Speaker 1: Scrubbing In with Beccatilly and Tanya red An iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 2: Hello Everybody, we are scrubbing In, Yes.
Speaker 1: We are, and today's guest is best known for his
Speaker 1: role as the interior design expert on the Netflix series
Speaker 1: Queer I.
Speaker 2: He grew up in Missouri in the middle of Amish
Speaker 2: farm country, where he experienced a difficult childhood being gay,
Speaker 2: facing external and internal homophobia. He left home at the
Speaker 2: age of fifteen and landed in Springfield, Missouri, where he
Speaker 2: got a job at Applebee's and slept in his car.
Speaker 1: Having worked many jobs across the country, including at Restoration, Hardware,
Speaker 1: Bed Bath and Beyond, and then Portico Home and Spa,
Speaker 1: he eventually launched his online home store in two thousand
Speaker 1: and six, opening his first store in Soho a year later.
Speaker 2: He went on to appear on television networks such as HGTV,
Speaker 2: NBCCBS and Bravo, and has been on Queer Eye since
Speaker 2: twenty eighteen.
Speaker 1: He is promoting his new book Right at Home, How
Speaker 1: Good Design Is Good for the Mind, and It's available
Speaker 1: September twelfth.
Speaker 2: Please welcome Bobby Burke.
Speaker 3: Wait.
Speaker 1: I think in the intro we should add before we
Speaker 1: say please we should say, and we just want to
Speaker 1: heads up. We can't ask him anything about Queerie because
Speaker 1: I feel we should say.
Speaker 4: At the very top.
Speaker 1: He is promoting his new book right at Home, How
Speaker 1: Good Design Is Good for the Mind, that's available September twelfth,
Speaker 1: and we just wanted a disclaimer because of the sag
Speaker 1: after strikes, we cannot ask Bobby anything about Queer Eye.
Speaker 1: He can't even talk about it. So spoiler alert.
Speaker 4: You won't be hearing anything about queer Ie because he
Speaker 4: cannot speak on it.
Speaker 2: Yes, so please welcome Bobby Bird. Bobby, We're so happy
Speaker 2: to have you here.
Speaker 3: Thank you.
Speaker 2: You were just talking about your podcast voice. It's very
Speaker 2: TV voice.
Speaker 4: It was a regular voice.
Speaker 3: I think some we're in the middle.
Speaker 4: This is the podcast Boyture giving us right now?
Speaker 3: It is it the podcast? I don't know. I don't know.
Speaker 2: It's not your Yah, I don't know.
Speaker 5: I can't tell myself.
Speaker 2: So many different mediums.
Speaker 3: I'm not allowed to do that right now, So I'll stop.
Speaker 2: I can't talk anything about that. We already gave the
Speaker 2: people a warning. Yes, but we are so excited. You know,
Speaker 2: we have kind of a connection that you might.
Speaker 3: Not know about.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 3: Wow, this is you took a twenty three and me
Speaker 3: and we are.
Speaker 2: Just kidding. So my girlfriend is Haley Kyoko, and y'all
Speaker 2: were in a Taylor Switch music video together. I don't
Speaker 2: know if y'all filmed at the same time.
Speaker 6: When you were, like y'all were in what I was like,
Speaker 6: I was in something with her and didn't see her.
Speaker 3: I love her. No.
Speaker 6: So the funny thing is like that video looks like
Speaker 6: we're all there together, but we're not. Like even Tan
Speaker 6: So Tan was actually filming the finale of Next and
Speaker 6: Fashion Season one that day, so he wasn't even there.
Speaker 6: His little teacup thing was like green screen in a studio.
Speaker 6: It looked like he was walking by us, but he
Speaker 6: wasn't there at all.
Speaker 2: Wow.
Speaker 6: So there's so many amazing people in that video that
Speaker 6: they're like, oh my god, blah blah blah blah, And
Speaker 6: I was like, no, yeah, no, we didn't if you
Speaker 6: were filming like that day together, like we were all
Speaker 6: in one big tent, so we like we got to
Speaker 6: meet some people. But yeah, no, there's a lot of
Speaker 6: people that just did their little parts from a green
Speaker 6: screen wherever they were in the world at the time.
Speaker 4: That's wild.
Speaker 2: And we're in the video.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, was she out.
Speaker 6: On the ranch filming and really oh nice? Yeah, must
Speaker 6: have been another I think it was like a four
Speaker 6: day shoot.
Speaker 4: Wow.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was quite the video.
Speaker 3: It was. Yeah, it's quit the video.
Speaker 2: But we're so excited to have you here because I
Speaker 2: feel like I resonated. So I've resonated so much with
Speaker 2: a lot of your story that you've talked about growing
Speaker 2: up been a very like conservative Christian background, and I'm
Speaker 2: from Louisiana. I grew up in the same you know,
Speaker 2: same background, and.
Speaker 6: There was a family like all my twenty three and
Speaker 6: meter it could because literally all my family's from Louisiana.
Speaker 3: Oh it could be. You could be.
Speaker 6: It could be like Lance and Brittany and we find
Speaker 6: out where cousins like, yeah, well they're Alabama.
Speaker 2: But it's not much okay, you know what.
Speaker 3: We could be brothers. We could be brothers.
Speaker 2: You never know. But I remember you talking about like
Speaker 2: there was a moment where you walked into a church
Speaker 2: and you were kind of like, this is a lot
Speaker 2: for me because I was.
Speaker 3: I wouldn't walk into the church.
Speaker 2: I think, oh, yeah, you want to walk into the church.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I actually got a lot of trouble for that
Speaker 3: that day. Really.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I won't say who, but somebody high up was
Speaker 6: very angry at me. They thought I was being very disrespectful.
Speaker 6: They thought I just wasn't doing my job. Joke on them.
