Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to OKF Daily with me
Speaker 1: your girl, Danielle Moody pre recording from the Home Bunker. Folks,
Speaker 1: it is my birthday, so I am taking a few
Speaker 1: days off for some rest and realignment, but I'm very
Speaker 1: happy to leave you with some episodes that I have
Speaker 1: pre recorded. The episode coming up today is with actor
Speaker 1: and the chair of the Glisten Board, Wilson Cruz, who
Speaker 1: is also a friend of mine. He is an LGBTQ
Speaker 1: friggin icon whose first portrayal of a queer character on
Speaker 1: television was in the nineties with My So Called Life.
Speaker 1: If you remember that show with Claire Danes and her
Speaker 1: best friend Ricky was played by Wilson Cruz. And so
Speaker 1: Wilson has spent his career we are not only on
Speaker 1: the screen but also in c suite working to advance
Speaker 1: representation for LGBTQ people and help our youth. And so
Speaker 1: I'm so excited to welcome him to wok F for
Speaker 1: this really insightful conversation. We pre recorded this so as
Speaker 1: of the time that you're listening to this, the strike,
Speaker 1: the longest strike for actors, tentatively has reached a deal.
Speaker 1: So in this conversation, we are still speaking about the
Speaker 1: strike because it was still going on when we recorded
Speaker 1: the show. So I hope that you enjoyed this episode.
Speaker 1: Coming up next, folks, I am so very excited to
Speaker 1: welcome to woke f Daily. Just oh, I don't know
Speaker 1: an icon, an actor and activists and all around absolute
Speaker 1: bad ass Wilson Cruz, who I have known, had the
Speaker 1: pleasure of knowing for several years now. Wilson, We've watched
Speaker 1: you on Star Trek, We've watched you on and so
Speaker 1: many shows. We've watched you get Vanguard Awards for your
Speaker 1: activism as an LGBTQ activist, and now you are also
Speaker 1: I don't know how you do it, but are also
Speaker 1: the board chair at Glisten Right, an organization that seeks
Speaker 1: to provide curriculum, books, information on LGBTQ youth to our
Speaker 1: schools to create better, more compassionate global citizens. I want
Speaker 1: to start off by asking, in the context of all
Speaker 1: the places we are right now, living in between all
Speaker 1: of these multiple dimensions of violence and grief and vacillating,
Speaker 1: how are you? How are you doing well?
Speaker 2: First of all, thank you for for having me here.
Speaker 2: I love seeing your faith How am I? I am?
Speaker 2: I am well because I really believe we're going to
Speaker 2: get through this. We're going to get to the other
Speaker 2: side of this. It's not going to be easy, but
Speaker 2: I'm well, you know, I do feel like the world
Speaker 2: is on fire, ye and I'm getting a tan from it.
Speaker 2: But I'm grabbing a hose. You know. We all need
Speaker 2: to grab a hose and do what we can and
Speaker 2: put out the fire where we can, where we can
Speaker 2: right and listen, is the place where I've chosen to
Speaker 2: put out that I've chosen to put out this fire
Speaker 2: or or help put out this fire? How do I
Speaker 2: do it? I do it because I'm not doing it
Speaker 2: by myself. I am part of a dynamic leadership, a
Speaker 2: new leadership team at Glisten, with Alamara Jones as my
Speaker 2: vice chair and with Melanie Williamn Jaggers as our new
Speaker 2: executive director. I am here to support them really yeah,
Speaker 2: to make to make it possible to get the resources
Speaker 2: this organization needs to do its important work. That's I
Speaker 2: see my self as you know, the catcher right on
Speaker 2: the team, and I have such faith in their abilities
Speaker 2: and the abilities of this staff, and that I feel
Speaker 2: really confident that We've seen this in terms of schools
Speaker 2: and and the sin stream that we're seeing with book
Speaker 2: bands and stuff like that. We've seen this play before.
