1 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,000 Speaker 1: Lindsay still has photos from when she was a maiden, 2 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:12,400 Speaker 1: when she lived in Alamoth and served as Lira, the 3 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: keeper of music and the spiritual battle they all fought together. 4 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:19,919 Speaker 1: Pictures of her in long dresses performing music, were huddled 5 00:00:19,920 --> 00:00:23,639 Speaker 1: with the maidens around Victor in a big hug. A 6 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: photo of Victor kissing her forehead as she plays the guitar, 7 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 1: Victor embracing her in front of the bridge over the 8 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 1: pond where Jesus was supposed to find them. But when 9 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:44,080 Speaker 1: she goes through her memorabilia, the photos, her diary, the 10 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: thing most on her mind isn't the man who called 11 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:50,879 Speaker 1: himself an apostle, the man she obeyed no matter what, 12 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:56,280 Speaker 1: who raped her for ten years. She doesn't think first 13 00:00:56,280 --> 00:01:00,280 Speaker 1: of her parents or her siblings. When she's reminded of 14 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:04,120 Speaker 1: her childhood. One thing is always at the four. 15 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:10,200 Speaker 2: It reminds me of the maidens. And the day that 16 00:01:10,319 --> 00:01:13,040 Speaker 2: our parents dropped us off was July twenty third, two thousand. 17 00:01:14,600 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 2: Victor did have a celebrate that anniversary every year with him. 18 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,959 Speaker 1: It wasn't just the anniversary of their commitment to Victor. 19 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 1: It was when the ten girls found themselves bound together, 20 00:01:27,920 --> 00:01:31,400 Speaker 1: living as a family, for the next decade, ten girls 21 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 1: and women aged twelve to twenty three, supporting each other 22 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:36,000 Speaker 1: through everything. 23 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:39,759 Speaker 2: I still miss them, you know. I don't think there's 24 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:41,560 Speaker 2: a day goes by that I don't think of the 25 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 2: maidens even more so than my own siblings. I think 26 00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 2: of them as my sisters, And sometimes I just wish 27 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 2: that I could have met them under different circumstances, you know, 28 00:01:56,400 --> 00:02:01,520 Speaker 2: or that somehow we would invol and out and come 29 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:06,880 Speaker 2: back together, you know, and been able to share in 30 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:12,560 Speaker 2: this grieving and healing process together. And it just really 31 00:02:12,600 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 2: makes me sad that that didn't happen either sides with Jess. 32 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 1: Jess, the youngest maiden, the girl with red hair, Lindsay's 33 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: best friend, who came forward with her to get Victor 34 00:02:28,520 --> 00:02:31,840 Speaker 1: put away while the other maidens were still in River 35 00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: Road or even visiting Victor in prison. Jess and Lindsay 36 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 1: had each other through the questions, the police interviews, the 37 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 1: media coverage, the manhunt, the plea bargaining sentencing. It was 38 00:02:48,600 --> 00:02:57,440 Speaker 1: always Jess. Three years later, in March of twenty twenty, 39 00:02:57,800 --> 00:03:00,200 Speaker 1: Lindsay was at home when she saw a post online. 40 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:04,240 Speaker 1: It was from Jess's brother. She didn't know what it meant. 41 00:03:09,800 --> 00:03:14,120 Speaker 2: Her brother posted something on Facebook asking to pray for her, 42 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:22,760 Speaker 2: and I immediately messaged him what is going on? What 43 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 2: is going on with Jess? 44 00:03:42,040 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 1: From her Cocoa Punch and iHeart podcasts, This is the 45 00:03:45,160 --> 00:03:48,040 Speaker 1: Turning River Road. I'm Alan Lance. 46 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:52,559 Speaker 3: Lesser and I'm Erica Lance Part nine. 47 00:03:53,160 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 1: Jess. The day of that sentencing hearing back in twenty 48 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,560 Speaker 1: sixteen was like coming out of a tunnel. You can 49 00:04:06,600 --> 00:04:08,880 Speaker 1: see it even now in the photos they took that day. 50 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:13,200 Speaker 2: This is me and Jess after we were in court. 51 00:04:13,480 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 2: Oh wow, it was October twenty, twenty sixteen. Yeah, you 52 00:04:17,720 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 2: both look really happy. We look really happy, you know, 53 00:04:26,839 --> 00:04:28,599 Speaker 2: And you can tell even from a picture that there's 54 00:04:28,600 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 2: a light in somebody's eyes. You can see the light. 55 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 2: We're both smiling so big, and she's kind of in front, 56 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 2: and I'm standing behind her and my head is over 57 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 2: her shoulder and we have our heads together. 58 00:04:44,839 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 1: They had both dyed their hair. Lindsay's, which is usually 59 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: curly brown, was straight and black in this picture. Jess's 60 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 1: hair was short and platinum blonde, almost white. They had 61 00:04:56,720 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 1: their survivor bracelets on the ones Jess had made. There 62 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: is something about that photo where both of you just 63 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 1: looks so happy. 