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Speaker 1: Welcome to Worst Year Ever, a production of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: We Get Everything, so don't don't welcome Welcome, Welcome to

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Speaker 1: to to. Hey everybody, this is the worst year ever.

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Speaker 1: My name is Cody Johnston, and we are here talking

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Speaker 1: about the worst checking this yeah year ever. Hi everybody. Hey, also, Hey, Hi,

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Speaker 1: I'm Katie. By the way. You didn't know Stole by

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Speaker 1: the way, in case you didn't know that either. Robert

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Speaker 1: Evans do you have a name? No? No, he does

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Speaker 1: not Alight, I have no follow ups? Um? Yeah, today,

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Speaker 1: great episode on this year. God, we're good at this.

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Speaker 1: We've got a topic that um, we seem to be

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Speaker 1: returning to pretty regularly every single week, every single episode

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Speaker 1: of every moment of every day. Um, which is uh,

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Speaker 1: different aspects of the coronavirus pandemic that I think everyone

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Speaker 1: doesn't need a summary of. And today we're gonna talk

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Speaker 1: about hydrochloroquin hack. Hey, today we're going to talk about

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Speaker 1: hydroxy chloroquin um, a miracle drug that needs no explanation

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Speaker 1: the end. Go use it. Yeah, I guess I'll lead

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Speaker 1: us off. So we're talking about hydro chloroquine. Hydroxy chloroquin

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Speaker 1: This is the this is the medicine that our our

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Speaker 1: president is convinced as a miracle here, and so we're

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Speaker 1: going to talk about a lot of aspects of that today. Um.

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Speaker 1: And it is the president about this? Is this the

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Speaker 1: President of the United States, Yes, the one that was

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Speaker 1: told repeatedly to not look directly at the sun during

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Speaker 1: the eclipse, and then he did, and then someone yelled,

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Speaker 1: don't look at it, and then he kept doing it

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Speaker 1: and he pointed directly at it. Yeah. President, Yeah, the

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Speaker 1: medical genius that is the president, President science, the president

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Speaker 1: who who's bold self experimentation is responsible for us all

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Speaker 1: now knowing that the eyes are the best way to

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Speaker 1: get vitamin D into your body. Um. So I hope

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Speaker 1: everyone is staring at the sun without blinking for twenty

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Speaker 1: five minutes a day like you're supposed to. Yep. What okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: so let's talk about let's talk about why hydroxy clarquin

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Speaker 1: um is even a subject that's in the general zeitgeist.

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Speaker 1: To explain that we have to go back in time

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Speaker 1: to uh, the halcyon days of early March, those beautiful

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Speaker 1: end of winter days. Yeah, I wonder I wish there

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Speaker 1: was some sort of sound that could help us go

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Speaker 1: back in time and differentiate the past from the now.

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Speaker 1: But I don't know what that would be. I'm taking

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Speaker 1: off my headphones. Katie, come back, Katie, I'm done. Back

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Speaker 1: around March I think it was March. Yeah, yeah, she's

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Speaker 1: We're good. Oh no, Cody horrible. Thank you. If you're

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Speaker 1: not here for them, they don't work, okay. So March

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Speaker 1: sixth a small French study was published on the use

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Speaker 1: of hydroxy chloroquine to treat UH COVID nineteen patients UM.

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Speaker 1: It was about twenty people in the study UM, and

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Speaker 1: they found that medicating folks with hydroxy chloroquine was was

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Speaker 1: associated with a viral load reduction UM and the disappearance

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Speaker 1: of COVID nineteen in many of the patients UM. And

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Speaker 1: the effect of hydroxy chloroquine on these patients was reinforced

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Speaker 1: by pairing it with a zithra mayasin, which is an

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Speaker 1: antibiotic better known as a z pac um. So this

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Speaker 1: is like the first study that came out UM, and

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Speaker 1: it seemed on its surface like this could be really interesting.

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Speaker 1: First step. You know, you get a data like that

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Speaker 1: during a pandemic, you definitely want to have follow up

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Speaker 1: studies UM to kind of try to confirm as to

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Speaker 1: whether or not there's actually anything going on there and

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Speaker 1: this might be a treatment that could really help a

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Speaker 1: lot of people. Um. So a study like this of

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Speaker 1: twenty people can be a good first step. But traditionally

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Speaker 1: in medicine, you don't just jump from a twenty person

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Speaker 1: study to dosing millions of people with a medication. You

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Speaker 1: do more studies with more people. No. No, that's that

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Speaker 1: that's like, it's that's what we would call unspeakably reckless. Um.

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Speaker 1: It's okay, most people do because America doesn't like science. Um.

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Speaker 1: But science way that you handle this is you do

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Speaker 1: more studies with more people, ideally in a couple of

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Speaker 1: different parts of the world, and you see if the

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Speaker 1: patterns from the first study continue to bear out. Uh.

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Speaker 1: And that's not what happened here, because on March thirteen,

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Speaker 1: cryptocurrency investor James tadaro In a New York City lawyer

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Speaker 1: named Gregory Rigano tweeted out a link to a paper

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Speaker 1: that they had put up on Google docs um, which

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Speaker 1: is the most reputable publishing house for scientific the medical

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Speaker 1: journal Google docs unfamiliar. Yeah, Yeah, that's where Jonah salk

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Speaker 1: Um cured polio was in Google docs. Uh yeah yeah

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Speaker 1: so uh. In this open file sharing paper that they

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Speaker 1: threw out, the men described a drug, you know, cloroquine

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Speaker 1: hydroxychloroquine um. And they described the early trials and France,

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Speaker 1: and there were also some early trials in China um

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Speaker 1: that had had shown some promise as a promise as

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Speaker 1: a COVID nineteen treatment. Um. And you know, they claimed

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Speaker 1: that this drug, which they said was a treatment from malaria,

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Speaker 1: which it was initially developed that way, it's not really

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Speaker 1: used much as a treatment for malaria. It's much more

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Speaker 1: often used for lupus these days. Um. They said that

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Speaker 1: it was cheap and plentiful uh and wrote that it

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Speaker 1: uh not only was it effective in treating COVID nineteen,

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Speaker 1: but it quote also has strong potential as a prophylactic

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Speaker 1: preventative measure against the coronavirus, which um, the data did

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Speaker 1: not actually really suggest at this point. But by saying that,

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Speaker 1: like you're basically telling people if you just take this medicine,

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Speaker 1: you'll be safe. UM. So this Google doc put up

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Speaker 1: by two people who are not epidemiologists and not medical professionals,

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Speaker 1: was basically crafted to create a run on this drug. Um.

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Speaker 1: And I should also note here that Gregory Regano the lawyer,

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Speaker 1: mischaracterized his qualifications in the paper. He described himself in

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Speaker 1: the paper as an advisor to the Stanford University School

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Speaker 1: of Years. Yeah. I mean this is kind of Yeah.

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Speaker 1: He didn't just do that. I mean, yes, he did that,

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Speaker 1: but we had Fox News bringing them on national television

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Speaker 1: with that as part of the chiron, you know, calling

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Speaker 1: this cure. Yeah. And Stanford has specifically come out and

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Speaker 1: said that like, no one in Stanford was involved in

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Speaker 1: the study and he is not an advisor with the

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Speaker 1: Stanford School of me uson. Um, he's just a liar. Uh.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, as you stated, Katie, it wound up on

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Speaker 1: Fox News. And the reason it went up on Fox

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Speaker 1: News A big part of that is that on March sixteen,

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Speaker 1: friend of the Show Elon Musk tweeted a link to

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Speaker 1: Google doc and wrote, maybe worth considering Cloroquin for c

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Speaker 1: nineteen unbelievable shocking. Uh. But you know he is a

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Speaker 1: super smart businessman. Yeah. Yeah. If if you know how

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Speaker 1: to pay people to design a pretty cool rocket in

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Speaker 1: a pretty cool car, you know how to treat a

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Speaker 1: viral epidemic. Sure, Yeah, yeah, I've read that. Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: was the Elon Musk's Twitter. Um. So yeah, he tweets

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Speaker 1: that out on March sixte and it goes super viral.

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Speaker 1: And on March eighteenth, Bright Bart and the Blaze pick

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Speaker 1: up the story. And on March nineteen, that's Katie when

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Speaker 1: Fox News has Gregory regano on um and yeah he

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Speaker 1: still he claims that it's got a hundred cure rate

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Speaker 1: against the ronavirus. This was a vast mischaracterization that the

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Speaker 1: idea that it has a curate against coronavirus was a

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Speaker 1: wild miss characterization of what the data suggested, um, but

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Speaker 1: also the data itself. That French study was profoundly flawed

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Speaker 1: in the reality, several patients in the study had to

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Speaker 1: drop out of it because they suffered significant health side

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Speaker 1: effects to the medication. In total, four of the forty

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Speaker 1: two patients covered in that study died. These outcomes were

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Speaker 1: not included in the studies final conclusions. UM. A thing

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Speaker 1: you might be as bad science, UM. Procedure for like

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Speaker 1: for study to not include that kind of information. No, uh,

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Speaker 1: And we will talk more later about some weird ship

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Speaker 1: that's happening with a number of these coronavirus studies. But

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Speaker 1: it's probably worth noting that, Um, every medical professional who's

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Speaker 1: been reached to about this, who's like an epidemiologist and

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Speaker 1: stuff has h has pretty much said the same thing,

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Speaker 1: which is kind of echoed by something Dr Kevin Tracy,

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Speaker 1: who's a CEO of the fine Stein Institute for Medical

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Speaker 1: Research in New York City, uh said about the study,

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Speaker 1: which is that it was a complete failure. So despite

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Speaker 1: it being a complete failure, Katie, you've got some stuff

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Speaker 1: on how Fox News continued to hype this ship up. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, like, as you said, you know, he went

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Speaker 1: on Bright Mart championed the story. Uh, went on Fox News.

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Speaker 1: The President got his jaws into it and started, you know,

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Speaker 1: whipping it around like a dog with meat. Um, the rumors.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, Fox News, I saw this interesting little tidbit apparently. Uh.

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Speaker 1: An analysis by Media Matters found that Fox News promoted

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Speaker 1: using the drug a hundred and nine times between March two.

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Speaker 1: In March, a hundred and nine times in two days. Um.

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Speaker 1: And and I know in addition to that, of course,

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Speaker 1: you know Bright Bar, Daily Wire, Daily Caller, even the

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Speaker 1: opinion pages of the Wall Street Journal. Uh. We're talking

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Speaker 1: about this miracle cure. Some of these headlines are like,

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Speaker 1: you know, talking about how nursing homes are giving all

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Speaker 1: of their patients hydra doxychloroquin in, and just there's just

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Speaker 1: like a pervasiveness of this word floating around, and of

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Speaker 1: course people start to like latch onto that, thinking like, oh, okay,

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Speaker 1: here's something that I can do to take control of this.

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Speaker 1: What's interesting is apparently when all of this started, I mean,

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Speaker 1: it was a drug that I was earmarked to like,

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Speaker 1: you know, it maybe has potential to be um helpful,

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Speaker 1: but that wasn't even the strongest drug, rem to severe.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure if I'm pronouncing that right. Rem dessevere

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Speaker 1: actually showed a lot more potential. But we all focused

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Speaker 1: on this because of all the stuff that you just outlined.

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Speaker 1: Are there other studies into that going on the better one? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there's some other studies we'll talk about a little later.

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Speaker 1: But it's just like that number, Katie, a hundred and

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Speaker 1: nine times in two days, Like it's stagering and like

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Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, what we're seeing with hydroxy

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Speaker 1: chloroquin is kind of like the anti science ship that

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Speaker 1: has been coming out of the Republican Party. And it's

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Speaker 1: media machine for the last my entire adult life is

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Speaker 1: like it's like Chekhov's gun, right, and we've all been

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Speaker 1: waiting it for it to really Like obviously it's gone

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Speaker 1: off because the climate change ship has been completely stymy,

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Speaker 1: but like this is this is the most direct, pulling

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Speaker 1: the trigger in someone's face way i've seen it go

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Speaker 1: off of of where oh now we just have Now

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Speaker 1: we're just lying about medication in the middle of a pandemic.

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Speaker 1: Like that's where this his his hit um And it's

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Speaker 1: become an ideological thing whether or not you support taking

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Speaker 1: an approved medication for fucking a plague. It's it's incredibly dangerous.

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Speaker 1: We're going to get into some of that, thankfully. I

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Speaker 1: was gonna say it rules rules different episodes, mindless dogshit

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Speaker 1: culture or stuff that affects people's lives. Uh like this too,

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Speaker 1: I mean a little bit of defensive fox Katie. I

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Speaker 1: text you at least a hundred and nine times every

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Speaker 1: two days about the various pain killers that I enjoy.

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Speaker 1: So you know, who's are you texting? Are you texting

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Speaker 1: audience of millions? Yeah? I recommend everybody break into your

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Speaker 1: local CVS. UH steal some delotted and uh, as I

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Speaker 1: hear there's no consequences to opiates, So like Fox News,

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Speaker 1: why why not, you know, let's let's go for it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: there used to be, but thanks to Jared Kushner, he's

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Speaker 1: he's uh stopped all the consequences. Yeah, consequences are gone,

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Speaker 1: which means the plague will I don't know that this

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Speaker 1: bit has no healthy conclusion. I just am so frustrated.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I needed just barrel through it keep going.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, from so as we've kind of laid out here,

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Speaker 1: it hits like the right wing fever swamp ship news

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Speaker 1: circus and it it gets spread there and this winds

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Speaker 1: up kind of leading it to the biggest spreader of

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Speaker 1: misinformation in the country today, the President of the United States. Um, yeah, yeah.