Speaker 2: We know how to deal with it. This is a
Speaker 2: louder contingent for sure, But there I still believe that
Speaker 2: they are the minority. They just happen to be a
Speaker 2: really loud one. The job of Listen is to give
Speaker 2: them the resource, give our team, give our our kids,
Speaker 2: our our parents, the teachers, our supportive teachers, administration, school districts,
Speaker 2: the resources they need, the tools they need to combat
Speaker 2: all of these lies, because that's what they are. There
Speaker 2: are lives, and we're here to provide the help and
Speaker 2: the resources and tools to fight back. So that gives
Speaker 2: me great confidence and it soothes my weary soul when
Speaker 2: I when I get worked up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I will say that it is so important,
Speaker 1: I think, particularly for young queer people to see successful
Speaker 1: whole queer adults right and from color, you know, of
Speaker 1: color of color in particular, and I think that often
Speaker 1: what we are bombarded with, what those youth are bombarded with,
Speaker 1: are all of the statistics about why they're not going
Speaker 1: to succeed, why they will die young, why the world
Speaker 1: is against them, and so as somebody that has been
Speaker 1: in the spotlight and has been out in the spotlight
Speaker 1: as a gay man of color, who's you know what
Speaker 1: your breakout character, my soul called life would have been
Speaker 1: banned probably that that that your your your Ricky would
Speaker 1: have been banned. That show would have been banned and
Speaker 1: it had aired not in the nineties, but today. That
Speaker 1: gave so many young queer people the opportunity to see themselves.
Speaker 1: You know, what do you think, how do you help
Speaker 1: provide that light that is needed for our lgbt Q
Speaker 1: kids of color in particular that are at the intersection
Speaker 1: battling so much.
Speaker 2: You know, I think it's really important right now, in
Speaker 2: this moment when there's you know, these high decibel screams
Speaker 2: from the MAGA, write that our students see us standing
Speaker 2: up for them, that we adults rise up, if you will,
Speaker 2: to borrow the phrase from Gliston's campaign, that campaign is important.
Speaker 2: That it's important that governors and mayors all across this
Speaker 2: country are declaring that they're pledging the to be supportive
Speaker 2: of LGBTQ plus students because the noise that they're hearing
Speaker 2: from the other side feels like it's the only story
Speaker 2: and they need to see that the other side of
Speaker 2: the story is that there is an entire community of
Speaker 2: LGBTQ plus adults and allies who are fighting for the right,
Speaker 2: for their right to live up to their potential. That's
Speaker 2: all we're asking. We're not asking for anything special. We're
Speaker 2: asking for these students to be able to go to
Speaker 2: school and to learn in order to be great citizens.
Speaker 2: It's no mistake. It's not an accident that these book
Speaker 2: bands and the censorings started in earnest right around the
Speaker 2: time that the sixteen nineteen project came out, because the
Speaker 2: front lines of our movement and of the fight is
Speaker 2: in our schools. Because if they can control what we learn,
Speaker 2: if they can control what these students learn, they can
Speaker 2: control everything. They can control how they see themselves, they
Speaker 2: can control how other people see them. If you don't
Speaker 2: have LGBTQ plus people in your history in the curriculum
Speaker 2: that you're teaching, it's going to be easy to dehumanize them,
Speaker 2: it's going to be easy to dismiss them. Students need
Speaker 2: to see them themselves mirrored in the curriculum that they
Speaker 2: have at school, and so do straight students. Straight students
Speaker 2: need to see LGBTQ plus trans people sist. Straight people
Speaker 2: need to see that too, because they gain empathy, they
Speaker 2: gain understanding about who we are in our movement, and
Speaker 2: so then it's harder to demonize us, do you understand.
Speaker 2: So the work that Glisten does is really about protecting
Speaker 2: our society, our country, our democracy from ignorance and from hate.
Speaker 2: I talk, you know, I tell people all the time,
Speaker 2: what can we do to to help our movement right now?
Speaker 2: Ensure that we continue to have one continue that we
Speaker 2: continue to have uh people within this community who are
Speaker 2: able to be out and loud and visible. That's that's
Speaker 2: we're raising these kids today to be able to be
Speaker 2: put uh great citizens and active in our democracy. And
Speaker 2: we're raising straight cisgender people to understand and and and
Speaker 2: accept and support and and understand that you know, we
Speaker 2: are a valuable part of this society. So the work
Speaker 2: that Goeston does is vital, uh you know, and it
Speaker 2: reaches the blast radius is enormous.
