WEBVTT - How Dissociative Identity Disorder Works 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:04.200 Welcome to you stuff you should know from house Stuff 0:00:04.240 --> 0:00:12.520 Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm 0:00:12.600 --> 0:00:15.520 Josh Clark. There's Charles W. Choke Bryant, and there's no 0:00:16.800 --> 0:00:21.320 there's no one of my alters. No, he's his own dude. Okay, 0:00:22.320 --> 0:00:27.680 do you have alters? Okay? Do you know? Not that 0:00:27.720 --> 0:00:29.800 I know. I think we've each seen a bit of 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:33.040 an altar in each other. But that's just called that's 0:00:33.040 --> 0:00:35.959 being jerks every now and in bad mood. Yeah, that's 0:00:35.960 --> 0:00:40.600 a little different. I was on a forum about a 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:44.120 forum for people with the associative identity disorder and like 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:50.360 the from what I was reading, you sometimes you feel crowded. Um. 0:00:50.360 --> 0:00:53.040 Some people have like felt like they have had altars 0:00:53.120 --> 0:00:56.880 like their whole life, as long as they've been around interesting. Um, 0:00:57.160 --> 0:00:59.720 sometimes they don't. Like One of the entries I saw 0:00:59.840 --> 0:01:02.280 was like, does your altar have to have a name? 0:01:03.120 --> 0:01:05.640 And it was like, I don't necessarily think of them 0:01:05.680 --> 0:01:09.080 as people, and another person responded and so that that's 0:01:09.120 --> 0:01:11.520 often like an early stage of the process, and then 0:01:11.560 --> 0:01:14.600 over time is they become more pronounced, they end up 0:01:14.840 --> 0:01:21.880 adopting names, or it is uh, super moody or some 0:01:21.959 --> 0:01:27.920 other bad behavior that you say is disassociative identity disorder, 0:01:27.959 --> 0:01:30.000 and you give it a name, Well, you don't, your 0:01:30.040 --> 0:01:34.800 therapist does, yeah, or you might. Yeah. So it's controversial 0:01:34.920 --> 0:01:38.160 and we'll get to that. But um, I guess we 0:01:38.200 --> 0:01:40.640 should start off by saying that another name for this 0:01:40.760 --> 0:01:44.839 a more popular name, even though it's been uh since 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:49.040 n D I D. The original name was multiple personality 0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:53.040 disorder personality. Yeah. When I was reading this at first, 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:56.640 I was like, this sounds an awful lot like split personality. 0:01:56.960 --> 0:01:59.040 It is. It is. They just renamed it and we'll 0:01:59.080 --> 0:02:01.760 see pretty soon, which is kind of a good move 0:02:01.920 --> 0:02:06.600 because from what I can tell, it seems to be 0:02:07.160 --> 0:02:13.560 a real thing that underwent a period of intense exploitation 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:17.120 and abuse, so much so that now there's a lot 0:02:17.120 --> 0:02:20.240 of people who doubt that it's a real thing, but 0:02:20.560 --> 0:02:23.840 that there are still people out there who do suffer 0:02:23.880 --> 0:02:27.320 from it enough so that psychiatry has said, we need 0:02:27.360 --> 0:02:30.480 to change the name and then just focus on these 0:02:30.480 --> 0:02:32.840 people that really have this. Now. Did they change it 0:02:32.880 --> 0:02:36.880 because it had a stigma? Really? That was the only reason. Yeah. Yeah, 0:02:36.919 --> 0:02:40.799 there's this excellent article um on I O nine actually 0:02:41.280 --> 0:02:44.640 about UM. I think it's called like the myth of 0:02:44.760 --> 0:02:50.000 dissociative identity disorder and um, the myth of multiple personality disorder. 0:02:50.040 --> 0:02:52.440 Thank you they went old school, yeah, um, and the 0:02:52.520 --> 0:02:54.200 lady who wrote it did a really good job of 0:02:54.240 --> 0:02:58.600 explaining the controversy around it and also like the renewal 0:02:58.720 --> 0:03:01.320 of it as well, like how it became renewed. But yeah, 0:03:01.360 --> 0:03:08.160 it was because it was basically, um exploited and fictionalized 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:13.120 by the psychiatric community a few notable people that we'll 0:03:13.160 --> 0:03:15.239 get to all that though. Yeah, so, I mean everybody 0:03:15.320 --> 0:03:18.480 has heard of multiple personality disorder thanks to that that 