1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:01,320 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening. 2 00:00:01,600 --> 00:00:05,320 Speaker 2: This is the best of with Clay Travis and Buck Sexton. 3 00:00:05,720 --> 00:00:08,760 Speaker 2: Welcome back in Clay Travis Buck Sexton Show. 4 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:09,639 Speaker 1: Okay Buck. 5 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:16,079 Speaker 2: Reports are that Sununu, the governor of New Hampshire, is 6 00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,960 Speaker 2: going to endorse Nicky Hayley. We know that Kim Reynolds. 7 00:00:19,960 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 2: You had Kim Reynolds on the show. I think just 8 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,040 Speaker 2: a couple of weeks ago. I think I was out 9 00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:26,640 Speaker 2: for that day for whatever reason. But Kim Reynolds, governor 10 00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 2: of Iowa, has endorsed Ron DeSantis. If you look at 11 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 2: the polling, it seems like Ron de Santis is likely 12 00:00:35,320 --> 00:00:39,080 Speaker 2: to come in second in Iowa. And if you look 13 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 2: at the polling, it now seems like Nicky Haley is 14 00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:44,800 Speaker 2: likely to come in second in New Hampshire. Again, this 15 00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:49,240 Speaker 2: is looking out six weeks out, seven weeks out. If 16 00:00:49,320 --> 00:00:53,559 Speaker 2: that happens, if what is expected to happen happens, that 17 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 2: is Trump wins in Iowa and New Hampshire and two 18 00:00:57,160 --> 00:01:01,319 Speaker 2: different candidates come in second. Isn't that the best thing 19 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,480 Speaker 2: that could happen for Trump? Because that means we finished 20 00:01:04,600 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 2: January without a clear number two having been established, and 21 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 2: then by the time you get into February, this thing 22 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:15,080 Speaker 2: feels like it's kind of over. In other words, I'm 23 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:18,040 Speaker 2: curious if you would agree with my assessment. In order 24 00:01:18,080 --> 00:01:21,440 Speaker 2: for Trump to there to be a scenario where Trump loses, 25 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:24,880 Speaker 2: to me, there has to be a rapidly and clearly 26 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:29,440 Speaker 2: established number two candidate that is clearly beyond a doubt 27 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:33,040 Speaker 2: number two at worst in both Iowa and New Hampshire, 28 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:37,240 Speaker 2: in order to make the argument going into February, and then, look, 29 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:39,400 Speaker 2: this thing's going to be decided by like March twelfth 30 00:01:39,480 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 2: or March nineteenth at the latest, maybe well before that. 31 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 2: But if you have two different candidates come in second 32 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:49,600 Speaker 2: place behind Trump, that seems like it's kind of ideal 33 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 2: for Trump. Now the wild card here would obviously be 34 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 2: somebody pulls off a big upset Desantus were to win 35 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 2: Iowa or Nikki Haley were to win New Hampshire. 36 00:01:58,560 --> 00:01:59,920 Speaker 1: I think that changes thing. 37 00:02:00,440 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 2: But if the if the overall landscape looks to be 38 00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 2: as it is right now, Trump finishes first in both 39 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:11,120 Speaker 2: the first two with two different number two's, isn't this 40 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 2: thing kind of over? 41 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: Or do you see it differently? I think it is 42 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:17,760 Speaker 1: very likely to be over. 43 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't I don't have any quibble with your analysis, 44 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:24,320 Speaker 3: unlike say when you talk about salso like a miniac, 45 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:26,679 Speaker 3: but on this issue on politics. 46 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 2: So we agree on politics, we disagree on what to 47 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:30,799 Speaker 2: do with a chip. 48 00:02:30,840 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 1: If you only have one thing, you can put a 49 00:02:32,600 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 1: chip in. 50 00:02:33,960 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 3: I'm still smarting from your your snide comments about crab dips, sir, 51 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:42,240 Speaker 3: I have not forgotten. But yes on that's just my 52 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:44,760 Speaker 3: way of saying, yeah, man, on the analysis of the 53 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:46,840 Speaker 3: numbers here and how this goes, I think I think 54 00:02:46,919 --> 00:02:48,000 Speaker 3: you're you're seeing it. 55 00:02:48,160 --> 00:02:49,639 Speaker 1: I mean, I'll be honest with you. 56 00:02:49,840 --> 00:02:54,639 Speaker 3: You need you need a Trump alternative in the primary, 57 00:02:55,200 --> 00:02:58,240 Speaker 3: can have multiple Trump alternatives once the votes are cast, 58 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 3: because he's at fifty percent. 59 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:01,880 Speaker 1: Bottom line, that's where we are. 60 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: I really thought if you would have said in you know, an. 61 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:11,120 Speaker 3: I'm not saying you need a Trump alternative like we 62 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:13,919 Speaker 3: should have one. I'm just saying, if you are one 63 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:16,440 Speaker 3: of the opponents of Trump in the primary, you have 64 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 3: to be number two. 65 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:19,000 Speaker 1: I'm not telling people who to vote for. Okay. 66 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 2: Second part of this, does any endorsement matter at all? 67 00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:28,679 Speaker 2: Trump's endorsement when he's not running, obviously is very impactful 68 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:32,520 Speaker 2: in a Republican primary field. We have seen that, But 69 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:38,240 Speaker 2: does anyone's endorsement in twenty twenty four actually carry that 70 00:03:38,520 --> 00:03:41,200 Speaker 2: much weight? Because I think if you talk to people 71 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:43,440 Speaker 2: in Iowa, they would say, Kim Reynolds is the best 72 00:03:43,520 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 2: endorsement you can get. It doesn't seem like that's gonna 73 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:48,720 Speaker 2: get Ron DeSantis unless he pulls off a big upset 74 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:53,080 Speaker 2: across the finish line there. Simultaneously, I think people would say, hey, 75 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:55,400 Speaker 2: in New Hampshire, if you could get anybody's endorsement, it 76 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 2: would be Sununu, the governor who's very popular there. I 77 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 2: don't know that he's going to move the needle at 78 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 2: all either, And then everybody focuses on, oh, what's the 79 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 2: Manchester Herald newspaper going to do or the Des Moines 80 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 2: Gazette or whatever. And yet it seems to me that 81 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 2: there's a massive obsession with endorsements and they have almost 82 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:15,120 Speaker 2: no impact. 