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Speaker 1: I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When

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Speaker 1: I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.

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Speaker 1: And when I find my.

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Speaker 2: Ball in a brid egg Friday Egg, the dreadit Frida Egg,

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Speaker 2: Frida Egg, Frida egg bride.

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Speaker 1: Egg Lie, I'm about ready to run off the golf course.

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Egg Podcast.

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Speaker 1: Today's episode is with Barry's for Luga from the Washington Post.

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Speaker 1: Barry writes about baseball a lot. He covers the Washington

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Speaker 1: Nationals as well as, uh, you know, just general baseball

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Speaker 1: topics for the Washington Post. He also covers golf for

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Speaker 1: the Washington Post, so he was at the Masters. He

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Speaker 1: goes to the major Championships. See Barry out on the

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Speaker 1: golf beat as well it you know, I've been wanting

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Speaker 1: to do this pod for a few weeks now. With

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Speaker 1: the new rules with Major League Baseball, Major League Baseball

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Speaker 1: obviously has undergone a pretty substantial change in the rules

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Speaker 1: of the game for this year. The intentions of them

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Speaker 1: really were to modernize the game, speed up the game,

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Speaker 1: make the game more appealing to a younger audience, and

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Speaker 1: they've instituted things such as a pitch clock, bigger bases,

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Speaker 1: and really, you know, this is a seismic change for

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Speaker 1: a sport that has held long standing traditions history. You know,

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Speaker 1: it might sound familiar to another sport we talk about

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Speaker 1: a lot on this podcast. Golf. Obviously, pace of play

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Speaker 1: has come to a head in recent weeks. You know,

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Speaker 1: I think slightly unfairly, I think Patrick Cantley has become

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Speaker 1: the boy for this. There are a lot of slow golfers.

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Speaker 1: Patrick Cantley obviously is in contentional lot. He's one of

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Speaker 1: the best players in the world. So it kind of

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Speaker 1: comes to light. But let's not act like there isn't

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Speaker 1: a hundred slow players on the PGA Tour. Patrick Cantley

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Speaker 1: is one of those. It does not excuse him, but

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Speaker 1: it also you know, I think one of the one

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Speaker 1: of the big issues in golf is that the governing

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Speaker 1: bodies of the sport, the PGA Tour, the USGA, the RNA,

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Speaker 1: don't do anything to really penalize slow play. We've had

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Speaker 1: two instances really in the last ten years of slow

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Speaker 1: play being penalized. One of them was said Decky Matsiama

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Speaker 1: in the Open Championship when he was eighteen years old

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Speaker 1: at Mierfield. So if it's not being monitored, what Patrick

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Speaker 1: Cantley is doing is using the rules to the best

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Speaker 1: of his advantage to play the best possible golf. Now,

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Speaker 1: the bigger question it shouldn't be let's crucify Patrick Cantlay

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Speaker 1: and Kim an example. It should be more discussing, Hey,

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Speaker 1: what are the rules of the game. What's important to

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Speaker 1: the game of golf is the ability to make decisions

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Speaker 1: under the gun and read putts quickly A big part

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Speaker 1: of golf, Like, is that an important part of the sport?

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Speaker 1: I think it is. Others might disagree, But if you

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Speaker 1: think about the product of golf, where it's going, what

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Speaker 1: you want golf to be in the next hundred years,

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Speaker 1: is pace of play important to the product of golf?

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Speaker 1: I don't think you could make an argument that says

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Speaker 1: it isn't you know these rounds where we were approaching

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Speaker 1: five hours with twusome's in golf on weekends. That's not

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Speaker 1: good for the sport. It makes it hard to televise

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Speaker 1: that there's all these other trickle down effects. So the

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Speaker 1: point of this conversation with Barry and I you know,

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Speaker 1: I think you know I don't like to say, I

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Speaker 1: think it turned out better than I anticipated. I was

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Speaker 1: hopeful that this would be a pod that really translated

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Speaker 1: and that Barry would kind of understand where I was

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Speaker 1: going with it, and he really did and provided a

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Speaker 1: lot of expertise on what baseball and is doing and

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Speaker 1: how it relates back to golf. You know, I think

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Speaker 1: that this is the type of things that the sport

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Speaker 1: of golf needs to be looking at. It is a

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Speaker 1: bit unique with the way it's structured, but if you

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Speaker 1: look at every major league sport, whether it's baseball, hockey, football, basketball,

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Speaker 1: they are constantly testing and looking at ways that they

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Speaker 1: can improve their game, improve their product on television because

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Speaker 1: they understand in order to stay relevant, in order to

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Speaker 1: stay popular across generations, you need to make modifications evolutions

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Speaker 1: to the game that appeal to the next generation. Baseball

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Speaker 1: has done this. One of the things that they looked

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Speaker 1: at was case of their games, and they have done

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Speaker 1: it masterfully with this pitchclock. They're a month into it

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Speaker 1: and really it's been phenomenal for the sport. So, without

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Speaker 1: further ado, we are going to get into this topic.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I think these are there are a

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Speaker 1: lot of things in here. A lot of things in

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Speaker 1: other sports that they are doing that golf really should

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Speaker 1: look at in terms of modernizing the game and making

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Speaker 1: the professional game more appealing to a wider range of people.

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Speaker 1: All Right, Barry, thanks for coming on. This is gonna

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Speaker 1: be a little bit different podcast than than our normal topic.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna talk. We're gonna talk a lot about baseball.

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Speaker 1: But I promise everybody there's going to be a tie

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Speaker 1: back to golf here that there's a method to the madness. Barry,

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Speaker 1: you cover both baseball and golf. I'm curious, just off

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Speaker 1: the off the time up, you know, what, what's your

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Speaker 1: favorite aspect about covering each sport? Like is there something

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Speaker 1: that you you know when you're at the Masters that

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Speaker 1: you said sin that you're like, I love covering golf,

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Speaker 1: and and when when baseball season kicks up, like, what

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Speaker 1: are you most excited about?

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Speaker 2: You know? I mean there's an old saying about sports

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Speaker 2: writing that the the smaller the ball, the better the writing,

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Speaker 2: And so the two smallest balls are baseball and golf.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if that's literally true, but there's certainly

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Speaker 2: if you go through the litany of legendary sports writers

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Speaker 2: like there's the Herbert Warren Wins and the you know,

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Speaker 2: Peter Gammons, and they're they're kind of are baseball and

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Speaker 2: golf writers. You don't think as much of the you know,

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Speaker 2: literary flair around football necessarily, So I mean from a

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Speaker 2: from a professional like aspiring to write well person, those

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Speaker 2: two sports, for whatever reason, lend themselves to good storylines

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Speaker 2: and good storytelling, and I do like them both, and

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Speaker 2: i'd like I think I like them both differently. I

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Speaker 2: love the flow of a golf tournament of a major

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Speaker 2: week and you know kind of what to expect on

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Speaker 2: Tuesdays and all the anticipation and and getting into the

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Speaker 2: actual competition, and then you know, yesterday, for instance, I

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Speaker 2: went up to Camding Yards and it's a sunny Wednesday

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Speaker 2: afternoon for a one pm start between the Red Sox

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Speaker 2: and the Orioles, and it feels like the whole summer

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Speaker 2: is stretched out before you you see a nice, clean

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Speaker 2: baseball game. I love them both kind of, I would

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Speaker 2: say similarly and and differently. There's a different flow, but

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Speaker 2: they also involve a lot of super insightful characters and storytellers,

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Speaker 2: So I love them both.

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Speaker 1: I imagine baseball like the dog days of you know

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Speaker 1: the famous baseball the dog days like of August? Is

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Speaker 1: that really like the dog days of being a sports

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Speaker 1: writer and being at like game one hundred and twenty

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Speaker 1: or whatever it is on the calendar, and just you know,

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Speaker 1: if your team's not if you if you've got a

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Speaker 1: bad team you're covering, it's gotta be just just an

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Speaker 1: absolute drive to write every day.

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Speaker 2: For sure, for sure. And that's you know, back when

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Speaker 2: I was the beat writer, I covered the Washington Nationals

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Speaker 2: for their first three and a half seasons, you know,

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Speaker 2: of their existence. Like, yeah, you'd get to you know,

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Speaker 2: you're on a one hundred lost pace and you get

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Speaker 2: to August and you know it's the eighth day of

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Speaker 2: an eleven day road trip, and it's not it's not easy.

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Speaker 2: I used to try to, you know, walking into the park,

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Speaker 2: say Okay, what's important and what's interesting about this team

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Speaker 2: on this day and try to gear myself up for

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Speaker 2: you know, not making it game one twenty out of

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Speaker 2: one sixty two kind of a silo, but making it

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Speaker 2: a chapter that tells that one hundred and sixty two

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Speaker 2: game game story. And when you find those those threads

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Speaker 2: that hold the season together. It makes it more interesting.

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Speaker 2: But you do I'm not going to say in those

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Speaker 2: days for the Beat writers that it's not a slog.

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Speaker 2: It can you can love the game and it can

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Speaker 2: be a slog in late August when you can't quite

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Speaker 2: see the finish line yet, you know there's there's still

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Speaker 2: quite a bit to go for a season that might

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Speaker 2: be going nowhere.

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Speaker 1: That that's good advice. That's that's great advice. I might

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Speaker 1: take it to heart this week with the Mexico Open

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Speaker 1: with one one player in the top ten, me wondering

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Speaker 1: what are we doing having this event right? You know,

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Speaker 1: it's just a chapter. It's a chapter in the season

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Speaker 1: long book. You know we need we need William mcgert

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Speaker 1: in the field for that for that chapter. It makes

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Speaker 1: it more interesting. So to get into what I wanted

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Speaker 1: to talk about here today, you know, baseball has gone

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Speaker 1: through some I think, I think pretty major rules changes

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Speaker 1: for the year. There are a few changes they aren't

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Speaker 1: you know that obviously everybody's talking about the pitch clock.

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Speaker 1: So the pitch clock is is the big change. There's

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Speaker 1: now a timer that between pitches players, you know, the

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Speaker 1: X amount of times the pitcher can throw the ball.

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Speaker 1: And anytime the batter's got to be ready in that

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Speaker 1: time frame. Obviously that that was untimed before it could

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Speaker 1: be however long you really wanted to throw a pitch.

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Speaker 1: You have bigger bases, and the shift has been eliminated.

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Speaker 1: So I got those are the three big ones, right.

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Speaker 1: What I'd love to hear about a little bit is like,

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Speaker 1: from your view, what were the prevalent trends in the

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Speaker 1: game before these changes, and you know kind of where

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Speaker 1: what was like if you could zoom out a little,

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Speaker 1: what was what was happening to baseball the last five

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Speaker 1: to ten years.

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Speaker 2: So in addition to games getting longer, just in terms

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Speaker 2: of enduring what last year was a three hour and

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Speaker 2: four minute game, there's been a real imbalance in baseball

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Speaker 2: over the last decade. Teams have fetishized velocity from pitchers

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Speaker 2: and really sought to develop it over all other qualities.

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Speaker 2: And that's really led to a few things. What was

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Speaker 2: you know, when we were growing up, what were the

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Speaker 2: big narratives about a baseball game? Who's pitching that night?

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Speaker 2: That was kind of defined what the matchup was going

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Speaker 2: to be. Was it going to be two aces against

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Speaker 2: each other? Was a lopsided matchup, and the job of

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Speaker 2: those pitchers in the seventies and the eighties was to

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Speaker 2: finish the game and shake the catcher's hand at the end.

