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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies, history is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Welcome Back Fellow conspiracy realist Tonight's classic episode takes us

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Speaker 2: to Staffordshire, England, where we are going to learn about gosh,

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Speaker 2: do you guys remember this one the Sugarburgh inscription cipher.

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Speaker 3: Sugarburwh Oh, yeah, that's where sug Knight was from. It

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Speaker 3: was named after sug Knight. That's his childhood home, that

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Speaker 3: sugar Burrow.

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Speaker 4: Yeahs.

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Speaker 2: There's a sculpture out there in England that is a

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Speaker 2: recreation of a painting called Shepherds of Arcadia. But this

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Speaker 2: sculpture has a very bizarre inscription. And this inscription has

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Speaker 2: birthed numerous conspiracy theories, or I guess, if we're being

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Speaker 2: a little more diplomatic, numerous fringe interpretations.

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Speaker 4: Love it accurate, let's start transcribe, no inscribe, I don't know,

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Speaker 4: let's check it out. Sure.

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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies, history is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn the stuff they don't want you to know a

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Speaker 1: production of iHeart Radios, How Stuff Works.

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt.

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Speaker 3: My name is Matt.

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Speaker 2: They call me Ben. We are joined as always with

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Speaker 2: our super producer Paul, Mission Control decad. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 2: are you, You are here, and that makes this stuff.

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Speaker 2: They don't want you to know. How's everybody feeling back.

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Speaker 4: For another week? I'm feeling awesome. Can I tell you

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Speaker 4: a quick story please? Okay. So my son is aware

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Speaker 4: of Star Wars. We haven't watched any of the movies yet,

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Speaker 4: but he has a couple of these, the paper or

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Speaker 4: the cardboard books of Star Wars stories, and he knows

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Speaker 4: what a lightsaber is. And he's real hyped about lightsabers.

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Speaker 4: So does he say it? Huh?

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Speaker 3: He says lightsaber yeah, lightsabers.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: He loves it, and he makes this sound. He goes great. Well,

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Speaker 4: So I realized that my wife and I had an

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Speaker 4: old stash of glow sticks, because you know, everybody's just

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Speaker 4: got some glow sticks hanging around that are still packaged

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Speaker 4: from you know, back in your twenties, right, I bro cool? Okay,

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Speaker 4: So I realized that we had some I found like

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Speaker 4: a green one and a red one. So I get

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Speaker 4: to play Darth Daddy and he gets to and he

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Speaker 4: pretends that he's Yoda, always Yoda. Yeah, and we have

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Speaker 4: lightsaber battles with glow sticks now almost nightly.

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Speaker 3: You think it's because Yoda is like around his height

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Speaker 3: and he recognizes that super agile. Yeah, yeah, that's got

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Speaker 3: to be. It's to mind control powers. That's a that's

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Speaker 3: a selling point.

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Speaker 4: Yeah. And he does force Tornado on me all the

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Speaker 4: time and it's it's stabilitated.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Where is that in the lexicon?

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Speaker 5: Though?

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Speaker 3: Forced tornado? Is that? Did he make that up? Or

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Speaker 3: is that canon?

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Speaker 4: Pretty sure? The next episode is going to have a

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Speaker 4: forced tornado. Okay, and you heard it here first.

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Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well we look forward to seeing this

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Speaker 2: franchise development.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the Star Wars things going places.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, you know, my Spider sense tells me, how

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Speaker 2: are you doing? Noel, how's it? How's how's it going?

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Speaker 3: I'm doing well? Speaking of Spider sense, did you guys

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Speaker 3: see the end game? The end of the end game?

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Speaker 4: I did, I haven't.

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Speaker 3: Okay you no? No?

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Speaker 4: No discussion then no, no, I kind of want discussion. Well,

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Speaker 4: I mean this isn't really the place I saved me

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Speaker 4: three hours.

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Speaker 2: Please Victory Lap.

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Speaker 3: It's it's a but it's a really really expensive Victory

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Speaker 3: Lap and and it and it has some very satisfying conclusions.

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Speaker 3: It has a few things that are kind of like

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Speaker 3: w TF. And it has a few things that are

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Speaker 3: kind of a little bit glossed over and then sort

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Speaker 3: of like wait what happened to that thread? They sort

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Speaker 3: of like it. But all in all, what a what

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Speaker 3: a feat?

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Speaker 2: What? What a what a feat?

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Speaker 3: Though? Like just organizational skills right to give all those

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Speaker 3: characters their.

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Speaker 2: Due and no one's expecting that wolverine cameo that well,

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Speaker 2: like that is wild.

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Speaker 4: Is there ever any point in the movie where all

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Speaker 4: of those A list like actors are in one place

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Speaker 4: totally or not, like like you can tell they're not

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Speaker 4: green screened in or whatever.

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Speaker 3: I can't comment that's too much though.

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Speaker 4: Okay, well, I mean there the Avengers plus all the others.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I mean it's a payoff people have been

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Speaker 2: waiting for, and I think it's well worth the price

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Speaker 2: of a ticket. You know, that's the kind of film

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Speaker 2: that's good to see in theaters.

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Speaker 3: Good to see on the imax. If you have that availability.

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Speaker 3: For sure, I will die on this hill. To quote

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Speaker 3: Ben Bollen, screw three D not worth the price. I'd

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Speaker 3: pay that price just to see it on the bigger

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Speaker 3: screen with the better sound system.

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Speaker 2: Did you watch it in three No?

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Speaker 3: I don't. I just some one time Black Panther I

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Speaker 3: saw on three D because someone invited me, having already

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Speaker 3: bought the tickets, and then popped it on. I mean

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Speaker 3: once I got there that it was three D and

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Speaker 3: the tickets were like forty bucks a B.

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Speaker 2: I don't like three D.

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Speaker 3: See, it's like, give me a headache. It wasn't fun,

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Speaker 3: and I have my kid with me, so that was

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Speaker 3: like eighty dollars of movie. Oh it was. I mean

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Speaker 3: I'm probably exaggerating.

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Speaker 2: A little bit, but I don't know. Man, once you

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Speaker 2: factor in popcorn.

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Speaker 3: I just don't like three D. I don't find it

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Speaker 3: immersive or fun.

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Speaker 2: We're already in three D, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 3: Album.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, fully, it's.

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Speaker 2: Like advertising a movie with sound.

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Speaker 4: I had this this well yeah, yeah, Ben, how are

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Speaker 4: you doing? You know?

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Speaker 2: I have an interesting story for you about Avengers that

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Speaker 2: has nothing to do with the film. Really, I won't

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Speaker 2: spoil anything, because I know a lot of us listening

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Speaker 2: feel very strongly about spoilers. I love them. Most people

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Speaker 2: hate them anyway. So I'm watching this I'm watching this

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Speaker 2: thing and it is a long journey. It's long film,

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Speaker 2: and there are ups in there, downs, and I think

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Speaker 2: overall it's very well made, but there's really there's a really,

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Speaker 2: really really sad part that gets a lot of people.

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Speaker 2: And as I was watching the sad part in the theater,

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Speaker 2: I heard someone uh kind of behind me and I thought, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I guess. I guess got a cold or something. You

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Speaker 2: shouldn't really be outside of your contagious And then I

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Speaker 2: heard more people like and.

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Speaker 4: Uh, everybody get a hold of and like.

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Speaker 2: I thought, people, I was like, wow, it's really going around,

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Speaker 2: you know, it's this And I've never encountered measles in

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Speaker 2: the wild, so it's like, do people have measles or whatever?

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Speaker 2: And then uh, the people I was at the movie with, uh,

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Speaker 2: I like, I asked them about it afterwards and they said, no,

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Speaker 2: you've I don't want to use the strong language they used,

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Speaker 2: but they said, no, dude, don't be a robot. They

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Speaker 2: were crying. Yeah, So I think I just am missing

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Speaker 2: that emotional switch.

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Speaker 3: Ire one feeling a year would possibly have fallen on

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Speaker 3: the Avengers.

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Speaker 4: I would have put that beat down to three three

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Speaker 4: three three.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going one of your one of your guy.

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Speaker 3: You could have reserved for the Avenger.

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Speaker 4: Because you you genuinely did grow up with these characters.

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Speaker 3: That's right.

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Speaker 2: I guess we all did.

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Speaker 5: Well.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, but out of a lot of people that I know,

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Speaker 4: you're probably one of Yeah, you know the characters in the.

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Speaker 3: Story, and you know the comics too, you know. That's

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Speaker 3: what I'm saying that the original the comic not no,

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Speaker 3: not to degree, so many of these characters were not

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Speaker 3: big flagship characters, at least for me, you know.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, uh. But but be that as it may,

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Speaker 2: I think we did a really great job talking about

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Speaker 2: the Avengers without giving anything away totally. So if if

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Speaker 2: you haven't seen it yet, do check it out. They

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Speaker 2: are not paying us to say this. You just think

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Speaker 2: of it, And Matt, I can't wait till you see

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Speaker 2: it so we can hang out and talk about it.