64 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:07,400 Speaker 4: M h. 65 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 1: I'm glad you captured that moment. 66 00:05:12,839 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 2: To see a comparison. I think I told you about 67 00:05:15,440 --> 00:05:15,960 Speaker 2: that play. 68 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:19,400 Speaker 1: Lindsay pulls out another picture of her and Jess. This 69 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:23,440 Speaker 1: time they're young girls and pigtails and sailor costumes as 70 00:05:23,480 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 1: from before they were maidens. When the Children of River 71 00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:29,119 Speaker 1: Road Fellowship put on a musical set on a ship 72 00:05:29,160 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: the community built, Jess and Lindsay had a duet together. 73 00:05:34,000 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 2: This was when early nineteen ninety nine. Jess and I 74 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 2: were in the crow's and as singing. I had just 75 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:42,880 Speaker 2: turned twelve and she was eleven. 76 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, that's us, and you've got little sailor 77 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:52,679 Speaker 1: hats on, and we were in the middle of singing 78 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:58,680 Speaker 1: because our our mouths are open. They were already friends, 79 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:01,640 Speaker 1: but that was the start of them really being a pair. 80 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:04,880 Speaker 1: These two little girls caught up in the bigness of 81 00:06:04,920 --> 00:06:08,440 Speaker 1: singing a duet for the whole camp, so long before 82 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,160 Speaker 1: they'd have to stand together in front of another audience 83 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 1: in court years later. 84 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:15,760 Speaker 2: We were so excited. We were the only ones who 85 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,280 Speaker 2: got to go up into this like huge tower that 86 00:06:18,320 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 2: they had built. I remember being nervous, and I think 87 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 2: she was nervous, but somehow we just helped calm each 88 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:30,960 Speaker 2: other down and climb up there and sing the song 89 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 2: Like a ship so far from home, wandering gamesleep. 90 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 5: Alone, storm, tossed by the troubles of this world, dune 91 00:06:47,080 --> 00:06:50,800 Speaker 5: by the something in the Mutiny of Sin. 92 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:58,800 Speaker 2: There I was alone, a singing man. Oh man, gosh, 93 00:06:58,880 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 2: I haven't sang this in a year. It's funny on 94 00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:03,000 Speaker 2: the brain, and I can't remember that. That's the word. 95 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:06,560 Speaker 2: Really sweet memory that I have of the two of 96 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:15,240 Speaker 2: us from early on, before you know, things turned. But 97 00:07:15,360 --> 00:07:19,920 Speaker 2: I look at this. This was early nineteen ninety nine, 98 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 2: and by that summer, my parents are having me sleep 99 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 2: in a camper with Victor. And I feel so sad 100 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 2: for these little girls because like they don't even know 101 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 2: that that innocence is slowly going to be ripped and 102 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 2: torn away from them. 103 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:46,160 Speaker 1: Jess was like a sister to Lindsay at age twelve 104 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,880 Speaker 1: and at age thirty, and that was a big deal 105 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:53,760 Speaker 1: because Lindsay's birth sisters weren't in their life anymore. They 106 00:07:53,800 --> 00:07:59,040 Speaker 1: supported Victor. But after Victor pled guilty, Lindsay and Jess 107 00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 1: took that picture their black and blonde hair and bracelets 108 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,960 Speaker 1: that said Survivor. They left Minnesota and went back to 109 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: their homes, Jess to Wisconsin and Lindsay to New Jersey. 110 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:14,840 Speaker 2: She kind of cut off contact with me. 111 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: Lindsay tried to reach her again and again, her DMS 112 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:22,360 Speaker 1: and texts and calls went unanswered, and. 113 00:08:22,320 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 2: When I didn't hear from her, I reached out to 114 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:27,200 Speaker 2: her husband. I reached out to her brother, like, Hey, 115 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 2: is everything okay with Jess. I've been trying to message 116 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 2: her and they'd be like, yeah, think she just needs 117 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:38,120 Speaker 2: some time to heal. And I kind of accepted that. 118 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,360 Speaker 2: At the time. I was like, Okay, maybe this is 119 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:49,040 Speaker 2: her way of moving on, which really sucked because I 120 00:08:49,080 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 2: wanted to move on with her. It was almost like 121 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 2: she just kind of wanted to maybe forget, and unfortunately 122 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 2: that didn't include me. 123 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,360 Speaker 1: It was almost four years later, in March of twenty twenty, 124 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 1: that Lindsay saw that post from Jess's brother. 