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Speaker 2: And what the job of the starting pitcher has become

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Speaker 2: is to throw as hard as you can for as

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Speaker 2: long as you can, and we'll come get you in

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Speaker 2: the fourth, fifth, maybe sixth inning, and we're going to

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Speaker 2: hand the ball over to a series of dudes that

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Speaker 2: throw ninety eight and have ridiculous sliders, and they're going

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Speaker 2: to go all out. And the only way the offense

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Speaker 2: could counter was to swing. You know, there were no

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Speaker 2: controlled swings. We're swinging up, we're swinging for launch angle,

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Speaker 2: we're swinging to hit the ball out of the park.

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Speaker 2: So what happened was you had strikeouts going up every

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Speaker 2: year since two thousand and five, new record every single year.

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Speaker 2: But also homer is starting to go up and no action.

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Speaker 2: Like I always say, like, what's more interesting in baseball?

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Speaker 2: A solo home run where you watch the ball go

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Speaker 2: out and the guy jogs around or somebody you know,

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Speaker 2: a run around first and a ball into the right

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Speaker 2: field corner and now you have to look at the

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Speaker 2: right fielder and the cutoff man, and then the third

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Speaker 2: base coach, and is the runner is. You know, there's

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Speaker 2: five or six things that are going on over a

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Speaker 2: longer speriod period of time in that play where the

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Speaker 2: home run is is is boring. So that's a long

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Speaker 2: witted way of saying that all of those things had

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Speaker 2: the game out of whack, and then it was taking longer,

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Speaker 2: too long, and those you know, four hour postseason games

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Speaker 2: that no ten year old kid on the East Coast

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Speaker 2: could see the end of, you know, really threatening to

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Speaker 2: kill the game. So change was needed. Change was necessary.

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Speaker 2: They made some really fundamental changes and it's already having

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Speaker 2: a big impact.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I think people would push back obviously immediately on

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Speaker 1: the homer being less interesting, But when when you think

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Speaker 1: about it, like, what makes a homer special is when

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Speaker 1: they're scarce, when you know they aren't the prevalent way

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Speaker 1: people score runs, right, Like, it's I think it's really similar.

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Speaker 1: And I don't want to get too into the comparisons

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Speaker 1: to golf, but with a long drive, right, everybody says like, oh,

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Speaker 1: they're super long drives, but if everybody hits the long drive,

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Speaker 1: what is a long drive? Right? I remember growing up

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Speaker 1: obviously I grew up in a Bridge era in the

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Speaker 1: ninety I mean, I remember early nineties baseball, and then

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Speaker 1: I was a Cubs. I grew up a Cubs fan,

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Speaker 1: so I had the Sammy Sosid Mark McGuire steroid fest.

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Speaker 1: I think that's okay to say on a golf podcast

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Speaker 1: where everybody's launching homers, but it was still like, you know,

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Speaker 1: you saw like the metamorphos of you talked about the

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Speaker 1: Orioles games of a Brady Anderson going from a nine

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Speaker 1: home run guy.

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Speaker 2: To fifty home run.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, when all of a sudden everybody's hitting thirty to

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Speaker 1: fifty homers. It's not of a crazy phenomenon. It's almost

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Speaker 1: like a diminishing return, right is the home run when

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Speaker 1: there's a couple, you know, when there might be one

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Speaker 1: a game. It's really an amazing spectacle that home run.

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Speaker 1: But the idea of manufacturing runs and the tension that

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Speaker 1: comes with having to really work for runs, I think

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Speaker 1: is I think that's what people fall in love with

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Speaker 1: every playoff. In the playoffs, where I feel like runs

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Speaker 1: become a little bit more scarce than in the regular season.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's this is just somebody that

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Speaker 1: usually watches baseball, but runs get a little bit more scarce.

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Speaker 1: And that's kind of what the lure of baseball is

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Speaker 1: is when you have to, you know, generate the runs

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Speaker 1: rather than just, you know, they just appear.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And I mean, I'll just use that game that

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Speaker 2: I went to yesterday, the Oriols one sixty two of

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Speaker 2: the Red Sox. The Red Sox had one of the

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Speaker 2: runs on a solo homer, but the Orioles they had

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Speaker 2: two sacrifice bunts to move guys just from first and

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Speaker 2: second to second and third. They I'm not going to

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Speaker 2: argue that the sacrifice fly is a particularly interesting play,

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Speaker 2: but at least if there's gonna be a play at

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Speaker 2: the plate, like, there's some tension there. The guy's setting up,

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Speaker 2: you've got places to turn your head and different. You know,

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Speaker 2: again the third base coach is he gonna send him?

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Speaker 2: What's the timing here? So the Oriols win a game

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Speaker 2: six to two in which you know, they had twelve hits,

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Speaker 2: that's action each one of those hits is you know,

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Speaker 2: I think there's more tension. And I don't want to

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Speaker 2: sound like some sort of home run fascist, but like

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Speaker 2: there's more tension in a single to write with a

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Speaker 2: guy on first and you're evaluating, Okay, is this guy

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Speaker 2: gonna go for thirty? Is there going to be a

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Speaker 2: play at third? There's just there's more action, and then

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Speaker 2: you take what we're really here to talk about is

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Speaker 2: the pitch clock, meaning that the next play comes more quickly.

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Speaker 2: There's just more reason to be engaged all the time.

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Speaker 2: You don't lose track of how many outs are there,

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Speaker 2: how you know what's the count. You're you're more locked

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Speaker 2: in because you have to be here. You're gonna miss stuff.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 1: A great way to synthesize this would be if, as

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Speaker 1: you were talking about that, I was thinking about going

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Speaker 1: back to my youth when I try what I keep score,

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Speaker 1: you know, manually keep score, and how simple solo home

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Speaker 1: runs are versus when you have a guy on first,

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Speaker 1: you have sacrifice, like all the little intricacies of of

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Speaker 1: keeping that perfect scorecard. You know, you know when that happens,

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Speaker 1: and you know that it's it's funny because like you

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Speaker 1: think about like a guy going to third, like you

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Speaker 1: signifying all that while you're keeping score, would be like

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Speaker 1: a perfect way to visualize what you're talking about, like

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Speaker 1: the interest in the game so.

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna grab from my trash, uh the score my

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Speaker 2: scorecard from yesterday.

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Speaker 1: Okay, wait, this might be the video video cutout right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so but anyway, you're you're totally right, Like you

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Speaker 2: probably can't see this, but that's this is the orial

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Speaker 2: side of the board and all this stuff where the

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Speaker 2: runs are scored and there's a sack here and I

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Speaker 2: keep track of which which hit place in the lineup

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Speaker 2: moves the guys over, and how did you know? That?

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Speaker 2: To me tells a more interesting story then then if

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Speaker 2: we go to the Red Sox, like here's the solo homers, Like, okay, yeah,

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Speaker 2: let us let off the inning with the solo homer,

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Speaker 2: it's just like a block. Like we may be getting

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Speaker 2: too deep in the in the weeds. But I'm sure

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Speaker 2: there are nerds who listen to this podcast and and

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Speaker 2: there's nothing nerdier than than doing that and believing that

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Speaker 2: it it tells a story about the game.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think that you could say the same thing

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Speaker 1: with with golf, right it's you know, when you have

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Speaker 1: to hit more shots, that's just like what we're talking

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Speaker 1: about here. And I didn't mean to get into the

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Speaker 1: comparisons directly, but like you know, when when players are

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Speaker 1: forced to hit more shots, just like there, when there

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Speaker 1: are more possible outcomes in in baseball, you could bunt,

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Speaker 1: you could try and hit and run, you could try

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Speaker 1: and you know you want to hit to the left

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Speaker 1: side of the enfield, you know, or the right side

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Speaker 1: of the enfield to move the right side of the enfield,

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Speaker 1: move a guy from second to third, Like you know,

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Speaker 1: when you have these these more varied outcomes in golf,

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Speaker 1: it's okay should I lay up on a par five,

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Speaker 1: like what we saw with the changes that Augusta National

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Speaker 1: has made, for example, where it's not a foregone conclusion

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Speaker 1: if I hit the fairway that I am going for

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Speaker 1: the green in two, like the idea that there was

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Speaker 1: even a thought in players heads, even though they all

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Speaker 1: ended up going for it again, but like even though

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Speaker 1: there was a thought, there was discourse before the week.

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Speaker 1: It made it more interesting because all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: when they're they hit the fairway, there's the tension of

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Speaker 1: the walk to the ball. Are they going to go

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Speaker 1: for it? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: And I think I was absolutely thinking about the team

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Speaker 2: move back at thirteen and Augusta when you were talking

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Speaker 2: about that, because like it wasn't even just that there

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Speaker 2: wasn't a thought that they were going to go for

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Speaker 2: it before. It was like they were going to go

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Speaker 2: for it with an aid iron, right, Like it's just

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Speaker 2: it's pitch and putt to some Now is there an

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Speaker 2: excitement and somebody rolling in an eagle putt at number

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Speaker 2: thirteen on August on a Sunday. Yeah, absolutely, I'm not

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Speaker 2: going to deny that. But like it matters that they're

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Speaker 2: standing over you know, in some cases a fore iron

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Speaker 2: over that creek and into you know, a green that

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Speaker 2: suddenly is not as receptive because the launch, you know,

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Speaker 2: the angle it's coming in is different. Like you want variety,

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Speaker 2: and if you put the home run with the long

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Speaker 2: drive and the long drive leading to just you know,

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Speaker 2: having a wedge in and spinning it back, that's not

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Speaker 2: as interesting as I think for nerds around the sport.

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Speaker 2: And I would equate this with baseball too, like all

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Speaker 2: the stuff that I was talking about earlier, the stuff

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Speaker 2: that's actually action that's not involved in a home run.

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Speaker 2: It's very very similar to Okay, I just hit a

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Speaker 2: three hundred and thirty four yard drive and now I

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Speaker 2: have a wedge in and that's an easy birdy.

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Speaker 1: And I think the thing about it is just like

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Speaker 1: homer's right, Homers, like what we're talking about, homers are

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Speaker 1: are more interesting when they're a little bit more of

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Speaker 1: a feat. Right. An eagle on a par five is

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Speaker 1: way way more compelling, way more exciting when it is

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Speaker 1: more of a feat. When there's less eagles of like

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Speaker 1: scored on a hole, that eagle is more exciting and interesting,

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Speaker 1: just the same same way a birdie on a on

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Speaker 1: a tough part part four, par three is is more

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Speaker 1: interesting than a you know, a birdie on a par

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Speaker 1: three that's giving them away like you know, free candy. Right,

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Speaker 1: those birdies, those become more significant, more relevant. So back

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Speaker 1: to the baseball stuff, you know, before these changes were made,

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Speaker 1: what were the complaints that kind of were bubbling within

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Speaker 1: within the game before anything was done.

