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Speaker 1: Al Zone Media.

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Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to Cool People Did Cool Stuff, a

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Speaker 2: podcast about the people who did stuff that was cool

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Speaker 2: who I like. Usually I'm Margaret Kiljoy and I'm your host,

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Speaker 2: and every week I talk about a new subject, except

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Speaker 2: for the following three weeks where I talk about related

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Speaker 2: subjects of the Russian Revolution. And this is part two,

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Speaker 2: and my guest is Mia Wong.

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Speaker 3: Heiya, Hello, I'm back again. I had a momentary moment

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Speaker 3: of panic before we started recording, because I I do

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Speaker 3: so many podcasts that I was going, oh no, I

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Speaker 3: don't have an intro written. What am I going to do?

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Speaker 3: And then to do the intro? Yeah, what else's episode?

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Speaker 1: So?

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Speaker 3: What else doing? Today?

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Speaker 2: You are doing a much harder job, which is pretending

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Speaker 2: to be the podcast idiot about a subject that you

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Speaker 2: know at least as much about as I do.

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Speaker 3: That's definitely not I've forgotten so much of I haven't

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Speaker 3: done fair enough a Russia dive in half a decade,

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Speaker 3: so it's all it's all like in one year the.

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Speaker 2: Other now, Yeah, fair enough. Our producer is Sophie Hi.

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Speaker 3: Sophie Hi.

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Speaker 2: Our audio engineers Daniel Hi, danel Hide. Our theme music

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Speaker 2: was written for us by a woman, and as promises,

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Speaker 2: it's too part of a sixth part about the crown

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Speaker 2: Stout Rebellion, and by doing that, I decided to cover

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Speaker 2: all of all of the Russian Revolution. I'm actually have

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Speaker 2: a specific thing where I'm going to talk about the

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Speaker 2: anarchists in Ukraine and Makno and Maria Niki Farova later,

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Speaker 2: but like not as part of the series, but it's

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Speaker 2: just as part of the show separately, So it's not

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Speaker 2: everything about the Russian Revolution.

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Speaker 3: Don't worry, There'll be more Russian Revolution for you. There's

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Speaker 3: so much revolution, so much I know it.

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Speaker 2: This is this is the big overview one and where

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Speaker 2: you last left off, I introduced the concept of Russia,

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Speaker 2: the concept of socialist revolutionaries, the concept of social democrats

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Speaker 2: who are the Marxists who are going to become the Bolsheviks,

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Speaker 2: and the concepts of the Russian anarchists.

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Speaker 3: And now.

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Speaker 2: We're going to talk about nineteen oh five, which was

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Speaker 2: a revolution. I first heard about the nineteen oh five

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Speaker 2: revolution because of a band and an arcopunk band called

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Speaker 2: nineteen oh five. They have a good song about one

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Speaker 2: brick today is one less for Tomorrow about like it's

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Speaker 2: very posi it's very like Turn of Millennia an Arco punk,

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Speaker 2: where they like stop in the middle to like rant

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Speaker 2: about like early Posi anarchist stuff. They're so good if

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Speaker 2: you're listening nineteen oh five, I like your band that.

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Speaker 2: It was a big important thing for me when I

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Speaker 2: was a baby anarchist. Anyway, I since then, I was like,

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Speaker 2: why are they called nineteen oh five? That seems random?

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Speaker 2: And then people were like because of the year that

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Speaker 2: the revolution in Russia happened. I was like, that's nineteen seventeen,

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Speaker 2: and they're like, no, there's more than one. And I

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Speaker 2: was like, how many revolutions these people need? Save some

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Speaker 2: for the rest of us. And then and the other

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Speaker 2: thing about nineteen oh five is that I used to

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Speaker 2: sleep on the roof of a not abandoned school right

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Speaker 2: next to a house. And the house was the address

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Speaker 2: was nineteen oh five. This is in Portland, but I'm

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Speaker 2: not gonna tell you where, but you probably know what.

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Speaker 2: Someone listening knows what roof I used to sleep on.

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Speaker 2: And there was like a punk house next door, and

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Speaker 2: it was nineteen oh five was the address.

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Speaker 3: And I was like, that's so cool.

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Speaker 2: And they were like why, And I was like never mind,

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Speaker 2: and one time I'll just go full full on embarrassing.

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Speaker 2: So I had scabies and I was like, I need

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Speaker 2: somewhere to sleep because I couldn't stay in anyone's house.

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Speaker 2: So I went to go sleep on the roof. And

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Speaker 2: I like covered myself in poisonous ointment in someone's garage

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Speaker 2: and went to go sleep on this roof, and I

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Speaker 2: brought a handle of whiskey, and I was like stopped

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Speaker 2: and talked to the skateboarding guy who was just like

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Speaker 2: hanging out at midnight on this street next to the house,

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Speaker 2: nineteen oh five, and he told me, you know that

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Speaker 2: permethine cream like it it's already attacking your liver. If

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Speaker 2: you drink that handle of whiskey, you might not wake up.

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Speaker 2: Oh no, So thank you skateboarding man for saving my

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Speaker 2: life next to the house nineteen oh five. That's not

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Speaker 2: what we're talking about today.

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Speaker 3: Good thing.

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Speaker 2: I totally told you all that story. So revolutionary fervor

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Speaker 2: or revolutionary terror, depending on how you want to call it,

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Speaker 2: it's spreading across Russia. General strikes or the order of

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Speaker 2: the day. Students are striking, workers are striking, and workers

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Speaker 2: are bringing revolutionary ideas back to their families in the countryside,

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Speaker 2: which is really cool. One of the things that people

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Speaker 2: don't like. They're like, oh, the peasant and the worker

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Speaker 2: near the twains shall meet. They're like, it's the kids

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Speaker 2: of the peasants who became the workers, like it happened.

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Speaker 2: This is the generation where it happened.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And this is one of these things that I think,

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Speaker 3: like some Marxists figure this out, but they don't figure

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Speaker 3: it out until later, which is like the most revolutionary

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Speaker 3: generation of like like working class city kids are the

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Speaker 3: first generation out of the countryside, Like, those are the

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Speaker 3: people who are most likely of anyone to go into revolt.

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Speaker 3: But Marxists don't figure this out for another like till

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Speaker 3: it's a little too late years. Yeah, it takes a

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Speaker 3: long time for them to really get there.

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Speaker 2: Like why won't hey revolt?

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Speaker 3: Come on? Why won't.

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Speaker 2: Class My dad had and my grandma had, and so

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Speaker 2: to get a sense of the of the the revolutionary

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Speaker 2: fervor at the time, A lyricist at the time, Alexander

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Speaker 2: Block wrote a you know, it's referred to as a lyricist,

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Speaker 2: but I read it as poetry. We will set the

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Speaker 2: world a flame, bitter woe to all bourgeoisie with blood

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Speaker 2: will set the world a flame. Good Lord, give us

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Speaker 2: thy blessing that rules. Yeah. So that's the attitude at

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Speaker 2: the time. And that guy's like important enough. I didn't

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Speaker 2: read it, but he has this whole Wikipedia page. It's

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Speaker 2: like he's not famous as a revolution he's just a

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Speaker 2: famous lyricist or whatever. So you have all these people

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Speaker 2: living in an autocracy who wish they didn't live in

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Speaker 2: an autocracy. The peasant population has exploded somehow. Okay, this

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Speaker 2: part the math doesn't track to me, but a historian

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Speaker 2: who's very good named Paul Averich, wrote that the population

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Speaker 2: went from five million to eighty million in a single

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Speaker 2: generation of the peasants. That doesn't I don't get it,

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Speaker 2: but I'm sure it went up and maybe even went

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Speaker 2: up that much. MIAs also doing a like I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure about that math.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I hm. They had a lot of kids. I

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Speaker 1: know that is a baby, all of who lived. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure. Anyway, people were living in one room

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Speaker 1: wooden huts with dirt floors. They were living off of bread, cabbage,

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Speaker 1: and vodka, and folks were supplementing their farming through cottage

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Speaker 1: industry work like and they had been for years, right.

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Speaker 1: They were like, Oh, we're gonna like make nails and

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Speaker 1: sad and whatever the fuck we can make when we're

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Speaker 1: done farming, because that's how we're going to make enough

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Speaker 1: money to live. But all of a sudden, there's in

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Speaker 1: these industrial factories and they're just spitting out nails. How's

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Speaker 1: a nail farmer supposed to compete? One ethnicity in particular

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Speaker 1: was particularly fucked. That ethnicity was the Jews. Even within

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Speaker 1: the Pale, there are new limitations on where they can

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Speaker 1: go and what they can do. There are reverse quotas

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Speaker 1: where schools can't have more than like ten percent Jewish students.

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Speaker 1: Even in the Pale. They're no longer allowed in the

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Speaker 1: sort of small regional governmental assemblies, and there are constant programs.

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Speaker 1: More and more Jewish folks are leaving the more moderate

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Speaker 1: organizations like the boond to join the anarchists. I think

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Speaker 1: less because they think they'll win, and more because they'll

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Speaker 1: go down fighting. It gives them the chance to do

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Speaker 1: something concrete and immediate. The Booned overall argued against the

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Speaker 1: terrorism approach of robbing the rich and killing right wing

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Speaker 1: politicians who are organizing the oppression, although soon enough some

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Speaker 1: people were like, well, we don't want to leave the

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Speaker 1: Boon to become anarchists, but you know what, can we

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Speaker 1: just have a faction of the Boon that's like down

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Speaker 1: with like Stabin guys. And they were like, I guess,

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Speaker 1: so it seems like there's a lot of guys who

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Speaker 1: need Stabin since there's pograms happening.

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Speaker 3: Did they have their own combat organization?

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Speaker 2: I believe so, but I'm not entirely certain they had

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Speaker 2: a group of I don't know whether they called themselves maximalists.