125 00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 2: Her brother posted something on Facebook asking like to pray 126 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:12,880 Speaker 2: for her, and I immediately messaged him, like what is 127 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 2: going on? I think it took him like two days 128 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:17,079 Speaker 2: to get back to me, and when he did, that's 129 00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 2: when he said, she is on life support and I 130 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:26,280 Speaker 2: was like, what what happened? I Am coming out there. 131 00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:30,840 Speaker 1: They'd found Jess after she tried to take her own life. 132 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:33,400 Speaker 1: It wasn't her first suicide attempt. 133 00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 2: She was like, we found her. They tried to resuscitate her, 134 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 2: but she had been dead for too like brain dead 135 00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:43,960 Speaker 2: for too long. And I messaged him back immediately saying, 136 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 2: please don't take her off. I want to come say goodbye. No, 137 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:56,120 Speaker 2: he said it would be too late, there wasn't time, 138 00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:03,120 Speaker 2: and nah, I think it was like an hour later 139 00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 2: he I sent me back and said that she was gone. 140 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:11,839 Speaker 2: It didn't feel real. 141 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:22,440 Speaker 1: Lindsay had cried many times over the previous decades. She'd 142 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,800 Speaker 1: had a lot to cry about. Often it was silent, 143 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 1: with tears on her face or pooling on her pillow, 144 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:33,080 Speaker 1: tears that could have filled that tear bottle her dad 145 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:36,880 Speaker 1: gave her many times over. But that's not what happened 146 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:43,240 Speaker 1: this time. This time she screamed, not in silence, not 147 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:59,040 Speaker 1: into a pillow. This time it was loud, just. 148 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:04,040 Speaker 2: So sad, wishing I could have helped her, and that 149 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:06,280 Speaker 2: wish she would have reached back out to me. And 150 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 2: you know, I we all went through a lot of 151 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:17,280 Speaker 2: similar things, and of course we all had our own 152 00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,720 Speaker 2: experiences being a maiden, things that others didn't, that I 153 00:11:21,720 --> 00:11:33,760 Speaker 2: didn't see, that she didn't see. For me, I felt 154 00:11:33,760 --> 00:11:37,320 Speaker 2: like I had lost the only person who really knew 155 00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:41,720 Speaker 2: what I had went through, you know who I mean. Yes, 156 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 2: the other maidens knew, but they weren't supporting Jess and I. 157 00:11:45,840 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 2: So it was like the only true sister who we 158 00:11:50,160 --> 00:12:14,319 Speaker 2: had lived through this together, and she was gone. 159 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:29,000 Speaker 4: It's hard for me every day because she was brilliant 160 00:12:29,360 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 4: and talented and just an absolute shining light of a person, 161 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:40,720 Speaker 4: and she had so much more to offer the world. 162 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:44,480 Speaker 3: This is Justice's Sister. Gray odins twice. 163 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 4: She genuinely just wanted to close that chapter of her 164 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:55,000 Speaker 4: life and move on, and she tried so hard to 165 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,200 Speaker 4: move past it and to build a life outside of it. 166 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:02,199 Speaker 4: She tried everything she could to run from her demons, 167 00:13:02,480 --> 00:13:05,400 Speaker 4: and she couldn't. 168 00:13:06,080 --> 00:13:09,319 Speaker 3: Unlike her older sister, Gray was born into River Road Fellowship. 169 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,520 Speaker 3: Victor actually named her when she was born, a name 170 00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 3: she doesn't use anymore. Gray was six when the announcement 171 00:13:16,000 --> 00:13:18,320 Speaker 3: came that her sister had been chosen for something special. 172 00:13:19,520 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 3: Jess who was twelve, would be a maiden. 173 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 4: Now it was all of the firstborn daughters of the 174 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:30,079 Speaker 4: head families. They were supposed to be basically like nuns 175 00:13:30,160 --> 00:13:34,360 Speaker 4: for our church. Like I don't understand, ah, Like how 176 00:13:34,360 --> 00:13:37,959 Speaker 4: these people genuinely believed that none of this was nefarious. 177 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:43,120 Speaker 4: I don't. It makes me so livid, it's so angry. 