Speaker 1: Welcome to Haunted Road, a production of I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: and Grim and Mild from Aaron Minky listener Discretion is advised.
Speaker 1: Years ago, I investigated a home in Massachusetts that was
Speaker 1: plagued with unexplained paranormal activity. The family was waking with
Speaker 1: scratches on them, They were seeing shadows in the home,
Speaker 1: and even experiencing strange lights moving through the house while
Speaker 1: they tried to sleep. Despite my best attempts, my research
Speaker 1: came up empty again and again. I couldn't find any
Speaker 1: history attached to the home that would cause unexplained phenomena.
Speaker 1: No deaths, nothing on the land before it, no tragedies nearby.
Speaker 1: Except one day I did have a breakthrough. Imagine being
Speaker 1: told that the house you built and put your blood, sweat,
Speaker 1: tears and savings into was being ordered immediately vacated, not
Speaker 1: just your house, but your entire neighborhood, churches, stores, schools,
Speaker 1: that the government was ordering you out under the law
Speaker 1: of eminent domain, and there was nothing you could do
Speaker 1: about it. Some become desperate an attempt to move their homes.
Speaker 1: Some dismantle them and take the wood elsewhere to hopefully rebuild.
Speaker 1: Others simply take them easily stipend offered by the authorities
Speaker 1: and leave everything they've known. Then the water comes slowly
Speaker 1: at first, but soon all you knew is now at
Speaker 1: the bottom of a lake, quiet eerie, a monument to
Speaker 1: entire lives completely displaced, all for a dam. That house
Speaker 1: that was haunted was built from wood taken from piles
Speaker 1: of dismantled homes that had been taken apart prior to
Speaker 1: a local dam being built. That would, to me, carried
Speaker 1: the energy and weight of entire lives up ended without
Speaker 1: any choice otherwise, that would contained memories of family's weddings, births, deaths, holidays, birthdays,
Speaker 1: you name it. When we started asking about the damn,
Speaker 1: the E V P s came quickly, water submerged, help change.
Speaker 1: I've long speculated that the energy of the wood caused
Speaker 1: the activity in that home, which takes us to today's haunt.
Speaker 1: An entire damn that never quite got it right, and
Speaker 1: its history begins with the words dark and bloody. Join
Speaker 1: me as we take a very literal deep dive into
Speaker 1: the rapids of the Tennessee River and visit Hale's bar Damn.
Speaker 1: I'm Amy Brunei, and this is Haunted Road. Hale's Bar
Speaker 1: damn had the odds stacked against it from day one
Speaker 1: and honestly probably shouldn't have ever been built. The carst
Speaker 1: formations in the area of Hal's Bar form a fractured
Speaker 1: cavernous system on and below the riverbed. Hale's Bar Dam
Speaker 1: was built on a faulty foundation. On the very day
Speaker 1: after Hale's Bar Dam filled its reservoir, engineers noticed water
Speaker 1: bubbling downstream of the dam. The dam was leaking due
Speaker 1: to the fractured bedrock. Before and during the arrival of
Speaker 1: white settlers in the Tennessee area, the land was used
Speaker 1: by the Cherokee people. This has resulted in one of
Speaker 1: the most consistently repeated motifs in the story of Hale's
Speaker 1: Bar Dam, the alleged curse of Chief Dragon Canoe. In
Speaker 1: seventy according to historical accounts, a Native American warrior, Dragon Canoe,
Speaker 1: upset that his tribe was trading hunting grounds to European
Speaker 1: settlers and what is now Kentucky and Tennessee, angrily warned
Speaker 1: that this land would be arc and bloody. The warning
Speaker 1: was apt, as the region featured an especially hazardous section
Speaker 1: of the river below Chattanooga that included the area known
Speaker 1: as the Narrows or the Tennessee River Gorge. As westward
Speaker 1: settlement continued, there were many accounts of the dangers associated
Speaker 1: with the Narrows, whirlpools, and shoals with colorful names such
Speaker 1: as the boiling pot, the suck, the skillet, and the
Speaker 1: frying pan. According to historian Sherry Teal, this illegal land
Speaker 1: deal between Richard Henderson and some of the Overhill Cherokee
Speaker 1: chiefs occurred near present day Wataga, Tennessee. In March sevent
Speaker 1: Dragon Canoe opposed the deal, and his reported words loom
Speaker 1: heavy in historical accounts of the event. Henderson and Daniel
Speaker 1: Boone visited Dragon Canoes father to show the Cherokee peace
Speaker 1: chief and others the goods that they would receive in
Speaker 1: the deal. This means that Richard Henderson traveled more than
Speaker 1: one hundred fifty miles over the Appalachian Mountains from North
Speaker 1: Carolina into the Overhill Cherokee territory during the winter to
Speaker 1: show goods to these chiefs. Why they wanted to strike
Speaker 1: when the iron was hot, or more precisely, while the
Speaker 1: winter was brutal and draining prior to the killing frost
Speaker 1: There had been a historic three year drought. The effects
Speaker 1: of the frost and drought upon the Cherokee would have
Speaker 1: lessened their resources during the winter, or at the very
Speaker 1: least strained them. It is probably not a coincidence, then,
Speaker 1: that Boone and Henderson visited the Cherokee during a lean winter,
Speaker 1: perhaps speculating that the pressure for Cherokee leaders to agree
Speaker 1: to a deal would have been strong. However, the story
Speaker 1: claims that Dragon Canoe was furious he refused to accept
Speaker 1: the treaty and spoke a curse on the ground he
Speaker 1: had fought for this idea that a mystical curse and
Speaker 1: not the threat of pushback from a skilled war chief,
Speaker 1: plagued the land and river, and manifested during the construction
Speaker 1: of the hales Bar Dam. It was constructed on the
Speaker 1: same stretch of the Tennessee River that his strategic strongholds sat.