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Speaker 2: There's like all these ways like we were talking about

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Speaker 2: last time, where it's like, oh, the left wing of

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Speaker 2: this in the center of this and whatever. The maximalist

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Speaker 2: position is usually the like we're going to get to

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Speaker 2: the revolution right away through Stabin, you know. But I

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Speaker 2: don't know whether the Boon specifically had their own of

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Speaker 2: that or what they called it. And they're all looking

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Speaker 2: for a chance when what happens. But in nineteen oh four,

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Speaker 2: Russian and Japan got in an argument about who got

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Speaker 2: to colonize Korea and Manchuria, and Japan was like, well,

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Speaker 2: what if you get Manchuria and we get Korea, And

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Speaker 2: like presented a I mean, it's all evil, it's all colonization, right,

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Speaker 2: It's two empires fighting, but they like presented a colonial compromise,

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Speaker 2: and we've talked actually, if you want to hear a

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Speaker 2: lot of Japanese labor history, listen to MIA's episodes on

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Speaker 2: it could happen here. And then I've also done a

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Speaker 2: couple also on this show that people can listen to,

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Speaker 2: especially in episodes about women who keep trying to kill emperors,

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Speaker 2: if you want to hear more about that, And it's

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Speaker 2: specifically how it ties into the struggle against the colonization

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Speaker 2: of Korea by Japan. But anyway, Russia's like, no, we

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Speaker 2: want a buffer zone. We don't want to be near

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Speaker 2: you or whatever, so where we want the following buffer

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Speaker 2: zone that I guess keeps them out of mainland China

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Speaker 2: was I guess part of the big deal about this.

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Speaker 2: And Japan was like, well, what if we sneak attack

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Speaker 2: and destroy your entire eastern fleet? And then Russia was like, oh, well,

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Speaker 2: we're just going to easily win this war because not white.

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Speaker 1: Do you know the story about how that whole fleet

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Speaker 1: got wiped out? I just turned as a sneak attack

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Speaker 1: it will tell me really funny. Well, so the thing

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Speaker 1: that happens in that battle is this is the first

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Speaker 1: time Japan wipes out a fleet, right, because they do it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, this is the first one. Is the first one.

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Speaker 3: And one of the problems that the Russian Navy has

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Speaker 3: is that basically all of their admirals are just like

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Speaker 3: some guy's cousin. They have guy knows Yeah, they have

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Speaker 3: one guy who actually knows what he's doing this, a

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Speaker 3: guy named Barkov. He's the guy who invented the icebreaker,

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Speaker 3: so he's like, he's legitimately a good admiral. However, Kama

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Speaker 3: Japan does its first volley at unbelievable maximum maximum possible

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Speaker 3: range of cannonball could possibly be fired and hit something.

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Speaker 3: And this is an era of warfare where like your

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Speaker 3: guns are so inaccurate, you're not like pointing a gun

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Speaker 3: at a ship, You're pointing it in like the general

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Speaker 3: direction of a ship. And one of their cannonballs just

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Speaker 3: like perfectly good, like just perfectly shreds the bridge of

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Speaker 3: the Russian flagship, kills Macrov, kills Markov, and then but

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Speaker 3: does it in a way where I think I can't

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Speaker 3: rever's mark off from Bacroff, one of the two. It

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Speaker 3: kills the animal and does it in a way. The

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Speaker 3: wrestler ships don't realize that they're that the flagship's like

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Speaker 3: bridge is gone, and so all the rest of the

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Speaker 3: ships and the Russian fleet are waiting for orders and

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Speaker 3: they never get orders because everyone's dead on the flagship,

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Speaker 3: and so Jetpe just run them through.

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Speaker 2: So it was a lucky shot combined with like the

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Speaker 2: failures of hierarchy.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like they accidentally like knocked out the toothpick

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Speaker 1: that was supporting the entire Russian aristocracy, and the entire

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Speaker 1: Russian aristocracy somed me had to do something on their own.

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Speaker 3: They just fell over and died. It's staggery. That's hilarious.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So so basically Russia declares war, which makes sense in

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Speaker 2: this context, and they're like, all right, we just got

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Speaker 2: to figure out how to get a bunch of guys

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Speaker 2: over there with guns. And everything I've read is that

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Speaker 2: they just straight up assumed that white people are the

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Speaker 2: best in Japan and they chance because like their eyes

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Speaker 2: are funny whatever, Like I mean, no racist, it's really staggered. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: racism will get you killed, hopefully indirect and immediate ways,

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Speaker 2: but sometimes just by underestimating Japan.

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Speaker 3: There's a good way to don't do that. Get cad

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Speaker 3: so terrifying, terrifying militarist society in the late nineteen hundreds

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Speaker 3: yea early twentieth century, probably at least for a couple

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Speaker 3: hundred more years, people aren't going to underestimate Japan. Yeah, ough,

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Speaker 3: bad memories.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm like, my granddad lived in a submarine as

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Speaker 2: a torpedoist for a very long time and almost died

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Speaker 2: multiple times.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, because there's my grandma thought she was an orphan

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Speaker 3: growing up because her mom like picked up her older

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Speaker 3: sister and just physically ran, like like just started running

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Speaker 3: and didn't stop running until she was like halfway across

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Speaker 3: the country.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: It's like just nightmare stuff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Really, it's really so thick.

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Speaker 2: And that's like like no one in the West pays

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Speaker 2: any attention to this, isn't okay, let's not talk about Okay,

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Speaker 2: Well we'll go back to the topic instead of talking

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Speaker 2: about the Pacific theater of World War two one day.

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Speaker 2: I want to talk to you more about that. So

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Speaker 2: Japan bee is the shit out of Russia. Russia had

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Speaker 2: this mighty navy, but it was on the western side

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Speaker 2: of Russia, based out of this little island fort called

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Speaker 2: Kronstat just west of Saint Petersburg. So they sailed all

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Speaker 2: the way the fuck around the world, like down past

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Speaker 2: Africa and all the way back up just to get

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Speaker 2: wiped off the map by the Japanese navy. And Russia

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Speaker 2: had been really late to the railroad game in general,

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Speaker 2: so they kept trying to like move troops east, but

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Speaker 2: they had I think, like single track like so they

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Speaker 2: couldn't send like a train one way and back or whatever.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I don't have the details about this in front of me.

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Speaker 2: Their railroad system sucked and they could not get an

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Speaker 2: army over there except by ship effectively. So they lost.

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Speaker 3: They lost like fuck.

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Speaker 2: And the war against Japan had been this big nationalist,

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Speaker 2: patriotic thing. We all love our two headed eagle flag

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Speaker 2: or the best it's okay that we're all starving or whatever,

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Speaker 2: just this moment because we're better than someone else. And

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Speaker 2: with the loss, people were like, this really isn't Amorican.

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Speaker 3: You guys lost to Japan. I know, really the Liberals

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Speaker 3: are on one in this.

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Speaker 2: Oh were they like specifically, like, what the hell's wrong

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Speaker 2: with you lost to Japan?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, well they were okay, they were slightly

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Speaker 1: less racist than the czar, which is you know, it's.

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Speaker 2: Like saying Biden is left of Trump. Well that's sort

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Speaker 2: of true, and most did not. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. It's also like very little consolation if you're in Palestine. Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, So people are not excited, and and actually a

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Speaker 2: lot of the stuff kicks off before I'm playing a

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Speaker 2: little fast and loose with a specific time. A lot

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Speaker 2: of the stuff kicks off before the war is like

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Speaker 2: totally lost. I mean, it's always doomed.

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Speaker 3: It's dumb war.

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Speaker 2: Well, from Russia's point of view, it was not a

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Speaker 2: well thought thought out military campaign, and general strikes are

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Speaker 2: getting more and more common. And you have this group

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Speaker 2: that I sort of don't talk about as much during

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Speaker 2: this the sort of centrist reformist organizations, like they're honestly

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Speaker 2: kind of center right. I think there's this guy named

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Speaker 2: Georghi Gapon, and he's a moderate Russian Orthodox priest who's

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Speaker 2: a reform minded group that only Russian Orthodox people can join.

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Speaker 2: That's why I'm calling him center right. I think he

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Speaker 2: was racist I don't have that evidence in front of me.

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Speaker 2: I am conjecturing. They start the meeting with the lords.

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Speaker 2: They're like reform meetings. They start with the lord's prayer

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Speaker 2: and they close out by singing, God save the Cizar.

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Speaker 3: Oh my God.

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Speaker 2: That is how not revolutionary this group is. And he Georghi,

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Speaker 2: believed that the czar had a right to rule, and

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Speaker 2: he worked with cops constantly, and he just wanted the good,

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Speaker 2: loyal Russian workers to be treated a bit better by

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Speaker 2: their father, the czar. Do you have this like autocratic

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Speaker 2: idea at the time, where like the czar is like

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Speaker 2: your dad is like the dad of everyone you know,

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Speaker 2: and a lot of people believed it. There are all

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Speaker 2: these revolutionary groups running around, the SRS, the social democrats

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Speaker 2: and the anarchists. But I think the average person in

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Speaker 2: Russia just wanted a fucking duma like a congress. They

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Speaker 2: wanted maybe a constitutional monarchy, or they wanted everything the same,

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Speaker 2: but just not starving, like a lot of people probably

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Speaker 2: would have been happy with no more control and just

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Speaker 2: more food. So Georgi led us a worker's march. I

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Speaker 2: almost had a strike. It was absolutely not a strike,

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Speaker 2: but this like peaceful workers march to the Winter Palace

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Speaker 2: to present a petition to the Tzar. The revolutionary stayed

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Speaker 2: home from this. They were like, this is some reform shit.

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Speaker 3: This is not us.

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Speaker 2: And Georgy agreed it wasn't a revolution. Like people were

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Speaker 2: like in his group were like ripping up the revolutionary propaganda.

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Speaker 2: They're like, no, we're the good guys. And Georgy sent

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Speaker 2: a copy of his petition ahead of time and was like, Hey,

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Speaker 2: I'm coming on January twenty second, don't worry. Oh, he

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Speaker 2: actually wrote January ninth. But that's because Russia worked on

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Speaker 2: a different calendar before the nineteen seventeen revolutions.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah, that's.

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Speaker 2: Figure dates the October revolution that happened in November. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So Georgy and either three thousand or fifty thousand of

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Speaker 2: his closest buds. I love history. It's so great. Either

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Speaker 2: three thousand or fifty thousand of his closest buds marched along,

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Speaker 2: singing God Save the Czar and holding up like religious

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Speaker 2: icons and all that shit. So the soldiers shot them,

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Speaker 2: ran them down with horses, cut them with swords. The

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Speaker 2: best averagest guess is that a thousand people died there's

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Speaker 2: a lot of fucking people to die in March. This

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Speaker 2: gets called bloody Sunday, like so many Sundays in history,

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Speaker 2: and GEORGI didn't want a revolution, but a revolution it

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Speaker 2: would be. People were not happy about bloody Sunday. Georgy himself,

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Speaker 2: he actually made it. Have you heard about how he

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Speaker 2: met his fate?

