Speaker 10: score as as like sort of the the electronic noises

930
00:51:17,040 --> 00:51:20,000
Speaker 10: of the surveillance equipment. But it's quite jarring in a

931
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:23,640
Speaker 10: way that that's unpleasant but effective. So yeah, that's my pick.

932
00:51:23,920 --> 00:51:25,920
Speaker 2: I wanted to slip I wanted to slip in something

933
00:51:25,960 --> 00:51:30,799
Speaker 2: that doesn't get recommended very often, and someone got got

934
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,320
Speaker 2: somewhat mixed reviews when came out, but I really like

935
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,479
Speaker 2: it and wanted to defend it. It's a late film

936
00:51:37,520 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 2: of his, that's Find Me Guilty, a film that he

937
00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 2: made in two thousand and six, you know, shooting on video,

938
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:48,040
Speaker 2: released by via Freestyle Releasing. You know, not not one

939
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 2: of your more high profile City Lamit performances, but it

940
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:55,279
Speaker 2: has this incredible lead performance by Vin Diesel in a

941
00:51:55,480 --> 00:51:59,879
Speaker 2: very amusing wig. He is based on truth, is based

942
00:51:59,920 --> 00:52:02,560
Speaker 2: on true story of what is I guess, the longest

943
00:52:03,280 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 2: mafia trial in American history, and and a lot of

944
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:10,600
Speaker 2: the a lot of like the dialogue is taken straight

945
00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:13,239
Speaker 2: from the transcripts. But what's interesting about it is that

946
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:17,840
Speaker 2: Vin Diesel plays a guy who is one of nineteen

947
00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:22,440
Speaker 2: Jersey mobsters who are on trial for racketeering. But what

948
00:52:22,560 --> 00:52:26,279
Speaker 2: sets him apart is that he is that he gets

949
00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:29,080
Speaker 2: rid of his lawyer and decides to defend himself in

950
00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:32,520
Speaker 2: an open court. And it is just. It is very,

951
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:35,760
Speaker 2: very funny and just. It is, as you might imagine,

952
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,239
Speaker 2: quite a bit of disorder in the court as a

953
00:52:38,239 --> 00:52:41,279
Speaker 2: result of him defending himself. And I think it's it's

954
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:44,000
Speaker 2: got I think it is a fun movie that doesn't

955
00:52:44,040 --> 00:52:47,080
Speaker 2: get mentioned enough. I mean, obviously Lumett got to end

956
00:52:47,120 --> 00:52:49,800
Speaker 2: his career with, you know, a film that many of

957
00:52:49,880 --> 00:52:52,919
Speaker 2: us think is great, that's Before the Devil Knows You're Dead.

958
00:52:53,120 --> 00:52:55,239
Speaker 2: But you know, if you've seen Before the Devil Knows

959
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:57,480
Speaker 2: You're Dead and you've seen some other a lot of

960
00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:01,439
Speaker 2: other Lumette films, and you're a little curious, I'm just saying,

961
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:03,719
Speaker 2: find me guilties out there, that's all I'm just gonna put.

962
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:05,480
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna say it's there for you.

963
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:09,279
Speaker 6: Yeah, Scott, we we have swapped recommendations because that's one

964
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,360
Speaker 6: of the last Loumets I haven't seen so based on

965
00:53:12,880 --> 00:53:15,879
Speaker 6: based on your recommendation, I'm gonna check that one out.

966
00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:21,000
Speaker 2: Cool, I'm glad, but again with caveat little absolutely, but

967
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:23,520
Speaker 2: do see I think it's I think it's a little

968
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:24,919
Speaker 2: bit underregarded.

969
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:26,000
Speaker 7: Well.

970
00:53:26,040 --> 00:53:28,920
Speaker 2: We always appreciate when our listeners share their thoughts and

971
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:32,520
Speaker 2: the recommendations. And if you all have some lut films,

972
00:53:32,600 --> 00:53:35,440
Speaker 2: Lesser City, Lumet films, little gems, he made so many

973
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:36,560
Speaker 2: of them, you can share them.

974
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:39,600
Speaker 7: There's a lot of films, so many sent in filmography.

975
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,160
Speaker 2: If you feel so inclined, we can feature your response

976
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:45,399
Speaker 2: on a future episode. To reach us, you can leave

977
00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,080
Speaker 2: a short voicemail at seven seven three two three four

978
00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:51,000
Speaker 2: nine seven three zero or email us at comments at

979
00:53:51,120 --> 00:53:53,440
Speaker 2: next Picture Show dot net. You can also send a

980
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 2: recorded message to our email address if you want to

981
00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,160
Speaker 2: make sure you get the wording just right, which is

982
00:53:58,200 --> 00:54:00,200
Speaker 2: something I would need to do. There's no chance, no

983
00:54:00,320 --> 00:54:03,360
Speaker 2: chance I would just can cold call a voicemail a

984
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:07,800
Speaker 2: voicemail line and get anything right. So I say, pre record,

985
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 2: send that secker and make it perfect. You know, hire producers.

986
00:54:11,000 --> 00:54:11,719
Speaker 2: What do you need to do?

987
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:16,040
Speaker 5: Uh that you don't have to, We'll take we'll take.

988
00:54:16,080 --> 00:54:18,799
Speaker 5: We'll take any feedback of an equality. You know, we

989
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:25,320
Speaker 5: don't be intimidated by scuss demand of high production value.

990
00:54:25,719 --> 00:54:28,160
Speaker 2: It's true. We'll, we'll, we'll. I'm sure you'll do a

991
00:54:28,239 --> 00:54:30,920
Speaker 2: fine job. Listeners. That's it for this episode of The

992
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:33,239
Speaker 2: Next Picture Show. In our next episode, we'll talk about

993
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:35,680
Speaker 2: a house of Dynamite before returning to fail Safe and

994
00:54:35,719 --> 00:54:38,400
Speaker 2: discussing how they relate to one another. Look for that

995
00:54:38,440 --> 00:54:41,799
Speaker 2: episode next Tuesday on your podcatcher of choice. For ad

996
00:54:41,800 --> 00:54:44,520
Speaker 2: free versions of the podcast and extra content, find us

997
00:54:44,560 --> 00:54:47,759
Speaker 2: on Patreon at patreon dot com slash Next Picture Show.

998
00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:50,680
Speaker 2: You can find us at Next pictureshow dot net and

999
00:54:50,719 --> 00:54:53,239
Speaker 2: on blue Sky at the Next Picture Show. If you

1000
00:54:53,280 --> 00:54:56,160
Speaker 2: want to keep track of when new episodes drop until

1001
00:54:56,239 --> 00:54:59,280
Speaker 2: next week. Remember, if your job gives you a recurring

1002
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:04,160
Speaker 2: nightmare about bullfighting, consider updating your LinkedIn page.