0:03:18.560 --> 0:03:22.400 period of exploitation from the fifties to the eighties. Um, 0:03:22.440 --> 0:03:25.520 so you have probably a pretty good idea of the 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:29.000 concept behind it of the disorder. To begin with, it's 0:03:29.520 --> 0:03:35.840 m a single person has their normal, their original um, 0:03:35.920 --> 0:03:43.080 what's called their host personality, and sometimes, especially under periods 0:03:43.160 --> 0:03:49.600 of acute psychosocial stress, maybe confronted with stress or something 0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:51.640 they don't want to think about or talk about or whatever, 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:56.840 another one of their personalities will emerge, and they're generally 0:03:56.920 --> 0:04:01.600 tied to a trauma and early life that you may 0:04:01.600 --> 0:04:05.880 not even know about until you have therapy that out 0:04:06.320 --> 0:04:10.240 of your subconscious right. And Um, they believe that for 0:04:10.400 --> 0:04:14.080 dissociative identity disorder, when it does come about from the 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:18.880 result of a trauma, it comes about as a coping 0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:23.600 mechanism to protect the mind because the the host personality 0:04:23.720 --> 0:04:28.760 simply can't handle dealing with it. But there is some 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:33.440 aspect of that person which is characterized through another personality 0:04:33.680 --> 0:04:37.520 that can handle it. And so that personality will come 0:04:37.520 --> 0:04:43.400 out to handle those periods where um, the the person 0:04:43.520 --> 0:04:46.960 is confronted with those memories. Yeah. And it can express 0:04:47.000 --> 0:04:50.800 itself in different ways depending on, UM, how severe a 0:04:50.880 --> 0:04:53.720 disorder is. But generally, if you've ever seen the United 0:04:53.760 --> 0:04:57.400 States of terra, um you ever seen that? No, I 0:04:57.440 --> 0:04:59.720 know of it, but I've never seen an episode. Emily 0:04:59.800 --> 0:05:03.479 was into it. Um, we're talking about completely new people. 0:05:03.600 --> 0:05:06.839 But your behavior, your speech, you can be a different sex, 0:05:07.279 --> 0:05:11.520 you can have a different accent, um, different species. Yeah, 0:05:11.680 --> 0:05:15.200 you could be like a dog technically, UM. I think 0:05:15.200 --> 0:05:18.880 that's a little more rare. I would imagine. Yeah. Um, 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:22.240 And there is no timetable that's um, it doesn't necessarily 0:05:22.279 --> 0:05:26.479 happen like right after a trauma, can come out years later. Um. 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:31.520 And it just there's not an awareness necessarily. Uh, that's 0:05:31.520 --> 0:05:34.520 a big one. Well, there's not an awareness of the 0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:37.880 host person doesn't have an awareness of the altars coming out. 0:05:38.040 --> 0:05:41.960 Sometimes they do sometimes, but the altars usually are aware 0:05:41.960 --> 0:05:45.120 of the other altars and the host. And that was 0:05:45.200 --> 0:05:47.160 like it was in the United States of Tara. Yeah, 0:05:47.279 --> 0:05:51.080 sometimes the um the altars, which I don't know if 0:05:51.120 --> 0:05:53.400 we specifically said or not yet, but an altar is 0:05:53.440 --> 0:05:57.520 one of these non one of the other personalities within 0:05:57.560 --> 0:06:00.120 the host personality. Yeah, and there's there's usually at LEAs 0:06:00.120 --> 0:06:04.160 to others. There has to be to a host at 0:06:04.240 --> 0:06:07.960 least one other right, UM. But then it can go 0:06:08.080 --> 0:06:12.280 People have reported up to a hundred or beyond UM 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:14.640 and they can happen at the same time too. Yeah. 0:06:14.720 --> 0:06:18.880 That's another thing is they can switch between them um 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:23.479 pretty quickly. And these periods where the altars emerge can 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:27.359 take place over the course of days or weeks. Basically, 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:30.200 if you if you if there's a period where the 0:06:30.240 --> 0:06:32.919 altars are really kind of coming out and fluidly changing, 