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Speaker 1: And so the same day as that Fox News interview,

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump gives yet another one of his press conferences

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Speaker 1: and announces, because he'd just seen it on Fox News,

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Speaker 1: that hydroxy cloroquine was a possible game changer. He stated

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Speaker 1: inaccurately that the FDA had approved it um and told

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Speaker 1: the entire country, We're going to be able to make

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Speaker 1: that drug available almost immediately. Um. During a few days later,

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Speaker 1: during another press conference, he said that clerk Win had

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Speaker 1: a real chance to be one of the biggest game

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Speaker 1: changers in the history of medicine. Uh. Two days after that,

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Speaker 1: he continued to talk about how wonderful this was, and

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Speaker 1: he told the story of a patient named Rio Jan Dnieri. UH,

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Speaker 1: a Florida man who was at death's door, who had

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Speaker 1: like said goodbye to his family, was given hydroxy clerk

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Speaker 1: Win and then Um had a seemingly miraq ulis recovery,

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Speaker 1: and Trump said a number of hours later, he woke up,

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Speaker 1: felt good. He's in good shape, and he's very happy

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Speaker 1: for this particular drug that we got approved in record

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Speaker 1: setting time. There's never been anything even close to it.

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Speaker 1: And as soon as Rio John Denieri's story hit the media,

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Speaker 1: UM he was adopted by the whole right wing punditry

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Speaker 1: ecosystem and prayed in front of the nation while he

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Speaker 1: was still in a hospital bed. He was interviewed on

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Speaker 1: Fox News, outlets around the country read stories about him. Uh. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I want to make it clear, Joon Denary has

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Speaker 1: actually been pretty reasonable about all this. There was an

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Speaker 1: article recently in Miami Herald where he was like Please

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Speaker 1: don't take hydroxy chloroquine if your doctor hasn't given to

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Speaker 1: you given it to you. He specifically stated, the one

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Speaker 1: thing that scares me to death is people taking these

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Speaker 1: stories and going out and self diagnosing and self medicating.

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Speaker 1: They can't do that. They've got to go to a doctor. Um.

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Speaker 1: He got scared about this when he, after his being

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Speaker 1: on Fox, started getting messages on like Facebook with people

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Speaker 1: asking him how to take hydroxy cloroquine. And it's one

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Speaker 1: of those things. He may it may have saved his life.

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Speaker 1: It also may have had nothing to do with his recovery.

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Speaker 1: We don't know yet because like it was a couple

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Speaker 1: of weeks ago. And yeah, it's just it's so fucking wild,

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Speaker 1: how reckless. I like, the gloves are off, there's no

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Speaker 1: truth anymore. Everything's fine, So we should all take as

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Speaker 1: much fucking painkillers as we want. Yeah, what's so dangerous

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Speaker 1: about this is that people see it being spread around

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Speaker 1: and look at his story and I think, oh, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I can do that for myself. For example, there's this

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Speaker 1: story of this couple from Arizona who wanted to take

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Speaker 1: hydroxy chloroquin after after hearing about this um and and

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Speaker 1: and the husband died because they took chloro quin phosphate,

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Speaker 1: which obviously sounds similar, but it's actually used to clean

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Speaker 1: fish tanks. UH, and I guess both of him and

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Speaker 1: the wife took the drug and then they immediately realized

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Speaker 1: that they needed to go to the hospital, and the

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Speaker 1: man passed away. And I thought this was interesting. This

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Speaker 1: is a little exchange from our interview with NBC, and

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Speaker 1: the woman who decided to remain anonymous for obvious reasons,

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Speaker 1: said Trump kept saying it was basically pretty much a cure. NBC.

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Speaker 1: What would your message be to the American public, woman, Oh,

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Speaker 1: my god, don't take anything. Don't believe anything, don't believe

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Speaker 1: anything that the president says and his people just call

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Speaker 1: your doctor. UM and I can't imagine that they're the

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Speaker 1: only people that I've done this. Health officials in Nigeria

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Speaker 1: actually issued a warning after they said three people in

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Speaker 1: their country died from overdosing on the drug, again because

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Speaker 1: they were citing Trump as having pushed it for the treatment.

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Speaker 1: The CIA is also UH internally warned everybody to not

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Speaker 1: take it. That's good. At least the CIA will be okay.

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Speaker 1: I was worried most about that. I feel I feel

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Speaker 1: safe now, um, because there are a lot of complications

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Speaker 1: with it, like it they're the side effects are very dangerous. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and we'll get into that a little bit more. But yes,

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Speaker 1: there are are significant side effects, as there often is

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Speaker 1: when you take you know, medication that's unapproved at random. Um.

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Speaker 1: But I think maybe the saddest thing about this is that, like,

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Speaker 1: while we're all being forced to change our whole lifestyles

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Speaker 1: as a result of this virus, like we can't even now,

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Speaker 1: Americans are going to be scared to eat fish, tank cleaner,

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Speaker 1: which just breaks my heart. Favorite hobbies, how many I

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Speaker 1: was excited? Yeah, it's just like how many things have

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Speaker 1: to be taken away from us? You know. Yeah, what's

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Speaker 1: what's left now? What's even left about being an American?

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Speaker 1: Banks Obama? Yeah, thanks Obama. So in the wake of

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Speaker 1: all this, Fox is handling like the fact that someone died,

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Speaker 1: the fact that, like there's been serious health consequences revealed

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Speaker 1: to like urging this ship has had zero impact on

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Speaker 1: Fox News. Sean Hannity has started referring to himself as

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Speaker 1: doctor Hannity in segnal helps people to tee. How dare

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Speaker 1: you tell you that it's pretty great. Uh yeah, He

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Speaker 1: wrote on the Fox News website that Governor Cuomo of

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Speaker 1: New York is creating a much bigger health crisis in

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Speaker 1: his states hospital system by denying New Yorkers the choice

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Speaker 1: in consultation with their doctors to take this potentially life

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Speaker 1: saving medication. I have some medication choices I think would

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Speaker 1: help his lung cancer, and they are all bleach. Um,

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Speaker 1: So get in contact, Rush, I can tell you how

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Speaker 1: to drink it. It's very simple that you just need

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Speaker 1: a cup and bleach. We'll get We'll get you on

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Speaker 1: the path to health, buddy. Um. So yeah, it's cool. Um.

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Speaker 1: And as this all kept happening, the President also continued

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Speaker 1: to push hydroxy clo quin on the people of the

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Speaker 1: United States. In early April, Uh he told America, the

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Speaker 1: side effects are the least of it. You're not going

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Speaker 1: to die from this pill. I say, try it, uh,

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Speaker 1: he said, before saying I'm not a doctor, um, which

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Speaker 1: I guess makes him more responsible than Sean Hannity slightly.

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Speaker 1: Do you think the president got coronavirus and then he

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Speaker 1: took this and just like because of the like he

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Speaker 1: was going to get better, but and it's not related,

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Speaker 1: but he took it and he's better, So he thinks

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Speaker 1: that this is the miracle drug because of his personal experience.

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Speaker 1: Conspiracy theorist at some point a really good book, high

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Speaker 1: fives everybody. So far, all of the books about inside

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Speaker 1: the Trump administration have been terrible and usually very irresponsible

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Speaker 1: to Eventually there will be a good one. And I

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Speaker 1: hope we learned the answer to that mystery, Cody, because

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Speaker 1: it's the number one mystery in my head right now

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Speaker 1: outside of has he Like, Yeah, I will say the

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Speaker 1: number one mystery in my head right now about this

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Speaker 1: administration is did he fucking get it? Like? Did he

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Speaker 1: get it? And just like take a couple of days

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Speaker 1: off because he's got access to like I don't know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know, but because he did not get it? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: has he fucking gotten it? I don't know if he's

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Speaker 1: gotten it, But I do know one thing that is

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Speaker 1: a cure rate against COVID nineteen products and services. It

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Speaker 1: is products and services. And we can say that because

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Speaker 1: there's no consequences anymore. Thanks to Jared kuch Together, we're back.

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Speaker 1: So I wanted to go into everything. I just read

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Speaker 1: everything I could find about the actual scientific studies that

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Speaker 1: they've done on this ship, because I wanted to know

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Speaker 1: what what actually is out there, because like one of

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Speaker 1: my big worries is that people would get rightfully frustrated

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Speaker 1: at the President for telling people to take an unapproved medication,

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Speaker 1: and then this stuff would wind up to actually be

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Speaker 1: a miracle drug and it would cause everyone to trust

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Speaker 1: the President when he says, I don't know that the

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Speaker 1: media or heading towards Earth isn't a problem or something.

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Speaker 1: I had a real worry about that, So I really

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Speaker 1: wanted to know, like what the fund does the data say,

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Speaker 1: and the data says um a lot of complicated and

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Speaker 1: conflicting things because spoilers, there's actually very little good data

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Speaker 1: about the use of this ship against COVID nine team,

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Speaker 1: which is not surprising. Yeah, and it's used for something else.

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Speaker 1: I just I I don't even know when it's a

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Speaker 1: good time to bring this up. But I find it

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Speaker 1: really interesting that whenever anyone talks about this drug, they

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Speaker 1: refer to it as the malaria drug. Uh, when he's

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Speaker 1: also used for lupus, and when even like just like

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Speaker 1: every media organization seems to refer to it as the

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Speaker 1: malaria drug, which seems to be downplaying the importance of

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Speaker 1: the actual use it has in the medical community and

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Speaker 1: for for people. The media is just now getting comfortable

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Speaker 1: with the idea that a medication might treat two things.

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Speaker 1: So the fact that this actually might treat three things

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Speaker 1: is really more than we can expect from them in

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Speaker 1: terms of new ones. So they have had to knock

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Speaker 1: just lupus sufferers off the off the radar um. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it also does seem like an attack against I mean,

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Speaker 1: if we're looking at the fox of lupus, lupus is

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Speaker 1: the people were living with loopus are women. Most people

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Speaker 1: with lupus developed the disease between the ages of fifteen

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Speaker 1: and forty five, and lupus is two or three times

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Speaker 1: more prevalent among women of color. So it does feel

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Speaker 1: like a targeted attack that they are not mentioning this

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Speaker 1: right and by framing it as malaria, I feel like

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Speaker 1: it's like, well, if you're like an American reading the news,

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Speaker 1: then you'll be like, oh, malaria, I'm not gonna get malaria.

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Speaker 1: We don't need to worry about people with malaria. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

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Speaker 1: And it's also just that like even less than being

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Speaker 1: a targeted attack, it's just it's a group of people

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Speaker 1: that are easy to ignore because of the races the

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Speaker 1: mainstream media. Yeah, so that's all good, And we are

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Speaker 1: going to have an interview with a loopus um sufferer

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Speaker 1: who takes hydroxychloroquine at the end of this episode. But

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Speaker 1: I wanted to get into a summary of, like all

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Speaker 1: of the actual research that's been done. So when we

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Speaker 1: tell about the actual dangers the side effects of this medication, UM,

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Speaker 1: most of them seem to come from the fact that

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Speaker 1: you are generally mixing it with a powerful antibiotic, usually

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Speaker 1: is a thromycin um and the combination of hydroxy cloquine

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Speaker 1: and is it thromyacin uh, it prolongs the q TC interval.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know what that means other than that

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Speaker 1: any any medication that prolongs the qt interval UM can

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Speaker 1: cause heart failure in certain people who are at risk

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Speaker 1: UM and a recent study suggests that up to eleven

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Speaker 1: of coronavirus patients are in the so called red zone

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Speaker 1: for potential cardiac side effects high percentage. That is a

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Speaker 1: lot of people, UM and it means that those people

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Speaker 1: could be very easily killed by this combination of medications. UM.

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Speaker 1: So and it is accurate to say that hydroxy cloquine

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Speaker 1: on its own is historically very very safe. This is

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Speaker 1: a medication that that has very few side effects, a

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Speaker 1: very limited history of harming anybody. Um, it is a

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00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,680
Speaker 1: very safe medication. But number one, people aren't just getting hydroxychloroquine,

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Speaker 1: and number two, the folks getting it aren't the folks

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Speaker 1: who normally get it. So it's there saying that it's

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Speaker 1: kind of ignoring a lot of critical details, including the

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Speaker 1: fact that it's it's really not even accurate to say

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Speaker 1: that hydroxy clorquin is the potential miracle cure here, because

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Speaker 1: the thing that most people are testing is hydroxychloroquine paired

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Speaker 1: with an antibiotic. It's a little bit like what people

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Speaker 1: do with like talking about ayahuasca when it's like, well, no, actually,

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Speaker 1: ayahuasca is a root within M A o I and

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Speaker 1: it and the d m T, which is the drug

415
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:31,400
Speaker 1: that makes you trip is usually like something like Mamusa

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Speaker 1: hostiles root bark or another DMT contraining containing plant. But like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's this perfect example, thank you, thank you, I tried.

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Speaker 1: It's a bummer. Uh. And there have been some doctors

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Speaker 1: who have been complicit in spreading this bullshit. One of

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Speaker 1: them is Dr Steven Smith, the founder of the Smith

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Speaker 1: Center for Infectious Diseases and Urban Health. Uh. He's been

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Speaker 1: on Laura Ingram show, The Ingram Angle. Uh. He called

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Speaker 1: the treatment a game changer. Uh. He said, I think

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Speaker 1: this is the beginning of the end of the pandemic.

