Speaker 1: My name is Comma Polo. I played Eric vander Woodson,
Speaker 1: and today we are rewatching Chuck when your watch. Welcome
Speaker 1: back listeners to your one and only source into all
Speaker 1: things gossip cruft. You know you love it. X O
Speaker 1: x O. Hey guys, it's Jessica's or and welcome to
Speaker 1: another episode of XO XO. Since I started this podcast,
Speaker 1: you've been asking about today's guests, and trust me, I'm
Speaker 1: equally as excited that the incredible Connor Pollo, also known
Speaker 1: as Eric van der Woodson, could join me today. Connor
Speaker 1: is such a light and so is his character. Eric
Speaker 1: is wise beyond his years, and his relationships with Serena, Jenny, Jonathan, Lily,
Speaker 1: Chuck and so many others made the show something truly special.
Speaker 1: Connor and I will be dive straight into a big
Speaker 1: episode for Eric season two, episode seven, Chuck in real Life.
Speaker 1: It gets into Eric's coming out story after Bart tells
Speaker 1: him not to bring his boyfriend to a family gathering. Oh.
Speaker 1: It also explores how Eric treats his mom, sister, and
Speaker 1: even Chuck Nate deals with family problems. Vanessa comforts Chuck
Speaker 1: and Dan gets in the way of the Chuck Nate duo.
Speaker 1: It's an awesome episode with the perfect guest joining me.
Speaker 1: I can't wait, So let's get started. What is uh?
Speaker 1: Oh my god? How are you? How are you doing well?
Speaker 1: How are you? Oh my gosh, I'm good. Where are you?
Speaker 1: I'm actually in my my buddies little uh like podcasting.
Speaker 1: The background looks cool, you look great. You look like
Speaker 1: you're like doing a cast yourself. If I have the
Speaker 1: time that I'm going to do it right. Otherwise we'd
Speaker 1: be on my laptop with my little spring headphones. And
Speaker 1: I'm not good at computer stuff. Yeah, it would like
Speaker 1: the worst with it. My relationship with technology is like
Speaker 1: no boy now, And I'm like, okay with that. But
Speaker 1: it's also very difficult and with what I'm doing because
Speaker 1: it's I feel some I it's some. In some moments,
Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm proud that I'm a luddite, and then
Speaker 1: in other moments I realized that I'm not meant for
Speaker 1: this world. And I mean, I feel you listen, most
Speaker 1: people I feel like are really dialed into it. So
Speaker 1: I'm like glad that we feel the same way about this. So,
Speaker 1: but where is the studio? Are you in New York?
Speaker 1: But it's like, so good to see your face. By
Speaker 1: the way, it's good to see yours. Yeah, okay, l A,
Speaker 1: I I'm in West Hollwood right now. Nice And have
Speaker 1: you been there for a while. We're you there during
Speaker 1: the pandemic or yeah, I'm kind of lay off and
Speaker 1: on for about ten years, right. I knew that. I
Speaker 1: just didn't know because when the whole world shutdown, it
Speaker 1: was so everyone was like leaving there and then some
Speaker 1: it was but it's such a nice place to be
Speaker 1: weather wise, so I'm like, no, I just yeah, I, um,
Speaker 1: I hunkered down. I was living in Echo Park at
Speaker 1: the time, so I just, you know, just sort of
Speaker 1: stayed there for um. I can't even remember how long
Speaker 1: the proper you know, quarantine was. Right, technically, the pandemic
Speaker 1: is still going. I know, it feels it feels still going.
Speaker 1: It's in the it's in the rear view, which is
Speaker 1: which is nice, but it's still happening. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just like shocking. And I'd like journal all the time.
Speaker 1: So sometimes I'll go back and like, look what was
Speaker 1: going on a year ago, and it's it's just it's insane.
Speaker 1: I'm glad. I during the initial months of the pandemic.
Speaker 1: That would have been ugly. Every time I've tried to journal.
Speaker 1: Sometimes I'll do it if I'm doing character work or something,
Speaker 1: but if I do it as me, every time I
Speaker 1: look back on it, I have a real crisis of
Speaker 1: thinking I'm insane. So I just sort of stopped because
Speaker 1: I read it back in like, oh no, dude, you can't. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe let's not do that. So you're in l A.
Speaker 1: You're not journaling, I'm not journing, and I'm in Los
Speaker 1: Angeles living to drink. We don't like technology stuff. Obviously
Speaker 1: you've been acting for a long time and you're brilliant
Speaker 1: at it. And where how long have you been acting?
Speaker 1: And what was something that made you say like this
Speaker 1: is what I want to do this again, this is
Speaker 1: what I want my career to be. I started doing
Speaker 1: my experimental theater around New York City when I was
Speaker 1: literally like five or six, as part of this very
Speaker 1: fascinating theater group, and it's sort of went from that
Speaker 1: into doing classes. I think I went to like the
Speaker 1: Lee Strassburg School when I was ten. Uh, what you
Speaker 1: know Stanoslavski training is to a ten year old? I
Speaker 1: don't know, but I had that's insane and amazing. And
Speaker 1: then I started. I got an agent when I was
Speaker 1: like eleven and just started going on auditions, and I
Speaker 1: just did it because it felt good. I had a
Speaker 1: lot of fun, and the concept of a career I
Speaker 1: don't think even occurred to me, even when we're doing
Speaker 1: the show. I don't think it like it really wasn't
Speaker 1: until I moved out of my parents house and stopped
Speaker 1: being student and acting was sort of the only thing
Speaker 1: I did as far as you do things, that the
Speaker 1: idea that it was a career occurred to me. And honestly,
Speaker 1: I think my constant effort in this business is to
Speaker 1: remind myself what it felt like before I realized it
Speaker 1: was a career, where it was just like, no, I
Speaker 1: just do this because it's like transcendent and fun and stuff,
Speaker 1: and I feel like most of myself when I'm on
Speaker 1: and I'm not going to do anything else. This is
Speaker 1: what I'm gonna do. This is just what it is.
Speaker 1: This is when I'm happiest and I feel most in
Speaker 1: touch with me and how it's It was always easiest
Speaker 1: for me to process emotions while wearing a mask like that.
Speaker 1: That's how I could learn about things safely and then
Speaker 1: apply it to myself. Then I could understand myself as
Speaker 1: sort of a I guess, like a third party. So yeah,
Speaker 1: I just it was just something that I did because
Speaker 1: not doing it is intensely painful for me. So but
Speaker 1: that's like a beautiful thing that you get to do
Speaker 1: what you love and feel that way and and it
Speaker 1: does get to be I don't like calling it a
Speaker 1: job either, because it doesn't feel like a job to me,
Speaker 1: But like that you can make a living doing something
Speaker 1: that makes you feel alive and good and most most
Speaker 1: like yourself, where you learn the most about yourself. I
Speaker 1: think that's like a really beautiful thing. Yeah. I love
Speaker 1: the arts, and I think that I think exposure and
Speaker 1: representation are about the best weapons we have against lack
Speaker 1: of empathy and bigotry and in isolation and things like that.
Speaker 1: I think that sort of the the best thing we
Speaker 1: can do is show people that divisions between us are
Speaker 1: all invented in arbitrary. You know, a lot of people
Speaker 1: in the world are pretty isolated, and I think media
Speaker 1: is like that that's the way to to show people
Speaker 1: that hey man, we all bleed and okay, we're just
Speaker 1: no difference. Look, you like these people, right, They're real right.