0:06:33.320 --> 0:06:37.039 that's a period of severe stress that that person is undergoing. Yeah, 0:06:37.120 --> 0:06:40.080 maybe calling back that previous drama. Maybe not. It might 0:06:40.120 --> 0:06:43.479 just be triggered by stress period and you said also 0:06:43.560 --> 0:06:46.360 that some sometimes a lot of times the altars are 0:06:46.400 --> 0:06:49.080 aware of each other. There's also been plenty of documented 0:06:49.120 --> 0:06:52.800 cases where the altars don't like each other. Sometimes they 0:06:52.800 --> 0:06:55.640 don't like the host um or they don't have much 0:06:55.640 --> 0:07:00.359 respect for the host uh, or like one of the 0:07:00.360 --> 0:07:02.599 other altars, they don't like how they deal with the 0:07:02.640 --> 0:07:05.920 host or deal with life or something like that, which 0:07:05.960 --> 0:07:09.880 is kind of neat because that that shows that these 0:07:09.920 --> 0:07:15.880 altars are aware that that the effects or the actions 0:07:15.920 --> 0:07:19.480 of the other altar or the host affects them. Yeah, 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:23.120 like they are somehow they understand that they're part of 0:07:23.160 --> 0:07:27.560 the whole. Well, you can be uh, the host person 0:07:27.600 --> 0:07:30.800 that just the regular Josh is a non drinker and 0:07:30.960 --> 0:07:34.880 you could have an alcoholic altar. Yeah, thinks the host 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.560 is a square And like, I can't wait to get 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:39.880 my hands on a drink because Josh is like he's 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:42.520 he won't go near the stuff. But now that I'm randy, 0:07:43.240 --> 0:07:46.120 I'm gonna buy that twelve pack of maister Brow. Yeah, 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:49.360 and very I don't think I've ever had a sip 0:07:49.360 --> 0:07:52.640 of maister Brow. I had a very long night with 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:56.640 it about fifteen years ago. Okay, so you might have 0:07:56.760 --> 0:08:00.960 undergone something that's similar to UM, the asociative disorder. We 0:08:00.960 --> 0:08:06.679 should say also when they renamed associative disorder, they also 0:08:06.840 --> 0:08:09.840 took all of these components that used to make up 0:08:09.920 --> 0:08:13.960 multiple personality disorder and split them. So now there's four 0:08:14.120 --> 0:08:20.240 associated disorders. UM. There is dissociative identity disorder, which is 0:08:20.280 --> 0:08:22.800 the most extreme, that's the one with altars and different 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:29.640 personalities coming out. And then there is UM dissociative amnesia, 0:08:30.520 --> 0:08:32.920 which is remember in our Amnicia podcasts who have brought 0:08:33.000 --> 0:08:37.640 this one about UM, where you just kind of forget 0:08:38.400 --> 0:08:41.920 a certain experience. Yeah, like I had this terrible car crash. 0:08:41.960 --> 0:08:43.439 I don't even remember it all right, And it was 0:08:43.520 --> 0:08:47.280 dissociative amnesia. That that's that where it's like you don't 0:08:47.320 --> 0:08:52.360 remember the terrible thing that happened to you. Um. There's 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:57.040 also dissociative fugue, which is where you basically just leave 0:08:57.120 --> 0:08:59.760 your life. You walk away from your life and maybe 0:08:59.800 --> 0:09:02.040 you seem like you're kind of out of it or whatever, 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:06.440 maybe you're under the influence of a different personality. UM. 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:09.760 It's it's not just like I'm not gonna come home 0:09:09.800 --> 0:09:12.600 any longer. It's like you left your life and are 0:09:12.600 --> 0:09:15.559 a different person. You're leading in different life in the 0:09:15.679 --> 0:09:19.480 last days, weeks, months, um, and then chuck. The fourth 0:09:19.480 --> 0:09:23.520 one is the personalization disorder, which is like you're you're 0:09:23.520 --> 0:09:27.199 watching your life as if you're viewing a movie. You're detached. 0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:30.280 And I think that one. I think these can work 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:32.480 together because I know that if you have d I D, 0:09:33.240 --> 0:09:36.960 you definitely have moments of experiencing uh that one. Yeah, 0:09:37.200 --> 0:09:39.520 they they like, even if you're just the host, you 0:09:39.600 --> 0:09:43.360 might feel like you're just watching yourself instead of being yourself. 