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Speaker 4: I can't wait to finally see ant Man get crushed

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Speaker 4: by the boot.

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Speaker 3: Of some other character that's actually his nemesis. It's a

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Speaker 3: supervillain called the Boot.

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Speaker 4: No, it's not.

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Speaker 2: It's like Paul is. Paul is a huge film buff

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Speaker 2: Mission Control over here, and he enjoyed the film as well.

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Speaker 2: So if you can't take Nolan I's co sign as

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Speaker 2: as worth worth it, yeah, take Paul's.

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Speaker 4: Okay, but what about Game of Game of Thrones, Joe

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Speaker 4: Game of Thrones? What about the Game of Thrones?

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Speaker 3: Hey?

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Speaker 2: Did you did you guys love that Cup cameo?

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Speaker 4: The Cup cameo made my day?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I get it because Cup's story is

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Speaker 2: super complicated in the books and it's like a pivotal point.

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Speaker 2: You just can't do it justice on the screen, you know.

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Speaker 4: Tyrian is like giving it the side eye.

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Speaker 3: They see gied it out though. That's one of the beauty,

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Speaker 3: beautiful things as far as the networks concerned of streaming

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Speaker 3: is you know, if it's printed and it's in the theaters,

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Speaker 3: they're not going to pull all those prints out of

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Speaker 3: every theater in the in the country. But for this

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Speaker 3: they just go in there, blip, re upload, yep. It's

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Speaker 3: like it was never there, except the internet never forgets.

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Speaker 4: How many people got fired? Do you think just one? One?

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Speaker 4: Uh one?

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Speaker 2: Best boy one best boy with the best dream, so well,

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Speaker 2: that guy became a legend. We'll get to the point

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Speaker 2: of the show in just a second.

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Speaker 3: We guys owe us a little bit of a rambling insurer.

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Speaker 3: I think we've been keeping it pretty tight.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And we want to hear directly from you

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Speaker 2: your opinions about this this intro, or your your opinions

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Speaker 2: about any old thing on your mind from previous episodes,

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Speaker 2: or suggestions for a future episode. Matt our friend and cohort.

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Speaker 2: Matt has been on this amazing journey listening to voicemails.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I gotta tell you, I haven't been off of

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Speaker 4: this journey in a while. Now.

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Speaker 2: Someone need to take up the mantleman.

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Speaker 4: It's so great. It's such a roller coaster because it

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Speaker 4: gets really dark sometimes and then it is the funniest

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Speaker 4: thing I've heard all week sometimes and then it just

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Speaker 4: happens again. But the best thing is that everything that

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Speaker 4: gets put on that the voicemail message machine is genuine

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Speaker 4: and awesome. And everyone, if you're hearing this, you are awesome.

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Speaker 4: Give us a call again. You can call one eight

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Speaker 4: three three S ST D W I T K right now.

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Speaker 4: Leave us a message. Any suggestions even on the format

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Speaker 4: of the show. Just tell us, tell us what you

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Speaker 4: want us to do. We're listening.

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Speaker 2: Get weird with it. And also, speaking of the phones,

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Speaker 2: shout out to our formerly anonymous caller, Stephen B. Who

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Speaker 2: hipped us to Canada's Shag Harbor incident as an episode.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for tuning in, Stephen. Stephen reached out,

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Speaker 2: reached out to us and I hope you don't get

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Speaker 2: mad at us for say this, Steven, but he said, guys,

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Speaker 2: I don't know why I didn't say my name, but

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Speaker 2: I'm the one who called about Shag Harbor incident. So

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Speaker 2: there you go. It's we I especially get it. It's

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Speaker 2: tough when you're when you're working live and you only

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Speaker 2: got three minutes, but call us. Try it for yourself.

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Speaker 2: Don't take my word or Steven's word for it. Today

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Speaker 2: we're off to England and as they say in Staffordshire,

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Speaker 2: both of them, yes, yes, yes, what the heck are

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Speaker 2: we talking about? We'll tell you a journey with us.

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Speaker 2: And if you are a listener on the other side

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Speaker 2: of the Atlantic, if you are located in Europe, if

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Speaker 2: you are located in the United Kingdom, if you are

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Speaker 2: located in Staffordshire or I've ever been there, We want

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Speaker 2: to hear from you. Here's the thing about Saffordshire. It's

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Speaker 2: a county in the west Midlands of England. It's landlocked, right,

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Speaker 2: it's not one of the coastal areas. It has a

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Speaker 2: pretty healthy population of just over one million people, and

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Speaker 2: like most places in the United Kingdom, it's home to

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Speaker 2: a storied past, numerous historical buildings, monuments and so on.

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Speaker 2: You know that thing that you probably here thrown around

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Speaker 2: all the time. In Europe, two hundred miles is a

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Speaker 2: long way and in the US two hundred years is

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Speaker 2: a long time. Yes, yeah, so this place does have

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Speaker 2: a lot of history. However, most people outside of the

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Speaker 2: United Kingdom in Europe haven't really heard of the place,

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Speaker 2: unless that is there into the world of fringe research

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Speaker 2: and conspiracies.

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Speaker 3: That's right.

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Speaker 4: Straffordshire is actually a little bit famous in those realms

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Speaker 4: because there's this tiny little thing relatively to the rest

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Speaker 4: of Straffordshire, tiny tiny little thing. It's a monument called

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Speaker 4: the Shepherd's Monument. And on this monument there's an engraving.

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Speaker 4: It's got one of the most enigmatic as of yet

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Speaker 4: unbroken ciphers that you heard us say, or at least

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Speaker 4: phonetically attempt to say earlier.

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Speaker 2: Be backwards masking again, that we're going to talk progressively

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Speaker 2: and backwards masking. Yes, nice episode. Yeah it was Paul's idea. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's true.

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Speaker 4: It's true.

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Speaker 2: We are phonetically pronouncing this very weird cipher.

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Speaker 4: It's literally eight characters and then two more little characters

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Speaker 4: and an exclamation mark.

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Speaker 2: No, no, you know. It made me think of do

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Speaker 2: you guys? You know I don't have time to play

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Speaker 2: a lot of video games, but I'm in this somewhat

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Speaker 2: monogamous video game relationship with a thing called Skyrim. And

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Speaker 2: still I went back and started playing it again. I'm

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Speaker 2: different now I'm an Argonian. They're the lizard people.

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Speaker 5: I was.

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Speaker 3: You were?

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Speaker 4: I was?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Were? You were?

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Speaker 2: You of age? I know you love in age.

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Speaker 3: I was an Argonian mage.

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Speaker 4: Nice messed up? You should have been a thief? Why?

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Speaker 4: I don't know. Argonians are awesome with.

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Speaker 2: The that's a stereotype.

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Speaker 4: They have a lot of good attributes for it. It's

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Speaker 4: all I'm saying, Oh God, that sounds awful, but it's

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Speaker 4: so true because you literally pick your like species or

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Speaker 4: your race.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's it's it's it's a great game and

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Speaker 2: you can go back and you can do all the

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Speaker 2: stuff you want to do.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 2: Anyway, anyway, it reminds me of the Dragon Shouts where

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Speaker 2: they're all, you know, it's got really dope music in

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Speaker 2: that game and they're like doing Dov King's you know,

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Speaker 2: Oh it totally does it. That's intense stuff, you know.

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Speaker 2: But anyhow, this weird Dovi king esque code came to

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Speaker 2: be sometime between well, the monument came to be sometime

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Speaker 2: between seventeen forty eight and seventeen sixty three, when this

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Speaker 2: British parliament member named Thomas Anson commissioned a monument to

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Speaker 2: be built at a place called Sugarburrow Hall in Staffordshire.

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Speaker 2: And we may be mispronouncing that. We talked a little

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Speaker 2: bit about that before it went on the Sugbroh, sugarbro

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Speaker 2: sug Barh and no, you said it feels like an

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Speaker 2: Australian It does kind of, yeah.

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Speaker 4: Sugar Barrow, Sugarbarrow was a little bit I think.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know why.

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Speaker 3: Shug just the word Shug, you know, feels Australia. Seems

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Speaker 3: like the name of some kind of Australian implement, you know,

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Speaker 3: a shug.

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Speaker 2: Dear OSSes, Yeah, I know.

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Speaker 4: It's like a shiv, but it's more blunt.

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Speaker 2: You know, into Australian slang. Calling McDonald's Macca's has like

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Speaker 2: just it's changed my world. I say that, yeah, m

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Speaker 2: Acca nice. I don't know if it'll actually get me

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Speaker 2: to go to a McDonald's, but I like to drive

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Speaker 2: by and say Macca's.

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Speaker 3: I feel like a shug would be some kind of club.

