WEBVTT - Palestine and the American University feat. Dana El Kurd

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<v Speaker 1>Col Zone Media.

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<v Speaker 2>Hello everyone, I'm welcome to it can happen here. My

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<v Speaker 2>name is Daniel Kurd, and I'm a writer, analyst, and

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<v Speaker 2>researcher of Palestinian and Arab politics. I'm an associate professor

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<v Speaker 2>of political science and a senior non resident Fellow at

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<v Speaker 2>the Arab Center Washington. I'm also occasional co host of

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<v Speaker 2>The Fire These Times. Today, I want to talk about

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<v Speaker 2>the attacks on American universities in American academia and what

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<v Speaker 2>role Palestine plays in all of this, and maybe end

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<v Speaker 2>on what's being done to stop it. So you may

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<v Speaker 2>or may not have heard about the attacks on universities

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<v Speaker 2>in academia, but given the general onslaught of disastrous news,

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<v Speaker 2>even for those of you who have noted something is

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<v Speaker 2>happening in higher education may not be keeping up with

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<v Speaker 2>the details. So let me give you a brief summary.

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<v Speaker 2>A number of universities, including Harvard, Brown, Columbia, and UCLA,

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<v Speaker 2>have been investigated for campus anti semitism related to pro

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<v Speaker 2>Palestine protests on those campuses over the past two years.

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<v Speaker 2>From there, the Trump administration has escalated by slashing federal

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<v Speaker 2>funding that those universities receive and forcing those universities to

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<v Speaker 2>settle with the administration not only monetarily, but also by

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<v Speaker 2>implementing changes to how their universities are run. So, for example,

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<v Speaker 2>Columbia University agreed to pay the Trump administration two hundred

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<v Speaker 2>and twenty million dollars punish seventy students involved in the

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<v Speaker 2>protests in a variety of ways, including by expelling them,

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<v Speaker 2>and they agreed to monitor and report their programs for

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<v Speaker 2>unlawful DEI goals. That's a quote. One of the ways

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<v Speaker 2>Columbia has agreed to monitor, as the Intercept reported in April,

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<v Speaker 2>is by appointing a vice provost in charge of monitoring

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<v Speaker 2>the Middle Eastern, South Asian and African Studies Department, in

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<v Speaker 2>particular for quote balanced curricula. The faculty in that department

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<v Speaker 2>will no longer run that department, and as the Middle

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<v Speaker 2>East Studies Association, in a statement back in March, noted this,

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<v Speaker 2>placing the department under administrative receivership is a quote fundamental

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<v Speaker 2>abrogation of the autonomy of university governance. This comes at

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<v Speaker 2>a time when the Trump administration has also attacked the

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<v Speaker 2>National Science Foundation, the National Endowment for the Humanities, the

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<v Speaker 2>National Institutes of Health, All of these are federal funding

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<v Speaker 2>sources for the majority of research that happens at universities

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<v Speaker 2>across disciplines the natural sciences, social sciences, humanities. The Trumpet

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<v Speaker 2>administration has also attacked foreign students and the processes by

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<v Speaker 2>which they are able to get visas study in the

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<v Speaker 2>United States, which is just another way to get at

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<v Speaker 2>a major revenue source for many universities. But why is

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<v Speaker 2>the Trump administration doing all this? Here is Vice President JD.

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<v Speaker 2>Vance speaking to the National Conservatism Conference back in twenty

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<v Speaker 2>twenty one.

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<v Speaker 3>We have to honestly and aggressively attack the universities in

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<v Speaker 3>this country. Ladies and gentlemen. The universities do not pursue

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<v Speaker 3>knowledge and truth. They pursued deceit and lies. And it's

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<v Speaker 3>time to be honest about that fact. And we subsidize,

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<v Speaker 3>we support, and in our own ways all of us

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<v Speaker 3>reinforce the power of universities to control our lives and

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<v Speaker 3>control how we live them. So much of what drives

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<v Speaker 3>truth and knowledge as we understand it in this country

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<v Speaker 3>is fundamentally determined by, supported by, and reinforced by the

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<v Speaker 3>universities in this country.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's Vance before him and Trump won the election,

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<v Speaker 2>identifying that universities are sites of power. Therefore, he argues

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<v Speaker 2>very explicitly that conservatives must destroy these sites of power

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<v Speaker 2>or submit them to their will. Our universities truly sites

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<v Speaker 2>of power? The short answer is yes, for two reasons.