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Speaker 3: No? Actually, I mean I knew the part about the

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Speaker 3: Russian Revolution being started by a police informant, but I

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Speaker 3: didn't know. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So he makes it out alive, and he leaves the

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Speaker 2: country to hang out with all the revolutionists and next

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Speaker 2: Isle and actually at this point he's a little bit like, oh,

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Speaker 2: maybe we need a revolution.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, it tends to happen when you get

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Speaker 1: to watch a bunch of soldiers killing a thousand people

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Speaker 1: of the street who were following you.

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Speaker 2: I believe he refers to it as like the river

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Speaker 2: of blood that stands between us and the czar.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: And so he's an exile and he starts hanging out

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Speaker 2: with the SRS and the anarchists. But he wanted to

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Speaker 2: play both sides, and I think it was less than

363
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Speaker 2: he was like a Tzaris spy among the revolutionaries. I

364
00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:03,720
Speaker 2: think he genuinely thought, well, I want to play both

365
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Speaker 2: sides because in the end, I'm going to make peace

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Speaker 2: with everyone. That's my I'm not a Georgy expert. I'm

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Speaker 2: just proud that I looked up how to pronounce his

368
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Speaker 2: first name because it looks like Georgie. So he's like,

369
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Speaker 2: I think it's best if I work with both the

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Speaker 2: hard and revolutionaries and the secret police of the Czar.

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Speaker 2: But he said that where some hard and revolutionaries could

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Speaker 2: hear him, So they hanged him in his room in

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Speaker 2: nineteen oh six. Yeah, they were what'd you think is

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Speaker 2: gonna happen?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, there's no good at it. Well, I mean, I

376
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Speaker 3: guess there's a version of the story where he lives

377
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Speaker 3: long enough to get to nineteen seventeen where they burn

378
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Speaker 3: all the police archives and then we can figure out

379
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Speaker 3: who all the informants were. Totally.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, he had eleven, like twelve years to make it

381
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Speaker 1: through it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, or just not talking to the fucking cops. God, Yeah,

383
00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:03,520
Speaker 2: it's not that hard, friend of the pod, don't talk

384
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Speaker 2: to cops. Actually, you know what that's our ad today is,

385
00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:11,159
Speaker 2: don't talk to the police. It makes everything worse. Here's

386
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Speaker 2: your ads, Hi, Margaret Kiljoy here, boy. The world sure

387
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,240
Speaker 2: is a mess right now? Huh. Seems like every day

388
00:20:19,280 --> 00:20:20,840
Speaker 2: there are more and more reasons to get out into

389
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Speaker 2: the streets and protest. That's why when I get arrested,

390
00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:27,720
Speaker 2: there's only one strategy. I trust, I shut the fuck up.

391
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Speaker 2: I say, I would like to remain silent, I would

392
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Speaker 2: like to talk to my lawyer, and then I shut

393
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Speaker 2: the fuck up. In the United States of America, it's

394
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Speaker 2: constitutionally protected and recommended by the National Lawyer's Guild. That's

395
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Speaker 2: shut thch f u c k up. Once again, that's

396
00:20:46,920 --> 00:20:52,360
Speaker 2: shut thch e f uck up. Because you can't talk

397
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,440
Speaker 2: yourself out of custody, but you can talk yourself into

398
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Speaker 2: a conviction.

399
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Speaker 4: Providing identification to law enforcement required in some states and situations,

400
00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:02,840
Speaker 4: giving name an address expedient in most circumstances. Never discuss

401
00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:04,960
Speaker 4: the events leading to arrest with anyone except your lawyer, doctor,

402
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,680
Speaker 4: or therapist. Hosting pictures of protests and actions on social

403
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,160
Speaker 4: media may lead to complications.

404
00:21:09,400 --> 00:21:09,840
Speaker 3: If you have.

405
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:12,680
Speaker 4: Already talked to cops or experienced confusion about talking to cops,

406
00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:15,000
Speaker 4: call your attorney immediately, as these may be signs of

407
00:21:15,040 --> 00:21:17,520
Speaker 4: more serious legal problems. The concept of not talking to

408
00:21:17,560 --> 00:21:19,280
Speaker 4: cops does not provide legal advice, and the foregoing statements

409
00:21:19,320 --> 00:21:21,960
Speaker 4: are for informational purposes only. If you have specific legal questions,

410
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:23,280
Speaker 4: consult an attorney.

411
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Speaker 3: And we're back.

412
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Speaker 2: So after Bloody Sunday, strikes break out even more and

413
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Speaker 2: half of Russia's industrial workers total are going on strike.

414
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Speaker 2: In this early time, Poland, however, throws the fuck down.

415
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Speaker 2: Ninety three point two percent of Polish workers are on

416
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Speaker 2: so oh why god, yeah, incredible. One hundred strikers are

417
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Speaker 2: killed in Warsaw. One hundred and thirty are killed in Rigo,

418
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Speaker 2: which is now not Latvia but was Russia at the time.

419
00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 2: Universities closed because of the upheaval, so students all join

420
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Speaker 2: the revolution. Saint Petersburg and Moscow are soon shut down

421
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Speaker 2: by workers' strikes, and it just spreads. The revolution spreads,

422
00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:14,040
Speaker 2: and it it like never quite knows exactly when it's

423
00:22:14,080 --> 00:22:16,160
Speaker 2: a revolution and when it's a general strike and when

424
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,040
Speaker 2: it's a you know, and like, and that's kind of

425
00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:19,959
Speaker 2: one of the kind of interesting and cool things about it.

426
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Speaker 2: I actually I thought I was going to like blow

427
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:24,240
Speaker 2: right past the reason this game of six part it

428
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:25,520
Speaker 2: was going to be a four Parter, and then I

429
00:22:25,560 --> 00:22:29,040
Speaker 2: was like, oh, the nineteen oh five revolution like needs

430
00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,320
Speaker 2: some attention to understand nineteen seventeen and especially nineteen twenty one,

431
00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:37,159
Speaker 2: which is what we're building too, you know. So for

432
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Speaker 2: the most part, this is self organized political groups like

433
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Speaker 2: the Bolsheviks and the Mensheviks are running to catch up

434
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Speaker 2: a pattern we've seen time and time again. And if

435
00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 2: you read some histories, they're like, and then the Bolsheviks

436
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,000
Speaker 2: and the Mensheviks set up all of the following things,

437
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 2: And then if you read the other histories, they're like,

438
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:53,399
Speaker 2: and then the other things got set up, and the

439
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 2: Bolsheviks showed up and tried to say that they were theirs.

440
00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:58,520
Speaker 2: Which is not to say that the Bolsheviks are boring

441
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:00,920
Speaker 2: and late to everything, but rather than the organized groups

442
00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:05,080
Speaker 2: in general, the professional revolutionaries and the vanguards are usually

443
00:23:05,119 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 2: caught with their pants down. During actual revolutions and rebellions,

444
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,520
Speaker 2: sailors start mutineering all over the place, including at Cronstadt,

445
00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,280
Speaker 2: which is the military the island fortress that's later going

446
00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 2: to be the center of what we're talking about. But

447
00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,200
Speaker 2: I read one history and who said, and I believe

448
00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,920
Speaker 2: it the reason this particular revolution didn't work is that

449
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:32,160
Speaker 2: the rebellion in the military stays relatively minor and uncoordinated. Overall,

450
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:35,199
Speaker 2: the military stays loyal to the czar and is therefore

451
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 2: able to One of the best ways to stop a

452
00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:41,879
Speaker 2: revolution is to kill everyone, but they don't succeeded that yet.

453
00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:45,640
Speaker 2: The revolution is still going on. In towns, workers start

454
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 2: forming soviets, and these are the first soviets that I

455
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,119
Speaker 2: found reference to, and people talk about it specifically coming out.

456
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:53,480
Speaker 3: Of this revolution.

457
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:54,960
Speaker 2: That's why I want to talk about this revolution so

458
00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:58,359
Speaker 2: much is the soviets, and these are councils or assemblies

459
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:02,000
Speaker 2: used to coordinate actions. The first one was in the

460
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:06,679
Speaker 2: city of Ivanovna. The strike committees at a textile strike

461
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 2: turned into an elected body of all the workers in town.

462
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:16,160
Speaker 2: Soon enough, soviets formed in sixty different towns. These councils

463
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 2: are attended by delegates elected from various factories in workplaces,

464
00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:23,280
Speaker 2: and these delegates are subject to immediate recall if they

465
00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:25,480
Speaker 2: don't do what they've been mandated to do. So this

466
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,560
Speaker 2: isn't like what we think of as democracy in America,

467
00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:33,359
Speaker 2: which isn't fundamentally democracy. This is like, oh, well, we

468
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,560
Speaker 2: can all go to the meeting. So Mia, you're going

469
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,320
Speaker 2: to go to the meeting to represent cool Zone media,

470
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:41,719
Speaker 2: but you're not there to come up with what you

471
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,360
Speaker 2: want to do. You're there because we've all talked together

472
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 2: about what we want to do, and you're just there

473
00:24:46,840 --> 00:24:49,639
Speaker 2: to report for us and stuff like that, you know,

474
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 2: and if you don't, if you like start wilden out

475
00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 2: and try and talk about some bullshit that we don't

476
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:58,280
Speaker 2: care about, well then we'll send someone else next time.

477
00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:05,200
Speaker 2: It's a it's a pretty good system.

478
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, And it's funny because later versions of these I

479
00:25:09,359 --> 00:25:11,199
Speaker 3: didn't episode I don't know when this is gonna come out,

480
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:16,040
Speaker 3: but I did an episode like God some time ago

481
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:20,480
Speaker 3: about the revolution in Algeria. And they also also end

482
00:25:20,560 --> 00:25:22,520
Speaker 3: up setting up a bunch of these workers councils. But

483
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,320
Speaker 3: one of the reasons they don't work is because they

484
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,520
Speaker 3: they're not they don't run on delegates, they're just basically

485
00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:33,920
Speaker 3: elected politicians. Yeah, and because this season sort of nested

486
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 3: like electoral things, they're not designed to represent the like

487
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,040
Speaker 3: the actual views of the group. They're designed to have

488
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:46,520
Speaker 3: one person in charge whose decisions get like kind of

489
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 3: rubber stamped by like the mass things, and it's it's

490
00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 3: it's really interesting that the the original ones of these

491
00:25:52,880 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 3: didn't work like that. They worked more like like how

492
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,480
Speaker 3: you would expect an anarctive system to work well.