Speaker 6: It became one of the most iconic moments of the
Speaker 6: whole series. Yeah, but yeah, they were mad at me
Speaker 6: for not just playing along and doing it. Even though
Speaker 6: that person when we had our first lunch before we
Speaker 6: ever started filming, was like, all right, you know, is
Speaker 6: there anything Is there anything in the world like you
Speaker 6: won't do? And I'm like, I mean within reason, No,
Speaker 6: I mean I'm down for anything. I'm like, except just
Speaker 6: don't ask me to go on a church And so
Speaker 6: I was like, yeah, I'm like, I told you. The
Speaker 6: funny thing is, well, that episode was actually not supposed
Speaker 6: to be filmed. So there was somebody else in that
Speaker 6: little town of Gay, Georgia who was supposed to be
Speaker 6: the hero that week, and they had a medical emergency
Speaker 6: and so Mam and Tammy they had talked to her
Speaker 6: a little Actually, no, they hadn't talked to her. She
Speaker 6: was like a last minute edition. And that was actually
Speaker 6: the last episode we were filming of that entire season,
Speaker 6: and so they kind of like threw it on. They
Speaker 6: tried to hide it. They told me I was doing
Speaker 6: a community center what which it was a community center
Speaker 6: but out of church. And it was my art director
Speaker 6: who like pulled me aside and.
Speaker 2: He was like, get the church.
Speaker 3: Don't believe them. And so it took a few days.
Speaker 6: Of kind of twisting my arm and honestly forcing me
Speaker 6: to do it because I was like, I'm not doing
Speaker 6: this episode.
Speaker 3: I'm like, this is the one thing I told you guys.
Speaker 2: I would something they do on The Bachelor where they're like,
Speaker 2: what's your biggest fear that you would never want to do?
Speaker 2: And they're like, skydive and then their date is going skydiving.
Speaker 4: Dark.
Speaker 2: But I did, I really I not. I haven't you know.
Speaker 2: I don't know that I have experienced the trauma that
Speaker 2: you have in terms of not wanting to go to
Speaker 2: a church. But just like once I met my girlfriend
Speaker 2: and it was like navigating my belief system when I
Speaker 2: believe in my background and how I grew up, and
Speaker 2: it was I just remember watching that being like, oh
Speaker 2: my gosh, this is so powerful to see someone having
Speaker 2: this experience and talking about it. Because it's very vulnerable,
Speaker 2: it's very emotional, it's very heavy and sorry that they
Speaker 2: tricked you. But it was impact TV.
Speaker 6: Thank you, thank you in the end. It in the end,
Speaker 6: it was a great moment, you know, in the end it.
Speaker 6: I think that moment kind of really helped a lot
Speaker 6: of people be kind of have permission to have those
Speaker 6: type of boundaries and draw those type of lines with
Speaker 6: the trauma that they experienced growing up and be okay
Speaker 6: with it, be okay with not being okay with the
Speaker 6: trauma that you grew up with.
Speaker 2: Yeah, how did you go from being in like a
Speaker 2: small town in Missouri to being on a TV show?
Speaker 2: Like how did that? Where?
Speaker 6: It was the trajectory, I mean, this is how much
Speaker 6: time do we Because.
Speaker 4: I was like, you got like, let go from your
Speaker 4: job at restoration.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I've been fired from every job I've ever had.
Speaker 6: I think really almost yeah, christ Teagan and I always
Speaker 6: like have that in comment.
Speaker 3: She's like, I've been fired from every job I've ever had.
Speaker 3: I was like, oh my god, me too.
Speaker 6: I think so I actually got fired for Restoration Hardware.
Speaker 6: While Tom Felicia, the original guy that had my job
Speaker 6: on the original Queer Eye was filming in the in
Speaker 6: the in the store. The long story wasn't anything crazy.
Speaker 6: I just I changed my own time in the system
Speaker 6: because I was there overnight, like making sure the store
Speaker 6: was perfect. And I went in the next day and
Speaker 6: I we had forgot to clock out the night before,
Speaker 6: and I noticed that the GM had just clocked us
Speaker 6: all out at the time that we were supposed to leave,
Speaker 6: but we had all worked hours later. So I went
Speaker 6: in and fixed everyone's time, including my own. And I
Speaker 6: had just let somebody go the week before for doing
Speaker 6: that because it was completely against company policy and somebody
Speaker 6: narked on me, and so.
Speaker 4: I always do.
Speaker 6: Yeah I know who it was too, with some other
Speaker 6: bitch who wanted my job. Yeah, so the GM, like
Speaker 6: on a technicality, had to fire me. But like her
Speaker 6: and I have stayed friends all this time. So when
Speaker 6: I when I went on Queer Eye, she actually was like,
Speaker 6: aren't you glad I fired you?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 2: Was that your job before? Well, like, because no, you
Speaker 2: had was was restoration before Queer before Queer Eyes?
Speaker 6: Oh the restation was like two thousand and four, Okay, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 6: a long way way before Queer I twenty almost twenty
Speaker 6: years before.
Speaker 1: Actually, how did you keep going, like after you kept
Speaker 1: getting like let go from all these jobs?
Speaker 4: What kept you going?
Speaker 3: I mean hunger, needing to pay rent?
Speaker 6: Yeah, like never having a security blanket or a net
Speaker 6: to fall back on.
Speaker 3: Like what kept me going was, yeah, needing to pay
Speaker 3: my bills.
Speaker 4: So interesting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I know everyone's like, what gave you drive?
Speaker 6: I'm like food, shelter, yeah, shelter yeah. Yeah, the yearning
Speaker 6: to go out every once.
Speaker 4: In a while.
Speaker 2: I have an expensive cocktail.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 6: When I worked at Resto then I brought home twenty
Speaker 6: two hundred dollars a month. My rent was twenty one hundred.
Speaker 6: I lived on one hundred bucks a month, yeah, my rent,
Speaker 6: and it included utilities how yeah like dollar chicken sandwiches
Speaker 6: a day.
Speaker 3: Like I was so thin.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I remember. I remember one day actually working there.