Speaker 1: So I've always really felt very lucky to be able
Speaker 1: to contribute to that in in any kind of type
Speaker 1: of small way, because yeah, I think, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: teaching empathy is about the best thing you can do. Absolutely. Um,
Speaker 1: So you got your first agent was at five or
Speaker 1: or eleven? Now my first year, my first agent was
Speaker 1: at eleven. And then like theater around New York, any
Speaker 1: New Yorker does every long order they can. So I
Speaker 1: didn't write just part of what you know. You have
Speaker 1: to be rescued by Chris Maloney at some point in
Speaker 1: order to be a New York actor. Yeah, and do
Speaker 1: you like do you prefer theater to film to TV
Speaker 1: or does it just depend on the character. It depends
Speaker 1: on the character. Ultimately, I really like film because film,
Speaker 1: uh just encapsulates this like weird little summer camp. I
Speaker 1: love the relationships you build on a film set. I
Speaker 1: love the immediate of it. The one thing that is
Speaker 1: really unique and beautiful about theater is that your experience
Speaker 1: in the moment and as an actor in film and
Speaker 1: TV never aligns with the audiences. You ideally have a
Speaker 1: really powerful moment with another actor, and you share with
Speaker 1: the crew, but it lives in that time and then
Speaker 1: if the audience responds to it, that's fantastic. But it's months,
Speaker 1: for weeks or years later. On stage, those things happen
Speaker 1: at the same time and and it creates this really
Speaker 1: profound energy which is unique. But then in TV you
Speaker 1: get to explore fascting storyline. Yeah, like you can't have
Speaker 1: a Walter White character arc in a movie. It's just impossible.
Speaker 1: You don't at the time. Um So TV has its
Speaker 1: own sort of brilliant way to build, arise and full over,
Speaker 1: you know, fifty hours in a way that you can't
Speaker 1: on stage or on screen. So they all have their things,
Speaker 1: But I really like film sense. They're just wild and
Speaker 1: strange and and you fall in love with people in
Speaker 1: this really kind of special way. Totally, I agree. And
Speaker 1: with a film set there's like a beginning, middle, and end,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. TV, I don't know with
Speaker 1: those people, and it's just it's very it's sort of
Speaker 1: it's it's sacred. It's fun, Yeah, it really is. Do
Speaker 1: you remember your casting story and situation where you were
Speaker 1: because sort of it's weird, how how long ago this was?
Speaker 1: I don't know, and and it was, you know, because
Speaker 1: like with the whole process started, I was probably fifteen
Speaker 1: or sixteen, so like on top of everything else, I
Speaker 1: just like brain development, right, it's it's all. At that point,
Speaker 1: it was all mush and now it's slightly defined mush.
Speaker 1: But what I remember is I remember the callback. This
Speaker 1: was the second time I've gone in, and I remember
Speaker 1: sitting in the in the waiting room. It's like being
Speaker 1: in a like a doctor's office if the doctor was
Speaker 1: only going to see one person or beat them in
Speaker 1: that whole waiting room. By the way, I really hope
Speaker 1: that is very very correct and appropriate and right. That
Speaker 1: is oh god. But I remember looking at one other guy,
Speaker 1: one of the kid who was in there and in
Speaker 1: the pilot, Eric had just come off a suicide attempt,
Speaker 1: and he was sitting in the waiting room with his
Speaker 1: shirt sleeves rolled up and he had bandaged his wrists
Speaker 1: like from here all the way up, as if he'd
Speaker 1: you know, as if as if he'd cut himself. And
Speaker 1: I just remember sitting there being like, oh man, that
Speaker 1: motherfucker's gonna get it, like um, but I don't, I
Speaker 1: don't I remember I have like an image in my
Speaker 1: head of sitting in the room with Josh and Stephanie
Speaker 1: and members of the casting team and maybe maybe the
Speaker 1: director of that I can't quite remember, and then sitting
Speaker 1: on on the other side of the table. And then
Speaker 1: there's that odd isolating out to see feeling of just
Speaker 1: sitting in a chair, sort of apropos of nothing doing
Speaker 1: doing scenes. Yeah, and that's that time too, where you're like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I gotta I'm getting ready to do this and like
Speaker 1: everyone's staring at yet it's such a weird process. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it is very it's very uh, sort of alienating. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I know at the time Eric was supposed to
Speaker 1: have blue hair. That's something I remember because he was
Speaker 1: he was like edgy, right, But never we you guys
Speaker 1: never did that though. No, I think I think this.
Speaker 1: The studio was like, a that's too far b he
Speaker 1: looks nothing like Blake, so blonde, let's see if that works.
Speaker 1: Let's just not go blue. Yeah, I was Blake already,
Speaker 1: was Blake cast I don't, I don't know. I assume,
Speaker 1: you know, I assume I would think she was, but
Speaker 1: maybe not. I might have been. First, they might have
Speaker 1: structured everything around me around very fast like that. But
Speaker 1: I also like, I actually sort of I was going
Speaker 1: through a period at that point in my life where
Speaker 1: I couldn't get hired without them trying to change my hair.
Speaker 1: It was just like I wouldn't matter what I did,
Speaker 1: they always wanted to cut it. Or at one point
Speaker 1: I had a perm or diet or liked something about
Speaker 1: my natural hair that just wasn't working. Yeah, but that
Speaker 1: also means that you're just like an amazingly talented actor
Speaker 1: there that they're like, well, just change how you look.
Speaker 1: We just like what you're doing. That's that is an interpretation. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I I never went further than like, oh, my hair
Speaker 1: must suck, but I like that I'm gonna But I
Speaker 1: actually I liked the fact that I had this sort
Speaker 1: of weird peroxided with the roots still showing, because it
Speaker 1: always made me feel like he was trying to fit
Speaker 1: in with this blonde family right and didn't so like
Speaker 1: sort of tried to do it on his own, even
Speaker 1: though God, there's of Eric's back story. Yeah, because I mean,
Speaker 1: how how he could have gotten away with leaving his
Speaker 1: roots exposed didn't ever make sense to me unless he
Speaker 1: did itself right, I mean that makes sense. You know
Speaker 1: what's really crazy. We've had so many conversations and stories
Speaker 1: about people's hair on this show. Like Layton was blonde
Speaker 1: and they needed her to the network did not see
Speaker 1: her as blair until she was dark hair mine. They
Speaker 1: needed it curly, they didn't like it straight. They shaved
Speaker 1: Pen's hair for the pilot, then they did tips on yours.
Speaker 1: I mean it was like a real These hair situations
Speaker 1: were like very serious, like colors, cuts, buzzes, and I'm like, wow, okay, okay.
Speaker 1: So we're going to get into rewatching Chuck and Real Life.
Speaker 1: This is season two, episode seven, which was based on
Speaker 1: the title Dan in Real Life, which is two thousand
Speaker 1: seven starting Steve Carrell. But um, so we're getting into this,
Speaker 1: which have you seen a lot of the show? Like
Speaker 1: since it just in general like Gossip Gold, I had
Speaker 1: not seen a lot of it, and I didn't really
Speaker 1: realize that. I feel similarly, I know, I know when
Speaker 1: it first started, I think I watched it more regularly,
Speaker 1: and then as it continued, I sort of lost the
Speaker 1: plot of certain things, and I think I would I
Speaker 1: think i'd watch episodes that had things, whether personally affecting
Speaker 1: me or just other cast members that I was like, Oh,
Speaker 1: I want like I almost see how that turned out.
Speaker 1: I want to see, yeah how it went. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: feel you. Um okay. So here's where we left off.
Speaker 1: Serena becomes friends with a new crowd of socialites. Vanessa
Speaker 1: knows everything about the scandal with Lady Catherine and the
Speaker 1: Lord Marcus. Dan and Nate have become buddies after their
Speaker 1: tour of Yale. So that's where we left off, And
Speaker 1: here's the logline for this episode. Vanessa blackmails Blair into
Speaker 1: helping her with with a cause, which leads to Blair
Speaker 1: seeking revenge. Along with Chuck, Lillian, Bart throw an extravagant
Speaker 1: house arming party, but a rebellious Serena is not ready
Speaker 1: to play by their rules. Dan and Jenny discover a
Speaker 1: big secret Nate has been keeping from his friends. Let's
Speaker 1: talk about the vander Woods and family, like Eric's relationship
Speaker 1: with his mom and your relationship with Serena, and now
Speaker 1: Bart being a new man in your life, Like how
Speaker 1: how what do you feel about this whole new family, Dyna,
Speaker 1: Chuck being your stepbrother. Yeah, I'm trying to remember the
Speaker 1: I think my memory of all of that was just that.