493
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 2: That actually gets to the crux, and we'll talk about

494
00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 2: it in a little bit about how this model was

495
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:10,959
Speaker 2: purposefully changed by Lenin, the most famous of these Soviets.

496
00:26:11,560 --> 00:26:14,679
Speaker 2: If you read a brief history of nineteen oh five revolution,

497
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 2: you're only going to hear about the Saint Petersburg Soviet

498
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,159
Speaker 2: of workers Deputies built out of the Great October Strike

499
00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:22,719
Speaker 2: that started with printers and sued Lenda workers shutting down

500
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:26,680
Speaker 2: all the railways in Russia. And the Bolsheviks and Mensheviks

501
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:31,399
Speaker 2: were both heavily involved in that Soviet. However, it's not

502
00:26:31,480 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 2: as directly, I believe, as later Bolshevik history presents it.

503
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,080
Speaker 2: There's this revolutionary he's back from exile named Leon Trotsky,

504
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:45,480
Speaker 2: and he I mean, he's not a slacker, I will

505
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:46,160
Speaker 2: say about him.

506
00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:48,080
Speaker 3: Unfortunately for all of us.

507
00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:52,119
Speaker 2: I know he's the one who like actually, in like

508
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,639
Speaker 2: I believe nineteen oh four wrote about how, hey, if

509
00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:57,080
Speaker 2: we do exactly what the Bolsheviks are planning to do later,

510
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,200
Speaker 2: it's going to go really badly. I should have written

511
00:26:59,200 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 2: that quote into the scripts, and I didn't. But he

512
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 2: has this quote about that, and then he didn't follow

513
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 2: his own advice. At this point, he is neither a

514
00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 2: Bolshevik nor Menshevik. He had been in the Menshevik faction

515
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:15,399
Speaker 2: and then he left the Menshevik faction because he was like,

516
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:17,440
Speaker 2: the Bolsheviks are kind of shitty and authoritarian, I don't

517
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,959
Speaker 2: like Lenin, and the Mensheviks are kind of boring and liberal.

518
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 2: So he's like, I'm just a social democrat. I'm a

519
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 2: non affiliated, non party affiliated social democrat. So at this

520
00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,440
Speaker 2: point he's like, I haven't got anything against him right now.

521
00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,399
Speaker 2: You know, he gives speeches that hundreds of thousands of

522
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:35,600
Speaker 2: people attend, at least according to like literally they're like

523
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 2: two hundred thousand people. Half the workers in Saint Petersburg

524
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,320
Speaker 2: came to see him talk, and maybe I don't know,

525
00:27:41,680 --> 00:27:45,880
Speaker 2: that's a lot of people. Yeah, but oh, and he

526
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,600
Speaker 2: is the vice chair of this Soviet And the way

527
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:54,160
Speaker 2: that the nineteen oh five revolution went down completely flabbergasted

528
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 2: the Marxists. Is not often I get to use the

529
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 2: word flabbergasted, but it is the perfect word for what.

530
00:27:58,960 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 3: Happened to the Marxists.

531
00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:04,480
Speaker 2: They rush to keep up both organizationally and then what's

532
00:28:04,560 --> 00:28:07,679
Speaker 2: fun because I'm a nerd. They had to rush to

533
00:28:07,720 --> 00:28:13,440
Speaker 2: keep up theoretically because general strikes and self organized soviets,

534
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 2: these are the two core things of the nineteen oh

535
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 2: five revolution that become the core of the later revolution.

536
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 2: Well thatden like the check on a bunch of evil shit.

537
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 2: But neither of these two things, general strikes and self

538
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,080
Speaker 2: organized soviets are in the rule book for how a

539
00:28:32,119 --> 00:28:35,439
Speaker 2: scientific revolution led by the vanguard of the proletariat is

540
00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:39,320
Speaker 2: supposed to go down. Because did you know that Marxists

541
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:40,280
Speaker 2: hate general strikes?

542
00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,560
Speaker 3: Yeah? I have, I I I oh god, this is

543
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 3: a whole thing. Oh I to talk about it. Yeah,

544
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:50,640
Speaker 3: you know I've been like this is yeah.

545
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, all of us are grinning.

546
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 3: That is how deep nerds, all three of us are.

547
00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're like all teeth right now.

548
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 1: I'm like, there's only like two other things that I

549
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 1: think mea is it more nerdy about one?

550
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,480
Speaker 4: Which is sending me things about football that She's like,

551
00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 4: what the fuck is happening?

552
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 3: You don't want star Wars?

553
00:29:13,280 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 2: Yes? Fuck? Yeah, So okay, I'm going to go through

554
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 2: what I'm my understanding event, and you should correct or

555
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 2: add or anything you want. General strikes are for anarchists,

556
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 2: according to the Marxists. In eighteen seventy three, Frederick Engels

557
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 2: the like the other half of the marx pair and

558
00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 2: the one that I have nothing nice to say about. Terrible,

559
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:41,440
Speaker 2: he wrote in the Bacoonist Anarchist Program. A general strike

560
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 2: is the lever employed by which the social revolution is started.

561
00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 2: But that's like bad according to him. Yeah, and so

562
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 2: the Marxists, instead of changing their dogma to fix the

563
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:55,680
Speaker 2: facts the way that science works, they just reworded everything.

564
00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 2: General strikes are hopelessly utopian. So what had happened were

565
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 2: mass strikes? These are different, you see. And I wrote

566
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 2: in my script I don't want to get two into

567
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 2: the weeds here, but I kind of do because it's fun.

568
00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 2: So the difference between these two ideas is really funny

569
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:18,719
Speaker 2: to me. Because Angles defined a general strike like roughly

570
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:21,880
Speaker 2: as like a single organized strike where one day everyone

571
00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:25,160
Speaker 2: wakes up and has a general strike, right, And he's like,

572
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,840
Speaker 2: and that's a terrible plan. No one had ever it's

573
00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:31,880
Speaker 2: a strong man argument. No anarchist had ever put forth

574
00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:35,760
Speaker 2: that definition. Of a general strike or had because that

575
00:30:35,840 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 2: is a terrible plan. That's not how general strikes hap.

576
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's like a chartless thing like the British in

577
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,520
Speaker 3: nineteen thirty. Okay, like no one believes that.

578
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so he claims that this is the anarchist

579
00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 2: theory and this is not true. That's like one of

580
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:50,520
Speaker 2: his favorite things to do is claim things that are

581
00:30:50,560 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 2: our theories and they're not. So these later Marxist theories theorists,

582
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 2: they have to develop the mass strike instead in response

583
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,960
Speaker 2: to these revolutions that happening. And this is good and

584
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:08,440
Speaker 2: Marxist compared to the anarchist general strike and the mass strike,

585
00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 2: it's actually just like more anarchistic. It's a bit more organic.

586
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 2: It's something that builds and ebbs and flows, you know.

587
00:31:15,840 --> 00:31:19,360
Speaker 2: So they just described how anarchists actually viewed and used

588
00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:24,320
Speaker 2: the general strike all the time. Yeah, okay. And then

589
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:28,960
Speaker 2: the other thing. The Soviets too, were fulfillment of anarchist principles.

590
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:33,040
Speaker 2: They are fundamentally what collectivists and communist anarchists are fighting for.

591
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 2: But Marxists didn't have anything like them in their books

592
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,400
Speaker 2: by Marx and Engels, which advocated for the seizure of

593
00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 2: state power instead of building bottom up power. And so

594
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 2: the way that the Bolsheviks decided to incorporate the Soviets

595
00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 2: is to treat them like you were saying, what happened

596
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 2: in Algeria. Later, I guess to treat them like little

597
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 2: parliaments to be attended by political parties and eventually, ideally

598
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,960
Speaker 2: only the Bolsheviks. The small scale of the Soviets was

599
00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 2: not a feature but a bug, according to them. Lennin

600
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 2: wrote nineteen oh seven that his party could utilize Soviets

601
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 2: for quote, the purpose of developing the social democratic movement,

602
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:18,480
Speaker 2: but soon they would be supliferous. So he's saying exactly

603
00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 2: what he's going to do ten years later, which is

604
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:26,040
Speaker 2: use the revolutionary program to centralize power and then get

605
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:32,440
Speaker 2: rid of the revolution. However, credit where's due the Mensheviks. Meanwhile,

606
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 2: they're like still Marxists, right, but they're like kind of pragmatic.

607
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 2: They're like, I don't know, Soviets seem cool, Like, yeah,

608
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 2: let's just do the Soviets. This seems great, like whatever.

609
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,280
Speaker 2: I kind of like them. And it gets really funny

610
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 2: because later the anarchists are going to be like more

611
00:32:46,960 --> 00:32:49,320
Speaker 2: siding with the Bolsheviks, because the anarchists are idiots and

612
00:32:49,680 --> 00:32:50,560
Speaker 2: are going to like be like.

613
00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:52,480
Speaker 3: Well, they're more radical, so they're therefore better.

614
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 2: You know, by the time I finished writing that part

615
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:56,560
Speaker 2: of the script, maybe all of a different attitude, and

616
00:32:56,560 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 2: I've done a lot of work on the rest of it. Anyway,

617
00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:04,880
Speaker 2: that's my difference between general strike and mass strike. And

618
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 2: there are real and serious differences between all these various

619
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:12,000
Speaker 2: factions of leftists. But it seems to me that the

620
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,000
Speaker 2: things that happened in nineteen seventeen and onward, only the

621
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,640
Speaker 2: Bolsheviks wanted to do those things. I don't know, maybe

622
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 2: I'm wrong, and we only know one thing that happened,

623
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 2: which is that the Bolsheviks did these bad things right.

624
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 2: And one of the reasons that anarchism gets left out

625
00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,760
Speaker 2: of the story of nineteen oh five is because anarchism

626
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 2: wasn't party politics. They rarely were like this is now

627
00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 2: an anarchist Soviet or an anarchist general strike. Soviets in

628
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:44,080
Speaker 2: general strikes were just the anarchist position. But that's not

629
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 2: how the people involved in the uprising ideologically would have

630
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 2: necessarily called themselves anarchists. Although in Poland and several other

631
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 2: places they were. And now I'm gonna talk about what

632
00:33:55,600 --> 00:33:59,640
Speaker 2: the anarchists in Poland were doing during the revolution, which

633
00:33:59,640 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 2: is where I promised you bombs. A Black Banner was

634
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 2: highly So now am I talk about the organizational structure.