Speaker 6: I was walking up these steps and like my pants
Speaker 6: fell down at restoration Art because I was so thin
Speaker 6: and I couldn't afford to get a belt, so I
Speaker 6: was always like holding my pants up. But I was
Speaker 6: carrying these boxes and my pants slipped down because I
Speaker 6: had lost so much weight.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Wow, but I wanted to be in New York, so.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean that's the thing. It's like, you do
Speaker 2: what you have to do. I mean, that is a
Speaker 2: wild though. You're like, I have one hundred dollars after
Speaker 2: I pay rent and utilities, and I have one sandwich. Yeah.
Speaker 6: Well I would get a sandwich and I would eat
Speaker 6: like half for lunch and then I would save the
Speaker 6: other half for dinner.
Speaker 2: Wow. Yeah, do you do like home renovation design outside.
Speaker 6: Of Yeah, I have a full Okay, that's what no.
Speaker 6: I did before Queer Eye. That's where I got the job.
Speaker 2: Oh that's what I was gonna say. Okay, so what
Speaker 2: was the path of Like were you already doing that
Speaker 2: when you were at restoration, like doing like side things.
Speaker 6: I was a design manager, so I was in charge
Speaker 6: of merchandising, so like making sure the store looked good,
Speaker 6: like setting up the displays. So I always had kind
Speaker 6: of an eye for that. And then I went to
Speaker 6: bed Bath Beyond that was horrible. And then I ended
Speaker 6: up at an Italian linen company and that was horrible.
Speaker 6: And then I worked at a company called Portico, which
Speaker 6: was a high end furniture company. I had about a
Speaker 6: dozen stores around the US, and I worked my way
Speaker 6: up excuse me, from like store manager to a creative
Speaker 6: director in the end, and that company ended up going bankrupt,
Speaker 6: not because I was running like I became creative director
Speaker 6: and then it went bankrupt, but when that company would
Speaker 6: make up, I had also built their e commerce division,
Speaker 6: and so that night when the company went under, I
Speaker 6: actually went in and this cloned the whole database that
Speaker 6: I had created for that company, and I registered Bobby
Speaker 6: Burke home dot com and I launched Bobby Broke home
Speaker 6: dot Com that night, being like, maybe I'll sell a
Speaker 6: sofa to while I look for another job. But it
Speaker 6: actually became quite successful. I was one of the first
Speaker 6: retailers in the world selling furniture online. My actually biggest
Speaker 6: hurdle was getting manufacturers to let me carry their product,
Speaker 6: because they're like, no one's going to buy furniture online.
Speaker 6: You're just gonna piss off our brick and mortar stores.
Speaker 6: So I two years later, I actually ended up opening
Speaker 6: up my first brick and mortar store, and so just
Speaker 6: so I could get the product I want wanted and
Speaker 6: so like, oh, if you have a brick and mortar store,
Speaker 6: we'll let you carry our stuff. Yeah, So then I
Speaker 6: started opening up more stores. I had stores in La Atlanta, Miami,
Speaker 6: and New York. And so I built that brand for
Speaker 6: about eight or nine years, and then my design firm
Speaker 6: started being more of a focus. So as leases were up,
Speaker 6: I started getting out of retail because retails, oh yeah,
Speaker 6: And the goal was never to be in retail. The
Speaker 6: goal was to use retails storefronts to build my brand
Speaker 6: name into license and design.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 6: And so twenty fifteen, my husband and I decided to
Speaker 6: move to LA and I was focusing to solely on
Speaker 6: my licensing business and my design business. And then twenty
Speaker 6: end of twenty sixteen, I started getting calls asking me
Speaker 6: to audition for QUEERAI and so I did a couple
Speaker 6: like virtual Skype. Yeah, you know, it was before pandemic,
Speaker 6: so Skype was the only thing you could do for video.
Speaker 6: Some Skype auditions, which I thought all went horrible, but
Speaker 6: I kept getting asked to do more, and then I
Speaker 6: got asked to come to in person auditions. The funny
Speaker 6: thing is I actually had a trip to Spain planned
Speaker 6: that week, and I was like, there's.
Speaker 3: No way I'm getting the show.
Speaker 6: I'm going to Spain, Like I'm not gonna add it
Speaker 6: was this tile company, Porcelonosa, was like bringing me to
Speaker 6: Spain and paying for everything, and like it was this amazing,
Speaker 6: once in a lifetime trip and I'm like, yeah, I'm
Speaker 6: not going to pass up this trip to go audition
Speaker 6: for show. There's that There's no way I'm going to
Speaker 6: get But luckily audition started on Wednesday night and I
Speaker 6: wasn't supposed to leave for Spain until Friday morning. So
Speaker 6: I'm like, all right, I'll go to the first two
Speaker 6: days and yeah, late late, at like one o'clock in
Speaker 6: the morning on Thursday night, because they told me like,
Speaker 6: we'll give you a call back if you're gonna come
Speaker 6: in Friday. If not, you just won't hear from us.
Speaker 6: And so at like midnight, I'm like, all right, well
Speaker 6: I'm going to Spain. I haven't heard from them. And
Speaker 6: then at like one one thirty in the morning, my
Speaker 6: phone ring and they're like, hey, we want you to
Speaker 6: come back for the final day. Oh so I wanted
Speaker 6: luckily canceled Spain.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and now you're not eating chicken sandwiches anymore.
Speaker 3: No, I am only because I want to.
Speaker 2: One for lunch and the whole one for there.
Speaker 1: What does your day to day look like? Now, Like,
Speaker 1: what's a typical day for you.
Speaker 6: It varies, which is what I love. You know, I
Speaker 6: used to when I had my stores. I was in
Speaker 6: my stores, you know, three hundred and sixty three days
Speaker 6: a year, except Thanksgiving and Christmas because that's the only
Speaker 6: days you're open.
Speaker 3: Which those days always pissed me off because.