Speaker 1: You know, you have been in this movement and on
Speaker 1: the front lines for so long. And what do you see, Wilson,
Speaker 1: that is different about this time this moment, both in
Speaker 1: its affirmative right, both in the tools that we didn't
Speaker 1: have right ten years ago, twenty years ago, but also
Speaker 1: in the obstacles that we are facing.
Speaker 2: You know, the reason why we are seeing such an
Speaker 2: enormous backlash to our community, to us, to an entire
Speaker 2: group of human beings, is because of the success that
Speaker 2: we have seen in the last forty years. Yeah, right,
Speaker 2: people came out in the nineties, people fought back against
Speaker 2: you know, the fact that nobody was carrying a damn
Speaker 2: about who was dying of aides. We passed marriage. We
Speaker 2: have an incredible visibility in our society. This moment is
Speaker 2: entirely a response to that. And how it's different is
Speaker 2: Donald Trump.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and the hate that he's unleashed and the permission
Speaker 3: that he's given people to be their least selves, their
Speaker 3: worst selves.
Speaker 2: Two allow people to humanize an entire multiple communities, to
Speaker 2: make it okay to hate, to put racist and white
Speaker 2: supremacists and homophobes and all of these people on equal
Speaker 2: footing with people who are doing good in the world,
Speaker 2: and showed love and educating people on why it's important
Speaker 2: for us to understand and value the ways that we
Speaker 2: are different. That that's part of being a part of
Speaker 2: the human race and part of being a society of
Speaker 2: a government that actually functions. So it's louder. I mean
Speaker 2: I also, you know, I just saw a few weeks
Speaker 2: ago the Judy Bloom documentary where she goes in detail
Speaker 2: about her experience during the book bands during the Reagan years,
Speaker 2: and you listen to that language, and it is the
Speaker 2: exact same language being used today, but it was about
Speaker 2: it was more about like you know, straight sex and
Speaker 2: teen books, and you know, they didn't want they didn't
Speaker 2: want us to know about ourselves. Right now they are
Speaker 2: our body to know our bodies, and now they don't
Speaker 2: want us to know about anybody else's different experience. Right,
Speaker 2: So it's the same bulk, and it's just louder. But
Speaker 2: I truly believe that it's a minority of people. I
Speaker 2: really do. I just think they're louder. And you know,
Speaker 2: there is such a fear of cancelation that this is
Speaker 2: different too. Right, So now you have people who really
Speaker 2: would want to stand up. I'm thinking about like corporations
Speaker 2: and allies who have historically stood with us and now
Speaker 2: are fearful, ye of speaking because they're afraid of the backlash.
Speaker 2: But My message to them is, you know, this is
Speaker 2: when we need you the most. We don't need we
Speaker 2: don't need you as much when we're when we're doing
Speaker 2: well right like that's easy. We need you when we're
Speaker 2: being attacked. We need corporations and leaders and adults and
Speaker 2: teachers and administrations and school boards to stand up against
Speaker 2: this ignorance, because we all know that it's ignorance, you know.
Speaker 2: So I urge people to use their voices at this
Speaker 2: time because it's the only way we're going to be
Speaker 2: able to get through it. We have to be vhicle.
Speaker 2: We have to educate ourselves. You know. Glisten has a
Speaker 2: navigator a map on our website glisten dot org. You
Speaker 2: can go on this map and you can click on
Speaker 2: your state and you can actually see the climate of
Speaker 2: your school system in your state, the laws that are
Speaker 2: that we need pass there, the laws that have been
Speaker 2: passed there in order to oppress us that we need
Speaker 2: to fight back over. You know, you can educate yourself
Speaker 2: and find ways to do something about it on this website.
Speaker 2: That's our that's part of our job, and we urge
Speaker 2: you to sign the pledge to rise up for LGBTQ.
Speaker 2: Plus students because it matters, you know, when when the
Speaker 2: when they don't say gay bills came out. One of
Speaker 2: the things that Glisten did was put was partner with
Speaker 2: local groups in Florida and put up these billboards all
Speaker 2: around the state so that students weren't just hearing the lies.