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<v Speaker 2>Number One, as Vance himself identifies, universities produce knowledge, and

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<v Speaker 2>that knowledge produce that universities drives in innovation in the

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<v Speaker 2>private sector, in tech, in health, and weapons manufacturing. Universities

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<v Speaker 2>are a main engine of economic growth. In fact, universities

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<v Speaker 2>are part and parcel of American global power. They are

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<v Speaker 2>a major source of that power for the United States,

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<v Speaker 2>whether in the students and scholars they attract, whether for

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<v Speaker 2>their research that they produce that various arms of the

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<v Speaker 2>American government can use, or whether for the legitimization that

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<v Speaker 2>universities provide for certain frameworks like the frame market, liberalism, etc. Etc. So, Really,

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<v Speaker 2>universities largely generate power for the powers that be. But

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<v Speaker 2>sometimes universities are also sites of power that can challenge orthodoxies.

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<v Speaker 2>With greater inclusion of scholars and students from a variety

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<v Speaker 2>of backgrounds, we get a diversity of thought, and because

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<v Speaker 2>of how universities are supposed to run in theory, as

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<v Speaker 2>governed by faculty and as sites of free inquiry. If

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<v Speaker 2>that means sometimes occasionally knowledge is produced that can challenge

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<v Speaker 2>power too. That sometimes occasional knowledge production is too much

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<v Speaker 2>for the jd vances of today's politics, though, so they're

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<v Speaker 2>cracking down. The number two reason why universities are sites

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<v Speaker 2>of power is because they offer a promise of social mobility.

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<v Speaker 2>And that's generally true too. Even the most modest regional

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<v Speaker 2>public school in America still offer some of the highest

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<v Speaker 2>quality of education you can get around the world. But

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<v Speaker 2>that shot at upward social mobility that you can get

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<v Speaker 2>with the university education is definitely getting harder and costlier

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<v Speaker 2>and less accessible. There's this book by Mark Busque I

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<v Speaker 2>highly recommend reading titled How the University Works. In it,

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<v Speaker 2>the author details how as universities became more corporatized, tuition increased,

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<v Speaker 2>university workers were disempowered, and the value of a degree plummeted.

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<v Speaker 2>And this process started way before Trump. Clifford Ando, professor

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<v Speaker 2>of Classics and history at the University of Chicago, wrote

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<v Speaker 2>for Compact magazine recently on what's happening at the University

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<v Speaker 2>of Chicago right now For those who may be unaware.

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<v Speaker 2>At the University of Chicago, the university is stopping PhD admissions,

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<v Speaker 2>it's increasing enrollment numbers, it's slashing budgets, it's even proposing

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<v Speaker 2>to teach some courses using chat. Gpt Ando argues that

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<v Speaker 2>this current dismantling of University of Chicago that we're witnessing

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<v Speaker 2>is again not Trump related, but can be traced to

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<v Speaker 2>this corporatization of the university, where universities prioritized money making

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<v Speaker 2>technologies and investments and as he writes, quote, fundamentally corroded

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<v Speaker 2>policymaking at universities. So to get a high quality education today,

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<v Speaker 2>at a university that isn't trying to trap you as

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<v Speaker 2>cheap labor or doesn't just use overworked adjuncts to teach

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<v Speaker 2>courses to avoid paying faculty they're worth, you need to

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<v Speaker 2>either come from money, or you need to be highly

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<v Speaker 2>highly exceptional, or you need to accrue exorbitant amounts of debt.