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Speaker 3: It's not like a club where you party, like a club,

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Speaker 3: like a couch club. Someone with yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So this this place, Sugarburw Hall in Staffordshire is

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Speaker 2: the location of this monument and Thomas Anson, although he

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Speaker 2: commissions this monument, the Shepherd's Monument, his brother George, who

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Speaker 2: is an admiral, actually pays for it. And a Flemish

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Speaker 2: sculptor named Peter Shemaker's with two e's is the guy

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Speaker 2: who actually builds the thing. But what does it look like?

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Speaker 3: Well, the sculpture is comprised of a mirror image, or

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Speaker 3: what's known as a boss relief, of a painting by

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Speaker 3: Nicholas Poussin that's called The Shepherds of Arcadia, and it's

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Speaker 3: also known as Okay, I'm gonna give this a whirl.

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Speaker 3: I think it's his Latin. Yes, yeah, at in Arcadia ego.

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Speaker 3: Les Burger's the Arcadi or the Arcadian Shepherds, and I

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Speaker 3: was painted in sixteen thirty seven or between sixteen thirty

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Speaker 3: seven to sixteen thirty eight.

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Speaker 2: And it's this fascinating iconic work. You can it's more

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Speaker 2: than worth your time to check it out. And I

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Speaker 2: think some of us listening will be familiar with this

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Speaker 2: painting and know where this is going.

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Speaker 4: Because it's shepherds that are around a tomb, right, and

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Speaker 4: then they have very specific hand gestures that they're doing,

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Speaker 4: and it's check it out.

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Speaker 2: So there are four figures in the in the painting,

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Speaker 2: there are three shepherds, there's a female figure gathered around

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Speaker 2: this tomb, as you said, Matt, and two of the

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Speaker 2: shepherds are pointing at the tomb and in a real

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Speaker 2: sketchy way, you know what I mean. And on this

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Speaker 2: tomb there's this Latin text at in Arcadia Ego, which

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Speaker 2: translates to I am even in Arcadia or I am

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Speaker 2: also in Arcadia. You'll hear other versions with like even

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Speaker 2: in arcadia, am I M whatever, it's Latin, it's really

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Speaker 2: it's really cool phrase, very famous phrase in literature. But

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Speaker 2: let's let's bracket that. Just know that that exists right now,

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Speaker 2: and let's let's go back to this sculpture, this bass relief.

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Speaker 2: It looks like the painting, but it's got some key differences.

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Speaker 4: The first big thing you'll notice if you're looking at

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Speaker 4: the monument, the Sugbro monument, is that there is an

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Speaker 4: extra sarcophagus that's sitting on top of a tomb inside

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Speaker 4: the original painting, which you go, Okay, I wonder what

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00:17:39,640 --> 00:17:42,760
Speaker 4: that could mean. An extra tomb. Maybe there are two

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Speaker 4: people in tomb that we need to be thinking about

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Speaker 4: in this Who knows it could be more cryptic than that.

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Speaker 4: Let's move on because the other thing is that there

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Speaker 4: are two stone heads above the image from the painting. Okay,

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Speaker 4: so you got one that's this mirthful, mirthful fellow. The

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Speaker 4: look on his face is the way to tell the mirth. Yeah.

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Speaker 4: The other, though, is horned and bearing a marketing resemblance

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Speaker 4: to that old Greek god Pan that you might remember,

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Speaker 4: that old goat literally the old goat Pan. That is

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Speaker 4: both fun in like whimsical but also extremely creepy. Yeah.

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Speaker 4: It has some representations, some symbolical representations of other things,

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Speaker 4: the goat being one of them. You might remember from

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Speaker 4: other things we've talked about on the show with the

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Speaker 4: old bachhomet Ah.

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Speaker 2: That's right, yes, yes, And while the sculpture itself is impressive,

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Speaker 2: most people are are kind of over the sculpture. They're

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00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:57,199
Speaker 2: more fascinated by this inscription carved below it. At first glance,

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Speaker 2: it seems simple. It's as you said, beat, it's a

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Speaker 2: scant two lines of text. Yes, and it looks very confusing.

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Speaker 2: It looks like the worst wheel of fortune.

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Speaker 4: Clue Ever, I'm going to do a version of your

382
00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:10,480
Speaker 4: Skyroom of how I would do it.

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Speaker 3: Chance here, Wow, that was great?

384
00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:18,280
Speaker 4: Is that? Did it blow out? Like crazy?

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00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:18,840
Speaker 3: Try?

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00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:19,160
Speaker 2: Okay?

387
00:19:19,200 --> 00:19:19,879
Speaker 4: All right, cool?

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00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:24,000
Speaker 3: We got protections against that, against the dark arts. I

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00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,920
Speaker 3: would do it more as like, oh, that's great, okay,

390
00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:33,439
Speaker 3: because the double V at the end gives you yeah,

391
00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:34,800
Speaker 3: how do you how do you add in the D

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00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:36,800
Speaker 3: in the M though? This is a separate line.

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00:19:36,920 --> 00:19:39,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so this is that's the top line O

394
00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:43,879
Speaker 2: U O S V A V V and it's encapsulated

395
00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:46,439
Speaker 2: or bookended by these letters at the bottom line. So

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00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:48,720
Speaker 2: if you look at the second at the second line,

397
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:51,200
Speaker 2: the line below O U O S V A V

398
00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:54,520
Speaker 2: v U, there is a letter D below and to

399
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:56,879
Speaker 2: the left of the first O if you're looking at it,

400
00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,320
Speaker 2: if you're looking straight at it, and there's an M

401
00:19:59,480 --> 00:20:03,040
Speaker 2: below and to the right of the last V. So

402
00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:05,439
Speaker 2: when you put it all together, that's what it looks like.

403
00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:09,119
Speaker 2: It looks like that, that agglomeration of vowels and v's

404
00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:12,119
Speaker 2: yeah and one s, and then below it there's the

405
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:15,720
Speaker 2: D and D M. And we keep adding the exclamation

406
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,439
Speaker 2: mark just because it feels like something you should shout.

407
00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:23,440
Speaker 2: But appearing simple is not the same thing as being simple, right.

408
00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:26,280
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, because a lot of people have been trying

409
00:20:26,320 --> 00:20:29,119
Speaker 4: to figure out since this thing was put up what

410
00:20:29,320 --> 00:20:34,840
Speaker 4: exactly it means, and nobody has, let's say, sufficiently come

411
00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:38,280
Speaker 4: up with an answer. But again, even if you think

412
00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:42,199
Speaker 4: you completely got the answer, there's a matter of proving it,

413
00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:45,359
Speaker 4: because who's gonna prove it to you anyway. We'll get

414
00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:47,560
Speaker 4: into that right now, because let's go through some of

415
00:20:47,560 --> 00:20:50,680
Speaker 4: the people who've actually attempted several charles in here.

416
00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:55,520
Speaker 2: It's very Charles Heavy Charles Dickens. We may be familiar

417
00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,560
Speaker 2: with some of his work. He wrote a ton of

418
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:02,119
Speaker 2: things that are popular in West drink Cannon and he

419
00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:05,560
Speaker 2: was defeated by this series of letters. He tried and

420
00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:06,240
Speaker 2: he failed.

421
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:10,760
Speaker 3: And we have another important British Charles also with a

422
00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:14,879
Speaker 3: D for her last name, Darwin, who apparently ate every

423
00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:16,400
Speaker 3: animal that he documented.

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Speaker 2: True story that was, wasn't it.

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00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,120
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, wait, you're telling me he was out there

426
00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:26,200
Speaker 4: in the Galapagos and he was just going to town. Yeah, yeah,

427
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:29,199
Speaker 4: I mean, I guess when you're in the Galapagos.

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00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,000
Speaker 3: Well, he apparently had a history. He was in some

429
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:36,160
Speaker 3: kind of club of exotic meats at Cambridge or whatever,

430
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:39,520
Speaker 3: where he would eat like albatrosses and egrets and weird,

431
00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:42,480
Speaker 3: you know, stringy gamey meats, and he.

432
00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:45,440
Speaker 4: Kept he carried that spirit right into his research. That

433
00:21:45,640 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 4: is like one of the most elite clubs I've ever

434
00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:48,879
Speaker 4: heard of.

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00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:53,360
Speaker 2: He called he apparently defended. We learned this from Jack O'Brien.

436
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:58,800
Speaker 2: Apparently he defended He defended this practice by say it

437
00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:01,760
Speaker 2: was for science, but he ate like twenty tortoises or something.

438
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:03,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, to the point where I think he threatened their

439
00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:07,399
Speaker 3: very existence on Set Island because he's thought of as

440
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:09,439
Speaker 3: this like great conservationist and that really was not his

441
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 3: bag at all. He was mortisis scientist, research or documentary

442
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:13,879
Speaker 3: and a devourer.

443
00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 4: There we go, lifest dollar.

444
00:22:16,440 --> 00:22:21,480
Speaker 3: Yet he mastered the tortoise, he discovered the secret of evolution,

445
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,720
Speaker 3: and yet he could not surmount these letters.