Speaker 1: More than a century before. Contemporary to Dragon Canoe, the
Speaker 1: waterway was referred to as the Suck by French explorers,
Speaker 1: but amongst the Cherokee people it was believed to be
Speaker 1: the home of uk Tina, the Great Horde serpent, who
Speaker 1: lived in the rivers of the Cherokee homelands and controlled
Speaker 1: the currents of rivers, creating whirlpools and other deadly river hazards.
Speaker 1: So what is the suck. The fast moving currents of
Speaker 1: Suck Creek flow from the north and its waters empty
Speaker 1: into the slower westward moving current of the Tennessee River.
Speaker 1: The faster creek waters caused lower pressure to be near
Speaker 1: to the mouth of the creek. This causes the water
Speaker 1: to whip around the low pressure, forming the whirlpool called
Speaker 1: the Suck or uk Tina. Before the Tennessee Valley Authority
Speaker 1: dam projects of the early twentieth century, the Suck would
Speaker 1: have been formidable, and it is still present today as
Speaker 1: a water navigational hazard for vessels on the Tennessee River.
Speaker 1: After colonizers moved in, they began to wonder how they
Speaker 1: could mitigate and perhaps harness the power of the Tennessee River,
Speaker 1: along with Mussel shoals and the Elk River shoals further downstream,
Speaker 1: The Tennessee River gorge had long been one of the
Speaker 1: major impediments to river navigation in the upper Tennessee Valley.
Speaker 1: While various nineteenth century canal projects had minor success in
Speaker 1: extending navigation across the shoals. The Tennessee River Gorge remained
Speaker 1: largely untamed, so enter the dam. This valley of the
Speaker 1: whirlpool rapids had not been tamed by the turn of
Speaker 1: the twentieth century. To improve navigation on this particular hazardous
Speaker 1: expanse and to provide electricity to Chattanooga, government approval was
Speaker 1: given to the Chattanooga and Tennessee River Power Company to
Speaker 1: Old Hales, bar Lock and dam. It has the distinction
Speaker 1: of being the first main river multi purpose dam built
Speaker 1: on the Tennessee River. In eight several Chattanooga business interests
Speaker 1: formed the Tennessee River Improvement Association to lobby for efforts
Speaker 1: to extend year round navigation to Chattanooga, and around nineteen hundred,
Speaker 1: Major Dan C. Kingman of the U. S. Army Corps
Speaker 1: of Engineers, drafted a design for a dam that would
Speaker 1: flood the Tennessee River gorge and remove the swift current
Speaker 1: in various hazards that had long prevented large scale navigation
Speaker 1: through this stretch of river. Congress passed the enabling legislation
Speaker 1: on April nineteen o four, and with funding from Chattanooga
Speaker 1: entrepreneur Charles E. James and new York financier Anthony Brady
Speaker 1: Guild formed the Chattanooga and Tennessee River Power Company to
Speaker 1: oversee the project. The project was estimated to cost three
Speaker 1: million dollars, but by the time the project was finished
Speaker 1: in nineteen thirteen, it costs ten million dollars. So just
Speaker 1: for reference, in one three million dollars would be about
Speaker 1: ninety three million dollars and ten million dollars would be
Speaker 1: about two hundred and eighty three million dollars. Construction began
Speaker 1: in nineteen o five, and it proved to be a
Speaker 1: massive undertaking. The project employed thousands of men, requiring the
Speaker 1: construction of a village to feed and house the workers
Speaker 1: and their families. Because people lived on both sides of
Speaker 1: the damn, a tunnel two and a half feet wide
Speaker 1: and six and a half feet tall was built underneath
Speaker 1: the dam to allow easy access from side to side.
Speaker 1: It was fraught from the get go, and between nineteen
Speaker 1: o five and nineteen ten, four different contractors failed to
Speaker 1: complete the project because of difficult foundation conditions. Another source
Speaker 1: claimed that not one, but two communities were constructed in
Speaker 1: order to house the workforce and their fami Lee's. The
Speaker 1: work required to build such a structure was demanding and dangerous.
Speaker 1: Since thousands of men worked three shifts around the clock
Speaker 1: in wet and muddy conditions without strong safety regulations, it
Speaker 1: is not surprising that there were injuries and fatalities. Nony Webb,
Speaker 1: an expert on Hale's bar, noted that the total number
Speaker 1: cannot be documented, but she has provided examples of the
Speaker 1: types of violent accidents that occurred during construction. A boiler
Speaker 1: explosion to the life of one man, of falling Derek
Speaker 1: crushed out the lives of two others, and one poor
Speaker 1: soul had his foot entangled in a rope and was
Speaker 1: pulled underwater and drowned before he could be saved. Besides
Speaker 1: work fatalities, there were also murders at the camps, along
Speaker 1: with shootings. There was one incident where a gentleman was
Speaker 1: struck across the neck with a heavy bench, killing him instantly.
Speaker 1: The project dragged on and missed at least two deadlines
Speaker 1: by the time it was completed in nineteen thirteen. At
Speaker 1: least one major flood had occurred in nineteen eleven, and
Speaker 1: the finances were about as leakproof as the dam itself.
Speaker 1: When construction was finalized, the hails Bar Dam measured almost
Speaker 1: one half mile across and sixty three feet high. The
Speaker 1: lock at the time was the highest single locklift in
Speaker 1: the world. With the best modern technology utilized, the dam
Speaker 1: still leaked. In fact, a group known as the rag
Speaker 1: Gang was hired to walk around and plug leaks for
Speaker 1: one dollar a day. What the heck is a rag gang.