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<v Speaker 2>And yet, and yet, marginalized people still made advances in

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<v Speaker 2>this system. We saw, for example, more African American presidents

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<v Speaker 2>of universities, more women, We saw diversifying scholarship courses, pathways

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<v Speaker 2>for students, as universities became more inclusive. That's what diversity,

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<v Speaker 2>equity and inclusion efforts did. Imperfect as they were, and

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<v Speaker 2>even though the university as an institution continues to exploit labor,

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<v Speaker 2>continues to exploit their own students, often doesn't deliver enough

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<v Speaker 2>on the promise of social mobility. Even delivering a little

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<v Speaker 2>was too much for the Jdvans's of the world. They

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<v Speaker 2>don't want upward social mobility for some Americans, and they

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<v Speaker 2>don't want those challenges to power even at the margins,

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<v Speaker 2>so they're cracking down. The attacks on Harvard, Brown, George Washington, UCLA,

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<v Speaker 2>the list goes on, is predicated on attacking DEI diversity,

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<v Speaker 2>equity and inclusion. Conservatives alleged that universities taking a person's

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<v Speaker 2>background into consideration in admissions or in hiring, or in scholarships, etc.

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<v Speaker 2>All of that violates anti discrimination laws, and our conservative

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<v Speaker 2>Supreme Court, in its recent ruling in the cases of

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<v Speaker 2>Students for Fair Admissions versus University of North Carolina and

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<v Speaker 2>Students for Vera Admissions versus Harvard, agreed they overturned the

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<v Speaker 2>two thousand and three Grutta versus Bullinger case that had

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<v Speaker 2>allowed higher education institutions to consider race and admissions. And

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<v Speaker 2>all of this comes at a time after decades of

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<v Speaker 2>the university as an institution eroded itself. But I would

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<v Speaker 2>say attacking DEI wasn't effective enough, especially after the Black

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<v Speaker 2>Lives Matter movement. Saying DEI is bad is a harder

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<v Speaker 2>sell for an American public fifty one percent of which

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<v Speaker 2>say they support Black Lives Matter, and this was according

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<v Speaker 2>to a twenty twenty three study by the Pew Research Center. Now,

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<v Speaker 2>fifty one percent isn't overwhelming, but it's not nothing either.

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<v Speaker 2>So conservatives to attack the university have had to exploit

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<v Speaker 2>the weaknesses that already exist within the academy. That has

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<v Speaker 2>meant exploiting the way the university as institution has become

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<v Speaker 2>sensitive to money and endowments and donors, and that has

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<v Speaker 2>meant exploiting the way the university has not actually been

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<v Speaker 2>a site of free inquiry or expression for particular people

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<v Speaker 2>and particular topics. And by exploiting and expanding that gap,

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<v Speaker 2>they are now trying to take those freedoms away from everybody.

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<v Speaker 2>This is where Palestine comes in. The truth is a

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<v Speaker 2>tax on student protesters for Palestine, a tax on scholars

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<v Speaker 2>who work on Palestine or speak on Paliste. That all

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<v Speaker 2>started before Trump, and that has become the blueprint for

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<v Speaker 2>attacking universities and academic freedom. Generally, they're using the pro

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<v Speaker 2>Palestine protests, pro Palestine programming, or just any knowledge production

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<v Speaker 2>about Palestine as an excuse to allege anti Semitism. Enter

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<v Speaker 2>into these investigations and demand the universities do what they want.

