WEBVTT - Biden Administration Wins Over Texas at Supreme Court 0:00:03.200 --> 0:00:08.000 This is Bloomberg Law with June Brusso from Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:09.320 --> 0:00:12.360 I'm ready to solve the problem. I really am massive changes, 0:00:12.440 --> 0:00:13.560 and I mean it's sincerely. 0:00:14.080 --> 0:00:16.919 The migration crisis at the border has become one of 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:21.880 President Joe Biden's biggest political liabilities, and he appears ready 0:00:21.920 --> 0:00:25.479 to deal. Biden says he's opened to massive changes in 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:29.480 US border policy, including to asylum laws, in order to 0:00:29.520 --> 0:00:33.680 secure a deal that would unlock Ukraine Aid. Biden expressed 0:00:33.720 --> 0:00:37.560 confidence the Senate could work out an emerging Bipartistan border 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:41.280 compromise as soon as this week, and Republican senators like 0:00:41.400 --> 0:00:45.640 Lindsey Graham point to the Biden administration's concessions and say 0:00:45.640 --> 0:00:47.920 it's the best deal the GOP can get. 0:00:48.200 --> 0:00:50.720 To those who think that if President Trump wins, which 0:00:50.760 --> 0:00:53.040 I hope he does, that we can get a better 0:00:53.080 --> 0:00:56.480 deal you want, you've got to get sixty votes to 0:00:56.480 --> 0:01:01.600 the United States Senate, So to my Republican friends, to 0:01:01.760 --> 0:01:05.560 get this kind of border security without granting a pathway 0:01:05.600 --> 0:01:09.360 to citizenship is really unheard of yet. 0:01:09.400 --> 0:01:12.520 Even if the measure passes the Senate, it faces a 0:01:12.600 --> 0:01:15.800 rougher time in the House, where House Speaker Mike Johnson 0:01:15.880 --> 0:01:20.680 is facing intense pressure from ultra conservative Republicans, some who've 0:01:20.680 --> 0:01:23.560 threatened to oust him if he makes a deal with Biden. 0:01:24.080 --> 0:01:26.080 I told the President what I have been saying for 0:01:26.240 --> 0:01:29.800 many months, and that is that we must have change 0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:32.880 at the border, substantive policy change. 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:37.040 And there's also been intervention by former President Donald Trump 0:01:37.240 --> 0:01:41.880 to quash any deal, leaving Biden questioning whether House Republicans 0:01:41.920 --> 0:01:46.000 would actually support immigration reform. That have to choose whether 0:01:46.040 --> 0:01:48.520 they want to solve a problem or keep weaponizing issue 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:51.320 to square political points against the President. Joining me is 0:01:51.400 --> 0:01:54.720 Leon Fresco, the former head of the Office of Immigration 0:01:54.880 --> 0:01:58.400 Litigation at the Justice Department and a partner at hollanden Knight. 0:01:59.440 --> 0:02:06.560 So let's start with the negotiations. Okay, So okay, No, 0:02:06.640 --> 0:02:09.120 I was going to say, Biden said he is seeking 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:12.400 massive changes to US immigration rules. 0:02:13.680 --> 0:02:17.679 So, but it's correct, the negotiations are proceeding and they're 0:02:17.680 --> 0:02:22.200 actually supposed to yield fruit. This week, Senator Schubert kept 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:24.840 the Senate in session even though the House went away 0:02:25.360 --> 0:02:28.079 for recess, under the guys that this would be the 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:31.400 legislation that would actually be brought to the floor for 0:02:31.440 --> 0:02:34.519 a vote. This week now. Having said that, no legislation 0:02:34.560 --> 0:02:39.440 has actually been introduced or distributed to other senators for reviews, 0:02:39.880 --> 0:02:42.359 but we do know certain things. We do know that 0:02:42.960 --> 0:02:46.119 asylum as we currently know it, where people can go 0:02:46.280 --> 0:02:49.640 across the border and ask for asylum, would be banned. 0:02:49.639 --> 0:02:51.200 They would be prohibited from here on. 0:02:51.280 --> 0:02:51.400 Now. 0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:54.560 What would happen is that would be replaced with a 0:02:54.760 --> 0:02:58.480 system where if you don't get specific appointments at the 0:02:58.560 --> 0:03:02.160 ports of entry, and the negotiators are currently talking about 0:03:02.200 --> 0:03:06.440 five thousand appointments being available per day, then you're just banned. 