425
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:03,560
Speaker 1: I'm very serious. Uh. And his evidence of this was

426
00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:06,240
Speaker 1: that not a single one of his COVID nineteen patients

427
00:25:06,359 --> 00:25:09,160
Speaker 1: who has been on the hydroxy clo quint and azithromycin

428
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,320
Speaker 1: regiment for five days has had to be intubated. He

429
00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 1: stated to Ingram, the chance of that occurring by chance.

430
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 1: According to my son's leon and Hunter, who did some

431
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:27,280
Speaker 1: stats for me, as every reputable statician says, don't trust

432
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 1: a doctor who doesn't have large adult sons do running

433
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:36,360
Speaker 1: the stats for him. Um, so that's great. So yeah,

434
00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,360
Speaker 1: he said that according to Leon and Hunter the stats

435
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 1: quote the stats from me are point zero zero something,

436
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:51,879
Speaker 1: which he added was ridiculously low. He's something is low,

437
00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:55,280
Speaker 1: point zero zero something is very low. I would even

438
00:25:55,320 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 1: say it's ridiculous. How low that is? Like the specificity too, yeah, uh,

439
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:02,359
Speaker 1: Leon and Hunter, if you want to be on the show.

440
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 1: We love having people named Leon on the show, particularly

441
00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:11,880
Speaker 1: big fans of that. UM. So yeah, this guy went

442
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:14,439
Speaker 1: on to tie like the research that he and his

443
00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:18,080
Speaker 1: his sons had done to that discredited French study, saying

444
00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:23,920
Speaker 1: it bolstered that research. Um, and then research it really

445
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:29,560
Speaker 1: did his his bad research really bolstered the other bad research. Um.

446
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 1: And another bad doctor got in on the game, because

447
00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: doctor memit Oz has really been on Fox and Friends

448
00:26:34,920 --> 00:26:37,200
Speaker 1: a lot. Uh, and he brought up what he called

449
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:41,920
Speaker 1: an important randomized study still unpublished from Wuhan, China. UM.

450
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:44,399
Speaker 1: When this study suggested that was was you know, a

451
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:47,640
Speaker 1: study of sixty two patients showed that the patients who

452
00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 1: were given the hydroxy clarquin um plus traditional therapy had

453
00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,800
Speaker 1: better results in the patients who just had the traditional therapy. Um.

454
00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 1: He said that. Uh, he said, quote, we think it's real. Um.

455
00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: After talking to the medical leader ship in China, which

456
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:02,560
Speaker 1: is one of the things that's fun to me is

457
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,960
Speaker 1: this mix of like, you can't trust China on anything,

458
00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:07,200
Speaker 1: but when they say this medicine is good, like, yeah,

459
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:12,520
Speaker 1: it's trustworthy. Um. Yeah. So that study in Wuhan that

460
00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,520
Speaker 1: he's referring to was published finally in the thirty one

461
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 1: of March. And since Dr oz is a complete fraud

462
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 1: and a liar who should be locked away in a

463
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:20,320
Speaker 1: dark cell for the rest of his life, I'm gonna

464
00:27:20,320 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 1: turn to Derek Lowe from Science Magazine, who is an

465
00:27:22,600 --> 00:27:25,840
Speaker 1: extremely competent scientific writer and journalist and has done a

466
00:27:25,920 --> 00:27:29,280
Speaker 1: really good job of breaking down his these studies. His

467
00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,479
Speaker 1: his cover Science and Studies Magazine is not in quotes,

468
00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:37,400
Speaker 1: no no, no, no, he's he's an actual scientist, um.

469
00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:39,560
Speaker 1: And he writes very well about this. Like his writing

470
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 1: is a bit dense, but his in the Pipeline blog

471
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: does a very good job of analyzing the studies being

472
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:45,840
Speaker 1: done on this, and I recommend him heavily as a source,

473
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,400
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna quote from him him here quote. What's

474
00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:52,200
Speaker 1: good is that this one is blinded, randomized, and controlled,

475
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,080
Speaker 1: so we can actually talk about it rather than just

476
00:27:54,119 --> 00:27:55,840
Speaker 1: spending all of our time wondering what the heck is

477
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:57,879
Speaker 1: going on this time. There were thirty one patients in

478
00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 1: the treatment group and thirty one in the control group.

479
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:02,280
Speaker 1: Mean age was forty four point seven years male to

480
00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: female ratio almost even both groups got standard of care

481
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:09,639
Speaker 1: oxygen therapy antiviral drugs, antibiotics presumably against suspected bacterial pneumonia,

482
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,159
Speaker 1: and immunoglobin with without cortical steroids. In addition, the treatment

483
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:17,080
Speaker 1: group got five days of hydroxychloroquine two milligrams. All we're

484
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 1: diagnosed with relatively mild illness, but all had pneumonia by

485
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:22,720
Speaker 1: CT scan. More patients in the in the treatment group

486
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:25,160
Speaker 1: presented with fever and cough as opposed to the control group.

487
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:28,560
Speaker 1: After five days of treatment, the treatment group showed significant

488
00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:31,160
Speaker 1: improvements in comparison to the controls and fever and cough

489
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:33,919
Speaker 1: and in pneumonia by CT scan. This is actually the

490
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 1: first controlled study to show any benefit for clorquin or

491
00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 1: hydroxy chloroquine therapy against the coronavirus and mace out odd

492
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 1: to say that, but all the positive reports we've had

493
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,960
Speaker 1: up until now, our anecdotal reports and open label studies

494
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: without control groups, you could argue that overall we're seeing

495
00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: either no yeah, yeah, and we'll talk about that a

496
00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: little more later. You could argue that either we're seeing

497
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,240
Speaker 1: no benefit or and this is his analysis of that study,

498
00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 1: you could argue that overall we're seeing either no benefit

499
00:28:58,720 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 1: or some benefit here, which is good as for adverse effects,

500
00:29:01,200 --> 00:29:04,160
Speaker 1: neither child reported anything serious, but both of them excluded

501
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 1: patients with any sort of cardiac arrhythmias, a wise precaution

502
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: since one of the most acute worries with high doses

503
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: of hydroxy cloroquine is you know, the QT interval prolongation

504
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 1: we were talking about. UM, So long as such patients

505
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:21,440
Speaker 1: are excluded for now, hydroxychloricin is in the might do nothing,

506
00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 1: might do some good category, which under the current condition

507
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 1: seems sufficient for treating patients pending further data. So what

508
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 1: he's saying is that rather than being a miracle cure,

509
00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 1: having a success rate, or being a good preventative, this medication,

510
00:29:35,240 --> 00:29:37,880
Speaker 1: when given only to people who are not at risk

511
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:42,720
Speaker 1: of any sort of cardiac event, might possibly do some good.

512
00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 1: Not a miracle cure, not unlike anything we've ever seen,

513
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 1: a medication that might provide a mild to moditate benefit

514
00:29:51,400 --> 00:29:53,720
Speaker 1: to a subset of the population who does not suffer

515
00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:55,720
Speaker 1: from heart disease. That's the most that can be said

516
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:59,959
Speaker 1: based on good data. Period. I wasn't listening to anything

517
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:06,000
Speaker 1: you said before or after miracle cure. So good, good, good,

518
00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:12,080
Speaker 1: That's that was the right thing to take from that dash, Robert. Now,

519
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 1: this study again, it excluded people with heart concerns. UM.

520
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 1: A different study that was recently shut down early in

521
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:25,000
Speaker 1: Brazil did not exclude those people. UH. This study involved

522
00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:28,080
Speaker 1: eighty one hospitalized patients in the city of Manal and

523
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:31,720
Speaker 1: was sponsored by the Brazilian state of Amazonis, and they

524
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:34,600
Speaker 1: had to end it early for a number of reasons.

525
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,600
Speaker 1: I want to say the first thing I should note

526
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,760
Speaker 1: about this study is that it had no control group.

527
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 1: And it had no control group because Brazil's national guidelines,

528
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: because the President of Brazil, jayar Bolson, was the same

529
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 1: kind of guy as Trump. Brazil's national treatment guidelines recommend

530
00:30:48,040 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 1: the use of clarquin in coronavirus patients, so the researchers

531
00:30:51,320 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 1: were legally forbidden from having a placebo in their trial,

532
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,800
Speaker 1: which means that this was, off the top a bad study.

533
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 1: But even so, the study had to be shut down

534
00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:05,040
Speaker 1: early UM because so many patients had adverse health reactions

535
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 1: to this medication. UM. Within three days, researchers started noticing

536
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:11,400
Speaker 1: harder rhythmus and patients taking the higher dose, and by

537
00:31:11,400 --> 00:31:14,240
Speaker 1: the sixth day of treatment, eleven of these patients had died,

538
00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:17,400
Speaker 1: leading to an immediate end for the high dose segment

539
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 1: of the trial. Yeah. So they had to shut this

540
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 1: study down because it killed eleven people, and they weren't

541
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: even able to do a good study because the government,

542
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:31,600
Speaker 1: which is like our government forbade them from fucking uh

543
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 1: from from doing a real study because it it mandates

544
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,040
Speaker 1: the use of clarquin in these patients. So what did

545
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 1: the SUNS say? Oh, yeah, you know, none of this scientists,

546
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:45,320
Speaker 1: the scientists who halted this study after eleven people died,

547
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,280
Speaker 1: has no sons that I'm aware of. So clearly he's

548
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:56,040
Speaker 1: best reputable, Yeah than leon and whoever the fun um Yeah, hunter,

549
00:31:56,160 --> 00:32:00,880
Speaker 1: the best most scientific first name. Um. So there was

550
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 1: another study, uh that came out recently from Marseilles Hospital,

551
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: and the scientists behind it was a guy named did

552
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 1: he a rolt uh and it presented a thousand and

553
00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:11,680
Speaker 1: sixty one patients treated for at least three days with

554
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 1: hydroxy clorquin and a zithromiasin with a follow up nine

555
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 1: days after. It includes the station nine the statement patients

556
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 1: were cured so far and that no cardiac toxicity was observed.

557
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:26,560
Speaker 1: Um And says that, yeah, these patients did better as

558
00:32:26,560 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 1: a result of this medication, which sounds great, Right, You've

559
00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:33,760
Speaker 1: got a thousand patients no cardiac events curate. That sounds

560
00:32:33,800 --> 00:32:38,200
Speaker 1: like a miracle cure. However, this study again had no

561
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,480
Speaker 1: control group. And the reason the study had no control group,

562
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 1: which is is because the doctor in charge of it

563
00:32:43,960 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 1: believes that it's immoral to use control groups because that

564
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 1: would be killing people, because he already went into this

565
00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,680
Speaker 1: believing that hydroxy cloroquine is a miracle care. Basically, so

566
00:32:53,760 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: that's not a great study. UM. Not a great study. UM. Yeah,

567
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:04,480
Speaker 1: and it sounds like a bad study. Yeah, it does

568
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 1: sound like a really bad study. Sounds like a lot

569
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: of bad studies are done about this specifically, it does.

570
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 1: It does sound like a lot of bad studies. UM. Now,

571
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:20,320
Speaker 1: when I went back to uh that that science magazine.

572
00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:23,680
Speaker 1: UM in the pipeline blog, I found another analysis of

573
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 1: a large multinational UM data gathering collaboration from Germany, Japan,

574
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:31,400
Speaker 1: the Netherlands, Spain, UK, and the United States. And it

575
00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,560
Speaker 1: compares the safety of hydroxy color quint and rheumatoid arthritis

576
00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:39,680
Speaker 1: patients versus patients taking another common rheumatoid arthritis drug UM.

577
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:42,000
Speaker 1: And it compares the safety of the combination of hydroxy

578
00:33:42,000 --> 00:33:44,840
Speaker 1: color quint and isithromius and taken together versus it in

579
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:47,680
Speaker 1: another antibiotic like comoxi cillin. So this gives us like

580
00:33:47,680 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 1: a good data on just how what because it because

581
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:53,560
Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of patients were given these drugs, you know,

582
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: for things that we're not coronavirus, we can have at

583
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,680
Speaker 1: least a better idea of how many people react negatively

584
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 1: when they are dosed with this combination of drugs UM

585
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:05,280
Speaker 1: and the good news is that combining hydroxy clorquin with

586
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 1: certain UH medicines UM like sulfas sulfa, the sulfa salazine

587
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:15,040
Speaker 1: doesn't show any difference in adverse events over one month

588
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 1: courses of treatments um SO like short term, there's certain

589
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,240
Speaker 1: things you compare with hydroxychloroquine that don't seem to boost

590
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: cardiovascular mortality. But the azithromiac in combination, which the presidents

591
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:29,280
Speaker 1: in the right wing news fear are specifically pushing UM

592
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:34,719
Speaker 1: has been associated with significant um fift increased risks of

593
00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 1: angelic chess plain and a heart failure, and a twofold

594
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: risk of cardiovascular mortality in the first month of treatment.

595
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 1: Um SO. Again, all of the large scale data shows

596
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 1: that there is significant risk of killing people with this ship.

597
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:54,600
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's not ideal, and neither is the economy tanking,

598
00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:57,879
Speaker 1: you know, So people need to have some hope. They

599
00:34:57,880 --> 00:34:59,799
Speaker 1: need to think that there's an answer whether or not

600
00:34:59,840 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 1: a works, because the economy, because the economy. There's also

601
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,399
Speaker 1: a study out in Michigan recently that was put together

602
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: by a bunch of ophthalmologists, which is weird, but it's

603
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:16,320
Speaker 1: not necessarily a bad study, um. And they they claim

604
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:19,760
Speaker 1: that quote our Infectious Disease division and our anti microbial

605
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:21,840
Speaker 1: pharmacist who reviewed all the available data, and we found

606
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 1: no convincing evidence that these drugs were effective in treating

607
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:27,840
Speaker 1: people with COVID nineteen um and that that data is

608
00:35:27,840 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: consistent with the observations of doctors in Michigan Medicines hospitals.