83 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:19,440 Speaker 3: Well, it's a little bit like when people start to calculate, 84 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 3: they say, well, this candidate has this amount of money 85 00:04:21,680 --> 00:04:23,560 Speaker 3: and that candidate has that amount of money, and so 86 00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 3: you know, if if it's really close, it may make 87 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:29,240 Speaker 3: a difference. But there are plenty of times where you 88 00:04:29,320 --> 00:04:32,320 Speaker 3: have candidates who throw crazy money. I mean, look at 89 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:36,200 Speaker 3: how much money becho O'Rourke raised and spent to try 90 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:39,360 Speaker 3: to beat Ted Cruz. You know he lost lost both times, 91 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:42,840 Speaker 3: you considerably? Was it both times he ran? Or once 92 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 3: I can't even remember now, but anyway, Long ran from 93 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 3: governor and he ran governor and Senate. Right, that's yeah, yeah, 94 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 3: so a lot of money that you know was lit 95 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:55,159 Speaker 3: on fire on the endorsement side of things. I think, 96 00:04:55,240 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 3: like a lot of things in politics these days, if 97 00:04:57,160 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 3: it's close, it can be a difference maker. But if 98 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:04,040 Speaker 3: you're forty points or thirty points behind, I don't know, 99 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:08,080 Speaker 3: that's tough. Well, these are weird, as everyone knows, because 100 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 3: everyone works in politics has to like google this and 101 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:11,800 Speaker 3: be like, wait, I'm not gonna lie to you, guys. 102 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:14,040 Speaker 3: I've done this every year there's been a cauca. Every 103 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:15,320 Speaker 3: time there's been a cause because I'm like, wait, I 104 00:05:15,320 --> 00:05:18,479 Speaker 3: gotta get into this. I kind of understand, but it's weird. 105 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:21,160 Speaker 3: It's like buying a diamond ring. You know a little 106 00:05:21,160 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 3: bit about it for a very short period of time, 107 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:26,560 Speaker 3: and then immediately unless you're getting married like eight times, 108 00:05:26,839 --> 00:05:29,080 Speaker 3: like Larry King back in the day and then you 109 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,039 Speaker 3: immediately forget it, hopefully forever. 110 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,719 Speaker 2: Right like color cut clarity. I can vaguely remember you 111 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:38,679 Speaker 2: just went through this recently, Carrot. Oh yeah, Carrott matters 112 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 2: cut clarity. Now they also have I was reading a 113 00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:43,400 Speaker 2: big article. They also have artificial diamond rings, by the way, 114 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 2: that cost a fraction of what the real ones do, 115 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 2: and people can't even tell them apart. 116 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 3: I'm gonna tell you guys right now, big, big, big 117 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:54,760 Speaker 3: proponent of the artificial diamonds. They it's a diamond. Yeah, 118 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 3: it's just a diamond that didn't come out of the ground. 119 00:05:56,360 --> 00:06:01,400 Speaker 3: But it's it's it is not biochemically but it is structurally, 120 00:06:01,600 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 3: molecularly identical to a diamond. So I'm just putting that 121 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:06,200 Speaker 3: out there for all the guys out there. You think 122 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 3: you think it's not a cz or whatever. It's not 123 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:09,839 Speaker 3: cubic X or codium. 124 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:11,520 Speaker 1: It is a diamond. It is a diamond. 125 00:06:11,560 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 3: It is a diamond, and it costs you half what 126 00:06:13,360 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 3: an actual mind diamond does. 127 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:19,360 Speaker 2: And it's becoming a big issue out there because I 128 00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:21,040 Speaker 2: was just reading about it recently. I think it was 129 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:23,520 Speaker 2: on the front page of the Wall Street Journal talking 130 00:06:23,560 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 2: about how as a result, women's diamond rings in case 131 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 2: you were already shopping and your nervous have gotten a 132 00:06:29,040 --> 00:06:32,159 Speaker 2: lot bigger recently, because to your point, you can buy 133 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 2: a much bigger ring for the price, and nobody can 134 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:39,520 Speaker 2: tell the difference whether it's you know, a lab manufactured 135 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:41,599 Speaker 2: or from the ground. 136 00:06:42,839 --> 00:06:45,560 Speaker 3: Welcome to America, where you can afford now twice the 137 00:06:45,640 --> 00:06:46,839 Speaker 3: diamond and half the house. 138 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:48,080 Speaker 1: It's a good point. 139 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:51,360 Speaker 2: That's exactly where we are, so building on this Chris 140 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:55,720 Speaker 2: Sununu endorsement. But tell me how this isn't all a 141 00:06:55,760 --> 00:06:59,240 Speaker 2: grand elaborate scheme for Nicky Hayley to get the vice presidency. 142 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:03,240 Speaker 2: I just I look at this and I say, everybody's 143 00:07:03,279 --> 00:07:06,599 Speaker 2: gonna drop out. Nicky Haley may well be the last 144 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:10,240 Speaker 2: person standing. The math does not add up for her 145 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 2: ever beating Trump. I don't believe head to head. 146 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:13,600 Speaker 1: Now. 147 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 2: She may have a chance in New Hampshire because they 148 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 2: have a lot of independence and Democrats. But it seems 149 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 2: to me that this is all just setting up for 150 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,800 Speaker 2: Trump to pick Nicky Haley as his VP. And this 151 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,760 Speaker 2: thing's all signed, seld and delivered by Valentine's Day. 152 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:33,520 Speaker 3: I would think, in my mind Nicki Haley. In many ways, 153 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:37,280 Speaker 3: the best path for her, the most that she could 154 00:07:37,280 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 3: hope for realistically, is to. 155 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:41,800 Speaker 1: Be Trump's VP. Now. 156 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:43,480 Speaker 3: I know a lot of Trump voters don't want that, 157 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:46,840 Speaker 3: but just remember who is Trump's last VP? Are you 158 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 3: excited about that choice? So don't count out Nicky Haley. Right, 159 00:07:51,720 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 3: she would be in a position where the base would 160 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 3: become you know, the Trump maga world. I think if 161 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 3: she served Trump as vice president would become more favorable 162 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 3: toward her, and it would be very difficult to take 163 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:10,440 Speaker 3: the you know, on deck spot if you will away 164 00:08:10,440 --> 00:08:12,720 Speaker 3: from her, and it comes up in just a couple 165 00:08:12,760 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 3: of years. It is so we keep forgetting this all 166 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 3: the presidential dynamics about who's running and who wants what, 167 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 3: And it's so different when you have a candidate who 168 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 3: can only be president for four more years. Yeah, which 169 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 3: is true on both sides. You know, Donald Trump cannot 170 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,160 Speaker 3: be president for eight more years, and so if you 171 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:35,680 Speaker 3: are his vice president, you're in a particularly powerful spot 172 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 3: because in two years, everyone's going to turn to you 173 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:40,079 Speaker 3: and be like, you're the one I was gonna see, 174 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:42,160 