446
00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 4: Wow, neither could a man named Josiah Wedgewood. He was

447
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,760
Speaker 4: one of the godfathers of industrialization, and oh man, he

448
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,480
Speaker 4: he got out all the steam works. He like figured out, Okay,

449
00:22:35,560 --> 00:22:38,600
Speaker 4: we're gonna do this whole thing. We're gonna uh, we're

450
00:22:38,600 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 4: gonna get an assembly line and figure out how to

451
00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:41,600
Speaker 4: do this. And guess what.

452
00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:47,159
Speaker 2: Nope, Nope, he couldn't. Even though he uh industrialized the

453
00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 2: manufacture of pottery, which you know, that's important. It sounds

454
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:55,479
Speaker 2: it sounds weird now, but it was a bit. To

455
00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:56,960
Speaker 2: take our word for it. He was a big deal.

456
00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:00,479
Speaker 2: Maybe a subject for a different episode, but here we are.

457
00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:03,760
Speaker 2: It's twenty nineteen and those old ants and bros Are

458
00:23:04,000 --> 00:23:07,959
Speaker 2: long since gone to dust and death. The guys who

459
00:23:08,200 --> 00:23:11,200
Speaker 2: actually made the thing, yeah, well, the guys who commissioned it.

460
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,680
Speaker 4: Well, yes, Okay, you're right, But the ones who commission

461
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:17,679
Speaker 4: are generally the ones who have the meaning right because

462
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:21,280
Speaker 4: the person who sculpted it and chiseled it just knew

463
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:24,040
Speaker 4: all that goes there. Yeah, got his marching orders.

464
00:23:24,080 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 2: Good call. So here we are, and people, everyone still

465
00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:35,159
Speaker 2: wonders what on earth this code could mean, And just

466
00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:39,640
Speaker 2: as importantly, everyone is still wondering whether someone has finally

467
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,120
Speaker 2: solved it. What are we talking about? Will tell you

468
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:50,760
Speaker 2: after a word from our sponsor, and we're back.

469
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:53,840
Speaker 4: And I just have to say, Paul was trying to

470
00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:55,560
Speaker 4: get us to go to ad break for like ten

471
00:23:55,600 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 4: minutes there, and it was so much fun to watch

472
00:24:00,480 --> 00:24:02,840
Speaker 4: Paul and continually not Tom like, oh yes, of course,

473
00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:06,120
Speaker 4: but when I could see where exactly we were going. Oh,

474
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:09,160
Speaker 4: toying with you, Paul is one of my greatest excitements.

475
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:12,840
Speaker 4: Here's where it gets crazy.

476
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:16,879
Speaker 3: So over the past few centuries, numerous people have made

477
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:22,640
Speaker 3: varying claims about this inscription. That includes conjecture about the intent,

478
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:27,880
Speaker 3: any some kind of explanation or origin story, and most importantly,

479
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 3: the meaning.

480
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:34,160
Speaker 2: So let's look at the theories in no particular order.

481
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,880
Speaker 2: Some are a little out there, some may seem more mundane,

482
00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,240
Speaker 2: but we want to see which one sound the most

483
00:24:41,280 --> 00:24:44,600
Speaker 2: reasonable to you. So there's an author named Dave Ramsden.

484
00:24:44,720 --> 00:24:49,159
Speaker 2: In a twenty fourteen book, he references manuscript efidence from

485
00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:52,639
Speaker 2: the local record office and he says that based on

486
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:56,919
Speaker 2: what he found, Thomas Andson's peers thought the monument was

487
00:24:57,040 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 2: a funereal structure that was dedicated to some figure known

488
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:07,320
Speaker 2: just as the Shepherdess. So from his take that DM

489
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:12,280
Speaker 2: stands for Dismannabus and the eight letter inscription is a

490
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:17,679
Speaker 2: cipher concealing the name of the person being memorialized. So

491
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:22,240
Speaker 2: in his book he walks through a pretty thorough decryption

492
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:26,360
Speaker 2: effort and he argues that through the use of a

493
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:31,600
Speaker 2: poly alphabetic cipher, he has found that the name, the

494
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:35,240
Speaker 2: name they're referring to is Magdalen Dude.

495
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,800
Speaker 4: By the way, the dismannabus that you heard us talking about,

496
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:44,400
Speaker 4: it's in reference to Roman spirits or goat, not ghosts,

497
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:47,520
Speaker 4: but spirits of people who have died. It's kind of

498
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:51,119
Speaker 4: really interesting because it has actually further back or it

499
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:54,440
Speaker 4: has pagan roots as well. So just an interesting thing

500
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:57,439
Speaker 4: when you connect it up with what Ben is just

501
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,760
Speaker 4: talking about there. I don't know, was it in the

502
00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:06,440
Speaker 4: spirit and a ghost man. Well, isn't it the same

503
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 4: thing by the ghost get is trapped and caught behind right?

504
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 3: Ah, yes, they cannot believe. Maybe I like that behind

505
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 3: that okay.

506
00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:20,560
Speaker 4: And also but having that name Magdalen, I mean, come on,

507
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,440
Speaker 4: we all know that might be referring to right old

508
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 4: Mary Mary Magdalene. Hmmm.

509
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,600
Speaker 2: Yes, the plot thickens, but that's not the only thing.

510
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:36,880
Speaker 2: Just spoiler alert. People disagree with this author. In another

511
00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:41,200
Speaker 2: book called Anson's Gold, a fellow named George Edmund says

512
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 2: that we have to remember George Anson was a navel man.

513
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:51,200
Speaker 2: He was an admiral, and George Edmund argues that Anson

514
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:56,280
Speaker 2: created this cipher to hide the latitude and longitude of

515
00:26:56,320 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 2: an island where he had buried or discovered huge Spanish treasure.

516
00:27:02,359 --> 00:27:04,400
Speaker 4: Oh, it's a treasure map, of course it.

517
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:10,239
Speaker 2: Is, yeah, and that he mounted a secret expedition in

518
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:13,920
Speaker 2: the eighteenth century to recover this treasure, which was located,

519
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 2: but due to unforeseen circumstances, left where it was found.

520
00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:23,560
Speaker 4: Oh, man, do you think it's in that one, that

521
00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 4: one giant hole, you know, the one I'm talking about

522
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:26,800
Speaker 4: Oak Island? Yeah?

523
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:32,120
Speaker 2: Man, do you think they're really finding stuff at Oak

524
00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:35,200
Speaker 2: Island or do you think that the production team is.

525
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,680
Speaker 4: Slipping growing stuff into the hole feathers?

526
00:27:37,720 --> 00:27:39,879
Speaker 2: And I mean, I I don't know. I don't know.

527
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 2: I had heard that, but I don't have a ton

528
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:44,560
Speaker 2: of experience. I've never been there.

529
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,320
Speaker 4: So it would certainly make for a good TV to

530
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:53,080
Speaker 4: have things discovered, That's all I would say. Good point,

531
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:53,879
Speaker 4: good point.

532
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,120
Speaker 2: So the idea here is that letters in code were

533
00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:02,840
Speaker 2: sent back to Lord Anson by the expedition leader, and

534
00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,520
Speaker 2: that these validate and include part of the cipher, and

535
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 2: that this proves what the cipher is for. So George

536
00:28:09,840 --> 00:28:15,040
Speaker 2: Edmund isn't necessarily saying that the cipher is solved, but

537
00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 2: he's saying that's the right direction to look into. And

538
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 2: then we have a returning school of thought from a

539
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 2: previous episode. In nineteen eighty two, the authors of a

540
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 2: book called The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail speculated

541
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:33,560
Speaker 2: that the painter you had mentioned earlier, Noel Pussin, was

542
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:37,399
Speaker 2: a member of what's called the Priory of Scion with

543
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:42,400
Speaker 2: an s. Yeah, and we remember we interviewed the daughter

544
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:43,719
Speaker 2: of one of the authors, Agient.

545
00:28:44,000 --> 00:28:46,280
Speaker 4: What was her last name, I believe, m hmm. Yeah,

546
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 4: that was a great interview, fascinating story. And the whole

547
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 4: idea here, right, is that perhaps the Shepherds of Arcadia,

548
00:28:56,920 --> 00:29:00,560
Speaker 4: they are in this monument, are actually pointed to something

549
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:05,000
Speaker 4: very specific, not necessarily anything to do with the tomb,

550
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:14,959
Speaker 4: but where to find the Holy Grail dunk dum. And

551
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 4: then there's this whole other thing where as part of

552
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 4: the promotion of the Holy Blood and the Holy Grail,

553
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:24,360
Speaker 4: they had these experts or they're I guess they're formerly

554
00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:27,920
Speaker 4: code breakers, right, who came through and they tried to

555
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:31,920
Speaker 4: figure out what the heck this thing is, and they

556
00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 4: specifically were looking at this connection here with the priory

557
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:39,320
Speaker 4: of Scion, connection with the shepherd's pointing to the Holy Grail,

558
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 4: and got a little more on that. So it's a

559
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:45,760
Speaker 4: Sheila and Oliver lawn to the people involved here. They

560
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 4: proposed that the letters actually encode a specific phrase, a

561
00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:57,080
Speaker 4: phrase Jesus H Deafi d e f Yeah, where the

562
00:29:57,240 --> 00:30:01,719
Speaker 4: H supposedly stands for Cristos and this is a Greek

563
00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:05,760
Speaker 4: word meaning Messiah, and the reference is to a Jesus

564
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:12,560
Speaker 4: bloodline or the bloodline of Jesus H. Christ. I don't

565
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,040
Speaker 4: I honestly don't know what that comes from Jesus H.

