WEBVTT - Penny Lane

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<v Speaker 1>Pushkin under Milk would by Dylan Thomas.

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<v Speaker 2>My mom would be doing the isling and she'd have

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<v Speaker 2>a play on, play for Today or something said her

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<v Speaker 2>with her listen, who yes, love?

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<v Speaker 3>What are the neighbor?

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<v Speaker 2>Paul? She puts up, never sort of mannaged. She didn't

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<v Speaker 2>have to stay with her mother.

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<v Speaker 4>One his mother did the ironing. Young Paul McCartney would

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<v Speaker 4>lie in front of the radio and conjure up images

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<v Speaker 4>in his mind.

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<v Speaker 2>And the characters, you know, they were also well for

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<v Speaker 2>trade love Hush, I'm a widow now.

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<v Speaker 4>From listening to the radio came an early understanding of

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<v Speaker 4>how to draw a character so precisely that a blind

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<v Speaker 4>person could see him.

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<v Speaker 2>Do you just get into it? You can see the characters.

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<v Speaker 5>It's as if you're in the room with them.

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<v Speaker 4>I'm Paul muldoon. I'm a poet, a lover of not

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<v Speaker 4>only the lyric poem, but the song lyric. Over the

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<v Speaker 4>past several years, I've got to spend time with one

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<v Speaker 4>of the greatest songwriters of our era.

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<v Speaker 2>And will you look at me? I'm going on to it.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm actually a performer.

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<v Speaker 4>That is, Sir Paul McCartney. We worked together on a

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<v Speaker 4>book Looking at the lyrics of more than one hundred

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<v Speaker 4>and fifty of his songs, and we recorded many hours

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<v Speaker 4>of our conversation.

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<v Speaker 2>She is a songwriter. My god, well that crypt homie.

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<v Speaker 4>This is McCartney, A life in lyrics, a masterclass, a memoir,

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<v Speaker 4>and an improvised journey with one of the most iconic

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<v Speaker 4>figures in popular music. In this episode, Penny Lane.

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<v Speaker 2>I mainly remember it as being where I would I

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<v Speaker 2>would get a boss to Penny Lane in order to

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<v Speaker 2>go to John's house.

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<v Speaker 6>No anonymous conurbation this but Liverpool, vital city and port

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<v Speaker 6>on the northwest Mersey, forty three square miles of teeming life.

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<v Speaker 4>Throughout my meetings with Paul McCartney, it's become clear to

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<v Speaker 4>me just how important his childhood and Liverpool has been

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<v Speaker 4>to his songwriting career.

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<v Speaker 6>Has this Liverpool sprung from its people? I have the

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<v Speaker 6>people sprung from Liverpool.

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<v Speaker 2>It was a place that featured very much in my

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<v Speaker 2>life and in John's life. It was near a church

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<v Speaker 2>where I was at Choie Corystal.

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<v Speaker 6>What is there in the Northwest to create this exciting atmosphere.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot of stuff happened there. I use that terminus

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<v Speaker 2>a lot to go to John's, for instance, and in

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<v Speaker 2>there it's all it's the scenery. This is quite accurate.

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<v Speaker 2>And the nice thing is writing is John knew exactly

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<v Speaker 2>where I was talking about Penny Lane.

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<v Speaker 7>There was a barn showing photographs of every.

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<v Speaker 8>Head he's had the pleasure to know, and all the

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<v Speaker 8>people back Man Stubborn sell.

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<v Speaker 4>On one level, Penny Lane paints a picture of an

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<v Speaker 4>ordinary suburban street with a barber, a farman, a banker,

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<v Speaker 4>and a nurse selling flowers. But somehow, just below the surface,

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<v Speaker 4>everything is a little strange.

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<v Speaker 2>So I'd say, Penny Land, there's a barber showing photographs.

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<v Speaker 2>I thought that's rather clever, because it's like a it's

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<v Speaker 2>like a gallery showing paintings. It's an exhibition in this window.

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<v Speaker 2>And you and I we know that. We just go

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<v Speaker 2>by and say, I'll have one of them. I'll have

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<v Speaker 2>a Tony Curtis, all have a crew cut or whatever.

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<v Speaker 2>But I like the idea that he's showing photographs. So really,

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<v Speaker 2>all I'm saying here is there's a barber shop and

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<v Speaker 2>he's got photos of hercuts in his window. But that

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<v Speaker 2>would be a little too mundane. But there is a

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<v Speaker 2>barber shop still there change hands, changed hand. It was

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<v Speaker 2>called Bioletti. The guy was Bioletti, mister Italian barber with

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<v Speaker 2>the stripe pole outside and everything, and so we knew that.