Speaker 3: You're the guy, You're the Galon Nikki Haley's case. 175 00:08:42,160 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 2: I love politics too, by the way, because I was 176 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:46,960 Speaker 2: gonna say, you know, Nicky Haley's pretty young, she's fifty one. 177 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 2: Politics is the only place where you can be like 178 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 2: fifty six or fifty eight and people are like, you know, 179 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 2: he or she, they're pretty young spring chicken at fifty five. 180 00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 2: Every other profession you would look at somebody in their 181 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,000 Speaker 2: fifty certainly the top half of the fifties, you would 182 00:09:02,040 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 2: never describe them as young. Remember when was it Henry 183 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 2: Hyde who confessed to cheating and said that cheating at 184 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 2: the age of forty two was a youthful indiscretion and 185 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 2: he was like eighty four years old or something, so 186 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 2: he was describing himself at forty two as youthful. I 187 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:23,040 Speaker 2: don't think most people out there think of, you know, 188 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,360 Speaker 2: like forty two or forty three as youthful, unless you're 189 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:28,000 Speaker 2: like in your eighties, and then obviously things are different. 190 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 2: But the point is Nicki Haley, I believe is fifty one. 191 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 2: She would be fifty five and an overwhelming favorite to 192 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 2: be picked as the nominee in twenty twenty eight if 193 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 2: she was the VP. 194 00:09:41,240 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 1: It seems to me she's running for that. 195 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 3: A part of me that a part of this rather 196 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 3: that I left out of it was even if Nicki 197 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 3: Haley were by some miracle able to win the primary 198 00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:51,320 Speaker 3: against Trump. 199 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 1: I don't know that all that. 200 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 3: I don't know that Trump voters come out for Nicki 201 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:56,960 Speaker 3: Haley where they have to for her to win the general, right, 202 00:09:57,160 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 3: Whereas if she becomes vice president. 203 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:01,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's a bet shot down the line. 204 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 3: She goes a little more maga, she goes to more rallies, 205 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 3: she's helpful to Trump. Maybe that people right now, I 206 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 3: know what a lot of people are thinking, that's crazy. 207 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 3: He would never she It's politics, folks. Yeah, you know, 208 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:16,480 Speaker 3: things change very very quickly. 209 00:10:16,559 --> 00:10:17,319 Speaker 1: I mean it was. 210 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:19,800 Speaker 3: Only six months ago that we were getting calls and 211 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:23,320 Speaker 3: emails saying that it should be an RFK junior Trump ticket. 212 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:26,680 Speaker 3: I remember this, and I was telling everybody he's a Democrat. 213 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:29,160 Speaker 3: He's a Democrat, he's a Democrat. I kept saying this 214 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:31,640 Speaker 3: over and over again. And now sure enough he's running 215 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:32,559 Speaker 3: third party. 216 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: And helping Trump. 217 00:10:33,480 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 2: It looks like in some of the states because it 218 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,440 Speaker 2: just ties to Biden's lack of popularity. By the way, 219 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 2: we got Tucker in hour three, I would pick if 220 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:44,360 Speaker 2: I were Trump, right, now I would pick Tucker. 221 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:46,400 Speaker 1: That's who I would pick. 222 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:50,680 Speaker 2: So I understand again my first pick is take a 223 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,680 Speaker 2: state where you guarantee yourself. I've said this for months, 224 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:55,760 Speaker 2: maybe even a year or more. Trump's not going to 225 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:57,200 Speaker 2: do that. If he's not going to do that, I 226 00:10:57,200 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 2: think Tucker would be his best possible option. 227 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:03,720 Speaker 1: Eight hundred two eight two two eighty two. Come back 228 00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:05,440 Speaker 1: to this. Also, remember in the next hour. 229 00:11:05,559 --> 00:11:10,200 Speaker 3: We're gonna be diving into the Jack Smith legal Hail Mary. 230 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:14,760 Speaker 3: I think you could call it over the January sixth election, 231 00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:19,800 Speaker 3: twenty twenty trial in DC against Trump. We have Aaron 232 00:11:20,080 --> 00:11:22,960 Speaker 3: who sounds like a brilliant audio file. 233 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:24,199 Speaker 1: Aaron, what's going on? 234 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,679 Speaker 4: Hey guys, thanks for having me. You know, I live 235 00:11:27,720 --> 00:11:29,960 Speaker 4: in San Diego. I got tickets to Metallica. I'm a 236 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,080 Speaker 4: diehard fan. Up at So count LA. Drove through the 237 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:36,640 Speaker 4: horrendous LA traffic, got to the stadium, got my fifteen 238 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:38,960 Speaker 4: dollars beer, and I couldn't hear a freaking note they 239 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:41,679 Speaker 4: were playing. You know, it's just loud gargles sounds. I 240 00:11:41,720 --> 00:11:44,400 Speaker 4: couldn't even make out those the music. I hate stadiums. 241 00:11:44,440 --> 00:11:47,640 Speaker 3: I agree with Bucks, You're a brilliant man, Aaron, because 242 00:11:47,679 --> 00:11:49,040 Speaker 3: see you've experienced the reality. 243 00:11:49,040 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 1: That's what I was telling people. Stadiums are not built 244 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:53,240 Speaker 1: for an outdoor state. It's not built for acoustics. 245 00:11:53,280 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 3: No, there's no way you're gonna be able to really, 246 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:57,960 Speaker 3: if you're somebody that wants to hear the crispness of 247 00:11:58,040 --> 00:12:00,199 Speaker 3: those notes, you want to hear those vocal. 248 00:12:01,600 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 2: He's just there's not pant I just want the big show, 249 00:12:05,640 --> 00:12:08,320 Speaker 2: the big screen. I would still like to go see 250 00:12:08,360 --> 00:12:12,240 Speaker 2: the Taylor Swift extravaganza, like back in. 251 00:12:12,200 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 1: The day you two rolling stones. 252 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 2: The big stadium shows I think are really cool, just 253 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 2: to see the way they put them on. 254 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,400 Speaker 1: So I don't really this sound. Do you want to 255 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: go to this thing in Vegas, the Sphere, I do 256 00:12:28,240 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 1: one hundred. 257 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 2: I want to go to the Sphere that for those 258 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 2: of you who don't know, the owner of the Knicks, 259 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:41,360 Speaker 2: James Dolan and Madison Square Garden, built this incredible concert. 