Speaker 6: I'm like, I still have to pay rent, yeah, but
Speaker 6: I can't open my stores. I'm like, landlord, why don't
Speaker 6: you give me those two days for free? It didn't
Speaker 6: worry that way, so, you know, back then, I worked
Speaker 6: seven days a week, you know, eighteen hour days on
Speaker 6: my store, and then my design firm, I was there,
Speaker 6: you know, five to six days a week every day.
Speaker 6: Now it varies. You know, I have a really great
Speaker 6: team at my design firm, so I don't have to
Speaker 6: deal with the day to day of it. I'm just
Speaker 6: kind of like a creative head I made. You know,
Speaker 6: There's some projects I'm like heavily involved in and then
Speaker 6: some really I'm not involved in at all anymore. And
Speaker 6: then I also have a marketing department at my company
Speaker 6: that we deal with brand partnerships and social and things
Speaker 6: like that. And then a lot of this like doing
Speaker 6: interviews and podcasts, and shows and random game shows and
Speaker 6: then filming other shows and yeah, so's it varies. Like
Speaker 6: there's some days where I won't be doing anything and
Speaker 6: I can just like have some chill time, which I
Speaker 6: didn't used to be okay with, going from somebody who
Speaker 6: worked like seven days a week up until the pandemic,
Speaker 6: that's all I could do.
Speaker 3: Like if I just didn't do something for an afternoon,
Speaker 3: I would feel like, oh, I'm like, oh my god,
Speaker 3: I'm so lazy. I'm not doing the most.
Speaker 6: Yeah, and then COVID came and I'm like, oh my god, yeah, no,
Speaker 6: I'm And.
Speaker 3: Now sometimes I get annoyed.
Speaker 6: I'm like, how do I have something four days this week?
Speaker 3: What is this?
Speaker 6: Because I'd also like today, my day started really early
Speaker 6: and it goes really late today and I'm packed all
Speaker 6: over the place, And I would prefer that instead of.
Speaker 3: Like, oh, you've got like one interview in the afternoon.
Speaker 6: I'm like, don't ruin a beautiful day by putting one
Speaker 6: thing of work right.
Speaker 3: Back it all into one.
Speaker 6: I'm fine with having a busy day, And like a
Speaker 6: line at my PR firms are always like, are you're
Speaker 6: sure you want all that one day? I'm like, yes, absolutely,
Speaker 6: I don't want to get camera ready for one interview. Yeah,
Speaker 6: pack them all in there. I can switch shirt so
Speaker 6: I'll never know.
Speaker 3: It's one day.
Speaker 4: So funny, it's so funny.
Speaker 1: It was the exact same way like I felt before
Speaker 1: the pandemic, like I had to just keep going.
Speaker 4: It was pretty crazy.
Speaker 3: It's horrible for your mental health. Yeah, yeah, now I
Speaker 3: think we all all realize we need to prioritize them.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and then when did you start writing this book?
Speaker 6: So this has been an idea I've had for quite
Speaker 6: a few years. When the show came out, everybody wanted
Speaker 6: me to do like a memoir design book, and I'm
Speaker 6: not ready to do a memoir like I've had. You know,
Speaker 6: I've had an interesting pass. I don't need to put
Speaker 6: all that out there yet. Yeah, I don't need to
Speaker 6: ruin those brand deals yet. And a design book I
Speaker 6: didn't really want to do because design books are pretty
Speaker 6: you know, there's tens of thousands of them out there,
Speaker 6: and they're all amazing, they're all wonderful, But design books
Speaker 6: are expensive to make because there's.
Speaker 3: A lot of photography that goes into it.
Speaker 6: There's a lot of photo shoots, there's a lot of
Speaker 6: photos to pay for. There's a lot of set direction
Speaker 6: and design to pay for, so it makes it an
Speaker 6: expensive book and I didn't want to make this pretty
Speaker 6: coffee table book where Honestly, a lot of times those
Speaker 6: books also just really make you feel bad about your
Speaker 6: space because they show these big, beautifl spaces that are
Speaker 6: really unattainable for most people. So and again I'm not
Speaker 6: knocking those.
Speaker 3: I love those.
Speaker 6: There's lots of inspiration, but I really wanted to do
Speaker 6: a book, like with my show, that helps people and
Speaker 6: really makes them think about how design affects not just
Speaker 6: the way their home looks, but the way their home
Speaker 6: makes them feel. So during the filming of my show,
Speaker 6: I started noticing like tall tale signs of depression in people's.
Speaker 4: Homes, and what are those signs?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 6: You know, when I would walk in and I would
Speaker 6: see piles of laundry in a bedroom, I'm like, I
Speaker 6: think we're dealing with depression here, and you were like, what,
Speaker 6: piles of laundry doesn't mean you're depressed. I'm like, you're right,
Speaker 6: it doesn't, but it can. You know, it's if you
Speaker 6: think of accomplishing laundry, you know, as an accomplishment. And
Speaker 6: when you go to bed at night and you see
Speaker 6: that pile of laundry sitting on the floor, and you
Speaker 6: think to yourself, ah, I told myself I was going
Speaker 6: to do that, but I didn't. So you go to
Speaker 6: bed with a notch of failure. And then when you
Speaker 6: wake up the next day, the very first thing you're
Speaker 6: confronted with is literally that pile of failure, and you.
Speaker 3: Don't think much of it.
Speaker 6: It's not like this huge nail, ghastly failure, but your
Speaker 6: brain starts your day off with a, oh, that was
Speaker 6: something I told myself I was going to accomplish and
Speaker 6: I didn't. So when you get to work, your brain
Speaker 6: is already kind of on that the road of not
Speaker 6: accomplishing things, you know, so little things like that, and
Speaker 6: even like making your bed in the morning, I know,
Speaker 6: it's not this huge accomplishment, it's this big thing you're accomplishing.