609
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:33,920
Speaker 1: We haven't seen any clear evidence of benefits. So we

610
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:37,160
Speaker 1: aren't going to use hydroxychlorquine routinely anymore. We were initially

611
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:39,440
Speaker 1: recommending it to both patients and outpatients, but we are

612
00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:41,759
Speaker 1: no longer doing that routinely. That's based on the fact

613
00:35:41,800 --> 00:35:43,920
Speaker 1: that we've been prescribing hydroxy or quin for a few

614
00:35:43,920 --> 00:35:46,520
Speaker 1: weeks did not see therapeutic benefit, but did see adverse

615
00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:53,880
Speaker 1: side effects. So again, we don't have solid, perfect data

616
00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:57,280
Speaker 1: on this stuff, uh, and we won't for a while,

617
00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:00,960
Speaker 1: but the data that exists suggest us we do have

618
00:36:01,000 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 1: perfect data suggesting that the combination of hydroxy cor quin

619
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 1: and um azithromiasin is toxic and potentially fatal to a

620
00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,560
Speaker 1: large chunk of the population. We know that to a

621
00:36:11,560 --> 00:36:13,759
Speaker 1: matter of certainty because we have studies with hundreds of

622
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:16,759
Speaker 1: thousands of people that say it um, and we know

623
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 1: that the data on whether or not this even helps

624
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: with COVID nineteen is far from a smoking gun, and

625
00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:26,040
Speaker 1: there's data that says it could be moderately useful and

626
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,359
Speaker 1: data that says it's useless, and we do not have

627
00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:32,920
Speaker 1: um a hard uh factual conclusion on that yet. But

628
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,600
Speaker 1: that's what we've got in terms of fucking science here.

629
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,399
Speaker 1: So that's that's what I've put together. I'm done now.

630
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:45,160
Speaker 1: I would be kind of phrase miracle cure a few times,

631
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:49,480
Speaker 1: and I'm really focusing on that. There was a lot

632
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 1: of words, a lot of words, a lot of words

633
00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:56,800
Speaker 1: that phrase and then some more words. So yeah, because

634
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: a miracle cure would be good. Right, and so yeah,

635
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:08,000
Speaker 1: there we go. Well, you know what is also America

636
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 1: Cure Services together everything and we're back, Cody back. I

637
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 1: want to hear we you worked on for this thing.

638
00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,480
Speaker 1: I know you got some juicy stuff. Present your homework

639
00:37:33,520 --> 00:37:38,200
Speaker 1: to the class, Cody, the class of America, the American class.

640
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:41,080
Speaker 1: I I just listened to what the president said, and

641
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:45,160
Speaker 1: I'm here to uh let you know that whatever he

642
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 1: said is good. Whenever Donald Trump does anything, you kind

643
00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 1: of wonder why and like so, so Donald Trump and

644
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 1: associates they're they're mysteriously pushing this drug that may kill people,

645
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:02,399
Speaker 1: may make things worse, may help people a little bit,

646
00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 1: may do nothing. Sorry, so just one correction absolutely has

647
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 1: killed people. Yes, thank you, thank you very much for

648
00:38:09,800 --> 00:38:15,640
Speaker 1: that fact check. Um. Yeah, and sure, so that sounds

649
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 1: like something uh he and they would do. Trump and

650
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:22,120
Speaker 1: his associates would do exactly this, um, which they are doing.

651
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 1: But why is I think an interesting question given the

652
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:29,840
Speaker 1: fact that the president like you know, owns companies still

653
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,680
Speaker 1: and could have been impeached by the emoluments clause long ago,

654
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 1: and has used his position to campaign and to make

655
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 1: money for his campaign, and he uses his campaign funds

656
00:38:37,719 --> 00:38:40,520
Speaker 1: for personal reasons. And he's just like a money crime guy.

657
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:44,040
Speaker 1: You know, he's like into money crimes. Right. Um So

658
00:38:44,719 --> 00:38:51,000
Speaker 1: a decent guest to this why question would be money. Um.

659
00:38:51,040 --> 00:38:53,160
Speaker 1: I think you may have seen a lot of uh

660
00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:55,960
Speaker 1: like a torrent I would say, of headlines like this

661
00:38:56,000 --> 00:38:58,799
Speaker 1: one from the Daily Beast. Trump has financial interest in

662
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:02,840
Speaker 1: hydroxychloroquin manufacturer. These all seem to be based on New

663
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:06,400
Speaker 1: York Times piece about the matter uh quote. Some associates

664
00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:10,359
Speaker 1: of Mr Trump's have financial interests in the issue. Sinofi's

665
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:14,040
Speaker 1: largest shareholders include Fisher Asset Management, the investment company run

666
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,840
Speaker 1: by Ken Fisher, a major donor two Republicans, including Mr Trump,

667
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: Another investor in both Senafi and Milan. Another pharmaceutical firm

668
00:39:22,160 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 1: is Investco, the fund previously run by Wilbur Ross, the

669
00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:29,640
Speaker 1: Commerce Secretary. As of last year, Mr Trump reported that

670
00:39:30,040 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: his three family trusts each had investments in a Dodge

671
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:36,759
Speaker 1: and Cox mutual fund whose largest holding was in Senofi.

672
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:41,320
Speaker 1: Several generic drugmakers are gearing up to produce hydroxy clarquin pills,

673
00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: including Amnil Pharmaceuticals, whose co founder Shirag Patel is a

674
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:48,400
Speaker 1: member of Trump National golf course, Bedminster in New Jersey

675
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:50,719
Speaker 1: and his golf in Mr Trump at least twice since

676
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:54,440
Speaker 1: he became president, according to a person who saw them.

677
00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 1: Um so as many have pointed out, though Trump's personal

678
00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 1: investment is something he likely didn't even know about, and

679
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:07,640
Speaker 1: it ranges fund. Yeah, it's like these like three family

680
00:40:07,640 --> 00:40:10,760
Speaker 1: trust and mutual fund and it ranges between five grand

681
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:15,120
Speaker 1: and fifteen grand um as Snows puts it, Trump's financial

682
00:40:15,160 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 1: stake in these companies is virtually negligible, contained indirectly via

683
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:22,279
Speaker 1: mutual funds and administered through three family trust he does

684
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:26,240
Speaker 1: not control. As a generic drug, hydroxy chloroquine is unlikely

685
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:29,080
Speaker 1: to provide any one company with significant profits compared to

686
00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:32,840
Speaker 1: other proprietary drugs. Um Vox also points out, in regards

687
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: to his associates, Ross, like Trump, is connected indirectly through

688
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:39,359
Speaker 1: a fund he used to run. Fisher has long been

689
00:40:39,440 --> 00:40:42,439
Speaker 1: a Snophie investor through his asset management company, and while

690
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 1: Patel's company does plan to produce hydroxy chloroquin Amuel has

691
00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 1: said it plans to donate pills as well. So they

692
00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:53,319
Speaker 1: are all these sort of light relationships via proxy, very

693
00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:58,080
Speaker 1: indirect that aren't really going to benefit these specific people. Financially.

694
00:40:58,440 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 1: I guess what you'll see mentioned mostly a couple of

695
00:41:00,719 --> 00:41:03,440
Speaker 1: people kind of indirectly related to a small fund may

696
00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:07,319
Speaker 1: not have even known about it. And although I don't

697
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:11,359
Speaker 1: want to downplay how ghoulish pharmaceutical companies are UM as

698
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:13,920
Speaker 1: well as the people who work for and benefit from them,

699
00:41:13,960 --> 00:41:18,360
Speaker 1: because they are. UH, it's not like a Trump problem.

700
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:23,399
Speaker 1: It's a gestures to society problem. UH. For example, Open

701
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:27,440
Speaker 1: Secrets and Sludge have reported. Last month, the conservative nonprofit

702
00:41:27,480 --> 00:41:31,920
Speaker 1: group Job Creators Network collaborated with healthcare nonprofit Physicians for

703
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:35,360
Speaker 1: Reform to launch an online petition, a series of Facebook

704
00:41:35,360 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 1: ads and a mass text message campaign urging Trump to

705
00:41:38,800 --> 00:41:44,040
Speaker 1: make hydrox clerq when available to treat patients battling COVID nineteen. UM.

706
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:46,160
Speaker 1: Real quick, but we get into it a little bit

707
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 1: about Job Creators Network. It's a conservative advocacy group co

708
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:54,440
Speaker 1: founded by Bernard Marcus, who's a former CEO of Home Depot.

709
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:59,319
Speaker 1: If you're fans of propaganda organization Prager University, you might

710
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:02,880
Speaker 1: recognize the recently made a collaboration with Job Creators Network

711
00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 1: is a video called what are stock buy Backs? And

712
00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:12,160
Speaker 1: the answer to that question is good. They're very good. Uh.

713
00:42:12,239 --> 00:42:16,680
Speaker 1: The video specifically mentioned journalism. It does. They did a

714
00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 1: good job. They're good, and you should do them and

715
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:22,120
Speaker 1: you should let companies do them. The video sparticularly mentions

716
00:42:22,440 --> 00:42:26,880
Speaker 1: home depots specifically. Uh, doing stock by packs is good

717
00:42:27,480 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: for some reason. I don't know. I don't know why

718
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:31,799
Speaker 1: they would do that. Um in this collaboration between Job

719
00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:36,760
Speaker 1: Creators Network and Pregri University. But anyway. According to Open Secrets,

720
00:42:37,000 --> 00:42:40,240
Speaker 1: Marcus gave seven million dollars to outside group supporting Trump's

721
00:42:40,239 --> 00:42:43,440
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen presidential run. He also gave one hundred thousand

722
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:47,400
Speaker 1: dollars to the pro Trump superPAC America First Action to

723
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,760
Speaker 1: further support Trump's second presidential bid and plans to spend

724
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 1: even more to support Trump's reelection. Physicians for Reform often

725
00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:57,960
Speaker 1: works with conservative advocacy group Freedom Works to influence the

726
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:01,719
Speaker 1: deregulation of health care policies. Uh, something that I'm sure

727
00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 1: we'll go over really great. During this pandemic. Pharmaceutical Research

728
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:09,000
Speaker 1: and Manufacturers of America gave millions in grants to conservative

729
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,719
Speaker 1: groups that pushed industry friendly policies to Trump. According to

730
00:43:12,719 --> 00:43:16,240
Speaker 1: tax returns analyzed by Open Secrets, the industry's top lobbying

731
00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:20,040
Speaker 1: group gave Freedom Works one thousand dollars. It also gave

732
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:24,279
Speaker 1: five hundred thousand dollars to the Job Creators Network in UH.

733
00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 1: They represent the most powerful drug companies in the country,

734
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:33,080
Speaker 1: such as Bayer, Nevardis, Tava, etcetera. Um. So, yeah, so

735
00:43:33,080 --> 00:43:36,399
Speaker 1: there's clearly like some financial benefit going on with people

736
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: pushing this drug. Um But it's not like Trump is

737
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: illegally doing it for himself specifically, or even like his

738
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:48,839
Speaker 1: friends generally. It seems like, if anything, it's just yeah,

739
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:53,319
Speaker 1: dark money, farma lobbying that isn't unique to Trump. A

740
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 1: happy accident. Yeah, it's just like he exacerbates these behaviors.

741
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 1: I think people get really angry at dark money a lot,

742
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:05,240
Speaker 1: and they don't consider the fact that because the money

743
00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:09,319
Speaker 1: is dark, it helps block UV rays, which lowers your

744
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 1: risk of skin cancer. I think that's how dark money works.

745
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:17,400
Speaker 1: So yeah, I read that in a study done by

746
00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:22,279
Speaker 1: Job Creator's Network. Yes, Big advocates of dark money as

747
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:25,800
Speaker 1: a sunscreen. Yeah, it's dark money. It's it's just they're shy,

748
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:28,680
Speaker 1: you know. Ye all I've heard in the last ten

749
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:34,320
Speaker 1: minutes of sunscreen. I love sunscreen, sunscreen, we love sunscreen here, folks.

750
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:40,200
Speaker 1: So yeah, so it's just yeah, dark money, pharma lobbying society. Um,

751
00:44:40,200 --> 00:44:42,359
Speaker 1: you're gonna have these groups pushing this kind of thing,

752
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:45,800
Speaker 1: which again this group was definitely doing in March. U.

753
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:48,919
Speaker 1: You can sign the petition if you want, Folks. It's

754
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:52,520
Speaker 1: not really about him unless we don't want to talk

755
00:44:52,560 --> 00:44:56,680
Speaker 1: about a man named Joe Pizza, which we are going

756
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:00,719
Speaker 1: to do right, No, Cody, Cody, Cody, we are not

757
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 1: going to drop into the bullshit partisan nonsense. You call

758
00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: him Joseph Pizza, Joseph Robinette Pizza, thank you. I think

759
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:18,719
Speaker 1: it's pronounced Joe Pizza Bezza yea Joe. Uh yeah, it's

760
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: again okay to make jokes about Italians. Yeah, I feel bad.

761
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:26,880
Speaker 1: You can't be racist. No, you cannot be racist against

762
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:30,200
Speaker 1: Italians anymore. We solve that problem. That's the law. That's

763
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:32,759
Speaker 1: what the law says. That is the law. That is.