260 00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:44,800 Speaker 2: I mean really, it's just a venue that is called 261 00:12:44,840 --> 00:12:47,600 Speaker 2: the Sphere right off of the Vegas Strip. And I 262 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:49,959 Speaker 2: believe they had you two open up for like nineteen 263 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 2: straight days or something like that, and they want to 264 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:56,920 Speaker 2: do a UFC event. I saw Dana White talking about this. Obviously, 265 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,280 Speaker 2: the UFC has major connections in Las Vegas. 266 00:12:59,600 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 1: It will books. 267 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 2: Incredible, and yes, I want to go see an event there. 268 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 2: I'm figuring they'll probably have something huge for the super 269 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:08,200 Speaker 2: Bowl this year because the Super bowls in Vegas, so 270 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 2: I'm hoping I'm out for some of the festivities surrounding that. 271 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 1: When is the Super Bowl? Do you know what month? 272 00:13:15,520 --> 00:13:19,679 Speaker 1: The Super bowls in? January or February? 273 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 2: Okay, that's pretty Yeah, it's in February. I believe that. 274 00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:25,880 Speaker 2: I haven't even looked up the official date, but usually 275 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:30,199 Speaker 2: February eleventh. Our staff tells us this year. My argument 276 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 2: has been for some time that they should move the 277 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:38,280 Speaker 2: Super Bowl to the Sunday before President's Day and give 278 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:43,520 Speaker 2: us basically a football holiday weekend every year. To me, 279 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:46,560 Speaker 2: feels like a no brainer. That would be an easy 280 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 2: calendar change to add one week to football season, which 281 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:53,000 Speaker 2: I don't think most people would complain about, and then boom, 282 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 2: everybody gets off Monday and it revitalizes President's Day, which 283 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 2: I feel like other than mattress Cell, most people really 284 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 2: kind of don't think very much about President's Day. 285 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:07,440 Speaker 3: Are my beloved Jets or my beloved Giants in the 286 00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:08,920 Speaker 3: running for this super Bowl. 287 00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:12,480 Speaker 2: It is an awful year for New York football fans. No, 288 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 2: they are not in the running. 289 00:14:14,880 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 1: That's a shame. Maybe they're both actually atrocious. Should I 290 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:21,320 Speaker 1: be a Dolphins fan then Dolphins are? Yeah, you should. 291 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 2: It's actually you're kind of coming in in a very 292 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 2: favorable time because the Dolphins have been trying to replace 293 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,760 Speaker 2: Dan Marino for twenty five years now whatever the math 294 00:14:31,840 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 2: is on that, maybe thirty years now, and Tua is 295 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:38,960 Speaker 2: really very good. They're gonna win the division, I think. Sorry, 296 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:43,280 Speaker 2: Bill's fans and a host home playoff game, so that 297 00:14:43,280 --> 00:14:45,400 Speaker 2: that's not been very common. You could be kind of 298 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:49,120 Speaker 2: fair weather fan, fanning yourself into a really good spot. 299 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:51,160 Speaker 2: So yes, I would be a Dolphins fan if I 300 00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 2: were you. 301 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:54,600 Speaker 3: Everything I know from about Dolphins football I learned from 302 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:55,680 Speaker 3: watching ace Ventura. 303 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,640 Speaker 2: So you know, oh, that's a great They couldn't couldn't 304 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:01,120 Speaker 2: make that movie now, but there's a lot of things 305 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:03,840 Speaker 2: in ash Ventura that would be very smokes. 306 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:05,080 Speaker 1: It makes a appearance in that. 307 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, Don Schuela means the quarterback, Yeah, Don Shula, I 308 00:15:08,320 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 2: mean that's NFL license. They were fine with that movie 309 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 2: being made, they would run in the opposite direction. Now, 310 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:14,520 Speaker 2: by the way, the movie's funny. I showed it for 311 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 2: my kids a couple of Thanksgiving ago, holds up for them. 312 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 1: They thought it was pretty funny. What are you thinking 313 00:15:19,960 --> 00:15:22,520 Speaker 1: of the movie that? What? What is the movie from 314 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:23,320 Speaker 1: our youth? 315 00:15:23,520 --> 00:15:23,680 Speaker 5: Now? 316 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:25,880 Speaker 3: I'm giving up the joke here because Clay and I 317 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 3: are basically the same age. Don't tell anyone what is 318 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 3: the movie from our youth that your kids. 319 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 1: Love the most? Well? It changes based on how they age, 320 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:36,200 Speaker 1: because but. 321 00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:37,720 Speaker 3: Like right now, like like right now, like in the 322 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,320 Speaker 3: last year or two, what's the one that they have 323 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:40,760 Speaker 3: liked them? 324 00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: Is there one that really sticks out? 325 00:15:42,600 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 5: Well? 326 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 2: The last the most two most reason we watched they 327 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:48,680 Speaker 2: loved both of them, The Lost Boys and Scream, and 328 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:51,000 Speaker 2: they really want to watch the entire Scream. 329 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:52,200 Speaker 1: That was around Halloween. 330 00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 2: We were watching all those movies, and before that it 331 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,800 Speaker 2: was I would probably say Indiana Jones. But they also 332 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,240 Speaker 2: love Star Wars, like the original Star Wars. But the 333 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 2: Indiana Jones movies they thought were pretty phenomenal. 334 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,440 Speaker 1: Dan in Minnesota, what's going on? Dan? 335 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:14,600 Speaker 5: Hello? With the votes coming in as early as they 336 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:20,040 Speaker 5: do now, no matter how energized the Republican base, or 337 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 5: the how good the polls look. I'm ready to be 338 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 5: disappointed because as the election nears, the Democrats ground game 339 00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 5: will will disappoint us election after election. And I think 340 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:37,080 Speaker 5: we have every right to know as long as we're 341 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:41,680 Speaker 5: going to be voting this early, what the what the 342 00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 5: score is. As the votes come in. That way, we 343 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:49,200 Speaker 5: won't be surprised and we won't have such a traffic jam. 344 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:51,800 Speaker 2: Thank you for the call. The amount of thank you, 345 00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 2: the amount of defeatism is. I mean, I'm trying to 346 00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,000 Speaker 2: think of the fan base that the Republican Party would represent. 