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Speaker 2: So I think, you know, if you go to the

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Speaker 2: velocity and the imbalance between the pitcher and the hitter,

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Speaker 2: that that people couldn't really identify that necessarily. But the

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Speaker 2: root of all evil here was velocity. But that built

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Speaker 2: a longer game, and worse than the length of the

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Speaker 2: game was the amount of inaction in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the game when a pitcher could take as much time

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Speaker 2: as he wanted to take deep breaths to walk off

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Speaker 2: the back of the mound to get the rosen ban

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Speaker 2: bag and dry his hand. He's gathering strength again to

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Speaker 2: throw another ninety nine mile an hour fastball to a

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Speaker 2: hitter who might say, you know what, Actually, I'm not

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Speaker 2: feeling it right now. I'm going to step out. So

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Speaker 2: what they've done with this pitch clock, which is fifteen

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Speaker 2: seconds between pitches on a normal scenario, is the brilliant

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Speaker 2: part about it is they have eliminated nothing that you

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Speaker 2: wanted to see in the first place. They have only

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Speaker 2: cut fat from the game. And it's visceral. You can

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Speaker 2: feel it when you're watching a game on TV or

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Speaker 2: you're at a game. The ball is going back to

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Speaker 2: the pitcher and he is reporting to the rubber and

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Speaker 2: he's getting himself set and the hitter has to be

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Speaker 2: in there at seven seconds on the clock or it's

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Speaker 2: a violation against him. And they're doing it again and

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Speaker 2: the result I mean. I asked Major League Baseball to

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Speaker 2: send me this morning the updated numbers through yesterday, through

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Speaker 2: twenty eight days of the season. Last year, games were

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Speaker 2: three hours and five minutes long. On average, they settled

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Speaker 2: at three hours and four minutes over the course of

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Speaker 2: the entire season. Through twenty eight days of this season,

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Speaker 2: they're two hours and thirty six minutes long. That is

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Speaker 2: twenty eight minutes a game shorter, essentially a half an

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Speaker 2: hour on average shorter. Take that over the course of

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Speaker 2: the season, and that's eighty hours of only fat that

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Speaker 2: you have cut out of baseball. And you may have

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Speaker 2: East Coast kids who can turn on their team at

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Speaker 2: seven and watch them until nine thirty and still get

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Speaker 2: to bed at an hour when they're not bleary eyed

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Speaker 2: in the morning. It's just it's a fundamental, fundamental change

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Speaker 2: to not just the length of the game, but the

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Speaker 2: pace of the game.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that it's it's it's so important, right obviously,

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Speaker 1: Like it is, like you said things that nobody wanted

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Speaker 1: to watch, right, Like you can maybe make an argument

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Speaker 1: that the time builds tension. That could be one thing

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Speaker 1: you could make an argument, but like, is it noticeably

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Speaker 1: different between fifteen seconds and a minute or two minutes?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, you talk about building the tension. Like I remember,

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Speaker 2: and this was years ago. I would say it was

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Speaker 2: two thousand and six or two thousand and seven, I

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Speaker 2: was primarily a baseball I was a baseball report and

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Speaker 2: in the postseason, you know, these games were the Red

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Speaker 2: Sox were taught to like take as many pitches as

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Speaker 2: you can follow them back, like have these incredibly long

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Speaker 2: at bats. And I remember doing a story on that

432
00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 2: at that time and talking to a television producer, you

433
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:21,639
Speaker 2: know who produced the games for Fox or ESPN or

434
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,159
Speaker 2: whoever it was at the time, saying, we have to

435
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 2: have this whole dance where okay, here's the picture, here's

436
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:32,640
Speaker 2: the hitter, now it's the manager, here's a nervous fan.

437
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 2: Now we're back to the picture. And you're what do

438
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,000
Speaker 2: you do? You know, yes, there's drama in doing that,

439
00:25:39,440 --> 00:25:42,840
Speaker 2: but there's no action. And if you repeat that kind

440
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 2: of scenario, you know, a hundred times a night, that's

441
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:51,399
Speaker 2: just that's rough, and that is it's not it's not action.

442
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:54,119
Speaker 2: And I think if you you know, with golf, the

443
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:57,160
Speaker 2: good thing about a golf telecast is you can move

444
00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:59,560
Speaker 2: away from it. Either's one hundred and forty four players

445
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:02,879
Speaker 2: or a hundred fifty six players or whatever, obviously not

446
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:04,679
Speaker 2: all out there at the same time, but half that

447
00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 2: out there at roughly the same time, you've got choices

448
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:10,360
Speaker 2: and you don't have to cut out or you don't

449
00:26:10,359 --> 00:26:13,320
Speaker 2: have to just sit there and watch the waiting. But

450
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 2: there's no question that it impacts the play the experience

451
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,640
Speaker 2: of anybody on site watching it when you're when you're

452
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:25,200
Speaker 2: walking around for a five hour round where you're watching

453
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 2: Patrick Cantley, you know, or yeah, right, no, it matters.

454
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:33,719
Speaker 2: It totally matters.

455
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 1: Well, I think, like the thing with golf telecast that

456
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,000
Speaker 1: I noticed is that the problem you know, and this

457
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:43,679
Speaker 1: is where the pitch clock's brilliant, right, and like the

458
00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:48,520
Speaker 1: problem with the with the golf telecast is that they

459
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,080
Speaker 1: have they go to pre shot routine and they have

460
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,480
Speaker 1: no clue when that pre shot routine is going to

461
00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:57,520
Speaker 1: be over right, so you might be with the player

462
00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:00,840
Speaker 1: for you see it. Sometimes where they're on a player,

463
00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:03,919
Speaker 1: they cut away from the player and come back to

464
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:07,040
Speaker 1: the player. Sometimes they stay on the player and it's

465
00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:10,080
Speaker 1: like we're watching this for ninety seconds. If all of

466
00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: a sudden they had a finite amount of time, you know,

467
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,520
Speaker 1: and I know that we can talk about implementation. I

468
00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 1: want to talk about this a little bit later, but

469
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:21,159
Speaker 1: if they have a finite amount of time, all of

470
00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:23,800
Speaker 1: a sudden, it cures one of like golf fans who

471
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:27,560
Speaker 1: watch on TV's biggest issues with the sport show the

472
00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 1: more shots. Right, if you know when players are hitting

473
00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:34,000
Speaker 1: and where it is in the in the shot clock,

474
00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:36,879
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, you can go to them like

475
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: you have like you have markers. It makes covering the

476
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 1: sport from a telecast standpoint way easier, as I imagine

477
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: baseball like baseball does different shots. You know, announcers like

478
00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,199
Speaker 1: one of the things I admire so much, and I

479
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:55,480
Speaker 1: think golf needs more of the baseball announcer, Like you know,

480
00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:59,240
Speaker 1: I'll never forget like Pat Hughes on radio telecast and

481
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 1: Chicago talking about like where baseball's were made, like in

482
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:07,000
Speaker 1: the dead time, like it's spanning like two innings, I'm

483
00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,040
Speaker 1: talking about the process of making a baseball Like I

484
00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:12,040
Speaker 1: don't know why that memory sticks in my head for

485
00:28:12,080 --> 00:28:16,040
Speaker 1: fifteen minutes. But like now I've imagined the sport's probably

486
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:19,040
Speaker 1: a lot easier to telecast, like the announcers have to

487
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 1: be like way more locked in.

488
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:25,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I do think you're right about the golf telecasts,

489
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:29,119
Speaker 2: Like you know, those producers are super super talented, and

490
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,840
Speaker 2: I think like, for the most part, I really enjoy

491
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,399
Speaker 2: golf telecasts, even though I agree with you that you

492
00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 2: know that the main complaint is show more shots. But

493
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:43,800
Speaker 2: if you if you have a hard clock on a

494
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 2: guy and you don't have to make if you're a producer,

495
00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 2: you don't have to make that choice of oh my god,

496
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 2: when is this guy going to pull the trigger? You

497
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:52,720
Speaker 2: know when the trigger is going to be pulled. You've

498
00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 2: got your screens up here and you know what's going

499
00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 2: on elsewhere. It's a lot I'd never been in that role.

500
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 2: I have to imagine would be a lot easier to

501
00:29:01,680 --> 00:29:05,280
Speaker 2: plan and have the end result be over the course

502
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 2: of X hours we've seen why more golf shots like that?

503
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,600
Speaker 2: That would be very, very meaningful to the to the

504
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 2: television product for sure.

505
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:31,720
Speaker 1: Now for a quick break from our sponsor, Club Champion.

506
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507
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509
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510
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511
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Speaker 1: you're going to buy a car, you're test driving a

512
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Speaker 1: bunch of cars So with Club Champion, what I love

513
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514
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Speaker 1: bunch of different shafts, a bunch of different club heads,

515
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Speaker 1: and you get to find what's best for you. I've

516
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Speaker 1: been going to them forever really, from you know, the

517
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Speaker 1: beginning of my golf life. I've been using Club Champion,

518
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Speaker 1: Like I started using them when I was in high school.

519
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520
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521
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Speaker 1: I love the I love their brand and what they do.

522
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Speaker 1: I love the idea of trying a bunch of clubs

523
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524
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Speaker 1: makes the most sense go into it. You know, you

525
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Speaker 1: can have your preferences on on what manufacturer you might like,

526
00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 1: but I think that at the end of the day,

527
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 1: you know what you want to do, and what everybody's

528
00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:42,680
Speaker 1: trying to do is get the best performance out of

529
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:47,480
Speaker 1: the game. As as many listeners probably know, I've been uh,

530
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 1: you know, I've been playing kind of a retro set

531
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 1: uh for the last year. But the big news, and

532
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:56,960
Speaker 1: reason one of the reasons is Mike, all my clubs broke.

533
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Speaker 1: Big news. I scheduled my club Champion fitting. I'm it's

534
00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 1: in the books. I'm gonna go get some new sticks.

535
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 1: I can't wait. I'm ready to having played the seventieth

536
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:09,880
Speaker 1: Bladze for a while, I'm just ready for some modern forgiveness.

537
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 1: I'm ready if I if I catch it a little

538
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:14,560
Speaker 1: off the toe for it not to be automatically ten

539
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 1: yards short. So looking forward to that and can't wait. So,

540
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 1: if you're looking for some new clubs some increased performance,

541
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546
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547
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Speaker 1: a club fitting with a club purchase. So go to

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549
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Speaker 1: for partnering with us and supporting the podcast. Now back

550
00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: to Barry. So, you know, as we we've gotten into

551
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 1: the weeds, you know this hasn't gone as as planned,

552
00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 1: but I kind of want to keep moving this conversation

553
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,240
Speaker 1: along because we could we could talk about this for hours,

554
00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 1: I think. But so to sum up kind of baseball

555
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:15,479
Speaker 1: in a state, you know, people had felt like some

556
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 1: of the intricacy of the game had been lost. The

557
00:32:18,320 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: game had fundamentally changed, you know, in the sense of

558
00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: what skills were recorded, rewarded and thrived. And maybe not

559
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:30,800
Speaker 1: everybody agreed for the better. I imagine that there were

560
00:32:30,880 --> 00:32:33,440
Speaker 1: some that said the game is better and healthier, and

561
00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 1: I want to get into some of that. And the

562
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 1: games were getting longer and longer. It was taking longer

563
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:42,960
Speaker 1: to play than ever really before. Would you say that

564
00:32:43,040 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 1: sums up kind of the main thesis of what was

565
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:48,480
Speaker 1: going on in baseball.