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<v Speaker 2>After the Hamas October seventh attacks, we saw student protesters

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<v Speaker 2>detained like Mahmud Trilt Columbia and Remisa auster G at

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<v Speaker 2>Tufts and many more. We have seen diplomas withheld, like

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<v Speaker 2>what Virginia Commonwealth University attempted to do to many students,

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<v Speaker 2>including students sitty in Haded. We have seen professors put

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<v Speaker 2>on leave or fired like what Muhlenberg College did to

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<v Speaker 2>Moura Finkelstein. The list goes on and on, but again,

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<v Speaker 2>a lot of this pattern started before Trump. In a

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<v Speaker 2>November twenty twenty three poll conducted by political scientists Mark

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<v Speaker 2>Lynch and Shibley Telhem called the Middle East Scholar Barometer,

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<v Speaker 2>the results show that sixty six percent of faculty members

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<v Speaker 2>who study the Middle East quote self censor when speaking

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<v Speaker 2>about the Middle East in an academic or professional setting,

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<v Speaker 2>and that number goes up to seventy seven point four

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<v Speaker 2>percent when talking about Israel Palestine. On the Israeli Palstinin

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<v Speaker 2>issue in particular, almost fifty two percent of scholars have

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<v Speaker 2>concerns about pressure from external advocacy groups, and of those

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<v Speaker 2>who said they self censor, a full eighty three percent

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<v Speaker 2>said the issue they most feel the need to censor

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<v Speaker 2>themselves about is anything related to criticism of Israel. This

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<v Speaker 2>is a crazy number if you consider that of the

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<v Speaker 2>same group, only one point six percent of respondents said

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<v Speaker 2>they censored criticism of US policy, and a full ninety

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<v Speaker 2>eight percent of assistant professors, untenured professors who work on

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<v Speaker 2>the Middle East quote field and new need to self

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<v Speaker 2>censor when speaking about the Palestinian Israeli issue in an

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<v Speaker 2>academic or professional capacity. Part of this story, the censorship story,

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<v Speaker 2>is the large scale adoption of the International Holocaust Remembrance

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<v Speaker 2>Alliance definition of antisemitism. Back during his first term, President

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<v Speaker 2>Trump's Executive Order on Combating Antisemitism directed government bodies to

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<v Speaker 2>take the IRA definition into consideration when enforcing Title six,

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<v Speaker 2>which is a part of the Civil Rights Act of

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<v Speaker 2>nineteen sixty four that prohibits discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex,

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<v Speaker 2>and national origin. The Biden administration didn't overturn any of

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<v Speaker 2>that either. They implemented that executive order themselves throughout their tenure.

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<v Speaker 2>And this definition is one definition of anti semitism that

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<v Speaker 2>critics say conflates criticism of Israel with anti semitism. In fact,

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<v Speaker 2>the main drafter of the IRA definition, ken Stearn, has

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<v Speaker 2>expressed concerns that this definition is being used as a

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<v Speaker 2>quote blunt instrument to label anyone an anti semi and

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<v Speaker 2>it's for that reason that Human Rights Watch and one

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<v Speaker 2>hundred and four other organizations signed a letter urging the

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<v Speaker 2>UN not to use this IRA definition. As a result,

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<v Speaker 2>there are, of course, a number of competing definitions of

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<v Speaker 2>anti Semitism, such as the Jerusalem Declaration on Anti Semitism,

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<v Speaker 2>that has a more nuanced understanding of one criticism of

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<v Speaker 2>Israel becomes anti semitism. As their website notes, the Jerusalem

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<v Speaker 2>Declaration is a product of an initiative that originated in

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<v Speaker 2>Jerusalem and includes in their numbers international scholars working in

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<v Speaker 2>anti Semitism studies and related fields, including Jewish Holocaust, Israel

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<v Speaker 2>Palestine and Middle Ast studies. But of course the IRA

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<v Speaker 2>definition is the one that the Trump administration wants to

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<v Speaker 2>follow and the one that universities are adopting. Maybe it

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<v Speaker 2>goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway. It's not

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<v Speaker 2>because this administration that engages with the far right and

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<v Speaker 2>propagates conspiracy theories like the Great Replacement, It's not like

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<v Speaker 2>they actually care about anti Semitism. It's just a tool.

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<v Speaker 2>As Jewish organizations working to combat anti Semitism, such as

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<v Speaker 2>the Nexus Project explicitly point out, it's a way to

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<v Speaker 2>quote weaponize anti semitism by attacking free speech DEI foreign students,

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<v Speaker 2>and in this environment, we can understand why there's so

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<v Speaker 2>much fear to speak up and so much self censorship.