178 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:46,920 Speaker 3: Of course, six year old Gray couldn't follow what was happening, 179 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 3: but the announcement was a turning point once it came 180 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:55,120 Speaker 3: she lost her big sister. They exchanged letters the first year, 181 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:58,760 Speaker 3: but then even that wasn't allowed anymore. Gray says they 182 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:01,640 Speaker 3: had no contact for six year years. The only time 183 00:14:01,679 --> 00:14:04,200 Speaker 3: Gray might see Jess was at big church gatherings on 184 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:07,720 Speaker 3: days like Easter or Pentecost, but even then it was 185 00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:08,199 Speaker 3: from afar. 186 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:13,520 Speaker 4: We weren't even allowed to talk to her at those 187 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:17,240 Speaker 4: gatherings because she was one of the maidens, Like they 188 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 4: were like the nuns, and you know, we're just the peasants. 189 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 4: We weren't allowed to approach her. She was off limits. 190 00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:29,200 Speaker 4: But there was a lot of brainwashing that first year 191 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:32,400 Speaker 4: after she left, to the point where by the time 192 00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 4: I was like eight, I didn't know who she was, 193 00:14:35,920 --> 00:14:41,480 Speaker 4: or that I'd even had a sister. They went through 194 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:46,240 Speaker 4: so much like work to get me to forget her existence, 195 00:14:46,800 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 4: to the point that when she moved back when I 196 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 4: was twelve, I had no idea who she was. Who's 197 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:59,960 Speaker 4: there the like leaders in the cult, like the trustee, 198 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 4: these the elders were what we called them. 199 00:15:05,760 --> 00:15:07,440 Speaker 3: Why do you think they didn't want you to know? 200 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:13,280 Speaker 4: One of the main tactics that they used was isolation, manipulation, 201 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:21,040 Speaker 4: twisting the narrative. And I think for the maidens because 202 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 4: they were just terrified teenage girls. The more that they 203 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 4: isolated them and cut them off and made them, you know, 204 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,480 Speaker 4: on a pedestal, the less the girls felt like they 205 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 4: could leave, the more trapped and helpless, like he was 206 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:44,160 Speaker 4: their protector and they weren't allowed to leave him. I 207 00:15:44,280 --> 00:15:49,440 Speaker 4: was robbed of my childhood. She was robbed of her childhood. 208 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:51,480 Speaker 4: But we were also robbed of each other. 209 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 3: At first, when Gray and Jess were both outside the cult, 210 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 3: their relationship was rocky. They went some periods without speaking. 211 00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,280 Speaker 3: Gray moved to Germany for her job in the military 212 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 3: and Jess was back in Wisconsin. But then Jess reached out. 213 00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 4: She said, Hey, I'd like to try to be friends. 214 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 4: I know, we don't really know each other. We were 215 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:22,400 Speaker 4: robbed of being sisters, and we started to really become friends. 216 00:16:23,160 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 3: She remembers one time they took a long drive together 217 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 3: and told each other everything that had happened in the 218 00:16:28,560 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 3: years they'd been apart, and. 219 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:33,360 Speaker 4: I think that was the day that we really started 220 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 4: to actually be sisters. The next two years were just amazing. 221 00:16:42,520 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 4: We would talk everay down on the phone, we would 222 00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:50,240 Speaker 4: video we got to know each other and just bond. 223 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,520 Speaker 3: Just flew to Germany for a month when Gray's daughter 224 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 3: was born. Gray and her daughter flew home to visit 225 00:16:56,640 --> 00:17:00,680 Speaker 3: Jess four months later, and it was just. 226 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,960 Speaker 4: A glimpse of what we could have had and what 227 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,200 Speaker 4: was stolen from us. And I think it made it 228 00:17:08,359 --> 00:17:13,080 Speaker 4: so much harder to see the childhood that we could 229 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 4: have had. 230 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:16,640 Speaker 3: But the time was happy because they had found each 231 00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:17,159 Speaker 3: other again. 