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<v Speaker 2>So when we evoked it later in this song, it

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<v Speaker 2>was a pleasant thing for John and I to share again.

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<v Speaker 4>Penny Lane was written while the Beatles were working on

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<v Speaker 4>the Sergeant Pepper album. The band had stopped during and

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<v Speaker 4>was putting all their energy into recording and working in

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<v Speaker 4>the studio. John, George and Ringo had been experimenting with

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<v Speaker 4>LSD and finally in the fall of nineteen sixty six

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<v Speaker 4>convinced Paul to try it as well. The inner pictures

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<v Speaker 4>and characters from the street of McCartney's childhood are projected

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<v Speaker 4>with hallucinogenic clarity.

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<v Speaker 2>My drive past it to this day, regularly showing everyone

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<v Speaker 2>of the barbers, the bankers, the firemen, the church. I

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<v Speaker 2>used to sing in and here's where the girls it

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<v Speaker 2>with a tray of poppies as I waited for the boss.

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<v Speaker 4>Selling puppies on Remembrance Day to honor the armed forces

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<v Speaker 4>of the Commonwealth. It was common to see people selling poppies.

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<v Speaker 4>The pretty nurse who sells them from a tray is

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<v Speaker 4>drawn from real life, but she also has this strange

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<v Speaker 4>feeling that she's in a play.

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<v Speaker 2>Now she.

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<v Speaker 9>Any Funnily, you're not a lot of Americans thought she

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<v Speaker 9>was selling puppies.

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<v Speaker 2>I say puppies. There's another interesting image, a tray full

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<v Speaker 2>of puppies, and now she's signed poppies. I know she

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<v Speaker 2>feels as interesting a play she is anyway. Yes, that's

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<v Speaker 2>that's very sort the sixties.

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<v Speaker 10>It is, and that's what they would call and polite circles,

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<v Speaker 10>a meta text. That is, it's a description of one

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<v Speaker 10>fact is happening in the song that she is in

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<v Speaker 10>a plane.

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<v Speaker 2>There's characters. There's a bunch of characters, and you know,

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<v Speaker 2>I'm proud of the way certain lines just fell out,

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<v Speaker 2>But in retrospect were sort of good lines, like the

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<v Speaker 2>the fireman who's cleaning his fire engine.

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<v Speaker 8>He likes to keep his fire and clean. It's a

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<v Speaker 8>clean machine.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a clean machine. I just you know, those kind

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<v Speaker 2>of phrases sort of stick. It's a clean machine.

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<v Speaker 10>Amusing, it's funny.

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<v Speaker 2>It's there's something slightly ominous. So the old stuff that happened,

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<v Speaker 2>they actually that the fire station is a little further away, right,

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<v Speaker 2>but like any good play, you put it all in

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<v Speaker 2>the wrong place.

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<v Speaker 10>But one of the wonderful things here we established the

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<v Speaker 10>barber and we leave him, but then we come.

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<v Speaker 2>Back to him. Yeah, which is extremely.

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<v Speaker 10>Effective in that we think, well, I know that guy.

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<v Speaker 10>So there he is.

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<v Speaker 7>Again another customers. We see the banks the way to

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<v Speaker 7>be trendy.

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<v Speaker 10>It's a way of bringing him the listener, I suppose,

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<v Speaker 10>isn't it.

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I'm not consciously unconsciously it's it's kind of film.

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<v Speaker 10>It is exactly.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, it's like we are. We thought we'd forgotten

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<v Speaker 2>him because we are now going on to the banker.

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<v Speaker 2>Now the banker. I mean, I've never seen any children

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<v Speaker 2>laugh at him, so's I've never seen him. I've seen

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<v Speaker 2>his bank. I had no idea that the children laughing

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<v Speaker 2>and the mac and the pouring rain, it's all fiction.

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<v Speaker 7>On the corner is a banker, the moticon, the little

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<v Speaker 7>children having him behind his man and the banking them

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<v Speaker 7>wears a man in.

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<v Speaker 2>The boring rain.

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<v Speaker 4>And here perhaps a brief explanation is needed. A mac

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<v Speaker 4>is what the British called a raincoat, after Charles Macintosh,

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<v Speaker 4>who patented a waterproof material for raincoats. So the banker

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<v Speaker 4>never wears a mac. It's all very strange.

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<v Speaker 10>It's a place, it's so play.

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<v Speaker 2>It's a little player, yes, okay.

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<v Speaker 4>The stories of Penny Lane appear to McCartney not just

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<v Speaker 4>visually but through sound. Penny Lane is not just in

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<v Speaker 4>his eyes, but also in his ears. Oral storytelling had

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<v Speaker 4>been a large influence on his songwriting ever since he

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<v Speaker 4>was a kid and would lie on the carpet listening

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<v Speaker 4>to the radio.