Speaker 2: You could go, they could actually see a visible display
Speaker 2: of support. That's important when you think about young people
Speaker 2: and their state of minds at this at this time. So,
Speaker 2: you know, I urge people to find ways to be
Speaker 2: vocally and visibly supportive of LGBTQ plus students.
Speaker 1: I want to switch gears for a moment because you,
Speaker 1: like I said at the beginning, or multiple hats and
Speaker 1: that of of actor, and you have been very vocal
Speaker 1: on your social media, very vocal on your platforms about
Speaker 1: the strikes right and about you know, I think that
Speaker 1: during this time, at least for myself, I will say,
Speaker 1: got a real education and in the machine that is Hollywood,
Speaker 1: got a real education on you know, those stars. You
Speaker 1: know that we see that bank the hundreds of millions
Speaker 1: right are far and few between the actual engine of people, yes,
Speaker 1: that make this glittery place go. And so I just
Speaker 1: want to give you an opportunity to talk about that
Speaker 1: strike and why it's important and why now.
Speaker 4: Frankly, Yeah, well, I'm happy to report from what I'm
Speaker 4: hearing that there are some actual negotiations finally happening.
Speaker 2: Good. And I say finally because the way they approached
Speaker 2: us from the beginning it was very much the way
Speaker 2: that we're treated on set, which is, you know, there's
Speaker 2: a tendency to infantilize actors, right, there's a very little respect,
Speaker 2: you know, when you feel like you have to have
Speaker 2: an ad follow your actors around in order to make
Speaker 2: sure that they're doing their job right, you know, to
Speaker 2: walk them to and from set. And you know, there's
Speaker 2: a mindset that these are you know, babies that you
Speaker 2: were babysitting. We're we are we are actors, we are
Speaker 2: are professionals, we are you know, we have trained in
Speaker 2: a skill. So and we're making you millions of dollars
Speaker 2: of millions of dollars right with the skill. And to
Speaker 2: treat us as if we have no agency and we
Speaker 2: have no right to to demand better pay, a better
Speaker 2: structure for residuals that has been outdated. The reason why
Speaker 2: we were doing this now is because over and over again.
Speaker 2: Even in my lifetime. You know, we went from uh
Speaker 2: four network, three networks to four. I remember when Fox
Speaker 2: came out, that's all my assets. So we went from
Speaker 2: four networks to cable to basic cable, to DVDs to streaming.
Speaker 2: So every time there was a new paradigm, there was
Speaker 2: a new platform, the producers would come to us and say, well,
Speaker 2: you know, it's a new media. This is this is
Speaker 2: a brand new thing. We don't know how it's gonna work,
Speaker 2: so just give us time and then you know, once
Speaker 2: it's once it's up and running, then we'll get to you. No,
Speaker 2: that's not gonna work anymore, because they never get back
Speaker 2: to us. Yeah, then things never change. And we just
Speaker 2: went through a worldwide pandemic in which people streamed all
Speaker 2: of our work and proudly that we got to help
Speaker 2: people get through that really difficult time with our work.
Speaker 2: But the sad truth is is that when inflation hit,
Speaker 2: and even before inflation, we weren't even breaking even with residuals.
Speaker 2: So then when we came when we came to the
Speaker 2: table and we presented a way to a you know,
Speaker 2: keep up with the cost of living and inflation's rise,
Speaker 2: they gave us an offer that was actually putting us
Speaker 2: at a point where we were making less than we
Speaker 2: were in twenty twenty. How is that a fair deal?
Speaker 2: How is that solving the problem. And we're using an
Speaker 2: old structure based on network television and rids that doesn't
Speaker 2: exist anymore. I mean, it exists on those platforms, but
Speaker 2: it doesn't work for streaming. That's not how it works.
Speaker 2: And they know it doesn't work. Uh So that's why
Speaker 2: it's one of the reasons why we're we're staying solid
Speaker 2: in our stance. And AI, you cannot tell me that
Speaker 2: you're going to pay me one hundred dollars as a
Speaker 2: background actor to scan my entire body and then use
Speaker 2: it in perpetuity.
Speaker 1: To do what It's insane, insane.