Speaker 6: But again, you make your bed and you've got that
Speaker 6: little notch of accomplishment, and you you're training your brain
Speaker 6: that you are going to succeed at the things today
Speaker 6: that you told yourself you're going to do, and by
Speaker 6: the time you get to work, your mind is already
Speaker 6: being pre programmed, like your car battery. I don't know
Speaker 6: if you guys drive electric, but if you put in
Speaker 6: an electric charging station, your car will automatically say, because
Speaker 6: it knows it's about to get charged, pre conditioning battery
Speaker 6: for charging. So it's pre conditioning that battery for success.
Speaker 6: That's what you're doing with these little things in your home.
Speaker 6: You're preconditioning your mind for success for.
Speaker 3: The rest of the day.
Speaker 2: I love that I do make my bed every day,
Speaker 2: and I also have a hell of laundry in my bedroom.
Speaker 2: I'm balanced.
Speaker 4: I'm like such a firm believer in that too.
Speaker 1: And like so I have an apartment that's mine and
Speaker 1: I like designed it to be exactly what I wanted
Speaker 1: to be, and I like felt so badass in that apartment,
Speaker 1: like it was all mine. It was all my design,
Speaker 1: Like I just was put together. And I have a
Speaker 1: boyfriend that I don't live with him officially, but I
Speaker 1: basically like live with him.
Speaker 4: I just haven't like this is this is a whole
Speaker 4: other time.
Speaker 1: You could talk to me for days about that, but
Speaker 1: I can't give up my apartment until I'm engaged.
Speaker 4: I just feel very strongly about that.
Speaker 6: But Anyways, I got to give him an ultimatum. Well
Speaker 6: he knows that watching ultimatum.
Speaker 4: We actually started watching it and he was like, this
Speaker 4: is probably not the best.
Speaker 2: Show for us to watch it.
Speaker 3: I'm that type of television.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's very empty. The house is just like
Speaker 1: very empty. There's nothing in it. And I'm like, there's
Speaker 1: something that's making me like I when I move my
Speaker 1: stuff over, I will you know, make it more of
Speaker 1: like my space. But I'm like, there is something about
Speaker 1: the way that you live Like I'm like, I feel
Speaker 1: empty because my home feels empty. It's such a subconscious thing.
Speaker 1: Like the space that you live in is so important,
Speaker 1: and like when we have just stuff everywhere, we're going
Speaker 1: to feel suffocated in life.
Speaker 6: Well, think of your home as like your phone charger.
Speaker 6: You know, if you don't plug your phone in every night,
Speaker 6: or if there's a short in that court, or you
Speaker 6: don't get it in all the way, your phone doesn't
Speaker 6: get fully charged, and what happens to it doesn't make
Speaker 6: it through the next day it does. Your home should
Speaker 6: be recharging you fully.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 6: When people are asking me all the time, like, oh,
Speaker 6: how should I design my home? What are the trends,
Speaker 6: and I'm like, the trend is whatever makes you happy.
Speaker 6: And like the first chapter in the book is talking
Speaker 6: about the literally it says, let's normalize not asking people
Speaker 6: what their design aesthetic is because your design aesthetic doesn't matter.
Speaker 6: It's not what your design aesthetic is. It's let's normalize
Speaker 6: asking people what makes them happy, because putting things in
Speaker 6: your home that make you happy is what's really going
Speaker 6: to cultivate a space that really recharges you. And if
Speaker 6: that ugly purple credenza from antch Gertrude makes you, put
Speaker 6: it in your house. It's about that eye.
Speaker 3: And if it doesn't, yeah, don't take yeah, exactly get
Speaker 3: rid of it.
Speaker 1: If somebody like, okay, if somebody's starting out, I guess
Speaker 1: I could say me, I'm not I'm designed for dummies.
Speaker 4: It's not my thing.
Speaker 1: It's like I just don't have that they I don't have.
Speaker 4: The eye, I don't have the touch.
Speaker 1: What's something that can really kind of like transform your
Speaker 1: home or your space like design for dummies?
Speaker 6: Well, a lot of times people, you know, going back
Speaker 6: to the design aesthetic, you know, they don't know because
Speaker 6: just like you, it's like design's not on the forefront
Speaker 6: of their mind, Like that's not what they do. They
Speaker 6: think they don't have an eye for it. But it's
Speaker 6: all about just figuring out the things in life that
Speaker 6: make you happy. Like years ago, there was a client
Speaker 6: on the show that you know, he had inherited his
Speaker 6: grandmother's house from the seventies, Like she had an amazing style,
Speaker 6: but it was not the style of a twenty seven
Speaker 6: year old bachelor. And so I asked him. I was like,
Speaker 6: you know, what's your favorite show? And he's like, mad Men.
Speaker 6: I'm like, okay, fifties, And like what's your dream vacation
Speaker 6: and he's like Cuba. I'm like, also stuck in the fifties.
Speaker 6: So I did his home in mid century modern and
Speaker 6: put this really mural of a havana in there, and
Speaker 6: did like, you know, some banana leaf wallpaper, and he's like,
Speaker 6: oh my god, how did you get in my head?
Speaker 6: Like this is exactly what I wanted, even though I
Speaker 6: had no idea exactly what I wanted. I'm like, I
Speaker 6: asked you about the things that you're passionate about in life,
Speaker 6: because those are what you should fill your home with.
Speaker 6: So like, think about what your favorite article of clothing is.
Speaker 6: If it's like a worn leather jacket, then you'll probably
Speaker 6: like leather accents in your home. Or if it's a
Speaker 6: you know, a chunky knit sweater, then you'll probably like
Speaker 6: chunky nit pillows or throws and like those are the
Speaker 6: things that are gonna make you happy in your home.
Speaker 6: So start with thinking about dream vacations, favorite movies, favorite shows.
Speaker 3: You know, think about what you like about those, and
Speaker 3: that will help you figure out what you like to
Speaker 3: put in your home.
Speaker 4: Mm hmm.
Speaker 2: What if you're someone who thinks set a white couch
Speaker 2: is going to make them happy, and then you get
Speaker 2: the white couch and you realize that it is a absolute
Speaker 2: pain and you can't keep it clean, like myself, what
Speaker 2: do you say to that person?