347 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: Right now. The Republican Party is like the New York Jets. 348 00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:09,440 Speaker 2: There is almost no faith that anything could ever go 349 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 2: possibly right. I would have said historically, buck the Detroit Lions. 350 00:17:13,560 --> 00:17:15,800 Speaker 2: Although here's a good sports analogy for you to drop 351 00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:18,720 Speaker 2: out at Thanksgiving, because the Lions will be playing on Thanksgiving, 352 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 2: and everybody out there who's listening right now, if you 353 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,760 Speaker 2: are not a sports fan at all, but you want 354 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:27,199 Speaker 2: to blow your family away on Thanksgiving by just dropping 355 00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:29,480 Speaker 2: an incredible sports stat, here's one for you. 356 00:17:29,520 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: Buck. 357 00:17:30,280 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 2: The Detroit Lions are eight and two. Detroit Lions play 358 00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:36,640 Speaker 2: every Thanksgiving. They are eight and two. They usually play 359 00:17:36,680 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 2: the early game. So you got all your family and 360 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:41,880 Speaker 2: friends around, you can say Detroit Lions are eight and two. 361 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:47,360 Speaker 2: They haven't been eight and two buck since nineteen sixty two. 362 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:52,359 Speaker 2: JFK was alive the last time the Detroit Lions started 363 00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:53,960 Speaker 2: off a season eight and two. 364 00:17:54,119 --> 00:17:56,879 Speaker 3: Fun fact that burn the boats comes from Hernand Cortes 365 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,520 Speaker 3: and the invasion of the Aztec Empire anther one. 366 00:17:59,400 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 1: Of nowhere where it came. 367 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, that's that's generally you know, you know, he 368 00:18:03,359 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 3: burned his ship so that the men couldn't leave. I 369 00:18:05,359 --> 00:18:07,960 Speaker 3: believe historians now think he actually scuttled the ships, but 370 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:10,199 Speaker 3: then the legend became that they were burned, but that 371 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 3: they just sort of sunk them instead of trying to 372 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 3: burn them. But I was thinking about this also yesterday 373 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 3: because you mentioned to burn the boat's thing, and we 374 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:20,520 Speaker 3: had people writing in about my claim that no, that 375 00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,680 Speaker 3: Hannibal was one of the five greatest generals of all time. 376 00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 3: I also mentioned Napoleon and someone wrote in Genghis Khan, 377 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:29,760 Speaker 3: and I'm like, you know, there's there's some there's some 378 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:33,560 Speaker 3: strong feelings out there about most impressive military commander. In 379 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:35,800 Speaker 3: the case of the Khan of the Khanate and Genghis 380 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:39,000 Speaker 3: Khan in particularly, you're talking about I mean mass destruction 381 00:18:39,119 --> 00:18:41,159 Speaker 3: of not just armies but civilians on a scale that 382 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:43,199 Speaker 3: had never been seen before in human history. So that's 383 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 3: a that's a tough one, but incredible military machine. The 384 00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 3: Mongol Vegas Khan. 385 00:18:48,240 --> 00:18:54,439 Speaker 2: Like, there's some insane percentage of his DNA that exists 386 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:58,199 Speaker 2: in much of that region of the world still is 387 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:01,440 Speaker 2: as much as like one in sixteen people are descended 388 00:19:01,640 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 2: from Ginghis Khan in some way. 389 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:07,280 Speaker 1: This I do not know. I've heard something along those lines. Yeah, 390 00:19:08,280 --> 00:19:08,840 Speaker 1: look that up. 391 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 2: You probably weren't expecting ginghis Khan genealogy, but it's some 392 00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:17,200 Speaker 2: unbelievable number of children that he individually and his family 393 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:20,639 Speaker 2: obviously that his heirs have fathered throughout the course of 394 00:19:21,280 --> 00:19:23,200 Speaker 2: that region. I think it was like one in sixteen 395 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 2: in some parts of the world can directly trace their 396 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,760 Speaker 2: descent to Ginghis Khan, which is kind of unbelievable to 397 00:19:29,760 --> 00:19:30,159 Speaker 2: think about it. 398 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 3: I also think if you're talking about the greatest generals 399 00:19:32,240 --> 00:19:34,679 Speaker 3: of all time, you do have to make a separation 400 00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:39,880 Speaker 3: into those who were for deployed combatants themselves versus those 401 00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:42,080 Speaker 3: who are strategic geniuses. A little bit, you know, you 402 00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:44,880 Speaker 3: start to get into like Alexander the Great was part 403 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:48,080 Speaker 3: of cavalry charges, right, he would actually get into it Nepole. 404 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:50,640 Speaker 2: And you know, actually you got me thinking now too, 405 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 2: like who is the greatest American general of all time? 406 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:57,240 Speaker 3: Oh, this audience gets we'll get our VIPs on email 407 00:19:57,280 --> 00:19:58,679 Speaker 3: because we're not have time for the calls on this. 408 00:19:58,840 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 3: Send us your the greatest American general of all Would 409 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,680 Speaker 3: you argue, I think you'd get a lot of people 410 00:20:04,720 --> 00:20:08,639 Speaker 3: who would say, based on results, Douglas MacArthur has to 411 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:09,480 Speaker 3: be high on the list. 412 00:20:09,640 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 1: Yeah. 413 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 3: I think people would argue that. Now others would say 414 00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,159 Speaker 3: that that's crazy. But there are definitely gonna be some 415 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:18,400 Speaker 3: Douglas MacArthur people in the audience. On a skills basis, 416 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:21,240 Speaker 3: you're going to get some people who say that for 417 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:25,760 Speaker 3: outcome on the battlefield, Robert E. Lee was an incredible 418 00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:29,359 Speaker 3: strategic mind for this time. That is just that is 419 00:20:29,400 --> 00:20:31,880 Speaker 3: a fact of military history. They will say that. I mean, 420 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,280 Speaker 3: you know you could no one's saying here, you know, 421 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 3: we're just talking about how good someone is at generalship. 422 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:39,800 Speaker 3: Who comes to mind for you from the American side, Well. 423 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:42,760 Speaker 2: It's gonna be even more controversial because I think the 424 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 2: most and again also the possibility is are you talking 425 00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 2: about commanding general or someone who had a core or 426 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 2: someone who had a division or so I'll give you 427 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,399 Speaker 2: a couple from the Civil War. Nathan Bedford Forrest, to 428 00:20:55,560 --> 00:21:01,080 Speaker 2: me is probably the greatest cavalry general that that ever 429 00:21:01,200 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 2: existed in maybe the world. And there's some interesting stories 430 00:21:05,320 --> 00:21:08,920 Speaker 2: buck again just talking military genius. If you look at 431 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 2: the way that Forrest fought his battles, they're incredible. And 432 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:15,320 Speaker 2: one of the people who was most impressed by Forrest 433 00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:20,760 Speaker 2: reportedly was Rommel, who traveled pre World War Two. You know, 434 00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 2: you study military history. Yeah, I was about to bring 435 00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 2: up that. You know, Ramel wasn't you know, Nazi fighting 436 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 2: World War Two. But in terms of military strategic. 