Speaker 1: You know, Eric was always a pretty perpetually lonely character. Again,
Speaker 1: if I if I can recall some pieces of dialogue
Speaker 1: whenever either his mother or his sister would say something
Speaker 1: to the effect of like, no, like we were there,
Speaker 1: we were always like I like you could have called
Speaker 1: me you're like I was, you know, I would have
Speaker 1: been here for you. His response was always something like, no,
Speaker 1: you weren't, and I couldn't. Like that's not true. Now
Speaker 1: you weren't. And as far as you know, other men
Speaker 1: showing up, I think he had learned at that point
Speaker 1: not to assume that family was permanent in any way,
Speaker 1: like it was always sort of transitory. And Mom, if
Speaker 1: she was here, she was here for now. If Serena
Speaker 1: was here, she was here for now. So I think
Speaker 1: I think he'd found a way to cope by just
Speaker 1: enjoying the times that everyone was together, but not not
Speaker 1: believing that that meant that they'd be together tomorrow. So
Speaker 1: I think like having Barton Chuck in the house, I
Speaker 1: think there was an enjoyment in having Chuck around because
Speaker 1: he's different. And again, if my memory serves, I'm pretty
Speaker 1: sure Chuck is the first person that Eric came out
Speaker 1: to I believe, yeah, which you would never think that
Speaker 1: that would be the case. Like, going back and watching,
Speaker 1: I was like, wait, what, well Chuck again, I like,
Speaker 1: if memory serves is sort of is just sort of
Speaker 1: fundamentally he's cruelsometimes and he's mean to people, but he's
Speaker 1: not particularly judgmental. He just he sort of thinks everyone's
Speaker 1: a peasant, like it's all like, that's all, it's all leveled,
Speaker 1: So I can understand why. I could understand why Eric
Speaker 1: would gravitate towards him, And because Chuck isn't take anything
Speaker 1: seriously and Eric takes everything seriously, so right, I would
Speaker 1: imagine that he enjoyed having Chuck around. Well you kind
Speaker 1: of get that there was art that I always like.
Speaker 1: I was always, uh, sort of sad they didn't explore more.
Speaker 1: It was like one or two episodes where they started
Speaker 1: dressing me like him. I was like, Oh, he's just
Speaker 1: gonna like he's gonna do the Chuck thing, which I
Speaker 1: always thought would have been really interesting, but it never
Speaker 1: never really materialized. When I when I go back and
Speaker 1: I'm watching the show and like, Okay, they really did
Speaker 1: touch on things, or maybe at the time things went
Speaker 1: over people's head in the sense of it's this glam fashion,
Speaker 1: but you really had some things of like you know,
Speaker 1: suicide and coming out that Eric's gay, like topics that
Speaker 1: should we talked about and should be shining light on.
Speaker 1: But that was a lot for Eric. You know, it
Speaker 1: always uh, it's if I'm thinking about the pilot again,
Speaker 1: you know, my memory is a little shitty. But I wasn't.
Speaker 1: I was never serious regular, so there was never a
Speaker 1: guarantee that I would show up again, at least in mind, right,
Speaker 1: so you were so when I did the pilot, it
Speaker 1: was like, well here now, but like, I don't, I
Speaker 1: don't have a guarantee that I'm an episode two, so
Speaker 1: it was always an unknown. So again my memory is
Speaker 1: always like I just sort of took every episode as
Speaker 1: as it came, as it came. And again, the way
Speaker 1: the TV works in the first place, like unless you
Speaker 1: have a really close relationship with the writer's room, but
Speaker 1: even then, like things changed so much that you know generally, um,
Speaker 1: you're never the first script you're sent for a given
Speaker 1: episode will generally not be the script that you shoot, right,
Speaker 1: It's certainly not in this entirety, So you never really
Speaker 1: know where it's going and they might have an idea
Speaker 1: on Tuesday, but by the time you get to Friday,
Speaker 1: an entire artist changed and now we're going to go
Speaker 1: in this direction. And with this show, there was always
Speaker 1: so many like bombs being dropped and so many storyline
Speaker 1: twists that like, the storyline would be so twisted and
Speaker 1: crazy to the point when it did it three more
Speaker 1: times and like I didn't even know that. I thought
Speaker 1: we would be done with this storyline and then it's
Speaker 1: exactly exactly. Yeah, the show did a very good job
Speaker 1: with constantly keeping you at the edge of your seat
Speaker 1: of like wait what now. I feel like that was
Speaker 1: that was sort of our experience as well, like Okay,
Speaker 1: well this is okay, this is happening now, you know,
Speaker 1: such as such as life. So you know, when I
Speaker 1: went into it, it seemed to me like whatever the
Speaker 1: specific moment was that pushed Eric into actually attempting, based
Speaker 1: on the way it was written, seemed like it had
Speaker 1: passed that obviously, the depression, the isolation, all of the
Speaker 1: things that put him in that desperate state to begin
Speaker 1: with that hadn't been alleviated, but that he wasn't going
Speaker 1: to attempt again. That was just always my impression. I
Speaker 1: wound up being like like that he was not out
Speaker 1: of the woods emotionally, but that like he wasn't gonna
Speaker 1: and that his sister was back. So like, yeah, and
Speaker 1: I think he said that again, I'm not I feel
Speaker 1: like he said that in the pilot of like I'm
Speaker 1: not going to do it again. Yeah, and your like
Speaker 1: Eric's relationship with Serena. It's how sweet she is with
Speaker 1: you and like wants to cover for you and protect
Speaker 1: you and do all that. Did you feel, like, Eric,
Speaker 1: how do you feel he felt with her? Yeah? I
Speaker 1: always felt that, Yeah, that that obviously he really loved her,
Speaker 1: and and but that that she was sort of you know,
Speaker 1: like a vapor, like you know, you could you could
Speaker 1: appreciate her, and you could, you know, like, oh, it's
Speaker 1: it's misty and humid in here, I'll enjoy the I'll
Speaker 1: enjoy the weather. But you couldn't hold on to her.
Speaker 1: And again, like he learned that someone telling you that
Speaker 1: they love you doesn't mean they're going to be there
Speaker 1: tomorrow morning. It means they love you and like they're
Speaker 1: there tonight, but they're not, like you know, like there
Speaker 1: is no guarantee even with family. So I think it
Speaker 1: seemed to me that he he'd sort of got into
Speaker 1: a place where his sister could not be there, and
Speaker 1: that wasn't a knock against their relationship. It was just
Speaker 1: sort of like a man I've never and you know,
Speaker 1: he was struck me as a character that years later
Speaker 1: when he matured more, when you know, when he was
Speaker 1: in his twenties thirties, had had adult relationships and successful
Speaker 1: and unscissful relationships when he became a father, if he
Speaker 1: chose to at that point, he'd probably look back and
Speaker 1: have some some issues with mom and sister that he'd
Speaker 1: need to talk to them about it, like, hey, like
Speaker 1: my childhood wasn't great, um, and I got I got
Speaker 1: some things that I buried. But I think because survival
Speaker 1: for him was tenuous, in order to get through, he
Speaker 1: needed to not allow himself to be disappointed by those people.