Speaker 2: So they know it's insane. But then they they you know,
Speaker 2: the their communication to to the to the to the
Speaker 2: world is you know, we're asking for too much. No,
Speaker 2: we're asking to be respected right for our work and
Speaker 2: to be paid in a fair way. That doesn't uh
Speaker 2: that that that that that acknowledges that things have changed, right,
Speaker 2: welcome to this new paradigm that you created, right, So yeah,
Speaker 2: have to pay for it. So I'm excited to hear,
Speaker 2: you know, where these negotiations land. You know, I was
Speaker 2: part of a letter that thousands of actors signed that said,
Speaker 2: you know, we've come this far. Don't stop now and
Speaker 2: settle for any for just anything. You know, we came
Speaker 2: here with a goal. We would like us to see
Speaker 2: that goal achieved, or at least get as close to
Speaker 2: it as we possibly can. But this paradigm worring right
Speaker 2: now isn't going to work anymore.
Speaker 1: And I honestly think that, you know, the actors strike,
Speaker 1: the writer's strike, you know, has it really set the
Speaker 1: stage in a lot of ways for its duration to
Speaker 1: have workers across industries recognize that you're not being paid
Speaker 1: your worth. Right that just keeping your head above water,
Speaker 1: whether it's a pandemic that hits, whether it's an emergency
Speaker 1: bill that hits, you should be able to live without that,
Speaker 1: without that level of economic security if you are working
Speaker 1: full time right like that, that is just the reality.
Speaker 2: And you know, we, I think everyone during the height
Speaker 2: of the pandemic, because let's not forget we are still
Speaker 2: in it. At the height of the pandemic, when we
Speaker 2: were locked up at home, we had a lot of
Speaker 2: time on our hands and realized how little we were
Speaker 2: settling for and that isn't that wasn't going to be
Speaker 2: acceptable anymore. And you see it happening with the auto workers. Yes,
Speaker 2: see it at hospital workers, you see at hotels in California, teachers,
Speaker 2: everyone knows that what you know, it just wasn't working anymore.
Speaker 2: We we we were literally living, you know, hand them out. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I mean I have nightmare story after nightmare story that
Speaker 2: I could tell you as an actor, you know, and
Speaker 2: the things that I allowed myself, the ways that I
Speaker 2: have allowed myself to be treated in order to do
Speaker 2: what I love because it's a dream, right. And that's
Speaker 2: the other thing, you know, we people are so so
Speaker 2: quick to say, well, you know, you know it's part
Speaker 2: of struggle, is part of being an actor or being
Speaker 2: an artist. Well why do we accept that? Right? You know,
Speaker 2: in France they actually subsidize artists. The government subsidizes artists.
Speaker 2: Not a great deal, but you know, there's there's like
Speaker 2: a stipend that because they value what art brings to
Speaker 2: their society. It's a way that we we it's a
Speaker 2: national conversation that we have to have. You know, I
Speaker 2: can I'm not supposed to promote my own work. But
Speaker 2: you know, when I think about Ricky Vasquez and what
Speaker 2: he was able to do for a generation of young people,
Speaker 2: queer people of color, and I think about what we
Speaker 2: did on the franchise I'm on now, you know, in
Speaker 2: order to have a conversation about diversity, real diversity in
Speaker 2: the future and who we value and our values in general.
Speaker 2: That's a service, that is a that is ah that
Speaker 2: is a value that we add to culture, to society,
Speaker 2: to the way that we think about ourselves. I think
Speaker 2: that's valuable, yeah, and we should be compensated for it.
Speaker 1: And I think that that's that's the thing, is that
Speaker 1: we should all be compensated for what it is that
Speaker 1: we offer, and that we are all of value regardless
Speaker 1: of what it is that we produce. But certainly when
Speaker 1: we are producing something that we should be able to
Speaker 1: see the fruits of that labor and not just see
Speaker 1: it in terms of rocket ships that are going into
Speaker 1: out of space with billionaires and you know, and and
Speaker 1: the like. The last question that I have for you,
Speaker 1: my friend, and thank you for being so gracious with
Speaker 1: your time, is, you know, people are struggling with hope
Speaker 1: right now. They are struggling with hope, they are struggling
Speaker 1: to find light, they are struggling to be the light.