0:09:43.559 --> 0:09:47.120 So the dissociative identity disorder diagnosis is almost has like 0:09:47.160 --> 0:09:51.360 split personalities fluid is switches between the different disorders, and 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:53.520 the one thing that they all have in common is 0:09:53.559 --> 0:09:56.160 that they all appear to be coping mechanisms to protect 0:09:56.240 --> 0:09:59.719 the mind from a trauma. They're basically saying like I'm 0:09:59.800 --> 0:10:03.080 check king out of my life or I'm detaching myself 0:10:03.080 --> 0:10:06.360 from my life, or I'm just not going to remember 0:10:06.440 --> 0:10:10.679 that part of my life right, or I am I 0:10:10.720 --> 0:10:14.520 can't handle my life and this other personality can. Yeah, 0:10:14.600 --> 0:10:16.920 And it's not it's not always just those things that 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:20.640 you know. Some of the side symptoms are can be hallucinations. 0:10:21.840 --> 0:10:24.080 A lot of times it leads to substance abuse or 0:10:24.080 --> 0:10:29.920 eating disorders, UM depressioning, anxiety, and mood swings obviously obvi. 0:10:30.679 --> 0:10:35.559 And uh, memory disturbance is either short or long term, right, 0:10:35.840 --> 0:10:40.199 it's kind of one of the keys. Probably UM and 0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:43.680 you apparently a person suffering from dissociative identity sort of 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:46.360 just kind of like you said, foggy is a really 0:10:46.360 --> 0:10:52.040 good descriptor of if not life, then their periods of UM, 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:55.080 this condition flaring up, I guess. Yeah, just their sense 0:10:55.120 --> 0:10:59.240 of place and time is just completely disrupted. It sounds awful. Yeah, 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:01.880 it is awful. Yeah, it is UM. Like I said, 0:11:01.920 --> 0:11:04.079 I haven't seen the United States of Terror, but apparently 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:06.640 it's a lot of comic effect out of Yeah, of course, 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:10.400 but if you have dissociative identity disorder, you'd likely have 0:11:10.720 --> 0:11:14.160 a really hard struggle in life. Yeah, and it shows 0:11:14.160 --> 0:11:16.200 some of that too. I mean, it's obviously for TV, 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:18.920 so there is some comedy with some of the altars, 0:11:18.920 --> 0:11:20.680 but it also shows the toll that it takes on 0:11:20.720 --> 0:11:24.679 the family and stuff like that. So, uh, this has 0:11:24.679 --> 0:11:27.440 been around for a little while. We've understood it its 0:11:27.480 --> 0:11:32.160 symptoms since at least the late eighteenth century. Yeah, and 0:11:32.160 --> 0:11:36.040 and some early scientists and researchers did a pretty good 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:39.439 job considering how long ago it was nailing it. Um. Well, 0:11:39.440 --> 0:11:45.079 it's a pretty like extravagant yeah case. Yeah. People sure, doctors, 0:11:45.280 --> 0:11:48.400 especially in the eighteen hundreds and seventeen hundreds, were like 0:11:49.000 --> 0:11:53.720 pretty excited about it, you know. Um, so demonic possession 0:11:53.840 --> 0:11:56.720 and weird things like that. Back in the day. A 0:11:56.720 --> 0:11:59.400 lot of many of those cases may have been things 0:11:59.760 --> 0:12:03.199 like these disorders. Uh, we just didn't know about it 0:12:03.280 --> 0:12:05.240 back then, so we just said someone was a hysteric 0:12:05.880 --> 0:12:09.640 or a witch and they killed them, yeah, or lock 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:11.800 them up, you know, in some room. Yeah. Um, but 0:12:11.920 --> 0:12:14.160 the first symptoms of the i D came around in 0:12:14.240 --> 0:12:18.480 nineteen and sev it's a long time ago. Yeah, a 0:12:18.520 --> 0:12:23.840 guy named eber Heart Gamelon No, yeah, Gamelon, Yeah, I 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:26.880 think it's g M E L I N. I would 0:12:27.320 --> 0:12:31.160 go silent GM that melon. Why don't they just spell 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:34.520 it right, that's