764
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: Laws are good. Following them all without question also good. Anyway, Cody,

765
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,160
Speaker 1: I feel like you've got a spicy meat a ball

766
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:44,239
Speaker 1: to unwrap about Joe Pizza. I might have a chef

767
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:48,040
Speaker 1: kiss here and there, who knows. Um, So we're gonna

768
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 1: briefly talk about a man named Joseph Pizza. I can't

769
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 1: confirm that his middle name is Robinett. Um uh. Emotionally

770
00:45:56,239 --> 00:45:59,960
Speaker 1: it is. Most people named Joe their middle name is Robinette.

771
00:46:00,040 --> 00:46:05,360
Speaker 1: So yeah, Plumber Joe Robinette, we all remember him. Um. So,

772
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:11,440
Speaker 1: according to Sludge Pizza, I'm gonna keep It's gonna be

773
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:17,680
Speaker 1: really fun. Pizza, formerly of the band Muffin No Stop It.

774
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:22,919
Speaker 1: Sludge said Pizza wasn't a band called Muffin. They did.

775
00:46:24,239 --> 00:46:29,040
Speaker 1: I love that. We are talking about incredibly important global

776
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:31,799
Speaker 1: politics that the lives of millions hene on right now.

777
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:37,400
Speaker 1: That's so good, it's uh, it's quite something. We're changing

778
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 1: the name of this podcast to Best Year Ever. Now

779
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:47,640
Speaker 1: best your best year ever with Joe Pizza. Mm hmm um.

780
00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: So yeah, he's a band called Muffin. I've been trying

781
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:51,960
Speaker 1: to find a little more on Muffin um, but we

782
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 1: don't need to waste our time with that. He is

783
00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:57,280
Speaker 1: a big donor to the pro Trump Superpack America First Action,

784
00:46:58,160 --> 00:47:03,000
Speaker 1: given the group hundred dollars in twenty nineteen. Mr Pizza

785
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:06,520
Speaker 1: has also made large donations to other organizations that backed

786
00:47:06,560 --> 00:47:09,760
Speaker 1: the president. Since sixteen, he has given sixty two thousand,

787
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:13,400
Speaker 1: five hundred dollars to Trump Make America Great Committee, UH

788
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:16,880
Speaker 1: sixty four hundred dollars to the Republican National Committee, and

789
00:47:17,000 --> 00:47:20,239
Speaker 1: four thousand dollars to Donald J. Trump for President. In

790
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:24,800
Speaker 1: making his political contributions, Pizza has listed several pharmaceutical companies

791
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:30,279
Speaker 1: as his employer, including Pharmasphere, inter Cam, and Pharma ce

792
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 1: According to his LinkedIn, Pizza's president and CEO of inter Cam,

793
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:37,799
Speaker 1: which appears to be a U S sales representative for

794
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:41,400
Speaker 1: companies from around the world that produce active pharmaceutical ingredients.

795
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 1: One product Interchem Sales is hydroxy chloroquin soul fate, the

796
00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:49,880
Speaker 1: primary active ingredient of plaquinil. He seems to have a

797
00:47:49,880 --> 00:47:54,000
Speaker 1: lot of connections with the pharmaceutical company. And before we

798
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:56,920
Speaker 1: get too much more into the Trump of it all,

799
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:02,880
Speaker 1: I have to read two paragraphs. One is on UH

800
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:08,560
Speaker 1: Joe's about page Joseph Pizza. Joe has been a professional

801
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,600
Speaker 1: musician since signing with the United Artists at age fourteen. Later,

802
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,320
Speaker 1: he formed the band Muffin Muffin Is on All Caps

803
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:19,520
Speaker 1: by the Way with his childhood friend Ron many No,

804
00:48:20,040 --> 00:48:23,440
Speaker 1: and they played to packed houses. Since then, Joe has

805
00:48:23,440 --> 00:48:28,200
Speaker 1: written the music and lyrics to over two hundred plus songs. Uh.

806
00:48:28,239 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 1: Just a tip for the about page. If you put

807
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: over and a number, you don't need to put plus

808
00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:35,759
Speaker 1: because that implies that it's over the number, So over

809
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:38,160
Speaker 1: two D plus you don't need to do that anyway.

810
00:48:38,239 --> 00:48:41,920
Speaker 1: He has also penned numerous plays, one acts and screenplays.

811
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:45,880
Speaker 1: His musical All for Joe, for which he wrote the book,

812
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:49,799
Speaker 1: music and lyrics, has been showcased at the Duke Theater Um.

813
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:54,719
Speaker 1: So again, I know this unbelievable, but I'm gonna unbelievable.

814
00:48:55,480 --> 00:49:00,239
Speaker 1: This is the first paragraph describing All for Joe on

815
00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:03,520
Speaker 1: the All for Joe website for Joseph Pizza's musical All

816
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:09,279
Speaker 1: for Joe. Goddamn it, this is for you. This is

817
00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:13,680
Speaker 1: towards the end of the episodes, Like God for us all,

818
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: when was the last time the world around you came

819
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:21,399
Speaker 1: together to help you live your dream? All for Joe

820
00:49:21,520 --> 00:49:24,680
Speaker 1: is the familiar, heartwarming story of one man's dream to

821
00:49:24,719 --> 00:49:29,359
Speaker 1: pursue his passion and leave his unfulfilling career behind him. Uh.

822
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:32,560
Speaker 1: I imagine he's referring to as many pharmaceutical companies that

823
00:49:32,600 --> 00:49:37,239
Speaker 1: he works for in your typical suburban It does. Yeah,

824
00:49:37,400 --> 00:49:40,799
Speaker 1: it really does. It seems like soul crushing in a way.

825
00:49:41,160 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 1: Uh so maybe you know through music he will find

826
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 1: his way. But in your in your typical suburban neighborhood.

827
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:52,480
Speaker 1: Joe and his wife Lauren. Uh side note, Joe Pizza's

828
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,200
Speaker 1: wife's name in real life is Lauren, who will talk

829
00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:59,440
Speaker 1: about um struggle to keep balance in their home, marriage,

830
00:49:59,440 --> 00:50:02,040
Speaker 1: and community. As the events of a high school reunion

831
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,279
Speaker 1: and an out of control teenage party unfold on the

832
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:06,920
Speaker 1: same night, things take a turn for the worst. Before

833
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:10,840
Speaker 1: looking up. Before looking up though with music book and

834
00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:15,120
Speaker 1: lyrics by Joseph M. Pizza, Dang Mobbinette Joseph Mobbinette Pizza

835
00:50:15,600 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 1: all through show post an impressive and diverse collection of

836
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:23,719
Speaker 1: musical numbers, ranging from modern love songs finger snapping doo

837
00:50:23,760 --> 00:50:28,719
Speaker 1: op to old fashioned rock and roll. So, uh, that's

838
00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:34,040
Speaker 1: a little bit about Joe and I. Maybe we'll maybe

839
00:50:34,080 --> 00:50:37,360
Speaker 1: later we'll listen to uh some songs from his musical

840
00:50:37,440 --> 00:50:39,920
Speaker 1: not in this episode. Uh, don't get your hopes up,

841
00:50:40,520 --> 00:50:43,319
Speaker 1: but um, there's so much to say about Joe M.

842
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:51,279
Speaker 1: Pizza and one of those yes, I don't have any

843
00:50:51,320 --> 00:50:55,080
Speaker 1: I came into this ready to really throw down some jokes,

844
00:50:55,280 --> 00:50:58,880
Speaker 1: you know, um to do my part, and I I

845
00:50:58,960 --> 00:51:03,640
Speaker 1: have nothing. I have nothing. There understand there's no joke

846
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:06,800
Speaker 1: to be made. Really not really no, not really, I

847
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:09,360
Speaker 1: understand you've got nothing. But you know who does have something?

848
00:51:10,680 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 1: Joe Pizza. And you know what he has. He has

849
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:20,279
Speaker 1: a pharmaceutical company. You know what else he has. He

850
00:51:20,360 --> 00:51:22,960
Speaker 1: also has a residence. He also has a residence in

851
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:26,600
Speaker 1: Palm Beach, located just two miles from the president's private

852
00:51:26,600 --> 00:51:31,719
Speaker 1: club Mara Lago Um. He also has a wife, Mr.

853
00:51:31,800 --> 00:51:38,839
Speaker 1: Pizza's wife, Lauren Pizza Um, who wrote a memoir and

854
00:51:39,160 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 1: before we get to a beautiful paragraph in that book,

855
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:45,680
Speaker 1: the book is called Meant to Be The Lives and

856
00:51:45,760 --> 00:51:51,040
Speaker 1: Loves of a Jersey Girl. And the description of this

857
00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:54,600
Speaker 1: book by Lauren Pizza, wife of all for Joe's Joe

858
00:51:54,600 --> 00:51:59,800
Speaker 1: Pizza of uh Intercom is when Lauren Pizza was thirteen,

859
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: she died caught under a small sale solid opening line.

860
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:10,080
Speaker 1: Caught under a small sailboat. She struggled to reach the surface,

861
00:52:10,080 --> 00:52:12,360
Speaker 1: only to find that what she thought was up was

862
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:15,319
Speaker 1: actually down. And that's all she remembers happened to me

863
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 1: ever since being resuscitated by two strangers. Pizza has felt

864
00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:22,840
Speaker 1: a presence in her life from the spirit world. Is

865
00:52:22,880 --> 00:52:26,719
Speaker 1: it crazy? Maybe? Her family sure thinks so, and so

866
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:29,160
Speaker 1: on and so forth. That's her memoir. By the way,

867
00:52:29,200 --> 00:52:31,480
Speaker 1: this isn't her her work or work of fiction. This

868
00:52:31,520 --> 00:52:35,280
Speaker 1: isn't meant to be a novel. This is a memo.

869
00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 1: It's nothing like that sounded like a work of fiction. Cody.

870
00:52:38,200 --> 00:52:43,480
Speaker 1: That sounds like actually a scientific paper. Um Jesus with

871
00:52:43,640 --> 00:52:47,880
Speaker 1: I assume, with a forward by her two sons confirming, Um, yeah, no,

872
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:55,240
Speaker 1: confirming the stats. Yeah, exactly. But I hate this so much.

873
00:52:56,000 --> 00:52:59,879
Speaker 1: It's it's not it's not great, but if but hey,

874
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:04,080
Speaker 1: don't worry, because you're gonna love this next paragraph. There's more.

875
00:53:04,840 --> 00:53:07,640
Speaker 1: This is from the book. I've spent the last decade

876
00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:10,480
Speaker 1: and a half staying in five star resorts and dining

877
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:13,040
Speaker 1: with people who can buy the town I grew up in.

878
00:53:13,920 --> 00:53:17,240
Speaker 1: Donald Trump sang Happy Birthday to me at mar A Lago,

879
00:53:17,760 --> 00:53:20,040
Speaker 1: and a billionaire sent me his private jet when I

880
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:23,040
Speaker 1: missed my connecting flight in Milan. And she goes on

881
00:53:23,520 --> 00:53:28,000
Speaker 1: with more examples. It's probably, uh, maybe it's relevant that

882
00:53:28,280 --> 00:53:32,200
Speaker 1: Donald Trump sang Happy Birthday to her at mar Lago,

883
00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:36,680
Speaker 1: the private club where the president schmoozes with donors. Um

884
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:40,279
Speaker 1: it maybe gives them favors to the wife of the

885
00:53:40,320 --> 00:53:45,080
Speaker 1: guy who is the CEO of inter Cam and lives

886
00:53:45,120 --> 00:53:49,160
Speaker 1: two miles away. I don't know. Um So in conclusion,

887
00:53:50,200 --> 00:53:56,200
Speaker 1: I don't know. Um it's a lot of there's just

888
00:53:56,239 --> 00:53:58,480
Speaker 1: a lot of these examples of things like, Okay, yeah,

889
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 1: that person talks to the president and we know that Trump.

890
00:54:01,080 --> 00:54:04,319
Speaker 1: Uh yeah, he's motivated by money. He's also motivated by

891
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:07,960
Speaker 1: the last person who said anything to him. He just

892
00:54:08,000 --> 00:54:11,400
Speaker 1: like absorbs his thoughts and ideas and it's like that's

893
00:54:11,560 --> 00:54:14,239
Speaker 1: that's the thing, and he focuses and he fixates on them,

894
00:54:14,520 --> 00:54:17,279
Speaker 1: and then that's it. Um it doesn't necessarily have an

895
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:20,840
Speaker 1: ulterior motive those sometimes they do something, but sometimes it

896
00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:23,600
Speaker 1: is just like a but Dr Oz told me, the

897
00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:26,400
Speaker 1: CEO of Oracle told me, Rudy Giuliani told me. And

898
00:54:26,440 --> 00:54:30,000
Speaker 1: now this is what I believe. You know what's really

899
00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:35,919
Speaker 1: crazy about all this if theoretically, and I'm saying theoretically

900
00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:37,719
Speaker 1: because this is the thing that has never happened and

901
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:40,360
Speaker 1: never will happen. But if theoretically, the host of a

902
00:54:40,400 --> 00:54:44,120
Speaker 1: podcast were to hand out the address or even the

903
00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:48,759
Speaker 1: crude location of the Pizza home in Florida and urge

904
00:54:48,840 --> 00:54:52,439
Speaker 1: people to break into it and take things that would

905
00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: be a crime. That would be a crime in that

906
00:54:54,280 --> 00:54:57,040
Speaker 1: person would have committed a crime you would have just

907
00:54:57,080 --> 00:54:59,840
Speaker 1: committed in front if you had said that, if I

908
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:04,080
Speaker 1: had said that. But if Joseph Pizza were to talk

909
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:07,120
Speaker 1: to his friend Donald Trump and say this hydroxy cloroquine

910
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:09,720
Speaker 1: ship that I have a financial interest in really should

911
00:55:09,719 --> 00:55:12,280
Speaker 1: be bought up by everyone in sundry and used immediately

912
00:55:12,440 --> 00:55:15,160
Speaker 1: as a miracle cure. And if that President of the

913
00:55:15,239 --> 00:55:18,799
Speaker 1: United States, who was also entirely hypothetical, were to urge

914
00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:23,080
Speaker 1: people to take this without any solid scientific backing, none

915
00:55:23,080 --> 00:55:29,040
Speaker 1: of that is illegal. Yeah, it doesn't seem like pretty Yeah,

916
00:55:29,360 --> 00:55:32,880
Speaker 1: um if a bunch of money to that president too,

917
00:55:32,920 --> 00:55:37,920
Speaker 1: in addition to just being yeah, a local friend, I

918
00:55:38,000 --> 00:55:43,840
Speaker 1: love the you know. Okay, We've been at this for

919
00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:46,239
Speaker 1: about an hour, and I think we've gotten some good

920
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:48,920
Speaker 1: information out and some deep frustrations out. But I am

921
00:55:48,960 --> 00:55:51,319
Speaker 1: now so overcome with rage that I think we have

922
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 1: no other option but to cut to our source for today. Um,

923
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:58,520
Speaker 1: who is a young woman who has lupus and is

924
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 1: on hydroxy cloquine and relies on it to exist in

925
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:07,279
Speaker 1: a way that is alive. UM, and wants to talk

926
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:11,800
Speaker 1: about how this whole situation, which is again not a crime,

927
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 1: has has dramatically impacted her life and caused her unremitting horror.