Speaker 1: Soon after the dam's completion, the leaks began to appear.
Speaker 1: The engineers had chosen the location of the dam because
Speaker 1: the river was narrow, But unknown to them at the
Speaker 1: time was that the ground beneath the river is limestone.
Speaker 1: Portions of the limestone continually collapsed and resettled, shifting the
Speaker 1: dams foundation and causing cracks to form in the dam walls.
Speaker 1: Administrators created a rag gang, which was a group of
Speaker 1: men tasked with stopping the leaks. Supposedly, they used whatever
Speaker 1: they could find to fill the cracks, including asphalts, hay bales, mattresses, blankets,
Speaker 1: and even a truckload of corsets. At one point, surprise,
Speaker 1: it didn't work. In nineteen nineteen, engineers attempted to minimize
Speaker 1: the leakage by pumping hot asphalt into the dam's foundation.
Speaker 1: This was temporarily successful, but by ninety one a study
Speaker 1: showed the dam was leaking at a rate of one
Speaker 1: thousand cubic feet per second. The passing of the t
Speaker 1: v A Act in nineteen thirty three created the Tennessee
Speaker 1: Valley Authority and gave it control a flood control and
Speaker 1: improvement initiatives in the Tennessee Valley. By this time, Chattanooga
Speaker 1: and Tennessee River Power had merged with several other companies
Speaker 1: to form the Tennessee Electric Power Company, or TEPCO. The
Speaker 1: new company was a fierce opponent of the t v
Speaker 1: A and was headed by Guild's son, Joe con Guild.
Speaker 1: TEPCO challenged the constitutionality of the tv A Act and
Speaker 1: federal court, and in nineteen thirty nine, the U. S.
Speaker 1: Supreme Court handed down their decision in favor of the
Speaker 1: t v A. A few months later, TEPCO was forced
Speaker 1: to sell most of their assets, including Hale's Bar Dam,
Speaker 1: to the t v A for seventy eight million dollars. Later,
Speaker 1: t v A efforts to stem the leaks were successful
Speaker 1: in the early nineteen forties, but it was far too little,
Speaker 1: too late. In the late nineteen fifties, boils began to
Speaker 1: appear in the water below hales Bar Dam, and an
Speaker 1: investigation showed the dam was again leaking, this time at
Speaker 1: an alarming two thousand cubic feet per second. Die tests
Speaker 1: carried out in nineteen sixty suggested that many of the
Speaker 1: leak as channels had interconnected, increasing the possibility of a
Speaker 1: future damn failure. Eventually, the cost of maintenance was far
Speaker 1: too much to bear. The t v A couldn't stay
Speaker 1: head of the damn dam Sorry, I had to do
Speaker 1: it at least once. According to a contemporary news article.
Speaker 1: The decision to replace hales Bar with a new dam
Speaker 1: was reached after a detailed review of efforts which had
Speaker 1: been carried on over several weeks to reduce leakage under
Speaker 1: the old dam. The tv A board said so, the
Speaker 1: Nikki Jack Dam was built six miles downstream, and the
Speaker 1: hales Bar Dam ceased operation on December four, nineteen sixty seven. Recently,
Speaker 1: the hales Bar Dam Powerhouse was listed on the National
Speaker 1: Register of Historic Places in two thousand and eight. Since
Speaker 1: the dam was closed, it has been operated as a
Speaker 1: private event space. In addition, tours can be arranged by reservation.
Speaker 1: A marina has been developed next to the site. The
Speaker 1: building is currently being used as the home of Damn
Speaker 1: Whiskey and Moonshine Distillery. Now. In addition to the workplace
Speaker 1: debts I cited earlier, there have been a number of
Speaker 1: drownings around the dam over the years. Another claim I've
Speaker 1: heard repeated many times over the years, but can't find
Speaker 1: anything specific to corroborate, is the idea that there are
Speaker 1: actual bodies in the cement of the dam. According to
Speaker 1: the serf Ski Nation news men lost their lives during
Speaker 1: the building of the dam. Some even fell into the
Speaker 1: cement mixer and were built into the walls of the dam.
Speaker 1: Other accounts are more intense, claiming that up to several
Speaker 1: hundred workers perished during the construction of the hales Bar
Speaker 1: Dam and that they were expected in such a large
Speaker 1: project in those days. That is taken from the website
Speaker 1: of the Paranormal Investigators of Milwaukee, but I don't see
Speaker 1: a source cited for the info. Stephen Waar, a tour
Speaker 1: guide at the dam, has given some of the most
Speaker 1: specific detail about bodies buried inside the dam that I've
Speaker 1: heard so far. According to him, in the tunnel behind
Speaker 1: a few inches of wall. There are apparently two bodies
Speaker 1: that have been stuck there in the concrete since nineteen
Speaker 1: o seven. Guide explained that they were able to use
Speaker 1: some device to detect crevices within the concrete and determined
Speaker 1: that the bodies had decayed and calcified in the limestone mixture,
Speaker 1: and they're apparently holding onto each other still as one
Speaker 1: pulled the other into the concrete behind them. Again, I
Speaker 1: cannot find any new sources to cite these claims, but
Speaker 1: they've been repeated so much I felt the need to
Speaker 1: pass them onto you all. Interestingly, the dam features yet
Speaker 1: another strange and mysterious bit of history. Thanks to the
Speaker 1: building of the dam, water levels upstream rose quite a bit,
Speaker 1: enough to cover an entire cemetery, Mullins Cove. The Mullins
Speaker 1: Cove cemetery has headstones dating back to eight and it's
Speaker 1: speculated it was flooded sometime in the forties. Typically, the
Speaker 1: t v A would move graves elsewhere if this was
Speaker 1: the case, but by the time they took over the
Speaker 1: damage was done. When the dam closed, the water level
Speaker 1: descended enough to make some of the graves viewable again
Speaker 1: just under the surface, with a few even standing above
Speaker 1: the waterline. It's an eerie spot to visit by kayak
Speaker 1: or by boat at three am, like I did when
Speaker 1: we filmed Ghost Hunters there with all that dark history.