635
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:12,560
Speaker 2: The Black Banner was highly organized into federations, and I

636
00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 2: have read that it was organized into multiple federations, each

637
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,840
Speaker 2: of about three hundred members. And I have read and that

638
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:23,120
Speaker 2: was the first person account the original source. The secondary

639
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:25,840
Speaker 2: source claimed that there was three hundred total in Black Banner.

640
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 2: I find that unlikely. I tended not because the primary

641
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:34,120
Speaker 2: source is inherently better, but I am based on what

642
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 2: he describes whatever. Anyway, the federations each represent this or

643
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,279
Speaker 2: that branch of an industry. They had huge meetings where

644
00:34:41,280 --> 00:34:44,440
Speaker 2: the members themselves discuss theory and strategy together. And apparently

645
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:47,240
Speaker 2: it's like the whole revolution is just like endless meetings.

646
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:51,760
Speaker 2: It's like fighting and meetings and like. But the meetings

647
00:34:51,800 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 2: are kind of like the social thing because you're like, oh,

648
00:34:53,480 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 2: are you going to that like theoretical talk where we're

649
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 2: going to talk about like theory that one hundred years

650
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:58,480
Speaker 2: from now people are still going to be talking about,

651
00:34:58,520 --> 00:35:00,359
Speaker 2: And people like yeah, I'm gonna go to that. I'm

652
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,000
Speaker 2: going to go to the other thing and whatever.

653
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,600
Speaker 3: You know, it's like Twitter that you have to go to.

654
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:09,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. And so they've set up these organizations and

655
00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:12,480
Speaker 2: whenever someone was mistreated by a boss or a landlord

656
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 2: or even a teacher abusing their students, they went to

657
00:35:15,400 --> 00:35:20,719
Speaker 2: Black Banner, and Black Banner would dish out some justice.

658
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:23,720
Speaker 2: Most of the time they met in like their houses

659
00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:26,279
Speaker 2: or whatever. But the other main gathering place for them

660
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:28,360
Speaker 2: was graveyards, which is cool as shit.

661
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:29,320
Speaker 3: That's so cool.

662
00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: Anarchists have never changed, no single time I have been

663
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:36,040
Speaker 1: to graveyard meetings before.

664
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 3: Zero changes ever.

665
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:43,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, And overall, the revolution of nineteen oh five didn't

666
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:47,279
Speaker 2: fully succeed. It did not succeed, but it it got

667
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 2: slightly more than sometimes is given credit for. The army

668
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:54,400
Speaker 2: stayed loyal to the Tzar, and so repression was pretty bad.

669
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 2: A bunch of nationalists did a bunch of pograms against Jews,

670
00:35:58,480 --> 00:35:59,839
Speaker 2: probably with the help of the Tzar.

671
00:36:00,719 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 3: I've read that.

672
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,319
Speaker 2: During this period of uprisings about three thousand Jews were killed.

673
00:36:05,360 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 2: There's one notable exception. The Jews in the anarchist quarter

674
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 2: of bial Stock in the heart of Black Banner territory.

675
00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 2: Right wing thugs, cops nor the military dared to go there,

676
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 2: and there were other Jewish combat organizations that fought off

677
00:36:22,800 --> 00:36:24,840
Speaker 2: programs every now and then. But I just had read

678
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:29,600
Speaker 2: that specific Like a guy who was there was like, yeah,

679
00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,359
Speaker 2: you know even that, Yeah, it was like pretty terrible,

680
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,520
Speaker 2: the anti Semitism and stuff. There's one place they wouldn't go,

681
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:42,160
Speaker 2: Like that's cool. They have like bomb factories and shit,

682
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:45,560
Speaker 2: they're just like rocks, and they're just like when they

683
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 2: get bored, they throw dynamite into someone's house.

684
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:48,320
Speaker 3: That's bad.

685
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:52,160
Speaker 2: Like I am also certain they occasionally threw dynamite into

686
00:36:52,200 --> 00:36:55,560
Speaker 2: houses of people who weren't bad, and like later, well,

687
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,360
Speaker 2: we'll talk about what happens after the revolution. They managed

688
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:01,560
Speaker 2: to win some suit serious demands. Not necessarily anarchists, but

689
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:03,839
Speaker 2: the revolution managed to win some serious demands, and they

690
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:07,279
Speaker 2: managed to fundamentally change organizing in Russia. It laid the

691
00:37:07,280 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 2: groundwork for the nineteen seventeen Revolution, and much like how

692
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:13,880
Speaker 2: the twenty twenty Uprising in the US laid the groundwork

693
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,480
Speaker 2: for the future revolution here, only this time we'll have

694
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:19,120
Speaker 2: learned enough history to not let authoritarian communist sweep in

695
00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 2: at the last minute instead of a dictatorship. The way

696
00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,040
Speaker 2: that the nineteen oh five revolution ended is kind of

697
00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 2: fun I hadn't heard this before. I knew, like, there's

698
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 2: one part of it that I think is funny that

699
00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:36,200
Speaker 2: I hadn't heard before. There's a centrist politician, the guy

700
00:37:36,239 --> 00:37:40,480
Speaker 2: who spearheaded Russian industrialization. His name is Sergei Witte or

701
00:37:40,520 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 2: Wit or something. I know how to pronounce its first name, Witta.

702
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:46,520
Speaker 2: That makes sense, but I know how to pronounce sir

703
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:50,000
Speaker 2: gay gay. Someone's gonna tell me I didn't pronounce that right,

704
00:37:50,040 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 2: but maybe anyway.

705
00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 3: Look, if you ever do a podcast your listener, you

706
00:37:55,080 --> 00:37:56,680
Speaker 3: too will learn that daves are hard.

707
00:37:57,120 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 2: I know, I look up almost all of them, and

708
00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 2: then there's like one that'll slip through the cracks or

709
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:02,719
Speaker 2: like I know how to pronounce that, and then I'm like, oh,

710
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 2: I spent so long on the first name.

711
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:05,600
Speaker 3: Listen.

712
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 2: We do the best we can.

713
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:10,000
Speaker 3: Yeah.

714
00:38:10,080 --> 00:38:14,239
Speaker 2: So he wrote the October Manifesto, and it laid out

715
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:17,400
Speaker 2: a bunch of reforms like have a constitution and create

716
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:20,759
Speaker 2: a Duma which is like a congress, and all men

717
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 2: can vote, and Zar Nicholas was like, no, you don't understand.

718
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:27,880
Speaker 2: And I think he believed this. He was like, I

719
00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:31,720
Speaker 2: am honor bound to stay the autocratic czar like hundreds

720
00:38:31,760 --> 00:38:34,600
Speaker 2: of years of my ancestors, Like who am I to

721
00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:37,319
Speaker 2: turn away from my like divine duty to be the

722
00:38:37,440 --> 00:38:41,960
Speaker 2: father of Russia. And it's funny because he's like just

723
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:45,600
Speaker 2: a fucking shitty czar who sucks at everything. Yeah, and

724
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:48,239
Speaker 2: like he can't do anything right and like I can't

725
00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:50,440
Speaker 2: remember I Rasputants on the picture now or not or

726
00:38:50,440 --> 00:38:53,440
Speaker 2: if that's a couple of years later. But he's like

727
00:38:54,440 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 2: not an impressive example of leadership. So he asked Grand

728
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 2: Duke Nicholas to lead up a military dictatorship. Grand Duke

729
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,640
Speaker 2: Nicholas looks at his first cousin, once removed Zar Nicholas

730
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:12,440
Speaker 2: the second, and says, I'm gonna give you a choice.

731
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:16,800
Speaker 2: Either you accept the October Manifesto or I'm gonna shoot

732
00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:18,200
Speaker 2: myself in the head right now.

733
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 3: Shit, I heard this far. That was the part I

734
00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:29,280
Speaker 3: hadn't heard before. And it works while.

735
00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:34,760
Speaker 2: Because this is like like his kind of his uncle,

736
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 2: Like this is the guy who's like, yeah, Zar Nicholas

737
00:39:38,120 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 2: is a seconds like grandfather had been another czar whatever,

738
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:46,800
Speaker 2: fucking royalty. And as soon as these reforms are promised,

739
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 2: the rebellions stopped, those strikes stopped, and then the reforms

740
00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,560
Speaker 2: didn't come, and the revolution actually reached its peak in

741
00:39:55,600 --> 00:39:58,960
Speaker 2: that December, primarily led by the Bolsheviks and Saint Petersburg

742
00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:01,359
Speaker 2: as best as I can tell, before they were put

743
00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 2: down by the army. Only the leftist groups like the

744
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:08,120
Speaker 2: SRS and the Social Democrats and the anarchists and shit

745
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 2: wanted to keep going. Everyone else was like, woo, we

746
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:15,040
Speaker 2: can vote now if these things go through. The revolutionists

747
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,759
Speaker 2: doubled down and tried to go for it, and they

748
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:22,239
Speaker 2: they failed, and nineteen oh six Russia became a constitutional

749
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,320
Speaker 2: monarchy with a multi party system. But it was except

750
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:28,919
Speaker 2: Nicholas the second was like, well, except I'm just still

751
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:30,440
Speaker 2: going to be an autocrat and you can have like

752
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,439
Speaker 2: the trappings of democracy, and he like slowly he made

753
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 2: the doom a powerless. There was this brief moment at

754
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:38,880
Speaker 2: the end of nineteen oh five where there's free press

755
00:40:39,280 --> 00:40:41,720
Speaker 2: and a ton of groups put out a ton of material,

756
00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 2: and a lot of the material is like, hey, everyone,

757
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:46,200
Speaker 2: let's organize and put a bunch of holes in the

758
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 2: czar until there's no more czar, and so all of

759
00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 2: these groups build up their ranks because the nineteen oh

760
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:56,000
Speaker 2: five revolution was fairly spontaneous and not necessarily party led.

761
00:40:56,320 --> 00:41:00,200
Speaker 2: But during what came after, the parties were like, oh,

762
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,000
Speaker 2: we can organize, and then free speech was like immediately revoked.

763
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 2: But do you know what else is free speed?