232 00:17:18,320 --> 00:17:21,320 Speaker 4: I finally got my sister back, like I finally had 233 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 4: what I should have had my whole life, only to 234 00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:29,440 Speaker 4: lose her two and a half years later. I think 235 00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:33,880 Speaker 4: that's the most unfair part of it. Obviously, a lot 236 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:36,199 Speaker 4: of is unfair and how much we were robbed of, 237 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:45,040 Speaker 4: but just each other and what could have been. It 238 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:46,160 Speaker 4: is really hard. 239 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 3: Gray got a message from Jess one day that things 240 00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:51,400 Speaker 3: were not going well. 241 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:54,040 Speaker 4: Because things were just she was in a really bad 242 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:59,480 Speaker 4: place in Wisconsin, and she was like, I can't do 243 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 4: this anymore, like I'm tired, I can't keep fighting, like 244 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 4: this is bad. And I was like, just come out here, 245 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:07,920 Speaker 4: you can reset. Come stay with me for a few 246 00:18:07,960 --> 00:18:12,000 Speaker 4: months or indefinitely. Europe is amazing and it has been 247 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 4: so healing for me. And I was like, just just 248 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 4: come stay with me. I'll take care of everything like 249 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:19,320 Speaker 4: I got you. I will save you. We'll figure this 250 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:29,080 Speaker 4: out and face it together. And she killed herself five 251 00:18:29,160 --> 00:18:32,560 Speaker 4: days before she was supposed to fly here to Germany. 252 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:37,439 Speaker 4: I thought I could save her, and it just I 253 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:42,240 Speaker 4: couldn't save her, and it wasn't enough, and it should 254 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:51,120 Speaker 4: have been me. I have so much survivors and I 255 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:53,960 Speaker 4: I feel like I will never be even half the 256 00:18:54,040 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 4: person that she was. I hope wherever her spirit and 257 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:04,399 Speaker 4: her energy is, that she is finally happy and at peace. 258 00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 3: We've heard lots of beautiful things about Jess, that she 259 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:22,200 Speaker 3: was kind, the sort of person who helps younger kids 260 00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 3: find frogs, who gives them her books so they can 261 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:28,919 Speaker 3: fall in love with reading too. Someone who liked tattoos 262 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,639 Speaker 3: and funky haircuts. Someone bold and artsy and beautifully weird. 263 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:36,720 Speaker 3: Someone with a massive Julia Roberts smile, too magnificent for 264 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:46,680 Speaker 3: the box Victor wanted to keep her in. There's some 265 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:49,639 Speaker 3: video footage of the press conference right after Victor was 266 00:19:49,680 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 3: sentenced the day of the survivor bracelets of the photo 267 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 3: with Lindsay and Jess's heads pressed together, the photo full 268 00:19:56,280 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 3: of light. Watching the video, I'm always by how frank 269 00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:04,880 Speaker 3: Jess is. She seems so genuine, like grounded and honest, 270 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:06,560 Speaker 3: the way I think we all wish we could be. 271 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 3: In the video, a reporter asks them, why do you 272 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 3: think Victor agreed to the maximum sentence instead of going 273 00:20:15,000 --> 00:20:15,480 Speaker 3: to trial? 274 00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:19,399 Speaker 4: Jess answers, objectively, there seems to be nothing in it 275 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:20,600 Speaker 4: for him. 276 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: Why do you think he really took this too? 277 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:26,560 Speaker 2: I think he wants to cover himself and his followers, 278 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:28,119 Speaker 2: and if we want. 279 00:20:28,040 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 6: To trial, I mean every detail, every account, and everything 280 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:37,080 Speaker 6: that we remember would be put into record and be public, 281 00:20:37,520 --> 00:20:40,320 Speaker 6: not just for us, but for him and for him 282 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,199 Speaker 6: to say, you know that he's trying to spare us. 283 00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:44,879 Speaker 4: The pain of a trial, and I mean. 284 00:20:44,760 --> 00:20:48,760 Speaker 6: We prepared for that, we were ready to do that, 285 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,640 Speaker 6: We were definitely. 286 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,560 Speaker 4: Going to go ahead with that, and so for him to. 287 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,960 Speaker 6: Say that he's doing it to spare us, it's very cowardly. 288 00:20:56,000 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 1: It's offensive because. 289 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 6: We are completely prepared. 290 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,639 Speaker 7: And want our story to be told and want the truth. 291 00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:11,159 Speaker 6: And we've had each other to remind each other that 292 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:12,880 Speaker 6: we're strong, our survivors. 293 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:24,000 Speaker 3: Yet, when Jess went back to Minnesota with the TV 294 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 3: reporter who broke the story and launched the pursuit of Victor, 295 00:21:27,960 --> 00:21:31,560 Speaker 3: she stood in the road outside the camp. A field 296 00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,240 Speaker 3: of shallow snow was like a flat white frame around 297 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 3: her face. Here, Jess was back at the Shepherd's camp 298 00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 3: as an adult, and she started to choke on emotion. 