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<v Speaker 2>You would lie on the carpet and the radio would

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<v Speaker 2>be in front of you, and you should be in it.

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<v Speaker 4>One of the plays a twelve year old McCartney might

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<v Speaker 4>have listened to was a nineteen fifty four play by

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<v Speaker 4>the poet Dylan Thomas called Under milk Wood, which portrays

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<v Speaker 4>the fictitious time of Clarigub.

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<v Speaker 11>It is springing, moonless night in the small town star

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<v Speaker 11>last and bible black. The cobble street silent, and the

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<v Speaker 11>hunch cutters and rabbits would limping invisible down to the

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<v Speaker 11>slow bless slow black crow, blessed fishing boat, bubbing sea.

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<v Speaker 4>As the time of Claragub slowly awakens, the narrative weaves

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<v Speaker 4>in and out of the thoughts of its inhabitants.

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<v Speaker 12>I must put by pajamas in the drawer marked pajamas.

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<v Speaker 12>I must take my cold back, which is good for me.

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<v Speaker 12>I must wear my flannel violon to ward off by attic.

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<v Speaker 12>I must dress behind the curtain and put on my apron.

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<v Speaker 12>I must blow my note.

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<v Speaker 2>In the garden. You've already written eleanor Rigby. Oh did

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<v Speaker 2>you feel mean?

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<v Speaker 10>Would you have felt at all that you were maybe

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<v Speaker 10>going back a little bit to that territory or no?

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<v Speaker 2>I like the rise area.

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<v Speaker 10>There's an under milkwood aspect to both eleanor Rigby and this,

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<v Speaker 10>and to some extent, isn't there the character.

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<v Speaker 2>Characters characters as a bunch of characters. This is the

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<v Speaker 2>kind of thing I liked. It still is.

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<v Speaker 13>I must take my salts, which our nature's braided.

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<v Speaker 2>I must spoil the drinking water because the Germans.

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<v Speaker 13>I must make my verb tea which is free from tannin.

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<v Speaker 2>And have a charcoal biscuit, which is good for me.

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<v Speaker 13>I may smoke one pipe of asthma mixtures in the woodshell.

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<v Speaker 4>At the time of writing Penny Lane, Paul McCartney had

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<v Speaker 4>become very interested in the London art scene. He was

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<v Speaker 4>also dating the actress Jane Asher, which might have influenced

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<v Speaker 4>the theatrical nature of the song. One of the people

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<v Speaker 4>in their circle was the great playwright Harold Pinter, Pinter

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<v Speaker 4>whose characters often have such complex psychologies.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it was this ear or two in our

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<v Speaker 2>lives when if you're going to write a play like

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<v Speaker 2>these characters, I'd rather have it be like a Pinter

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<v Speaker 2>play than something a bit straighter, right, you know, I

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<v Speaker 2>like the idea that they're a bit wonky, all these characters.

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<v Speaker 2>There's just something a little bit strange about them.

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<v Speaker 10>And you would have seen already some Pinter.

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<v Speaker 2>Well, you know, by the time we've written this, we've

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<v Speaker 2>been down in London for a while and I was

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<v Speaker 2>going out with an actress, so we would go regularly

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<v Speaker 2>to the National Theater. How would you have met Pinter

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<v Speaker 2>at that time? Chance he was on the social She

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<v Speaker 2>was on the scene with Vivian merchant Is actress wife. Yes. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>we went to a party at third place we lived

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<v Speaker 2>in Regis Park, and enduring image.

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<v Speaker 9>Was the bathtub was filled with bottles of champagne. So

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<v Speaker 9>and people like Kenneth Tyne and very luminarus like that.

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<v Speaker 9>Would there be pinted Wesker would be there.

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<v Speaker 2>It was very nice just talking to these sort of

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<v Speaker 2>people on the London scene because I was one of

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<v Speaker 2>those people on the under see me and James, She

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<v Speaker 2>being the actress, May being the musician. It was a

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<v Speaker 2>nice time to be around. With an invite, you would

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<v Speaker 2>get painters, sculptors, actors, comedians, musicians, playwrights and just that

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<v Speaker 2>all these people who just were in on your scene.

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<v Speaker 10>Would do you think you would have been conscious as

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<v Speaker 10>you were writing this that this is maybe something that

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<v Speaker 10>Harold Pinter might read.

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<v Speaker 2>Maybe maybe certainly influenced by all of that. Yeah, and

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<v Speaker 2>I think not not that specifically.