566
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:15,480
Speaker 3: Christ.

567
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 4: What what is that?

568
00:30:17,280 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 3: Do we know?

569
00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:24,479
Speaker 5: Somebody somebody call us right, Yeah, it's it's this idea, right,

570
00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 5: that that Jesus Christ, the historical Jesus Christ, did actually

571
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:33,120
Speaker 5: have children, yes.

572
00:30:33,040 --> 00:30:35,719
Speaker 2: Or issue as they would be called. And you know,

573
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 2: this is very Dan Brown. Dan Brown leans very heavily

574
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:40,840
Speaker 2: on this in one of his books, at least in

575
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 2: The Da Vinci Code. And the idea is that this

576
00:30:43,760 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 2: bloodline was secreted away and you'll read about it being

577
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,000
Speaker 2: secreted away in different parts of the world, often France.

578
00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:58,480
Speaker 2: So that that idea is really interesting because these code breakers,

579
00:30:59,120 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 2: Sheila Lahan and Oliver Lawn are no joke. They are

580
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:07,240
Speaker 2: the legit, true blue, real deal. Yes, they were working

581
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 2: on a enigma in World War Two, so they're not

582
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 2: just They're not just some couple who happened by.

583
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,200
Speaker 4: You know what I mean. They're breaking Nazi codes and

584
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:21,160
Speaker 4: then they think that that's what happened, right, or that's

585
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 4: they think that that's what the meaning could.

586
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 2: Be, right, And Sheila Lahan said that she believes it

587
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:30,080
Speaker 2: may also be kind of a love letter of some.

588
00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 4: Sort of Yeah. Well, the other thing you have to

589
00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:37,360
Speaker 4: remember here is that they're having ideas put out there

590
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 4: for them to look for in a way, you know,

591
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 4: with the way it was shaped, with the promotion for

592
00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 4: the Holy Blood and the Holy Grail, and for what

593
00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 4: it could mean. You just just keep that in mind.

594
00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:49,160
Speaker 4: You're the little skeptic part of the back of your

595
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 4: mind that they're being led a little bit.

596
00:31:51,760 --> 00:31:55,080
Speaker 2: So already this is this is getting weird, right. You've

597
00:31:55,080 --> 00:32:00,080
Speaker 2: got we've got someone saying it's the one of the

598
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 2: clues to the secret story of Jesus Christ. We've got

599
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:08,440
Speaker 2: someone else saying it's buried treasure. And we've got someone

600
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 2: else saying that Anson was in love drahps with someone

601
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,560
Speaker 2: and needed for some reason to keep their identity a secret.

602
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 4: Yeah.

603
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 2: So how does this shake out in the modern day?

604
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, most of the modern theories approach this from sort

605
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 3: of acrostic kind of perspective or like, you know, think

606
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:32,240
Speaker 3: about any kind of word patterned patterned word art, I

607
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 3: guess where various letters line up, almost like a crossword puzzle,

608
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 3: but when across is a specific form of this meaning,

609
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,680
Speaker 3: they interpret each letter as the initial letter of a

610
00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:42,520
Speaker 3: larger word.

611
00:32:42,840 --> 00:32:45,800
Speaker 2: So like m Att, for example, not to pick on you,

612
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:51,600
Speaker 2: like make make alice, take tile it all or whatever.

613
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 3: Absolutely so sort of like a mnemonic device of like

614
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 3: the way to remember something or it's They're also very

615
00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 3: popular in like presentations or kind of like self help,

616
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 3: touchy feely kind of you know, office power points. You

617
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,640
Speaker 3: know about things like synergy and you know thing you

618
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,840
Speaker 3: know S would stand for super cool and e. Anyway,

619
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:12,080
Speaker 3: it's not good. I love that.

620
00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:13,520
Speaker 4: I'm fond of making up those.

621
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,320
Speaker 3: They're fun when you make them absurd on purpose, but

622
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:19,400
Speaker 3: like as an actual motivational device, it sort of illicits

623
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 3: an instant I roll because it's sort of like a cliche, right,

624
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 3: you know what I mean.

625
00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:26,000
Speaker 2: Right, But it's it's just a fundamental exercise. It is

626
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 2: tough to take it seriously though, well, it's also tough

627
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:29,280
Speaker 2: to do it well.

628
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,240
Speaker 3: And that's the joke too, right, is a lot of

629
00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:33,560
Speaker 3: times they end up people run out of ideas and

630
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 3: they just kind of become either redundant or just absurd.

631
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,760
Speaker 2: If you're ever in a knife fight, remember to stop.

632
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:42,280
Speaker 2: That stands for a stab to other people.

633
00:33:42,360 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 3: There you go, very very good, very very helpful. But yeah,

634
00:33:46,360 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 3: So in nineteen fifty one, More Charred Bishop or more

635
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 3: Card and I'm not going to go with the hard

636
00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:56,800
Speaker 3: ch speculated that the letters might be an initialism for

637
00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:04,760
Speaker 3: the Latin phrase optim sorous optimy soros vydue a Montese moose.

638
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 3: I want to sing this in like a choir, sorrow

639
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:15,400
Speaker 3: ses VDUs a Montese moose vovied veritui boo.

640
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:19,839
Speaker 4: That was great, But the big question is what does

641
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:22,040
Speaker 4: that mean for those of us who don't speak Latin.

642
00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:26,400
Speaker 4: Best of wives, best of sisters, a most devoted widower

643
00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:30,600
Speaker 4: dedicates parentheses this to your virtues.

644
00:34:31,000 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 3: Oh that's nice.

645
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 4: See now that's really really nice. So that's that's specifically

646
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:40,360
Speaker 4: about George andson, right, And that would mean, if this

647
00:34:40,480 --> 00:34:42,960
Speaker 4: is correct, that those eight letters are actually just a

648
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 4: coded dedication to his wife after she passed away.

649
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 2: Which is interesting because why would you have to put

650
00:34:49,239 --> 00:34:49,840
Speaker 2: that in code?

651
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 4: Well, it's I think it's less of in code and

652
00:34:53,160 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 4: more of fitting it on monument perhaps, right, And this

653
00:34:57,239 --> 00:35:01,040
Speaker 4: would be my opinion. His his spouse, by the way,

654
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:05,360
Speaker 4: Lady Elizabeth Yorke, daughter of Philip Yorke, first Earl of Hardwick.

655
00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 4: They did not have any children, but I could see

656
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 4: that if it's just a person who spouse died and

657
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:19,719
Speaker 4: had the means to give some kind of dedication to

658
00:35:19,840 --> 00:35:24,120
Speaker 4: her that only maybe even had meaning to him. Maybe, Okay,

659
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:24,879
Speaker 4: maybe that's there.

660
00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:29,560
Speaker 2: Let's be their private thing. Yeah, I just like it.

661
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:34,120
Speaker 2: To me, Alan's surface, it seems it seems very strange

662
00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 2: and a little bit chuckleworthy that this guy would say,

663
00:35:37,800 --> 00:35:40,960
Speaker 2: all right, I really love my wife and I think

664
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,919
Speaker 2: all these wonderful nice things about her, but no one

665
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 2: can know. Well, yeah, well, guys, I love my wife.

666
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:48,720
Speaker 2: Everyone keep it a secret.

667
00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:53,360
Speaker 4: The other don't tell anyone. The other thing that you

668
00:35:53,360 --> 00:35:55,879
Speaker 4: could say here, just before we move on, is that

669
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 4: maybe it was a backhanded thing or like a cruel

670
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:03,960
Speaker 4: joke in in her memory, because maybe she wasn't devoted,

671
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 4: Maybe she wasn't the best of wives and sisters and devoted.

672
00:36:07,320 --> 00:36:11,520
Speaker 3: Uh a little tongue in the cheek.

673
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:16,520
Speaker 2: This is before that forward slash s stand for sarcasms. Yeah,

674
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:16,919
Speaker 2: and what.

675
00:36:17,000 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 3: I need to be I need to use that.

676
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,480
Speaker 4: But see, but that way, only he knows that he's

677
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:21,680
Speaker 4: being a dick to his wife.