Speaker 3: Be cleaner?
Speaker 2: Like I have a little dog and like her little
Speaker 2: pawprins just like going outside, they get on there.
Speaker 3: I have a white sofa and I have a little dog.
Speaker 6: How do you keep I buy a sofa with removable
Speaker 6: cushions so they can be washed.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, don't you have that?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Take off?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean she gets a dirty sometimes, but I
Speaker 6: just take the cushions off every few months. Yeah, But like,
Speaker 6: don't ever if you have a pet, you know, don't
Speaker 6: buy a white sofa that doesn't have removable cushions.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Like there's a sofa I'm dying to get from
Speaker 6: this company in Australia called Jardin and this is so beautiful,
Speaker 6: but like it's all tight back and tight cushion, which
Speaker 6: means like the fabric is just like part of the sofa.
Speaker 6: There's nothing that's removable, And I'm like, no, I can't
Speaker 6: have that, you know, And you have to think about
Speaker 6: things that are in your life when you're doing design,
Speaker 6: Like what part of the book it's all about function,
Speaker 6: you know, figuring out how things need to function in
Speaker 6: your life because function is the mother of design. Like,
Speaker 6: when I'm going into somebody's home, the first thing I
Speaker 6: think about is how the space needs to function, not
Speaker 6: about how it's going to look, because if it's dysfunctional,
Speaker 6: that's the thing that's going to cause frustration and annoyance
Speaker 6: and anger and you know, strife with your relationship with
Speaker 6: your partners and your kids because you're frustrated that your
Speaker 6: space isn't working for you. Like one of the chapters
Speaker 6: is there's a little room guide in every single chapter,
Speaker 6: And one of them is for the kitchen, and it's
Speaker 6: like your kitchen should be the sous chef, Like your
Speaker 6: kitchen should be set up in a way that you
Speaker 6: don't necessarily need somebody helping you. Like, your kitchen should
Speaker 6: be organized in a way that everything you need is
Speaker 6: right there and accessible.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 6: So like there's something like the you know, the single
Speaker 6: arm test, if you can, if it's something that you
Speaker 6: use often, you should be.
Speaker 3: Able to reach it without having to pull a chair out.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 6: Obviously there's some smaller spaces that that's just not possible,
Speaker 6: but you know, there's there's good advice in there for
Speaker 6: for everybody, even small spaces.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2: I think I thought I think I was thinking, oh,
Speaker 2: I don't have kids, phoebe my dogs, I know, but
Speaker 2: like I don't have like a you know. And then
Speaker 2: I just started noticing. I was like, this feels.
Speaker 3: You can also I don't know, like wash her feet.
Speaker 2: Her feet, it's like the it's like something about whatever
Speaker 2: whenever her paws ge Like what I know, it's impossible.
Speaker 1: I'm so like I I'm a clean freak, and I
Speaker 1: would like anytime my dog will go outside, i'd wipe
Speaker 1: her feet when she came back.
Speaker 3: I used to not anyone.
Speaker 4: No, you just can't. Every time she wants to go outside,
Speaker 4: it's like.
Speaker 6: It's like your parents who have like one kid, they
Speaker 6: do like sanitize everything, and then the first one comes along,
Speaker 6: there's like throw their food on the ground.
Speaker 3: They're like, here you go your that.
Speaker 1: Literally, I try to get shoes for my dog. So
Speaker 1: anytime I took her out that she would like put
Speaker 1: her shoes on.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have those too, and she hated them. Yeah,
Speaker 3: She's like, what.
Speaker 4: Are you doing to me?
Speaker 2: She just lay down.
Speaker 4: She's like, I'm not having anything.
Speaker 6: We had a French of years ago that we would
Speaker 6: We lived in New York, so you had to take
Speaker 6: her outside, you know, there was no yard, and so
Speaker 6: when it was rainy, we would put a clothes on
Speaker 6: her and stuff and she would just stand there and
Speaker 6: refuse to ye, no, get this.
Speaker 3: Off of me.
Speaker 2: So yeah, and that's what Phoebe does too. She just
Speaker 2: stares at me like, how dare you? How did you
Speaker 2: meet your husband online? Online?
Speaker 6: Which one gay dot com? This was two thousand and four, girl,
Speaker 6: Oh it's long long gone.
Speaker 4: Oh wow.
Speaker 6: The funny thing is it now forwards to the the
Speaker 6: Los Angeles LGBTQ Center is apparently like whoever owned it
Speaker 6: got in like huge trouble with taxes, and so as
Speaker 6: part of their penance, they had to like donate things
Speaker 6: to charity, and that they donated the domain to the
Speaker 6: LGBTQ s. LGBTQ Center has done anything with it yet.
Speaker 6: I'm like, that's a really great ip that you are
Speaker 6: literally gay.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, we've been together almost twenty years.
Speaker 2: Wow, amazing.
Speaker 4: What's the secret?
Speaker 6: He's the secret? Yeah, being with somebody that can put
Speaker 6: up with you. I don't know, you know, uh, we
Speaker 6: enjoy each other's company, you know, we we This sounds crazy,
Speaker 6: but we don't really do things apart, even though like
Speaker 6: we travel for work, so we're not like with each
Speaker 6: other twenty four to seven. But I know so many
Speaker 6: couples that are like, oh, I have to have my
Speaker 6: boys night or my girl's night a few nights a week,
Speaker 6: the like get away from my spouse. I'm like, if
Speaker 6: you feel they need to have to get away from
Speaker 6: your spouse, like that's not the person you need to
Speaker 6: be with. Like, you know, I can't imagine telling my
Speaker 6: husband and being like I'm gonna go out with my friends. Bye,
Speaker 6: Like that's just not ever been an option in our relationship,
Speaker 6: Like we do things together yea, And I think that's
Speaker 6: been one of the secrets to our relationship is we've
Speaker 6: never grown apart because we've we've always been very conscious
Speaker 6: to not allow that. Yeah, you know, I think it
Speaker 6: can be kind of a slippery sope. And I'm not,
Speaker 6: you know, saying that everybody who needs a girl's night
Speaker 6: out with their friends is in a doomed relationship, right right, Yeah,
Speaker 6: you know, but I think it starts to slippery slope,
Speaker 6: Like the more you do that, the more you know,
Speaker 6: you guys start not spending time with each other.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I was thinking because I did that too, where I
Speaker 2: have to actively go do things with my friends without
Speaker 2: my girlfriend because I could spend every moment with her.