566
00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, if you want to distill it down

567
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:55,760
Speaker 2: to maybe one sentence or one catchphrase, it was a

568
00:32:55,760 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 2: lot more time for a lot less action. So I mean,

569
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:02,600
Speaker 2: you take we can if you want to get really

570
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 2: into the weeds, like batting average is not a really

571
00:33:04,520 --> 00:33:09,520
Speaker 2: good way to evaluate an individual player, but league batting

572
00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 2: average is. You know, what does an average major league

573
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 2: hitter hit is a way to tell how much action

574
00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,120
Speaker 2: there is in the game, and that had dipped down

575
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 2: last year. Two I'm going to get the number not

576
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:26,440
Speaker 2: exactly right, but to around two forty like in in

577
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 2: when I was growing up in the eighties, a two

578
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 2: forty hitter was like, you better be a really good

579
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 2: defender to stay in the in the lineup because you're

580
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:37,080
Speaker 2: not doing your pulling your weight offensively. When that's the

581
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 2: average hitter across the league, that tells you that the

582
00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 2: ball's not in play enough, there's not enough enough action.

583
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:47,120
Speaker 2: And then you couple that with okay, all that action

584
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,560
Speaker 2: is spread out over three hours rather than contained to

585
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 2: two and a half. That was a major, major impetus

586
00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:55,160
Speaker 2: for the rule changes. And one of the things you

587
00:33:55,160 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 2: didn't mention in rule changes that is important as well

588
00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 2: is they've limited pickoff attempts for when you're throwing for

589
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:04,959
Speaker 2: a pitcher throwing to a base, you can do it

590
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 2: twice the third time. Uh, it's it's a buck if

591
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:12,120
Speaker 2: you don't get them that. That, along with the larger bases,

592
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:16,920
Speaker 2: has stolen base attempts up and when you when you

593
00:34:17,520 --> 00:34:20,239
Speaker 2: Major League Baseball did a survey I think it was

594
00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:23,440
Speaker 2: two or three years ago that they didn't widely publicize,

595
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 2: but they asked fans, what are your more most exciting

596
00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 2: were the plays you get most excited about? Stolen base

597
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:34,640
Speaker 2: attempts was up there. Great defensive plays was up there,

598
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 2: the triple was up there. I'm probably forgetting something, but

599
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:40,680
Speaker 2: it was not. It was not the home run. It

600
00:34:40,760 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 2: was these things that involve athleticism, anticipation, that kind of

601
00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:53,680
Speaker 2: excitement they've started to instill. We don't know the full

602
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: summer play out of Like is batting average going to

603
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,200
Speaker 2: rise over the course of the summer. It hasn't changed,

604
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:00,960
Speaker 2: you know, Guys still throw one hundred and they still

605
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,320
Speaker 2: use a lot of relievers all that kind of stuff,

606
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 2: but they've they've started to get at least the running

607
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 2: game going again, and that matters. It totally matters in

608
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:15,360
Speaker 2: your enjoyment of a specific play, a specific inning, a

609
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 2: specific game.

610
00:35:16,880 --> 00:35:19,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, let's say would be said with golf,

611
00:35:19,239 --> 00:35:21,960
Speaker 1: with with law everybody, you know, what's the most exciting

612
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 1: shot in golf? What are the most memorable shots in golf?

613
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,960
Speaker 1: They're usually chip shots or approach shots. You know, Yeah,

614
00:35:28,000 --> 00:35:30,279
Speaker 1: there's a coup, there's a handful of drives, and those

615
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:33,080
Speaker 1: are like when you drive a green, you know, and

616
00:35:33,400 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 1: you know that if you you know, like, but for

617
00:35:35,640 --> 00:35:38,320
Speaker 1: the most part, the predominant shot that you think about,

618
00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:40,920
Speaker 1: like if you remember iconic shots. A lot of them

619
00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: are approach shots or chip shots. So how did how

620
00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:49,520
Speaker 1: did this the rules changes get started? And like what

621
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:52,759
Speaker 1: was like the kind of undercurrent of this whole, this

622
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,440
Speaker 1: big change that happened this year. And I think to

623
00:35:55,480 --> 00:35:58,000
Speaker 1: your point about the rules changes, like you're not going

624
00:35:58,080 --> 00:36:01,600
Speaker 1: to see the big impact of these rules changes at

625
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 1: baseball until you can zoom out from like five or

626
00:36:04,280 --> 00:36:06,799
Speaker 1: ten years and see where the game goes, because it

627
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:10,560
Speaker 1: takes a while for you know, strategies and different things

628
00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:12,640
Speaker 1: to change personnel too.

629
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:18,320
Speaker 2: Right, Well, I mean, I think it's also again probably

630
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 2: similar to the discussions going in golf if you have

631
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 2: a slower product in a you know, being played to

632
00:36:26,880 --> 00:36:30,200
Speaker 2: generations that are used to rapid fire in whatever they want,

633
00:36:30,239 --> 00:36:33,320
Speaker 2: you know, whether it's social media or texting or whatever.

634
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 2: Kids are not sitting on the couch being like Okay,

635
00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:41,240
Speaker 2: I'm going to see one pitch every ninety seconds or whatever.

636
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:43,879
Speaker 2: Like that's not compelling in any way. So you're you're

637
00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:47,160
Speaker 2: you're dealing with a sport that has an aging fan

638
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:50,200
Speaker 2: base to begin with. You have to find a way

639
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:55,879
Speaker 2: to replenish the fans on the young end and get

640
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,359
Speaker 2: that demographic and have a future for the sport and

641
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:01,719
Speaker 2: have it be something that even resembled the national past time.

642
00:37:01,800 --> 00:37:04,880
Speaker 2: I mean, I think it baseball has seated that spot

643
00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 2: a long time ago, but it just wasn't sustainable down

644
00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:13,200
Speaker 2: the path that it was going. And it took smart

645
00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:16,760
Speaker 2: people at Major League Baseball and with the players Union

646
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 2: to say we got to do something here. So when

647
00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 2: I think we both admires theo Epstein, who was a

648
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 2: formal general manager with the Red Sox and the Cobs,

649
00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 2: he became a point person for MLB on thinking through

650
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:37,040
Speaker 2: these problems and saying, Okay, what what can we do

651
00:37:37,200 --> 00:37:41,479
Speaker 2: here to restore some of the balance between pitcher and hitter,

652
00:37:42,040 --> 00:37:45,480
Speaker 2: to instill more action into the game so that it's

653
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:48,440
Speaker 2: moving at a faster pace and there's more exciting stuff

654
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,560
Speaker 2: to watch. And you come up with a pretty interesting

655
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,800
Speaker 2: package that they you know, they were able to test

656
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:57,319
Speaker 2: in the in the minors. And I remember hearing the

657
00:37:57,360 --> 00:37:59,920
Speaker 2: first data points when the pitchclock was used in a

658
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:04,319
Speaker 2: couple of minor league leagues a couple of years ago,

659
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:08,399
Speaker 2: where they were saying, oh, the game time is down

660
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 2: to two twenty eight here whatever, I'm picking a number.

661
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,080
Speaker 2: The game time's down to two and a half hours

662
00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:15,680
Speaker 2: in this league is single a league in California that

663
00:38:15,719 --> 00:38:19,400
Speaker 2: we tried it, It's just made this huge difference. I

664
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:24,359
Speaker 2: was like, that can't possibly be true. Like, if that's true,

665
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:27,360
Speaker 2: why aren't we doing it right now? And it's after

666
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:31,800
Speaker 2: less than a month of the pitchclock being in the majors.

667
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,759
Speaker 2: I mean, I think it'll be mid season before the

668
00:38:36,040 --> 00:38:41,040
Speaker 2: wide percentage of the fan base is saying isn't saying

669
00:38:41,400 --> 00:38:44,279
Speaker 2: what's up with this pitchclock? They're saying, how did we

670
00:38:44,400 --> 00:38:47,720
Speaker 2: not have a pitch clock for the last twenty years?

671
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:51,759
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean, you know, I haven't been excited for

672
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:54,160
Speaker 1: a baseball season for a while. And part of that,

673
00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:57,320
Speaker 1: you know, my Cubs are we might be on the

674
00:38:57,440 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 1: up and up, but it's been a rough a couple

675
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 1: of years. But I mean, like I was with my

676
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,399
Speaker 1: Dad's a huge baseball man, and I was with him

677
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 1: on spring break right before you know, uh, the season started,

678
00:39:11,040 --> 00:39:14,200
Speaker 1: and like we were like talking baseball and how like

679
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:16,840
Speaker 1: how excited? You know? And it was opening day and

680
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 1: I had I turned baseball on. I was like, I

681
00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:22,759
Speaker 1: couldn't wait to watch baseball, you know, because of this clock.

682
00:39:22,800 --> 00:39:25,160
Speaker 1: I wanted to see what was going on? And I

683
00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:28,719
Speaker 1: think like the thing that golf and baseball share here

684
00:39:28,880 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 1: is like you talked about the pace, this younger generation pace,

685
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,800
Speaker 1: Like what do you do if you know NBA playoffs

686
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 1: are on right now? When when a game goes to commercial,

687
00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:41,479
Speaker 1: what's what's your first inclination if you're sitting on the couch,

688
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:42,120
Speaker 1: what do you do?

689
00:39:42,880 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 2: You go and get a drink, you go to the bathroom,

690
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 2: I don't know.

691
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 1: I mean you look at your phone, you do something, or.

692
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,400
Speaker 2: You click to something else, Like your attention is distracted.

693
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 1: Right, So it's just the same thing with golf. It's

694
00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 1: like if you have ninety seconds between a pitch or

695
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,360
Speaker 1: ninety seconds between a shot, it's extremely likely that somebody's

696
00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 1: not gonna watch shot because they're going to get distracted

697
00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:06,200
Speaker 1: and do something else, right, And that's the idea, is

698
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:09,560
Speaker 1: giving people a clock to measure against. Like, Okay, I

699
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:13,680
Speaker 1: know I have to pay attention. Here is a fascinating

700
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:16,840
Speaker 1: it just like it makes sense and like what you said,

701
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:19,600
Speaker 1: like you get into it, you get into the miners

702
00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:21,840
Speaker 1: what they're doing it, and it's like, why why haven't

703
00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 1: we been doing this? What were the main detractors to

704
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:29,120
Speaker 1: these rules changes, saying and like, who who did they represent?

705
00:40:29,600 --> 00:40:33,319
Speaker 2: Well? I mean, I think you know people who romanticize

706
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:36,280
Speaker 2: about baseball, and I think that the two most romanticized

707
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:40,600
Speaker 2: sports from people within them are golf and baseball. People

708
00:40:40,719 --> 00:40:44,960
Speaker 2: they there are people in my job as sports writers

709
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:48,279
Speaker 2: who I think in both of these sports almost see

710
00:40:48,320 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 2: themselves as protectors and promoters of the game. No, we don't.

711
00:40:52,400 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 2: We've never had a clock in baseball. Baseball's beauty is

712
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,120
Speaker 2: in fact that it is untimed, and you'll be stripping

713
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:05,279
Speaker 2: away a fundamental element of the game. Now, was that

714
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:09,759
Speaker 2: over romanticized and was it outdated because of what has

715
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:13,520
Speaker 2: happened and the way pitchers and hitters were manipulating the

716
00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:16,759
Speaker 2: fact that they were not timed. Yeah, I would argue absolutely.

717
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:19,800
Speaker 2: And you're not in either of these sports. Are you

718
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 2: going to please everybody if you make changes? I mean

719
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:28,000
Speaker 2: it's there's that debate with the ball in golf as well, right, Like,

720
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:31,560
Speaker 2: you know, are we would if the ball is real? Back?

721
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 2: Are we stripping these guys of you know, these more

722
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:39,520
Speaker 2: athletic players of something that they've worked hard to attain.