0:03:06.520 --> 0:03:10.840 There's no ability to actually cross the border and get asylum. 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:14.480 You get immediately removed back into Mexico if you try 0:03:14.520 --> 0:03:17.520 to do that. But plus, even for those five thousand 0:03:17.520 --> 0:03:20.040 people who would have appointments at the ports of entry, 0:03:20.440 --> 0:03:22.680 they would have a much higher standard to be in 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:26.480 order to actually be admitted into the country from these 0:03:26.560 --> 0:03:29.680 port of entry interviews, they would actually have to show 0:03:29.720 --> 0:03:33.080 that they have a reasonable fear of being persecuted on 0:03:33.120 --> 0:03:37.760 the basis of their race, religion, national origin, social group, 0:03:37.840 --> 0:03:41.640 or political opinion. And right now there's an easier standard 0:03:41.640 --> 0:03:45.600 called credible fear, which is just a reasonable possibility of 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:48.680 a meritorious claim. Here, you're going to have to show 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:53.560 a significant likelihood that you have a meritorious claim, and 0:03:53.720 --> 0:03:57.080 so that's going to raise the threshold, and usually at 0:03:57.120 --> 0:04:00.360 their higher threshold like that, you're talking about moving from 0:04:00.400 --> 0:04:03.640 about an eighty percent success rate to about a twenty 0:04:03.640 --> 0:04:06.760 to thirty percent success rate for people who will even 0:04:06.800 --> 0:04:10.720 make those claims along the ports of entry, So it 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:14.320 would be a significant change. The final question that still 0:04:14.400 --> 0:04:17.599 hasn't been decided is what will happen to the parole 0:04:17.720 --> 0:04:21.560 authority that President Biden currently has on their laws. And 0:04:21.600 --> 0:04:23.920 there's two kinds of parole authority, and this is what's 0:04:24.000 --> 0:04:27.080 kind of holding things up. There's the first kind, where 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:30.799 President Biden has actually asked people from around the world 0:04:30.839 --> 0:04:34.039 to actually apply to enter legally here, so they have 0:04:34.120 --> 0:04:39.880 one right now for Ukraine, they have one for Venezuela, Cuba, Vicaragua, Haiti. 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.720 So the Republicans want to get rid of that kind 0:04:42.760 --> 0:04:45.680 of parole. But there's also the parole that happens when 0:04:45.720 --> 0:04:48.240 you ask for asylum at the port of entry, which 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:51.520 is if you ask for asylum and you actually show 0:04:51.640 --> 0:04:54.880 that you now have this significant likelihood, what's going to 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:57.880 be your status while you're waiting here to actually have 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:01.280 your final trial. And so the Biden administration says, well, 0:05:01.320 --> 0:05:03.480 that has to be a parole. There's the only way 0:05:03.800 --> 0:05:07.120 you can let someone legally in. And I think this 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.360 is where they're getting caught up as the Republicans don't 0:05:09.400 --> 0:05:12.120 really have a good answer for what's that is somebody 0:05:12.160 --> 0:05:15.720 who cloes legally through the board and asked for asylum 0:05:15.720 --> 0:05:18.440 and meets the standard, how would they be allowed to 0:05:18.480 --> 0:05:21.800 remain here? I think the Republicans want those people to 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:24.760 be in detention the whole time. And I think that's 0:05:24.920 --> 0:05:26.600 the current logjam. 0:05:27.040 --> 0:05:31.040 Is the Biden administration really opposed to closing that because 0:05:31.080 --> 0:05:33.680 that's a significant number of people that are coming in. 0:05:33.640 --> 0:05:35.520 Addition to everyone else. 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:39.400 Republican centators Lindsay Grahm and John Thune held a press 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:44.120 conference last week complaining that the number of immigrants paroled 0:05:44.160 --> 0:05:48.159 into the United States has gone up dramatically under President Biden. 