Speaker 2: So I'm like, I have to like make this pun no, no,
Speaker 2: but I feel so grateful that I that we always
Speaker 2: want to be together. But I also am like, I
Speaker 2: want to, you know, nurture these other relationships outside of
Speaker 2: my relationship.
Speaker 6: Yeah, you don't want to be one of those people
Speaker 6: that when they get in a relationship, they just like
Speaker 6: abandon their friends.
Speaker 3: We had a friend like that in.
Speaker 6: New York years ago, and we always knew when he
Speaker 6: was dating somebody because we're like.
Speaker 3: Hell, has anybody heard from Bryce? Yeah, like Bryce must
Speaker 3: have a new boyfriend.
Speaker 6: And then like a couple months later, you start hearing
Speaker 6: from them every day again, I'm like, oh, they broke up.
Speaker 3: And then after a while.
Speaker 6: We're just like weird, just don't answer as called anymore
Speaker 6: because we're clearly not important. So yeah, like it obviously
Speaker 6: is good to cultivate, but you know, our friends, his
Speaker 6: friends became our friends. My friends became our friends. You know,
Speaker 6: Like I can still cultivate the relationships with my friends,
Speaker 6: I just do it with him.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think that's been one of the secrets.
Speaker 3: Is we just every aspect of our life we include
Speaker 3: it with each other.
Speaker 4: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I love that. I mean twenty years, that's like a
Speaker 2: real testament of being with the right person.
Speaker 3: And the funny you know, for years, I traveled a
Speaker 3: lot for work, and so I'm like, for a while,
Speaker 3: my God, is a secret to our relationship is that
Speaker 3: we just you know, were away from each other.
Speaker 6: But then COVID happened and we were together twenty four
Speaker 6: to sevens seven days a week, and we had like one.
Speaker 3: Fight over the three years, and I was like, actually, no,
Speaker 3: that wasn't the secret. Like we can still be with
Speaker 3: each other twenty four to seven and we're still good.
Speaker 2: I didn't ask how y'all how y'all deal with that?
Speaker 2: Because my girlfriend, she's an artist, so she goes on tour.
Speaker 2: I have a real I hate when she's gone, Like
Speaker 2: it's really hard for me.
Speaker 3: So he goes to New York every month for five
Speaker 3: days for work.
Speaker 4: Oh wow.
Speaker 6: And then I used to travel constantly before COVID and
Speaker 6: even when I had my stores, I was always on
Speaker 6: the road. But with my show, like when I'm un traveling,
Speaker 6: he just he makes it. We make an effort to
Speaker 6: see each other every single week. I mean we He
Speaker 6: will fly to wherever I am every single week.
Speaker 2: Oh that's great. Yeah, that's what I have to do too,
Speaker 2: every two weeks. You know.
Speaker 4: I heard the store.
Speaker 1: Ryan always tells a story about when Keith Urban was
Speaker 1: a judge on American Idol.
Speaker 4: There was he do you remember exactly?
Speaker 1: He like it was like he flew to Australia to
Speaker 1: see Nicole for like the night I want to dinner
Speaker 1: with her because they had like film Idol and I'm like,
Speaker 1: that is commitment to your reallyation.
Speaker 3: We we had a date at the airport once because
Speaker 3: he was landing at the airport and I was leaving,
Speaker 3: and so we like, at least work the flights to
Speaker 3: where we could like grab dinner at PF Chains in
Speaker 3: the international terminal, and you know, you you have to
Speaker 3: make an effort.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love PF Changs.
Speaker 4: It's a great day spot.
Speaker 5: Love.
Speaker 2: What is your dream like moving forward? You have the book,
Speaker 2: you're you've done done the show that we cannot speak of, Like,
Speaker 2: what what's your dream situation? In terms of career wise?
Speaker 6: I would love to do a new design competition show.
Speaker 6: You know, if you guys remember like Design Star from
Speaker 6: back in the day. It's kind of like Project Runway,
Speaker 6: but for design. I want to find the next emerging
Speaker 6: designer and not just for like somebody to have their
Speaker 6: own show, but like the next big home brand, you know,
Speaker 6: the next Joanna Games, you know, the next line that's
Speaker 6: going to be in a major retailer. Like I want
Speaker 6: to do a design show like that, which I would host.
Speaker 2: I feels like something is it already.
Speaker 4: In the yea?
Speaker 6: Maybe people are like, oh, it's because in fashion and
Speaker 6: like actually know, like this is something that that I
Speaker 6: wanted to do long before Tan told us in on
Speaker 6: set one days, like by the way, Loves I got
Speaker 6: my own show, and when he told me, I was like, noll,
Speaker 6: I want to do that too. So yeah, I've been
Speaker 6: like writing challenges for that show for for years.
Speaker 2: And years and years. I so see that for you,
Speaker 2: And I love the idea of seeing someone come up
Speaker 2: and have that moment for themselves. That's really cool fun.
Speaker 6: But I definitely wanted to be a show where you know,
Speaker 6: the ones back in the day, they're all like kind
Speaker 6: of like white box challenges. It's all shot in a studio,
Speaker 6: you know. I want to do it like out in
Speaker 6: the real world, like designing real homes, designing hotel rooms.
Speaker 3: You know, actually like out there in the world.
Speaker 6: Hopefully internationally, although studios are not spending any money on budget,
Speaker 6: so I don't know when you knew that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love the idea of a hotel, like see
Speaker 2: who's going to design the look for the hotel exactly?