678
00:36:22,080 --> 00:36:25,759
Speaker 2: Oh good good, Oh, this is this is terrible. I

679
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:29,239
Speaker 2: hope that's not the case. Other people don't think it is, though.

680
00:36:29,360 --> 00:36:32,920
Speaker 2: There's a guy named Steve Regimbal, who interprets the letters

681
00:36:32,920 --> 00:36:36,760
Speaker 2: as standing for a new Latin translation of the following

682
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:42,080
Speaker 2: phrase vanity, oh vanities saith the preacher all is vanity,

683
00:36:43,520 --> 00:36:51,839
Speaker 2: oh Ecclesiastes Ecclesiastes twelve eight uh. He speculates that this,

684
00:36:51,840 --> 00:37:00,319
Speaker 2: this phrase, orator ut omnia vanitas vanitatum, would feel like

685
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:01,200
Speaker 2: I just cast a spell.

686
00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 3: Yep.

687
00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 2: He thinks it may be the source of an earlier

688
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:10,000
Speaker 2: inscription only a Vanitas, which might have been carved on

689
00:37:10,040 --> 00:37:14,240
Speaker 2: an alcove at the estate by one of Thomas Anson's pals,

690
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:20,800
Speaker 2: George Lyttleton. Interesting, they keep an eye on that, maybe though,

691
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:22,000
Speaker 2: that might and that.

692
00:37:22,120 --> 00:37:26,960
Speaker 4: Maybe again this one, this is one of the ones that, yeah,

693
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:30,000
Speaker 4: I guess I just don't I need to know more

694
00:37:30,239 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 4: about that, because I vanity of vanities, saith the preacher

695
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:41,400
Speaker 4: all is vanity, all is vanity. All worldly things and

696
00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 4: actions are vanity. It's it's just like carving a giant

697
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 4: monument for anything.

698
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:50,839
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, yeah, well, you know, this reminds me of

699
00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:55,760
Speaker 3: It reminds me of the Georgia guidestones, that whole idea

700
00:37:56,000 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 3: of like give a little thought to what's important, you

701
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:01,759
Speaker 3: know what I mean. It's sort of like, but at

702
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:05,879
Speaker 3: least the Georgia guidestones intent was to be understood, right, Yeah,

703
00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:07,600
Speaker 3: you know, it's not really very cool if you have

704
00:38:07,680 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 3: like a message for the world and no one can

705
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,239
Speaker 3: understand it, or if they're just wildly speculating about what

706
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:12,520
Speaker 3: it means.

707
00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:13,280
Speaker 4: That's a good point.

708
00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 2: So it may be a personal thing, you know what

709
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 2: I mean of personal significance to the ants and brothers,

710
00:38:18,960 --> 00:38:23,319
Speaker 2: if they are. Indeed the people who inscribed this. The

711
00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 2: NSA also got involved, so we had us intelligence in there.

712
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:32,480
Speaker 2: A guy named Keith Massey. In modern times you'll read

713
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:35,520
Speaker 2: some press about him claiming to have solved the letters.

714
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 2: He interprets them as an initialism for the Latin phrase

715
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:46,680
Speaker 2: oro ut omnes sequant vm vitam.

716
00:38:45,200 --> 00:38:48,720
Speaker 4: I pray that all may follow the way to true life.

717
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:52,760
Speaker 4: Is this biblical again?

718
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:59,799
Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, Johnny four sixteen, John, Yeah, that's really good

719
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:04,200
Speaker 2: reference to that verse. Reading John four sixteen read I

720
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,719
Speaker 2: am the Way, the Truth and the life. He goes

721
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:09,880
Speaker 2: something via at veritas at vita.

722
00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 3: And that's the one that stone cold Steve Austin had

723
00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:16,080
Speaker 3: printed on the back of his sleeveless leather jacket.

724
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:19,759
Speaker 4: No. I was three sixteen. That's the one.

725
00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 2: That's the go too, that's the go to. Yeah, as

726
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:24,440
Speaker 2: a child, I never understood that.

727
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:27,200
Speaker 4: Oh I have way too many of those rattling around

728
00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 4: in my brain that I could probably well, I'm not

729
00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:29,760
Speaker 4: even going.

730
00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:34,759
Speaker 3: Through versus Wrestler trivia, just versus and Wrestler trivia.

731
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:38,239
Speaker 2: The Yeah, I thought the Undertaker was the coolest, but

732
00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:39,480
Speaker 2: that's very unbranded for me.

733
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,439
Speaker 3: Staying Man three sixteen is just for God so loved

734
00:39:42,480 --> 00:39:45,400
Speaker 3: the world. Yeah, I didn't realize that. Yeah, that's a

735
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,279
Speaker 3: very nice message that stone Cold has on his That's

736
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:53,200
Speaker 3: very counter to his stone cold image.

737
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:54,840
Speaker 4: You know. For God so loved the world that he

738
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,960
Speaker 4: made me, and then what does he do?

739
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 3: He does the stunner stunner. Yeah, it reminds me of

740
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,879
Speaker 3: like jewels in pulp fiction doing that Biblical verse. Only

741
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,359
Speaker 3: that one gets scary though, that one gets I will

742
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:11,840
Speaker 3: strike down upon thee and all that you think anyway.

743
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:13,120
Speaker 4: But which wasn't an actual Bible verse?

744
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:13,720
Speaker 3: You kidding?

745
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:19,520
Speaker 4: No, it's what No, really, it's this whole time man. Sorry,

746
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,800
Speaker 4: it's an interpretation, let's put it that way.

747
00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,960
Speaker 2: And maybe it's just vanity. Maybe it all is vanity.

748
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 2: But these are just some of the most popular concepts.

749
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:35,359
Speaker 2: Now it's time to ask whether any of this checks out,

750
00:40:35,560 --> 00:40:39,120
Speaker 2: And we'll do just that after a word from our sponsor.

751
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 3: And we're back in Matt, you just wrecked my childhood.

752
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:51,479
Speaker 3: That Tarantino line isn't from the Bible. It's a much

753
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 3: more elaborated version. The real verse is actually just and

754
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 3: I will execute great vengeance upon them with furious rebukes.

755
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:59,759
Speaker 3: And they shall know I am the Lord when I

756
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:01,239
Speaker 3: shall lay my vengeance upon them.

757
00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:04,040
Speaker 4: So obviously, well that's one translation. There are so many

758
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:04,640
Speaker 4: different ones.

759
00:41:04,719 --> 00:41:08,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, but vulgate versions and whatnot. I like the word rebuke.

760
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:10,279
Speaker 2: Let's bring rebuke back.

761
00:41:10,360 --> 00:41:11,720
Speaker 4: I would rebuke some stuff.

762
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:13,640
Speaker 3: Isn't that as when you like call someone out you

763
00:41:13,680 --> 00:41:16,000
Speaker 3: take them to task. It's sort of like a rebuttal,

764
00:41:16,040 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 3: but it's a little stronger. It's a little it's like

765
00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:21,800
Speaker 3: it implies shaming of some sort of finger wagging.

766
00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:26,400
Speaker 2: Right, criticizing someone, So it's it's not quite rejecting. It's

767
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 2: kind of admonishing, but in a very strong way, kind

768
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,040
Speaker 2: of like how contempt is worse than dislike.

769
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:35,160
Speaker 4: It's a really good white instant for pretty low manocosts.

770
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:35,799
Speaker 4: Just so you know.

771
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:40,759
Speaker 2: You have made so many people's day. It's just that

772
00:41:40,880 --> 00:41:41,120
Speaker 2: said it.

773
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:42,720
Speaker 3: I don't think I understand the reference.

774
00:41:42,760 --> 00:41:44,720
Speaker 4: It's the MTG magic together.

775
00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:48,880
Speaker 3: Ah, yes, yes, anytime anytime you say something that I

776
00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:51,960
Speaker 3: don't understand, I should always assume that it's even when

777
00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:55,120
Speaker 3: you say MTG, I have to be Madison Square Gardens and.

778
00:41:56,040 --> 00:42:01,319
Speaker 2: We're making an acrostic move them giblets. I don't ye, yep,

779
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:02,680
Speaker 2: I'm working live here.

780
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 4: But literally all of my vocabulary comes from middle school magic.

781
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:07,120
Speaker 3: The gathering plan.

782
00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:09,600
Speaker 4: We should get together and play play magic.

783
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:14,160
Speaker 3: At some point you have to learn first, all of us. Yeah, everyone, like,

784
00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:16,400
Speaker 3: even even you the listener.

785
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,759
Speaker 4: Well yeah, yeah, come hang out, let's play, let's do

786
00:42:20,080 --> 00:42:20,480
Speaker 4: let's do it.

787
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:22,880
Speaker 2: We'll sneak everyone in. I think it's more fun if

788
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:24,040
Speaker 2: we feel like it's a heist.

789
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 3: We'll do an MTG meetup.

790
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 4: MTG conspiracy meetup sounds epic. Meet the group MTG or

791
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:33,720
Speaker 4: the gang or the guys.