0:05:49.000 --> 0:05:53.040 And so the answer is, there's discussions about allowing those 0:05:53.080 --> 0:05:56.159 things to exist, but capping them. And I think they're 0:05:56.360 --> 0:05:59.000 trying to determine what is an appropriate cap is at 0:05:59.240 --> 0:06:01.719 one hundred thous and paroles like that a year. Is 0:06:01.720 --> 0:06:05.359 it fifty thousand, is it two hundred thousand, and so 0:06:05.440 --> 0:06:08.480 they continue to debate that number. But I do think 0:06:08.960 --> 0:06:10.960 they're probably going to end up with some sort of 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:14.599 cap there, or if not a cap, then something where 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:18.560 the Congress has to vote on exceeding the cap something 0:06:18.680 --> 0:06:21.039 like that. So those are the areas where they're going 0:06:21.120 --> 0:06:23.680 to have that discussion. So I think the answer is 0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:26.800 it's not where it's dead and they're not negotiating, but 0:06:26.880 --> 0:06:28.800 it's just a matter of trying to reach the correct 0:06:28.920 --> 0:06:29.560 answer there. 0:06:30.000 --> 0:06:31.240 Tell me if this is correct. 0:06:31.640 --> 0:06:37.240 I read that the Venezuelan migrants, unlike other migrant groups, 0:06:37.640 --> 0:06:40.000 they don't have ties to friends or family here, so 0:06:40.080 --> 0:06:42.839 they're arriving without resources or a sponsor. 0:06:43.320 --> 0:06:46.600 Well, that's correct. The newest problem for almost everybody arriving 0:06:46.600 --> 0:06:49.520 at the border now is that people arriving at the 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:52.359 border used to have some sort of plan for what 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:55.880 to do when they arrived in America, and now those individuals, 0:06:55.920 --> 0:06:58.640 many of them arriving at the border, don't have a plan, 0:06:58.720 --> 0:07:01.360 which is why cities are having to spend a lot 0:07:01.400 --> 0:07:05.400 of resources on shelters and other things that it's needs 0:07:05.480 --> 0:07:09.440 for these individuals. The deal with these paroles is those 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:13.360 are for people who have some sponsor or ties, and 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:18.200 the question is is that actually replacing illegal immigration, which 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.880 would be a good thing, or is it just extra 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:24.320 people that wouldn't have come, And so it's not doing anything, 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:27.280 it's just adding extra people. And so the Democrats believe 0:07:27.360 --> 0:07:31.680 that those legal parole programs are actually causing illegal immigration 0:07:31.760 --> 0:07:34.800 to go down because it's having people who would otherwise 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:38.960 have come illegally come legally. But the Republicans are saying, no, no, no, 0:07:39.040 --> 0:07:42.760 The people who are coming are people without ties, and 0:07:42.840 --> 0:07:45.840 so these extra people coming with ties are just people 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:48.520 who wouldn't have come but are now coming because there's 0:07:48.560 --> 0:07:51.720 a legal pathway for this. And so that's why we're 0:07:51.720 --> 0:07:52.640 seeing this debate. 0:07:53.160 --> 0:07:57.200 Oklahoma Senator James Langford, who is the lead GOP negotiator, 0:07:57.240 --> 0:07:59.880 said it will be by far the most conservative border 0:08:00.080 --> 0:08:05.040 security bill in four decades, and Lindsey Graham said something 0:08:05.120 --> 0:08:08.120 similar like this is as good as we're ever gonna get. 0:08:08.720 --> 0:08:09.520 Do you agree with that? 0:08:10.080 --> 0:08:13.000 Correct? I think if there is a desire to actually 0:08:13.040 --> 0:08:16.920 get Democrats to actually vote for a bill that dramatically 0:08:17.040 --> 0:08:19.720 changes the way people can have paid asylum in the 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:22.720 United States, this is the last and only chance for 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:26.520 Republicans to get it, because you have the right atmospherics 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:30.000 in play, where it's always that expression only Nixon can 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:33.079 go to China, and so you want the other side. 0:08:33.120 --> 0:08:36.000 So you know, just like Clinton did welfare reform, or 0:08:36.160 --> 0:08:39.959 just like President Bush, did you know, no Child Left Behind? 