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<v Speaker 10>No, I understand someone like someone like that, someone smart musically,

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<v Speaker 10>someone smart.

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<v Speaker 4>While Paul McCartney aspired to be recognized by the serious

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<v Speaker 4>artists and writers of the day, the Beatles also nurtured

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<v Speaker 4>a sense of playfulness in the studio which to this

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<v Speaker 4>day seems totally original.

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<v Speaker 2>And you're playing, you know, it's very important to play.

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<v Speaker 2>People say to me why he works so hard to

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<v Speaker 2>say I don't work music. I play it. And you know,

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<v Speaker 2>whilst that is a kind of kind of clip statement,

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<v Speaker 2>I say it because it's really true. Sure, I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>obviously in the two meanings of playing music, playing an instrument,

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<v Speaker 2>but playing it is really important. The ones who can

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<v Speaker 2>play almost success.

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<v Speaker 10>I mean playing the sense of playing playing games.

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<v Speaker 2>Look about mucking about it. You know, it's a good

0:16:16.504 --> 0:16:23.424
<v Speaker 2>thing us.

0:16:30.864 --> 0:16:33.144
<v Speaker 7>Somebody could do that, you know, if they suddenly decide

0:16:33.184 --> 0:16:33.824
<v Speaker 7>that it needs it.

0:16:33.944 --> 0:16:41.384
<v Speaker 2>There So this idea of just playing around it's good.

0:16:41.664 --> 0:16:45.264
<v Speaker 2>And in the music too, you know, we've had a

0:16:45.464 --> 0:16:50.024
<v Speaker 2>very sort of cavalier attitude to a lot of things,

0:16:50.224 --> 0:17:01.584
<v Speaker 2>very sort of from offhand thing. I mean, I just

0:17:01.704 --> 0:17:03.864
<v Speaker 2>what came to mind that. I was just thinking when

0:17:03.864 --> 0:17:08.384
<v Speaker 2>I do Petty Lane, there's this lovely solo that I

0:17:08.464 --> 0:17:11.584
<v Speaker 2>knew I want to too. And I talked to George

0:17:11.624 --> 0:17:14.264
<v Speaker 2>Martin about a piccolo trumpet that I'd seen in the

0:17:14.344 --> 0:17:24.584
<v Speaker 2>Brandenburg Concerto the night before, and I said, what was that?

0:17:24.664 --> 0:17:29.344
<v Speaker 2>And he said, and so we got the top player.

0:17:29.584 --> 0:17:33.624
<v Speaker 2>I called David Mason in the studio and I just

0:17:34.184 --> 0:17:37.384
<v Speaker 2>remember thinking that we didn't know what he was going

0:17:37.504 --> 0:17:40.944
<v Speaker 2>to play. We hadn't written it, but he was booked

0:17:40.984 --> 0:17:44.624
<v Speaker 2>and he was sitting there, so you'd better get something together. Mate.

0:17:45.224 --> 0:17:49.464
<v Speaker 2>So we just I just Saidee said, wait a minute

0:17:49.944 --> 0:17:50.864
<v Speaker 2>and wrote it down.

0:17:51.984 --> 0:17:52.984
<v Speaker 8>I just did a little.

0:17:54.304 --> 0:17:58.744
<v Speaker 2>I played a ridiculously high note, and then David Mason said, well,

0:17:58.784 --> 0:18:01.984
<v Speaker 2>that's out of the range of even the piccolo trumpet,

0:18:02.584 --> 0:18:06.024
<v Speaker 2>which is a high, high high trumpet, sets out of

0:18:06.024 --> 0:18:08.144
<v Speaker 2>the range, and I wish we had a little play

0:18:08.184 --> 0:18:11.664
<v Speaker 2>for moment. We just looked at each other and he's

0:18:11.704 --> 0:18:14.064
<v Speaker 2>sort of I'm giving him a kind of yeah, but

0:18:14.664 --> 0:18:18.304
<v Speaker 2>you could probably do it. Smile, and he's given me back,

0:18:18.584 --> 0:18:22.464
<v Speaker 2>you passtward smile kind of yeah, I probably could.

0:18:39.944 --> 0:18:42.384
<v Speaker 4>Even though the song took a lot of its inspiration

0:18:42.584 --> 0:18:46.744
<v Speaker 4>from the non visual medium of radio, in early nineteen

0:18:46.824 --> 0:18:50.664
<v Speaker 4>sixty seven, Penny Lane was one of the first songs

0:18:51.224 --> 0:18:55.424
<v Speaker 4>ever to have been accompanied by a music video. The

0:18:55.544 --> 0:19:01.864
<v Speaker 4>Swedish director Peter Goldman, using techniques from underground filmmaking, took

0:19:01.944 --> 0:19:04.264
<v Speaker 4>the promotional film format.