Speaker 1: Of course, there are paranormal reports at the dam. Many
Speaker 1: people have heard women and children's voices, maybe a whisper
Speaker 1: in their ears. Strange shadows have been seen moving about
Speaker 1: the dam, including a man dressed from the nineteen forties.
Speaker 1: Several guests have been touched lightly, with some claiming to
Speaker 1: have been scratched and even strangled. Visitors have left gifts
Speaker 1: for the spirits and areas that are said to be
Speaker 1: haunted by children. Supposedly, most of the gifts disappear from
Speaker 1: one visit to the next. Regarding Dragon Canoe, stories often
Speaker 1: claim that the curse was true and that all of
Speaker 1: the shadows in the history of the dam stemmed from it.
Speaker 1: Some accounts mentioned sightings of Dragon Canoe spirit as well.
Speaker 1: The presence of the spirits of children doesn't immediately make sense.
Speaker 1: Many have attributed it to a supposed flood that happened
Speaker 1: that filled that tunnel on property that many used to
Speaker 1: walk from place to place, including children going to school.
Speaker 1: Others attributed it to the high fatality rate of children
Speaker 1: in the camps during the Spanish flu epidemic. I can't
Speaker 1: find record of any of those happenings, but I did
Speaker 1: find drownings, lots of them, including a six and a
Speaker 1: nine year old in nineteen fifty. I also found a
Speaker 1: horrific account of a little girl who burned to death
Speaker 1: in a fire on a pleasure launch at the Damn
Speaker 1: in nine Her aunt also perished, and a number of
Speaker 1: people were taken to area hospitals with severe burns. On
Speaker 1: that tragic note, let's shift gears. I've investigated Hales Bar
Speaker 1: Damn on a number of occasions, including three nights in
Speaker 1: a row with Adam Burry for our show Kindred Spirits.
Speaker 1: Prior to that, we investigated with TAPS when we were
Speaker 1: on Ghost Hunters. We had a number of experiences, so
Speaker 1: I thought it fit to bring him back to chat
Speaker 1: with me about them. This includes details of one of
Speaker 1: the most terrifying moments I have ever had while investigating,
Speaker 1: So you can hear all about that and more when
Speaker 1: we get Adam on the line right after the break.
Speaker 1: All right, So I am sitting here with someone who
Speaker 1: you should all be very familiar with by now, and
Speaker 1: If you're not, then I don't know what to say. Mr.
Speaker 1: Mr Adam Barry and my partner in crime on Kindred Spirits,
Speaker 1: my real life bestie. He's here to talk about Hale's
Speaker 1: bar damn with me. So Hi Adam. Hi. Yeah, if
Speaker 1: you don't know who I am, google right now and
Speaker 1: come back to this episode because you're going to need
Speaker 1: to know it. Hit pause. He's highly google able. Yeah, highly.
Speaker 1: My net worth is forty million apparently on Google. But
Speaker 1: don't tell anyone because I didn't even saw that, and
Speaker 1: I'm mine is net worth eight hundred thousand, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: what is that Adam doing? Right? I like this. It's
Speaker 1: all crypto. It's all crypto and n f T girl.
Speaker 1: What we're referring to is that there's these like very
Speaker 1: made up biographies about us all over the internet, and
Speaker 1: they just have these very weird ideas of like our
Speaker 1: net worth and totally I apparently have like three children,
Speaker 1: so you have millions he didn't know about. I have
Speaker 1: kids that didn't know about. And my husband apparently he's
Speaker 1: worth fifteen million. He went to go check the mattress
Speaker 1: to see if it's in there. He was like, where
Speaker 1: did I put it. Oh my goodness. Anyways, as usual,
Speaker 1: we immediately just went off topic. So not like a
Speaker 1: ghosts what ghosts? Okay, So we're talking about Hale's bar damn.
Speaker 1: I was talking a bit with Adam before this. I
Speaker 1: really tried hard to find someone affiliated with the damn
Speaker 1: to talk about it today, but no one would reply
Speaker 1: to me. So I was like, you know, Adam and
Speaker 1: I have investigated there. We've been there at least five
Speaker 1: or six nights investigating. We you know a lot of
Speaker 1: people over the years who have investigated, so we've heard
Speaker 1: a lot of stories. I do want to write off
Speaker 1: the bat before we get into the ghosts. I did
Speaker 1: have one of the most terrifying moments of my life
Speaker 1: in that place, and to this day, it still gives
Speaker 1: me the shivers to even think about it. So Adam
Speaker 1: and I were there investigating for ghost hunters years and
Speaker 1: years ago, and in the middle of the dam building.
Speaker 1: This is gonna get good. In the middle of the
Speaker 1: damn building, there's water, it's filled up, and there's a
Speaker 1: whirlpool in there. And so Adam and I are there
Speaker 1: at night and it's just us in like our camera
Speaker 1: operator and maybe a sound person and I look in
Speaker 1: that water and there is something very large in there,
Speaker 1: and it's like circling around the edge. And I am
Speaker 1: not kidding when I say this fish was five or
Speaker 1: six ft long, and I was like, what is that?
Speaker 1: I couldn't even concentrate on investigating. There's just this mass.