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think he really I think he envied
Speaker 1: the way that Serena seemingly was able to just attached
Speaker 1: and then unattached because I don't think the movement. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't think he had that sort of perpetual motion
Speaker 1: that she did. He would seemed more like not stuck,
Speaker 1: but just more solid, right. And Eric's relationship with Jenny
Speaker 1: was like I always felt like Jenny was always trying
Speaker 1: to do the right thing, and you always had like
Speaker 1: grounded Eric had this grounded suite wonderful, like when you
Speaker 1: come on this, when you come on, it's like a
Speaker 1: breath of fresh air. Um. Eric's relationship with Jenny, which
Speaker 1: when she came on Taylor she was like I still
Speaker 1: talked to Connor all the time, like she loves Yeah,
Speaker 1: she's wonderful. But um, did you that had to be
Speaker 1: fun playing with with Taylor being such good friends. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it was. That was really like we wound up, you know,
Speaker 1: she wounded up going to the the high school that
Speaker 1: I was going through the time. And like I still
Speaker 1: even though we don't have a big age gap when
Speaker 1: we met, those like two or three years are much
Speaker 1: more of a divide, you know, between thirteen and fifteen
Speaker 1: or the like that's huge. Yeah. So I still Taylor
Speaker 1: still like fourteen or fifteen to me, and I still
Speaker 1: feel like I'm an older brother to her, even though
Speaker 1: I know she's a grown ass woman. But yeah, I
Speaker 1: I loved that relationship. And even though her family, Jenny's
Speaker 1: family was much more cohesive and took care of each
Speaker 1: other much better than Eric's family did. She was still
Speaker 1: isolated in in somewhat of a similar way, so I
Speaker 1: always felt like they understood each other in that in
Speaker 1: that respect. And even though conversely, my age gap with
Speaker 1: Blake Penn uh you know, Chase wasn't massive either, sixteen
Speaker 1: twenty one is huge, so I couldn't go out drinking
Speaker 1: with them like I could. Like there was just a
Speaker 1: whole different Yeah, there's a whole different universe. So I was, uh,
Speaker 1: me and Tylor spent a lot of time together. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I just felt like that relationship Eric and Jenny was
Speaker 1: it's a relief like fresh um. And and because you
Speaker 1: guys are the you know, were the younger siblings of
Speaker 1: this whole Upper east Side world, and Serena being this
Speaker 1: like glamorous person who is everyone so in love with,
Speaker 1: and Dan trying to figure out fit in and and
Speaker 1: get Serena's you know, keep Serena's heart, and all that
Speaker 1: was interesting, like the whole like spider web between it all.
Speaker 1: And then the relationship with like Rufus and your mom
Speaker 1: with Lily is always kind of like lingering there, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean every couple episodes, I'm like, they're
Speaker 1: for sure getting back together. Oh wait, no, she's she's
Speaker 1: with Bart. But oh wait, you know, there was a
Speaker 1: brief little arc where we thought we all might be related.
Speaker 1: I think I remember it was like we might we
Speaker 1: might actually be like half siblings. Oh my god. Yeah,
Speaker 1: the little thing of like, oh maybe Dan and Serena
Speaker 1: are a brother and sister and isn't that illegal? You know, right?
Speaker 1: But only on Gossip Girl. Oh my gosh. Also this
Speaker 1: whole like big housewarming party that you're doing and where
Speaker 1: Serena goes, you know, into her sister mode protection when
Speaker 1: she knows that your boyfriend is not coming, and it
Speaker 1: it does feel like it was probably something Bart was
Speaker 1: worried about or didn't want to. That's, you know, the
Speaker 1: kind of where it felt like it was going. And
Speaker 1: then you come on and you're like, no, he really
Speaker 1: gave me the option. And I think that was important
Speaker 1: for the audience too. Then really like Bart because that
Speaker 1: changed everything, and that was a big thing. Even with
Speaker 1: Serena in this episode where she ends up like kind
Speaker 1: of going off on Lily at the party. That really
Speaker 1: kind of made for me me look at Bart in
Speaker 1: a different way and sort of lily, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. You know what's interesting is I when I
Speaker 1: when I look back at the episode when you said
Speaker 1: we're gonna cover it, and I Eric's explanation for like, well, hey, no,
Speaker 1: I Bart simply presented the reality of the situation. I
Speaker 1: was like, hey, like, what do you want to do?
Speaker 1: Do you really want to I still think it's manipulative
Speaker 1: because Bart, just from an optics standpoint and what he wants,
Speaker 1: it definitely doesn't help him in his world. And there's
Speaker 1: a whole thing about like, well, he's trying to uh,
Speaker 1: he's trying to give people curfuses like this because he's
Speaker 1: trying to court people who have family values, which is
Speaker 1: a euphemism for conservative values, which means they're probably not
Speaker 1: uncomfortable with you having a gay step son. So I
Speaker 1: always interpreted, or I guess when I saw it now
Speaker 1: as an adult, was like, well, I don't think Eric
Speaker 1: realizes that Art has a dog in this fight, and
Speaker 1: maybe Bart doesn't realize it either, But going I think
Speaker 1: Serena is correct when she says like, yeah, a billionaire
Speaker 1: in fifteen year old, that's a that's an equal discussion.
Speaker 1: I would think that him even saying like, hey, there's
Speaker 1: press here, do you want to come out to the nation.
Speaker 1: That implies that coming out to the nation isn't a
Speaker 1: normal or okay thing to do. While at the same time,
Speaker 1: I also like, I also totally understand it. He shouldn't
Speaker 1: have to He shouldn't have to come out in a
Speaker 1: widely public way if that's not what he's comfortable with.
Speaker 1: But I did think it was interesting that like, yeah,
Speaker 1: but Bart, there's a better and there's a worst case
Speaker 1: scenario for him, right, But I do think I do
Speaker 1: agree with you in the sense that I think at
Speaker 1: least my impression from from that episode was that, yeah,
Speaker 1: Bart does he is trying to to put a family. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: I see that. For me, maybe it was too that
Speaker 1: might I was assuming like, Oh, she's going to go
Speaker 1: to Bart and it's it's gonna like it was a
Speaker 1: little bit more nasty or manipulative. So when it was
Speaker 1: dropped that, I know, talk asked him, I told him like,
Speaker 1: this is what's going to happen. I guess it was
Speaker 1: probably cause I was assuming something different. So when that
Speaker 1: came in, like oh, that kind of laid down a
Speaker 1: little bit differently than what I thought was going to
Speaker 1: go down. Yes, but that being said, yes, when Serena
Speaker 1: comes in and it's like, okay a billionaire and yes,
Speaker 1: like come on that she made a good point for yeah,
Speaker 1: you're you're primed, and they do a good job of
Speaker 1: setting it up where you would have said that, like board,
Speaker 1: obviously we would all imagine that he just said like, no,
Speaker 1: this doesn't look good for me. So I don't want
Speaker 1: I don't want that to be the story, but what
Speaker 1: have you. But I also just think Eric is a
Speaker 1: Erk's a character that I think we'll always put other
Speaker 1: people's comfort first unless he really really has to protect himself.
Speaker 1: But for the most part, he's someone that would choose
Speaker 1: to take himself out of existence rather than call his
Speaker 1: sister and say, hey, I need you to come home,
Speaker 1: like I'm really sad, you know that like breaks my heart. Yeah.
Speaker 1: And again like most kids and most people, uh you know,
Speaker 1: aren't really taught and don't know how to just say hey,
Speaker 1: like yeah, I'm lonely, I need a hug, because we're
Speaker 1: all taught that that equates to weakness or you know
Speaker 1: what kind of things were taught as kids. Um, But yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that Bart doesn't know Eric well, but I
Speaker 1: think if if you're someone that knows him really well,
Speaker 1: you would know that presenting him with a scenario where
Speaker 1: it's like, hey, this would make everything easier. Versus this,
Speaker 1: he's always going to take the well, let me just
Speaker 1: do the thing that's easier for everybody's easier. I think
Speaker 1: in that world someone would. I think someone like him
Speaker 1: is just sort of screwed because that that world you
Speaker 1: you really need to be. It seems like you need
Speaker 1: to be willing to step on people. You need to
Speaker 1: be really single minded in order to not get eaten. Um.
Speaker 1: And he doesn't seem to have that part of him. Um.