Speaker 1: And I just want, you know, to ask you what
Speaker 1: are you doing? You know, how are you holding on
Speaker 1: to hope in this time? And what you know, what
Speaker 1: do you offer to others that that are that find
Speaker 1: themselves in darkness.
Speaker 2: It's a great and necessary question. And I'll tell you
Speaker 2: the thing that has gotten me through this year specifically,
Speaker 2: and it's one of the reasons why I feel so
Speaker 2: strongly about advocating for inclusive curriculum is I've gone back
Speaker 2: and reminded myself of our history. You know, I read,
Speaker 2: I reread Eric Servini's book The Debiant War, which which
Speaker 2: tracks the the progress, let's call it, of Frank Cameny
Speaker 2: and his case against the United States. But in that book,
Speaker 2: it's also you know, he also covers Sylvia Rivera, he
Speaker 2: covers Marsha P. Johnson. And when I go back and
Speaker 2: I read about what they endured, what they were able
Speaker 2: to do in a moment when we weren't talking about pride,
Speaker 2: where the feeling that was overwhelming was shame. And it's
Speaker 2: what they're trying to do now. They're trying to shame
Speaker 2: us into silence again. They're trying to shove us back
Speaker 2: in the closet, trying to make us feel like we
Speaker 2: can't be who we are in public. When I go
Speaker 2: back and read about what they were able to do
Speaker 2: that they demanded that we'd be proud of who we
Speaker 2: are and that people respect us. When we were literally
Speaker 2: called deviance. We were, you know, we were still considered
Speaker 2: by psychiatrists as sick. Yep, right, yea, And yet they
Speaker 2: changed the conversation at a really dark time. We're not
Speaker 2: in that place. We could be. They're trying to get
Speaker 2: us back there, but we're not in that place now.
Speaker 2: So my hope lies in the fact that we know
Speaker 2: better now that we're armed with all that Frank and
Speaker 2: Sylvia and Marcia gave us. And my hope is that
Speaker 2: we rise up and use what they taught us to
Speaker 2: fight back to say no, we won't be silenced, No
Speaker 2: we won't be shamed about who we are, and yes,
Speaker 2: we will take care of our students, we will take
Speaker 2: care of our parents and teachers, and yes we will
Speaker 2: demand that we let our students live up to their
Speaker 2: potential because we all, we all gain something from that
Speaker 2: our true democracy. I love it.
Speaker 1: I love it. I am so appreciative for you, your voice,
Speaker 1: your advocacy. I think that Glisten made you know the
Speaker 1: that's choice in terms of having you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm glad you think so. Thank you. I mean,
Speaker 2: I honestly, honestly, they took it, took them, took me
Speaker 2: a minute to agree. But like I said, because I'm
Speaker 2: doing it with these amazing people, I'm more than willing
Speaker 2: to do it. And I don't have any kids. I'm
Speaker 2: about to turn fifty in a couple of months and
Speaker 2: I don't have any children. You know, I've been trying
Speaker 2: to deal with my career, but these students are mine. Yeah,
Speaker 2: these students are my generation that I have responsibility to,
Speaker 2: and so this is my way of stepping up and
Speaker 2: making sure that I'm leaving their schools and this place
Speaker 2: at least better than I found it.
Speaker 1: Amazing. Well, thank you, my friend, Wilson Cruz. You are brilliant, badass.
Speaker 1: You are just you make fifty, are almost fifty with
Speaker 1: my air quotes look pretty fucking good.
Speaker 2: So I'm trying. I'm trying.
Speaker 1: You give us all. HOLD appreciate you, and.
Speaker 2: I appreciate your voice. And I appreciate what you do
Speaker 2: with your show. I really do. Thank you for doing it,
Speaker 2: thank you for having these conversations and reminding us that
Speaker 2: we have power to and that we yes, you know what,
Speaker 2: and I'm proud to be woke as fuck. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 2: I love it all right, my darling.
Speaker 1: That is it for me today, dear friends on Woke
Speaker 1: a f as always, Power to the people and to
Speaker 1: all the people. Power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.