723
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:41,960
Speaker 2: We can you know, that's a totally different path that

724
00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:45,239
Speaker 2: I know, you guys talk about a lot, but there

725
00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:49,960
Speaker 2: are in any of it. There are people who would say,

726
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:54,880
Speaker 2: it's the sport is going to evolve. We should allow

727
00:41:54,920 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 2: it to evolve naturally, not by putting artificial implement that's

728
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,080
Speaker 2: in that say, okay, now we have a structure that

729
00:42:02,120 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 2: we've never had before. And I would argue that the

730
00:42:05,160 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 2: one change that they did that I think more people

731
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:13,640
Speaker 2: are queasy about than even the pitch clock is the

732
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 2: banning of shifts, because the argument would be, there's never

733
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 2: been assigned defensive positions by rule other than the pitcher

734
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:27,839
Speaker 2: has to stand on the rubber and the catcher has

735
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 2: to be in the catcher's box. The other seven guys

736
00:42:29,840 --> 00:42:31,560
Speaker 2: could all stand in left field if they thought that

737
00:42:31,640 --> 00:42:32,320
Speaker 2: was the most.

738
00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:36,240
Speaker 1: Effect, not have a catcher. It would be a bad idea,

739
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:37,279
Speaker 1: But you like.

740
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,880
Speaker 2: That would be bad, right. But the point is, I

741
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:44,200
Speaker 2: think the thing that people are uneasy about there is

742
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:47,680
Speaker 2: no have the offense. Part of this evolution should be

743
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 2: can't be offense? Figure out how to beat three infielders

744
00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 2: to the right side of second base, that kind of thing.

745
00:42:55,719 --> 00:43:00,200
Speaker 2: So I get that debate, but as a package has

746
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:05,200
Speaker 2: had to happen because the sport was killing itself essentially

747
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 2: by what it had become.

748
00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean baseball's undergone ball deadening too, right, yeap,

749
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: I mean did now that question? This is I didn't

750
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:18,440
Speaker 1: plan on asking this question. But do you feel like

751
00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:23,680
Speaker 1: that when they deadened the ball, that athletic, powerful baseball

752
00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 1: players were had things stripped away from them?

753
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:30,319
Speaker 2: No? No, no, no. And and in fact, you know,

754
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 2: you go back to something you said very originally like

755
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,400
Speaker 2: homers are more interesting when they're less prevalent, right, Like,

756
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:37,919
Speaker 2: so if it took more to hit a homer, then

757
00:43:38,080 --> 00:43:43,160
Speaker 2: then that's fine. The other thing about the you know, athleticism.

758
00:43:43,719 --> 00:43:48,759
Speaker 2: One thing that shifting did, uh, was minimize athleticism. Because

759
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 2: if if you've got three guys to the right of

760
00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:53,399
Speaker 2: second base and there's a hard ground ball over there,

761
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 2: you know, Ryan Sandberg doesn't have to die for it

762
00:43:56,280 --> 00:43:59,760
Speaker 2: because he's got somebody playing behind him in short right field.

763
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:04,279
Speaker 2: You're like, okay, we've got this covered. There's less exciting

764
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:08,160
Speaker 2: defensive plays. I mean, again, theof seen in a conversation

765
00:44:08,239 --> 00:44:10,160
Speaker 2: I had with him probably a couple of years ago. Now,

766
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:17,200
Speaker 2: put it this way, we have better athletes than we've

767
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:22,040
Speaker 2: ever had playing this sport and we are limiting the

768
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:25,719
Speaker 2: ways that they can show their athleticism. So you know,

769
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:29,680
Speaker 2: the same could be said, uh. I think for for golf,

770
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:35,760
Speaker 2: you want things to be rare. Rare means exciting.

771
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:39,319
Speaker 1: Well, how did players feel about it? Like, what was

772
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:43,239
Speaker 1: there the general discourse with players? Obviously they don't have

773
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,839
Speaker 1: as uh I would say, outside of an influence as

774
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:50,840
Speaker 1: UH as golfers do, where they they are the owners

775
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:53,719
Speaker 1: of the sport and the UH and the players, right

776
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:56,719
Speaker 1: there is a little bit different setup. But what was

777
00:44:56,800 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 1: the what was the general feeling of players?

778
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:05,799
Speaker 2: Well, I mean there was you know, some pushback and

779
00:45:05,880 --> 00:45:11,319
Speaker 2: some reluctance because it's hard for players. I mean, one

780
00:45:11,360 --> 00:45:16,239
Speaker 2: way that baseball players are similar to golfers is in

781
00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 2: a way they're all their individual corporations. Right. Yes, they're

782
00:45:19,200 --> 00:45:21,320
Speaker 2: a member of a team and the team's success matters

783
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:23,960
Speaker 2: and that's part of their legacy. But in a in

784
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:27,799
Speaker 2: a vacuum, in a selfish way, their job, over the

785
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:31,359
Speaker 2: course of their very finance career is to earn as

786
00:45:31,440 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 2: much as they can, and so part of that is

787
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,640
Speaker 2: like what is my routine, what is my routine in

788
00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:40,399
Speaker 2: leading into a game, and what was my routine in

789
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:45,560
Speaker 2: that game very analogous to golf, Like your pre shot

790
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:48,520
Speaker 2: routine is really important to you. My pre pitch routine

791
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 2: before I throw a pitch is very important to me.

792
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:56,239
Speaker 2: If you're fundamentally changing that, I might I might be

793
00:45:56,400 --> 00:46:00,640
Speaker 2: really reluctant. I would give. And I think the gives

794
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 2: players an enormous amount of credit for not complaining left

795
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:10,879
Speaker 2: and right. You have there been individual instances where you know,

796
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,880
Speaker 2: how can how can that be? Like I get this penalty,

797
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:18,479
Speaker 2: you know, a ball four when I was fractionally late

798
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 2: on something. Yes, and there will be those going going forward.

799
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:25,759
Speaker 2: But in general, because they had an entire spring to

800
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:28,040
Speaker 2: get used to it, and spring training in baseball is

801
00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:33,920
Speaker 2: essentially seven weeks, the buy in has been tremendous. And

802
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:38,319
Speaker 2: even guys joke about like, well, you know, it's kind

803
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:40,600
Speaker 2: of nice being home at nine forty five and not

804
00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:44,600
Speaker 2: ten forty five after a night game. There are they

805
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:48,040
Speaker 2: I think they can see that they haven't been so

806
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:53,200
Speaker 2: disturbed in their pre pitch or pre shot routine that

807
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 2: it's fundamentally affecting how they do their jobs. And there

808
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 2: are ancillary benefits like they have more time with their

809
00:46:59,200 --> 00:46:59,880
Speaker 2: kids or whatever.

810
00:47:00,160 --> 00:47:03,880
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, you're talking eighty hours of like not

811
00:47:04,239 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 1: competing is extraordinarily that's like very relevant. Well and in

812
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 1: terms of like how you're gonna feel and mentally in

813
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:20,000
Speaker 1: the body, Like the mental aspect of being on field

814
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:24,760
Speaker 1: for thirty extra minutes is extreme. Like anybody that's played

815
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:28,880
Speaker 1: competitive golf, like you, you feel a difference when you

816
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:32,000
Speaker 1: get off the course when it's a five hour competitive

817
00:47:32,080 --> 00:47:35,000
Speaker 1: round versus a four and a half hour competitive round,

818
00:47:35,200 --> 00:47:37,799
Speaker 1: like that stuff. And if you do it, you know,

819
00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:40,800
Speaker 1: four days in a row, just like baseball, Just like golf,

820
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 1: like if you have four games in a row, two

821
00:47:44,600 --> 00:47:49,239
Speaker 1: extra hours of that intense focus, like you know, both

822
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 1: of them, I think people would say are not like

823
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:54,120
Speaker 1: the most physically grueling sports. Sure do you need to

824
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,759
Speaker 1: be physically tuned to play them, but like they are

825
00:47:56,800 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 1: not like basketball or tennis, where you're just like holy cow,

826
00:48:00,440 --> 00:48:04,240
Speaker 1: like I can't believe the endurance, you know, but they

827
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,000
Speaker 1: they they have a mental aspect of them that those

828
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:11,080
Speaker 1: other sports might not carry as much in terms of

829
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:16,200
Speaker 1: like the just the anguish in the amount of focus

830
00:48:16,239 --> 00:48:17,960
Speaker 1: that's required in short bursts.

831
00:48:18,120 --> 00:48:21,719
Speaker 2: So I also think that that so there's the totality

832
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:24,000
Speaker 2: of what you're talking about, like the extra half hour

833
00:48:24,480 --> 00:48:26,359
Speaker 2: adding on to an extra half hour the next night,

834
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:28,640
Speaker 2: adding on to an extra half hour in the third

835
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:33,160
Speaker 2: game of the series or whatever. But there's also the

836
00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:38,880
Speaker 2: possibility and probability of losing focus in between pitches, like, Oh,

837
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:41,799
Speaker 2: I'm oh, it's going to be you know, seventy five

838
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 2: seconds before this guy's what I'm looking in the stands.

839
00:48:44,239 --> 00:48:49,680
Speaker 2: I'm like, that's a real thing. You see, Guys have

840
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:54,200
Speaker 2: to be more engaged on every pitch because every pitch

841
00:48:54,239 --> 00:48:58,759
Speaker 2: is coming more quickly. I think that there's a and

842
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:01,000
Speaker 2: this is probably down a rabbit hole. But there's a

843
00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:06,040
Speaker 2: sports psychology element to all of this that plays to

844
00:49:06,120 --> 00:49:12,759
Speaker 2: both golf and baseball, where you know an individual players

845
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:17,360
Speaker 2: in either sports, sports psychologists is saying you control what

846
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:21,359
Speaker 2: you can control, and what you can control is your

847
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:25,120
Speaker 2: preparation for not only that day, but for each and

848
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:30,279
Speaker 2: every event within that day. That I think, it's inarguable,

849
00:49:30,440 --> 00:49:35,040
Speaker 2: has contributed to slow play in either of those sports.

850
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:37,880
Speaker 2: Because I'm the pitcher, I'm in control. I'm not going

851
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:40,600
Speaker 2: to do this until i'm ready. I'm a golfer, I'm

852
00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,760
Speaker 2: not going to stand over this ball until i'm very

853
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:45,879
Speaker 2: clear in how I'm visualizing this shot. I've sorted out

854
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:48,200
Speaker 2: all the variables and now I'm in control of my

855
00:49:48,960 --> 00:49:55,440
Speaker 2: swing that contributes to longer processes period across the board

856
00:49:55,480 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 2: whatever you're trying to execute.

857
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:01,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, I completely agree with this in I think that's

858
00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:04,920
Speaker 1: like one of the failings up until nowt of baseball

859
00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 1: and golf is not rewarding the skill of somebody who's

860
00:50:10,200 --> 00:50:14,400
Speaker 1: able to a process information quickly and able to be

861
00:50:15,160 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 1: get themselves mentally ready to hit a shot or throw

862
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:22,400
Speaker 1: a pitch or taken a bat in a short amount

863
00:50:22,440 --> 00:50:24,920
Speaker 1: of time. That is a talent and a skill and

864
00:50:24,960 --> 00:50:27,880
Speaker 1: one that should be rewarded because that's a huge differentiator

865
00:50:28,000 --> 00:50:32,239
Speaker 1: right mentally being that player. I always use this comparison.