792
00:42:33,880 --> 00:42:35,080
Speaker 2: I like the gang now, but it's not.

793
00:42:35,120 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 3: An acrosstic and an acronym aren't the same thing, right,

794
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:39,759
Speaker 3: I mean they're sort of they're they're kind of no,

795
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:41,840
Speaker 3: because this isn't the down word has to be a

796
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,560
Speaker 3: word in and of itself. Oh right, So MTG, even

797
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:48,279
Speaker 3: if it's spelled MTG and Magic Gathering, it's not an

798
00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:51,839
Speaker 3: acrosstic because MTG is meaningless without representing something.

799
00:42:51,920 --> 00:42:55,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, an acronym would be the abbreviation made out of

800
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:57,920
Speaker 2: the first letters of the words. So our MTG thing

801
00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:01,480
Speaker 2: is an acronym. But an acrostic would be uh, some

802
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:04,360
Speaker 2: kind of poem or form of writing like you described,

803
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:07,120
Speaker 2: where the first letter or syllable or word of each

804
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,439
Speaker 2: line or spells out a word.

805
00:43:09,719 --> 00:43:11,279
Speaker 4: Ah. Uh.

806
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:15,160
Speaker 2: So we've got to ask ourselves, does any of this

807
00:43:15,200 --> 00:43:16,000
Speaker 2: stuff check out?

808
00:43:16,520 --> 00:43:17,280
Speaker 4: Uh? Not?

809
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:20,760
Speaker 2: Not our not our plans to invite everyone to play

810
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:24,680
Speaker 2: Magic the Gathering with us, uh and have Matt roundly

811
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:28,520
Speaker 2: kick kick the snot out of all of us. Very

812
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:31,800
Speaker 2: good at that game. You are lying. You're one of

813
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 2: my favorite peopil. But I can tell when you're lying.

814
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:39,400
Speaker 2: Oh no, Matt, Matt is really really good at this. Uh.

815
00:43:39,520 --> 00:43:43,880
Speaker 2: So not talking about that stuff, but talking about this concept.

816
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:44,279
Speaker 1: Uh.

817
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:46,600
Speaker 2: The one that I think really stuck out to us

818
00:43:46,640 --> 00:43:48,680
Speaker 2: and to a lot of us listening now is the

819
00:43:48,719 --> 00:43:50,960
Speaker 2: idea of this priory of scion.

820
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:56,840
Speaker 4: I think this is definitely where the mystery heightens.

821
00:43:56,520 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, yeah, this is this is a wild one.

822
00:43:59,800 --> 00:44:06,840
Speaker 2: So this is a fringe I guess secret society. Maybe

823
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:10,080
Speaker 2: a fraternal order is a good way to describe it.

824
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:14,200
Speaker 2: It was founded. The official stories it was founded and

825
00:44:14,200 --> 00:44:17,879
Speaker 2: then dissolved in nineteen fifty six by a guy named

826
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:21,959
Speaker 2: Pierre Plantart as part of a hoax. But people who

827
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:27,160
Speaker 2: buy into the idea think it dates back much much further,

828
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:30,840
Speaker 2: you know, back to of course the time of the

829
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:36,279
Speaker 2: living historical Jesus Christ. This was considered. This was not

830
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:39,960
Speaker 2: taken very well or very seriously by a lot of

831
00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:43,759
Speaker 2: people in the Academy with a capital A, but the

832
00:44:44,760 --> 00:44:48,319
Speaker 2: concept existed for a long time. Some people say it

833
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:50,520
Speaker 2: was a hoax and some people taking it very seriously,

834
00:44:50,760 --> 00:44:53,200
Speaker 2: and some people even claiming to be members of the

835
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:57,560
Speaker 2: Priory of Scion. And then boom, it went mainstream when

836
00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 2: Dan Brown leveraged this concept for the the basis of

837
00:45:01,000 --> 00:45:04,880
Speaker 2: the Da Vinci Code, which is I still think a solid,

838
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:06,879
Speaker 2: solid film, and I enjoyed the book.

839
00:45:07,760 --> 00:45:10,200
Speaker 4: I would say I have not read the book, but

840
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:13,319
Speaker 4: the film I was happier than a lot of the

841
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:14,600
Speaker 4: critics about it.

842
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 3: You enjoyed it, yeah, did you see the subsequent film The.

843
00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:21,600
Speaker 4: Inferno, Angels and Demons and Infernos, and I did not.

844
00:45:21,600 --> 00:45:23,520
Speaker 3: See was there a third one that was an inferno?

845
00:45:23,719 --> 00:45:26,880
Speaker 4: Inferno is the third one? Angels and Demons is the second?

846
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:29,520
Speaker 4: Is that correct? Well?

847
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:31,319
Speaker 3: Did this do well? I mean they made three of them,

848
00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:32,640
Speaker 3: they must have done relatively sure.

849
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:35,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, they had to coast off the blockbuster status expensive.

850
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:40,840
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, okay, so Paul just off Mike or in

851
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:42,920
Speaker 3: our ears and at last you will never hear the

852
00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 3: voice of Paul because if you did, it would melt

853
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:46,759
Speaker 3: your insides. It was much like hearing the voice of

854
00:45:46,760 --> 00:45:49,560
Speaker 3: the archangel Gabriel or something like that. But yeah, he says,

855
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:52,920
Speaker 3: Inferno was apparently quite bad. I haven't seen any of them.

856
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:54,600
Speaker 3: But the reason I asked did they do well? Is

857
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 3: because I just don't really have much of a memory

858
00:45:56,920 --> 00:45:57,680
Speaker 3: of them existing.

859
00:45:57,840 --> 00:46:01,400
Speaker 4: I just remember the lyric of the lure of You

860
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:02,480
Speaker 4: guys are great at French.

861
00:46:04,200 --> 00:46:07,880
Speaker 2: I'm not even gonna try it yet. Yeah. So this

862
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:10,520
Speaker 2: also this book, by the way, the da Vinci Code.

863
00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:13,120
Speaker 2: Just to be fair, we should say that he did

864
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 2: receive criticism from other authors and people familiar with the theory,

865
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:21,319
Speaker 2: because you know, the authors of Holy Blend and Holy

866
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 2: Grail felt to a large degree that he plagiarized their work. Yeah,

867
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:30,440
Speaker 2: and that he was essentially using their research to sell

868
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:36,120
Speaker 2: a novel. So that that's the moment, though, that is

869
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:38,799
Speaker 2: the moment where this stuff hit the zeitgeist. And the

870
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:43,640
Speaker 2: idea here is that the Antson brothers were both members

871
00:46:43,680 --> 00:46:47,320
Speaker 2: of the Priory of Scion, and the original painter of

872
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:52,799
Speaker 2: the Arcadian Shepherd painting was also a member of the

873
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:56,480
Speaker 2: Priory of Scion, and that the Holy Grail is not

874
00:46:56,920 --> 00:47:00,960
Speaker 2: really a cup a goblet, you know, the the what's

875
00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:04,440
Speaker 2: the Indiana Jones's ligne, the cup of a carpenter. Yeah,

876
00:47:04,680 --> 00:47:05,600
Speaker 2: yours indeed.

877
00:47:06,520 --> 00:47:13,360
Speaker 3: Melting, My face is melting, he chose he also should

878
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:14,600
Speaker 3: have moisturized.

879
00:47:14,920 --> 00:47:19,600
Speaker 4: Well, okay, so but if it's not that cup, then

880
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:21,440
Speaker 4: has dastardly powers.

881
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:24,680
Speaker 2: What is it? It's a symbol, it's a code phrase.

882
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 2: It's describing the physical descendants of Jesus Christ. If this

883
00:47:31,400 --> 00:47:35,760
Speaker 2: were true, if this were proven, this would be one

884
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:40,319
Speaker 2: of the most significant moments in human history. And we

885
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 2: found a provable living descendant of the historical figure known

886
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:49,560
Speaker 2: as Jesus Christ. So if that's such an amazing thing,

887
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:50,840
Speaker 2: why hide it.

888
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:53,720
Speaker 4: Because it would upend everything, right.

889
00:47:54,040 --> 00:47:56,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean, for most of the last two

890
00:47:56,719 --> 00:47:59,560
Speaker 2: thousand years, the idea of Jesus Christ having children at

891
00:47:59,560 --> 00:48:04,319
Speaker 2: all was very heretical, and the Catholic Church worked arduously

892
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:10,120
Speaker 2: to control its message, and any splinter groups or dissidence

893
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:15,640
Speaker 2: schools of thought were brutally suppressed, murdered wholesale, you know

894
00:48:15,640 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 2: what I mean. Ironically, of course, this is exactly what

895
00:48:19,160 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 2: happened to the first Christians, the predecessors of the Catholics.

896
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 4: New ideas banished the and also torture.