Speaker 1: I'm like, is that a shark? Like? Are there sharks
Speaker 1: in Tennessee? Like? What is this? The whole time we
Speaker 1: were in there, it just slowly circled around the edge
Speaker 1: of this pool and we never got our answers until
Speaker 1: we went back, and the gentleman who was giving us
Speaker 1: the tour when we went back for Kindred years later,
Speaker 1: he was like, oh, yeah, that was an alligator gar.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, what is an alligator gar? And so
Speaker 1: I googled it. They're also highly google able and disgusting.
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I cannot believe your your best your
Speaker 1: friend here, your best friend here is smart, but he's
Speaker 1: not a Jeopardy person. However, last night, three Letter Animals
Speaker 1: was a category and it was alligator this, and I screamed, gar,
Speaker 1: It's like it's synchronousity and I I screamed it, and
Speaker 1: Ben looked at me like I was crazy. And then
Speaker 1: the answer was gar and I was like, see, I
Speaker 1: know it. I was, that's a nail's bar down. I
Speaker 1: can't even and I know they're probably gentle giants. I
Speaker 1: don't know, but the way they look. I love aquatic
Speaker 1: creatures with that, the idea of that in that water.
Speaker 1: And so then we went back for Kindred to film.
Speaker 1: There were a lot of reports, like paranormal reports coming
Speaker 1: from that pool area, and so they preemptively, they thought
Speaker 1: they were helping us out there, like, hey, we preemptively
Speaker 1: ordered you a boat so you can get into this water.
Speaker 1: And and I was like, no, I'm not doing that.
Speaker 1: And so if you notice on the episode Adams in
Speaker 1: the boat by himself, because I was like, I'm not,
Speaker 1: I am not doing that. Like what if that thing
Speaker 1: is still in there and it like brushes up, like
Speaker 1: if I fall in it? Oh my god, I can't anyway,
Speaker 1: so I think it is okay. So I have never
Speaker 1: googled it, and I just now did that. If I
Speaker 1: had googled alligator gar before getting into that boat, I
Speaker 1: do not think I would have actually done it. These
Speaker 1: things look crazy, it's yeah, So there you have it,
Speaker 1: and apparently they're very prevalent in that area. So they're monsters.
Speaker 1: They're like literal dinosaurs. They are they are so fascinating
Speaker 1: and terrifying. So, like I said, one of my scariest
Speaker 1: moments when people ever when they asked me, like, what's
Speaker 1: the scariest thing that's ever happened to you? Like I
Speaker 1: quickly flashed to the alligator gar and then like try
Speaker 1: to get to a ghost moment for them. But it's
Speaker 1: there always forever. So okay, let's talk about ghosts. So
Speaker 1: we have actually had a number of experiences I think,
Speaker 1: probably too many to even fit into the shows that
Speaker 1: we've filmed there. So why don't you start? What do
Speaker 1: you think has been like one of the craziest moments
Speaker 1: that you've had while investigating at Hales bar Well, having
Speaker 1: a rock thrown at my face and hitting me in
Speaker 1: the face, I think while investigating around that whirlpool in
Speaker 1: the middle of the damn I think that was probably
Speaker 1: pretty intense. I mean, we've seen objects move, and we've
Speaker 1: been touched, and you know, we've been pinched and poked.
Speaker 1: To have something physically thrown at you is pretty um,
Speaker 1: pretty intense. Yeah, And that kind of activity doesn't happen often,
Speaker 1: and so I remember because your face actually had like
Speaker 1: a red mark on it. And I'm trying to recall
Speaker 1: where I was. I heard the rock, I heard multiple rocks,
Speaker 1: like I definitely heard things being thrown in that moment.
Speaker 1: You were to my left. We were up on that
Speaker 1: platform up the stairs, and so we were looking across,
Speaker 1: and so strangely enough, years before that, when we were
Speaker 1: filming or um investing. I hate saying filming because we're investigating,
Speaker 1: but just it's automatically my brain. But we were investigating
Speaker 1: and being filmed while doing so for Ghost Hunters, and
Speaker 1: I do remember standing in that same spot and we
Speaker 1: were looking across and we saw a shadow figure in
Speaker 1: like a very high up area which no one was
Speaker 1: either able to get to or was there at that moment.
Speaker 1: And then we heard this like crazy voice yelling at us,
Speaker 1: like just this very like gruff like voice, and we
Speaker 1: record it, like we got it on our recorders and everything,
Speaker 1: and I remember Steve Gonsolves just being like, what the
Speaker 1: heck is that, and like, we don't know, there's something
Speaker 1: weird in that room. And I think maybe that whirlpool,
Speaker 1: that energy, the whole makeup of hales Bar. I don't
Speaker 1: know if you remember this, but like it literally is
Speaker 1: built on limestone, and you know a lot of people
Speaker 1: speculate and theorize that limestone has to do with paranormal activity.