299 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 3: I don't know if I will ever get away from it, 300 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:49,240 Speaker 3: she said to the camera. Every day I can't get 301 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:51,320 Speaker 3: away from it. I mean, how do you you know, 302 00:21:52,160 --> 00:21:54,080 Speaker 3: It's like you grow up somewhere and you go back 303 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 3: to visit part of you is still there, that's your home. 304 00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:08,159 Speaker 3: In the months after Jess died, Lindsay sort of shut 305 00:22:08,200 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 3: down and shut others out. She knew they didn't get it, 306 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,560 Speaker 3: not really, No one but her could understand what she 307 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:21,880 Speaker 3: had lost by losing Jess. 308 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 2: And it was right when COVID was starting, so everything 309 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 2: was crazy, but it was almost like I wanted to 310 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:34,119 Speaker 2: live in the sorrow of it for a little while, 311 00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:41,639 Speaker 2: feel all of those emotions. I remember, like months after 312 00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:43,560 Speaker 2: just I'd wake up in the middle of the night 313 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 2: and just like talk, you know, talk to her, even 314 00:22:46,880 --> 00:22:51,239 Speaker 2: though I know like she couldn't hear me. But I 315 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 2: remember vowing, I will never let our story not be heard. 316 00:22:56,119 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 2: I will never let the story die. I will share 317 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,359 Speaker 2: it with whoever will listen until the day I die, 318 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,280 Speaker 2: because Jess is never to be forgotten. I will make 319 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:10,160 Speaker 2: sure the world hears of what we went through, of 320 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:14,399 Speaker 2: the amazing person you were. I am not going to 321 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 2: let anyone forget about what happened to us, no matter 322 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:21,960 Speaker 2: what it takes. I want to be that voice and 323 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 2: that light and. 324 00:23:24,000 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 7: Share Jess as a nice story. 325 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,120 Speaker 3: The Maidens had been Lindsay's sisters since she was thirteen. 326 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:07,040 Speaker 3: They were her role models, her confidence, her friends. Jess 327 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 3: was gone, but what about the others. Some of them 328 00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 3: had defended Victor after his arrest. Some were Facebook friends 329 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:20,120 Speaker 3: with Lindsay. Surreal acquaintances whose lives she could watch unfold 330 00:24:20,280 --> 00:24:25,960 Speaker 3: in pieces and glimmers and Facebook posts and pictures. But 331 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,040 Speaker 3: talking about her past with us and all of these 332 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:31,520 Speaker 3: interviews reignited something in Lindsay. She wanted to reach out 333 00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:34,800 Speaker 3: to them again. She sent Facebook messages to a few 334 00:24:34,840 --> 00:24:37,560 Speaker 3: former Maidens and one of them told her she'd like 335 00:24:37,640 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 3: to meet. We'll call her Kelsey to protect her identity. 336 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:46,400 Speaker 3: Kelsey still lived in Washington. In Seattle, Lindsay flew out 337 00:24:46,440 --> 00:24:50,359 Speaker 3: there on the day of their meeting. Lindsay took forever 338 00:24:50,440 --> 00:24:53,440 Speaker 3: to pick just the right outfit. Kelsey always had a 339 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 3: great sense of style, and she wanted to impress her. 340 00:24:56,600 --> 00:24:59,440 Speaker 3: She wondered if they could be friends, or if Kelsey 341 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:02,520 Speaker 3: might resis see Lindsay as the person who had betrayed 342 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:04,560 Speaker 3: her and the Maidens. 343 00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,640 Speaker 2: Okay, I'm walking up to the coffee shop. Definitely so nervous, 344 00:25:14,359 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 2: had butterflies in my stomach, freaking out kind of. But 345 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:24,879 Speaker 2: I think it's gonna be really good, hopefully. Yeah, what 346 00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:28,680 Speaker 2: do you even say? Like? Hello? Is that a good starter? 347 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 2: I guess that's a good starter. Okay, I'm just gonna 348 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 2: go for it. I'm waiting in the coffee shop, just 349 00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:44,760 Speaker 2: kind of sitting there and I see her at the 350 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:47,360 Speaker 2: corner across out the window, and I was like, oh 351 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:49,880 Speaker 2: my gosh, and I didn't want to just stare at her, 352 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,200 Speaker 2: so I kind of looked away. And then she walks 353 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:59,840 Speaker 2: in the door and she's like, Lindsay, we can give 354 00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:02,840 Speaker 2: you each other hug, you know, like some tears came, 355 00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,720 Speaker 2: and it wasn't that awkward. We got coffee, we sat 356 00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:08,080 Speaker 2: down and. 357 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,520 Speaker 3: They started talking about their lives now Kelsey had gotten married, 358 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 3: had a career. Lindsay told her how she'd gone to 359 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:15,439 Speaker 3: college and had a daughter. 