928
00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:21,680
Speaker 1: So we're going to cut to that now. Hello, Abby,

929
00:56:21,840 --> 00:56:24,160
Speaker 1: thank you for being on worst year ever. UM. Do

930
00:56:24,200 --> 00:56:26,319
Speaker 1: you want to kind of introduce yourself more than me

931
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:30,680
Speaker 1: just saying hello Abby thing? Hello? Hello? Uh So, my

932
00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:33,960
Speaker 1: name is Abby. I am a twenty six I'm located

933
00:56:34,000 --> 00:56:37,400
Speaker 1: over in Los Angeles, and I have had lupus likely

934
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:40,920
Speaker 1: since I was twelve. That I was diagnosed at age two. Now,

935
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:43,040
Speaker 1: when you say likely since I was twelve, could you

936
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:45,200
Speaker 1: explain a little bit more about like how, how the

937
00:56:45,239 --> 00:56:47,919
Speaker 1: hell are you? Like, how you found out? You know what?

938
00:56:47,920 --> 00:56:49,919
Speaker 1: What what? What is that like? It's been a really

939
00:56:49,920 --> 00:56:53,920
Speaker 1: interesting process. So when I was twelve years old, I

940
00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,719
Speaker 1: was jumping on my friends trampoline in her backyard and

941
00:56:56,840 --> 00:56:59,160
Speaker 1: my knee just gave out, which, like you know, it

942
00:56:59,200 --> 00:57:01,560
Speaker 1: sounds like something that can happen to any kid hopping

943
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:05,799
Speaker 1: on a trampoline, but this definitely was the start of

944
00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:10,040
Speaker 1: something in that period of time. In retrospect, I also

945
00:57:10,080 --> 00:57:13,920
Speaker 1: realized that I had been experiencing uh clarity, which is

946
00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:18,000
Speaker 1: an inflammation of the lining of my lungs. And so

947
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:20,720
Speaker 1: my my parents were both physicians, so this was something

948
00:57:20,760 --> 00:57:22,800
Speaker 1: that I wasn't like brought to a hospital for my

949
00:57:22,880 --> 00:57:24,720
Speaker 1: dad's nacci all. Just my mom is a nurse, and

950
00:57:24,760 --> 00:57:26,960
Speaker 1: so it was the thing of like I was in

951
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:29,160
Speaker 1: banned class that when I was twelve years old in

952
00:57:29,200 --> 00:57:31,720
Speaker 1: middle school and I was having trouble breathing, but I

953
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:34,840
Speaker 1: definitely didn't have asthma uh and so that's kind of

954
00:57:34,880 --> 00:57:38,240
Speaker 1: what we landed on and it went away eventually. Um,

955
00:57:38,280 --> 00:57:43,439
Speaker 1: as I got older, my arms started to uh well,

956
00:57:43,600 --> 00:57:46,080
Speaker 1: I guess first my my other knee went A couple

957
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:48,440
Speaker 1: of years later, like I had a similar experience that

958
00:57:48,560 --> 00:57:51,040
Speaker 1: like it just kind of made a loud, cracking sound

959
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:53,320
Speaker 1: and then it was never the same sense. As I

960
00:57:53,320 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 1: got into high school, I was like getting pretty serious

961
00:57:55,720 --> 00:58:00,920
Speaker 1: about playing clarinet um and as I practiced and practiced

962
00:58:01,000 --> 00:58:04,360
Speaker 1: and practice for college auditions, my hands started to give

963
00:58:04,360 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 1: out and they swelled from I think I was about

964
00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:09,120
Speaker 1: a size eight ring and now on the size ten

965
00:58:09,200 --> 00:58:11,600
Speaker 1: of twelve uh, and the swelling just has never gone

966
00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:15,680
Speaker 1: down since UM still wasn't diagnosed though, So it was

967
00:58:15,720 --> 00:58:18,320
Speaker 1: just kind of like enjoy your misery, kid, time to

968
00:58:18,360 --> 00:58:19,840
Speaker 1: figure out what you want to do with your life

969
00:58:19,920 --> 00:58:24,360
Speaker 1: that is completely different from what you're planning on. UM.

970
00:58:24,520 --> 00:58:29,600
Speaker 1: So went through college with you know, continuous unexplained symptoms

971
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:34,200
Speaker 1: UM from clarency to my joints, but that was those

972
00:58:34,200 --> 00:58:40,080
Speaker 1: were the main ones. UM. Once I got out of college,

973
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:43,960
Speaker 1: I really took getting diagnosed serious, like more seriously, not

974
00:58:44,000 --> 00:58:47,480
Speaker 1: that I hadn't been. Like throughout my entire childhood. You know,

975
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:50,080
Speaker 1: there was like an m R I here, a meeting

976
00:58:50,120 --> 00:58:53,720
Speaker 1: with a physician there. My dad would be at dinner

977
00:58:53,760 --> 00:58:56,160
Speaker 1: and ask his friend about it. Like there were just

978
00:58:56,200 --> 00:59:00,800
Speaker 1: these little inklings of uh, you know, possible diagnos stick treatment,

979
00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:04,840
Speaker 1: and nothing came up. Uh. Just the correct blood tests

980
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:08,440
Speaker 1: were also never taken. I mean, if I really want

981
00:59:08,440 --> 00:59:09,680
Speaker 1: to get into you can cut some of out if

982
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:12,160
Speaker 1: you want. But when I was a senior in college,

983
00:59:12,160 --> 00:59:14,120
Speaker 1: when I was home for winter break, I went to

984
00:59:14,120 --> 00:59:16,800
Speaker 1: a rheumatologist in Beverly Hills, like hoping that this man

985
00:59:16,840 --> 00:59:20,040
Speaker 1: would be uh the answers to my problems. He did

986
00:59:20,040 --> 00:59:23,919
Speaker 1: not even touch my body. Like he he like gave

987
00:59:23,960 --> 00:59:26,480
Speaker 1: me up and down. Look, he listened to what I

988
00:59:26,520 --> 00:59:27,920
Speaker 1: had to say, and then he was like, you five

989
00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:30,160
Speaker 1: from aalgia, and he prescribed me a couple of meds

990
00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:34,960
Speaker 1: that did nothing. So that sounds really really really really frustrating.

991
00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,120
Speaker 1: It was quite frustrating. Um. Finally, though, when I when

992
00:59:38,120 --> 00:59:41,920
Speaker 1: I graduated college in twos sixteen, I met with a

993
00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:45,440
Speaker 1: younger woman rheumatologist and she listened to me and touched

994
00:59:45,560 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 1: my body and actually took that time and ran the

995
00:59:47,840 --> 00:59:52,240
Speaker 1: right blood tests, and I was first diagnosed with undifferentiated

996
00:59:52,280 --> 00:59:56,280
Speaker 1: connective tissue disorder. Because that's kind of it's okay. So

997
00:59:56,320 --> 00:59:58,840
Speaker 1: if you look at it end diagram of rheumatorid arthritis,

998
00:59:58,920 --> 01:00:02,240
Speaker 1: systemic lupus, rick and ptosis, and two Jogrin syndrome. If

999
01:00:02,280 --> 01:00:06,600
Speaker 1: those were three circles and have been diagram, undifferentiated connective

1000
01:00:06,600 --> 01:00:09,320
Speaker 1: tissue disease sits right in the middle. There's a light

1001
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:12,040
Speaker 1: theory that all autoimmune diseases are somewhat the same thing,

1002
01:00:12,120 --> 01:00:16,200
Speaker 1: but we differentiate them as diagnosticians based upon what is

1003
01:00:16,240 --> 01:00:19,600
Speaker 1: being affected. So like, uh, you know, you're more likely

1004
01:00:19,680 --> 01:00:22,320
Speaker 1: to be diagnosed with sovereign syndrome if you just can't

1005
01:00:22,360 --> 01:00:26,600
Speaker 1: seem to produce any tears or saliva, because that's where

1006
01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:30,000
Speaker 1: the autoimmune disease is attacking your body. But I ended

1007
01:00:30,080 --> 01:00:32,480
Speaker 1: up on joints as a primary problem, so that's why

1008
01:00:32,520 --> 01:00:35,640
Speaker 1: I end up with that one. UM. But as I

1009
01:00:35,640 --> 01:00:38,160
Speaker 1: I had to switch doctors for a number of reasons

1010
01:00:38,320 --> 01:00:42,480
Speaker 1: and I began to flare, and so uh I A

1011
01:00:42,600 --> 01:00:44,760
Speaker 1: was started on hydroxy color quinn. Then though in the

1012
01:00:44,760 --> 01:00:47,760
Speaker 1: summer of I've been taking it ever since. I've never

1013
01:00:47,760 --> 01:00:53,200
Speaker 1: stopped four d milligrams a day. UM. And after about

1014
01:00:53,280 --> 01:00:56,200
Speaker 1: a year of being on it, I stopped getting like more,

1015
01:00:56,960 --> 01:00:59,520
Speaker 1: I stopped getting as much disease activity. And then we

1016
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,600
Speaker 1: kind of focused on, you know, talking about my my

1017
01:01:02,680 --> 01:01:05,720
Speaker 1: life history in my doctor's appointments a little bit more,

1018
01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:08,000
Speaker 1: and we realized that, yeah, I've probably have LUPAS for

1019
01:01:08,040 --> 01:01:12,160
Speaker 1: a much longer time. Uh My. My diagnosis still says

1020
01:01:12,240 --> 01:01:15,200
Speaker 1: undifferentiated connected tissue disorder though, because the treatment is the

1021
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:17,720
Speaker 1: same and we don't want my insurance premiums to go up,

1022
01:01:17,720 --> 01:01:21,280
Speaker 1: which is another very interesting twist in the way that

1023
01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:25,200
Speaker 1: we treat people in the US. I know, uh, it's

1024
01:01:25,240 --> 01:01:28,480
Speaker 1: real fascinating. Uh, but you know I do get the

1025
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:32,000
Speaker 1: very notable uh butterfly rash across my face every now

1026
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:35,640
Speaker 1: and again. Um. I I experienced clears. You experienced daily

1027
01:01:35,720 --> 01:01:40,680
Speaker 1: joint pain. Uh. My vitamin D has always been deficient. Uh,

1028
01:01:40,720 --> 01:01:43,640
Speaker 1: and so I take a lot of vitamin D weekly.