Speaker 1: It was built in an area that the French I believe,
Speaker 1: referred to it as the Suck because they couldn't navigate
Speaker 1: it with boats, and so they built the dam specifically
Speaker 1: to make that area more easy to navigate and then
Speaker 1: also to provide electricity of Chattanooga. But I feel like
Speaker 1: that whole whirlpool thing, if you believe any of the
Speaker 1: theories that running water is some sort of conduit for
Speaker 1: paranoral activity, hails Bar has it. I think we thought
Speaker 1: maybe that that area that like whirlpool area, because it
Speaker 1: was connected to like Native Americans, that that section of
Speaker 1: the dam had sort of a Native American aspect to it,
Speaker 1: that kind of activity in that area, and then when
Speaker 1: you got to the other side were like the offices
Speaker 1: and the barracks were where the workers were, it was
Speaker 1: a completely different set of activity. Yes, and that was
Speaker 1: weird too, because that was when we were dealing with
Speaker 1: a spirit that did not like disorder, and I think
Speaker 1: you really we were just talking about this in another
Speaker 1: interview recently, but remind me what happened exactly, because you
Speaker 1: know that sequence of events better than I remember. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So we were investigating in the third or fourth floor,
Speaker 1: because we had to walk through the tunnels and then
Speaker 1: up three flights of stairs, and we were in this
Speaker 1: section and we were doing the STS method, the spiritbox session,
Speaker 1: and we garnered from that communication that whoever was there
Speaker 1: seemed to be in charge. And the idea I think
Speaker 1: came because this person of this entity wanted order and
Speaker 1: structure and liked to watch out for this space. We
Speaker 1: were thinking like that, maybe that's why they were there,
Speaker 1: and so we decided to leave trash on that third
Speaker 1: floor with a rimpod you know that makes sound if
Speaker 1: anybody gets near it. And we explained all of our
Speaker 1: equipment and said this is how you can communicate with
Speaker 1: us and get our attention. And so we put like
Speaker 1: a plastic bottle and a rapper I think of something else,
Speaker 1: and we just left it. And when we got down
Speaker 1: maybe a flight and a half of stairs from where
Speaker 1: we were, the equipment started going off like crazy as
Speaker 1: if to say, hey, you're a jerk. You left this
Speaker 1: trash on the third floor, and as soon it kept
Speaker 1: going off and kept going off, we both went back up.
Speaker 1: It was still going off. As soon as we touched
Speaker 1: that trash. As soon as we picked it up, it stopped,
Speaker 1: the equipment stop going off, and we were like, Okay,
Speaker 1: that's weird. Yeah, remember I feel like that. The gentleman
Speaker 1: who we were speaking with at that time, he said
Speaker 1: he'd always felt like someone was in that area kind of.
Speaker 1: I mean, he got very emotional at the end when
Speaker 1: we were kind of telling him everything that happened, but
Speaker 1: he always felt like there was someone there who kind
Speaker 1: of felt the same affinity for the location as he did,
Speaker 1: like really wanting to clean it up, really wanting to
Speaker 1: keep it nice and neat, And so that was kind
Speaker 1: of cool that we were able to tell him that
Speaker 1: his feelings were correct. I think we all sometimes get
Speaker 1: those vibes like there's something around here that maybe we're
Speaker 1: all a little bit psychic. But yeah, I don't know
Speaker 1: if he's still working at the dam, but hopefully whoever
Speaker 1: is there is aware of this person in this area
Speaker 1: who likes order. Yeah. I think what was really cool
Speaker 1: about that is this gentleman really devoted a lot of
Speaker 1: his time and his life to cleaning up that damn
Speaker 1: because they were doing damn tours. It's never gonna get old.
Speaker 1: They were doing don't We're in the history, I do
Speaker 1: it like three times. They want to do damn tours,
Speaker 1: and so it has to be safe for people to
Speaker 1: do that. And so he had like pulled out a
Speaker 1: bunch of like drywall and bricks and rocks like hard labor,
Speaker 1: like hard work. And then when the activity in the
Speaker 1: office area was getting aggressive towards him, like he had
Speaker 1: felt like he was grabbed there and I got grabbed
Speaker 1: in that same area, and you know, there was a
Speaker 1: dark shadow figure. He assumed that they were just mad
Speaker 1: at him or something was wrong, and all he wanted
Speaker 1: to do was make the space safe for guests, but
Speaker 1: also clean it up for the spirits in a way.
Speaker 1: And so when we told him that, I was not
Speaker 1: expecting him to get as emotional as he did, because
Speaker 1: this guy is like southern and stoic. But he was
Speaker 1: really moved by the e vps that we got and
Speaker 1: our assessment of the space, and it really changed his
Speaker 1: It really changed his life. Honestly, Now, speaking of getting grabbed,
Speaker 1: like how did that feel when you got grabbed there. Okay,
Speaker 1: wasn't the best moment. I think the weirdest part about
Speaker 1: that experience is we had heard that if you just
Speaker 1: stand in this area of this section of the room
Speaker 1: or whatever, you sometimes feel like somebody's grabbing you. And
Speaker 1: we always try it ourselves and most of the time
Speaker 1: it doesn't really work, but we I stood there and
Speaker 1: the first thing I thought was it was my pants leg.
Speaker 1: I thought it was my pant leg, like I don't know,
Speaker 1: like bunching up or something. But I wasn't moving, and
Speaker 1: so when I looked down to see that my pants
Speaker 1: leg was fine, it felt sort of like a staticky
Speaker 1: hold of some kind. I can't explain it any other
Speaker 1: way than it being like this weird staticky maybe my
Speaker 1: fabrics moving, but I felt like something was grabbing onto me.
Speaker 1: And you know, we were filming and we had equipment
Speaker 1: and obviously nothing was around me. And I think we
Speaker 1: tried to figure out if it could be logically explained,
Speaker 1: but it couldn't. So I think it was more about
Speaker 1: the I think it was a pressure. I thought maybe
Speaker 1: it was my pants, like bunching up staticky. But it
Speaker 1: was very different than just standing there normal like I
Speaker 1: knew something was off and it felt like something was
Speaker 1: like grabbing onto me. And obviously you're not the first.