764
00:41:09,160 --> 00:41:09,600
Speaker 3: No, it's not.

765
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:14,080
Speaker 2: People pay a lot of money to have people advertise

766
00:41:14,160 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 2: to you. You know who else has given a lot

767
00:41:16,160 --> 00:41:20,160
Speaker 2: of money to feed my dog is the sponsors of

768
00:41:20,239 --> 00:41:23,200
Speaker 2: this podcast, who you can listen to if you want,

769
00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 2: or you can press forward a couple times on the

770
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 2: little thing on your phone, or you can subscribe to

771
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,600
Speaker 2: Cooler Zone Media and give the money directly to my

772
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:34,440
Speaker 2: dog and then you don't have to hear the ads

773
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:36,719
Speaker 2: or the ads are great and you're like, man, I

774
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 2: just love getting to hear what's going on in the

775
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:45,799
Speaker 2: world and learn about why I should gamble. Here's ads

776
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:58,040
Speaker 2: and rebec So for several years you have the rise

777
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 2: of political violence and there's like more strikes and rebellions

778
00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 2: going on, like kind of this echo of nineteen oh five,

779
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:07,279
Speaker 2: and here's where we get what we promised you last time.

780
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 2: The kind of pissing match between sars and anarchists to

781
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:16,560
Speaker 2: see who can like kill the most motherfuckers. The SRS

782
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:19,640
Speaker 2: had their own split. He was the maximalist faction that

783
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 2: wanted to bring about an immediate revolution, who turned to

784
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:26,799
Speaker 2: revolutionary violence. But things slowly settled down again. In that

785
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 2: pattern we see again and again after the mass movement fails,

786
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:33,680
Speaker 2: the diehards keep going, like the how in the nineteen

787
00:42:33,719 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 2: sixties to nineteen seventies. You know, partly things settled down

788
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:43,759
Speaker 2: because the crackdowns on the leftists were pretty fucking successful.

789
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 2: The leaders and organizers of most of the revolutionary parties died,

790
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:51,000
Speaker 2: were imprisoned in Siberia, or went into exile around the country.

791
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:54,759
Speaker 2: This includes a bunch of the major figures. Leon Trotsky

792
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:57,680
Speaker 2: was sentenced to Siberia but escaped during transport made it

793
00:42:57,680 --> 00:42:59,800
Speaker 2: to London. I do want to hear that story of

794
00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:02,839
Speaker 2: that escape. I don't know it, but you randomly know it.

795
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:05,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't. I don't actually know that one. Unfortunately,

796
00:43:06,040 --> 00:43:10,360
Speaker 3: that's right, we're into the territory of leftist prison breaks.

797
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:12,840
Speaker 3: They don't know the story. I don't know. It's just

798
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:13,880
Speaker 3: I just don't like Trotsky.

799
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:15,799
Speaker 2: No, I know That's one of the things about this

800
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 2: is like, yeah, like spoiler alert for anyone who's like

801
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:21,280
Speaker 2: wondering why we're like, but Trotsky seems like the reasonable

802
00:43:21,280 --> 00:43:23,040
Speaker 2: one you're all talking about. Trotsky is the one who's

803
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:26,759
Speaker 2: going to lead the attack on Kronstad and put down

804
00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:29,279
Speaker 2: and like lead the counter revolution, and he's he's the

805
00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 2: guy who should have known better, unlike Vladimir Lenin is

806
00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:37,120
Speaker 2: the next one we're gonna talk about. He actually sat

807
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:41,400
Speaker 2: the nineteen oh five revolution out. He wrote from London

808
00:43:41,400 --> 00:43:43,680
Speaker 2: about how the Russian Bolsheviks should get involved in all

809
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 2: the armed insurrection and mass terror and expropriation, because overall

810
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,320
Speaker 2: the Bolsheviks back then were like, that's not really our deal,

811
00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:55,960
Speaker 2: Like that's more Maximus stars and anarchists who do that

812
00:43:56,040 --> 00:43:58,839
Speaker 2: kind of stuff. And Lenin's like, but why not us?

813
00:43:59,040 --> 00:44:01,440
Speaker 2: Can't we do it too? And by us doing it,

814
00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 2: I mean you, I'm going to write a letter and

815
00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:05,080
Speaker 2: then you can do it, and then I'm going to

816
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:09,320
Speaker 2: stay in London. And I actually don't think Lennon was

817
00:44:09,320 --> 00:44:13,080
Speaker 2: a coward. That's not an accusation I'm trying to make.

818
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,480
Speaker 2: But there was some serious lead from the back energy happening.

819
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:15,680
Speaker 4: Yeah.

820
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:21,400
Speaker 2: After the Tsar accepted the Manifesto and was briefly liberalizing,

821
00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:25,000
Speaker 2: Lenin went home to Saint Petersburg and the Bolsheviks joined

822
00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:26,960
Speaker 2: the s RS and the anarchists and doing the rob

823
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:30,480
Speaker 2: the rich, kill the rulers stuff. Most famous of these

824
00:44:30,520 --> 00:44:36,960
Speaker 2: Bolshevik bank robbers was the admittedly attractive, later mass murderer

825
00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:38,240
Speaker 2: Joseph Stalin.

826
00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:41,200
Speaker 3: Okay, I want to clear something up here. The picture

827
00:44:41,239 --> 00:44:43,640
Speaker 3: of young Stalin that everyone points out is not real.

828
00:44:44,000 --> 00:44:46,080
Speaker 3: Wait what, yeah, it's it's a it's a it's a

829
00:44:46,080 --> 00:44:50,600
Speaker 3: propaganda picture that Stalin distributed and has hundreds of years.

830
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:52,920
Speaker 2: Well, not necessarily the shirtless one, just that even the

831
00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:56,600
Speaker 2: one with him like like the picture where like him

832
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 2: with like a mustache and yeah, yeah that's fair to

833
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:03,719
Speaker 2: look like the from one direction not real. I don't

834
00:45:03,760 --> 00:45:07,200
Speaker 2: know reference is that. Nobody on this thing but me.

835
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,160
Speaker 3: I just don't know what Zaye looks like that. I

836
00:45:10,640 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 3: was a one direction hater.

837
00:45:12,920 --> 00:45:15,759
Speaker 2: So the like, if you google young Stalin, it's like

838
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 2: a porky. That's not it's not like shirtless whatever, you're

839
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:18,440
Speaker 2: just hot.

840
00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 3: That's not him.

841
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:23,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's fake. Yeah, that's someone else that they as

842
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:25,000
Speaker 1: the Stalin thing.

843
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:26,319
Speaker 3: I literally showed you.

844
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,879
Speaker 1: A screen by screen of Zaye and the fake Stalin thing.

845
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:34,680
Speaker 2: Oh no, yeah, no, I to listening. Yeah, fake Stalin

846
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:37,680
Speaker 2: is even hotter than Zaane would It would be so

847
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:40,759
Speaker 2: fun if he was in a boy band. Sorry, the

848
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:42,040
Speaker 2: world would have been a better place.

849
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, someone should have silo him there.

850
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm like, all right, Saddam wrote romance novels Stalin

851
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:49,960
Speaker 1: was in a boy band, like, that's fun.

852
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:52,920
Speaker 2: Yeah, do it for the girlies.

853
00:45:53,400 --> 00:45:53,960
Speaker 3: Yeah.

854
00:45:54,239 --> 00:45:57,239
Speaker 2: Well, by the time Joseph Stalin, who is apparently not

855
00:45:57,280 --> 00:46:01,720
Speaker 2: as attractive as I was led to believe, was robbing banks,

856
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:03,919
Speaker 2: Lenin was already out of the country again. He moved

857
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:06,480
Speaker 2: to Switzerland and then Paris, where he argued that instead

858
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 2: of educating the Russian masses, the important thing was that

859
00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 2: the existing intelligency. I should lead the working class. I

860
00:46:12,239 --> 00:46:14,640
Speaker 2: see where the anti intellectual anarchists were coming from.

861
00:46:15,000 --> 00:46:19,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I do the anti intellectual. The intellectual was Lenin.

862
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:22,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly if the intellectual meant I get to learn

863
00:46:22,760 --> 00:46:26,520
Speaker 2: things and you don't, yeh like if everyone gets to

864
00:46:26,600 --> 00:46:29,920
Speaker 2: learn things, It's cool that sometimes people focus on learning things.

865
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:33,399
Speaker 2: Nesser Makno the anarchist who's going to be important later

866
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:36,680
Speaker 2: he goes to Siberia for killing a cop and a

867
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:40,600
Speaker 2: lot of the maximalists, and I'm a little bit confused

868
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:42,440
Speaker 2: about whether Sr's were the only ones who could be

869
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:45,040
Speaker 2: called maximalists. I also feel like I've heard anarchists referred

870
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 2: to as maximalists or maybe ultras. At this time, I

871
00:46:47,719 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 2: get there's so many All of the words that are

872
00:46:51,719 --> 00:46:54,239
Speaker 2: used for the left everywhere else in the West are

873
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:59,080
Speaker 2: not the words that people use in Russia anyway. An

874
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:03,160
Speaker 2: awful lot of the people doing the terrorism take their

875
00:47:03,160 --> 00:47:07,440
Speaker 2: own lives rather than be arrested. Death is the sister

876
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:10,440
Speaker 2: of liberty, when anarchists put it before ending his life,

877
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:14,160
Speaker 2: I believe to the court many of them took their

878
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:17,280
Speaker 2: own lives by self immolating, like setting themselves on fire.

879
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:20,799
Speaker 2: One anarchist at the time, a guy who's later are

880
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:23,680
Speaker 2: going to become Bolshevik anti anarchist. His name is Victor Serge.

881
00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:27,879
Speaker 2: He referred to it, Yeah, he referred to it. It

882
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:30,920
Speaker 2: was like a collective suicide. And actually the fact that

883
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:32,600
Speaker 2: Victor Surge is one of the people writing about this

884
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:34,839
Speaker 2: is part of what makes it so hard. All of

885
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:39,719
Speaker 2: this stuff is clouded in misinformation, you know, because the

886
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:42,479
Speaker 2: Bolsheviks have a specific way that they want to paint

887
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:45,200
Speaker 2: the anarchists, and what they want to paint the anarchists

888
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:50,279
Speaker 2: as is bandits. So they want to play up the

889
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:57,439
Speaker 2: disorganized nature, the fractious nature, and the like noble sack

890
00:47:57,560 --> 00:47:59,480
Speaker 2: self sacrificing.