866
00:50:32,320 --> 00:50:36,480
Speaker 1: I saw KVV Kevin Bev Balkenberg use this as in

867
00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:39,759
Speaker 1: an article he wrote about slow play on No Laying

868
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 1: Up dot com. But the idea of like what made

869
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:49,759
Speaker 1: Tom Brady the greatest quarterback of all time was his

870
00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:55,239
Speaker 1: ability to process a defense in a split second, be

871
00:50:55,360 --> 00:50:59,759
Speaker 1: able to read a defense, understand his progressions, and throw

872
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 1: the pass faster. You know, there's a load of people

873
00:51:03,560 --> 00:51:07,920
Speaker 1: who had more physical traits for physical attributes like every year, Like,

874
00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,560
Speaker 1: what's the big discourse this year with the NFL draft

875
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:14,239
Speaker 1: this this week this weekend is can Anthony Richardson? Like?

876
00:51:14,400 --> 00:51:17,480
Speaker 1: Is he he has these physical traits? But can he

877
00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:20,480
Speaker 1: go through the progressions? Can he run an offense? Can

878
00:51:20,480 --> 00:51:23,359
Speaker 1: he handle the new Like when you remove all the time,

879
00:51:23,400 --> 00:51:27,560
Speaker 1: if you remove the pass rush and the need to

880
00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:30,560
Speaker 1: throw the ball and go through these progressions quickly, all

881
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:32,600
Speaker 1: of a sudden, Tom Brady might not have been the

882
00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:36,720
Speaker 1: greatest quarterback of all time. That is important in sports.

883
00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:39,319
Speaker 1: That's the same thing with why is Lebron great? Like

884
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:42,080
Speaker 1: Lebron like you watch him at age? What is he

885
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:45,160
Speaker 1: thirty nine or thirty eight now? And you watch him

886
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:48,239
Speaker 1: like just like they just get into the exact thing

887
00:51:48,320 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 1: they want all the time, and he just hunts and

888
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:54,200
Speaker 1: picks apart defenses. It's not quite as prevalent as it

889
00:51:54,280 --> 00:51:56,759
Speaker 1: used to be, but his ability to just and it's

890
00:51:56,800 --> 00:51:59,479
Speaker 1: in a twenty four second shot clock. That's what makes

891
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:03,360
Speaker 1: NBA offense so incredible is the finite amount of time

892
00:52:03,680 --> 00:52:06,360
Speaker 1: that they have to run the offense. How much different

893
00:52:06,360 --> 00:52:08,320
Speaker 1: would the NBA look if there was no time?

894
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,160
Speaker 2: You know, well, you'd have a four corners offense which

895
00:52:11,160 --> 00:52:12,520
Speaker 2: you used to have, like, Okay, we have an eight

896
00:52:12,560 --> 00:52:15,120
Speaker 2: point lead with ten minutes left, Like why in the

897
00:52:15,120 --> 00:52:17,719
Speaker 2: world would we shoot, Like we don't have to. I mean, so,

898
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:22,160
Speaker 2: just to bring it back to golf real quickly, competitive

899
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:28,239
Speaker 2: decisiveness and decision making in a specified amount of time

900
00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:32,320
Speaker 2: should be rewarded. At the Masters this year, on Sunday

901
00:52:33,920 --> 00:52:38,959
Speaker 2: walk in the final group, rom and Kopka Brooks hits

902
00:52:38,960 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 2: his drive at a way left into the trees. I'm

903
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:46,880
Speaker 2: almost positive this, yeah, And so I was probably with

904
00:52:47,000 --> 00:52:51,360
Speaker 2: KVB standing there on the left side of the fairway

905
00:52:51,880 --> 00:52:55,919
Speaker 2: and he's got this evaluation to make and he's gonna

906
00:52:55,920 --> 00:52:57,879
Speaker 2: have to punch back out right. It's a birdie hole.

907
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:01,839
Speaker 2: This is a disastrous things ramist and to turn the momentum.

908
00:53:02,360 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 2: And I just remember he got in there, he looked

909
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 2: at it, he talked to his caddy, he went through

910
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:11,000
Speaker 2: the thing, and I'm, you know, up ahead a little

911
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:14,080
Speaker 2: bit but trying to keep an eye into the trees,

912
00:53:14,320 --> 00:53:16,120
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, the ball's coming out, and

913
00:53:16,160 --> 00:53:20,000
Speaker 2: I was like, oh my goodness. Like he went in there,

914
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:23,040
Speaker 2: he evaluated all the information that he needed to evaluate,

915
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:25,920
Speaker 2: and he made a decision and he whacked it out

916
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:27,319
Speaker 2: and it was a good like you know, whatever he

917
00:53:27,360 --> 00:53:32,040
Speaker 2: made par I think, but it why, you know, we

918
00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:33,880
Speaker 2: can I'm not gonna list the players who would have

919
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 2: gone in there and spent ten minutes, but it's a

920
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:38,040
Speaker 2: longer list that would have gone in there and then

921
00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:41,680
Speaker 2: spent you know, seventy five seconds and it and it

922
00:53:42,000 --> 00:53:46,280
Speaker 2: moved the game. It was it was I just remember

923
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,400
Speaker 2: being struck by Wow. No one does things that fast

924
00:53:48,400 --> 00:53:50,799
Speaker 2: that that should be, that should be more the norm

925
00:53:51,360 --> 00:53:52,560
Speaker 2: than than the opposite.

926
00:53:53,080 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 1: A couple of years ago, I you know, when Bryson

927
00:53:55,520 --> 00:53:57,960
Speaker 1: was being accused of slow play. I went to the

928
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:00,960
Speaker 1: US Open in a time I spent like a Friday

929
00:54:01,360 --> 00:54:05,120
Speaker 1: timing every every player in the group for nine holes

930
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:08,720
Speaker 1: and it was him, JT, Kevin Kissinger, and Kevin Kissinger

931
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:11,400
Speaker 1: was incredible. I mean, like, you know, kind of in

932
00:54:11,440 --> 00:54:13,920
Speaker 1: the vein of Matt Fitzpatrick where he was just ready

933
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:17,279
Speaker 1: to hit after you know, if he was the second

934
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:19,719
Speaker 1: player to hit, he was hitting in like twelve seconds.

935
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:22,560
Speaker 1: You know, Bryson was always and he's done a great

936
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 1: job of speeding up. I think that you know, you

937
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:27,040
Speaker 1: have to give him props. He has sped up his

938
00:54:27,160 --> 00:54:29,759
Speaker 1: pace of play from this moment, but he was he

939
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:32,040
Speaker 1: was taking one and a half two minutes to hit

940
00:54:32,080 --> 00:54:36,040
Speaker 1: a shot every every time. But what I noticed, everybody's

941
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:40,400
Speaker 1: slow at the green. And that's perhaps where skill is

942
00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:44,160
Speaker 1: most would be most rewarded of, Like I can read

943
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:47,640
Speaker 1: a green quickly and be confident and stand over a shot.

944
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 1: And if you think about where golf like, you know

945
00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,719
Speaker 1: what happened with the Masters to go back to this,

946
00:54:52,800 --> 00:54:55,440
Speaker 1: and I think this is where it really started to bubble.

947
00:54:55,520 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 1: This discourse is bubbled and blown up to where you know,

948
00:54:59,200 --> 00:55:01,359
Speaker 1: we're getting to p point where I don't think, like

949
00:55:01,440 --> 00:55:04,360
Speaker 1: golf like people are going to stand for this for

950
00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:07,560
Speaker 1: much longer with how you know, like something has to

951
00:55:07,640 --> 00:55:12,560
Speaker 1: happen eventually because you know, Brooks and Rom are putting

952
00:55:12,920 --> 00:55:15,680
Speaker 1: on they're getting to the green. I saw like John

953
00:55:15,760 --> 00:55:19,719
Speaker 1: Rom's caddy was visually upset on the fifteenth green about

954
00:55:19,800 --> 00:55:22,719
Speaker 1: Patrick Cantley and Victor Hovelin and to can't lay in

955
00:55:22,760 --> 00:55:27,239
Speaker 1: Hovelin's credit like they were waiting on fifteen. Yes, you

956
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:30,719
Speaker 1: know this, this this was a This wasn't just a

957
00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:34,920
Speaker 1: Patrick cantlay problem. Is he a slow player? Absolutely, But

958
00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:39,399
Speaker 1: there are probably one hundred slow players on the PGA Tour.

959
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:44,200
Speaker 1: So anyways, he goes to the green at like, uh, Rom,

960
00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:47,080
Speaker 1: they're on the fifteenth green. Those guys are walking to

961
00:55:47,120 --> 00:55:51,319
Speaker 1: the sixteenth green. They're on the sixteenth green and they're

962
00:55:51,360 --> 00:55:55,680
Speaker 1: still putting on the fifteenth green. They finished putting. Rom

963
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:58,400
Speaker 1: obviously has opened up this lead at this point. Kepkaz

964
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:01,520
Speaker 1: like looks just like flabbergast when he's on the sixteenth tee.

965
00:56:01,560 --> 00:56:03,879
Speaker 1: They walk to the sixteenth te not a close walk,

966
00:56:04,120 --> 00:56:07,839
Speaker 1: I mean it's forty fifty yards. They get there, Rob

967
00:56:07,920 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 1: goes to the bathroom, comes back. Patrick Cantley, who's out

968
00:56:11,280 --> 00:56:15,520
Speaker 1: still has not hit his putt. Yes, and that's just

969
00:56:16,280 --> 00:56:17,120
Speaker 1: that can't happen.

970
00:56:17,320 --> 00:56:20,000
Speaker 2: It can't happen. It can't happen. And if you take

971
00:56:20,360 --> 00:56:24,239
Speaker 2: I mean, I think this debate in golf can be

972
00:56:24,320 --> 00:56:28,319
Speaker 2: applied at all levels, like the we've both played with

973
00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:34,360
Speaker 2: people who watch whoever else is in the group do

974
00:56:34,520 --> 00:56:37,640
Speaker 2: whatever they're doing with their shot, and then they begin

975
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:40,440
Speaker 2: their preparation for their shot. Okay, what's my yard? Like

976
00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:44,720
Speaker 2: just stop it stop get ready, like, don't that's happening

977
00:56:44,719 --> 00:56:48,240
Speaker 2: over there, don't worry about it. Yeah, I love playing

978
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:51,120
Speaker 2: with the regular people that I play with, who I know.

979
00:56:51,880 --> 00:56:56,960
Speaker 2: If they're having a problem an issue, they're they're solving

980
00:56:57,000 --> 00:56:58,960
Speaker 2: it quickly and not worried about where I'm on the

981
00:56:59,040 --> 00:57:01,759
Speaker 2: left side of the fairway. We're all your look across, Okay,

982
00:57:01,760 --> 00:57:04,520
Speaker 2: he's not ready, I'm playing right now. Why can't Why

983
00:57:04,520 --> 00:57:08,240
Speaker 2: can't that be the flow of a professional round of golf?

984
00:57:08,280 --> 00:57:10,480
Speaker 2: And that's from t to green? Whatever is it hard

985
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 2: to read a pot? And like should they take some time?

986
00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:15,440
Speaker 2: You don't want to have guys just like getting up

987
00:57:15,480 --> 00:57:17,960
Speaker 2: there and doing stuff they're not prepared for, because that

988
00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 2: wouldn't bring out the best performance. But it's it is

989
00:57:22,560 --> 00:57:25,080
Speaker 2: out of control. And the example that you you used

990
00:57:25,080 --> 00:57:26,280
Speaker 2: at fifteen and sixteen is a.