Speaker 1: A lot of people have reported being grabbed. It's interesting
Speaker 1: how physical the activity is at Hales Bar and there's
Speaker 1: a lot of shadow figures. I mean, the history there
Speaker 1: is intense. I don't think I remembered how intense it
Speaker 1: was until I just started going back through our research
Speaker 1: for this podcast. But like it has seen everything, and
Speaker 1: so I could see why there would be a lot
Speaker 1: of spirits there that would feel the need to try
Speaker 1: to get attention. But I never felt anything there was
Speaker 1: negative or evil or bad per se. No protective and
Speaker 1: rightly so based on the history. I feel like the
Speaker 1: land was sacred and Native Americans, the organization or the
Speaker 1: damn was very important to those that built it and
Speaker 1: that protected it, quote unquote, and I think that's what
Speaker 1: it was about. And that can also be confused with
Speaker 1: aggressive activity. I mean, a protective spirit is going to
Speaker 1: do what they need to do to make sure that
Speaker 1: you aren't destroying the place or or making it worse,
Speaker 1: or you know, not following the rules, like that guy
Speaker 1: who you know leading trash, and so I think that
Speaker 1: can be confused with like this aggressive activity, but it
Speaker 1: was all about protection I think. I think so too,
Speaker 1: And the activity didn't seem to change day or night.
Speaker 1: You know, people always ask us, you know, why do
Speaker 1: you investigate at night? And you know, we investigate at
Speaker 1: night for a lot of reasons, mostly because outside influences
Speaker 1: are not as you know, there's not a lot of traffic,
Speaker 1: there's not a lot of outside noise. You know, you
Speaker 1: can see light anomalies easier in the dark, things like that.
Speaker 1: But Hail's Bar specifically has activity all the time. Like
Speaker 1: I remember few times having like because we I think
Speaker 1: we had oh yeah, we had our DVR and everything
Speaker 1: is set up in that main room where we could
Speaker 1: look over everything. And I remember a few times going
Speaker 1: into that giant space where the pool is and they
Speaker 1: do boat storage in there and stuff, and hearing noises
Speaker 1: in the middle of the day, like knocking, sounds, rustling,
Speaker 1: like it almost felt alive, like it just never stops. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: it makes sense because if you're you know, they would
Speaker 1: work during the day. You know, they probably there was
Speaker 1: probably a security guard or somebody at night, like monitoring
Speaker 1: the space. But you know that the place is very
Speaker 1: active during the day, so it could be anything from
Speaker 1: residual activity to intelligent activity too, you know, a ghost
Speaker 1: just going about its business, you know, like like it's
Speaker 1: still an operation. Do you remember the tunnel? Oh god, wait, okay,
Speaker 1: wait a second, So there's two different So there's the tunnel, right, yes,
Speaker 1: I mean it is a tunnel, but it's just like buried,
Speaker 1: you know. They put it on top of the ground
Speaker 1: and then put land over it. So it is a tunnel.
Speaker 1: But the other tunnel, like when I was in that
Speaker 1: boat and like you got to the end of the
Speaker 1: thing and they were like can you the I think,
Speaker 1: are I forget who? Maybe it is Brian, but he
Speaker 1: was like it works for us. He was like, can
Speaker 1: you get through this doorway to go into this other
Speaker 1: water filled tunnel? And I was like, absolutely not, No,
Speaker 1: I can't. That is the layer of the alligator car
Speaker 1: and the spiders. It was very strange because you walked
Speaker 1: down those stairs and it's just submerged. It's just water. Literally.
Speaker 1: You can tell this used to be an area people
Speaker 1: worked in. But it also goes to show Damned was
Speaker 1: constantly being repaired, Like it was just constantly like there
Speaker 1: was a team assigned to filling the cracks because it
Speaker 1: was constantly breaking because it was on that limestone, and
Speaker 1: they would shove anything in these cracks, mattresses at one
Speaker 1: point a truckload. Of course, it's like just trying to
Speaker 1: repair this damn And you know, once they stopped that
Speaker 1: within however many years, or it's just completely flooded inside.
Speaker 1: Like what they were stopping for so long is crazy
Speaker 1: to think about, and you can really see it going
Speaker 1: down there. Yeah, it's probably one of the weirdest things
Speaker 1: we've ever had to investigate, like going down those stairs
Speaker 1: where that water is. Like, that's as an investigator, I think,
Speaker 1: you know, we always were always like, oh, we'll do it,
Speaker 1: but like then when you get down there, like, well,
Speaker 1: how do we how do we do it? And I
Speaker 1: think we did it pretty well. I think we're doing
Speaker 1: e VP work. And then maybe do we have any
Speaker 1: kind of underwater I don't even remember when we tried
Speaker 1: that with Ghost Remember there's also a cemetery up the
Speaker 1: way that was submerged. Um I forgot about that, Yes,
Speaker 1: and so we did try to do some like underwater recording.
Speaker 1: So what's interesting about that? And I could be misremembering
Speaker 1: because I did the history a bit ago, but I
Speaker 1: feel like the cemetery was a lot more submerged in
Speaker 1: the forties and then the sixties they did something and
Speaker 1: then suddenly the cemetery resurfaced in areas. So now for
Speaker 1: anyone who visits their boats there, the cemetery is literally
Speaker 1: right under the surface, and that water is very clear,
Speaker 1: and there are some headstones actually like coming up. But
Speaker 1: it's crazy how well they've been preserved having been submerged
Speaker 1: for so long. And also I don't know that you
Speaker 1: know this, but that is five miles up from the damp.
Speaker 1: So we got in a boat and it was thirty degrees.
Speaker 1: I don't know, I just remember being Remember we were
Speaker 1: five miles up that river in the middle of the
Speaker 1: night to the cemetery. I don't think any of us
Speaker 1: knew far away it was. They were like going, it
Speaker 1: was you mean, Dave and Steve. They gave us boots
Speaker 1: or something. And I was a WE investigator at this moment, right,
Speaker 1: so they're like, go out, go stand over there. So
Speaker 1: I put these boots on to go stand in an
Speaker 1: area I think on the near the graves that I
Speaker 1: could stand there, and then my foot just like slipped
Speaker 1: and water filled my boot, remember that, right, I do?