891
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 3: Like fool.

892
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:10,160
Speaker 2: But on the other hand, that happens too, you know. Yeah,

893
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 2: those anarchists who were arrested generally gave Baller's speeches or

894
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:15,640
Speaker 2: just refused to talk to the court at all, refusing

895
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:19,160
Speaker 2: to dignify the proceedings. One young anarchist woman on trial

896
00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:21,280
Speaker 2: for killing a priest and then trying to kill a cop,

897
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:25,680
Speaker 2: told the court proudly and bravely, we shall mount the scaffold,

898
00:48:25,840 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 2: casting a look of defiance at you. Our death like

899
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:31,720
Speaker 2: a hot flame, will ignite many hearts. We are dying

900
00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:35,440
Speaker 2: as victors forward, then our death is our triumph.

901
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:36,840
Speaker 3: Rules.

902
00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:42,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, she took cyanide pills in captivity. That seems to

903
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:44,359
Speaker 2: be the attitude of a lot of these people, because

904
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:49,160
Speaker 2: you're you're living in a dirt floor house, oppressed like hell,

905
00:48:50,560 --> 00:48:52,160
Speaker 2: and you're like, oh, we almost had a revolution.

906
00:48:52,239 --> 00:48:52,879
Speaker 3: It didn't work.

907
00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:57,759
Speaker 2: I'm not going back to starving, like, yeah, I will

908
00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:02,240
Speaker 2: take as many months out with me and I knew

909
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:05,399
Speaker 2: that the end result of living is death, and I'm

910
00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:10,120
Speaker 2: gonna do it as nobly as I can. Other final

911
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:13,080
Speaker 2: words to court are things like you yourself should be

912
00:49:13,080 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 2: sitting on the bench of the accused. Down with you, all,

913
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:19,759
Speaker 2: villainous hangmen, Long live anarchy, and that the anarchists would

914
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:23,920
Speaker 2: take away quote your privileges and idleness, your luxuries and authority,

915
00:49:24,080 --> 00:49:26,920
Speaker 2: death and destruction to the whole bourgeois order. Hail the

916
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:31,560
Speaker 2: revolutionary class struggle of the oppressed. Long live anarchism and communism.

917
00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 2: They also promised that they were the first swallows of

918
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:40,719
Speaker 2: a coming spring, and they were right. Actually, it's a

919
00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:43,920
Speaker 2: shame that spring was hijacked by power hungry tyrants.

920
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:50,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, it rapidly became winter. And yeah, as springs are

921
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 3: wont to do.

922
00:49:51,520 --> 00:49:55,960
Speaker 2: I know, stupid cycles. Why can't we just have utopia,

923
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,000
Speaker 2: gonna stop the earth?

924
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:03,400
Speaker 3: Yeah vie. Yeah.

925
00:50:03,440 --> 00:50:06,439
Speaker 2: With all the mass arrests happening, the Russian left turned

926
00:50:06,480 --> 00:50:08,880
Speaker 2: to a group that had been active for decades, the

927
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:13,160
Speaker 2: political Red Cross. This was a group, or rather several

928
00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 2: groups working together that helped political prisoners in Russia. Interestingly,

929
00:50:18,840 --> 00:50:22,640
Speaker 2: this predates the modern Red Cross by several years, at

930
00:50:22,719 --> 00:50:26,400
Speaker 2: least under that name. Yeah, no, I this one like

931
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:29,600
Speaker 2: I fell into a hole about well, I mean, that's

932
00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:31,719
Speaker 2: what could probably call this podcast is.

933
00:50:32,239 --> 00:50:34,839
Speaker 3: Margaret reports from the hole that Margaret fell in this week.

934
00:50:36,160 --> 00:50:40,080
Speaker 2: But where all the groups got the name of the

935
00:50:40,120 --> 00:50:42,759
Speaker 2: Red Cross was at in eighteen sixty four, the first

936
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 2: Geneva Convention picked the Red Cross as an international symbol

937
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:48,960
Speaker 2: for don't shoot, contrary to some pictures that have come

938
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:52,160
Speaker 2: out of Gaza over the past couple decades. Yeah, it

939
00:50:52,239 --> 00:50:55,120
Speaker 2: is the symbol of neutrality and armed conflict is what

940
00:50:55,200 --> 00:50:58,400
Speaker 2: the Red Cross was designed as, not even specifically medical.

941
00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 2: It's obviously become that, but it was like it's it's

942
00:51:02,560 --> 00:51:06,280
Speaker 2: the don't shoot symbol. And I'm sure that other groups

943
00:51:06,360 --> 00:51:08,359
Speaker 2: use the name, but the first one I'm aware of

944
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 2: is the political Red Cross in Russia, which is later

945
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:13,200
Speaker 2: going to become the anarchist Black Cross. To be clear

946
00:51:13,239 --> 00:51:15,360
Speaker 2: to where I'm going with this, it was formed in

947
00:51:15,360 --> 00:51:18,360
Speaker 2: eighteen seventy, whereas the International Committee of the Red Cross,

948
00:51:18,360 --> 00:51:20,600
Speaker 2: the group that we talk about today, picked its name

949
00:51:20,640 --> 00:51:26,360
Speaker 2: in eighteen seventy six, the Political Red Cross fundraised and

950
00:51:26,400 --> 00:51:28,560
Speaker 2: offered support to political prisoners that had been doing it

951
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:32,400
Speaker 2: since eighteen seventy. They fundraised basically the same way that

952
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:35,280
Speaker 2: people do now like again, and then nothing ever changes.

953
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:39,480
Speaker 2: First bail support group, it is, it absolutely is. They

954
00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:43,239
Speaker 2: did it through benefit shows, oh my god, donations from

955
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:47,760
Speaker 2: leftists with middle class jobs and or generational wealth and crime.

956
00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:51,279
Speaker 2: Nothing has ever changed, nothing has ever changed. To be fair,

957
00:51:51,320 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 2: To be fair, I do want this on the record,

958
00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:55,160
Speaker 2: we don't actually fund bail funds with crime. That's actually

959
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:56,120
Speaker 2: not a thing that happens.

960
00:51:56,680 --> 00:52:02,400
Speaker 3: But yeah, fair enough. Yeah.

961
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:05,760
Speaker 2: They first started off by supporting the Nerodniks, the eco hippies,

962
00:52:05,840 --> 00:52:08,680
Speaker 2: the Back of the Landers, and then the nihilists, the

963
00:52:08,719 --> 00:52:12,400
Speaker 2: eco hippies plus guns, and then all the various political

964
00:52:12,440 --> 00:52:15,000
Speaker 2: groups after the nineteen oh five revolution failed is where

965
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:20,840
Speaker 2: they went next. But here's the interesting part. The group

966
00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:24,680
Speaker 2: was meant to be non ideological right. But then the

967
00:52:24,719 --> 00:52:28,040
Speaker 2: Social Democrats. I believe this means the Bolsheviks, but what

968
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:31,760
Speaker 2: I read was the Social Democrats. They started only helping

969
00:52:31,800 --> 00:52:34,920
Speaker 2: their own folks. Oh, after nineteen oh five, as the

970
00:52:34,920 --> 00:52:39,759
Speaker 2: political Red Cross, so the anarchist Red Cross split off

971
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:43,880
Speaker 2: and what matters about this? And it mattered then and

972
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:46,280
Speaker 2: it matters now, and I think is crucial for understanding

973
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:50,360
Speaker 2: the Russian Revolution. The Anarchist Red Cross split off to

974
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:55,520
Speaker 2: support not the anarchist prisoners, but all political prisoners, regardless

975
00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 2: of their ideology, whereas the Bolsheviks used the larger umbrella

976
00:52:59,640 --> 00:53:04,239
Speaker 2: name Polytical Red Cross to only support their folks. Anarchists

977
00:53:04,239 --> 00:53:07,240
Speaker 2: in the Russian Revolutions were fighting for an anarchist society,

978
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 2: they almost always did so in a way that encouraged

979
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:16,239
Speaker 2: and supported ideological pluralism. So as compared to the Bolsheviks,

980
00:53:16,239 --> 00:53:19,680
Speaker 2: who would take the big umbrella name but mean the

981
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:22,000
Speaker 2: tiny click and they've been doing it since the beginning,

982
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:25,400
Speaker 2: since they got the name Bolsheviks. They are the smaller

983
00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:29,400
Speaker 2: group that takes the larger umbrella group name and then

984
00:53:29,840 --> 00:53:35,520
Speaker 2: turns it into the tiny elite banguard. This new Anarchist

985
00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:38,799
Speaker 2: Red Cross started spreading across the world as Russians went

986
00:53:38,840 --> 00:53:41,880
Speaker 2: into exile. At some point along the way, I think

987
00:53:42,040 --> 00:53:45,840
Speaker 2: the late nineteen oughts, but I'm not sure, it changed

988
00:53:45,840 --> 00:53:48,720
Speaker 2: its name to Anarchist Black Cross to avoid being confused

989
00:53:48,760 --> 00:53:52,320
Speaker 2: the International Red Cross, and good on it. That is

990
00:53:52,360 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 2: a better name for this particular project is the Anarchist

991
00:53:56,160 --> 00:53:58,879
Speaker 2: Black Cross. Is still around today and it is one

992
00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,560
Speaker 2: of the best entry points into anti authoritarian politics for

993
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:03,000
Speaker 2: folks who are interested but don't know.

994
00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:03,520
Speaker 3: Where to start.

995
00:54:04,680 --> 00:54:08,640
Speaker 2: ABC chapters. Anarchist Black Cross chapters put on political prisoner

996
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:12,640
Speaker 2: letter writing nights and support all politicized prisoners, not just anarchists,

997
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:16,520
Speaker 2: and have since the start. There are even still chapters

998
00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:21,920
Speaker 2: in Russia. They are officially marked as undesirable organizations by

999
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:24,920
Speaker 2: the state, which means that they are prohibited from organizing

1000
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 2: and disseminating information. The first time that you're caught is

1001
00:54:28,080 --> 00:54:33,360
Speaker 2: a fine. After that it is a jail sentence. But

1002
00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:36,040
Speaker 2: that's where we're going to leave Russia for this week.