Speaker 1: Eric No. And that's what I think is why it's
Speaker 1: like a breath of fresh air when you see him,
Speaker 1: because you you get that feeling where like you said,
Speaker 1: you you'll just do something so it doesn't complicate anyone else,
Speaker 1: which is like a good nice quality to have, But
Speaker 1: then it probably doesn't feel so right for Eric he does,
Speaker 1: and that's so sad. And also, like I mean, this
Speaker 1: is depends on the person and this and how they're
Speaker 1: feeling about their situation. They would walk in life and
Speaker 1: their thing, but maybe Eric didn't want to it to
Speaker 1: come out in the press like that, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean, maybe there was a layer of that too.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I know, I look, I know me personally,
Speaker 1: like I've never been comfortable sharing any parts of like
Speaker 1: my intimate life publicly, Like I don't want to talk
Speaker 1: about who I'm dating or um Like, that's just never
Speaker 1: been something that I wanted to share with strangers, you know.
Speaker 1: Um so I can I totally And at fifteen I
Speaker 1: was no different. It was like super private about my
Speaker 1: my personal life. So I totally get that, and I
Speaker 1: probably would have done the same thing at his age
Speaker 1: in the situation. And then when I see like Chuck's
Speaker 1: relationship with bart and he, I feel like Chuck's just
Speaker 1: wanting to be so loved and and have that relationship,
Speaker 1: and there's just this like That's why I thought sometimes
Speaker 1: in this episode, I'm like, wait, are they trying to
Speaker 1: make me feel like Art really is like has this
Speaker 1: big heart or so? And then I just feel like
Speaker 1: when he's going and trying to save this like bar
Speaker 1: in Brooklyn, and when he gets in there like and
Speaker 1: and he just wants Blair to love him for him,
Speaker 1: I feel like this was a little bit we saw
Speaker 1: like this real soft not soft wouldn't be the word,
Speaker 1: but like I felt like Chuck was hurting in this episode,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Like every single one of
Speaker 1: these characters is so sad and like so desperate for
Speaker 1: friends and for because everyone in their life lies and
Speaker 1: fox with them constantly, constantly and trust anybody, um and
Speaker 1: they're constantly getting Even when you think you can trust Vanessa,
Speaker 1: she pulls some ship and I'm like Vanessa, everyone is,
Speaker 1: like everyone's constantly being reminded that their safest by themselves
Speaker 1: and shut down from everybody else. And that that goes
Speaker 1: for basically every character in the show. Well, and I
Speaker 1: feel like they really like throw people under the bus
Speaker 1: and are willing to do like anything to kind of
Speaker 1: get what that person wants, even if it is putting
Speaker 1: someone else down in a real gnarly way, Like and
Speaker 1: the kids do that, Like kids don't understand the long
Speaker 1: term effects of trauma and psychological damage and like what
Speaker 1: that does to someone long term, to have the people
Speaker 1: closest to them betray them or to do like you know,
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's a rom com trope, but it's
Speaker 1: like your relationship with Chuck in that episode is like
Speaker 1: a little mini sort of she's all that right because
Speaker 1: he's doing a bet, but then he actually like, oh
Speaker 1: maybe I like you. I don't know, um, but that
Speaker 1: concept like I can't fathom how how much that would
Speaker 1: wreck my trust in future partners if I started to
Speaker 1: fall for someone and they were like, hey, I like you,
Speaker 1: but this was also a bet, so so sorry, UM,
Speaker 1: I don't know how, Like, I don't know how my
Speaker 1: next relationship the And at that age, you're just learning
Speaker 1: what it feels like to be loved and how you
Speaker 1: want to be loved. So when your first experiences with
Speaker 1: relationships and sex and friendship are all with people who
Speaker 1: perpetually lie, um, just because that's what they were taught, Like,
Speaker 1: oh man, uh and you see what all those characters
Speaker 1: are basically going to turn into because you you know
Speaker 1: their parents. It's like, yeah, the odds are they're going
Speaker 1: to turn into Lily. They're gonna turn into Bart like
Speaker 1: who are still haven't figured out how they want to
Speaker 1: be loved and how to treat people and are also
Speaker 1: incredibly lonely um and don't know how to ask for
Speaker 1: the affection that they need. Yeah, so yeah, just watching
Speaker 1: it back, I was like, oh, man, like Nate's so
Speaker 1: sad and like Dan so sad, and she doesn't know
Speaker 1: how to have friends, and like the little arc with
Speaker 1: like you know, I guess Nate is losing his home.
Speaker 1: I mean he thinks make his home and not his parents.
Speaker 1: And then he finds out like, oh, no, you broke
Speaker 1: into my house, Like you don't you don't want to
Speaker 1: be my friend? You um, but it is that and
Speaker 1: what there's like another layer to this connor Sometimes like
Speaker 1: I feel like Dan's always getting the short end of
Speaker 1: the stick, Like he wasn't really like trying to like
Speaker 1: out Nate or like break into the house and do that.
Speaker 1: He genuinely saw it and and was like, oh god, I
Speaker 1: don't want him to like be sleeping by himself, Like
Speaker 1: and how wild is that you see this like multimillion dollar,
Speaker 1: amazing place on the Upper East Side and here's like
Speaker 1: this lonely kid sleeping on a sleeping bag on a
Speaker 1: like cold floor. You can have all this stuff and
Speaker 1: still be like totally alone. Yeah, But so I'm like
Speaker 1: feeling bad for Dan, and then I'm like, at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, he's also gossip girl literally putting
Speaker 1: everyone on blast and putting everyone else there. That makes
Speaker 1: him when you rewatch the series knowing that's what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: he's like he's not a good person, Like and I'm
Speaker 1: literally sitting here feeling so bad, and but you're literally
Speaker 1: the person that is like outed people that didn't want
Speaker 1: to come out yet or relationships that came out, and
Speaker 1: that's pretty like scandalous and sketchy, and I forgot that.
Speaker 1: So it's just so funny when I'm like, That's why
Speaker 1: Gossip Girl was very entertaining, because then you get it
Speaker 1: has your mind going this way, and then I'm like,
Speaker 1: but yeah, who did you Who did you think it was?
Speaker 1: And when you found out it was Dan it was Penn,
Speaker 1: were you shocked? Yeah? I found I because I left
Speaker 1: the show in season four and or after season four,
Speaker 1: and I guess that that wasn't revealed until like the
Speaker 1: end end, which was I think two or three years later, right,
Speaker 1: So um, I yeah, who did I think it was?
Speaker 1: I didn't think it was a cast member. I always
Speaker 1: just thought it was like in my mind, I was like,
Speaker 1: it's Kristen Bell, that's right, just Christ It's just it's
Speaker 1: just actually come out. Um for whatever reason, Like you know,
Speaker 1: she's she's spending her time doing that, right, keeping up
Speaker 1: with these people. I always thought it was Yeah. I
Speaker 1: just thought it was sort of this like, you know,
Speaker 1: like the good voice of God type, Like, yeah, she's
Speaker 1: a person, but she's like not someone that any these
Speaker 1: people have ever met. She's just this omnipotent amalgamation of gossip.
Speaker 1: She's like the god of gossip. I think throughout the years,
Speaker 1: people would ask me, who do I think, And then
Speaker 1: that got in my head. I'm like, oh, it is
Speaker 1: probably is going to be a cast member. But I
Speaker 1: never I never internalized, but I guess inherent who done
Speaker 1: it right? Of gossip girls? Like that never occurred to me.
Speaker 1: I just took it at face value. And he's like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: she doesn't exist. It's like she's not here. It's just
Speaker 1: a voice over. I don't know if you're familiar with
Speaker 1: Neil Gaiman, but he has this, you know, really fascinating
Speaker 1: way of um personifying gods in a way that the
Speaker 1: Greeks did, where it was well you got the god
Speaker 1: of wine, et cetera. And he does this with American gods,
Speaker 1: where you have the god of technology and new media
Speaker 1: and things like that, um, and that was always my
Speaker 1: sort of conception of what that character was, where it
Speaker 1: was just like this is this is the internet basically, right,
Speaker 1: which was interesting to do the show pre Instagram, I think,
Speaker 1: pre all of it. I mean there weren't really we
Speaker 1: had Facebook. It was weren't blogs, but it wasn't the
Speaker 1: primary method of communication, no, And it was stilled to
Speaker 1: this at the beginning, like things weren't catching on, like
Speaker 1: how everything is now. Like I always give respect to
Speaker 1: the way that they know. Josh and step are really
Speaker 1: good writers, so they they I think there are two
Speaker 1: ways to do pilots in television. You either give people
Speaker 1: sort of a shmort export of everything that you can
Speaker 1: expect from that show forever you Like, you give them like,
Speaker 1: well they're here's like there's gonna be some light comedy,
Speaker 1: so we'll give you this scene and like, let's just
Speaker 1: introduce you to this world, um, little by little, and
Speaker 1: then we can ease you into the series. That's my
Speaker 1: least preferred pilot. Then there's the other way, which is
Speaker 1: what Josh and Stephanie did, where you don't get a preamble,
Speaker 1: They just drop you in the center of a story.