0:19:04.184 --> 0:19:05.384
<v Speaker 10>To a new level.

0:19:06.184 --> 0:19:12.024
<v Speaker 4>Fast montage editing shows Lane and the band members dressed

0:19:12.184 --> 0:19:17.144
<v Speaker 4>in red du licks riding horses through a dreamlike landscape.

0:19:17.824 --> 0:19:19.064
<v Speaker 2>But it's the.

0:19:19.344 --> 0:19:23.464
<v Speaker 4>Enduring power of radio to allow listeners to create their

0:19:23.704 --> 0:19:28.184
<v Speaker 4>own images. The shimmers at the heart of Penny Lane.

0:19:28.704 --> 0:19:31.624
<v Speaker 2>What I love is you get your own picture. This

0:19:31.784 --> 0:19:34.424
<v Speaker 2>is why when they came to film Sergeant Pepper with

0:19:34.584 --> 0:19:37.544
<v Speaker 2>the Beg's, I said, this is never gonna work because

0:19:37.664 --> 0:19:43.264
<v Speaker 2>everyone has their own image from Sergeant Pepper the album,

0:19:44.024 --> 0:19:46.144
<v Speaker 2>and so if you select one.

0:19:46.024 --> 0:19:49.824
<v Speaker 3>Image, it's never going to be enough because your vision

0:19:50.144 --> 0:19:52.704
<v Speaker 3>is different from mine. I often think this from my

0:19:52.824 --> 0:19:57.544
<v Speaker 3>audience is I think every single person in those forty

0:19:57.624 --> 0:20:00.264
<v Speaker 3>thousand people is having a different experience.

0:20:00.824 --> 0:20:05.024
<v Speaker 2>I'm singing this song. Someone thinks it's sad, someone thinks

0:20:05.064 --> 0:20:09.984
<v Speaker 2>it's dramatic, someone thinks it's funny, and fascinated by the

0:20:10.144 --> 0:20:19.344
<v Speaker 2>idea that everyone's perception is completely different. Now behind the eyes.

0:20:19.104 --> 0:20:22.264
<v Speaker 11>And secrets of the dreamers in the street Rocked to

0:20:22.464 --> 0:20:25.504
<v Speaker 11>Sleep by the Sea, Steve tip.

0:20:25.384 --> 0:20:29.504
<v Speaker 13>Bits and Topsy turveys, bobs and button tops, bags and bones,

0:20:29.944 --> 0:20:33.784
<v Speaker 13>ash and grind and dender for nail perries, sliva and

0:20:33.944 --> 0:20:35.744
<v Speaker 13>snowplates and bolted beads.

0:20:35.744 --> 0:20:41.584
<v Speaker 2>The breed for the imagination radio was great and as

0:20:41.664 --> 0:20:46.464
<v Speaker 2>I met friends like John George, we all harked back

0:20:47.304 --> 0:20:50.104
<v Speaker 2>to that it was very much our period. We grew

0:20:50.184 --> 0:20:51.104
<v Speaker 2>up without television.

0:20:51.464 --> 0:21:05.944
<v Speaker 8>Teddy Skies, I said.

0:21:24.664 --> 0:21:38.064
<v Speaker 4>A Penny Lane was released in nineteen sixty seven on

0:21:38.304 --> 0:21:43.144
<v Speaker 4>a double A single along with Strawberry Fields Forever.

0:21:43.824 --> 0:21:52.544
<v Speaker 14>We're so sorry, local elms. We're so sorry if we

0:21:52.784 --> 0:21:54.304
<v Speaker 14>caused you anything.

0:21:55.984 --> 0:21:59.704
<v Speaker 4>In the next episode, Paul McCartney pays tribute to his

0:21:59.824 --> 0:22:01.064
<v Speaker 4>Liverpool origins.

0:22:01.664 --> 0:22:03.664
<v Speaker 2>It was a cut up from me. It was so

0:22:03.984 --> 0:22:07.544
<v Speaker 2>rich and I think a lot of what I am,

0:22:07.704 --> 0:22:11.584
<v Speaker 2>a lot of what I write. What I think is that.

0:22:17.744 --> 0:22:22.424
<v Speaker 4>Uncle Albert the pis artist. Next time on McCartney A

0:22:22.584 --> 0:22:30.184
<v Speaker 4>Life in Lyrics. McCartney A Life in Lyrics is a

0:22:30.264 --> 0:22:35.624
<v Speaker 4>co production between iHeartMedia, NPL and Pushkin Industries.