0:08:40.559 --> 0:08:43.160 Sort of always it's the opposite. And here you would 0:08:43.160 --> 0:08:45.880 want to buy an administration to actually be the one 0:08:46.040 --> 0:08:48.800 who would curtail asylum because of its Trump. Then all 0:08:48.840 --> 0:08:52.120 the Democrats will just oppose whatever Trump was gonna do. 0:08:52.679 --> 0:08:55.160 And so this is your best chance to actually get 0:08:55.200 --> 0:08:58.120 a sylum reform. And so that's why you hear Senator 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:00.920 like for Senator Graham saying. 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:05.320 However, let's say this does pass the Senate, then it 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:10.319 goes to the House. And already we're hearing Trump pressuring 0:09:10.400 --> 0:09:13.920 the House Speaker not to reach a bipartisan deal. He 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:16.679 sat on social media last week, I do not think 0:09:16.720 --> 0:09:19.320 we should do a border deal at all unless we 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:23.000 get everything needed to shut down the invasion of millions 0:09:23.000 --> 0:09:24.160 and millions of people. 0:09:24.720 --> 0:09:27.040 And he's been talking to the House Speaker. 0:09:27.559 --> 0:09:30.680 Yes, I think there's a different calculation in place for 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:34.320 President Trump than there is with regard to the people 0:09:34.320 --> 0:09:37.080 at the border, which is for President Trump, he's sort 0:09:37.080 --> 0:09:41.280 of got these big votives, which is one, yes, obviously 0:09:41.320 --> 0:09:44.040 there's a desire to secure the border, but there's also 0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:47.160 a desire to put oneself in the best position possible 0:09:47.480 --> 0:09:50.640 to win election. And so if the border is not fake, 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:54.040 President Trump would have that calculation, then it would be 0:09:54.080 --> 0:09:57.880 the best possible situation for him to win. And so 0:09:58.080 --> 0:10:00.920 this is the problem, and this is where you're going 0:10:01.000 --> 0:10:03.559 to have a lot of dispute. And what I think 0:10:03.679 --> 0:10:06.120 is very interesting is you have Governor Greg Abbit of 0:10:06.160 --> 0:10:10.640 Texas and Senator John Cornyan, who are usually not people 0:10:10.640 --> 0:10:15.160 who come to the final deal on immigration. They're saying, look, 0:10:15.440 --> 0:10:18.000 as much as we'd like to give an advantage to 0:10:18.120 --> 0:10:23.160 President Trump an election in twenty twenty four, the problem is, 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:25.360 how are we going to keep it so that another 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:29.080 three million people cross the border this year. Why wouldn't 0:10:29.120 --> 0:10:32.680 we actually take the effort to actually close that down. 0:10:33.240 --> 0:10:35.520 And so this is going to be quite the skirmish. 0:10:35.679 --> 0:10:39.160 And so if it passes the Senate, I think it's 0:10:39.200 --> 0:10:41.280 going to be very very difficult for the House to 0:10:41.320 --> 0:10:44.600 just ignore this, because then the House and the Republicans 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:47.520 will start getting blamed for everything that's happening on the 0:10:47.559 --> 0:10:51.959 border rather than President Biden. So if the Republicans really 0:10:52.080 --> 0:10:55.480 wanted President Biden to be the ones that would be blamed, 0:10:55.520 --> 0:10:57.960 that they would just shut this all down. But if 0:10:57.960 --> 0:11:01.400 something passes in the Senate, no doubt, the Republicans are 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:03.200 going to be blamed in the House that they don't 0:11:03.240 --> 0:11:06.320 actually at least even give a vote for what the 0:11:06.400 --> 0:11:07.160 Senate produced. 