437 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,359 Speaker 3: And tactical prowess, a lot of military historians would say 438 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:36,400 Speaker 3: Rammel was one of the great military tacticians of all time. 439 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:38,879 Speaker 2: And that he came here and studied and walked the 440 00:21:38,920 --> 00:21:44,240 Speaker 2: battlefields of Nathan Bedford Forrest to try to understand the strategies. 441 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 1: That he deployed. Because if you see the topography. 442 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:50,639 Speaker 2: If you are a military historian, anybody who studies history, 443 00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:55,399 Speaker 2: the topography of a battlefield was hugely important historically to 444 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:56,439 Speaker 2: who won and who lost. 445 00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:00,479 Speaker 3: And I mentioned Harnan Cortes at the beginning and the 446 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 3: conquest of the Aztec Empire. I mean he arrived with 447 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:09,600 Speaker 3: hundreds of men and managed to defeat an empire that 448 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:12,640 Speaker 3: was had a human sacrifice in slavery, by the way, 449 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,280 Speaker 3: but the Aztec Empire, massive slave empire. Actually you don't 450 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:18,600 Speaker 3: hear about that, but defeated them and it was I 451 00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 3: think they asked him in a couple of million people 452 00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 3: he managed to just you know, it's an incredible story. 453 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:28,439 Speaker 3: You could make an amazing television series about Cortes and 454 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:32,680 Speaker 3: the Aztecs, but it would be very controversial. He was 455 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,119 Speaker 3: a he was a rough dude, There's no question about it. 456 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 1: We've got some geinghis con updates. 457 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,080 Speaker 2: Let me also give you a couple more Civil War generals, 458 00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 2: because people are gonna be like Clay Travis praises, you know, 459 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:44,639 Speaker 2: Clay Travis and Buck Sexton praise Robert E. 460 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:46,640 Speaker 1: Lee. Yeah you're you're on you. Oh yeah, I said 461 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 1: Robert Lee. I was gonna say, you're on your own. 462 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 2: Nathan Bedford Forrest, who had a checkered at best passed 463 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:55,760 Speaker 2: after the Civil War, I would say George Thomas, who 464 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:59,400 Speaker 2: was a Virginian who stayed loyal to the North. If 465 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:02,800 Speaker 2: you look at what he did in the Western theater. Uh, 466 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:06,680 Speaker 2: saved the Union army at Chickamauga and then later basically 467 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 2: wiped out Hood in the Battle of Nashville. One of 468 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 2: the most successful Union generals. That's probably under the radar. 469 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 2: And then the other one I would point to, and 470 00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,439 Speaker 2: again it goes to not only the strategic genius, but 471 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:20,520 Speaker 2: being forward thinking enough to even try it. 472 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:21,240 Speaker 1: Sherman. 473 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 5: Uh. 474 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 2: The idea when Sherman decided to begin his march to 475 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:29,360 Speaker 2: the sea that his family that his army could forage 476 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,640 Speaker 2: off of the land without supply chains was a revolutionary idea. 477 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 1: Uh and uh. 478 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 2: And obviously Sherman's ability to basically fight the will of 479 00:23:40,560 --> 00:23:42,800 Speaker 2: the Southern people to continue that war. 480 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: You know who's not a great general if you actually 481 00:23:45,720 --> 00:23:47,320 Speaker 1: and I'm gonna get people fired out of your year, 482 00:23:47,359 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 1: are throwing under the bus here? 483 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 2: No, No, I actually think Grant. I was gonna say, 484 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:55,080 Speaker 2: George Washington. If you look at George Washington's. 485 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 3: Actually George kept the army together during very tough times. 486 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:01,680 Speaker 1: He was an your tongue with that George talk. 487 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:05,960 Speaker 2: You go look at George Washington on the battlefield as 488 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:10,560 Speaker 2: opposed to uh. Certainly he was a genius at managing 489 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,919 Speaker 2: and maintaining the revolution, but in terms of his on 490 00:24:14,040 --> 00:24:17,080 Speaker 2: the battlefield performance, not that good of it. 491 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 1: But he was an insurgent, and insurgents just have to 492 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:20,760 Speaker 1: outlast the will. 493 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 3: Of the enemy, which is what which is what he did. So, okay, 494 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:26,800 Speaker 3: we have some Ganghis updates. And also if you want 495 00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:28,200 Speaker 3: to say, okay, if you want to wait and now 496 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 3: we started the greatest generals, we have a lot of 497 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:32,040 Speaker 3: news to get to. I promise we'll get to that too. 498 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 3: But eight hundred two two two a A two. We 499 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,600 Speaker 3: got the military historians, some of them, especially Clay. With 500 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:40,239 Speaker 3: your civil war takes, someone's gonna gallo at us. We're 501 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:41,400 Speaker 3: I'm sure we're leaving. 502 00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:41,760 Speaker 1: People out there. 503 00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:43,840 Speaker 2: Some civil war takes are going to be respected by 504 00:24:43,840 --> 00:24:46,359 Speaker 2: civil war people. But it's going to be a headline 505 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:48,879 Speaker 2: on one of these left wing sites that I said 506 00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,120 Speaker 2: something positive about a Confederate general. 507 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:52,360 Speaker 1: How dare I? 508 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 3: I'll balance it for the left wingers by saying that 509 00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:58,879 Speaker 3: Zukov in the second you know, Soviet Zukov in the 510 00:24:58,880 --> 00:25:02,600 Speaker 3: Second World War was is a very effective general and 511 00:25:02,640 --> 00:25:04,960 Speaker 3: tactician in the Soviet sense, which means, you know, lose 512 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,000 Speaker 3: as many lives as you have to get the job done. 513 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:09,800 Speaker 2: And by the way, Stonewall Jackson genius, I should have 514 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,440 Speaker 2: obviously mentioned him, but he obviously is very well known. 515 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 2: Poor call screeners never thought they were gonna step into 516 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:20,440 Speaker 2: greatest American general fire today with body. 517 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:23,120 Speaker 1: To seal these vip emails. We are drowning. 