Speaker 1: And then you had to we had to go back
Speaker 1: and it was so cold one lost your foot. What
Speaker 1: a story that would have been. Oh god, I think
Speaker 1: I spent like fifteen minutes. They had a dryer, a
Speaker 1: washer and dryer, and I think I put my socks
Speaker 1: in the dryer to dry them off. I too have
Speaker 1: a picture of myself. I took a selfie like waiting
Speaker 1: for my socks to dry, like in this area. That's
Speaker 1: so weird. That place is so weird. Not to mention
Speaker 1: the kittens, the feral kittens that are everywhere that we
Speaker 1: kept feeding, you kept feeding. Listen, Okay, I had to
Speaker 1: get some Caesar's or whatever they eat because they were hungry.
Speaker 1: And that little orange kitty cat I really wanted, but
Speaker 1: I'm allergic. I know. It's so funny how much the
Speaker 1: interviews are different from week to week on the show,
Speaker 1: because sometimes they're just like all business and then I
Speaker 1: get like you or John Tenney on or something and
Speaker 1: it's just all over the place, which is fine, I'm
Speaker 1: sure it. To listen, I think ghost kind of goes.
Speaker 1: You know, we go out and do these things and
Speaker 1: we're very serious, and it is business, and it's like
Speaker 1: we want to help and we want to figure out
Speaker 1: the things, but there are times that we have to
Speaker 1: be normal in a way quote unquote we have to
Speaker 1: like have fun or like do something else to take
Speaker 1: our mind off of the seriousness of the business. Otherwise
Speaker 1: it can weigh as it can weigh us down. Oh yeah,
Speaker 1: we learned that. And I think that's actually a really
Speaker 1: fair kind of warning to investigators, is that there, you know,
Speaker 1: you are surrounded by stories of really awful things. When
Speaker 1: you're a paranormal investigator, you know, you you are constantly
Speaker 1: reminded of your mortality and death and unfortunate situations. And
Speaker 1: I think that's why Adam and I do make time
Speaker 1: to kind of, you know, have fun and laugh with
Speaker 1: each other and but be serious when we need to be.
Speaker 1: But also like there has to be some like levity
Speaker 1: and all of this really because it could drag you
Speaker 1: down very quickly if you go down that dark, deep
Speaker 1: hole of sadness, you know, or or the world pool
Speaker 1: of sadness, the whirlpool of alligator cars. I just in
Speaker 1: my brain, I just feel like there's an entire school
Speaker 1: of very large alligator cars waiting down there. For me,
Speaker 1: and I'm going to have nightmares about it tonight. I
Speaker 1: promise you next time we'll go fishing and see if
Speaker 1: we can catch it. Oh my gosh, No, okay, I
Speaker 1: think we should stop talking about this now. Well, you
Speaker 1: know what, I appreciate you. Thank you so much for
Speaker 1: coming on and reminiscing and talking about the spooky things
Speaker 1: that go on there. Just the two people out of
Speaker 1: many who have had experiences at Hales bar and so
Speaker 1: I'm sure they are still doing tours. If you want
Speaker 1: to visit, tell them that you heard about it on
Speaker 1: Haunted Road or Kindred Spirits or Ghost Centers. But everyone
Speaker 1: we've met there has been lovely, so definitely check it
Speaker 1: out if you have time. So, Mr Barry, what are
Speaker 1: you up to? Anything you want to promote or throw
Speaker 1: out there? God, I don't know. Just google me, Just
Speaker 1: google me and you'll find out. Yes, Adams on every
Speaker 1: Strange Escapes that I do, you were doing a cruise
Speaker 1: this summer. Obviously, new episodes of Kindred Spirits are airing,
Speaker 1: but I think this is either happening the week of
Speaker 1: our season finale or the week after. But if you
Speaker 1: haven't seen it, go check it out and stream it
Speaker 1: on Discovery Plus. You can watch Adam and Me act
Speaker 1: like this all you want. You can watch both episodes
Speaker 1: of Ghost Hunters that were there and Kindred Spirits. All right, well,
Speaker 1: thank you, Mr Barry. I appreciate you, and I will
Speaker 1: see you very soon. You're welcome. Thank you. Bye. I
Speaker 1: don't think I've ever used the word damn so many
Speaker 1: times in my damn life, but it certainly seems appropriate
Speaker 1: because Hale's bar dam quite literally seems damned oddly though,
Speaker 1: when you visit there, it's actually rather peaceful, and there
Speaker 1: are so many strange nooks and crannies to explore. Plus
Speaker 1: the view of the river, it's easy to sit on
Speaker 1: the water and reflect on everything that happened there in
Speaker 1: its history. It's a massive structure, unmistakable, a constant reminder
Speaker 1: of what once was, a place so cloaked in tragedy
Speaker 1: that the urban legends and myths that have sprung from
Speaker 1: it aren't much worse than the real things that happened there.
Speaker 1: We might never know if there are bodies in the cement,
Speaker 1: or if dragon Canoes curse had anything to do with
Speaker 1: the Damn's downfall, but one thing is for shore Hale's
Speaker 1: bar Dam continues to be a beacon for both the
Speaker 1: living and the dead. I'm Amy Bruney and this was
Speaker 1: Haunted Road. Haunted Road is a production of I Heart
Speaker 1: Radio and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Mankey. The podcast
Speaker 1: is written and hosted by Amy Bruney. Executive producers include
Speaker 1: Aaron Mankey, Alex Williams, and Matt Frederick. The show is
Speaker 1: produced by rema Ill Kali and Trevor Young. Research by
Speaker 1: Taylor Haggerdorn, Amy Bruney and Robin Miniter. For more podcasts
Speaker 1: from I Heeart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio Apple
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. M