0:11:07.640 --> 0:11:10.160 Coming up next on the Bloomberg Law Show, I'll continue 0:11:10.160 --> 0:11:14.920 this conversation with immigration law expert Leon Fresco, and we'll 0:11:14.920 --> 0:11:18.720 talk about the escalating battle between Texas and the Biden 0:11:18.760 --> 0:11:24.120 administration over the border. The Biden administration won one fight today, 0:11:24.480 --> 0:11:27.160 as the Supreme Court said it can remove parts of 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:31.360 a fence along the southern border built by Texas. The 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:34.880 vote was five to four, with the Chief Justice John 0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:38.320 Roberts and Justice Amy Coney Barrett voting with the liberals. 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:39.560 In the case, I'm. 0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:42.960 June Grosso and you're listening to Bloomberg. A divided Supreme 0:11:43.080 --> 0:11:47.240 Court has sided with the Biden administration, allowing US Border 0:11:47.240 --> 0:11:51.680 Patrol agents to remove razor wire fencing put up by Texas. 0:11:51.800 --> 0:11:55.840 Along the southern border, Texas officials installed twenty nine miles 0:11:55.880 --> 0:12:00.240 of barriers using barbed wire in the escalating fight between 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:04.199 the state and the administration over illegal immigration at the border. 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:07.800 The sharp barriers have been a particular source of tension, 0:12:08.000 --> 0:12:11.400 with federal agents saying they have maimed and bloodied migrants 0:12:11.440 --> 0:12:15.400 and pose a hazard to US agents. Here's Texas Democratic 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:18.120 Congressman Joaquim Castro back in July. 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:20.959 As far as the razor wire goes, not only is 0:12:21.000 --> 0:12:23.439 it in umade on the face of it, but it's 0:12:23.480 --> 0:12:25.840 also placed along the water in such a way that 0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:29.080 at times it's invisible to the people who are trying 0:12:29.120 --> 0:12:29.720 to cross. 0:12:30.320 --> 0:12:33.560 The Supreme Court's emergency order vacates a ruling from the 0:12:33.600 --> 0:12:37.280 Fifth Circuit that said border patrol could only cut down 0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:40.520 the razor wire in an emergency. It was a five 0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:43.600 to four decision, with the Chief Justice and Justice Amy 0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:47.640 Coney Barrett siding with the Court's liberals. I've been speaking 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:51.960 with immigration law expert Leon Fresco of Hollanda Knight. Are 0:12:51.960 --> 0:12:54.839 you surprised that the Supreme Court sided with the Biden 0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:55.800 administration here? 0:12:56.360 --> 0:13:01.319 Well, it's not surprising from a purely legal personective, which 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:02.840 is that at the end of the day, it would 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:05.880 have been very tough to say that a stake can 0:13:05.920 --> 0:13:10.560 actually erect a razor wire fencing barrier along the Mexico 0:13:10.679 --> 0:13:14.040 border that the border patrol wouldn't be able to access 0:13:14.160 --> 0:13:18.480 only in the highest of emergencies. So from that standpoint, 0:13:18.880 --> 0:13:21.800 that is not surprising. But it's interesting that it was 0:13:21.840 --> 0:13:24.840 a five to four decision and that if simply Justice 0:13:24.880 --> 0:13:28.559 amy Cony Barrett had switched to the other side, then 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:32.640 this injunction would have remained in place, and Texas basically 0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:37.679 could have walled off a twenty nine mile wire square 0:13:37.720 --> 0:13:40.920 there along the Rio Grande River that the federal government 0:13:40.960 --> 0:13:42.840 wouldn't have been able to go in. And the idea 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:45.920 was that Texas wanted to wire that off to deter 0:13:46.480 --> 0:13:48.440 foreign nationals from crossing the border. 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:53.400 So that means that four justices thought that Texas should 0:13:53.440 --> 0:13:55.560 have the authority to do this, or could it be 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:58.600 that four justices thought the government didn't make out a 0:13:58.640 --> 0:13:59.680 strong enough case. 0:14:00.440 --> 0:14:03.080 I mean, we don't know, because it's just an order, right. 