360 00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,639 Speaker 2: And she told me when we were meeting that the 361 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:25,280 Speaker 2: idea of travel always appealed to her. And she was 362 00:26:25,280 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 2: telling me how back when we were maidens, she would 363 00:26:28,359 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 2: read an atlass just for fun to see all the 364 00:26:30,960 --> 00:26:34,200 Speaker 2: places in the world. I didn't know that about her. 365 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:37,880 Speaker 3: All of the maidens had had to keep some parts 366 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:38,880 Speaker 3: of them selves secret. 367 00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:44,600 Speaker 2: She shared with me that once Jess and I went 368 00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:53,680 Speaker 2: to the cops, things just got really crazy. People knew 369 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:55,879 Speaker 2: what was going on, but it was always hush hush. 370 00:26:56,440 --> 00:26:59,639 Speaker 2: It was just rumors or maybe like if they had 371 00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 2: read an news article from somewhere being out and doing 372 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:07,199 Speaker 2: cleaning jobs or whatever. And in the beginning, she's like, 373 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,880 Speaker 2: we did think that you and Jess, you guys are 374 00:27:09,880 --> 00:27:13,080 Speaker 2: bringing on like the persecution, that Victory was being persecuted. 375 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,639 Speaker 2: And at that time she still wanted to remain faithful 376 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:22,920 Speaker 2: and thought she was doing the right thing, she said. 377 00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 2: Eventually some of the other maidens started leaving. So many 378 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:30,000 Speaker 2: of the maidens left, things were really breaking up, she said. 379 00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,680 Speaker 2: At the end, it was only her, I think one 380 00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:36,679 Speaker 2: other maiden there. 381 00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 3: Lindsay's mom lived with the last two maidens at the time. 382 00:27:44,520 --> 00:27:47,800 Speaker 2: And so she said that she went and bought a car, 383 00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,119 Speaker 2: and my mother went and helped her buy a car, 384 00:27:51,200 --> 00:27:55,040 Speaker 2: which it's not her fault at all, but it just 385 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 2: kind of stung a little bit that here my mother's 386 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 2: supporting her to go buy a car when she wrote 387 00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:08,200 Speaker 2: a letter to the judge and said all those awful things. 388 00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 2: I don't know, it just struck a chord. 389 00:28:12,520 --> 00:28:17,439 Speaker 3: Yeah with me, I'm sure that felt like a stab 390 00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:23,080 Speaker 3: to the gut, yeah, Lindsay says. Kelsey told her she 391 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,960 Speaker 3: booked a ticket to Minnesota to visit Victor in jail. 392 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:28,800 Speaker 2: She was only able to see him, I think through 393 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:32,440 Speaker 2: a monitor but she was like, as I sat there 394 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:36,760 Speaker 2: looking at him and hearing him, I just got such 395 00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:40,000 Speaker 2: the icky feeling and knew I never ever wanted to 396 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 2: support this person ever again. And that was the last 397 00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 2: time she ever saw him ever, like put any time 398 00:28:48,480 --> 00:28:53,560 Speaker 2: into defending him or anything like that. She made it 399 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:56,600 Speaker 2: very clear that she loved me, and she was very 400 00:28:56,600 --> 00:28:59,320 Speaker 2: thankful for what we did. I think, which is healing 401 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:00,560 Speaker 2: for me to hear. 402 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:05,360 Speaker 3: Lindsay heard back from another former maiden too. This maiden 403 00:29:05,400 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 3: had been nineteen when the ten of them are chosen, 404 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 3: and sort of the head of the Maidens, someone Lindsay 405 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 3: had always looked up to. Of course, Lindsay wondered how 406 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 3: she took it when she went public with her story 407 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:19,240 Speaker 3: and took Victor down. Lindsay had last messaged her in 408 00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:21,680 Speaker 3: twenty twenty to give her the news that Jess had died. 409 00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 2: She said at that time, we probably agree on more 410 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,920 Speaker 2: than you think. Finally we were able to schedule a 411 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 2: time to talk. Just last Friday. She called me and 412 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:38,200 Speaker 2: I was like hello, and she's like, Lindsay, Oh my gosh, 413 00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:39,200 Speaker 2: it's so good. 414 00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:39,840 Speaker 7: To hear your voice. 