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<v Speaker 2>You can be falsely accused of anti semitism for bringing

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<v Speaker 2>up Palestine as a topic of discussion, for trying to

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<v Speaker 2>study what's happening, for trying to produce any sort of

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<v Speaker 2>knowledge on what's going on. I also really want to

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<v Speaker 2>underscore that this self censorship and fear that already existed

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<v Speaker 2>in a space in academia is a worsening trend today,

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<v Speaker 2>but it definitely existed before October seventh two. Take it

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<v Speaker 2>from me as someone who studies Palestine in American academia.

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<v Speaker 2>Palestinian scholars have long been on attack in the American academy.

0:15:01.840 --> 0:15:05.520
<v Speaker 2>But after October seventh, and before Trump, this of course

0:15:05.560 --> 0:15:09.720
<v Speaker 2>got worse. External actors and donors got involved in campus governance.

0:15:09.760 --> 0:15:12.840
<v Speaker 2>As we saw in Harvard and many other places, university

0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:17.720
<v Speaker 2>administrations cracked down on students, professors, everyone, often preemptively doing

0:15:17.720 --> 0:15:20.040
<v Speaker 2>the work of the right wing because they thought that

0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:22.440
<v Speaker 2>taking away freedoms from some groups wouldn't come back to

0:15:22.440 --> 0:15:25.920
<v Speaker 2>bite them. And this is how Palestine is now one

0:15:25.920 --> 0:15:29.520
<v Speaker 2>of the cudgels that Trump is using to attack universities

0:15:29.840 --> 0:15:32.880
<v Speaker 2>and the academy. And it's an effective cudgel because some

0:15:33.080 --> 0:15:37.480
<v Speaker 2>liberals in universities and outside universities can also be persuaded

0:15:37.880 --> 0:15:41.320
<v Speaker 2>to attack scholarship on Palestine and students who speak on Palestine.

0:15:42.040 --> 0:15:45.960
<v Speaker 2>But those exceptions to academic freedom that have long existed

0:15:46.000 --> 0:15:49.680
<v Speaker 2>in the academy are now being used to attack everyone.

0:15:49.760 --> 0:15:53.160
<v Speaker 2>A quick note here to outline what academic freedom for

0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:57.160
<v Speaker 2>a faculty member actually means. As the American Association of

0:15:57.280 --> 0:16:02.440
<v Speaker 2>University Professors the AAUP on their website academic freedom has

0:16:02.640 --> 0:16:06.880
<v Speaker 2>these main elements. Number one, the freedom to discuss relevant

0:16:06.920 --> 0:16:10.320
<v Speaker 2>matters in the classroom. Number two, the freedom to explore

0:16:10.360 --> 0:16:13.480
<v Speaker 2>all avenues of scholarship, research, and creative expression, and to

0:16:13.480 --> 0:16:17.560
<v Speaker 2>publish the results of such work. Number three intramural speech

0:16:17.880 --> 0:16:22.040
<v Speaker 2>freedom from institutional censorship or discipline when addressing matters of

0:16:22.080 --> 0:16:26.840
<v Speaker 2>institutional policy or action. And number four extramural speech freedom

0:16:26.880 --> 0:16:31.119
<v Speaker 2>from institutional censorship or discipline when speaking or writing as citizens.

0:16:31.680 --> 0:16:35.520
<v Speaker 2>So faculty members are allowed to speak on matters as citizens.

0:16:36.320 --> 0:16:38.280
<v Speaker 2>Being a faculty member and being a member of the

0:16:38.360 --> 0:16:41.640
<v Speaker 2>university community does not take away their right to be citizens.