Speaker 1: She's gone. This is the day she comes back. We're
Speaker 1: starting the story here because it's the day she comes back.
Speaker 1: And beyond the right metic, we don't they don't give
Speaker 1: us proof that's Serena's special. She just shows up and
Speaker 1: clearly she is because of how people treat her. And
Speaker 1: I like so in the same way they never explain, well,
Speaker 1: gossip girls, this blog, that's like it is around like
Speaker 1: she just starts talking and then you have to just
Speaker 1: get into the groove of well, this is how this
Speaker 1: world works. And I like that way of presenting a
Speaker 1: pilot like here, I could get on the train because
Speaker 1: this is the way the show works, yep, and you'll
Speaker 1: find out things as we go. I couldn't agree more
Speaker 1: because I feel like the other way it's you do
Speaker 1: get all the things and then you kind of know
Speaker 1: what's not what's coming because they give it to you.
Speaker 1: But you you also know more about the character instead
Speaker 1: of learning about the character as it's coming. You know,
Speaker 1: when you get all that in the pilot, you're like, Okay,
Speaker 1: I kind of knew this, this and this, So I
Speaker 1: couldn't agree more. And they did a wonderful job. And
Speaker 1: then like the taste in music and like the city
Speaker 1: and they are good music music designers, so that I
Speaker 1: mean the list and I found so many bands being
Speaker 1: on that show, and they totally every time they do
Speaker 1: a new episode or I even remember like we had
Speaker 1: Robin in the living room performing for someone's birthday show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I just remember, Yeah, the people that they would get
Speaker 1: to show up and yeah, they just like and they
Speaker 1: did it with the O C too, Like they just
Speaker 1: have really really good taste when it comes to music
Speaker 1: to music. I yeah, I couldn't get and yeah, like
Speaker 1: Florence and the Machine came on at one point and yeah,
Speaker 1: it was they did a really good job with that. Um,
Speaker 1: how many like party scenes we're on this show. When
Speaker 1: I go back and watch him, like, oh my gosh,
Speaker 1: that was every There was like three an episode, which
Speaker 1: are just there. Those days are long. I always had
Speaker 1: fun because I always liked when a lot of us
Speaker 1: were together because it was just fun to like chat
Speaker 1: and talk and see and especially like you and I
Speaker 1: when we came in and out of the show, was
Speaker 1: like nice to come back and see everyone's face again.
Speaker 1: But those scenes, I mean the angles and the shots
Speaker 1: and the amount of times that you have to do
Speaker 1: those lines and those setups are is insane because you
Speaker 1: have to redo your dialogue over and over for everyone's
Speaker 1: coverage in the scene. Party scenes suck and big dinner
Speaker 1: scenes suck, and we did all of them. We had,
Speaker 1: um oh my god, the dinner scenes do because a
Speaker 1: lot of times there's even more setups for that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you've got a single, single, single, single, single single. You know,
Speaker 1: we have eight people at the table. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of brunches. Is always closely difficult than the way that
Speaker 1: you know network TV shot, unless it's like a single
Speaker 1: cam comedy, you don't have that roving, steadicam shots. So
Speaker 1: like you don't have you can't do those scenes in
Speaker 1: one long take where the camera just moves into everybody's
Speaker 1: coverage in a sequence. You have to move it every
Speaker 1: time and get a single shot. That's just sort of
Speaker 1: the style of most network TV, especially dramas, so it
Speaker 1: just takes forever. And party scenes are always difficult too,
Speaker 1: because like they're supposed to be music, so theoretically you
Speaker 1: should be talking louder, but that never really plays on
Speaker 1: the mix. You can't be like why you have to
Speaker 1: just talk normal? And then I just always like I
Speaker 1: just always hats off the background who have to like
Speaker 1: try to keep some sort of rhythm and don't tend
Speaker 1: to talk yea for hours, like literally can't talk because
Speaker 1: they just have to be like quiet in the background.
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, they're just trying, you know, And after
Speaker 1: seven hours, I'd want to probably talk to the person
Speaker 1: I've been fake dancing with two So yeah, I always
Speaker 1: you know that I liked party scenes to because I um,
Speaker 1: I guess. One of the sad things about the way
Speaker 1: again big cast network shows are structured is generally, like
Speaker 1: you interact, you have like a small orbit of people
Speaker 1: that you interact with because that's who the character knows best.
Speaker 1: So mine would be Kelly and Blake primarily, and then
Speaker 1: you you have pen and Matt and Taylor primarily, and
Speaker 1: then it sometimes it will expand. So you have these
Speaker 1: people that ideally of friends and you want to spend
Speaker 1: time with, and you rarely get to work with most
Speaker 1: of them. Like my time working with with Chase was
Speaker 1: so minimal because Eric and Nate just like had no
Speaker 1: reason to hang out, right, And that was always like
Speaker 1: it was always a frustrating part of making a show
Speaker 1: with people that you like. It's like, I don't like,
Speaker 1: we never get to interact that much, but party sans
Speaker 1: you could, So that was always like that. That was
Speaker 1: always nice. What was your favorite location to shoot? Did
Speaker 1: you like shooting on the Upper east Side? Was that?
Speaker 1: Where did you live? Again? I lived? I looked at
Speaker 1: my parents, I was I was still nice, but I
Speaker 1: lived on York Avenue on the Upper east Side, but
Speaker 1: not like I feel like, if your connection to New
Speaker 1: York City is is this show, then you have a
Speaker 1: very different concept that what the upperast Side is. I
Speaker 1: didn't grow up on that Upper east Side York Fiel.
Speaker 1: They don't have a second Avenue subway line back then,
Speaker 1: so it was four avenues to get the Lexington. Basically,
Speaker 1: what that translates to is there's not a lot of
Speaker 1: culture in that area. Town like restaurants had a hard
Speaker 1: time surviving, and like basically where I grew up as
Speaker 1: where all the hospitals are, like hospital Special Surgery in
Speaker 1: the rivers right there, So there just wasn't much to
Speaker 1: do in that area. You definitely didn't have like nice
Speaker 1: stores ut of that. Well. Also, the Upper east Side
Speaker 1: is big. People don't because if you watch the show,
Speaker 1: you think it's like because I think that you know,
Speaker 1: the show's Upper East Side is not it's about the community,
Speaker 1: not the location. True true to the community I think
Speaker 1: is very small. The actual geography is it's bigger. But
Speaker 1: I I love shooting on the streets of New York City.
Speaker 1: The energy that, um it's just a beautiful experience. Like
Speaker 1: I I used being outside and not at Silver Cup.
Speaker 1: It was always great because studios are just tough. They
Speaker 1: they're like casinos. There's no windows. All the light is artificial.
Speaker 1: Even though you know you've got like the best set
Speaker 1: designers in the business making these beautiful homes and they
Speaker 1: look real to anyone watching real you know, it's not
Speaker 1: a real home. Um, So actually being you know, real home,
Speaker 1: it's just different. Like for an actor, I think practical
Speaker 1: as much practical things as possible, right, Like I don't
Speaker 1: know any actors that would choose green screen over a
Speaker 1: practical location because it's just like you can touch things
Speaker 1: and you can feel it and smell it. I loved
Speaker 1: being on on the streets of the city, so anywhere, yeah,
Speaker 1: anywhere we could go that and there were all places
Speaker 1: that I knew intimately. I grew up there, So that's question.