897
00:48:26,880 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 2: Well, it's you know, when you think about it, they

898
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:32,279
Speaker 2: wanted to control a message because they didn't have the

899
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:35,560
Speaker 2: cost of communication is so high that when people are

900
00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 2: in isolation, you know, like in an island off the

901
00:48:38,200 --> 00:48:41,160
Speaker 2: coast of France or somewhere in North Africa, they can

902
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:44,560
Speaker 2: begin to make their own saints, for instance. That's a

903
00:48:44,600 --> 00:48:46,000
Speaker 2: huge thing even now, right.

904
00:48:45,880 --> 00:48:48,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, dude, the more we look at it, it seems,

905
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:51,719
Speaker 4: at least in my opinion right now, the brutality of

906
00:48:51,719 --> 00:48:56,000
Speaker 4: the control mechanisms throughout history do seem eerily necessary in

907
00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:58,839
Speaker 4: a lot of ways, and that scares me a little bit.

908
00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 2: It's a real pos kind of move. But this is

909
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:06,719
Speaker 2: the idea. So it would make sense then for this

910
00:49:06,920 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 2: to be kept a secret, because the idea is that

911
00:49:11,600 --> 00:49:15,439
Speaker 2: the Catholic Church doesn't want this truth to get out.

912
00:49:16,040 --> 00:49:18,520
Speaker 2: And we know that while we don't know for sure

913
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 2: whether this is true or whether it's all you know, speculation,

914
00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:24,799
Speaker 2: bluff and bluster, we do know that the Catholic Church

915
00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:31,839
Speaker 2: has in the past run very, very large and ambitious

916
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:39,120
Speaker 2: information control campaigns, like for centuries. But is this too weird?

917
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 2: It might be too weird for some of us. There's

918
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 2: another mundane theory that came from the telegraph. I like

919
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:48,719
Speaker 2: this one too. This is interesting. Lay it on it.

920
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:52,120
Speaker 4: Well, I guess if this is what it is, then

921
00:49:52,320 --> 00:49:55,880
Speaker 4: it makes so many other things hilarious that have happened

922
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:58,520
Speaker 4: with the NSA getting involved in other high profile people

923
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:01,759
Speaker 4: trying to solve this thing, when in actuality, perhaps it's

924
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 4: just some graffiti left by people who lived in the

925
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:10,440
Speaker 4: house or the estate after the money was put there.

926
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:14,000
Speaker 4: So okay, So it's this historian aj Morton, and he

927
00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:17,000
Speaker 4: thinks that the inscription is just was put there in

928
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 4: the nineteenth century by residents George Adams and his wife

929
00:50:22,080 --> 00:50:25,760
Speaker 4: Mary Vernon Venables. I love that last name, Vernon Venables.

930
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:31,000
Speaker 4: Now what were the two bottom letters D and M?

931
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,920
Speaker 4: D and M hmm? All right? In my head, I

932
00:50:35,640 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 4: was for some reason connecting G or making it G

933
00:50:38,760 --> 00:50:41,040
Speaker 4: and M for a moment they are thinking George and Mary.

934
00:50:41,719 --> 00:50:42,839
Speaker 4: But no, that doesn't make sense.

935
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:43,880
Speaker 2: But Vernon Venables.

936
00:50:43,960 --> 00:50:46,319
Speaker 4: That's two these, That's at least two of them, and

937
00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:47,080
Speaker 4: there are a lot of those.

938
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:52,239
Speaker 2: So Morton, who is an expert in graves and monuments,

939
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 2: he said that the letters can be matched to this couple,

940
00:50:56,719 --> 00:51:00,520
Speaker 2: Adams and Vernon Venables, because they were relations of Tom Ansen.

941
00:51:00,920 --> 00:51:04,360
Speaker 2: And there doesn't appear to be any reference to the

942
00:51:04,400 --> 00:51:08,560
Speaker 2: curious letters until the nineteenth century. To Morton, this suggests

943
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,320
Speaker 2: that they were added later. Nothing in Thomas Anson's life

944
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:15,400
Speaker 2: fits the letters in the inscription, except the family of

945
00:51:15,480 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 2: his nephew, George Adams. So the idea is that, regardless

946
00:51:20,080 --> 00:51:24,799
Speaker 2: of all our speculation and these concepts of conspiracy spanning centuries,

947
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:30,600
Speaker 2: someone just did some graffiti. Which is also it always

948
00:51:30,640 --> 00:51:33,360
Speaker 2: reminds me of that story about the runic inscriptions in

949
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:34,440
Speaker 2: the Hagia Sophia.

950
00:51:34,480 --> 00:51:37,279
Speaker 4: Do we talk about this on air? I don't know

951
00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:39,399
Speaker 4: that we have maybe as a casual mention.

952
00:51:39,880 --> 00:51:45,160
Speaker 2: So there's this thing in the Haiya sofia these to

953
00:51:45,239 --> 00:51:49,000
Speaker 2: blow people's minds. It is a runic description called the

954
00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:53,320
Speaker 2: half Dan inscription and was discovered in nineteen sixty four.

955
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:57,919
Speaker 2: And for a while, people, you know, not naturally being

956
00:51:58,000 --> 00:52:01,720
Speaker 2: prone to reading rooms. For a while people thought, whoa,

957
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 2: this is amazing. Vikings got all the way down here

958
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 2: and the history is hidden and it goes so much

959
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:16,879
Speaker 2: deeper and found oh when they translated it. When they

960
00:52:16,920 --> 00:52:19,320
Speaker 2: translated it and they still couldn't read all of it,

961
00:52:19,320 --> 00:52:22,240
Speaker 2: it turned out that it said like half Dan carved

962
00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:26,120
Speaker 2: these rooms. So it's the historical equivalent of you know,

963
00:52:26,280 --> 00:52:32,000
Speaker 2: Paul was here, so a lot of graffiti happens. This

964
00:52:32,960 --> 00:52:37,040
Speaker 2: answer might not satisfy a lot of us, but anyway

965
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:39,800
Speaker 2: you look at it, the truth is this. At this point,

966
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:43,560
Speaker 2: no one really agrees on what this inscription means. We've

967
00:52:43,600 --> 00:52:46,680
Speaker 2: outlined some of the main theories, and each of these

968
00:52:46,719 --> 00:52:49,719
Speaker 2: theories have their proponents. Some of us listening now have

969
00:52:49,800 --> 00:52:53,719
Speaker 2: probably found one that particularly calls to us. And I

970
00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:57,680
Speaker 2: will say, the theory of a priory of sion is

971
00:52:57,719 --> 00:53:01,319
Speaker 2: a fascinating read. We just don't know if it is

972
00:53:01,400 --> 00:53:08,640
Speaker 2: connected to this inscription, but residents of Staffordshire encounter new

973
00:53:08,760 --> 00:53:12,040
Speaker 2: theories continually, like all the time.

974
00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:16,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, we were quote here that says we get five

975
00:53:17,000 --> 00:53:19,240
Speaker 4: or six people a week who believe they have solved

976
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:22,560
Speaker 4: the code, so we're a bit wary of them. Now

977
00:53:25,160 --> 00:53:34,480
Speaker 4: exhausted Stratfordshire and shireen Stratfordshire would maybe sheer Stretford sheer well,

978
00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:39,240
Speaker 4: it's Lancashire, Lancashire. I've always heard Lancashire.

979
00:53:39,480 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 3: Well, if you want, if the Beatles the Day and

980
00:53:41,760 --> 00:53:45,320
Speaker 3: the Life of is to be believed, it's ten thousand

981
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:47,759
Speaker 3: holes in Blackford, Lancashire.

982
00:53:48,000 --> 00:53:49,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, but they were just trying to make it fit

983
00:53:50,040 --> 00:53:51,160
Speaker 4: the song.

984
00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 3: It didn't wasn't a rhymestate.

985
00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:59,879
Speaker 2: And that's our classic episode for this evening. We can't

986
00:54:00,040 --> 00:54:01,640
Speaker 2: wait to hear your thoughts. We try to be easy

987
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:02,360
Speaker 2: to find online.

988
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:04,680
Speaker 3: Find this at the handle Conspiracy Stuff where we exist

989
00:54:04,719 --> 00:54:08,200
Speaker 3: on Facebook x and YouTube, on Instagram and TikTok. We're

990
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 3: Conspiracy Stuff.

991
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:14,399
Speaker 4: Show call our number. It's one eight three three std WYTK.

992
00:54:14,719 --> 00:54:17,000
Speaker 6: Leave a voicemail and if you have more to say,

993
00:54:17,080 --> 00:54:18,839
Speaker 6: we can't wait to hear from you at our good

994
00:54:18,840 --> 00:54:22,879
Speaker 6: old fashioned email address where we are conspiracy at iHeartRadio

995
00:54:23,120 --> 00:54:42,640
Speaker 6: dot com.

996
00:54:42,840 --> 00:54:44,920
Speaker 4: Stuff they Don't want you to know is a production

997
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:49,560
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998
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:52,879
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