991
00:57:26,200 --> 00:57:30,000
Speaker 1: Good one in your in you're just having watched this

992
00:57:30,440 --> 00:57:34,960
Speaker 1: baseball and play out and covering golf. You know, what

993
00:57:35,000 --> 00:57:37,680
Speaker 1: would you like to see golf do? What do you

994
00:57:37,680 --> 00:57:40,280
Speaker 1: you know? Obviously they have the distance thing is on

995
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:43,160
Speaker 1: the table. It looks like it's gonna happen at some

996
00:57:43,800 --> 00:57:48,080
Speaker 1: you know events, which obviously will relieve pace of play.

997
00:57:48,720 --> 00:57:52,240
Speaker 1: If less guys can get home into they're less driveable

998
00:57:52,280 --> 00:57:56,040
Speaker 1: part fours that will relieve pace of play. But you

999
00:57:56,040 --> 00:57:58,880
Speaker 1: know what, what else do you think the baseball should

1000
00:57:58,880 --> 00:57:59,440
Speaker 1: be looking at.

1001
00:58:00,080 --> 00:58:03,600
Speaker 2: That's a really interesting question because I'm still kind of

1002
00:58:03,640 --> 00:58:10,400
Speaker 2: processing the first month of pretty unprecedented. I mean, you

1003
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:13,280
Speaker 2: have to go back to nineteen sixty eight when they

1004
00:58:14,440 --> 00:58:17,120
Speaker 2: lowered I'm sorry, sixty nine, after the year the pitcher.

1005
00:58:17,120 --> 00:58:21,000
Speaker 2: In sixty eight they made a uniformly lower mound because

1006
00:58:21,040 --> 00:58:23,480
Speaker 2: pitchers had too great an advantage and there was less

1007
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:27,760
Speaker 2: action in the game. There's so much to digest with

1008
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:31,880
Speaker 2: what's happened over you know, only the first twenty eight

1009
00:58:31,960 --> 00:58:36,200
Speaker 2: days of the season that what next steps might be

1010
00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 2: are a little bit hard to envision. They are trying

1011
00:58:41,600 --> 00:58:46,920
Speaker 2: in an independent league something called the double hook rule,

1012
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:52,360
Speaker 2: which would incentifize teams to leave their starters in longer.

1013
00:58:52,720 --> 00:58:55,440
Speaker 2: The idea is, if you pull your starter before he's

1014
00:58:55,480 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 2: completed five innings, you lose the designated hitter and the

1015
00:58:59,720 --> 00:59:02,360
Speaker 2: pitch has to hit in that that's the pitcher spot.

1016
00:59:03,320 --> 00:59:05,400
Speaker 1: So that would be amazing.

1017
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:08,080
Speaker 2: It's really interesting. Way to get back to that thing

1018
00:59:08,080 --> 00:59:09,680
Speaker 2: I was talking about at the very beginning of what's

1019
00:59:09,680 --> 00:59:12,240
Speaker 2: the narrative of any day of baseball is like, Okay,

1020
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:14,880
Speaker 2: who's pitching? If that person's not going to be you know,

1021
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:17,840
Speaker 2: there's this whole idea of the Tampa Bay Rays and

1022
00:59:17,840 --> 00:59:22,400
Speaker 2: other teams using openers, essentially starting a pitcher who's they

1023
00:59:22,440 --> 00:59:24,840
Speaker 2: know is only going to pitch two innings and building

1024
00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:28,160
Speaker 2: a game plan of guys that are only going to

1025
00:59:28,200 --> 00:59:30,800
Speaker 2: pitch one or one or two innings. That takes away

1026
00:59:30,800 --> 00:59:35,960
Speaker 2: that starting pitcher narrative completely. Maybe that double hook rule

1027
00:59:36,080 --> 00:59:39,800
Speaker 2: is the next thing that you you stick in there

1028
00:59:39,840 --> 00:59:43,200
Speaker 2: to Again, you're not trying to do to get to

1029
00:59:43,240 --> 00:59:46,080
Speaker 2: the game to a place that it's never been before.

1030
00:59:46,120 --> 00:59:49,960
Speaker 2: You're actually trying to restore it to how it always

1031
00:59:50,120 --> 00:59:54,400
Speaker 2: was played. I mean, if you Tom Boswell, who had

1032
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:57,720
Speaker 2: my job at the Washington Post for ever and ever

1033
00:59:57,760 --> 01:00:02,960
Speaker 2: and ever and covered baseball and go as well. He's retired,

1034
01:00:02,960 --> 01:00:05,040
Speaker 2: but he wrote a column going into this baseball season

1035
01:00:06,600 --> 01:00:10,600
Speaker 2: after having watched spring training games saying, essentially, this isn't new.

1036
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:15,040
Speaker 2: The pitch clock isn't making the game something we haven't

1037
01:00:15,040 --> 01:00:17,360
Speaker 2: seen before. It's actually restoring it to the way it

1038
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:21,040
Speaker 2: was played forty and fifty years ago, which is refreshing

1039
01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:24,360
Speaker 2: and which I think would be perfect for golf, because

1040
01:00:24,840 --> 01:00:27,680
Speaker 2: you know, Jack Nicholas didn't stand over a shot for

1041
01:00:28,600 --> 01:00:32,760
Speaker 2: ninety seconds or two minutes. He evaluated, stepped up and

1042
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:35,120
Speaker 2: executed it to the best of visibility in that in

1043
01:00:35,120 --> 01:00:36,920
Speaker 2: that moment. That should be rewarded somehow.

1044
01:00:37,560 --> 01:00:39,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think something that you just hit on

1045
01:00:39,840 --> 01:00:46,160
Speaker 1: is all these all these leagues, with the exception of golf.

1046
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:51,160
Speaker 1: I mean, the NBA is constantly experimenting in it's like

1047
01:00:51,400 --> 01:00:54,800
Speaker 1: lower level leagues, you know they are, and the idea

1048
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:58,840
Speaker 1: that MLB is now in this era of experimentation. You know,

1049
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:04,360
Speaker 1: the NFL changed his rules regularly. The only sport that's

1050
01:01:04,440 --> 01:01:07,520
Speaker 1: just like kind of just no, we're not doing anything.

1051
01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:10,040
Speaker 1: We aren't going to try and evolve at this point,

1052
01:01:10,320 --> 01:01:14,000
Speaker 1: you know, and any any of the only evolution that

1053
01:01:14,120 --> 01:01:17,880
Speaker 1: has been introduced has been met with sharp, you know,

1054
01:01:18,400 --> 01:01:21,160
Speaker 1: detractors criticism is golf.

1055
01:01:22,280 --> 01:01:25,560
Speaker 2: And I think when you strip away, I mean, I

1056
01:01:25,560 --> 01:01:27,880
Speaker 2: talked earlier about the protectors of the game in both

1057
01:01:27,920 --> 01:01:31,120
Speaker 2: baseball and golf, and I feel like, for whatever reason

1058
01:01:31,440 --> 01:01:35,760
Speaker 2: those sports have, they have such a reverence for their history,

1059
01:01:35,880 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 2: right like in baseball even more than golf, the numbers

1060
01:01:39,080 --> 01:01:42,680
Speaker 2: of their history and anything that could alter what sixty

1061
01:01:42,680 --> 01:01:46,919
Speaker 2: one homers by Roger Marris meant in nineteen sixty one

1062
01:01:47,520 --> 01:01:50,080
Speaker 2: or any of those, you know, the career home run

1063
01:01:50,160 --> 01:01:53,440
Speaker 2: mark that you debate, like, is Hank Aaron still the

1064
01:01:53,480 --> 01:01:57,080
Speaker 2: all time greatest because Bonds was on steroids. Blah blah blah.

1065
01:01:57,240 --> 01:02:02,800
Speaker 2: Anything that threatens that kind of sanctity of that history

1066
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 2: is seen as evil. I do think if there's a

1067
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:11,160
Speaker 2: relationship between the two sports and the problems that they

1068
01:02:11,200 --> 01:02:16,280
Speaker 2: have with an aging audience and an audience that, you know,

1069
01:02:16,720 --> 01:02:20,040
Speaker 2: a younger audience that wants to see more and more action,

1070
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:25,600
Speaker 2: is baseball has now stripped away some of that reverence

1071
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:28,680
Speaker 2: for this is the way that we've always done things.

1072
01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:32,640
Speaker 2: Therefore we will always do them going forward. Golf might

1073
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:35,280
Speaker 2: want to look over there and say, Okay, they had

1074
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:40,440
Speaker 2: a similar They honored their history and valued their history

1075
01:02:40,480 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 2: in a similar way. They've done some pretty radical things,

1076
01:02:44,200 --> 01:02:49,120
Speaker 2: and they that radical stuff involved buy in from all parties,

1077
01:02:49,480 --> 01:02:52,000
Speaker 2: reluctant by in in some cases, but people that have

1078
01:02:52,040 --> 01:02:55,640
Speaker 2: come around and understand it, couldn't we do the same

1079
01:02:55,880 --> 01:02:59,560
Speaker 2: in the name of saving our sport, not just at

1080
01:02:59,560 --> 01:03:03,040
Speaker 2: the profession level, but at the recreational level and getting

1081
01:03:03,120 --> 01:03:06,200
Speaker 2: more people involved, because you know, we all make those

1082
01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:08,479
Speaker 2: evaluations when we're gonna go play golf. Am I gonna

1083
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:11,120
Speaker 2: play on a Saturday morning when I know it's going

1084
01:03:11,200 --> 01:03:13,200
Speaker 2: to kill you know, I'm not going to be home

1085
01:03:13,280 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 2: until two or three because this round is going to

1086
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:18,440
Speaker 2: take five hours. Like that's a real life evaluation that

1087
01:03:18,520 --> 01:03:21,720
Speaker 2: has nothing to do with whether TV producers watching Patrick

1088
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:24,000
Speaker 2: Cantlay stand over a ball for two minutes, like, but

1089
01:03:24,040 --> 01:03:25,800
Speaker 2: they're related.

1090
01:03:25,280 --> 01:03:29,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean absolutely, it's uh. I think one of

1091
01:03:29,240 --> 01:03:32,200
Speaker 1: the things like that's interesting about golf is I think

1092
01:03:32,240 --> 01:03:34,560
Speaker 1: the people that hold the most reverence for the history

1093
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:37,040
Speaker 1: of the game are the ones that want to change

1094
01:03:37,120 --> 01:03:37,520
Speaker 1: the most.

1095
01:03:38,120 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 2: That could be true, I mean it, and you think

1096
01:03:40,040 --> 01:03:45,600
Speaker 2: about it, like because whatever, like Jack Nicholas and Gary

1097
01:03:45,600 --> 01:03:47,400
Speaker 2: Player and Arnold Palmer when he was alive and now

1098
01:03:47,480 --> 01:03:51,480
Speaker 2: Tom Watson. They do the honorary shot thing at the Masters,

1099
01:03:51,480 --> 01:03:53,600
Speaker 2: and they come in for a press conference like early

1100
01:03:53,640 --> 01:03:57,480
Speaker 2: that Thursday morning, and of course they're they're asked state

1101
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 2: of the game questions because their their opinion matters. If

1102
01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:05,800
Speaker 2: you go back to the thirteenth hole, you know they're

1103
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:08,960
Speaker 2: talking about, well, we're evaluating whether to hit four iron

1104
01:04:09,000 --> 01:04:11,680
Speaker 2: into that green. We would like these guys to have

1105
01:04:11,800 --> 01:04:16,800
Speaker 2: that same evaluation. It's you know, eagling it with eight

1106
01:04:16,840 --> 01:04:19,720
Speaker 2: iron in your hand is not the same. So you're right,

1107
01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:26,360
Speaker 2: like the historical figures are hyper aware that the challenge

1108
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:29,320
Speaker 2: is not the same that they faced both on a

1109
01:04:29,520 --> 01:04:31,880
Speaker 2: day to day basis and a shot by shot basis.