just a guess. Yeah. Well, he was 0:12:34.559 --> 0:12:37.760 the first one to describe the conditions. He had a 0:12:37.760 --> 0:12:40.800 patient who was a middle class German woman who had 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:43.920 an altar who was a French aristocrat. So he hypnotized her, 0:12:44.040 --> 0:12:49.600 brought out the French aristocrat, the animal magnetized her or mesmerism. Yeah, 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:51.520 and we did an episode on hypnosis if you want 0:12:51.520 --> 0:12:54.480 to go check that out. Yeah, it's a very good one. Um. 0:12:54.520 --> 0:12:58.800 But up until the late eighteen hundreds, about eighteen eighty, 0:12:59.040 --> 0:13:01.600 they generally thought that what the deal was was that 0:13:01.679 --> 0:13:08.040 humans had a background consciousness and that was actually greater 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:12.520 than our regular primary consciousness. And when that background consciousness 0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:18.040 got sick, then that's what brought out the gray. Right, 0:13:18.120 --> 0:13:20.960 that's what mental illness came from. Pretty much. Basically, it 0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:25.000 was another way of putting the conscious in the subconscious 0:13:25.800 --> 0:13:28.680 because I mean, and it still today, people believe the 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:31.319 subconscious exists and that it's the one that's really running 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:33.640 the show. Realize, that's still the belief that it's greater 0:13:33.679 --> 0:13:36.120 as far as I know, certainly among Freudians. But yeah, 0:13:36.240 --> 0:13:39.760 that's true. I don't I don't think anyone's really discredited 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:43.600 the idea of the subconscious, all right, who knows, Well, 0:13:43.760 --> 0:13:47.080 sure we're gonna find out here. They're about the same 0:13:47.080 --> 0:13:50.160 time as that was going on, Um, they started to 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:53.240 tie it with childhood trauma, which is pretty spot on. 0:13:53.960 --> 0:14:00.480 And then a French patient named Louis viev Viva Vive. 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:03.319 He was twenty two years old and he had this 0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:07.440 is in the late eight had six personalities. Doctors just 0:14:07.480 --> 0:14:11.160 went crazy over this guy. Um, they didn't overlap with 0:14:11.200 --> 0:14:15.160 their memories. They thought that they were just hypnotic variations 0:14:15.160 --> 0:14:17.200 of each other. They didn't understand though, at the time, 0:14:17.240 --> 0:14:22.720 that they were actually completely separate personalities. They thought it 0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:26.320 was just all parts of Louis, which if you, if 0:14:26.360 --> 0:14:30.680 you really kind of follow the timeline of um, the 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:34.440 I d like they were. We've come back to that 0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:37.360 understanding of it. Yeah, I guess you're right. You know 0:14:38.000 --> 0:14:41.920 that it's not like just different personalities. It's just different 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:47.120 aspects of a single personality that are kind of given 0:14:47.200 --> 0:14:50.320 voice in a very literal like different voice in a 0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:52.960 literal way, right, you know. Yeah, that's a good point. 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:55.920 And then after that are actually around the same time. 0:14:55.960 --> 0:15:00.880 Pierre Janette, another French researcher, UM said, no, these are 0:15:00.960 --> 0:15:05.840 different personalities and it comes from a trauma that they suffered. Right, 0:15:05.960 --> 0:15:08.600 So he was kind of hit it early on. Yeah, 0:15:08.640 --> 0:15:10.920 he I guess he laid the groundwork for the understanding 0:15:11.000 --> 0:15:15.400 for the next century or so to come UM and 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:18.480 then Uh. It wasn't until nineteen o five that somebody 0:15:18.520 --> 0:15:22.280 claimed to cure a person with UM dissociative identity disorder 0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:27.000 