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:06.040 The decision is just an order which says that the 0:14:06.120 --> 0:14:10.040 injunction that Texas had sought in the fifth circuit to 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:13.840 prevent the federal government from coming in and cutting down 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:18.520 the wire. That injunction was vacated, and we know that 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:22.080 justice is Thomas, Alito, Gorsich, and Kavanaugh would have kept 0:14:22.120 --> 0:14:24.520 that injunction in place. Now, if you're going to keep 0:14:24.560 --> 0:14:29.880 an injunction in place, you're technically saying that you believe 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.680 that that injunction was rightfully issued. Otherwise you have some 0:14:32.880 --> 0:14:37.400 duty to vacate that injunction. And so from that standpoint, 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:39.880 I do think it's fair to say that those four 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:44.000 justices thought that because the fence was built on private land, 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:47.000 that the federal government wouldn't have any authority to be 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:49.880 able to cut down that fire fencing. But at the 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:52.360 end of the day, that's very hard argument to make 0:14:52.760 --> 0:14:56.400 when it's really controlling. I mean, if the intentive defence 0:14:56.560 --> 0:15:01.320 is to control the border, then you have to say, Okay, 0:15:01.400 --> 0:15:05.080 if that's the incentive defense, then that's the jurisdiction of 0:15:05.120 --> 0:15:07.480 the Border patrol. You can't have it both ways. And 0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:11.680 it had been a fence to deal with livestock or something, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:14.160 then you could have that debate, well, can the Border 0:15:14.200 --> 0:15:17.680 Patrol arbitrarily say they need it for the border, But 0:15:17.760 --> 0:15:20.200 if the whole point of defense is to control the border, 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:23.160 then you start having this problem of well, why is 0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:27.120 it the ultimate arbiter of that, the border patrol and. 0:15:27.120 --> 0:15:29.600 Leon is the case continuing below. 0:15:30.120 --> 0:15:33.240 Yes, this is the injunction phase of the case. Now 0:15:33.280 --> 0:15:35.680 we have to have sort of the merit part of 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:37.720 this case, and so you got to go through it. 0:15:37.720 --> 0:15:40.680 It's always the case gets decided before it gets decided, 0:15:41.280 --> 0:15:44.160 and so in the first round, which is the turbo round, 0:15:44.760 --> 0:15:49.720 the government wins. But now we have the longer briefing 0:15:49.800 --> 0:15:52.360 where the district court has to decide who's right is 0:15:52.360 --> 0:15:55.200 it the state of Texas or is it the federal government. 0:15:55.280 --> 0:15:57.840 The Fifth Circuit has to decide who's right is it 0:15:57.880 --> 0:16:00.760 the State of Texas or the federal government. And if 0:16:00.800 --> 0:16:02.760 the federal government wins in the Fifth Circuit, I don't 0:16:02.800 --> 0:16:05.080 think you'd see this case get to the Supreme Court. 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:07.880 But if the State of Texas wins in the Fifth Circuit, 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:10.680 then you would see this case come back to the 0:16:10.720 --> 0:16:12.560 Supreme Court for a final decision. 0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:16.240 And LeAnn remind me, how did the Chief Justice rule 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:21.160 in the Arizona case where was decided that states can't 0:16:21.200 --> 0:16:23.600 implement their own immigration laws. 