415 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:41,920 Speaker 2: And I was like, yours two. And I think we 416 00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,000 Speaker 2: started laughing, and she's like, it's so good to hear 417 00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:48,560 Speaker 2: your laugh. You sound exactly the same. It was so 418 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 2: good to hear her laugh again. And she said, for 419 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:54,440 Speaker 2: her own healing, she does not go back into the 420 00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 2: past at all. She's basically closed that door. She said. 421 00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:00,680 Speaker 2: The one thing she loves to do now all the 422 00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 2: time is laugh She loves to laugh, and it's one 423 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 2: thing that her boyfriend has said about her that he 424 00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:10,400 Speaker 2: loves being around her. Kashill giggle at this or laugh 425 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:10,719 Speaker 2: at that. 426 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 3: She was usually more serious when Linday knew her. Of course, 427 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 3: the Maidens laughed and had good times, but everything with 428 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:18,920 Speaker 3: the Maidens felt important and heavy. 429 00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:21,880 Speaker 2: And being almost like the head of the Maidens, she 430 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:25,480 Speaker 2: had to carry such a weight, being responsible for the 431 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:29,160 Speaker 2: ten of us. To hear her just that feeling of 432 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:33,200 Speaker 2: lightness and happiness was really good. It made me really 433 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:33,920 Speaker 2: happy to hear that. 434 00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:41,640 Speaker 3: For a long time, Lindsay has felt separate from the 435 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:44,520 Speaker 3: Maidens she loves so much. She and just took the 436 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:46,960 Speaker 3: risk of speaking out about what happened, breaking one of 437 00:30:47,000 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 3: their most sacred rules. And for Lindsay, part of that 438 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:56,080 Speaker 3: sacrifice was losing the Maidens along the way. She saw 439 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 3: their photos bridesmaids in each other's weddings. She pictured the 440 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,400 Speaker 3: rest of them, the Maidens, still close to each other, 441 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:05,560 Speaker 3: somehow together while she was out here alone. When she 442 00:31:05,600 --> 00:31:08,000 Speaker 3: talked to these two maidens again, she thought, maybe this 443 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 3: could be the beginning of something. But she learned in 444 00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,120 Speaker 3: their conversations that some of them don't keep in touch 445 00:31:13,120 --> 00:31:15,120 Speaker 3: as much as she thought. 446 00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:19,520 Speaker 2: I think in my head, I was like, Okay, if 447 00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:23,720 Speaker 2: this goes well, we'll just go back to being how 448 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:27,479 Speaker 2: we were, texting and maybe calling and planning. I just 449 00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:33,000 Speaker 2: had this weird hope that we'd be able to reminisce 450 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:35,520 Speaker 2: on like more of the good stuff and like really 451 00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:38,680 Speaker 2: bond and click and be like sisters again. 452 00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 7: Yeah. 453 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,680 Speaker 3: But when she talked to these two former maidens, she 454 00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 3: wasn't sure she fit in their lives anymore. 455 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 2: It could be that it's too much of a reminder 456 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:56,680 Speaker 2: of the past. It was almost like all the Maidens 457 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:01,040 Speaker 2: we were made into this beautiful pot and then it 458 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:05,880 Speaker 2: all got smashed into pieces, and we've had to grow 459 00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 2: individually and heal individually, and we just don't fit together anymore. 460 00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:37,600 Speaker 1: Next time. On the final episode of The Turning, Hey 461 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:42,360 Speaker 1: Lindsay's Erica, Hi, Hey, how are you doing good? 462 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:42,800 Speaker 7: How are you? 463 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:43,800 Speaker 2: I'm good? 464 00:32:45,120 --> 00:32:45,680 Speaker 1: So what's up? 465 00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:47,400 Speaker 4: It's been crazy. 466 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 2: I'm just gonna jump right into what's been going on. 467 00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 1: The Turning is a production of Rococo Punch and iHeart Podcasts. 468 00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:12,160 Speaker 1: It's written and produced by Erica Lance and me. Our 469 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,479 Speaker 1: story editor is Emily Foreman. Mixing and sound designed by 470 00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:19,800 Speaker 1: James Trout. Grace Doe is our production assistant. Fact checking 471 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:25,200 Speaker 1: by Andrea Lopez Cruzado. Our executive producers are John Piratti 472 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:28,920 Speaker 1: and Jessica Alpert at Rococo Punch, and Katrina Norvell and 473 00:33:29,000 --> 00:33:32,800 Speaker 1: Nikki e Tour at iHeart Podcasts. You can follow us 474 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:35,880 Speaker 1: on Instagram at Rococo Punch, and you can reach out 475 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:40,280 Speaker 1: via email The Turning at rococo punch dot com. I'm 476 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:42,760 Speaker 1: Alan Lance Lesser. Thanks for listening.