again back then known as multiple personality disorder UM, a 0:15:27.040 --> 0:15:31.200 guy named Morton Prince Morty Prince not Martin, Prince Morton 0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:36.600 Prince UM. He basically said that using hypnosis he was 0:15:36.720 --> 0:15:41.640 able to UM coax out the very easily coax out 0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:44.880 the altars. Because this is something like very early on, 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:48.880 dissociative identity disorder and hypnosis were basically just went hand 0:15:48.880 --> 0:15:53.760 in hand, and UM alienists believed that they could use 0:15:53.840 --> 0:15:57.440 hypnosis to very easily draw out the altars, which they 0:15:57.480 --> 0:16:00.200 could who am I talking to now exactly? Or I 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:03.680 want to talk to you know this personality and then 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:08.320 start confronting those personalities and convincing them to integrate into 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:13.120 the host personality. And then once you had full successful integration, 0:16:13.400 --> 0:16:18.440 you had a reunited whole host person who was just 0:16:18.800 --> 0:16:22.840 one personality. But the the the key is is that 0:16:22.880 --> 0:16:29.040 they're using hypnosis, and hypnosis doesn't isn't real, right, So 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:31.880 like we have a huge clue here to a mystery 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:36.560 of what exactly is going on. But before anybody really 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:40.120 kind of faces that and confronts it um and starts 0:16:40.160 --> 0:16:44.080 to really truly treat associative identity disorder on its face 0:16:45.560 --> 0:16:48.360 or at its root. It treated it on its face. 0:16:48.880 --> 0:16:53.480 Psychiatry took a really like it just went all in 0:16:53.560 --> 0:16:59.160 and doubled down on the most um, the sexiest craziest 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:02.000 versions against come up with. And it did this in 0:17:02.040 --> 0:17:05.080 the fifties. Um, and we'll tell you how right after 0:17:05.119 --> 0:17:13.600 this message, so Chuck, psychiatry is about to say, multiple 0:17:13.800 --> 0:17:19.000 multiple personality disorder is um exactly what it looks like. 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:23.040 Some of these people are beyond looney. This guy over 0:17:23.040 --> 0:17:26.640 here as a hundred personalities and seven of them are dogs, 0:17:26.840 --> 0:17:31.000 different dogs. Can you believe this? And uh, these these 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:33.000 cases are going to start to grow by leaps and 0:17:33.000 --> 0:17:35.800 bounds in number. And it all can be traced back 0:17:35.840 --> 0:17:41.720 to a single book which is based on single case history. Yeah, 0:17:41.720 --> 0:17:44.440 well a couple of books. Yeah. But to start, it 0:17:44.520 --> 0:17:48.520 was all about Eve, that's right, the Three Faces of Eve. 0:17:49.440 --> 0:17:52.760 It was a book written in seven by two psychiatrists, 0:17:53.080 --> 0:17:56.280 and it was about a woman whose real name was 0:17:56.359 --> 0:17:59.560 Chris Costner size more, who may or may not be 0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:02.320 related to Kevin Costner. Neither I nor anybody on the 0:18:02.320 --> 0:18:05.080 internet appears to know for sure. Oh really I looked 0:18:05.160 --> 0:18:07.879 and nobody all there are questions. I can't believe I 0:18:07.920 --> 0:18:10.400 didn't think to look that up. Yeah Costner, Sure, there's 0:18:10.440 --> 0:18:16.000 like two of them, Kevin and who Chris Okay, Um, 0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:19.520 so she uh Chris Costner size More went um by 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:21.600 the name of Eva White, or at least that's what 0:18:21.640 --> 0:18:24.119 they called her in the book, although funnily I didn't 0:18:24.160 --> 0:18:26.280 look up to see whether or not she's related to 0:18:26.280 --> 0:18:30.880 Tom size More, just Kevin Costner. Yeah, did I say 0:18:30.880 --> 0:18:33.440 Eva White? I meant Eve White? Yeah, I might said Eve. 