Speaker 1: Places that I was familiar with was super cool. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's so special. It's so wild because sometimes you'll like
Speaker 1: walk upstairs in a studio like you're in a huh,
Speaker 1: and then you go through the door and it's literally
Speaker 1: like there's nothing called down and they literally break your
Speaker 1: your legs. There's like no stair. But like when you
Speaker 1: watch it on TV and it looks like you're walking
Speaker 1: into like this most the most amazing bedroom and then
Speaker 1: you go shoot the bedroom and a whole different patient
Speaker 1: coming through the door. It's it's really insane, But I
Speaker 1: do know what you mean. When it's a real home,
Speaker 1: there's a different energy. I was thinking about that when
Speaker 1: I was looking back to the episode that, like I
Speaker 1: that living room of the Underwoods apartments, like, oh, that
Speaker 1: that was my house for a number of years. But
Speaker 1: I I can't remember Eric's bedroom. I know I had one,
Speaker 1: but we spent very very little time in it. If
Speaker 1: I did, so, it was just funny to watch it, like, oh,
Speaker 1: I have such a clear memory of that living room.
Speaker 1: That's the extent of my house because I couldn't tell
Speaker 1: you what Serena's bedroom looked like. I don't know if
Speaker 1: Eric had one, and I don't think Lily had one
Speaker 1: either that we spent really any time in. So that
Speaker 1: living room was what was up. Yeah, there's I don't
Speaker 1: think there was a bathroom that I could connect to
Speaker 1: that area, like what the shower looked like, Like it's
Speaker 1: just that living room with that protest sign and the
Speaker 1: art of the that that lady with sort of different
Speaker 1: colored believe that go hair. Yeah like that that's my
Speaker 1: concept of that house, which is just funny. It is funny.
Speaker 1: I mean, yes, that's exactly what I picture when I think,
Speaker 1: like Eric, We're going to Eric's home or Serena's. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then on top of it, like now Chuck and
Speaker 1: and Barter there, yes, like where is their room? Right? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I saw when that when the episode started and it starts,
Speaker 1: I think we're all sitting at breakfast, and I was like,
Speaker 1: all right, did those two live with us for a while.
Speaker 1: I forgot that was the thing because I always think
Speaker 1: too like Serena like is so cringe, like can't stand Chuck,
Speaker 1: you know, and like what he stands for, and it's
Speaker 1: always kind of has like this poor taste in her
Speaker 1: mouth for him, and then he wakes her up with
Speaker 1: the flower one day and I'm like, imagine in real life,
Speaker 1: like someone who's in your friend group, but you can't
Speaker 1: stand them because of you know, some of the things
Speaker 1: they do is all of a sudden, your stepbrother and
Speaker 1: living in your home, Like that's nuts. Yeah, it's insane. Um.
Speaker 1: Speaking of Chuck, Blair is talking with Chuck and she says,
Speaker 1: you know, eight letters three said, both say it and
Speaker 1: I'm yours. That went like iconic. That was like everywhere
Speaker 1: people were making shirts from it, and I remember it
Speaker 1: being so big, but I had not watched the episode.
Speaker 1: Well then in this episode after the whole thing where
Speaker 1: Chuck humiliates Vanessa and in their whole like game again
Speaker 1: Blair and Chuck and then he says it back to her,
Speaker 1: do you like these two together? I guess so. I
Speaker 1: feel like it's when you go back and watch though,
Speaker 1: it's because they what everyone loved that so much in
Speaker 1: the way they were like the writers writing for them
Speaker 1: like more and more with their dynamic. It almost feels
Speaker 1: like going back, I'm like you you can't not like
Speaker 1: I'm almost you know. I mean, I guess as an
Speaker 1: as an audience member, obviously you would want these characters
Speaker 1: get to get together there toxic, Like why why would
Speaker 1: you not want that? That's fun um and they love
Speaker 1: each other despite their toxices, and like that's even better
Speaker 1: there romantic but the fun up and I, you know,
Speaker 1: were these real people and were either friends, like I
Speaker 1: would never it would be like, no, Chuck's fun, do
Speaker 1: not date him, like please, Like this is not in
Speaker 1: love with even if he's nice to you, like he's
Speaker 1: really damaged, he's gonna wind up hurting you just like
Speaker 1: he doesn't. That dude's got a lot of therapy to
Speaker 1: work through, and like maybe in ten years not now.
Speaker 1: And Blair somewhat the same. If I had a buddy
Speaker 1: or a girlfriend that was that was interested in in her,
Speaker 1: I just be like she's nice and she can be
Speaker 1: really fun, and she's smart and she's loyal and like,
Speaker 1: but also she's gonna hurt you, like she's not emotionally
Speaker 1: stable and neither is he. So these aren't good people
Speaker 1: to date. But at the same time, like, I know
Speaker 1: you're gonna do it anyway. They're super fine and you're fun,
Speaker 1: Like I get it. I'll be here to pick you
Speaker 1: up when they'll be here. Yeah, I'll be here for
Speaker 1: should you know, Like yeah, should they be together, Like, no,
Speaker 1: they're both gonna pick on the worst parts of each
Speaker 1: other and they like feed off of each other without that,
Speaker 1: and that they they at least at this stage in
Speaker 1: their lives, they're really only able to commit fully when
Speaker 1: they're almost positive that the other person won't reciprocate. Then
Speaker 1: they can be like like she can only say I
Speaker 1: love you when she's positive Chuck won't say it back,
Speaker 1: and vice versa, which is like very twisted. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: it's also like, I you know, that's that's not an
Speaker 1: abnormal place to be. You're like, yeah, I I feel
Speaker 1: safe being vulnerable with you because I know I don't
Speaker 1: have to follow through on it because you won't. And
Speaker 1: if I thought that you were ready with those two
Speaker 1: like every time you come to me now, I don't know.
Speaker 1: I can't do it because then I'd have to actually
Speaker 1: like to be with you, and I don't know if
Speaker 1: that will work. It's much easier to love you knowing
Speaker 1: that you don't want me right now. I still find
Speaker 1: it like so, but that's why it's fun. Yeah, that
Speaker 1: is why it's fun. And then you almost sometimes want
Speaker 1: your like just say it back, just say it, you know,
Speaker 1: and then they keep you, like pulling you with them.
Speaker 1: But I think for all these characters, because they all
Speaker 1: come from broken homes and they I think, I love
Speaker 1: I love you is just like I think most of
Speaker 1: them have a similar experience that Eric does. That like
Speaker 1: telling someone that you love them doesn't mean they're going
Speaker 1: to be there. It's just something that you say sometimes.
Speaker 1: So I think it's a dangerous thing for all of
Speaker 1: those characters, especially because like having all of their best
Speaker 1: friends banged the people that they were in love with,
Speaker 1: like that sucks. Like that's really tough, you know, really tough.
Speaker 1: And it's that's like how the show started. I mean
Speaker 1: the opening pilot we find out that Serena took Nate's virginity.
Speaker 1: I'm like, that's like this like a kind of coke
Speaker 1: fueled rampage fourteen. She was you know exactly. It's like what,
Speaker 1: oh man, it makes me think that it's a really
Speaker 1: interesting uh because the show is so patrician and pretty
Speaker 1: and everyone's hairs back to you know, in the right
Speaker 1: place designed well you do, it's very easy to forget
Speaker 1: that two thirds of these characters are drug addicts or
Speaker 1: you know, or have substance music issues, you know, body
Speaker 1: image issues, eating disorders, suicidality, like, they all have extreme
Speaker 1: mental health issues that that they need help with, and
Speaker 1: you don't really notice that. It's easy because miss that
Speaker 1: because they all look good. But again, such as such
Speaker 1: as life like most people are a storm beneath beneath
Speaker 1: all that. Yeah's man, it's so true. And that's why
Speaker 1: when I was in in a lot of episodes when
Speaker 1: we went when I went back and started watching, That's
Speaker 1: why when I was talking about even what comes out
Speaker 1: with eric in in the beginning, there were so many
Speaker 1: layers and deeper things than what I think. When you
Speaker 1: ask someone who's oh did you watch class, what do
Speaker 1: you like about it? They don't get into everything that
Speaker 1: we were talking about, because I do. Really they think
Speaker 1: it was over overlooked a lot, you know, I think.