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.760 The Chief Justice ruled in favor of the federal government, 0:16:26.960 --> 0:16:31.720 so he's been remarkably consistent there that states cannot take 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:35.520 immigration laws into their own hands. So there's four votes 0:16:35.560 --> 0:16:38.440 for that. The question is who's the fifth vote in 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:41.240 any of these given cases, And at least for this 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:45.440 particular case, Justice Cony Barrett was the one who came 0:16:45.480 --> 0:16:48.760 along with Chief Justice Roberts and said, the State of 0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:49.920 Texas can't do this. 0:16:50.560 --> 0:16:53.360 Does this cover the buoys too, or is it separate? 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:56.600 No, this does not cover the movie. So this is 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:01.720 a specific case where the State of tech Texas actually sued. 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:05.199 In this case, the State of Texas actually sued to 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:09.119 get an injunction to prevent the Border Patrol from cutting 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:12.120 the wire that the State of Texas was putting in. 0:17:12.119 --> 0:17:16.480 In the Booiz case, the federal government sued under the 0:17:16.520 --> 0:17:19.760 Maritime and Rivers Act to get the Booies out. So 0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:23.679 that's a separate case which the Fifth Circuit actually just 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:28.000 decided to rehear on Bank also where the Fifth Circuit 0:17:28.119 --> 0:17:31.639 panel had said that the water barriers were illegal, and 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:33.840 that one is now going on Bank to the Fifth 0:17:33.840 --> 0:17:37.600 Circuit to decide whether the buoys can remain on the 0:17:37.680 --> 0:17:40.240 Rio Grande River or whether they have to be taken out. 0:17:40.800 --> 0:17:44.240 Is it the same principle, so we'd see the same majority. 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:46.639 I think at the end of the day you probably will, 0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:52.720 because the buoys quite frankly, more than the fencing one, 0:17:53.000 --> 0:17:55.600 they're actually closer to the border because they're on the border, 0:17:55.640 --> 0:17:58.960 they're in the Rio grand River, so they're actually affecting 0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:02.240 our relations with Mexico, which is a very important fact. 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:07.800 But secondly, they are governed by this very clear Rivers 0:18:07.840 --> 0:18:12.600 and Maritime Act, which actually really places the jurisdiction there 0:18:12.640 --> 0:18:15.160 on the federal government to decide what kinds of barriers 0:18:15.200 --> 0:18:18.320 you can create in these areas, so states really can't 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:21.080 take matters into their own hands. So I would expect 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:23.400 at some point you would see these moooies be able 0:18:23.440 --> 0:18:26.320 to be eliminated from the Rio Grande River. 0:18:26.840 --> 0:18:27.240 And lee on. 0:18:27.280 --> 0:18:32.520 The Biden administration asked for this emergency order earlier in 0:18:32.560 --> 0:18:35.320 the month, so we've been waiting for it and waiting 0:18:35.359 --> 0:18:38.560 for it. I'm wondering what was going on behind the scenes. 0:18:39.440 --> 0:18:44.080 I definitely think that perhaps the events that happened recently 0:18:44.280 --> 0:18:47.920 with the drowning in the river played some role here 0:18:47.960 --> 0:18:51.359 in getting Justice Cony Barrett to come across the finish 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:56.080 line and join the liberal group to lift this injunction 0:18:56.320 --> 0:18:58.800 because the Border Patrol says that they couldn't get to 0:18:58.960 --> 0:19:02.480 the individuals, and the debate about whether the individuals whatever 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:05.840 wouldn't have drowned had the Border Patrol been able to 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:09.000 get to them. I definitely think those events really played 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:11.600 a role here. I can't imagine that wasn't the case, 0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:14.440 because otherwise we might have had a decision earlier. 