0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.080
<v Speaker 2>That last one is worth emphasizing. To maintain universities as

0:16:46.120 --> 0:16:48.720
<v Speaker 2>sites of free inquiry and knowledge production, there has to

0:16:48.760 --> 0:16:54.600
<v Speaker 2>be academic freedom, and that freedom includes teaching, research, intramul speech,

0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:58.240
<v Speaker 2>and extramural speech. You can't censor people you don't like

0:16:58.600 --> 0:17:02.040
<v Speaker 2>or don't agree with think your institution and your university

0:17:02.080 --> 0:17:05.040
<v Speaker 2>will continue to function. You certainly can't do that and

0:17:05.119 --> 0:17:08.080
<v Speaker 2>think the right wing won't sniff it out and use

0:17:08.119 --> 0:17:12.480
<v Speaker 2>it against you. So what's to be done? Things are happening,

0:17:12.760 --> 0:17:15.880
<v Speaker 2>People are fighting back, and just like Palestine has been

0:17:16.119 --> 0:17:19.480
<v Speaker 2>the Canarian the coal mine for so many things, including

0:17:19.480 --> 0:17:22.600
<v Speaker 2>the assault on American academia. Palestine may be one of

0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:26.040
<v Speaker 2>those crucial issues that helps academics and students and faculty

0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:29.520
<v Speaker 2>to organize in this moment. For example, because of the

0:17:29.600 --> 0:17:34.080
<v Speaker 2>arrests of pro Palestine students and their attempted deportation, the

0:17:34.080 --> 0:17:38.040
<v Speaker 2>American Association of University Professors, alongside the Middle East Studies

0:17:38.040 --> 0:17:42.680
<v Speaker 2>Association and the Night First Amendment Institute, sued the Trump

0:17:42.680 --> 0:17:46.520
<v Speaker 2>administration over this policy of arresting and threatening deportation for

0:17:46.640 --> 0:17:49.760
<v Speaker 2>lawful speech on Palestine. The AAUP is also now ap

0:17:49.800 --> 0:17:52.959
<v Speaker 2>plaintive in a number of cases challenging the Trump administration

0:17:53.040 --> 0:17:56.399
<v Speaker 2>on the tax on DEI, attempting to abolish the Department

0:17:56.440 --> 0:18:01.159
<v Speaker 2>of Education cuts, and federal funding of research except an

0:18:01.200 --> 0:18:04.480
<v Speaker 2>attacks on students and faculty after October seventh, which set

0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:07.280
<v Speaker 2>off this whole barrage of attacks on university since then

0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:12.639
<v Speaker 2>have galvanized people to demand their university administrations uphold academic freedom.

0:18:13.119 --> 0:18:16.280
<v Speaker 2>In twenty twenty four, nearly forty chapters of the AAUP

0:18:16.440 --> 0:18:20.119
<v Speaker 2>were founded or re established across the US, Even professors

0:18:20.119 --> 0:18:22.560
<v Speaker 2>who don't teach or study the Middle East or Palestine

0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:24.760
<v Speaker 2>are starting to speak out about the dangers of these

0:18:24.760 --> 0:18:28.040
<v Speaker 2>moments and these trends. I think people are starting to

0:18:28.080 --> 0:18:31.840
<v Speaker 2>realize that American universities will have to uphold their ideals

0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:37.040
<v Speaker 2>of faculty governance, free inquiry, free thought for everyone, or

0:18:37.080 --> 0:18:41.159
<v Speaker 2>they really will cease to exist. That's all I have

0:18:41.240 --> 0:18:43.199
<v Speaker 2>for you today. I'll be back soon to talk more

0:18:43.240 --> 0:18:46.560
<v Speaker 2>about the latest developments in Palestine. Stay strong, everybody. Thanks

0:18:46.560 --> 0:18:47.000
<v Speaker 2>for listening.

0:18:50.119 --> 0:18:52.720
<v Speaker 1>It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media.

0:18:52.800 --> 0:18:55.840
<v Speaker 1>For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

0:18:55.920 --> 0:18:59.720
<v Speaker 1>Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

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<v Speaker 1>podcast or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can now

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<v Speaker 1>find sources for It could Happen Here, listed directly in

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<v Speaker 1>episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.