518 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 2: Lots of history hot takes coming in this this morning. 519 00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:28,639 Speaker 2: By the way, let me I was not far off 520 00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 2: from my on my ginghis Khan take Ali again, something 521 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,560 Speaker 2: she probably wasn't expecting to look up. Historians long known 522 00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:41,679 Speaker 2: that he had a ton of kids, But according to 523 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,600 Speaker 2: a two thousand and three study in the American Journal 524 00:25:45,720 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 2: of Human Genetics, zero point five percent of the world's 525 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 2: male population is a descent of Ginghis Khan. Eight percent 526 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 2: of all men living in his former territory Buck had 527 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 2: his hy chromosome. So think about that one in every 528 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:11,679 Speaker 2: two hundred people in men anyway that they can trace 529 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 2: through the y chromosome. One in every two hundred men 530 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:19,280 Speaker 2: is a descendant of Ginghis Khan and one in every 531 00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:22,680 Speaker 2: what is that? One in sixteen of every men in 532 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:27,800 Speaker 2: the world area in which he conquered. That is unbelievable. Now, 533 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 2: they said they knew he had a lot of kids, 534 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 2: six wives, untold number of concubines. But and it could 535 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:38,439 Speaker 2: be I guess his sons as well, right, I imagine that 536 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:41,840 Speaker 2: Genghis Khan had a lot of sons, and that would 537 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,480 Speaker 2: obviously have continued as well, and they were probably powerful 538 00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:45,000 Speaker 2: and had a lot. 539 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:48,440 Speaker 3: Of It makes sense because when people, for example, are 540 00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 3: having a speakerphone conversation at the coffee shop next to me, 541 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:55,000 Speaker 3: I go full Genghis Khan on that, so that I 542 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:56,000 Speaker 3: might have some gang. 543 00:26:57,600 --> 00:26:59,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, makes makes perfect sense. 544 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:04,000 Speaker 2: And yes, the the amount of emails that are rolling 545 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:05,240 Speaker 2: in right now. 546 00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:07,520 Speaker 1: I can't. I look at you. 547 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,040 Speaker 3: You just that was just you were just starting the 548 00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 3: fire there you were throwing you were throwing an M 549 00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:17,119 Speaker 3: eighty into a bucket of gasoline with your well, I 550 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:18,440 Speaker 3: guess that would actually put it out, But you know 551 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 3: what I mean. 552 00:27:20,520 --> 00:27:24,399 Speaker 2: George, my George Washington, Washington can take Yeah, my George, 553 00:27:24,520 --> 00:27:28,199 Speaker 2: which is accurate historically. Military historians, they're nodding. All the 554 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,480 Speaker 2: rest of you are ready to tar and feather me 555 00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:31,480 Speaker 2: and and throw me. 556 00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:33,600 Speaker 1: In the I just want to say, I sit here. 557 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:38,840 Speaker 3: I have total solidarity with George Washington on this issue. 558 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:40,639 Speaker 3: I think that he had a very tough hand that 559 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 3: he had to deal with militarily. 560 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,400 Speaker 1: So militarily he was a poor general. 561 00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:48,960 Speaker 2: Now in terms of holding I mean on the battlefield, 562 00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:53,600 Speaker 2: in terms of holding together the revolution and the men 563 00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:57,919 Speaker 2: in material the armada aspect of the battle, he was 564 00:27:58,080 --> 00:27:58,879 Speaker 2: very impressive. 565 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:01,040 Speaker 1: But you got him on the field, yield right, you 566 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:01,920 Speaker 1: got him in the ring. 567 00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:05,080 Speaker 2: I don't think gw took a great threw a great 568 00:28:05,119 --> 00:28:07,000 Speaker 2: punch or took a great punch. He just wasn't that 569 00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:09,560 Speaker 2: good actually in combat leading troops. 570 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:11,959 Speaker 1: I mean, it's Benn Nick Arnold talk over here. It's 571 00:28:12,000 --> 00:28:13,639 Speaker 1: all I can tell you. It's crazy crazy. 572 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,879 Speaker 2: Meanwhile, Stonewall Jackson the Valley Campaign, I was I was 573 00:28:16,880 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 2: talking about Nathan Bedford Forrest. Probably the greatest strategic military 574 00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:29,119 Speaker 2: campaign in a in in our history is what Stonewall 575 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 2: Jackson did in the Shenandoah Valley UH with the with 576 00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,920 Speaker 2: the with his army there. It's still unprecedented to this day. 577 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,160 Speaker 3: What he accomplished incredibly brutal. But Julius Caesar would be 578 00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 3: somebody you should also think of as a as a 579 00:28:44,840 --> 00:28:49,040 Speaker 3: a phenomenally accomplished military commander. We think of him in 580 00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:51,160 Speaker 3: a much more sort of theatrical sense in getting stabbed 581 00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,480 Speaker 3: and all that. Steve in New York wants to throw 582 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:56,200 Speaker 3: a name in the mix that we haven't talked about yet. 583 00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:56,800 Speaker 1: What's up, Steve? 584 00:28:58,480 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 4: How about General George Patton? 585 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,240 Speaker 2: Yep, that was one that we yeah, one of the 586 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 2: greatest Thank you for the call, maybe the greatest military 587 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 2: movie ever made. 588 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:11,960 Speaker 1: Paton, Well, that's that's that's a whole dude, that's it. 589 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:14,120 Speaker 1: You can't just throw these you can't just drop these. 590 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 3: Bombs, Clay, I said conversation, best military movie. 591 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:19,720 Speaker 1: I know, I wouldn't go that far. What would you say? 592 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:21,000 Speaker 1: Is the best military movie ever? 593 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:26,440 Speaker 3: Ah, most realistic, most realistic for modern combat, Blackhawk down, 594 00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,360 Speaker 3: best military movie ever made. And dude, you can't put 595 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:31,960 Speaker 3: me on the spot like that. You can't do that. 596 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 3: I mean, there's so many. 597 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:38,400 Speaker 2: Patton is so good, so good, I mean, Brave Heart, Gladiator, 598 00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:40,120 Speaker 2: if you want to, I mean again, you can get. 599 00:29:40,920 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: I was thinking more like military combat. I mean, Saving 600 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,520 Speaker 2: Private Ryan is a phenomenal movie that holds up incredibly well, 601 00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:49,360 Speaker 2: incredibly well made, so that has to be on my list. 602 00:29:49,400 --> 00:29:51,840 Speaker 2: And there's lots of tell like Band of Brothers obviously 603 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 2: that are television series that are incredibly well done. 604 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:56,200 Speaker 1: But Patten. 