Speaker 1: I asked him on the other day, I said, what
Speaker 1: do you think? They said, Well, I think what I
Speaker 1: got A big thing I got from it was not
Speaker 1: a lot of people have that type of money, and
Speaker 1: a lot of people fantasize, and you know, think a
Speaker 1: lot of problems would go away if I had lived
Speaker 1: like this or that. And this girl said watching it,
Speaker 1: I really realized that all these people seem so broken
Speaker 1: and are lonely, and they have all the money in
Speaker 1: the world. So she said, that's kind of the in
Speaker 1: the big picture what she kind of took from it.
Speaker 1: But when she said that, I was like, that's interesting
Speaker 1: because I'm so used to everyone being like, so, how
Speaker 1: was it wearing Mark Jacob some season, Like, you know,
Speaker 1: I was so used to those questions in the press
Speaker 1: and all the things for so many years. So coming
Speaker 1: back as a mom and watching more like as an audience,
Speaker 1: I am like really looking at things differently and certain
Speaker 1: things they touched on that like, I just don't think
Speaker 1: people really realized, you know what I mean at the time.
Speaker 1: And it was also different because now people, you know,
Speaker 1: when you watch to show, people can talk about it
Speaker 1: on their platforms or give yeah or oh my god,
Speaker 1: can you believe the ending of this? And everyone could.
Speaker 1: You know, there's like an open dialogue about things now
Speaker 1: where then it wasn't. But I just feel like it
Speaker 1: was it was overlooked many times, you know. Yeah, But um,
Speaker 1: but I had fun watching this. I'd love seeing you
Speaker 1: on again. Um. Here's how Gossip Girls closes out the episode,
Speaker 1: just like the season's people have the ability to change.
Speaker 1: It doesn't happen very often, but when it does, it's
Speaker 1: almost always right. Sometimes it takes what's broken becoming whole again.
Speaker 1: Sometimes it takes opening up to new people and letting
Speaker 1: them in. But most times it just takes one person
Speaker 1: who is truly afraid to show what they feel getting
Speaker 1: an opportunity they never thought possible. And some things never change.
Speaker 1: Let a new game begin XO x o. Oh gossip girls,
Speaker 1: you know, like little little poets. Yeah, And she's like
Speaker 1: it's broken up in the music and the flashes to
Speaker 1: each person. I'm like, oh, yeah, they did. They did
Speaker 1: a good job at that. But so you're in l A,
Speaker 1: do you do you want to share anything, talk about
Speaker 1: anything that you want us to know about. UM? Sure, yeah.
Speaker 1: I got these a couple of films that I guess
Speaker 1: we'll have to be out this year or next that
Speaker 1: I'm excited about. When I just finished as a film
Speaker 1: called The Young Wife, which is a director UM called
Speaker 1: Yisha Pose second film. I just think she's pretty brilliant.
Speaker 1: And this picture was such a like such an interesting
Speaker 1: mixt of really talented cast and I mean it's just
Speaker 1: everybody and it's got a very specific and interesting aesthetic
Speaker 1: that I'm I'm just really excited to see come together.
Speaker 1: You talk about and where did you found? We show
Speaker 1: that in Savannah and my my outfits, I think like,
Speaker 1: with all due respect, sort of one up, we'll definitely
Speaker 1: want up. Eric as far as peacocking, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: there's there's one in particular that's like very the late
Speaker 1: Prince in terms of the way this guy dresses. So
Speaker 1: that was it reminded me. It was the first time
Speaker 1: in a long time. Uh. And this would happen sometimes
Speaker 1: on Gossip Girl, even though Eric, as far as that
Speaker 1: show would go, was never like it was always prett
Speaker 1: conservative as far as how he dressed, like, he didn't
Speaker 1: do kind of crazy bright colors or anything like Chuck.
Speaker 1: But it was one of the first times that I
Speaker 1: have felt since that show that like we're always playing
Speaker 1: dress up, you know, but like a lot of times
Speaker 1: costume fittings don't feel like playing dress up. So it's like,
Speaker 1: I don't know, he's a close people. Uh, And this
Speaker 1: felt like and I guess this Gossip Girl was so
Speaker 1: different from my own personal style that whenever I would
Speaker 1: do a fitting, it felt like trying on clothes and
Speaker 1: like my mom or my dad's closet or something. I
Speaker 1: don't know. I was put this all. Yeah, this feels,
Speaker 1: this feels odd, but let's do it. Yeah, it's always fun.
Speaker 1: Like so I really enjoyed, uh, putting things together. And
Speaker 1: that was also my experience on on this show where yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd never choose these things, like you have someone else
Speaker 1: with an eye, like like Eric Damon did, like and
Speaker 1: then you see yourself in and you're like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess it's weird. He literally did so good. Yeah, dude,
Speaker 1: he made me. He made me stop wearing belts. He
Speaker 1: always had a real issue with men and belts, sort
Speaker 1: of broke the broken thing. He's like, I really like
Speaker 1: to this day, whenever I go to put a I'm like, no,
Speaker 1: man Erica. Yeah, no, he wouldn't. He wouldn't like this.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's so funny. Yeah. Sebastian said he
Speaker 1: went to a fitting and they were like, no suspenders
Speaker 1: if you have to get belts. Um. Yeah, I'm excited
Speaker 1: about that. There's a there's a film I'm supposed to
Speaker 1: start doing next week in Colombia that would be it
Speaker 1: should be pretty interesting, just working out visa issues, so hopefully,
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that's exciting. Have you been No, I've
Speaker 1: been to South America, but not to Bocata, so that
Speaker 1: would be Yeah, that would be fun. And then, well,
Speaker 1: I'm excited. I'm really excited to see all your get
Speaker 1: ups in this. What's the movie called The Young Wife? Okay,
Speaker 1: And I'm interested because I've read a lot about that
Speaker 1: director and she seems really rad. Yeah, I think she's
Speaker 1: sort of likely a genius. I like her a lot,
Speaker 1: so I I was quite I was quite psyched to
Speaker 1: be able to collaborate with her. I think she's really cool.
Speaker 1: That's so cool. I'm very very pumped and excited. H Well,
Speaker 1: thank you for coming on. Thank you for um. This
Speaker 1: was a really great conversation. I like getting in and
Speaker 1: digging in a little bit deeper, because that's what these
Speaker 1: conversations are for, you know. But thank you so much,
Speaker 1: and we'll try. We'll have to get together with Taylor
Speaker 1: to at some point. I'd love that. Yeah, but you
Speaker 1: enjoy your day. Thank you so much for coming on.
Speaker 1: This was super fun and I can't wait to watch
Speaker 1: your stuff and then we'll get the crew together. And
Speaker 1: I am just so glad you could join me today, Connor,
Speaker 1: I missed you so much. You've got such a good
Speaker 1: little vibe help me, and it was so great to
Speaker 1: catch up and hear all about your time on the show.
Speaker 1: And to all the rest of you listening, I'll see
Speaker 1: you next week for another Gossip Girl rewatch. Make sure
Speaker 1: to subscribe to the podcast and leave us a review,
Speaker 1: and don't forget to keep dropping your questions for us
Speaker 1: over on Instagram. I'm at Jessica's Or and I'll pick
Speaker 1: my favorites to answer on the show. All right, until
Speaker 1: next time. XO XL x O x O is produced
Speaker 1: by Propagate Content and Met Jessica's Or. Our show is
Speaker 1: executive produced by Langley. Our producers are Diego Tapia, Kristin Vermilia,
Speaker 1: Emily Carr, and Hannah Harris. Original music by Moxie and Lune,
Speaker 1: and the episode was mixed by Setho Landscape