1110
01:04:32,360 --> 01:04:36,000
Speaker 2: Restoring that would be would be good for everybody.

1111
01:04:36,000 --> 01:04:40,320
Speaker 1: I think last question and we'll get you out of here.

1112
01:04:40,440 --> 01:04:42,680
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for the time. But do you

1113
01:04:42,720 --> 01:04:46,240
Speaker 1: think a pitch clock or a shot clock is feasible

1114
01:04:46,600 --> 01:04:47,120
Speaker 1: for golf?

1115
01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:51,120
Speaker 2: I think you have to you. Instead of phrasing it

1116
01:04:51,160 --> 01:04:54,400
Speaker 2: that way, I think it should be phrased why is

1117
01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:58,360
Speaker 2: it not feasible? Like why can we not be aggressive

1118
01:04:59,040 --> 01:05:03,480
Speaker 2: in a address identifying and addressing a problem that is

1119
01:05:03,520 --> 01:05:07,280
Speaker 2: affecting the game from the top level to the entry level,

1120
01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:12,560
Speaker 2: and that includes players who young players who are really

1121
01:05:12,600 --> 01:05:14,760
Speaker 2: into golf. If you're lucky enough to have hooked somebody

1122
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:18,640
Speaker 2: on the sport and they're watching a round of golf

1123
01:05:18,720 --> 01:05:21,800
Speaker 2: and they see player A, B, and C on TV

1124
01:05:23,080 --> 01:05:25,800
Speaker 2: taking all this time, evaluating all these things and not

1125
01:05:26,000 --> 01:05:28,200
Speaker 2: stepping up there and decisively hitting a shot, what are

1126
01:05:28,200 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 2: they going to do? You mimic? You know, if you're

1127
01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:34,240
Speaker 2: a left handed hitter as a kid, you're mimicking Ken

1128
01:05:34,280 --> 01:05:38,320
Speaker 2: Griffy's stance, right like you you learn from your heroes.

1129
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:43,080
Speaker 2: If you're learning that taking however much time you want

1130
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:48,080
Speaker 2: is rewarded or not penalized, then there's the train has left.

1131
01:05:48,080 --> 01:05:52,360
Speaker 2: It's it's it's impossible to stop. I think golf should

1132
01:05:52,360 --> 01:05:56,120
Speaker 2: be asking the question, we know we have this problem,

1133
01:05:56,920 --> 01:06:01,040
Speaker 2: we have to take steps to reel it in. For

1134
01:06:01,320 --> 01:06:03,760
Speaker 2: you know, we have to figure out logistically what does

1135
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:06,920
Speaker 2: a shot clock mean? How do we penalize people? How

1136
01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:10,040
Speaker 2: do we implement it? Rather than saying well, it's so

1137
01:06:10,160 --> 01:06:11,840
Speaker 2: it would be so hard, I think you got to

1138
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:13,080
Speaker 2: get more aggressive about it.

1139
01:06:13,720 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you if you're worried about solving a problem

1140
01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:20,040
Speaker 1: and the solution being too hard, is you're thinking about

1141
01:06:20,040 --> 01:06:22,800
Speaker 1: it completely the wrong way. And I think, like you know,

1142
01:06:23,040 --> 01:06:28,320
Speaker 1: important anecdote to what you said, you know, the distance debate.

1143
01:06:28,440 --> 01:06:31,520
Speaker 1: A lot of what's fueled some of the something needs

1144
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:35,280
Speaker 1: to change is looking at college golf and seeing, wow,

1145
01:06:35,400 --> 01:06:38,560
Speaker 1: these kids are longer than the PGA tour, Like this

1146
01:06:38,680 --> 01:06:40,880
Speaker 1: is a problem that is going to continue. You hear

1147
01:06:40,920 --> 01:06:43,360
Speaker 1: Mike Wan talk about this, right, you know, it is

1148
01:06:43,480 --> 01:06:46,120
Speaker 1: just going to keep becoming a bigger problem because the

1149
01:06:46,240 --> 01:06:48,880
Speaker 1: kids are longer and longer. The same thing for pace

1150
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:51,160
Speaker 1: to play. If you go to a college event, it

1151
01:06:51,240 --> 01:06:53,200
Speaker 1: is so slow. If you go to a junior event,

1152
01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:57,680
Speaker 1: so slow. And it is just become going to continue

1153
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:01,080
Speaker 1: to become a bigger problem with the sport because it

1154
01:07:01,160 --> 01:07:04,360
Speaker 1: is a self perpetuating problem, and.

1155
01:07:04,240 --> 01:07:10,000
Speaker 2: You're you're in there, somewhere in there, you're stifling creativity

1156
01:07:10,320 --> 01:07:17,120
Speaker 2: and individuality because you're creating these robotic you know, go

1157
01:07:17,200 --> 01:07:21,280
Speaker 2: back to baseball. If you're fetishizing velocity in baseball, it's

1158
01:07:21,320 --> 01:07:26,000
Speaker 2: the same thing as fetishizing length in golf. It takes

1159
01:07:26,240 --> 01:07:31,000
Speaker 2: some you know, finesse. Pitchers are not They don't get

1160
01:07:31,040 --> 01:07:34,960
Speaker 2: a Jamie Moyer doesn't get a shot anymore. Greg Maddox,

1161
01:07:35,280 --> 01:07:38,520
Speaker 2: you know who I'm sure you loved. I mean, does

1162
01:07:38,520 --> 01:07:41,040
Speaker 2: he not get a shot? He's not valued the same way.

1163
01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:42,240
Speaker 2: He doesn't get the chance to.

1164
01:07:42,520 --> 01:07:45,960
Speaker 1: What about Mark Burley, Yeah, exactly, the best best player

1165
01:07:45,960 --> 01:07:48,640
Speaker 1: a lot. When you saw Mark Burley is on the mound,

1166
01:07:48,680 --> 01:07:50,600
Speaker 1: You're just like, ah, this is awesome. It's gonna be

1167
01:07:50,600 --> 01:07:51,520
Speaker 1: like a two hour game.

1168
01:07:51,640 --> 01:07:53,800
Speaker 2: Hour and fifty five minutes and he's gonna allow three

1169
01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,560
Speaker 2: hits and this is gonna be awesome. There's there's fun

1170
01:07:56,680 --> 01:08:00,440
Speaker 2: in that, and there's creativity and individuality, and it's not

1171
01:08:00,600 --> 01:08:05,040
Speaker 2: just you know, some six' five broad shouldered kid from

1172
01:08:05,120 --> 01:08:08,080
Speaker 2: the prairie who's thrown ninety nine with a ninety two

1173
01:08:08,160 --> 01:08:10,600
Speaker 2: mile an hour slider that dives at the bottom of the.

1174
01:08:10,680 --> 01:08:14,640
Speaker 2: Zone it's the same thing As, okay everybody hits a three. Forty,

1175
01:08:14,680 --> 01:08:20,000
Speaker 2: now you, know there's not as much individuality and, creativity

1176
01:08:20,000 --> 01:08:23,800
Speaker 2: and the characters are are less distinct when everybody does

1177
01:08:23,840 --> 01:08:26,760
Speaker 2: the same, thing and the skills are our level across the.

1178
01:08:26,760 --> 01:08:30,000
Speaker 1: Board all, Right, barry thank you so much for coming.

1179
01:08:30,040 --> 01:08:32,920
Speaker 1: On that was. GREAT i you, KNOW i thought this

1180
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:36,600
Speaker 1: might be a fun conversation and it exceeded WHAT i was.

1181
01:08:36,640 --> 01:08:40,880
Speaker 1: Hoping you people can find You you're you're right at

1182
01:08:40,920 --> 01:08:44,439
Speaker 1: The Washington. Post it's a publication a few people may

1183
01:08:44,439 --> 01:08:47,960
Speaker 1: have heard. Of you also have written a few books about,

1184
01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:54,320
Speaker 1: Baseball The, Grind Inside Baseball's Endless season And National, Pastime sports,

1185
01:08:54,320 --> 01:08:57,519
Speaker 1: politics and the return of baseball To, WASHINGTON. Dc so

1186
01:08:57,960 --> 01:09:01,040
Speaker 1: people can find you On twitter and find your writing

1187
01:09:01,560 --> 01:09:04,439
Speaker 1: at very very many.

1188
01:09:04,560 --> 01:09:07,559
Speaker 2: OUTLETS i appreciate you, Plugging, matt and thanks for handing

1189
01:09:07,760 --> 01:09:09,040
Speaker 2: having Me. Andy it was a fun.

1190
01:09:09,080 --> 01:09:11,439
Speaker 1: Conversation, Yeah i'll see you see you at THE Us.

1191
01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:13,880
Speaker 2: Open yeah sounds. Good all, right.

1192
01:09:23,800 --> 01:09:26,679
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to another edition of The Friday.

1193
01:09:26,840 --> 01:09:31,080
Speaker 1: Podcast today's episode was edited By Matt. Rushes thank, You.

1194
01:09:31,320 --> 01:09:33,920
Speaker 1: Matt we are gonna be on the. Road we got

1195
01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:37,680
Speaker 1: a ton of stuff going on this. Weekend but as

1196
01:09:37,720 --> 01:09:41,040
Speaker 1: a quick, reminder we're humming in In CLUB. Tf we've

1197
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 1: had a lot of great content, recently great photography AND

1198
01:09:46,720 --> 01:09:49,360
Speaker 1: i think some words that match up with. It our

1199
01:09:49,720 --> 01:09:53,719
Speaker 1: most recent course profiles have been kind OF i think standout.

1200
01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:56,599
Speaker 1: Once we've done a hoopy Match Club Chicago Golf Club

1201
01:09:57,280 --> 01:10:00,599
Speaker 1: belvedere was the most recent. One we've got some new

1202
01:10:00,640 --> 01:10:05,160
Speaker 1: ones coming in every. Week we now HAVE i think

1203
01:10:05,280 --> 01:10:08,640
Speaker 1: twenty in, total almost Twenty may eighteen or eighteen or

1204
01:10:08,720 --> 01:10:12,519
Speaker 1: nineteen in. Total so go check it. Out obviously you

1205
01:10:12,560 --> 01:10:15,200
Speaker 1: get access to the whole back catalog if you haven't.

1206
01:10:15,280 --> 01:10:19,200
Speaker 1: Joined it is thefridagg dot com slash. Membership you can

1207
01:10:19,240 --> 01:10:22,320
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Speaker 1: twenty dollars a year and it really helps us continue

1209
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Speaker 1: to produce great. Content this is the best way you

1210
01:10:28,760 --> 01:10:32,719
Speaker 1: can Support Frida. Egg thank you and we'll be back

1211
01:10:32,800 --> 01:10:34,280
Speaker 1: next week with a couple. Episodes