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:37.200 Either way, it's Eve White. And she was referred because 0:18:37.200 --> 0:18:41.400 she had headaches amnesia, and she worked with these two 0:18:41.400 --> 0:18:46.040 psychiatrists and a couple of altars emerged and they wrote 0:18:46.040 --> 0:18:51.000 a book. Well they supposedly cured her and reintegrated them 0:18:51.080 --> 0:18:55.240 back into one host person. But they wrote a book 0:18:55.280 --> 0:18:59.120 really quickly that exploded on the scene, super popular, made 0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:01.679 them a ton of money. Uh, there was a big 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:07.520 blockbuster movie. Um, it was just it took over, well 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:10.320 not took over, but it made a huge splash in 0:19:11.600 --> 0:19:16.399 just people's consciousness about what this is like for the 0:19:16.440 --> 0:19:19.120 first time. It was everyone you know, like you said, 0:19:19.160 --> 0:19:22.560 it's kind of super sexy and interesting and people were 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:26.600 captivated by this new disease. And this Eve woman who 0:19:26.640 --> 0:19:31.680 was really three women and one right there was Eve 0:19:33.080 --> 0:19:36.480 Peggy and I can't remember the other one, but um 0:19:36.600 --> 0:19:39.920 one was like a good girl, uh, the other one 0:19:40.040 --> 0:19:43.159 was like a bad girl or a tough girl. And 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:46.199 then the host was just kind of a combination of 0:19:46.240 --> 0:19:50.800 the two. Yeah, and she's still alive, she still is well. 0:19:50.920 --> 0:19:57.320 She um so that this doctor, um was it thig Pen. Yeah, 0:19:57.560 --> 0:20:02.639 doctor Thigpen. Um, it was treating her Corbett Thigpen and 0:20:02.680 --> 0:20:08.880 a colleague. I believe his name is Henny Cleckly. Seriously, 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:13.920 so um Thigpen was the one who wrote, like really 0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:15.720 went off the deep end with the book and then 0:20:15.960 --> 0:20:19.320 sold the ladies life rights without her approval to Hollywood, 0:20:20.080 --> 0:20:22.760 and they made this story or this movie and like 0:20:22.800 --> 0:20:26.280 you said, it was Fox, Yeah it was, and it was. 0:20:26.359 --> 0:20:28.360 It made a pretty big splash, both the book and 0:20:28.480 --> 0:20:32.119 the movie. Um. And she came out and wrote a 0:20:32.119 --> 0:20:35.080 book called I'm Eve and said, Dude, this guy is 0:20:35.119 --> 0:20:40.399 a total fraud, Like, yes, I do have multiple personalities, 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:44.440 but they didn't cure me. Like this guy kept insisting 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:47.399 I was cured. It didn't work. He uh, he shot 0:20:47.440 --> 0:20:50.040 me up with sodium pentethal and like just used the 0:20:50.160 --> 0:20:55.200 power of suggestion. Um. And he's just a huckster, basically 0:20:55.640 --> 0:20:59.040 he was after the story. UM. But here I am 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:03.359 left with my conditions still. Yeah. And she had reportedly suffered, 0:21:03.480 --> 0:21:06.399 UM witnessed a bad accident and witness to deaths as 0:21:06.440 --> 0:21:11.119 a child, and that's where hers was born. So UM 0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:15.840 that set the stage that for popular consciousness to UM 0:21:16.119 --> 0:21:20.320 kind of come to understand multiple personality disorder, which again 0:21:20.359 --> 0:21:22.840 that's what it was called at the time. UM. And 0:21:22.880 --> 0:21:24.760 I mean it was all over the place, like people 0:21:24.840 --> 0:21:28.680 just people were just aware of it, whereas they hadn't 0:21:28.680 --> 0:21:32.960 been before. UM. And it was kind of like a 0:21:33.040 --> 0:21:35.840 one two punch. You had all about Eve and the fifties, 0:21:36.480 --> 0:21:40.879 and then about fifteen years later you had Sybil. And 0:21:40.920 --> 0:21:43.399 Sybil was the one that blew this thing wide open. 0:21:44.520 --> 0:21:47.359 It just happened, I guess, to arrive at a time 0:21:47.400 --> 0:21:54.240 when UM America was really ready to UM undergo or 0:21:54.359 --> 0:21:59.040 be party to psychological exploitation like big time. Yeah. And 0:21:59.160 --> 0:22:02.200 in three is when Sybil the book came out, UM 0:22:02.720 --> 0:22:08.080 written by Oh uh, let's see Flora Rita Schreiber about 0:22:08.240 --> 0:22:13.440 her treatment with psychiatrist Cornelia Wilbur and about the treatment 0:22:13.520 --> 0:22:16.080 of the real name was Shirley Mason, and they kept 0:22:16.119 --> 0:22:19.520 that a secret for many years, Sybil, Yeah, to protect 0:22:19.520 --> 0:22:23.840 her her identity. Um, but eventually the name came out. Well, 0:22:23.880 --> 0:22:26.600 she died in the nineties. Yeah, she died ninety breast cancer. 