605 00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:59,040 Speaker 2: That opening scene of Patent when he walks out in 606 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 2: front of the American I think is one of the 607 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,240 Speaker 2: greatest scenes that's ever been filmed in American history. 608 00:30:04,280 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 1: People are shouting out apocalypse now. There there's a lot 609 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:11,560 Speaker 1: of movies I see. I'm not a person, but we 610 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 1: could talk. We could talk about that. Man. 611 00:30:14,320 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 3: The anti eggnog crowd is fired up right now online, 612 00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:22,200 Speaker 3: sending us emails and hitting us up on Twitter. The 613 00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:25,640 Speaker 3: you know, we need Team Eggnog to start to speak 614 00:30:25,680 --> 00:30:29,320 Speaker 3: up because it's sounding like, I don't know, we got 615 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:32,040 Speaker 3: a lot of eggnog haters in this in this audience 616 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,400 Speaker 3: right now. I was just looking it up before it 617 00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 3: turns out. Eggnog, they believe, according to food historians, comes 618 00:30:39,160 --> 00:30:44,960 Speaker 3: from uh comes from adding a bit of ale or 619 00:30:45,080 --> 00:30:51,440 Speaker 3: grog to some curdled milk. Hmm, you know me, And 620 00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 3: they think it is that the tradition goes all the 621 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:58,480 Speaker 3: way back to the medieval era, and then some monks 622 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 3: came along and added some figs to sweeten it up. 623 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:03,480 Speaker 1: I gotta say, you look, you. 624 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,880 Speaker 3: Look at a cappuccino monks, champagne monks, the monks out there, 625 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 3: you guys back in the day, we're doing a lot 626 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:14,000 Speaker 3: of a lot of beverage exploration. I believe, even adding 627 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,320 Speaker 3: sugar to the thing that I probably am more addicted 628 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:20,160 Speaker 3: to than anything else in the world, chocolate. That was 629 00:31:20,200 --> 00:31:24,200 Speaker 3: something that monks did in Europe after they brought the 630 00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 3: cacao back from the New World. If you know this already, 631 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:33,440 Speaker 3: oh you might know this already. The Aztecs were drinking 632 00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:36,320 Speaker 3: what we think of as chocolate. Initially, it was a 633 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 3: very bitter drink with chili's in it. It was not sweetened. 634 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,320 Speaker 3: They weren't adding sugar to it, and it was considered 635 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:44,600 Speaker 3: some kind of you know, elixir for religious purposes and 636 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:47,960 Speaker 3: stuff too. I think chocolate still serves the religious purpose 637 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,440 Speaker 3: of making me feel good in my tummy every time 638 00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:53,240 Speaker 3: I eat it, which is very important. But eggnog is 639 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 3: getting is getting people very divisive right now. Oh, I 640 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:01,880 Speaker 3: check this out too. Because I was curious by the way. 641 00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,440 Speaker 3: My family is proagnog. I'm just gonna say, I'm gonna 642 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:09,040 Speaker 3: out my own the Sexton family. My parents are pro agnog. 643 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. 644 00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:14,600 Speaker 3: They also like strawberry ice cream, so you know, sometimes 645 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 3: the apple does fall far from the tree. Because I'm 646 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:18,400 Speaker 3: not particularly an egnog guy. That's why I wanted it 647 00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 3: in the I wanted it in the ice cream form. 648 00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,240 Speaker 3: I'm trying to see here how much of this stuff 649 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:26,400 Speaker 3: is Actually there's. 650 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:27,800 Speaker 1: Some crazy amount of this. 651 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:33,000 Speaker 3: One hundred and third according to some communist website that 652 00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:34,480 Speaker 3: I won't name on the air, but. 653 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 1: It is, one hundred and thirty million pounds of eggnog. 654 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:40,640 Speaker 3: Are sold every year in this country. 655 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:42,200 Speaker 1: That's a lot. 656 00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:44,840 Speaker 3: And it's only really something that people drink this time 657 00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:46,920 Speaker 3: of year. You know, this is like a little bit 658 00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 3: of the If it's such a good flavor, and this 659 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:52,200 Speaker 3: sends the pumpkin spice people into. 660 00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,440 Speaker 1: Fits of rage too. But if it's such a good flavor, 661 00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,040 Speaker 1: why is it only a seasonal flavor? 662 00:32:56,680 --> 00:32:59,000 Speaker 3: Oh, because we're gonna save the flavor for just that 663 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 3: one time of the year. This is how I always 664 00:33:01,640 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 3: felt about Cadbury eggs growing up. I loved Cadbury eggs, 665 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:06,320 Speaker 3: and I was always bitter that you can only get 666 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,280 Speaker 3: them around Easter. I'm like, why not year round? Cadbury 667 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 3: eggs doesn't make sense to me? But you know, I 668 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:11,840 Speaker 3: guess some. 669 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:15,440 Speaker 1: People they like to create artificial scarcity, like what you. 670 00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:18,840 Speaker 3: Have with the diamond market, although thanks to artificial diamonds 671 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:21,200 Speaker 3: that's changing a little bit. We cover a lot of 672 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 3: ground here on clay and buck and we're going to 673 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:27,600 Speaker 3: continue to do that tomorrow. Let me see, later this week, 674 00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 3: I believe we have Chip. 675 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:30,160 Speaker 1: Roy joining us. 676 00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 3: He's been in the headlines recently, talked about the border. 677 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 3: Talk to him about Iole Caucuses, stuff like that. We've 678 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 3: got some other guests that'll be joining in, probably do 679 00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 3: some history of Christmas stuff here as well as we 680 00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 3: get later on in the week, because you know, why not. 681 00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,920 Speaker 3: I'm excited about all of that. The team right now 682 00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 3: weighing in and saying, no, we've got Chip Roy tomorrow. 683 00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:56,440 Speaker 3: Oh that's great. But my team in New York, there 684 00:33:56,440 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 3: are at least a few of you that are saying you 685 00:33:58,120 --> 00:34:01,600 Speaker 3: like both eggnog and strawberry eye cream, and I just 686 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:02,600 Speaker 3: this is what I gotta say. 687 00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: Guys, we are a civilized people. Eggnog and strawberry ice cream. 688 00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 1: This is madness.