1003
00:54:36,400 --> 00:54:39,440
Speaker 2: They've had a mostly failed revolution, all the radicals are

1004
00:54:39,440 --> 00:54:42,080
Speaker 2: dead or in jail or in exile or desperately supporting

1005
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:48,279
Speaker 2: imprisoned comrades. And then famously nothing happened in Europe for

1006
00:54:48,360 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 2: the nineteen tens except World War One and a string

1007
00:54:52,760 --> 00:54:55,080
Speaker 2: of revolutions, including the most famous of all revolutions, the

1008
00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:58,440
Speaker 2: Russian Revolution, which is really three revolutions, the sort of

1009
00:54:58,520 --> 00:55:01,120
Speaker 2: liberal one, the more radical one, and then a desperate

1010
00:55:01,160 --> 00:55:05,040
Speaker 2: revolutionary attempt against the Bolshevik counter revolution, which we'll get

1011
00:55:05,080 --> 00:55:09,520
Speaker 2: at into. That wasn't right grammar, but I'm going with it.

1012
00:55:09,760 --> 00:55:12,680
Speaker 2: We're gonna get at into in parts three, four, five,

1013
00:55:12,800 --> 00:55:18,840
Speaker 2: and six. Fuck yeah, our first six parter. Any thoughts,

1014
00:55:19,520 --> 00:55:23,160
Speaker 2: of course, it's cronstat that no other episode could possibly.

1015
00:55:22,719 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 3: Have been for six partner.

1016
00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:28,239
Speaker 2: No, it could have been a two parter, Kross I

1017
00:55:28,239 --> 00:55:30,239
Speaker 2: could have been two parter if I had already done

1018
00:55:30,239 --> 00:55:31,440
Speaker 2: the enough of the Russian Revolution.

1019
00:55:33,560 --> 00:55:37,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, but but just morally it had to be cross

1020
00:55:37,600 --> 00:55:38,160
Speaker 1: sixth part.

1021
00:55:39,400 --> 00:55:42,759
Speaker 2: I think Kronschat is one of the single pivotal moments

1022
00:55:42,920 --> 00:55:44,880
Speaker 2: of human history.

1023
00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:46,839
Speaker 3: Yeah, it is, like.

1024
00:55:48,360 --> 00:55:50,800
Speaker 2: And I was surprised years ago when I used to

1025
00:55:50,840 --> 00:55:55,200
Speaker 2: make my living selling buttons on Etsy. I tried to

1026
00:55:55,200 --> 00:55:57,120
Speaker 2: be clever all the time for a living, and I

1027
00:55:57,160 --> 00:56:00,200
Speaker 2: made one that said I'm still mad about Kronstadt, and like,

1028
00:56:00,840 --> 00:56:03,520
Speaker 2: I thought that was gonna be my like ten people

1029
00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:05,040
Speaker 2: are gonna buy this. Ever, that was one of my

1030
00:56:05,080 --> 00:56:06,240
Speaker 2: most popular buttons.

1031
00:56:06,520 --> 00:56:08,839
Speaker 3: I've seen them in the wild. Before I knew you,

1032
00:56:08,880 --> 00:56:10,160
Speaker 3: i'd seen those in the wild.

1033
00:56:10,400 --> 00:56:14,799
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been one hundred years, We're still bad.

1034
00:56:15,160 --> 00:56:18,400
Speaker 3: You ruined literally all of human history. Congratulations.

1035
00:56:18,600 --> 00:56:21,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, and It's funny too, because it's like one of

1036
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:23,279
Speaker 2: the things that I used to think, oh, Cronshot was

1037
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:25,120
Speaker 2: when the anarchists tried to stop the Bolsheviks. No, it's

1038
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:30,040
Speaker 2: when everyone who was a communist tried to stop the Bolsheviks.

1039
00:56:30,440 --> 00:56:32,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, like it.

1040
00:56:32,640 --> 00:56:41,280
Speaker 2: Was when socialism tried to stop a terrible thing. Oh, anyway,

1041
00:56:42,120 --> 00:56:45,680
Speaker 2: we'll talk about all those revolutions next week, but first

1042
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:49,239
Speaker 2: we'll talk about your plugs. Yeah, you can find me

1043
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:53,520
Speaker 2: a podcasting could happen here. We do it every day

1044
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:59,760
Speaker 2: except Saturdays and Sundays. Yeah, and you two can figure

1045
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:02,040
Speaker 2: out how to not have this happen to you again.

1046
00:57:02,960 --> 00:57:06,040
Speaker 2: That is one of the I really appreciate the like

1047
00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:09,080
Speaker 2: strategic analysis that you all do with current events as

1048
00:57:09,080 --> 00:57:11,000
Speaker 2: well as like historical events and how they relate to

1049
00:57:11,360 --> 00:57:14,480
Speaker 2: current events. I actually, I was really I was really impressed.

1050
00:57:14,719 --> 00:57:19,800
Speaker 2: People should check out Gare's recent breakdown of organizing in

1051
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:22,440
Speaker 2: Atlanta and like updates that are fairly recent. This is

1052
00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:24,400
Speaker 2: a couple of weeks old now at this point, but

1053
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:28,040
Speaker 2: Garret did a good talk that just is like here's

1054
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:29,880
Speaker 2: how people try to organize, and here's what works, and

1055
00:57:29,920 --> 00:57:32,720
Speaker 2: here's what didn't, and that's the kind of you know,

1056
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:37,120
Speaker 2: that's the kind of without like talking trash on each

1057
00:57:37,120 --> 00:57:39,840
Speaker 2: other and being like, oh, y'all are fools, Just be like,

1058
00:57:39,880 --> 00:57:43,680
Speaker 2: well this didn't work. What can we try instead? And

1059
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:47,400
Speaker 2: that's what I'm doing with these episodes.

1060
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:51,160
Speaker 1: My episode is called Crackdown on Stop Cup City.

1061
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:55,360
Speaker 2: Oh thank you if you're looking for it. My main

1062
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:57,640
Speaker 2: plug is a September twenty fourth, I have a new

1063
00:57:57,640 --> 00:58:00,200
Speaker 2: book coming out. It is actually my debut novel in

1064
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:02,680
Speaker 2: a ton of books, but they are all either short

1065
00:58:02,720 --> 00:58:05,400
Speaker 2: novellas or long novellas, like a Country a Ghost is

1066
00:58:05,440 --> 00:58:09,120
Speaker 2: like right on the line between novella and novel, and

1067
00:58:10,200 --> 00:58:12,040
Speaker 2: so I'm going with con a long novella. And this

1068
00:58:12,080 --> 00:58:14,200
Speaker 2: is my debut novel. It's called The Sapling Cage and

1069
00:58:14,240 --> 00:58:18,000
Speaker 2: it is a crossover book, and crossover is a marketing term.

1070
00:58:18,360 --> 00:58:20,520
Speaker 2: It means it's a ya book that like a young

1071
00:58:20,560 --> 00:58:22,640
Speaker 2: adult book that knows that it's mostly adults who are

1072
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:27,120
Speaker 2: going to read it. And it is about a young

1073
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 2: person who wants to go be a witch. But they

1074
00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:31,160
Speaker 2: have one major problem, which is that they were born

1075
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:34,760
Speaker 2: a boy and their best friend has been promised for

1076
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:37,800
Speaker 2: the witches and they go in their friend's place and

1077
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:40,640
Speaker 2: learn all about magic and in the meantime have.

1078
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:41,960
Speaker 3: To save the world.

1079
00:58:41,960 --> 00:58:44,880
Speaker 2: Because it's a high fantasy book and I hope you

1080
00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:46,640
Speaker 2: like it is the first book in the Daughters of

1081
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:50,400
Speaker 2: the Empty Throne trilogy, because of course that's the title

1082
00:58:50,440 --> 00:58:54,560
Speaker 2: of my trilogy, Rules Kingdom that Doesn't have a King.

1083
00:58:56,800 --> 00:58:58,760
Speaker 2: It comes out September twenty fourth. I'll be talking about

1084
00:58:58,760 --> 00:59:00,000
Speaker 2: a lot more. It's going to go for pre order

1085
00:59:00,160 --> 00:59:04,560
Speaker 2: probably in June. And it's from Feminist Press. And there's

1086
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:08,439
Speaker 2: a new Pool Zone media podcast called sixteenth Minute, and

1087
00:59:08,720 --> 00:59:11,040
Speaker 2: it is by someone who wrote about hot dogs. And

1088
00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:14,440
Speaker 2: you don't need to know anything else about Jamie Besides.

1089
00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:16,520
Speaker 2: That's what's so great is that everyone can have the

1090
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:18,880
Speaker 2: one thing that people decide they're famous for and then

1091
00:59:18,880 --> 00:59:22,320
Speaker 2: never deviate from that ever. Yeah.

1092
00:59:22,360 --> 00:59:24,560
Speaker 3: For me, it's ice must be Destroyed. Yes, that's all

1093
00:59:24,600 --> 00:59:25,000
Speaker 3: I got.

1094
00:59:25,680 --> 00:59:29,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I even like when I'm like, oh wow,

1095
00:59:29,800 --> 00:59:32,480
Speaker 2: like Margaret writes fiction too, It's like, look, I know,

1096
00:59:33,280 --> 00:59:37,040
Speaker 2: my podcast is probably the widest reaching thing I've ever done.

1097
00:59:37,680 --> 00:59:40,960
Speaker 2: Writing about history is way newer to me than writing

1098
00:59:41,680 --> 00:59:43,600
Speaker 2: fantasy and science fiction. I've been doing that for a

1099
00:59:43,640 --> 00:59:48,720
Speaker 2: long time. Anyway, Sixteenth minute. I somehow made it about me,

1100
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:53,880
Speaker 2: but it's not at all. It's about Jamie Loftus and

1101
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:57,640
Speaker 2: you should check it out in May June May you

1102
00:59:57,760 --> 00:59:59,919
Speaker 2: may check. Nope, not gonna do it by everyone seeing

1103
00:59:59,920 --> 01:00:00,439
Speaker 2: it next week.

1104
01:00:00,720 --> 01:00:01,000
Speaker 3: Bye.

1105
01:00:06,640 --> 01:00:09,120
Speaker 2: Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff is a production of

1106
01:00:09,160 --> 01:00:10,080
Speaker 2: cool Zone Media.

1107
01:00:10,440 --> 01:00:13,240
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website

1108
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:17,080
Speaker 1: Coolzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

1109
01:00:17,120 --> 01:00:19,960
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.