1029
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:48,240
Speaker 1: It's it sucks. I really wouldn't recommend it to anybody. Well,

1030
01:01:48,280 --> 01:01:52,360
Speaker 1: that's a strong anti uh lupus statement, which I don't

1031
01:01:52,360 --> 01:01:56,480
Speaker 1: know people can agree with or disagree with. You autoimmunit

1032
01:01:56,480 --> 01:02:01,000
Speaker 1: seasons aren't fun. How would you describe like the importance

1033
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:04,520
Speaker 1: of being able to access hydroxy chloroquine, Like what happens

1034
01:02:04,560 --> 01:02:06,840
Speaker 1: to you if you are no longer able to get

1035
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:10,680
Speaker 1: this medication? So, Um, I've never gone off of it

1036
01:02:10,720 --> 01:02:12,880
Speaker 1: since I was on it, but I can describe my

1037
01:02:12,920 --> 01:02:16,000
Speaker 1: worst flare, and that's what I anticipate would be the

1038
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 1: beginning of my experience of being off of it. Uh,

1039
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:23,200
Speaker 1: since I have not actually done that. But I'm very

1040
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:28,600
Speaker 1: scared too. So my last really bad flair summer and

1041
01:02:28,640 --> 01:02:31,080
Speaker 1: I had been on vacation. You're not supposed to spend

1042
01:02:31,080 --> 01:02:32,600
Speaker 1: a lot of time in the sun as a person

1043
01:02:32,640 --> 01:02:36,120
Speaker 1: with lupus. You're sensitive to UV radiation to begin with,

1044
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:39,800
Speaker 1: and actually hydroxy chloroquine makes you more sensitive to UV,

1045
01:02:40,520 --> 01:02:43,000
Speaker 1: which is really fascinating. So I spent a lot of

1046
01:02:43,000 --> 01:02:45,280
Speaker 1: time in the sun for a week at altitude, and

1047
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:47,600
Speaker 1: I was also drinking a lot because it's vacation. And

1048
01:02:47,720 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 1: the very last day, UH, my joints started to swell

1049
01:02:51,960 --> 01:02:55,240
Speaker 1: around five PM. Like, we noticed that my knees were hot,

1050
01:02:55,520 --> 01:02:58,600
Speaker 1: and my chest was flushed, and my face had the

1051
01:02:58,720 --> 01:03:00,960
Speaker 1: malar rash. And then by now I p m. Every

1052
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:03,840
Speaker 1: single one of my joints was bolen, including my jaw,

1053
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:06,520
Speaker 1: and so like my teeth didn't connect and it was like,

1054
01:03:06,600 --> 01:03:08,040
Speaker 1: you know, it was the last native camp. So I

1055
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:10,280
Speaker 1: went to the camp dance with my cane and everybody

1056
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:13,760
Speaker 1: freaked out, but I just wanted to have fun. Um,

1057
01:03:13,840 --> 01:03:17,240
Speaker 1: So that would my assumption be the beginning of what

1058
01:03:17,320 --> 01:03:20,320
Speaker 1: I would face. Thankfully that that flare didn't last too

1059
01:03:20,320 --> 01:03:24,200
Speaker 1: long because I I hit it with some steroids right

1060
01:03:24,240 --> 01:03:28,440
Speaker 1: at the beginning. But steroids are really rough on the body,

1061
01:03:28,840 --> 01:03:32,840
Speaker 1: and prednizone will make me further immuno compromised UH and

1062
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:35,920
Speaker 1: any other treatment that I would seek out as a

1063
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:41,440
Speaker 1: lupa's patient without my hydroxy chloroquine would be further immunosuppressive

1064
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,600
Speaker 1: than hydroxy chloroquine already is, which like that that is,

1065
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:49,880
Speaker 1: hydroxy chloroquine is less of an immunosuppressant than other LUPAS medications.

1066
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:52,360
Speaker 1: It's actually more of an immuno regulator. So while it

1067
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:55,960
Speaker 1: does change the way that my immune system functions, it

1068
01:03:56,000 --> 01:04:01,160
Speaker 1: doesn't just tamp it down. It It changes how it

1069
01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:05,320
Speaker 1: interacts with my body, so it stops it from you know,

1070
01:04:05,400 --> 01:04:08,680
Speaker 1: beating up my own system and instead directs it to

1071
01:04:09,160 --> 01:04:11,840
Speaker 1: function more properly. But as I said, not as suppressive

1072
01:04:11,880 --> 01:04:14,560
Speaker 1: as other things like metho trek state and a lot

1073
01:04:14,600 --> 01:04:18,640
Speaker 1: of these other medications can really only be delivered properly

1074
01:04:18,760 --> 01:04:21,200
Speaker 1: through I V. So that would mean that if I

1075
01:04:21,240 --> 01:04:23,600
Speaker 1: were to seek treatment, I would have to go into

1076
01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:28,160
Speaker 1: a doctor's office or a hospital. Where as an already

1077
01:04:28,160 --> 01:04:32,680
Speaker 1: immunal compromised person, I would be more likely to catch

1078
01:04:32,800 --> 01:04:36,200
Speaker 1: COVID nineteen if I don't already have it. And as

1079
01:04:36,240 --> 01:04:41,160
Speaker 1: we've seen across the country, there are a triage uh

1080
01:04:41,280 --> 01:04:44,080
Speaker 1: you know, methods being put into place. UH. And so

1081
01:04:44,240 --> 01:04:47,360
Speaker 1: knowing that I'm more likely to get worse once infected

1082
01:04:48,080 --> 01:04:50,520
Speaker 1: UH and knowing that I would be less likely to

1083
01:04:50,520 --> 01:04:53,840
Speaker 1: be considered for a ventilator. Uh, should I get worse?

1084
01:04:54,240 --> 01:04:57,800
Speaker 1: This just seems like the beginning of a domino effect

1085
01:04:57,920 --> 01:05:03,120
Speaker 1: of shittiness. Absolutely, And I mean pregna zone is brutal

1086
01:05:03,360 --> 01:05:06,120
Speaker 1: on somebody that doesn't have an autoimmune disorder. It's so

1087
01:05:06,200 --> 01:05:10,120
Speaker 1: hard that body and makes you feel like you're going

1088
01:05:10,160 --> 01:05:12,720
Speaker 1: to pass out at any moment in time. Yeah, like

1089
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:16,240
Speaker 1: you got hit by a truck. It's literally. Yeah. And

1090
01:05:17,960 --> 01:05:20,400
Speaker 1: have you noticed any sort of difficulty, Like I've been

1091
01:05:20,400 --> 01:05:22,400
Speaker 1: reading online, a lot of people have had trouble getting

1092
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:25,440
Speaker 1: their full like they've been going. They have been able

1093
01:05:25,440 --> 01:05:28,120
Speaker 1: to get yeah, like ninety day prescriptions or whatever. Um,

1094
01:05:28,160 --> 01:05:31,280
Speaker 1: they've been locked down a thirty year. Yeah. Coincidentally, I

1095
01:05:31,320 --> 01:05:33,200
Speaker 1: picked up a ninety day prescription at like the end

1096
01:05:33,200 --> 01:05:37,440
Speaker 1: of January, beginning of February, so I had a stockpile,

1097
01:05:37,560 --> 01:05:39,480
Speaker 1: you know. Yeah, who would have thought, Um, I was

1098
01:05:39,520 --> 01:05:41,479
Speaker 1: just started traveling and so I you know, I picked

1099
01:05:41,520 --> 01:05:44,240
Speaker 1: up for that, Uh, correct me up. That actually gave

1100
01:05:44,280 --> 01:05:47,480
Speaker 1: me like the prescription bottle, like the manufacturer's bottle, because

1101
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:49,240
Speaker 1: they're like, just take it, You're taking all of it. Anyway,

1102
01:05:49,280 --> 01:05:52,240
Speaker 1: I thought that was amazing. Um, you gotta take the

1103
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:56,120
Speaker 1: little joys when you're product real. So um, all of

1104
01:05:56,160 --> 01:05:59,040
Speaker 1: that said, I am thankfully okay for now that I

1105
01:05:59,080 --> 01:06:02,680
Speaker 1: know this this won't last forever, and I've been really

1106
01:06:02,720 --> 01:06:04,920
Speaker 1: in touch with the way that this story has unfolded

1107
01:06:04,960 --> 01:06:07,640
Speaker 1: since uh it started. I actually saw like the o

1108
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:10,760
Speaker 1: g elon Musk tweet and somebody had posted on Reddit

1109
01:06:10,800 --> 01:06:14,080
Speaker 1: in February that there was some testing of hydroxy chloroquine

1110
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:17,160
Speaker 1: in China, So I was like tapped in on this one.

1111
01:06:17,600 --> 01:06:20,000
Speaker 1: How did that feel when you see that, like this,

1112
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:23,240
Speaker 1: this weird little niche, you know, hydroxy chloroquine. Nobody who

1113
01:06:23,280 --> 01:06:25,680
Speaker 1: didn't take it knew what the hell this stuff was

1114
01:06:25,760 --> 01:06:30,200
Speaker 1: prior to that Musk tweet. It's also a relatively drug

1115
01:06:30,240 --> 01:06:34,240
Speaker 1: as well, I mean chloric for a while, but yeah,

1116
01:06:34,400 --> 01:06:36,800
Speaker 1: hydroxy chlorquine has been around a little. Uh it's a

1117
01:06:36,840 --> 01:06:39,600
Speaker 1: little bit more recent than chloroquine itself. But like overall,

1118
01:06:39,680 --> 01:06:42,280
Speaker 1: this is an old drug. It's an old malarial that

1119
01:06:42,320 --> 01:06:45,160
Speaker 1: actually doesn't work as well on malaria anymore, so it's

1120
01:06:45,160 --> 01:06:47,760
Speaker 1: been kind of abandoned in its original treatment form and

1121
01:06:47,760 --> 01:06:50,880
Speaker 1: now it's almost exclusively only grabbed automneian people which has

1122
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:55,720
Speaker 1: been an infuriating like invisibility that media has allowed us

1123
01:06:55,760 --> 01:06:59,840
Speaker 1: to fall into. Uh rarely is it actually described as

1124
01:06:59,840 --> 01:07:03,040
Speaker 1: well it is used for I digress how it felt

1125
01:07:03,200 --> 01:07:06,000
Speaker 1: to read that on like read it and Twitter and everything.

1126
01:07:06,400 --> 01:07:08,600
Speaker 1: At first, I was like, oh, yoh, that's my boy,

1127
01:07:08,760 --> 01:07:11,919
Speaker 1: Like maybe this is the only good thing that my

1128
01:07:12,200 --> 01:07:15,280
Speaker 1: visibility has ever donne for me, Like what if I'm

1129
01:07:15,320 --> 01:07:17,040
Speaker 1: you know, I'm gonna live forever, I'm never gonna get

1130
01:07:17,080 --> 01:07:21,720
Speaker 1: this but yeah, yeah, right again, gotta gotta make little jokes.

1131
01:07:21,760 --> 01:07:24,920
Speaker 1: As the story, though, became more clear, and I you know,

1132
01:07:25,000 --> 01:07:27,840
Speaker 1: kept in touch with this musk tweets and started I

1133
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:31,280
Speaker 1: have like a spreadsheet of all of these resources that

1134
01:07:31,320 --> 01:07:35,680
Speaker 1: I've been following because the story has just balloon so quickly. Um,

1135
01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:37,520
Speaker 1: it became more and more clear that this is going

1136
01:07:37,560 --> 01:07:39,760
Speaker 1: to be a big problem for not only me, but

1137
01:07:39,840 --> 01:07:42,320
Speaker 1: like I will say, us as a community of automan

1138
01:07:42,400 --> 01:07:45,720
Speaker 1: people who take this drug. Uh. And it's like completely

1139
01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:48,640
Speaker 1: taken over my life. I have no work right now,

1140
01:07:49,040 --> 01:07:52,760
Speaker 1: I'm gonna I'm a professional photographer and as you can imagine,

1141
01:07:52,960 --> 01:07:55,960
Speaker 1: events that I would usually shoot have evaporated. And my

1142
01:07:56,040 --> 01:07:58,320
Speaker 1: day job is scooping ice cream and I'm too immuno

1143
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:02,240
Speaker 1: compromised to do that, So I have nothing better to

1144
01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:05,240
Speaker 1: do but track this and stress over it. As the

1145
01:08:05,600 --> 01:08:09,600
Speaker 1: sort of stockpiling has begun. Um Like I don't know,

1146
01:08:09,680 --> 01:08:12,480
Speaker 1: Like I keep just wanting to ask, like how does

1147
01:08:12,520 --> 01:08:16,200
Speaker 1: it feel to have your your health care jeopardized by

1148
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:20,080
Speaker 1: a president desperate for like a miracle cure, Like it's this,

1149
01:08:20,160 --> 01:08:24,880
Speaker 1: it's this, yeah, yeah, it is full fal but this

1150
01:08:25,000 --> 01:08:27,599
Speaker 1: has h Like I feel like the way that I'm

1151
01:08:27,680 --> 01:08:29,840
Speaker 1: being viewed by my friends is like, oh, this is

1152
01:08:29,920 --> 01:08:32,360
Speaker 1: just abby, you know, making it all about her, when

1153
01:08:32,360 --> 01:08:33,840
Speaker 1: it's like no, no no, no, no, no, no, you guys

1154
01:08:33,920 --> 01:08:37,240
Speaker 1: don't understand, Like this is it for us. For most

1155
01:08:37,240 --> 01:08:40,160
Speaker 1: people with lubis, this is the only drug that we

1156
01:08:40,200 --> 01:08:43,439
Speaker 1: can take for a relatively normal life, Like otherwise you

1157
01:08:43,520 --> 01:08:46,800
Speaker 1: kind of have to structure your life around infusions and

1158
01:08:46,880 --> 01:08:50,000
Speaker 1: like for some people, these infusions are really really taxing.