0:19:14.760 --> 0:19:18.080 Yeah, and the Solicitor General did tell the Justices in 0:19:18.160 --> 0:19:22.320 a filing that the limited exception that the Fifth Circuit 0:19:22.400 --> 0:19:25.760 gave to Border Patrol that it could only cut down 0:19:25.800 --> 0:19:30.720 the razor wire fencing in an emergency, posed a serious 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:33.960 threat to human life because it didn't give border agents 0:19:34.119 --> 0:19:37.840 enough time to respond to medical emergencies such as the 0:19:37.840 --> 0:19:40.440 one where a woman and her two children had drowned 0:19:40.480 --> 0:19:41.920 on January twelfth. 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:44.240 So that was part of the argument. 0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:48.000 And this is just one of several legal fights the 0:19:48.040 --> 0:19:52.600 administration is having with Texas. The federal government is suing 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:56.879 Texas over a criminal law on immigration that the state 0:19:56.960 --> 0:20:00.439 has passed. It hasn't gone into effect yet. Tell us 0:20:00.480 --> 0:20:00.960 about that. 0:20:01.680 --> 0:20:04.080 So then there's another law, which was called Senate Bill 0:20:04.200 --> 0:20:07.679 foro in Texas, which is trying to overturn what was 0:20:08.320 --> 0:20:12.240 the decision in twenty twelve in Arizona versus the United 0:20:12.320 --> 0:20:16.120 States which said that states couldn't take immigration enforcement into 0:20:16.160 --> 0:20:20.000 their own hands, but that was preended by federal law. Well, 0:20:20.320 --> 0:20:22.560 Texas is saying, well, maybe that could change it. I'll 0:20:22.600 --> 0:20:25.280 give it the new composition of the Supreme Court. And 0:20:25.320 --> 0:20:28.440 so they passed the law that said that if they 0:20:29.119 --> 0:20:35.920 uncover some undocumented foreign nationals crossing into Texas or recently 0:20:36.000 --> 0:20:39.640 arrived in Texas, they could basically take that foreign national 0:20:39.800 --> 0:20:44.159 to the border and they would then be able to say, 0:20:44.240 --> 0:20:46.639 if you don't cross back into Mexico, we're going to 0:20:46.720 --> 0:20:50.879 prosecute you for a misdemeanor. And if the person refused 0:20:50.880 --> 0:20:53.440 to do that, it either re entered or something, they 0:20:53.440 --> 0:20:56.439 could be prosecuted for a felony. And so that is 0:20:56.520 --> 0:21:01.640 basically prosecuting people for undocumented immigration, which is currently illegal 0:21:01.720 --> 0:21:05.520 under Arizona versus United States. And so the question is 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.399 will this Supreme Court allow Texas to do that? 0:21:08.920 --> 0:21:11.320 As a federal judge even ruled in that case yet. 0:21:11.200 --> 0:21:13.920 Correct, there's been no decision on any request for an 0:21:13.920 --> 0:21:15.200 injunction yet on this. 0:21:15.280 --> 0:21:17.600 Case, but we can sort of guess what's going to 0:21:17.640 --> 0:21:21.479 happen there. It's in Texas, so a Texas judge and 0:21:21.520 --> 0:21:22.479 then the Fifth Circuit. 0:21:22.840 --> 0:21:24.320 I mean, we're going to end up with the Supreme 0:21:24.359 --> 0:21:27.399 Court deciding one way or another on this injunction. But 0:21:27.680 --> 0:21:29.880 until we get there with it's going to be quite 0:21:29.920 --> 0:21:30.679 a rollercoaster. 0:21:31.359 --> 0:21:35.080 So leon we've talked over the years about the drastic 0:21:35.160 --> 0:21:40.120 measures that Governor Greg Abbott has taken, and he proudly 0:21:40.160 --> 0:21:44.760 announced on January ninth that the state had sent over 0:21:44.880 --> 0:21:50.640 one hundred thousand migrants to sanctuary cities across the United States. 0:21:51.320 --> 0:21:52.160 And while that. 0:21:52.160 --> 0:21:56.840 Action seems wrong on so many levels, he sort of 0:21:56.880 --> 0:22:01.160 made his point by forcing Northern City Ease to deal 0:22:01.280 --> 0:22:06.719 with an overwhelming number of migrants, because now we're dealing 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:10.280 with the problems that that Texas border communities have dealt 0:22:10.320 --> 0:22:11.960 with for many, many years. 0:22:12.440 --> 0:22:16.639 It was a very effective technique, especially once the people 0:22:16.680 --> 0:22:19.479 that were being sent were people who did not have 0:22:19.520 --> 0:22:21.359 a plan for what they were going to do in 0:22:21.400 --> 0:22:24.359 the United States. It was one thing to send people 0:22:24.960 --> 0:22:27.600 to other cities if they had a plan because then 0:22:27.640 --> 0:22:30.399 the cities could simply get a boss or an uber 0:22:30.520 --> 0:22:34.159