0:22:27.280 --> 0:22:32.120 But um, she had sixteen personalities. And like I said, 0:22:32.119 --> 0:22:34.200 Sally Field played her in the movie. It was a 0:22:34.240 --> 0:22:36.639 big hit. I remember my mom reading the book. It 0:22:36.720 --> 0:22:39.880 was all the rage in the seventies. Yeah, it was huge, huge, 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:46.040 And um, she was actually an artist, a painter, and 0:22:46.080 --> 0:22:49.000 like taught painting too, I think. But they found a 0:22:49.080 --> 0:22:51.359 hundred and three paintings in her basement after she died, 0:22:51.960 --> 0:22:55.720 and she only signed the ones that she felt like 0:22:55.760 --> 0:22:58.320 she the host had painted, Like, she wouldn't sign the 0:22:58.320 --> 0:23:00.879 ones that an altar had paint it. So many of 0:23:00.920 --> 0:23:02.679 them are unsigned. But it's when you look at it, 0:23:02.680 --> 0:23:05.720 it's really like they're all different, Like some are like realists, 0:23:05.920 --> 0:23:10.640 some are abstract, some are impressionistic. Really all over the map, 0:23:11.119 --> 0:23:13.520 and it's just I don't know, kind of a testament 0:23:13.560 --> 0:23:15.520 to like how real this can be? Is there a 0:23:15.560 --> 0:23:18.879 website that hosts all of them? Uh? I don't know. 0:23:18.920 --> 0:23:20.840 I think if you look just look up, you know, 0:23:21.040 --> 0:23:24.560 hidden paintings of Sybil, you can probably buy them. And 0:23:24.600 --> 0:23:27.720 that would be what s I B y L is? 0:23:27.720 --> 0:23:31.080 How they spelled that? No s y B I L Yeah? 0:23:31.320 --> 0:23:35.439 Um so Sybils the smash hit. It's based on the wave, 0:23:35.560 --> 0:23:38.119 the first wave that was brought about by all about 0:23:38.160 --> 0:23:41.399 Eve and the public is um just fully aware of 0:23:41.480 --> 0:23:45.280 multiple personality disorders like these two are like the cream 0:23:45.320 --> 0:23:47.520 of the crop. There were tons of made for TV 0:23:47.680 --> 0:23:52.120 movies and um Donna Hue episodes and all sorts of 0:23:52.320 --> 0:23:57.000 just chatter about multiple personality disorder, and all of a sudden, 0:23:57.880 --> 0:24:01.360 the cases go from about two hundred in the medical 0:24:01.440 --> 0:24:06.480 literature to suddenly eight thousand after the movie Sybyl comes out, 0:24:07.520 --> 0:24:11.879 and it seems like every psychiatrist has a patient with 0:24:12.000 --> 0:24:17.600 multiple personality disorder. And because of all this sensationalism that 0:24:17.640 --> 0:24:20.879 went along with it, there are fortunately a caudra of 0:24:21.119 --> 0:24:25.080 serious psychiatrists and psychologists who said, wait a minute, what, 0:24:25.359 --> 0:24:28.520 like what what what's going on here? Like movies aren't 0:24:28.520 --> 0:24:33.879 supposed to trigger outbreaks of disorders. Some people explain it 0:24:33.920 --> 0:24:37.119 away by saying, well, there, these people may have been 0:24:37.400 --> 0:24:40.520 suffering like this. They didn't have a name to associate 0:24:40.560 --> 0:24:42.399 with her. The movie gave him the name so they 0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:44.000 could go to the doctor and speak to it and 0:24:44.040 --> 0:24:48.200 be treated. Right. Um, that is one explanation. The problem 0:24:48.280 --> 0:24:52.760 is the explanation that this was a real phenomenon and 0:24:52.840 --> 0:24:56.680 not like some sort of um, what are they call, 0:24:57.320 --> 0:25:01.919 I guess outbreak of maths hysteria a little bit? Yeah, um, 0:25:02.000 --> 0:25:03.960 And this is a no way to diminish anybody who's 0:25:03.960 --> 0:25:07.119 suffering mentally in any way. Yeah, yeah, of course. But 0:25:07.200 --> 0:25:09.960 I'm talking about the specific moment in history in the 0:25:10.040 --> 0:25:13.119 seventies in the West where there was an outbreak of 0:25:13.200 --> 0:25:17.720 multiple personality disorder cases. Um. The idea that it was 0:25:17.760 --> 0:25:23.440 a real thing was definitely undermined by the civil case itself, which, 0:25:24.240 --> 0:25:29.680