Speaker 5: That is cool.
Speaker 1: We're going to be praying for that for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you so much for taking time out of
Speaker 2: your schedule to scrub in with us.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and tell everybody where they can get your book.
Speaker 6: You can go to Bobby Burk dot com slash book
Speaker 6: and you can find a list of retailers there. Please
Speaker 6: buy from small book retailers. I mean, we love the
Speaker 6: big retailers, but support the small booksellers.
Speaker 3: I love that.
Speaker 2: And where can they follow you? On social media?
Speaker 3: My TikTok and my Instagram is Bobby.
Speaker 6: Just Bobby, Yeah, at Bobby. And then when I people
Speaker 6: are like just Bobby, I'm like, yeah, just Bobby, and
Speaker 6: then they're like, I'm typing in just Bobby.
Speaker 3: I know it's just atye.
Speaker 6: Yeah, my threads, my TikTok, and my Instagram all that's thanks.
Speaker 3: My X is not But does it even really matter anymore?
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 4: I like still forget that it's X. Like I was
Speaker 4: like looking for it the other day and I'm like,
Speaker 4: where's my.
Speaker 3: I mean, that's that's a whole other episode. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank goodness, the destruction of an amazing brand.
Speaker 5: I have one quick question for you, Bobby.
Speaker 3: I'm sorry.
Speaker 5: My wife and I are restoring this like one hundred
Speaker 5: year old craftsman. I'll do it, yeah, the hard way.
Speaker 5: We've been in white paint colors for a very long time.
Speaker 5: We're in Minrovia near Pasadena.
Speaker 3: Yeah, beautiful craftsman over there.
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's it's great, but it's also a lot of work.
Speaker 5: Uh what's your go to white paint color? Do you
Speaker 5: have one?
Speaker 6: It's Sherman Williams snow something. It's there's a whole article
Speaker 6: on Bobby burg dot com about my favorite white paints.
Speaker 5: Oh there you go, thank you. We're stuck in polar
Speaker 5: bear and I want some other ideas.
Speaker 3: You know, whites are polarizing. You know.
Speaker 6: When we were doing my my offices, we had like
Speaker 6: twenty different white swatches painted up on the wall and
Speaker 6: inside and the outside of the house because it's white
Speaker 6: as well.
Speaker 3: And You're like, all.
Speaker 6: Right, is this white? This is the perfect white on
Speaker 6: the on the exterior. But I'm like, oh, I think
Speaker 6: this might be too reflect for the neighbors. And it's
Speaker 6: like gotta be too bright, you know, And so yeah,
Speaker 6: whites can be hard.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I feel like I see a lot of people
Speaker 2: talk about this and they're like, which white do you
Speaker 2: like the most of them?
Speaker 4: Like they when they put them on a pink.
Speaker 6: Undertone, so them have gray undertones, And you really do
Speaker 6: need to put them up on the wall, and you
Speaker 6: need to see how they look in the light when
Speaker 6: when the light changes throughout the day, because as the
Speaker 6: light changes, you'll start to see the undertone color. And
Speaker 6: again like often, I mean you might want a pink undertone,
Speaker 6: but usually that's not the best white because it's not
Speaker 6: going to go with more modern things. So yeah, put
Speaker 6: up some swatches, like a at least like a twelve
Speaker 6: inch by twelve inch swatch, and so you can see
Speaker 6: the way. And put them up kind of close together
Speaker 6: so you can because it's hard the naked eye. It's
Speaker 6: it's kind of hard sometimes to see the differences in
Speaker 6: the white. You're like, I don't see It's like you know,
Speaker 6: a Terra Tara a Tyra Banks smiles. I'm like, I
Speaker 6: don't see the difference. I don't see what you're doing
Speaker 6: with your eyes, you know, do you.
Speaker 3: See the difference?
Speaker 4: You see what I'm doing?
Speaker 3: Like, no, I don't.
Speaker 2: You know?
Speaker 3: White page it the same way. It's like, do you
Speaker 3: see the difference, And I'm like, no, I don't.
Speaker 6: So put them right up next to each other so
Speaker 6: you can you can exactly see why they are different.
Speaker 2: Last question, what is your one design. I know you
Speaker 2: said it's all about how you feel whatnot. But if
Speaker 2: you just based on like design mind not like how
Speaker 2: you feel emotion, what is your one design? Don't that
Speaker 2: you tell.
Speaker 3: People scale the scale of things? Like I don't really think.
Speaker 6: People always like what's the rules of design? And like
Speaker 6: the rules are there are no rules? Like the rules
Speaker 6: are really what makes you happy and what works for
Speaker 6: your space. But I would say the one thing I
Speaker 6: always cautioned people on is making sure the scale of
Speaker 6: things work for the room, Like because if if furniture
Speaker 6: is too big, yeah, you know, it really creates chaos
Speaker 6: in the space. Like I was at a hotel in
Speaker 6: DC recently and every single piece of furniture in the
Speaker 6: room was exquisite. That they were all too big and
Speaker 6: it made you made you feel like pac Man, like
Speaker 6: going through the room, like and you're stubbing your toe
Speaker 6: and you're hitting your hip and I'm just like God,
Speaker 6: the designer had such good taste that they do not
Speaker 6: understand scale, Like the scale of things need to be right,
Speaker 6: the scale of your rug, the height of lamps.
Speaker 3: You know, like a scale needs.
Speaker 6: To be right for a space to feel good. So
Speaker 6: always look for the right scale of things.
Speaker 2: That's good advice.
Speaker 1: I definitely have to get a copy of your book,
Speaker 1: because again.
Speaker 3: I'd give you this one if it wasn't my only one.
Speaker 4: If anybody wants a book, it's right at home.
Speaker 1: How good design is good for the mind, And it's
Speaker 1: available September twelfth, so everybody order it now, pre order it,
Speaker 1: and let's get you on the New York Times bestseller list.
Speaker 2: Yeah, thank you so much, You so much.