1159
01:08:50,200 --> 01:08:52,479
Speaker 1: And so that's you know, three days off of work,

1160
01:08:52,560 --> 01:08:54,160
Speaker 1: like one day to prepare, one day to get it,

1161
01:08:54,160 --> 01:08:59,160
Speaker 1: one day to recover. Like these are tough drugs in

1162
01:08:59,280 --> 01:09:01,479
Speaker 1: the best of time times, but to see that our

1163
01:09:01,560 --> 01:09:05,479
Speaker 1: most successible drug during a pandemic is being kind of

1164
01:09:05,520 --> 01:09:08,679
Speaker 1: co opted as a political football, and what it's turned

1165
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:16,439
Speaker 1: into is is truly that like divisive? Uh, that divisive

1166
01:09:16,439 --> 01:09:19,280
Speaker 1: thing that people are latching onto. Like the more and

1167
01:09:19,360 --> 01:09:23,400
Speaker 1: more I've read, or rather, let me rewind slightly because

1168
01:09:23,720 --> 01:09:29,880
Speaker 1: the original um news stories that started coming out, let

1169
01:09:29,880 --> 01:09:33,320
Speaker 1: me scroll up, because the everything organized by date. Some

1170
01:09:33,400 --> 01:09:36,320
Speaker 1: of the first stories that came out, we're on Breitbart

1171
01:09:36,320 --> 01:09:39,760
Speaker 1: in the Blaze, those were on March eighteen. Um, those

1172
01:09:39,760 --> 01:09:42,200
Speaker 1: are the first ones that I saw outside of like

1173
01:09:42,240 --> 01:09:46,719
Speaker 1: Elon must mentioning it on Twitter on March sixteenth. Um,

1174
01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:51,000
Speaker 1: So seeing it be grabbed so immediately by righty Twitter

1175
01:09:51,800 --> 01:09:58,519
Speaker 1: was alarming. Um. And then yeah, yeah, like having that

1176
01:09:58,600 --> 01:10:02,280
Speaker 1: then the like twisted into this narrative of like you're

1177
01:10:02,320 --> 01:10:05,680
Speaker 1: being selfish? How dare you take this drug that you've

1178
01:10:05,720 --> 01:10:09,479
Speaker 1: always taken because you're worried for your health? Like as

1179
01:10:09,479 --> 01:10:11,519
Speaker 1: if that that that's not what other people are saying,

1180
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:15,480
Speaker 1: and it's the lack of scientific literacy in the conversation

1181
01:10:15,600 --> 01:10:19,479
Speaker 1: overall has been Um, have you actually had people call

1182
01:10:19,560 --> 01:10:22,800
Speaker 1: you selfish for taking this medication? Absolutely? Read it was

1183
01:10:22,800 --> 01:10:27,880
Speaker 1: the first class called selfish. And then book yeah, like

1184
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:30,360
Speaker 1: how like I'll be fine if I don't take this medication.

1185
01:10:30,439 --> 01:10:35,760
Speaker 1: Obviously it's Jeff lupas. So yeah, um, I really don't

1186
01:10:35,760 --> 01:10:38,280
Speaker 1: think that people know what lupas is, like whether uh

1187
01:10:38,560 --> 01:10:41,160
Speaker 1: it's you know, helped by Doctor House saying it was

1188
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:43,400
Speaker 1: never Les. I'm gonna I was gonna say, my whole

1189
01:10:43,439 --> 01:10:47,479
Speaker 1: knowledge of lupus comes from doctor House. Yeah. Um. So

1190
01:10:47,520 --> 01:10:49,280
Speaker 1: the quick summary though, because I feel like I haven't

1191
01:10:49,280 --> 01:10:51,719
Speaker 1: really said that, I've only talked about it for me. Um,

1192
01:10:52,240 --> 01:10:57,120
Speaker 1: the lupus is an autoimmune disease that is the most

1193
01:10:57,160 --> 01:10:59,800
Speaker 1: kind of broad descriptor of an autoimmune disease, Like you'll

1194
01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:03,200
Speaker 1: get at something like uh, you know ankloting spondylitis, which

1195
01:11:03,240 --> 01:11:07,080
Speaker 1: is like really focus on your lower back and pain there,

1196
01:11:08,160 --> 01:11:12,000
Speaker 1: or like Celiac disease has a clear cause and effect

1197
01:11:12,280 --> 01:11:15,720
Speaker 1: of you know, uh, gluten being the cause and then

1198
01:11:15,880 --> 01:11:19,400
Speaker 1: your immune system responding to that. But lupus is like

1199
01:11:20,400 --> 01:11:25,240
Speaker 1: you can experience inflammation from your body attacking itself literally anywhere.

1200
01:11:25,720 --> 01:11:28,680
Speaker 1: But there are some consistencies, so like most of us

1201
01:11:28,680 --> 01:11:31,439
Speaker 1: get that rash, most of us experience problems in the sun,

1202
01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:36,160
Speaker 1: but every everybody with lupas is different. Um. One of

1203
01:11:36,200 --> 01:11:39,519
Speaker 1: the worst things that can happen for lupus patients is uh,

1204
01:11:39,880 --> 01:11:43,639
Speaker 1: pericardial swelling, so the swelling of the tissue around your heart,

1205
01:11:43,720 --> 01:11:46,439
Speaker 1: which can then interfere with its feeding. And then the

1206
01:11:46,479 --> 01:11:49,800
Speaker 1: other thing is lupus loves the kidneys. Lupas nephritis is

1207
01:11:49,840 --> 01:11:53,360
Speaker 1: one of the most common deadly versions of lupus. That

1208
01:11:53,439 --> 01:11:57,719
Speaker 1: was actually why Selena Gomez got a kidney transplant, Like yeah, yeah,

1209
01:11:58,280 --> 01:11:59,960
Speaker 1: so I was actually really trying to get Selena goal.

1210
01:12:00,000 --> 01:12:01,960
Speaker 1: It's his attention at first, and she's kind of been

1211
01:12:01,960 --> 01:12:03,920
Speaker 1: tunting about it, but not really because I guess she's

1212
01:12:03,960 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 1: fine now, so whatever. Um, but uh, like, not taking

1213
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:12,320
Speaker 1: our medication is not just like you'll put up with

1214
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:14,280
Speaker 1: some pain for a while, Like I put up with

1215
01:12:14,280 --> 01:12:17,040
Speaker 1: pain every day because there's no rewinding the ten years

1216
01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:21,720
Speaker 1: of uncontrolled disease that I experienced. But without it, there

1217
01:12:21,880 --> 01:12:24,920
Speaker 1: is the chance that my immune system will attack my

1218
01:12:25,000 --> 01:12:27,280
Speaker 1: kidneys and I will die because like, what am I

1219
01:12:27,280 --> 01:12:33,120
Speaker 1: going to get a kidney transplant during a pandemic? Probably not? Who? Well,

1220
01:12:33,240 --> 01:12:39,360
Speaker 1: um Jesus, that is I think without you know, getting

1221
01:12:39,400 --> 01:12:44,240
Speaker 1: too partisan because reporters aren't allowed to have opinions some bullshit. Um,

1222
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:47,880
Speaker 1: let me second, that that's some fucking bullshit. I can

1223
01:12:47,960 --> 01:12:49,400
Speaker 1: also speak to a little bit more, and I've been

1224
01:12:49,400 --> 01:12:54,400
Speaker 1: experiencing online because I think it's fascinating. Yeah. So I've

1225
01:12:54,400 --> 01:12:56,920
Speaker 1: been following the story as to you guys know, I

1226
01:12:57,000 --> 01:12:59,880
Speaker 1: sent you my my big spreadsheet. UM. And as I've

1227
01:12:59,880 --> 01:13:01,679
Speaker 1: been and following it more and more, and as I've

1228
01:13:01,680 --> 01:13:07,680
Speaker 1: been like, you know, proudly adopting my reply guy Crown, UM,

1229
01:13:07,720 --> 01:13:11,839
Speaker 1: I've been seeing the way that the like meme culture

1230
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:15,000
Speaker 1: is kind of curdling this narrative. And then on Facebook,

1231
01:13:15,560 --> 01:13:20,320
Speaker 1: I have been getting inundated by friend requests from all

1232
01:13:20,760 --> 01:13:24,160
Speaker 1: men with Southeast Asian names that I'm assuming our boss.

1233
01:13:24,200 --> 01:13:26,559
Speaker 1: But I've gotten dozens within the last twenty four hours

1234
01:13:26,560 --> 01:13:29,040
Speaker 1: and then a couple before then that I can somewhat

1235
01:13:29,080 --> 01:13:32,040
Speaker 1: trace back to a comment that I made on a

1236
01:13:32,040 --> 01:13:36,000
Speaker 1: Wall Street Journal article advocating for Luca's patients getting protections

1237
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:40,840
Speaker 1: for our medication. Um, I have screenshots of full all

1238
01:13:40,920 --> 01:13:43,280
Speaker 1: the friend requests, the messages that I've been getting, and

1239
01:13:43,520 --> 01:13:45,320
Speaker 1: because like I got messages from some of them that

1240
01:13:45,360 --> 01:13:48,800
Speaker 1: have been like gone to filtered messages, and then I

1241
01:13:48,840 --> 01:13:51,400
Speaker 1: have like all of the friendly requests that I got.

1242
01:13:51,479 --> 01:13:54,800
Speaker 1: It's just really weird. And it feels like I'm experiencing

1243
01:13:56,280 --> 01:13:59,919
Speaker 1: bought networks that are set up specifically to so discord.

1244
01:14:00,120 --> 01:14:01,920
Speaker 1: I have no proof of this yet, but I have

1245
01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:05,840
Speaker 1: some light connections that could lead me to this conclusion,

1246
01:14:06,640 --> 01:14:08,439
Speaker 1: or at least lead me to where I'm at now.

1247
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:10,760
Speaker 1: There's no conclusions yet, but I've been trying to get

1248
01:14:10,800 --> 01:14:12,880
Speaker 1: in touch with reply all actually to see if they

1249
01:14:12,880 --> 01:14:15,040
Speaker 1: can figure out what's going on. Oh, that's a good

1250
01:14:15,080 --> 01:14:20,120
Speaker 1: call it And it's primarily on Facebook. Primarily on Facebook. Um,

1251
01:14:20,160 --> 01:14:21,760
Speaker 1: I've tweeted up with by Ale a couple of times,

1252
01:14:21,800 --> 01:14:24,120
Speaker 1: and I emailed them with all of the like friend requests.

1253
01:14:24,120 --> 01:14:27,280
Speaker 1: But it feels like such a conspiracy theory even like

1254
01:14:27,360 --> 01:14:30,960
Speaker 1: saying it out loud. But like, I don't know, I'm

1255
01:14:31,000 --> 01:14:35,240
Speaker 1: experiencing a weird thing right now, and there's some I

1256
01:14:35,240 --> 01:14:38,200
Speaker 1: don't know, there's stuff going on. As someone who has

1257
01:14:38,240 --> 01:14:41,519
Speaker 1: like periodically jammed his head into aspects of the culture

1258
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:45,920
Speaker 1: war online from a reporting standpoint, Um, I get regularly

1259
01:14:45,960 --> 01:14:49,520
Speaker 1: deluged in waves that go along with those head jammings.

1260
01:14:49,600 --> 01:14:53,320
Speaker 1: Um of of folks you know signing that for Botanich

1261
01:14:53,400 --> 01:14:55,800
Speaker 1: works for bullshit or not bott signing me up for

1262
01:14:55,840 --> 01:15:00,800
Speaker 1: like mailing list, people like random um sex bo reaching

1263
01:15:00,800 --> 01:15:02,519
Speaker 1: out to me on Google Hangout. It's like, yeah, it's

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01:15:02,520 --> 01:15:06,120
Speaker 1: a thing that happens, um, when you wind up in

1265
01:15:06,160 --> 01:15:09,479
Speaker 1: the middle of one of these culture war firing squads. Yeah,

1266
01:15:09,520 --> 01:15:12,800
Speaker 1: and like, I have no intention to stop doing what

1267
01:15:12,880 --> 01:15:17,240
Speaker 1: I'm doing until we are actually seeing progress on LUCAS

1268
01:15:17,280 --> 01:15:21,599
Speaker 1: patients being guaranteed access to our medication. So like we'll

1269
01:15:21,600 --> 01:15:24,880
Speaker 1: see where I end up. All right, Well, um, Abby,

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01:15:24,960 --> 01:15:27,320
Speaker 1: I think that's everything we had. Thank you so much

1271
01:15:27,320 --> 01:15:29,840
Speaker 1: for coming on. If you guys need anything else, you know,

1272
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:32,040
Speaker 1: I got all the resources and I'm just gonna keep

1273
01:15:32,040 --> 01:15:34,559
Speaker 1: going on this one, So thank you so much. Well

1274
01:15:34,600 --> 01:15:36,840
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for us here at whatever this

1275
01:15:36,920 --> 01:15:39,479
Speaker 1: show was called, no one knows anymore. It's been so

1276
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:42,240
Speaker 1: long ago that we created it. It's called next Year.

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01:15:42,320 --> 01:15:47,720
Speaker 1: Please next year, please ye the year. Everything is fine

1278
01:15:47,800 --> 01:15:50,080
Speaker 1: the year check us out next week if we are

1279
01:15:50,120 --> 01:15:58,920
Speaker 1: all still alive, which is a crapshoot. You can find

1280
01:15:59,000 --> 01:16:02,040
Speaker 1: us online at where steer pod on the things, you know,

1281
01:16:02,160 --> 01:16:07,240
Speaker 1: the Instagram thing and the Twitter thing. Uh, you know,

1282
01:16:08,200 --> 01:16:13,000
Speaker 1: stay safe, you guys, wash your hand, yeah, wash your

1283
01:16:13,000 --> 01:16:20,240
Speaker 1: hand as safe Don't Commit Crimes where some check out

1284
01:16:20,520 --> 01:16:25,040
Speaker 1: the latest album from Muffin Don't. Oh yeah, definitely check

1285
01:16:25,040 --> 01:16:28,840
Speaker 1: out Muffin. Oh my god, absolutely check out Muffin. See

1286
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:32,160
Speaker 1: if your local theater's got any performances of All for

1287
01:16:32,320 --> 01:16:37,640
Speaker 1: Joe coming up. Oh yeah, check that shut Out too. Okay, Hi,

1288
01:16:38,920 --> 01:16:51,760
Speaker 1: we are all right. Every Everything I Tried, Worst Your

1289
01:16:51,800 --> 01:16:54,080
Speaker 1: Ever is a production of I Heart Radio. For more

1290
01:16:54,160 --> 01:16:56,920
Speaker 1: podcasts from My heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app,

1291
01:16:57,040 --> 01:16:59,920
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

1292
01:17:00,000 --> 01:17:00,040
Speaker 1: It